Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
You're listening to Mix one O four nine's three sixty. Now.
I'm sure that you will recall about a month ago
the Chief Minister referring to the teals and trolls as
she presented her speech to the National Press Club about
the Northern Territory's energy future and the Middle Arm development. Well,
it seems there's going to be some additional scrutiny on
(00:20):
that project. A Senate inquiry into the planned development has
been established after being voted down twice previously by the
federal government. Now joining me on the line is the
executive director of the Environment Center here in the Northern Territory,
Kirsty Howie. Good morning to you.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Good morning Katie and Hearty listener.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Thanks so much for your time today. Now, Kirsty, what
was your reaction to the announcement yesterday.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Look, we welcome this decision with open arms. We think
that this particular project deserves the highest level of scrutiny,
and it's been shrouded in secrecy and minding controversy from
the get go. And it's entirely appropriate that when we
have one point five billion dollars of tax payer money
(01:08):
on the table, that it's scrutinized by the Australian Parliament.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
Now from your understanding, what exactly is it going to
look into?
Speaker 2 (01:18):
We believe that the terms of reference will be pretty
wide ranging and look at the circumstances in which the
one point five billion dollars was committed, some of the
environmental impacts which we're particularly concerned about, and so are
a range of doctors and other people in the Northern Territory.
It will look into the economics of the projects, because
(01:39):
we know, and Territorians know better than anyone, that often
we have wide elephants that don't ever see the light
of day, and so it should be quite broad ranging
and should be something that Territorians welcome, so that we're
not just fared lines by the government without truly understanding
what's been put on the table and what the impacts
might be.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Kirsty, do you that speech that the Chief Minister delivered
at the National Press Club was what sort of antagonized
this situation and led to maybe some of those in
the Senate thinking all right, we need to have a
closer look here.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Look, I think it's spectacularly backfired. It's not okay to
call people who oppose projects or question them on reasonable
grounds trolls, and I wouldn't be surprised if that particular
speech has led to people's ears being pricked up in
Canberra and thinking, well, maybe we need to look at
(02:34):
this much more closely. Bearing in mind, and immediately after
that a bunch of doctors and parents from the Northern
Territory went down and asked for this inquiry and it
looks like those calls have been answered.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Now what do you say to the comments from the
Northern Territory government there? I mean, they're promoting the Middle
Arm project as a lower missions manufacturing hub that is
going to focus on developing green hydrogen critical minerals and
carbon capture technology. Do you not believe that that's what
they're planning to do.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
So we believe, and we think this is what is
borne out in the documents which we've had to drag
from the government kicking and screaming through freedom of information processes,
that what the government is doing is greenwashing this site
and emphasizing these kinds of industries which may or may
not occur on the site, when actually what is planned
is mass expansion of the fossil fuel industry and the
(03:31):
anchor tenant is Betloufraka Tamborin. Now, if that project goes
ahead in the Beatloo basin, and if their LNG export
hub goes ahead at Middle Arm, it'll be located less
than three kilometers from Palmerston, just over the road, just
over the Elizabeth River, from the Elizabeth riverboat ramp. It
will dwarf and tower over Palmerston, less than three kilometers
(03:54):
from Bellamack. And it's very very far from sustainable. It
is very very far from lower emissions. This is mass
expansion of the fossil fuel industry in the middle of
a climate crisis, which will have significant impacts on air
quality and on our harvests.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Kristy, what do you say to those people listening though,
who think that there needs to be, you know, a
transition period here and that we do need gas and
that it is you know, that it is actually required.
But they also want to see the creation of jobs
and industry in the territory.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
So the line that gas is a transition fuel is
a gas industry talking point. The time for transition, if
it ever existed, has well and truly gone. You cannot
reduce emissions by increasing them, and that's what opening up
the Beatloo basin will do. We aren't opposed to jobs.
We encourage investment in jobs, particularly in renewables, in stabilizing
(04:54):
our grids, our electricity grids, in creating jobs that are
going to be good for Territorians in the long term.
And we don't think middle arm will do this. We
think it's a whole lot of rubbish.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
Frankly, So how do you create those jobs if not
through middle Arm.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Well, we actually are in the process of developing a
report that will point to how seven thousand jobs we
believe can be created in the territory by investing in renewables,
and that's things like investing in a huge new battery
to stabilize the grid, ensuring that low income housing and
social housing has solar panels, investing in training so that
(05:35):
we can spearhead the development of skills, training and jobs
in this industry that's so sorely needed. We are the
sunniest jurisdiction in Australia and we should be harnessing this
power and investing in those kinds of industries rather than
yesterday's technology and yesterday's industry.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
Just very quickly though, I mean, are you worried about
the stability of our power network given the fact that
we have got you know, we've got a solar farm
or a couple of solar farms that are sitting idle
at this point, unable to be turned on.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Oh look, it's absolutely ridiculous and it's a travesty to
be honest, that these solar farms haven't been connected to
the grid. We need urgent investment by our government and
by the federal government if needed, in the stability of
our grid so that we can cope with the peaks
and trials of demand and supply. And if we do that,
(06:32):
if we actually invest public money into that, then we
can have all kinds of industry. At the moment, it's
actually not possible with the grid as it stands to
have much additional manufacturing and industry at all.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Well, Kirsty Howie, I really appreciate your time this morning.
I know that you are incredibly busy this morning, so
I appreciate you taking the time to have a chat
with us. Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Thank you so much, Katie, and thanks to your listeners.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
Thank you. Kirsty Howie there, who is indeed the executive
director of the Environment Center here in the Northern Territory,
You're listening to Mix one O four nine's three sixty. Now.
I'm sure that you will recall about a month ago
the Chief Minister referring to the teals and trolls as
she presented her speech to the National Press Club about
the Northern Territory's energy future and the Middle Arm development. Well,
it seems there's going to be some additional scrutiny on
(00:20):
that project. A Senate inquiry into the planned development has
been established after being voted down twice previously by the
federal government. Now joining me on the line is the
executive director of the Environment Center here in the Northern Territory,
Kirsty Howie. Good morning to you.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Good morning Katie and Hearty listener.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Thanks so much for your time today. Now, Kirsty, what
was your reaction to the announcement yesterday.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Look, we welcome this decision with open arms. We think
that this particular project deserves the highest level of scrutiny,
and it's been shrouded in secrecy and minding controversy from
the get go. And it's entirely appropriate that when we
have one point five billion dollars of tax payer money
(01:08):
on the table, that it's scrutinized by the Australian Parliament.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
Now from your understanding, what exactly is it going to
look into?
Speaker 2 (01:18):
We believe that the terms of reference will be pretty
wide ranging and look at the circumstances in which the
one point five billion dollars was committed, some of the
environmental impacts which we're particularly concerned about, and so are
a range of doctors and other people in the Northern Territory.
It will look into the economics of the projects, because
(01:39):
we know, and Territorians know better than anyone, that often
we have wide elephants that don't ever see the light
of day, and so it should be quite broad ranging
and should be something that Territorians welcome, so that we're
not just fared lines by the government without truly understanding
what's been put on the table and what the impacts
might be.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Kirsty, do you that speech that the Chief Minister delivered
at the National Press Club was what sort of antagonized
this situation and led to maybe some of those in
the Senate thinking all right, we need to have a
closer look here.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Look, I think it's spectacularly backfired. It's not okay to
call people who oppose projects or question them on reasonable
grounds trolls, and I wouldn't be surprised if that particular
speech has led to people's ears being pricked up in
Canberra and thinking, well, maybe we need to look at
(02:34):
this much more closely. Bearing in mind, and immediately after
that a bunch of doctors and parents from the Northern
Territory went down and asked for this inquiry and it
looks like those calls have been answered.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Now what do you say to the comments from the
Northern Territory government there? I mean, they're promoting the Middle
Arm project as a lower missions manufacturing hub that is
going to focus on developing green hydrogen critical minerals and
carbon capture technology. Do you not believe that that's what
they're planning to do.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
So we believe, and we think this is what is
borne out in the documents which we've had to drag
from the government kicking and screaming through freedom of information processes,
that what the government is doing is greenwashing this site
and emphasizing these kinds of industries which may or may
not occur on the site, when actually what is planned
is mass expansion of the fossil fuel industry and the
(03:31):
anchor tenant is Betloufraka Tamborin. Now, if that project goes
ahead in the Beatloo basin, and if their LNG export
hub goes ahead at Middle Arm, it'll be located less
than three kilometers from Palmerston, just over the road, just
over the Elizabeth River, from the Elizabeth riverboat ramp. It
will dwarf and tower over Palmerston, less than three kilometers
(03:54):
from Bellamack. And it's very very far from sustainable. It
is very very far from lower emissions. This is mass
expansion of the fossil fuel industry in the middle of
a climate crisis, which will have significant impacts on air
quality and on our harvests.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Kristy, what do you say to those people listening though,
who think that there needs to be, you know, a
transition period here and that we do need gas and
that it is you know, that it is actually required.
But they also want to see the creation of jobs
and industry in the territory.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
So the line that gas is a transition fuel is
a gas industry talking point. The time for transition, if
it ever existed, has well and truly gone. You cannot
reduce emissions by increasing them, and that's what opening up
the Beatloo basin will do. We aren't opposed to jobs.
We encourage investment in jobs, particularly in renewables, in stabilizing
(04:54):
our grids, our electricity grids, in creating jobs that are
going to be good for Territorians in the long term.
And we don't think middle arm will do this. We
think it's a whole lot of rubbish.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
Frankly, So how do you create those jobs if not
through middle Arm.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Well, we actually are in the process of developing a
report that will point to how seven thousand jobs we
believe can be created in the territory by investing in renewables,
and that's things like investing in a huge new battery
to stabilize the grid, ensuring that low income housing and
social housing has solar panels, investing in training so that
(05:35):
we can spearhead the development of skills, training and jobs
in this industry that's so sorely needed. We are the
sunniest jurisdiction in Australia and we should be harnessing this
power and investing in those kinds of industries rather than
yesterday's technology and yesterday's industry.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
Just very quickly though, I mean, are you worried about
the stability of our power network given the fact that
we have got you know, we've got a solar farm
or a couple of solar farms that are sitting idle
at this point, unable to be turned on.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Oh look, it's absolutely ridiculous and it's a travesty to
be honest, that these solar farms haven't been connected to
the grid. We need urgent investment by our government and
by the federal government if needed, in the stability of
our grid so that we can cope with the peaks
and trials of demand and supply. And if we do that,
(06:32):
if we actually invest public money into that, then we
can have all kinds of industry. At the moment, it's
actually not possible with the grid as it stands to
have much additional manufacturing and industry at all.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Well, Kirsty Howie, I really appreciate your time this morning.
I know that you are incredibly busy this morning, so
I appreciate you taking the time to have a chat
with us. Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Thank you so much, Katie, and thanks to your listeners.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
Thank you. Kirsty Howie there, who is indeed the executive
director of the Environment Center here in the Northern Territory,
Popular Podcasts
Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club
Welcome to Bookmarked by Reese’s Book Club — the podcast where great stories, bold women, and irresistible conversations collide! Hosted by award-winning journalist Danielle Robay, each week new episodes balance thoughtful literary insight with the fervor of buzzy book trends, pop culture and more. Bookmarked brings together celebrities, tastemakers, influencers and authors from Reese's Book Club and beyond to share stories that transcend the page. Pull up a chair. You’re not just listening — you’re part of the conversation.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!