Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
We have spoken quite a bit over the last week
or so about issues flaring up again in Alice Springs. Now,
last week we heard from a distressed mum who said
that she'd been followed by teens in a stolen.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Car, who then rocked her vehicle.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
Now there is no doubt that everyone in Alice is
hoping that moves are being made to ensure that the
tourist town doesn't suffer the same issues which took hold
earlier in the year. And joining me on the line
is the local member forre Ara Lun, Robin Lamley.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Hi, Robin, how.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
Are you, Good morning, Katie.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
I'm well now, Robin. How are things on the weekend?
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Firstly, well, I heard reports yesterday that there's been a
lot of break ins, a lot of traumatized, very unhappy people.
I think it's safe to say that things are not
looking good for Alice Springs at the moment, which is
extremely concerning given that we really are not even within
(00:59):
the hot months yet, even though it is dan hot
down in Alice. At the moment, things are looking grim
and people are extremely concerned.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Robin.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
We spoke to a victim last week as I just
touched on. She was driving in her vehicle with kids
after someone had tried to get into their house. She
then ended up with these teenagers allegedly following.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Her car and rocking her vehicle.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
I mean, I've seen the posts on the Action for
Alice page, as you've touched on there. Things aren't looking
good from your perspective. Are you hearing that there's a
plan from what our politicians are saying.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
I'm not hearing anything, Katie, and that's not unusual. I mean,
just because I'm a local member of parliament doesn't mean
I hear any more than anyone else. I need to
scratch around and find out what's happening from different sources
if I'm lucky. But Katie, there has to be something
put in place. I wrote to the new police minister
(01:58):
last week imploring him, begging him, I use that word.
I beg you to consider rather extreme strategies if necessary,
to maintain law and order and Alice springs over the
coming months. I think it's a little bit unfortunate that
we have a new minister at this point in time
(02:20):
trying to get their head around a crime crisis which
has been ongoing for years now. Katie, it's not the
time for someone new to come into that position. But
as it is, we do have someone new, and we
need to get him up to speed and make him
realize that this isn't about a group of people living
(02:42):
south of the Baron line winging. It is an actual
problem that is getting worse and worse as time goes on.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
Robin, what did you outline in that letter to the
new police minister.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
I suggested that he consider emergency lockdowns of the town,
and I also suggested that you consider implementing an emergency curfew.
These are things that haven't been implemented by the Northern
Territory government at all, and I think if we're looking
at another year like last year, or potentially even worse,
(03:17):
then these things have to be considered. Don't forget, Katie
that in Alice Springs at the moment we have two
takeaway alcohol free days per week, and yet we are
still experiencing this horrific level of crime and intimidation on
the streets of Alice Springs. I mean, there's a lot
to be fixed up, Katie.
Speaker 1 (03:38):
Robin, emergency lockdowns of the town. It sounds extreme. How
exactly would that work?
Speaker 3 (03:46):
Well? I have looked into this over the last year
or so, and in lots of cities around the world,
particularly cities that have experienced writing for one reason or another,
have bollards and gates put up at different points around
the cities to stop people from rampaging and forming causing problems.
(04:14):
I went to Scotland last year and Edinburgh had gates
and bollards at different points around the city to stop
problems occurring. This is something that could be easily implemented.
It looks ugly, it is a sign that things are
out of control, but I think given what we've already
experienced in Alice Springs last summer, it doesn't matter what
(04:36):
it looks like. We just have to maintain law and order.
And you know, what we saw last year was a
state of lawlessness and a situation where the government had
lost control. And I feel, and I think a lot
of people feel in Alice Springs that we're heading in
the same direction.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
Robin Brent Potter, the new police Minister, joined us on
the show last week. He said that he's heading down
to Allie Springs this week. Are there any plans for
you to meet with him and discuss, you know, this
proposal or to see whether these emergency lockdowns of the
town or those curfews could actually be a possibility.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
A Look, that hasn't There's no plan for him to
meet with me as yet. As I said I wrote
to him last week. Look, I'm happy to meet with him,
but this isn't a new idea, Katie. You know that
these ideas have been talked about for many years. But
I guess as time moves on, those ideas have to
(05:34):
move beyond just ideas to actual possible strategies for him
to consider. I hope that with new eyes and a
new perspective, Brent Potter might consider doing something that his
government has previously just caibot cant completely. But we cannot
go down this track again, Katie. I mean, you know
(05:58):
there are young people in Alice Springs who are behaving
extraordinarily badly. We had six people, six young girls in
our shop in Alice Springs last week, causing havoc to
out to workers there, who were both in their seventies.
It is just behavior that cannot be accepted under any circumstance.
(06:20):
I know you guys in Darwin are experiencing the same
sort of thing, but the rate of crime in Alice
Springs is still far beyond what it is in Darwin,
irrespective of the populations.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
What are they doing in the shop. Those six young
girls that were in your family's shop.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
Well, they came in and they tipped over stock, swore
abuse at the staff, they tried to steal things and
pretty quickly they were able to bring it under control.
But if it's happening in our shop case, it's no
(06:58):
doubt happening in lots of jops all around town. And
that's why a lot of shops have decided to just
lock their doors. But look that small fry. There's other
horrific things happening in town. There's people who can't live
in their accommodation anymore because they've been they've been turned
over so often, and people are living in absolute terror.
(07:23):
And then you've got cars being stolen and being grand
paged around the streets. Look, it's something that requires leadership
and I just hope brand Potter is up for it.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
Now, Robin, tell me, are people quite like are they
quite annoyed at this point? Because the fact is Alice
Springs was in a terrible stage earlier this year. Right,
we had the Prime Minister obviously fly there, we had
the Chief minister.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
We had the cabinet fly there. Everybody was there.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
We were being told that, you know, these alcohol restrictions
were being put in place to try and have an impact.
There was a number of diferent measures that were put
in place as a bit of an emergency. But every
local was saying that they were concerned that things were
going to kick back off as the summer period arrived,
and that seems to be what is happening.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Are locals now angry.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
Angry, distressed, extremely worried. There's nothing happening, clearly that's happening
that gives anyone any faith that this will not be
another summer from hell. We need leadership. We need someone
to front us and tell us that they will do
(08:39):
whatever it takes to maintain law and order, and that
has to include things that they haven't tried before. Look, Katie,
the other thing that needs to be addressed is that
they've lowered the age of criminal responsibility to twelve, so
kids under the age of twelve know that they can
do exactly what they want. I think there has to
be some tougher consequences around kids. Children that offend. I
(09:06):
think they need to be taken into the care and
Protection of the Minister. They need to be taken out
to a bush camp until a responsible adult can be found,
and there has to be some conditions put around how
that child is managed and parented. There can't just be
a vacuum when it comes to children offending in places
(09:30):
like Alice Springs, because they will reoffend and reoffend, and
that's what we're seeing already. It is a major problem.
The timing for this was appalling. I think in an
ideal world, yes, we wouldn't have to do this, we
wouldn't have to address the problem of child criminals, but
we do have them, and they are causing a lot
(09:51):
of grief in the community, and the government doesn't have
a plan or a strategy of how to contain that
behavior of children.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
Robin a couple of quick ones that I do want
to ask you before I let you go. Matt Patterson
joined us on the show last week. He also said
that there really needs to be an audit of the
thirty four community service providers. He said if that if
they were working effectively, then we wouldn't have a situation
where we've got kids out on the street committing crimes.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Should that happen well.
Speaker 3 (10:21):
People have been saying that for years, including myself, and
that's obvious. But this government has categorically stated they won't
do that on numerous occasions in Parliament. Steve Edgington from
the COLP recently asked for an audit along those sort
of lines. They won't go there, and they particularly won't
go there over the next ten months in the lead
(10:43):
up to a Northern Territory election because those people traditionally
vote Labor. If they start digging around in all those
left leaning organizations, making them squirm and account for every
cent that they've spent beyond what they already have to,
then that would pose a major political problem for Labor
(11:07):
in their plight to be re elected. So you're not
going to see any change at all in this space
for a long long time, if ever, under this Labor
government and the same federally. I think now that the
referendum has done and dusted, people have said no, there's
no way in the world that Alvenez is going to
trigger yerstra orders of Aboriginal youth services in places like
(11:32):
Alice Spring. It is politically not very sexy at all.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
Robin, what about these calls for yipper and your school
to have a boarding house there. I mean, this has
been something we've been talking about I reckon on the
show for a good eighteen months and it just seems
to you know, it just seems to be something that
can keeps being kicked along. But we do understand now
that there is going to be one of the federal ministers,
(11:58):
I believe, come and.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
Have a look at that and whether it should happen.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
Would it make a difference, Katie, I have a different
perspective on this subject, and that is that to run
something like that is almost impossible. We already have an
Aboriginal boarding school, a boarding school for Aboriginal kids in
Alice Springs. It's called Urrara College. They have originally had
(12:25):
capacity for about don't quote me, but around two hundred children.
They're lucky to have less than one hundred now. It's
difficult to get kids to stay in boarding schools, and
managing them is extremely, extremely difficult. I don't think you
are in your school is functioning at a level that
(12:46):
can handle what they've got, let alone adding a boarding
school on top of it. It is a well intentioned idea.
It is in an ideal world, it could solve problems
that they just don't think that anyone in the current climate,
no matter how well meaning they are, can manage kids
(13:08):
in boarding schools. In a place like Alice Springs, the
temptation to get out and run a mark is there.
They can't jail them, they can't lock them in. It
is an incredibly difficult business to run, and I think
that URA, rather than trying to spread their wings into
something that could be an added complication for an already
(13:32):
extremely difficult school to run, they should be just concentrating
on their core business. That's my view.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
Kdie Robin, I do want to ask you before I
let you go. In news over the weekend, the Northern
Territory's largest legal service is facing a major audit, with
the federal government attempting to take control of all grant
funding to the embattled North Australia Aboriginal Justice Agency. According
to The Northern Territory News, a letter sent on Friday,
(13:59):
the Australian Northern Territory Attorney General's Departments have demanded NAJAH
agree to allow a grant controller to oversee all funding.
A Territory government led orders of the service, weekly staffing
reports and an observer position on the board of the
Independent Legal Aid Service, Robin, should this happen, of course.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
It should happen, But it really is an interesting case this.
I mean, if you're talking about doing orders of aboriginal
organizations or any organizations that accept public money, this is
a really interesting place to look. First, this organization is
falling apart. It's been going through a very public and
(14:44):
untidy court case involving staff making allegations about each other,
tearing each other apart. Is this what has to happen
before the government steps in and does these audits and
makes organizations like this comply? Apparently the answer to that
is yes. But the unnecessary angst around it all is incredible.
(15:07):
I mean, yeah, I think it's a fascinating case. It's
not something I've chosen to even think too much about.
It's out of my purvey to some extent. But what
a bloody mess.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
It seems that way, doesn't it.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
Well, Robin Lamley, I always appreciate your time the Independent
Member Ferarra lun and will no doubt talk to you
again very soon.
Speaker 3 (15:29):
My pleasure, Katie.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
Thank you,
We have spoken quite a bit over the last week
or so about issues flaring up again in Alice Springs. Now,
last week we heard from a distressed mum who said
that she'd been followed by teens in a stolen.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Car, who then rocked her vehicle.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
Now there is no doubt that everyone in Alice is
hoping that moves are being made to ensure that the
tourist town doesn't suffer the same issues which took hold
earlier in the year. And joining me on the line
is the local member forre Ara Lun, Robin Lamley.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Hi, Robin, how.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
Are you, Good morning, Katie.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
I'm well now, Robin. How are things on the weekend?
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Firstly, well, I heard reports yesterday that there's been a
lot of break ins, a lot of traumatized, very unhappy people.
I think it's safe to say that things are not
looking good for Alice Springs at the moment, which is
extremely concerning given that we really are not even within
(00:59):
the hot months yet, even though it is dan hot
down in Alice. At the moment, things are looking grim
and people are extremely concerned.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Robin.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
We spoke to a victim last week as I just
touched on. She was driving in her vehicle with kids
after someone had tried to get into their house. She
then ended up with these teenagers allegedly following.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Her car and rocking her vehicle.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
I mean, I've seen the posts on the Action for
Alice page, as you've touched on there. Things aren't looking
good from your perspective. Are you hearing that there's a
plan from what our politicians are saying.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
I'm not hearing anything, Katie, and that's not unusual. I mean,
just because I'm a local member of parliament doesn't mean
I hear any more than anyone else. I need to
scratch around and find out what's happening from different sources
if I'm lucky. But Katie, there has to be something
put in place. I wrote to the new police minister
(01:58):
last week imploring him, begging him, I use that word.
I beg you to consider rather extreme strategies if necessary,
to maintain law and order and Alice springs over the
coming months. I think it's a little bit unfortunate that
we have a new minister at this point in time
(02:20):
trying to get their head around a crime crisis which
has been ongoing for years now. Katie, it's not the
time for someone new to come into that position. But
as it is, we do have someone new, and we
need to get him up to speed and make him
realize that this isn't about a group of people living
(02:42):
south of the Baron line winging. It is an actual
problem that is getting worse and worse as time goes on.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
Robin, what did you outline in that letter to the
new police minister.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
I suggested that he consider emergency lockdowns of the town,
and I also suggested that you consider implementing an emergency curfew.
These are things that haven't been implemented by the Northern
Territory government at all, and I think if we're looking
at another year like last year, or potentially even worse,
(03:17):
then these things have to be considered. Don't forget, Katie
that in Alice Springs at the moment we have two
takeaway alcohol free days per week, and yet we are
still experiencing this horrific level of crime and intimidation on
the streets of Alice Springs. I mean, there's a lot
to be fixed up, Katie.
Speaker 1 (03:38):
Robin, emergency lockdowns of the town. It sounds extreme. How
exactly would that work?
Speaker 3 (03:46):
Well? I have looked into this over the last year
or so, and in lots of cities around the world,
particularly cities that have experienced writing for one reason or another,
have bollards and gates put up at different points around
the cities to stop people from rampaging and forming causing problems.
(04:14):
I went to Scotland last year and Edinburgh had gates
and bollards at different points around the city to stop
problems occurring. This is something that could be easily implemented.
It looks ugly, it is a sign that things are
out of control, but I think given what we've already
experienced in Alice Springs last summer, it doesn't matter what
(04:36):
it looks like. We just have to maintain law and order.
And you know, what we saw last year was a
state of lawlessness and a situation where the government had
lost control. And I feel, and I think a lot
of people feel in Alice Springs that we're heading in
the same direction.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
Robin Brent Potter, the new police Minister, joined us on
the show last week. He said that he's heading down
to Allie Springs this week. Are there any plans for
you to meet with him and discuss, you know, this
proposal or to see whether these emergency lockdowns of the
town or those curfews could actually be a possibility.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
A Look, that hasn't There's no plan for him to
meet with me as yet. As I said I wrote
to him last week. Look, I'm happy to meet with him,
but this isn't a new idea, Katie. You know that
these ideas have been talked about for many years. But
I guess as time moves on, those ideas have to
(05:34):
move beyond just ideas to actual possible strategies for him
to consider. I hope that with new eyes and a
new perspective, Brent Potter might consider doing something that his
government has previously just caibot cant completely. But we cannot
go down this track again, Katie. I mean, you know
(05:58):
there are young people in Alice Springs who are behaving
extraordinarily badly. We had six people, six young girls in
our shop in Alice Springs last week, causing havoc to
out to workers there, who were both in their seventies.
It is just behavior that cannot be accepted under any circumstance.
(06:20):
I know you guys in Darwin are experiencing the same
sort of thing, but the rate of crime in Alice
Springs is still far beyond what it is in Darwin,
irrespective of the populations.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
What are they doing in the shop. Those six young
girls that were in your family's shop.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
Well, they came in and they tipped over stock, swore
abuse at the staff, they tried to steal things and
pretty quickly they were able to bring it under control.
But if it's happening in our shop case, it's no
(06:58):
doubt happening in lots of jops all around town. And
that's why a lot of shops have decided to just
lock their doors. But look that small fry. There's other
horrific things happening in town. There's people who can't live
in their accommodation anymore because they've been they've been turned
over so often, and people are living in absolute terror.
(07:23):
And then you've got cars being stolen and being grand
paged around the streets. Look, it's something that requires leadership
and I just hope brand Potter is up for it.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
Now, Robin, tell me, are people quite like are they
quite annoyed at this point? Because the fact is Alice
Springs was in a terrible stage earlier this year. Right,
we had the Prime Minister obviously fly there, we had
the Chief minister.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
We had the cabinet fly there. Everybody was there.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
We were being told that, you know, these alcohol restrictions
were being put in place to try and have an impact.
There was a number of diferent measures that were put
in place as a bit of an emergency. But every
local was saying that they were concerned that things were
going to kick back off as the summer period arrived,
and that seems to be what is happening.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Are locals now angry.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
Angry, distressed, extremely worried. There's nothing happening, clearly that's happening
that gives anyone any faith that this will not be
another summer from hell. We need leadership. We need someone
to front us and tell us that they will do
(08:39):
whatever it takes to maintain law and order, and that
has to include things that they haven't tried before. Look, Katie,
the other thing that needs to be addressed is that
they've lowered the age of criminal responsibility to twelve, so
kids under the age of twelve know that they can
do exactly what they want. I think there has to
be some tougher consequences around kids. Children that offend. I
(09:06):
think they need to be taken into the care and
Protection of the Minister. They need to be taken out
to a bush camp until a responsible adult can be found,
and there has to be some conditions put around how
that child is managed and parented. There can't just be
a vacuum when it comes to children offending in places
(09:30):
like Alice Springs, because they will reoffend and reoffend, and
that's what we're seeing already. It is a major problem.
The timing for this was appalling. I think in an
ideal world, yes, we wouldn't have to do this, we
wouldn't have to address the problem of child criminals, but
we do have them, and they are causing a lot
(09:51):
of grief in the community, and the government doesn't have
a plan or a strategy of how to contain that
behavior of children.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
Robin a couple of quick ones that I do want
to ask you before I let you go. Matt Patterson
joined us on the show last week. He also said
that there really needs to be an audit of the
thirty four community service providers. He said if that if
they were working effectively, then we wouldn't have a situation
where we've got kids out on the street committing crimes.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Should that happen well.
Speaker 3 (10:21):
People have been saying that for years, including myself, and
that's obvious. But this government has categorically stated they won't
do that on numerous occasions in Parliament. Steve Edgington from
the COLP recently asked for an audit along those sort
of lines. They won't go there, and they particularly won't
go there over the next ten months in the lead
(10:43):
up to a Northern Territory election because those people traditionally
vote Labor. If they start digging around in all those
left leaning organizations, making them squirm and account for every
cent that they've spent beyond what they already have to,
then that would pose a major political problem for Labor
(11:07):
in their plight to be re elected. So you're not
going to see any change at all in this space
for a long long time, if ever, under this Labor
government and the same federally. I think now that the
referendum has done and dusted, people have said no, there's
no way in the world that Alvenez is going to
trigger yerstra orders of Aboriginal youth services in places like
(11:32):
Alice Spring. It is politically not very sexy at all.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
Robin, what about these calls for yipper and your school
to have a boarding house there. I mean, this has
been something we've been talking about I reckon on the
show for a good eighteen months and it just seems
to you know, it just seems to be something that
can keeps being kicked along. But we do understand now
that there is going to be one of the federal ministers,
(11:58):
I believe, come and.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
Have a look at that and whether it should happen.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
Would it make a difference, Katie, I have a different
perspective on this subject, and that is that to run
something like that is almost impossible. We already have an
Aboriginal boarding school, a boarding school for Aboriginal kids in
Alice Springs. It's called Urrara College. They have originally had
(12:25):
capacity for about don't quote me, but around two hundred children.
They're lucky to have less than one hundred now. It's
difficult to get kids to stay in boarding schools, and
managing them is extremely, extremely difficult. I don't think you
are in your school is functioning at a level that
(12:46):
can handle what they've got, let alone adding a boarding
school on top of it. It is a well intentioned idea.
It is in an ideal world, it could solve problems
that they just don't think that anyone in the current climate,
no matter how well meaning they are, can manage kids
(13:08):
in boarding schools. In a place like Alice Springs, the
temptation to get out and run a mark is there.
They can't jail them, they can't lock them in. It
is an incredibly difficult business to run, and I think
that URA, rather than trying to spread their wings into
something that could be an added complication for an already
(13:32):
extremely difficult school to run, they should be just concentrating
on their core business. That's my view.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
Kdie Robin, I do want to ask you before I
let you go. In news over the weekend, the Northern
Territory's largest legal service is facing a major audit, with
the federal government attempting to take control of all grant
funding to the embattled North Australia Aboriginal Justice Agency. According
to The Northern Territory News, a letter sent on Friday,
(13:59):
the Australian Northern Territory Attorney General's Departments have demanded NAJAH
agree to allow a grant controller to oversee all funding.
A Territory government led orders of the service, weekly staffing
reports and an observer position on the board of the
Independent Legal Aid Service, Robin, should this happen, of course.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
It should happen, But it really is an interesting case this.
I mean, if you're talking about doing orders of aboriginal
organizations or any organizations that accept public money, this is
a really interesting place to look. First, this organization is
falling apart. It's been going through a very public and
(14:44):
untidy court case involving staff making allegations about each other,
tearing each other apart. Is this what has to happen
before the government steps in and does these audits and
makes organizations like this comply? Apparently the answer to that
is yes. But the unnecessary angst around it all is incredible.
(15:07):
I mean, yeah, I think it's a fascinating case. It's
not something I've chosen to even think too much about.
It's out of my purvey to some extent. But what
a bloody mess.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
It seems that way, doesn't it.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
Well, Robin Lamley, I always appreciate your time the Independent
Member Ferarra lun and will no doubt talk to you
again very soon.
Speaker 3 (15:29):
My pleasure, Katie.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
Thank you,
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