Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Joining me in the studio right now. Well is the
Minister for Veterans Affairs and also Police Brent Potter.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Good morning to you.
Speaker 3 (00:06):
Good morning Katie.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Now, Brent, I understand you've already been at some of
the commemorations this morning for the bombing of Darwin.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
There is a lot planned for this morning.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
Yeah, it is, and it's a very special day for
the territory and it should be a national day of remembments,
I believe. So I was at the uss Pirie Memorial
this morning and then we'll go down to the waterfront,
not the Esplanade, the waterfront for the Bombing of Darwin
ceremony at about nine point thirty.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Yeah, there had been a bit of confusion.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
We did have the mayor on on Friday outlining exactly
where it's going to be happening and what's going on,
but there was still a bit of confusion this morning.
So definitely going to the waterfront, that is where it's
happening today.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
Going to the waterfront for your listeners, do.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
You reckon it should be a public holiday?
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (00:44):
Listen, I'm not going to be one to advocate because
I know as soon as you say public holiday, business
small business and it hurts them. I do think though,
when we look at some of the public holidays, this
would have a justification to be one. At the very least,
it needs to be a nationally recognized day and it
does need to be taught in our schools because I
think we talk about a lot of other try's military history,
we don't talk about enough of our own.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
As a former defense member, how important do you think
today is and how important do you think it is
that we do pause and remember the lives lost, but
also you know the impact that the bombing of Darwin
had on our great city. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
Absolutely, And for those that don't know, I did serve
and I did go to Afghanistan, and I think being
based in Darwin and seeing the bombing of dah and
ceremonies and living that history, it makes it even more
special when you get the chance to put your uniform
on and serve your country. But I think it's for
every territory and we know how special it is. I
think the rest of the country needs to understand how
important it is. You know, more bombs were dropped on
Northern Australia than was dropped on Pearl Harbor. It's just
(01:37):
that we were so dispersed, and we obviously had the
USS period their whole crew go down here in Darwen,
and we had two hundred and forty three. I could
be wrong with a two hundred and forty three territorians
lose their life on that day, so quite significant and
the first time that the mainland had ever been attacked.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Well, look, it is such an important day and I
know that there'll be a lot of people listening this
morning who have different ways that they would like to
commemorate this morning. So if you do want to send us,
you'll give us a call. We always love hearing from you.
But look, a week is certainly a long time in politics,
as they say, and that was very evident last week.
Now the Chief Minister started the week outlining her vision
(02:12):
for the Northern Territory in her year ahead speech, before
headlines were dominated by Chancey Paike Shares scandal and calls
for the Deputy Chief Minister to stand down now.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
He's dug his heels in.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
Despite revelations on Friday that Matt met Cash was one
of seventeen Panel contractors to win tenders with a combined
title of up to seventy million dollars to deliver and
supply products to hospitals and correctional facilities across the Northern Territory. Now,
while that tender is managed by the Department of Health,
the tender itself says that the Department of Health and
(02:44):
Department of Attorney General and Justice have a requirement for
the supply and delivery of food products to hospitals and
correctional facilities. Now, just when you thought things couldn't get
much worse for the government, though, we learned on Friday
that the colp's member for Braitlang was involved in a
car crash in August last year and is now facing charges. Minister,
(03:06):
the situation with the Member for Brakling is sounding more
serious by the day. The leader of the Opposition on
Friday confirmed that she knew about the incident when it happened,
but for some reason they chose to keep it quiet.
What's your understanding of this incident?
Speaker 3 (03:21):
Obviously I only know what is in the public domain,
and I think that is the point. Leah says one thing,
she has a set of standards and rules that she
lives by, and then she has another set for territorians.
Been close to four days and she's not come out
and spoken to your show, she's not front of the media,
she's not got an ABC Josh Bergorn has not come
out and spoken about it. They release a paper statement
only after the ABC initially questioned them. Territorians deserve her
(03:44):
to come out and tell us what the actual information
and truth of it is. But if it is something
like dangerous driving, alleged dangerous driving that causes harm, that's
a serious offense. And the fact that we're talking about
going to court proceedings means he has something to potentially
answer for. And obviously it's alleged until proven otherwise. But
why didn't they just come out and say that.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
Well, that's what I can't wrap my head around. I
think to myself. You know, sometimes things like this are unavoidable.
I don't know exactly what has gone on with this crash,
but what I do know is that when you're opening
up front, and when you're on the front foot with
something going on, you're certainly gonner. I think a lot
more sympathy or a lot more understanding from the public.
So I can't understand why they've not been opening up frontier.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
Well, I think, and you can acknowledge this that chance.
He obviously last week had some issues that he had
to talk through. We came out Monday morning, the Chief
Minister myself. Then he came out that afternoon and did
the press gallery, and then the next day he was
on your show and ABC and then on the Friday again,
you've got another chance to have a chat to him.
Not once has Leah or Josh Burgoyne come out and
spoken to territories and answered the questions. They are hiding
(04:47):
something from us, Why not just come out and own it?
Speaker 1 (04:50):
Well, do we need a request to get him on
the show today? We were told that wasn't going to happen.
We are due to have Leo Finocchiaro on the show
tomorrow morning, so I certainly host for six days. There
is going on be some questions answered. I mean at
the end of the day here, like even I've got
somebody messaging through saying Katie, it's interesting that it's that
there is only now looking like charges are going to
(05:10):
be laid six months later.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Why is that? Why would that be the case.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
I suspect police were investigating over that period of time,
and I know nothing more than the public does. But
what I can tell is if police have been investigating
that whole time, there would have been back and forward
conversations between police and Josh Burt are burgling, and then
there would have absolutely surely been discussions between Josh's talking
to Leah, and Lea and her team have made conscious
decision not to tell Terrritoriins. This is the twenty twelve
(05:37):
to twenty sixteen.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Polas do you first find out about it?
Speaker 3 (05:39):
I found out on Thursday night on ABC. That was
the first time.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
First Jude heard of it as well.
Speaker 3 (05:44):
I was shocked, and to be honest, they all seemed
a bit flat that afternoon on the other side, and
we thought maybe end of sittings that was why. But
I suspect it's now now because the ABC HADOK questions
to me.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
So, what do you think needs to happen here? I mean,
as the Minister for Police, what do you think needs.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
To happen here?
Speaker 3 (05:59):
Well, let me tell you what I would if this
was me and his position, I would have come out
on day DOT. I would have put a post out
on Facebook or a media statement saying I've been involved
in a car accident. I will keep Territoriins abreast of
what has occurred and I'll work with police. He didn't
do that then she and then Leah f Andociarra has
not done that once since then until last. So what
she needs to do is come out front the media,
put everything on the table, talk about the timeline from
(06:19):
when she was told to now. It needs to be
very clear and transparent and easy for territoriins to understand
and let territorians be the judge of what needs to
happen going forward.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Do you think he can stay in his position?
Speaker 3 (06:30):
Listen? I think if there is criminal charges and alleged
criminal to activity, If there is charges and found guilty,
then I would be questioning his ability to remain as
a public So I.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
Mean the thing is, though, this is potentially going to
be a long drawn out process. I mean the fact
that he's not been charged for sort of six months
indicates just how drawn out this process could be. We
know the courts are incredibly busy at the moment, so
this could be very drawn out. If once if because
have the charge has actually been laid.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
Yet, well that's again we all need Lee to come
out and tell us what has actually occurred, because I
don't get that information regardless of being the Minister for Police.
We're not involved, and rightly so they keep us separate.
She needs to come out and answer these questions. But
what I would say, if he is charged, or he's
going to be charged momentarily and there is a court
date set, the best thing he can do is temporarily
take a leave of absence. Take a leave of absence,
(07:16):
let it run its course. Let's get this separate from him.
The responsibility of someone to represent the members in Brakling
or the constituents of Brakling. She's called for many people
to resign, many people over time, and I reckon you
could go through the media of articles and pull up
recording she calls for everyone to resign when there's something Well,
now the shoes on the other foot, is she going
to live by what she says?
Speaker 2 (07:37):
So are you saying that he should.
Speaker 3 (07:38):
I'm saying you should at least consider and come out
and talk to territoriins and then let you know from
once we know the information will call for more. But
I suspect that the very least take a period of
absence so that we get an understanding of what's occurring
and ultimately to allow the judicial process to run its course.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Yeah, Look, I think that I think that there is
definitely a lot of questions that remain unanswered here that
we need to get to the bottom.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
I think the difference, and you don't get wrong with
obviously spoken about Chancey Paiker a week there is a
difference between a conflict of interests and potentially criminal outcomes,
like they are very different.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
They are very different.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
But look, I do want to go to the Chancey
Paik Shares scandal because looks it's not over either as far.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
As I'm concerned.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
You know, and we know now that it has been
revealed that met Cash was one of seventeen panel contractors. Well,
they were obviously one of those that we were set
to deliver or they were certainly given the contract one
of the contracts to deliver and supply food to correctional
facilities and health facilities across the Northern Territory. Now the
combined contracts worth up to seventy million dollars. Chancey said
(08:37):
on Friday that ministers are not involved in procurement. But
does this muddy the waters even further?
Speaker 3 (08:45):
Well, let's be really clear minas, like you said, ministers
are not involved in any contract negotiations. They are not
involved in any procurement, so that was completely done by
the Department. Now I appreciate that doesn't look great in
the context of what we're talking about, and if anyone
has any indications of something else, and they can go
to the IKA because we established it for that reason.
But what I can tell you is chance he has
been very clear and coming forward and answering questions. Like
(09:06):
I said, he's come on your show, ABC, came back
on week that was he'll continue to front the media
and answer any questions.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
Where a lot of people, though I was still calling
it out as BS myself, included.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
Well, I can only I can only tell you what
I know, which is that the Department never engaged the
ministry in relation to contracts. That doesn't happen.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
But I mean in terms of the shares scandal, in
terms of the purchasing of those shares, we know that
they've now been sold. Like a lot of questions still
remain unanswered about whether he truly did declear that conflict
of interest when he was walking into those cabinet meetings.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
And obviously I wasn't in cabinet at the time, I
was a backbencher. But what I can tell you is
that the cabinet process, when you sit in the room,
the very first discussion that comes out of the chief ministries.
Are there any conflicts in relation to what's being discussed,
and so you go through that. But just to put it, being.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
Able to answer that yes or no, that must be
getting frustrating for you guys, for the rest of the
team going this is just hanging over us.
Speaker 3 (09:54):
This is the question would be was there ever a
discussion around younger futures. It wasn't our legislation.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
I understand that, but there is definitely alcohol legislation, and
there is other legislation.
Speaker 3 (10:04):
And I guess what I would say, is there And
I think this has raised a wider issue around conflicts
of interest. You know, the opposition had shares in the
gas companies and they were voting on the floor of
Parliament in support.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
Of Look I'm talking about you, guys.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
I'm going to bring it back just because you have
shares in a company that he disclosed for two years.
Like it wasn't like randomly popped up. He had disclosed
them for two years on the registrar.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
But two months before the stronger futures legislation was ending,
he purchased those. It's like you can understand rights.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
Shying away from this. I absolutely understand how it looks
to Territorians. What I'm telling Territorians is we don't get
involved in contracts as the minister, and he's made it
very clear that he there was no discussion around stronger future.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
Can you see though, how some listening might be thinking
to themselves, well, he was privy to more information than
what a normal person would be.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
Absolutely, and I think even as backbench as you are
privy to more information, and as the opposition you get
you get briefs from all these companies as the opposition,
so they knew, for example, the opposition would know that
Santos is putting money into Brosso, that other businesses were
putting money into gas. So it is something we have
to manage as a parliament and either has committed to
a full review and change in the way we do it.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
Look Caroline from Catherine's dismissaged through, she said, mister Potter
Chancey only came out and fronted after he was called
out by the NT Independent.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
That's my whole point I'm saying here that when you
are asked to come and answer questions you come and
answer questions, and that's what he's done. I mean, he's
not going to come out three weeks ago when because
they were declared they were. The reason the NT Independent
was able to find the shares is because Chancey Paig
had them on his disclosure form that anyone in the
public can go on accent.
Speaker 1 (11:34):
So I suppose the point that you were trying to
make though with the Josh Bergoin situation is that he's
not come out in front foot at it.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
Not once. He's not come out once. And I mean,
like I said, if I was in his position, I
would have done an immediately, done a Facebook post or
a public statement says I've been in a car accident.
I owned it early. It's the standard you live by.
And he could have done that and then for six
months nothing more would have had to have been said
because there was no potentially charges. Now we know there's charges,
and only because there's now potentially charges and a court hearing,
(12:02):
he's come out and given a written statement, not once
front of the media.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
Look, like I said, there are questions still that remain unanswered.
But I don't think that things are over either for
the Labour Party at this point in time in terms
of the chance he paid shares scandal.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
And I'm cognizant right now territories have probably had a
gutfull of s some scans like this is why I'm
sitting here going we'll own our mistakes from day I've said,
that's what I'll do as a minister. I own the
mistakes that I haven't and collectively she just needs to
come out and known it because he is a taste
of what you get with the CLP government where they
just won't front the media.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
Well, I guess though others will be listening thinking, hang
on a sec. You've got a minister who's purchased shares
in a company that thinn is winning fairly large tenders
and they're feeling as though, you know, there could be
conflicts there as well.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
And I get the perception now is that that people
think that there was a conflict or there's some undertones
there and hence why they've now sold it. Or what
I would say is four hundred dollars in shares he
sold them. He sold them when he became chief deput
Chief Minister and the reason for that is the deputy
chief you sometimes have to cover off other portfolios, and
he made a cognizant decision and said, there is a
real chance of a conflict by me having these shares,
(13:08):
and he sold his portfolio.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
All right, I'm going to have to move it frong
because on Friday you're out having a look at this
new police case management system sir PRO, which has been
rolled out to police across the Northern Territory. The new
system indeed replaces promise which was well, it was certainly old.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
It was outdated.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
When I worked in the Police Media unit, I know
that it was very clunky, and that was twenty years ago.
How has the rollout of that system gone.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
Yeah, listen, no digital transformation is without its barriers, hurdles
and frustrations because you're changing twenty five years of people
the way they've worked. But what it will do is
that it will create a more efficient and true reflection
of crime statistics. And to give you one example, when
we talk about offenses against the person, offenses against the
person are very high in the Northern Territory, but that
(13:52):
included like alcohol offenses, firearm offenses, traffic offenses and on
the old system you would have to put in the
victim being the Crown that would then create an offense under,
for example, offense against the person. So, as I said
the other day, because the system's changed and the way
that it categorizes information, you're going to see a decline
in crimes against the offenses against the person. It doesn't
(14:12):
mean crime isn't occurring. It's just the way that the
system identifies information. And that's where I came out last
week owning it early to say we're not hiding anything,
just a different system records.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
It is going to mean though, that that data collection
is different, like you've just touched on, and that we're
no longer able to do the year on year with
the crime stats.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
You will be able to do month or months since
we've taken over, and then in twelve months time you'll
be able to do year on year. Just because the
way it records the offense has changed, doesn't mean the
offense is not recorded. It's just recorded.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
I guess it.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
Means that you know you're not able to go all right, well,
the crime stats this quarter are the worse they've been
in fifteen years.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
No, but we have other mechanisms to identify. That's a
cause for assistance to police and how many jobs they
attend and then register as an offense the court system,
and I understand people will be going, well, we want
to be able to compare and guess what I absolutely
want to as the Minister as we because I'm justifying
resources in cabinet for police based on need and I
can't compare that now. What I can compare is from
(15:07):
November through to now and then come November this year
we'll be able to compare a year.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
On you a couple of really quick ones because I
know you've got to get to the bombing of Darwin commemorations.
But the Association has said that the new system's clunky
and it's slowing offices down.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
How's that going to be worked through?
Speaker 3 (15:22):
Yeah, so we need to get more equipment into the
cars so that people don't have The whole point is
so they don't actually have to go back to the
office to do the work. And I was in Army
when we went from paper and pins on a board
to digital. It took us twelve months to get there.
And the only way to do it is more technical
support when the officers need it. And we've extended that
provision in the call center for for another six months.
I believe to support them.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Are you're potentially going to be able to lift different
data though from this system, ie youth crime, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
Well in specific ones. I'm unsure of youth crime specifically,
but I know that we will get a better reflection.
Like I said, I'll give you an example assault. Previously
there was one assault in the system, for promise, but
now there are multiple categories of assaults, so we'll get
a better undering of the types of assaults as an example,
which then means we actually can probably target the root
causes better.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
So would we be able to search through and go, Okay, well,
this property offense has occurred, the people arrested were youths
and be able to break down some of that.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
I would assume so, because I'm already getting percentage data
around youth crime versus adult etc. For property. But I'm
more than happy to take you through and have a
look at serpra yourself. You want to come in so
you can talk to listeners about what it's like.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
Well, look, I don't know that that's going to help
in much way.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
It's probably more going to be useful if they actually
get the data this thereafter, you know, to find out
where the stats, whether whether there are actually, you know,
an increase in youth crime or not. And look, I
do want to talk to you further about youth crime,
but we've run out of time. I'm keen to catch
up with you again very soon about that though, particularly
with these changes that the government announced when it comes
to the review of youth crime, but also some of.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
What's going on in Queensland. So I might say that
for another time If that works.
Speaker 1 (16:51):
Yeah, we'll see how we go. Brent Potter, good to
speak with you this morning. Appreciate your time.
Joining me in the studio right now. Well is the
Minister for Veterans Affairs and also Police Brent Potter.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Good morning to you.
Speaker 3 (00:06):
Good morning Katie.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Now, Brent, I understand you've already been at some of
the commemorations this morning for the bombing of Darwin.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
There is a lot planned for this morning.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
Yeah, it is, and it's a very special day for
the territory and it should be a national day of remembments,
I believe. So I was at the uss Pirie Memorial
this morning and then we'll go down to the waterfront,
not the Esplanade, the waterfront for the Bombing of Darwin
ceremony at about nine point thirty.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Yeah, there had been a bit of confusion.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
We did have the mayor on on Friday outlining exactly
where it's going to be happening and what's going on,
but there was still a bit of confusion this morning.
So definitely going to the waterfront, that is where it's
happening today.
Speaker 3 (00:40):
Going to the waterfront for your listeners, do.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
You reckon it should be a public holiday?
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (00:44):
Listen, I'm not going to be one to advocate because
I know as soon as you say public holiday, business
small business and it hurts them. I do think though,
when we look at some of the public holidays, this
would have a justification to be one. At the very least,
it needs to be a nationally recognized day and it
does need to be taught in our schools because I
think we talk about a lot of other try's military history,
we don't talk about enough of our own.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
As a former defense member, how important do you think
today is and how important do you think it is
that we do pause and remember the lives lost, but
also you know the impact that the bombing of Darwin
had on our great city. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
Absolutely, And for those that don't know, I did serve
and I did go to Afghanistan, and I think being
based in Darwin and seeing the bombing of dah and
ceremonies and living that history, it makes it even more
special when you get the chance to put your uniform
on and serve your country. But I think it's for
every territory and we know how special it is. I
think the rest of the country needs to understand how
important it is. You know, more bombs were dropped on
Northern Australia than was dropped on Pearl Harbor. It's just
(01:37):
that we were so dispersed, and we obviously had the
USS period their whole crew go down here in Darwen,
and we had two hundred and forty three. I could
be wrong with a two hundred and forty three territorians
lose their life on that day, so quite significant and
the first time that the mainland had ever been attacked.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Well, look, it is such an important day and I
know that there'll be a lot of people listening this
morning who have different ways that they would like to
commemorate this morning. So if you do want to send us,
you'll give us a call. We always love hearing from you.
But look, a week is certainly a long time in politics,
as they say, and that was very evident last week.
Now the Chief Minister started the week outlining her vision
(02:12):
for the Northern Territory in her year ahead speech, before
headlines were dominated by Chancey Paike Shares scandal and calls
for the Deputy Chief Minister to stand down now.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
He's dug his heels in.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
Despite revelations on Friday that Matt met Cash was one
of seventeen Panel contractors to win tenders with a combined
title of up to seventy million dollars to deliver and
supply products to hospitals and correctional facilities across the Northern Territory. Now,
while that tender is managed by the Department of Health,
the tender itself says that the Department of Health and
(02:44):
Department of Attorney General and Justice have a requirement for
the supply and delivery of food products to hospitals and
correctional facilities. Now, just when you thought things couldn't get
much worse for the government, though, we learned on Friday
that the colp's member for Braitlang was involved in a
car crash in August last year and is now facing charges. Minister,
(03:06):
the situation with the Member for Brakling is sounding more
serious by the day. The leader of the Opposition on
Friday confirmed that she knew about the incident when it happened,
but for some reason they chose to keep it quiet.
What's your understanding of this incident?
Speaker 3 (03:21):
Obviously I only know what is in the public domain,
and I think that is the point. Leah says one thing,
she has a set of standards and rules that she
lives by, and then she has another set for territorians.
Been close to four days and she's not come out
and spoken to your show, she's not front of the media,
she's not got an ABC Josh Bergorn has not come
out and spoken about it. They release a paper statement
only after the ABC initially questioned them. Territorians deserve her
(03:44):
to come out and tell us what the actual information
and truth of it is. But if it is something
like dangerous driving, alleged dangerous driving that causes harm, that's
a serious offense. And the fact that we're talking about
going to court proceedings means he has something to potentially
answer for. And obviously it's alleged until proven otherwise. But
why didn't they just come out and say that.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
Well, that's what I can't wrap my head around. I
think to myself. You know, sometimes things like this are unavoidable.
I don't know exactly what has gone on with this crash,
but what I do know is that when you're opening
up front, and when you're on the front foot with
something going on, you're certainly gonner. I think a lot
more sympathy or a lot more understanding from the public.
So I can't understand why they've not been opening up frontier.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
Well, I think, and you can acknowledge this that chance.
He obviously last week had some issues that he had
to talk through. We came out Monday morning, the Chief
Minister myself. Then he came out that afternoon and did
the press gallery, and then the next day he was
on your show and ABC and then on the Friday again,
you've got another chance to have a chat to him.
Not once has Leah or Josh Burgoyne come out and
spoken to territories and answered the questions. They are hiding
(04:47):
something from us, Why not just come out and own it?
Speaker 1 (04:50):
Well, do we need a request to get him on
the show today? We were told that wasn't going to happen.
We are due to have Leo Finocchiaro on the show
tomorrow morning, so I certainly host for six days. There
is going on be some questions answered. I mean at
the end of the day here, like even I've got
somebody messaging through saying Katie, it's interesting that it's that
there is only now looking like charges are going to
(05:10):
be laid six months later.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Why is that? Why would that be the case.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
I suspect police were investigating over that period of time,
and I know nothing more than the public does. But
what I can tell is if police have been investigating
that whole time, there would have been back and forward
conversations between police and Josh Burt are burgling, and then
there would have absolutely surely been discussions between Josh's talking
to Leah, and Lea and her team have made conscious
decision not to tell Terrritoriins. This is the twenty twelve
(05:37):
to twenty sixteen.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Polas do you first find out about it?
Speaker 3 (05:39):
I found out on Thursday night on ABC. That was
the first time.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
First Jude heard of it as well.
Speaker 3 (05:44):
I was shocked, and to be honest, they all seemed
a bit flat that afternoon on the other side, and
we thought maybe end of sittings that was why. But
I suspect it's now now because the ABC HADOK questions
to me.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
So, what do you think needs to happen here? I mean,
as the Minister for Police, what do you think needs.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
To happen here?
Speaker 3 (05:59):
Well, let me tell you what I would if this
was me and his position, I would have come out
on day DOT. I would have put a post out
on Facebook or a media statement saying I've been involved
in a car accident. I will keep Territoriins abreast of
what has occurred and I'll work with police. He didn't
do that then she and then Leah f Andociarra has
not done that once since then until last. So what
she needs to do is come out front the media,
put everything on the table, talk about the timeline from
(06:19):
when she was told to now. It needs to be
very clear and transparent and easy for territoriins to understand
and let territorians be the judge of what needs to
happen going forward.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Do you think he can stay in his position?
Speaker 3 (06:30):
Listen? I think if there is criminal charges and alleged
criminal to activity, If there is charges and found guilty,
then I would be questioning his ability to remain as
a public So I.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
Mean the thing is, though, this is potentially going to
be a long drawn out process. I mean the fact
that he's not been charged for sort of six months
indicates just how drawn out this process could be. We
know the courts are incredibly busy at the moment, so
this could be very drawn out. If once if because
have the charge has actually been laid.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
Yet, well that's again we all need Lee to come
out and tell us what has actually occurred, because I
don't get that information regardless of being the Minister for Police.
We're not involved, and rightly so they keep us separate.
She needs to come out and answer these questions. But
what I would say, if he is charged, or he's
going to be charged momentarily and there is a court
date set, the best thing he can do is temporarily
take a leave of absence. Take a leave of absence,
(07:16):
let it run its course. Let's get this separate from him.
The responsibility of someone to represent the members in Brakling
or the constituents of Brakling. She's called for many people
to resign, many people over time, and I reckon you
could go through the media of articles and pull up
recording she calls for everyone to resign when there's something Well,
now the shoes on the other foot, is she going
to live by what she says?
Speaker 2 (07:37):
So are you saying that he should.
Speaker 3 (07:38):
I'm saying you should at least consider and come out
and talk to territoriins and then let you know from
once we know the information will call for more. But
I suspect that the very least take a period of
absence so that we get an understanding of what's occurring
and ultimately to allow the judicial process to run its course.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Yeah, Look, I think that I think that there is
definitely a lot of questions that remain unanswered here that
we need to get to the bottom.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
I think the difference, and you don't get wrong with
obviously spoken about Chancey Paiker a week there is a
difference between a conflict of interests and potentially criminal outcomes,
like they are very different.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
They are very different.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
But look, I do want to go to the Chancey
Paik Shares scandal because looks it's not over either as far.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
As I'm concerned.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
You know, and we know now that it has been
revealed that met Cash was one of seventeen panel contractors. Well,
they were obviously one of those that we were set
to deliver or they were certainly given the contract one
of the contracts to deliver and supply food to correctional
facilities and health facilities across the Northern Territory. Now the
combined contracts worth up to seventy million dollars. Chancey said
(08:37):
on Friday that ministers are not involved in procurement. But
does this muddy the waters even further?
Speaker 3 (08:45):
Well, let's be really clear minas, like you said, ministers
are not involved in any contract negotiations. They are not
involved in any procurement, so that was completely done by
the Department. Now I appreciate that doesn't look great in
the context of what we're talking about, and if anyone
has any indications of something else, and they can go
to the IKA because we established it for that reason.
But what I can tell you is chance he has
been very clear and coming forward and answering questions. Like
(09:06):
I said, he's come on your show, ABC, came back
on week that was he'll continue to front the media
and answer any questions.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
Where a lot of people, though I was still calling
it out as BS myself, included.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
Well, I can only I can only tell you what
I know, which is that the Department never engaged the
ministry in relation to contracts. That doesn't happen.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
But I mean in terms of the shares scandal, in
terms of the purchasing of those shares, we know that
they've now been sold. Like a lot of questions still
remain unanswered about whether he truly did declear that conflict
of interest when he was walking into those cabinet meetings.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
And obviously I wasn't in cabinet at the time, I
was a backbencher. But what I can tell you is
that the cabinet process, when you sit in the room,
the very first discussion that comes out of the chief ministries.
Are there any conflicts in relation to what's being discussed,
and so you go through that. But just to put it, being.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
Able to answer that yes or no, that must be
getting frustrating for you guys, for the rest of the
team going this is just hanging over us.
Speaker 3 (09:54):
This is the question would be was there ever a
discussion around younger futures. It wasn't our legislation.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
I understand that, but there is definitely alcohol legislation, and
there is other legislation.
Speaker 3 (10:04):
And I guess what I would say, is there And
I think this has raised a wider issue around conflicts
of interest. You know, the opposition had shares in the
gas companies and they were voting on the floor of
Parliament in support.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
Of Look I'm talking about you, guys.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
I'm going to bring it back just because you have
shares in a company that he disclosed for two years.
Like it wasn't like randomly popped up. He had disclosed
them for two years on the registrar.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
But two months before the stronger futures legislation was ending,
he purchased those. It's like you can understand rights.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
Shying away from this. I absolutely understand how it looks
to Territorians. What I'm telling Territorians is we don't get
involved in contracts as the minister, and he's made it
very clear that he there was no discussion around stronger future.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
Can you see though, how some listening might be thinking
to themselves, well, he was privy to more information than
what a normal person would be.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
Absolutely, and I think even as backbench as you are
privy to more information, and as the opposition you get
you get briefs from all these companies as the opposition,
so they knew, for example, the opposition would know that
Santos is putting money into Brosso, that other businesses were
putting money into gas. So it is something we have
to manage as a parliament and either has committed to
a full review and change in the way we do it.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
Look Caroline from Catherine's dismissaged through, she said, mister Potter
Chancey only came out and fronted after he was called
out by the NT Independent.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
That's my whole point I'm saying here that when you
are asked to come and answer questions you come and
answer questions, and that's what he's done. I mean, he's
not going to come out three weeks ago when because
they were declared they were. The reason the NT Independent
was able to find the shares is because Chancey Paig
had them on his disclosure form that anyone in the
public can go on accent.
Speaker 1 (11:34):
So I suppose the point that you were trying to
make though with the Josh Bergoin situation is that he's
not come out in front foot at it.
Speaker 3 (11:41):
Not once. He's not come out once. And I mean,
like I said, if I was in his position, I
would have done an immediately, done a Facebook post or
a public statement says I've been in a car accident.
I owned it early. It's the standard you live by.
And he could have done that and then for six
months nothing more would have had to have been said
because there was no potentially charges. Now we know there's charges,
and only because there's now potentially charges and a court hearing,
(12:02):
he's come out and given a written statement, not once
front of the media.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
Look, like I said, there are questions still that remain unanswered.
But I don't think that things are over either for
the Labour Party at this point in time in terms
of the chance he paid shares scandal.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
And I'm cognizant right now territories have probably had a
gutfull of s some scans like this is why I'm
sitting here going we'll own our mistakes from day I've said,
that's what I'll do as a minister. I own the
mistakes that I haven't and collectively she just needs to
come out and known it because he is a taste
of what you get with the CLP government where they
just won't front the media.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
Well, I guess though others will be listening thinking, hang
on a sec. You've got a minister who's purchased shares
in a company that thinn is winning fairly large tenders
and they're feeling as though, you know, there could be
conflicts there as well.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
And I get the perception now is that that people
think that there was a conflict or there's some undertones
there and hence why they've now sold it. Or what
I would say is four hundred dollars in shares he
sold them. He sold them when he became chief deput
Chief Minister and the reason for that is the deputy
chief you sometimes have to cover off other portfolios, and
he made a cognizant decision and said, there is a
real chance of a conflict by me having these shares,
(13:08):
and he sold his portfolio.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
All right, I'm going to have to move it frong
because on Friday you're out having a look at this
new police case management system sir PRO, which has been
rolled out to police across the Northern Territory. The new
system indeed replaces promise which was well, it was certainly old.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
It was outdated.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
When I worked in the Police Media unit, I know
that it was very clunky, and that was twenty years ago.
How has the rollout of that system gone.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
Yeah, listen, no digital transformation is without its barriers, hurdles
and frustrations because you're changing twenty five years of people
the way they've worked. But what it will do is
that it will create a more efficient and true reflection
of crime statistics. And to give you one example, when
we talk about offenses against the person, offenses against the
person are very high in the Northern Territory, but that
(13:52):
included like alcohol offenses, firearm offenses, traffic offenses and on
the old system you would have to put in the
victim being the Crown that would then create an offense under,
for example, offense against the person. So, as I said
the other day, because the system's changed and the way
that it categorizes information, you're going to see a decline
in crimes against the offenses against the person. It doesn't
(14:12):
mean crime isn't occurring. It's just the way that the
system identifies information. And that's where I came out last
week owning it early to say we're not hiding anything,
just a different system records.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
It is going to mean though, that that data collection
is different, like you've just touched on, and that we're
no longer able to do the year on year with
the crime stats.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
You will be able to do month or months since
we've taken over, and then in twelve months time you'll
be able to do year on year. Just because the
way it records the offense has changed, doesn't mean the
offense is not recorded. It's just recorded.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
I guess it.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
Means that you know you're not able to go all right, well,
the crime stats this quarter are the worse they've been
in fifteen years.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
No, but we have other mechanisms to identify. That's a
cause for assistance to police and how many jobs they
attend and then register as an offense the court system,
and I understand people will be going, well, we want
to be able to compare and guess what I absolutely
want to as the Minister as we because I'm justifying
resources in cabinet for police based on need and I
can't compare that now. What I can compare is from
(15:07):
November through to now and then come November this year
we'll be able to compare a year.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
On you a couple of really quick ones because I
know you've got to get to the bombing of Darwin commemorations.
But the Association has said that the new system's clunky
and it's slowing offices down.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
How's that going to be worked through?
Speaker 3 (15:22):
Yeah, so we need to get more equipment into the
cars so that people don't have The whole point is
so they don't actually have to go back to the
office to do the work. And I was in Army
when we went from paper and pins on a board
to digital. It took us twelve months to get there.
And the only way to do it is more technical
support when the officers need it. And we've extended that
provision in the call center for for another six months.
I believe to support them.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Are you're potentially going to be able to lift different
data though from this system, ie youth crime, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
Well in specific ones. I'm unsure of youth crime specifically,
but I know that we will get a better reflection.
Like I said, I'll give you an example assault. Previously
there was one assault in the system, for promise, but
now there are multiple categories of assaults, so we'll get
a better undering of the types of assaults as an example,
which then means we actually can probably target the root
causes better.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
So would we be able to search through and go, Okay, well,
this property offense has occurred, the people arrested were youths
and be able to break down some of that.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
I would assume so, because I'm already getting percentage data
around youth crime versus adult etc. For property. But I'm
more than happy to take you through and have a
look at serpra yourself. You want to come in so
you can talk to listeners about what it's like.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
Well, look, I don't know that that's going to help
in much way.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
It's probably more going to be useful if they actually
get the data this thereafter, you know, to find out
where the stats, whether whether there are actually, you know,
an increase in youth crime or not. And look, I
do want to talk to you further about youth crime,
but we've run out of time. I'm keen to catch
up with you again very soon about that though, particularly
with these changes that the government announced when it comes
to the review of youth crime, but also some of.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
What's going on in Queensland. So I might say that
for another time If that works.
Speaker 1 (16:51):
Yeah, we'll see how we go. Brent Potter, good to
speak with you this morning. Appreciate your time.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.