Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
As you would have heard last week, Labour's member Filling
Yari last week made headlines after saying that youth justice
laws need to stop treating criminal miners as little angels
and start applying tough love to lawless children now. In
what was considered quite an extraordinary intervention against Labour's handling
off the Northern Territory youth crime crisis, Marian's Grimjaw said
(00:20):
that authorities need to stop pussy footing around on juveniles
and that the decision to raise the age of criminal
responsibilities not working and that it's time for parents to
be held accountable for their children's actions. So is the
Northern Territory government pussy footing around on youth crime? Well,
the Chief Minister, Evia Laula joins me in the studio.
(00:40):
Good morning to your chief Monaster, Chief Minister. Even more
crime Unfortunately overnight this time for youths have been arrested
following a stolen car chase through Darwin. Police called off
two pursuits in Palmeston and Darwin City before the vehicle
was brought to a standstill using spikes in Casarina in
the early hours of the small. Charges are yet to
(01:01):
be laid. Meantime, police are investigating a link to another
incident in Casarina early this morning where a Domino's worker
was held up with a team demanding the keys to
their vehicle and striking the employee with a steel bar
when they refuse to hand them over. Now that work
has been taken to Royal Dalen Hospital with minor injuries
(01:22):
while the offender fled, Chief Minister, is the government doing
enough to tackle this issue which is plaguing the Northern territory?
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Absolutely shocking incidents as just yeah, nobody wants to see
those or hear about those incidents. It's a terrible situation
when you hear about those on a Monday morning and
I'm like everybody else thinking that, absolutely, we don't want that,
and we really do need to make sure that these
people who are perpetrating these crimes understand that there is
(01:54):
consequences and there will be consequences for their actions. And yeah,
we don't want people doing that. We want territories to
be feel safe. We want somebody who's going about their
daily work to feel safe.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
It's ridiculous, Chief Minister, is your government pussy footing around
this issue? As Marion Scrimgeorde said last week.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
No, we're not pussy footing around it. I mean, obviously
we work very closely with Marion. You know, we work
and keep our federal counterparts informed. On the day that
Marion made those comments, I actually was in Alice Springs.
I was opening the new youth detention facility in Alice
Springs and the new youth just Detention facility in Darwin
will be opened in the middle of the year. And
(02:32):
you know, the message loud and clear when we're there
talking to the people on the ground at the youth
detention facility was around this is the end of the
line for these kids. This is when they're in considerable
trouble basically, but we also need to make sure then
that they don't become super criminals, that we get them
on the pathway to getting an education, pathway to employment.
(02:55):
Also to identify if they have fetal alcohol or any
of them those things to get them onto an NDIS
plan so that they can have a better life. So, no,
not pussy footing around. Will continue to work with marrying
one of those.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Last week, we did report on that situation in Alice
Springs where juveniles allegedly stole a car and then took
it on a joy ride through the streets. I mean,
we're hearing a similar situation now from over the weekend
in Alice. That incident was well reported in the Australian newspaper.
The police located and apprehended four youths aged between ten
and thirteen following that incident. The two eleven year olds
(03:31):
and the ten year old were conveyed to their homes
and reportedly handed over to a responsible adult. Does that
seem reasonable to you?
Speaker 2 (03:40):
So, Lim Mendez the Australian journal I spoke to him
when I was in Alice Springs and he told me
the story of the family because he then met with
the family. That any child under twelve goes into our
on track program, so there will be support through territory
families getting that child back on track to education as well.
(04:00):
But yeah, both of those children should not have been
on the street. But I think we need to make
sure that there is those wrap around services around them,
but to get them and turn their lives around so
that they then don't end up at the youth detention facility.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Look, and this is where a lot of people are
at at the moment. You know, last week, we also
reported on an incident in the Northern Suburbs which saw
a person allegedly ambushed by youths with a machete after
pulling over to remove a bike from the middle of
the road. The person's car was stolen when that group
of youths one eleven held them up at knife point.
The eleven year old again was taken home to a
(04:37):
responsible adult. The others were bailed. Now, police told me
they worked within the legislative framework that they're given to
make that decision. But do you think that that's in
line with the public's expectations.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
No, I think the public wants to see that anybody
who commits any crime in the Northern Territory understands that
they've done something that is apparent. It's wrong that people
don't want to see them then repeating those crimes. But
you know, Katie, this is part of the work that
we're doing, A much bigger picture work that we have
to do around getting kids on pathways to employment. So
(05:11):
these kids, I bet their attendance figures would be low.
So that's the work of government around getting these kids
into education but then on a pathway to home.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
I mean some of them are eleven years old, Like
you just think to yourself, it's so young. I've got
kids that are that age, and I know you've got grandkids.
We've spoken about this before. We all understand it's a
really complex and difficult situation. But we also can't have
kids walking around on the streets holding people up with
a machete. And that's where the community's at at the moment,
where they're going, what do you have to do to
(05:41):
not be bailed? If you can hold someone up with
a machete, can still be bailed.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
So that was the work that I announced, I think
last time I was on Katie around those residential youth
justice facilities because at the moment you've got the detention centers,
you've got bail accommodation. We need this bit, that's the
bit before that, which is these resident mental youth justice facilities.
So some of these children that you're talking about, and
these young kids that it will provide the judges with
(06:07):
a different option for them. They are an opportunity for
these kids then to learn right from wrong and to
get on a better pathway. You know, they will need
to be there, they will be accommodation there, they'll be
you know, they'll be well fed, but also then around education,
training those skills, and that's a way to keep these
(06:27):
kids then to turn their lives around and get them
on a better pathway and to get them Often these
young kids we see are being easily led, it's often
the ones that are under twelve. My understanding is often
there's an older child that's leading them astray, a brother
or sister, your cousin or somebody. We need to make
sure that those younger kids then get you know, learn
(06:49):
right from wrong and aren't getting that just.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
The does to be Does it need to be a
closer look though at the legislative framework that the Northern
Territory Police are working within. If we are in a
situation where kids and hold up somebody with a machete
and still be bailed.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
So yes, and that's the work that we talked about
that youth Justice review. So we're doing a comprehensive review
of the whole youth justice.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
System until the end of this year.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Yeah, Katie, I mean it needs to be done properly
around that because we need to not just have you know,
we need to actually look at the Bail Act and
maybe it is that there's a separate Youth Bail Act,
So that might be the way that government goes.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
The Chief Minister.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
People are looking at this right now and they're going,
why do we have to wait until the end of
the year. Labour's been in for seven years. Why are
you now looking at this?
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Because Coatie, I think people also expect things to be
done comprehensively rather than just tinkering around the edges. You
need to actually look at the big picture around each
of these. So it may be as I just mentioned
that you need to have a look at the whole
Youth Bail Act and I mean the Bail Act, and
maybe we need a separate Youth Bail Act. So that's
comprehensive work that we'll need to be done rather than
(07:58):
just looking at one aspect that we do need to
look at across the system. You know, what we need
to what we're doing is around that. You know, some
of the things that I've talked about previously, those youth
justice facilities that correspond to model is one that's been
really positively received and seems to be working. Where you
have the police and territory family. So if a young
(08:19):
person's picked up on the street at night, they're then
going into a home where they've got some care. They're
also then in the morning, there's the services that wrap
around them. The police review also will provide direction around
whether we need more resources. But Katie, all of these
incidentss all that you talk about. You know, absolutely the
(08:42):
police are on top of all of these. These kids
have been arrested, These young people have been arrested. Some
of them aren't young people.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
I think people feel like, yes, the police are on
top of it, but somewhere, the system's letting us down,
you know, Somewhere the system continues to allow the fact
that we've got these youths that are out on this
street running a mark. I mean from over the weekend.
What we've seen is horrendous. You know, some of the
incidents that we've seen are absolutely horrendous.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
Agree, Katie, And you know, the system is, as we know,
families who are dysfunctional, families who are you know, on alcohol,
on drugs, alcohol, who aren't looking after their children, who
aren't bringing up their young people in the right way.
Territory Families continue to work with those families, take those
if they're you know, if they need to to take
(09:29):
those children away from those families. That's where it starts.
You know, we agree with marrying around family responsibilities. Families
do need to be responsible for these children. But to me,
we need to change. Then the big picture is getting adults,
getting people working, because there's too many Territorians who aren't working.
They get up in the morning and there you know,
sitting around not working. We need to get people to work,
(09:51):
which gets kids to school. So there's big picture work
that needs to be done, right Chief.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
I'm very mindful of your time because I know you've
got to be out of here by nine point thirty.
Speaker 3 (09:59):
But there's a few things I want to get through.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
It's been a couple of weeks since you and I
last spoke, but I've really not had the opportunity to
ask you questions about the situation with Chancey Paik and
the Shares fiasco. There's been some well discrepancy around whether
he declared a conflict of interest before cabinet discussions around
the ceasing of stronger Futures legislation. I asked him about
this a number of times. He wouldn't directly answer the question,
(10:24):
and he did say that the stronger Futures legislation is
federal legislation. We all understand that, but did he declare
the conflict before discussions on this?
Speaker 2 (10:34):
So, Katie I said, at the time, I wasn't aware
of whether he did or not. I mean, I probably
could not tell you. I wasn't the chair of Cabinet
at the time. I couldn't tell you whether Selena or
Nari or Kate or anybody at any given time has
declared a conflict around specific things.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
It's on the minute.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
Surely it's on some kind of minutes that you'd be
able to go back and have a look at that.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
There is a record of cabinet discussions, but I haven't
gone back and had a look at those.
Speaker 3 (11:02):
But Katie, is.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
He assured because it's a question of whether Territorians can
trust him or not.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Well, so he has always disclosed those shares. There was
no decision made, so the Stronger Futures legislation was decisions
that were made by the federal government, So there was
no you know, that was what he He.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
Did advocate very strongly though, for those for the Stronger
Futures legislation not to stay in place, and he advocated
very strongly saying that it was race based politics. So
what people are trying to get to the bottom of
is whether they can trust him.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Well, kat Katie, I mean their conversations with Chancey and
I know you've had those, but you know I trust
Chancey absolutely. I trust Chancey.
Speaker 3 (11:44):
But you know we.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
All have we all have had disclosures. Those are done
every and where they're about to be updated. Kathleen Robinson,
I've said is going to do a review of is
going to do a review of all the conflicts of
interest because and I think Selena used the word it
is clunky, so it needs to be clear around that.
But you know that's what happens in cabinet. People do
(12:06):
make their conflicts known and that's part of than the
discussions during it.
Speaker 1 (12:10):
So you don't feel that, you know, you don't feel
that there is any issue now for.
Speaker 3 (12:14):
Your government in terms of.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
That trust issue with Chancey Paig as the Attorney General.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
No, I don't feel there is, Katie. You know Chancey
has then since then sold those shares and I think
I think everybody sold chairs, even Robin Lamley I think
said she sold her shares. So I think that you know,
we've all moved on from that shares issue. Yeah, it's
been really difficult for everybody. We do want the best
(12:41):
people in Parliament and I think in the past you're
having shares was seen as something that you could manage,
but obviously from the perceptions of the public it's something
that people don't want to see. They don't want to
see politicians with shares, so I think it's a better
position now. Kathleen Robinson will provide that review, which I
don't know what it'll say, but I do know that
(13:03):
we need to be able to update our register a
lot more often, so it's not just every twelve months,
particularly for ministers. So there's two separate parts to the shares.
There's the front facing one around conflicts that the public sees,
but then ministers have additional ones which are only updated
every twelve months. So we do need to improve the
way that we report conflicts.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
All right, Chief Minister.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
The Coronial inquest gets back under way today into the
death of.
Speaker 3 (13:29):
Kumen Ji Walker.
Speaker 1 (13:31):
Zachary Rolf, who was charged with mister Walker's murder but
later acquitted by a Supreme Court jury, is expected to
answer questions. Last week, though one police sergeant, Lee Bowen's
faced questions about racist text message that will text messages
that he'd exchanged with former Constable Zachary Rolf. On Friday,
it was revealed that he'd sent a text describing Aboriginal
(13:53):
people as well. Bush, I won't say the word. Do
you think an officer who you u says that kind
of language should keep their job? Oh?
Speaker 2 (14:03):
Look, I'll leave that to the coronial, because it is
obviously one that is you know, it is very very
difficult situation to be in and I can see, you know,
the difficulty for Elizabeth Armitage around this. I think our
police do cross cultural training, and I think the vast
majority of our police force people who have a comprehensive
(14:27):
understanding of Obriiginal people because they work with them every day.
We know the facts are that I think eighty five
percent of people in our in our detention centers are
Aboriginal people. So I think our police force comes in
contact with Aboriginal people. That may be one of the
recommendations from the Coronial is that there might be great
(14:47):
cross cultural understandings.
Speaker 3 (14:48):
But I think the police.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Are pretty well known that you just don't say things
like that though, And I guess it's probably quite shocking
for people to realize, you know, to think that a
serving member has.
Speaker 2 (14:58):
Yeah, I think it is. Of course, it's shocking. It's
shocking language. And you know, I'm not going to, as said,
buy into all of that. I'll leave Elizabeth Armitage to
do her job. She's got probably one of the most
difficult jobs in the Northern Territory.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
But it is.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
Yeah, it's a parent language. It's not language that we
want to see in the Northern Territory. But again, as
I said, our police force work under tough conditions as.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
Well, Chief Minister. One last quick one Tourism Central Australia.
They've written to you, as I understand it, asking for
a relaxation on alcohol restrictions in Alice Springs.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
Have you received that letter?
Speaker 2 (15:33):
Yeah, I have apparently got it. It's come through my office.
I haven't read it myself, but apparently it's come in
through my mailing system. I spoke to somebody this morning
about it. I can understand where Tourism Central Australia are
coming from, but you know, we do need to have
a really good look to see how it's working in
Central Australia because I know Congress have been very happy
(15:54):
with the changes around Monday and Tuesday, not having alcohol,
takeaway alcohol. You know there are still alcohol and alice springs.
You can buy alcohol at a at a bar, but
you know, at a restaurant, all of those sorts of things.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
So what do you make of them?
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Sort of saying that that that after that relaxation of
alcohol restrictions, sorry, after they you know, the restrictions came
into place, the letter says that those laws have resulted
in fifty percent of like a fifty percent decrease for
some of those for some of those tourism businesses.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
So yeah, as I said, I would, I need to
have a look at that data around that. I mean,
we're putting in the territory tourism discount scheme, so we're,
you know, which is about a million dollars trying to
stimulate the economy. Those restrictions were put in place as
a result of the issues that we saw in Central Australia.
So if Congress are telling me things are better with
their admissions to hospital or you know, all of those angles,
(16:48):
we have to weigh up all of those things. So, yes,
can they be wound back? Maybe they can be wound
back partially. They're the things that Brent potterill you know
bring to bring to our discussions around that. But this
stage Monday and Tuesday you can't buy takeaway. Yes, if
you're a tourist coming through, are you a gray nomad?
Do you know you have to buy your our call
it before you get Talis Springs or is there some
(17:11):
other way of doing that? But you know, we will
continue to work with tourism Central Australia. We do want
a strong tourist industry in Central Australia.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
It's a tough jugle right now between that and then
the social issues that you obviously are seeing there. Like
it's tough to weigh those two things up.
Speaker 2 (17:26):
Yeah, it is, And I mean not all tourists drink
and a lot of them may be able to purchase
their alcohol before they get Talis Springs. So they're the
things that you work through. But I mean you need
to make decisions based on evidence and that's important around that.
But we'll continue to work around We know that how
just how difficult the issue is around olcohol in the
Northern Territory, but you know it underpins a lot of
(17:48):
these things that we're seeing.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
Chief Minister evil Ala, we better leave it there. I
know you've got to get to a meeting. Thanks so
much for your time this morning.
As you would have heard last week, Labour's member Filling
Yari last week made headlines after saying that youth justice
laws need to stop treating criminal miners as little angels
and start applying tough love to lawless children now. In
what was considered quite an extraordinary intervention against Labour's handling
off the Northern Territory youth crime crisis, Marian's Grimjaw said
(00:20):
that authorities need to stop pussy footing around on juveniles
and that the decision to raise the age of criminal
responsibilities not working and that it's time for parents to
be held accountable for their children's actions. So is the
Northern Territory government pussy footing around on youth crime? Well,
the Chief Minister, Evia Laula joins me in the studio.
(00:40):
Good morning to your chief Monaster, Chief Minister. Even more
crime Unfortunately overnight this time for youths have been arrested
following a stolen car chase through Darwin. Police called off
two pursuits in Palmeston and Darwin City before the vehicle
was brought to a standstill using spikes in Casarina in
the early hours of the small. Charges are yet to
(01:01):
be laid. Meantime, police are investigating a link to another
incident in Casarina early this morning where a Domino's worker
was held up with a team demanding the keys to
their vehicle and striking the employee with a steel bar
when they refuse to hand them over. Now that work
has been taken to Royal Dalen Hospital with minor injuries
(01:22):
while the offender fled, Chief Minister, is the government doing
enough to tackle this issue which is plaguing the Northern territory?
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Absolutely shocking incidents as just yeah, nobody wants to see
those or hear about those incidents. It's a terrible situation
when you hear about those on a Monday morning and
I'm like everybody else thinking that, absolutely, we don't want that,
and we really do need to make sure that these
people who are perpetrating these crimes understand that there is
(01:54):
consequences and there will be consequences for their actions. And yeah,
we don't want people doing that. We want territories to
be feel safe. We want somebody who's going about their
daily work to feel safe.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
It's ridiculous, Chief Minister, is your government pussy footing around
this issue? As Marion Scrimgeorde said last week.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
No, we're not pussy footing around it. I mean, obviously
we work very closely with Marion. You know, we work
and keep our federal counterparts informed. On the day that
Marion made those comments, I actually was in Alice Springs.
I was opening the new youth detention facility in Alice
Springs and the new youth just Detention facility in Darwin
will be opened in the middle of the year. And
(02:32):
you know, the message loud and clear when we're there
talking to the people on the ground at the youth
detention facility was around this is the end of the
line for these kids. This is when they're in considerable
trouble basically, but we also need to make sure then
that they don't become super criminals, that we get them
on the pathway to getting an education, pathway to employment.
(02:55):
Also to identify if they have fetal alcohol or any
of them those things to get them onto an NDIS
plan so that they can have a better life. So, no,
not pussy footing around. Will continue to work with marrying
one of those.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Last week, we did report on that situation in Alice
Springs where juveniles allegedly stole a car and then took
it on a joy ride through the streets. I mean,
we're hearing a similar situation now from over the weekend
in Alice. That incident was well reported in the Australian newspaper.
The police located and apprehended four youths aged between ten
and thirteen following that incident. The two eleven year olds
(03:31):
and the ten year old were conveyed to their homes
and reportedly handed over to a responsible adult. Does that
seem reasonable to you?
Speaker 2 (03:40):
So, Lim Mendez the Australian journal I spoke to him
when I was in Alice Springs and he told me
the story of the family because he then met with
the family. That any child under twelve goes into our
on track program, so there will be support through territory
families getting that child back on track to education as well.
(04:00):
But yeah, both of those children should not have been
on the street. But I think we need to make
sure that there is those wrap around services around them,
but to get them and turn their lives around so
that they then don't end up at the youth detention facility.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Look, and this is where a lot of people are
at at the moment. You know, last week, we also
reported on an incident in the Northern Suburbs which saw
a person allegedly ambushed by youths with a machete after
pulling over to remove a bike from the middle of
the road. The person's car was stolen when that group
of youths one eleven held them up at knife point.
The eleven year old again was taken home to a
(04:37):
responsible adult. The others were bailed. Now, police told me
they worked within the legislative framework that they're given to
make that decision. But do you think that that's in
line with the public's expectations.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
No, I think the public wants to see that anybody
who commits any crime in the Northern Territory understands that
they've done something that is apparent. It's wrong that people
don't want to see them then repeating those crimes. But
you know, Katie, this is part of the work that
we're doing, A much bigger picture work that we have
to do around getting kids on pathways to employment. So
(05:11):
these kids, I bet their attendance figures would be low.
So that's the work of government around getting these kids
into education but then on a pathway to home.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
I mean some of them are eleven years old, Like
you just think to yourself, it's so young. I've got
kids that are that age, and I know you've got grandkids.
We've spoken about this before. We all understand it's a
really complex and difficult situation. But we also can't have
kids walking around on the streets holding people up with
a machete. And that's where the community's at at the moment,
where they're going, what do you have to do to
(05:41):
not be bailed? If you can hold someone up with
a machete, can still be bailed.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
So that was the work that I announced, I think
last time I was on Katie around those residential youth
justice facilities because at the moment you've got the detention centers,
you've got bail accommodation. We need this bit, that's the
bit before that, which is these resident mental youth justice facilities.
So some of these children that you're talking about, and
these young kids that it will provide the judges with
(06:07):
a different option for them. They are an opportunity for
these kids then to learn right from wrong and to
get on a better pathway. You know, they will need
to be there, they will be accommodation there, they'll be
you know, they'll be well fed, but also then around education,
training those skills, and that's a way to keep these
(06:27):
kids then to turn their lives around and get them
on a better pathway and to get them Often these
young kids we see are being easily led, it's often
the ones that are under twelve. My understanding is often
there's an older child that's leading them astray, a brother
or sister, your cousin or somebody. We need to make
sure that those younger kids then get you know, learn
(06:49):
right from wrong and aren't getting that just.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
The does to be Does it need to be a
closer look though at the legislative framework that the Northern
Territory Police are working within. If we are in a
situation where kids and hold up somebody with a machete
and still be bailed.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
So yes, and that's the work that we talked about
that youth Justice review. So we're doing a comprehensive review
of the whole youth justice.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
System until the end of this year.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Yeah, Katie, I mean it needs to be done properly
around that because we need to not just have you know,
we need to actually look at the Bail Act and
maybe it is that there's a separate Youth Bail Act,
So that might be the way that government goes.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
The Chief Minister.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
People are looking at this right now and they're going,
why do we have to wait until the end of
the year. Labour's been in for seven years. Why are
you now looking at this?
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Because Coatie, I think people also expect things to be
done comprehensively rather than just tinkering around the edges. You
need to actually look at the big picture around each
of these. So it may be as I just mentioned
that you need to have a look at the whole
Youth Bail Act and I mean the Bail Act, and
maybe we need a separate Youth Bail Act. So that's
comprehensive work that we'll need to be done rather than
(07:58):
just looking at one aspect that we do need to
look at across the system. You know, what we need
to what we're doing is around that. You know, some
of the things that I've talked about previously, those youth
justice facilities that correspond to model is one that's been
really positively received and seems to be working. Where you
have the police and territory family. So if a young
(08:19):
person's picked up on the street at night, they're then
going into a home where they've got some care. They're
also then in the morning, there's the services that wrap
around them. The police review also will provide direction around
whether we need more resources. But Katie, all of these
incidentss all that you talk about. You know, absolutely the
(08:42):
police are on top of all of these. These kids
have been arrested, These young people have been arrested. Some
of them aren't young people.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
I think people feel like, yes, the police are on
top of it, but somewhere, the system's letting us down,
you know, Somewhere the system continues to allow the fact
that we've got these youths that are out on this
street running a mark. I mean from over the weekend.
What we've seen is horrendous. You know, some of the
incidents that we've seen are absolutely horrendous.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
Agree, Katie, And you know, the system is, as we know,
families who are dysfunctional, families who are you know, on alcohol,
on drugs, alcohol, who aren't looking after their children, who
aren't bringing up their young people in the right way.
Territory Families continue to work with those families, take those
if they're you know, if they need to to take
(09:29):
those children away from those families. That's where it starts.
You know, we agree with marrying around family responsibilities. Families
do need to be responsible for these children. But to me,
we need to change. Then the big picture is getting adults,
getting people working, because there's too many Territorians who aren't working.
They get up in the morning and there you know,
sitting around not working. We need to get people to work,
(09:51):
which gets kids to school. So there's big picture work
that needs to be done, right Chief.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
I'm very mindful of your time because I know you've
got to be out of here by nine point thirty.
Speaker 3 (09:59):
But there's a few things I want to get through.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
It's been a couple of weeks since you and I
last spoke, but I've really not had the opportunity to
ask you questions about the situation with Chancey Paik and
the Shares fiasco. There's been some well discrepancy around whether
he declared a conflict of interest before cabinet discussions around
the ceasing of stronger Futures legislation. I asked him about
this a number of times. He wouldn't directly answer the question,
(10:24):
and he did say that the stronger Futures legislation is
federal legislation. We all understand that, but did he declare
the conflict before discussions on this?
Speaker 2 (10:34):
So, Katie I said, at the time, I wasn't aware
of whether he did or not. I mean, I probably
could not tell you. I wasn't the chair of Cabinet
at the time. I couldn't tell you whether Selena or
Nari or Kate or anybody at any given time has
declared a conflict around specific things.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
It's on the minute.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
Surely it's on some kind of minutes that you'd be
able to go back and have a look at that.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
There is a record of cabinet discussions, but I haven't
gone back and had a look at those.
Speaker 3 (11:02):
But Katie, is.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
He assured because it's a question of whether Territorians can
trust him or not.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Well, so he has always disclosed those shares. There was
no decision made, so the Stronger Futures legislation was decisions
that were made by the federal government, So there was
no you know, that was what he He.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
Did advocate very strongly though, for those for the Stronger
Futures legislation not to stay in place, and he advocated
very strongly saying that it was race based politics. So
what people are trying to get to the bottom of
is whether they can trust him.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Well, kat Katie, I mean their conversations with Chancey and
I know you've had those, but you know I trust
Chancey absolutely. I trust Chancey.
Speaker 3 (11:44):
But you know we.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
All have we all have had disclosures. Those are done
every and where they're about to be updated. Kathleen Robinson,
I've said is going to do a review of is
going to do a review of all the conflicts of
interest because and I think Selena used the word it
is clunky, so it needs to be clear around that.
But you know that's what happens in cabinet. People do
(12:06):
make their conflicts known and that's part of than the
discussions during it.
Speaker 1 (12:10):
So you don't feel that, you know, you don't feel
that there is any issue now for.
Speaker 3 (12:14):
Your government in terms of.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
That trust issue with Chancey Paig as the Attorney General.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
No, I don't feel there is, Katie. You know Chancey
has then since then sold those shares and I think
I think everybody sold chairs, even Robin Lamley I think
said she sold her shares. So I think that you know,
we've all moved on from that shares issue. Yeah, it's
been really difficult for everybody. We do want the best
(12:41):
people in Parliament and I think in the past you're
having shares was seen as something that you could manage,
but obviously from the perceptions of the public it's something
that people don't want to see. They don't want to
see politicians with shares, so I think it's a better
position now. Kathleen Robinson will provide that review, which I
don't know what it'll say, but I do know that
(13:03):
we need to be able to update our register a
lot more often, so it's not just every twelve months,
particularly for ministers. So there's two separate parts to the shares.
There's the front facing one around conflicts that the public sees,
but then ministers have additional ones which are only updated
every twelve months. So we do need to improve the
way that we report conflicts.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
All right, Chief Minister.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
The Coronial inquest gets back under way today into the
death of.
Speaker 3 (13:29):
Kumen Ji Walker.
Speaker 1 (13:31):
Zachary Rolf, who was charged with mister Walker's murder but
later acquitted by a Supreme Court jury, is expected to
answer questions. Last week, though one police sergeant, Lee Bowen's
faced questions about racist text message that will text messages
that he'd exchanged with former Constable Zachary Rolf. On Friday,
it was revealed that he'd sent a text describing Aboriginal
(13:53):
people as well. Bush, I won't say the word. Do
you think an officer who you u says that kind
of language should keep their job? Oh?
Speaker 2 (14:03):
Look, I'll leave that to the coronial, because it is
obviously one that is you know, it is very very
difficult situation to be in and I can see, you know,
the difficulty for Elizabeth Armitage around this. I think our
police do cross cultural training, and I think the vast
majority of our police force people who have a comprehensive
(14:27):
understanding of Obriiginal people because they work with them every day.
We know the facts are that I think eighty five
percent of people in our in our detention centers are
Aboriginal people. So I think our police force comes in
contact with Aboriginal people. That may be one of the
recommendations from the Coronial is that there might be great
(14:47):
cross cultural understandings.
Speaker 3 (14:48):
But I think the police.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Are pretty well known that you just don't say things
like that though, And I guess it's probably quite shocking
for people to realize, you know, to think that a
serving member has.
Speaker 2 (14:58):
Yeah, I think it is. Of course, it's shocking. It's
shocking language. And you know, I'm not going to, as said,
buy into all of that. I'll leave Elizabeth Armitage to
do her job. She's got probably one of the most
difficult jobs in the Northern Territory.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
But it is.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
Yeah, it's a parent language. It's not language that we
want to see in the Northern Territory. But again, as
I said, our police force work under tough conditions as.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
Well, Chief Minister. One last quick one Tourism Central Australia.
They've written to you, as I understand it, asking for
a relaxation on alcohol restrictions in Alice Springs.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
Have you received that letter?
Speaker 2 (15:33):
Yeah, I have apparently got it. It's come through my office.
I haven't read it myself, but apparently it's come in
through my mailing system. I spoke to somebody this morning
about it. I can understand where Tourism Central Australia are
coming from, but you know, we do need to have
a really good look to see how it's working in
Central Australia because I know Congress have been very happy
(15:54):
with the changes around Monday and Tuesday, not having alcohol,
takeaway alcohol. You know there are still alcohol and alice springs.
You can buy alcohol at a at a bar, but
you know, at a restaurant, all of those sorts of things.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
So what do you make of them?
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Sort of saying that that that after that relaxation of
alcohol restrictions, sorry, after they you know, the restrictions came
into place, the letter says that those laws have resulted
in fifty percent of like a fifty percent decrease for
some of those for some of those tourism businesses.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
So yeah, as I said, I would, I need to
have a look at that data around that. I mean,
we're putting in the territory tourism discount scheme, so we're,
you know, which is about a million dollars trying to
stimulate the economy. Those restrictions were put in place as
a result of the issues that we saw in Central Australia.
So if Congress are telling me things are better with
their admissions to hospital or you know, all of those angles,
(16:48):
we have to weigh up all of those things. So, yes,
can they be wound back? Maybe they can be wound
back partially. They're the things that Brent potterill you know
bring to bring to our discussions around that. But this
stage Monday and Tuesday you can't buy takeaway. Yes, if
you're a tourist coming through, are you a gray nomad?
Do you know you have to buy your our call
it before you get Talis Springs or is there some
(17:11):
other way of doing that? But you know, we will
continue to work with tourism Central Australia. We do want
a strong tourist industry in Central Australia.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
It's a tough jugle right now between that and then
the social issues that you obviously are seeing there. Like
it's tough to weigh those two things up.
Speaker 2 (17:26):
Yeah, it is, And I mean not all tourists drink
and a lot of them may be able to purchase
their alcohol before they get Talis Springs. So they're the
things that you work through. But I mean you need
to make decisions based on evidence and that's important around that.
But we'll continue to work around We know that how
just how difficult the issue is around olcohol in the
Northern Territory, but you know it underpins a lot of
(17:48):
these things that we're seeing.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
Chief Minister evil Ala, we better leave it there. I
know you've got to get to a meeting. Thanks so
much for your time this morning.
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