Kerre Woodham: Let the police get back to policing

There simply must be a better way of dealing with mental health patients rather than relying on police. For years now, police men and women have been left to pick up the pieces of broken minds because of a lack of resources within the beleaguered mental health sector. But more than the lack of resources is the lack of will on the part of the mental health sector. When you're overworked, when you're under resourced, and you have somebody else doing the heavy lifting, (that is the police) why on Earth would you make more work for yourself? Why on Earth would you if you were a crisis counsellor, a mental health worker, go out on strike and demand that you be given resourcing for crisis teams to go and pick up the mentally unwell and stop the police doing it? You're just not going to, are you? You've got bigger fish to fry simply putting one foot in front of the other and getting through the shift.  

But it is simply not right that the police are the babysitters for the mentally ill, simply because no other government agency will do it. They won't, and they know the police are last resort. Hospital staff say they can't be left to look after people who are a danger to themselves and other people. They don't have the resources or the personnel, and I have seen the charge nurses in ED’s going no, no, you needn't think you're leaving her here to the police officers who bring them in. I haven't got the people. I cannot have two or three nurses sitting here looking after this person while we wait for them to be seen, when really there's nothing physically wrong with them. Nothing. I've got screaming babies running high temperatures. I've got people who can't breathe. I've got broken arms. I've got seven ambulances out the back.  

And the police can't leave somebody who is having an episode on their own. And the reason they can't is because nobody else will take the responsibility and nobody else cares, because they have to care more about what's in front of them. Mental health workers say they simply can't produce crisis teams out of thin air, people who are trained to defuse tense situations and provide the sort of triaging necessary when dealing with somebody who's in the midst of a mental health crisis. But that's not the job of the police, either. And yet they're left with it because they can't strike. They can't lobby, and they can't strike, and they can't refuse. And so, because of that, other government agencies are using and abusing them. The police in the past haven't been able to say we haven't got the staff either, and besides, this is not our job. Until now.  

Recent changes have seen officers not attending 111 calls relating to mental health if there is no immediate risk to safety or if it's deemed no immediate risk to safety. There are plans to transfer some of those 111 calls to the non-emergency 105 line, and police have been directed that they should only spend a maximum of 60 minutes waiting in ED’s with mental health patients, then it becomes somebody else's problem. I mean, 60 minutes, you're not going to be seen in 60 minutes, but they are going to have to walk away and then it becomes the responsibility of the overworked ED departments. At least they have the luxury of striking. The nurses can say no, we're not doing this until we get the staff, until we get the highly trained staff we need to be able to manage these patients. The police don't have that option. It's the mental health workers and the health agencies who need to be lobbying for extra resources, extra staff, the ability to care for these people, not the police. And what the hell are the police doing there in the first place? Most of these patients that they're dealing with are sad, not bad. They're just very sad people in the midst of a mental health crisis who haven't committed a crime. What the hell are the police doing there? They're there because it's been dumped on them, because other agencies know they can't refuse.  

Mark Mitchell said yesterday that police need to draw a line in the sand.  

“There's always going to be times when police are going to be required, but there's many times that there aren't, and I think that the rest of the system has got used to always having the police. The police have always been seen as that 24/7 government agency and over time, they've picked up a whole lot of work that is not their core role, and other agencies are going to have to step up. They are going to have to build out some more capability. We are going to have to get smart around triaging and, and identifying what the actual need is and how we best respond to that. I know that it's been about a 60% increase in mental health call outs for police. Like I said to you that that is not sustainable.  

“Look, if I use another example, I've been

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Carrywood and Morning's podcast from News Talks,
he'd be there.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
Simply has to be a better way of dealing with
mental health patients rather than relying on police. For years now,
policemen and women have been left to pick up the
pieces of broken minds because of a lack of resources
within the beleagued mental health sector. But more than the
lack of resources is the lack of will on the

(00:34):
part of the mental health sector. When you're overworked, when
you're under resourced, and you have somebody else doing the
heavy lifting, that is the police, why on earth would
you make more work for yourself. Why on earth would you,
if you were a crisis counselor a mental health worker,

(00:59):
go out on strike and demand that you be given
res sourcing for crisis teams to go and pick up
the mentally unwell and stop the police doing it. You're
just not going to, are you. You've got bigger fish
to fry, simply putting one foot in front of the
other and getting through the shift. But it is simply

(01:21):
not right that the police are the babysitters for the
mentally ills, simply because no other government agency will do it.
They won't and they know the police are last resort.
Hospital staff say they can't be left to look after
people who are a danger to themselves and other people.

(01:41):
They don't have the resources or the personnel. And I
have seen the charged nurses and Ned's going mmmmmmm. You
needn't think you're leaving a here to the police officers
or bringer In or Himan. No, I haven't got the people.
I cannot have two or three nurses sitting here looking
after this person while we wait for them to be seen,

(02:03):
when really there's nothing physically wrong with them. Nothing. I've
got screaming babies running high temperatures. I've got people who
can't breathe, I've got broken arms, I've got the lot. No,
I'm not doing it. I've got seven ambulances out the
back and one of the police.

Speaker 1 (02:23):
Can't leave.

Speaker 2 (02:25):
Somebody who is having an episode on their own. And
the reason they can't is because nobody else will. Nobody
else will take the responsibility, and nobody else cares because
they have to care more about what's in front of them.
Mental health workers say they simply can't produce crisis teams

(02:48):
out of thin air. People who are trained to diffuse
tense situations and provide the sort of triaging necessary when
dealing with somebody who's in the midst of a mental
health crisis. But that's not the job of the police either,
and yet they're left with it because they can't strike,
they can't lobby, and they can't strike, and they can't refuse,

(03:13):
and so because of that, other government agencies are using
them and abusing them. The police in the past haven't
been able to say, yeah, well, we haven't got the
staff either, and besides, this is not our job. Until now,

(03:33):
recent changes have seen officers not attending one one one
calls relating to mental health if there is no immediate
risk to safety or if it's deemed no immediate risk
to safety. There are plans to transfer some of those
one to one one calls to the non emergency one
zero five line, and police have been directed that they

(03:54):
should only spend a maximum of sixty minutes waiting in
eds with mental health patients. Then it becomes somebody else's problem.
I mean sixty minutes. You're not going to be seen
in sixty minutes.

Speaker 3 (04:06):
But.

Speaker 2 (04:08):
They are going to have to walk away, and then
it becomes the responsibility of the overworked ed departments, ed
nurses and doctors. At least they have the luxury of striking.
The nurses can say no, we're not doing this until
we get the staff, until we get the highly trained

(04:29):
staff we need to be able to manage these patients.
The police don't have that option. It's the mental health
workers and the health agencies who need to be lobbying
for extra resources, extra staff, the ability to care for
these people, not the police. And what the hell are
the police doing there in the first place. Most of

(04:53):
these patients that they're dealing with are sad, not bad.
They're just very sad people in the midst of a
mental health crisis who haven't committed a crime. What the
hell are the police doing there? They're there because it's
been dumped on them because other agencies know they can't refuse.

(05:14):
Mart Mitchell said yesterday that police need to draw a
line in the sand.

Speaker 3 (05:19):
There's always going to be times when police are going
to be required, but there's many times that there aren't,
and I think that the rest of the system has
got used to always having the police. The police has
always been seen as the twenty four to seven government agency,
and over time they've picked up a whole lot of
work that is not their core role, and other agencies
are going to have to step up and they are
going to have to build out some more capability. We
are going to have to get smart around triarging and

(05:41):
identifying what the actual need is and how we best
respond to that. I know that it's been about a
sixty percent increase in mental health callouts for police. Like
I said to you that that is not sustainable. Looking
if I use another example I've been out of nightshift
for the staff, is that you had an eye carr
and incident car which is two police officers in it
that was called to a young woman that was having

(06:03):
thoughts of self harm nineteen years now. She needs proper support,
She needs proper mental health and health for sport support
wrapped around her. Those police officers were tied up for
an entire shift sitting in an ed I'm looking after it.
They're not trained to do that. And when people are
actually putting up their hands, when they are having to
try and survive a violent domestic and there isn't a

(06:25):
police card to attend. Because the sitting in an ed
baby sitting and looking after someone that should actually be
getting some proper mental health support. Then you know that
the system is not working. Probably it's certainly not working
properly for us as a country. It's not working properly
for the victims that actually need that support, need a
police there when they put their hand up for help.

Speaker 2 (06:44):
Amen to that, Where should people go when a family
member is having a mental health crisis. Surely, to goodness,
the first port of call would be a mental health
crisis team, not the police. When the asylums were closed,
when the mental hospitals were closed, patients the community will

(07:07):
promised that there would be the care necessary for those
who find life tough. That hasn't happened, and there needs
to be a line drawn in the sand. Just because
the police have been the last resort for so many years,
It's time to stop and make the agencies that should

(07:27):
be in charge of these people, that should be giving
them the help and the sucker and the sort of
tools they need to try and rebuild their life. It's
mental health agencies, public health agency's job, not the job
of police. Let the police get back to policing.

Speaker 1 (07:47):
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