September 6, 2025 • 17 mins
Former Labour minister Stuart Nash has put his hat in the ring to be a candidate to become a New Zealand First MP at the party's AGM this weekend.
Nash was sacked from Cabinet in 2023 after disclosing confidentiall information from a Cabinet meeting to two businessmen.
Now, Winston Peters says he would be a 'seamless' addition.
LISTEN ABOVE
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News talks 'b.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
So Yes, former Labor Minister Stuart Nash has put his
hat in the ring to be a candidate to become
a New Zealand First MP at the party's agm this weekend.
He did that and he was Stuart Nash. Did I
say hop for a lot? The name right? Yes, Chase. Anyway,
Nash was sat from cabinet in twenty twenty three after
disclosing confidential information from a cabinet meeting to two businessmen.
(00:33):
And now the will comes toable circle and Winston Peters
says he will be a seamless addition to New Zealand First.
And Stuart Nash is with me now. Happy Father's Day.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
Happy Father's Day to you too and to all your listeners.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Yeah, how long have you felt drawn to New Zealand First?
Speaker 4 (00:51):
Okay, let me start by saying I actually didn't put
my hat in the ring on my hand up via
New Zealand First MP. I had been on the radio
commentating for a little while about about my political allegiances
and where I see things and my politics like quite
squarely New Zilm First at the moment for a whole
number of reasons we can talk about if you'd like,
But yesterday's speech was a was not a play to
(01:13):
be in New Zilm First.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
MP.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
It feels like that's where it's going, isn't it?
Speaker 4 (01:20):
Well potentially, but you know, I'm not so arrogant to
think that I can just you know, give a speech
Whilston when there's a whole party process to go through
in terms of determining who will stand where, how things
will get sorted. So you know, there is a process
to go through. Whether I go through that process or
not remains to be seen. But at this stage, I
just do want to be clear. No decision has been
made by myself or the party, but I think I
(01:43):
made it very clear that my allegiances at this point,
certainly in terms of politics and the way politics has
played and the policy is out there in the way
that delivery is undertaken. New Ziolm First is the party
that that I sort of more clossely linted than anyone
out there at the moment.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
Okay, I must say just about everyone I've spoken to
just assumes it's a foregone conclusion that you're going to
stick your hat in the ring to be a candidate.
Have you had conversations. I mean, we're talking about selection processes.
I guess that you can't assume you're going to be
a candidate, but do you want to be a candidate.
Speaker 4 (02:19):
Look at this stage, I've got a business that I'm
working incredibly hard on building, and that's I'm bringing high
net worth individuals into the country, making them feel valued
and welcomed. I'm enjoying that. But I haven't said that
I will not stand from Jilm First. So but no
(02:39):
final decision has been made, and as mentioned, you know,
until the new Zilm First party list comes out, until
the candidates are named, then I don't think anyone can
make any assumptions about.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
What things will look like.
Speaker 4 (02:51):
But you know, I will be clear, and I think
I made it reasonably clear yesterday that my values are
the core values of the Labor Party as they were
for the first fifty years. I think the Labor Party
these days has almost become the political wing of the
union movement, as opposed to the party that once stood
up for good, hard work and keys no matter what
(03:12):
they were, who they were, what race they were, where
they lived, and it used to be a very very
broad party that stood for all workers. The quote I
used was the one that Julia Gillard gave and she
gave her first press conference upon becoming Australian MP, and
it's something to the lines of, you know, she wants
to have a party that stands up for those that
(03:33):
worked the hardest as opposed to complain the loudest.
Speaker 3 (03:35):
And I don't think that Labor's doing that at the moment.
Speaker 2 (03:38):
You did say, and I just want to clarify something
because there might be a few people are confused about this.
And look, I've heard you having a chat with Heather
on the huddleine things and obviously the announcement that you
aligned with New Zealand First is not much of a surprise.
But you've said until the party list comes out, So
what is the process from here on in if you
(03:59):
are going to be a candidate for New Zealand First.
Speaker 4 (04:02):
Well, look, every party goes through a process of determine
who was going to be on their party list. Obviously
you know that's the basis of m MP. I'm not
ruling out being in Jillan First MP at all. I
just want to make that clear. But what I'm not
saying is that it's a fate accomplished.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
I know, yeah, I understand that, but where are your wishes?
Speaker 4 (04:24):
If I was ever going to stand for parliament again,
then it would be with the jailm first. But I think,
you know, I don't think you would speak to any
former cabinet minister who didn't say I left politics without
with unfinished business. You know, every minister that I've spoken to,
doesn't matter what hugh, how long they've been there, has
always said there was always more to do. And for me,
(04:46):
there was certainly unfinished business. You know, there are many
things that I was working on, to policies that I
thought would have made New Zealand a better country, would
have served our business as well and our people well.
And you know, if you think the principles of the
original Labor Party or the Labor Party, you know, the
sort of first three governments, they were about working in
the Clark government, to be fair, they were about working
(05:08):
hard for families, building national infrastructure, standing up for those
that didn't have a voice, working really hard for families,
ensuring that there was work for even who wanted it.
I don't know if the Labor Party stands for that.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
These days.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
I'll be interested to know what your calls think.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
Well, we've got to throw some things for talk back
for them once we're finished, which I'm not near concluding
this yet. So what has to happen for you to
become a candidate that ends up on the party list?
What is missing in the process? Now do you have
to do? You have to say to Winston or to
(05:45):
the party now, I want to do it because it
felt like that was the energy of what was happening yesterday.
What has to happen now?
Speaker 3 (05:53):
And absolutely that's the case.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
So what happens with every party, not just New Zilm First,
but certainly with New Zilm First. As nominations are open,
you put your hat in the ring if you want
to be in Jilm First MP.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
They go through that.
Speaker 4 (06:06):
You know, there is a selection process that's undertaken by
key party holders within key official holders within the party
and then they will come out with a party list
that to which then they go to the public work
and say, if you want New Zealand First and government,
these are the people who're putting forward. And you know
if I put my hand up then then I will
be on that list.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Welcome back, to politics because God, I'm telling you what,
it does feel a bit blurry when it felt clear
ten minutes ago.
Speaker 4 (06:36):
Well, look, I think what happened yesterday and then a
lot of the media there was an absolute assumption that
I was going back into politics with New Zealand First
there was a very clear you know, all the headlines
said that Stuart Nash has put a hand up to
be in New Zealand First MP and it's a pay
to complete. My point, I suppose is I'm not so
(06:56):
arrogant to assume that I can just turn up and
you know, let me start by saying, when I was
in cabinet from twenty seventeen to twenty twenty, I went
very close with Shane and Winston. I have an immense
amount of respect for Winston Peters. I consider Shane a
friend of mine. I get on well with the New
Zealand First MPs and people that I know, and the
staff is that I know, and their policies are very
(07:18):
in the way they delivered their policies and the pragmatism
very closely aligns with what I believe, and that is
New Zealanders. Don't you sort of want a vision for
twenty fifty. They want to know what the world's going
to look like in six twelve months time and how
politicians going to get there, and that pragmatic policy delivery
play that New Zealand First is expert at. It's my
(07:39):
own political philosophy. But I just want to be clear that,
you know, if they probably being New Zealand First people
listening who have worked really hard in the party and
may want to be MP's and go, you know, who
does this character think he has just come waltzing in
and thinking he's got a good, great place on my list?
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Yeah, I guess, but that wouldn't stop you saying I
intend to put a nomination and I want to have
a crack.
Speaker 3 (07:59):
Well, look, let's wait and see.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
I mean, but okay, okay, I'm not going.
Speaker 4 (08:05):
To announce on your show that I'm standing for New
Zealand First. But I think it's pretty clear anyone who's
read the headlines or listen to my speech that this
is where my political flights.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Okay, so we're heading in that we're heading in that direction,
as we could say, subject to your own humility and
whether the party wants you. Is that a fair Okay,
that's a fair Okay, crikey. Okay, So have you had
specific or general conversations with Winston Peters about becoming a candidate?
Speaker 4 (08:38):
Yes, I have, and with other staffers. I mean, I look,
some of your listeners are going to be going, oh
my god, here we go, bloody politics. Can't even answer
a straight question. But but I do want to be
very clear about there is approaches to go through. And seriously, Matte,
I don't want to see miss arrogant to think that
like Miss Wilson. Okay, but I wouldn't have been there
(08:58):
yesterday if I hadn't had conversations with Winston and a
number of others. Okay, So yeah, I think we can
we can leave that and that's pretty clear, and I
think your listeners will give a clear view out.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Yeah, well Claire is mud, but I think we get
the gist. Now, look what about Okay, these are the
let's have a discussion about some of the challenges you're
going to have if you become a candidate for New Zealand. First,
I saw on the news last night that you said
that Chris Hipkins should have had your back, and it
was almost I got the feeling that you were sort
(09:33):
of putting the blame somewhere else when in fact, you know,
let's let's not be around the bush. You did breach
the cabinet confidentiality rules, and so.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
David Seymour breaches the cabinet confidence you can have confidences
every single week when he comes out there and he says,
kbinet decided this, I didn't agree with it. That is
a fundamental breach in the cabinet rules.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
I didn't agree with that as opposed to as opposed
to I think you said you particularly gave views to
these people outside cabinet of what other people's views were,
which is specifically against the cabinet manual. I guess look.
Speaker 4 (10:07):
I've owned I owned the fact that I made mistakes,
and I'm not saying that I didn't, and there's no
doubt about that. You know, there are three things I did.
First of all, I phoned Andrew Costa, who was the
then Commissioner of Police. I was not the Minister of Police.
There was a case that came out when I was
(10:27):
Minister of Police. I've been wondering around the country saying
to everyone, if you have illegal firearms, or if you
do not have a firearms license, or you commit a
crime involving firearms, we're going to go after you. And
there was a chap down in the South and who
had illegal firearms. He didn't have a license, he had
a legal ammunition and he got home detention. And I
thought that was outrageous. Considering as minister, I thought I
(10:52):
had been very clean, sent a very clear message to
the judiciary through legislation that this was our expectation. So
I was talking to Andy, who was a good friend
of Mine's commissioner and still is a good friend of mine,
And even Andy himself said he just thought it was.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Advent But hadn't you also spoken to the donors about
what particular members of cabinet had been opposed to such
So what happened here? You did end up getting the
sack for it, and I guess, well, I guess we
can restruction.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
So there were two of at the time, the two
largest landlords in Wellington during COVIDU were very good friends
of mine and donors and had done the right thing
in terms of giving rent relief to their tenets that
they had so they had done the right thing. There
were a number of large Australian well predominantly but not
(11:42):
exclusively landlords who hadn't done the right thing. I was
working with these guys to come up with a workable
solution to ensure that the other landlords who hadn't done
the right thing would be required to do the right thing.
We put a paper to cabinet. I thought that I
had got it across the line. I didn't. The Prime
Minister had gone out and articulated the policy that that
(12:04):
cabin had agree on. I sent a message to my
two guys who had done a lot of work on this, said, sorry, guys,
I thought we got this across the line.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
We didn't.
Speaker 4 (12:13):
And I mentioned two names of people who spoke against this,
so you know, I didn't give them any confidential information.
They were never going to benefit from this in any way,
shape or form. It was advising to guys who had
worked on a policy that we didn't get it across
the line. Now, yes, that is a breach of cabinet
policy because what I did is I divulged cabinet discussions
(12:35):
to two guys who'd worked on a paper that was
in front of cabinet and technically I should not have done.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
Doesn't it mean as a result of that, is there
a journey that you have to undertake to re establish
trust with one your fellow politicians if you end up
being a candidate, and also if you ended up being
a minister. You've been a minister before. I mean, you
know most people would imagined years. Yeah, yeah, exactly. But
is there an issue of you having to rebuild trust
with other political colleagues as well as the public because
(13:01):
of those headlines? Shall we say?
Speaker 3 (13:04):
Well?
Speaker 4 (13:05):
I think I had reputation as a minister for getting
stuff done. I worked incredibly hard. I was renowned for
reading all my papers, for being completely over my portfolios,
challenging officials when I thought they got it wrong, and saying, officials,
this is the way we're going to do it. If
I didn't agree with them, you know, there was no
(13:25):
concern about me and my ability to handle the workload
and to understand the issues and come up with solutions.
That's what, in my opinion, good ministers need to do,
and that's what I did. Now I have very firm
ideas on certain things that we need to do. Did
I breach the cabinet, man, I've owned that, mate, I've
owned it for the last two years, and I've apologized
(13:46):
and I said that I got that wrong, and I'm
the first to admit that was it an egregious breach
of the cabinet manner.
Speaker 3 (13:53):
It was a breach. I suppose what.
Speaker 4 (13:55):
I was saying yesterday is of course being sacked from
cabinet hurt.
Speaker 3 (14:00):
Of course it did.
Speaker 4 (14:02):
But I also mentioned that. You know, one of the
things that the second call that I got in trouble
for is when I was a local MP, two surgeons
came into my office from Hawks Bay, I don't know
who they were and said we are leaving the country
because immigration policy, immigration is not moving fast enough. I
was the chief mby minister. I phoned up the guy
(14:23):
who was in charge of immigration, said can you take
a look at this. We cannot afford to lose this.
I was told that was a poor form of a
poor use in my power.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
I'll tell you what, mate, I will jump in there
because we've got to I do it and we need
to wrap up the interview on the march. But I
mean that stuff is public record.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
It's a matter of public record. Absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
I guess the question is I hate saying repeating if
you went sacked from labor, but if you hadn't been
sacked from Labor. If that, if you hadn't left for
whatever reason, would you still be with them now? If
that hadn't happened.
Speaker 4 (14:57):
Well, I would have stood for Labor, and I suspect
I would have held my seat and I'd be sitting
in a caucus at the moment going come on, guys,
we need to do a hell of a lot better
in engaging with the public because at the moment we're
not telling a story that our supporters need to hear.
And I've been waiting for two years to hear a
story from Labor around what they're going to do to
make life better for good hard work and keywis and
(15:18):
I'm just not hearing what they think or their vision
is for New Zeale. Now, the other thing I would
say is I've been very clear there is no way
I could ever vote for Labor if the party Marri
was to be any formal any part of coalition supplying
confidence I get. And I have no idea why Chris
Sipkins hasn't come out and explicitly ruled out cloesh Warbook
(15:40):
from ever being Minister of Finance. I think her ideas
are not only natty, they are actually harmful to our economy.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
So I've got a text here that's I'll just read
it to you as one of our closing questions. It's
despite as humble protestations I am aware of. I've just
got to scroll down here. Despite his humble protestations. It
sounds to me like Stuart's just looking for a gig.
Speaker 4 (16:03):
Oh, for goodness sake, you know think that politics is
an easy gig. You go in there and you're on
the pigs back, then think again. You know when I
was a minister, it was eighty ninety one hundred hours
a week. You lose touch with friends, you don't see
your family, you're very really home. It is an incredible
amount of work. And it is not for the faint hearted.
(16:24):
I mean, you know your listeners will know of ministers
who just have been able to cut the mustard and
they end up leaving politics broken people. This is not
an easy gig. And I'm no longer a young man.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
We're still beach pressing eighty kilos, aren't you?
Speaker 4 (16:39):
One hundred?
Speaker 3 (16:42):
Get that right? Okay?
Speaker 4 (16:44):
Minimum amount of exercise. There's no such thing as a
minimu amount. People should start.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
You can tune in for you can tune in for
the health I'll just stick around. Just one last question
is Stuart, what did you do for Father's Day? Do
you manage to have some family time or you've been
hanging out with Winston and Shane and the rest.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
No, I did well.
Speaker 4 (17:00):
We live in people who know Nape yet we live
on the Marine Parade. And my wife got up, she
wandered down to a cafe, got me a coffee and
made me bricks and bed, which was delightful. She's a
very good woman. And then we went out to lunch
with my mother in law and father in law, my
four children, my wonderful wife, and my sister. So and
(17:20):
then I did a little bit of stuff around the
house and.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Then you danced around on the head of a pen
with me.
Speaker 4 (17:24):
So, hey, look, look, that's what I would like to do.
Because there were obviously questions here that people have about
I don't know if it's about my interviewed, but where
I see things and what I want to achieve. If
you ever want to have a session where it's all
about just taking phone calls, I'm happy.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
To do that.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
Yeah, you got it. That sounds like you're on campaign
note already. Stewart but hey, thanks, thanks, good time, Happy
Father's Day. I appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (17:48):
Thanks good sure bye bye.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to news
Talks It'd be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News talks 'b.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
So Yes, former Labor Minister Stuart Nash has put his
hat in the ring to be a candidate to become
a New Zealand First MP at the party's agm this weekend.
He did that and he was Stuart Nash. Did I
say hop for a lot? The name right? Yes, Chase. Anyway,
Nash was sat from cabinet in twenty twenty three after
disclosing confidential information from a cabinet meeting to two businessmen.
(00:33):
And now the will comes toable circle and Winston Peters
says he will be a seamless addition to New Zealand First.
And Stuart Nash is with me now. Happy Father's Day.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
Happy Father's Day to you too and to all your listeners.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Yeah, how long have you felt drawn to New Zealand First?
Speaker 4 (00:51):
Okay, let me start by saying I actually didn't put
my hat in the ring on my hand up via
New Zealand First MP. I had been on the radio
commentating for a little while about about my political allegiances
and where I see things and my politics like quite
squarely New Zilm First at the moment for a whole
number of reasons we can talk about if you'd like,
But yesterday's speech was a was not a play to
(01:13):
be in New Zilm First.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
MP.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
It feels like that's where it's going, isn't it?
Speaker 4 (01:20):
Well potentially, but you know, I'm not so arrogant to
think that I can just you know, give a speech
Whilston when there's a whole party process to go through
in terms of determining who will stand where, how things
will get sorted. So you know, there is a process
to go through. Whether I go through that process or
not remains to be seen. But at this stage, I
just do want to be clear. No decision has been
made by myself or the party, but I think I
(01:43):
made it very clear that my allegiances at this point,
certainly in terms of politics and the way politics has
played and the policy is out there in the way
that delivery is undertaken. New Ziolm First is the party
that that I sort of more clossely linted than anyone
out there at the moment.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
Okay, I must say just about everyone I've spoken to
just assumes it's a foregone conclusion that you're going to
stick your hat in the ring to be a candidate.
Have you had conversations. I mean, we're talking about selection processes.
I guess that you can't assume you're going to be
a candidate, but do you want to be a candidate.
Speaker 4 (02:19):
Look at this stage, I've got a business that I'm
working incredibly hard on building, and that's I'm bringing high
net worth individuals into the country, making them feel valued
and welcomed. I'm enjoying that. But I haven't said that
I will not stand from Jilm First. So but no
(02:39):
final decision has been made, and as mentioned, you know,
until the new Zilm First party list comes out, until
the candidates are named, then I don't think anyone can
make any assumptions about.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
What things will look like.
Speaker 4 (02:51):
But you know, I will be clear, and I think
I made it reasonably clear yesterday that my values are
the core values of the Labor Party as they were
for the first fifty years. I think the Labor Party
these days has almost become the political wing of the
union movement, as opposed to the party that once stood
up for good, hard work and keys no matter what
(03:12):
they were, who they were, what race they were, where
they lived, and it used to be a very very
broad party that stood for all workers. The quote I
used was the one that Julia Gillard gave and she
gave her first press conference upon becoming Australian MP, and
it's something to the lines of, you know, she wants
to have a party that stands up for those that
(03:33):
worked the hardest as opposed to complain the loudest.
Speaker 3 (03:35):
And I don't think that Labor's doing that at the moment.
Speaker 2 (03:38):
You did say, and I just want to clarify something
because there might be a few people are confused about this.
And look, I've heard you having a chat with Heather
on the huddleine things and obviously the announcement that you
aligned with New Zealand First is not much of a surprise.
But you've said until the party list comes out, So
what is the process from here on in if you
(03:59):
are going to be a candidate for New Zealand First.
Speaker 4 (04:02):
Well, look, every party goes through a process of determine
who was going to be on their party list. Obviously
you know that's the basis of m MP. I'm not
ruling out being in Jillan First MP at all. I
just want to make that clear. But what I'm not
saying is that it's a fate accomplished.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
I know, yeah, I understand that, but where are your wishes?
Speaker 4 (04:24):
If I was ever going to stand for parliament again,
then it would be with the jailm first. But I think,
you know, I don't think you would speak to any
former cabinet minister who didn't say I left politics without
with unfinished business. You know, every minister that I've spoken to,
doesn't matter what hugh, how long they've been there, has
always said there was always more to do. And for me,
(04:46):
there was certainly unfinished business. You know, there are many
things that I was working on, to policies that I
thought would have made New Zealand a better country, would
have served our business as well and our people well.
And you know, if you think the principles of the
original Labor Party or the Labor Party, you know, the
sort of first three governments, they were about working in
the Clark government, to be fair, they were about working
(05:08):
hard for families, building national infrastructure, standing up for those
that didn't have a voice, working really hard for families,
ensuring that there was work for even who wanted it.
I don't know if the Labor Party stands for that.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
These days.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
I'll be interested to know what your calls think.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
Well, we've got to throw some things for talk back
for them once we're finished, which I'm not near concluding
this yet. So what has to happen for you to
become a candidate that ends up on the party list?
What is missing in the process? Now do you have
to do? You have to say to Winston or to
(05:45):
the party now, I want to do it because it
felt like that was the energy of what was happening yesterday.
What has to happen now?
Speaker 3 (05:53):
And absolutely that's the case.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
So what happens with every party, not just New Zilm First,
but certainly with New Zilm First. As nominations are open,
you put your hat in the ring if you want
to be in Jilm First MP.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
They go through that.
Speaker 4 (06:06):
You know, there is a selection process that's undertaken by
key party holders within key official holders within the party
and then they will come out with a party list
that to which then they go to the public work
and say, if you want New Zealand First and government,
these are the people who're putting forward. And you know
if I put my hand up then then I will
be on that list.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Welcome back, to politics because God, I'm telling you what,
it does feel a bit blurry when it felt clear
ten minutes ago.
Speaker 4 (06:36):
Well, look, I think what happened yesterday and then a
lot of the media there was an absolute assumption that
I was going back into politics with New Zealand First
there was a very clear you know, all the headlines
said that Stuart Nash has put a hand up to
be in New Zealand First MP and it's a pay
to complete. My point, I suppose is I'm not so
(06:56):
arrogant to assume that I can just turn up and
you know, let me start by saying, when I was
in cabinet from twenty seventeen to twenty twenty, I went
very close with Shane and Winston. I have an immense
amount of respect for Winston Peters. I consider Shane a
friend of mine. I get on well with the New
Zealand First MPs and people that I know, and the
staff is that I know, and their policies are very
(07:18):
in the way they delivered their policies and the pragmatism
very closely aligns with what I believe, and that is
New Zealanders. Don't you sort of want a vision for
twenty fifty. They want to know what the world's going
to look like in six twelve months time and how
politicians going to get there, and that pragmatic policy delivery
play that New Zealand First is expert at. It's my
(07:39):
own political philosophy. But I just want to be clear that,
you know, if they probably being New Zealand First people
listening who have worked really hard in the party and
may want to be MP's and go, you know, who
does this character think he has just come waltzing in
and thinking he's got a good, great place on my list?
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Yeah, I guess, but that wouldn't stop you saying I
intend to put a nomination and I want to have
a crack.
Speaker 3 (07:59):
Well, look, let's wait and see.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
I mean, but okay, okay, I'm not going.
Speaker 4 (08:05):
To announce on your show that I'm standing for New
Zealand First. But I think it's pretty clear anyone who's
read the headlines or listen to my speech that this
is where my political flights.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Okay, so we're heading in that we're heading in that direction,
as we could say, subject to your own humility and
whether the party wants you. Is that a fair Okay,
that's a fair Okay, crikey. Okay, So have you had
specific or general conversations with Winston Peters about becoming a candidate?
Speaker 4 (08:38):
Yes, I have, and with other staffers. I mean, I look,
some of your listeners are going to be going, oh
my god, here we go, bloody politics. Can't even answer
a straight question. But but I do want to be
very clear about there is approaches to go through. And seriously, Matte,
I don't want to see miss arrogant to think that
like Miss Wilson. Okay, but I wouldn't have been there
(08:58):
yesterday if I hadn't had conversations with Winston and a
number of others. Okay, So yeah, I think we can
we can leave that and that's pretty clear, and I
think your listeners will give a clear view out.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Yeah, well Claire is mud, but I think we get
the gist. Now, look what about Okay, these are the
let's have a discussion about some of the challenges you're
going to have if you become a candidate for New Zealand. First,
I saw on the news last night that you said
that Chris Hipkins should have had your back, and it
was almost I got the feeling that you were sort
(09:33):
of putting the blame somewhere else when in fact, you know,
let's let's not be around the bush. You did breach
the cabinet confidentiality rules, and so.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
David Seymour breaches the cabinet confidence you can have confidences
every single week when he comes out there and he says,
kbinet decided this, I didn't agree with it. That is
a fundamental breach in the cabinet rules.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
I didn't agree with that as opposed to as opposed
to I think you said you particularly gave views to
these people outside cabinet of what other people's views were,
which is specifically against the cabinet manual. I guess look.
Speaker 4 (10:07):
I've owned I owned the fact that I made mistakes,
and I'm not saying that I didn't, and there's no
doubt about that. You know, there are three things I did.
First of all, I phoned Andrew Costa, who was the
then Commissioner of Police. I was not the Minister of Police.
There was a case that came out when I was
(10:27):
Minister of Police. I've been wondering around the country saying
to everyone, if you have illegal firearms, or if you
do not have a firearms license, or you commit a
crime involving firearms, we're going to go after you. And
there was a chap down in the South and who
had illegal firearms. He didn't have a license, he had
a legal ammunition and he got home detention. And I
thought that was outrageous. Considering as minister, I thought I
(10:52):
had been very clean, sent a very clear message to
the judiciary through legislation that this was our expectation. So
I was talking to Andy, who was a good friend
of Mine's commissioner and still is a good friend of mine,
And even Andy himself said he just thought it was.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Advent But hadn't you also spoken to the donors about
what particular members of cabinet had been opposed to such
So what happened here? You did end up getting the
sack for it, and I guess, well, I guess we
can restruction.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
So there were two of at the time, the two
largest landlords in Wellington during COVIDU were very good friends
of mine and donors and had done the right thing
in terms of giving rent relief to their tenets that
they had so they had done the right thing. There
were a number of large Australian well predominantly but not
(11:42):
exclusively landlords who hadn't done the right thing. I was
working with these guys to come up with a workable
solution to ensure that the other landlords who hadn't done
the right thing would be required to do the right thing.
We put a paper to cabinet. I thought that I
had got it across the line. I didn't. The Prime
Minister had gone out and articulated the policy that that
(12:04):
cabin had agree on. I sent a message to my
two guys who had done a lot of work on this, said, sorry, guys,
I thought we got this across the line.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
We didn't.
Speaker 4 (12:13):
And I mentioned two names of people who spoke against this,
so you know, I didn't give them any confidential information.
They were never going to benefit from this in any way,
shape or form. It was advising to guys who had
worked on a policy that we didn't get it across
the line. Now, yes, that is a breach of cabinet
policy because what I did is I divulged cabinet discussions
(12:35):
to two guys who'd worked on a paper that was
in front of cabinet and technically I should not have done.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
Doesn't it mean as a result of that, is there
a journey that you have to undertake to re establish
trust with one your fellow politicians if you end up
being a candidate, and also if you ended up being
a minister. You've been a minister before. I mean, you
know most people would imagined years. Yeah, yeah, exactly. But
is there an issue of you having to rebuild trust
with other political colleagues as well as the public because
(13:01):
of those headlines? Shall we say?
Speaker 3 (13:04):
Well?
Speaker 4 (13:05):
I think I had reputation as a minister for getting
stuff done. I worked incredibly hard. I was renowned for
reading all my papers, for being completely over my portfolios,
challenging officials when I thought they got it wrong, and saying, officials,
this is the way we're going to do it. If
I didn't agree with them, you know, there was no
(13:25):
concern about me and my ability to handle the workload
and to understand the issues and come up with solutions.
That's what, in my opinion, good ministers need to do,
and that's what I did. Now I have very firm
ideas on certain things that we need to do. Did
I breach the cabinet, man, I've owned that, mate, I've
owned it for the last two years, and I've apologized
(13:46):
and I said that I got that wrong, and I'm
the first to admit that was it an egregious breach
of the cabinet manner.
Speaker 3 (13:53):
It was a breach. I suppose what.
Speaker 4 (13:55):
I was saying yesterday is of course being sacked from
cabinet hurt.
Speaker 3 (14:00):
Of course it did.
Speaker 4 (14:02):
But I also mentioned that. You know, one of the
things that the second call that I got in trouble
for is when I was a local MP, two surgeons
came into my office from Hawks Bay, I don't know
who they were and said we are leaving the country
because immigration policy, immigration is not moving fast enough. I
was the chief mby minister. I phoned up the guy
(14:23):
who was in charge of immigration, said can you take
a look at this. We cannot afford to lose this.
I was told that was a poor form of a
poor use in my power.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
I'll tell you what, mate, I will jump in there
because we've got to I do it and we need
to wrap up the interview on the march. But I
mean that stuff is public record.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
It's a matter of public record. Absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
I guess the question is I hate saying repeating if
you went sacked from labor, but if you hadn't been
sacked from Labor. If that, if you hadn't left for
whatever reason, would you still be with them now? If
that hadn't happened.
Speaker 4 (14:57):
Well, I would have stood for Labor, and I suspect
I would have held my seat and I'd be sitting
in a caucus at the moment going come on, guys,
we need to do a hell of a lot better
in engaging with the public because at the moment we're
not telling a story that our supporters need to hear.
And I've been waiting for two years to hear a
story from Labor around what they're going to do to
make life better for good hard work and keywis and
(15:18):
I'm just not hearing what they think or their vision
is for New Zeale. Now, the other thing I would
say is I've been very clear there is no way
I could ever vote for Labor if the party Marri
was to be any formal any part of coalition supplying
confidence I get. And I have no idea why Chris
Sipkins hasn't come out and explicitly ruled out cloesh Warbook
(15:40):
from ever being Minister of Finance. I think her ideas
are not only natty, they are actually harmful to our economy.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
So I've got a text here that's I'll just read
it to you as one of our closing questions. It's
despite as humble protestations I am aware of. I've just
got to scroll down here. Despite his humble protestations. It
sounds to me like Stuart's just looking for a gig.
Speaker 4 (16:03):
Oh, for goodness sake, you know think that politics is
an easy gig. You go in there and you're on
the pigs back, then think again. You know when I
was a minister, it was eighty ninety one hundred hours
a week. You lose touch with friends, you don't see
your family, you're very really home. It is an incredible
amount of work. And it is not for the faint hearted.
(16:24):
I mean, you know your listeners will know of ministers
who just have been able to cut the mustard and
they end up leaving politics broken people. This is not
an easy gig. And I'm no longer a young man.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
We're still beach pressing eighty kilos, aren't you?
Speaker 4 (16:39):
One hundred?
Speaker 3 (16:42):
Get that right? Okay?
Speaker 4 (16:44):
Minimum amount of exercise. There's no such thing as a
minimu amount. People should start.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
You can tune in for you can tune in for
the health I'll just stick around. Just one last question
is Stuart, what did you do for Father's Day? Do
you manage to have some family time or you've been
hanging out with Winston and Shane and the rest.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
No, I did well.
Speaker 4 (17:00):
We live in people who know Nape yet we live
on the Marine Parade. And my wife got up, she
wandered down to a cafe, got me a coffee and
made me bricks and bed, which was delightful. She's a
very good woman. And then we went out to lunch
with my mother in law and father in law, my
four children, my wonderful wife, and my sister. So and
(17:20):
then I did a little bit of stuff around the
house and.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Then you danced around on the head of a pen
with me.
Speaker 4 (17:24):
So, hey, look, look, that's what I would like to do.
Because there were obviously questions here that people have about
I don't know if it's about my interviewed, but where
I see things and what I want to achieve. If
you ever want to have a session where it's all
about just taking phone calls, I'm happy.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
To do that.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
Yeah, you got it. That sounds like you're on campaign
note already. Stewart but hey, thanks, thanks, good time, Happy
Father's Day. I appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (17:48):
Thanks good sure bye bye.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to news
Talks It'd be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio
Popular Podcasts
NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal
Gregg Rosenthal and a rotating crew of elite NFL Media co-hosts, including Patrick Claybon, Colleen Wolfe, Steve Wyche, Nick Shook and Jourdan Rodrigue of The Athletic get you caught up daily on all the NFL news and analysis you need to be smarter and funnier than your friends.
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com