February 10, 2025 • 22 mins
On Sports Fix with D'Arcy Waldegrave for Tuesday 11 February 2025, NZ Herald rugby writer Gregor Paul runs through the financial details of INEOS pulling out of their sponsorship deal with New Zealand Rugby.
D'Arcy delivers an opinion piece on the Black Caps' impressive form before the Champions Trophy.
Plus, Newstalk ZB sports news director Clay Wilson joins the panel to discuss the Hurricanes naming four different captains for the year!
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
You're listening to a podcast from News Talks EDB. Follow
this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
This is Sportsfix Howard by News Talks EDB.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
Here we go again, Welcome int to Sports Fix. It's
a Tuesday. It's the eleventh of February twenty twenty five.
My name is Darcy Walter Grave and this podcast is
all you need to know about sport of a day,
tied up and presented in a charming bundle. On this
podcast will be joined by Gregor Paul First, the esteemed
(00:42):
New Zealand Herald sports writer, specifically in the rugby space.
Today in z Are announced they were taking a billionaire
to court because he hasn't paid his bills and doesn't
want to carry on honoring his contract. Ins and outs
and ups and downs, and we'll talk about that with Gregor.
Shortly joining us in the chamber is Clay Wilson. He's
(01:04):
News Talk zbb's sports director. We've got a couple of
issues to buy off and chew about, which we will
do and he wants some opinion you I got some
of that for you. Last night came Williamson scored a
ton devon Conway didn't quite. The victory was secured, but
it was a low strength South African side. How good
(01:26):
are the black Caps looking ahead of the champions trophy?
All that more still to come, so let's buckle in
and do it.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
In other news.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
And in Sport today, black Caps bat Devon Conway's happy
to be back in the runs after a lean patch.
The left handed opener replaced the injured Ruchen Revenger in
New Zealand's six wicket Tri Nations win of South Africa
in Lahore. After scoring a fine ninety seven, Conway revealed
(01:58):
he wasn't fussed about missing out on a century.
Speaker 4 (02:01):
I wasn't too stressed, you know. At the end of
the day.
Speaker 5 (02:03):
For me, as long as we win the game, it's
all that matters.
Speaker 4 (02:05):
I'm not really one for milestones or anything like that.
Speaker 5 (02:08):
So I'm just grateful that the boys got us across
the line and was great to have a nice partnership
with Cain.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
At the other end, NZIDA has launched legal action against
sponsor Anios full breach of contract. Rugby editor Elliott Smith.
Speaker 6 (02:21):
Reports, London Telegraph reports, and he asks have failed to
pay the first installment due this year to New Zealand
Rugby at the halfway point of a six year deal
to sponsor the teams in black, including the All Blacks.
A statement released by INZIDA says they view the non
payment as in theos exiting the six year agreement early
and if no option but to launch legal proceedings. The
(02:41):
deal worth eight million dollars a year to INSIDA, leaving
a big financial shortfall to phil at short notice, and
the ass who cut ties with the British America's Cup
Syndicate last month have not commented.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
And finally, the Hurricanes have named four skippers for this
season ahead Brad Shields, the Plessy Currefee, Billy Proctor and
suffer Old Mooer. Coach Clark laid Law says it reflects
the rotational selections expected through the campaign.
Speaker 7 (03:09):
Suffers already as an example, isn't playing at the start
of the season, so you're going to the three. So
maybe feels a little bit different in practice, it's not
actually that different to what we've done the last couple
of years.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
Needing a vex, We've got just the ticket. It's Sports
Vex News Talks Ivy.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
The Fects welcomes now to the podcast in New Zealand
Herald A Rugby scribe Gregor Paul Gregor, Hi, hi Dar.
I trust you're well and are looking at the current
situation with Jim radclifor should I say Surgeon and the
All Blacks with some interest. The story out today around
an eight million dollar deal that's been renegged on and
(03:50):
there is no money being paid for services already exchanged,
already rendered. This is a Is this a scary situation
for the All Blacks?
Speaker 7 (04:00):
It's definitely not a good one. I don't know if
it's scary. It's commercially important. Two things are commercially important here.
One deal itself is reasonably significant for them. I think
it's slightly closer to ten million a year that they're
taking from Minios, which is not an insubstantial amount of
money for them. And if they lose it, which they have,
(04:22):
you know, that will need to be found somewhere else.
So that's going to be challenge number one for them.
Speaker 4 (04:26):
But really the much bigger.
Speaker 7 (04:28):
Challenge here is protecting their reputation and putting a message
out to the world that says, look, we can't have
billionaires decide arbitrarily or unilaterally that they don't want to
carry on with an existing deal for whatever reason, spurious
at best, and we need to protect ourselves and we
need to say that we won't be bullied, we won't
(04:49):
be pushed around, and if you renege on a deal
for no good reason, we're going to take you to
court and we're going to let the law decide whether
you have the right to do that or not.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
So in essence, this is posturing that they would like
some form of result, because as you've seen, close on
teen million dollars, that's quite the whole and dig their
way out of. But it's very much a scene of saying,
don't with us, and we're going to go through the law.
This is a stance.
Speaker 7 (05:13):
I think primarily, certainly initially it's a message to not
only to any OS, but to any other future potential
commercial partners that this is where things will end up
if we do not abide by the contract and if
we do not you know, live by the law. I mean,
anyone knows once you once you go to court proceedings,
(05:33):
you don't know what the outcomes are going to be.
Speaker 4 (05:35):
In a case like that, they will argue, any us.
Speaker 7 (05:37):
Will argue that whatever that you know, they were let
down by the terms of the agreement, they'll say and said,
oh I didn't fulfill them, and said I will say
it did, and a court will try and determine, you know,
who's right, who's wrong, and what the solution might be.
Speaker 4 (05:49):
Now, that could take a long time.
Speaker 7 (05:50):
That could rack up, you know, significant legal fees for
the union with limited possibility of what they will get
in return or what a settlement might look like with
any of So you're going to weigh up the risk
and the reward. You know what that might look like,
and how long do you want this to carry on for,
you know, before you're willing to pull the pin. And
you get the impression that when you're a billionaire and
(06:12):
you've got sort of infinite debt to your pocket, you're
probably going to gamble that an organization like nz R
isn't going to want to have a prolonged, expensive legal
battle with you because they can't afford to do that
in the way that you can.
Speaker 3 (06:27):
That's why I said, scary. We know that there's not
a lot of cash on the ground for n z R.
Should they engage. I suppose they can walk if it
gets too expensive, But this could be long and pricey Yeah.
Speaker 4 (06:40):
It could be.
Speaker 7 (06:41):
And maybe what they're hoping is by filing the court action,
by going public with it, maybe that will bring any
ofsen Sir Jim to the table to say, look, okay,
what would it take for this to come out of
the courts?
Speaker 4 (06:56):
Can we make a settlement here? What would you agree to?
Speaker 7 (06:59):
You know, maybe they agree a full and final payment
that says, okay, you don't want to be a partner anymore.
How about you pay you eighteen months of the contract
and we'll let you out the other eighteen months.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
It's fifty fifty percent of what.
Speaker 7 (07:11):
You as and we could we do a deal round
about that sort of price point and leave it in
a state that doesn't take both organizations time, effort, money
and cause them reputational damage.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
Gregor Paul joining us? Gregor, how long does it take
to replace someone like Anios? They've got a three year deal,
they haven't paid up for service has already been rendered
by inz R. I'm talking about that in a minute.
But how do they cover this? And how long does
it take to get a Jersey sponsor? Because what they've
(07:45):
got at to make them they've got altrad and they've
got Anyos This is fairly rare territory, isn't it.
Speaker 7 (07:52):
Well, both Ultrad and Inios were actually signed on sixty
year deals in twenty They began in twenty twenty two.
So look, it took the better part of two years
to secure both of those partners. That's the sort of
length of time it takes to run a global tender
for deals with the size this magnitude roughly, that's how
(08:14):
long it was. So my understanding is that even though
if you look at the front of Jersey Sponsor, which
is all tried, even though that's in play until twenty
twenty seven, end of that, they will begin the process
now of putting that out to tender, because that's how
long it will take to secure the next partner or
(08:34):
or in you with I'll trad if that's what it
is that they're going to do. So that's the sort
of time frame that you'd be looking at.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
So they'll be ond that now. I'm presuming that they
know after they walked, after any I said now we're
not doing this anymore, they would have put everything in motion.
Speaker 7 (08:53):
Well, I think it depends only if you're talking about
formal or informal. My understanding would be that there would
be informal conversations going all the time with potential partners,
because that's what they should be doing, the commercial guys
sort of sounding out people not just about front of
but this, that and the other.
Speaker 4 (09:09):
So they will have a network of people that they've
been talking to.
Speaker 7 (09:13):
And look, yeah, I think from why I can gather,
Inyos were signaling late last year that this was a possibility,
that they that they were struggling with the partnership for
whatever reason. I don't know the answer to that why,
But I don't think that the letter that arrived at
the end of January this year to formally announce that
(09:34):
Inos reneging on the partnership came as a massive surprise
to New Zealand Rugby, so that they've probably had a
couple of months head start aware that this is where
it would probably end up. Whether that's any use to
them or not a couple of months don't know, but
at least now they've got clarity that they're definitely going
to be without Aniols, and they've got a bit of
clock ticking, which is never a bad thing when you're
(09:56):
trying to do a deal. We've actually got some a
real time frame now to move as quickly as you
can to get something else on the table.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
So will we see ineos on the shorts and the
training gear this year? We have to wait to the
court case finishes. How does that operate?
Speaker 4 (10:10):
Do you know? No, they won't my understanding again, they
won't appear.
Speaker 7 (10:15):
So the invoice was sent to any else at the
end of last year for the second half of what
you were twenty five, So when were in second half
of twenty four. That invoice was due on the first
of January. That hasn't been paid, so you would now
say their account is in arrears.
Speaker 4 (10:34):
Within say it are. So there's two issues here.
Speaker 7 (10:37):
One they haven't paid for services delivered that relate to
twenty twenty four, and now they've cut the deal arbitrarily,
you know, actually cut that three years ahead of its
natural expiry date. So that's the second part of the
legal challenge. So I guess if nothing else new, Zealand
Rugby would expect that invoice that they filed late last year,
(10:59):
they would expect that to be paid minimum, you know,
as part of this action.
Speaker 3 (11:04):
Next stop Riard. I say that were pung firmly in cheek,
but you never know Gregor Paul. It is a pleasure.
Thanks very much for your time.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
This is Sportsfix, your daily does of sports news, how
news talks.
Speaker 3 (11:20):
On the face of it, there was a tremendous win
overnight to the black Caps. But if you did slightly deeper,
actually you don't even have to scratch the surface. Did
it really mean anything?
Speaker 2 (11:31):
No?
Speaker 3 (11:31):
And that was the thought that went through my head
at one in the morning, when I was still up
watching it. What am I doing here? This is a
tri series that means nothing except a bit of a
warm up run. But I'm an addict when it comes
to cricket and it was on, so I watched it
until sense prevailed. There were some positives. Great to see
(11:53):
Daddy Conway back in the runs again three short of
a tone, dare there was a massive partnership. Amazing to
see Kine Williamson not only not chup seven thousand one
Day International runs but chop himself yet enough the century
watching O'Rourke scare everybody in sight, although the scariest thing
(12:14):
for me was the way the subcontinental commentators chose to
pronounce his name. Oh Rourke's not that hard, really, is it?
And of course Tom Latham another duck. That's three in
a row. That was all so scary. In the wash up,
the black Caps had a win, but they had a
win against let's say it, substandard opposition. They had four debutants.
(12:38):
One of those debutantes scored one hundred and fifty runs.
That's the highest one danged national total on debut by anyone.
We got smacked by a rookie and then when it
comes to scoring the required runs, we got it done,
but only just again against a team of rookies. So
(13:00):
what do we actually learn out of that game? Yep,
we had the wherewifore to actually win, but really we
should have smashed that. Let's see what happens in the
final of the Try series and maybe we can glean
slightly more out of cricket, which, for all intentsive purposes
is pointless. But it's cricket, so you'll watch it anyway.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
The chamber is now in session on Sportsfix.
Speaker 3 (13:27):
Joining me in the chamber now is the Director of Sport.
For news talks, there'd be mister Clay Wilson. Greetings to you, sir,
Welcome into the cave.
Speaker 5 (13:35):
Hello Darcy, thank you. Always a pleasure to dive in here.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
Interesting story released today that we were I suppose flagged
last week about four captains being named for the Hurricanes. Now,
Co Captaincy was one that a lot of people struggled with.
He's jumped the third and gone for four. Clarks made
an interesting call here, where do you use it on
this one?
Speaker 5 (13:59):
I just said to you off here, and I have
to say it while I'm here. A great line from
one of our colleagues, Adam Koober this morning who wrote
the story four Plumes of Smoke Hurricanes HQ, which I
thought was a brilliant way to kind of first address
this story. Yeah, four cokept I.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Told on what's he saying that? Basically that Wellington is
the Vatican City. That's what he's saying. He's saying, this
is God's team, is the Hurricanes.
Speaker 5 (14:24):
That's fresh after all. I'm happy with that. You might
have a few more disputes with that. I'm more than
happy with that analogy. Yeah, like we've seen co Captaincy before.
I'm thinking I've seen three, but I can't recall four.
And I think Clark Laidlawa is kind of well aware
that how people are going to perceive this and has
(14:46):
been it pains to explain that it's not how it appears,
and there is solid logic behind it in terms of
the players that they've got in their leadership group and
that some of them might need to not necessarily be
starting each week. So this way it gives them the
ability to pick two co captains each week.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
And players get broken, let's face it, and players get suspended,
let's face it, and players get egged off because they're
all blacks, let's face it. So it is quite You.
Speaker 5 (15:12):
Understand the logic behind it as well as I do.
But to me, I think, for you know, we're seeing
a lot of kind of fan initiatives in Super Rugby
on the back of the new commission coming in. We've
seen the fantasy competition, a few other things happening, and
I think for fans, fans want to know who the
captain is and leadership groups are. Leadership groups are fine,
(15:36):
all well and good, and every team nowadays is not
going to have one leader, right, They're going to have three, four, five,
six leaders in a team. But just name one captain.
That's for me, Just name one captain to.
Speaker 3 (15:48):
Me quatering the disappointment when the Hurricanes get rolled in
the final right, they've got to word each and their
step down speech for the way that goes. And there's
also the theory that everyone gets a certificate for participations.
So next week the Islanders are going to say our
whole team captains.
Speaker 5 (16:09):
You know that, Oprah Winfrey meme, you get a you
get a captain c umband and you get a captain's ben.
And that's the first thing that came to my mind.
Look like I say, I understand internally the logic. I
just think wonder, I wonder if if it was me,
whether I would say internally talk about it and have
the system externally say so and so is our captain.
Speaker 3 (16:32):
The fans need someone to blame someone, and someone like
the one of the broadest shoulders. Let's get away from that.
Let's get to a slightly more serious rugby story. We
know that Sir Jim Ratcliffe, he's not broke. He's a billionaire.
It takes a lot of time to run out of
a billion dollars, right or a billion pounds. But he's
decided to ah bother paying me all blacks. What's the point? Yeah,
(16:53):
so they wore my jersey. It was last year. It
doesn't matter. In fact, I don't want to play games anymore.
I'm out on gone, insid Ira gone, We'll see you
in court. That's brave from enz Art because fighting a
billionaire in court probably not the greatest man. But they
had no choice, did they?
Speaker 5 (17:10):
Yeah? And you say brave, and I tend to agree,
and not necessarily from a from a financial standpoint, more
from a time standpoint, because to me, a legal process
like this, against a company like this, against a man
like that who has so much money, this is a
legal process that could drag on forever. But I guess
they sort of left with no other option. You know,
(17:33):
they may get if they win, they get their they
get their money back, they get you know, all their
legal costs paid for. But how long does that process take?
Speaker 3 (17:41):
Said?
Speaker 5 (17:41):
Yeah? Like I said, I suppose they had no other option,
did they? I mean, how else could insid Are have
approached this?
Speaker 3 (17:47):
Do you think rolled over and said, we're really sorry,
would you like some more and feed them back money?
You see, Jim is, you know, plainly an upset man.
He's got us problems with this America's Cup team. That's
what it is. He's got as proverbials in a Tangleester United,
they well, I know if we won't even go to that,
you're worse than the Glazers. What all that was from
(18:09):
the fan base? And who took it over? Nazi America's
Cup team New Zealand beat him, and he's just packing
a hisssy foot because his money got speed and got
sunk off the coast of Spain. So he's like, that's it. Oh,
it's a lively theory. I could get funny anything at
the moment, you know, anything to do that. But they
are in a situation where as Gregor Paul pointed out
(18:30):
to us at the start of the program, they can't
do nothing. They have to be seen to do something
they otherwise everybody is going to go ah.
Speaker 5 (18:39):
And eight million dollars to Sir Jim Ratcliffe is a
lot different than eight million dollars to New Zealand Rugby.
That's a lot of money. We know about the financial
situation the game in this country has been in in
recent years and is still in. That's not an insignificant
amount of money. And this is money that goes into
all the New Zealand, the teams in black, as they say,
(19:00):
the all Blacks, black Ferns, the seven Sides, the junior teams,
I would assume, So what gets what gets kind of
crossed off the wish list for this year at least
because you don't you think you're not going to see
that money for even if you do win in court.
How does that affect the All Blacks? How does it
affect the Black fans, the sevens teams do?
Speaker 3 (19:20):
How does it to support staff, the hotels in first
class air tickets off to conferences on the other side of.
Speaker 5 (19:26):
The world for the fish heir, Well, these are the
questions we wanted to ask New Zealand Rugby answer. They've
put out a quite a strongly wirded statement, but you know,
as they is there will sometimes have decided not to
put anyone up to talk about it. But that's the
first question that came to my mind, And yeah, where
where does where does the where does that kind of
that money get cut off the wish list for twenty
(19:48):
twenty five at least because yeah, likes going to play.
Speaker 3 (19:53):
I'm more interested in what happened between Jim and the
All Blacks, why he actually pulled in the first place.
You sign something up goodwill, it promotes your petrol chemical company,
so they knew what they were doing it, but to
walk away not pay it seems.
Speaker 5 (20:12):
It's very odd. It seems like with everything that's going
on with Sir Jim Ratcliffe with the America's Cup thing,
like you say, his involvement now with Manchester United, there's
got to be some other factor at play here with
that company, with himself to make them because it's it's
too much of a coincidence for the America's Cup and
New Zealand rugby thing to happen around the same time
(20:33):
and then withdraw from those deals. So who knows. Maybe
maybe down the track we're going to find out, but
for now it's a bit of a mystery as to
why they would do this at all.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
Tell im, I'm pointed out to him and Jimmy spent
all this money and you just got your name across
the ass of the All Blacks. Maybe finally he worked
out how silly he looked at me.
Speaker 4 (20:49):
That's it.
Speaker 3 (20:49):
I'm out, I'm gone, and on that you're out, You're gone.
Clay Wilson, Director of Sport for News Talk CB, thanks
very much for.
Speaker 5 (20:55):
Your time, no worries thanks to us.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
Dissecting the sporting agenda.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
It's Sports Fix with Jason fine and Darcy Waldgrave.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
The habit Sports Fixed for another that day being Tuesday,
the eleventh of Fab twenty twenty five. I'm Darcy walder Grave.
Thanks very much for listening. If you've enjoyed it, please
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If you really liked it, tell your friends, tell your
(21:27):
family and get them to subscribe as well. And if
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and it's all about weekend sport. Well, Jason's got that show.
Weekend Sport is from twelve to three Saturday and Sunday
(21:49):
on News Talk ZB. I hope you've enjoyed the Fix
and we'll look forward to catching up with all the
sport again tomorrow.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
For more from News Talk zed B, listen live on
air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever
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You're listening to a podcast from News Talks EDB. Follow
this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
This is Sportsfix Howard by News Talks EDB.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
Here we go again, Welcome int to Sports Fix. It's
a Tuesday. It's the eleventh of February twenty twenty five.
My name is Darcy Walter Grave and this podcast is
all you need to know about sport of a day,
tied up and presented in a charming bundle. On this
podcast will be joined by Gregor Paul First, the esteemed
(00:42):
New Zealand Herald sports writer, specifically in the rugby space.
Today in z Are announced they were taking a billionaire
to court because he hasn't paid his bills and doesn't
want to carry on honoring his contract. Ins and outs
and ups and downs, and we'll talk about that with Gregor.
Shortly joining us in the chamber is Clay Wilson. He's
(01:04):
News Talk zbb's sports director. We've got a couple of
issues to buy off and chew about, which we will
do and he wants some opinion you I got some
of that for you. Last night came Williamson scored a
ton devon Conway didn't quite. The victory was secured, but
it was a low strength South African side. How good
(01:26):
are the black Caps looking ahead of the champions trophy?
All that more still to come, so let's buckle in
and do it.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
In other news.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
And in Sport today, black Caps bat Devon Conway's happy
to be back in the runs after a lean patch.
The left handed opener replaced the injured Ruchen Revenger in
New Zealand's six wicket Tri Nations win of South Africa
in Lahore. After scoring a fine ninety seven, Conway revealed
(01:58):
he wasn't fussed about missing out on a century.
Speaker 4 (02:01):
I wasn't too stressed, you know. At the end of
the day.
Speaker 5 (02:03):
For me, as long as we win the game, it's
all that matters.
Speaker 4 (02:05):
I'm not really one for milestones or anything like that.
Speaker 5 (02:08):
So I'm just grateful that the boys got us across
the line and was great to have a nice partnership
with Cain.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
At the other end, NZIDA has launched legal action against
sponsor Anios full breach of contract. Rugby editor Elliott Smith.
Speaker 6 (02:21):
Reports, London Telegraph reports, and he asks have failed to
pay the first installment due this year to New Zealand
Rugby at the halfway point of a six year deal
to sponsor the teams in black, including the All Blacks.
A statement released by INZIDA says they view the non
payment as in theos exiting the six year agreement early
and if no option but to launch legal proceedings. The
(02:41):
deal worth eight million dollars a year to INSIDA, leaving
a big financial shortfall to phil at short notice, and
the ass who cut ties with the British America's Cup
Syndicate last month have not commented.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
And finally, the Hurricanes have named four skippers for this
season ahead Brad Shields, the Plessy Currefee, Billy Proctor and
suffer Old Mooer. Coach Clark laid Law says it reflects
the rotational selections expected through the campaign.
Speaker 7 (03:09):
Suffers already as an example, isn't playing at the start
of the season, so you're going to the three. So
maybe feels a little bit different in practice, it's not
actually that different to what we've done the last couple
of years.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
Needing a vex, We've got just the ticket. It's Sports
Vex News Talks Ivy.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
The Fects welcomes now to the podcast in New Zealand
Herald A Rugby scribe Gregor Paul Gregor, Hi, hi Dar.
I trust you're well and are looking at the current
situation with Jim radclifor should I say Surgeon and the
All Blacks with some interest. The story out today around
an eight million dollar deal that's been renegged on and
(03:50):
there is no money being paid for services already exchanged,
already rendered. This is a Is this a scary situation
for the All Blacks?
Speaker 7 (04:00):
It's definitely not a good one. I don't know if
it's scary. It's commercially important. Two things are commercially important here.
One deal itself is reasonably significant for them. I think
it's slightly closer to ten million a year that they're
taking from Minios, which is not an insubstantial amount of
money for them. And if they lose it, which they have,
(04:22):
you know, that will need to be found somewhere else.
So that's going to be challenge number one for them.
Speaker 4 (04:26):
But really the much bigger.
Speaker 7 (04:28):
Challenge here is protecting their reputation and putting a message
out to the world that says, look, we can't have
billionaires decide arbitrarily or unilaterally that they don't want to
carry on with an existing deal for whatever reason, spurious
at best, and we need to protect ourselves and we
need to say that we won't be bullied, we won't
(04:49):
be pushed around, and if you renege on a deal
for no good reason, we're going to take you to
court and we're going to let the law decide whether
you have the right to do that or not.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
So in essence, this is posturing that they would like
some form of result, because as you've seen, close on
teen million dollars, that's quite the whole and dig their
way out of. But it's very much a scene of saying,
don't with us, and we're going to go through the law.
This is a stance.
Speaker 7 (05:13):
I think primarily, certainly initially it's a message to not
only to any OS, but to any other future potential
commercial partners that this is where things will end up
if we do not abide by the contract and if
we do not you know, live by the law. I mean,
anyone knows once you once you go to court proceedings,
(05:33):
you don't know what the outcomes are going to be.
Speaker 4 (05:35):
In a case like that, they will argue, any us.
Speaker 7 (05:37):
Will argue that whatever that you know, they were let
down by the terms of the agreement, they'll say and said,
oh I didn't fulfill them, and said I will say
it did, and a court will try and determine, you know,
who's right, who's wrong, and what the solution might be.
Speaker 4 (05:49):
Now, that could take a long time.
Speaker 7 (05:50):
That could rack up, you know, significant legal fees for
the union with limited possibility of what they will get
in return or what a settlement might look like with
any of So you're going to weigh up the risk
and the reward. You know what that might look like,
and how long do you want this to carry on for,
you know, before you're willing to pull the pin. And
you get the impression that when you're a billionaire and
(06:12):
you've got sort of infinite debt to your pocket, you're
probably going to gamble that an organization like nz R
isn't going to want to have a prolonged, expensive legal
battle with you because they can't afford to do that
in the way that you can.
Speaker 3 (06:27):
That's why I said, scary. We know that there's not
a lot of cash on the ground for n z R.
Should they engage. I suppose they can walk if it
gets too expensive, But this could be long and pricey Yeah.
Speaker 4 (06:40):
It could be.
Speaker 7 (06:41):
And maybe what they're hoping is by filing the court action,
by going public with it, maybe that will bring any
ofsen Sir Jim to the table to say, look, okay,
what would it take for this to come out of
the courts?
Speaker 4 (06:56):
Can we make a settlement here? What would you agree to?
Speaker 7 (06:59):
You know, maybe they agree a full and final payment
that says, okay, you don't want to be a partner anymore.
How about you pay you eighteen months of the contract
and we'll let you out the other eighteen months.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
It's fifty fifty percent of what.
Speaker 7 (07:11):
You as and we could we do a deal round
about that sort of price point and leave it in
a state that doesn't take both organizations time, effort, money
and cause them reputational damage.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
Gregor Paul joining us? Gregor, how long does it take
to replace someone like Anios? They've got a three year deal,
they haven't paid up for service has already been rendered
by inz R. I'm talking about that in a minute.
But how do they cover this? And how long does
it take to get a Jersey sponsor? Because what they've
(07:45):
got at to make them they've got altrad and they've
got Anyos This is fairly rare territory, isn't it.
Speaker 7 (07:52):
Well, both Ultrad and Inios were actually signed on sixty
year deals in twenty They began in twenty twenty two.
So look, it took the better part of two years
to secure both of those partners. That's the sort of
length of time it takes to run a global tender
for deals with the size this magnitude roughly, that's how
(08:14):
long it was. So my understanding is that even though
if you look at the front of Jersey Sponsor, which
is all tried, even though that's in play until twenty
twenty seven, end of that, they will begin the process
now of putting that out to tender, because that's how
long it will take to secure the next partner or
(08:34):
or in you with I'll trad if that's what it
is that they're going to do. So that's the sort
of time frame that you'd be looking at.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
So they'll be ond that now. I'm presuming that they
know after they walked, after any I said now we're
not doing this anymore, they would have put everything in motion.
Speaker 7 (08:53):
Well, I think it depends only if you're talking about
formal or informal. My understanding would be that there would
be informal conversations going all the time with potential partners,
because that's what they should be doing, the commercial guys
sort of sounding out people not just about front of
but this, that and the other.
Speaker 4 (09:09):
So they will have a network of people that they've
been talking to.
Speaker 7 (09:13):
And look, yeah, I think from why I can gather,
Inyos were signaling late last year that this was a possibility,
that they that they were struggling with the partnership for
whatever reason. I don't know the answer to that why,
But I don't think that the letter that arrived at
the end of January this year to formally announce that
(09:34):
Inos reneging on the partnership came as a massive surprise
to New Zealand Rugby, so that they've probably had a
couple of months head start aware that this is where
it would probably end up. Whether that's any use to
them or not a couple of months don't know, but
at least now they've got clarity that they're definitely going
to be without Aniols, and they've got a bit of
clock ticking, which is never a bad thing when you're
(09:56):
trying to do a deal. We've actually got some a
real time frame now to move as quickly as you
can to get something else on the table.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
So will we see ineos on the shorts and the
training gear this year? We have to wait to the
court case finishes. How does that operate?
Speaker 4 (10:10):
Do you know? No, they won't my understanding again, they
won't appear.
Speaker 7 (10:15):
So the invoice was sent to any else at the
end of last year for the second half of what
you were twenty five, So when were in second half
of twenty four. That invoice was due on the first
of January. That hasn't been paid, so you would now
say their account is in arrears.
Speaker 4 (10:34):
Within say it are. So there's two issues here.
Speaker 7 (10:37):
One they haven't paid for services delivered that relate to
twenty twenty four, and now they've cut the deal arbitrarily,
you know, actually cut that three years ahead of its
natural expiry date. So that's the second part of the
legal challenge. So I guess if nothing else new, Zealand
Rugby would expect that invoice that they filed late last year,
(10:59):
they would expect that to be paid minimum, you know,
as part of this action.
Speaker 3 (11:04):
Next stop Riard. I say that were pung firmly in cheek,
but you never know Gregor Paul. It is a pleasure.
Thanks very much for your time.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
This is Sportsfix, your daily does of sports news, how
news talks.
Speaker 3 (11:20):
On the face of it, there was a tremendous win
overnight to the black Caps. But if you did slightly deeper,
actually you don't even have to scratch the surface. Did
it really mean anything?
Speaker 2 (11:31):
No?
Speaker 3 (11:31):
And that was the thought that went through my head
at one in the morning, when I was still up
watching it. What am I doing here? This is a
tri series that means nothing except a bit of a
warm up run. But I'm an addict when it comes
to cricket and it was on, so I watched it
until sense prevailed. There were some positives. Great to see
(11:53):
Daddy Conway back in the runs again three short of
a tone, dare there was a massive partnership. Amazing to
see Kine Williamson not only not chup seven thousand one
Day International runs but chop himself yet enough the century
watching O'Rourke scare everybody in sight, although the scariest thing
(12:14):
for me was the way the subcontinental commentators chose to
pronounce his name. Oh Rourke's not that hard, really, is it?
And of course Tom Latham another duck. That's three in
a row. That was all so scary. In the wash up,
the black Caps had a win, but they had a
win against let's say it, substandard opposition. They had four debutants.
(12:38):
One of those debutantes scored one hundred and fifty runs.
That's the highest one danged national total on debut by anyone.
We got smacked by a rookie and then when it
comes to scoring the required runs, we got it done,
but only just again against a team of rookies. So
(13:00):
what do we actually learn out of that game? Yep,
we had the wherewifore to actually win, but really we
should have smashed that. Let's see what happens in the
final of the Try series and maybe we can glean
slightly more out of cricket, which, for all intentsive purposes
is pointless. But it's cricket, so you'll watch it anyway.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
The chamber is now in session on Sportsfix.
Speaker 3 (13:27):
Joining me in the chamber now is the Director of Sport.
For news talks, there'd be mister Clay Wilson. Greetings to you, sir,
Welcome into the cave.
Speaker 5 (13:35):
Hello Darcy, thank you. Always a pleasure to dive in here.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
Interesting story released today that we were I suppose flagged
last week about four captains being named for the Hurricanes. Now,
Co Captaincy was one that a lot of people struggled with.
He's jumped the third and gone for four. Clarks made
an interesting call here, where do you use it on
this one?
Speaker 5 (13:59):
I just said to you off here, and I have
to say it while I'm here. A great line from
one of our colleagues, Adam Koober this morning who wrote
the story four Plumes of Smoke Hurricanes HQ, which I
thought was a brilliant way to kind of first address
this story. Yeah, four cokept I.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Told on what's he saying that? Basically that Wellington is
the Vatican City. That's what he's saying. He's saying, this
is God's team, is the Hurricanes.
Speaker 5 (14:24):
That's fresh after all. I'm happy with that. You might
have a few more disputes with that. I'm more than
happy with that analogy. Yeah, like we've seen co Captaincy before.
I'm thinking I've seen three, but I can't recall four.
And I think Clark Laidlawa is kind of well aware
that how people are going to perceive this and has
(14:46):
been it pains to explain that it's not how it appears,
and there is solid logic behind it in terms of
the players that they've got in their leadership group and
that some of them might need to not necessarily be
starting each week. So this way it gives them the
ability to pick two co captains each week.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
And players get broken, let's face it, and players get suspended,
let's face it, and players get egged off because they're
all blacks, let's face it. So it is quite You.
Speaker 5 (15:12):
Understand the logic behind it as well as I do.
But to me, I think, for you know, we're seeing
a lot of kind of fan initiatives in Super Rugby
on the back of the new commission coming in. We've
seen the fantasy competition, a few other things happening, and
I think for fans, fans want to know who the
captain is and leadership groups are. Leadership groups are fine,
(15:36):
all well and good, and every team nowadays is not
going to have one leader, right, They're going to have three, four, five,
six leaders in a team. But just name one captain.
That's for me, Just name one captain to.
Speaker 3 (15:48):
Me quatering the disappointment when the Hurricanes get rolled in
the final right, they've got to word each and their
step down speech for the way that goes. And there's
also the theory that everyone gets a certificate for participations.
So next week the Islanders are going to say our
whole team captains.
Speaker 5 (16:09):
You know that, Oprah Winfrey meme, you get a you
get a captain c umband and you get a captain's ben.
And that's the first thing that came to my mind.
Look like I say, I understand internally the logic. I
just think wonder, I wonder if if it was me,
whether I would say internally talk about it and have
the system externally say so and so is our captain.
Speaker 3 (16:32):
The fans need someone to blame someone, and someone like
the one of the broadest shoulders. Let's get away from that.
Let's get to a slightly more serious rugby story. We
know that Sir Jim Ratcliffe, he's not broke. He's a billionaire.
It takes a lot of time to run out of
a billion dollars, right or a billion pounds. But he's
decided to ah bother paying me all blacks. What's the point? Yeah,
(16:53):
so they wore my jersey. It was last year. It
doesn't matter. In fact, I don't want to play games anymore.
I'm out on gone, insid Ira gone, We'll see you
in court. That's brave from enz Art because fighting a
billionaire in court probably not the greatest man. But they
had no choice, did they?
Speaker 5 (17:10):
Yeah? And you say brave, and I tend to agree,
and not necessarily from a from a financial standpoint, more
from a time standpoint, because to me, a legal process
like this, against a company like this, against a man
like that who has so much money, this is a
legal process that could drag on forever. But I guess
they sort of left with no other option. You know,
(17:33):
they may get if they win, they get their they
get their money back, they get you know, all their
legal costs paid for. But how long does that process take?
Speaker 3 (17:41):
Said?
Speaker 5 (17:41):
Yeah? Like I said, I suppose they had no other option,
did they? I mean, how else could insid Are have
approached this?
Speaker 3 (17:47):
Do you think rolled over and said, we're really sorry,
would you like some more and feed them back money?
You see, Jim is, you know, plainly an upset man.
He's got us problems with this America's Cup team. That's
what it is. He's got as proverbials in a Tangleester United,
they well, I know if we won't even go to that,
you're worse than the Glazers. What all that was from
(18:09):
the fan base? And who took it over? Nazi America's
Cup team New Zealand beat him, and he's just packing
a hisssy foot because his money got speed and got
sunk off the coast of Spain. So he's like, that's it. Oh,
it's a lively theory. I could get funny anything at
the moment, you know, anything to do that. But they
are in a situation where as Gregor Paul pointed out
(18:30):
to us at the start of the program, they can't
do nothing. They have to be seen to do something
they otherwise everybody is going to go ah.
Speaker 5 (18:39):
And eight million dollars to Sir Jim Ratcliffe is a
lot different than eight million dollars to New Zealand Rugby.
That's a lot of money. We know about the financial
situation the game in this country has been in in
recent years and is still in. That's not an insignificant
amount of money. And this is money that goes into
all the New Zealand, the teams in black, as they say,
(19:00):
the all Blacks, black Ferns, the seven Sides, the junior teams,
I would assume, So what gets what gets kind of
crossed off the wish list for this year at least
because you don't you think you're not going to see
that money for even if you do win in court.
How does that affect the All Blacks? How does it
affect the Black fans, the sevens teams do?
Speaker 3 (19:20):
How does it to support staff, the hotels in first
class air tickets off to conferences on the other side of.
Speaker 5 (19:26):
The world for the fish heir, Well, these are the
questions we wanted to ask New Zealand Rugby answer. They've
put out a quite a strongly wirded statement, but you know,
as they is there will sometimes have decided not to
put anyone up to talk about it. But that's the
first question that came to my mind, And yeah, where
where does where does the where does that kind of
that money get cut off the wish list for twenty
(19:48):
twenty five at least because yeah, likes going to play.
Speaker 3 (19:53):
I'm more interested in what happened between Jim and the
All Blacks, why he actually pulled in the first place.
You sign something up goodwill, it promotes your petrol chemical company,
so they knew what they were doing it, but to
walk away not pay it seems.
Speaker 5 (20:12):
It's very odd. It seems like with everything that's going
on with Sir Jim Ratcliffe with the America's Cup thing,
like you say, his involvement now with Manchester United, there's
got to be some other factor at play here with
that company, with himself to make them because it's it's
too much of a coincidence for the America's Cup and
New Zealand rugby thing to happen around the same time
(20:33):
and then withdraw from those deals. So who knows. Maybe
maybe down the track we're going to find out, but
for now it's a bit of a mystery as to
why they would do this at all.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
Tell im, I'm pointed out to him and Jimmy spent
all this money and you just got your name across
the ass of the All Blacks. Maybe finally he worked
out how silly he looked at me.
Speaker 4 (20:49):
That's it.
Speaker 3 (20:49):
I'm out, I'm gone, and on that you're out, You're gone.
Clay Wilson, Director of Sport for News Talk CB, thanks
very much for.
Speaker 5 (20:55):
Your time, no worries thanks to us.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
Dissecting the sporting agenda.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
It's Sports Fix with Jason fine and Darcy Waldgrave.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
The habit Sports Fixed for another that day being Tuesday,
the eleventh of Fab twenty twenty five. I'm Darcy walder Grave.
Thanks very much for listening. If you've enjoyed it, please
subscribe and that means this will turn up in your
inbox Monday through Friday at around about the same time.
If you really liked it, tell your friends, tell your
(21:27):
family and get them to subscribe as well. And if
you want some interact with sports talk, well, you can
get that on Sports Talk seven to eight Monday to
Friday on News Talk ZB with Jason Pine or myself,
and it's all about weekend sport. Well, Jason's got that show.
Weekend Sport is from twelve to three Saturday and Sunday
(21:49):
on News Talk ZB. I hope you've enjoyed the Fix
and we'll look forward to catching up with all the
sport again tomorrow.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
For more from News Talk zed B, listen live on
air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever
you go with our podcast on iHeartRadio.
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