October 6, 2025 • 9 mins
The All Blacks defeated the Wallabies 28-14 in Perth on Saturday night, registering back to back wins in the Rugby Championship for the first time in 2025.
Of the 23 who played Quinn Tupaea was a real standout, scoring a double in his first hit out at the centre position for the All Blacks.
Frank Bunce is a former All Black centre, Piney caught up with him to discuss Tupaea's performance and the similarities and differences between 12 and 13.
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Dancy Wildergrave
from News Talk zed B.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
As the All Blacks bet Australia on Saturday nights in Perth,
a standout performer in the eyes of many was Quintu Pire.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
Jordy Barrett with a week rubber through up over halfway.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Pier tries to wrap it up.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
He's knocked it on to Pie kicks ahead, but to fire.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
We'll get that.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Querson stuck when to Pire the benefit of the falcon
and his first test starting at center, quint to Pire
scored two tries and had a very strong all round game.
So is he the long term solution at center for
the All Blacks or at the very least is he
worthy of further appearances in that jumper? One of the
(00:50):
best to ever do it, Frank Bunce He played fifty
five test matches and a total of sixty nine games
for the All Blacks and was one of our great
center three quarters. He joins us now, Buncee, what did
you make of quint to Pire's performance? First of all
on Saturday night in Perth?
Speaker 3 (01:06):
H oh, I loved it. We've been sort of waiting
a little bit. You know, for probably he propped it
really to fire, and you know Quintupie got his chance
and took it with you know, with open arms, and
he was involved in everything. So I was really happy,
you know. And for a guy to have come back
(01:27):
from from what he did, you know, it's a long
journey back for such a serious injury. To get his
opportunity and then and then take it was Yeah, it
was awesome to watch.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
What did you like most about what you saw from
him on Saturday?
Speaker 3 (01:42):
I like the fact that he was you know, he
stood out, he went, he was looking for work. You know,
he was making break. I wouldn't say there was anything specific,
but you know, he was, he was involved. I just
liked the way that he was. He was in a
lot of the play. You know, he made ground when
he carried the ball. You know, his passing was good.
(02:03):
Is he He just had a real good all round contribution.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
He himself said that he was quite surprised when the
coaches said to him, how you're playing center. We've only
really seen him at Super rugby and for the All
Blacks as a second five. How interchangeable are twelve and thirteen?
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Well, they're interchangeable for some. You know, it's easier for
some people than others. You know, in this day and age,
things have changed a little bit. And I did hear,
you know, Jeff Wilson or Milsey or someone like that,
you know, had said that it was the style of
the game that was kind of hindering Billy Procter, And
I can see that. I don't think his center's role,
(02:42):
as you know, is the same as it used to be. Necessarily,
you obviously still want someone who can distribute the ball well,
who can set up as outsides. Yeah, I'm not taking
away from Billy procterory there, because you know I've seen
him do that. But I think test level again is
another level up, and you know you're just under a
whole lot more pressure. What was your question, rambling?
Speaker 2 (03:02):
No, No, not at all about I was just really
interested to know, I mean about the adjustment from twelve
to thirteen, because for me, it looked like he made
it seamlessly. You know, I know you played a bit
of twelve, but mainly thirteen. So I just just wonder
whether you know, some guys play one or the other,
don't they Some like anton Letta Brown can play both.
I just wonder like, is it more challenging with ball
in hand? Do you have to learn different defensive patterns?
(03:24):
For example, when you when you're defending.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
It doesn't sound right, but it's the same, but it's different.
You know, you you're under a bit more pressure because
you're closer in. You know, when you're playing at twelve,
you're closer to the defense. You're closer to you know,
the loose forwards can get to your two or three
steps closer. So you have to make decisions very very quickly.
I think I ended up as an outside tender, you know,
played second five and never liked it because you were
(03:48):
under that pressure and you didn't get the room that
you know, someone like me needed. You just have a
little bit more time, a little bit more, a little
bit more space, you know, before the defense gets to you.
I think it's that type of person. I guess it
depends a bit on what type of person you are too.
I just like I prefer that rather than closer and
you know, and probably more physical role of a second
(04:10):
five because you know you're right there, you're there for
the taking, but you know it's up to you to
take the ball up to you to carry into you know,
some of the bigger loose forwards that are that are
going around. So yeah, different positions name but different and
you need to be a different type of player.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
And the hallmark of all great centers like yourself, Joe
Stanley before you, Conrad Smith after you always had the
ability with ball in hand to put their outsides into space.
I know it's it's it's perhaps more difficult now with
defensive patterns being different. But what was the key? What
is the key to making space for your outsides?
Speaker 3 (04:48):
It is vision. You can see things that that opportunities
that open, not necessarily that it is going to happen,
it's the possibility of something happening. I think it is
a vision aspect to the game. When you're playing at twelve,
you don't get a you don't get a you know,
like a chance really to you know, to have a
(05:09):
lock outside you to take the time to have a
look at see where the opposition is standing and what's likely.
You know, it's all about figuring out where people are,
where they aren't, you know, what holes, what what might occur?
You know, it's all of that thing and sometimes you
have to do that all in the space of a
few seconds. Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
You mentioned Billy a couple of times there. Do you
think he still has a claim to that thirteen Jersey.
Do you think he's still got, you know, the ability
to grow into into a top class test center.
Speaker 3 (05:41):
Yeah, yeah, I think so. You know, we've seen him
excel at super rugby level, you know, and I think
a little bit more time Quinn had a little bit
of experience, you know, at that level, I'd give Billy
Procter a you know, a bit more time. We know
that he's you know, he's a good player. It's just
he hasn't been able to make it happen, you know,
like now up until now. You can imagine and I
(06:04):
would have been doing the same thing. He'd be sitting
there in the stands watching quldn't go and you know,
while he'd been loving it and all for you know,
of course you want the Orblecks to win personally, I'm
sure because I would have been. I would have been going,
oh damn, look look how he and then he's scores
two tries and go, man, just guess what I need exactly?
Speaker 2 (06:24):
And what about I mean ricco Yoanni's played there a
lot in the last last three four years, hasn't had
a crack there this year? Can you see them going
back to Rico yo Wanni at Centinel? Do you think
that has been gone?
Speaker 3 (06:36):
Yeah, I'm not too sure. You know, it's for someone
like that. Well, he's obviously still in the picture because
he was there on the weekend. You know, I don't
know what rasis sports are. You know, we're probably going
to find that out pretty soon. You know, unless you
out and out drop them. I don't think you can
just sort of face someone like Rico just you know,
out of the team. Truth of the matter is, we
(06:57):
don't have a better option, you know at the moment,
even if it's backer. You know, to Quinn, everything Rico
has done over the years, you know, he's got all
the experience. You know. I didn't think much phasism and
and sometimes you need that.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
And just on the partnership side of this, because I'm
pretty sure Quinta Pie wouldn't have played with Jordy Barrett
and a midfield anywhere. And you think of the great
midfield partnerships, and yours with Walter Little was one of those.
How long did that take to develop? How long did
it take does it take for a good midfield partnership
to to really start thriving.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
Well, we myself and Walter. You know, we had the
benefit of having you know, played at North Harbor Heather
as well, so you know when we when we weren't
with the All Blacks, we were we were doing the
same sort of thing with Harbor, so you know we
had we had the benefit of that. But jeez, it's
hard to put a time sort of un limit on it,
but I would say it. You know, it's got to
(07:55):
take you know, at least a year or so, at
least a season and a number of tests, and you
know there's going to be highers and lows. But you
know you're kind of it's development, you know, it's it
doesn't happen all the times. The thing about Quinn his
performance on Saturday, Imagine how pumped up he would have
been to that. Imagine his motivation going into that. You know,
(08:18):
he had a lot to prove. He was put in
a new position, so you know, the real it was real,
real focus. So that happened. Now every time it's up
to him just to make sure it's not a one off.
But you know, as much as we'd love it, we
can't hold him to you know, to expecting that standard
all the time. So there's going to be highs and
there's going to be lows. You know. Wallace Titi's you know,
(08:40):
one outstanding first year. Been a little bit quieter, you
know a couple of injuries and stuff, but he hasn't
sort of been the you know, the player that that
we got used to in the first season. Quinn just
had to, you know, he just has to buy his
time and maybe not put too much precking on himself
and not expect, you know, too much.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Fascinating a couple of years ahead, I went and see
what Riser thinks about the Jordy Barrett quin to midfield partnership.
But you always appreciate your thoughts, mate, Thanks for taking
the time.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
She's plenty.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
For more from Sports Talk, listen live to News Talks.
It'd be from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Dancy Wildergrave
from News Talk zed B.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
As the All Blacks bet Australia on Saturday nights in Perth,
a standout performer in the eyes of many was Quintu Pire.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
Jordy Barrett with a week rubber through up over halfway.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Pier tries to wrap it up.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
He's knocked it on to Pie kicks ahead, but to fire.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
We'll get that.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Querson stuck when to Pire the benefit of the falcon
and his first test starting at center, quint to Pire
scored two tries and had a very strong all round game.
So is he the long term solution at center for
the All Blacks or at the very least is he
worthy of further appearances in that jumper? One of the
(00:50):
best to ever do it, Frank Bunce He played fifty
five test matches and a total of sixty nine games
for the All Blacks and was one of our great
center three quarters. He joins us now, Buncee, what did
you make of quint to Pire's performance? First of all
on Saturday night in Perth?
Speaker 3 (01:06):
H oh, I loved it. We've been sort of waiting
a little bit. You know, for probably he propped it
really to fire, and you know Quintupie got his chance
and took it with you know, with open arms, and
he was involved in everything. So I was really happy,
you know. And for a guy to have come back
(01:27):
from from what he did, you know, it's a long
journey back for such a serious injury. To get his
opportunity and then and then take it was Yeah, it
was awesome to watch.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
What did you like most about what you saw from
him on Saturday?
Speaker 3 (01:42):
I like the fact that he was you know, he
stood out, he went, he was looking for work. You know,
he was making break. I wouldn't say there was anything specific,
but you know, he was, he was involved. I just
liked the way that he was. He was in a
lot of the play. You know, he made ground when
he carried the ball. You know, his passing was good.
(02:03):
Is he He just had a real good all round contribution.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
He himself said that he was quite surprised when the
coaches said to him, how you're playing center. We've only
really seen him at Super rugby and for the All
Blacks as a second five. How interchangeable are twelve and thirteen?
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Well, they're interchangeable for some. You know, it's easier for
some people than others. You know, in this day and age,
things have changed a little bit. And I did hear,
you know, Jeff Wilson or Milsey or someone like that,
you know, had said that it was the style of
the game that was kind of hindering Billy Procter, And
I can see that. I don't think his center's role,
(02:42):
as you know, is the same as it used to be. Necessarily,
you obviously still want someone who can distribute the ball well,
who can set up as outsides. Yeah, I'm not taking
away from Billy procterory there, because you know I've seen
him do that. But I think test level again is
another level up, and you know you're just under a
whole lot more pressure. What was your question, rambling?
Speaker 2 (03:02):
No, No, not at all about I was just really
interested to know, I mean about the adjustment from twelve
to thirteen, because for me, it looked like he made
it seamlessly. You know, I know you played a bit
of twelve, but mainly thirteen. So I just just wonder
whether you know, some guys play one or the other,
don't they Some like anton Letta Brown can play both.
I just wonder like, is it more challenging with ball
in hand? Do you have to learn different defensive patterns?
(03:24):
For example, when you when you're defending.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
It doesn't sound right, but it's the same, but it's different.
You know, you you're under a bit more pressure because
you're closer in. You know, when you're playing at twelve,
you're closer to the defense. You're closer to you know,
the loose forwards can get to your two or three
steps closer. So you have to make decisions very very quickly.
I think I ended up as an outside tender, you know,
played second five and never liked it because you were
(03:48):
under that pressure and you didn't get the room that
you know, someone like me needed. You just have a
little bit more time, a little bit more, a little
bit more space, you know, before the defense gets to you.
I think it's that type of person. I guess it
depends a bit on what type of person you are too.
I just like I prefer that rather than closer and
you know, and probably more physical role of a second
(04:10):
five because you know you're right there, you're there for
the taking, but you know it's up to you to
take the ball up to you to carry into you know,
some of the bigger loose forwards that are that are
going around. So yeah, different positions name but different and
you need to be a different type of player.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
And the hallmark of all great centers like yourself, Joe
Stanley before you, Conrad Smith after you always had the
ability with ball in hand to put their outsides into space.
I know it's it's it's perhaps more difficult now with
defensive patterns being different. But what was the key? What
is the key to making space for your outsides?
Speaker 3 (04:48):
It is vision. You can see things that that opportunities
that open, not necessarily that it is going to happen,
it's the possibility of something happening. I think it is
a vision aspect to the game. When you're playing at twelve,
you don't get a you don't get a you know,
like a chance really to you know, to have a
(05:09):
lock outside you to take the time to have a
look at see where the opposition is standing and what's likely.
You know, it's all about figuring out where people are,
where they aren't, you know, what holes, what what might occur?
You know, it's all of that thing and sometimes you
have to do that all in the space of a
few seconds. Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
You mentioned Billy a couple of times there. Do you
think he still has a claim to that thirteen Jersey.
Do you think he's still got, you know, the ability
to grow into into a top class test center.
Speaker 3 (05:41):
Yeah, yeah, I think so. You know, we've seen him
excel at super rugby level, you know, and I think
a little bit more time Quinn had a little bit
of experience, you know, at that level, I'd give Billy
Procter a you know, a bit more time. We know
that he's you know, he's a good player. It's just
he hasn't been able to make it happen, you know,
like now up until now. You can imagine and I
(06:04):
would have been doing the same thing. He'd be sitting
there in the stands watching quldn't go and you know,
while he'd been loving it and all for you know,
of course you want the Orblecks to win personally, I'm
sure because I would have been. I would have been going,
oh damn, look look how he and then he's scores
two tries and go, man, just guess what I need exactly?
Speaker 2 (06:24):
And what about I mean ricco Yoanni's played there a
lot in the last last three four years, hasn't had
a crack there this year? Can you see them going
back to Rico yo Wanni at Centinel? Do you think
that has been gone?
Speaker 3 (06:36):
Yeah, I'm not too sure. You know, it's for someone
like that. Well, he's obviously still in the picture because
he was there on the weekend. You know, I don't
know what rasis sports are. You know, we're probably going
to find that out pretty soon. You know, unless you
out and out drop them. I don't think you can
just sort of face someone like Rico just you know,
out of the team. Truth of the matter is, we
(06:57):
don't have a better option, you know at the moment,
even if it's backer. You know, to Quinn, everything Rico
has done over the years, you know, he's got all
the experience. You know. I didn't think much phasism and
and sometimes you need that.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
And just on the partnership side of this, because I'm
pretty sure Quinta Pie wouldn't have played with Jordy Barrett
and a midfield anywhere. And you think of the great
midfield partnerships, and yours with Walter Little was one of those.
How long did that take to develop? How long did
it take does it take for a good midfield partnership
to to really start thriving.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
Well, we myself and Walter. You know, we had the
benefit of having you know, played at North Harbor Heather
as well, so you know when we when we weren't
with the All Blacks, we were we were doing the
same sort of thing with Harbor, so you know we
had we had the benefit of that. But jeez, it's
hard to put a time sort of un limit on it,
but I would say it. You know, it's got to
(07:55):
take you know, at least a year or so, at
least a season and a number of tests, and you
know there's going to be highers and lows. But you
know you're kind of it's development, you know, it's it
doesn't happen all the times. The thing about Quinn his
performance on Saturday, Imagine how pumped up he would have
been to that. Imagine his motivation going into that. You know,
(08:18):
he had a lot to prove. He was put in
a new position, so you know, the real it was real,
real focus. So that happened. Now every time it's up
to him just to make sure it's not a one off.
But you know, as much as we'd love it, we
can't hold him to you know, to expecting that standard
all the time. So there's going to be highs and
there's going to be lows. You know. Wallace Titi's you know,
(08:40):
one outstanding first year. Been a little bit quieter, you
know a couple of injuries and stuff, but he hasn't
sort of been the you know, the player that that
we got used to in the first season. Quinn just
had to, you know, he just has to buy his
time and maybe not put too much precking on himself
and not expect, you know, too much.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Fascinating a couple of years ahead, I went and see
what Riser thinks about the Jordy Barrett quin to midfield partnership.
But you always appreciate your thoughts, mate, Thanks for taking
the time.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
She's plenty.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
For more from Sports Talk, listen live to News Talks.
It'd be from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio.
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