May 16, 2025 • 11 mins
Sky Sport is primed to recommence coverage of First XV rugby after a two-season absence, with live broadcasts kicking off from May 29.
Sky today announced plans to broadcast up to 20 First XV fixtures this year, with nine matches confirmed to date – and all expected to draw thousands of eyeballs.
However, it comes with a caveat: there are no plans to broadcast any Auckland 1A First XV matches this season, given a media ban still in force there by school principals.
Gary Burchett Head of Sky Sport joined D'Arcy Waldegrave to discuss the return of First XV to our screens.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Dancie Waldergrave
from News Talk ZEDB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Good evening, Gary Darcy.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Pleasure to be with you again and great.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
To have you on Massive News today. First fifteen rugby
is back, first and fore.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
Most wonderful news. How well, I really have to thank
Sky has to thank the schools for their for their
ongoing enthusiasm and for their desire for schoolboy rugby to
be beamed around the screens across Alta. It's not a
sky Lit initiative. This is done in concert with the schools.
(00:44):
As you can appreciate, you need to be invited on
school grounds to showcase rugby. So we can't do this
without the support of the schools. And what we're hearing
is that schools and communities are just truly excited for
the prospect of bringing you know, first fifteen rugby back,
and we're encouraged by their enthusiastic response. I think it's
a great win for rugby. You know, in this day
(01:06):
and age.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Did they approach you, Gary?
Speaker 3 (01:10):
The conversations have been ongoing, I think since Sky stopped
doing First fifteen sort of nineteen twenty, nineteen twenty twenty,
so and we just got to a point where there
was there was such a chorus of enthusiasm from rugby
fans and the schools that there was just an opportunity
(01:30):
to seriously reignite the competition. So we've heard, we've listened,
and we've responded.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Is there a case of rights money changing hand? What
a Sky stand to make out of this? And indeed
what are the schools stand to make out of us?
When we're talking purely fiscally here.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
This is not a commercial play. In fact, you know
what it takes to put on a sports broadcast. Whilst
it won't have the kind of production spec that Super
Rugby or some of our more prominent sports justify, there's
still an expense of mobilizing teams around the country. So
this is this is not a commercial play the Sky,
(02:10):
but it's more of a complementary experience, but more tapping
into one of the most passionate fan bases of rugby
union in this country. The all good sporting contests need
healthy tribalism, and I don't think there's greater tribalism than
what you see at first fifteen level. And as a
(02:31):
relatively new Kiwei, I remember like coming to this country
and then seeing videos of you, say, the Kevin's kids
all coming down, you know, in convoy onto the field
of play and doing the Harker. I remember sending those
visuals to my colleagues and friends around the world who
are absolutely staggered that this kind of passion and loyalty
(02:52):
at school level exists. So sport is about celebrating that passion,
celebrating that rivalry, and we're glad that we can be
the conduit to bring you know, that collegiate and that
that healthy level of competition to our screens and to
our fans.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
Are you guys going to take a hit because it
won't be cheap You said it's not going to be
super rugby level production, but I'm presuming you're not going
to film it on potato. You're going to put in
a really good shot to film all these games. So
you guys are actually taking a wallet to put this
on air, aren't you.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
Yeah. We've also got to be smart about how we
do productions, and in this day and age, remote productions
a very tactical and strategic way of capturing live sport.
You don't bring a full ensemble of production personnel to
a venue with fiber connectivity, you can actually bring pictures back.
You can have your director in the studio, you can
(03:48):
have your commentators in the studio, your tape operators, your audio,
and you can do a very solid production without the
production footprint at the actual match itself. So wherever it's
smart about the way we want to deliver this kind
of content. And having said that, it's also worth noting
(04:10):
that we are going to be bringing some of how
big guns to do the occasional call, like Jeff Wilson, Mills, Muliaina,
you know, justin Marshall broadcasters, but they're also ads. And
I also know you know the pressures and the opportunities
that young men and women in this country you have
when given an opportunity to be featured on national broadcast.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
The benefits for the schools that's not going to be financial,
But what do they get out of this, What do
they see as a positive for engaging.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
In this healthy competition. You know, a lot of schools
can use sport as a very powerful tool for promoting
school values. We've seen that very clearly in the US.
I think that probably best exemplifies the power of the
sports team doing rather well. Look, I can't speak on
behalf of the schools. I can just speak on behalf
(05:02):
of a broadcaster who knows the power of sport. We
know that, we know that when you're in a sporting team,
the values of resilience and unity and harmony, collaboration and
empowerment they're there. They're they're they're really valuable skill sets
and principles just in everyday life, you know, and being
(05:26):
being on a national broadcast can do wonders. I mean,
the conversations that I've had, you know, with with various
schools and with various communities and families, is that all
the kids are fizzed, who want who wouldn't want to
be and then and having that opportunity to be in
front you know, of a live TV audience and and
potentially own your moment. I mean it's fair to say
(05:49):
that I could think of a couple of current All
Blacks who probably got their their breakthrough through through first
fifteen through that exposure. So I think it's a wonderful
opportunity to shine the light of the next generation of talent.
In So the.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
Elephant in the room is Auckland one a there not
involved tell us about the way that work. Did you
approach them, did they walk? What was the deal there?
Because this is something that you know, the biggest population
in New Zealand will go what about them? What's the
deal with that? Gary.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Look, we've had a constructive dialogue with the Auckland One
Hour Competition as part of our planning. But yes, you're
right that no matches from that league will be broadcast
this season on Sky. And look, we're not in the
position to coerce or force that's not our objective. We
certainly remain open to working with the one Air competition
(06:44):
in the future, and as head of Sport, I hope
that when they look at the brand and the style
and the tonality of coverage that they see on Sky,
that we give it, you know, the Goldies and the
Marshes and the Mills and some of our top tier
talent in tandem with a very slick, you know, graphics
and creative package that they look and understand what we're
trying to do with rugby. We want to grow the
(07:06):
game at Sky. We want more people to play rugby,
we want more people to talk about rugby. So we
think it's there's no better opportunity than tapping into a
really strong and cherished format that is a hotbed of
passion and very healthy rivalry Gary.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
When it all disappeared back in twenty twenty two, there
was numerous points that the schools brought up. They were
uncomfortable with, the one a schools student well being, unhealthy,
scrutiny of the players, professionalization of the game, lack of control,
the potential for poaching. What lessons to pick up out
(07:45):
of that, and how's it affected? How are you're going
to cover the games this time around, even though the
Auckland teams aren't involved.
Speaker 3 (07:53):
All very valid points, and we are not deaf to
that criticism and that scrutiny. But I just want to
be very clear that the scrutiny will not come from sky.
We take our responsibility as broadcasters extremely seriously. You must
appreciate that the tonality of schoolboy rugby coverage will be
vastly different to that of professional rugby or any professional
(08:16):
sports that we cover. These miners are in the infancy
of their sporting journey, so we need to be mindful
of that. We're not, I mean, we have no interest
in being critical or crucifying potential careers. I mean, that's
just counterproductive. We need we're there to champion sports, celebrate sport,
and we know that we've got a very important role
(08:39):
in making sure that we do the best to champion
these bright athletes in a really responsible way.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
I'm glad you mentioned minus. That's a question for you.
What kind of permission do you need from the schools,
from the parents in order to put this to air?
Is this a week by week at school by school,
a team by team situation.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
We have constructive and mature talks with the school. There's
a dos and don'ts, and we're working that with the
school At the moment, I'll be sitting down with my
commentary team very shortly and we'll be talking through our
not negotiables and what I just told you about making
sure that our commentary. All commentary has to be truthful.
But we're not going to show, you know, multiple replays
(09:21):
of a young kid knocking on a ball. We've also
taken the steps that we don't have any photo imagery
when we go through team cards, so you know, again,
we just want to make sure that we're doing our
bit to sort of celebrate the game and not in
any way look to injure reputations. Or do anything that
(09:41):
may be seen to be casting a harsh and unfair
eye on the way that the game is played.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
And I'm presuming from there the running of the games
and how it all operates, that's in the hands of
the schools. It's not your control, that's right.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Yeah, So it's not a national competition as such. So
we've sort of hand picked twenty to twenty one matches,
you know, across the sort of six to eight week
time period. So we're starting with Nelson College and Marlborough
on the twenty ninth of May, and it's almost like
we look at the regions and we look at the
(10:17):
schedules that those regions are put out, and then we
sort of cherry pick the matches that we feel will
resonate with our audiences.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
And finally, Gary Burchett, and thank you so much for
your time. Explanations. What is the involvement of the union
in ZI are around this.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Well, as far as I know, ns I have always
been a strong supporter of secondary rugby. Look, they don't
control the draws or the schedule. That's the domain of
the schools, which you've just implied, because entry to the
grounds of the schools is incumbent on granting Sky permission.
But I understand that there is announcement coming out from
(10:54):
ns ANDR shortly in respect to secondary schools rugby and
that an under eighteen secondary school side will be playing Australia.
So my understanding is that NZR is very supportive in
promoting secondary schools rugby for the future, but you have.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
An engage a theme around the coverage of this.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
I believe that our management team have also kept our
partner a very valuable partner, ands that are in step
with our movements.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
For more from sports Talk, listen live to news Talks
there'd be from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Dancie Waldergrave
from News Talk ZEDB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Good evening, Gary Darcy.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Pleasure to be with you again and great.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
To have you on Massive News today. First fifteen rugby
is back, first and fore.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
Most wonderful news. How well, I really have to thank
Sky has to thank the schools for their for their
ongoing enthusiasm and for their desire for schoolboy rugby to
be beamed around the screens across Alta. It's not a
sky Lit initiative. This is done in concert with the schools.
(00:44):
As you can appreciate, you need to be invited on
school grounds to showcase rugby. So we can't do this
without the support of the schools. And what we're hearing
is that schools and communities are just truly excited for
the prospect of bringing you know, first fifteen rugby back,
and we're encouraged by their enthusiastic response. I think it's
a great win for rugby. You know, in this day
(01:06):
and age.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Did they approach you, Gary?
Speaker 3 (01:10):
The conversations have been ongoing, I think since Sky stopped
doing First fifteen sort of nineteen twenty, nineteen twenty twenty,
so and we just got to a point where there
was there was such a chorus of enthusiasm from rugby
fans and the schools that there was just an opportunity
(01:30):
to seriously reignite the competition. So we've heard, we've listened,
and we've responded.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Is there a case of rights money changing hand? What
a Sky stand to make out of this? And indeed
what are the schools stand to make out of us?
When we're talking purely fiscally here.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
This is not a commercial play. In fact, you know
what it takes to put on a sports broadcast. Whilst
it won't have the kind of production spec that Super
Rugby or some of our more prominent sports justify, there's
still an expense of mobilizing teams around the country. So
this is this is not a commercial play the Sky,
(02:10):
but it's more of a complementary experience, but more tapping
into one of the most passionate fan bases of rugby
union in this country. The all good sporting contests need
healthy tribalism, and I don't think there's greater tribalism than
what you see at first fifteen level. And as a
(02:31):
relatively new Kiwei, I remember like coming to this country
and then seeing videos of you, say, the Kevin's kids
all coming down, you know, in convoy onto the field
of play and doing the Harker. I remember sending those
visuals to my colleagues and friends around the world who
are absolutely staggered that this kind of passion and loyalty
(02:52):
at school level exists. So sport is about celebrating that passion,
celebrating that rivalry, and we're glad that we can be
the conduit to bring you know, that collegiate and that
that healthy level of competition to our screens and to
our fans.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
Are you guys going to take a hit because it
won't be cheap You said it's not going to be
super rugby level production, but I'm presuming you're not going
to film it on potato. You're going to put in
a really good shot to film all these games. So
you guys are actually taking a wallet to put this
on air, aren't you.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
Yeah. We've also got to be smart about how we
do productions, and in this day and age, remote productions
a very tactical and strategic way of capturing live sport.
You don't bring a full ensemble of production personnel to
a venue with fiber connectivity, you can actually bring pictures back.
You can have your director in the studio, you can
(03:48):
have your commentators in the studio, your tape operators, your audio,
and you can do a very solid production without the
production footprint at the actual match itself. So wherever it's
smart about the way we want to deliver this kind
of content. And having said that, it's also worth noting
(04:10):
that we are going to be bringing some of how
big guns to do the occasional call, like Jeff Wilson, Mills, Muliaina,
you know, justin Marshall broadcasters, but they're also ads. And
I also know you know the pressures and the opportunities
that young men and women in this country you have
when given an opportunity to be featured on national broadcast.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
The benefits for the schools that's not going to be financial,
But what do they get out of this, What do
they see as a positive for engaging.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
In this healthy competition. You know, a lot of schools
can use sport as a very powerful tool for promoting
school values. We've seen that very clearly in the US.
I think that probably best exemplifies the power of the
sports team doing rather well. Look, I can't speak on
behalf of the schools. I can just speak on behalf
(05:02):
of a broadcaster who knows the power of sport. We
know that, we know that when you're in a sporting team,
the values of resilience and unity and harmony, collaboration and
empowerment they're there. They're they're they're really valuable skill sets
and principles just in everyday life, you know, and being
(05:26):
being on a national broadcast can do wonders. I mean,
the conversations that I've had, you know, with with various
schools and with various communities and families, is that all
the kids are fizzed, who want who wouldn't want to
be and then and having that opportunity to be in
front you know, of a live TV audience and and
potentially own your moment. I mean it's fair to say
(05:49):
that I could think of a couple of current All
Blacks who probably got their their breakthrough through through first
fifteen through that exposure. So I think it's a wonderful
opportunity to shine the light of the next generation of talent.
In So the.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
Elephant in the room is Auckland one a there not
involved tell us about the way that work. Did you
approach them, did they walk? What was the deal there?
Because this is something that you know, the biggest population
in New Zealand will go what about them? What's the
deal with that? Gary.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Look, we've had a constructive dialogue with the Auckland One
Hour Competition as part of our planning. But yes, you're
right that no matches from that league will be broadcast
this season on Sky. And look, we're not in the
position to coerce or force that's not our objective. We
certainly remain open to working with the one Air competition
(06:44):
in the future, and as head of Sport, I hope
that when they look at the brand and the style
and the tonality of coverage that they see on Sky,
that we give it, you know, the Goldies and the
Marshes and the Mills and some of our top tier
talent in tandem with a very slick, you know, graphics
and creative package that they look and understand what we're
trying to do with rugby. We want to grow the
(07:06):
game at Sky. We want more people to play rugby,
we want more people to talk about rugby. So we
think it's there's no better opportunity than tapping into a
really strong and cherished format that is a hotbed of
passion and very healthy rivalry Gary.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
When it all disappeared back in twenty twenty two, there
was numerous points that the schools brought up. They were
uncomfortable with, the one a schools student well being, unhealthy,
scrutiny of the players, professionalization of the game, lack of control,
the potential for poaching. What lessons to pick up out
(07:45):
of that, and how's it affected? How are you're going
to cover the games this time around, even though the
Auckland teams aren't involved.
Speaker 3 (07:53):
All very valid points, and we are not deaf to
that criticism and that scrutiny. But I just want to
be very clear that the scrutiny will not come from sky.
We take our responsibility as broadcasters extremely seriously. You must
appreciate that the tonality of schoolboy rugby coverage will be
vastly different to that of professional rugby or any professional
(08:16):
sports that we cover. These miners are in the infancy
of their sporting journey, so we need to be mindful
of that. We're not, I mean, we have no interest
in being critical or crucifying potential careers. I mean, that's
just counterproductive. We need we're there to champion sports, celebrate sport,
and we know that we've got a very important role
(08:39):
in making sure that we do the best to champion
these bright athletes in a really responsible way.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
I'm glad you mentioned minus. That's a question for you.
What kind of permission do you need from the schools,
from the parents in order to put this to air?
Is this a week by week at school by school,
a team by team situation.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
We have constructive and mature talks with the school. There's
a dos and don'ts, and we're working that with the
school At the moment, I'll be sitting down with my
commentary team very shortly and we'll be talking through our
not negotiables and what I just told you about making
sure that our commentary. All commentary has to be truthful.
But we're not going to show, you know, multiple replays
(09:21):
of a young kid knocking on a ball. We've also
taken the steps that we don't have any photo imagery
when we go through team cards, so you know, again,
we just want to make sure that we're doing our
bit to sort of celebrate the game and not in
any way look to injure reputations. Or do anything that
(09:41):
may be seen to be casting a harsh and unfair
eye on the way that the game is played.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
And I'm presuming from there the running of the games
and how it all operates, that's in the hands of
the schools. It's not your control, that's right.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Yeah, So it's not a national competition as such. So
we've sort of hand picked twenty to twenty one matches,
you know, across the sort of six to eight week
time period. So we're starting with Nelson College and Marlborough
on the twenty ninth of May, and it's almost like
we look at the regions and we look at the
(10:17):
schedules that those regions are put out, and then we
sort of cherry pick the matches that we feel will
resonate with our audiences.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
And finally, Gary Burchett, and thank you so much for
your time. Explanations. What is the involvement of the union
in ZI are around this.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Well, as far as I know, ns I have always
been a strong supporter of secondary rugby. Look, they don't
control the draws or the schedule. That's the domain of
the schools, which you've just implied, because entry to the
grounds of the schools is incumbent on granting Sky permission.
But I understand that there is announcement coming out from
(10:54):
ns ANDR shortly in respect to secondary schools rugby and
that an under eighteen secondary school side will be playing Australia.
So my understanding is that NZR is very supportive in
promoting secondary schools rugby for the future, but you have.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
An engage a theme around the coverage of this.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
I believe that our management team have also kept our
partner a very valuable partner, ands that are in step
with our movements.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
For more from sports Talk, listen live to news Talks
there'd be from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio
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