July 24, 2024 • 12 mins
New Zealand E-Sports CEO Jonathan Jansen joined D'Arcy Waldegrave to discuss the creation of the 2025 ESports Olympic Games in Saudi Arabia.
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Dancy Wildergrave
from News Talk ZEDB.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
E Sport is the flavor now right on the eve
of the opening of the Olympic Games. Well, the Olympics
have chimed on in with E Sports. Their tournament is
coming up next year. Jonathan Jansen joins us now at
CEO of E Sport in z. Welcome to the show, Jonathan.
First up, just how big is this announcement?
Speaker 3 (00:35):
This announcement is huge and thanks for having me Arc.
It's great to be here, and it's tens of years
in the making. We've been pushing this for a really
really long time. And to be recognized by the International
Olympic Committee and not just be part of the Olympics,
which I think what some people were expecting, but to
have our own Olympic Esport Games next to the Summer
Winter and Paralympics is really awesome.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
What did they base that on? Because this is big
news and I think out of left field for a
lot of people. So when you applied to have this
sport out as its own stand the Lone Games, what
was the basis? Jonathan?
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Well, so we didn't apply, you know, intended to have
sort of worked this way. It was something that was
bubbling it back in the background. So, I mean, we
know that, you know, two point seven million Kiwis are
gamers and play games. We know that there are hundreds
of millions of dollars in prize money one every year
through e sports.
Speaker 4 (01:25):
Like it's a really really.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Big global phenomenon that more and more people are participating,
and it's been growing in New Zealand and the Olympic
Committee sort of went away and decided how they were
going to interact with this. They established a commission to
go away and sort of investigate how they could engage
with esports, and that commission, which was internal to the
Olympic Committee, decided that their proposal was to create their
(01:47):
own Olympic esports games rather than integrating it into the
summer or Winter Olympics, which really makes sense because esports
isn't just a sport, right, It's like fifty sports, because
the basketball and the e football and the sim racing,
they're all unique cultures and people and competitions, and so
you can't just add it like you could add high jump.
You really need its own sort of structure around it,
(02:09):
which is what they've landed on.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
Okay, so how big in New Zealand? You mentioned two
point seven million people? Is that on a regular basis?
How do you count that? How do you know? Is
just people who are from time to time roll on
to play a bit of I don't know what they'd play.
I mean, I don't know, I'm too old for it.
Or is it a regular participation style? What was the
guts here?
Speaker 4 (02:31):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (02:31):
Yeah, so I mean if we we measured across lots
of different metrics. But let's look at your schools, right,
So there are two hundred and fifty secondary school teams.
There's only four hundred secondary schools in New Zealand. You know,
there's two hundred and fifty two secondary school teams who
compete during the school year as part of a school sport.
There are thousands of kiwis who are competing every single
night across different things. Because it's really it's a connected thing.
(02:53):
The cool thing about esports is you could have a
mate from Fun today. You could have a mate from
Invercargo and two guys from walk Them and one from
Hamilton and they jump on the computer or the console
or whatever it is on a Tuesday night and they
can all play together as a team, you know, all
together at once, and so I think that connectedness is
really what attracts people. But now gaming and esports is
just massive. The biggest game in the world right one
(03:15):
hundred and eighty million monthly players. And that was a
country that it'd be larger than Russia. It's like the
eighth largest economy in the world. And this is just
one game.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
What's the game?
Speaker 4 (03:26):
What's the game? Tell me? What's the game? League of Legends?
Have you ever heard of it?
Speaker 3 (03:31):
No?
Speaker 2 (03:31):
But I am an oxygen thief, so I probably shouldn't have.
Speaker 4 (03:34):
Heard of it.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
Yeah, so League of Religion is one of the big ones.
But they're just they're phenomenal. People spend more time gaming,
they're on social media in a day, if you can
believe it, eighty one minutes a day on average people
were spending the average Kiwi is spending gaming and it's
not also who you'd expect, you know, the All Blacks
tour with their PS five's and the Toll Blacks are
all out there gaming. There are a lot of our shows,
so it's something that everyone does. And the fact that
(03:59):
now we can have kiwis winning Olympic medals representing their
country under the rings is really exciting.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
CEO of E Sports that z Jonathan Jansen joins us
I suppose to separate it out to its own individual
competition the e Olympics. It saves drama and arguments around
people saying but is it actually a sport because it's
stand alone. Now you would have dealt with this a
lot of times before, so put it to you again,
me being an old bugger who remembers defender. But that's
(04:28):
about it. Is it a sport and how is it
a sport?
Speaker 3 (04:32):
Well, look, you still don't think it's a sport. Not
every sport is for everyone, and there are some people
who are want to die on that hill who are
going to say, no, it's not a sport. But at
the end of the day, when we look at what
why a sport?
Speaker 4 (04:43):
Is a sport?
Speaker 3 (04:44):
So people can feel connected, so that we can compete it,
so that we have teamwork, we can communication, so we
can a lot of the KEI we values that I
think we find the purpose behind our sport. They're through
esports and there are a lot of people out there
who can't participate in sport for whatever reason. And we've
found that actually, surprisingly, esports is a way for them
(05:05):
to connect with each other student. It's sixty one percent
of kids who play esports in schools then go on
to play another sport because they make friends that they
weren't able to make before, and then they're building the
confidence to go out and play on the field. So
we're finding that absolutely it's a sport on its own right,
but it's also in as well as not and instead
of people aren't choosing to do it instead of regular sport,
(05:25):
it's actually helping make our kids more active because they're learning, Hey,
if I want to be the best in the world now,
if I want to go to the Olympic esports games,
I have to be the very best. And to be
the very best, I need to sleep right. I need
to eat right. Because if you're you know, chugging back
some energy drinks or you're doing something you know, like
you're feeding into those stereotypes, then you've got brain fog
(05:46):
and you're not healthy and you can't make quick decisions.
You're not you don't have quick reflexes, and those are
all things that are super important in the world of esports.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
We keep getting absolutely.
Speaker 2 (05:54):
We keep getting told that screen time is bad for
our children and they need physical activity and that should
trump any form of sitting behind a screen. What you're saying, though,
is by this you can actually move into something more physical.
But is that in itself being behind a screen and
looking at that and not indulging physically, Is that a problem?
Speaker 3 (06:15):
Do you think, Jothan No, I mean I think you're
banging on like, yes, screen too much. Screen time is
the problem, and it's whether or not we want to
acknowledge it for what it is and then and then
use the goods out of it. And we know and
that's all. That's what esports is about. It's like, it's
kind of like boxing. You got to boxing to learn discipline.
And just like sport helps us lead healthy physical lives,
(06:38):
esports does the same thing, but it helps us learn
healthy lead healthy digital lives. And it's about that moderation
of screen time and the balance in what you're doing
and if you structure it in a competition format. Because remember,
esports and gaming are different. They're two different things, and
a lot of people don't don't realize that is that
gaming can just be going home and jumping on the
console or eating a bag of chips. You know, that's
the same as going to the beach with a rugby
(07:00):
ball and calling yourself an All Black, Like they're two
different things. Esports is the competitive aspect of it, so
it's training with your team, it's practicing discipline and willpower,
and even though sometimes you know you might be in
front of a screen. Or there are esports that are
very physical like Hadeau is virtual dodgeball. You've got Zwift,
which is cycling where your physical energy is actually being
translated through different technological means. But all of these are
(07:24):
very very health focused, and so we're seeing very well
researched health benefits, physical health benefits coming from esports. And
whether they do esports or not, we know that kiwis
are gaming, and so it comes down to would you
rather than game in a structured manner that's organized and
has physical benefits, or would you rather just kind of
(07:44):
put your head in the sand than in the same
way as you know, as TikTok healthy for you physically?
Absolutely not. And so let's get them doing something productive.
If they're going to be in front of a screen.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
They haven't got TikTok games yet. I hasten to edge
as far as training and application, if you're looking to
do something like represent how many hours a day a
peace training, I'm presuming a difference between a various e sports.
Give us a rough idea of commitment required to get
to the top and how that changes between different sports.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
Commitment is huge. It's probably one of the most competitive,
if not the most competitive individual commitment required for any
sport globally. You mentioned at the top of the interview,
you know, we just had the World Esports cut over
in Saudi, which had one hundred million dollar prize. Paul,
there's twenty five hundred competitors from across the globe competing
in there. That's life changing money for anyone, and those
(08:40):
players will be practicing or committing their whole lives to
the pursuit of being the absolute best in their game.
But what we're learning with people like High Performance Sport
New Zealand is what is actual high performance E sports
and how do we train it well? And it's not
sixteen hours of sitting in front of a computer. It
is about you know, it is about that physical balance,
and it's the what's your cardiovascular fitness? Like, what's your
(09:03):
VO two? How are you emotionally regulating your responses, your
reaction time, which relates lots of your diet. It's actually
a lot of neuro and cognitive work that goes into
the athletes, and so spending more than two or three
hours in front of a computer, you start to get
diminishing returns very very quickly. Just like you can overtrain
in rugby you're running or soccer, you know your body
(09:25):
fatigues quite quickly and the signs are very obvious. The
risk with esports is that cognitive fatigue is not as obvious,
and so we have to be extra careful in terms
of when you're preparing athletes about how much exposure to
the screen they have, how they're practicing with intent, and
really how we condition their bodies to perform best.
Speaker 4 (09:43):
So there is very much a science to.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
It, Jonathan. People don't want to compete at this games?
How do they go through that process? Are a series
of competitions and different sports they can do? How does
this work? You want to represent New Zealand, you want
to win a gold medal in your esport? You're start
now right, what is to happen?
Speaker 3 (10:02):
I just love that you're saying that, because it's just
so cool to hear that that's a possibility. Now, Well,
if people want to get involved, the best way it's
very early, so head over to the We've got a
website usually on ends at sports dot z. There's some
social media pages up around it. But we're still learning
what the criteria is. But the best part is is
just be part of the community, wait for more news
(10:23):
to come out. It'll be just like the regular Olympics,
where there's a selection criteria and we'll be out there
actively trying to find through schools, university competitions, our amateur
leagues and our national leagues. We'll be looking for the
sort of the best athletes to scout and then prepare
them to don the silver fern and head over to
the Olympic Games.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
There's one hundred million bucks in prize money. Does this
have to be funded from bank?
Speaker 4 (10:46):
Here?
Speaker 2 (10:46):
The government going to dig into the rather shallow pockets
and help you guys out.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
Well, that's what the High Performance New Zealand structures and
everything's already for. That type of prize money that you're
talking about is for the Sports World Cup, which is
sort of a separate it's sort of like the World
Championships versus the Olympics, so it's a separate event, but
we already have great partnerships with you know, Sport New
Zealand and High Performance Sport, and that's how we've been
(11:12):
supporting our athletes. So far. We've had Kiwis win bronze
medals at World Championships and Global Games. New Zealand's got
a pretty good name out there already because we've got
some really talented, I think individuals in our country. It's
kind of in our DNA to be successful in competition.
And so now we've already got that all started and
set up.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
And finally and thanks very much for joining us. Jonathan Jansen,
CEO of E Sports en Z. Have you got a favorite?
What one really texted for you? Who?
Speaker 4 (11:41):
Look?
Speaker 3 (11:42):
Personally, I am a bit of a fan of League Legends,
but I think to watch Street Fighter. Street Fighter is
one of my favorites. That's just your classic one on
one combat game. And the skill required to do that
blows my mind because you know me and you look
at a screen and we just see a screen, right,
These guys look at a screen and they see like
(12:02):
sixty frames per second and they count frames. So the
how quickly their minds have to react to me is
actually a superhuman and so I love watching that because
it's just, yeah, it's awesome.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
Mat take me back to Defender and Frogger. I'll be
all over it like a rash, but.
Speaker 4 (12:20):
Hey, we'll get you there. It's about you know, when
they start the Masters League.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
Yeah, it's all about looking forward. It's all about the future,
and someone like myself will still balks at that wronghill
to die on because the only constant is change. You've
got to be amongst otherwise you're left behind. So thanks
so much for joining us and explaining a little bit
about the Olympic Games for esports.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
Good on your.
Speaker 4 (12:44):
Jonathan, thanks Hamming on the show.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
For more from Sports Talk, listen live to News Talks
it'd be from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Dancy Wildergrave
from News Talk ZEDB.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
E Sport is the flavor now right on the eve
of the opening of the Olympic Games. Well, the Olympics
have chimed on in with E Sports. Their tournament is
coming up next year. Jonathan Jansen joins us now at
CEO of E Sport in z. Welcome to the show, Jonathan.
First up, just how big is this announcement?
Speaker 3 (00:35):
This announcement is huge and thanks for having me Arc.
It's great to be here, and it's tens of years
in the making. We've been pushing this for a really
really long time. And to be recognized by the International
Olympic Committee and not just be part of the Olympics,
which I think what some people were expecting, but to
have our own Olympic Esport Games next to the Summer
Winter and Paralympics is really awesome.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
What did they base that on? Because this is big
news and I think out of left field for a
lot of people. So when you applied to have this
sport out as its own stand the Lone Games, what
was the basis? Jonathan?
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Well, so we didn't apply, you know, intended to have
sort of worked this way. It was something that was
bubbling it back in the background. So, I mean, we
know that, you know, two point seven million Kiwis are
gamers and play games. We know that there are hundreds
of millions of dollars in prize money one every year
through e sports.
Speaker 4 (01:25):
Like it's a really really.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Big global phenomenon that more and more people are participating,
and it's been growing in New Zealand and the Olympic
Committee sort of went away and decided how they were
going to interact with this. They established a commission to
go away and sort of investigate how they could engage
with esports, and that commission, which was internal to the
Olympic Committee, decided that their proposal was to create their
(01:47):
own Olympic esports games rather than integrating it into the
summer or Winter Olympics, which really makes sense because esports
isn't just a sport, right, It's like fifty sports, because
the basketball and the e football and the sim racing,
they're all unique cultures and people and competitions, and so
you can't just add it like you could add high jump.
You really need its own sort of structure around it,
(02:09):
which is what they've landed on.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
Okay, so how big in New Zealand? You mentioned two
point seven million people? Is that on a regular basis?
How do you count that? How do you know? Is
just people who are from time to time roll on
to play a bit of I don't know what they'd play.
I mean, I don't know, I'm too old for it.
Or is it a regular participation style? What was the
guts here?
Speaker 4 (02:31):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (02:31):
Yeah, so I mean if we we measured across lots
of different metrics. But let's look at your schools, right,
So there are two hundred and fifty secondary school teams.
There's only four hundred secondary schools in New Zealand. You know,
there's two hundred and fifty two secondary school teams who
compete during the school year as part of a school sport.
There are thousands of kiwis who are competing every single
night across different things. Because it's really it's a connected thing.
(02:53):
The cool thing about esports is you could have a
mate from Fun today. You could have a mate from
Invercargo and two guys from walk Them and one from
Hamilton and they jump on the computer or the console
or whatever it is on a Tuesday night and they
can all play together as a team, you know, all
together at once, and so I think that connectedness is
really what attracts people. But now gaming and esports is
just massive. The biggest game in the world right one
(03:15):
hundred and eighty million monthly players. And that was a
country that it'd be larger than Russia. It's like the
eighth largest economy in the world. And this is just
one game.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
What's the game?
Speaker 4 (03:26):
What's the game? Tell me? What's the game? League of Legends?
Have you ever heard of it?
Speaker 3 (03:31):
No?
Speaker 2 (03:31):
But I am an oxygen thief, so I probably shouldn't have.
Speaker 4 (03:34):
Heard of it.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
Yeah, so League of Religion is one of the big ones.
But they're just they're phenomenal. People spend more time gaming,
they're on social media in a day, if you can
believe it, eighty one minutes a day on average people
were spending the average Kiwi is spending gaming and it's
not also who you'd expect, you know, the All Blacks
tour with their PS five's and the Toll Blacks are
all out there gaming. There are a lot of our shows,
so it's something that everyone does. And the fact that
(03:59):
now we can have kiwis winning Olympic medals representing their
country under the rings is really exciting.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
CEO of E Sports that z Jonathan Jansen joins us
I suppose to separate it out to its own individual
competition the e Olympics. It saves drama and arguments around
people saying but is it actually a sport because it's
stand alone. Now you would have dealt with this a
lot of times before, so put it to you again,
me being an old bugger who remembers defender. But that's
(04:28):
about it. Is it a sport and how is it
a sport?
Speaker 3 (04:32):
Well, look, you still don't think it's a sport. Not
every sport is for everyone, and there are some people
who are want to die on that hill who are
going to say, no, it's not a sport. But at
the end of the day, when we look at what
why a sport?
Speaker 4 (04:43):
Is a sport?
Speaker 3 (04:44):
So people can feel connected, so that we can compete it,
so that we have teamwork, we can communication, so we
can a lot of the KEI we values that I
think we find the purpose behind our sport. They're through
esports and there are a lot of people out there
who can't participate in sport for whatever reason. And we've
found that actually, surprisingly, esports is a way for them
(05:05):
to connect with each other student. It's sixty one percent
of kids who play esports in schools then go on
to play another sport because they make friends that they
weren't able to make before, and then they're building the
confidence to go out and play on the field. So
we're finding that absolutely it's a sport on its own right,
but it's also in as well as not and instead
of people aren't choosing to do it instead of regular sport,
(05:25):
it's actually helping make our kids more active because they're learning, Hey,
if I want to be the best in the world now,
if I want to go to the Olympic esports games,
I have to be the very best. And to be
the very best, I need to sleep right. I need
to eat right. Because if you're you know, chugging back
some energy drinks or you're doing something you know, like
you're feeding into those stereotypes, then you've got brain fog
(05:46):
and you're not healthy and you can't make quick decisions.
You're not you don't have quick reflexes, and those are
all things that are super important in the world of esports.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
We keep getting absolutely.
Speaker 2 (05:54):
We keep getting told that screen time is bad for
our children and they need physical activity and that should
trump any form of sitting behind a screen. What you're saying, though,
is by this you can actually move into something more physical.
But is that in itself being behind a screen and
looking at that and not indulging physically, Is that a problem?
Speaker 3 (06:15):
Do you think, Jothan No, I mean I think you're
banging on like, yes, screen too much. Screen time is
the problem, and it's whether or not we want to
acknowledge it for what it is and then and then
use the goods out of it. And we know and
that's all. That's what esports is about. It's like, it's
kind of like boxing. You got to boxing to learn discipline.
And just like sport helps us lead healthy physical lives,
(06:38):
esports does the same thing, but it helps us learn
healthy lead healthy digital lives. And it's about that moderation
of screen time and the balance in what you're doing
and if you structure it in a competition format. Because remember,
esports and gaming are different. They're two different things, and
a lot of people don't don't realize that is that
gaming can just be going home and jumping on the
console or eating a bag of chips. You know, that's
the same as going to the beach with a rugby
(07:00):
ball and calling yourself an All Black, Like they're two
different things. Esports is the competitive aspect of it, so
it's training with your team, it's practicing discipline and willpower,
and even though sometimes you know you might be in
front of a screen. Or there are esports that are
very physical like Hadeau is virtual dodgeball. You've got Zwift,
which is cycling where your physical energy is actually being
translated through different technological means. But all of these are
(07:24):
very very health focused, and so we're seeing very well
researched health benefits, physical health benefits coming from esports. And
whether they do esports or not, we know that kiwis
are gaming, and so it comes down to would you
rather than game in a structured manner that's organized and
has physical benefits, or would you rather just kind of
(07:44):
put your head in the sand than in the same
way as you know, as TikTok healthy for you physically?
Absolutely not. And so let's get them doing something productive.
If they're going to be in front of a screen.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
They haven't got TikTok games yet. I hasten to edge
as far as training and application, if you're looking to
do something like represent how many hours a day a
peace training, I'm presuming a difference between a various e sports.
Give us a rough idea of commitment required to get
to the top and how that changes between different sports.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
Commitment is huge. It's probably one of the most competitive,
if not the most competitive individual commitment required for any
sport globally. You mentioned at the top of the interview,
you know, we just had the World Esports cut over
in Saudi, which had one hundred million dollar prize. Paul,
there's twenty five hundred competitors from across the globe competing
in there. That's life changing money for anyone, and those
(08:40):
players will be practicing or committing their whole lives to
the pursuit of being the absolute best in their game.
But what we're learning with people like High Performance Sport
New Zealand is what is actual high performance E sports
and how do we train it well? And it's not
sixteen hours of sitting in front of a computer. It
is about you know, it is about that physical balance,
and it's the what's your cardiovascular fitness? Like, what's your
(09:03):
VO two? How are you emotionally regulating your responses, your
reaction time, which relates lots of your diet. It's actually
a lot of neuro and cognitive work that goes into
the athletes, and so spending more than two or three
hours in front of a computer, you start to get
diminishing returns very very quickly. Just like you can overtrain
in rugby you're running or soccer, you know your body
(09:25):
fatigues quite quickly and the signs are very obvious. The
risk with esports is that cognitive fatigue is not as obvious,
and so we have to be extra careful in terms
of when you're preparing athletes about how much exposure to
the screen they have, how they're practicing with intent, and
really how we condition their bodies to perform best.
Speaker 4 (09:43):
So there is very much a science to.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
It, Jonathan. People don't want to compete at this games?
How do they go through that process? Are a series
of competitions and different sports they can do? How does
this work? You want to represent New Zealand, you want
to win a gold medal in your esport? You're start
now right, what is to happen?
Speaker 3 (10:02):
I just love that you're saying that, because it's just
so cool to hear that that's a possibility. Now, Well,
if people want to get involved, the best way it's
very early, so head over to the We've got a
website usually on ends at sports dot z. There's some
social media pages up around it. But we're still learning
what the criteria is. But the best part is is
just be part of the community, wait for more news
(10:23):
to come out. It'll be just like the regular Olympics,
where there's a selection criteria and we'll be out there
actively trying to find through schools, university competitions, our amateur
leagues and our national leagues. We'll be looking for the
sort of the best athletes to scout and then prepare
them to don the silver fern and head over to
the Olympic Games.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
There's one hundred million bucks in prize money. Does this
have to be funded from bank?
Speaker 4 (10:46):
Here?
Speaker 2 (10:46):
The government going to dig into the rather shallow pockets
and help you guys out.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
Well, that's what the High Performance New Zealand structures and
everything's already for. That type of prize money that you're
talking about is for the Sports World Cup, which is
sort of a separate it's sort of like the World
Championships versus the Olympics, so it's a separate event, but
we already have great partnerships with you know, Sport New
Zealand and High Performance Sport, and that's how we've been
(11:12):
supporting our athletes. So far. We've had Kiwis win bronze
medals at World Championships and Global Games. New Zealand's got
a pretty good name out there already because we've got
some really talented, I think individuals in our country. It's
kind of in our DNA to be successful in competition.
And so now we've already got that all started and
set up.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
And finally and thanks very much for joining us. Jonathan Jansen,
CEO of E Sports en Z. Have you got a favorite?
What one really texted for you? Who?
Speaker 4 (11:41):
Look?
Speaker 3 (11:42):
Personally, I am a bit of a fan of League Legends,
but I think to watch Street Fighter. Street Fighter is
one of my favorites. That's just your classic one on
one combat game. And the skill required to do that
blows my mind because you know me and you look
at a screen and we just see a screen, right,
These guys look at a screen and they see like
(12:02):
sixty frames per second and they count frames. So the
how quickly their minds have to react to me is
actually a superhuman and so I love watching that because
it's just, yeah, it's awesome.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
Mat take me back to Defender and Frogger. I'll be
all over it like a rash, but.
Speaker 4 (12:20):
Hey, we'll get you there. It's about you know, when
they start the Masters League.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
Yeah, it's all about looking forward. It's all about the future,
and someone like myself will still balks at that wronghill
to die on because the only constant is change. You've
got to be amongst otherwise you're left behind. So thanks
so much for joining us and explaining a little bit
about the Olympic Games for esports.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
Good on your.
Speaker 4 (12:44):
Jonathan, thanks Hamming on the show.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
For more from Sports Talk, listen live to News Talks
it'd be from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio.
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