The Country 11/10/24: Kathryn Wright talks to Jamie Mackay

This Southland-based rural mental health counsellor is also part of the way through her PhD on the effects of carbon farming on the social fabric of rural communities. Her findings, thus far, make for sobering reading.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
We chatted to Catherine Wright at the end of September
as a part of our Mental Health Awareness weekness. She's
a registered counselor. Interestingly, also she's doing a PhD on
the effects of carbon farming on rural New Zealand, particularly
Otago and south and Catherine, you're based out of Tiana
on the Fiordland border there. I know it's been very,

(00:21):
very wet. I might come back to that one if
I've got time. What made you decide to do a
PhD on carbon farming?

Speaker 2 (00:28):
Okay, so I guess my main interest is for all
mental health. That's the area that I specialize in. I
completed masters research in twenty twenty two on mental health
and young rural men. There was a lot of finans
that came out of there, and I talked to a
lot of people, including stakeholders, and one thing that kept

(00:50):
coming up with this worry about population decline in forestry,
also coupled with reading in the media, and I think
that people have got a right to be concerned about it,
but at this point there is no research to show
us that it's actually happening or how that's affecting the people.
So this is where I thought I could make a contribution.

Speaker 1 (01:11):
You realize, Catherine, that the forestry industry will come back
at you and say, there are just as many jobs
in forestry as there are in keeping that land and
pastoral farming sheep and beef.

Speaker 2 (01:23):
Well, the forecast reports tell us otherwise. Yes, there are
flurries of activity around planting and harvest. But if you
look deeply at some of the forecasts, so there's a
great one by Great South, there's one that was conducted
in the Wairoa community show us that actually there's not
a consistent employment stream four people in forestry. It's very

(01:46):
hidden mass along the way.

Speaker 1 (01:48):
Are we growing or planting trees in the wrong places,
i e. On land that should be producing food yees?

Speaker 2 (01:57):
So most people would be a weir of the classification
which is the land use capability, and it goes from
one to eight, one being the most useful, which is
often used for well, it can be used for anything,
but often used for vegetable plant and things like that,
right up to eight, which is essentially too difficult to graze. Now,

(02:19):
research has shown in what exists already that up to
ninety percent of carbon forestry is being planted on l
uc six in New Zealand, so this is still highly
suitable for pastoral farming.

Speaker 1 (02:33):
One of your other findings was that many of the
farms sold to carbon forestry, and this doesn't surprise me
at all. Overseas owned, they may never be harvested, and
that's what worries me into the future. You know, we're
talking about climate change, We're talking about the east coast
of both islands getting increasingly dry. What's to stop mass
forest fires for these unkempt forests in the future.

Speaker 2 (02:57):
Yeah, and fires are one of the concents bands along
with out of control, invasive peace, the water usage. There's
a lot of things to be concerned about. Yes, there's
some great things about forestry if it's planted in the
right place, but we have to look at the long
term effects on the people, on the population.

Speaker 1 (03:18):
You can't blame farmers, especially sheep and beef farmers at
the moment if a forestry company comes along and offers
them good money, because no one else wants to buy
their farm at the moment.

Speaker 2 (03:28):
Yep, exactly. And this is absolutely not against farmers that
are doing there. I've seen some articles that I guess
aim criticism at farmers and only farmers do sell to forestry.
That's true, but this is an overly simplistic view. So
just as you said, the kind of position of farming

(03:49):
at the moment, government regulations, low commodity prices, advancing ages
of farmers, and that would encompass poor physical mental health.
Farmers are being backed into a corner if they have
the bank breathing down their neck, which is a lot
of this is happening at the moment. Of course they're
going to look at this, especially if it's the only

(04:09):
offer on the table and it's not going to change anything.
If one farmer says, I'm not selling and I believe
that there have been farms like that, and that's great
that this is something that needs to change at government
policy level.

Speaker 1 (04:24):
Have we got our policy wrong around carbon credits?

Speaker 2 (04:29):
I think it needs to be looked at in terms
of how this affecting the people, How what will this
look look like in long term for our population. Do
we really want to go down a road that is
very difficult to go back from.

Speaker 1 (04:42):
Well, talking about roads, if you drive from Dunedin where
I'm based, through to central Otago, you will see a
lot of forestry planting going on and the likes of Lawrence,
which is one of my favorite little towns. You want
to hear from towns in South London Otaga that may
have been adversely affected by forestry or carbon farming, and

(05:02):
you also want to hear from towns that are currently flourishing.

Speaker 2 (05:07):
Yeah, that's right. So I essentially need to select a
couple of case studies for where my research will take place.
So Lawrence is definitely in my sights. It's been suggested
to me a couple of times. So yes, a town
that has experienced in population declined, maybe the shops, schools
are closing, but also one that has, even if it's

(05:28):
not immediately obvious, a flourishing social community of groups, sports teams,
things like that. And in the Otago Southern.

Speaker 1 (05:37):
Area, Yes, well I'll tell you that town. It's called
Riversdale and Northern Southland, the capital of Northern south and
the best little town in Northern Southland just down the
road from you and Tianna. Very quickly to finish on Catherine,
I mentioned the weather. It's been appalling. How are you
getting on.

Speaker 2 (05:53):
Pretty good? Here? We're made to soak up a lot
of water. We're on the border of a rainforest, but yeah,
there's still a few bit of mud around and you're
sloshy under for sure.

Speaker 1 (06:04):
Well you're a deer farmer. There were built to handle
that and they're not fawning until November, so good luck. Hey,
thanks for your time. We'll follow your PhD on the
effects of carbon farming on rural New Zealand with much interest.

Speaker 2 (06:16):
Thank you very much, Jamie