September 18, 2024 • 12 mins
Feral or roaming dogs have been causing concern in remote parts of New Zealand for years.
But now things are getting so bad, trampers are being told they risk being attacked if they walk alone.
It’s prompted calls for drastic action to be taken to curb the issue – but what tools do we have at our disposal to manage the problem, and how has it gotten so bad?
Today on The Front Page, we are joined by NZ Herald premium content development deputy editor Hannah Brown, who has been looking into this issue.
Follow The Front Page on iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.
You can read more about this and other stories in the New Zealand Herald, online at nzherald.co.nz, or tune in to news bulletins across the NZME network.
Host: Susie Nordqvist
Sound Engineer: Paddy Fox
Producer: Ethan Sills
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Cure. I'm Susie nordquiston for Chelsea Daniels and this is
the Front Page, a daily podcast presented by the New
Zealand Herald. Feral or roaming dogs have been causing concern
in remote parts of New Zealand for years, but now
things are getting so bad trampers have been told they
(00:26):
risk being attacked if they walk alone. It's prompted calls
for drastic action to be taken to curb the issue.
But what tools do we have at our disposal to
manage the problem and how has it gotten so bad?
Today on the Front Page, we're joined by New Zealand
Herald Premium Content Development Deputy editor Hannah Brown, who has
(00:48):
been looking into this issue. Hannah, just how bad has
our feral dog problem become?
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Well, it kind of in twenty twenty one. I talked
to a farmer last week who said he and his
two neighbors between them have shot ninety dogs since twenty
twenty one. That included five in the last two months.
So in twenty twenty one there was a big push
to eradicate them and a whole bunch was shot. And
(01:19):
so now you could say there's a ragtag bunch of
dogs still out there by the sounds of it.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
And many of us will remember the issues with the
giant pack of dogs and the Far North from about
twenty twenty one. And what areas of New Zealand are
we seeing these wild dogs and how difficult are they
to track down?
Speaker 2 (01:37):
Well, it seems like the worst problems in the Far
North around Tippaki region, but we've also seen them further
down in Northland round Fangad. There's been some in the
central North Island to Udawda and Taranaki and the South Island.
So it basically sounds like any remote region can suffer
(01:58):
from this.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
What sort of problem do these dogs pose to farmland?
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Well, you know that worst problem In twenty twenty one
you had one farmer lose one hundred and twenty stock
and so yeah, it can be a major problem. And
the farmers that seem to have the most problem with
this kind of thing tend to be the ones who
border on dockland or forestry land. So you know, these
dogs can run one hundred kilometers a day, so they're like,
(02:26):
you know, they're in these big tracts of public land
or forestry land. And if you have a farm next
to that, then you can be a target.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
One of the.
Speaker 4 (02:38):
Farmers we were talking to who's lost a lot of stock.
It's been going on on is properly for thirty years,
but I'll bet it's been going on for a lot
longer than that. There's a huge economic impact for farmers.
We've spoken to farmers. We've just given up on raising
sheep because there's no point. They just get killed. So
it's switched over the cattle.
Speaker 1 (03:01):
Okay, And it's not just farmers, right. What advice has
been issued to trampers and hikers walking through the bush?
Speaker 2 (03:07):
Yeah, there have been quite a few reports over the
years from trampers that they've spotted dogs. Several I think
five dock tracks have been closed in the last few years.
While there's been a sweep by hunters to try and
track down these dogs. There haven't been any attacks by
dogs on trampers. But people are being told in the
(03:30):
far North around you know, the out door track, they're
being told to have a stick if a dog is
not aggressive, go around it, and to travel in pairs.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
And what about wildlife? What's the risk there?
Speaker 3 (03:43):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (03:43):
This has been I mean, this is one of the
things that upsets people the most. Since twenty eighteen, there
have been eighty nine kiwi known to be killed by dogs,
another thirty five more dead kiwi likely to have been
killed by dogs, and of course that doesn't include the
dogs we don't know about.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
So yeah, really tragic.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
And also not just kiwi, but penguins, seal pups, rare snails,
all sorts of wildlife.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
And what could happen to wildlife like kiwi if this
problem persists.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Well, a single dog can kill lots of kiwi in
one night, so you know that's really of concern.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
And if a pet dog gets violence, we love blaming
the owner. Is there any one personal group that can
be blamed for this problem getting so out of hand? Well,
I mean it looks like if you track this back,
the much bigger problem is domestic dogs not being well
looked after. Full domestic dogs were well looked after, we
(04:45):
wouldn't have a feral dog problem.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
So you know, there have been eighty six dog attacks
on kids in Auckland since only April, so you know
there were calls in this story, you know, by farmers
for there to be a licensing system for dot So
you know, I think it is something that people are
starting to realize if we're not going to look after
our domestic dogs properly, we're going to have these problems.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
We need fu L dinners who are not being responsible
to really step up and make sure that they're looking
after their animals. And right now, our most expensive registration
is only one hundred and thirty two dollars per in them.
The cheapest right now is about eighty dollars. Man, if
you want to have a dog, you bloody look after
your dog. You make sure it's well treated. Please make
sure that it's got its vaccinations that you get at
(05:33):
d SXT and everything.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
What have officials said about this problem? Are they aware
of just how bad it has become?
Speaker 5 (05:43):
Well?
Speaker 2 (05:44):
I spoke in depth to Mayreen Hardybirch, who's the regional
manager for DOC in the Far North. She's got thirty
years of experience and was amazing on this topic, and
she said that she's had conversations with MPI with the SPCA.
The SPC told me that they are quite concerned about
feral dogs and they've been lobbying MPI on various aspects
(06:05):
of this problem for years. And I've got an Official
Information Act request in with MPI. I did make a
couple of requests for an interview with them and I
didn't get a response in time, but I'm still hoping
to get that interview.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
You touched on the possibility of licensing dog owners. What
are some other solutions that are being proposed to tackle this?
Speaker 2 (06:38):
Well, this is a super tricky topic, both politically and
for those at the grassroots on the ground dealing with
this problem.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
You know.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
Marine Hardy Birch, the dock regional manager in the Far North.
She didn't have any easy answers. She said that the
legal options available are shooting the dogs, which is what
is currently happening. So doc hires sharpshoe basically hunters to
kill the dogs when they become aware of them in
the bush, and farmers are allowed to kill the dogs
on their own property if they're threatening them of their animals,
(07:09):
so that's what's happening at the moment. You can also
trap them, however, these dogs are just so clever they're
not going to go for that most of the time.
So those are the two options available at the moment.
Marine Hardy Birch said that it might be getting to
the point in New Zealand where we need to look
at some options, such as Australia has they use toxins
(07:31):
and poisons. She was kind of at pains to point
out that where you know, everybody cares about these being
humane options, are there even options that are humane enough?
SPCA is asking the same question. It's very unclear.
Speaker 5 (07:50):
Yeah, they had no fear or human they it was
either me or the dog. It's only time before before
they'll come out and get some little kid and plan
on the g NS or a tourist walker.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
And you had a conversation with Doc recently about what
they are doing to tackle this problem in the Far
and North. What did they say at the moment.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
They're doing a sweep of the Far North ahead of
the tramping season with those hunters, so they're going through
all those really large tracts of bush and forestry land
just to flush out any dogs ahead of the tramping
season to keep people safe.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
What does the law say about poisoning feral dogs. Definitely
no poisoning of feral dogs. It's not lawful in New Zealand,
it's lawful in Australia. If anything of that nature was
going to be tested here, it would need some political
will it would need a lot of groups to get
together and collaborate on that. That would be the.
Speaker 2 (08:55):
SPCA, doc MPI, and we're miles away from that at
the moment.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
And I understand some farmers are taking matters into their
own hands when it comes to the issue of wild dogs.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
Yeah, they've had to be really creative. I mean when
this issue really blew up in twenty twenty one, you know,
it was a huge community effort to support the farmers
who were getting their stock killed at night by these dogs.
So you had volunteers from around those far North communities
helping those farmers. They did all sorts of things. They
put a dog in heat in a cage to attract
(09:30):
feral dogs onto the farm where they.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
Could be shot.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
They caught a feral dog and they called her a
Judas dog. They were putting a electric collar on her
and hoping she'd go running with a pack that would
enable them to find the pack. Unfortunately, she went off
and lived by herself, so it didn't work. So yeah,
the farmers are the ones who have had to come
(09:55):
up with the most creative solutions because they're the ones
with the animals being killed on them farm.
Speaker 6 (10:02):
When you like knights out in the cold and the wet,
looking through thermal imaging cameras and scopes. This one was
stalking my sister when she shot it, and that one
was caught amongst my Stop.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Hannah, you said that one dog owner wants authorities to
take some pretty drastic action. Can you tell us a
bit more about that. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
One of the farmers I spoke to in the Far North,
John Nilson. He suggested that domestic dog owners should be licensed,
and that there should be different levels of licensing depending
on whether you want to breed dogs. He considered them
like firearms in the sense that they need to be regulated.
Speaker 1 (10:44):
And if we stand back and do nothing about this problem,
what could happen?
Speaker 2 (10:48):
In your view, well, I guess we are looking at
damage to wildlife and more sightings of dogs in the
wild and potential for attack, although that hasn't happened yet.
The tramper could be attacked and more wildlife could be
damaged and killed. And I guess it's an issue where
we have to balance off the needs of farmers, the
(11:12):
needs of wildlife, the needs of trampers, and the needs
of the dogs themselves, because of course, you know, we
want them to be living a good life too.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
How quickly do we need to get on top of
this issue.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
Well, Doc's doing it sweet right now. I think they're
doing their best to get on top of it very quickly.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
Thanks for joining us, Hannah. That's it for this episode
of the Front Page. You can read more about today's
stories and extensive news coverage at zet here al dot
co dot endzet The Front Page is produced by Ethan Sills.
Patty Fox is a sound engineer. I'm Susie Nordquist. Subscribe
(11:51):
to the Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you get
your podcasts, and tune and tomorrow for another look behind
the headlines.
Cure. I'm Susie nordquiston for Chelsea Daniels and this is
the Front Page, a daily podcast presented by the New
Zealand Herald. Feral or roaming dogs have been causing concern
in remote parts of New Zealand for years, but now
things are getting so bad trampers have been told they
(00:26):
risk being attacked if they walk alone. It's prompted calls
for drastic action to be taken to curb the issue.
But what tools do we have at our disposal to
manage the problem and how has it gotten so bad?
Today on the Front Page, we're joined by New Zealand
Herald Premium Content Development Deputy editor Hannah Brown, who has
(00:48):
been looking into this issue. Hannah, just how bad has
our feral dog problem become?
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Well, it kind of in twenty twenty one. I talked
to a farmer last week who said he and his
two neighbors between them have shot ninety dogs since twenty
twenty one. That included five in the last two months.
So in twenty twenty one there was a big push
to eradicate them and a whole bunch was shot. And
(01:19):
so now you could say there's a ragtag bunch of
dogs still out there by the sounds of it.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
And many of us will remember the issues with the
giant pack of dogs and the Far North from about
twenty twenty one. And what areas of New Zealand are
we seeing these wild dogs and how difficult are they
to track down?
Speaker 2 (01:37):
Well, it seems like the worst problems in the Far
North around Tippaki region, but we've also seen them further
down in Northland round Fangad. There's been some in the
central North Island to Udawda and Taranaki and the South Island.
So it basically sounds like any remote region can suffer
(01:58):
from this.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
What sort of problem do these dogs pose to farmland?
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Well, you know that worst problem In twenty twenty one
you had one farmer lose one hundred and twenty stock
and so yeah, it can be a major problem. And
the farmers that seem to have the most problem with
this kind of thing tend to be the ones who
border on dockland or forestry land. So you know, these
dogs can run one hundred kilometers a day, so they're like,
(02:26):
you know, they're in these big tracts of public land
or forestry land. And if you have a farm next
to that, then you can be a target.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
One of the.
Speaker 4 (02:38):
Farmers we were talking to who's lost a lot of stock.
It's been going on on is properly for thirty years,
but I'll bet it's been going on for a lot
longer than that. There's a huge economic impact for farmers.
We've spoken to farmers. We've just given up on raising
sheep because there's no point. They just get killed. So
it's switched over the cattle.
Speaker 1 (03:01):
Okay, And it's not just farmers, right. What advice has
been issued to trampers and hikers walking through the bush?
Speaker 2 (03:07):
Yeah, there have been quite a few reports over the
years from trampers that they've spotted dogs. Several I think
five dock tracks have been closed in the last few years.
While there's been a sweep by hunters to try and
track down these dogs. There haven't been any attacks by
dogs on trampers. But people are being told in the
(03:30):
far North around you know, the out door track, they're
being told to have a stick if a dog is
not aggressive, go around it, and to travel in pairs.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
And what about wildlife? What's the risk there?
Speaker 3 (03:43):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (03:43):
This has been I mean, this is one of the
things that upsets people the most. Since twenty eighteen, there
have been eighty nine kiwi known to be killed by dogs,
another thirty five more dead kiwi likely to have been
killed by dogs, and of course that doesn't include the
dogs we don't know about.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
So yeah, really tragic.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
And also not just kiwi, but penguins, seal pups, rare snails,
all sorts of wildlife.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
And what could happen to wildlife like kiwi if this
problem persists.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Well, a single dog can kill lots of kiwi in
one night, so you know that's really of concern.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
And if a pet dog gets violence, we love blaming
the owner. Is there any one personal group that can
be blamed for this problem getting so out of hand? Well,
I mean it looks like if you track this back,
the much bigger problem is domestic dogs not being well
looked after. Full domestic dogs were well looked after, we
(04:45):
wouldn't have a feral dog problem.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
So you know, there have been eighty six dog attacks
on kids in Auckland since only April, so you know
there were calls in this story, you know, by farmers
for there to be a licensing system for dot So
you know, I think it is something that people are
starting to realize if we're not going to look after
our domestic dogs properly, we're going to have these problems.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
We need fu L dinners who are not being responsible
to really step up and make sure that they're looking
after their animals. And right now, our most expensive registration
is only one hundred and thirty two dollars per in them.
The cheapest right now is about eighty dollars. Man, if
you want to have a dog, you bloody look after
your dog. You make sure it's well treated. Please make
sure that it's got its vaccinations that you get at
(05:33):
d SXT and everything.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
What have officials said about this problem? Are they aware
of just how bad it has become?
Speaker 5 (05:43):
Well?
Speaker 2 (05:44):
I spoke in depth to Mayreen Hardybirch, who's the regional
manager for DOC in the Far North. She's got thirty
years of experience and was amazing on this topic, and
she said that she's had conversations with MPI with the SPCA.
The SPC told me that they are quite concerned about
feral dogs and they've been lobbying MPI on various aspects
(06:05):
of this problem for years. And I've got an Official
Information Act request in with MPI. I did make a
couple of requests for an interview with them and I
didn't get a response in time, but I'm still hoping
to get that interview.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
You touched on the possibility of licensing dog owners. What
are some other solutions that are being proposed to tackle this?
Speaker 2 (06:38):
Well, this is a super tricky topic, both politically and
for those at the grassroots on the ground dealing with
this problem.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
You know.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
Marine Hardy Birch, the dock regional manager in the Far North.
She didn't have any easy answers. She said that the
legal options available are shooting the dogs, which is what
is currently happening. So doc hires sharpshoe basically hunters to
kill the dogs when they become aware of them in
the bush, and farmers are allowed to kill the dogs
on their own property if they're threatening them of their animals,
(07:09):
so that's what's happening at the moment. You can also
trap them, however, these dogs are just so clever they're
not going to go for that most of the time.
So those are the two options available at the moment.
Marine Hardy Birch said that it might be getting to
the point in New Zealand where we need to look
at some options, such as Australia has they use toxins
(07:31):
and poisons. She was kind of at pains to point
out that where you know, everybody cares about these being
humane options, are there even options that are humane enough?
SPCA is asking the same question. It's very unclear.
Speaker 5 (07:50):
Yeah, they had no fear or human they it was
either me or the dog. It's only time before before
they'll come out and get some little kid and plan
on the g NS or a tourist walker.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
And you had a conversation with Doc recently about what
they are doing to tackle this problem in the Far
and North. What did they say at the moment.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
They're doing a sweep of the Far North ahead of
the tramping season with those hunters, so they're going through
all those really large tracts of bush and forestry land
just to flush out any dogs ahead of the tramping
season to keep people safe.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
What does the law say about poisoning feral dogs. Definitely
no poisoning of feral dogs. It's not lawful in New Zealand,
it's lawful in Australia. If anything of that nature was
going to be tested here, it would need some political
will it would need a lot of groups to get
together and collaborate on that. That would be the.
Speaker 2 (08:55):
SPCA, doc MPI, and we're miles away from that at
the moment.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
And I understand some farmers are taking matters into their
own hands when it comes to the issue of wild dogs.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
Yeah, they've had to be really creative. I mean when
this issue really blew up in twenty twenty one, you know,
it was a huge community effort to support the farmers
who were getting their stock killed at night by these dogs.
So you had volunteers from around those far North communities
helping those farmers. They did all sorts of things. They
put a dog in heat in a cage to attract
(09:30):
feral dogs onto the farm where they.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
Could be shot.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
They caught a feral dog and they called her a
Judas dog. They were putting a electric collar on her
and hoping she'd go running with a pack that would
enable them to find the pack. Unfortunately, she went off
and lived by herself, so it didn't work. So yeah,
the farmers are the ones who have had to come
(09:55):
up with the most creative solutions because they're the ones
with the animals being killed on them farm.
Speaker 6 (10:02):
When you like knights out in the cold and the wet,
looking through thermal imaging cameras and scopes. This one was
stalking my sister when she shot it, and that one
was caught amongst my Stop.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Hannah, you said that one dog owner wants authorities to
take some pretty drastic action. Can you tell us a
bit more about that. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
One of the farmers I spoke to in the Far North,
John Nilson. He suggested that domestic dog owners should be licensed,
and that there should be different levels of licensing depending
on whether you want to breed dogs. He considered them
like firearms in the sense that they need to be regulated.
Speaker 1 (10:44):
And if we stand back and do nothing about this problem,
what could happen?
Speaker 2 (10:48):
In your view, well, I guess we are looking at
damage to wildlife and more sightings of dogs in the
wild and potential for attack, although that hasn't happened yet.
The tramper could be attacked and more wildlife could be
damaged and killed. And I guess it's an issue where
we have to balance off the needs of farmers, the
(11:12):
needs of wildlife, the needs of trampers, and the needs
of the dogs themselves, because of course, you know, we
want them to be living a good life too.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
How quickly do we need to get on top of
this issue.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
Well, Doc's doing it sweet right now. I think they're
doing their best to get on top of it very quickly.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
Thanks for joining us, Hannah. That's it for this episode
of the Front Page. You can read more about today's
stories and extensive news coverage at zet here al dot
co dot endzet The Front Page is produced by Ethan Sills.
Patty Fox is a sound engineer. I'm Susie Nordquist. Subscribe
(11:51):
to the Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you get
your podcasts, and tune and tomorrow for another look behind
the headlines.
Popular Podcasts
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Therapy Gecko
An unlicensed lizard psychologist travels the universe talking to strangers about absolutely nothing. TO CALL THE GECKO: follow me on https://www.twitch.tv/lyleforever to get a notification for when I am taking calls. I am usually live Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays but lately a lot of other times too. I am a gecko.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.