June 1, 2025 • 40 mins
Pushing yourself to your limit is kind of the whole point of exercise - running just a little longer when you're exhausted, doing that extra rep until you can't lift anymore.
But sometimes we miss warning signs, and push ourselves too hard - leading to an injury that even once fully recovered, most won't get back into the gym.
So how hard is too hard to push yourself?
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News talksb.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Pack Ah.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Okay, welcome, Welcome back to the week In Collective. We
let our guests choose the tune often on this hour,
and that is the choice of my guest. That is
apparently a tune called talk show host. But it's not
the most uplifting piece of music.
Speaker 4 (00:46):
Is that.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
It's an interesting choice. So I'm I will thank our guests.
I'm about to introduce to you in just a moment,
mind you know who it is. Look, it's great paint. Oh,
it's just salurite of him, now shall we He's coming
to us hot from a holiday and Mattapuri and we've
got the screen on. He's in the lap of luxury.
By the look of him, with a wonderful painting of
(01:07):
it looks like of a Kia or behind him or
I think it is or a kea or a two
or something or some native bird. And his name is
Greg Payne. Hello, Greg, How are you good?
Speaker 4 (01:19):
Afternoon? Tim? I apologize.
Speaker 5 (01:21):
Look, I've always had a very strong passion towards Radiohead.
It's probably my absolute all time favorite band. And the
little two lines that came up were probably the most
questionable two lines in the entire track. So I do
apologize for that, but I won't apologize for Radiohead.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
Don't worry. We had We had a much dodger a
set of lyrics yesterday when we play a little bit
of Motorhead, and nobody picked up on it. But I
thought that lyrics a bit dodged. Thats a bit of anyway. Hey, Now,
for those who are listening, before we get into it
with Greg, the whole thing about pushing you to your
limit when you get in a way, it's sort of
(01:59):
the point of exercise, or at least exploring your limits,
perhaps running just that little bit longer when you're maybe
even when you're exhausted.
Speaker 4 (02:06):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (02:07):
I'm reading this and thinking, I'm not sure I would
run if I was exhausted doing that extra rip rep
when you think you can't lift anymore. But maybe there
are chances when we're actually missing certain warning signs that
pushing ourselves too hard might lead to an injury, or
that might not even get you back in the gym.
Oh and when you're starting exercise, how far should you
(02:28):
push it and avoid those early injuries? Anyway, Greg, let's
explore that a bit. Have you ever blown a foo
foo valve because you've just gone to too hard on
your exercise?
Speaker 4 (02:37):
A foo foo.
Speaker 5 (02:37):
Valve is something I don't blow on a regular basis,
thank you, Tim. But I do have a reliable I
had failed back surgery about twelve years ago, and accordingly
I still have some nerve tension down the back of
one of my legs, and I basically doesn't bother me.
Speaker 4 (02:58):
I can wing.
Speaker 5 (02:58):
Foil, I can do whatever I want, But as soon
as I start to run, I just have a tendency
of blowing my left car as soon as I start
to push it. So if I have a four food
val but it's called my left calf, But yeah, it happens,
and it's a tricky injuries. And you know, blowing calves,
(03:19):
blowing muscles is such a multifaceted discussion and there's always
a large number of factors.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
That contribute to it. It's never ever just one thing.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
I mean, are there some guidelines for what's the difference
between pushing yourself and abusing yourself in terms of you know,
obviously you work with some elite athletes who would probably
push themselves beyond what any of us could imagine would
be humanly possible.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
Yeah, I mean, it depends on what you're trying to achieve.
Like you know, if you're working.
Speaker 5 (03:50):
Awesomeness or there are always varying levels of awesomeness. But
from a physiological perspective, let's just say you're a running
coach or a triathlon coach. You are trying to push
your athletes into a state of fatigue so that with
that adaptation from that fatigue, they get stronger and they
become a better athlete. When you're looking at a movement
(04:12):
pattern like say running or whether it's deadlifting in the
gym or back squadding or whatever it is, you want
to try and avoid what we call task failure. And
that's when the multiple systems, whether it's your biomechanics or
whether it's your blood flow, or whether it's a whole
multitude of factors come together and you can no longer
(04:32):
say lift safely, or you can't maintain your running technique correctly,
and each of these things actually do have a place
that in a controlled environment you do want to get
to because again, with that adaptation, you get stronger and
more resilient. But particularly if you're coming back from injury,
or you're new to a sport or new to lifting weights.
(04:53):
Task failure is something that you probably want to avoid.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
Well, I mean a common injury. You talked about blowing
a calf muscle, But for older runners, once they get
into it, sometimes they can not even movie pushing that
that hard. And it's because it's quite a common I
gather it's quite a common sort of injury to happen
if you're getting a bit older about how can you
avoid those seemingly innocuous sort of like I wasn't even
doing anything and all of a sudden, boom, there goes
(05:17):
the calf.
Speaker 5 (05:18):
So a calf when you're running is a really interesting
injury to try and manage. You can look at it
from your calf is just not strong enough, you know.
We know that particularly there are two calves. There's Celius
and gastrocs. Celius is the deep one. Gas Strocks is
the good looking one. You know when you've got a
pair of high heels on and your cars look great.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
Well I haven't done that for a while, but.
Speaker 5 (05:40):
Well neither neither. But you know we have the gist.
But the deep calf being celius when you're running, that
has to contend with you know, sometimes six to even
at most like eight times body weight loading per contact.
And so if we're not in the gym or at
least doing some really heavy lifting on our calves, they
are more susceptible to overload and therefore injury. But the
(06:02):
other thing as well is that very few runners, and
this is what I do a lot when I'm doing
my gate analysis of my runners, is I look at
what we call their hip extension strategy. So that's like,
how well are the muscles on the back of your leg,
being your butt muscles, your hamstrings, and your calves. How
are they working together in order to generate propulsive force.
(06:23):
Most people who have a recurring calf problem have something
higher up traditionally, like their butt muscles aren't doing enough work,
and so therefore the calf is working over time to compensate.
Speaker 4 (06:34):
And so that's why you see a recurring.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
Ausery is that sometimes postura or for running. Now look
up by the way, yeah, by the way, we're going
to take calls here. Eight hundred and eighty, ten eighty.
The reason I mentioned posture is because I saw you
Greg when you first came on the show. You and
analyzed my running style, and you got me to actually
stand up right. I was running like us a depressed
sort of old man.
Speaker 5 (06:55):
So yeah, I mean running running is very, very very postural,
and there are a number of key things that we
want to see a runner do. And if you have
a team, you can see as an endurance runner of
leaning a little bit too far forward. The one thing
I would never just say to you is or tim
you're leaning too far forward. So therefore try and stand
more upright. To get you more upright, there is a strategy,
(07:17):
and that's about getting your palvis in the right place
and using your core to hold the palvis up more,
and by doing that you can get more upright. But
also by doing that you get your butt muscles into
play more as well. So there's a termin movement mechanics
and it's proximal stability for distal mobility. And what that
basically means is that proximal is your pelvis if that's
(07:40):
in the correct place and everything around the palvis is
moving working correctly muscular wise, things above being your trunk
and things below being your legs are way more likely
to be balanced and therefore efficient.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Is that why when you were talking to me about
running that you didn't say you need to stand more upright.
You might have said your postures wrong, but instead of
saying stand or upright, you actually see it. Imagine that
you are being propelled by someone pushing you from your backside,
And so I thought of it that way. I wasn't
thinking of I wasn't thinking of being upright. I was
simply thinking about, I imagine that this is how I'm
(08:14):
propelling myself, and all of a sudden, hey pressed it.
Speaker 5 (08:17):
Because the end result is going to be exactly the
same thing. If I say to your term, you're leaning
too far forward. Just bring your shoulders back to get
more upright, Yes you will be more upright, but unfortunately
to achieve that, you'll end up sort of probably arching
your lower back more, which could increase the likelihood of
a bit of a back niggle a back injury. Whereas,
instead if you think about like I used a Q
(08:39):
hopefully appropriately, I'm imagining like someone's hands are on your
butt and they're pushing your pelvis forward that way to
get more upright. Ultimately the exact same result, but they
get a very different response as far as how your
muscles work around the pelvis and therefore above and below.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Yeah, okay, right, well, look, we want to take your
calls on this if you've got any questions about especially
well actually any questions you've got for Greg around movement
and exit size, but also if you've got persistent injuries
or you've got questions around movement, and we're wondering if
there's a reason that you might be getting injured more persistently.
But how not to avoid as I jokingly say, blowing
(09:17):
a foo foo valve. I have no idea where I
got that expression from. Some might say something that happens
when you're trying to do a sumo squat that's too heavy,
but we won't get into that, and let's take some calls,
shall we. Let's go to Dalla Sollo.
Speaker 6 (09:31):
Yeah, hi, Greg, I've injured my back months ago, Bell two,
bell three down lower back there and I've been to
physio once a week and he's given me stretching exercises
and I still have pain some.
Speaker 7 (09:51):
Days and not.
Speaker 6 (09:52):
So I'm just wondering how far do you push these
stretching exercises.
Speaker 4 (09:58):
So when it come back.
Speaker 5 (09:59):
To tricky, yes, banks are tricky, and there's a bit
of a recurring theme like you know, if we're talking
about half injuries or any sort of injury, it's never
just going to be one thing, but there are There's
definitely a few things you can do in order to
try and one reduced pain or discomfort in the lower back,
and two sort of protect it from further injuries going forward.
(10:23):
The one thing that I make a suggestion to people
is an ideal a lot with back injuries is yes,
there is some validity and benefit and say stretching, but
I'd be more interested in getting you moving and trying
to think about what typically happens when you get a
back injury is your pelvis will tip forward and your
(10:43):
lower back will arch. It's a guarding mechanism. So I'd
start to think about basic core stability to pelvit tilt
to try and unload those back muscles. But also when
you're upright and walking, and I highly highly if your
back is saw make sure you walk, keep moving, don't
not move, but if you can, when you're nice and
upright and you're walking, just make again this procuring theme
(11:06):
of when your foots in contact with the ground, make
sure your butt muscles are working to try and pull
back because again that will unload those back muscles, ask
them to do a little bit less, and the situation
should start to settle down. But I'd look at really
gaining some mastery around what we call pelvit tilt or
cour stability stuff, because it's something that is a little
(11:29):
bit overblown as far as exercise prescription is concerned, but
the fundamental skill that it offers is really really powerful
when it comes to managing back problems.
Speaker 6 (11:38):
Pelvits shouldn't thought because when you injure yourself, the bustles
around the ligaments tight and up, don't they correct?
Speaker 5 (11:45):
And so what that does is it sends you into
what we call an anterior pelvit tilt, which is basically
like a duck sticking its butt out. Now that's again
that's there for a reason. But when you have pain
in your back, there's a term called reciprocal inhibition, and
that back pain will also switch off to a degree
you'll call abdominal muscles. So just sort of at a
(12:07):
very low level, getting those abdominal muscles to work to
hold the front of the palvis up into what we
call a posterior pelvic tilt. That can help to just
create a little bit more length and stretch and those
back muscles that are overactive and causing the problems.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
Any other any Dallas, because I know you've been keen
to talk to Greg.
Speaker 6 (12:28):
Your pelvis should be tilted forward then rather than back.
Speaker 5 (12:31):
Well, this is where it gets confusing on a radio.
If you put your fingertips on the bones at the
very front of your pelvis. If you use those bones
at the front, they should be pulled back slightly. So
if you have your hand in your lower back, your
back's arched. You're trying to flatten your lower back very slightly.
If you go online and just type in posterior pelvic tilt,
(12:55):
that's what you're trying to work towards.
Speaker 3 (12:58):
Okay, good on your Dallas, Absolute pleasure, good luck, good luck.
Look we actually let's get another call. I've got lots
of questions lined up for myself that we've had come
through as well on the text. But let's get on
with some more calls. Janas, Hello, oh hello, Just for Greg.
Speaker 8 (13:16):
I've started walking again uphills and I can't remember if
he said you have to try and stand more upright
or lean forward? I know you take little steps, yes.
Speaker 5 (13:29):
So yeah forward or so lean forward? Slightly walking up
a hill is walking uphill is very very good for
leg strengths. It's very good for all that sort of
postural adaptation. Basically, think about your trunk. The angle of
your upper body should basically be in line with gravity.
(13:49):
So yes, you are leaning forward, but you're you're still
in line with gravity, if that makes sense.
Speaker 4 (13:55):
You don't want to be leaning.
Speaker 5 (13:56):
Forward excessively, because that will make you your thigh muscles
work probably a little bit too much relative to your
butt muscles in your handstrings. But shortsteps and lean and
leaning slightly forward is exactly where you want to be.
Speaker 8 (14:10):
Oh that's lovely, Thank you Greek.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
My absolute pressure.
Speaker 3 (14:12):
Well done, Jane, bye bye. Let's go to that was
that was easily?
Speaker 5 (14:18):
Sort?
Speaker 9 (14:18):
Was?
Speaker 4 (14:20):
Oh no, we love the.
Speaker 5 (14:21):
Easy ones, but we also love that the detailed complex
I'm fascinating as well.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
A right, let's go to.
Speaker 7 (14:29):
Oh, good guys, how are you Craig? Yeah, look, I
just got a bit of a problem I in my
left in the ankle joint. But it's the top of
the joint. I get it. Scruciating pain when walking on
the top of the foot coming up to the top
(14:51):
of that joint. If you can imagine and then on
about halfway up the front of the shin. Now I've
been I've been to my GP. She they took some memages,
said that I've got some something like osteopene yep, yeah, yeah,
and small signs of osteoarthritis. Now I'm sixty five, so
(15:16):
it doesn't surprise me. Greg. Yeah, now she's She's sort
of said, I thought it was a hip problem. But
I've been for imaging with that as well. No, that's
all good. So that's fine. So I was wondering if
what and I can't live on volcar and for the
rest of my life. No, I really need to know
(15:39):
what do you think?
Speaker 5 (15:41):
Well, that's a very very complex one to answer. I mean,
if it's top of the ankle, there could be an
irritation maybe around what we call the retendaculum, which is
a bit of a it's a ligament to strap on
top of the ankle. And I'm certainly dipping my toes
into more of the podietary space or physio space with
these comments. But you know osteopenia and osteopenia is a
(16:02):
precursor to osteoporosis. So whether there's a bone health issue
there or not.
Speaker 4 (16:07):
I don't know.
Speaker 5 (16:09):
As far as helping the ankle, just doing little simple
things like sort of similar to what Janus was just saying.
If you're walking particularly try and make smaller, shorter, smaller steps,
shorter strides that can help unload the ankle. But even
just practicing. You don't need any specific tools or anything
like that, but just even practicing. You know, if you're
(16:31):
in the kitchen and chopping up some potatoes or something,
just practice, maybe not with a sharp knife, but just
practice standing on that one foot to help. Will be
call those proprire septors, which are little things, little pieces
will tend or not tend, and sorry, little signals within
the joint that help to get the muscles to work
a little more effectively around the joint. But if you're
(16:53):
really struggling with that, what I would probably say, Craig
is find a good physio or a good pediatrist in
your area to give you some advice because there could
be a number of different things going on there.
Speaker 7 (17:04):
They have rushed me on to vitamin D and calcium.
They are concerned about the bone density. Greg, I know
you've got other callers. Look very quickly. Would electromagnetic treatment help.
Speaker 5 (17:23):
By my understanding, again, this is more of a physio thing.
The efficacy around that sort of electro treatment is a
little ambiguous. But I don't want to go on record
and saying that I probably the physio. But what I
do know is that if you do, if there is
signs of sort of early osteoporosis involved, that is when
(17:45):
you do want to start thinking about getting into the
gym and making sure that you get some good weightlifting underway,
because that's a very very effective tool carefully and supervised,
I should admit, I should state, but that is a
very effective tool for helping to manage bone house.
Speaker 7 (18:03):
Very helpful, Greg, thanks very much.
Speaker 4 (18:05):
My absolute picture. Good luck, Craig.
Speaker 3 (18:08):
Craig right, we'll take a moment, we'll come back. We'll
take more of your calls. I went Undredaddy Teddy with
Greg Pain. He's a sports biomechanist at BioSport. It is
twenty coming up to twenty five, past four news talks.
He'd be.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
Wouldn't the pimps in the grib monk drop it, legg it,
tid rub it legged hard, drop it?
Speaker 3 (18:27):
Oh my god, who chose this song?
Speaker 4 (18:29):
Is this?
Speaker 3 (18:29):
My guest? Again? Was this Greg Oh okay, look, okay,
it's the Motorhead. Next we're with Greg Pain, who's chosen
the first two songs. I'm just trolling him. Really, he's
a good guy, he's biomechanist. We're taking your cause on well,
getting into trying to avoid injury while you're doing your
favorite exercise, or getting into exercise, among other things. But
(18:50):
we've had a few people talking about backs, which I
suspect we might get quite a few more of those calls. Greg,
was that your that was your song choice? Was it?
Speaker 7 (18:56):
No?
Speaker 5 (18:57):
I was a tone and cheek thing that I sort
of suggested Tara, not for a second thinking that.
Speaker 4 (19:01):
She would take me seriously. Ah, I'm gonna regret. I'm
going to do this ever again.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
She takes you at your word.
Speaker 4 (19:10):
Makes me blushing sitting here.
Speaker 3 (19:13):
Did you really mean it as a joke? Oh good,
that's funny. Good on your tire. She's got a since
a hear she's great, Leslie, Hello.
Speaker 10 (19:25):
Hello, This program couldn't have been couldn't have been come
up a better time? Wag in bed. He was a
very sore back. I am yesterday. I wasn't really all
that bright and the room seemed to be moving a
bit when I when I got out of bed, and
so I just sat mostly most of the day and
(19:48):
did nothing. But today I had to get up because
somebody was coming and I fell over, fell and headlong
into the wardrobe door and knocked it off its hinges
and badly hurt my back and I and then beard
it the moment because that's the most comfortable place I'm
(20:10):
in my nineties, So you know, I'm dodvery h Are
you looking?
Speaker 3 (20:16):
Have you got a question for Greg about what you
can in particular movement or just what's your question there?
Speaker 8 (20:22):
Yes?
Speaker 10 (20:23):
Am I business to be moving all the time? Or
is it all right for reader stay in bed where
I'm more comfortable.
Speaker 5 (20:31):
Well, firstly, I'm just going to say I'm sorry that
you've had such a rough twenty four hours there, Leslie,
But you've actually asked a very very smart question, because
a lot of people think that when they have pain
or discomfort, they should lie in bed or sit and
basically wait till the pain goes away, which is assuming,
(20:55):
of course the pain levels are manageable. But it is
the worst thing to do, and particularly as we get older.
So the most important thing you should we in one
who does have back pain or generally speaking painful, stop
is to try and ensure that you keep moving, like, yes,
you do want to protect the area and make sure
(21:15):
you don't make it progressively worse. But keep optimistic, keep moving,
keep blood flow, and if possible, try and build that
strength back up again. But you know, trying to. Sorry,
just lying in bed hoping that that will actually help
the recovery of the situation is probably not the best
(21:39):
advice that I could give you.
Speaker 3 (21:40):
Thanks for your call, Leslie, and best wish. Just with that, Hey, Greg,
just one thing with lower back pain. This is actually
me as well, but I know other people have had
this with doing weights and things. It's just just that
sense of if I'm sitting on the couch for a while,
i get up, I'm like, oh God, but I'm doing
you deadlifts and squats and stuff, and I feel fine
(22:01):
while I'm doing them, But is there something that happens
at the where you're getting the residual thing just because
you're no longer twenty three?
Speaker 5 (22:08):
So I mean, if you go into the gym and
you're doing your back squats and your deadlifts, which are
which basically everybody should be doing, there should be no
fear or stigma around lifting weights and doing those sort
of movements because we know that they are profoundly beneficial
and effective from a longevity perspective Muscular ski lettle health.
(22:29):
But I mean, everything that we're trying to do when
we're in the gym is progressively and carefully increase our load,
increase the number of reps and sets relatively speaking, which
is going to induce some loading and therefore fatigue into
the tissues. So if it's just fatigue related, that's absolutely fine.
(22:49):
If there is something within the movement, whether it's again
you're deadlift or your back squad that is posturally a
little bit out of whack that could cause a little
bit more of it of an acute level of pain,
that again just then to be managed with maybe some
pain pain relif on some walking. But I'm a very
big believer in saying don't let pain you know, again,
(23:11):
similar to what Lizzie was just was just asking don't
let pain stop you from doing these really really positive
things because not doing them is potentially way worse than
doing them and having a slight niggle in your lower back.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
Yeah right, Okay, let's carry on. We work to guy. Hello, Hello, how.
Speaker 11 (23:30):
Are we doing?
Speaker 4 (23:31):
Hi guy?
Speaker 11 (23:32):
Hey, similar fame. Yeah, I have had neck pain for
like close to twelve months without getting towards a full recovery.
I was just wondering, like I've done a bit of
reading on it, and a lot of the times it
says if it goes the pain goes on after three
four months, and it's like you're just gonna have to
(23:55):
sort of deal with it on an ongoing basis and
it might not make a full recovery. Is that you're understanding.
Do you see people who do make a recovery.
Speaker 5 (24:06):
So it depends entirely on what's causing the pain, if
it's something arising from an introvertible disc. That we do
know that if say, for example, you've prolapsed a disc
in your neck, that it can take upwards of eighteen
months for that disc to be reabsorbed and to get
(24:26):
back to full function. We know that traditionally, when an
injury becomes chronic, which is regarded as twelve weeks or more,
then it becomes a lot harder to manage the long
term prognosis of the injury. But that does not for
a second mean that the injury is never going to heal.
Speaker 4 (24:47):
The key to success is finding out.
Speaker 5 (24:50):
What has actually caused the neck pain or what is
actually going on, and building particularly like a strength strategy
around it. And if there are things that you need
to adjust in your workstation or the way that you
drive your car or the way that you sleep, that's
going to be beneficial as well.
Speaker 4 (25:05):
But a lot of neck.
Speaker 5 (25:07):
Injuries are recurring because people have what we call chin protrusion,
and that's if you're looking at someone's side on ultimately
their ears should be more or less this is a
little bit of an exaggeration, but more or less aligned
directly above their shoulder. Now, with computers and driving and
digital devices, we tend to chin protrude, which is when
(25:29):
your chin goes forward a little bit. And there are
really simple exercises you can do and you can find
them online called deep netflexer exercises, and that can just
help strengthen those deep intrinsic muzzles of the neck to
help get a little bit more balanced around the neck
as well. So I mean, if you're struggling, then I
would certainly get further advice from a good physio or
(25:51):
similar because you do want to be proactive in managing
these things and not just accept the fact that you're
going to be in pain for the rest of your life,
because nobody wants that, that's for sure.
Speaker 3 (26:03):
Okay, thanks for call my hey. Just a quick question
the thing they're talking about. You know, if you've got
sometimes people end up with certain injuries, like you've got
a tight muscle and your right leg, and it means
that somehow there's something up in your left shoulder. I
think it's called the sling. What's what's the story with that?
Speaker 5 (26:21):
So muscular slings are still a very highly debated subject
in movement house. So let's just muscular slings are based
around the muscles have a fiber direction. So if you
look at a muscle map, if someone say your thigh
muscles travel that the muscle fibers travel in the vertical plane.
(26:44):
Your butt muscles are in a horror a diagonal plane.
And so because of those angles of muscles, you can
sort of say that, well, your left glop, your left
butt muscle slings across to you, or say your right shoulder.
Speaker 4 (26:57):
And so we've quite.
Speaker 5 (26:58):
Often seen say in a runner, for example, who has
left hip or left knee pain. If we start to
think about putting their opposite right shoulder in a better
place when they're running.
Speaker 4 (27:09):
It improves that sling tension.
Speaker 5 (27:11):
So it's a little bit of a little bit of
a pseudoscience to a degree. It's hotly discussed, but I
still use it quite a lot and I think it's
quite effective.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
Yeah. Well, the thing I noticed was I was just
talking to someone I had as in duram of right knee,
and I noticed that my left shoulder was weaker on
certain exercises. Yes, and it was, and so we said, well,
that sort of makes sense. It might have been you.
Speaker 7 (27:31):
Actually, Yeah, we've.
Speaker 4 (27:34):
Been together for so long term. Who wouldn't know. We can't,
I can't get up with our conversations.
Speaker 3 (27:39):
Hey, Greg, we'll take some more calls in just a moment.
My guest expert as a sports biomechanist, Greg Pain. It's
worth pointing actually just before we go to the break,
because while you have been a regular on the show,
there's a difference between a physio and a biomechanist, and
maybe if you just give us a quick explainer as
we head to the break.
Speaker 5 (27:57):
So my background as a biomechanist is I look at
movement patterns and identify within those movement patterns where faults
are occurring in that they can relate to either performance
or injuries. So if you're a runner with a sore knee,
then you come and see me. If you're a runner
and you fall over and hit your knee on something
and you've got pain in the need, that's certainly of physio.
(28:19):
So they deal with more of the sudden onset not
as much of an overuse area. But physios are also
becoming quite good in the biomechanics field as well.
Speaker 3 (28:30):
Excellent, we'll come back with more stuff in the moment
and something for people who want to get running as well.
It is twenty one minutes to five News Talk as
they'd be ah, yes, a little bit of deep Purple
to ease ourselves into our next session with Greg pain
(28:52):
by a mechanists. Great, just a quick question. You know
all these you know, these apps to get into I
got into a running with an app which was like,
I can't remember what it was as so many weeks
to running six to eight weeks into doing thirty mins.
I mean, there's so much choice out there. Have you
ever decided to get into that sort of line of
work getting people running? Because that's your warehouse, isn't it.
Speaker 5 (29:13):
Well, it is actually Tim and I yes, I actually
have just launched today, seriously, Yes, today, it has gone
live on my website, an evidence based, biomechanically driven, exercise
driven learned to run program and it's completely different to
(29:35):
anything else that is on the marketplace. So I'm very
excited that you asked the question.
Speaker 3 (29:41):
And so actually what is it? So what do people do?
Speaker 5 (29:43):
So what I've done is I've based it around what's
called training age. So instead of just saying, well, everyone
who wants to learn to run should just go and
follow this learn to run program of a number of
time or distance per day, what I've done is I've
given people the tools to identify what their training age is,
which is basic your your amount of experience within the running,
(30:07):
and then the running and the exercise programs are based
around that.
Speaker 4 (30:11):
So it's not generic. And and I've also got a
free code, so I'm giving it away for free.
Speaker 3 (30:20):
So i can go and check it out for nothing
for free.
Speaker 5 (30:23):
Yes, So if you just go onto my website to
buy a sport dot co dot z, it's on the
home page at checkout. If you just put in the
code News talk zb you get it completely for free,
and I've also got I've got the buyosport app so
you can you can go through it at your own speed.
I suggest following it pretty closely or on the buy
(30:43):
a Sport app.
Speaker 4 (30:44):
So there you go.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
God, good on you. Well, they say the secret of
good comedy is timing. Buy a sport dot cat is it?
Good on you mate?
Speaker 7 (30:54):
Thank you.
Speaker 4 (30:54):
I'm very proud of it. It's one of those ones.
Speaker 5 (30:56):
I've spent a lot of time building it, and yeah,
I think it's a really good product and there's nothing
else around that looks at run.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
On the scope. I'll go and check that out. Anyone
else's listening, go and check it out, right, Let's take
some more calls.
Speaker 12 (31:09):
Steve Hello, Yeah, okay, guys, Steve too advertorial there, that
was yeah, good timing. Hey, look the reason I was calling.
I've recently really saw right right shoulder, but my left
shoulders got quite sore as well. Many years ago, I
had a quarter zone injection in my right shoulder. It's
(31:32):
very the pain, very similar, it was, he said, basically
a very similar to frozen shoulder. Now my right shoulder,
saying really, story again, but I've noticed my left shoulder's
got a bit sore again, So I was kind of wondering,
is it likely to be a return of the old
injury that the quarter zone was for. There'd be something
else inflammatory going on in one bit of information sort
(31:53):
of trigger some in another joint. It's just a bit.
He had to found it a bit weird that my
left lum was getting a bit sore as well.
Speaker 5 (31:59):
We do know that if you have frozen shoulder and
one side, I don't know the exact I probably should.
I think it's around about a seventy five percent likelihood
that you're going to get it in the other shoulder
as well. But again, when it comes down to these things,
keeping it moving and trying to actively maintain a nice
mobile shoulder is key. But there are little things that
(32:21):
you can do. I've got a client that I'm treating
at the moment. She's a surgeon dealing with frozen shoulder, so,
you know, being really proactive and trying to keep the
shoulder sort of If you think the shoulder joints like
a seal balancing a ball on its nose, it's an
incredibly unstable joint because it is regarded as a ball
and socket joint. So it's very very easy to say
(32:43):
the muscles on the front of the shoulder being your
chest muscles to pull the shoulder forward. So if you
spend a little bit of time really trying to make
sure that the muscles on the back of the shoulder
and your rotator cuff are doing the right job, then
that can hopefully sort of deload those tissues and reduce
the level of pain. But yeah, I mean, frozen shoulder
(33:05):
is fairly common. But again it's a case of just
being really proactive and managing it with good clinical advice. Well,
I certainly my one really strong piece of advice is
don't just leave it and hope that it will get better, because,
as I sort of suggesting earlier, a chronic injury is
not something that you want to let go.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
Okay, hey, cheer Steve, Thank you very much. Thanks, thank you.
All right, let's go to lots of text by the way,
where if you do want to jump the queue, jump
into the onto the cause. But we'll try and get
through two or three texts as well. But Warwick you're next.
Speaker 9 (33:39):
Yeah, thanks him. I just want to hopefully help help
people out that might be into weight training and bodybuilding.
I just I'm in my mid sixties. I'm retired, but
I'm also very seriously end of my bodybuilding, which might
just do at home. I don't want to like sound
like I'm pulling myself, but I get people asking me
(34:00):
because they can see that I'm in the sixties, and
people ask me, what do you do when you men?
You know, when they go out, because I'm still making gain,
still getting bigger and stronger. But the key that I'm
going to tell people is it's all about low volume.
Don't do a lot of volume, you know, don't spend
a lot of time in the gym. Just do what
(34:21):
you do safely to extreme intensity intensity, you know, so
then you're quit the stimulation. The reason that has to
adapt to a new situation. You have to do it safely.
You have to warm up properly, you have to do
it's correctly. But you have your point where you simply
(34:43):
cannot anymore.
Speaker 4 (34:45):
It's You've got a.
Speaker 3 (34:47):
Terrible line there. So I've just got to jump in there.
But I am a bit cautious about people who are
not guests on the show giving advice to people on exectly.
Speaker 5 (34:54):
Yeah, I would, just I mean, there is definitely a
lot of merit in that. For sure, we don't if
you're trying to build muscle mass, you want to try
and get close to failure. But we also do know
that you do not need to get too failure. That
is when we start to see a likelihood of injury.
We also know that in order to try and get
(35:16):
really effective gains by building strength or muscle mass, which
ideally the two, you will do the bothah three gym
sessions a week is pretty much optimal.
Speaker 4 (35:27):
You don't get much.
Speaker 5 (35:28):
More by doing four or five gym sessions a week.
But particularly if you are looking at trying to get
into the gym, technique does become very very important, So
really taking your time to build that confidence and knowledge
before you start to go heavy as.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
Gain if you're uninitiated, work with a trainer.
Speaker 5 (35:46):
Absolutely, I mean if you're in a position where you
can afford to get someone or in a good group environment.
But technique becomes less important if you're highly experienced in
a gym space, but if you're new ish it is crucial.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
Actually, one of the things that does come out of
orric school as well. Though I think I remember a
study that was talking about the benefits of of using
weights for people right through their years, right up to
their nineties. Things and weight just keep for somehow fine
an opportunity to work with weights. Don't think it's something
for the just the young and.
Speaker 5 (36:17):
The absolutely I mean, you know we know now that
with if you're dealing with osteoporosis, even if you have
quite severe levels of osteoporosis, like a T score of
same minus six, which is very very severe, going to
the gym and lifting an appropriate amount of weight for
you will make a big difference. So don't you don't
(36:38):
want to be sitting there thinking to yourself, I'm eighty,
I'm too old. Absolutely not, you should at eighty you
can still get out there and lift weight and make
a big difference because we also know it reduces the
likelihood of falls. We also know it improves grip strength,
it improves mental health, it improves community spirits. So yeah,
do not think to yourself, I'm too old and therefore
I can't do it.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
Excellent, Right, we'll take a break. We'll be back in
just a mirle. It's ten to five news talks. It'd
be yes news talks. He'd be with a Tim Beveridge
and my guess Greg Pain sports biomechanist at BioSport. You
want to go check out his website BioSport dot coutter
and z don't forget. If you want to do that
running thing, go and check it out here. You can
do it for free if you just get enter news Talk.
Z B is the code check out for Greg's get
Started running program. Hey, Greg, achilles tendons, I've got a
(37:22):
text about that. How can we protect the safety of
our achilles tendon as we get into later life. I
am a once a week tennis player, supplemented by a
bit of regular walking, and I think there comes an
age where you do hear about people blowing out achilles,
don't you as you get older.
Speaker 4 (37:38):
Yes.
Speaker 5 (37:38):
So when it comes to overuse injuries musculisk a little
obvious injuries, I think the stats are approximately eighty to
eighty five percent of those injuries are more tenderness than
muscle specific. When it comes to achilles, which are very
very common, again, particularly as we age, it's not so
much because we're aging, it's because what we haven't done
(38:02):
enough over the years is trained the tendon how and
so that's when even at home you don't need to
go to a gym for this. But if you can
just buy some weights, some basic kettlebells or dumbbells or
something like that, and just progressively do bent leg and
straight knee calf phrases full range, like from all the
(38:24):
way down, from the bottom of the movement all the
way up, that will help you already build that tendon resilience.
And the key to success there is to really think
about where possible, getting as much load into it as
you can and doing the movement license slowly as well.
But if you do have achilles or tendon problems, the
biggest mistake you can make is to try and avoid
(38:46):
using it and therefore loading it, because but a little
bit of pain will actually help to stimulate the repair
of the tissue.
Speaker 3 (38:52):
Okay, one to hear Hi Tim and guest Greg. I
have a meniscus tear on my left knee. I had
the same injury my right near about twelve years ago
that a keyhole surgery, and since has been as good
as gold. Now I'm told told to rehab the injury.
They don't want to operate. I've done ours on the exercycle,
squats car phrases, yet my knee is not right, hurts
when I run, and I had to stop playing soccer
(39:14):
after playing for you.
Speaker 5 (39:15):
Yeah, so there's quite a big difference between getting pain
in a knee and getting pain in a knee when
you're playing soccer or running, because you can go to
the gym and do your squats and do your deadlifts
and do your knee extensions, but that doesn't necessarily extrapolate
through to what it is that you're doing when you're running.
So I would also and I'm treading a patient with
(39:38):
this exact same problem as we speak right now. We
spend a lot of time working on glut strength and
glut mead strength, which is your lateral butt muscle. But
also if you're trying to get into running, build into
some very low grade pliometrics that's not hard to do skipping,
but also making sure that when you're getting into your
running you're thinking about having a nice high cadence and
(39:59):
that sort of thing, just to try and again deload
the tissue. So don't just think of the strength exercise
is being positive for running. They are positive, but think
it a little more running specific with your exercise prescription.
Speaker 3 (40:11):
Excellent, Greg Hey, once again, great to be on the show.
If people want to check your website at BioSport dot
co dot en zed enjoy the rest of your little
break at Matta Purrie when you're back in town.
Speaker 5 (40:22):
Back in town on Monday, back to work on Tuesday,
trying to squeeze five days into four. Awesome, well done,
keep up good work, thank you, thanks so much all.
Speaker 3 (40:31):
We'll be back shortly with a new guest for Smart Money.
Todd Hamington Talking is an employment retention expert talking about
what keeps you happ in the workplace.
Speaker 1 (40:39):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to News
Talk said Be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News talksb.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Pack Ah.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Okay, welcome, Welcome back to the week In Collective. We
let our guests choose the tune often on this hour,
and that is the choice of my guest. That is
apparently a tune called talk show host. But it's not
the most uplifting piece of music.
Speaker 4 (00:46):
Is that.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
It's an interesting choice. So I'm I will thank our guests.
I'm about to introduce to you in just a moment,
mind you know who it is. Look, it's great paint. Oh,
it's just salurite of him, now shall we He's coming
to us hot from a holiday and Mattapuri and we've
got the screen on. He's in the lap of luxury.
By the look of him, with a wonderful painting of
(01:07):
it looks like of a Kia or behind him or
I think it is or a kea or a two
or something or some native bird. And his name is
Greg Payne. Hello, Greg, How are you good?
Speaker 4 (01:19):
Afternoon? Tim? I apologize.
Speaker 5 (01:21):
Look, I've always had a very strong passion towards Radiohead.
It's probably my absolute all time favorite band. And the
little two lines that came up were probably the most
questionable two lines in the entire track. So I do
apologize for that, but I won't apologize for Radiohead.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
Don't worry. We had We had a much dodger a
set of lyrics yesterday when we play a little bit
of Motorhead, and nobody picked up on it. But I
thought that lyrics a bit dodged. Thats a bit of anyway. Hey, Now,
for those who are listening, before we get into it
with Greg, the whole thing about pushing you to your
limit when you get in a way, it's sort of
(01:59):
the point of exercise, or at least exploring your limits,
perhaps running just that little bit longer when you're maybe
even when you're exhausted.
Speaker 4 (02:06):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (02:07):
I'm reading this and thinking, I'm not sure I would
run if I was exhausted doing that extra rip rep
when you think you can't lift anymore. But maybe there
are chances when we're actually missing certain warning signs that
pushing ourselves too hard might lead to an injury, or
that might not even get you back in the gym.
Oh and when you're starting exercise, how far should you
(02:28):
push it and avoid those early injuries? Anyway, Greg, let's
explore that a bit. Have you ever blown a foo
foo valve because you've just gone to too hard on
your exercise?
Speaker 4 (02:37):
A foo foo.
Speaker 5 (02:37):
Valve is something I don't blow on a regular basis,
thank you, Tim. But I do have a reliable I
had failed back surgery about twelve years ago, and accordingly
I still have some nerve tension down the back of
one of my legs, and I basically doesn't bother me.
Speaker 4 (02:58):
I can wing.
Speaker 5 (02:58):
Foil, I can do whatever I want, But as soon
as I start to run, I just have a tendency
of blowing my left car as soon as I start
to push it. So if I have a four food
val but it's called my left calf, But yeah, it happens,
and it's a tricky injuries. And you know, blowing calves,
(03:19):
blowing muscles is such a multifaceted discussion and there's always
a large number of factors.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
That contribute to it. It's never ever just one thing.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
I mean, are there some guidelines for what's the difference
between pushing yourself and abusing yourself in terms of you know,
obviously you work with some elite athletes who would probably
push themselves beyond what any of us could imagine would
be humanly possible.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
Yeah, I mean, it depends on what you're trying to achieve.
Like you know, if you're working.
Speaker 5 (03:50):
Awesomeness or there are always varying levels of awesomeness. But
from a physiological perspective, let's just say you're a running
coach or a triathlon coach. You are trying to push
your athletes into a state of fatigue so that with
that adaptation from that fatigue, they get stronger and they
become a better athlete. When you're looking at a movement
(04:12):
pattern like say running or whether it's deadlifting in the
gym or back squadding or whatever it is, you want
to try and avoid what we call task failure. And
that's when the multiple systems, whether it's your biomechanics or
whether it's your blood flow, or whether it's a whole
multitude of factors come together and you can no longer
(04:32):
say lift safely, or you can't maintain your running technique correctly,
and each of these things actually do have a place
that in a controlled environment you do want to get
to because again, with that adaptation, you get stronger and
more resilient. But particularly if you're coming back from injury,
or you're new to a sport or new to lifting weights.
(04:53):
Task failure is something that you probably want to avoid.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
Well, I mean a common injury. You talked about blowing
a calf muscle, But for older runners, once they get
into it, sometimes they can not even movie pushing that
that hard. And it's because it's quite a common I
gather it's quite a common sort of injury to happen
if you're getting a bit older about how can you
avoid those seemingly innocuous sort of like I wasn't even
doing anything and all of a sudden, boom, there goes
(05:17):
the calf.
Speaker 5 (05:18):
So a calf when you're running is a really interesting
injury to try and manage. You can look at it
from your calf is just not strong enough, you know.
We know that particularly there are two calves. There's Celius
and gastrocs. Celius is the deep one. Gas Strocks is
the good looking one. You know when you've got a
pair of high heels on and your cars look great.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
Well I haven't done that for a while, but.
Speaker 5 (05:40):
Well neither neither. But you know we have the gist.
But the deep calf being celius when you're running, that
has to contend with you know, sometimes six to even
at most like eight times body weight loading per contact.
And so if we're not in the gym or at
least doing some really heavy lifting on our calves, they
are more susceptible to overload and therefore injury. But the
(06:02):
other thing as well is that very few runners, and
this is what I do a lot when I'm doing
my gate analysis of my runners, is I look at
what we call their hip extension strategy. So that's like,
how well are the muscles on the back of your leg,
being your butt muscles, your hamstrings, and your calves. How
are they working together in order to generate propulsive force.
(06:23):
Most people who have a recurring calf problem have something
higher up traditionally, like their butt muscles aren't doing enough work,
and so therefore the calf is working over time to compensate.
Speaker 4 (06:34):
And so that's why you see a recurring.
Speaker 3 (06:36):
Ausery is that sometimes postura or for running. Now look
up by the way, yeah, by the way, we're going
to take calls here. Eight hundred and eighty, ten eighty.
The reason I mentioned posture is because I saw you
Greg when you first came on the show. You and
analyzed my running style, and you got me to actually
stand up right. I was running like us a depressed
sort of old man.
Speaker 5 (06:55):
So yeah, I mean running running is very, very very postural,
and there are a number of key things that we
want to see a runner do. And if you have
a team, you can see as an endurance runner of
leaning a little bit too far forward. The one thing
I would never just say to you is or tim
you're leaning too far forward. So therefore try and stand
more upright. To get you more upright, there is a strategy,
(07:17):
and that's about getting your palvis in the right place
and using your core to hold the palvis up more,
and by doing that you can get more upright. But
also by doing that you get your butt muscles into
play more as well. So there's a termin movement mechanics
and it's proximal stability for distal mobility. And what that
basically means is that proximal is your pelvis if that's
(07:40):
in the correct place and everything around the palvis is
moving working correctly muscular wise, things above being your trunk
and things below being your legs are way more likely
to be balanced and therefore efficient.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Is that why when you were talking to me about
running that you didn't say you need to stand more upright.
You might have said your postures wrong, but instead of
saying stand or upright, you actually see it. Imagine that
you are being propelled by someone pushing you from your backside,
And so I thought of it that way. I wasn't
thinking of I wasn't thinking of being upright. I was
simply thinking about, I imagine that this is how I'm
(08:14):
propelling myself, and all of a sudden, hey pressed it.
Speaker 5 (08:17):
Because the end result is going to be exactly the
same thing. If I say to your term, you're leaning
too far forward. Just bring your shoulders back to get
more upright, Yes you will be more upright, but unfortunately
to achieve that, you'll end up sort of probably arching
your lower back more, which could increase the likelihood of
a bit of a back niggle a back injury. Whereas,
instead if you think about like I used a Q
(08:39):
hopefully appropriately, I'm imagining like someone's hands are on your
butt and they're pushing your pelvis forward that way to
get more upright. Ultimately the exact same result, but they
get a very different response as far as how your
muscles work around the pelvis and therefore above and below.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Yeah, okay, right, well, look, we want to take your
calls on this if you've got any questions about especially
well actually any questions you've got for Greg around movement
and exit size, but also if you've got persistent injuries
or you've got questions around movement, and we're wondering if
there's a reason that you might be getting injured more persistently.
But how not to avoid as I jokingly say, blowing
(09:17):
a foo foo valve. I have no idea where I
got that expression from. Some might say something that happens
when you're trying to do a sumo squat that's too heavy,
but we won't get into that, and let's take some calls,
shall we. Let's go to Dalla Sollo.
Speaker 6 (09:31):
Yeah, hi, Greg, I've injured my back months ago, Bell two,
bell three down lower back there and I've been to
physio once a week and he's given me stretching exercises
and I still have pain some.
Speaker 7 (09:51):
Days and not.
Speaker 6 (09:52):
So I'm just wondering how far do you push these
stretching exercises.
Speaker 4 (09:58):
So when it come back.
Speaker 5 (09:59):
To tricky, yes, banks are tricky, and there's a bit
of a recurring theme like you know, if we're talking
about half injuries or any sort of injury, it's never
just going to be one thing, but there are There's
definitely a few things you can do in order to
try and one reduced pain or discomfort in the lower back,
and two sort of protect it from further injuries going forward.
(10:23):
The one thing that I make a suggestion to people
is an ideal a lot with back injuries is yes,
there is some validity and benefit and say stretching, but
I'd be more interested in getting you moving and trying
to think about what typically happens when you get a
back injury is your pelvis will tip forward and your
(10:43):
lower back will arch. It's a guarding mechanism. So I'd
start to think about basic core stability to pelvit tilt
to try and unload those back muscles. But also when
you're upright and walking, and I highly highly if your
back is saw make sure you walk, keep moving, don't
not move, but if you can, when you're nice and
upright and you're walking, just make again this procuring theme
(11:06):
of when your foots in contact with the ground, make
sure your butt muscles are working to try and pull
back because again that will unload those back muscles, ask
them to do a little bit less, and the situation
should start to settle down. But I'd look at really
gaining some mastery around what we call pelvit tilt or
cour stability stuff, because it's something that is a little
(11:29):
bit overblown as far as exercise prescription is concerned, but
the fundamental skill that it offers is really really powerful
when it comes to managing back problems.
Speaker 6 (11:38):
Pelvits shouldn't thought because when you injure yourself, the bustles
around the ligaments tight and up, don't they correct?
Speaker 5 (11:45):
And so what that does is it sends you into
what we call an anterior pelvit tilt, which is basically
like a duck sticking its butt out. Now that's again
that's there for a reason. But when you have pain
in your back, there's a term called reciprocal inhibition, and
that back pain will also switch off to a degree
you'll call abdominal muscles. So just sort of at a
(12:07):
very low level, getting those abdominal muscles to work to
hold the front of the palvis up into what we
call a posterior pelvic tilt. That can help to just
create a little bit more length and stretch and those
back muscles that are overactive and causing the problems.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
Any other any Dallas, because I know you've been keen
to talk to Greg.
Speaker 6 (12:28):
Your pelvis should be tilted forward then rather than back.
Speaker 5 (12:31):
Well, this is where it gets confusing on a radio.
If you put your fingertips on the bones at the
very front of your pelvis. If you use those bones
at the front, they should be pulled back slightly. So
if you have your hand in your lower back, your
back's arched. You're trying to flatten your lower back very slightly.
If you go online and just type in posterior pelvic tilt,
(12:55):
that's what you're trying to work towards.
Speaker 3 (12:58):
Okay, good on your Dallas, Absolute pleasure, good luck, good luck.
Look we actually let's get another call. I've got lots
of questions lined up for myself that we've had come
through as well on the text. But let's get on
with some more calls. Janas, Hello, oh hello, Just for Greg.
Speaker 8 (13:16):
I've started walking again uphills and I can't remember if
he said you have to try and stand more upright
or lean forward? I know you take little steps, yes.
Speaker 5 (13:29):
So yeah forward or so lean forward? Slightly walking up
a hill is walking uphill is very very good for
leg strengths. It's very good for all that sort of
postural adaptation. Basically, think about your trunk. The angle of
your upper body should basically be in line with gravity.
(13:49):
So yes, you are leaning forward, but you're you're still
in line with gravity, if that makes sense.
Speaker 4 (13:55):
You don't want to be leaning.
Speaker 5 (13:56):
Forward excessively, because that will make you your thigh muscles
work probably a little bit too much relative to your
butt muscles in your handstrings. But shortsteps and lean and
leaning slightly forward is exactly where you want to be.
Speaker 8 (14:10):
Oh that's lovely, Thank you Greek.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
My absolute pressure.
Speaker 3 (14:12):
Well done, Jane, bye bye. Let's go to that was
that was easily?
Speaker 5 (14:18):
Sort?
Speaker 9 (14:18):
Was?
Speaker 4 (14:20):
Oh no, we love the.
Speaker 5 (14:21):
Easy ones, but we also love that the detailed complex
I'm fascinating as well.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
A right, let's go to.
Speaker 7 (14:29):
Oh, good guys, how are you Craig? Yeah, look, I
just got a bit of a problem I in my
left in the ankle joint. But it's the top of
the joint. I get it. Scruciating pain when walking on
the top of the foot coming up to the top
(14:51):
of that joint. If you can imagine and then on
about halfway up the front of the shin. Now I've
been I've been to my GP. She they took some memages,
said that I've got some something like osteopene yep, yeah, yeah,
and small signs of osteoarthritis. Now I'm sixty five, so
(15:16):
it doesn't surprise me. Greg. Yeah, now she's She's sort
of said, I thought it was a hip problem. But
I've been for imaging with that as well. No, that's
all good. So that's fine. So I was wondering if
what and I can't live on volcar and for the
rest of my life. No, I really need to know
(15:39):
what do you think?
Speaker 5 (15:41):
Well, that's a very very complex one to answer. I mean,
if it's top of the ankle, there could be an
irritation maybe around what we call the retendaculum, which is
a bit of a it's a ligament to strap on
top of the ankle. And I'm certainly dipping my toes
into more of the podietary space or physio space with
these comments. But you know osteopenia and osteopenia is a
(16:02):
precursor to osteoporosis. So whether there's a bone health issue
there or not.
Speaker 4 (16:07):
I don't know.
Speaker 5 (16:09):
As far as helping the ankle, just doing little simple
things like sort of similar to what Janus was just saying.
If you're walking particularly try and make smaller, shorter, smaller steps,
shorter strides that can help unload the ankle. But even
just practicing. You don't need any specific tools or anything
like that, but just even practicing. You know, if you're
(16:31):
in the kitchen and chopping up some potatoes or something,
just practice, maybe not with a sharp knife, but just
practice standing on that one foot to help. Will be
call those proprire septors, which are little things, little pieces
will tend or not tend, and sorry, little signals within
the joint that help to get the muscles to work
a little more effectively around the joint. But if you're
(16:53):
really struggling with that, what I would probably say, Craig
is find a good physio or a good pediatrist in
your area to give you some advice because there could
be a number of different things going on there.
Speaker 7 (17:04):
They have rushed me on to vitamin D and calcium.
They are concerned about the bone density. Greg, I know
you've got other callers. Look very quickly. Would electromagnetic treatment help.
Speaker 5 (17:23):
By my understanding, again, this is more of a physio thing.
The efficacy around that sort of electro treatment is a
little ambiguous. But I don't want to go on record
and saying that I probably the physio. But what I
do know is that if you do, if there is
signs of sort of early osteoporosis involved, that is when
(17:45):
you do want to start thinking about getting into the
gym and making sure that you get some good weightlifting underway,
because that's a very very effective tool carefully and supervised,
I should admit, I should state, but that is a
very effective tool for helping to manage bone house.
Speaker 7 (18:03):
Very helpful, Greg, thanks very much.
Speaker 4 (18:05):
My absolute picture. Good luck, Craig.
Speaker 3 (18:08):
Craig right, we'll take a moment, we'll come back. We'll
take more of your calls. I went Undredaddy Teddy with
Greg Pain. He's a sports biomechanist at BioSport. It is
twenty coming up to twenty five, past four news talks.
He'd be.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
Wouldn't the pimps in the grib monk drop it, legg it,
tid rub it legged hard, drop it?
Speaker 3 (18:27):
Oh my god, who chose this song?
Speaker 4 (18:29):
Is this?
Speaker 3 (18:29):
My guest? Again? Was this Greg Oh okay, look, okay,
it's the Motorhead. Next we're with Greg Pain, who's chosen
the first two songs. I'm just trolling him. Really, he's
a good guy, he's biomechanist. We're taking your cause on well,
getting into trying to avoid injury while you're doing your
favorite exercise, or getting into exercise, among other things. But
(18:50):
we've had a few people talking about backs, which I
suspect we might get quite a few more of those calls. Greg,
was that your that was your song choice? Was it?
Speaker 7 (18:56):
No?
Speaker 5 (18:57):
I was a tone and cheek thing that I sort
of suggested Tara, not for a second thinking that.
Speaker 4 (19:01):
She would take me seriously. Ah, I'm gonna regret. I'm
going to do this ever again.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
She takes you at your word.
Speaker 4 (19:10):
Makes me blushing sitting here.
Speaker 3 (19:13):
Did you really mean it as a joke? Oh good,
that's funny. Good on your tire. She's got a since
a hear she's great, Leslie, Hello.
Speaker 10 (19:25):
Hello, This program couldn't have been couldn't have been come
up a better time? Wag in bed. He was a
very sore back. I am yesterday. I wasn't really all
that bright and the room seemed to be moving a
bit when I when I got out of bed, and
so I just sat mostly most of the day and
(19:48):
did nothing. But today I had to get up because
somebody was coming and I fell over, fell and headlong
into the wardrobe door and knocked it off its hinges
and badly hurt my back and I and then beard
it the moment because that's the most comfortable place I'm
(20:10):
in my nineties, So you know, I'm dodvery h Are
you looking?
Speaker 3 (20:16):
Have you got a question for Greg about what you
can in particular movement or just what's your question there?
Speaker 8 (20:22):
Yes?
Speaker 10 (20:23):
Am I business to be moving all the time? Or
is it all right for reader stay in bed where
I'm more comfortable.
Speaker 5 (20:31):
Well, firstly, I'm just going to say I'm sorry that
you've had such a rough twenty four hours there, Leslie,
But you've actually asked a very very smart question, because
a lot of people think that when they have pain
or discomfort, they should lie in bed or sit and
basically wait till the pain goes away, which is assuming,
(20:55):
of course the pain levels are manageable. But it is
the worst thing to do, and particularly as we get older.
So the most important thing you should we in one
who does have back pain or generally speaking painful, stop
is to try and ensure that you keep moving, like, yes,
you do want to protect the area and make sure
(21:15):
you don't make it progressively worse. But keep optimistic, keep moving,
keep blood flow, and if possible, try and build that
strength back up again. But you know, trying to. Sorry,
just lying in bed hoping that that will actually help
the recovery of the situation is probably not the best
(21:39):
advice that I could give you.
Speaker 3 (21:40):
Thanks for your call, Leslie, and best wish. Just with that, Hey, Greg,
just one thing with lower back pain. This is actually
me as well, but I know other people have had
this with doing weights and things. It's just just that
sense of if I'm sitting on the couch for a while,
i get up, I'm like, oh God, but I'm doing
you deadlifts and squats and stuff, and I feel fine
(22:01):
while I'm doing them, But is there something that happens
at the where you're getting the residual thing just because
you're no longer twenty three?
Speaker 5 (22:08):
So I mean, if you go into the gym and
you're doing your back squats and your deadlifts, which are
which basically everybody should be doing, there should be no
fear or stigma around lifting weights and doing those sort
of movements because we know that they are profoundly beneficial
and effective from a longevity perspective Muscular ski lettle health.
(22:29):
But I mean, everything that we're trying to do when
we're in the gym is progressively and carefully increase our load,
increase the number of reps and sets relatively speaking, which
is going to induce some loading and therefore fatigue into
the tissues. So if it's just fatigue related, that's absolutely fine.
(22:49):
If there is something within the movement, whether it's again
you're deadlift or your back squad that is posturally a
little bit out of whack that could cause a little
bit more of it of an acute level of pain,
that again just then to be managed with maybe some
pain pain relif on some walking. But I'm a very
big believer in saying don't let pain you know, again,
(23:11):
similar to what Lizzie was just was just asking don't
let pain stop you from doing these really really positive
things because not doing them is potentially way worse than
doing them and having a slight niggle in your lower back.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
Yeah right, Okay, let's carry on. We work to guy. Hello, Hello, how.
Speaker 11 (23:30):
Are we doing?
Speaker 4 (23:31):
Hi guy?
Speaker 11 (23:32):
Hey, similar fame. Yeah, I have had neck pain for
like close to twelve months without getting towards a full recovery.
I was just wondering, like I've done a bit of
reading on it, and a lot of the times it
says if it goes the pain goes on after three
four months, and it's like you're just gonna have to
(23:55):
sort of deal with it on an ongoing basis and
it might not make a full recovery. Is that you're understanding.
Do you see people who do make a recovery.
Speaker 5 (24:06):
So it depends entirely on what's causing the pain, if
it's something arising from an introvertible disc. That we do
know that if say, for example, you've prolapsed a disc
in your neck, that it can take upwards of eighteen
months for that disc to be reabsorbed and to get
(24:26):
back to full function. We know that traditionally, when an
injury becomes chronic, which is regarded as twelve weeks or more,
then it becomes a lot harder to manage the long
term prognosis of the injury. But that does not for
a second mean that the injury is never going to heal.
Speaker 4 (24:47):
The key to success is finding out.
Speaker 5 (24:50):
What has actually caused the neck pain or what is
actually going on, and building particularly like a strength strategy
around it. And if there are things that you need
to adjust in your workstation or the way that you
drive your car or the way that you sleep, that's
going to be beneficial as well.
Speaker 4 (25:05):
But a lot of neck.
Speaker 5 (25:07):
Injuries are recurring because people have what we call chin protrusion,
and that's if you're looking at someone's side on ultimately
their ears should be more or less this is a
little bit of an exaggeration, but more or less aligned
directly above their shoulder. Now, with computers and driving and
digital devices, we tend to chin protrude, which is when
(25:29):
your chin goes forward a little bit. And there are
really simple exercises you can do and you can find
them online called deep netflexer exercises, and that can just
help strengthen those deep intrinsic muzzles of the neck to
help get a little bit more balanced around the neck
as well. So I mean, if you're struggling, then I
would certainly get further advice from a good physio or
(25:51):
similar because you do want to be proactive in managing
these things and not just accept the fact that you're
going to be in pain for the rest of your life,
because nobody wants that, that's for sure.
Speaker 3 (26:03):
Okay, thanks for call my hey. Just a quick question
the thing they're talking about. You know, if you've got
sometimes people end up with certain injuries, like you've got
a tight muscle and your right leg, and it means
that somehow there's something up in your left shoulder. I
think it's called the sling. What's what's the story with that?
Speaker 5 (26:21):
So muscular slings are still a very highly debated subject
in movement house. So let's just muscular slings are based
around the muscles have a fiber direction. So if you
look at a muscle map, if someone say your thigh
muscles travel that the muscle fibers travel in the vertical plane.
(26:44):
Your butt muscles are in a horror a diagonal plane.
And so because of those angles of muscles, you can
sort of say that, well, your left glop, your left
butt muscle slings across to you, or say your right shoulder.
Speaker 4 (26:57):
And so we've quite.
Speaker 5 (26:58):
Often seen say in a runner, for example, who has
left hip or left knee pain. If we start to
think about putting their opposite right shoulder in a better
place when they're running.
Speaker 4 (27:09):
It improves that sling tension.
Speaker 5 (27:11):
So it's a little bit of a little bit of
a pseudoscience to a degree. It's hotly discussed, but I
still use it quite a lot and I think it's
quite effective.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
Yeah. Well, the thing I noticed was I was just
talking to someone I had as in duram of right knee,
and I noticed that my left shoulder was weaker on
certain exercises. Yes, and it was, and so we said, well,
that sort of makes sense. It might have been you.
Speaker 7 (27:31):
Actually, Yeah, we've.
Speaker 4 (27:34):
Been together for so long term. Who wouldn't know. We can't,
I can't get up with our conversations.
Speaker 3 (27:39):
Hey, Greg, we'll take some more calls in just a moment.
My guest expert as a sports biomechanist, Greg Pain. It's
worth pointing actually just before we go to the break,
because while you have been a regular on the show,
there's a difference between a physio and a biomechanist, and
maybe if you just give us a quick explainer as
we head to the break.
Speaker 5 (27:57):
So my background as a biomechanist is I look at
movement patterns and identify within those movement patterns where faults
are occurring in that they can relate to either performance
or injuries. So if you're a runner with a sore knee,
then you come and see me. If you're a runner
and you fall over and hit your knee on something
and you've got pain in the need, that's certainly of physio.
(28:19):
So they deal with more of the sudden onset not
as much of an overuse area. But physios are also
becoming quite good in the biomechanics field as well.
Speaker 3 (28:30):
Excellent, we'll come back with more stuff in the moment
and something for people who want to get running as well.
It is twenty one minutes to five News Talk as
they'd be ah, yes, a little bit of deep Purple
to ease ourselves into our next session with Greg pain
(28:52):
by a mechanists. Great, just a quick question. You know
all these you know, these apps to get into I
got into a running with an app which was like,
I can't remember what it was as so many weeks
to running six to eight weeks into doing thirty mins.
I mean, there's so much choice out there. Have you
ever decided to get into that sort of line of
work getting people running? Because that's your warehouse, isn't it.
Speaker 5 (29:13):
Well, it is actually Tim and I yes, I actually
have just launched today, seriously, Yes, today, it has gone
live on my website, an evidence based, biomechanically driven, exercise
driven learned to run program and it's completely different to
(29:35):
anything else that is on the marketplace. So I'm very
excited that you asked the question.
Speaker 3 (29:41):
And so actually what is it? So what do people do?
Speaker 5 (29:43):
So what I've done is I've based it around what's
called training age. So instead of just saying, well, everyone
who wants to learn to run should just go and
follow this learn to run program of a number of
time or distance per day, what I've done is I've
given people the tools to identify what their training age is,
which is basic your your amount of experience within the running,
(30:07):
and then the running and the exercise programs are based
around that.
Speaker 4 (30:11):
So it's not generic. And and I've also got a
free code, so I'm giving it away for free.
Speaker 3 (30:20):
So i can go and check it out for nothing
for free.
Speaker 5 (30:23):
Yes, So if you just go onto my website to
buy a sport dot co dot z, it's on the
home page at checkout. If you just put in the
code News talk zb you get it completely for free,
and I've also got I've got the buyosport app so
you can you can go through it at your own speed.
I suggest following it pretty closely or on the buy
(30:43):
a Sport app.
Speaker 4 (30:44):
So there you go.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
God, good on you. Well, they say the secret of
good comedy is timing. Buy a sport dot cat is it?
Good on you mate?
Speaker 7 (30:54):
Thank you.
Speaker 4 (30:54):
I'm very proud of it. It's one of those ones.
Speaker 5 (30:56):
I've spent a lot of time building it, and yeah,
I think it's a really good product and there's nothing
else around that looks at run.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
On the scope. I'll go and check that out. Anyone
else's listening, go and check it out, right, Let's take
some more calls.
Speaker 12 (31:09):
Steve Hello, Yeah, okay, guys, Steve too advertorial there, that
was yeah, good timing. Hey, look the reason I was calling.
I've recently really saw right right shoulder, but my left
shoulders got quite sore as well. Many years ago, I
had a quarter zone injection in my right shoulder. It's
(31:32):
very the pain, very similar, it was, he said, basically
a very similar to frozen shoulder. Now my right shoulder,
saying really, story again, but I've noticed my left shoulder's
got a bit sore again, So I was kind of wondering,
is it likely to be a return of the old
injury that the quarter zone was for. There'd be something
else inflammatory going on in one bit of information sort
(31:53):
of trigger some in another joint. It's just a bit.
He had to found it a bit weird that my
left lum was getting a bit sore as well.
Speaker 5 (31:59):
We do know that if you have frozen shoulder and
one side, I don't know the exact I probably should.
I think it's around about a seventy five percent likelihood
that you're going to get it in the other shoulder
as well. But again, when it comes down to these things,
keeping it moving and trying to actively maintain a nice
mobile shoulder is key. But there are little things that
(32:21):
you can do. I've got a client that I'm treating
at the moment. She's a surgeon dealing with frozen shoulder, so,
you know, being really proactive and trying to keep the
shoulder sort of If you think the shoulder joints like
a seal balancing a ball on its nose, it's an
incredibly unstable joint because it is regarded as a ball
and socket joint. So it's very very easy to say
(32:43):
the muscles on the front of the shoulder being your
chest muscles to pull the shoulder forward. So if you
spend a little bit of time really trying to make
sure that the muscles on the back of the shoulder
and your rotator cuff are doing the right job, then
that can hopefully sort of deload those tissues and reduce
the level of pain. But yeah, I mean, frozen shoulder
(33:05):
is fairly common. But again it's a case of just
being really proactive and managing it with good clinical advice. Well,
I certainly my one really strong piece of advice is
don't just leave it and hope that it will get better, because,
as I sort of suggesting earlier, a chronic injury is
not something that you want to let go.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
Okay, hey, cheer Steve, Thank you very much. Thanks, thank you.
All right, let's go to lots of text by the way,
where if you do want to jump the queue, jump
into the onto the cause. But we'll try and get
through two or three texts as well. But Warwick you're next.
Speaker 9 (33:39):
Yeah, thanks him. I just want to hopefully help help
people out that might be into weight training and bodybuilding.
I just I'm in my mid sixties. I'm retired, but
I'm also very seriously end of my bodybuilding, which might
just do at home. I don't want to like sound
like I'm pulling myself, but I get people asking me
(34:00):
because they can see that I'm in the sixties, and
people ask me, what do you do when you men?
You know, when they go out, because I'm still making gain,
still getting bigger and stronger. But the key that I'm
going to tell people is it's all about low volume.
Don't do a lot of volume, you know, don't spend
a lot of time in the gym. Just do what
(34:21):
you do safely to extreme intensity intensity, you know, so
then you're quit the stimulation. The reason that has to
adapt to a new situation. You have to do it safely.
You have to warm up properly, you have to do
it's correctly. But you have your point where you simply
(34:43):
cannot anymore.
Speaker 4 (34:45):
It's You've got a.
Speaker 3 (34:47):
Terrible line there. So I've just got to jump in there.
But I am a bit cautious about people who are
not guests on the show giving advice to people on exectly.
Speaker 5 (34:54):
Yeah, I would, just I mean, there is definitely a
lot of merit in that. For sure, we don't if
you're trying to build muscle mass, you want to try
and get close to failure. But we also do know
that you do not need to get too failure. That
is when we start to see a likelihood of injury.
We also know that in order to try and get
(35:16):
really effective gains by building strength or muscle mass, which
ideally the two, you will do the bothah three gym
sessions a week is pretty much optimal.
Speaker 4 (35:27):
You don't get much.
Speaker 5 (35:28):
More by doing four or five gym sessions a week.
But particularly if you are looking at trying to get
into the gym, technique does become very very important, So
really taking your time to build that confidence and knowledge
before you start to go heavy as.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
Gain if you're uninitiated, work with a trainer.
Speaker 5 (35:46):
Absolutely, I mean if you're in a position where you
can afford to get someone or in a good group environment.
But technique becomes less important if you're highly experienced in
a gym space, but if you're new ish it is crucial.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
Actually, one of the things that does come out of
orric school as well. Though I think I remember a
study that was talking about the benefits of of using
weights for people right through their years, right up to
their nineties. Things and weight just keep for somehow fine
an opportunity to work with weights. Don't think it's something
for the just the young and.
Speaker 5 (36:17):
The absolutely I mean, you know we know now that
with if you're dealing with osteoporosis, even if you have
quite severe levels of osteoporosis, like a T score of
same minus six, which is very very severe, going to
the gym and lifting an appropriate amount of weight for
you will make a big difference. So don't you don't
(36:38):
want to be sitting there thinking to yourself, I'm eighty,
I'm too old. Absolutely not, you should at eighty you
can still get out there and lift weight and make
a big difference because we also know it reduces the
likelihood of falls. We also know it improves grip strength,
it improves mental health, it improves community spirits. So yeah,
do not think to yourself, I'm too old and therefore
I can't do it.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
Excellent, Right, we'll take a break. We'll be back in
just a mirle. It's ten to five news talks. It'd
be yes news talks. He'd be with a Tim Beveridge
and my guess Greg Pain sports biomechanist at BioSport. You
want to go check out his website BioSport dot coutter
and z don't forget. If you want to do that
running thing, go and check it out here. You can
do it for free if you just get enter news Talk.
Z B is the code check out for Greg's get
Started running program. Hey, Greg, achilles tendons, I've got a
(37:22):
text about that. How can we protect the safety of
our achilles tendon as we get into later life. I
am a once a week tennis player, supplemented by a
bit of regular walking, and I think there comes an
age where you do hear about people blowing out achilles,
don't you as you get older.
Speaker 4 (37:38):
Yes.
Speaker 5 (37:38):
So when it comes to overuse injuries musculisk a little
obvious injuries, I think the stats are approximately eighty to
eighty five percent of those injuries are more tenderness than
muscle specific. When it comes to achilles, which are very
very common, again, particularly as we age, it's not so
much because we're aging, it's because what we haven't done
(38:02):
enough over the years is trained the tendon how and
so that's when even at home you don't need to
go to a gym for this. But if you can
just buy some weights, some basic kettlebells or dumbbells or
something like that, and just progressively do bent leg and
straight knee calf phrases full range, like from all the
(38:24):
way down, from the bottom of the movement all the
way up, that will help you already build that tendon resilience.
And the key to success there is to really think
about where possible, getting as much load into it as
you can and doing the movement license slowly as well.
But if you do have achilles or tendon problems, the
biggest mistake you can make is to try and avoid
(38:46):
using it and therefore loading it, because but a little
bit of pain will actually help to stimulate the repair
of the tissue.
Speaker 3 (38:52):
Okay, one to hear Hi Tim and guest Greg. I
have a meniscus tear on my left knee. I had
the same injury my right near about twelve years ago
that a keyhole surgery, and since has been as good
as gold. Now I'm told told to rehab the injury.
They don't want to operate. I've done ours on the exercycle,
squats car phrases, yet my knee is not right, hurts
when I run, and I had to stop playing soccer
(39:14):
after playing for you.
Speaker 5 (39:15):
Yeah, so there's quite a big difference between getting pain
in a knee and getting pain in a knee when
you're playing soccer or running, because you can go to
the gym and do your squats and do your deadlifts
and do your knee extensions, but that doesn't necessarily extrapolate
through to what it is that you're doing when you're running.
So I would also and I'm treading a patient with
(39:38):
this exact same problem as we speak right now. We
spend a lot of time working on glut strength and
glut mead strength, which is your lateral butt muscle. But
also if you're trying to get into running, build into
some very low grade pliometrics that's not hard to do skipping,
but also making sure that when you're getting into your
running you're thinking about having a nice high cadence and
(39:59):
that sort of thing, just to try and again deload
the tissue. So don't just think of the strength exercise
is being positive for running. They are positive, but think
it a little more running specific with your exercise prescription.
Speaker 3 (40:11):
Excellent, Greg Hey, once again, great to be on the show.
If people want to check your website at BioSport dot
co dot en zed enjoy the rest of your little
break at Matta Purrie when you're back in town.
Speaker 5 (40:22):
Back in town on Monday, back to work on Tuesday,
trying to squeeze five days into four. Awesome, well done,
keep up good work, thank you, thanks so much all.
Speaker 3 (40:31):
We'll be back shortly with a new guest for Smart Money.
Todd Hamington Talking is an employment retention expert talking about
what keeps you happ in the workplace.
Speaker 1 (40:39):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to News
Talk said Be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio
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