Full Show Podcast: 16 June 2024

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine
from News Talks Edbo, the only place to discuss the
biggest sports issues on and after field. It's all on
weekends Ford with Jason Vane on your home of sport
Used Talks.

Speaker 2 (00:27):
Hello Kiota, good afternoon and welcome into the Sunday edition
of Weekend Sport for June sixteenth, Happy birthday a Kedda
Yowani and Phil Mickelson. I'm Jason Pine, Mark Kelly Show producer.
Today we're here talking sports until three. We have got
our Super Rugby Final locked in. They just need to
give it into touch.

Speaker 3 (00:47):
Save your road doesn't ain't For the second time in
successive seasons, the Chiefs are headed for the Grand Final.

Speaker 2 (00:55):
Yeah I'm not quite as excited as I sound in
that commentary clip. They'll play the Blues at Eden Park
next Saturday night. The Chiefs so well done to the Chiefs,
terrific when over the Canes last night. It'll be the
Blues against the chief for Super Rugby supremacy in twenty
twenty four. Going to break that down for you after
one o'clock. Hope to get the chance to chat to
Clayton McMillan, head coach of the chiefs keen to get

(01:15):
your analysis as well. Meantime, the Warriors still can't break
their drought against the Storm.

Speaker 3 (01:22):
Lovely Clay fil Hones is brilliance, sir, level.

Speaker 2 (01:30):
Drive the game right there.

Speaker 4 (01:32):
The Storm win by thirty eight points to twenty four.

Speaker 2 (01:35):
They're going to cover that off this afternoon as well,
and can to get your thoughts on the league and
on the rugby. First up today though, want to talk
some cricket with you and to start to chart the
way forward for the black Caps across the format. So
I want to get your views on the roadmap forward
for our national men's side and how we navigate this

(01:57):
current cricketing landscape and all of its moving parts. And
I want this to be a solutions based discussion. I
think you know, we've we've sort of gone past the
point of just bagging, you know, people for the sake
of bagging them. Let's let's try and find a way
forward in terms of navigating how you know, we can
we can negotiate the you know, the franchise cricket that

(02:18):
is growing exponentially around the world, and our international sides
and our continued performance at a high level. Chris Ken's
is standing by to chat with us on that. Then
I want to open the lines for your calls other
matters around today. With less than six weeks now until
the start of the Olympic Games, our Road to Powis
feature continues after two double Olympic medalist in the fifteen

(02:41):
hundred meters and five time Olympian Nick Willis is with
us on the show. The European Football Championship under way.
We're in Germany to assess prospects for the month ahead
with German based football writer Sebastian Stafford blew up conra
At Smith with us this afternoon as well. He's been
refereeing grassroots rugby in Taranaki this season. We'll have a

(03:03):
chat to him about that, and James mcconey along of course,
in his regular day slot at around one forty five
Live Sport while we're on the air. T twenty Cricket
World Cup Australia v Scotland from twelve thirty now. Australia
already threw to the Super eights. Scotland need to win
this game if they are to advance, and there's been
the suggestion of some skull duggery here. Australia know that

(03:27):
if they lose to Scotland then England will be knocked out.
It was brought up in a press conference earlier in
the week and yeah, look, I don't for a second
expect Australia to take it easy and lose to Scotland
just to knock England out. But well it's a possibility.
We'll keep a close eye on that one for you.
Closing stages of round three at Golf's US Open at Pinehurst,
Number two Bryson D Chambeau is the outright leader. He's

(03:50):
playing the eighteenth. He's seven under three seventeen holes, a
three shot lead from Matthieu Paven, Rory McElroy and Patrick Kantlid,
who are all in the clubhouse at four under the cup.
Ryan Fox earlier today firing a six over seventy six
in his third round that has him in a share
of sixty fifth at eleven over the card. Round three

(04:11):
in football's Chatham Cup this afternoon to a few games
to keep an eye on there. Please get in touch
whenever you like on the show. We would love to
hear from you. Oh eight hundred eighty ten eighty gets
you throw on the phone. That's a free call nine
to nine two if you would prefer to correspond via text,
or you can send us an email Jason at NEWSTALKSEB
dot co dot Nz coming up eleven past midday.

Speaker 1 (04:34):
The schoons from the track, fields and the court on
your home of sort weekends for it with Jason.

Speaker 5 (04:40):
Vine Us talks NB.

Speaker 2 (04:42):
So the T twenty Cricket World Cup will go into
its Super eight stages without New Zealand's involvement. Losses to
Afghanistan and the West Indies have put paid to the
black Caps chances. They accounted comfortably, of course, for Uganda
by nine wickets yesterday, and they'll complete their tournament against
Papa New Guinea in the early hours of Tuesday morning.
One of the great New Zealand all rounders is Chris Kens.

(05:03):
He played sixty two Test matches, two hundred and fifteen
One Day internationals in two T twenty internationals for the
black Caps in a career which spanned from nineteen eighty
nine to two thousand and six. Perhaps his finest moment
was in the final of the two thousand ICC Knockout
Trophy against India in Nairobi.

Speaker 6 (05:23):
Flow of all that's kennesas one hundred. What a fineingings
that is punches the air in delight.

Speaker 2 (05:28):
That is a marvelous.

Speaker 6 (05:29):
Effort for the man who wasn't even sure he was
going to play this morning. One hundred from one hundred
and ten balls. Remember, if the scores a level, we
have a bowl out. Cans has to go over the top.
The fielders are crowning him full task, They've got it.
New Zealand to that worked away for the single that
gives New Zealand victory two sixty five for six. What

(05:52):
a stunning effort that is. New Zealand win this ICC
knockout trophy by four wickets.

Speaker 2 (05:59):
Chris Kens, who.

Speaker 6 (06:01):
Wasn't even sure that he could play this morning because
of that injured knee as we got an unbeaten one
hundred and two understeered New Zealand.

Speaker 5 (06:11):
So a wonderful way.

Speaker 2 (06:12):
Yeah, hard to believe. That's nearly quarter of a century ago.
Now the year two thousand. Chris Keynes joins us from
where he lives now in Australia. Chris, thanks for taking
the time to chat here on news talks. He'd be
how deeply should we examine New Zealand's exit in the
group stages of this T twenty Cricket World Cup.

Speaker 7 (06:31):
Yeah, look, it's a good question. I actually I knew
I was going to have a chat to you guys.

Speaker 8 (06:36):
I sort of I thought about it last night and
I sort of tried to look at, you know, what
was going on. The negatives are positives, and I then
sort of had a look at over the last ten years.
You know, this is an outlier, right, So performance wise,
I think New Zealand at major tournaments over the last
several years have been tremendous.

Speaker 7 (06:55):
They have been excellent.

Speaker 8 (06:56):
So so given the preparation or lack of it, and
given what occurred how quickly it was, I don't think
you can dig too deep into this.

Speaker 7 (07:04):
I really do.

Speaker 2 (07:05):
A lot made of the lack of warm up matches
ahead of the tournament. How much difference might it have
made if that had a couple of pre tournament hudouts.

Speaker 8 (07:15):
A huge, huge amount of difference because you had guys
as well who were at the IPL but not really playing.
I mean there was you know a few guys who
were there for quite some time, you know, sitting on
the sidelines, and you can't beat match played I mean,
you can, you can net as much as you like,
you can practice as much as you like. But if
you're if you're not sort of match fit, then you know,

(07:36):
that's a that makes a huge amount of difference. And
then also those rainouts at the beginning of the tournament,
so you know, again I come back, I don't given
the nature of how quick this thing turns around. Yeah,
I personally don't think you can look too much into this.
I mean, I just think it was a performance that
doesn't lie sort of where New Zealand's been out over
the last several years.

Speaker 2 (07:57):
So it's an outlie. Then for you, Chris, it's it's
nothing too much to worry about. So what should we
take any lessons from it?

Speaker 9 (08:05):
Though?

Speaker 2 (08:06):
How we move forward here?

Speaker 10 (08:08):
Yeah, I suppose you've got to prepare.

Speaker 8 (08:10):
I mean the lessons really are just if you get
in that situation in a tournament in the you know,
in the future, you know, what do you do? But
but you know, given given the nature of you know,
the things that were out of their control like weather,
and that's a that's a huge thing. And then you know,
guys they just look rusty, you know, even with the
bat in the field, especially in that first match as well,
which again is as an outlier for a New Zealand team.

(08:34):
So so you know, yeah, you can analyze these things
to the degree, but I just I just really don't
think it's worth it in this scenario. That the big
thing now though, is that you've got the likes of
South and Bolton, Williamson, some key players coming towards the
end of their careers, so you know, you're looking at
contingencies now and sort of moving forward.

Speaker 7 (08:54):
I think the talent I D aspect and what the
team's going to look like.

Speaker 8 (08:58):
I think that's more prevalent to sort of analyzing the
performance of this Work Cup.

Speaker 2 (09:02):
Have you got a gut feel on on what that
might look like beyond some of the player that you
talked about, I think not really.

Speaker 8 (09:09):
I think that they'll look I mean, Bolton Sudia are
still going tremendously well, and you know, and again Williamson
just keeps tuning it out.

Speaker 7 (09:18):
So whether they've got a couple of years still left.

Speaker 8 (09:20):
In them, you know, only they know, and so you
know I think that you know, I'm sure Gary Staid
now will be starting to plan for the future. And
we saw I think during the home series last summer.
You know, there's there's young talent coming through in the
bowling department. You know, we need to identify and bring
forward a replacement for Williamson. I mean, you know that's

(09:42):
going to be extremely difficult. I mean, he's a once
in a generation player, so so people are going to
have to start stepping up. But I do think that
there needs to be some planning now sort of for
you know, going forward for the future.

Speaker 2 (09:52):
Might the days of the three format player be coming
to an end? Might we see more specialization?

Speaker 9 (10:00):
Yeah?

Speaker 8 (10:00):
Maybe, you know, possibly, I do think you know, in time,
you know, as the the riches in the IPL increase
and players place a premium you know, on those contracts
just purely because the value of them, you know, you're
going to see that naturally appear.

Speaker 10 (10:17):
Anyway.

Speaker 8 (10:18):
I think it's like it's, you know, as the IPL
season grows and sort of gets bigger and a team
or two gets added, you know, that to me appears inevitable.

Speaker 7 (10:27):
So you're going to have players that perhaps.

Speaker 8 (10:29):
You know, are focused on that T twenty element just
purely from a financial point of view, because it's just
makes sense, and you know that's going to that's going
to pose all sorts of problems from an international point
of view, and how and how those sort of games
and how the season continues and what that sort of
looks like. So over the next five to ten years,
cricket's going to transition, I think quite significantly.

Speaker 2 (10:50):
Yeah, what can you say, what what is your crystal
ball telling you?

Speaker 8 (10:54):
I think cricket could end up like like soccer, like football,
and that you know, the season in India, as I say,
we'll just get bigger because of the financial windfall and
benefits that occur off the back of that product, which
is an amazing product. It's it's a great it's a
great brand, it's a great competition, and and I just

(11:18):
think that that will get bigger and stronger. And then
if you've got one or two more leagues around that,
you know, guys will be making significant income. So then
I just think that what will occur. You'll have windows
for World Cups, windows for international matches, but but primarily
cricket will become sort of a domestic orientated or dominated

(11:38):
game around the world, much as much as like soccer.
Soccer does and if you look at the biggest leagues
in the world, they're all domestic. You know, you look
at the NBA Basketball, NFL, Major League Baseball, and the
e p L. They're all domestic leagues. And now the
i PL is in that. You know, it's in the
you know, you're speaking of the i PL on the
same breath as those those those other sort of mega leagues.

Speaker 7 (11:58):
So so that's that's that's.

Speaker 8 (12:00):
Where I see cricket heading. Not not for a while,
but but yeah, I do. I do see hitting that direction.

Speaker 2 (12:05):
Yeah, and just hearing you talk about that, it makes
me think about our domestic cricket competition, the New Zealand
domestic cricket competition. If the best players are all off
playing in India and other places, what might our domestic
competition look like in the future. You know, you're the nurstricts,
the districts, these teams.

Speaker 8 (12:22):
Yeah, I think I think there's still be windows and
chances for people to play there. But you know, ultimately
it's going to be a nursery to sort of bring
young talent through to then sort of get onto the
international stage. But the international stage being big domestic leagues
and so you know, yeah, look, but as I say,

(12:42):
it's a while off yet, but you know, for me,
it just seems inevitable that that's going to occur. And
that's why I think it's really important that also from
an Indian perspective, that you know, the riches that are
sort of gleaned from IPL sort of passed through and
support it in places like New Zealand where you know,
whether that be through academies, whether it's investment into the

(13:04):
game to bring the talent through. It's important that you know,
we have international talent or that they have international talent
to sort of boost their league and to have the
best players in the wild playing in it.

Speaker 2 (13:15):
Is it also inevitable Chris, that that more and more
players will opt out of New Zealand cricket contracts in
order to play franchise cricket and then I guess, you know,
make themselves available if and when required.

Speaker 7 (13:28):
Yeah, I totally agree.

Speaker 8 (13:30):
And you know, very much like a just on a
match free basis, so you know you'll have again sort
of like again like soccer, like football, you know, the
English players will play or are you paid for by
their by their league teams, but you know if they
play internationally as a match freek and so so yeah,

(13:52):
it just it just flips with regards to you know,
what the priority is and what what dominates, and so
that would just be the case, you know, for World
Cups or for any other matches, the players would simply
have a match a match.

Speaker 2 (14:04):
Parents all of these teas the franchise teams have have
a specialist coach. Do you have a view on splitting
the coaching responsibility between international formats.

Speaker 8 (14:17):
Yeah, again, that's I suppose it's excuse me, it's hard,
you know, you I think to have somebody giving that
much time up and what they're doing, you know, and
then sort of cutting their salary in half effectively to
sort of switch that over. I don't really think there's
a need for that in New Zealand and internationally. I think,
you know, we produce some pretty all round human beings

(14:40):
and I and I think from what Gary said, I
mean he can cut across all formats, and I think,
you know, New Zealanders would be more than capable of
being involved in multi formats and sort of maybe having
a couple of different changes and support stuff. But I
would support having the head coach across all formats.

Speaker 2 (14:55):
Do you think the future of Test cricket is still bright?

Speaker 7 (14:59):
Yeah?

Speaker 8 (15:00):
In the short term. Yeah, in the short term. But again,
if somebody is earning significant amounts of money contract wise
in the I p L, you know, why would they
jeopardize that that security, that future to sort of injure
themselves bowling thirty overs or forty overs in a Test match.
And you know, again, I just pose these points in

(15:22):
these questions because for me, it just it just seems
you know, a logical evolution of where this thing goes,
and that you know, somebody's not going to to to
injure themselves, you know, playing Test cricket when there's a
significant contract on offer, playing T twenty cricket. So so
you know, and you and you can't blame the players
for that at all. I mean, they need to look
after themselves and their families and their security and so

(15:45):
you know, that's the demands of Test cricket are the
ultimate in our sport. But again, the contracts and what's
on offer will dictate where where players go.

Speaker 2 (15:56):
Yeah, so are we only really a generation Chris away
from from a bunch of cricketers who never played Test cricket,
never play red ball cricket, will never pick up a
red ball.

Speaker 8 (16:05):
At all, because that that is a scenario, you know.
I mean, I'm a huge Test match cricket fan because
you know, again, like I said, it's the ultimate in
our sport. But it's you know, the sport comes down
to what the fans want and what the public want.
And you know, if that's T twenty cricket, well then
that's where the investment goes. And and again that's just

(16:27):
that's just the fact of life. And but you know,
I don't think we need to worry in the short term.
I still still think it there, but I think you're
right and in a generation, you know, we we could
well see the demise of it.

Speaker 2 (16:39):
So interesting, Well, I've got you to be remissing me
not to ask about your ongoing rehab. Saw some awesome
footage of your walking unaided in late April. How is
everything going, Yeah, it's.

Speaker 8 (16:49):
Good, thank you, it's Look, it's it's it's a challenge
every day, you know, and it's a new journey that
I'm on. And you know, this is this is by
far the biggest and toughest battle that I've ever faced
in my life. And and so you know, you just
have to yeah, you just just small games. It really
is just just a day by day thing. And you know,
will I walk again?

Speaker 7 (17:07):
I don't know. I don't know.

Speaker 8 (17:08):
But what I'm trying to do is give myself to
the opportunity to be in a position to be able
to do that. And with the technological advances and everything
that sort of goes with it and a stubborn attitude,
then you know who knows And look, that's and that's
you know, that's what I'm trying to do.

Speaker 2 (17:22):
Well, you've got a lot of Kiwi's chearing you on, Chris.
I can assure you of that answer. Look, I appreciate
your time talking cricket with us today. Thanks indeed for
awesome Thank you very much, Thank you very much, Chris,
Chris Kenes. There you've heard from Chris. Yeah, that went
a slightly different way than I thought it might. Actually,
you know, I wondered whether there might need be the
need for forensic examination of this T twenty campaign, but

(17:46):
clearly yeah, well, Chris, and this words it's an outlier.
Your chance to react though to what you heard? Anything
you want to pick up on, I'd love to chat
to you about it. Oh, eight hundred and eighty ten
eight are going to go open the lines now on
this in particular, I'd like to know what are the
planks for the way forward for our international me insight
for the black Caps. Now, let's approach this as as
I said before, in a solutions based fashion. I think

(18:09):
we've gone past the stage of bagging the players or
bagging the coach. Let's look ahead and in this ever
changing cricketing landscape, ask ourselves how we preserve our competitiveness
at international level? How do we do that? Oh, eight
hundred eighty ten eighty is our number. I wonder if

(18:29):
it's time for genuine change in the way we pick
our international cricket teams. And while there'll always be players
who can play all three formats, the proliferation of T
twenty franchise competitions has created a legion of T twenty specialists.
So rather than fight against that, why don't we just
embrace it. Let's pick a T twenty team that is

(18:54):
dedicated to playing T twenty cricket for New Zealand and
have others who play almost exclusively red ball or fifty
over stuff for us. Make it a clear delineation, and
that includes I reckon a specialist T twenty coach, someone
like Stephen Fleming, who's utterly immersed in the nuances of
the T twenty game through his time coaching Chennai, who

(19:16):
can show innovation, flexibility, the ability to adapt. Because that's
what T twenty cricket requires. Have our T twenty team
sit off to one side and act as a connected
but separate entity. Now, of course, I know this would
cause a few issues when it comes to New Zealand
Crickets Central contracting. But maybe that's where you say, Okay,

(19:40):
our contracts are for test and one day international players
and those players may or may not end up playing
some T twenty as well. But for our T twenty side,
we are quite happy to pick uncontracted players who are
specialists in traveling the world playing franchise T twenty cricket.
They don't get New Zealand contracts, but they can play

(20:01):
for New Zealand. In fact, we want them to play
for New Zealand. So you'd pick the likes of Trent Bolt.

Speaker 10 (20:06):
Now.

Speaker 2 (20:07):
I know he said that he won't play for New
Zealand probably again, and I get that. But someone like him,
someone like Jimmy Neisham, Colin Monroe, Martin Gupdel, Tim seiferd
you pick them for T twenty and at internationals, and
then you top the team up with players who you
need for the balance and probably ones who at least
play IPL and you would then have T twenty specialists

(20:28):
playing T twenty Creckitt in New Zealand, and I reckon
that would also improve the test in one day sites
give them a bit of rest, because if you want
to play all three formats at the moment, you basically
have to play cricket twelve months of the year and
that's not good for balance or really for the development
of your red ball game. I honestly believe the days
of three format players are coming to an end, and

(20:50):
rather than fight against that, I reckon we just embrace it,
blaze our own trail, rather than following what is already
becoming a trend in other countries. Oh, eight hundred and
eighty ten eighty would love to get your thoughts nine
two ninety two on text. How are you, Brian.

Speaker 11 (21:06):
Jason. I don't think I can add anything more to
what you've just said.

Speaker 2 (21:11):
Well, it's good to have your support, Brian. I love that.

Speaker 11 (21:14):
Yeah, because you know, looking at the games, I think
we all know now that Kane Williamson is not a
T twenty player. He's a very good Test player and
also one day when he's got time to mold his innings,
but not in T twenty. And also we need a freshness, Jason.

(21:41):
I think Gary said probably has done a good job
in some ways, but he just needs perhaps to step
aside now and let a fresh face come in and
with fresh ideas. But what you've just said about a
T twenty team as such is a wonderful idea. Someone

(22:03):
that can get in and hit the ball right from
the start. I mean, Finn Helen tries to do it
all the time, and he comes off now and again.
And also, Jason, I think you need to pick a
wiki keeper first who could perhaps get a few runs
if they needed that towards the end of an innings,

(22:25):
but not someone who's a good bat who can catch
the ball down again like Conway. It's too much. I
think it's too much pressure on him as well, although
he seem to hit a few decent balls for the
last one. But also the other thing is Cain wins them,
seems to want to when he wins the toss, wants

(22:48):
to field first. Jason, I always say, if the pitch
is quite good. You get the runs on the board
and then you adjust your bowling to keep them under
that score. But when the team gets a big score,
each going out is under pressure to get going, and

(23:10):
that doesn't always happen, as we've seen in the last
few weeks. Yeah, we could win the mat we could
win the tournament.

Speaker 2 (23:20):
We could you and I think you and I make
a great combination, Brian, I really do. I wonder whether
the I wonder whether the decision not to not to
bat first had had a bit to do with not
really knowing much about the conditions because they hadn't any
more mud games. But I take your point, didn't know.
I mean, I know it's a different form, but I
remember I think was Ian Chappell always said when he
was Captain of Australia. You know, if you win the
toss nine times out of ten, you're bat the tenth

(23:41):
time you think about bowling and you're still bad. Good
on your Brian, appreciate your time. Oh eight hundred and
eighty ten eighty twelve thirty is the time speed line
if you want to jump aboard. They've just started the
Australia Scotland game. Australia won the toss and have elected
to field first in that one will keep an eye
on that for you, and particularly with regard to the
fact that of Scotland win this game, then England go home.

(24:02):
They were good this morning though in a rain shortened
game it looked as tho rain would actually completely washed
their game against Nimbibia are out it didn't have got
reduced down to a ten over a side affair in
England when at twelves and then old Nimibia out recently
bold the map that restricted them in their ten over,
So they've done all they can, but they know that
of Scotland beat Australia, then they go home England. That

(24:23):
is quite a few texts coming through which I'll get
to in a moment, but I would like to hear
your thoughts in particular around that idea that I've just
put out there. Brian was a fan. You might be
a complete opponent to what I've said there, because I
know there are people who have not been fans at
all of Trent Bolt playing for New Zealand. They you know,

(24:43):
they make the point and it's a valid one that
he has made his mind up around what he wants
to do with the remaining years of his cricketing career
and therefore should be left to do that without you know,
being called back into play for New Zealand or or
I guess if you flip that, a lot of people
sort of think that's he's just picking and choosing. For me,
if you're playing T twenty cricket as your job around

(25:05):
the world, playing it every you know and every day,
but you're playing T twenty cricket almost exclusively in the
IPL and the Caribbean Premier League and Major League Cricket
in the US and all of the other ones that
are popping up, you're a T twenty specialist. So why
doesn't New Zealand Cricket take advantage of that and say, okay, cool,
we won't contract you, but you know, we'd love to
have you back, and we'll pay you X dollars a

(25:27):
match fee and then our central contracted list can be
focused on test players and one day international players. Look,
I know there are holes in my argument, and feel
free to pick those holes in it. Eight hundred eighty
ten eighty twenty eight away from one back in a moment.

Speaker 1 (25:42):
Don't get caught offside call eight hundred and eighty ten
eighty Weekend Sports with Jason Paine and GJ. Gunnobes, New
Zealand's most trusted home builder NEWSTALGSB.

Speaker 2 (25:52):
News talks the B twenty five to one eight hundred
eighty ten eighty as our number. I want to talk
some cricket with you and the way forward as far
as our different formats are concerned. Kind of outlined a
plan that I quite like. As I say, I know
there will be holes that you might like to pick inn,
but feel free to do that. Eight hundred and eighty
ten Eighty's just a quick update on Scotland against Australia.
Scotland batting first are four for the loss of one

(26:14):
and the second over. I only really mentioned it because
the man out is the brilliantly named Michael Jones. Michael
Jones is the only amazement for Scotland and he is.
He's out unfortunately bob By Asteneger for two, so he
hasn't risen to the heights of his name necessarily. I
think I can go to Jamie game mate, how are you?

Speaker 12 (26:35):
You're not too bad yourself?

Speaker 2 (26:37):
I'm very good, thanks Jamie.

Speaker 12 (26:39):
Yeah, yeah, I just think it. But this, yeah, probably
for a bit of support behind your idea. It definitely
does have a bit of merit. I just think of
the analogy between between rugby. You know, it's like back
in the day fifteens. You know, we're players that both
fifteens and sevens, and now it's pretty much separate. And

(27:02):
I think it's if cricket we could probably probably a
good idea of going down that same path.

Speaker 13 (27:09):
Pretty much.

Speaker 2 (27:10):
Great analogy, Jamie, It's one that's been made a couple
of times to be on text as well. But you're dead.
I remember the days of Cully and Joan Ohlama and
others playing, yeah, playing playing sevens and then going back
and playing fifteen's. In fact, I think for a while
at the Wellington Sevens there was a dispensation given for
players because the organizers of the Wellington Sevens wanted the
best New Zealand players there. They'd work out some sort

(27:32):
of some sort of system with you know, with the
super rugby coaches to get you know, two or three
of the best players as as headline acts if you like.
But it doesn't happen anymore, you don't, you know, the
top one hundred and forty players in the country play
Super rugby and then it's up to the it's up
to Tamasi Tharma to pick up the rest for sevens.

Speaker 12 (27:49):
Yeah, you know, I mean, and it's probably caused a
bit of controversy over the time, especially when it's when
it got to the Olympics. But but yeah, yeah, probably
think it's it's you'll probably see, yeah that those who
want to go and play cricket for T twenty it's
probably yeah, they can. They can in a bit of

(28:09):
money that way, and also yeah, freeze up our players
who wanted to who really want to play test cricket
and good probably yeah, yeah, so I'm quite I'm quite
keen on that idea. But whether they go for or
not go for with it or not, then he knows.

Speaker 2 (28:26):
Yeah, indeed, Jamie, thanks Mike, good to chat to you. Yeah,
there was Caleb Clark, wasn't it. He decided he would
go down the seven's route. He said, I'll take a
break from fifteen so I'll go down the seven's route
and try and get to the Olympics. And then the
end I don't think he was even picked, was he
for the sevens team? Has come back and has made
a really good first of his fifteen's career. Yeah, So
why why don't we just get Why don't we just

(28:50):
explore the idea of having specialists who uncontracted. If you
want a New Zealand cricket contract, you have to commit
to playing test matches and One day internationals for New Zealand. Right,
you have to say, right, I commit to those two
forms of the game for New Zealand. If you don't
want to do that, you'd rather chase the dollars around

(29:10):
the world. That's cool. In fact, it helps because under
this new system I'm going to call it the Brian
system because Brian is a big fan of it. The
T twenty players in our New Zealand black Caps T
twenty team are basically selected from those who do that
a travel around the world playing T twenty, so they're
good at it, they understand the nuances of it, they're

(29:32):
right up to date with the latest trends in the
game of T twenty. And then when they come back
and put a black cap on, we get the benefit
of that and we leave our test and one day
players to be on the contracted list. Again, as I say,
I'm sure there are holes in my argument. If you'd
like to pick them, please do so. Hello, Bob.

Speaker 9 (29:55):
Yeah, hey, Bonny, I totally agree with your concept about
the specialist T twenty team. I think that's really the
way to go.

Speaker 2 (30:09):
Oh good, Bob, I thought you I thought there was
a butt. I thought you were gonna say, but, but.

Speaker 9 (30:15):
There is a Okay. But I think it's fun. You've
got your head out of the sand about the Warriors,
because they're nothing. They no championship team. There's just a
mediocre middle of the ladder team and will be for
some time.

Speaker 2 (30:32):
Well they're not, though, Bob, are they? They They're not though,
are they? They made it to within a game or
two of the Grand Final last year.

Speaker 9 (30:39):
Well that means you're middle of the road.

Speaker 2 (30:43):
Yeah, I mean, I like, I know where you're coming from, Bob,
and I know they have trouble beating the Storm in particular,
and it's a it's a hoodoo that continues. I'll wait
and see. I think. I don't think I've got my
head in the sand on them. I I like the Warriors.
I'm realistic. I think about them. I know they've got
a lot of work to do if they are to

(31:04):
become a championship winning side. But I think they last year,
they've got raw materials. Let's see. But good to chet.
To you, Bob, and glad to like my idea about
the cricket Oh eight hundred and eighty ten eighty the
black Cap, says Stephen had lots of players playing in
the IPL, how can they be rusty? The yessue was
Stephen that most of them didn't really get a lot
of game time over there. A lot of those guys
turned up at this Cricket World Cup and hadn't played

(31:25):
cricket for a long time, not any form of it,
particularly no T twenty. But I get your point. Maybe
the real takeaway here, says GT, is never to disrespect Afghanistan.
We turned up obviously thinking we could use them as
a warm up for the West Indies and we got
punished for it. For a group of guys from an impoverished,
war torn country, what the Afghan team accomplished against millionaire

(31:48):
opposition is incredible. I give them great respect, Thank you GT.
A lot of people making the comparison with rugby test
rugby and seven's rugby that used to be an overlapping situation.
These days you choose one or the other, and I
think the I think the commonly held view is that

(32:10):
most most players growing up want to be part of
the want to be part of fifteen's. They aspire to
being all black in the fifteens game. But sevens is
also an option. You get to travel the world, you're
a professional player, male or female, you get to play
for Olympic gold. It's an option. As I've often said recently,

(32:34):
I've come to try and apply this filter to a
lot of sporting issues these days. Nothing should be off
the table. As we look to innovate, as we look
to accept change, as we look to chart the way forward.
Nothing should be off the table. Eighteen away from one,
We'll keep chatting cricket. OH eight hundred eighty ten eighty
back with more of your calls after this.

Speaker 1 (32:56):
The Voice of Sport on your Home of Sport Weekend
Sport with Jason Vain and GJ Gunners, New Zealand's most
trusted OH Builder News.

Speaker 2 (33:05):
Talk said quarter to one, Piney says, David, when are
you going to talk about the Chiefs outstanding performance last night?
I was at the game and they were simply outstanding.
I agree, David. I agree. That's why we've got coach
Clayton McMillan standing by after one o'clock to have a
chat to us. We're talking cricket till one. All right, divebo,
come on mate, you must have some holes to pick
in my idea.

Speaker 13 (33:26):
Ah look your idea has merit, mate, But I just
think what we're seeing is black Cat fans have had
a guts full of the T twenty in the summit
we had we had four nations come and play on
New Zealand chores, with the pinnacle being Australia. And what
we saw was and I think Williamson's hiding behind Stead.

(33:47):
We know that Stead couldn't run a bath littlone team,
and we saw Souley could play in game one and
but nine in game two in game.

Speaker 10 (33:54):
Three against the Aussies. And then we had.

Speaker 13 (33:57):
Ravenderick and play in game one and two but not
game three. So here we are one taking on the Aussies.
We almost beat them in game one at the captin
Bee Liva will funish game two in game three at
Eden Park where a debarcle. It's the debarcle. And then
nothing's changed As we prepared for this World Cup, arrogance

(34:17):
and pampered players, the tail wagging the dog. They arrive
at first class, you know, business class travel. They get pampered,
turned down warm up games.

Speaker 14 (34:29):
This is a habit.

Speaker 13 (34:30):
I mean when we lasted Australia, Piney, we turned down
warm up games for the tests over there got wallet free.

Speaker 2 (34:36):
Now that was terrible years and.

Speaker 13 (34:40):
I think if you get to the real core of it,
New Zealand Cricket's got a problem trying to attract a
separate coaches because I think talking to some of the
players behind the scenes, Poney that steads on about two
hundred and fifty k, maybe a bit more, maybe a
bit less. Daniel Battori for being a part time coach
with the Aussies is getting over three hundred heaven Tibetsu.

(35:01):
What McCallum's getting is the test coach for the Poms.
There's just no need to get a decent coach. We
need a different voice. We don't have the same coach
coaching three formats and the players are dictating they didn't
want a warm up game, pining, so they didn't get one,
some of them.

Speaker 2 (35:19):
Mitchell sent that. I came out to Dobbo, didn't he
and he said, look, it's been a chaotic build up.
We haven't had any games. I think some of the
players wanted to play.

Speaker 10 (35:25):
Twenty of players.

Speaker 13 (35:25):
The senior players didn't want one. And what's amazing, Pony,
was that the onlies had a warm up game where
there's support start.

Speaker 2 (35:33):
They had nine players. I don't vote.

Speaker 13 (35:35):
Why don't we have stead and all these other guys
come out and just allow a half? Doesn't that one
of a game just to make up the numbers.

Speaker 2 (35:43):
That's a great question, A great question.

Speaker 13 (35:45):
The horrible and I agree with you horses for courses Monroe.
He knew how to play on the West Indian tracks.
He should have been in the same. Oh, it's just
but when you predetermine another T twenty series like we
did with Australia in New Zealand, we hardly have them
here that players can play one of three games or
two or three games. We never have our best squad
to beast the team in a series. So they are

(36:08):
so fraught with issues it's laughable. It's a debarkle. And
the last thing, why are we wearing teal green? We
look at what we look like martians.

Speaker 2 (36:20):
Us Dominus of it. Unpack there mate, I'm glad I
gave you the chance to have a chat. Yeah, look,
this is why I'm trying to find a solution because
you're right, there are issues here, and much as Chris
Ken said, look, this is an outlier and T twenty
can be fickle and it's easy to lose games on
small moments. Maybe you're doing it to dig deeper and
look ahead. And Dobbo clearly is of the mind that

(36:42):
we do, and I agree, and that's why I'm trying
to come up with some sort of solutions based discussion here.
I honestly think there might be merit, and I definitely
think there's merit in having different coaches without question, but
maybe it's financial. If you if the figures that Dobbo
just told us it to be believed, then clearly, if

(37:04):
it's done on a pro rata basis, then you're asking
somebody to know to coach the black Cats T twenty
so for about eighty grand I mean, Steven Flem's probably
on ten times that, and the IPL has worked with Chennai.
Great to Chet Dobo. Always enjoy our conversation, Shllo Grant.

Speaker 15 (37:23):
Yeah, point a good idea about the twenty twenty selection.
Some other problems, so I will afford. In general, our
batting seems to be out the last few years since
to be our major problem seems to have coincided with
having a wicket keeper Luke Wonky as a batting coach.
Oldest of that for general discussion, I think, instead of

(37:47):
all the three formats, twenty twenty is he's not a
more autom I trying to say he's not as good
as he is, that the other format's good. It's meet
one guy as the other formats are twenty twenty. So
I think we definitely need a separate twenty twenty coach,
And I would say with Williamson, twenty twenty is his

(38:09):
least successful format depending on his form. I mean as batting,
you know, he's just not suited to twenty twenty. If
he's hitting the ball all over the place, then pick him.
But if he's not, then shock horror, don't pick him
in the twenty twenty team. And also, you know, I'm
sure someone else could do an equal job in twenty

(38:31):
twenty as a captain.

Speaker 2 (38:34):
Yeah, I think that day may well come at some stage.
Grant before came, Williamson calls time on his career. It
tends to be when players retire from a certain format,
they retire from the longer formats first in order to
elongate their careers and their money making opportunities at T
twenty level. I like at the feeling King Williamson will

(38:54):
still have a few years playing franchise cricket, particularly in
the IPL. But now the power hitters in T twenty
hour are striking at one sixty pretty much from ball one,
and apart from Finn Allen and Glenn Phillips to a
lesser extent, we don't have those players and so I
just like I say, I just wonder whether we need
to find specialists. Colin Munroe is a great example. He's

(39:18):
been on the franchise circuit for three or four years,
had the carrot dangled in front of him earlier this
year that if he went to Pakistan he might be
in contention for this World Cup squad couldn't go, And
whether that was the reason that he wasn't selected for
the World Cup we'll never know. But when I spoke
to him on the show a couple of three weeks ago,

(39:39):
he seemed to intimate that he was given a pretty
good indication that he was in the frame for the
T twenty World Cup, and then that rug was pulled
out from under him. I think Colin Munroe would have
been a really good I mean, hindsights a wonderful thing,
but Colin Munroy would have been a great addition to
this team. And Brian made the point. I think it
was right at the start of our chat on this

(40:00):
that you know have a specialist wicket keeper, but a
specialist T twenty wicketkeeper, a wicketkeeper also a power hitter.
And Devin Conway's a terrific bat Don't get me wrong,
He's a terrific batsman and I still think a terrific
T twenty batsman. He showed that in the IPL last season.
But he don't I just don't think he loves wicket keeping.
I don't think he even likes it. What about Tim

(40:22):
Seifert T twenty wicket keeper power hitter from Barie. I'm
a bit of a hypocrite because I think Trent Bowl
proves himself year and year out the best T twenty
comps in the world, the IPL side in the IPL,
so he deserves to be picked. But try and convince
me our best rugby players should be allowed to be
playing overseas and be picked. I can't see him being
good for New Zealand rugby not very different scenario, Barry.

(40:43):
We're talking about two different formats here, the rugby. The
rugby example is very different. We're talking two different formats here,
and I'll tell you what. There was a lot wrong
with New Zealand's campaign at this Cricket World Cup, but
Trent Bolts bowling was not one of those things. Seven
away from one News Talk saib.

Speaker 1 (40:59):
Breaking down the Hail Mary's and the epic fails weekend
Sport with Jason Lyin.

Speaker 7 (41:05):
You saw zed b.

Speaker 2 (41:07):
Just on four to one. Just to continue the Trent
Bolt point four overs two for twenty two against Afghanistan,
four overs three for sixteen against the West Indies and
four overs two for seven against Uganda, twelve overs seven
for forty five at an average of less than six
and a half per wicket and runs per over of
three point seven five. Trent Bolt certainly was not the
problem at this T twenty Cricket World Cup and I

(41:30):
feel it illustrates the point get T twenty specialists playing
T twenty cricket for New Zealand Chiefs coach Clayton McMillan
after one the.

Speaker 1 (41:39):
Only place for the big names, the big issues the
big controversies and the big conversations. It's all on Weekend
Sport with Jason Vain on your home of Sport News
Talk ZEDB.

Speaker 2 (41:56):
Hello one O seven. Its welcome into the show. Well,
welcome back to the show. As the case may be,
I'm Jason Pine Mark Kelly as executive producer. Today, I
want to talk to warriors this hour. What is it
about the Melbourne Storm? Why can't we beat them? I
mean it can't. Sixteen games in a row is a
long It's a long drought, isn't it. And I thought

(42:16):
last night fourteen knill ahead, I thought this could be ye,
the drought is breaking. Unfortunately wasn't to be the case.
We're gonna be out about that. Actually we'll take some
calls on that a bit later on the I want
to focus on the Super Rugby semi final last night
or earlier on in the evening afternoon kickoff if you
call it that. Four thirty five yesterday, Chiefs getting up

(42:36):
over the Hurricanes. James mccony this hour as well, with
his regular offerings on a Sunday updating you on some
live sport. Scotland going along quite nicely. Actually they're not
going Actually they are going along nicely. I was going
to say they're not going that good a clip, but
they're eighty four for one, Scotland batting first against Australia

(42:58):
and we're only in the ninth over, So what's it?
They're going at tens. George Munsey twenty eight night out
of twenty and Brandon McMullen. Brandon McMullin. I've heard of him,
didn't he he played? This isn't his first rodeo?

Speaker 16 (43:14):
Is it?

Speaker 2 (43:15):
Fifty one?

Speaker 7 (43:16):
Not?

Speaker 2 (43:16):
Out of twenty seven balls. He's at two fours and
five sixers. Brandon McMullen nearly a namesake of another power hitter.
Now I'll keep an eye on that for you Scotland. Remember,
if they win, we'll go through to the Super eight
and England will be going home. Nine past one, the

(43:37):
Chiefs have booked their spot in the twenty twenty four
Super Rugby Pacific Final against the Blues, beating the Hurricanes
thirty points to nineteen in yesterday's second semi and Wellington
and decepted by their tt.

Speaker 3 (43:49):
He's over halfway, he's over the ten, he's over the
twenty two, being chased hard at a great tackle by
Devin Flanders. It's still there for the Chiefs go out
towards the left and they will store in the corner
through Daniel Rona.

Speaker 15 (44:03):
Wallace.

Speaker 2 (44:03):
The tt has been massive tonight.

Speaker 3 (44:06):
He sprints at fifteen meters, tackled by Flanders, but they
recycled quickly.

Speaker 2 (44:11):
Daniel Rona and in the corner there. It was a
terrific performance from the Chiefs and Wallace Atiti. My days,
what a player. He reminds me of Sioni Lwaki the
way he plays the game. And he just seems to
have a tremendous future, doesn't he already? I see there
are calls for him to be fast tracked into the

(44:32):
All Blacks. I guess we and see there's some pretty
handy loose forwards going around and Brady and Joss has
had a good season. Two But Wallace Atiti last night crikey.
The Chiefs out to a fourteen mil lead after just
seven minutes. They led seventeen to seven at halftime. Both
both sides rather scored three tries in the game. The
difference a perfect goal kicking performance from Chiefs playmaker Damien McKenzie.

(44:56):
Three penalties as well as three conversions. The Chiefs also
played twenty minutes of the game with just fourteen men.
Yellow cards to Summer Penny Fenale for head to head
con tacked against TJ Petnada and Luke Jacobson for a
late tackle on Jordi Barrett. So the Blues will host
the Chiefs in next Saturday's final at Eden Park. Very

(45:19):
surely going to chat to Chiefs head coach Clayton McMillan
just quickly though. Damien McKenzie a standout last night. He
spoke briefly with our sideline I Matt Buck after the
final whistle to give his assessment.

Speaker 17 (45:31):
Yeah, it was tough.

Speaker 7 (45:33):
Probably commend our forwards.

Speaker 4 (45:35):
You know, last couple of games we've played them, we've
we've probably been beating up front and she's the boys
come out and fired right from the star. We had
a great start and then so absorbed the pressure under
forty men for a couple of times was outstanding.

Speaker 2 (45:46):
So our fords were awesome.

Speaker 4 (45:47):
I thought we kicked well, put pressure on throracticking game
and then come with us some good points and just
proud of the Aphit's on defense, this championship defense.

Speaker 2 (45:54):
And hope for we Gontas next week Damien.

Speaker 17 (45:57):
The kicking game, you talked about a lot of aerial
ping pong. Did that plan into your hands? Do you
enjoy that you were kicking the ball?

Speaker 16 (46:02):
Well?

Speaker 17 (46:02):
But were you surprised so much ball? The Hurricanes kick
back to.

Speaker 4 (46:05):
You a lot of threats back during their back three,
and you know when you come down to the Cayton,
the ones around you just don't know what the one's
really doing. So I guess it's about putting us in
the right ears of the field. You know, our Fords
has done a lot of work, so we want to
keep the ball in front of them, and I thought
we did a really good job of that tonight and
our kickchasing is excellence. Putt them under pressure with their
back three are very dangerous, so very happy.

Speaker 17 (46:25):
You look very happy as well. There's a couple of
quick ones before I let you go and join your teammates.
You've got a pretty hot number eight running around at
the moment, haven't you made?

Speaker 4 (46:32):
He's outstanding. He's he's a young kid, he's he's he's
still learning them, but he's sat right right into his
role this year and every week he keeps standing up and.

Speaker 2 (46:41):
He's got a bright future ahead. Of him and he's
a big part of our team.

Speaker 17 (46:44):
We're going to need him next week.

Speaker 2 (46:45):
There's Damien mckinns who will leave it there with Matt
Buck's side on because Clayton McMillan joins us on weekend Sport.
Thanks for taking the time, Clayton after the overnight Test.
How pleased dare you with last last night's performance?

Speaker 18 (47:00):
You're finding it pretty pretty good mate. He's always going
to be a really tough ass to go down and
been a quality Hurricanes team in Wellington. A lot of
teams have gone down there in the past and failed
and was really satisfying to get the result and we
look forward to another week.

Speaker 2 (47:19):
How crucial was your fast start to build a bit
of scoreboard pressure on them.

Speaker 18 (47:26):
Yeah, we talked about as part of our build up
around trying to generate some early momentum. We kind of
felt that, you know, watching the Hurricanes a week before
against the Rebels, it looked a little bit tighter than
they had been throughout the throughout Paul play, and that
comes from being the team that everyone's chasing and then

(47:47):
that expectation at home to keep winning. So it was
important for us to start well and we run a
few opportunities which we we we nailed and you know,
we really didn't really relinquish the lead from that point on.

Speaker 2 (48:00):
Can you just expand on that a bit. You said
it in the post match as well, that you sensed
some anxiety and the Hurricanes went over the Rebels in
their quarter final last weekend. How did you factor that
into your game preparation for us today?

Speaker 18 (48:17):
We're just we just understand from having been in a
similar situation feeling recently around how that expectation can you know,
way heavy on your mind at times, and and we
just saw little things in their game that weren't really
consistent with what we saw through pool play. So and

(48:38):
it's just that's natural that just that just happens to Tens.
We felt it, and it's as why, as I said
last night, you take your head off to a team.

Speaker 10 (48:47):
Like the Crusaders, who everybody's.

Speaker 18 (48:50):
Been chasing over the last seven or eight years, and
they managed to skip keep pointing away. Look, we just
we had to create some pressure really for them to
feel uncomfortable and to potentially be chasing the game.

Speaker 10 (49:03):
And that's what I'm folded.

Speaker 2 (49:05):
Do you see anything some are in the Blues.

Speaker 10 (49:11):
Now the Blues are probably at the other end of
the spectrum.

Speaker 18 (49:13):
I think they're pretty confident with the way they've been going,
and they were they were pretty impressive around how they
went about their business against the Brumbies, another extremely tough
place to go and win.

Speaker 10 (49:24):
Eden Park.

Speaker 18 (49:26):
Blues playing a very direct, competive game and even though
they've had their fair share of injuries, they really care
on how they want to play and every player that
steps up as has been delivering for them. So it's
but we won't have to do too much work to understand,
you know, how they're going to play the game, what

(49:46):
they're going to throw at us on the weekend. But
it's a it's a challenge that we're relishing.

Speaker 2 (49:53):
You lost both of your hookahs last night, Summersny Tokyo
who limped off on the first half, Bradley Slater in
the SEC and any update you can give us on
those two.

Speaker 18 (50:04):
It's not looking great for SUMMASONI. He's got a an
ac kill's injury that looks looks like it's going to
be pretty serious, which is unfortunate not just for us
but for him and and probably has all but prospects
of less.

Speaker 10 (50:17):
Than the immediate future and Bentley Slater are still a
little bit of an unknown.

Speaker 18 (50:22):
We're hopeful that he will know just a minor MCL
that will sort of loosen up and with a couple
of roles of strapping tape, he might be able to
get back out there next week. But we've got young
Tyrone Thompson who's been been a great performer for us
over the last two or three years. He's been sitting
in the wings waiting for his opportunity and there will

(50:42):
get it.

Speaker 10 (50:42):
On the weekend.

Speaker 2 (50:44):
Sean Stevenson a late withdrawal from yesterday's game. Will he
be okay for the final?

Speaker 17 (50:48):
Do you think?

Speaker 18 (50:51):
Yeah, well, he's a much stronger chance. So they trained
all week with us, but it just wasn't quite at
one hundred percent. Didn't want to compromise the team, and
you know, we made a tough decision to leave him out.
But the silver lining is that he's is potentially going
to be in a better space this week. And you

(51:11):
know there's another experienced body that would love to have
running out with us on the weekend.

Speaker 2 (51:17):
Wallace Satiti turned a lot of heads last night, in fact,
not just last night, He's been doing that right across
the season. What have you made of his progress as
a Super Rugby player this season?

Speaker 18 (51:30):
Are pretty rapid, But we always were confident that he
had a lot of potential, a very high ceiling.

Speaker 10 (51:40):
Mean, to be fair, probably never really expected.

Speaker 18 (51:42):
Him to deliver the sort of performances that he's been
able to deliver for us on a consistent basis since
he has given us first opportunity in about round five
of Super Rugby this year. But look, he's a smart
young man, real real mature here on his shoulders, massive

(52:02):
appetite for learning, and just a genuinely good human sook.
He's got all the physical attributes, he's got the mental
attitude to.

Speaker 10 (52:13):
Go a long way in the game.

Speaker 18 (52:14):
He's still young men with things to learn. But he's
certainly certainly putting himself in the shop window.

Speaker 2 (52:22):
That's for sure. That's for sure. He had a couple
of guys go to the bin last night, Clayton. There
was also an incident that appeared to annoy you, actually
involving t J Petnada and Wallace to Titi, Is it
the inconsistency that is most frustrating for you in these things?

Speaker 10 (52:38):
Yeah, it is.

Speaker 18 (52:39):
It is to be fair, and I wouldn't be the
only coach that probably gets a bit frustrated that I
guess the inconsistency of how some of these tackles have
been officiated, and that pains to point out last night,
there and nothing against you know, the referees and the
TMO that made decisions last night, Like we all will

(53:02):
live and die by the sword of decisions that they
have made on the night.

Speaker 10 (53:05):
You just live with them and move forward.

Speaker 18 (53:06):
But it's just so hard made us, I reckon we
you know, we've we've put ourselves in a position where
we just don't know what a penalty is, what a
yellow card is, what a red card is, what mitigation
looks like from one instance to the next, and and
no one wants to get those decisions wrong. But the

(53:27):
fact that we can't have a number of people sit
in the room and collectively come out with some agreement
around what, you know, what each scenario looks like, is
probably just something that needs to be talked through by
people that get back a lot more money than me
at some stage, because you can, as we can, have

(53:48):
a big impact on the outcome of games.

Speaker 2 (53:52):
I think a lot of our listeners are nodding their
heads as we as we speak after Friday nights, when
Blues coach for and Corder, who I know you know well,
was asked if he'd rather play the Chiefs or the
Hurricanes in the final, he said, that's like choosing between
cholera and the plague. So which one do you reckon?
You guys are.

Speaker 10 (54:11):
Wow, he's he's a good man, and he's you know,
he's an experience an experienced coach that he's got a
good way with words. I don't care which.

Speaker 18 (54:23):
One we are or We'll just bring the best version
of ourselves and we'll hope that you know, that will
cause them a few problems and then we get our
fist year of access into the game and give them
something to think about.

Speaker 10 (54:34):
So big week for both teams.

Speaker 18 (54:37):
I've had the advantage, I guess, of having an extra
day's recovery, and after we're we're pretty banged up at
the moment to be to be really transparent, a lot
of claire or damage after last night.

Speaker 10 (54:48):
So I imagine our week will look a little bit different.

Speaker 18 (54:50):
It will largely be about just getting the bodies right
and the mind's right, and and you know that that
won't necessarily look like us, have been out on the
rugby field for long periods of time trying to put
a plan together to take on the Blues.

Speaker 2 (55:05):
So apart from summer Sorney, is there anybody who's definitely
out next week?

Speaker 10 (55:12):
I mate this. Yeah.

Speaker 18 (55:13):
I don't want to speculate too much at this stage,
but I'd say that there's probably about five guys out
of the last night they've played the last night's game,
they've got a definite question mark around there available to
play this week.

Speaker 2 (55:26):
Jeepers. All right, well, I'll let you get into the
recovery room with them and start doing what you need
to do just before, just before you go, I do
want to thank you for your access you gave us
both here today but also on here last night. It's
not every head coach you'll join a radio broadcast before
a game and also at halftime. Clayton, we greatly appreciate that.
All the best for the week ahead and for the
Grand Final as well.

Speaker 10 (55:46):
Mate, Yeah, no worries. Thank you very much.

Speaker 2 (55:51):
All the best, Clayton McMullan, head coach of the Chiefs
with a big week ahead of him, a second success
of Grand Final for the Chiefs up against the Blues.
That is interesting what he said at the end of this.
I definitely no Summer Sauny talkie A. That's that's a
given Kelly's problem. He's out and may well be out
of the initial test matches for the All Blacks as
well against England and then Figi. So that's another little

(56:13):
head scratch if for Scott Robertson as he plans for
his first tests as All Blacks head coach, he names
that side. Incidentally, a week tomorrow a thirty two man
squad will be named a week tomorrow Monday the twenty
what will that be, the twenty fourth of June five
point thirty in the afternoon, and he's going to do
it in christ Church, which is probably fair enough seeing

(56:36):
that's where he's from. But yeah, he won't be able
to pick Summer Sauny Trkiyah Cody Taylor, you have to think,
is a dead shot for one of the hooker's spots,
but without Tokiya Hoole there and a Safaoar Moore has
to be moving firmly into that frame if he wasn't
there already, And then you start thinking to yourself, who
is the third hooker in a thirty two man squad.

(56:57):
If Takiyaho's not there, who's your third hooker? If a
Safawar Moore is indeed the second, which I think he
probably is. At eighty ten eighty, anything that you heard
from Clayton McMillan, Now, I really really like Clayton McMillan.
I must say. I really like the way that he
goes about things, just very considered, but makes good logical points,

(57:19):
coaches that team terrifically well, obviously has the respect of
his fellow coaches and all of those players too. And yeah,
just just listening to him there and also having the
chance to listen to him in the postmatch media conference
in Wellington yesterday, it's it's obvious just what a quality
coach and a quality human being he is. I eight

(57:43):
hundred eighty ten eighty want to talk chiefs with you. Look,
Chiefs fans, can you can ring up and give it
to me if you like? You know that I'm a
Hurricanes fan. You know I'll be a bit gutted today.
Feel free to kick me when I'm down, That's okay,
happy for you to do that, or just luxuriate in
the win and the reasons for it. What did you
see in that game that gave the Chiefs the edge.

(58:04):
I eight hundred eighty ten eighties out him nine two
ninety two. If you would prefer to send us a text,
we're back with your calls on the rugby after this.

Speaker 1 (58:12):
The big issues on and after fields call oh eight
hundred and eighty ten eighty weekends Forward with Jason.

Speaker 7 (58:18):
Fain and GJ.

Speaker 1 (58:19):
Gunnerholmes, New Zealand's first trusted home builder.

Speaker 7 (58:22):
News talks a baby.

Speaker 2 (58:23):
One twenty six four border course to get to, but
just before I do, a couple of text hype piney,
can anyone tell me why TJ. Peinada wasn't yellow cardiff
that head on head contact. His expression afterwards was a
worried one, as he knew he'd made contact head on head.
I think that's what Clayton McMillan was saying, that we
just don't know, you know, we don't know what is
and what isn't a yellow carter red carter penalty. There

(58:46):
just seems to be no consistency that can be applied
across a range of different incidents. And I know they're
all different, but there doesn't You could see Clayton's expression
in the box when he'd already had a couple of
guys for different incidents yellowcarded and then that one went unpunished. Yeah,
he's right to be confused by that. And from this
Blues and Pinty perfect result from Blues country home final.

(59:09):
Injuries are plenty and key position for an opposition that
potentially played their final last night. Happy days. Yes, I
think the Blues will be rightful favorites. Right, let's get
to the calls. Hello, Mark, hey.

Speaker 19 (59:21):
Pay, how many days of morning do you have after
the loft last night?

Speaker 2 (59:26):
Yeah, it'll few. The funny thing is, though, Mark, it's
not funny necessarily, But you know, the curious thing is
that I think at the start of the season, if
you said to me, little Hurricanes are are going to
host a semi final on a bit in your hand
off for that, But now that they did it and
couldn't quite take the step to the final, you feel
a bit gutted, you know.

Speaker 1 (59:46):
Oh.

Speaker 19 (59:46):
I was at the game and I thought the young
players are a bit overalled with the occasion. To be honest,
I thought, yeah, Love especially had a pretty bad game
when he's been pretty good all season. And I think, yeah,
the pressure they did a good job and putting pressure
on our backs all the time, and there's only so
much JORDI could do it.

Speaker 10 (01:00:04):
I thought, yeah, they just.

Speaker 19 (01:00:05):
Now play us in the back line and they had
their pressure cause the mistakes and yeah, and I mean
I didn't have any excuses the Hurricanes in the end,
they had two players, you know, two players seeds off
on unquestionable goals. Although it didn't stop me yelling off as.

Speaker 2 (01:00:22):
I thought I could hear you. I thought I could
hear you.

Speaker 19 (01:00:26):
Yeah, no, I mean it was it was quite a
disappointing game. But yeah, I just think the young players
and I mean, if you look at the experience, I
thought d Matt kad an outstanding game. I thought he
was just a class player on the field and he
showed his experience in that game and I think that
was probably the difference maker in the end. But yeah, yeah,
it was pretty disappointing. But yeah, I guess this next year.

(01:00:47):
And yeah, and it's for the hooker. I reckon Ricket
telling it would be more firm. Well, I think he
said an outstanding you. With the Blues this year, he
has been one of their top traw scores.

Speaker 2 (01:00:57):
Yep, it has to be in the frame has to
be in the frame, Mark, You're right, yeah, others. I mean,
Kurt Ecklin's up there as well in Blues Country, of course,
but I think Ricketel he's kind of been preferred to him. Yeah,
but yeah, I mean, when you're the starting hooker for
the team that is going to host the Grand Final,
then yeah, surely your names in the conversation, right, Oh.

Speaker 10 (01:01:17):
Absolutely.

Speaker 19 (01:01:18):
And I think he's grown as a player since leaving
the Hurricanes. And I think I think, you know, looking
at the final, there's a lot of players that are
really performing well in the Blues this year. And I
mean I think that game against the Bumbies, they sort
of won the game in the first sort of twenty
and thirty and then almost took the foot off and
sort of whether the stormer, but that always did their
game under control. And I think if the Blues can

(01:01:41):
play as well as they can for say forty or
fifty minutes of the final, I think they probably should
be I think they will be favorite. Actually, you have
quite considerable favorite to the TBO imagine.

Speaker 2 (01:01:52):
Yeah, I agree with you.

Speaker 13 (01:01:53):
Mark.

Speaker 2 (01:01:53):
Good to chat to you, mate, as far as Morning
is concerned. You, I mean, yeah, I think we're allowed
to be a bit disappointed, aren't we. I think every
team and fans of every team you know, are allowed
to be disappointed when their team gets not I'm sure
Brumby's fans felt exactly the same way Saturday morning. Okay, yeah,
I'm gutted. I wanted my team to go through, but
I'm sure that Chiefs fans are delighted. I've already heard

(01:02:15):
from many of them this morning. I have to say
here's another one. Good Mark.

Speaker 14 (01:02:22):
Hello, Piney.

Speaker 20 (01:02:22):
I'm glad the game didn't go the extra time, mate,
because your voice was sounding pretty good.

Speaker 13 (01:02:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:02:28):
Yeah, I don't know how it would have lasted.

Speaker 20 (01:02:29):
Make you're right now, just a couple of things, was
my prediction sort of right? With the two players dominating
the game last night?

Speaker 2 (01:02:39):
Well, I think Damian Mackenzie had a terrific game. I
thought Jordi Barrett was good as well, but I think
Damien Mackenzie certainly outplayed Brett Cameron in the Battle of
the Tens.

Speaker 20 (01:02:50):
Yeah, okay, Now, can I quickly go back to the
twenty twenty Piney?

Speaker 2 (01:02:54):
Yes, all blacks?

Speaker 20 (01:02:56):
Where do they originate from?

Speaker 14 (01:02:58):
Originally?

Speaker 13 (01:03:00):
High school?

Speaker 2 (01:03:01):
Yes?

Speaker 20 (01:03:03):
Do the high schools have a twenty twenty competition, because
that's where all our talent's going to come from, isn't it.

Speaker 2 (01:03:09):
Well, I know more and more secondary schools are playing
ten twenty cricket. Yes they are.

Speaker 20 (01:03:14):
Okay, that was just yeah, this made us crossed my
mind when I was listening before.

Speaker 10 (01:03:18):
I agreed that I agree with everything you said about it.

Speaker 20 (01:03:21):
But that is where the talent comes from, isn't it
from from high school?

Speaker 2 (01:03:25):
Yeah? Yeah, Well you look at the we're certainly in rugby.
You look at the first for den competitions around the
country and the high quality rugby that's being played. And
look it used to be in my day, Mark, my
day you went from you know, high school to club,
then to province, then to super rugby. Well, these days
the club's almost being skipped out and in some cases
the provinces being skipped out as well.

Speaker 13 (01:03:46):
Look at the boys that have come from road boys high.

Speaker 16 (01:03:49):
Yep, and I think there's quite a few in.

Speaker 2 (01:03:52):
There, absolutely, Mark, good to chat. May Yeah, Look, it's
a it's one little bubble along And like I said
when we chatted about it last hours, I'm just looking
for solutions. Really, just want to be a solutions based
conversationalist around this. How do we chart the way for
good to chat to you?

Speaker 16 (01:04:07):
Mate?

Speaker 2 (01:04:08):
As always? Can I film.

Speaker 21 (01:04:11):
Oney black armbands all round today?

Speaker 13 (01:04:14):
Is it?

Speaker 2 (01:04:15):
I don't have mine on, no, but it's not far away.
I'm wearing one a should we say metaphorically speaking, I'm
wearing one?

Speaker 21 (01:04:24):
Oh well, mate? It a feel for you? You love
your team? Can I touch on a few things I
didn't get in earlier? And I wanted to have a
comment about the cricket as well, and about the the
rugby and the Warriors, So I would it feel right
to give a quick comment on all three?

Speaker 2 (01:04:44):
You go for it?

Speaker 13 (01:04:45):
Phil?

Speaker 21 (01:04:46):
Okay?

Speaker 16 (01:04:47):
Cool? Can you hear me?

Speaker 21 (01:04:47):
You're right becase I've just got my phone on my knee.

Speaker 2 (01:04:50):
I can hear you, find mate? I can hear you?

Speaker 13 (01:04:51):
Fine?

Speaker 21 (01:04:52):
Excellent? Yeah, no, Chris kens As at the start of
your show made me think about some things with the
cricket that I never even considered or thought about for
the future. And because I'm a sports lover cricket fan
for they the works, you know. So yeah, I think
your ideas, Your thoughts and ideas are spot on about

(01:05:13):
having a separate tea specialized T twenty team you know,
I think that is the way to go forward in
the future. And I think I wanted to say too
about I think it was LT said about I also
have separate coaches, you know, specialized coaches rather than one
coach coach in the whole three formats. That goes forward,

(01:05:34):
like having a specialized T twenty team. And I think
it was l T said about I think the black
Cats they took Afghanistan too lightly and they didn't realize
how good Afghanist down are, you know, and so they
didn't give them the respect that they deserved, you know,
and sort of and that's where they where their downfall
might have been with that. Now that the Warriors last night,

(01:05:59):
the Melbourne I had a few drinks last night, some
struggling during Heber actually a lot of the game, but
I can remember the start of it and I looked
at the Warrior's side, you know, when they put the
names up on the TV, and I thought, geez, we've
got a great team, Cheese, that's a good team, you know,
name after name, and then then the Melbourne Storm goes
and beats them, and like you, like you said, the

(01:06:21):
first forteen we forteen up, you know, in the first
fifteen ten minutes, I thought it changes, but then the
old Melbourne storm just all class came back, got a
couple of Troyes and again one of those freakish ones
in the corner remosistion of the earlier first round when
they beat us, And yeah, they're just too good. The

(01:06:42):
old Melbourne is only just too good a class a team.
You know, whether or not the Warriors will beat them.
I suppose at some stage they will do, because the
Warriors can beat the best teams and then they can
lose to the worst teams. But that sort of thing
they do.

Speaker 2 (01:06:56):
If they play like if they play like they do,
if they play like they did in the first fifteen
twenty minutes for even sixty minutes, they will, I mean
one day they'll beat them. So one day they'll beat them. Yeah,
I just I just hope it take another fifteen games.

Speaker 21 (01:07:10):
Yeah, now with the with the with the you agree with.
Now with the Chiefs in the Canes last night, you
beloved Canes. Jeez, what a great game. And yeah McKenzie
was outstanding. And I think where the Canes got beaten
was with the forwards and the and the chiefs. They

(01:07:32):
just bet them bet the canes at the breakdown, and
that their forwards were outstanding and they made the canes.
They rattled them, you know, and forced them into eras
like about three forward passes when the guy was running
down the sideline. But I think that was just brought
about because of the pressure and rattled them and made
them look not as good a sight as the as

(01:07:53):
they really are. So I think that was all brought
about for the forward pressure and the outstanding themat game.
And that that young fellow at number eight, is it
that he's gonna I wouldn't be surprised if he gets
fast tricked into the All blacksil raised or have his
eye on him, I reckon. So we just forget his name,
but he was outstanding, you know in the Only twenty
one or something.

Speaker 2 (01:08:13):
So yeah, he was good Wallace to Titi is his name, Phil,
And you're right, he is a terrific prospect. Like I say,
he kind of reminded me and the way he used
to play the late uh and yeah, look just so powerful,
so exciting to watch, a lot to learn, as Clayton
mcmilland said, But yeah, well we'll watch with interest. Thanks

(01:08:34):
for your call. Film always enjoyed chatting Hello, Hayden, you mate, Hey.

Speaker 16 (01:08:39):
Can you hear me there?

Speaker 2 (01:08:40):
I can?

Speaker 22 (01:08:41):
Hey, So he did the game last night? Okay. We
had sort of sem rate kIPS from the wire ever
that played jav and we Geral to support the games
last night. It was what I was was this sort
of a bit disappointed and there's sort of the whole
in atmosphere edicated to last night just the terms of

(01:09:07):
the thoughts for the team only had I don't know
how many was there, but it was there was a
reasonable change of the stadium that there was a fall,
and just other things in terms of the way the
stadium was run, you know, like there was no.

Speaker 10 (01:09:21):
Go on.

Speaker 22 (01:09:22):
The PA wasn't doing anything to encourage the crowd to
get behind the hurricane. If you understand what it means.

Speaker 2 (01:09:31):
I do understand what you mean, and you know.

Speaker 22 (01:09:34):
Look and the other thing that was really sort of
disappointed me was out the game was the length of
players that were prepared to sign, that were prepared to
hang around and sign for stuff for the kids. Like
I didn't understand. But through the whole season they've had
the kids going there where they you know, they've met

(01:09:56):
the kids onto the field to have the signing and that,
and there was none of that last night.

Speaker 2 (01:10:03):
I thought that was interesting to Hayden, and part of
me thought, you know what, players after a gutting loss
like that probably just seek the sank, the sanctuary of
the changing room. However, I know that other sports teams
and the Hurricanes are included in this, still normally have
signing sessions after a game, win, lose, or draw. So

(01:10:24):
I did think that was interesting last night. I saw
I saw a few players, I must say, from both sides,
you know, going over and seeing seeing some fans, but
you're right, there wasn't that big lineup that they normally
have at the southern end.

Speaker 22 (01:10:37):
Yeah, and you know, we've got to share his signatures
and stuff like that. Was lucky enough to get sufferers
boats and the way that you know, the ones that
make the efforts to come out, and the way they
conducted themselves and in direct us with outstanding.

Speaker 2 (01:10:53):
Did you say he got one of his boots?

Speaker 22 (01:10:55):
Yeah, they asked them, but yeah, good, Yes, they asked
him for his paying boats and he said, hey, mad pardon,
it's already our obligations to give these boots to someone else.
And and my kids are very well minted. And they said, oh, well,
that's great, thank you.

Speaker 19 (01:11:13):
And then he said, hang on a.

Speaker 22 (01:11:15):
Minute, mate, I'll run down to the changing room. I'll
keep us Papa for you. Make your way out of
the time and I'll hand them to you and the
shine them for us. And it was, you know, highlight
of them because at the start of the rugby collection
of memorabilia, which was which was really.

Speaker 10 (01:11:31):
Nice of us.

Speaker 2 (01:11:32):
That is brilliant. And the other thing as well, Hayden
as I'll remember that long long after they forget the
result of this game, right.

Speaker 22 (01:11:40):
And just in terms of the game, it was, you know,
in that last ten minutes there where the Hurricanes had
four or five turnovers there, so we were where it's
start and then behind behind the goalposts there and we'll
sitting there watching the game going, hang on, we've got
five or six boards in the backline here and we're

(01:12:02):
losing these turnovers. Boy was almost bike and a lot
of those guys were reserved boards. And it was the
body language was that they had already given up. And
you know Krety was the prime example there. He was
standing right out on the way. Creek is a great player.

(01:12:25):
I don't trying to knock the boys at all, just
in terms of there, you know, ten minutes, thirty two tries.
You know they still they still had more than enough
opportunities to win that game, and you know, I just
didn't understand the mindset of those players at the stage.

Speaker 2 (01:12:45):
Thanks for your Col Hayden, awesome story about the boots,
and thanks for your analysis of the game too. I
already appreciate it. Nineteen away from two, when we come back.
James mconie in his regular Sunday Slot.

Speaker 1 (01:12:55):
One crutch Hold Engage Weekend Sports with Jason Hym and GJ.
Gunner Homes New Zealand's first trusted home builder News talks
of baby.

Speaker 2 (01:13:05):
Just sixteen to two. James mcconey, as usual on a
Sunday Super Rugby titled Town Hamilton, James.

Speaker 16 (01:13:13):
Oh can you can you? You can dream it? But
it's I've already been hit once. Then in fact, last
year it's just the memory. I would kill for Moo's boots,
but how good amazing. But last year all I did
is get a bit of an interesting conversation with the

(01:13:35):
Barrett family who were loving it. And then Razor did
a breakdowance in front of me and I was there.
I struggled with that.

Speaker 2 (01:13:41):
I've got to say, well, there's no danger of that
this year, and I don't really Neither Veron Cotta or
Clayton McMillan strikes me as the is the type to
do the worm or or a headspin or what even
they calling it these days. I have to say that
I was so impressed with the Chiefs yesterday. I thought
they were They were terrific against the case.

Speaker 16 (01:14:02):
Yeah, I totally agree as another step up, wasn't it.
You know, felt like they might have been peeking at
the right time at least being able to pick a
team that they felt was their burst of team. But
that game was hectic, brutal, fragmented even but highly entertaining.
And two things, let's get it out of the way.
Wallace ATSI had a blinder and the TMO was blind.

(01:14:25):
But we should start with Wallace because before that game
he was a boltipo the All Blacks. Now he's going
to be hard to leave out and probably like you,
I was a big fan of his dad, Semott played
mainly blindside for Wellington and the King of course the
captain Manu Samoa. And the one thing I can tell
you about the Satti family loved to defend the faster

(01:14:46):
than you think.

Speaker 2 (01:14:48):
Well, Wallace Titi when he sprinted away to set up
that try for Daniel Rohner, my goodness, well he just
you might have heard me say. I mean he's like lack,
isn't he in the way that he plays?

Speaker 16 (01:15:01):
Yes, yeah, exactly, He's got great feats And I mean
it was just a vital play. The game was close
to him, wasn't it. Was it twenty fourteen when yes, yes,
that's so. Ye, Jordi was in the gap. I mean
it was just all or nothing play from Wallace. But
back to the TMO briefly, I'm not here to I mean,

(01:15:21):
I thought Summer Pennies tackle on females tackle on TJ.
Perrina looked like it was sort of head to shoulder
blake contact. Maybe maybe head to head, but like it's debatable.
But then after TJ. Pernada was defending upright and close
heads with Titi, as you've touched on. Not to not
even penalize that, I think shows that the whole system

(01:15:43):
is a bit broken there. And I even reckon Luke
Jackinson's late tackle on Jordi Barrett was a penalty only.
But hey, you know it's easy to talk about it
now after the Chiefs won.

Speaker 2 (01:15:52):
Well, the fact we are talking about it just proves
the point. Hey, just back to the back to the
number eight? Then are we talking about sotutu or satiti?
Is that what we're talking? Is that what we're talking
You should come up with a song about that.

Speaker 16 (01:16:06):
It's a sort of son that could get me canceled.

Speaker 7 (01:16:08):
In some things.

Speaker 16 (01:16:08):
But let's do it anyway. If you do it, tokokomo
to tt oh, you know, like that sort of thing.
You need to give me some time, but I'll come
up with something for you.

Speaker 2 (01:16:23):
No, well, I gave you teen I gave you teen seconds.
You've already come up with a hook magnificent.

Speaker 10 (01:16:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 16 (01:16:29):
Yeah, So I think, like, what's the game up for me?
Was Peter lark I running the ball back so fast
and then slipping so that his head hit with Nito
Arkhoy in the knee and it was so out of control,
but the referee couldn't do anything about it. It was
just madness at that point. And so the intensity is

(01:16:49):
what I I guess I loved about that game. A
great advertisement for the game would.

Speaker 2 (01:16:55):
The Chiefs be your favorite team of all the teams
you follow.

Speaker 16 (01:17:00):
Yes, Pioney, I think I sent you a little question
saying who's your top four? Because for me, I think
in every listener out there, if you're in your car
or wherever you are, thinking who are the teams that
you know? I will make sure I watch the kids
that affects my day, and the Chiefs are right up
there with me and for me and my top four
with White Cuts or rugby men and women Chiefs, White

(01:17:21):
Cuts or Auckland University rugby clubs up there in my
top four and probably Hamilton Boys High my old school,
mainly rugby and possibly rowing, and so at this time
of the year it's quite hard to they're all sort
of three of those teams that are all in action,
so it's quite tough.

Speaker 10 (01:17:39):
Who's your top four?

Speaker 16 (01:17:39):
Painting well, I think.

Speaker 2 (01:17:41):
The Phoenix have become my top one, both men and women.
I just don't ever see a time where I would
miss a game for any good reason. From those two,
the Hurricanes I've watched since ninety six and will until
the end of time. I feel my football club is
Tawa Tawa AFC, and I would never miss a game
of the Tawer College Senior A basketball team, mainly because

(01:18:03):
my son's and that team, so it would be you know,
parentally irresponsible for me to miss one of their games.

Speaker 16 (01:18:10):
I thought you chose that because maybe you were, you know,
nine for your impressive slam dunks in the in the
early nineties. But hey, it's all right, matey. I actually
think that there's you know, like I love the Wellington
Phenix as well, and the Warriors and various teams from Tiomutu,
but sometimes there's only so much you can do. Like

(01:18:30):
even the black Caps are playing and the Euros have started,
so I really need to think that black Caps were
bowing out of the picture.

Speaker 2 (01:18:38):
Yeah, well, it gives you a bit more so. I mean,
I don't know how many people do you, reckon are
getting up on Tuesday morning at two thirty to watch
the black Caps play Popa New Guinea and would stick
out the entire game from two thirty to let's say
four thirty Tuesday morning.

Speaker 16 (01:18:51):
Well, I know of one, and that is my claim
from the ACC. So he will be commentating that on
Sky Sports fifty nine. He's also said anyone else who
gets up and calls and can commentate with him. So
he's desperate at the moment, And so if you care
about that sort of thing, get up and watch the
game of Mike Lane.

Speaker 2 (01:19:12):
Any thoughts on on I mean, we don't. We haven't
got a long time to unpack it all. But I
kind of feel like I said this on the first day.
You probably went listening, you're probably doing something far more
on boardant. But I think the T twenty side should
sit off to the side of New Zealand cricket in
terms of the central contracts. Let's just have a team
of players so we're used to playing T twenty play
around the world, kind of renegade, you know, nism and
Monroe and Bolton, all of these guys, and that can

(01:19:34):
be in New Zealand black Caps T twenty team exactly.

Speaker 16 (01:19:37):
I think we should have never lost Corey Anderson either. Yes, yes,
I mean he's still a key player playing around the
world like Trent bolt is now and like a lot
of our players pop up in the APL, So who cares.
Why do we have to lose our talent like that?
And I mean, look, I think they've made some really
dubious calls with contract priority. There's a secret list. Nobody

(01:19:59):
knows that except for the cricketers in the New Zealand
Cricket and I think Gary Stead and some of the
NSI cricket people have put some of their he ripped
high up on that list, which has forced people over
the course of the past decade. I'm talking forced people
like Colin Monroe, Martin Guppdell, Mitchell mclenahan. They've all been
sent and Cory Anderson have all been sent into exile.

(01:20:20):
And I mean it is a bit like you say,
it should be like the seventeen separate skills, separate contracts
and just picked the best people, and I think we
wouldn't have this problem at all.

Speaker 2 (01:20:31):
And to finish, what's the latest in the Caitlan Clark
ongoing Olympic snub drama slash landscape with her?

Speaker 16 (01:20:41):
Yes, Caitlyn Clark, let's talk about it before I do
get into that. I was just going to say George Bell,
Ricky Ricottelli or Curt Ecklund a shot out between those three. Yes,
she lost a lot of weight through illness this year,
so we struggled to get back to a hooker's playing weight.
But yeah, probably George might be at the head there.
But yes, Caitlyn Clark, she's that she was snubbed from

(01:21:01):
the Olympics team. But some Paul Pierce, the Celtics Grape
has come out and said, well, why don't they actually
pick Caitlin Clark and Angel Rees who they've sort of
had this feud with the the two young players, put
them in the team and just make it so blockbuster
and see if together as teammates they can in the
feud and bring harmony to the force. And I love

(01:21:23):
that idea. And also Serena Williams is coming out and
supporting Clark and saying, the only reason why people criticize
you is because they can't do what you do. So
I mean, it doesn't matter where you look. Her name
is mentioned all across the American media. She's a phenom
and changing women's basketball. I think for the better.

Speaker 2 (01:21:43):
So ttutu Ooh, we're gonna beat you? Is that any
good or not?

Speaker 10 (01:21:48):
Really? That's good?

Speaker 16 (01:21:49):
Yeah, pony, now we're getting somewhere. Yeah, watching you as
such a treaty you like that.

Speaker 14 (01:22:03):
Kind of thing.

Speaker 16 (01:22:03):
But I think the beat you is better.

Speaker 10 (01:22:05):
I think it's good.

Speaker 2 (01:22:06):
Oh No, you're the wordsmith when it comes to these things.
Wonderful to chet James. Thanks mate, James mcchy big part
of our Sunday. It's one of my favorite times of
the week. Seven away from two news Talks.

Speaker 1 (01:22:16):
Ebents analyzing every view from every angle in the sporting world.
Weekends Forward with Jason Pine Call eight hundred and eighty
and eighty US Talks, eNB.

Speaker 2 (01:22:27):
Gunner on text, Pinty, Sorry for your loss on the Canes.
I still want to see my Chiefs play full eighty
four eighty minutes with fifteen men and see what they
could really do. I thought to beat the Canes at
home with fourteen men for sixty minutes was outstanding. My
hope is for Angus Gardner to referee the final. He
had a positive attitude to the match, great entertainment, Go
my Chiefs, Gunner. I totally agree that Angus Gardner was
terrific with the whistle last night, and well onto your Chiefs,

(01:22:48):
all the best for the final. Nick Willis on the
road to Paris after two.

Speaker 1 (01:22:54):
The only place to discuss the biggest sports issues on
and after fields. It's all on Weekends Forward with Jason
Vane on your Home of Sport Used Talks.

Speaker 2 (01:23:07):
Two o seven another hour of us, and then Tim
Beverage and the chair for the weekend Collective Sunday edition.
Between now and three are Conrad Smith's on the show.
He's refereeing at the moment at community level in Taranaki,
so talk about walking the walk. A lot of players
in all sports say, hey, I want to give back.
I want to give back, but you know a lot don't.

(01:23:29):
Conrad Smith has picked up a whistle. I have a
chat to him about that before three o'clock. We're also
in Germany. The Euros are underway the European Football Championship
for twenty twenty four. The hosts smashing Scotland five to
one yesterday, wins overnight for Spain and also for Italy
and Switzerland. Sebastian Stafford Bloher is a highly regarded football

(01:23:50):
journalist based in Germany. He's going to chat to us
this hour and the Road to Paris continues shortly as
we reflect on some great Olympic moments with the Paris
Games coming into full focus less than six weeks away
now from the Paris Olympic Games. Nick Willis is on
the show. He went to five Olympic Games, won two
medals in the fifteen hundred meters. One of our great

(01:24:12):
middle distance runners, Nick willis standing mighty chat to us.
We'll keep an eye on live sport as well. Scotland
one hundred and eighty for five in their twenty overs.
Australia wanted to chase down one hundred and eighty one
to win that match. If Scotland win, they go through
to the super rights and England go home. If Australia
do reach that target, then England squeakin to the super rights.
But as we always do it around about this time,

(01:24:33):
which is eight past two, cue the music and there
it is from producer Mark Kelly, your little be audience,
in case you missed it, the well some of the
sports you may have missed as you've gone about your
daily life over the last eighteen to twenty four hours
or so. Let's start at the Euros. A sensational start
to Albania's tournament. Ope done against defending champions Italy. Federico

(01:24:56):
did Marco went.

Speaker 23 (01:24:57):
To throw and it's a really terrible one is he
did to.

Speaker 1 (01:25:01):
Start?

Speaker 2 (01:25:04):
I've never seen anything like it.

Speaker 3 (01:25:07):
Less than half a minute on the watch, A stunning start.

Speaker 2 (01:25:11):
How don you have arrived on this euro Yeah? The
quickest goal in the history of the Euros, coming after
just twenty three seconds. Italy, though did come back to
win two one. Switzerland beat Hungary three to one, and
Spain accounted for Croatia three nil to the Nral. The
Tigers snapping a nine game losing streak with victory over
the Titans. Sorris Our big dummy a kickers really cleaned

(01:25:35):
up their.

Speaker 3 (01:25:36):
Tigers, cleaned up by the newer play a ricochet play scores.

Speaker 2 (01:25:44):
The Tigers bleed by six and went on to win
eighteen ten. Meantime, the Roosters moved up to fifth with
a twenty eight eighteen victory over the Eels. I love
this left side to kick this carpet.

Speaker 24 (01:25:55):
Hever come here, Come here, the Cagets cutting come appropriate.
It's Curton, but Shelley puts this game away.

Speaker 2 (01:26:05):
At the T twenty cree Worll Cup this morning, the
pull match between England and Namibia shortened by rain to
a ten over contest. England made one twenty two for
five batting first or rounder Liam Livingston, taking no time
at all to get his eye in when he arrived
with four balls remaining in the innings.

Speaker 25 (01:26:25):
He goes lackside and starts with a sex one handed
that sex nonetheless true. Livingston straight this time, same result.
Wonderful hitting from Liam Levingston.

Speaker 2 (01:26:38):
And pair sixers off the first two balls he faced
for Liam Livingston, England winning by forty one runs and
the NBA Finals will go to a game five after
the Dallas Mavericks finally got on the board with a
one hundred and twenty two eighty four home winner of
the Boston Celtics, the third largest margin of victory in
NBA Finals history. The Mavericks starred duo of Luka Doncic

(01:26:59):
and Kyrie Irving to the four don't it's.

Speaker 24 (01:27:01):
Stripped from behind by Holiday Paul Louis servant trying to
come up with it and does draws it inside dudgets
and lays it up fowl Kylrie Irving's hustle New.

Speaker 3 (01:27:12):
Zealand and the home straight medaland.

Speaker 2 (01:27:16):
GEVs all.

Speaker 1 (01:27:22):
Weekend Sport Road to Paris twenty twenty four.

Speaker 2 (01:27:27):
We're now just over a month away from the twenty
twenty four Olympics. We continue our Road to Paris feature
catching up with some of our great Olympians. Our guest
this afternoon, one of the finest track athletes New Zealand
has ever produced. Nick Willis competed in the fifteen hundred
meters at five Olympic Games, winning silver at Beijing in

(01:27:48):
two thousand and eight and bronze at Rio in twenty sixteen.

Speaker 23 (01:27:51):
Centrovitz is the Olympic champion mccluefee at silver and bronze.
Can you believe it to Nick Willis off New Zealand? Well,
there would have been a lot of people watching in
New Zealand. What a fine career it's been for Nick Willis.
His third consecutive final. It wasn't quite a replica of

(01:28:13):
the legendary exploits of Lovelock Snell and John Walker forty
years ago, but a silver in Beijing A little fistpuff there.
He is a masterful tactician and while all around him
were beginning to crumble, Willis kept his composure and he
has a second Olympic medal.

Speaker 2 (01:28:33):
Nick Willis takes the bronze. He also won fifteen hundred
meters medals and all three of his Commonwealth Games gold
at Melbourne two thousand and six, bronze at Deli twenty ten,
Bronze again in Glasgow in twenty fourteen, and as the
New Zealand record holder over the distance three twenty nine
sixty six, which he ran in Monaco in twenty fifteen.

(01:28:54):
Nick Willis is with us on Weekend Sport. Nick, when
you think back about your many Olympic Games experiences, what
stands out most vividly for you?

Speaker 26 (01:29:04):
The first thing just talking about Olympic Games, a thing
about Snell and Walker, to be honest, and I forget
that I was there. It feels like such a long
time ago, even it was just most recently. But yeah,
I think probably most of all, it's just all of
the New Zealand team doing a haka when I got
into the village or coming back from a meta all
of that sort of team New Zealand experience around the village.

(01:29:25):
We really crushed that sort of set up there. We
definitely had the best sort of space in the village
that the New Zealand team had set up. So just
the real sense of coming home. And when I'm based
overseas all the time, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:29:38):
How much camaraderie is there amongst a New Zealand team
at an Olympic Games. Do you get the opportunity to
mix much with the others or are you really kind
of focused on your own on your own event.

Speaker 26 (01:29:50):
No, absolutely, especially amongst the different sports. They really did
a good job of setting up down in the lobby
and a sort of a viewing area for everyone to
get together and chair on the different sports. And athletics
is in the second half of the game, so the
first week you get to watch swimming and other sports
going on.

Speaker 10 (01:30:09):
Yeah.

Speaker 26 (01:30:09):
No, and always get a chance to go hang out
with some other sports people to go to other events
as well. That was always fun. Probably my most vivid
memory of that was Kirk Penny taking me under his
wing at the Athens Olympics when I was sort of
a young spark, sort of intimidated by the whole endeavor,
and he sort of saw that in me as some

(01:30:30):
nerves as we were sort of getting around the village
and he sort of mentored me through that experience and
we've stayed met since.

Speaker 2 (01:30:36):
Amazing stuff. Can ask about two thousand and eight silver medalist,
You came across the line third, there was a disqualification
which saw you upgraded to silver. Did that at all
take the gloss off it that you didn't get the
silver on the podium?

Speaker 26 (01:30:52):
No, I was really very fortunate in many regards because
of that, I'm the only person to ever get to
have a medal presented on their home track when they
didn't win the gold medal and get the hair the
national anthem on their homes at Newtown Park. They put
on a special ceremony for the occasion, and so I
got to have the experience in Beijing, and bronze was

(01:31:15):
as good as silver in my eyes at the time,
and then I got to go through that whole moment again,
even sort of more emotionally on my home track in Wellington.
So yeah, I sort of got double the dose. But hey,
I deserved it. When cheats beat you, you get to
be rewarded in those moments as well.

Speaker 10 (01:31:31):
I love that.

Speaker 2 (01:31:31):
I love that London twenty twelve, you were the flag bearer.
How do I tell you about these things any Is
there any sort of ceremony around the revealing of this
news that you'll be carrying the flag or is it
just a sort of an off end conversation asking if
you'd like to do the job.

Speaker 26 (01:31:47):
I believe I was in my tackety at an athletics
meeting there, so that would have been February of twenty
twelve and I got a phone call from the chef
the mission at the time and he said, hey, Nick,
I just wanted to see if you'd be willing and
able to be the flag bearer for the event. I
think they m Valerieville had already turned it down, perhaps

(01:32:08):
my head Drysdale. So I was just like the third
pick because everyone else is worried about the curse of
being the flag bearer, which turned out to be true, right,
like I ended up having my worst games. No, that's coincidental,
but yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:32:24):
That must have been a proud moment though. I mean,
could you know eight year old Nick Willis ever have
imagined carrying the flag out in front of a New
Zealand team at Olympic Games.

Speaker 26 (01:32:34):
Never in my wildest dreams. I was always felt so
intimidated and all of these sorts of moments. I was
never a sports captain or anything at my school. I
don't think I was ever a captain for any of
my sports teams, let alone being the flag bearer for
the country. So it was a huge, huge honor.

Speaker 2 (01:32:49):
In twenty sixteen, I want to ask you about that
and the bronze you won there. How do you reflect
on twenty sixteen.

Speaker 26 (01:33:00):
I think mostly I was just really really proud of
like not giving it up really after twenty twelve hours,
pretty devastated to get sort of blown away in the
last lap of the final and wondering if the old
legs still had it in them, and I sort of
worked with my coaches and my support network to try

(01:33:20):
and figure out, is there a way to really just
focus on how to be the best version of myself
and not get too distracted by all the other phenomenal
athletes in the world. And I think that's when I
had the best head on my shoulders. I may not
have had quite the best body anymore, but just the
preparations that went into those games sort of we avoided

(01:33:40):
all of the different pitfalls and obstacles along the way
that might have helped me back in other years, and
it just was the perfect preparations. And then on race day,
I was just it was just through a privilege to
be there at thirty three, thirty four years old against
all of these young bucks, and when it went out
being a super slow race. I've always enjoyed those sort

(01:34:02):
of moments so I don't have to feel the pain
and suffering of a race, so I got to enjoy
those first two laps and then it was game on,
and fortunately the gaps opened up and I was able
to capitalize on them.

Speaker 2 (01:34:13):
Did you ever consider a move to the five thousand
meters or was the fifteen hundred always the one that
you were keen to continue competing in.

Speaker 26 (01:34:23):
I always had the allure and the idea of giving
it a go, but each time I tried, it didn't
seem to have the same success that I had envisioned
I hoped. And one of my last serious races as
an international runner was at the Rohm Diamond League and
I think I was last by two hundred meters in
the five thousand meter race there. So that was pretty

(01:34:43):
raiding on the wall that it was never meant to be.

Speaker 2 (01:34:47):
Can you take us inside the I don't know, half
an hour fifteen minutes before an Olympic final? What's that
like and how much sort of how much impact does
what you do in the last fifteen minutes before the
gun goes actually have on the way that you race?

Speaker 26 (01:35:06):
Yeah, it can be a really intense moment. I think
the whole five days in the Olympic village, around your heat,
your semi on your final. It's a long period of
time to be really focused on that one soul goal
and endeavor, and so for me personally, it's like, finally
I get a chance to sort of come out of
that cocoon, so to speak, where you're really just trying

(01:35:26):
to suppress all your emotions and excitement and trying to
have them all be ready to be put into that
one focused effort in the final. So I just get
really excited in the last thirty minutes. I think I've
been really nervous in the sort of four hours to
an hour and a half before the race, But once
I start my warm up and get into the motions,
that's when I've always enjoyed that sort of this is

(01:35:49):
what I signed up for, you know, this is what
you dream as a child. I always wanted to be
the guy that kicked the winning penalty kick Athletic Park
from the twenty two, you know, and so this is
my moment to do that and the slightly less skilled
arena of running. But you know, I always enjoyed that
the bigger moments that sort of brought the best out
of me.

Speaker 2 (01:36:09):
And did you enjoy being part of a legacy? You
mentioned some of the great names of middle distance running
in New Zealand before Hellberg, Snell, Lovelock, Walker. Obviously you're
in that conversation now too for the present day cohort.
Did you enjoy the opportunity to add to that middle
distance legacy.

Speaker 5 (01:36:30):
Absolutely.

Speaker 19 (01:36:31):
I was.

Speaker 26 (01:36:33):
A fan first before I was an athlete at that level,
and I just soaked up everything to do with all
of the history of so along the side of that,
and that's pretty well documented. One of the most special
moments for me was about a month before, maybe three
weeks before the Rio Games, when they announced the final
selections and my training partners from New Zealand, Julian Matthews

(01:36:56):
and Hamish Carson, got announced to the team and I
had got wind of that a day early, so I
reached out to Snell and Dick Quacks, the lead to
it Quacks and.

Speaker 5 (01:37:07):
Rod Dixon.

Speaker 26 (01:37:08):
I asked if they'd be willing to sort of be
available on a group call as a surprise to welcome
those two young New Zealand milers into the running fraternity,
the great New Zealand Olympians, and so that was really
cool to get the six of us together on a
call for about an hour and really just sort of
like soaken to that moment.

Speaker 5 (01:37:27):
So yeah, that's amazing.

Speaker 2 (01:37:29):
And Sam Tanner will wear that black singlet in Paris
in a few weeks time. How do you assess his
ability to do well in Paris?

Speaker 26 (01:37:38):
Sam's doing great. He hasn't had too many opportunities of late,
but we've got so many other New Zealanders doing well
right now as well. With Jordy Beamish he won the
World Indoor Championships in the fifteen hundred meters. There's something
I was never able to do and now James Press
him from Wellington he just broke and his record in
the eight hundred meters and on a women's side with
Maya Ramsden winning the NCAA titled two back to bat

(01:38:01):
years and a woman's fifteen hundred meters. So yeah, it's
just really exciting to be a fan of or distance
running for New Zealand at the moment.

Speaker 2 (01:38:08):
You've still got that record, mate, three twenty nine sixty six.
You reckon Sam will break that at some stage, or
somebody will.

Speaker 26 (01:38:14):
I'm sure it won't be too long. But these are
a great crop of kids, so I'll be cheering them
on as well, and.

Speaker 2 (01:38:20):
Just to finish an Olympic year. Do you you still
take a keen interest in in the Olympic Games? Nick Will?
You be taking in some of the action from Paris.

Speaker 26 (01:38:32):
My family and I will be in Paris for two
weeks before the games, but we won't be there jurying
the games, but we'll be watching on TV. I think
that's that's you get a better view sometimes from Tally,
to be honest, So yeah, it'll be it'll be a
bit different, but I honestly haven't thought about it too
much more. There's luck going on in my other area
of life moment, but it should be fun.

Speaker 2 (01:38:53):
Yeah, I can hear the other areas of a life
clamoring for your retention in the background, Nick, appreciate you
taking the time for a chat in a bit of
a wander down memory lane. Congrats on everything you achieved
and let's hope there's more to come in a black single.
It for the latest cohort.

Speaker 26 (01:39:05):
Thanks for your time, mate, Thanks so much, so look
forward to catching up when I homeless winter for American
Winter selby there for Christmas.

Speaker 2 (01:39:13):
Look forward to that, mate. Thanks indeed, that is Nick
willis there the latest guest on our road to Paris
Every Sunday, just after the two o'clock news, we chat
to one of our great Olympians, and Nick Willis five
Olympic games and two medals in the fifteen hundred meters
certainly falls into that category. Another guest just after the
two o'clock news. Next Sunday two twenty three, Australia have

(01:39:35):
lost an early wicket in their chase for one eighty
one to beat Scotland at the T twenty Cricket World Cup.
They're three for one and the second over. When we
come back where in Germany the Euros are on, they're underway.
We've hit the first couple of days in the first
four matches. Sebastian Stafford Blower is a well regarded football
journalist based in Germany. He is going to have a
chat to us about the championship right after this.

Speaker 1 (01:39:57):
You be the TMO have your say on eight hundred
and eighty ten eighty Weekend Sport with Jason Pin and GJ. Garvnerholmes,
New Zealand. This was Trusted home Builder News Talks. It'd
be two twenty six on News Talks.

Speaker 2 (01:40:11):
Here'll be the twenty twenty four European Football Championship underway
in Germany, twenty four teams chasing glory over the next
month or so. Results on the first two days Germany five,
Scotland won. That was on opening night, and then three
games overnight Switzerland three, Hungary won, Spain beat in Croatia
three nil and Italy two Albania one. A great pleasure

(01:40:31):
to welcome back to the New Zealand, Aer waves. Sebastian
Stafford Bloer, German based football writer for The Athletic and
Fatifo Football, said great to get the chance to chat
to you. What is the mood first of all in
Germany at the start of this month long feast of football.

Speaker 27 (01:40:47):
It's a great question, Jason, because initially there was a
bit of trepidation. I think Jeremany have had some pretty
party form over the last couple of years. They've had
some terrible times in the tournaments, back to back eliminations
at the group stage in twenty eighteen World Cup twenty
twenty two World Cup. I think the moods since the
five one win over Scotland has been in I wouldn't
say you forig but it's been a big uplift. I

(01:41:09):
think that should set the mood coming towards the end
of the first day, which has been okay, have to say,
though marred by organizational difficulties and trouble getting around the country.
So that's a little bit of a kink, which I
hope you will sort yourself out. But I think fundamentally
that the old idea of a tournament which happens in
one country, where everybody engages with the culture, and it's

(01:41:30):
not one of those kind of plan European affairs we've
got used to, and not one way you share it
with another country, which is kind of the future because
the tournament's getting so big for people that are going
to buy into that as a thing, right like this
is one of the last chances to really have fun
in a traditional style European championship.

Speaker 2 (01:41:46):
What did you make of Germany's first up five to one.
Let's call it what it is, a demolition of Scotland.

Speaker 27 (01:41:52):
Deeply impressive, deeply deeply impressive. I think two sides to
that coin. Jason, Scotland were not good at all. I
thought there were some really obvious flaws in their game plan,
the unwillingness to close down tiny Cross. I find it
really hard to understand then you know, you need a
smart tactical mind than me to explain that one. But

(01:42:13):
having said that, I thought the cohesion, particularly an attack,
particularly amongst Jamal Maasiarlo Florin Vitz and Kai Haveitz, was
so so impressive, and the chemistry was was was really
reassuring actually because obviously Hughlett Maagusman has had maybe nine
months to put this team together and so they've seen
a little bit of an incomplete work and a team
in a rebuilding phase. So to see it will work

(01:42:35):
that well was was really encouraging. And yeah, I'm almost
going to say it's eighty thousand people in Allens Arena
or Football Stadium Munich as we are to call it
during the tournament for you know, to keep team on
the right.

Speaker 5 (01:42:45):
Side of the UF for rules. Pretty catchy.

Speaker 27 (01:42:48):
Yeah, it was a wonderful occasion and the team just
seemed better. It seemed to get better and better, and
once once they scored their first couple of goals, and
obviously the red cards chained things. While they've scored the
first couple of goals, you saw the players relax a
little bit and some of the trepidation drop out of
the game. And yeah, he really really strong statement in
their first game performed.

Speaker 2 (01:43:06):
I know expectations up high for Scotland and they're not
a European footballing powerhouse by any stretch of the imagination,
but did you expect a bit more from them?

Speaker 5 (01:43:14):
Yes, yes, I think I did.

Speaker 27 (01:43:16):
I think they have improved dramatically under Steve Clark, and
I'm a big fan of what he's done with the
Scottish national team. I'm not quite sure what it was, whether,
I mean Clark said in this press conference afterwards, which
by the way, Jason, he was pretty terse. I mean's
one of those where, I mean he didn't try very
hard to hide his disappointment, and you know, you had
journey Is kind of shifting in their seats and a

(01:43:38):
little bit uncomfortable with how I sort of want to
slabit the responses were. But it just seemed as if
in his mind his players hadn't quite done what he wanted,
or he didn't feel like the game plan was executed properly,
or you know, he was Santa at times, what like
he was demoiging himself. But yeah, I certainly expected it
to be a bit feistier through the first thirty minutes

(01:44:01):
and actually if you look back at the first goal,
the florin vert Schal, that's the kind of basic error
that if or if you're a team in Scotland's position,
you cannot you cannot do that. You cannot allow a
player of that quality that much space, because I mean,
he's the reigning German player of the year, who is
the player in that attack that you would have been told,
under no circumstances to leave free in ten yards of
space and the edge of the box. So yeah, deeply

(01:44:22):
disappointing it was. It was never really a contest at
any point during that game.

Speaker 2 (01:44:27):
Spain they're underweiy as well, an impress of when first
up against Croatia and I've probably dacent football, so I'd
heard he was Spain's chances of going deep into the tournament.

Speaker 27 (01:44:35):
Yeah, well, funny one because they're almost a dark horse,
which is a really strange thing to say about Spain,
because obviously they are a power in European football, but
I think because because Spanish football as a whole has
had little bit of a decline, like domestically clear, we're
talking about Proma tripping European champions again, So it's not
that bad right, but I think some of their players

(01:44:56):
have gone under the radar and I was I was
holding some friends during it on what's happened.

Speaker 5 (01:45:00):
They were saying, oh, you know, Alvarra Moratu is still there,
and you.

Speaker 27 (01:45:03):
Know who's La Mignel, and you know, like, I think
this is going to be one of those where people
kind of learn how good they are as the tournament
goes on. But they were awfully impressive against Croatia. I mean,
that's we talked about Germany making a statement that's a
very good creation team and a side where which traditionally
Spain have had quite a few problems with it in
the past, and they'd absolutely dispatched them.

Speaker 5 (01:45:25):
It was excellent. And again I feel like Spain.

Speaker 27 (01:45:28):
Of one of those teams where historically, if you look
back at what's happened to them, like early in the tournament,
with probably the exception of twenty ten when they lost
to Switzerland and went on to win the tournament, it
feels like one of those sides where, particularly when you're
carrying a lot of young players.

Speaker 5 (01:45:42):
You need a good mood to be set. And yeah,
I was hugely impressed, hugely.

Speaker 2 (01:45:46):
Impressed England see it, but England. Let's talk England. They
opened their campaign against Serbia tomorrow morning breakfast time here
in New Zealand. What is your analysis of England's chances
at this tournament.

Speaker 27 (01:45:58):
They're going to have to defend well, Like I think
if you look at kind of if you aggregate England's
attacking talent, you could probably make an argument to say
they are They're probably among the strongest teams at the tournament.
Issues in central defense. In my mind, I don't think
England have that kind of solidity. I don't think they
have a kind of permanent combination there anymore, and haven't

(01:46:20):
had for quite some time. I also think that psychologically,
a lot of the players coming into this tournament, and
obviously the coach Kris Southgate, been a situation where they've
had the talent to win competitions for quite a few
years now. They probably could have gone further what they
should have gone further. They did in the World Cup,
could have probably won that U twenty to twenty slash
twenty one. Finally against Italy, had enough chances to do it,

(01:46:44):
didn't get over the line, and so I think you're
dealing with the kind of psychological issue. Can they win it. Yes,
will they It's almost like I don't trust them to
do it. And there comes a point in tournaments with
England where you get the sense sometimes that the players
don't really believe that, either not in the way that
you see in France or we've just talked about Spain.

(01:47:06):
Like it's not about talent always. You have to have
a certain amount of prerequisite yes, but you also have
to Hey, i'm talking to you to someone from news
in it like it's the all about mentality, right, At
some point you need to have the conviction to go
and win the thing. And I still don't know where.
No one canswer this for sure. No one knows whether
England have that. No one knows whether the Southcake can
navigate the tricky sort of ten twenty minute periods that

(01:47:29):
occur right at the end of knockout rounds that decide
whether you advance or not. And he's still to convince
people with that.

Speaker 2 (01:47:37):
Yeah, that's such interesting Anellis's such an interesting month. They
head just before we leave England. Jude Bellingham is the
next big thing. He's only twenty, for goodness sake, plays
for Real Madrid. But Eddie Das have built an entire
advertising campaign around him with Hey Jude in the background.
It's quite astonishing. Where is Jude Bellingham in your mind

(01:47:58):
in the pantheon of modern day footballers?

Speaker 27 (01:48:01):
An absolute rock star of a footballer. He's one of
my favorite players in the world because of, you know,
his set of abilities. I love the way that Jue
Belling holds himself on the pitch off it. He's very
well raised, he's very well brought up as a person,
which is great, but also like he's this really rare
combination of humility in the right moments but ego in

(01:48:24):
the right moments, and he's fun. Like I think, listen
to sport sports entertainment place, doesn't it like you know,
we all know this and you need people that kind
of provide the entertainment. Yes, you need the players that win,
and you need you need achievement, and you need players
that collect medals. You also have people that, even if
you had you know, even if you're watching games of

(01:48:46):
neutral you think, I want to watch that game because
I want to watch this player play.

Speaker 5 (01:48:50):
And Bellingham is one of those.

Speaker 27 (01:48:51):
I had the privilege of watching him when he was
growing up at Brittie Dortmund and it's rare that you
get to say this, but from the first moment he
stepped on a pitch, even as a very young boy
who had no experience of senior football, let alone German
football in a foreign country, didn't speak the language, and
he got there. It just it just takes it all
in its stride and it's so so impressive and it's

(01:49:13):
so rare. And I think also because we've grown used
to just celebrating young athletes very early in their career,
and you know, you know, we kind of insulate them
when we forget kind of how difficult it is to
be that person and to to deal with the things
that come with playing for British Dorman, playing for Real Madrid,
being an England player in this generation them deals with

(01:49:34):
it so well that you can't help it admire and
he's great, and I you know, I hope that I
hope sort of the from a collective standpoint like this
is I think if it's the mold of a group
of pretty likable English players. I'm allowed to say this
because I was born in England, but we haven't always

(01:49:55):
been great a likability in the past. Some of the
national teams we'll put out I think this is a
generally good group of people, good group of human beings,
and he's top of the list of those, and you
know it'd be a a lovely thing for him to
win something with England.

Speaker 2 (01:50:08):
Yeah, I can't wait to see how how he plays
in England. Shood at the Euros and on France said,
let's not forget you know, last World Cup they were
beaten in the final by Argentina in an absolute classic.
They play Austria in their opening match on Monday night.
How similar is the French side to that which played
in the World Cup final?

Speaker 27 (01:50:27):
Very similar, very similar, very dangerous, like all the kind
of basically they return all of their strongest parts and
it's a it's a little bit you know, it's a
little bit contraller and to look beyond killing and bappe.
But I think the question with France, Jason is always
not is not necessarily personal. It's that and we always

(01:50:50):
seem to have the same conversation around France. It's like
you you look at the kind of the ability they're
able to put on the pitch. If I did have
a question, it'd be around central defense and whether William
Saliba starts, because I to me, he was the best
central defender in the Premier League this season. I think
he deserves to start. Some suggest that he won't, so
that's a kind of a wait and see. We'll see

(01:51:11):
what we are on Monday with that. But I guess
it's always about chemistry and that strange gene that French
national football teams have had in the past, which creates
sort of inexplicable moments in tournaments like you they I mean,
if you think back to it, I don't know, two
thousand and two, when they came into the World Cup
as defending champions and then left without scoring a goal.

Speaker 5 (01:51:33):
It's like France just have that capability somehow.

Speaker 27 (01:51:37):
There's always an issue, there's always a lot of a
stumbling block, so that's something that has to be navigated.
But I think if you're going to win this tournament,
I think you're going to have to beat France at
some point. I think that's that's a pretty good starting
point and an assumption to make. Whether you're Germany, whether
you're England, whether you're I think Portugal are a little
bit of an overlook side. I think they're really talented.

(01:52:00):
Holland are dangerous. There's some interesting things that could happen
within that team. But I don't think you can win
it without having beaten this France and without having captain
Bapequa for ninety slash one hundred and twenty minutes.

Speaker 2 (01:52:13):
All right, Well to circle back to finish, SIB. If
we're talking, you know, five or six weeks from now,
and the tournament's all over and it's done and dusted,
what sort of things will to have happened on the
field and off the field for this tournament to be
regarded as a success.

Speaker 5 (01:52:29):
What a great question. I suppose a couple of things.

Speaker 10 (01:52:34):
I think.

Speaker 27 (01:52:35):
I think it's important that the host team go far
in it. I not because I live in Germany and
not because of you know, I'm covering the national team,
but because I think when a home team is successful,
I think that dictates the mood that surrounds the tournament
and the nature of the interactions between people who live
in the country and people who are visiting the country.
I think that's a culturally essential and an essential ingredient.

(01:52:58):
I think also that you know, we're going to have
to find a nice balance between fans enjoying themselves and
the authorities allowing them to enjoy them. I think that
has to be There has to be a bit of
give and take in that relationship. I think also some
of the some of the organizational bugbears have to be
hind out. So we talked about the trains earlier, and

(01:53:18):
some of the transporting issues being a couple of conversations
already about overcrowded fan parks and a few miscommunications about
when they're full and what happens when they're full. Then
we need to get on top of those, because you've
got to make sure you've got to give people the opportunity,
especially when they come from abroad, and especially when they
spend a lot of money to get here and to
stay here for a long periods of time, because it's

(01:53:39):
not cheap to you know, to do a tournament obviously
as a fan. And these all these little things like
in isolation, perhaps they don't matter, but I think they
all have to be got right for everybody to to
really buy into the experience. And Joernany has put this
country and the food is great, and I don't think
anybody needs telling about the alcohol and the beer and

(01:54:00):
all that kind of stuff. But as a as a
country to visit and as a place I sound like
I work for the tourist board, Jason, but as a
place where you can have a lot of different experiences,
see a lot of different things within the same country.
It offers an awful lot and it's a great place
to have a tournament and so hopefully everybody gets the
chance to experience that.

Speaker 2 (01:54:17):
Yeah, mouthwatering month of football ahead, Seb. It's always great
to catch up and get your expertise in your analysis.
Thanks so much for joining us across New Zealand today.
Thanks having me on, Jason, Thankseb. Seb Stafford Blower, German
based football writer for The Athletic and Tifo Football, with
his as always incisive analysis of the European Football Championship
Day three tomorrow, including England v Serbia seven o'clock tomorrow morning,

(01:54:40):
New Zealand time, nineteen away from three. Australia in a
touch of bother here against Scotland thirty five for two.
They are chasing one hundred and eighty one to beat
the Scotts. Now this won't matter as far as Australia
are concerned. They're already through to the Super Eights. But
if Scotland would have win this game, they would go
through and England would miss out. It's one worth keeping

(01:55:02):
an eye on when we come back. Conrad Smith, former
All Black, now commun Unity rugby referee. He's with us
after this.

Speaker 7 (01:55:10):
It's more than just a game.

Speaker 1 (01:55:12):
Weekends for it with Jason Kine and GJ. Gunnerhomes New
Zealand's most trusted home builder, News talks.

Speaker 2 (01:55:19):
Be coming up to forty five. You often hear about
elite athletes wanting to give back to their sport. It's
very easy to talk the talk not always matched by
walking the walk, but one man is doing it outspeed.

Speaker 5 (01:55:32):
Away for Collins against Smith.

Speaker 28 (01:55:35):
Smith starts Wax the ninety four Test double World Cup
winning All Black.

Speaker 2 (01:55:46):
Conrad Smith has taken up refereeing. He's controlled a combination
of schoolboy and women's rugby in Taranucky's competitions this season,
and Conrad Smith is with us. Great to have you
join us, Conrad, and congrats for picking up a whistle.
How did this all come about?

Speaker 14 (01:56:03):
I think, Jason, Yeah, to be honest, it was it
was a bit of curiosity. I was I'm still working,
you know, with the game with the international rugby players.
So we deal with will Rugby on player related issues,
and so a lot of that is around the rules
of the game regulations. So I talked with referees a lot,

(01:56:24):
talk with Ben o'keeith and a lot of the referees
up in the Northern Hemisphere. And then obviously when you
talk about the laws that often you end up talking
about policing. You know, how how the laws actually work
in practice, and how hard it is, easier it is
to referee. So that's sort of how it started a
couple of years ago, and then I thought, oh, I'd

(01:56:44):
give it a go, and this year it's sort of
eventuated and done a few games. I'm not I'm not reliable.
I'm not doing it every weekend unfortunately, but yeah, doing
a little bit and really enjoying it.

Speaker 2 (01:56:54):
Actually, Yeah, how I was going to ask, how have
you found it? Have you have you found it? What
you expect that?

Speaker 14 (01:57:00):
Yeah, in terms I knew it was going to be challenging,
and but I wanted to see, Like I say, that
was sort of the reason for doing it. And I'm
learning a lot in terms of, yeah, just just how
difficult it is to make calls, to see everything, to
get into a right position to particulate community rugby like

(01:57:21):
we're spoil I'm like anyone I watched most of the
rugby is the elite level on TV cameras giving perfect images,
but at community level you don't have any help and
it's all on you to get into position to make
a to make a call, and that's bloody tough. So yeah,
there's more than one or two occasions on scratching the

(01:57:43):
head wanting a replay or I think you know I
got that right. You're just got to back yourself. And yeah,
as long as the players are supportive, which they have
been up until now.

Speaker 2 (01:57:55):
That's good one. I mean back chats to Conrad Smith though,
or do they give it a crack?

Speaker 14 (01:58:00):
Oh yeah, I think there's a few young young guys
and girls that even see me play so at the
start that don't really know.

Speaker 10 (01:58:10):
And I have to say I have.

Speaker 14 (01:58:11):
I have played a few games, so I know that
role and that's normally an interesting conversation, but respectful and
I've been spoiled with the players I've had so far
have been really good.

Speaker 2 (01:58:25):
Do you have any aspirations to emulate the likes of
Glenn Jackson and take it take it further, become a
teaset referee?

Speaker 17 (01:58:31):
One day.

Speaker 14 (01:58:33):
No, not at all, not a stage, and that's not
you know, look, I think it's a great role. Well
I'm actually you know, I'm really enjoying what I'm doing,
working sort of off the field with referees, players, coaches
around the laws of the game, and this sort of
role helps, you know, I don't and don't envisage me
giving that up to the end to see refereeing, but

(01:58:54):
who knows. I'm enjoying it so far, so you never know,
give it a few more months and terms of the
terms with the it might change. I can't see that
happening because, to be perfectly.

Speaker 2 (01:59:07):
Honest, as you say, you've stayed involved through the International
Rugby Players since you're retired from the elite level. So
you're in London recently launching the Global Rugby Players Foundation
charity to support elate level players and their lives beyond
the game, making sure they lead healthy and for filling
lives once their rugby careers end. Can you tell us
a bit more about that.

Speaker 14 (01:59:28):
Yeah, that's sort of something I suppose.

Speaker 29 (01:59:31):
It's sort of a part of what the player associations
do that I'm pretty passionate about. Just Look, there's a
lot of programs a lot every union, every player associations
wanting to help players if they leave the game. You know,
we're understanding more and more how challenging that is for
all sports, particularly for rugby. You guys getting involved in

(01:59:52):
girls younger and younger, which you know, sort of knowing them,
the normal opportunity and normal routes around education and the
areas where you normally develop yourself for careers, and so
then it's sort of like, well, how do you help
PLARSS when they finish your careers? And there's a lot
of good ideas and programs, but they're all lacking resource,

(02:00:14):
and so you know, the foundation is just about recognizing
it's a global issue, So let's do it globally, raise
some money and and then then feed the money the
resource to to these programs that are really well run
and just need a bit of extra support and then
and hopefully they can ultimately help help plars and as

(02:00:36):
they leave the game, you know, they pleany of support
while we play and clean and support to get on,
you know, the academies and that that are becoming more
and more popular. So now we just want to see
the support at the other end of the planers career.

Speaker 2 (02:00:48):
Such valuable work you're doing in this area, Conrad, and
congrats on picking up the whistle as well. Make great
to get the chance to chat to you, No problem,
thank you, Conrad. Conrad Smith there ninety four Test All
Black double, World Cup winner and now grassroots rugby referee.
What terrific thing that is from Leon and Melbourne. Always
enjoy getting your emails. Leon. He has focused in on

(02:01:11):
the Warriors. As you know, I'm a huge stats fan,
says Lee. I here are a few to chew over
from the Storm Warriors game last night. After sixteen minutes
Melbourne were behind fourteen nil, that had to make sixty
eight tackles to only six against, had mist eleven tackles,
had made three errors, had given away three penal release
and made only three runs. Yet they stuck to their
game plan and still won against the Warriors for the

(02:01:32):
sixteenth straight time. Incredibly, it's now been three two hundred
and sixty one days since the Warriors last beat the Storm.
The Storm have, arguably, says Leon, been the most consistent
team since joining the NRL in nineteen ninety eight, winning
their made in title the following year and six in total.
They have a winning culture from the front office to
the players, which sets them apart from most other clubs

(02:01:53):
and is why they're always there at the business end
of the season. Enough said, Thanks Leon, appreciate your email
as always. Australia fifty one for two in the eight
over chasing one point eighty one to beat Scotland. Weekend
Sport ninety three us.

Speaker 1 (02:02:06):
Down to the line you made a call on eight
ten eighty Weekend Sport with Jason Pyne News Talk.

Speaker 2 (02:02:13):
ZMV five and a half to three. Are Scotland have
picked up another work in a big one too. Glenn
Maxwell is out, So Australia are three down now three
for sixty in the night over chasing one eighty one.
As I say, this won't matter for Australia, but England
we'll be watching on with a growing sense of anxiety.
I'm sure because of Scotland win this. England are going

(02:02:35):
home quite astonishing, really quite incredible. That is us for
Weekend Sport. Tim beverages in the chair after three o'clock
with the Sunday edition of the Weekend Collective. Huge thanks
to Mark Kelly for producing the show the last couple
of days. Thank you for listening in and for taking
a part in the show. If that's what you decided
to do. The Weekend Sport Show is now available as

(02:02:56):
a full podcast. They tell me so. If you search
for a Weekend Sport on iHeartRadio or Reeve you get
your podcasts, you can find the entire show. I think
they even take the air. It's out for you. You
listen to the whole thing, magnificent yees. So just if
you want to listen to the whole show, or don't
get the chance to listen to it when we're on
the air, then the full show podcast is available for

(02:03:16):
you back on Sports Talk Tomorrow night between seven and
eight to take us out today well. With England taking
part in the European Championships this month, ahead their first
game tomorrow morning against Serbia, a fresh wave of hysteria
has hit England football fans who firmly believe that this

(02:03:37):
drought of theirs that stretches all the way back to
nineteen sixty six is going to end. They believe football
is coming home. It might be, but then again it
might not. See Tomorrow Night Shows.

Speaker 1 (02:04:22):
Josh for more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine. Listen
live to news talks. It be weekends from midday, or
follow the podcast on iHeartRadio

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