The Crusaders are no strangers to playing on the biggest stage.
One of the icons of the Crusaders is 7-time champion and captain of the undefeated 2002 champion team, Reuben Thorne.
He joined Piney to discuss what’s behind the club’s prolonged success.
“There was obviously a lot of talented players, there’s some outstanding players, but it was the way that we were able to be a team, y’know, true team players.”
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine
from News Talks ed b.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Let's bring In Though a true Crusaders legend. Reuben Thorn
debuted for the team in nineteen ninety seven. He was
part of seven Super Rugby title wins ninety eight, ninety
nine and two thousand, then two, five, six and eight,
the last four of those as captain. In his debut
season as Crusader skipper in two thousand and two, the
(00:34):
team completed a perfect season with thirteen wins from thirteen games,
beating the Brumbies in the final gap opening up.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
For Hakwell Cayla Brown hand a bend. They won't catch him.
They gotta do it again. They're gonna bring up thirty five.
They've done it every turnment.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Even there goes the siren and the Crusaders have done
it again. Pop time, that's the Crusaders winning the final
in two thousand and two. Rubin Thorn played one hundred
and twenty nine Super Rugby games in red and black,
(01:13):
and last year was inducted into the Crusaders Hall of Fame.
Lets not forget he also played fifty one times for
the All Blacks, fifty of those were tests and he
was captain and twenty two of them went to three
World Cups. Rubin Thorn is with us. Ruben, thanks for
joining us on Grand Final day. Thinking back to your
time and the team and the huge success that you had,
what were the hallmarks of that prolonged success that you
(01:36):
enjoyed during your time with the Crusaders.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Well, I think it was just the teamness of the group,
if that makes sense, because there was obviously a lot
of talented players. There's some outstanding players, But it was
the way that we were able to be a team,
you know, a true team players a team, and rather
than just be a group of talented individuals, it was
all about putting the team first and coming together and
(02:04):
playing as a really solid team, particularly in those in
those type moments where games can sort of go either way,
it's the team that plays most like a team that
often comes through, rather than the team with the talent.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Yeah. You run an eye down the list of some
of those teams and they're just chock full of some
of our best ever all blacks. When you were captaining
those sides, What was the best way to lead such
an experienced, talented group.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
For me, it was. I guess I just had to
be authentic myself and try to do the best Jobe
I could do. But with that sort of caliber of
people around you, you use them, you encourage them, you
let them lead in your way. I always felt like
it was a collaborative, collaborative type of environment that we
had where people could express themselves and lead in their areas.
(02:55):
So you know, we just sort of encourage that and
that made a lot easier for me as well.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Does any of the titles stand out above the others
for you.
Speaker 3 (03:06):
Us? There quite a bit, but it's actually really hard,
a hard one to pick. I mean, one of my
favorite ones is still the very first title that we
won against the Blues of ninety ninety eight, just because
it was, I guess, the start of something and the
way it came about. In the team that we played
in the final was an outstanding Blues team. I mean,
they should have probably beaten us on paper every day,
(03:28):
but you know, we went up there and we had
to fight really hard that season to get through and
we won that final and it was I still have
some incredible memories of that moment and the aftermath of that,
just the celebrations and the sort of euphoria of actually
winning one title, but that sort of led us into
this sort of dynasty. I guess that the Crusaders of
(03:50):
bill from there.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Yeah, certainly did the first of three in a raw,
and then you took over as captain that two thousand
and two team that went through unbeaten. Was that the
best Crusaders side you played in?
Speaker 3 (04:04):
Again, another really tough question. That was a very good team,
and we played something outstanding rugby, a really enjoyable brand
of rugby, and you know, we just found a way
to win a lot of really tight games, because there
was a lot of games we played that year that
were we won, but not by much. So that that
was one of the things that team had was a
(04:26):
lot of character as well as some exciting young talent
coming through. Guys who were sort of coming becoming household
names if you like, like the Dan Cards, Richard mccaws
and the Chris Jacks and those young talented players who
were just at the sort of early stages of their
careers that's when they sort of made their mark, well
started to make their mark on the scene. So it
(04:47):
was a great team to be part of, and we
we played for rugby.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
The unbeaten winning streak and home finals. This status been
thrown around a lot in the last couple of weeks.
Thirty one straight finals games in christ Church or at
home without ever losing any of them. You were obviously
part of building that at the start these you were
building it. Were you aware of it and did it
ever come with any pressure?
Speaker 3 (05:13):
Well, I know we weren't really aware of it at
the time. I mean not something that we've talked about.
It's I guess now over such a long period it's
built up to this incredible number thirty one to Oh.
Back when I was playing, it wasn't really an issue.
We just had real pride in playing at home in
front of our home people. That was what we focused
on giving back to them, and you know, putting our
(05:36):
performances that we could be proud of as a team
and that we wanted to our supporters to be proud
of as well. And that was that was more of
a focus than the than the stats or the numbers
behind it.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
You won seven titles, but you lost a couple of
finals as well. Oh three to the Blues, so four
to the Brumbies. How deflating our super rugby final defeats.
Speaker 3 (05:57):
Yeah, they're pretty disappointing. Yeah, I mean for both sides.
You go all the way through, you put a huge
amount of work into getting yourself that opportunity, You put
your heart and soul into it, and to fall short
at their last hurdles, really, it is deflating. It is disappointing. Yeah,
even though you can look back and say, well, we
(06:18):
made a final and that's a great achievement, but you
don't want to just make it. You know, you want
to go there, you want to win the title, and yeah,
it's definitely a totally different feeling if you don't.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
And your crusader's coach is Wayne smith initially and then
Robbie Dean's. Can you tell us about their respective styles?
Speaker 3 (06:37):
Yeah, Look, Smithie, I think his influence is still there today.
You know, he started, in my opinion, he started a
lot of the coaching sort of methodology that modern coaches use,
particularly guys like Razor and Robbie Deans who followed after
Smithy around theming seasons and getting to sort of real
(06:59):
mental skill space, that was a massive part of what
he sort of introduced. And for me as a young player,
it was the first time might have ever come across it,
So it was it was huge for us. And you know,
that's part of building a culture and getting buy in
from the whole group and the whole organization and doing
all those sorts of things that are not just run
(07:20):
catch pass stuff. It's it's all the other stuff off
the field, around the team environment, around the mental skills
space and all of that that the great coaches sort
of bring to a group.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
And to the modern day. Reuben, what has been so
different in twenty twenty five compared to twenty twenty four.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
Look, I think twenty twenty four for Rock Penny anyway,
it was I want, I don't want to call it
a hospital pass, but I think he sort of he
came in late, the team had been selected, that they
had a pre season already organized, and he sort of
came into it, and they went over to Europe, as
you'll remember, and I think they just got that part
of it wrong, that whole transition to a new coach,
(08:02):
new coaching group in the preseason side of it wrong.
So they started a little but on the back foot
and just never able to quite get out of it.
And I know this year they put a lot of
emphasis on getting that part of it right starting the
season well, and you know, I'm building the team the
way that it should have been done last year, but
just for various circumstances, they couldn't do in.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
The final tonight the Chiefs. It just feels like a
coin flip. You know, any anyone who doesn't have skin
in the game as far as being a Crusaders or
Chief supporter would tell you that. I mean, I've got
no idea how how this game is going to go.
Do you have a have an idea of what might
decide it tonight? What the small you know, but the
small but large factors might be.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
I feel very much like you. I mean, the Chiefs
are an outstanding team. They really, they really are that.
It's an incredible group. They're playing great rugby. They've dominated
the Crusaders in the round robin, but the Crusaders at
home again for a final, so it's really tough one
to pack. And you know, I really hope it's a
great game. Obviously, I'm a Crusaders supporter, so I hope
(09:08):
they'll do it, and I think home advantage will be
a factor. But they are up against a hell of
a good team and the Chiefs and you know they've
got a lot of motivation behind I've come how they've
come to the final as well.
Speaker 2 (09:22):
So yeah, it'll be exciting, well, well, in a brand
new stadium to look forward to next year. You know,
you come to christ Church now and you see it there,
and I'm sure Cantabrians have been excited watching its construction.
What will the new stadium do for the city and
for the rugby community in christ Church.
Speaker 3 (09:39):
Well, you're right, there's a huge amount of excitement around
it and it's such a you know, if you, as
you say, if you come to christ each now, it's
a massive part of the of your eyeline almost. It's everywhere.
There's not many places you can look to the city
and not see part of it. So it's just really exciting. Look,
I just think having a really world class home base
(10:01):
for rugby and other events in the city is going
to be massive in that whole side of town. Yeah. Look,
it's just coming along so much now and everyone's excited
about it. The current stadium has done a fantastic job
and has created its own bit of history there, but
I think people are really looking forward to getting in
to this new stadium and it's it's looking like it's
going to be world class. We've got some ex Crusaders
(10:24):
who are working on it actually, so they've been sending
us updates and photos of the changing rooms and other
bits and pieces, and it's it looks incredible. So you know,
having a facility like that will be amazing for the
city and for and obviously for for rugby and the Crusaders.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
Oh so, who have your former teammates is on the tools?
Speaker 3 (10:42):
I met Musters in there. He's he's got a plumbing
business and he's doing a lot of the fit outwork
on the inside, so he's been he's been showing us
around a.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
Wee bit brilliant, brilliant stuff. You a like miss Eddington.
You are miss turning up at Eddington and you owned
the beaning and eight layers to watch.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
No, no, look, it's been great, Like the surface is
great there and it's it's not a bad place to
view rugby, but you know, having a roof on and
being closed and just the you know, a real world
class quality stadium will make a mess of difference and
I think people are super excited about it.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Can't wait. Well, one more game at dear Old Addington tonight.
I hope it goes the way that Crusaders stands. So
thanks for taking the time for a chat today, Rubin.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Thank you, cheers, thank you, Ruben.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
Ruben thorn gee what success the Crusaders had with him
and that team, A seven time Super Rugby champion during
his time in the side.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Faine, listen live
to News Talk sed B weekends from midday or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine
from News Talks ed b.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Let's bring In Though a true Crusaders legend. Reuben Thorn
debuted for the team in nineteen ninety seven. He was
part of seven Super Rugby title wins ninety eight, ninety
nine and two thousand, then two, five, six and eight,
the last four of those as captain. In his debut
season as Crusader skipper in two thousand and two, the
(00:34):
team completed a perfect season with thirteen wins from thirteen games,
beating the Brumbies in the final gap opening up.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
For Hakwell Cayla Brown hand a bend. They won't catch him.
They gotta do it again. They're gonna bring up thirty five.
They've done it every turnment.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Even there goes the siren and the Crusaders have done
it again. Pop time, that's the Crusaders winning the final
in two thousand and two. Rubin Thorn played one hundred
and twenty nine Super Rugby games in red and black,
(01:13):
and last year was inducted into the Crusaders Hall of Fame.
Lets not forget he also played fifty one times for
the All Blacks, fifty of those were tests and he
was captain and twenty two of them went to three
World Cups. Rubin Thorn is with us. Ruben, thanks for
joining us on Grand Final day. Thinking back to your
time and the team and the huge success that you had,
what were the hallmarks of that prolonged success that you
(01:36):
enjoyed during your time with the Crusaders.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Well, I think it was just the teamness of the group,
if that makes sense, because there was obviously a lot
of talented players. There's some outstanding players, But it was
the way that we were able to be a team,
you know, a true team players a team, and rather
than just be a group of talented individuals, it was
all about putting the team first and coming together and
(02:04):
playing as a really solid team, particularly in those in
those type moments where games can sort of go either way,
it's the team that plays most like a team that
often comes through, rather than the team with the talent.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Yeah. You run an eye down the list of some
of those teams and they're just chock full of some
of our best ever all blacks. When you were captaining
those sides, What was the best way to lead such
an experienced, talented group.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
For me, it was. I guess I just had to
be authentic myself and try to do the best Jobe
I could do. But with that sort of caliber of
people around you, you use them, you encourage them, you
let them lead in your way. I always felt like
it was a collaborative, collaborative type of environment that we
had where people could express themselves and lead in their areas.
(02:55):
So you know, we just sort of encourage that and
that made a lot easier for me as well.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Does any of the titles stand out above the others
for you.
Speaker 3 (03:06):
Us? There quite a bit, but it's actually really hard,
a hard one to pick. I mean, one of my
favorite ones is still the very first title that we
won against the Blues of ninety ninety eight, just because
it was, I guess, the start of something and the
way it came about. In the team that we played
in the final was an outstanding Blues team. I mean,
they should have probably beaten us on paper every day,
(03:28):
but you know, we went up there and we had
to fight really hard that season to get through and
we won that final and it was I still have
some incredible memories of that moment and the aftermath of that,
just the celebrations and the sort of euphoria of actually
winning one title, but that sort of led us into
this sort of dynasty. I guess that the Crusaders of
(03:50):
bill from there.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Yeah, certainly did the first of three in a raw,
and then you took over as captain that two thousand
and two team that went through unbeaten. Was that the
best Crusaders side you played in?
Speaker 3 (04:04):
Again, another really tough question. That was a very good team,
and we played something outstanding rugby, a really enjoyable brand
of rugby, and you know, we just found a way
to win a lot of really tight games, because there
was a lot of games we played that year that
were we won, but not by much. So that that
was one of the things that team had was a
(04:26):
lot of character as well as some exciting young talent
coming through. Guys who were sort of coming becoming household
names if you like, like the Dan Cards, Richard mccaws
and the Chris Jacks and those young talented players who
were just at the sort of early stages of their
careers that's when they sort of made their mark, well
started to make their mark on the scene. So it
(04:47):
was a great team to be part of, and we
we played for rugby.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
The unbeaten winning streak and home finals. This status been
thrown around a lot in the last couple of weeks.
Thirty one straight finals games in christ Church or at
home without ever losing any of them. You were obviously
part of building that at the start these you were
building it. Were you aware of it and did it
ever come with any pressure?
Speaker 3 (05:13):
Well, I know we weren't really aware of it at
the time. I mean not something that we've talked about.
It's I guess now over such a long period it's
built up to this incredible number thirty one to Oh.
Back when I was playing, it wasn't really an issue.
We just had real pride in playing at home in
front of our home people. That was what we focused
on giving back to them, and you know, putting our
(05:36):
performances that we could be proud of as a team
and that we wanted to our supporters to be proud
of as well. And that was that was more of
a focus than the than the stats or the numbers
behind it.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
You won seven titles, but you lost a couple of
finals as well. Oh three to the Blues, so four
to the Brumbies. How deflating our super rugby final defeats.
Speaker 3 (05:57):
Yeah, they're pretty disappointing. Yeah, I mean for both sides.
You go all the way through, you put a huge
amount of work into getting yourself that opportunity, You put
your heart and soul into it, and to fall short
at their last hurdles, really, it is deflating. It is disappointing. Yeah,
even though you can look back and say, well, we
(06:18):
made a final and that's a great achievement, but you
don't want to just make it. You know, you want
to go there, you want to win the title, and yeah,
it's definitely a totally different feeling if you don't.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
And your crusader's coach is Wayne smith initially and then
Robbie Dean's. Can you tell us about their respective styles?
Speaker 3 (06:37):
Yeah, Look, Smithie, I think his influence is still there today.
You know, he started, in my opinion, he started a
lot of the coaching sort of methodology that modern coaches use,
particularly guys like Razor and Robbie Deans who followed after
Smithy around theming seasons and getting to sort of real
(06:59):
mental skill space, that was a massive part of what
he sort of introduced. And for me as a young player,
it was the first time might have ever come across it,
So it was it was huge for us. And you know,
that's part of building a culture and getting buy in
from the whole group and the whole organization and doing
all those sorts of things that are not just run
(07:20):
catch pass stuff. It's it's all the other stuff off
the field, around the team environment, around the mental skills
space and all of that that the great coaches sort
of bring to a group.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
And to the modern day. Reuben, what has been so
different in twenty twenty five compared to twenty twenty four.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
Look, I think twenty twenty four for Rock Penny anyway,
it was I want, I don't want to call it
a hospital pass, but I think he sort of he
came in late, the team had been selected, that they
had a pre season already organized, and he sort of
came into it, and they went over to Europe, as
you'll remember, and I think they just got that part
of it wrong, that whole transition to a new coach,
(08:02):
new coaching group in the preseason side of it wrong.
So they started a little but on the back foot
and just never able to quite get out of it.
And I know this year they put a lot of
emphasis on getting that part of it right starting the
season well, and you know, I'm building the team the
way that it should have been done last year, but
just for various circumstances, they couldn't do in.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
The final tonight the Chiefs. It just feels like a
coin flip. You know, any anyone who doesn't have skin
in the game as far as being a Crusaders or
Chief supporter would tell you that. I mean, I've got
no idea how how this game is going to go.
Do you have a have an idea of what might
decide it tonight? What the small you know, but the
small but large factors might be.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
I feel very much like you. I mean, the Chiefs
are an outstanding team. They really, they really are that.
It's an incredible group. They're playing great rugby. They've dominated
the Crusaders in the round robin, but the Crusaders at
home again for a final, so it's really tough one
to pack. And you know, I really hope it's a
great game. Obviously, I'm a Crusaders supporter, so I hope
(09:08):
they'll do it, and I think home advantage will be
a factor. But they are up against a hell of
a good team and the Chiefs and you know they've
got a lot of motivation behind I've come how they've
come to the final as well.
Speaker 2 (09:22):
So yeah, it'll be exciting, well, well, in a brand
new stadium to look forward to next year. You know,
you come to christ Church now and you see it there,
and I'm sure Cantabrians have been excited watching its construction.
What will the new stadium do for the city and
for the rugby community in christ Church.
Speaker 3 (09:39):
Well, you're right, there's a huge amount of excitement around
it and it's such a you know, if you, as
you say, if you come to christ each now, it's
a massive part of the of your eyeline almost. It's everywhere.
There's not many places you can look to the city
and not see part of it. So it's just really exciting. Look,
I just think having a really world class home base
(10:01):
for rugby and other events in the city is going
to be massive in that whole side of town. Yeah. Look,
it's just coming along so much now and everyone's excited
about it. The current stadium has done a fantastic job
and has created its own bit of history there, but
I think people are really looking forward to getting in
to this new stadium and it's it's looking like it's
going to be world class. We've got some ex Crusaders
(10:24):
who are working on it actually, so they've been sending
us updates and photos of the changing rooms and other
bits and pieces, and it's it looks incredible. So you know,
having a facility like that will be amazing for the
city and for and obviously for for rugby and the Crusaders.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
Oh so, who have your former teammates is on the tools?
Speaker 3 (10:42):
I met Musters in there. He's he's got a plumbing
business and he's doing a lot of the fit outwork
on the inside, so he's been he's been showing us
around a.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
Wee bit brilliant, brilliant stuff. You a like miss Eddington.
You are miss turning up at Eddington and you owned
the beaning and eight layers to watch.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
No, no, look, it's been great, Like the surface is
great there and it's it's not a bad place to
view rugby, but you know, having a roof on and
being closed and just the you know, a real world
class quality stadium will make a mess of difference and
I think people are super excited about it.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Can't wait. Well, one more game at dear Old Addington tonight.
I hope it goes the way that Crusaders stands. So
thanks for taking the time for a chat today, Rubin.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Thank you, cheers, thank you, Ruben.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
Ruben thorn gee what success the Crusaders had with him
and that team, A seven time Super Rugby champion during
his time in the side.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Faine, listen live
to News Talk sed B weekends from midday or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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