October 7, 2025 • 20 mins
Wellington mayoral candidate and former minister Andrew Little joins Nick Mills in studio for the final of Wellington Morning's mayoral interviews.
Little discussed how he would handle local government compared to central and the reality of a 0% rate increase claim.
And on the Golden Mile Little says he would need to take a look at disruption and financial strain before continuing with the project.
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talks B.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
The last of the main event candidates running for Willington,
Marialty joins us in the studio. Andrew Little, Good morning,
Good morning Nick. How are you feeling?
Speaker 3 (00:23):
Oh good, I'm pleased as the end of the campaign.
It's been a long campaign and just a few days ago.
We'll know what happens on Saturday.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Oh eight hundred and eighty ten eighties a number. If
you'd like to ask Andrew a question, feel free to
give us a call and we will put you in
front of Andrew Little. I want to start by asking
you for why why? What's your motivation why?
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Like a lot of Wellingtonian's, I sort of saw what
the councilor has been doing, particularly over the last year
or say, some of the decisions. I think the thing
that really turned it for me was the story at
the beginning of this year where councils around the country
had the opportunity to line up for the government's Regional
Deals program and Wellington didn't put in a deal. And
I would have thought for a region in particularly a
(01:10):
city that is in desperate need of whatever support they
can get for infrastructure that it was a pretty poor failure.
And when I looked at it, I thought, actually, I've
got a set of skills. It's about building relationships with
other counselors, with central government that could make a difference
for Wellington.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
I want to know whether it's a genuine desire to
help Wellington or it's ae genuine desire to sort of
stay in power. So stay you stay in a political position.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
No, I've done my time in public office. I've gone
back to the practice of law. I've thoroughly endowed being
back in law. I was talking to the law firm
about it's in long term prospects there part of the
there's a I think an attraction to public service, I thought,
and I still think I have a set of skills
that could make a difference for Wellington at a time
that it desperately needs it. And that's what motivated me
(01:59):
to put my hat in the ring. Is public power
a drake? Look, I think I've got a pretty good
track reck of not letting my ego get in the
way of things like this. I think I'm good in
public roles. I'm a good decision maker when I'm in
those sorts of roles. But I've done a long time
in the public eye, but as a union leader, but
(02:20):
also in public office, and I was quite happy going
back to a very private life and life as a lawyer. Well, obviously,
I just think I'm wanting to need something now that
isn't there at the moment.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Hold on a little bit there. Obviously you're not, because
you wouldn't have put your name it to run for me.
If you were happy being you know, quiet Andy instead
of angry Andy. You would have stayed at home and
walked your dog and got.
Speaker 3 (02:43):
On with it.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
You haven't.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
Except that what I saw was a city and a
city council that needs a set of skills. I think
the relationship building skills, both internally, I think some organizational skills.
The more I've got around and spoken to people and
seen the quality of engaged with they having with council offices,
there's something seriously wrong there with some of the council culture.
(03:05):
Those are all things that I've got a track record
and dealing with inside organizations I've been part of, And
so I got to the point where that actually I
do have a set of skills that could make a
difference for Willington, and I think that sense of public
service and public duty that I do have propelled me
to make the decision that I let's.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Move on and some of the things that people in
Wontington care about. Firstly social housing. You know, there's a
lot of people that think that we're you know what,
are we costing us four hundred and thirty nine million
over the next ten years, that's straight on our rates bill.
Do we need as a city to have social housing
when we've got conger or we've got the government doing
it for us.
Speaker 3 (03:42):
But they're not doing it for us, and they had
come or had all sorts of plans which they've now
backed out of a large chi we have to do
it well, we've been doing it for our eighty odd years.
A large chunk of the Wilton City Council social housing
is not is not usable. That's sitting there because the
commitment made however many years ago to do the upgrades
hasn't been followed through on. So I think we need
(04:02):
to do the upgrades at a time when we have grown.
Homelessness are very evident in Wellington. We need to be
doing everything we can to provide that roof other people's
heads who need it along with those who need it
the wrap around services. So we need to fulfill the
commitment we made to see through our social housing program.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Would you, if you become mayor be interested in talking
to the government about taking it over so it takes
all that expense away from Wellington, do we you know?
Speaker 3 (04:29):
Well, we need to have conversations with government about a
lot of things. I think the most useful thing we
could have a conversation with the government about when it
comes to social housing is lifting the number of tenants
who qualified the income related rent subsidies. So the government
at the moment has kept it at ten percent of tenants.
For christ Church City Council that has more social housing
units than we do, the government's kept it at fifty percent.
(04:51):
If we had fifty percent of well As the City
Council social housing tenants on related rent subsidies, it would
largely pay for itself. So that's a conversation we should
have with see.
Speaker 2 (05:00):
When you re look at the costings that we've looked at,
will you re look at it and think see whether
we've got that right or wrong? Because I mean, you know,
half a billion dollars over the next ten years a
lot of money.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Yeah, I think. Look, my principal sort of plank of
my election is everything which we haven't entered into a
contrary for that's in the pipeline of capital works. We
need to have a look at to look at value
for money because we have to do everything we can
to get costs under control and drive down that pressure
on rates. So yes, that would be.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
Now talking about costs, Golden Mile your standards, you want
the Golden Mile to go ahead.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
I've supported in principle because the objectives are the right objectives,
But I am concerned, like a lot of people, at
a couple of things. First of all, the cost the
costings are five years out of date. The government money
that goes with that project is static, so that won't
have changed. So there's a real question about what additional
cost the Council can absorb. And the other is at
a time when the economy is so fragile, protective for
(05:57):
retail and hospitality, just the level of disruption that that
would have and the impact that would have on those businesses.
So those things need to be taken into account on
a decision about whether we proceed with it.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
So what's your gut telling you right now, you walk
the streets, you see it, you're talking to people. What's
your gut?
Speaker 3 (06:11):
Two things the city, the center said, he Courtney place
them to care whatever it does need to spruce up.
There's no question about that. But there's a real question
about what additional cost the council can absorb because the
council's own finances are very fragile at the moment too,
and we have to do everything we can to drive
cost out of the council.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
So just sow our listeners are perfectly clear, not one
hundred percent committed on Golden mile. It's all about whether
you can do it financially. Yeah, there's conditions I've attached
to the Golden Mile. One is financial credibility for like
and disruption to business and minimizing that. I want to
be satisfied that those things can be achieved before coming ahead, right,
(06:52):
could you just put your headphones on for a second.
We've got Peter Peter calling. Good morning. Peter, you have
a question for Andrew Little.
Speaker 4 (07:01):
Thank you very much, guys. I'll be very very quick.
Perhaps that Wellington said, council, the debt say the two
billion mind you, and the hut it's going to be
approaching two billion. Well, what's your specific plan to part
off please?
Speaker 3 (07:18):
Thanks Peter. Look, there's a couple of things that are
really important. The Council's operational spending, what it does on
a day to day basis, that's got to be reviewed.
So I've committed to a line by line review of that.
We have to see whether we're getting value for money,
see with a lot of the stuff we're doing, whether
we still need to continue to do that. And the
other is on the big capital projects. If you have
a look at the what's really put pressure on our
(07:40):
debt burden it is big capital projects just blowing right
out of control. There's clearly a capability gap inside council.
We have to address that and we have to get
better at managing those big projects.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Andrew, if you become mayor on Saturday or mere elect
on Saturday, are we going to hear for the next
six months? Oh this is worse than I thought. This
is where you know, you know, are you going to
hit us with that or you're just going to hit
us with with with you running into power and changing things.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
Well, I think we do need to have a bit
of an opening the books. Let's let's understand what the
picture is. I mean, there is an issue that hasn't
been widely debated in this election campaign, is about what
happens when we flick over to metro water, what impact
that's going to have on household budgets, because that's going
to put real pressure there too, And what that tells
me is that the council has to get on top
(08:24):
of its own spending to keep that downward pressure on rate.
So we do need an honest conversation about what is
there and what's coming at us so that people can
see the decisions that we take over the next three years.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Just very quickly because I've got to go to an
ad break. Have you had a meeting with and with
Matt Prosser, the CEO of Wellington City Council.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
We've met twice since he started, both with both so
opportunistic and just at a social setting. We just agreed.
The first time I met him, I just announced though
which degreed would keep a professional distance. That's the extent
of the contact I've had with him.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Have you looked at the books?
Speaker 3 (08:57):
I've seen what's in the pre election report that council
puts out and obviously the long term plan. There's a
lot of commitments made haven't been signed up to with
con but commitments made. We are going to have to
go through all of those.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
If you just joined the show, We've got Andrew Little
in the final of our contenders to become Mayor of
Wellington on Saturday. A text just come through from Martin
Andrew Heiinik. What local government experience does Andrew have.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
I've never served in local government before. I think what
I see in the Willington City Council is an environment
like all elected environments. It's political, it's about dealing with
people's views and different priorities. My skills are about drawing
people together in an environment like that, building good relationships,
and keeping people focused on the priority issue, which for
(09:45):
right now for Willington City Council is what is best
for Willington.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
Andrew, We've got a couple of callers, so let's go
to them. Thomas, you have a question for Andrew.
Speaker 5 (09:54):
I do, Andrew. We are a group of people who
are often seen as the minority, older people and disabled people,
and the city really isn't that friendly for us. So
I guess you know. We've lobbied, We've done all sorts
of stuff with council staff and with some counselors where
we've had some traction, but our voices are just ignored it.
(10:17):
What are you going to do to make our city
more livable and accessible for disabled people?
Speaker 3 (10:23):
Yeah, thanks Thomas. I think that's a really important question,
and that goes to the whole question about what might
the Golden Mile, if it goes ahead, sort of achieve.
But regardless of that, we still have to we still
have more to do in terms of, you know, curbing
access to buildings, all those sorts of things, access to
green spaces that are accessible to people regardless of their mobility.
(10:44):
There's more that we can do on that. I'm very
keen to see those sorts of developments happening, and again
it's going to be at a time when the Council
has constrained what it can spend future money on.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
Jeremy has a question for Andrew.
Speaker 6 (10:57):
Andrew ray Chung's been running as zero rates increases policy
picked up by some experienced financial professionals Luise Tongue and
poor Elie Smith. You haven't made a commitment to a
number on the rates rises. You call it fantasies, a
fantasy Land.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
What's your question, Jeremy, Well, the question.
Speaker 6 (11:14):
Is what analysis have you made to say that zero
rates rises are not possible.
Speaker 3 (11:19):
The cut of two point eight billion dollars proposed by
batter Wellington involves closing down the zoo, It involves taking
one hundred million dollars out of supporting community facilities like
the community centers like Ko Tonguey, and it means selling
the social housing in the market that doesn't want it.
So those things are impractical. I think there's no question
(11:42):
council spending has got to get under control. It is
a top priority for me and would have to be
a top priority for the future council. And that is important.
But it's not possible to specify what level of rates
increases might come as a result. Clearly, thirty percent increases
over two years is totally unacceptable and we have to
do way better than that.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Andrew, I heard someone on a Q and A program
once saying, you know, only a couple of months ago
when we started talking anybody, any politician that says that
they can give you a zero an increase in rates,
you should never vote for.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Yeah, it's impractical. I think it just doesn't be a
relation to really I mean, part of the thing that
we know that part of the cost driver at the
moment has been the fact that there's this huge catch
up of infrastructure spending that hasn't happened. That said, we're
living in the real world and a thirty percent increase
in rates over two years is really hard on most households.
So the Council does have to weigh up what is
(12:37):
practical and realistic for households with the spending that they're doing.
And we will be in a position where we will
have to say no to some stuff over the next
few years. If we're going to make the books balance.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Can you do that? Are you a no guy? I mean,
are you a guy that's going to walk in there.
I've asked you this question before, and now you've had
some time to probably think about it. Are you the
guy that can walk into council but on the first
job of first day and say, look, we've got too
many staff in there. We need to cut some costs.
I'm going to have to make some people redundant.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
Yeah, and I've done that in previous roles I've had
when I ran the Union, you know, when we had
the economic downturn, we had to gear our staff numbers
to suit. I'm used to dealing with redundancies. I'm used
to dealing with staff and having to reduce staff numbers.
I don't have any problem with about that. If I'm
then a decision making and responsible and leadership role, I've
(13:25):
got to you know, I have a duty to make
sure that the organization I'm responsible for is viable and sustainable,
and that means making those hard decisions.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Now you get your rapes bill, like all of us do,
it's pretty horrific. How are you What are you going
to do?
Speaker 4 (13:40):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (13:40):
And I think that comes back to the point I'm
making is I want to look and see what Council
on a day to day basis is doing. Do we
need to be doing everything that we've got at the moment?
Where can we find savings? I think there is a
real question about some of the functions that have been
contracted out and whether we're getting value for money for
that or whether we sort of bring some services back inside.
But I go back to the big capital projects, and
(14:01):
it's interesting. I've had a few people from inside the
organization or used to be in the organization come to
me over the last few months telling me about their
stories about what they saw and what they think happened
there is. It just seems to me a real capability
question and side that council about running big projects without
the spending getting way out of control. We have to
(14:21):
address that. You do that. The mayor does that through
their relationship with the chief executive. We've got the new
chief executive. I'm used to dealing with chief executives of
big departments and what have you and making my expectations clear,
and I will do that with the backing of a
new council if I'm elected as mayor.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
Now, I haven't had the pleasure of meeting Matt Prosser,
but I hear only good things, which is a great situation.
What's your gut about them? I mean, you've already talked
to them socially. You can work people out pretty quickly,
can't you.
Speaker 3 (14:49):
Yeah. My sense is here's somebody I can work with.
Were established a pretty good rapport and the two occasionals
I met with them, so I'm confident that I can
establish a good when I say a good working relationship,
a relationship that achieves the objectives that people want to see.
The council delivering on.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
What are you visualizing around the actual council table? What
are you thinking? I mean you must have started writing
some names down and looking at it. I mean, are
you concerned?
Speaker 3 (15:14):
Like I'm not concerned, because who turns out there is
who Wellentonians will vote for.
Speaker 4 (15:19):
Look.
Speaker 3 (15:19):
To be honest, I find it pretty hard to pick.
But what I do see of the candidates, and I've
met quite a few of the candidates, I see everybody
is focused on the critical things, getting costs under control,
getting the mojo of the city back. Everybody wants that stuff.
So I'm confident that whoever gets around that table, if
I'm the mayor, I can work with them and we
(15:41):
will find the common ground and the common objectives, and
we'll make Willington a pretty special place to be.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
I want to speed up becase I've got still a
few questions, and I know you're on a time barrier.
We're all on a time barrier. Text question is how
can Andrew Little justify the Golden Mile financially when so
much else needs doing and we're in so much debt.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
Yeah, that's a good question, and it's a large chunk
of the Golden Mile is funded by central government. But
the reality is those cost of five years.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Half though, I mean we're still got to put money.
The counsels still got to put money into it.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
And in fact it'll be less than half now because
there will be cost inflation. So that's why we need
to have a look at it. And if we can't
justify it, then I won't be justifying.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
Hi, Andrew, what have you accomplished in politics that you
think you can carry over into your role as mayor.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Look, I've had I've had lesterally a dozen roles as
a minister, saw through a whole range of changes, legislative changes,
practical changes, organizational changes and politics. You get to do
what you do by building good relationships, both political and administrative.
And that's what I would do if I'm elected as mayor.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
Another texts just come through from Tricia. What will Andrew
do about the City to see Bridge? The decision appears
to be still in limbo.
Speaker 3 (16:52):
I'm a support of the City to see Bridge and
it sounds like as a result of the announcements by
Chris Penk, the minister, with a change in the way
that earthquake ratings are going to be happening is that
there's it looks like that the bridge can stay. There
are some bigger questions about that whole precinct, but I
will be doing everything I can to keep the city
to see.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
Bridge amalgamation, Lower Hot Upper Hot Polydor in Wellington four
or against four.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
I just think look for most Wellingtonians now who live
in those areas plus and Wellington City, we think of
this as a region now. I think about you know,
when my wife and I were raising our son, we
would go to swimming pools in those other areas, We'd
go to parks in those other areas. And a mountain
bike rider, I'd ride my mountain bike and hut valley
tracks and what have you. So I think Wellingtonians increasingly
(17:38):
think of themselves as part of a region, and I
think we should be organizing the cities along that line.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Today, Tory Farno is giving her closing speech as Maya
and Wellington rater.
Speaker 3 (17:50):
Oh look, it's pretty hard to say she's elected to
step out of the race. She served in public office.
She deserves thanks for that. She's going to deliver her
reflections today. People will have a variety of different views
about Tory. I think there in some respects. Tory had
a pretty hard go because of some of the personal
issues that she was also dealing with. But look, this
(18:11):
weekend is the time to turn into a new chapter
and focus on what Wellington needs it particular point.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
You've lived here through the whole three years that Tory's
been here. Is Wellington a better place or a worse
place in the last three years?
Speaker 3 (18:25):
Well, there are some good things that will sort of
become apparent in the next few months. The new library
will open those sorts of things. Those things take time
to get in place. She's made She's led the Council
through some difficult decisions. She's led them through some decisions
like the airport's arsl that probably didn't Would you sell
the way she wanted? No, I wouldn't have sold them
(18:45):
because I think the return to Wellington is too great
and it's too important an asset to be setting down
the holding. Now.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
I know you can see my voting papers there.
Speaker 3 (18:53):
I can see them.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
I know you wanted to grab them, but last time
you're on a show with a camera on you grab something,
it didn't look that good.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
So I'm going to pass them over to you.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
Don't whatever you do, don't give my address out, but
can you just quickly show who I voted for? Please
don't give my dress out?
Speaker 3 (19:12):
No, no, you've got you haven't voted.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
There you go. I just wanted to be open and transparent.
Speaker 3 (19:18):
You have been very good.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
I wanted to wait till everyone had covered it and
discussed it with everyone, and then I'll make my decision
this afternoon.
Speaker 3 (19:27):
All the information, then make your decision. That's a very
rational approach to take.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
Thank you for coming in all the very best for Saturday.
I'm just one little final question. The show's been going
I think thirty something years, right, and it's always had
an agreement, not with me. I always had an agreement
with the Wellington City Council that the mayor would come
in one hour a month and talk to the people
of Wellington. Will you make that commitment? Yes, thank you,
(19:52):
thank you. We had that commitment with the last year.
But what happens if you don't like my questions.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
Like I've had in public life? You devil all sorts
of people. I Mike cost always used to say to me,
He said, every time you get up da onto the show,
you front up, you turn up. That's me. That's what
I do. I'm a lot harder than my cost. We sorry,
but we're not here to be friends. If you're in
a public role, you're accountable, and this is a very
effective means of being accountable, and so that's why I
(20:18):
would do it.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Thank you very much, catch you hopefully for your sake.
Whatever whatever decision the city goes with, we'll we'll we'll
run with it. But we are hoping to speak to
the mayor elect on Monday morning. Cheers, Nick, good luck
for the weekend.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Thank you for more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills.
Listen live to news talks It'd be Wellington from nine
am weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talks B.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
The last of the main event candidates running for Willington,
Marialty joins us in the studio. Andrew Little, Good morning,
Good morning Nick. How are you feeling?
Speaker 3 (00:23):
Oh good, I'm pleased as the end of the campaign.
It's been a long campaign and just a few days ago.
We'll know what happens on Saturday.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Oh eight hundred and eighty ten eighties a number. If
you'd like to ask Andrew a question, feel free to
give us a call and we will put you in
front of Andrew Little. I want to start by asking
you for why why? What's your motivation why?
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Like a lot of Wellingtonian's, I sort of saw what
the councilor has been doing, particularly over the last year
or say, some of the decisions. I think the thing
that really turned it for me was the story at
the beginning of this year where councils around the country
had the opportunity to line up for the government's Regional
Deals program and Wellington didn't put in a deal. And
I would have thought for a region in particularly a
(01:10):
city that is in desperate need of whatever support they
can get for infrastructure that it was a pretty poor failure.
And when I looked at it, I thought, actually, I've
got a set of skills. It's about building relationships with
other counselors, with central government that could make a difference
for Wellington.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
I want to know whether it's a genuine desire to
help Wellington or it's ae genuine desire to sort of
stay in power. So stay you stay in a political position.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
No, I've done my time in public office. I've gone
back to the practice of law. I've thoroughly endowed being
back in law. I was talking to the law firm
about it's in long term prospects there part of the
there's a I think an attraction to public service, I thought,
and I still think I have a set of skills
that could make a difference for Wellington at a time
that it desperately needs it. And that's what motivated me
(01:59):
to put my hat in the ring. Is public power
a drake? Look, I think I've got a pretty good
track reck of not letting my ego get in the
way of things like this. I think I'm good in
public roles. I'm a good decision maker when I'm in
those sorts of roles. But I've done a long time
in the public eye, but as a union leader, but
(02:20):
also in public office, and I was quite happy going
back to a very private life and life as a lawyer. Well, obviously,
I just think I'm wanting to need something now that
isn't there at the moment.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Hold on a little bit there. Obviously you're not, because
you wouldn't have put your name it to run for me.
If you were happy being you know, quiet Andy instead
of angry Andy. You would have stayed at home and
walked your dog and got.
Speaker 3 (02:43):
On with it.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
You haven't.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
Except that what I saw was a city and a
city council that needs a set of skills. I think
the relationship building skills, both internally, I think some organizational skills.
The more I've got around and spoken to people and
seen the quality of engaged with they having with council offices,
there's something seriously wrong there with some of the council culture.
(03:05):
Those are all things that I've got a track record
and dealing with inside organizations I've been part of, And
so I got to the point where that actually I
do have a set of skills that could make a
difference for Willington, and I think that sense of public
service and public duty that I do have propelled me
to make the decision that I let's.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Move on and some of the things that people in
Wontington care about. Firstly social housing. You know, there's a
lot of people that think that we're you know what,
are we costing us four hundred and thirty nine million
over the next ten years, that's straight on our rates bill.
Do we need as a city to have social housing
when we've got conger or we've got the government doing
it for us.
Speaker 3 (03:42):
But they're not doing it for us, and they had
come or had all sorts of plans which they've now
backed out of a large chi we have to do
it well, we've been doing it for our eighty odd years.
A large chunk of the Wilton City Council social housing
is not is not usable. That's sitting there because the
commitment made however many years ago to do the upgrades
hasn't been followed through on. So I think we need
(04:02):
to do the upgrades at a time when we have grown.
Homelessness are very evident in Wellington. We need to be
doing everything we can to provide that roof other people's
heads who need it along with those who need it
the wrap around services. So we need to fulfill the
commitment we made to see through our social housing program.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Would you, if you become mayor be interested in talking
to the government about taking it over so it takes
all that expense away from Wellington, do we you know?
Speaker 3 (04:29):
Well, we need to have conversations with government about a
lot of things. I think the most useful thing we
could have a conversation with the government about when it
comes to social housing is lifting the number of tenants
who qualified the income related rent subsidies. So the government
at the moment has kept it at ten percent of tenants.
For christ Church City Council that has more social housing
units than we do, the government's kept it at fifty percent.
(04:51):
If we had fifty percent of well As the City
Council social housing tenants on related rent subsidies, it would
largely pay for itself. So that's a conversation we should
have with see.
Speaker 2 (05:00):
When you re look at the costings that we've looked at,
will you re look at it and think see whether
we've got that right or wrong? Because I mean, you know,
half a billion dollars over the next ten years a
lot of money.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Yeah, I think. Look, my principal sort of plank of
my election is everything which we haven't entered into a
contrary for that's in the pipeline of capital works. We
need to have a look at to look at value
for money because we have to do everything we can
to get costs under control and drive down that pressure
on rates. So yes, that would be.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
Now talking about costs, Golden Mile your standards, you want
the Golden Mile to go ahead.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
I've supported in principle because the objectives are the right objectives,
But I am concerned, like a lot of people, at
a couple of things. First of all, the cost the
costings are five years out of date. The government money
that goes with that project is static, so that won't
have changed. So there's a real question about what additional
cost the Council can absorb. And the other is at
a time when the economy is so fragile, protective for
(05:57):
retail and hospitality, just the level of disruption that that
would have and the impact that would have on those businesses.
So those things need to be taken into account on
a decision about whether we proceed with it.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
So what's your gut telling you right now, you walk
the streets, you see it, you're talking to people. What's
your gut?
Speaker 3 (06:11):
Two things the city, the center said, he Courtney place
them to care whatever it does need to spruce up.
There's no question about that. But there's a real question
about what additional cost the council can absorb because the
council's own finances are very fragile at the moment too,
and we have to do everything we can to drive
cost out of the council.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
So just sow our listeners are perfectly clear, not one
hundred percent committed on Golden mile. It's all about whether
you can do it financially. Yeah, there's conditions I've attached
to the Golden Mile. One is financial credibility for like
and disruption to business and minimizing that. I want to
be satisfied that those things can be achieved before coming ahead, right,
(06:52):
could you just put your headphones on for a second.
We've got Peter Peter calling. Good morning. Peter, you have
a question for Andrew Little.
Speaker 4 (07:01):
Thank you very much, guys. I'll be very very quick.
Perhaps that Wellington said, council, the debt say the two
billion mind you, and the hut it's going to be
approaching two billion. Well, what's your specific plan to part
off please?
Speaker 3 (07:18):
Thanks Peter. Look, there's a couple of things that are
really important. The Council's operational spending, what it does on
a day to day basis, that's got to be reviewed.
So I've committed to a line by line review of that.
We have to see whether we're getting value for money,
see with a lot of the stuff we're doing, whether
we still need to continue to do that. And the
other is on the big capital projects. If you have
a look at the what's really put pressure on our
(07:40):
debt burden it is big capital projects just blowing right
out of control. There's clearly a capability gap inside council.
We have to address that and we have to get
better at managing those big projects.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Andrew, if you become mayor on Saturday or mere elect
on Saturday, are we going to hear for the next
six months? Oh this is worse than I thought. This
is where you know, you know, are you going to
hit us with that or you're just going to hit
us with with with you running into power and changing things.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
Well, I think we do need to have a bit
of an opening the books. Let's let's understand what the
picture is. I mean, there is an issue that hasn't
been widely debated in this election campaign, is about what
happens when we flick over to metro water, what impact
that's going to have on household budgets, because that's going
to put real pressure there too, And what that tells
me is that the council has to get on top
(08:24):
of its own spending to keep that downward pressure on rate.
So we do need an honest conversation about what is
there and what's coming at us so that people can
see the decisions that we take over the next three years.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Just very quickly because I've got to go to an
ad break. Have you had a meeting with and with
Matt Prosser, the CEO of Wellington City Council.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
We've met twice since he started, both with both so
opportunistic and just at a social setting. We just agreed.
The first time I met him, I just announced though
which degreed would keep a professional distance. That's the extent
of the contact I've had with him.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Have you looked at the books?
Speaker 3 (08:57):
I've seen what's in the pre election report that council
puts out and obviously the long term plan. There's a
lot of commitments made haven't been signed up to with
con but commitments made. We are going to have to
go through all of those.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
If you just joined the show, We've got Andrew Little
in the final of our contenders to become Mayor of
Wellington on Saturday. A text just come through from Martin
Andrew Heiinik. What local government experience does Andrew have.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
I've never served in local government before. I think what
I see in the Willington City Council is an environment
like all elected environments. It's political, it's about dealing with
people's views and different priorities. My skills are about drawing
people together in an environment like that, building good relationships,
and keeping people focused on the priority issue, which for
(09:45):
right now for Willington City Council is what is best
for Willington.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
Andrew, We've got a couple of callers, so let's go
to them. Thomas, you have a question for Andrew.
Speaker 5 (09:54):
I do, Andrew. We are a group of people who
are often seen as the minority, older people and disabled people,
and the city really isn't that friendly for us. So
I guess you know. We've lobbied, We've done all sorts
of stuff with council staff and with some counselors where
we've had some traction, but our voices are just ignored it.
(10:17):
What are you going to do to make our city
more livable and accessible for disabled people?
Speaker 3 (10:23):
Yeah, thanks Thomas. I think that's a really important question,
and that goes to the whole question about what might
the Golden Mile, if it goes ahead, sort of achieve.
But regardless of that, we still have to we still
have more to do in terms of, you know, curbing
access to buildings, all those sorts of things, access to
green spaces that are accessible to people regardless of their mobility.
(10:44):
There's more that we can do on that. I'm very
keen to see those sorts of developments happening, and again
it's going to be at a time when the Council
has constrained what it can spend future money on.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
Jeremy has a question for Andrew.
Speaker 6 (10:57):
Andrew ray Chung's been running as zero rates increases policy
picked up by some experienced financial professionals Luise Tongue and
poor Elie Smith. You haven't made a commitment to a
number on the rates rises. You call it fantasies, a
fantasy Land.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
What's your question, Jeremy, Well, the question.
Speaker 6 (11:14):
Is what analysis have you made to say that zero
rates rises are not possible.
Speaker 3 (11:19):
The cut of two point eight billion dollars proposed by
batter Wellington involves closing down the zoo, It involves taking
one hundred million dollars out of supporting community facilities like
the community centers like Ko Tonguey, and it means selling
the social housing in the market that doesn't want it.
So those things are impractical. I think there's no question
(11:42):
council spending has got to get under control. It is
a top priority for me and would have to be
a top priority for the future council. And that is important.
But it's not possible to specify what level of rates
increases might come as a result. Clearly, thirty percent increases
over two years is totally unacceptable and we have to
do way better than that.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Andrew, I heard someone on a Q and A program
once saying, you know, only a couple of months ago
when we started talking anybody, any politician that says that
they can give you a zero an increase in rates,
you should never vote for.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Yeah, it's impractical. I think it just doesn't be a
relation to really I mean, part of the thing that
we know that part of the cost driver at the
moment has been the fact that there's this huge catch
up of infrastructure spending that hasn't happened. That said, we're
living in the real world and a thirty percent increase
in rates over two years is really hard on most households.
So the Council does have to weigh up what is
(12:37):
practical and realistic for households with the spending that they're doing.
And we will be in a position where we will
have to say no to some stuff over the next
few years. If we're going to make the books balance.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Can you do that? Are you a no guy? I mean,
are you a guy that's going to walk in there.
I've asked you this question before, and now you've had
some time to probably think about it. Are you the
guy that can walk into council but on the first
job of first day and say, look, we've got too
many staff in there. We need to cut some costs.
I'm going to have to make some people redundant.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
Yeah, and I've done that in previous roles I've had
when I ran the Union, you know, when we had
the economic downturn, we had to gear our staff numbers
to suit. I'm used to dealing with redundancies. I'm used
to dealing with staff and having to reduce staff numbers.
I don't have any problem with about that. If I'm
then a decision making and responsible and leadership role, I've
(13:25):
got to you know, I have a duty to make
sure that the organization I'm responsible for is viable and sustainable,
and that means making those hard decisions.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Now you get your rapes bill, like all of us do,
it's pretty horrific. How are you What are you going
to do?
Speaker 4 (13:40):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (13:40):
And I think that comes back to the point I'm
making is I want to look and see what Council
on a day to day basis is doing. Do we
need to be doing everything that we've got at the moment?
Where can we find savings? I think there is a
real question about some of the functions that have been
contracted out and whether we're getting value for money for
that or whether we sort of bring some services back inside.
But I go back to the big capital projects, and
(14:01):
it's interesting. I've had a few people from inside the
organization or used to be in the organization come to
me over the last few months telling me about their
stories about what they saw and what they think happened
there is. It just seems to me a real capability
question and side that council about running big projects without
the spending getting way out of control. We have to
(14:21):
address that. You do that. The mayor does that through
their relationship with the chief executive. We've got the new
chief executive. I'm used to dealing with chief executives of
big departments and what have you and making my expectations clear,
and I will do that with the backing of a
new council if I'm elected as mayor.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
Now, I haven't had the pleasure of meeting Matt Prosser,
but I hear only good things, which is a great situation.
What's your gut about them? I mean, you've already talked
to them socially. You can work people out pretty quickly,
can't you.
Speaker 3 (14:49):
Yeah. My sense is here's somebody I can work with.
Were established a pretty good rapport and the two occasionals
I met with them, so I'm confident that I can
establish a good when I say a good working relationship,
a relationship that achieves the objectives that people want to see.
The council delivering on.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
What are you visualizing around the actual council table? What
are you thinking? I mean you must have started writing
some names down and looking at it. I mean, are
you concerned?
Speaker 3 (15:14):
Like I'm not concerned, because who turns out there is
who Wellentonians will vote for.
Speaker 4 (15:19):
Look.
Speaker 3 (15:19):
To be honest, I find it pretty hard to pick.
But what I do see of the candidates, and I've
met quite a few of the candidates, I see everybody
is focused on the critical things, getting costs under control,
getting the mojo of the city back. Everybody wants that stuff.
So I'm confident that whoever gets around that table, if
I'm the mayor, I can work with them and we
(15:41):
will find the common ground and the common objectives, and
we'll make Willington a pretty special place to be.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
I want to speed up becase I've got still a
few questions, and I know you're on a time barrier.
We're all on a time barrier. Text question is how
can Andrew Little justify the Golden Mile financially when so
much else needs doing and we're in so much debt.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
Yeah, that's a good question, and it's a large chunk
of the Golden Mile is funded by central government. But
the reality is those cost of five years.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Half though, I mean we're still got to put money.
The counsels still got to put money into it.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
And in fact it'll be less than half now because
there will be cost inflation. So that's why we need
to have a look at it. And if we can't
justify it, then I won't be justifying.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
Hi, Andrew, what have you accomplished in politics that you
think you can carry over into your role as mayor.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Look, I've had I've had lesterally a dozen roles as
a minister, saw through a whole range of changes, legislative changes,
practical changes, organizational changes and politics. You get to do
what you do by building good relationships, both political and administrative.
And that's what I would do if I'm elected as mayor.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
Another texts just come through from Tricia. What will Andrew
do about the City to see Bridge? The decision appears
to be still in limbo.
Speaker 3 (16:52):
I'm a support of the City to see Bridge and
it sounds like as a result of the announcements by
Chris Penk, the minister, with a change in the way
that earthquake ratings are going to be happening is that
there's it looks like that the bridge can stay. There
are some bigger questions about that whole precinct, but I
will be doing everything I can to keep the city
to see.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
Bridge amalgamation, Lower Hot Upper Hot Polydor in Wellington four
or against four.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
I just think look for most Wellingtonians now who live
in those areas plus and Wellington City, we think of
this as a region now. I think about you know,
when my wife and I were raising our son, we
would go to swimming pools in those other areas, We'd
go to parks in those other areas. And a mountain
bike rider, I'd ride my mountain bike and hut valley
tracks and what have you. So I think Wellingtonians increasingly
(17:38):
think of themselves as part of a region, and I
think we should be organizing the cities along that line.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Today, Tory Farno is giving her closing speech as Maya
and Wellington rater.
Speaker 3 (17:50):
Oh look, it's pretty hard to say she's elected to
step out of the race. She served in public office.
She deserves thanks for that. She's going to deliver her
reflections today. People will have a variety of different views
about Tory. I think there in some respects. Tory had
a pretty hard go because of some of the personal
issues that she was also dealing with. But look, this
(18:11):
weekend is the time to turn into a new chapter
and focus on what Wellington needs it particular point.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
You've lived here through the whole three years that Tory's
been here. Is Wellington a better place or a worse
place in the last three years?
Speaker 3 (18:25):
Well, there are some good things that will sort of
become apparent in the next few months. The new library
will open those sorts of things. Those things take time
to get in place. She's made She's led the Council
through some difficult decisions. She's led them through some decisions
like the airport's arsl that probably didn't Would you sell
the way she wanted? No, I wouldn't have sold them
(18:45):
because I think the return to Wellington is too great
and it's too important an asset to be setting down
the holding. Now.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
I know you can see my voting papers there.
Speaker 3 (18:53):
I can see them.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
I know you wanted to grab them, but last time
you're on a show with a camera on you grab something,
it didn't look that good.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
So I'm going to pass them over to you.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
Don't whatever you do, don't give my address out, but
can you just quickly show who I voted for? Please
don't give my dress out?
Speaker 3 (19:12):
No, no, you've got you haven't voted.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
There you go. I just wanted to be open and transparent.
Speaker 3 (19:18):
You have been very good.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
I wanted to wait till everyone had covered it and
discussed it with everyone, and then I'll make my decision
this afternoon.
Speaker 3 (19:27):
All the information, then make your decision. That's a very
rational approach to take.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
Thank you for coming in all the very best for Saturday.
I'm just one little final question. The show's been going
I think thirty something years, right, and it's always had
an agreement, not with me. I always had an agreement
with the Wellington City Council that the mayor would come
in one hour a month and talk to the people
of Wellington. Will you make that commitment? Yes, thank you,
(19:52):
thank you. We had that commitment with the last year.
But what happens if you don't like my questions.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
Like I've had in public life? You devil all sorts
of people. I Mike cost always used to say to me,
He said, every time you get up da onto the show,
you front up, you turn up. That's me. That's what
I do. I'm a lot harder than my cost. We sorry,
but we're not here to be friends. If you're in
a public role, you're accountable, and this is a very
effective means of being accountable, and so that's why I
(20:18):
would do it.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Thank you very much, catch you hopefully for your sake.
Whatever whatever decision the city goes with, we'll we'll we'll
run with it. But we are hoping to speak to
the mayor elect on Monday morning. Cheers, Nick, good luck
for the weekend.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Thank you for more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills.
Listen live to news talks It'd be Wellington from nine
am weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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