Beehive Buzz: Sophie Trigger on the PM's trip to Vietnam, Helen Clark questioning Five Eyes

Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has spent the last week in Vietnam - what has come from the trip?

Also, former Prime Minister Helen Clark appeared on Q+A yesterday - what did she say about the Five Eyes intelligence sharing agreement?

Newstalk ZB chief political reporter Sophie Trigger joined Nick Mills for the Beehive Buzz. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talk SEDB direct from News Talks, Saib's team
at Parliament's the bee Hive Buzzi.

Speaker 2 (00:21):
Joining us this morning for the bee High buzz as
we go to the Beehives, News Talk said be chief
political reporter Sophie Trigger. Good morning, Sophie children Neck.

Speaker 3 (00:29):
How are you.

Speaker 2 (00:30):
I'm very well. What a weekend? What a weekend?

Speaker 3 (00:32):
Roman has been a big weekend? Yeah, yeah, I.

Speaker 2 (00:36):
Was hoping you didn't say, well, I was actually following
the Prime Minister of Vietnam or I was over there.
I was over there because it was a great weekend.
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon's been in Vietnam. What do you
think has been to the main event? What do you
think has come out of that? The fact that he's
been there?

Speaker 3 (00:52):
Yeah, So, as you say, the Prime Minister spent most
of last week in Vietnam where he was with a
senior business delegation, and our political editor Jason Walls has
been with him and he describes it as a really
brilliant week of diplomacy contrasted with quite a terrible week
in New Zealand politics. As Jason said, So this is

(01:13):
the stuff Chris Luckson's actually really good at the meeting
and the greeting, the working of a room, and listening
to Jason's reporting over the past week, lu San's not
been afraid of sort of embracing those awful moments as
well as the handshakes and the small talks. He at
one point jumped on an ev scooter, pretending to ride it.
At another point cooked premium snails with Fonterra cream. But

(01:36):
there was also something tangible to come out of the
week nick a deal called a Comprehensive Strategic Partnership with Vietnam.
So this actually puts New Zealand in a group of
about ten priority countries, making New Zealand a country of
choice when it comes to trade and diplomacy, which isn't
insignificant considering Vietnam as a country of one hundred million

(01:58):
people and New Zealand is a comparatively much smaller trading
nation of five million. So Jason wrote a column over
the weekend and he points out that Chris Lackson's successful
week in Vietnam came at the same time as a
pretty poor week in domestic politics. You'll, of course have
heard that interview between Chris Luxon and Mike Costing last week, Nick,

(02:21):
in which the pair went back and forth for more
than three minutes. I think it was Luxon refusing to
say whether or not he would have sacked former Minister
Andrew Bailey had Bailey himself not resigned, So eventually he
landed on the fact that he would have let Bailey go,
which he's confirmed in subsequent interviews. But it's been quite

(02:41):
telling and revealed quite a lot about Luxon's communication style
and relationship with the media. And there's been some commentary
that it's going to be a bit of a wake
up call for Luxon. So it'll be interesting to have
him back this week, Nick, back at Parliament and to
see if any of those questions come up.

Speaker 2 (03:01):
So if we do we get a list, do we
the public get a list of the people that are
going on the business delegate Gaisha with him or does
that does that kept quite quiet and secretive.

Speaker 3 (03:11):
I don't know if I could answer that, Nick. I'm
not sure exactly who was who was on the delegation. Jason,
as I mentioned, was on that trip and he would
have had a better idea. But whether or not it's
publicly available. That's a good question.

Speaker 2 (03:26):
Yeah, that's what I'm just thinking about. Obviously, Fontierra they've
got an office there, so Fontier people would have been there,
and I suppose a lot of people that are doing business,
big business with Vietnam. I didn't realize the population was
one hundred million. That is massive. That's five times the
size of Australia. So the trade deal becomes very significant,

(03:46):
doesn't it.

Speaker 3 (03:47):
It certainly does, and especially being just one of the
ten countries, it's not something it's not a relationship they're
forming with everyone, so certainly put New Zealand at the
top of the list there.

Speaker 2 (03:59):
What did you make of Helen Clark's interview yesterday? I thought,
I thought she looked she's seventy five. Last week's so
her brain and her presentation was was just like she
was still Prime Minister.

Speaker 3 (04:14):
Yeah, it was a really interesting interview, I thought, Nick,
as you say from TV and thats Q and A.
The part I found particularly interesting was her questioning whether
New Zealand should still be involved in the intelligence sharing
group known as Five Eyes. So that's between the United States,
the United Kingdom, Canada, Australia and New Zealand. So there

(04:35):
was a part when Helen Clark commented on a recent
media report from the Financial Times saying that the Trump
administration wanted to see Canada booted from the arrangement, and
she said, please could we follow So later in the
interview she appeared to soften that stance a little bit,
but she said her main concern with Five Eyes was
the mission creep into areas beyond intelligence. So she noted

(04:58):
that in her time as Prime Minister, the agreement was
so secret that the government wouldn't even confirm it existed,
whereas now it's moved beyond intelligence sharing into other areas
of policy. So, for example, the Five Eyes countries issued
a joint statement on China's crackdown in Hong Kong. They
also cooperate on issues of migration, and during the pandemic,

(05:20):
the five countries had joint meetings between their finance ministers.
So being able to get FaceTime with these leaders obviously
has some advantages for New Zealand. But Helen Clark is
concerned that the Mission creep sort of isn't being properly
scrutinized and we Zealand could end up being involved in

(05:40):
something that is a bit more of a formal alliance,
I suppose.

Speaker 2 (05:43):
See, So I thought, I mean Ethans took the same
readout of it that you did that she wanted out
of five Eyes. What I thought she actually wanted to
do was keep Five Eyes what it was a secretive organization.
She feels that it's too out the open. That's that's
the take that I took from Helen Clark on it.
But it's interesting that you both took the take that
she probably not stay involved with it.

Speaker 1 (06:05):
Well.

Speaker 3 (06:05):
She went on to say that it would be useful
if it went back to being sort of a quiet,
intelligent sharing polic like what it had been, but she's
concerned that it's it's moving more into a coordination of
foreign policy positioning.

Speaker 2 (06:22):
That's right. Okay, what are we expecting to see at
Parliament this week? I mean the Prime Minister comes back
it as he get a cop it a bit for
his interview with Oscar Our videos.

Speaker 3 (06:32):
Oh potentially potentially Nick, Yeah, that corsitting week after recess
week last week and with the Prime Minister away, so
we'll be hearing from him this afternoon at the post
Cabinet press conference. Also, we're going to have you know
the likes of former Minister Andrew Bailey back in Parliament
and face to face with the press gallery for the

(06:53):
first time. Another minister is also likely to face the
scrutiny this week, and that's New Zealand's First Minister, Mark Patterson,
who's the rural community is an Associate Agricultural Minister. So
last week it was reported that the Ministry of Primary
Industries has stopped sending employees to work in Patterson's office

(07:13):
after complaints from staff. Now the complaints aren't said to
be directly about the minister, but it is something that
he's likely to be questioned on this week. The other
major global news story, of course, that's likely to feature
is the latest developments in the Russian invasion of Ukraine
and that sit down in the Oval Office over the

(07:35):
weekend between voladimirsa Zelensky, Donald Trump and JD Vance. We've
seen Chris Luckson among the global leaders, making a statement
on x to reaffirm his backing for Ukraine. The tweet
read New Zealand remains steadfast in its support for Ukraine
as it defends itself in a war that Russia started.
It's mounting the defense of a proud democratic and sovereign nation,

(07:58):
but also the defense of international law.

Speaker 2 (08:01):
There you go, there go, he came out. I didn't
think that lux And would be so quick to come
out with that one, but he did. Thanks great to
talk to you, Sophie. Trigger We are actually live at
the Beehive with Sophie.

Speaker 1 (08:14):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
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