November 25, 2025 • 7 mins
Dwell Housing CEO Elizabeth Lester joins Nick Mills to discuss the new initiative to help homelessness in the Wellington CBD.
Dwell is partnering with Downtown Community Ministry (DCM) to provide more support to our homeless population in Wellington. Lester discusses what the programme has accomplished so far and the future for the city if it were to be expanded. 40 homes are being supplied, Dwell and DCM say they now hope the Government will back an expansion of the programme.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News TALKSB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Over the last few months, probably the last few years,
we've talked about homeless people on our streets and what
we need to do. We've talked about doing everything from
taking hoses down the streets to kicking them out. But
what do you do with homeless people? Well, there's an
organization that wants to help them. It's called Dwell Housing
Trust and their CEO is Elizabeth Lester. Good morning, Elizabeth morning.
(00:37):
We have talked, not me and you, but we have
talked on this show many times about the issue that
we've got with homeless on our streets. Your organization, Dwell
Housing Trust, wants to do something about it. Tell us
what you're going to do.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Well.
Speaker 3 (00:52):
We think the real solution for homelessness is homes. We're
all about long term solutions. Dwell has been operating in
Wellington for almost forty five years, so we are partnering
with DCM, who've also been around in the city doing
some tenantastic work. We've formed a partnership to directly address
homelessness in the city. They are going to focus on
(01:13):
the people and we're going to focus on the home.
So we've joined up. We've got some government support via
the Housing First program to move people into homes, wrap
them up in the support they need and focus on
their long term success.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Now, for our listeners that don't know what DCM is,
it's a downtown Community ministry. Tell us a bit about them.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
They have been working with our rough sleepers, Wellington's homeless
population for years. They are specialists at dealing with people
who are suffering from trauma and a lot of the
complex needs that come with our rough sleepers. They are
experts in that area, so they hold those relationships. Dwell
(01:59):
has been working in the social housing property management space
for a long time, so we think that we're bringing
our strengths to together. Really makes sense.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
And how do you do that?
Speaker 3 (02:10):
They wrap up the people with the support. We lease
properties from private landlords and walk alongside the tenants, so
that the theory is you provide the four walls first,
but that it goes beyond that, so that they need
people to walk alongside them, help them with those other
things that are preventing them from being tenants on their own.
(02:31):
So it might be, you know, they've suffered from trauma, abuse,
domestic violence is a wide range of things. But together
we can work with them to bring them some dignity
and get them a long term solution rather than moving
them on. You know that's not going to work.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
So the moving on situation, we've talked about that also,
it's just putting them from one area to another area.
It doesn't fix anything. So it doesn't So how bigger
issue do you actually believe it is, Elizabeth?
Speaker 3 (03:02):
Well, you know, the numbers are hard to quantify, but
we think there's between one hundred and one hundred and
fifty people in Wellington right now rough sleeping. We know
that criminalizing as is not going to work, it's just
going to move the situation on. We think that the
only real solution to homelessness is homes. This is a
proven international program called Housing First. DCM have measured it
(03:25):
over five years. They measured that ninety two percent of
the people that went through this program was successful and
could then sustain a long term tenancy on their own.
Ninety two percents. Brilliant.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
What do you think of the government's promises to deal
with homelessness. I mean, we've heard this before. Are they
doing anything concrete to prove that they are doing something
about it.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Well, this, this program is supported by government, so this
is the answer. It just needs the funding to be expanded.
And I know that the numbers are higher in Auckland,
but this, you know, the start here with forty extra
people off the streets, that will make a significant difference
in Wellington. If this is successful, we believe it can
be double tripled to really addres the issue. And you know,
(04:08):
we're looking forward to having that support from government because
you know, we know it works.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Do you see the day that you can walk down
williw Street to a courtny place and see no homeless
on the streets?
Speaker 3 (04:18):
I really hope. So you know, it's not a quick fix.
This is not going to happen overnight. If we want
to set people up for success, we really need to
walk on the journey alongside them. So this is not
something that's going to happen by tomorrow. But if we
set them up for success, it will work over time.
And we can't take or we can't always look for
(04:40):
solutions that just take five minutes. You know, moving people
out of emergency housing hasn't worked. Moving people from the
central city into the suburbs is not something that will work.
We have to look long term and take a people
centered approach.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
What do you need us, the people of Wellington to
do to assist you and help you.
Speaker 3 (04:59):
We need properties, so we don't have enough properties that
we own ourselves to provide the numbers, so we need
to work with private owners. And this is a really
good deal for private landlords. Guaranteed rents, no tendency management costs,
capable property managers, long term leases. You know there's a
lot of people out there with long with vacant rentals
(05:20):
right now, we consolve that will return it to you
at the end the same condition that was in at
the beginning, minus a bit of wear and tear. But
this is a great deal for property owners, you know,
funded by government.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
So how do you, I suppose, convince private landlords to
take a risk because the sort of people that they
are going to have as tenants are people that have
normally been living on the streets. They don't tend to
look after their properties like they own them.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
Sure, but that's what this program is about. The risks
are funded. You know, we are funded enough to cover
every eventuality and we take care of that. All we
want and all we do is say to the landlords
will return it to you at the end in the
same condition it was at the beginning. You don't have
to worry about a thing. And you know, we need
we need those landlords, and we also need the community
(06:12):
to be understanding that we're working on this and it's
going to take some time, but boy, it will be successful.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Gosh, I hope it's successful, Elizabeth. I think this is
an amazing idea. It's called the dwell Housing Trust. It's
been around for forty five years, and yet I've never
heard of it. I mean, how does that happen? How
do you work under the radar like that?
Speaker 3 (06:31):
We're quiet achievers.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
You definitely are quiet achievers. And I hope you know, Gosh,
every part of me hopes that you've got it right
and this plan does work. We need to try and
help the people that have got nowhere to live and
be help the streets feel like a bigger, better and
safer place. Do you get landlords ringing you and saying,
hey you, we'll give you our place.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
Yes? Absolutely. You did your peace last week and we
had landlords ringing up on the phone straight away afterwards.
And it's just good to remember that what's good for
our homeless population, is good for our city. You know,
these are New Zealanders, they've had fallen on tough times.
You know, a lot of us are a couple of
pages away from being homeless. Is a lot of women homeless.
There is a lot of people you know have suffered
(07:12):
domestic violence. They need our support. So we shouldn't be
punishing them. We should be walking alongside them. And I
think Wellingtonian's are sympathetic to that and we'll get behind us.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Well said one hundred percent. I call it a light
switch moment in your life. You turn you know, your
life can turn around like you turn a light on
and off.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
This is something yep.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
So good on you and thank you very much. Thank
you for doing what you do. And I'll definitely be
as supportive as I possibly can because I think it's
a great plan and I wish you and the DCM
all the best of luck. Let's dwell Housing Trust CEO
Elizabeth Leicester, what a great job.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
That much.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
Thank you so much, don't thank me.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
Thank you for more From Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills.
Listen live to news talks. There'd be Wellington from nine
am weekdays or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio,
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News TALKSB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Over the last few months, probably the last few years,
we've talked about homeless people on our streets and what
we need to do. We've talked about doing everything from
taking hoses down the streets to kicking them out. But
what do you do with homeless people? Well, there's an
organization that wants to help them. It's called Dwell Housing
Trust and their CEO is Elizabeth Lester. Good morning, Elizabeth morning.
(00:37):
We have talked, not me and you, but we have
talked on this show many times about the issue that
we've got with homeless on our streets. Your organization, Dwell
Housing Trust, wants to do something about it. Tell us
what you're going to do.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Well.
Speaker 3 (00:52):
We think the real solution for homelessness is homes. We're
all about long term solutions. Dwell has been operating in
Wellington for almost forty five years, so we are partnering
with DCM, who've also been around in the city doing
some tenantastic work. We've formed a partnership to directly address
homelessness in the city. They are going to focus on
(01:13):
the people and we're going to focus on the home.
So we've joined up. We've got some government support via
the Housing First program to move people into homes, wrap
them up in the support they need and focus on
their long term success.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Now, for our listeners that don't know what DCM is,
it's a downtown Community ministry. Tell us a bit about them.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
They have been working with our rough sleepers, Wellington's homeless
population for years. They are specialists at dealing with people
who are suffering from trauma and a lot of the
complex needs that come with our rough sleepers. They are
experts in that area, so they hold those relationships. Dwell
(01:59):
has been working in the social housing property management space
for a long time, so we think that we're bringing
our strengths to together. Really makes sense.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
And how do you do that?
Speaker 3 (02:10):
They wrap up the people with the support. We lease
properties from private landlords and walk alongside the tenants, so
that the theory is you provide the four walls first,
but that it goes beyond that, so that they need
people to walk alongside them, help them with those other
things that are preventing them from being tenants on their own.
(02:31):
So it might be, you know, they've suffered from trauma, abuse,
domestic violence is a wide range of things. But together
we can work with them to bring them some dignity
and get them a long term solution rather than moving
them on. You know that's not going to work.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
So the moving on situation, we've talked about that also,
it's just putting them from one area to another area.
It doesn't fix anything. So it doesn't So how bigger
issue do you actually believe it is, Elizabeth?
Speaker 3 (03:02):
Well, you know, the numbers are hard to quantify, but
we think there's between one hundred and one hundred and
fifty people in Wellington right now rough sleeping. We know
that criminalizing as is not going to work, it's just
going to move the situation on. We think that the
only real solution to homelessness is homes. This is a
proven international program called Housing First. DCM have measured it
(03:25):
over five years. They measured that ninety two percent of
the people that went through this program was successful and
could then sustain a long term tenancy on their own.
Ninety two percents. Brilliant.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
What do you think of the government's promises to deal
with homelessness. I mean, we've heard this before. Are they
doing anything concrete to prove that they are doing something
about it.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Well, this, this program is supported by government, so this
is the answer. It just needs the funding to be expanded.
And I know that the numbers are higher in Auckland,
but this, you know, the start here with forty extra
people off the streets, that will make a significant difference
in Wellington. If this is successful, we believe it can
be double tripled to really addres the issue. And you know,
(04:08):
we're looking forward to having that support from government because
you know, we know it works.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Do you see the day that you can walk down
williw Street to a courtny place and see no homeless
on the streets?
Speaker 3 (04:18):
I really hope. So you know, it's not a quick fix.
This is not going to happen overnight. If we want
to set people up for success, we really need to
walk on the journey alongside them. So this is not
something that's going to happen by tomorrow. But if we
set them up for success, it will work over time.
And we can't take or we can't always look for
(04:40):
solutions that just take five minutes. You know, moving people
out of emergency housing hasn't worked. Moving people from the
central city into the suburbs is not something that will work.
We have to look long term and take a people
centered approach.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
What do you need us, the people of Wellington to
do to assist you and help you.
Speaker 3 (04:59):
We need properties, so we don't have enough properties that
we own ourselves to provide the numbers, so we need
to work with private owners. And this is a really
good deal for private landlords. Guaranteed rents, no tendency management costs,
capable property managers, long term leases. You know there's a
lot of people out there with long with vacant rentals
(05:20):
right now, we consolve that will return it to you
at the end the same condition that was in at
the beginning, minus a bit of wear and tear. But
this is a great deal for property owners, you know,
funded by government.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
So how do you, I suppose, convince private landlords to
take a risk because the sort of people that they
are going to have as tenants are people that have
normally been living on the streets. They don't tend to
look after their properties like they own them.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
Sure, but that's what this program is about. The risks
are funded. You know, we are funded enough to cover
every eventuality and we take care of that. All we
want and all we do is say to the landlords
will return it to you at the end in the
same condition it was at the beginning. You don't have
to worry about a thing. And you know, we need
we need those landlords, and we also need the community
(06:12):
to be understanding that we're working on this and it's
going to take some time, but boy, it will be successful.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Gosh, I hope it's successful, Elizabeth. I think this is
an amazing idea. It's called the dwell Housing Trust. It's
been around for forty five years, and yet I've never
heard of it. I mean, how does that happen? How
do you work under the radar like that?
Speaker 3 (06:31):
We're quiet achievers.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
You definitely are quiet achievers. And I hope you know, Gosh,
every part of me hopes that you've got it right
and this plan does work. We need to try and
help the people that have got nowhere to live and
be help the streets feel like a bigger, better and
safer place. Do you get landlords ringing you and saying,
hey you, we'll give you our place.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
Yes? Absolutely. You did your peace last week and we
had landlords ringing up on the phone straight away afterwards.
And it's just good to remember that what's good for
our homeless population, is good for our city. You know,
these are New Zealanders, they've had fallen on tough times.
You know, a lot of us are a couple of
pages away from being homeless. Is a lot of women homeless.
There is a lot of people you know have suffered
(07:12):
domestic violence. They need our support. So we shouldn't be
punishing them. We should be walking alongside them. And I
think Wellingtonian's are sympathetic to that and we'll get behind us.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Well said one hundred percent. I call it a light
switch moment in your life. You turn you know, your
life can turn around like you turn a light on
and off.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
This is something yep.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
So good on you and thank you very much. Thank
you for doing what you do. And I'll definitely be
as supportive as I possibly can because I think it's
a great plan and I wish you and the DCM
all the best of luck. Let's dwell Housing Trust CEO
Elizabeth Leicester, what a great job.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
That much.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
Thank you so much, don't thank me.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
Thank you for more From Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills.
Listen live to news talks. There'd be Wellington from nine
am weekdays or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio,
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