December 14, 2025 • 9 mins
We sent our newsreader Max Towle to interview acclaimed director James Cameron before the premiere of his new film Avatar: Fire and Ash.
Max sat down with the legend to ask him about the film, the future of the franchise and what makes Wellington special to him.
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
EDB next toll with News Talks AB for Wellington Mornings
with Nick Mills. First of all, congratulations, a wonderful spectacle
and a wonderful occasion for Wellington with the premiere in
the city. What's your impression of Wellington whenever you come
into the city. Well, I live here well in White
at Apple south Wide Apple.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
But the city I was in Town and Rosney.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Do you spend much time in the city.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Yeah, I mean when I, for example, finishing the Avatar
films for the last couple of years, every day is here.
In fact, I have a hard time getting over to
the farm, you know, although I can edit over there,
but I can't do a lot of the finish work
over there in terms of sound mixer and so on
that we do. We do it at Park Road Post right,
and our officers are based at Stone Street.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
There seems to be a sort of impressionate moment in
the city that it's stagnating, that things perhaps aren't.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Is the city itself, the.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
City itself is thriving, is perhaps it should be? Is
that your impression?
Speaker 3 (01:09):
That's not my impression, and I don't have the ash
warials that show that we're you know, down in GDP
or whatever. I don't know that. I don't know what
the metrics are for that. You know. I was certainly
involved in that group that was the future of Wellington
sort of sort of you know, ad hoc town hall
kind of kind of group, and that seemed to be
(01:31):
the impetus for pulling that together. But that's just not
my personal impression. But again I'm quite focused in the
screen sector. I would say in terms of screen sector,
were down definitely, you know, Like I said, my base
of operations is at Stone Street and that studio has
had tumbleweeds blown through the stages for probably about a
(01:52):
year and a half now.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Joe Bluss is at West Effects as well.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
That's year, yes, exactly. So everything's down. The whole theatrical
market is down globally, which is not good news for
anybody in the entertainment business. And I think that, you know,
we have to work hard here in New Zealand. I
think going forward to recapture that share of the production
market that we used to have, you know, and I
think that the little incremental change to the to the
(02:17):
rebate scheme recently is it's it's it's an effort in
the right direction, but it's far from sufficient to do that.
And I also think that we need to focus on
training because we need depth of crew. And I see
all the all the crew aging forward without replacement coming
in behind them, and I don't want to lose that
knowledge base and that capability. So it's hard to encourage
(02:40):
young people to come into these trades when demonstrably we're
not getting as much production. So it's a little bit
of a chicken and the egg problem.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Do you interact much with politicians? You do much lobbying
for the rebate for instance, for improving training these pathways.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
I've found it healthy to not interact with politicians as
much as possible. That said, I'm more than willing to
meet with whom ever is interested in helping to bolster
the screen screen sector in the in the country. Yeah,
I want to be involved in that going forward. I
think it's important to have the voices of you know,
(03:19):
because because I straddle two worlds, right, I mean, I
don't spend much time in Hollywood, and I don't think
of myself as a Hollywood guy, but I definitely know
all those people, and I know how they think.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
Well, it feels like we're about as far away from
Hollywood as possible.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
Here is and that's a good thing.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Is that part of the reason that oh live here
and you want to be here as much as possible?
Speaker 3 (03:38):
Absolutely? I just you know, I wanted to raise my
kids in a in a value system that wasn't highly
materialistic like in Los Angeles. We lived in Malibu, which
was nice and kind of secluded, but you were still
you were still caught in that sort of Gucci mentality,
you know. And that's not who we are. That's not
(03:58):
how we see ourselves. I'm talking about my wife, Susie
and I And that's certainly not how our kids see themselves.
They're all young adults now, but they're deeply appreciative of
our move to New Zealand as a family now and
have fit in and want to fit in, and have
absorbed a lot of the culture. So and I mean
(04:19):
even including mari culture in that you know, two of
our kids have Marii partners, so they're learning a lot
at Torio and all that. And and they mock me
because of my pronunciation, which is you know fair, I
would say.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Sometimes in the future touch with the two next sequels,
do go ahead. You're committed to working with what digital
for instance, filming parts of the movie in New Zealand,
You've committed to Wellington in the country.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Yeah, I think it's safe to say. I mean, look,
we have to reevaluate, reevaluate the business model for Avatar
in general based on how well the film does this
next film. The market is changing and shifting worldwide with
the advent of streaming and the partial collapse of the
theatrical marketplace, Avatar movies may not be viable no matter
(05:11):
where we make them. That's an issue that I'm prepared
to confront. And we also have, like I said, challenges
right here in New Zealand. So to me, it's going
to be an analytical process for the next year or so.
We're not just going to plunge straight back into production.
And there are other things I want to do as well,
other stories I want to tell.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
Well, in terms of the stories you want to tell
with the Avatar films, now with Fire and Dash, when
you start work on the film, are you working from
a point of the visuals you want to show, or
do you start with the story you want to tell
or is it all symbiotic.
Speaker 3 (05:46):
I think it's a combination of both. I always say
in my writing process that I work forward from character,
and I work backward from set pieces that I imagine
that I want to see, because they start as a
visual artist, right, I draw and paint and all of
those things. Not so much lately, but I used to.
And some of the visual ideas have been around for
a long time. I haven't even gotten to them yet.
(06:08):
So I have visual set pieces. I have visual ideas,
some of which are inspired by some of the other
artists that are working on the film. Oh, we don't
have time for that one this time. Let's push that
down the line. But I always work forward from character,
and that's obviously the most important driver, because you know,
the journal consensus we're getting on this film anecdotally is
(06:30):
that it's the most emotional by far of the three,
and that's by design. And you do that by familiarizing
the audience with the characters and their unique sets of
problems and then putting them under increasing jeopardy. And I
don't mean physical jeopardy like they could killed by the
ash people, but I mean emotional, psychological jeopardy.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
There's also you can't help but feel this underlying message
about climate protection, climate action, how important it is to
protect our world. The current government in New Zealand's has
been seen as perhaps anti climate in some of the
ways that measures have been rolled out. Yeah, do you
have an opinion on that?
Speaker 3 (07:15):
Well, look, I think that that, you know, typically a
more right leaning government that's business friendly is going to
wind up in at a kind of an anti environmental
stance or at least being very neutral, certainly not going
to push that agenda. And that's true everywhere. I'm much
more concerned with the backlash in the US, where they're
literally unwinding all of the good work that has been done.
(07:37):
I mean, it was just in the Los Angeles Times
yesterday that the EPA, the so called Environmental Protection Agency,
went enlisting all of the causes of climate change, neglected
to mention fossil fuels, even though the entire the scientific
consensus is that that's accounting for ninety plus percent of it,
you know, sort of anthropogenic sources. So I would say
(08:01):
that even though I'm not in favor of New Zealand
turning its back on climate, at least we're not going
backwards here and we may not be progressing the way
we the way we should. So look, I mean, any
responsible citizen of the world, especially in a country like ours,
where we celebrate nature and we celebrate a kind of
(08:22):
almost imaginary, pristine version you know of New Zealand, where
we protect the birds and we have predator free zones
and all that sort of thing. We need to be
consistent because you can't preserve that that natural ecosystem with
the entire world changing. You know, winds, I mean, especially
right here in Wellington. Winds are going to become even
(08:45):
more active in a more dynamic, heated world, which is
where we're heading.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Very briefly. Your favorite place to go out to eat, drink,
coffee and Wellington?
Speaker 3 (08:58):
Oh, well, I'm vegan, so there are some There are
some good vegan restaurants. I don't want anybody flocking there,
so I'm not going to say I realize I'll never
get a reservation.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Well, thank you very much for your time. Much appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
Okay, pleasure.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news talks It'd be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio,
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
EDB next toll with News Talks AB for Wellington Mornings
with Nick Mills. First of all, congratulations, a wonderful spectacle
and a wonderful occasion for Wellington with the premiere in
the city. What's your impression of Wellington whenever you come
into the city. Well, I live here well in White
at Apple south Wide Apple.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
But the city I was in Town and Rosney.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Do you spend much time in the city.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Yeah, I mean when I, for example, finishing the Avatar
films for the last couple of years, every day is here.
In fact, I have a hard time getting over to
the farm, you know, although I can edit over there,
but I can't do a lot of the finish work
over there in terms of sound mixer and so on
that we do. We do it at Park Road Post right,
and our officers are based at Stone Street.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
There seems to be a sort of impressionate moment in
the city that it's stagnating, that things perhaps aren't.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Is the city itself, the.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
City itself is thriving, is perhaps it should be? Is
that your impression?
Speaker 3 (01:09):
That's not my impression, and I don't have the ash
warials that show that we're you know, down in GDP
or whatever. I don't know that. I don't know what
the metrics are for that. You know. I was certainly
involved in that group that was the future of Wellington
sort of sort of you know, ad hoc town hall
kind of kind of group, and that seemed to be
(01:31):
the impetus for pulling that together. But that's just not
my personal impression. But again I'm quite focused in the
screen sector. I would say in terms of screen sector,
were down definitely, you know, Like I said, my base
of operations is at Stone Street and that studio has
had tumbleweeds blown through the stages for probably about a
(01:52):
year and a half now.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Joe Bluss is at West Effects as well.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
That's year, yes, exactly. So everything's down. The whole theatrical
market is down globally, which is not good news for
anybody in the entertainment business. And I think that, you know,
we have to work hard here in New Zealand. I
think going forward to recapture that share of the production
market that we used to have, you know, and I
think that the little incremental change to the to the
(02:17):
rebate scheme recently is it's it's it's an effort in
the right direction, but it's far from sufficient to do that.
And I also think that we need to focus on
training because we need depth of crew. And I see
all the all the crew aging forward without replacement coming
in behind them, and I don't want to lose that
knowledge base and that capability. So it's hard to encourage
(02:40):
young people to come into these trades when demonstrably we're
not getting as much production. So it's a little bit
of a chicken and the egg problem.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Do you interact much with politicians? You do much lobbying
for the rebate for instance, for improving training these pathways.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
I've found it healthy to not interact with politicians as
much as possible. That said, I'm more than willing to
meet with whom ever is interested in helping to bolster
the screen screen sector in the in the country. Yeah,
I want to be involved in that going forward. I
think it's important to have the voices of you know,
(03:19):
because because I straddle two worlds, right, I mean, I
don't spend much time in Hollywood, and I don't think
of myself as a Hollywood guy, but I definitely know
all those people, and I know how they think.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
Well, it feels like we're about as far away from
Hollywood as possible.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
Here is and that's a good thing.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Is that part of the reason that oh live here
and you want to be here as much as possible?
Speaker 3 (03:38):
Absolutely? I just you know, I wanted to raise my
kids in a in a value system that wasn't highly
materialistic like in Los Angeles. We lived in Malibu, which
was nice and kind of secluded, but you were still
you were still caught in that sort of Gucci mentality,
you know. And that's not who we are. That's not
(03:58):
how we see ourselves. I'm talking about my wife, Susie
and I And that's certainly not how our kids see themselves.
They're all young adults now, but they're deeply appreciative of
our move to New Zealand as a family now and
have fit in and want to fit in, and have
absorbed a lot of the culture. So and I mean
(04:19):
even including mari culture in that you know, two of
our kids have Marii partners, so they're learning a lot
at Torio and all that. And and they mock me
because of my pronunciation, which is you know fair, I
would say.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Sometimes in the future touch with the two next sequels,
do go ahead. You're committed to working with what digital
for instance, filming parts of the movie in New Zealand,
You've committed to Wellington in the country.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Yeah, I think it's safe to say. I mean, look,
we have to reevaluate, reevaluate the business model for Avatar
in general based on how well the film does this
next film. The market is changing and shifting worldwide with
the advent of streaming and the partial collapse of the
theatrical marketplace, Avatar movies may not be viable no matter
(05:11):
where we make them. That's an issue that I'm prepared
to confront. And we also have, like I said, challenges
right here in New Zealand. So to me, it's going
to be an analytical process for the next year or so.
We're not just going to plunge straight back into production.
And there are other things I want to do as well,
other stories I want to tell.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
Well, in terms of the stories you want to tell
with the Avatar films, now with Fire and Dash, when
you start work on the film, are you working from
a point of the visuals you want to show, or
do you start with the story you want to tell
or is it all symbiotic.
Speaker 3 (05:46):
I think it's a combination of both. I always say
in my writing process that I work forward from character,
and I work backward from set pieces that I imagine
that I want to see, because they start as a
visual artist, right, I draw and paint and all of
those things. Not so much lately, but I used to.
And some of the visual ideas have been around for
a long time. I haven't even gotten to them yet.
(06:08):
So I have visual set pieces. I have visual ideas,
some of which are inspired by some of the other
artists that are working on the film. Oh, we don't
have time for that one this time. Let's push that
down the line. But I always work forward from character,
and that's obviously the most important driver, because you know,
the journal consensus we're getting on this film anecdotally is
(06:30):
that it's the most emotional by far of the three,
and that's by design. And you do that by familiarizing
the audience with the characters and their unique sets of
problems and then putting them under increasing jeopardy. And I
don't mean physical jeopardy like they could killed by the
ash people, but I mean emotional, psychological jeopardy.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
There's also you can't help but feel this underlying message
about climate protection, climate action, how important it is to
protect our world. The current government in New Zealand's has
been seen as perhaps anti climate in some of the
ways that measures have been rolled out. Yeah, do you
have an opinion on that?
Speaker 3 (07:15):
Well, look, I think that that, you know, typically a
more right leaning government that's business friendly is going to
wind up in at a kind of an anti environmental
stance or at least being very neutral, certainly not going
to push that agenda. And that's true everywhere. I'm much
more concerned with the backlash in the US, where they're
literally unwinding all of the good work that has been done.
(07:37):
I mean, it was just in the Los Angeles Times
yesterday that the EPA, the so called Environmental Protection Agency,
went enlisting all of the causes of climate change, neglected
to mention fossil fuels, even though the entire the scientific
consensus is that that's accounting for ninety plus percent of it,
you know, sort of anthropogenic sources. So I would say
(08:01):
that even though I'm not in favor of New Zealand
turning its back on climate, at least we're not going
backwards here and we may not be progressing the way
we the way we should. So look, I mean, any
responsible citizen of the world, especially in a country like ours,
where we celebrate nature and we celebrate a kind of
(08:22):
almost imaginary, pristine version you know of New Zealand, where
we protect the birds and we have predator free zones
and all that sort of thing. We need to be
consistent because you can't preserve that that natural ecosystem with
the entire world changing. You know, winds, I mean, especially
right here in Wellington. Winds are going to become even
(08:45):
more active in a more dynamic, heated world, which is
where we're heading.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
Very briefly. Your favorite place to go out to eat, drink,
coffee and Wellington?
Speaker 3 (08:58):
Oh, well, I'm vegan, so there are some There are
some good vegan restaurants. I don't want anybody flocking there,
so I'm not going to say I realize I'll never
get a reservation.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Well, thank you very much for your time. Much appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
Okay, pleasure.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news talks It'd be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio,
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