Part One: Erik Prince: The Rich Kid Who Bought An Army

Have you ever heard of a guy named Erik Prince? In episode 23, Robert is joined by Miles Gray (The Daily Zeitgeist) and they discuss the life of Erik Prince the man who wants his own Air Force. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Mmm, Hello Internet, and welcome back. I am Robert Evans,
and this is Behind the Bastards, the show where we
tell you everything you don't know about the worst people
in history. Today, our subject is a little guy named
Eric Prince. Miles, what do you know about Eric Prince?

(00:21):
I know they started black Water, Okay, I know he's
the brother of Betsy Devas, right, uh. And I just
know about like how generally black Water is evil and
there's some Funcker involved. But aside from that, I just
know Eric Prince equals Blackwater, equals military contractors equals war crimes. Okay, Yeah,
that's a good that's a good basic basic line. Well,
Eric was born on June SI. Yes, but nine, so

(00:47):
the summer D Day of the Summer of Love. I
don't know why I'm obsessed with D Day. It's a
good it's a good day. Yeah, it was, I think
Private Ryan actually yeah. Uh. I was born in Holland, Michigan.
His father was Edgar Prince, an entrepreneur who built a
billion dollar company, the Prince Machine Corporation, from the ground up.
His company built like a type of illuminated mirror that's

(01:08):
common in cars today, so his family got super rich
weight off what do you mean an illuminated like a
like a back lit mirror exactly, so that like you
can see it in the mirror at night or whatever.
They're living off that invention. Basically that that's how his
family got rich. So his his dad was like a
legitimate started making forty cents an hour and like created
a business, got super rich. Uh, and then you know,

(01:31):
with his money, decided he should do some good in
the world. But his version of good was founding the
Family Research Council. You know what the Family Research Council does.
The I know they were spreading some kind of really
bad misinformation back in the day, back in the now too. Um.
One of their staffers wrote in nine gaining access to

(01:52):
children was a long term goal of the homosexual movement. Um.
So it's that kind of like anytime there's family mean facts, Yeah,
I shout out to the Family Research Council for their Wow.
So that was his version, okay, that he wanted to spread.
That's what he wanted to do with his money. Full
fucking conspiracy. Okay. Yeah. Eric's mother, Elsa, donated seventy dollars

(02:13):
to a campaign to stop same sex marriage in two
thousand four clearly worked. Uh at, Elsa and Edgar also
formed the Prince Foundation so that they could use their
families wealth to advance general right wing causes like abstinence
only education, state sponsored prayer in the fight against abortion UM.
In order to get around restrictions on lobbying, the Princes
reclassified their lobbying as prayer warrior networks. So basically they said, like,

(02:37):
we're not lobbying politicians. We're asking them to pray over
certain issues. So we're not saying vote against abortion. We're
saying pray against abortion, and that's different. So we can
spend our money with less restrictions. So they were they
were registered as lobbyists before, uh yeah, and there's more
restrictions on how lobbyists conspinue, so they were like, we're

(02:58):
not lobbyists. Were prayer warriors? Do? They just kind of
do that thing where a lot of people dark money
groups just become five oh one C four's Yeah. It
was something like that, like those nonprofits that don't have
to disclose any of their origins of their money so
they can do whatever. Yeah. Yeah, they found a shady
way to make themselves less accountable with the billions or
millions of dollars that they were spending on garbage. Um,

(03:19):
you obviously heard that Eric's sister is Betsy Divace. Um,
it's probably won't surprise you to know that he grew
up religious, conservative and rich. No, he donated fifteen thousand
dollars to the Republican Party when he was nineteen. Um,
I'm sorry, fifteen thousand dollars when he was well, so
he's a normal guy. Yeah. I know, for a second,
I've I forgot that. You said he grew up rich,

(03:41):
and I was like, what fucking job did you have
in high school that he had? That with twenty But
you're rich, So his job was being a rich kid.
Or you know, his parents just used him to make
as much of a max out donation to the party.
They love to do that, just like get the kids
to donate and we can give you a lot of money,
donate a lot of money. Yeah, nineteen year old has
fifteen thousand dollars. Yeah, but he was he was. He was,
you know, a normal, down to earth kid like most people.

(04:01):
He got his pilot's license before he got his driver's license,
you know that that old canard. Uh. He attended a
Christian high school in Holland. But but halland Michigan, not
the cool halland that the Netherlands. Yeah. Uh. He went
to the Naval Academy, but according to one of his professors,
he did not think it was conservative enough, so he
left to attend Hillsdale College. That the military wasn't conservative.

(04:21):
The Naval Academy is a bastion of left wing job
and hippies with long hair. Like that almost seems like
he's trying to impress someone. But I mean, like, oh,
the Navy wasn't conservative enough for me, so I had
to leave like that. Well, Eric denies that that's why
he left the Navy. One of his professors is the
one saying he was piste off because we, the Navy professors,

(04:42):
weren't conservative enough for him. Oh got you that? Yeah right,
He didn't want people to expand his way of thinking. Yeah, yeah,
that that's what it seems like. Um, so, do you
know anything about Hillsdale College. No, I don't know anything
about college. Hillsdale College is like one of the rightest
wing colleges in the country. Um. They basicallyly worship the
economic theories of Vine rand Um for some sort of

(05:04):
color on what the schools. Like in two thousand fifteen,
their school chaplain sent this email out to students and faculty. Hey, friends,
exclamation point uh, just to give you a heads up.
Ugly things are happening in the Supreme Court right now.
Justice Anthony Kennedy is seen as the quote swing vote,
and if that is the case, he will have the
power to legalize same sex marriage all caps nationwide. Yeah.

(05:28):
I do not even think we can imagine the effects
this would have in our nation, the church and families.
So we are praying for God to give the justices
and the courts wisdom, courage, and discernment, for evil to
be revealed and destroyed, and for a heart of love
and sound mind. So we want to destroy the gays
with a heartful of love. I love when conservatives like
sort of like, you know, sound the war drums of

(05:52):
like the gays might be able to have rights, and
like I'm always curious how they play that out in
their head that leads to exactly what, Like I really
want to know if they have a very clear vision
of what that looks like. When you know, the LGBTQ
community has like nuh disturbed rights, Like do they think
I don't know. I mean it always seems like very

(06:13):
aggressive what they think will happen. Well, if we let
gays mary, then we could wind up with a country where,
like I don't know, the president sleeps with porn stars
and pays them a hundred and thirty thou dollars, And
that would be just It would be a post morality America. Yeah, exactly.
Where is Hillsdale College. It's in Michigan. So he's not leaving.
He's a Michigan boy. Uh. Well, at least he was

(06:33):
a Michigan boy, right, So he's all about his comfort zone.
Uh yeah, at this point in his life. That's kind
of where Eric is. Um And yeah, so in in
nineteen nine, he uh gets a sweet job becoming an
intern in George H. W. Bush's White House. Um, which
you think would be like this kid's dream job, you know,
super conservative president uh not considering to work for him. Yeah, exactly.

(06:55):
Eric gets piste off that George H. W. Bush's administration
is not conservat of enough. Quote. I saw a lot
of things. I didn't agree with homosexual groups being invited
in the budget agreement, the Clean Air Act. I mean,
that's what the fun I understand What that means is
that like his sort of like you know, big government philosophy,
is that what he's sort of Yeah, you know, the

(07:16):
Clean Air Act is anti business because it wants people
to be able to breathe, and like, right, it's better
for business if people can't breathe. I mean, that's basic capitalist.
Christ professed his love for capital, hated air, hated air
because he didn't need it. He's Christ, yeah, exactly, so
why should anyone else? Like that's I'm trying to be
more like Christ and not breathe there tupping your lungs upright,

(07:37):
walk on some water. Um. After his time as an intern,
Eric got a gig as a volunteer firefighter fighter. Uh
so that's nice until he joined the Navy Seals. Um.
He was apparently good at his job. He was deployed
to Bosnia Haiti in the Middle East, but tragically for Eric,
his service came during a time of unprecedented peace and
prosperity and he never saw combat. Oh he didn't know.

(08:00):
That's the shittiest kind of Navy seals, you know what
I mean, Like, you don't even have a fucking good
story at a bar when something like yeah, man, what
did you see have you seen g I Jane, I
went to Haiti. You did some fund up ship and Haiti. No,
we kind of did a lot of push ups. Yeah,
I'm kind of just moving potable water around. But uh yeah,
oh wow. That really that must have been heartbreaking for

(08:21):
him because he seems like somebody who really like a
war bonner. Right. No, but he's he just I mean basically,
if you're a Navy seal and you don't fight, you're
just a really good swimmer. Yeah, and like future fitness instructor. Yeah,
and I'm sure in fairness to Eric, he's I'm sure
he's a great swimmer. Oh this this dude can tear
up and that pool. No matter what your politics are,
your your body and your your your physical fitness is

(08:44):
at another level as a Navy seal. Yeah and and yeah,
I have the body of just a harbor seal. So um.
So Eric leaves the Navy Seals early in because his
dad dies of a heart attack and he's got a
deal with that deal with the family money they sell
the company and they make like one point three billion
gets split up between him and the rest of his
family members. Uh. He gets hit with a second tragedy

(09:07):
when his wife gets breast cancer. She was able to
have two kids, but she died not that long after. Um.
But Eric, you know, settled down to a quiet life
of being incredibly wealthy, and he started a six thousand
acre training facility for security operators. Uh. He named this
space Blackwater. Um Um. It was a place where you know,
you could go if you were a military unit or
a police unit, a swat team and do training. They

(09:29):
had like a fake high school there, um so that
you could practice like dealing with a Columbine situation where
they had like recorded one or perpetrating one. Right, this
is a crisis actor conspiracy theory. Thinking he'll drop on
us Miles like Robert, when you're on my podcast, we'll
talk about crisis acting. It's called Inside the Crisis Actor's Studio,
talk about the craziest conspiracies and once a crisis act. No,

(09:53):
I'm not no, I don't mean to cast his persons
on that person. But yeah, wait so black Oh so
in a way, he was just kind of like, I
want to create like the gym for cops and military
people to beef up there. It's not an unreasonable thing
to do, Like people who's are in SWAT teams and
whatever need like fake schools to practice and because that's
the thing they might have to do. So he's providing that.

(10:13):
So far, relatively reasonable. Um. But over the next couple
of years, Print shifted black Water from a training facility
to a company that also provided security personnel for the
US government. UM. One of Blackwater's first contracts was actually
in China guarding North Korean defectors that the government was
afraid the Chinese would abduct to send back to North Korea.
So they didn't want to put US soldiers or CIA

(10:34):
guys on these guys because that could be a diplomatic incident.
So they have private security to get them out of
the country and stuff that they were extracting them from China. Yeah,
that's what I understand was was sort of the situation
UM at that point. So again, not an unreasonable thing.
The government always needs a couple of kind of deniable
asset of course, that stuff with so pretty low level,

(10:55):
low key. Um, that's kind of what he's moving into.
But it's not it's not total darkness yet, but I'm
starting to see the sun start to go down. Yeah,
sun's definitely setting right right now, we're past four pm here. Um,
so you know nine eleven happens after that? I'm sorry,
what was the nine eleven? Uh? Oh um, I feel
like we should stop and pull a Wikipedia page. Oh yeah,

(11:16):
let's can we pull something up? Oh that, yes, okay,
I'm on board. Also, jet fuel can't melt steel beams.
Yeah you say that a lot. Hey, look what happened
to Building seven? That's my question anyway, So nine eleven
goes great for Eric Prince. Uh. He's on the billow
Riley Show not that long after, and he notes that
his phone is ringing off the hook. Uh. He attempts

(11:38):
to join the CIA, but he fails to pass their
polygraph test. Whoa, yeah, what do you know what kind
of stuff they ask? You know? I mean, I know,
in general polygraph test, but I don't know what the
CIA was asking him. Well, clearly it's not must not
be good to be hooked up to a truth machine
and tell lies to the CIA. Although polygraph tests have
been kind of there, people to say they're dubious a

(12:00):
little right now, they're supposed to be pretty sketchy. Um,
I don't, I don't know, I'm not here defense, but yes, right. Yes,
he tries to get into the CIA, and the CIA
is like, you're a little too shape for us. We're
gonna go continue to smuggle crack into the inner cities. Exactly.
Um so, uh, Eric isn't gonna let the little thing
like the CIA stop him from living out his dream

(12:22):
of walking around with guns in foreign countries. Uh. He
forms Blackwater Security Consulting, and he moves his company into
the business of selling mercenaries to the government. His hope
was that Blackwater would quote do for national security apparatus
what FedEx did for the Postal Service. Hold on, let
me process this. That what that he wants to do
for the national security apparatus? What FedEx did for the

(12:43):
postal service. Wow, Like, let me take a little burden
off you and also do it in a crazy aggressive way.
I want to be the FedEx of shooting people. Yeah, right, exactly. Like, Look,
of course the US didn't kill those people, you know,
just US contractors did. Okay, Okay, Yeah, so that's where
we're going visionary. Start to see the vision. So two

(13:04):
thousand one, black Water has a total about seven hundred
and thirty thousand dollars in federal contracts, right, so kind
of small beans at this point. Uh. In two thousand four,
less than a year into the Iraq war, they had
forty eight million dollars in contracts. By two thousand seven,
they'd made more than a billion dollars in federal contracts
by two thousand seven. Yeah, wait, when did it started?
Two thousand one is when he started, and then two

(13:24):
thousand seven he turned that into a billion dollars, So
pretty good rate of return. Yeah. How do I invest
in black Water? Um, you probably don't getting into it now. Yeah,
two thousand one was the time. Yeah, you know, two
thousand was that? Yeah, that was the August of two
thousand one, September t was really the time you wanted

(13:46):
with money into mercenaries. Yeah. Um. So after the invasion
of Iraq, Eric volunteers to provide the government with hundreds
and eventually thousands of contractors. Has been carried guns and
guarded high value government officials and convoys. Since they were
private civilians who regularly got into gunfights and war zones
for money, some people call Blackwaters contractors mercenaries. This makes

(14:07):
Eric very angry. Here's a quote from a Newsweek article
titled profile Blackwaters. Eric Prince quote, that's a slanderous term,
an inflammatory word they used to malign us, says Prince. Mercenaries,
he says, are professional soldiers who worked for a foreign government.
Blackwaters men are Americans working for the American government. Okay,
semantics man, Yeah, okay. Yeah. So that's the Eric's point

(14:31):
of view on the mercenaries. He's providing the U. S.
Government you're not mercenaries because they're American and so is
the government. You're still a cell sword though. Yeah, you're
still I mean selling your ability to kill people for money, right, Yeah,
And in a way it's like shittier because like it's
like you couldn't even make the real team, like could
be like an actual military personnels. It's like I guess
they'll do the mall cop version of being a cop,

(14:52):
which is a blackwater guy. Yeah. It's like one of
the things that's respectable about the military is like, oh,
you know, you know, you're not making that much money,
like you get there's got to be some degree I
like something you want to do or like there's some
degree of idealism as opposed to like, no, I'm making
a quarter of a million bucks a year to go
shoot people yeah, because you can. So you can argue
that someone in the military like they're sort of north
stars being patriotic or being nationalistic or whatever, yeah, versus like, yeah,

(15:16):
you're black Water, Like I'm here for the check and
to be and I get to shoot people for a
lot more money than I did when it was not honorable.
But I'm making eight times as much money to do
the same job, and I don't have to follow the
rule because a lot of their guys are are ex military, right, yes, absolutely,
So a guy can't just be like, hey, I'm here
to I'm here for the black Water tryouts. We'll get

(15:37):
to that a little. Um so in actuality, because he
was just saying, you know, an Americans working for the
American government. In actuality, many of Prince's employees in Iraq
were from Pakistan, Yemen, in other countries collectively known as
not America. A State Department investigation found that these quote
third world nationals were often forced to live in horrifying
conditions three people to a tiny room with no better

(15:59):
Erican to um so. This actually speaks to a big misconception.
When we think of black Water, we think of like
big burly mercenaries with beards and machine guns. They have
those guys. That's a big part of what they do.
But they also and all of the contracting companies in
Iraq and Afghanistan, most of the people they provide are
like poorly paid foreigners from Southeast Asia or the Middle
East to like run the kitchens and drive trucks and

(16:21):
convoys to transport food and ammunition. Um and so, like
those guys are doing horribly dangerous jobs and a lot
of them die. But if they die, the US government
doesn't have to say anyone died. So it's like, oh,
six Bangladeshi's died driving m R. E S two troops
in this base. Nobody needs to know. No US soldiers died. Yeah,
no Americans die. So that's a lot of what Prince

(16:44):
is doing. So and even then he's even hiring people
in like not combat roles necessarily, but just to do
sort of other leg work. Yeah, but they're going to
get shot and they're not in armored vehicles and they're yeah,
you know, yeah, it's it's really messed up. Um. So,
black Water Armed contractors, who were the guys who made
the company famous, were good at protecting their clients. They

(17:04):
never lost a client in iraq Um, but they were
bad at the winning hearts and minds thing. So one
of their favorite tactics was to drive on the opposite
side of the road as fast as they could and
shoot above any vehicle that didn't drive away fast enough,
which they said protected their convoys and which Iraqi said
was fucking terrified. They drove in the opposite direction of

(17:25):
traffic and shot above the cars that were coming towards them. Yeah,
if anyone got too close, they would shoot above them
to be like, get the funk out of the way,
wrong of the road. Yeah, this is black water. Yeah,
now in a little bit of fairness to blackwater. So
like one of the traffic is really bad, Well it's not.
It's not entirely unheard of an Iraq to direct traffic
with guns. When I was there last time, I kind

(17:47):
of made friends with a guy, an Iraqi army guy
who was directing traffic at this checkpoint in Mosle, and
whenever he'd get in to an argument with somebody, he
would shoot next to their head with his M sixteen.
And I was like, what do you That seems really
messed up. Really was like, well yeah, but like I'm
I'm doing this twelve hours a day, and if I
yell at everybody, I'm not gonna have a voice. And
I gotta be out here all the time. So it's

(18:08):
just easier to shoot next to him, just sucking shots
like that. Yeah, he said he put spent about a
dred and eight rounds a day doing that, just like
pop rather than talking. Yeah, I'll just squeeze off shots. Well,
just one or two at a time. But I mean
a lot of people will come right yeah. Um, but
black Water, you know, it's the driving on the opposite
side of the road thing that's that's the most controversial thing. Um.

(18:31):
So here's what one bad dead housewife told a French
journalist about them. Uh, they sail off the roads and
drive on the wrong side. They simply kill That Newsweek
profile and Eric quoted an advisor for the Coalition forces
who had traveled with both Blackwater guys as her guards
and American soldiers as her guards, and she said the
black Water guys that explain their attitude towards the iraqis
as our mission is to protect the principle at all costs.

(18:52):
If that means pissing off the iraqis too bad. So right.
In September two six, the black Water convoy, driving down
the wrong side of the road, struck an Iraqi car
and sent it careening into a telephone pole. The car
caught fire, black Wire drove without rendering aid, and the
driver died. It's not the only time that happened. That's
just a time that happened, right, because they're just always
driving on the other side of the road super fast,

(19:13):
shooting at people right there, Like you don't even know
what the right side of the road is. We just
know the black Water side. Yeah, here's another quote from
a Bagdad could traffic cop. They're impolite and do not
respect people. They bump other people's cars to frighten them
and shout at anyone who approaches them. Two weeks ago,
guards of a convoy open fire randomly and that led
to the killing of two policemen. Uh so Yeah. Another

(19:35):
journalist who spent a lot of time with them, Robert
Young Pelton, noted that they used their machine guns like
car horns. So, wow, Eric, you've got to You've got
a great group of employees here. Yeah. It's funny because
I only just know of like isolated incidents here or there.
Or that I was familiar with, like during the Iraq

(19:55):
War about hearing about black Water and the kind of
ship they did. But like when you when you really
start to, like as you're revealing it to me, now
realize like they're like frat bros in a war zone.
It's great, did you bring up frat Bros. We've got
a break for commercials, But once we come back, we're
gonna talk about black Waters drunken shenanigans in Iraq, and
then we're gonna move on to Eric Prince's new job
in China. So all that after some ads, uh, and

(20:23):
we're back and we're about to talk about the frat
bro aspect of Blackwater's history. I feel it. I can
feel it. I could feel it coming. I do want
to note I found a lot of these quotes in
a really good Brookings Institute article called The Dark Truth
about black Water. So if you're looking for more info
on these fox, uh, that's a good source. Um Two
Blackwater one an exciting new contract to help deliver kitchen

(20:45):
equipment in Fallujah. Uh. They were eager to impress the
immoratic company that hired them, and they rushed the delivery.
Now I don't know if Prince was eager to impress
this company, but he was the guy running the whole
company at this time. So somebody from Blackwater top side
said get this kitchen equipment to its source as quick
as possible. And the people whose job it is to
determine how to do things, we're like, okay, well, we

(21:06):
need at least six armed men and they should all
be in armored vehicles. And whoever was in charge of
the mission was like, no, we'll have four guys and
we'll drive normal cars. Four guys in a VW bus
And Um, they were supposed to let the U. S.
Marines who were in charge of Fallujah at the time,
know that they were going to be there in case
they needed back up. It's containing to let the Marines
know that someone might be operating that they need help. Okay,

(21:28):
they didn't. Uh So these four guys get ambushed and killed. Um,
and a quote enraged mob drags their burnt bodies through
the streets and hangs their corpses from a bridge. Remember, yeah,
you do. Um. That whole incident sparked the Battle of Fallujah,
which is one of the bloodiest fights of the entire
Iraq War. Around a thousand or so civilians died, it's
hard to say, along with nine U S. Soldiers. Wow,

(21:50):
the kitchen equipment was never delivered. Yeah, someone's got a
nice kitchen though, somebody's got a great kitchen or it
all got burnt. Um. I don't think Blackwater impress the company, No,
not at all, I guess. And they really did try
and do their FedEx thing where also were there and
at their record time because they'll be poor so understaffed. Well,
you know, I've lost cant of how many times I've

(22:12):
ordered something through FedEx and their employees been ambushed and
hung from a bridge and sparked a brutal month long
siege of the city. Yeah, that's why I don't order
from Cranton Beryln. Yeah, they use FedEx. Yeah. Yeah, it's
just too many deaths. Yeah, it really is. Yeah, tragic.
So um. The high profile murder of four employees did
not exactly lower Blackwater's tempo in regards to flipping out

(22:36):
in any Iraqis who came near them. Uh. In two
thousand five, the Brigadier General responsible for Security and Bagdad
noted that in two months, contractors were involved in twelve
shootings that resulted in at least six civilian deaths. On
Christmas Eve two thousand six, of Blackwater employee got ship
faced and started wandering around the Green Zone. He staggered
up to the Iraqi Vice President's house, got into an

(22:56):
argument with his bodyguards, and shot one of them to death.
What the This brave patriot ran back to a checkpoint
guarded by another group of contractors and told them he'd
been in a firefight with Iraqis. He was clearly drunk
and waving a gun around. They disarmed him and tried
to question him, but he was just way too hammered
to be questioned. Um So Blackwater fired the man, flew
him home, and paid fifteen thousand dollars to the family

(23:17):
of the dead guard. It was a tragic incident, but
not they assured a sign that their employees were a
bunch of irresponsibly violent cowboys. Holy ship, how is that
not an indication that there are a bunch of irresponsible cowboys?
You know what? The guy he got fired, and you
know it took him mean thousand dollars to that family.
I mean, I get it that in Iraq, that could
be a lot of money. So that's like that that

(23:39):
that maybe that's the going rate that Blackwater deems is
like you know, consolation pay, but well it's in a
really messed up area. But like the initial amount the
US government suggested they give the family was two hudred
and fifty thousand. But then other people within the government,
so this is in Blackwater, we're like, well, if we
give that much money to the family that broke well,
no people are going to get their relatives old to

(24:00):
get money from us. That was their fear, not that
that ever happened, because I don't know that it like,
but of course it's like how all people think when
you're talking about destitute communities, like, well, they're gonna find
a way to take advantage of and they learned how,
and they'll self murderer and you know, frame less and
their kids murdered for cast ship and that was the government.
That's not on right. I mean the murders on black

(24:22):
Water absolutely um. But you know, you'll be happy to
know that the employee he was fired, he was sent
back to the US and it took him two months
to get another job at a private security firm and
wind up in Kuwait with a gun. Jesus right, back.
You can only fail up, yeah, or at least laterally.
And now I think he's Ryan Zinky right. The Interior Secretariat.
In August seven, the State Department decided they should investigate

(24:45):
Blackwater because of everything Naturally said so far. Yeah, they
came up with a bunch of fun incidents once they
started asking around. One of the things they found is
that several Blackwater employees had gotten hammered as fuck and
stolen a hundred and thousand dollar armored vehicle and driven
it to a party where they accidentally crashed it into
a concrete wall. Wow, what the fuck? It's so weird

(25:09):
to like hear this, right, because like, on one side,
it's just like deeply troubling, evil, tragic ship that they do,
and the other side is not that it's funny, but
it's so reckless that you can't believe that. Well, I
guess you can, because I've never you know, I feel
like all the things we hear about how the United
States operates outside of this country is just in a

(25:30):
very uh sort of haphazard way or irresponsible way. So yes, okay,
go on, let this uncomfortable laughter continue. So, the investigation
did find that Blackwater had been cutting corners um. They
regularly reduced the number of their men guarding high profile
people without actually charging for fewer guards. Automatic weapons were
found stored in private residences, which not supposed to do.

(25:54):
Blackwater employees were found to drink heavily, party with prostitutes,
and regularly failed to qualify on weapons. They were also
found to carry weapons like grenade launchers that they were
not certified to use. What wait, so they're drunk as
fun and then they'll be like, Yo, where did you
get that M two or three grenade launcher? They're like, hey,
I just I bought on eBay. Use it over here

(26:16):
in two oh three. I think we're talking about like
the automatic grenade launchers that you mount on the top
of a vehicle, like big like uh sort of murder canons. Yeah, okay,
I don't. I think it's called like an m K.
I don't look at someone. I've seen him shoot a
couple of times. They're definitely fun looking, but um, you know,
maybe a qualified weight. So how are they getting it though?

(26:37):
Do you know, like are they self supplying it? And
they're just simply like you're actually not supposed to be. Yeah,
the Blackwater has is able to as one of these companies,
they're able to buy that sort of equipment to use
in these war zones. Um It's just that there are
certain standards that like the military has for anyone who's
going to be using that ship in a war zone,
Like if you're carrying that weapon in your a marine
or whatnot, you've done certain things. These guys are quired

(27:00):
to qualify on those weapons too, if they're going to
carry them in war zones, and they're not. Blackwater is
basically not holding its people to the same standard as
the military, right, and they're treating it like, Yo, I
just put rims on my dad's fucking navigator. Let's take
it up for a spin, except this time it's a
it's a rocket launcher and you're in a war zone exactly. Yeah.
Um So, in response to this, uh so, the State
Department you know, does this investigation and finds out black

(27:22):
Waters fucking up all over the place. The State Department
investigator you know, sitting down and talking to the guy
Eric Prince, appointed to run Blackwater's operations in Iraq, uh
and this conversation turns heated, and the Blackwater guy threatens
to murder the State Department investigator and says, quote, no
one could or would do anything about it as we
were in Iraq. That's the State Department guy what we're

(27:43):
calling the conversation. It's basically like, I'm gonna murder you
if you don't stop investigating Blackwater, and we're in Iraq,
so nobody's going to give a ship in space. No
one can hear you scream in Iraq. I can murder,
you know, undisturbed, and no one could and you know
I can because you just investigated all the times by
companies murdered people here without any kind of repercussion. Yeah,

(28:04):
you would expect all of us to have some consequences.
Um but the US military, while government mainly, was kind
of in a bind when it came to Blackwater and
other contractors. So in two thousand seven there were at
least a hundred and sixty thousand contractors in Iraq. This
means they equalled and perhaps, since they weren't required to
disclose their true numbers, perhaps exceeded the numbers of the
US military in the country. Um So wow. Eric Prince's

(28:28):
pitch at the start of the whole fighting thing, which
the Bush administration had bought hook line and sinker was
that contractors would allow the government to vastly increase their
presence in the country without paying a political price for it.
So Bush can say, we only need a hundred and
sixty thousand troops to keep her acts safe, but thanks
to contractors that they've got three hundred thousand plus guys
in the country. Um. The government also left contractors and

(28:49):
needed them because their deaths were easy to ignore. By
two thousand seven, at least a thousand contractors had been
killed and thirteen thousand wounded, nine per day were dying
at the height of the surge. Any of those people
were the Third World nationals we talked about earlier, probably
because we don't actually know how many contractors died, it
could be even higher, and we don't know where any
of them came from, because none of that is required

(29:11):
to be reported to anybody, and none of those deaths
go on the official tallies of US losses in the
War on Terror. So the government knows Blackwater is fucking
up and they're ruining the hearts and minds thing, which
is a critical part of being an insurgency. But also
they can't function the way that they've come used to
functioning in Iraq without these guys because they're most of

(29:32):
the effort now, right right, right, and so so a
lot of these people who are saying who were like
the third world nationals, are they coming with any kind
of military training? Most of them aren't doing. I mean,
so most of are those who are getting are getting
killed in sort of non combat role exactly. Whenever you've
got the military occupation, like when the U S militaries
in Iraq, there's a hundred and sixty service members in Iraq.

(29:52):
Most of them aren't kicking indoors and getting into gunfights.
Most of them are maintaining vehicles and doing you know,
built putting up communications equipment and all that stuff. It's
the same with the contractors. Most of them are driving
trucks or cooking for people, or maintaining building spaces. What
do you think that how does that percentage you think
or what's the ratio to like, I'm going to guess
most of the people dying or driving trucks because there's

(30:13):
constant streams of trucks all throughout right, and those guys, yeah,
those trucks aren't armored, right because Funckett, we don't have
to do anything because their third world nationals, who are
just a digit on a paper or spreadsheet. If they die,
it doesn't hurt us politically. Bush isn't being asked to
account for dead you know, uh, foreign national contractors. How

(30:33):
many Bangladeshis were killing exactly? I don't know, You're not
going yeah. Um So, despite the rough patches, the first
four years of the Iraq War went pretty well for
Erik Prince. It is possible that some of this went
to his head. In mid two thousand seven, he gathered
a bunch of contractors at Blackwater's headquarters in North Carolina
and aman did they swear an oath of allegiance? Um? Okay.

(30:56):
I think the text of the oath said a lot about,
you know, swearing to fight war on terror and you know,
loyalty to the principles of America and stuff. But a
former employee, an actual Blackwater armed contractor, told The New
York Times, it kind of felt like pledging allegiance to Eric.
That's how a lot of us interpreted it. Wow. Yeah, he,
I mean, he has such a weird origin story to

(31:19):
like to not watch it. Starting off as like rich
kid who for whatever reason was like, I mean, I
don't know whatever reason it, probably his upbringing was hyper
conservative and now turned into like this sort of demi god. Yeah,
many little dictator in his own little fiefdom army thing. Yeah.
Um So, a couple of weeks after he has them

(31:39):
all pledged loyalty, disaster strikes when Blackwater employees freak out
and start firing machine guns and grenade launchers into a
crowd at back Dad's Nissoire Square. They killed at least
seventeen people, wounded dozens more. And one of the people
they killed was a nine year old boy. He was
like burnt to the bodies of his parents in a car.
It was horrible. Uh. Blackwater's immediate response to the masser

(32:00):
was to take down their website and refuse all interviews.
The company spokesperson sent out an email in English only
two Americans that said the civilians reportedly fired upon by
Blackwater professionals were in fact armed enemies. This contrast with
the opinion of the US military, who found no evidence
of insurgent activity in the square that day. But that's
just the military, right righte? What do they know about
insurgents there? Let the contractors the real work. That's insane

(32:25):
and so their account to defend themselves for slaughtering a
bunch of innocence was that, like, is there was there
any like like in the reporting of it, like anything
that someone could even perceive to be as a threat
or do people just think like they're so unprofessional that
they got spooked and just fired on a bunch of civilians.
So I can tell you that when you hang out
in credit Iraqi cities, especially when there's a lot of unrest,

(32:46):
you're gonna hear gunfire regularly. My guests, from what I've
read is that somewhere else in the city there was
some shooting or maybe even a fucking backfiring car. There
might have been a bomb that went off somewhere else
in the city, and these guys got spooked, oh right,
And they said from maybe they saw a guy who
looked shady and they heard a sound that was shady
and at the same time, and people just started firing,
and maybe a couple of the bullets ricocheted passed and

(33:07):
that made him keep firing. Like It's it's hard to say,
but the military says there's no evidence, uh that they
were under fire at all, that there is any insurgent activity.
Um After releasing the statement, black Water put their website
back up. They made no mention of the massacre, and
continue to sell black Water branded T shirts, baseball caps,
and baby clothes. Your strategies are like literally kind of

(33:28):
putting their fingers in their ears by taking their website down,
and like, well, just wait for this to pass, but
let's make sure we're getting the merch out there to
merch out there. I mean, I've ordered some of the
baby clothes for Jack. I feel like it's a good gift.
I think, I mean he I think Jack is wearing
the black Water hoodie. Got Jack loves black Yeah, he's
big into contractor where I mean if Jack, I think

(33:49):
he should really be thinking about in terms of if
his own powerful ascension, he should have a private army
to everyone needs a private army. Nobody's disagreeing with that.
We're talking about Jack O'Brien. Jacob, you haven't. If you
know about this podcast, you know what universe you're in.
The only Jack there is is Jack O'Brien black Water enthusiast. Um.
We could keep talking about black Water for several podcasts.

(34:11):
There's so much that I just didn't even include. Um,
But the Eric Prince story is much bigger and dumber
than that, and so we have to move on. Oh okay,
so that was a moose bush for the main main course, Well,
there's just there's just a lot to cover here. Um.
So you know, after after that whole massacre thing, some
people go to jail, although their convictions were overturned last year.

(34:32):
What yeah, again, it's a lot of stories here, um.
But Prince changed the company's name to x E from
Blackwater to avoid the bad press, and then he sold
the company like two ten. It's now called Academy with
an Eye because I don't I don't really know why. Um,
Blackwater is no longer black Water. Prince was no longer
with black Water, he was still devoted to the company,
and one of the last things he did was work

(34:54):
with the game's developer to make a black Water video game.
According to Prince, the game's purpose was to quote give
players the chance to experience what it is like to
be on a Blackwater team on a mission without being
dropped into a real combat situation. We already have games
for that, sir. They're every other video yeah, exactly. If
you just want to kill people randomly. Whatever it was

(35:15):
like a Connect Motion game. I haven't actually played it. Yeah,
oh yeah, it was a Connect Motion video Blackwater Blackwater Guy.
It was apparently very bad. All of the reviews I've
read are terrible. Yeah, because I can't imagine like people.
I found a lot like people who are sort of
like in the very conservative side of things. They tend
to not have the best taste in creatives that they

(35:35):
work with. So I'm sure they probably just found some
kid who's like, you know, it's like they went to
Infinity Ward who made like Call of Duty, and we're like, hey,
we need you for the new black Water game. They
didn't pull all the stops out for this. Are the
gestures like, anyway, I'll have to I'll have to read something.
I've got a couple. There's a quote from I g
N that could double his review for the actual company Blackwater. Um.
They said it employs nothing but bad ideas and it

(35:56):
fails to do anything exciting with any of them. Um.
Another reviewer from Giant Bomb noted that the game presents
Blackwater employees as quote a bunch of selfless, good natured
totally not mercenaries who save hostages and deliver food and
totally don't kill civilians. How could they when there are
literally no civilians anywhere in this game? No margin. Yeah yeah,

(36:19):
so I know what you're thinking. Isn't it sad that
poor Eric Prince had to give up on his dreams
of having his own private armies. Well, don't worry. Eric
does not give up on his dreams. He's not that
kind of man. After selling Blackwater, he relocated to Dubai.
The Immati police ponied up five million dollars for him
to create an eight hundred man foreign fighting force because
you know, they have internal revolts to suppress. Um. The

(36:42):
emirates are filled with crowded labor camps. That's who builds
all those fans slave slave labor from Southeast Asia at
best a half step up from object slavery. Uh, and
there's a lot of unrest there. So the U a E.
Was like, Eric Prince, would you make us an army
of foreign soldiers that we can use to brutally suppress
us up right? Yeah, I need something to uh quell

(37:05):
the revolts that are impending with your professional killer groups.
Eric Prince was just the guy to make that happen. Um.
The whole operation was almost certainly illegal. American citizens are
not allowed to train foreign soldiers without permission from the
State Department. During his last year in charge of Blackwater,
the company had paid a forty two million dollar fine
for illegally training troops in Jordan's So this is like

(37:26):
a pattern with Eric Prince is illegally training foreign troops.
In order to sidestep any problems, this time, Prince just
pretended he wasn't involved. He adopted the code name Kingfish
so no one would know that he was committing blatant
international crimes. Wait, what do you mean the code name?
Like he's just like the documents, so they would never
the words Eric Prince wouldn't show up. There was a
company like RS two or something like. That was the

(37:47):
name of the company doing the training, and Prince was
connected to them and own them, but like didn't Like
it's one of those like when you've got enough lawyers
and stuff and figure out the layers of it. There's
been some great journalists, particularly the Inner Stup to have
spent years sort of unappealing the onion of Eric Princess.
So he's showing like sort of the mechanics of his

(38:07):
plausible deniability machine. Basically, yeah, exactly, but kingfish is what
he goes by at this time, so of course, yeah,
uh not no longer Prince Fish. Yeah, he's become king.
He's a kingfish. Yeah. Um. So rather than hiring US
Special Forces veterans, which remembers what he promised to do
and why he said that he wasn't a mercenary warlord,
because he was because I hire American people, right. Uh,

(38:30):
he opted to bring in soldiers from Colombia because they
were cheaper. The project immediately encountered problems when it turned
out that many of these soldiers had never even fired
a weapon. Uh. Prince initially hoped that this battalion would
be the first of many, but after numerous problems, the
force was reduced in size to five and eighty men.
Men who actually served in the battalion reported being locked
indoors all day and being incredibly bored. The boredom was

(38:51):
only broken up by occasional trips paid for by the
company to divide the prostitutes. Wow. Otherwise they're just like
in a room. Slave kill squad just had to hang
out in a room until it was process. They would
do some running and training, but then they were locked
in a room. Uh, but every now and then they
got some prostitutes. So that's okay, okay, Eric Prince, this

(39:13):
this all seems above board. So yeah, I mean, at
this point, Eric Prince's first army had committed numerous war
crimes and his second army uh seemed to be on
its way to fizzling out. Um So in two fourteen,
Erik Prince decided to take a break from making armies
to try a bold new business strategy, making his own
air force. WHOA, what the fuck? So that year Eric

(39:35):
Prince gets closes up with an investment firm called the
Civic Group and founded a company named Frontier Logistics Group.
Now Civic Group is an investment company that is owned
by the Chinese government. So this meant Eric Prince was
either in business with or straight up working for China.
Now wow, so he doesn't he does not give up.
You think he's a patriot in any way, or he's

(39:56):
just like pure reptilian brand, like I'm just gonna do
what I want. I know nothing else but for me
to obtain what I want. I am sure he would
consider himself a patriot and have a justification. What kind
of mental gymnastics do you think he's doing to say, like, oh,
I made a you know, like a kill squad for
the U A E. And now I'm making a weird
private Chinese air force the U a EAR sort of
allies of the United States. He's not making an air

(40:19):
force for China. We're about to get into that. He's
just so The Frontier Logistics Group is supposed to be
just a logistics company. They're the people you call if
you're a corporation. You're like, we've got a bunch of
diamonds in this country. I got him shipped here. Can
you help us arrange that? Or we've got sick executives
in Central Africa, can you get a metavact. We're building
an oil field in this country. Help us figure out
how to set it up an organize so that like

(40:40):
that's a perfectly legitimate business. Somebody needs to do that
work if you're like in that industry. Um so secretly
without getting the approval of the rest of the company.
Eric Prince also started trying to use FLG to build
his own private air force, which you could then rent
out to small African nations who needed to suppress insurgencies.
So the Chinese as far as we know, have no

(41:00):
idea he's doing this, and neither do the other people
he's working with at f LG. He has his own
tiny team within the company, and he decides, We're going
to build an air force and not tell anyone. How
do you fucking hide your It's like you have a
you're making a bong in your room at a teenager
and mom was like, what are you doing in there?
Like nothing, just like playing with this cups, like I
smell fire, I smell plastic mountain. It's like you're building

(41:22):
a straight up rental air force and you can keep
it under wraps. Well, you can't keep it under rest.
We've got some commercials and after that we're going to
talk about Eric tried to hide his private air force
and how it didn't quite work out the way he planned.
So all of that, after some capitalism ditties, we're back,

(41:46):
uh and we are talking about Eric Prince's noble quest
to build his own private air force without anyone knowing. Um,
so I probably shouldn't have to say it, but I will.
It is illegal to make your own air force U
S government does and allowed you just mean like creating
a collection of like fighter jets or armed planes meant
to murder people from the sky. Can even buy an

(42:08):
armed plane? No, no, you cannot, So you need the
cover of a government even obtain a kill plane. There
are ways for private companies to deploy air assets that
can attack people, provide close air support. There are companies
that do that. But there's like a problem, like you
have to get a lot. Like you the government has
to issue you a bunch of ships like it's a
it's a thing. Like some of Prince's competitors. We're able

(42:30):
to get government approval to provide close air support and
have small fleets of aircraft, but like you know, you
agree to government inspections, you get a bunch of And
Eric Prince is not a big fan of licenses or
qualifications or not breaking international law. What are you doing
in your room? Nothing? Mom, it's not an airport. Um,
so Eric Prince. So just to catch you up, he

(42:52):
starts a company with a Chinese government called Frontier Logistics
Group that's supposed to like help companies particularly working like
Africa and Southeast Asia. Um, you know, get stuff from
A to b right, because China's got their eye on
Africa right now, China's got their eye on a lot
of places. Yeah, well, and I think they're smart. It's funny.
When I was in Ghana, like in two thousand and eight,
they were the African Cup of Nations was happening and

(43:12):
they had to build a bunch of new stadiums there
and when I was like, oh, wow, like this is crazy,
like these are huge modern stadiums, and one of the
locals are like, yeah, if they're all Chinese prisoners building it,
And then I was like whoa what? And I was like, yeah,
they use these guys because if they try and escape
there in the middle of Africa, and they're just gonna
be like have you seen the Chinese guy? And they
can like they just know. They don't really have to

(43:32):
put them under much, you know, surveillance. But I mean,
at least I could have been a myth. But I
feel like and also a lot of the consumer goes.
I was surprised how much of it came from China,
but I guess they see a market. So yeah. Um.
What Prince tells Civic Group, which is the Chinese company
that owns Frontier with him, what Prince tells them is that,

(43:53):
you know, he thinks there's a market where they can
make some quick cash if they have a couple of
moderately armored planes with sensors on them. So that like,
if a company has a mine somewhere and they're worried
that insurgents are going to rob the mine, you know,
the government can pay us to surveil the area to
let them know if an attacks company. That's legal. There's
nothing illegal about, you know, government paying you to provide

(44:15):
aerial surveillance uh or an area like a mine. So
that's what Prince says he's doing to his backers in
China and to his other American friends who work in
Frontier with him. Without telling them, he buys of another company,
h an Austrian company called Airborne Technologies, so it becomes
an owner in this company, and he uses them to

(44:36):
start producing an aircraft. They take an old Thrush five
tin crop dusting plane and they turned it into an
engine of war. And now at this point and for
most of the air Force stuff. Here, I'm quoting from
a fabulous article in the intersect called Echo Papa Exposed.
Now here's a quote describing the airplane he has built.
In addition to surveillance and laser targeting equipment. Airborne had

(44:57):
outfitted the plane with bulletproof cockpit windows and arm engine block,
anti explosive mesh for the fuel tank, and specialized wiring
that could control rockets and bombs. The company also installed
pods for mounting two high powered twenty three millimeter chain
guns straight Vulcan canon in that thing. So to maintain secrecy,
Prince does his best to keep his name out of
this project. So the people at Airborne, other than like

(45:19):
a couple of their top people, don't know him as
Eric Prince. He's referred to in all of their papers
as Echo Papa. But he purchased or he I mean, yeah,
essentially that's the only name he's known by in any
of the public or not even public, and even the
documents the engineer see. So the engineers see that someone
with a codename Echo Papa is ordering them to build

(45:40):
a military aircraft. That doesn't seem weird to them initially
because they've done some contracts that are secret for like
the German government in the Swiss government, so they think, okay,
this is probably a government thing. Be done this kind.
Our bosses assure us it's on the up and up.
We're not breaking any laws, but they knew they were
getting into bed with Eric Prince. Right, A couple of
people at the top of the company knew. The people

(46:00):
actually building the plane think they're working for like a
German But yeah, but I guess, I guess yeah, to
buy stake in a company like obviously, the people at
the top are gonna know. Oh, I see who this
person is, Okay, So yeah, one day, near the end
of finishing this plane, Eric Prince comes by the hangar
to inspect it, and one of these engineers recognizes him
and knows who he is, and it's like, oh fuck,

(46:22):
we're building a military aircraft for Eric Prince. Uh. And
so these guys go to their bosses and they're like,
we're pretty sure we're committing an international crime by making
most right right, but the management is shares them things
will be fine if they keep their mouth shut. Um,
it's funny. Everything will be fine if you keep your
mouth shut. It don't say anything. It's everything we find.

(46:43):
If you could keep your mouth shut, you don't tell anyone.
We will get in trouble for building a bomber. The
plane you're talking about that they retrofitted. You said, it's
a crop like a propeller plane engine. It's got like
engines and stuff. It doesn't look like a prop plane, okay,
because in my mind, a crop dusting plane is like,
you know, like the old propeller plant, like like a
right brother. No, it's it's like a nice crop dusting

(47:05):
But they had a bunch of problems because like it
wasn't made to have thousands of pounds of armor they
had to build. So like the things that bombs hang
on on a plane but are called pylons and they're
either like made for US munitions or Warsaw Pact, you know,
Russian munitions, and so these guys even designed pylons that
could fit both because Eric didn't know what kind of
bombs he was going to be able to get from. Yeah,

(47:28):
so like that this is the kind of thing he
has made. And before the plane's even finished, Eric goes
out to a bunch of prospective clients, mainly people that
we would call warlords or dictators, uh, and tries to
sell them on his sexy new murder engine. Um. He
told his partners in Frontier, including the CEO, that they
were not running a security company, you know. Again, they
just thought they were buying surveillance planes. Um So nobody

(47:50):
knows but Eric Prince and a couple of his close
people what he's doing. Yeah that for for the other people,
they just think, oh, we've got a surveillance plane, and
he's like, I've got something and that can do it
all baby. Yeah. Uh so that's that's the situation. Um,
nobody but Prince knows that he's planning to put missiles
on this plane and use it to murder dissidence. Um

(48:11):
So having his own air force to track back a
bit has been a goal of Eric since at least
two thousand and eight, when he purchased an unarmed attack
aircraft that he later at least to the Pentagon to
use an Afghanistan to test it out to see if
it would be good for the Afghan Air Force. Um.
In Iraq, he tried and failed to sell a contract
providing close air support to the CIA. Also in Iraq,
Blackwater had a feat of tiny helicopters. Prince would have

(48:32):
men with machine guns hang off them and shoot at people.
Those helicopters can be known by the Iraqis as little birds.
Oh yeah, yeah yeah, but those are unarmored helicopter. Armed
helicopter but which that that's a specific kind of helicopter though,
the little bird, right, and maybe you know it's not
like a Huey or the other ones, but it looks
a little bit like a Huey, but even tinier. Yeah right, right.

(48:52):
I just think of it because I know, like I
read a lot about like Somalia ninety three kind of stuff,
and that was like those are like a lot of
the other guys were in like those little bird helicopters. Yeah,
from the video games I always hoppen. Yeah. Yeah. Uh
So Prince had never gotten to order his own private
military aircraft bomb insurgents, and that's what was his dream, um,

(49:13):
And in two thousand and fourteen it seems like it
was finally going to come true. So the Austrians finished
this thing and they've taken on the practice flight, and
its dozens of problems pop up because of course you're
not supposed to put armaments on a crop duster. Um.
So they fix whatever they can, but Prince rushes them
and says, basically, I need this thing in two days.
I've already promised it to somebody and it needs to
be right. God, what the fund is wrong with this guy?

(49:35):
So during the plane's first flight, it's grounded for a
faulty fuel pump that's eventually fixed, and the plane makes
it to Juba, South Sudan, where it was expected to
help with the civil war. Unfortunately for Eric Prince, but
thankfully for humanity. Some random guy in Greece took picture.
You know, there's there's this this random guy in Greece
whose hobby is taking pictures of planes that take off
from He's just one of those nerds, and he takes

(49:58):
a picture of this thing as it lifts off from Greece. Oh,
because that's how they were getting it into Sudana, was
taking off from like they were taking off from Greece.
And the plane was registered in San Marino, which is
a tiny micro state in like northern Italy or in
that area. Um So this thing takes off, this guy
uploads a picture. It gets back to the authorities in
San Marino, who realized that the plane that Eric Prince

(50:18):
had registered bore no resemblance to the plane on that runway,
which is clearly a military aircraft. All right, He's like, Hi,
I want to register my nice little process plane. It's
a hobby plane. Nothing to see here, right, And They're like,
those are missile pylons on the bottom. No, no, no,
those are fun holders. So credit to the government of
San Marino. They pulled his registration. The plane had to

(50:41):
be flown to another hangar in a different East African nation,
and it's probably still there right now. The whole project
fell apart and Eric Prince never got to bomb anyone.
Oh yeah, he really is like a tortured guy with
a war boner who never got to get his war
penis off. Basically, yeah, credit to Airborne Technology. It was
one of the engineers who worked on the plane that

(51:03):
leaked this story to the intercept or at least leaked
a big intercept who was like, this is fucked up.
I'm I'm okay making a plane for the German government.
I really don't want to make one for this guy. God.
That must have been such a moment though, to realize
it's air Princes. Yeah, he looks him up on his
phone and it's like like in a movie, like he's
holding it up next to him, just like going back
and forth. It's the guy. Yeah, this isn't gonna be

(51:27):
good for my resume. Um, okay, So they clearly say
you made a kill jet. Yeah, but is there any
trial or like, so does anyone get in trouble, anyone
to release a statement or anything? Like as far as
I understand at this point, Airborne denies uh making a

(51:49):
fighter jet. FLG denies that the fighter jet was made
with their money. Prince just doesn't talk about it. Like
the reason we know about this is the Intercept report,
and they have everything. If you go read Echo Pop Expose,
they have like advertising documents he built for this attack craft,
like you can see like, yeah, you can see his
marketing materials. It's very well documented. It's like this could

(52:10):
be yours or if they were just making it up
for some reason, all of these companies would have sued
them to ship. But nothing's happened. Like that's the way
it wout. Nothing has happened. The plane is still sitting
in a hangar somewhere in East Africa. As far as
we know, it was never used. Um right, So that's
that's exactly what the situation any like conspiracy or logic
to why we think like he has never had to

(52:33):
answer for that, like because clearly that those are international crimes.
If he's creating an armed aircraft, that that's that's probably
in violation of many laws. Well, because what they have
is the picture, which is why San Marino pulled his registration. UM.
But they don't have like you don't have hard documented
evidence outside of like what the journalists put up about

(52:53):
how it was made or about exactly who ordered it,
Like Prince doesn't have his name TI do it in
legal documents. These are allegations in a news report that
has a significant amount of backing to it. Um. But
also it's not like he was caught bombing civilians in
Soudan got stopped before that point, so it's just sort
of fizzled out. It's like being called like a homemade

(53:14):
gun or something. Yeah. Well, it's like Prince didn't get
in trouble when like when he was found illegally training
troops for a foreign country company got a forty two
million dollar uh lost, like had to pay forty two
million dollars in fines, but that he didn't get charged
with anything, and then they consider that an operating cost.
Yeah exactly, I mean they made billions at this point.
It's forty two million. What's forty two million? It's like

(53:36):
when you sue Perdue Pharmaceuticals for you know, marketing illegally
and hiding like the truth about the pain killers they
were selling, Like they pay one and a half percent
of the profits that they've made refines and they're like, yeah,
it's fine. What also doing a business like this is
it's not like Eric Prince was flying a jet and
dropping bombs on people himself. He had shell companies set
up through all this and the plane never actually got

(53:57):
to drop anything. So he's he's in the clear, right,
And it's it's murky enough that people can just point
fingers at thin air and no one really has to
take the but like the back, you can see the
plane and you can trace its registration back and you
can like it's a picture of the planet. It's all
pretty well documented. Um, if you get Echo Papa exposed
on the intercept, it will be there. I wonder if too,
if because the government has done so much business with him,

(54:20):
it's like better to be like, dude, don't we don't
even need to dig that whole part of It's possible
that if the government filed a case against him, he
would win in court because he's a billionaire with a
lot of lawyers, and he's I mean, it's not like
he just like did this haphazardly. He sat every step
of the way. How does this have to be structured
to minimize my risk? How does this like what we
do to reduce my exposure? So Eric Prince is still

(54:43):
keeping busy today. His current project involves working with the
Chinese government co owner of his company to set up
a forward operating base in the Yunan Province of China
as part of a Chinese government initiative to help remake
the Silk Road. Princess quote about the matter is we're
not helping to serve Chinese foreign policy goals. We're helping
to increase trade. Uh, it is possible, that's true. The

(55:04):
basis stated goal is to quote provide logistics and unarmed
security training services to facilitate Chinese trade throughout Southeast Asia.
So I'm sure that's all on the up and up.
And this mercenary warlord won't try to hide committing war
crimes in the guise of a legitimate business venture with
the same company twice in a row. Um. So his
other hobby right now is trying to convince the US
government to hand the war in Afghanistan over to an
army of private contractors. M Yeah, about six thousand mercenaries

(55:28):
ought to be enough to really get Afghanistan under yea,
and to make sure nothing terrible happens. These guys, they're
not going to be lawless out there. They're gonna be
commanded by someone Prince thinks should be put in charge
of the Afghanistan effort, and he calls the guy of Viceroy.
So that's a good idea, Like we should go back
to that. Yeah, I love that. Yeah, back when Viceroy
that that's really one. That's the time we all miss

(55:50):
the world was great. Yeah, So that's that's that's it,
simple man um. So far, the Pentagon hasn't bitten. And
in fact, all of like like Maddison, all of the
generals in the world are like right, like I've been
around these assholes, like they can't even drive on the
right side of the road. Yeah. But if I know Eric,
a little thing like you know, complete lack of interest
isn't going to stop him from trying, clearly, and he's

(56:13):
gonna keep plugging away that keep making that bong in
his room. Yea, even when his mom asks, no, he's
got it. He's got an active life, you know, several
days before the election, Prince showed up on Breitbart Radio
to claim that Hillary Clinton and Bill Clinton laundered money
and regularly visited a quote sex island with quote underage
sex slaves. Uh. And in January if seventeen, Prince met

(56:33):
with a guy named Kirol Dmitriev, a Russian businessman with
strong ties to Vladimir Putin. They met in say Chell's right,
Say Chell yeah? And he claims that the trip was
just for business purposes and had nothing to do with
the Trump campaign. But earlier this year, George Nader, a
guy who helped organize the meeting, told a grand jury
that it was quote an effort to establish a back
channel between the incoming administration and the Kremlin. It's also

(56:56):
worth noting that Prince donated about two to the Trump
campaign and group support con try it during it left.
They're representative, isn't natter? Uh? He represents inters of the
U A E. Two, doesn't he? Probably? I think because
that that was like the connection, because now that makes
sense to me when you're saying that he created a
mercenary army with them, that they've already done business. And
but also he's like an easy go between. Prince was

(57:19):
also regularly in contact with Steve Bannon throughout the transition,
where while he's having this meeting with Love the conspiracy
about the Sex Island because it goes back to sort
of this bizarre form of what a conservative thinks is like,
you know, the most evil ship. It's like sex Island.
I mean, if Hillary Clinton had a Sex Island, she
would not have lost the election. No, she would have.

(57:40):
There would have been some flavor in that putting there
would absolutely yea, yeah, that's not That is someone who
I don't even think has been to an island, even
though a restaurant called islands. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, that's
where we are right now. The whole incident is of
extreme interest to Robert Mueller because it might be proof
that Kushner was trying to establish a back channel and
go back channel to Russia. Um. So we'll be hearing

(58:03):
more about Eric Prince in the future, probably before the
time this podcast drops. Possibly. Um yeah, I again, it's crazy.
I mean, it's not crazy to me, right because we've
we see people like this all the time, but like that,
this is the guy who has constantly just been trying
to make his secret little play army and do all

(58:25):
the fun stuff that he maybe was never able to do.
He's clearly like haunted, you know, from his like familial life.
I'm almost curious to know what that what that upbringing
was like, like what that household must have been a
lot of fun. Yeah, And there's no there's nothing that
I would call like trustworthy information out about like what
that upbringing was like, like like a lot of these guys,

(58:47):
you know, we're able to talk a little bit about,
like the abuse that Saddam Hussein and Jurd. I don't
know what, I don't know. It's possible he had great
parents who were just crazy far right nut jobs, and
so Prince grew up because maybe he's just a happy
guy being a billionaire nut job. Also he's a billionaire now,
it's like worth two and a half billion dollars. So
this has all worked out great for Prince and is

(59:09):
there is there? You think the closest he would come
to any kind of liability legally would be through the probe,
the Russia probe. I mean, at this point, so many
international crimes and never gotten in trouble me in a
meaningful way. I haven't trouble believing that anything is going
to happen that puts this guy away. Being a rich

(59:29):
white guy is the best ship ever. And it's like
getting the suit like the star in Mario. Yeah, you know, Yeah,
he's he's Yeah, he's always got that flashing and vulnerability thing.
I mean, most of the people talk about on this
podcast have been dead for a while. Um, but Eric
is still alive. And yeah, I'd be down with him
spending the rest of his life in prison, Like that'd

(59:51):
be great. That'd be the Bee's knees. Um. But he'll
probably just keep on making more armies. And I got
a feeling one of these days he's going to get
his own air force, right God, I mean I believe it. Yeah,
they'll Yeah, help I help problem prior Russia or something weird.
You're just gotta have a dream and a hope and
billions of dollars in a rich white family that's heavily

(01:00:13):
connected to the U. S. President. Yeah, that's all you need,
and you can do any anything. I just don't go
to college. Miles. Yes, thank you so much for your
help today. You've been wonderful. Thank you for illuminating this
for me. Yeah, you got some plugs, you want to
plug in the plug zone? Do I want to plug anything? Yes?
I do. Uh. There's a little podcast I do every

(01:00:34):
day with Jack O'Brien called The Daily Seitgeist. But you
probably knew that, right because everybody knows the most famous
podcast out there. Not really, but please listen to that.
We talked about the news and have fun and we
always have funny comedians and just try and make the
news of the day bearable. And you can follow me
on social media and on you know all that Twitter,
Instagram at Miles of Gray, and you can find us

(01:00:55):
on all of the various social media platforms as Bastards
pod or at the Hid the Bastards dot com, our
home on the Worldwide Internet Web dot net. Peace m
h m hm