November 8, 2022 • 30 mins
We pick up with our young revolutionaries as they begin to fight back.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Oh. Like many people in Myanmba, the boys weren't usually
political before the protest, but what they saw in the
streets change them. This wasn't about the minor disagreement between
two parties. It was about fighting for the right to
(00:26):
live their life that a boot on their necks. Election
had delivered victory to asan Suki's National League for Democracy
and delivered a resounding vote of no confidence in the
political arm of the top of the door, the nation's military.
It's worth noting here that yes, we are compressing some
complex things. The elections weren't perfect, and people in areas
(00:47):
that were largely non Berman tend not to support the NLD.
The NLD had failed to prevent a genocide, but in
the country that was well accustomed to harsh military rule,
there remained a better option than a military which saw
ruling as its and it's sold just a separate from
the citizens. So when the military lost a record number
of seats, everyone knew what would happen next. The same
(01:09):
thing that happened in the same thing that always happened
when the people came a little too close to taking
power from their military. So that happened on February first,
and the first few days we didn't know what to do.
We I mean we we knew the military was going
to make it coop because one the Analogy won the election.
(01:31):
That's why. That's how it started, right and then and
the military saying that they you know, they cheated, they like,
I don't know how to say, they like funked up
the votes, and you know they make themselves win. It
wasn't true. I mean, the military's not going to win
at all. Like it was because, like I said, there
were changes. You know, people saw those changes, and and
(01:53):
people were saying, yes, if she had one more you know,
like four more years, right, more years, she could make
a real difference. Those first few days of protest, everyone
says so hopeful, just like our protagonists and Zor who
he met in a previous episode, thousands of young people
ran into the street and found solidarity in a simple
politics to buck that guy. There were so many people
(02:15):
man insane, So in reality there was I think two
hundred thousand people that day. The marches got bigger every day,
and it seemed like nothing could stop them. Briefly, Western
news organizations public stories, and everyone hoped that the U.
N or the US or the EU would show up
and the Top Medal will be dealt with once and
(02:35):
for all. Yeah. I was trying to film, but then
one of the guy pointed and going at me, and
I was like, but none of that happened. The stories stopped.
The West never sent a single bullet or soldier, and
the Top Meda deployed thousands. Even after a year. All
the boys remember the first time they saw the force
(02:56):
of the state turned against them. Even before he got
out of the border town of Mile Wady, Andy saw
the Top medaw begin to fight back against the movement
that had grown up to oppose them. It's a story
we heard from everyone we spoke to. Once they began organizing,
the cops started trying to infiltrate their groups. I think
police and military started realizing that we are that group too,
(03:17):
So then they started trying to track down. So there
was one night where two of the guys almost got
arrested and then they ran away and then we're like, okay,
they they are kind of following us. Yeah, yeah, and
so after a week, um, the same thing happened. I
was living because I wasn't from yality, they didn't know
I was just a new face, so they didn't really
(03:39):
know where I lived or you know, and I always
like take like two or three taxi just to get
to where I was. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but the
same place or you like switching. No, that was the
same place, but it was out of town. Three of
his friends got arrested. They're still in jail. Actually in
jail is the best case scenario because the top Medal
(03:59):
make a habit of executing captured activists. The stakes were
life and death at every moment, and covering the movement
on a daily basis took its toll on Andy and
his brothers too. So my younger brother, Um, they were
in the capital city and that the first time the
military killed someone, they were there. They were in the
same protests, so they saw the whole thing, and you know,
(04:21):
they were traumatized. And so I thought at the second time,
I went back and I thought, well, you know, like
it's better to bring them all together with me, like
in the same place that we do it together than
all of us spread out everywhere, you know. And like
I said, my family's military on the military side, so
they didn't like that my brothers were going out to protest,
(04:43):
so that I was like, Okay, I'm gonna bring you guys,
um and yeah, so we did all we did the
Young protests together, six of us. They came face to
face with the potential cost of their struggle. And they
were in Napole when that happened there, and it's it's
military city, so it's very heavily controlled by the military.
(05:05):
And the first time they went out to protest um,
the military shoot people. And he was, yeah, there was
like these trucks with the water pennants. So he got
here by one and like he he wasn't viewing well,
so they took him to the ambulance. But then once
he got in there there was a guy without his
(05:26):
eyes because they shot like brown bullets into him. Um,
he was trump that. Yeah. Remember when Andy says Napier
Do is a military city, he isn't just saying it's
a city like Colleen, Texas or San Diego. Napier Door
is a city created out of nothing starting in two
thousand two, to be a capital for men. Mar If
(05:47):
you've seen it at all, it's probably in a TV
show that mocks the totalitarian excess of building seven lane
motorways in a city that was until recently only populated
by the people building it. Top Gear played car foot
ball on the empty freeways, and the TV show Dark
Tourists also featured the city. Today, it is a real
city with a real population, but everything about it was
(06:09):
designed to reinforce authority. And yet the boys and thousands
of others took to the streets here streets built to
reinforce the power of the people. They were fighting to
demand that the military listened to them. Andy shows us
a picture of the man with his eyes shot out.
It looks how you think it would, and it is
worth noting that shooting people's eyes out is a time
honored international policing tactic. US cops shot more than a
(06:33):
hundred and fifteen people in the face with less legal munitions.
Thirty suffered permanent damage to their eyes. But in Myanmar
everything escalated several levels higher than that. Shooting out eyes
wasn't radical violence for the toutmad Aw. They treated it
more like stretching before a run. In one protest, the
boys saw some drunk people tossing water bottles at the police.
(06:54):
The police responded with live gunfire. Under police can fall,
people's are turned to the backside the retreat. Yeah, yeah,
very intense situation. Peoples are running. They also some guys
(07:15):
during rocks back to the police. Yeah, that's when the
police started shooting. Andy translated the next part for us.
He so he was in the protest and then they
started shooting, and he ran away and got the male amail.
But he was not in his neighborhood, in his area
(07:38):
of the city. He was somewhere else. So when they
started running, he didn't have anywhere to go. And then
someone um like accept him at the house. They say,
coming coming and he hit but no beating him. Yeah.
(07:58):
So yeah, he hit in the us for like two
hours until the shooting stopped. It wasn't until they got
home that they realized the police had killed someone. In
the early days of what became the revolution, people formed
tight bonds and made radical commitments in the form of
legal activity. Well, the top of the door was still
scrambling to counter the counter coup. Everyone felt the clamp
down bite at a different time. It took a longer
(08:20):
than average for the cops to find a mirror and
her card of revolutionaries, but eventually that day came. It
came as she and her friends were gathered in a
t shot preparing for an action at that time. On
that day, they are trying to protacts in a Santo
pro provenience. Uh so before the protest that they getting
(08:44):
the people at the t shop. Uh. They sitting in
the table with her teams about including her five people.
But she had to go and I give the banner
to the other groups. So she's leaving just about like
(09:06):
this match. And then then the soldiers came into the
tea shop and then arrested her teammates. She's lucky to
escape it yea, yeah, really narrow, you know, yeah, cy,
she could leave immediately. Yeah, yeah, so that's how she
(09:28):
came here because her teammates know where she left, her
house and everything, so she has no choice to stay
in the Younger. But that she stayed organizing her teams
to the protests in the Younger from here here? What
(09:48):
her parents think when she had to leave, So her
parents told her the survivor, it's the fast, so she
can't do whatever she wants. And then but she have
to be on her own, okay, well yeah, and then
(10:10):
they don't they agree, you know, like if if she
wants to leave, just leave. If she say want to
do the you know, uh, protesting or whatever she wants.
And they're not saying no to her, but they're not supporting.
They just sort of thing she's on her right, Yeah,
(10:32):
she's on her own. That that's how last night I
told you guys that she lost her inheritance. Uh, like
you know, she have to give up on everything. Well,
every in San Francisco, t K could see what was
happening through the scouts on the ground and soldiers post
on Facebook. He started to amass a huge amount of intel.
(10:54):
He also knew where the underground groups and what obbedience
movement centers were in the city's and when he saw
the cops of the military coming for them, he was
able to give them the heads up. So whenever we
we have like you know, uh information about from the
you know, some cd M soldiers, some CIDIUM police and
(11:15):
then they gave him the informations had so we got
the information, so like, okay, those guys are going to
the you know, let's say, okay, this place and then
within one hour so from that place where we're living,
the underground kings move out to get out, yeah get out. Yeah.
(11:37):
So so so that kind of things with with that,
we save a lot of people. And then we got
arrested people too, But we also save people. Everyone we
(11:57):
spoke to told us the same story. They went into
the street thinking that if they made enough noise, the
world would listen, and that the US or the EU
or the u N would defend democracy and invoke their
responsibility to protect innocent people being gunned down in the street.
To quote from the online publication The Diplomat endorsed by
all Member States of the United Dations in two thousand five,
(12:19):
Our two P advances a potentially revolutionary idea that state
sovereignty entails a responsibility for a government to protect its
population from massive trustee crimes and human rights violations. When
a nation fails to exercise this responsibility, our two P
grant the international community the legal warrant to intervene. The
doctrine authorizes the use of a range of coercive tools,
(12:40):
with military intervention as a last resort. People in Myanma
thought that if they were peaceful, civil and respectable, the
governments of the world would do the right thing. The
government of the world, however, didn't give a funk. But yeah,
so the protests are very very peaceful, you know, it's
it's when you go into the protest, it's very peaceful,
very organized, very um it's they try to make it
(13:04):
look so clean, so nice because I guess you know, no,
it was at the beginning they were trying to get
attention from the international community, and they were hoping that
someone will come in and say, you know, take down
the military and put our government back. Yeah, a lot
of people die, just like there was this saying like
(13:24):
to you, and you know, people were saying how many
like how many dead people do you need for you
to take action? Right? And there are people saying I
will if you need one more, I'll be that person.
I'll just fucking die. I'll just get killed by the
military so that you will come in and fix it
and change this situation in the country. Right, and Mayror
felt the same. She even organized the protest five people
(13:47):
displaying the map of the whole country on the river
and you ain't gone. She called it a suicide admission,
but she thought it would send a visible signal to
the world and it was worth risking her life to
make the statement. Okay, at the time, she she she
didn't know anything about the politics, so she believed in
(14:10):
our TWOPI because people are protesting peacefolly, but the government
take the action. So other countries not gonna wait in
and see and then they're gonna take the actions about that.
That's what she believed in, and then she she decided
to go protesting peacefolly theater And Okay, did she think
(14:33):
that other countries, United States, whatever, we're gonna come in
and intervene. Yeah, yeah, that that that's what she thought, Like,
you know, I want the wall seal, the government take
the actions, and the government killing people and if they
if the war knows, and then we can get a
hab from the from the other countries. Where they did
(14:55):
find support within other countries in Asia fighting games dictatorship,
they formed so called milk Ti aligns and through on
the example of Hong Kong to learn how to stay
in the streets when the government doesn't want you there.
But then when it happens in our country, it's like,
oh fuck, where does it happen before? And then we
went back straight with Hong Kong and there was it's
not just us, like there were so much infographics and
(15:17):
like how to be in the protests, how to do
certain things depending on the situation. Um, so we had
a lot of information. We were Yeah, we were looking
through and I think that these are the same thing
that like people in Hong Kong used, I think, but
Hong Kong didn't have sniper shooting kids in the head
or cops faring rifles blindly into crowds. But then later on,
(15:37):
like by the time we got to young and people
were sitting down, they were little protests. What the military
does is they would come in and they would just
start shooting everyone. There was no there's no negotiation, there
was no hey, guys, can you move and then you know,
any any of that stuff. They were coming and they
would treat this as a battlefield. And it didn't take
(15:59):
a while. It didn't well, it did take a while.
I think it took about like a month and a
half for us to finally say, fuck the peaceful protests,
the international community, they're not coming. If they wouldn't come,
they would have come a long time ago, you know,
And we started fighting back. But when we say we
fight back, it's like moltalth cuttails, sling charts, dr wander
(16:28):
you exactly when and how police were. He would spend
his days targing people who would survive from those who
might not make it soon. The worst nightmares of his
medical team are coming true, and so police began seizing
his colleagues the alleged crime of saving lives. I remember
before the Mali Free Police, Emily fee Man totally totally
(16:52):
intruded our hospital one day. I think at the middle
of them. May Okay, they totally intruded our horse with
it because they have they have hearts. Our city and
doctors are to be operation at that hospital because we
have no more, no, no another place like that drum
trauma set. We could give a good treat man for
(17:16):
that trauma de patient because but we have to take
a risk because what we're gonna take a rest soon.
One of our concert was arrested at that emergency unit
because he took he took also his race. But if
he wasn't here, his junior can't handle that situation. You know,
(17:41):
you know, so many tense handres injury endure patient on
that day mostly are can't your patient. You know, summer
open apolement, open limbs. Okay, so we have so many
prices on that not things only got worse. Yeah, Yeah,
there was a pregnant woman who got shot and obviously
(18:06):
with the kids in and she died because she accepted
like twenty protesters in her house and when they came
they shot her death. And she wasn't like five weeks.
Oh it's it's you can see that she was pregnant.
A military used straight up real bullets, like they don't
(18:26):
give a ship, they don't give a ship. That the
way the military control people is fear, right, So then
they want people to see that if you go against me,
you'll die horribly, and they shoot had We saw so
many faces with holes, you know, so many people with
holes in their face. It was fucked up, and it
(18:47):
was scary because every time you go out, you're saying,
that could be me, that could be my brothers, that
could be you know. Very quickly the revolution organized itself,
not with hierarchies, officers, or vanguard parties. The people who
had existed in those roles had already been arrested or fled,
so instead the revolution started with people giving whatever they
(19:08):
could to the struggle and taking whatever they needed to
get by. The revolutionaries reinterviewed all initially thought that the
struggle would be sure, that the world would come to
their aid. But even when it became clear that this
was not the case. They continued to fight under the
logic that's better to die than live with the bluet
on your neck. They took all the leaders from the
opposition side, so there was no one to tell us
(19:30):
what to do. There was no instructions, right, so there
was like two days of Okay, what the fun do
we do? You know? And then people started protesting, but small,
like very small, and then I think after like five
days then there was like two d tho people everywhere.
And now that I remember the first day we arrived,
(19:51):
I mean, we haven't seen each other since COVID started,
so it was like rather, you know, back again and together.
And then yeah, it was fun for like one night
and then we're all hanging out and trying to plan
what we're gonna do the next day. So basically we
kind of planned that, like each of us have a rule,
and our plan was to go out and kind of
(20:15):
be like a media crew. Right, so we're filming, we're
writing news, we're posting on the internet so that everywhere
else people can see it. Um, so yeah, two of
us are like the camera people. And then this too,
they look out for the roads and streets like because
these places we've never been right Daniel in these areas.
(20:36):
So whenever we go to a protest, we'll sit down
or we'll walk around and take photos while these twos
goes around and look for the fastest escapes. You know,
if the military come in, what would be the best
way to go? Would you know? Escape? And then him
another one. They kind of look after us. They look
at the news to see what's happening around us, so
(20:57):
that if there's a post on Facebook saying, oh so
military truck heading towards you, we kind of be prepared,
you know. But yeah, that was Yeah, we had a
lot of energy at that time. It was like constant.
We were going out and you can see like he's
(21:18):
always following me, like that's me and living him and
he's always following me everywhere I go. So that's something happening.
And he's grabbed me. And while the boys and Andy
were reporting, Amira found her calling on the front lines.
It's almost impossible to stress how incredible she is. Before
we recorded, she casually dropped into conversation that she also
trained in knife fighting. Sometimes. We met her at a
(21:39):
shooting range near my soft and blasted a few paper
targets together with a twelve gage shotgun we've been using
for a bit of target practice. When it jammed, and
it always jammed, she cleared the chamber and got it
back into action with a practiced efficiency that any formally
trained soldier would have recognized. In the revolution, it didn't
take long for her to find her way to the
front lines, and she's got the scars to prove it,
(22:01):
including some from hucking a tear gas grenade bare handed
back at the cops. Others adopted roles to Some picked
up shields and took on the police toe to toe.
Other supported protesters with medical aid and food and water.
So you can see the shield two three four or
five two yeah, to make it and then you can
see like they have these wet like plastic bads to
(22:25):
like watch people's faces when they were two gats or
like um two killed the smokes with the what towels too,
and then there's someone always water in it, like yeah,
And this is all from the neighborhood, like they provided
to us. They build barricades and even developed a system
(22:46):
of communications for when things were getting violent. This allowed
folks who were not comfortable to get away, or at
least that was the goal. So the white flag means
like we have this place, like this is our But
then the black flag means will suck you up back,
like if you've done so much that we're gonna suck
you up you know. Um, I have a video of it.
(23:08):
Wanted changed from white to black. Their tactics improved over time.
When one group got kettled, another group would pop up
nearby and draw soldiers away. Oh yeah, so wait, and
then there was one time when one one part of
the city was enter attacked by the military. A lot
(23:29):
of protesters were trapped in there, and so we decided
to go out. So every other parts of the city
came out at nighttime to protest, so that they soldiers
have to kind of yeah yeah, a mirror too, came
face to face with state violence. Oh yeah yeah. Balldi
and Machia wants she wants to take the Acian bag
(23:53):
because uh, they are all protesting peace folly and at
that time she wants to have a superpower. M M yeah,
maybe she does. What what did she what did she
decided to do? What? What did they do at that time?
And she feels like she's going until the act and
(24:16):
then she would keep moving and then she will participate
in a every role that she can, and then she
would do as much as she can. That's that's what
she decided to. We saw that picture of her in
front of the car and burning. Yeah, we're happened there
with the throwing molotov cocktails. Yeah, okay, so like smoke
(24:37):
bombs and then something like that, and then she's trying
to tow them back pure yeah yeah, yeah, so she
picked it up and then she told them back hurt
your hand, Yeah, you have a scar? Fuck? Oh well
yeah yeah. Then uh she got hit by the smoke
bone like a twice. And then at that time she
(25:01):
lost everything. She lost her pads, she lost her phones,
and someone have her to hold and took her back.
That's how she escaped by they helped you. You know
who helped you with it? A friend or just a stranger.
Her Francis with her and now want that to your
gas hit down and then the other strangers had them
(25:27):
and then she got hit by the tor gas and
then and then she almost faint and a black out.
Our doctor who goes by wonder faced a difficult choice
returning to the hospital meant risking arrest. The military could
come in at any time to arrest injured protesters and
the doctors helping them, but not going back then letting
(25:48):
his comrades die. State violence increased. He decided he needed
to help. They cleared so many waceful protest on that day.
I think up around about nearly round our handred or
more might be more than that, Yes, on that day,
you know, or because we have already we have already
(26:11):
started see that this Verdian movement on that on that time,
because we didn't go the hospital that was roomed by
that generate Okay, okay, so we did outside the hospital.
You know, we are we managed templary camp like that
(26:32):
because for emergency in Joe patient at that time I
was involved one of the campsie. Yeah, because but actually
we can't do uh some of the injury of pelet
that may need for emergency operations like that bullet go through. Yeah,
(26:52):
go to break the bombs and open wom so, but
we have to take the risk because we have to
operate that patient. We go to hospital trauma emergency department.
We did our operation. I remember that not one of
the pasions was shot down by police and they chased,
(27:14):
they followed that patient. We kept that pasion in our
hospital in our war we emergency or we did emergency
operation on that at that night, on that night, and
we emagineing moved him out on that not because we
can't keep him on that hospital, because soon he just
(27:37):
left our hospital. The police just came and started for him.
But this is one of our ice creams. It was
they just quite there again, what is that guy? T
K got on telegram? Lots of people couldn't be underground fighting,
but they still wanted to be part of the struggle.
(27:57):
He developed good connections with people on the ground, but
first that was just him desperately try and stay informed.
But soon he realized that he was well placed to
be doing the informing. With internet access cut off VPN
is slowing down, only someone outside the country with blazing
fast Bay Area WiFi could collect all the info coming
in and turn it into useful, actionable advice for protesters
(28:19):
on the ground. At that time, we know nothing about it.
No one's no one's teaching us what to do. So
we have to do it. Do it, you know, like
we we we met. We like I said, we have
a seventy people. So we have a meeting every day,
every night, so we try to you know, brainstormy what
(28:42):
we're gonna do. And then so we're making we're making
the plans and that we're making like, Okay, we're gonna
get the informations from you know everything, details that we
can get, and that that's what we're going to share
to the people. That's what we're gonna share to the
underground team and other people. Within a few weeks, it
(29:03):
had become clear that a diverse range of people, tactics,
and tools are going to be needed in the fight
for freedom in Myanma. Next time we'll talk about how
that fight took shape and tell you what it's like today.
Hi everyone, it's James here. I just wanted to note
that lots of the words in the script a Burmese
(29:25):
or karen or tie, and we've made every effort to
make sure that we pronounce them correctly, but we're sure
we've obviously made some mistakes along the way. That's not
out of a lack of respect or out of a
lack of re recording on my part. That we did
want to note that where we've made a mistake, we're
very sorry for doing so. It could Happen Here is
a production of cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from
cool Zone Media, visit our website cool zone media dot com,
(29:48):
or check us out on the I Heart Radio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can
find sources for It could Happen Here, updated monthly at
caol zone Meda dot com slash sources. Thanks for listening.
Oh. Like many people in Myanmba, the boys weren't usually
political before the protest, but what they saw in the
streets change them. This wasn't about the minor disagreement between
two parties. It was about fighting for the right to
(00:26):
live their life that a boot on their necks. Election
had delivered victory to asan Suki's National League for Democracy
and delivered a resounding vote of no confidence in the
political arm of the top of the door, the nation's military.
It's worth noting here that yes, we are compressing some
complex things. The elections weren't perfect, and people in areas
(00:47):
that were largely non Berman tend not to support the NLD.
The NLD had failed to prevent a genocide, but in
the country that was well accustomed to harsh military rule,
there remained a better option than a military which saw
ruling as its and it's sold just a separate from
the citizens. So when the military lost a record number
of seats, everyone knew what would happen next. The same
(01:09):
thing that happened in the same thing that always happened
when the people came a little too close to taking
power from their military. So that happened on February first,
and the first few days we didn't know what to do.
We I mean we we knew the military was going
to make it coop because one the Analogy won the election.
(01:31):
That's why. That's how it started, right and then and
the military saying that they you know, they cheated, they like,
I don't know how to say, they like funked up
the votes, and you know they make themselves win. It
wasn't true. I mean, the military's not going to win
at all. Like it was because, like I said, there
were changes. You know, people saw those changes, and and
(01:53):
people were saying, yes, if she had one more you know,
like four more years, right, more years, she could make
a real difference. Those first few days of protest, everyone
says so hopeful, just like our protagonists and Zor who
he met in a previous episode, thousands of young people
ran into the street and found solidarity in a simple
politics to buck that guy. There were so many people
(02:15):
man insane, So in reality there was I think two
hundred thousand people that day. The marches got bigger every day,
and it seemed like nothing could stop them. Briefly, Western
news organizations public stories, and everyone hoped that the U.
N or the US or the EU would show up
and the Top Medal will be dealt with once and
(02:35):
for all. Yeah. I was trying to film, but then
one of the guy pointed and going at me, and
I was like, but none of that happened. The stories stopped.
The West never sent a single bullet or soldier, and
the Top Meda deployed thousands. Even after a year. All
the boys remember the first time they saw the force
(02:56):
of the state turned against them. Even before he got
out of the border town of Mile Wady, Andy saw
the Top medaw begin to fight back against the movement
that had grown up to oppose them. It's a story
we heard from everyone we spoke to. Once they began organizing,
the cops started trying to infiltrate their groups. I think
police and military started realizing that we are that group too,
(03:17):
So then they started trying to track down. So there
was one night where two of the guys almost got
arrested and then they ran away and then we're like, okay,
they they are kind of following us. Yeah, yeah, and
so after a week, um, the same thing happened. I
was living because I wasn't from yality, they didn't know
I was just a new face, so they didn't really
(03:39):
know where I lived or you know, and I always
like take like two or three taxi just to get
to where I was. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but the
same place or you like switching. No, that was the
same place, but it was out of town. Three of
his friends got arrested. They're still in jail. Actually in
jail is the best case scenario because the top Medal
(03:59):
make a habit of executing captured activists. The stakes were
life and death at every moment, and covering the movement
on a daily basis took its toll on Andy and
his brothers too. So my younger brother, Um, they were
in the capital city and that the first time the
military killed someone, they were there. They were in the
same protests, so they saw the whole thing, and you know,
(04:21):
they were traumatized. And so I thought at the second time,
I went back and I thought, well, you know, like
it's better to bring them all together with me, like
in the same place that we do it together than
all of us spread out everywhere, you know. And like
I said, my family's military on the military side, so
they didn't like that my brothers were going out to protest,
(04:43):
so that I was like, Okay, I'm gonna bring you guys,
um and yeah, so we did all we did the
Young protests together, six of us. They came face to
face with the potential cost of their struggle. And they
were in Napole when that happened there, and it's it's
military city, so it's very heavily controlled by the military.
(05:05):
And the first time they went out to protest um,
the military shoot people. And he was, yeah, there was
like these trucks with the water pennants. So he got
here by one and like he he wasn't viewing well,
so they took him to the ambulance. But then once
he got in there there was a guy without his
(05:26):
eyes because they shot like brown bullets into him. Um,
he was trump that. Yeah. Remember when Andy says Napier
Do is a military city, he isn't just saying it's
a city like Colleen, Texas or San Diego. Napier Door
is a city created out of nothing starting in two
thousand two, to be a capital for men. Mar If
(05:47):
you've seen it at all, it's probably in a TV
show that mocks the totalitarian excess of building seven lane
motorways in a city that was until recently only populated
by the people building it. Top Gear played car foot
ball on the empty freeways, and the TV show Dark
Tourists also featured the city. Today, it is a real
city with a real population, but everything about it was
(06:09):
designed to reinforce authority. And yet the boys and thousands
of others took to the streets here streets built to
reinforce the power of the people. They were fighting to
demand that the military listened to them. Andy shows us
a picture of the man with his eyes shot out.
It looks how you think it would, and it is
worth noting that shooting people's eyes out is a time
honored international policing tactic. US cops shot more than a
(06:33):
hundred and fifteen people in the face with less legal munitions.
Thirty suffered permanent damage to their eyes. But in Myanmar
everything escalated several levels higher than that. Shooting out eyes
wasn't radical violence for the toutmad Aw. They treated it
more like stretching before a run. In one protest, the
boys saw some drunk people tossing water bottles at the police.
(06:54):
The police responded with live gunfire. Under police can fall,
people's are turned to the backside the retreat. Yeah, yeah,
very intense situation. Peoples are running. They also some guys
(07:15):
during rocks back to the police. Yeah, that's when the
police started shooting. Andy translated the next part for us.
He so he was in the protest and then they
started shooting, and he ran away and got the male amail.
But he was not in his neighborhood, in his area
(07:38):
of the city. He was somewhere else. So when they
started running, he didn't have anywhere to go. And then
someone um like accept him at the house. They say,
coming coming and he hit but no beating him. Yeah.
(07:58):
So yeah, he hit in the us for like two
hours until the shooting stopped. It wasn't until they got
home that they realized the police had killed someone. In
the early days of what became the revolution, people formed
tight bonds and made radical commitments in the form of
legal activity. Well, the top of the door was still
scrambling to counter the counter coup. Everyone felt the clamp
down bite at a different time. It took a longer
(08:20):
than average for the cops to find a mirror and
her card of revolutionaries, but eventually that day came. It
came as she and her friends were gathered in a
t shot preparing for an action at that time. On
that day, they are trying to protacts in a Santo
pro provenience. Uh so before the protest that they getting
(08:44):
the people at the t shop. Uh. They sitting in
the table with her teams about including her five people.
But she had to go and I give the banner
to the other groups. So she's leaving just about like
(09:06):
this match. And then then the soldiers came into the
tea shop and then arrested her teammates. She's lucky to
escape it yea, yeah, really narrow, you know, yeah, cy,
she could leave immediately. Yeah, yeah, so that's how she
(09:28):
came here because her teammates know where she left, her
house and everything, so she has no choice to stay
in the Younger. But that she stayed organizing her teams
to the protests in the Younger from here here? What
(09:48):
her parents think when she had to leave, So her
parents told her the survivor, it's the fast, so she
can't do whatever she wants. And then but she have
to be on her own, okay, well yeah, and then
(10:10):
they don't they agree, you know, like if if she
wants to leave, just leave. If she say want to
do the you know, uh, protesting or whatever she wants.
And they're not saying no to her, but they're not supporting.
They just sort of thing she's on her right, Yeah,
(10:32):
she's on her own. That that's how last night I
told you guys that she lost her inheritance. Uh, like
you know, she have to give up on everything. Well,
every in San Francisco, t K could see what was
happening through the scouts on the ground and soldiers post
on Facebook. He started to amass a huge amount of intel.
(10:54):
He also knew where the underground groups and what obbedience
movement centers were in the city's and when he saw
the cops of the military coming for them, he was
able to give them the heads up. So whenever we
we have like you know, uh information about from the
you know, some cd M soldiers, some CIDIUM police and
(11:15):
then they gave him the informations had so we got
the information, so like, okay, those guys are going to
the you know, let's say, okay, this place and then
within one hour so from that place where we're living,
the underground kings move out to get out, yeah get out. Yeah.
(11:37):
So so so that kind of things with with that,
we save a lot of people. And then we got
arrested people too, But we also save people. Everyone we
(11:57):
spoke to told us the same story. They went into
the street thinking that if they made enough noise, the
world would listen, and that the US or the EU
or the u N would defend democracy and invoke their
responsibility to protect innocent people being gunned down in the street.
To quote from the online publication The Diplomat endorsed by
all Member States of the United Dations in two thousand five,
(12:19):
Our two P advances a potentially revolutionary idea that state
sovereignty entails a responsibility for a government to protect its
population from massive trustee crimes and human rights violations. When
a nation fails to exercise this responsibility, our two P
grant the international community the legal warrant to intervene. The
doctrine authorizes the use of a range of coercive tools,
(12:40):
with military intervention as a last resort. People in Myanma
thought that if they were peaceful, civil and respectable, the
governments of the world would do the right thing. The
government of the world, however, didn't give a funk. But yeah,
so the protests are very very peaceful, you know, it's
it's when you go into the protest, it's very peaceful,
very organized, very um it's they try to make it
(13:04):
look so clean, so nice because I guess you know, no,
it was at the beginning they were trying to get
attention from the international community, and they were hoping that
someone will come in and say, you know, take down
the military and put our government back. Yeah, a lot
of people die, just like there was this saying like
(13:24):
to you, and you know, people were saying how many
like how many dead people do you need for you
to take action? Right? And there are people saying I
will if you need one more, I'll be that person.
I'll just fucking die. I'll just get killed by the
military so that you will come in and fix it
and change this situation in the country. Right, and Mayror
felt the same. She even organized the protest five people
(13:47):
displaying the map of the whole country on the river
and you ain't gone. She called it a suicide admission,
but she thought it would send a visible signal to
the world and it was worth risking her life to
make the statement. Okay, at the time, she she she
didn't know anything about the politics, so she believed in
(14:10):
our TWOPI because people are protesting peacefolly, but the government
take the action. So other countries not gonna wait in
and see and then they're gonna take the actions about that.
That's what she believed in, and then she she decided
to go protesting peacefolly theater And Okay, did she think
(14:33):
that other countries, United States, whatever, we're gonna come in
and intervene. Yeah, yeah, that that that's what she thought, Like,
you know, I want the wall seal, the government take
the actions, and the government killing people and if they
if the war knows, and then we can get a
hab from the from the other countries. Where they did
(14:55):
find support within other countries in Asia fighting games dictatorship,
they formed so called milk Ti aligns and through on
the example of Hong Kong to learn how to stay
in the streets when the government doesn't want you there.
But then when it happens in our country, it's like,
oh fuck, where does it happen before? And then we
went back straight with Hong Kong and there was it's
not just us, like there were so much infographics and
(15:17):
like how to be in the protests, how to do
certain things depending on the situation. Um, so we had
a lot of information. We were Yeah, we were looking
through and I think that these are the same thing
that like people in Hong Kong used, I think, but
Hong Kong didn't have sniper shooting kids in the head
or cops faring rifles blindly into crowds. But then later on,
(15:37):
like by the time we got to young and people
were sitting down, they were little protests. What the military
does is they would come in and they would just
start shooting everyone. There was no there's no negotiation, there
was no hey, guys, can you move and then you know,
any any of that stuff. They were coming and they
would treat this as a battlefield. And it didn't take
(15:59):
a while. It didn't well, it did take a while.
I think it took about like a month and a
half for us to finally say, fuck the peaceful protests,
the international community, they're not coming. If they wouldn't come,
they would have come a long time ago, you know,
And we started fighting back. But when we say we
fight back, it's like moltalth cuttails, sling charts, dr wander
(16:28):
you exactly when and how police were. He would spend
his days targing people who would survive from those who
might not make it soon. The worst nightmares of his
medical team are coming true, and so police began seizing
his colleagues the alleged crime of saving lives. I remember
before the Mali Free Police, Emily fee Man totally totally
(16:52):
intruded our hospital one day. I think at the middle
of them. May Okay, they totally intruded our horse with
it because they have they have hearts. Our city and
doctors are to be operation at that hospital because we
have no more, no, no another place like that drum
trauma set. We could give a good treat man for
(17:16):
that trauma de patient because but we have to take
a risk because what we're gonna take a rest soon.
One of our concert was arrested at that emergency unit
because he took he took also his race. But if
he wasn't here, his junior can't handle that situation. You know,
(17:41):
you know, so many tense handres injury endure patient on
that day mostly are can't your patient. You know, summer
open apolement, open limbs. Okay, so we have so many
prices on that not things only got worse. Yeah, Yeah,
there was a pregnant woman who got shot and obviously
(18:06):
with the kids in and she died because she accepted
like twenty protesters in her house and when they came
they shot her death. And she wasn't like five weeks.
Oh it's it's you can see that she was pregnant.
A military used straight up real bullets, like they don't
(18:26):
give a ship, they don't give a ship. That the
way the military control people is fear, right, So then
they want people to see that if you go against me,
you'll die horribly, and they shoot had We saw so
many faces with holes, you know, so many people with
holes in their face. It was fucked up, and it
(18:47):
was scary because every time you go out, you're saying,
that could be me, that could be my brothers, that
could be you know. Very quickly the revolution organized itself,
not with hierarchies, officers, or vanguard parties. The people who
had existed in those roles had already been arrested or fled,
so instead the revolution started with people giving whatever they
(19:08):
could to the struggle and taking whatever they needed to
get by. The revolutionaries reinterviewed all initially thought that the
struggle would be sure, that the world would come to
their aid. But even when it became clear that this
was not the case. They continued to fight under the
logic that's better to die than live with the bluet
on your neck. They took all the leaders from the
opposition side, so there was no one to tell us
(19:30):
what to do. There was no instructions, right, so there
was like two days of Okay, what the fun do
we do? You know? And then people started protesting, but small,
like very small, and then I think after like five
days then there was like two d tho people everywhere.
And now that I remember the first day we arrived,
(19:51):
I mean, we haven't seen each other since COVID started,
so it was like rather, you know, back again and together.
And then yeah, it was fun for like one night
and then we're all hanging out and trying to plan
what we're gonna do the next day. So basically we
kind of planned that, like each of us have a rule,
and our plan was to go out and kind of
(20:15):
be like a media crew. Right, so we're filming, we're
writing news, we're posting on the internet so that everywhere
else people can see it. Um, so yeah, two of
us are like the camera people. And then this too,
they look out for the roads and streets like because
these places we've never been right Daniel in these areas.
(20:36):
So whenever we go to a protest, we'll sit down
or we'll walk around and take photos while these twos
goes around and look for the fastest escapes. You know,
if the military come in, what would be the best
way to go? Would you know? Escape? And then him
another one. They kind of look after us. They look
at the news to see what's happening around us, so
(20:57):
that if there's a post on Facebook saying, oh so
military truck heading towards you, we kind of be prepared,
you know. But yeah, that was Yeah, we had a
lot of energy at that time. It was like constant.
We were going out and you can see like he's
(21:18):
always following me, like that's me and living him and
he's always following me everywhere I go. So that's something happening.
And he's grabbed me. And while the boys and Andy
were reporting, Amira found her calling on the front lines.
It's almost impossible to stress how incredible she is. Before
we recorded, she casually dropped into conversation that she also
trained in knife fighting. Sometimes. We met her at a
(21:39):
shooting range near my soft and blasted a few paper
targets together with a twelve gage shotgun we've been using
for a bit of target practice. When it jammed, and
it always jammed, she cleared the chamber and got it
back into action with a practiced efficiency that any formally
trained soldier would have recognized. In the revolution, it didn't
take long for her to find her way to the
front lines, and she's got the scars to prove it,
(22:01):
including some from hucking a tear gas grenade bare handed
back at the cops. Others adopted roles to Some picked
up shields and took on the police toe to toe.
Other supported protesters with medical aid and food and water.
So you can see the shield two three four or
five two yeah, to make it and then you can
see like they have these wet like plastic bads to
(22:25):
like watch people's faces when they were two gats or
like um two killed the smokes with the what towels too,
and then there's someone always water in it, like yeah,
And this is all from the neighborhood, like they provided
to us. They build barricades and even developed a system
(22:46):
of communications for when things were getting violent. This allowed
folks who were not comfortable to get away, or at
least that was the goal. So the white flag means
like we have this place, like this is our But
then the black flag means will suck you up back,
like if you've done so much that we're gonna suck
you up you know. Um, I have a video of it.
(23:08):
Wanted changed from white to black. Their tactics improved over time.
When one group got kettled, another group would pop up
nearby and draw soldiers away. Oh yeah, so wait, and
then there was one time when one one part of
the city was enter attacked by the military. A lot
(23:29):
of protesters were trapped in there, and so we decided
to go out. So every other parts of the city
came out at nighttime to protest, so that they soldiers
have to kind of yeah yeah, a mirror too, came
face to face with state violence. Oh yeah yeah. Balldi
and Machia wants she wants to take the Acian bag
(23:53):
because uh, they are all protesting peace folly and at
that time she wants to have a superpower. M M yeah,
maybe she does. What what did she what did she
decided to do? What? What did they do at that time?
And she feels like she's going until the act and
(24:16):
then she would keep moving and then she will participate
in a every role that she can, and then she
would do as much as she can. That's that's what
she decided to. We saw that picture of her in
front of the car and burning. Yeah, we're happened there
with the throwing molotov cocktails. Yeah, okay, so like smoke
(24:37):
bombs and then something like that, and then she's trying
to tow them back pure yeah yeah, yeah, so she
picked it up and then she told them back hurt
your hand, Yeah, you have a scar? Fuck? Oh well
yeah yeah. Then uh she got hit by the smoke
bone like a twice. And then at that time she
(25:01):
lost everything. She lost her pads, she lost her phones,
and someone have her to hold and took her back.
That's how she escaped by they helped you. You know
who helped you with it? A friend or just a stranger.
Her Francis with her and now want that to your
gas hit down and then the other strangers had them
(25:27):
and then she got hit by the tor gas and
then and then she almost faint and a black out.
Our doctor who goes by wonder faced a difficult choice
returning to the hospital meant risking arrest. The military could
come in at any time to arrest injured protesters and
the doctors helping them, but not going back then letting
(25:48):
his comrades die. State violence increased. He decided he needed
to help. They cleared so many waceful protest on that day.
I think up around about nearly round our handred or
more might be more than that, Yes, on that day,
you know, or because we have already we have already
(26:11):
started see that this Verdian movement on that on that time,
because we didn't go the hospital that was roomed by
that generate Okay, okay, so we did outside the hospital.
You know, we are we managed templary camp like that
(26:32):
because for emergency in Joe patient at that time I
was involved one of the campsie. Yeah, because but actually
we can't do uh some of the injury of pelet
that may need for emergency operations like that bullet go through. Yeah,
(26:52):
go to break the bombs and open wom so, but
we have to take the risk because we have to
operate that patient. We go to hospital trauma emergency department.
We did our operation. I remember that not one of
the pasions was shot down by police and they chased,
(27:14):
they followed that patient. We kept that pasion in our
hospital in our war we emergency or we did emergency
operation on that at that night, on that night, and
we emagineing moved him out on that not because we
can't keep him on that hospital, because soon he just
(27:37):
left our hospital. The police just came and started for him.
But this is one of our ice creams. It was
they just quite there again, what is that guy? T
K got on telegram? Lots of people couldn't be underground fighting,
but they still wanted to be part of the struggle.
(27:57):
He developed good connections with people on the ground, but
first that was just him desperately try and stay informed.
But soon he realized that he was well placed to
be doing the informing. With internet access cut off VPN
is slowing down, only someone outside the country with blazing
fast Bay Area WiFi could collect all the info coming
in and turn it into useful, actionable advice for protesters
(28:19):
on the ground. At that time, we know nothing about it.
No one's no one's teaching us what to do. So
we have to do it. Do it, you know, like
we we we met. We like I said, we have
a seventy people. So we have a meeting every day,
every night, so we try to you know, brainstormy what
(28:42):
we're gonna do. And then so we're making we're making
the plans and that we're making like, Okay, we're gonna
get the informations from you know everything, details that we
can get, and that that's what we're going to share
to the people. That's what we're gonna share to the
underground team and other people. Within a few weeks, it
(29:03):
had become clear that a diverse range of people, tactics,
and tools are going to be needed in the fight
for freedom in Myanma. Next time we'll talk about how
that fight took shape and tell you what it's like today.
Hi everyone, it's James here. I just wanted to note
that lots of the words in the script a Burmese
(29:25):
or karen or tie, and we've made every effort to
make sure that we pronounce them correctly, but we're sure
we've obviously made some mistakes along the way. That's not
out of a lack of respect or out of a
lack of re recording on my part. That we did
want to note that where we've made a mistake, we're
very sorry for doing so. It could Happen Here is
a production of cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from
cool Zone Media, visit our website cool zone media dot com,
(29:48):
or check us out on the I Heart Radio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can
find sources for It could Happen Here, updated monthly at
caol zone Meda dot com slash sources. Thanks for listening.
It Could Happen Here News
Hosts And Creators
Robert Evans
Garrison Davis
James Stout
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