October 26, 2023 • 38 mins
James talked to Raina from the Palestinian Journalists syndicate about the difficulties and dangers faced by journalists in Gaza and the importance of reporting from inside the blockade.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Colson Media. Hello, everyone, it's me James Today. I am
back from my trip to Kurdistan and I'm talking today
with Rania Hayat, a name that I've probably just but shered.
But Ranier is the communications officer for the Palestinian Journalist Syndicate.
(00:25):
And we're very, very lucky to have Ronnie talking to us.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Welcome Renie, thank you, Jams, thank you for contacting me
and letting me be letting me with you.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Yeah, of course you're very welcome. So I think Rania,
it's it's been a really hard time to consume news.
For the first week of what's happening. I was in
mostly Syrian and Iraqi Kurtistan, and I wasn't maybe consuming
as much news so I normally do, because I was
trying to write news in today Uh. And then I
(00:58):
got back there just the the barers you, information and
disinformation has been very hard for people to sort of
wade through, and I wonder I think one of the
things I'd like us to focus on first and foremost
is the impact of Israel's bombing campaign on journalists, specifically
(01:19):
working in Gaza. I know, like friends of mine are
journalists in Gaza. We featured on this podcast before the
people of Parkour, Gaza, and I know that many journalists
have lost their lives covering what's been happening. So can
you explain a little bit about what's been happening and
(01:39):
maybe bring us up to date on the amount of
every loss is a tragedy, but like the amount of
people who have lost their lives covering this.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Yes, James, well, let's start that journalists and Gaza are
civilians who are people who travel. They work, They should travel,
but they work, They do their job. They try to
cover the news with very hard conditions with the daily
life of Gaza. Since the beginning of the war against
(02:08):
Gas on the seventh of October, you know how the
war started targeting everything in Gaza, not even all the people,
more than the people, you know, the buildings, the children,
even the animals, the plants, you know, just bombing and
(02:29):
bombing and bombing strikes the whole time. At the beginning,
we try to we have some our contacts with journalists
in Gaza, we have our General Secretaria member and so
we try to get information from them. At the beginning, Yeah,
it was not easy, but it was okay to get
(02:51):
some information about what's going on. But by the time
now we reached to a place that when I call them,
they always tell dozens of we don't know. We are disconnected.
I'm homeless. Now, I am not able to get any news.
I can't tell you about my friend or my neighbor
(03:12):
next to me, but I'm not able to tell you
about further than this. I will just give some statistics.
Up to now, we have eighteen killed journalists who have
been either killed while try covering, others were killed in
their homes, being through air strikes with their families and
(03:34):
so on. We have also many many journalists who have
dozens of them have been injured. I'm really sorry. I
was I wanted to have some you know, I curate statistics,
but I can't give you until now. We are now
trying trying to develop like a tool to get some statistics,
(03:56):
but until now it's not working well. And we have
many journalists who lost their homes, homes because it was
bomb bombed or yeah, airstract others they were in this place, yeah,
and many of them moves from their homes either because
(04:18):
their homes was bombed or other because they were threatened
to stay at their home safely, so they go to
other like schools, hospitals and so on. The most tragic
is the journalists who are losing their families. When you
call a journalist to ask him about any thing, they
told you Okay, I lost my son, I lost my wife,
(04:39):
I lost all my family, I lost my mother. Now
they are they are completely broken. You can't talk to them.
They are you know, it's really very tragic situation.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
Yeah, it's it's I mean, it's literally unimaginable, like, yeah,
I think I've attended wars, I've lost friends, but nothing.
I can't imagine what it's like on this scale. And
it's heartbreaking to even think about it. And I think
some of what you said obviously, like part of the
(05:13):
situation this creates is that it's very hard to do
reporting on the ground. It's always been hard to do
reporting on the ground at Gaza. I have made plans
to go to Gaza, which probably won't work out now,
but it's hard foreign press, and of course there are
many very capable journalists within Ghas that we don't need
(05:35):
foreign press to go then necessarily. But can you explain
a little bit of how when this war started, it
didn't just like affect these people in terms of killing them,
killing their families, displacing them, detroying their homes. But also
like every day this war goes on, it gets harder
for us to see I think the impact of this
(05:56):
war on civilians living in Gaza, right because of the
image to infrastructure.
Speaker 3 (06:01):
Is that fair to say, yes, this is what's going on,
and yes, reporting is getting more and more complicated because
as also you know, there is no electricity.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
Communication is very very difficult when sometimes through phone call
I call them just to get something, they tell me, okay,
wait until I get some internet and I will get.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
Back to you.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
I wait for hours and hours, sometimes for the second
day to get a little information. So you can imagine
how they can even contact with each other.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
Yeah, and yeah, that makes it very hard. I think
often like we might have more info. This is not
uncommon actually, like you have more information sitting somewhere with
a broad bank connection and access to Twitter than you
do on the ground, right, Like they may not know
everything that's happening.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Yes, I don't know if I can talk about this,
but you know about the restrictions that on all social
media applications, the restrictions on the Palestinian contract content on
the social media. We're facing a big massive wave against
(07:17):
our content, was against our news through Twitter, Instagram, Facebook,
all those applications. So we are not able even to
reach many people are banned, many people are hanged, and
we are just hearing about the banning of many accounts
of Palestinians. The very limited reach the very limited, and
(07:41):
there are sometimes many times they are blocked or yeah,
blocked or from posting and so on. So even also
this is another problem that we are facing to reach out.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Yeah, I think this is in a sense obviously, like
it's in terms of specifically getting information about because I
think that is important. I think if people could understand
what it's like to see someone lose their baby, and
then I think very few people would be able to
(08:12):
in good conscious support that. And the fact that this
has come at a time when I think generally, certainly
for the US, reporting on things outside the US is
an all time low, like it's atrocious, and so people
lack the context to understand, not through any fault of
their own right, but they've just been fed terrible you know,
(08:33):
opinion pieces for the last few years. They lack the
context to understand why what's happening is happening. And I
think obviously Elon Muskusport, Twitter and and just it's accessible.
It's terrible, it's full of false information. And as you say,
often videos that I have friends who are photographers in Gaza,
(08:56):
a friends who are just people in Gaza, and videos
that they post be taken down. It's sometimes they're to
say it's too graphic, it's too violent, but like also
that's their everyday life. Now that's been happening for two weeks. This, Yeah,
graphic violence is sadly what's visited upon them every day.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
Yeah, yes, believe me, what's going on in Gaza is
very You can't image, you can't hold it when you
when you watch it. Even the TV channels they try
to make to minimize how dangerous and how violent are
the scenes that we see. At the same time, I
(09:38):
had a discussion this morning, I don't want people to
cry for us, it's not I don't want people to
cry for the babies killed, and so with very hard
pictures and videos, I just want the humanity without seeing
the video just here that there is a charge it's
loading child children. Thousands of children are losing their child's
(10:02):
life or nothing. Are losing their hands, their legs, they
are now handicapped. They don't know why. You know, we
don't need to see the video, just know that this
is going on. We don't want to make a tragedy.
We don't want to to people to cry with us
when we cry. Yes, we want, okay, some solidarity, but
(10:26):
it's not something to have the emotions and then then
we sleep and then we wake up. That's what Or no, no,
there is something going on. We don't need the sympath
you know, we need some actions, we need steps, we
need humanity now.
Speaker 1 (10:41):
Yeah. So I think that's an excellent, really really excellent point.
Like it's not a film or like something you can
consume and then step away from. So what sort of
solidarity actions can people take to support people in gather,
to support journalists there, to support the greater cause of
not having this issue where every few years thousands of
(11:02):
Palestinian civilians get killed.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
Yes, well, to be honest, we want when we want
to feel better, we turn on the television to see
the demonstrations. When we see the demonstrations London, blocks, cell
the United States and different cities Arab world everywhere. When
we see these demonstrations, we feel that somebody knows there
is like a kind of movement. This helps us, and
(11:28):
we need further steps after the demonstration. We need lobbying.
We need the people who elect their governments who support
those massacs and to say no, we give you leg
legitimacy to be human. Stop this inhumanity. We need the
people to lobby on their governments that this should not
(11:49):
be supported. This is this is the real action that
we need. Lobbying, lobbying, lobbying by the people, by the
power of people.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
Yeah, I think it's one of those things, like some
things will never change in America, at least not by voting,
but like some things, yeah, if enough people and I
think more people, Like I remember when I moved to
America fifteen years ago, when I was young as twenty one,
and I came into America and I had a free Palestine,
like a badge on my jacket like to sew things
(12:19):
on my jacket, you know, and they sent me straight
to the secondary you know, like they're like where they
pat you down and take off your clothes and go
through your bags and stuch, and like it just wasn't
as big of a concern I think more people in
the fifteen years since then have become aware of the
tragedy and the loss of life. And certainly now I've
seen more people wake up to what's happening and like
(12:43):
protest or you know, get out and do things in
a way that they wouldn't have done ten years ago.
And I think that's really it's good, Like hopefully that
demand for people to be allowed to live with dignity
and safety continues.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
Yes, I mean, I just always want to ask anybody
you'd like to say, are you going? Are you happy
to pay your tax for killing others?
Speaker 1 (13:06):
Is it Jesus?
Speaker 2 (13:07):
Yeah, this is the very initial, very first question. Are
you happy with this? Do you pay your tax for
this or for anything that you like to have your
tax to be paid for? Yeah, this is what we want.
We are facing killing, we are facing assassination and bombarding
(13:28):
and so on, and we need all What we need
is humanity, nothing else.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
I was thinking this morning of like, how very obviously
right when when Russia bombed Ukrainian cities, most people said
we should help the Ukrainians, send them moms, send them
medical supplies, and some of them went and volunteered to
fight the Ukrainians when and I understand that like this
obviously this this conflict began in very different circumstances other
(14:08):
than the Russia Ukraine conflict, but nonetheless, like little children
are being killed and continue to be killed, and the
response wasn't the same. And I think some of that
comes from like and not particularly hard to see orientalism
in the US and the US media. Also some of
it comes from the complete absence of Palestinian voices in
(14:29):
certainly in like the English language press in America. And
I wonder, like I know that there are certain organizations
which have specifically worked to make it harder for Palestinian journalists,
like my friend Hassam Salem. He's an excellent photographer. You
can find him on all the places where you find
people on the internet. But we worked on stories together,
(14:50):
and I know he's now had he's lost contract with
major outlets because of this sort of campaign of accusing
him of bias. I think it's hard not to be
biased when you see little children die. But I wonder
if you could talk about that, like how Palestinian voices
are excluded or missing from what even now right the
Atlantic since two weeks of bombing now and I was
(15:12):
looking this morning and they've managed to find two Palestinian
voices to share. Like, you know, it's maybe not. I'll
have to check that after we've done. But I was
flicking through these big sort of opinion piece type outlets
and it's very clear that like even now, people haven't
like editors specifically, or the greater press has not stopped
(15:34):
excluding Palestinian voices. So maybe we could talk about like
how that happens, what allows that to happen, and what
people can do to help lift up those voices.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Well, yes, Perastilian voices are being banned all over by
different movements. There are many times fired from their works
and big news outlets and the media outlets for different
political reasons. And if you want to go and through
(16:06):
the stories, you find that some people are just trying
to make to make problems for those people to let
them leave their work and stop writing or telling the
news or analyzing or anything about the Peristinian cause and
what's going on. We're facing this globally, and we have
(16:27):
many cases recorded and undocumented in the pgs, and we
can give you many examples about them. But I have
to tell about something that we're a member of the
International Federation of Journalists. And we have also even our
president of Pilian Peristinian Journalist Syndicate. He's a vice president
(16:50):
of the International Federation of Journalist. He has been elected
last year in the last congress. We have sister unions.
One of them one of the best friends of us
are the National Writers Union, the American National Writers Union,
which is a very big supporter to us. They even
(17:13):
very got better. The general secretary even he visited us
in Palestine a few months ago, and he's a very
supporter of what's going on, of all our statements, of
our news at the beginning of the world they produced
like a statement about biosity and misleading news and so on,
(17:39):
how to avoid them supporting the Palestinians, supporting our life,
our right to life, and so on. So we we
highly appreciate this movement. Of course, he's not the only one.
Many many syndicates, many unions all over the world sent
us solidarity letters. Some of them supported us even with
(18:02):
some in kind contribution, with some funds in addition to solidarity,
in addition to demonstrations and so on, which really gave
us a lot of power of hope. So we can
continue and we are not alone.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Yeah, I think that's really powerful. Yeah. Well, I mean
it's not enough, but it's something that unions. I think
people also, if they're members of the union, can encourage
their union to do that, right, just to make a statement, Yeah,
just to show some solidarity. I wonder like what you
talked about in kind donations, and you talked about the
support you're getting from unions. I know one unions which
(18:41):
i'm a member, that's your Workers of the World FJAU
just did a fundraiser or still doing a fundraiser for
flag vests and bullet profess for journalists. What kind of
support can people give, like in a concrete sense, beyond
getting in the streets and protesting and writing letters and
emails and phone calls. It's the stuff that they can
(19:03):
do with their money, if they have some money.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
Well, it's not a kind of money, it's a kind
of I will tell you now, the situation in Gaza,
we can't or what we do we need is a ceasfire,
to be honest, they even don't have fresh water they
drink by the way, and they say try to minimize that.
The water they drink, and they know that the water
(19:30):
they drink is not very clean, but just to survive.
So you can start with this very basic need of
life and then you go further. As I already told
you that the safety vests are very important, but when
you are under strikes, this will never help you. But
if I want to talk about the daily life, about
(19:51):
how it's going and the West Bank and Gaza, our journalists,
we all work under the same conditions of aggress the events,
covering aggressive events and so on. So we try as
pg US to to contact all the media outlets and
Palestine to offer or provide safety kits for all journals
(20:17):
to work in the field. But for example our freelancers,
they work on their on responsibility and a very dangerous situation.
We try to to to tell how dangerous that what
they do when you go to cover with you don't
have very full safety kits or it's it's very dangerous
(20:42):
for them, but they are not able to cover it
and they want to they need to work, they need
to do their job, so they do it in a
very strained, sory, dangerous conditions. So one of the things
that we can support unless yes, safety kets, which are
very important. Medical kids also are very important. What what
(21:10):
else we try we try to to do. Also, we
try to raise the awareness to make some materials for
the journals about safety. Safety is very important for us.
We try to teach them more about how to take
care of themselves, how to report and so on, about
(21:32):
their security and so on. This is mainly what I
can talk about for for the needs or the inkind contribution.
As I told you, in the current situation, for example,
we try to support through some donations, through support to
support the journalists with better charging. Better is because of
(21:53):
the lack of electricity and power sources in Gaza, so
just to give them connected currently they are very useful
for them and it helps.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Now.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
Yeah, yeah, I can see. It's probably best that you
guys just have money and then you can be flexible
in getting what people need. I think that's generally the
best advice. It's when there's a crisis, is to send
the people nearest to it money and then they can
decide what they need. I certainly I found that. I
found that in a lot of places I worked. Yes,
so you talked about the power situation. I think that's
(22:26):
sort of it has gone relatively unreported. I mean, it'll
still say, like the power and water have been cut off,
but that creates a lot of other dangerous situations, right
Like obviously some people rely on that power if they're infirm,
if they have medical devices, that kind of thing. But
also like where there are places to charge, that results
in a very high concentration of people. Right Like my
(22:48):
friend was telling me that their parents were in a
hospital to charge their their devices. Right They wanted to
call their child and say we're safe, we're alive, but
their phone had run out of batteries, so they had
to go to the hospit. Yeah, can you explain a
little bit of some of the things that like that
that has resulted in the loss of power for people.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
Yes, of course. For example, first of all, let me
tell you that we already asked quested all our journalists
in Gaza to be in the hospitals for their safety.
We try, we expect that it would be a pleas
safe place, but there is no safe plessing as now
as you already know about the hospitals that have been targeted.
(23:33):
But we already asked them to be in the hospitals.
We try to make some press zones and the hospitals
in some places whereas for press, for journalists to be
there so they can get some electricity power and so
they can ought to be together, try to exchange information
and work together, so it will be better for them
(23:57):
to work and safer between brackets always for them to work,
to be honest, Yes, I don't know. If you see
the news now, it's we had the sun has set,
so it's completely dark, and because you just gonna have
some light and spots which are the hospitals, and you
(24:20):
know that even the solar and the sorry, the fuel
for school for hospitals is about to to to finish
here and in two days I think maximum. But we
will see. Maybe we'll have some trucks or they will
(24:40):
get something inside Gaza for fuel and so on. But
I'm not sure about this.
Speaker 1 (24:45):
Yeah, I think, yeah, every day it's changing, I guess.
And I wondered, like talking about getting things into gather,
getting getting things two people in Gaza, a thing that
seems to be completely like I don't know, Genue. It
seems to be people think people could just walk out
of Gaza and go somewhere else. So I guess, just
(25:07):
to be extremely clear on that, can you explain the
situation for people in Gaza with respect to if they
want their mobility and their ability to leave, because I
think it's something that again has been like criminally overlooked
in the United States, discourse.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
Ability to leave Gaza.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
I mean yeah, yeah, like a lack thereof would be
more accurate, right, like they complete absence of that.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
Well, unfortunately, people on Gaza are blocked. They are all
and they are not allowed to leave Gaza with any
kind of borders. Even the people who have international passports
like American, European or whatever passports, they are not now.
They are not able to leave Gaza. They have to
(25:50):
face their faith now. They are just displaced from place
to another. Some people have been displaced four times and
for areas different areas, and others were displaced and bombed
letter So no, they are blocked. They have They are
blocked in a like a very limited area which is
(26:12):
under strikes the whole time. No place is safe, even
the Baptist hospital. They thought that it would be a
Baptist hospital, hospital related to a church and so on.
It was strike massively cruely. More than five hundred have
(26:33):
been killed. They were all children. Mothers are sitting just
as thinking that it would be a shelter for them. So, yes,
this is the situation because there is no safe place,
no hospitals. If you are in a hospital, you will
be bombed. If you are in school, you'll be bombed.
If you are in a mosque if you will be bombed.
If you're in a church, you will be bombed. No
(26:55):
safe place unfortunately.
Speaker 1 (26:58):
Yeah, it's yeah, it's it's unimaginable. And like the act
of bombing that we were talking about this before we started,
but like when you're being bombed, it's very different from
like a small art conflict or even like a you
know whatever, artillery motors rockets like you, there isn't much
(27:20):
you can do to be safe. It's not like there
is no like cover from bombs. You know that, you
you there's no.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
By the way, there's no under ground shoulters.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
Yeah, and now they are intense. By the way, they
were in houses houses, they were falling on their heads,
so they went to tense. So when they were tent falls, it's.
Speaker 1 (27:43):
Not so yeah Jesus, Yeah, it's it's bleak. It's yeah,
it's it's unimaginable. Like I said, yeah, I just spent
a week in a place that was being.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
Very fat protected by the sky which is full of
planes bombing them.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Yeah. Yeah, and every time you look up you wonder
what that is and is this still time or is
this still one? So I think one thing people are
really struggling with is like overload of information missed information, right,
(28:25):
just some of the worst pieces I've ever seen in
opinion pieces on PLA things center social media, which are
like it seems that we've returned to like peak a
islamophobic rhetoric of like September twelve, two thousand and one,
and we've learned absolutely nothing from twenty years of killing
and dying. So I wonder where you would recommend if
(28:50):
there are members of your syndicate or other places where
people can find reliable and for reporting which is you know,
fact checked, which is not overloading and with you know,
like if if you go on Twitter to try and
find your information at the minute, you're just going to
get into an argument with someone who has the worst
opinions in the world, and it's not good and it
can dissuade you from taking action in the ways that
(29:11):
you've mentioned which are actually useful. So is there a
place you suggest people look for information outlets or individuals
they could follow.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
Well, who wants to know the truth will be will
find it. You know, the media is always any media outlet,
it has its it has its mandate and vision and
so on. So I just advise everyone when you go
for any outlet, media outlet, just try to read about
(29:43):
what's what's its mandate, who's they are related to, who's
they are supporting, and so on, so to know from
which perspective you will know the truth. I can't tell
now the names of outlets because I am. It's not
me who to decide who's who's the right one. As
(30:05):
you know, I am, I work in a syndicate which
is like a union, which is for all journalists with
all food, all at outlets, so they are all our members.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
So yeah, yeah, I think that's advice so that people
can take more. It's it's good advice that people can
take more broadly, because I think people are completely unaware
the ownership of some outlets that mandate there perceived biases.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
Yes, try to read about them, not only the New Elf,
not the news itself, but try to see about this outlet,
about this establishment, how it's working, what their objectives, how
do they work, and what are their connections and so on,
so you will know what kind of which kind of
news they are covering and how do they cover it? Y. Yes,
(30:57):
this is what I can say for us as tell
a journalist syndicate. We try now to report about journalists
because this is our manda, this is our work to
tell about what's going for our members, to try to
get any protection for them. Actually were this appen in
this very hard condition. But we try our through our friends,
(31:18):
through our relations to our supporters, through our memberships and
so on, to have some international support for them through information,
through like a flow of information telling what's going on.
How many journalists have been killed, how many journals are displaced,
how many and so on, So we try to give
(31:40):
data those that are not. As I already told you,
it's really a hard job that we are going we
are doing now. It's getting more and more difficult. We
are trying to cope, trying to develop new tools to
cope with this hard, very hard speit situation. But we
try our maximum to be nests to get very real
(32:02):
and true information, not to get any misleading information. There's
a flow of misleading information information Even we hear about
many journalists that they are killed, but when we try
to make sure that we found that they are not journalists,
we don't get them put them in our lists. We
try to investigate as much as we can, so to
(32:23):
put our lists to be limited to journalists, to our members,
to the people who work with us, with our within
our mandad and so on, so to be credible source
of information.
Speaker 1 (32:38):
Yeah, I think it's very important. I am so. I
don't know if you guys shared it. I sure a
video early on it was well, I was still in
Syrian courdi is down, but we were watching it a
funeral of three journalists who have been killed, and like
someone was saying at the funeral that they were speaking
and there's someone else will pick up his camera and
like keep documenting things. Really was very emotional for me
(33:02):
and my friends. Yeah, it was really sad, but.
Speaker 2 (33:05):
Yes it is.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
Yeah, I believe you. It's just you know, that's the
thing that I do, and I see people, you know,
dressed like me. People I know it's been very of
your coverage of that has been very emotionally challenging for me,
but it should be emotionally challenging. It's terrible, but I
think people should definitely tune into it if they can.
(33:27):
I wonder, are there like social media accounts that the
PJS has that people can follow.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Yes, we have Facebook page. It's on Facebook. Yes, it's
a Palestinian Journalist syndicate. Yeah, just and we try to
download all our news on it. Also we have our
website which is www dot PJS dot p S. Also
(33:53):
you can find some news statements, updates and so on.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
Yeah, that's great, and I encourage people to to follow
that they're able to. I wonder, really, is there anything
else you think that people are like, anything that's been
missing from the media narrative that you'd like people to
know about the situation now in Palestine, or like the
situation more broadly that hasn't been reported on as much
as it should be. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
Yeah, I just want to add something about besides what's
going on, and because even a journalists in the West Bank,
even in Palestinian journalists in Israel are facing a lot
of threats, facing a lot of problems. There is a
massive campaign of arrests. So up to now one thousand,
(34:44):
in three days, one thousand persons have been arrested. We're
trying to find the number of journalists, which is I'm
not sure about it, but I can't give you the figure,
as I told you, because of the big number we're
trying to make who are the journalists? But a massive
(35:04):
arrests campaign is taking place now. Also, journalists are facing
a lot of threats about a lot of violations while covering.
Many times they are prevented from coverage, They are threatened
by weapons, They are threatened sometimes by the settlers aren't
(35:25):
settlers even not the army while covering many of them. Also,
they they are subject to incitement through social media pages
like spreading their photos or the and so to make
a kind of excitement how to kill them or to
(35:45):
get rid of them and so on. So, also journalists
are facing a very hard time now. Yeah, they are
under the threat.
Speaker 1 (35:55):
Yeah damn, Yeah, that's terrible and kipedian acceptable. So yeah,
I'm glad you shared that, and I think it's important
that people follow this and do whatever they can to help,
do whatever they can to to I don't know, to
encourage people to stop bombing other people, Like it's never
a good situation. People are bombing children and hopefully it
(36:17):
comes to an end, get it. I don't know. I've
never seen this much outgoing support for Palestine in the
United States. But I've also you know, this is an
unprecedented act of a war crimes solicated. It's very hard
to see where this is going. I suppose.
Speaker 2 (36:38):
Yes, we believe that the voice is reaching maybe a
little but not that fast that that's easy, because it's
not easy. But we believe in every person who thinks
and say, no, this is inhuman I should not I
should be with those people who are under attack, who
are under under Yeah, a lot of hard life. Yeah,
(37:05):
it's a hard life, a lot of oppostion.
Speaker 1 (37:08):
So yeah, when.
Speaker 2 (37:09):
We see that as adult, when we see the demonstrations,
it really gives us power. It really gives us that
we have right to life. You know, this is a
minimum right that we need people to tell us, Yes,
you have a right to life.
Speaker 1 (37:23):
Yeah, I think that's it's nice to hear, you know it.
It's like if you can feel that you're helping, even
just helping people feel like a little bit, you know, elevated,
a little bit better, a little bit less despairing, because
I can see how it would be very easy if
you're stuck in Gaza to feel like the world's abandon
you because it has to a large degree, right, the
(37:43):
world's allowed this to happen, and it's you know, it's
not it's American bombs, American plaints dropping bombs unfortunately. Yeah.
So I think that's really good to hear. It's good
to hear that that has made some difference. Thank you
so much for giving us some of your time. I
know it's thank you.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
Thank you, Jams, thank you for having me with you.
I wish you all good luck. Thank you, Thank you
all who listener listeners to this podcast. I hope that
I was able to give you an overview of what's
going on. And let's pray that this violence will end
(38:25):
very soon.
Speaker 1 (38:26):
Yes, yeah, yeah, indeed, let's thank you very much. I
was wonderful.
Speaker 2 (38:29):
Thank you. It could Happen here as a production of
cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from cool Zone Media,
visit our website cool zonemedia dot com, or check us
out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you
listen to podcasts. You can find sources for It Could
Happen Here, updated monthly at coolzonemedia dot com slash sources.
(38:51):
Thanks for listening.
Colson Media. Hello, everyone, it's me James Today. I am
back from my trip to Kurdistan and I'm talking today
with Rania Hayat, a name that I've probably just but shered.
But Ranier is the communications officer for the Palestinian Journalist Syndicate.
(00:25):
And we're very, very lucky to have Ronnie talking to us.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Welcome Renie, thank you, Jams, thank you for contacting me
and letting me be letting me with you.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
Yeah, of course you're very welcome. So I think Rania,
it's it's been a really hard time to consume news.
For the first week of what's happening. I was in
mostly Syrian and Iraqi Kurtistan, and I wasn't maybe consuming
as much news so I normally do, because I was
trying to write news in today Uh. And then I
(00:58):
got back there just the the barers you, information and
disinformation has been very hard for people to sort of
wade through, and I wonder I think one of the
things I'd like us to focus on first and foremost
is the impact of Israel's bombing campaign on journalists, specifically
(01:19):
working in Gaza. I know, like friends of mine are
journalists in Gaza. We featured on this podcast before the
people of Parkour, Gaza, and I know that many journalists
have lost their lives covering what's been happening. So can
you explain a little bit about what's been happening and
(01:39):
maybe bring us up to date on the amount of
every loss is a tragedy, but like the amount of
people who have lost their lives covering this.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Yes, James, well, let's start that journalists and Gaza are
civilians who are people who travel. They work, They should travel,
but they work, They do their job. They try to
cover the news with very hard conditions with the daily
life of Gaza. Since the beginning of the war against
(02:08):
Gas on the seventh of October, you know how the
war started targeting everything in Gaza, not even all the people,
more than the people, you know, the buildings, the children,
even the animals, the plants, you know, just bombing and
(02:29):
bombing and bombing strikes the whole time. At the beginning,
we try to we have some our contacts with journalists
in Gaza, we have our General Secretaria member and so
we try to get information from them. At the beginning, Yeah,
it was not easy, but it was okay to get
(02:51):
some information about what's going on. But by the time
now we reached to a place that when I call them,
they always tell dozens of we don't know. We are disconnected.
I'm homeless. Now, I am not able to get any news.
I can't tell you about my friend or my neighbor
(03:12):
next to me, but I'm not able to tell you
about further than this. I will just give some statistics.
Up to now, we have eighteen killed journalists who have
been either killed while try covering, others were killed in
their homes, being through air strikes with their families and
(03:34):
so on. We have also many many journalists who have
dozens of them have been injured. I'm really sorry. I
was I wanted to have some you know, I curate statistics,
but I can't give you until now. We are now
trying trying to develop like a tool to get some statistics,
(03:56):
but until now it's not working well. And we have
many journalists who lost their homes, homes because it was
bomb bombed or yeah, airstract others they were in this place, yeah,
and many of them moves from their homes either because
(04:18):
their homes was bombed or other because they were threatened
to stay at their home safely, so they go to
other like schools, hospitals and so on. The most tragic
is the journalists who are losing their families. When you
call a journalist to ask him about any thing, they
told you Okay, I lost my son, I lost my wife,
(04:39):
I lost all my family, I lost my mother. Now
they are they are completely broken. You can't talk to them.
They are you know, it's really very tragic situation.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
Yeah, it's it's I mean, it's literally unimaginable, like, yeah,
I think I've attended wars, I've lost friends, but nothing.
I can't imagine what it's like on this scale. And
it's heartbreaking to even think about it. And I think
some of what you said obviously, like part of the
(05:13):
situation this creates is that it's very hard to do
reporting on the ground. It's always been hard to do
reporting on the ground at Gaza. I have made plans
to go to Gaza, which probably won't work out now,
but it's hard foreign press, and of course there are
many very capable journalists within Ghas that we don't need
(05:35):
foreign press to go then necessarily. But can you explain
a little bit of how when this war started, it
didn't just like affect these people in terms of killing them,
killing their families, displacing them, detroying their homes. But also
like every day this war goes on, it gets harder
for us to see I think the impact of this
(05:56):
war on civilians living in Gaza, right because of the
image to infrastructure.
Speaker 3 (06:01):
Is that fair to say, yes, this is what's going on,
and yes, reporting is getting more and more complicated because
as also you know, there is no electricity.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
Communication is very very difficult when sometimes through phone call
I call them just to get something, they tell me, okay,
wait until I get some internet and I will get.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
Back to you.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
I wait for hours and hours, sometimes for the second
day to get a little information. So you can imagine
how they can even contact with each other.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
Yeah, and yeah, that makes it very hard. I think
often like we might have more info. This is not
uncommon actually, like you have more information sitting somewhere with
a broad bank connection and access to Twitter than you
do on the ground, right, Like they may not know
everything that's happening.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Yes, I don't know if I can talk about this,
but you know about the restrictions that on all social
media applications, the restrictions on the Palestinian contract content on
the social media. We're facing a big massive wave against
(07:17):
our content, was against our news through Twitter, Instagram, Facebook,
all those applications. So we are not able even to
reach many people are banned, many people are hanged, and
we are just hearing about the banning of many accounts
of Palestinians. The very limited reach the very limited, and
(07:41):
there are sometimes many times they are blocked or yeah,
blocked or from posting and so on. So even also
this is another problem that we are facing to reach out.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Yeah, I think this is in a sense obviously, like
it's in terms of specifically getting information about because I
think that is important. I think if people could understand
what it's like to see someone lose their baby, and
then I think very few people would be able to
(08:12):
in good conscious support that. And the fact that this
has come at a time when I think generally, certainly
for the US, reporting on things outside the US is
an all time low, like it's atrocious, and so people
lack the context to understand, not through any fault of
their own right, but they've just been fed terrible you know,
(08:33):
opinion pieces for the last few years. They lack the
context to understand why what's happening is happening. And I
think obviously Elon Muskusport, Twitter and and just it's accessible.
It's terrible, it's full of false information. And as you say,
often videos that I have friends who are photographers in Gaza,
(08:56):
a friends who are just people in Gaza, and videos
that they post be taken down. It's sometimes they're to
say it's too graphic, it's too violent, but like also
that's their everyday life. Now that's been happening for two weeks. This, Yeah,
graphic violence is sadly what's visited upon them every day.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
Yeah, yes, believe me, what's going on in Gaza is
very You can't image, you can't hold it when you
when you watch it. Even the TV channels they try
to make to minimize how dangerous and how violent are
the scenes that we see. At the same time, I
(09:38):
had a discussion this morning, I don't want people to
cry for us, it's not I don't want people to
cry for the babies killed, and so with very hard
pictures and videos, I just want the humanity without seeing
the video just here that there is a charge it's
loading child children. Thousands of children are losing their child's
(10:02):
life or nothing. Are losing their hands, their legs, they
are now handicapped. They don't know why. You know, we
don't need to see the video, just know that this
is going on. We don't want to make a tragedy.
We don't want to to people to cry with us
when we cry. Yes, we want, okay, some solidarity, but
(10:26):
it's not something to have the emotions and then then
we sleep and then we wake up. That's what Or no, no,
there is something going on. We don't need the sympath
you know, we need some actions, we need steps, we
need humanity now.
Speaker 1 (10:41):
Yeah. So I think that's an excellent, really really excellent point.
Like it's not a film or like something you can
consume and then step away from. So what sort of
solidarity actions can people take to support people in gather,
to support journalists there, to support the greater cause of
not having this issue where every few years thousands of
(11:02):
Palestinian civilians get killed.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
Yes, well, to be honest, we want when we want
to feel better, we turn on the television to see
the demonstrations. When we see the demonstrations London, blocks, cell
the United States and different cities Arab world everywhere. When
we see these demonstrations, we feel that somebody knows there
is like a kind of movement. This helps us, and
(11:28):
we need further steps after the demonstration. We need lobbying.
We need the people who elect their governments who support
those massacs and to say no, we give you leg
legitimacy to be human. Stop this inhumanity. We need the
people to lobby on their governments that this should not
(11:49):
be supported. This is this is the real action that
we need. Lobbying, lobbying, lobbying by the people, by the
power of people.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
Yeah, I think it's one of those things, like some
things will never change in America, at least not by voting,
but like some things, yeah, if enough people and I
think more people, Like I remember when I moved to
America fifteen years ago, when I was young as twenty one,
and I came into America and I had a free Palestine,
like a badge on my jacket like to sew things
(12:19):
on my jacket, you know, and they sent me straight
to the secondary you know, like they're like where they
pat you down and take off your clothes and go
through your bags and stuch, and like it just wasn't
as big of a concern I think more people in
the fifteen years since then have become aware of the
tragedy and the loss of life. And certainly now I've
seen more people wake up to what's happening and like
(12:43):
protest or you know, get out and do things in
a way that they wouldn't have done ten years ago.
And I think that's really it's good, Like hopefully that
demand for people to be allowed to live with dignity
and safety continues.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
Yes, I mean, I just always want to ask anybody
you'd like to say, are you going? Are you happy
to pay your tax for killing others?
Speaker 1 (13:06):
Is it Jesus?
Speaker 2 (13:07):
Yeah, this is the very initial, very first question. Are
you happy with this? Do you pay your tax for
this or for anything that you like to have your
tax to be paid for? Yeah, this is what we want.
We are facing killing, we are facing assassination and bombarding
(13:28):
and so on, and we need all What we need
is humanity, nothing else.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
I was thinking this morning of like, how very obviously
right when when Russia bombed Ukrainian cities, most people said
we should help the Ukrainians, send them moms, send them
medical supplies, and some of them went and volunteered to
fight the Ukrainians when and I understand that like this
obviously this this conflict began in very different circumstances other
(14:08):
than the Russia Ukraine conflict, but nonetheless, like little children
are being killed and continue to be killed, and the
response wasn't the same. And I think some of that
comes from like and not particularly hard to see orientalism
in the US and the US media. Also some of
it comes from the complete absence of Palestinian voices in
(14:29):
certainly in like the English language press in America. And
I wonder, like I know that there are certain organizations
which have specifically worked to make it harder for Palestinian journalists,
like my friend Hassam Salem. He's an excellent photographer. You
can find him on all the places where you find
people on the internet. But we worked on stories together,
(14:50):
and I know he's now had he's lost contract with
major outlets because of this sort of campaign of accusing
him of bias. I think it's hard not to be
biased when you see little children die. But I wonder
if you could talk about that, like how Palestinian voices
are excluded or missing from what even now right the
Atlantic since two weeks of bombing now and I was
(15:12):
looking this morning and they've managed to find two Palestinian
voices to share. Like, you know, it's maybe not. I'll
have to check that after we've done. But I was
flicking through these big sort of opinion piece type outlets
and it's very clear that like even now, people haven't
like editors specifically, or the greater press has not stopped
(15:34):
excluding Palestinian voices. So maybe we could talk about like
how that happens, what allows that to happen, and what
people can do to help lift up those voices.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Well, yes, Perastilian voices are being banned all over by
different movements. There are many times fired from their works
and big news outlets and the media outlets for different
political reasons. And if you want to go and through
(16:06):
the stories, you find that some people are just trying
to make to make problems for those people to let
them leave their work and stop writing or telling the
news or analyzing or anything about the Peristinian cause and
what's going on. We're facing this globally, and we have
(16:27):
many cases recorded and undocumented in the pgs, and we
can give you many examples about them. But I have
to tell about something that we're a member of the
International Federation of Journalists. And we have also even our
president of Pilian Peristinian Journalist Syndicate. He's a vice president
(16:50):
of the International Federation of Journalist. He has been elected
last year in the last congress. We have sister unions.
One of them one of the best friends of us
are the National Writers Union, the American National Writers Union,
which is a very big supporter to us. They even
(17:13):
very got better. The general secretary even he visited us
in Palestine a few months ago, and he's a very
supporter of what's going on, of all our statements, of
our news at the beginning of the world they produced
like a statement about biosity and misleading news and so on,
(17:39):
how to avoid them supporting the Palestinians, supporting our life,
our right to life, and so on. So we we
highly appreciate this movement. Of course, he's not the only one.
Many many syndicates, many unions all over the world sent
us solidarity letters. Some of them supported us even with
(18:02):
some in kind contribution, with some funds in addition to solidarity,
in addition to demonstrations and so on, which really gave
us a lot of power of hope. So we can
continue and we are not alone.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Yeah, I think that's really powerful. Yeah. Well, I mean
it's not enough, but it's something that unions. I think
people also, if they're members of the union, can encourage
their union to do that, right, just to make a statement, Yeah,
just to show some solidarity. I wonder like what you
talked about in kind donations, and you talked about the
support you're getting from unions. I know one unions which
(18:41):
i'm a member, that's your Workers of the World FJAU
just did a fundraiser or still doing a fundraiser for
flag vests and bullet profess for journalists. What kind of
support can people give, like in a concrete sense, beyond
getting in the streets and protesting and writing letters and
emails and phone calls. It's the stuff that they can
(19:03):
do with their money, if they have some money.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
Well, it's not a kind of money, it's a kind
of I will tell you now, the situation in Gaza,
we can't or what we do we need is a ceasfire,
to be honest, they even don't have fresh water they
drink by the way, and they say try to minimize that.
The water they drink, and they know that the water
(19:30):
they drink is not very clean, but just to survive.
So you can start with this very basic need of
life and then you go further. As I already told
you that the safety vests are very important, but when
you are under strikes, this will never help you. But
if I want to talk about the daily life, about
(19:51):
how it's going and the West Bank and Gaza, our journalists,
we all work under the same conditions of aggress the events,
covering aggressive events and so on. So we try as
pg US to to contact all the media outlets and
Palestine to offer or provide safety kits for all journals
(20:17):
to work in the field. But for example our freelancers,
they work on their on responsibility and a very dangerous situation.
We try to to to tell how dangerous that what
they do when you go to cover with you don't
have very full safety kits or it's it's very dangerous
(20:42):
for them, but they are not able to cover it
and they want to they need to work, they need
to do their job, so they do it in a
very strained, sory, dangerous conditions. So one of the things
that we can support unless yes, safety kets, which are
very important. Medical kids also are very important. What what
(21:10):
else we try we try to to do. Also, we
try to raise the awareness to make some materials for
the journals about safety. Safety is very important for us.
We try to teach them more about how to take
care of themselves, how to report and so on, about
(21:32):
their security and so on. This is mainly what I
can talk about for for the needs or the inkind contribution.
As I told you, in the current situation, for example,
we try to support through some donations, through support to
support the journalists with better charging. Better is because of
(21:53):
the lack of electricity and power sources in Gaza, so
just to give them connected currently they are very useful
for them and it helps.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Now.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
Yeah, yeah, I can see. It's probably best that you
guys just have money and then you can be flexible
in getting what people need. I think that's generally the
best advice. It's when there's a crisis, is to send
the people nearest to it money and then they can
decide what they need. I certainly I found that. I
found that in a lot of places I worked. Yes,
so you talked about the power situation. I think that's
(22:26):
sort of it has gone relatively unreported. I mean, it'll
still say, like the power and water have been cut off,
but that creates a lot of other dangerous situations, right
Like obviously some people rely on that power if they're infirm,
if they have medical devices, that kind of thing. But
also like where there are places to charge, that results
in a very high concentration of people. Right Like my
(22:48):
friend was telling me that their parents were in a
hospital to charge their their devices. Right They wanted to
call their child and say we're safe, we're alive, but
their phone had run out of batteries, so they had
to go to the hospit. Yeah, can you explain a
little bit of some of the things that like that
that has resulted in the loss of power for people.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
Yes, of course. For example, first of all, let me
tell you that we already asked quested all our journalists
in Gaza to be in the hospitals for their safety.
We try, we expect that it would be a pleas
safe place, but there is no safe plessing as now
as you already know about the hospitals that have been targeted.
(23:33):
But we already asked them to be in the hospitals.
We try to make some press zones and the hospitals
in some places whereas for press, for journalists to be
there so they can get some electricity power and so
they can ought to be together, try to exchange information
and work together, so it will be better for them
(23:57):
to work and safer between brackets always for them to work,
to be honest, Yes, I don't know. If you see
the news now, it's we had the sun has set,
so it's completely dark, and because you just gonna have
some light and spots which are the hospitals, and you
(24:20):
know that even the solar and the sorry, the fuel
for school for hospitals is about to to to finish
here and in two days I think maximum. But we
will see. Maybe we'll have some trucks or they will
(24:40):
get something inside Gaza for fuel and so on. But
I'm not sure about this.
Speaker 1 (24:45):
Yeah, I think, yeah, every day it's changing, I guess.
And I wondered, like talking about getting things into gather,
getting getting things two people in Gaza, a thing that
seems to be completely like I don't know, Genue. It
seems to be people think people could just walk out
of Gaza and go somewhere else. So I guess, just
(25:07):
to be extremely clear on that, can you explain the
situation for people in Gaza with respect to if they
want their mobility and their ability to leave, because I
think it's something that again has been like criminally overlooked
in the United States, discourse.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
Ability to leave Gaza.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
I mean yeah, yeah, like a lack thereof would be
more accurate, right, like they complete absence of that.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
Well, unfortunately, people on Gaza are blocked. They are all
and they are not allowed to leave Gaza with any
kind of borders. Even the people who have international passports
like American, European or whatever passports, they are not now.
They are not able to leave Gaza. They have to
(25:50):
face their faith now. They are just displaced from place
to another. Some people have been displaced four times and
for areas different areas, and others were displaced and bombed
letter So no, they are blocked. They have They are
blocked in a like a very limited area which is
(26:12):
under strikes the whole time. No place is safe, even
the Baptist hospital. They thought that it would be a
Baptist hospital, hospital related to a church and so on.
It was strike massively cruely. More than five hundred have
(26:33):
been killed. They were all children. Mothers are sitting just
as thinking that it would be a shelter for them. So, yes,
this is the situation because there is no safe place,
no hospitals. If you are in a hospital, you will
be bombed. If you are in school, you'll be bombed.
If you are in a mosque if you will be bombed.
If you're in a church, you will be bombed. No
(26:55):
safe place unfortunately.
Speaker 1 (26:58):
Yeah, it's yeah, it's it's unimaginable. And like the act
of bombing that we were talking about this before we started,
but like when you're being bombed, it's very different from
like a small art conflict or even like a you
know whatever, artillery motors rockets like you, there isn't much
(27:20):
you can do to be safe. It's not like there
is no like cover from bombs. You know that, you
you there's no.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
By the way, there's no under ground shoulters.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
Yeah, and now they are intense. By the way, they
were in houses houses, they were falling on their heads,
so they went to tense. So when they were tent falls, it's.
Speaker 1 (27:43):
Not so yeah Jesus, Yeah, it's it's bleak. It's yeah,
it's it's unimaginable. Like I said, yeah, I just spent
a week in a place that was being.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
Very fat protected by the sky which is full of
planes bombing them.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Yeah. Yeah, and every time you look up you wonder
what that is and is this still time or is
this still one? So I think one thing people are
really struggling with is like overload of information missed information, right,
(28:25):
just some of the worst pieces I've ever seen in
opinion pieces on PLA things center social media, which are
like it seems that we've returned to like peak a
islamophobic rhetoric of like September twelve, two thousand and one,
and we've learned absolutely nothing from twenty years of killing
and dying. So I wonder where you would recommend if
(28:50):
there are members of your syndicate or other places where
people can find reliable and for reporting which is you know,
fact checked, which is not overloading and with you know,
like if if you go on Twitter to try and
find your information at the minute, you're just going to
get into an argument with someone who has the worst
opinions in the world, and it's not good and it
can dissuade you from taking action in the ways that
(29:11):
you've mentioned which are actually useful. So is there a
place you suggest people look for information outlets or individuals
they could follow.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
Well, who wants to know the truth will be will
find it. You know, the media is always any media outlet,
it has its it has its mandate and vision and
so on. So I just advise everyone when you go
for any outlet, media outlet, just try to read about
(29:43):
what's what's its mandate, who's they are related to, who's
they are supporting, and so on, so to know from
which perspective you will know the truth. I can't tell
now the names of outlets because I am. It's not
me who to decide who's who's the right one. As
(30:05):
you know, I am, I work in a syndicate which
is like a union, which is for all journalists with
all food, all at outlets, so they are all our members.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
So yeah, yeah, I think that's advice so that people
can take more. It's it's good advice that people can
take more broadly, because I think people are completely unaware
the ownership of some outlets that mandate there perceived biases.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
Yes, try to read about them, not only the New Elf,
not the news itself, but try to see about this outlet,
about this establishment, how it's working, what their objectives, how
do they work, and what are their connections and so on,
so you will know what kind of which kind of
news they are covering and how do they cover it? Y. Yes,
(30:57):
this is what I can say for us as tell
a journalist syndicate. We try now to report about journalists
because this is our manda, this is our work to
tell about what's going for our members, to try to
get any protection for them. Actually were this appen in
this very hard condition. But we try our through our friends,
(31:18):
through our relations to our supporters, through our memberships and
so on, to have some international support for them through information,
through like a flow of information telling what's going on.
How many journalists have been killed, how many journals are displaced,
how many and so on, So we try to give
(31:40):
data those that are not. As I already told you,
it's really a hard job that we are going we
are doing now. It's getting more and more difficult. We
are trying to cope, trying to develop new tools to
cope with this hard, very hard speit situation. But we
try our maximum to be nests to get very real
(32:02):
and true information, not to get any misleading information. There's
a flow of misleading information information Even we hear about
many journalists that they are killed, but when we try
to make sure that we found that they are not journalists,
we don't get them put them in our lists. We
try to investigate as much as we can, so to
(32:23):
put our lists to be limited to journalists, to our members,
to the people who work with us, with our within
our mandad and so on, so to be credible source
of information.
Speaker 1 (32:38):
Yeah, I think it's very important. I am so. I
don't know if you guys shared it. I sure a
video early on it was well, I was still in
Syrian courdi is down, but we were watching it a
funeral of three journalists who have been killed, and like
someone was saying at the funeral that they were speaking
and there's someone else will pick up his camera and
like keep documenting things. Really was very emotional for me
(33:02):
and my friends. Yeah, it was really sad, but.
Speaker 2 (33:05):
Yes it is.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
Yeah, I believe you. It's just you know, that's the
thing that I do, and I see people, you know,
dressed like me. People I know it's been very of
your coverage of that has been very emotionally challenging for me,
but it should be emotionally challenging. It's terrible, but I
think people should definitely tune into it if they can.
(33:27):
I wonder, are there like social media accounts that the
PJS has that people can follow.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Yes, we have Facebook page. It's on Facebook. Yes, it's
a Palestinian Journalist syndicate. Yeah, just and we try to
download all our news on it. Also we have our
website which is www dot PJS dot p S. Also
(33:53):
you can find some news statements, updates and so on.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
Yeah, that's great, and I encourage people to to follow
that they're able to. I wonder, really, is there anything
else you think that people are like, anything that's been
missing from the media narrative that you'd like people to
know about the situation now in Palestine, or like the
situation more broadly that hasn't been reported on as much
as it should be. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
Yeah, I just want to add something about besides what's
going on, and because even a journalists in the West Bank,
even in Palestinian journalists in Israel are facing a lot
of threats, facing a lot of problems. There is a
massive campaign of arrests. So up to now one thousand,
(34:44):
in three days, one thousand persons have been arrested. We're
trying to find the number of journalists, which is I'm
not sure about it, but I can't give you the figure,
as I told you, because of the big number we're
trying to make who are the journalists? But a massive
(35:04):
arrests campaign is taking place now. Also, journalists are facing
a lot of threats about a lot of violations while covering.
Many times they are prevented from coverage, They are threatened
by weapons, They are threatened sometimes by the settlers aren't
(35:25):
settlers even not the army while covering many of them. Also,
they they are subject to incitement through social media pages
like spreading their photos or the and so to make
a kind of excitement how to kill them or to
(35:45):
get rid of them and so on. So, also journalists
are facing a very hard time now. Yeah, they are
under the threat.
Speaker 1 (35:55):
Yeah damn, Yeah, that's terrible and kipedian acceptable. So yeah,
I'm glad you shared that, and I think it's important
that people follow this and do whatever they can to help,
do whatever they can to to I don't know, to
encourage people to stop bombing other people, Like it's never
a good situation. People are bombing children and hopefully it
(36:17):
comes to an end, get it. I don't know. I've
never seen this much outgoing support for Palestine in the
United States. But I've also you know, this is an
unprecedented act of a war crimes solicated. It's very hard
to see where this is going. I suppose.
Speaker 2 (36:38):
Yes, we believe that the voice is reaching maybe a
little but not that fast that that's easy, because it's
not easy. But we believe in every person who thinks
and say, no, this is inhuman I should not I
should be with those people who are under attack, who
are under under Yeah, a lot of hard life. Yeah,
(37:05):
it's a hard life, a lot of oppostion.
Speaker 1 (37:08):
So yeah, when.
Speaker 2 (37:09):
We see that as adult, when we see the demonstrations,
it really gives us power. It really gives us that
we have right to life. You know, this is a
minimum right that we need people to tell us, Yes,
you have a right to life.
Speaker 1 (37:23):
Yeah, I think that's it's nice to hear, you know it.
It's like if you can feel that you're helping, even
just helping people feel like a little bit, you know, elevated,
a little bit better, a little bit less despairing, because
I can see how it would be very easy if
you're stuck in Gaza to feel like the world's abandon
you because it has to a large degree, right, the
(37:43):
world's allowed this to happen, and it's you know, it's
not it's American bombs, American plaints dropping bombs unfortunately. Yeah.
So I think that's really good to hear. It's good
to hear that that has made some difference. Thank you
so much for giving us some of your time. I
know it's thank you.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
Thank you, Jams, thank you for having me with you.
I wish you all good luck. Thank you, Thank you
all who listener listeners to this podcast. I hope that
I was able to give you an overview of what's
going on. And let's pray that this violence will end
(38:25):
very soon.
Speaker 1 (38:26):
Yes, yeah, yeah, indeed, let's thank you very much. I
was wonderful.
Speaker 2 (38:29):
Thank you. It could Happen here as a production of
cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from cool Zone Media,
visit our website cool zonemedia dot com, or check us
out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you
listen to podcasts. You can find sources for It Could
Happen Here, updated monthly at coolzonemedia dot com slash sources.
(38:51):
Thanks for listening.
It Could Happen Here News
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Robert Evans
Garrison Davis
James Stout
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