October 9, 2025 • 35 mins
Mia talks with Dr. Kaveh Hoda about Trump’s efforts to stop giving children the Hepatitis vaccine.
Sources:
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Also media welcome. It could happen here a podcast beset
by horrors of such magnitude that sometimes you have to
go back to a thing that you just talked about
because there were more horrors in it that you didn't
have time to cover the first time you went to
the horror. Sorry, the first two times you went through
the horrors and with me to talk about the horrors.
(00:24):
Is doctor kave Hoda, who is a doctor? I guess,
as you probably could have guessed from the title. You know,
I scripted this out very poorly. Uh, this is great,
You're doing great, Keep going, I say, scripted this out.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Literally.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
The only part of this introduction that was in my
notes was cave Hoda, doctor and host of House of
Pod and friend of the show, which was not in
my notes either.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
But that's right, friend. The energy is chaotic today. Friend,
most importantly, yeah, it has to be. That is the
normal response to what is happening in this world. If
we don't embrace a little chaos, and we will lose
our minds.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
So I am. I am loving how this is going
so far.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
I am so glad because there is so much chaos.
One of the chaos things that we have been tracking,
and that you spend a hideous amount of time tracking
too much on your share too much. Yes, it's not good,
it's very bad. Please stop doing this stuff so we
can all go back to doing normal things in our lives.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
I would love to just do more fart jokes and
episodes on poop, but people in power keep saying and
doing terrible things. You have crazy, terrible things that make
me feel like I'm losing my mind. So I have
to keep doing this from ultards one because someone's got
(01:43):
to talk about it. Two, it's sort of therapy for me,
Like if I just internalize this, I'm gonna I'm gonna
be a miserable person. So thanks, thanks for having me on.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Yeah, I'm excited to talk to you about well.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
Okay, see this Literally every single time I do an episode,
it's like, I'm really excited to talk to you. And also,
Jesus Christ, I wish we did not to talk about this.
That's how everyone feels. That's that's when they see me. Yeah,
it's terrible, God, really, truly, we got to stop meeting
like this.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
One day. We'll do a find episode one day and.
Speaker 4 (02:20):
I swear to God.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Okay, but the thing that I've been talking about, that
we've both been covering is basically the annihilation of the
entire US medical establishment at the federal level is being
systematically dismantled. And one of the ways that's being sematically
dismantled is that a bunch of people have been put
in charge of it who are I mean, two years ago,
(02:44):
were fringe anti vaccine cranks and are now running like
the most sophisticated like public health institutions that have ever existed.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
As a producer extraordinaire, so lichtrom In once said, you
can't put a hater in charge of the thing that
they hate the most, and that is what has happened,
completely and fully, almost at every step of this government,
they find the person that hates it the most and
they put that person in.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
And you know, one of the big sort of I
don't know if turning points is the right word, but
one of the major events we've been covering from this
was the announcement by Rfkgnior and Trump that they had
found what causes autism and also ADHD too, which I
got very little coverage. I think I said this last
(03:39):
time I talked about this. It was very baffling. But
there's just there was so much in that whole thing
that I think a lot of the stuff kind of
fell through the cracks inside of like, well, there was
a lot, there was a lot to digest the so much.
There's so much, and so I guess I want to
we wanted to talk about mostly the hepatitis B thing,
(03:59):
but also just sort of the broader anti VAXX stuff
that was in this before we get into I don't know,
like the weirder, more boutique anti vax stuff, which is
like the anti hepatitis B vagcazine stuff, a thing that
I didn't realize people were against children getting until like now,
(04:21):
and like I follow these things decently closely.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
Yeah, let's start a little bit with.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Like, let's let's ease the audience into this by going
back to the classics, the greatest hits. We didn't really
have one hit, the one hit of the anti vaccine movement,
which was Trump's stuff about separating the MMR vaccine.
Speaker 4 (04:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
So yeah, recently during that press conference where he really
threw tail and all under the bus. He also really
it was weird because there's no new evidence. I want
to make that clear. There was no new evidence that
they presented about vaccine. But Trump actually really harped on
vaccines and his thoughts, his medical opinion, and his advice
(05:08):
on how.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
To manage vaccines. It's truly bizarre.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
Never seen a president say or do those sorts of things.
But one of the things he mentioned was the MMR vaccine,
the measles, mumps, rubella, and he said that it should
be split into three separate shots, again medically unfounded. It really,
as you have alluded to, echoes these long debunked claims,
(05:32):
these Wakefield like claims, starting from back in nineteen ninety eight. Again,
Wakefield was the disgraced author of that vaccine study that
tied it to autism, lost his medical license for that.
But that has persisted and carried on, and the seeds
of that are still growing terrible, terrible plants in trees today,
(05:54):
and one of them was this fruit of Trump saying
we should break up the MMR vaccine. So to say
it up front, one, there's no reason to do that.
There's no reason that shows improved safety. There's no credible
evidence to suggest that at least, and more importantly, the
more you split these things up, the more likely you're
gonna end up missing doses. That is like a known fact.
(06:18):
If you delay vaccines, if you split them up more
than they need to be, there is a much greater
chance you will miss that. In case this is not clear,
measles is bad. It is one of the most contagious
viruses out there, and lower vaccination rates quickly lead to outbreaks,
as we're already starting to see, and when there's already
some hesitancy in the community, pushing it like this is
(06:41):
a terrible thing. So even though that was a throwaway
statement from the President of the United States, it could
have serious repercussions.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
And it's very concerning.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
And I've also I have committed myself every single time
this comes up that the Wakefield study, which is where
this whole separate data war thing like came up a
it's not even a conclusion that even even if you
take his completely fake premise that he made up, yeah,
it doesn't actually follow that you should split the vaccines up, right,
(07:10):
It's baffling. But the second thing is the reason he
wanted to split the vaccines up was that he was
trying to sell his own vaccines. Correct, He was just
trying to sell his own vaccin I it makes me
insane every single time this has talked about, because this
whole thing is sabetically.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
It's literally an industrial complex. It's like the end vaccine
industrial complex. They're all trying to sell you something. That's
the whole thing.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
I was watching Trump give this talk this press conference,
and I said, I think I said this on another
show here on this channel. I started to disassociate. I'm like, yeah,
this can't be real life. I am I dreaming is this?
It felt like I was having an out of body experience.
It did not feel real to me.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
To be fully transparent, I did not make it through
that press conference.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Watching it on video.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
About like four minutes in, I was like, fuck this,
I'm going to read the transcript. So I'm just working
off the transcript because I was like, I can't.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
It was tough. I can't do this.
Speaker 3 (08:06):
So on my podcast, The House of Pod you should
all listen to it, I played a clip from Trump
talking about tail and all and another clip of him
talking about heptis B and when you listen to it.
When I listened back to it as I was editing it,
it sounded like I edited his clips to make him
(08:27):
sound crazy.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
I did not.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
I just took straight from what he says, and it
just the way he was talking, it's hard to listen to.
I mean, it's hard to read too, but the way
he talks, it's so disjointed and he just goes from
one thought to the next. Hey, does this weave thing
that he thinks is so clever, But it's just lost.
The threads are never brought back together. It's just an unraveled,
terrible rug of lies. And that is that is why
(08:50):
it's so hard to listen to him. I totally understand.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Yeah, well, and this has also been you know, one
of the things that most of the media has done
is that you know, in order to be able to
like play a listenable clip on air, right, and also
in sort of innservative power, they edit the clips to
make him sound like a normal human being. Right, So
the version of it that people are seeing is not
the version where he's just sort of completely ranting incoherently
(09:16):
and like, you know, you just see these clips. But
then also because they're because they're they're editing it down
progressively more and more like.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Just more.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Stuff more, just like information content gets lost every time,
which is the problem because there's just like so much.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
The fire hose in this of nonsense. Yeah, title my
first albums incredible, incredible.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Oh god, Okay, so you know what, we're going to
a second fire hose of nonsense.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
This is slightly really to be doing this, but fuck.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
It, it's chaos week. We're doing it. Do you know
what else is a fire hose of nonsense? Oh well,
I wouldn't say it's nonsense. I would say it's very important.
And they's so it's very very important. I believe in.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
I don't end up just kidding. I'm assuming ads and services. Yeah,
this is the practice.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
Services that support this podcast.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
We are back.
Speaker 1 (10:22):
So it makes the torrent of you know, the MMR stuff,
which also I do want to say, very briefly, is
sort of a baffling thing to be talking about in
a thing where you're.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
Not blaming the vaccines for autism.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
You're blaming tail at all, but then you're still also
mad at the vaccine. It's very weird. Yeah, I have
thoughts about that.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
You know.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
I felt like what Trump was doing with that by
bringing up the vaccine stuff was I felt he was
trying to console RFK Junior in a way. I felt
like he was like, Okay, hey, we're moving away from
the vaccine stuff to focus on this tile law stuff.
But I know how much you love the vaccine stuff, AREFK,
So let's.
Speaker 2 (11:03):
Talk about that.
Speaker 3 (11:04):
So I felt like he was just throwing that out
there to play k RFK Junior.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
That was my guess. But I don't know how.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
To read sociopaths very well, so.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
This could also just be like what comes into his
mind when he thinks about medicine.
Speaker 3 (11:19):
Right, so you know, oh yeah, again, weird to me
that this president was giving medical advice. I mean, he
was making statements, do not take timely said that multiple
times he talked about breaking up the hepatitis B vaccine,
changing the heptides B vaccine, that the times of it,
which I think we're going to talk about because that
is very important to me, and things that doctors would
(11:41):
have a little pause to say so strongly, and even
the people whose paper he's citing would say, oh, slow
down a little bit with that. You know, it's very important.
I think it's super impactful, and you're right, it's slipping
under the radar. So I would love to talk about
the hepatitis B stuff. Yeah, let's do this, so I'll
(12:02):
give a little background for your listeners who don't know me.
I am a gastroentrologist and hepatologist that's liver, not herpetologists,
which is study of snakes, which sometimes people think online.
I am a doctor that looks at the liver, and
hepatitis B has an important place in my heart. It's
a disease that can be incredibly devastating. It's incredibly common,
(12:25):
it has so many complications, It has such long term
ramifications on someone's life if they have it, so many
things they have to consider, do follow up, so many
possible things that can happen with it. And the thing
about it is, we have a vaccine for it that
is very safe and super efficacious and works really well,
(12:46):
and when we use it, it works amazing. In Trump during
this conference, through that a couple of passing shots as
he was doing this whole rant about tile mall etc.
And those passing sts can have a huge impact on
uptake in this country. I think it really needs to
be discussed. So I'll stop there. I'll let you see
(13:07):
what questions you have for me hepatites because I could
talk about hepatitiz B for a long time.
Speaker 1 (13:11):
Yeah, okay, let's let's let's go back to like the
very basic. How would you explain hepatitis B to our
dear listener who knows many things, but what hepatitis B
is is not one of them.
Speaker 3 (13:22):
Yes, So, hepatitis just means inflammation of the liver. Anything
with itis means inflammation. And there are different ways of
getting hepatitis or inflammation of the liver. They range from alcohol, medications,
autoimmune problems to viral things. And there are viral things
that can cause bad hepatitis affect the liver, primarily hepatitis A, B, C.
(13:48):
You've heard of some of these hepatides, and hepatitis B
is a very common one in the world. It's about
two billion people in the world have either had it
or presently have it. About eight hundred and eighty thousand
people in the US alone have chronic hepatitis B, but
if you actually look at studies that include more immigrant populations,
(14:11):
that number can go up to about two point two million.
It is something that can when you get it at
an early age, when you're young and you're a baby
or an infant, you're young and your immune system is
not super robust yet. It's very likely, about ninety percent
or more that if you are exposed to it, you'll
(14:31):
get chronic infection from it. If you get it when
you're older, it's a little different. You can have a
pretty strong reaction to it. You'll get really sick, potentially
sometimes to the point where the liver fails, but most
people are when they're older able to clear it. They're
going to eventually get rid of the virus to point
(14:51):
where the liver is fine and it manages, but it
lives in the liver indefinitely. Once you get the hepatitis B,
there's a very good chance you will have it forever.
Whether or not it's causing you problems is another thing.
A lot of people can live with it not have
any problems, but a lot of people will get it
and they will be very sick in the beginning. And
when you get it as an infant, you have a
(15:13):
very good chance of having it for the rest of
your life. And that can be a major problem because
like all viruses that go into the liver like this,
all these viral hepatides, what can happen is it can
cause scarring, which you might have heard of when it's
really bad, called cirrhosis. When that happens, the liver can
(15:35):
stop working. You can get cancer of the liver. You
can get big blood vessels in your esophagus called esophageal varses,
and vomited blood. You can get a lot of bad
things that happen. Now, what makes heptizes be particularly insidious,
It makes it a little bit even my opinion, more
dangerous than a lot of other viral hepatides is that
(16:00):
you don't always have to go through these phases to
get to the really bad part. Like when you have
hepatitis C, for example, you get bad scarring over a
long time that can cause that cirrhosis, and that cirrhosis
can lead to cancer. But since hepatitis B is a
DNA virus, that DNA can get into the DNA of
(16:22):
your liver cells and it can cause cancer without even
having to go through those steps of cirrhosis. That's obviously terrible,
and that can happen to young people, and I've seen
it and it's awful. So I'm saying all these terrible
things about hepatitis B because it's one of these things
that does not need to be I didn't mean to
(16:43):
say that like that. No, I didn't mean to make
a play on words there, but it doesn't need to
happen because we have this great vaccine that can manage this,
and when we use this vaccine, it works. In fact,
in the US, they looked at it between nineteen ninety
it was introduced in this country like for infants in
nineteen ninety one, and when they looked from nineteen ninety
(17:04):
to two thousand and four, they saw a ninety four
percent decrease in kids and adolescents who have hepatitis being incredible,
that's amazing, that's really good. Like this is a great
success story. And part of the reason people like Trump
don't recognize that this is an issues because it's done well,
because this vaccine works and it does a good job. Now,
(17:28):
the other thing to discuss is how it is transmitted,
because that's a big part of what Trump was saying
during this press conference. Yeah, and he said it's sexually transmitted,
which is true. That is one of the ways that
you get it, but you also get it from the mother.
The mother when you're having a pregnancy and a delivery,
(17:49):
it's a messy, bloody process and that is a huge
risk factor for the infant getting hepatized B from the mother.
There's also household things that can happen. You know, people
share razors, that's a risk factor, toothbrushes, small things, bites
at daycare centers. All these things are small risks. They're
not as common as sex or the childbirth ways of transmission,
(18:13):
but there are other modes of transmission for getting hepatitis B,
not just sex like Trump was saying. So I think
that's super important to be clear that. I think that
is one of the major things he said that was wrong.
He said a lot of things are wrong, but that's
probably the biggest easiest one to point out.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
Yeah, And I think it also was interesting because that
was one of the things that got followed up on
by reporters. But the reporter was like, well, you can
also get it from like reusing needles, which like yeah,
but like not not mentioning the whole. You can get
it from being born, a thing that everyone has to do. Statistically,
this is true. The statistics bear that out.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
That is true.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Yeah, but percent rate of being born in order to exist.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
That's exactly exact, exactly right.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
You know why, I realized why Trump says this, This
is the realization I came to he doesn't even think
about this as a possible mode of transmission. If you've
ever seen a delivery, I don't know if you have mia,
but if you've ever seen someone give birth, whether it's natural,
vaginal or cesarean or whatever, whatever method, there's a lot
of fluids, blood, mucus. There's a lot of fluids happening
(19:25):
during this time exchange between mother and baby. And if
you saw that, I think you'd be like, oh, well, yeah,
that makes sense that you would get it that way.
If you do get it through sex, why couldn't you
get it through that? You know, if you could get
it by putting a penis into a vagina, for example,
why couldn't you get it from being birth from one?
So you would you would see that, you would It
(19:47):
would make sense to you inherently and automatically. My guess
is that Trump has not seen any of his kids delivered.
Speaker 2 (19:54):
That that would not surprise me.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
I mean, if he was in a nearby room, I
would be impressed in Edwa cast aspersions on our president.
I don't know. Maybe he was there, you know, cutting
the umbilical corridor. I don't know, but I get the
sense he was not, and I feel like that's why
in his mind he doesn't even register it.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
And then then the other thing that makes that's weird
about this is he's like, Oh, it's just me.
Speaker 3 (20:17):
I say that they get the shot at the age
of twelve because it's sexually transmitted, And that makes me
wonder And I'm surprised no one's brought this up. Why
does he think that's okay? Then does he think that
kids are having sex at the age of twelve and
that's okay?
Speaker 1 (20:32):
Why did why did twelve become the number for him?
It's so weird and I don't know that's truly one
of the There is something just deeply evil going on
in his mind, but I have no idea what it is,
and I can't follow the path of logic because I'm
not like a billionaire who was born in like the
(20:56):
fifties or whatever.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
I don't know that that guy has seen.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
That guy has gotten brain word from things that like
don't exist anymore.
Speaker 2 (21:09):
No, he was born in the forties.
Speaker 1 (21:10):
Sorry, my apologies for thinking he was born a full
decade later than he actually was.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
Good lord, Yeah, I mean I think the results are
still the same.
Speaker 1 (21:22):
Yeah, but I mean it's like, you know, there's just
like there's prejudices and weird stuff that he picked up
rattling around there that like who knows where they came from.
And I think also, you know, one of the other
ankles about this this sort of really distressing is this
like what feels like the sort of stigmatizing aspect of
it of just being like, oh, well, there's something you
(21:43):
can only get like sexually transmitted, so like why are
we giving this to kids? And it's like, well, yeah,
but like there's just like a bunch of other ways
that you can get it, and like only talking about
that one and then having it as an excuse to
like raise the vaccination age for no reason.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
In that you know, again goes.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
Back to the MMR thing, because you know, when we
talk about giving these doses the who the CDC, they
recommend the birth vaccine within twenty four hours are the
first at least. Then the current schedule is you get
at birth and follow up set one to two months,
and then again at six to fifteen months. And part
of the thing of stretching that out, pushing that out
(22:22):
further again, same thing as the MMR, which is the
more likely you are to not do it at all
and to have decreased uptake. Yeah, so this is the
real reason why that's a concern.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
Yeah, And it's this sort of decreased uptake is their goal, right,
Like that's what they want. Like that's why RFKI Junior,
for example, is making it increasingly difficult to get like
the COVID vaccine and the flu vaccine and stuff like that.
And it's, you know, they're doing this sort of like
double pronged approach of both establishing it from the top
(22:55):
down through the medical bureaucracy of taking control of and
also just like spreading it among their supporters and among
people who are like, oh that the President wouldn't just
like lie to me about medical stuff, right, that's unreasonable.
Speaker 3 (23:14):
And I mean if you didn't know, if you didn't
know that there was another means of transmission, what he
said is reasonable. You know, why would you give an
infant a vaccine for something they could only get through sex.
I mean, yeah, you bet sure that makes sense, but
(23:35):
it's just wrong.
Speaker 4 (23:36):
Yeah, it's kind.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
Of pointless to ask the question does he know he's
lying on this one?
Speaker 2 (23:52):
But I don't think he is.
Speaker 3 (23:54):
I honestly don't think he understands. I think he probably
did hear that there are some other modes of transmission,
and in his mind it requires some sort of blood
contact or some sort of mucosal contact in his mind,
and that's how he interpreted it. And I think he
just doesn't equate that with childbirth. I think he assumes that,
(24:18):
like because the child he sees comes out like perfectly
wrapped and cleaned and you know, looks like a little
baby in like a blanket when he sees it. Yeah,
So I think I think that's the thing. I think
he believes this. I don't think he's lying on purpose.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
On this one. Yeah, that makes sense, And I think
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
I think it's an interesting aspect of this is that
this is like it was kind of just a Trump thing, right,
Like this is like one of the parts of it
that like RFK Junior and Martin McCary didn't really talk about.
It was just Trump kind of just like started talking
about it for reasons that are deeply unclear.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (24:56):
I mean, Martin McCarry is an interesting guy, and I
think he did some good things in the past, and
it's done some not so great things, some bad things.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
Yeah, would not be so in this administration.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
This may shock you, Mia, but Trump picked somebody for
a high level position that might be a little problematic.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Well, especially this version of the administration too, where it's
like in Trump won, it was possible for them for
him to appoint someone random and it kind of be
like Department of Energy, right right, They put Rick Perry,
who famously would call to a well forgot that it
was the thing that he wanted to abolish, but then
he got in charge of it, and the Department of
(25:36):
Energy of people like explained to him this is this
is where the nuke stuff is. And then he was like, sure, whatever,
fucking go run this. I'll just stay out of everyone's way.
And that kind of works. Fine that he's not happening
this administration, you are not getting You're actualting Rick Perry
going to like a make worksipshop, letting the bureaucrats run
(25:56):
the actual stuff.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
How wild it is that we long for the days
of Rick Perry.
Speaker 5 (26:02):
Yeah, the days when someone could explain to you, hey,
this is the department that does the nukes, and they'd
be and they would change their opinion about it.
Speaker 2 (26:14):
Staggering incredible.
Speaker 3 (26:18):
So let me tell you a little bit more about
this McCrary character. Yeah, so he is a surgeon. I
don't think he practice as a surgeon anymore, but he's
sort of a health policy expertly self fashioned as one.
And he's the person that was tapped by Donald Trump.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
To leave the FDA.
Speaker 3 (26:36):
You've seen him on Fox News a lot, and he's
been very outspoken about pandemic policies in the past. He
was noted as one of the greatest perpetrators of COVID
misinformation during those times when they people fact checked him
again and again found that he was wrong. But the
thing about him that you may or may not know
(26:58):
how I first learned him and how he popped up
on my radar a while back, was he is the
person that's responsible for this claim that medical error is
the third leading cause of death in the United States.
Sometimes that's cited as second. Yes, that's him, he's the person,
oh boy, right. Which there's a lot of issues with
(27:20):
this claim. It is at best controversial. It's based on
extrapolated data. There was no formal methodology that went into
him doing this. It totally misrepresents the complexity of healthcare
and health care outcomes. But It's like the herpees of
medical misinformation because it always comes back. No matter how
(27:41):
many times it gets disproven or people talk about it,
it always comes back, and it's always used as this.
It's an inherent part of the belief structure of these
anti vaxxers. It is taken as gospel now. But back
in twenty sixteen, basically he wrote this BMJ paper that
estimated something like two hundred and fifty thousand deaths per
(28:01):
year in US hospitals were due to medical errors. But again,
was not a formal study. It presented no new data,
and it didn't have any sort of real rigorous statistical
method behind it. It kind of averaged figures from different sources.
It doesn't actually even work because death certificates don't capture
(28:23):
medical error, so it's hard to really study that even
if you wanted to. But anyways, long story short, no
matter how many times people disprove this or make arguments
that work against it, it never goes away.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
So that's him. That's McCary. Oh boy, oh boy. And
he's not running the FDA. Oh yeah, which is great.
Speaker 3 (28:43):
We put the worst people in charge of quite possibly
the most important part of our country.
Speaker 1 (28:51):
Yeah, I mean, just the Health and Human Service is
run by RFK Junior is just when he first took office,
my line on it was millions we'll die. And we
are so incredibly on track for millions to die from
just this guy and his people being put in charge.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
Yeah, I mean, I should say one more thing about
maccarury before we move on from him that claim. You know,
I wouldn't say that medical error isn't an issue. I
think it is a very serious issue. Even if there's
one or two cases in the whole country, it's a
serious issue and that should be addressed. But what he's
doing is I think harmful. I don't think that is
(29:32):
helping in any way. I think it's only made things
worse by contributing to where we're at today with our
anti vaxstance, our whole anti intellectual approach to medicine. And
that's a thing that they do. This is the thing
they take a little kernel of truth. If there is
any lack of knowledge, that there's any slight vacuum in understanding,
(29:54):
it gets filled with these bad actors, these people, and
he is, in my opinion.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
One of them, but still somehow not the worst, you know,
not The worst is one of those bars in the
Trump administration where it's not even the bar solo, it's
on the ground. The bar is so low that like
you have to go digging to get under the bar.
And it's not like a little bit of digging, it's
a lot of digging because the bar truly is below hell.
(30:22):
There's like a second hell down there to find this
bar for where these people are.
Speaker 3 (30:28):
Oh god, it's second hell. Every time I look into
any of these people. Just yeah, no, no, you're never
gonna be surprised.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Hes get hit a marine with an axe?
Speaker 1 (30:42):
Like this guy's just the Secretary of Defense now he's
like he's the guy going and yelling at the general.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
This is the guy who.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
Was on Fox News and he's just throwing an axe
and he threw it over the targy and it hit
a bunch of marines, Like what are we doing here?
Speaker 3 (30:56):
Well, whom amongst us hasn't done that? Maybe he is
the real Antifa.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
Yeah that's trutch.
Speaker 3 (31:03):
You.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
I have never hit a marine with an axe. Yeah,
so yeah, well there you go. Huh tragic.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Talma, Do you have anything else that you want to
tell our dear listeners.
Speaker 3 (31:19):
About this whole debacle. Get your vaccines, Yeah, you know,
get your vaccines. Get vaccinated. Now's the time to start
doing it for flu and COVID. If you can, talk
to your doctor. If you're having difficulty getting your vaccine
from your local places, your regular places, talk to your
(31:39):
doctor about getting it. You should still be able to
in most cases. So do it while you can. And
if you want to hear more about this stuff, make
sure to check out my podcast, The House of Pod.
We're going to talk about the stuff a lot more.
We'll talk about other stuff too, but you'll hear more
(32:00):
on this along the way as well. And you know,
I like that people are questioning some of these things.
I don't think it's unreasonable. Some of these topics are
not unreasonable to have. You know, we as I discussed
earlier on another podcast on this channel, channels that we
say on this network, I should say the title and
(32:23):
all autism question is not like a totally wacky, crazy one.
It was a decent question to ask. There was some correlation,
but the evidence when you look at it, shows that
it is very likely not a causal relationship when you
look at the evidence, And I think it's okay to
have some of these conversations, and sometimes it takes a
(32:44):
little nuance when you look at them. But I encourage
people to continue to do so, and to keep reading,
and to find trusted sources and look at those and
learn about them yourself. I think if nothing else good
comes from all this, it's that people are starting to
have an understanding of antibodies and the science behind vaccines.
And I think that's not a bad thing. So, I mean,
(33:07):
things are terrible. Things are terrible. There's so many bad
things in the world. But I will say this, I
see bright spots constantly. I see more and more people
who care about science. I see more and more people
than I ever have before care about important topics across
the world. They're not scientific, like gaza, for example. I've
seen more people care about things that I've ever seen
(33:28):
before in my long life, and I feel like that's
a good thing. There are bright spots out there and
that's what I cling to. And I see more people
interested in this. People want to talk to me about
hepatitis B and what it is and how to avoid it.
And I think that's great. So there's some good coming
from this.
Speaker 1 (33:48):
Yeah, And you know, and this is I think the
fundamental thing that both the media apparatus and the regime
are trying to conceal, which is that there are more
of us in the ear of them.
Speaker 3 (33:55):
M m.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
There always have been, and especially right now, there are
way more of us. And you know, their ability to
shape the world is disastrous, but their ability to shape
the world as fundamentally a minoritarian force in this country
right with like thirty to forty percent of the population
is always going to be limited and always is always
(34:18):
going to be in danger of simply being reversed. Yeah,
and we can be that reversal, one person.
Speaker 4 (34:25):
At a time. Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
Well, kymye, thank you for being on the show, and
go listen to House of Pod. It's great, it's all
thank you.
Speaker 3 (34:34):
Yeah, we're okay.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
You could do worse.
Speaker 6 (34:44):
It could Happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media.
For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website
Coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can
now find sources for it could Happen here. Listened to
direct episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.
Also media welcome. It could happen here a podcast beset
by horrors of such magnitude that sometimes you have to
go back to a thing that you just talked about
because there were more horrors in it that you didn't
have time to cover the first time you went to
the horror. Sorry, the first two times you went through
the horrors and with me to talk about the horrors.
(00:24):
Is doctor kave Hoda, who is a doctor? I guess,
as you probably could have guessed from the title. You know,
I scripted this out very poorly. Uh, this is great,
You're doing great, Keep going, I say, scripted this out.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Literally.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
The only part of this introduction that was in my
notes was cave Hoda, doctor and host of House of
Pod and friend of the show, which was not in
my notes either.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
But that's right, friend. The energy is chaotic today. Friend,
most importantly, yeah, it has to be. That is the
normal response to what is happening in this world. If
we don't embrace a little chaos, and we will lose
our minds.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
So I am. I am loving how this is going
so far.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
I am so glad because there is so much chaos.
One of the chaos things that we have been tracking,
and that you spend a hideous amount of time tracking
too much on your share too much. Yes, it's not good,
it's very bad. Please stop doing this stuff so we
can all go back to doing normal things in our lives.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
I would love to just do more fart jokes and
episodes on poop, but people in power keep saying and
doing terrible things. You have crazy, terrible things that make
me feel like I'm losing my mind. So I have
to keep doing this from ultards one because someone's got
(01:43):
to talk about it. Two, it's sort of therapy for me,
Like if I just internalize this, I'm gonna I'm gonna
be a miserable person. So thanks, thanks for having me on.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Yeah, I'm excited to talk to you about well.
Speaker 1 (01:57):
Okay, see this Literally every single time I do an episode,
it's like, I'm really excited to talk to you. And also,
Jesus Christ, I wish we did not to talk about this.
That's how everyone feels. That's that's when they see me. Yeah,
it's terrible, God, really, truly, we got to stop meeting
like this.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
One day. We'll do a find episode one day and.
Speaker 4 (02:20):
I swear to God.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Okay, but the thing that I've been talking about, that
we've both been covering is basically the annihilation of the
entire US medical establishment at the federal level is being
systematically dismantled. And one of the ways that's being sematically
dismantled is that a bunch of people have been put
in charge of it who are I mean, two years ago,
(02:44):
were fringe anti vaccine cranks and are now running like
the most sophisticated like public health institutions that have ever existed.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:57):
As a producer extraordinaire, so lichtrom In once said, you
can't put a hater in charge of the thing that
they hate the most, and that is what has happened,
completely and fully, almost at every step of this government,
they find the person that hates it the most and
they put that person in.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
And you know, one of the big sort of I
don't know if turning points is the right word, but
one of the major events we've been covering from this
was the announcement by Rfkgnior and Trump that they had
found what causes autism and also ADHD too, which I
got very little coverage. I think I said this last
(03:39):
time I talked about this. It was very baffling. But
there's just there was so much in that whole thing
that I think a lot of the stuff kind of
fell through the cracks inside of like, well, there was
a lot, there was a lot to digest the so much.
There's so much, and so I guess I want to
we wanted to talk about mostly the hepatitis B thing,
(03:59):
but also just sort of the broader anti VAXX stuff
that was in this before we get into I don't know,
like the weirder, more boutique anti vax stuff, which is
like the anti hepatitis B vagcazine stuff, a thing that
I didn't realize people were against children getting until like now,
(04:21):
and like I follow these things decently closely.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
Yeah, let's start a little bit with.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Like, let's let's ease the audience into this by going
back to the classics, the greatest hits. We didn't really
have one hit, the one hit of the anti vaccine movement,
which was Trump's stuff about separating the MMR vaccine.
Speaker 4 (04:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
So yeah, recently during that press conference where he really
threw tail and all under the bus. He also really
it was weird because there's no new evidence. I want
to make that clear. There was no new evidence that
they presented about vaccine. But Trump actually really harped on
vaccines and his thoughts, his medical opinion, and his advice
(05:08):
on how.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
To manage vaccines. It's truly bizarre.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
Never seen a president say or do those sorts of things.
But one of the things he mentioned was the MMR vaccine,
the measles, mumps, rubella, and he said that it should
be split into three separate shots, again medically unfounded. It really,
as you have alluded to, echoes these long debunked claims,
(05:32):
these Wakefield like claims, starting from back in nineteen ninety eight. Again,
Wakefield was the disgraced author of that vaccine study that
tied it to autism, lost his medical license for that.
But that has persisted and carried on, and the seeds
of that are still growing terrible, terrible plants in trees today,
(05:54):
and one of them was this fruit of Trump saying
we should break up the MMR vaccine. So to say
it up front, one, there's no reason to do that.
There's no reason that shows improved safety. There's no credible
evidence to suggest that at least, and more importantly, the
more you split these things up, the more likely you're
gonna end up missing doses. That is like a known fact.
(06:18):
If you delay vaccines, if you split them up more
than they need to be, there is a much greater
chance you will miss that. In case this is not clear,
measles is bad. It is one of the most contagious
viruses out there, and lower vaccination rates quickly lead to outbreaks,
as we're already starting to see, and when there's already
some hesitancy in the community, pushing it like this is
(06:41):
a terrible thing. So even though that was a throwaway
statement from the President of the United States, it could
have serious repercussions.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
And it's very concerning.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
And I've also I have committed myself every single time
this comes up that the Wakefield study, which is where
this whole separate data war thing like came up a
it's not even a conclusion that even even if you
take his completely fake premise that he made up, yeah,
it doesn't actually follow that you should split the vaccines up, right,
(07:10):
It's baffling. But the second thing is the reason he
wanted to split the vaccines up was that he was
trying to sell his own vaccines. Correct, He was just
trying to sell his own vaccin I it makes me
insane every single time this has talked about, because this
whole thing is sabetically.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
It's literally an industrial complex. It's like the end vaccine
industrial complex. They're all trying to sell you something. That's
the whole thing.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
I was watching Trump give this talk this press conference,
and I said, I think I said this on another
show here on this channel. I started to disassociate. I'm like, yeah,
this can't be real life. I am I dreaming is this?
It felt like I was having an out of body experience.
It did not feel real to me.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
To be fully transparent, I did not make it through
that press conference.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Watching it on video.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
About like four minutes in, I was like, fuck this,
I'm going to read the transcript. So I'm just working
off the transcript because I was like, I can't.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
It was tough. I can't do this.
Speaker 3 (08:06):
So on my podcast, The House of Pod you should
all listen to it, I played a clip from Trump
talking about tail and all and another clip of him
talking about heptis B and when you listen to it.
When I listened back to it as I was editing it,
it sounded like I edited his clips to make him
(08:27):
sound crazy.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
I did not.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
I just took straight from what he says, and it
just the way he was talking, it's hard to listen to.
I mean, it's hard to read too, but the way
he talks, it's so disjointed and he just goes from
one thought to the next. Hey, does this weave thing
that he thinks is so clever, But it's just lost.
The threads are never brought back together. It's just an unraveled,
terrible rug of lies. And that is that is why
(08:50):
it's so hard to listen to him. I totally understand.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Yeah, well, and this has also been you know, one
of the things that most of the media has done
is that you know, in order to be able to
like play a listenable clip on air, right, and also
in sort of innservative power, they edit the clips to
make him sound like a normal human being. Right, So
the version of it that people are seeing is not
the version where he's just sort of completely ranting incoherently
(09:16):
and like, you know, you just see these clips. But
then also because they're because they're they're editing it down
progressively more and more like.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Just more.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Stuff more, just like information content gets lost every time,
which is the problem because there's just like so much.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
The fire hose in this of nonsense. Yeah, title my
first albums incredible, incredible.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Oh god, Okay, so you know what, we're going to
a second fire hose of nonsense.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
This is slightly really to be doing this, but fuck.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
It, it's chaos week. We're doing it. Do you know
what else is a fire hose of nonsense? Oh well,
I wouldn't say it's nonsense. I would say it's very important.
And they's so it's very very important. I believe in.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
I don't end up just kidding. I'm assuming ads and services. Yeah,
this is the practice.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
Services that support this podcast.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
We are back.
Speaker 1 (10:22):
So it makes the torrent of you know, the MMR stuff,
which also I do want to say, very briefly, is
sort of a baffling thing to be talking about in
a thing where you're.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
Not blaming the vaccines for autism.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
You're blaming tail at all, but then you're still also
mad at the vaccine. It's very weird. Yeah, I have
thoughts about that.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
You know.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
I felt like what Trump was doing with that by
bringing up the vaccine stuff was I felt he was
trying to console RFK Junior in a way. I felt
like he was like, Okay, hey, we're moving away from
the vaccine stuff to focus on this tile law stuff.
But I know how much you love the vaccine stuff, AREFK,
So let's.
Speaker 2 (11:03):
Talk about that.
Speaker 3 (11:04):
So I felt like he was just throwing that out
there to play k RFK Junior.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
That was my guess. But I don't know how.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
To read sociopaths very well, so.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
This could also just be like what comes into his
mind when he thinks about medicine.
Speaker 3 (11:19):
Right, so you know, oh yeah, again, weird to me
that this president was giving medical advice. I mean, he
was making statements, do not take timely said that multiple
times he talked about breaking up the hepatitis B vaccine,
changing the heptides B vaccine, that the times of it,
which I think we're going to talk about because that
is very important to me, and things that doctors would
(11:41):
have a little pause to say so strongly, and even
the people whose paper he's citing would say, oh, slow
down a little bit with that. You know, it's very important.
I think it's super impactful, and you're right, it's slipping
under the radar. So I would love to talk about
the hepatitis B stuff. Yeah, let's do this, so I'll
(12:02):
give a little background for your listeners who don't know me.
I am a gastroentrologist and hepatologist that's liver, not herpetologists,
which is study of snakes, which sometimes people think online.
I am a doctor that looks at the liver, and
hepatitis B has an important place in my heart. It's
a disease that can be incredibly devastating. It's incredibly common,
(12:25):
it has so many complications, It has such long term
ramifications on someone's life if they have it, so many
things they have to consider, do follow up, so many
possible things that can happen with it. And the thing
about it is, we have a vaccine for it that
is very safe and super efficacious and works really well,
(12:46):
and when we use it, it works amazing. In Trump during
this conference, through that a couple of passing shots as
he was doing this whole rant about tile mall etc.
And those passing sts can have a huge impact on
uptake in this country. I think it really needs to
be discussed. So I'll stop there. I'll let you see
(13:07):
what questions you have for me hepatites because I could
talk about hepatitiz B for a long time.
Speaker 1 (13:11):
Yeah, okay, let's let's let's go back to like the
very basic. How would you explain hepatitis B to our
dear listener who knows many things, but what hepatitis B
is is not one of them.
Speaker 3 (13:22):
Yes, So, hepatitis just means inflammation of the liver. Anything
with itis means inflammation. And there are different ways of
getting hepatitis or inflammation of the liver. They range from alcohol, medications,
autoimmune problems to viral things. And there are viral things
that can cause bad hepatitis affect the liver, primarily hepatitis A, B, C.
(13:48):
You've heard of some of these hepatides, and hepatitis B
is a very common one in the world. It's about
two billion people in the world have either had it
or presently have it. About eight hundred and eighty thousand
people in the US alone have chronic hepatitis B, but
if you actually look at studies that include more immigrant populations,
(14:11):
that number can go up to about two point two million.
It is something that can when you get it at
an early age, when you're young and you're a baby
or an infant, you're young and your immune system is
not super robust yet. It's very likely, about ninety percent
or more that if you are exposed to it, you'll
(14:31):
get chronic infection from it. If you get it when
you're older, it's a little different. You can have a
pretty strong reaction to it. You'll get really sick, potentially
sometimes to the point where the liver fails, but most
people are when they're older able to clear it. They're
going to eventually get rid of the virus to point
(14:51):
where the liver is fine and it manages, but it
lives in the liver indefinitely. Once you get the hepatitis B,
there's a very good chance you will have it forever.
Whether or not it's causing you problems is another thing.
A lot of people can live with it not have
any problems, but a lot of people will get it
and they will be very sick in the beginning. And
when you get it as an infant, you have a
(15:13):
very good chance of having it for the rest of
your life. And that can be a major problem because
like all viruses that go into the liver like this,
all these viral hepatides, what can happen is it can
cause scarring, which you might have heard of when it's
really bad, called cirrhosis. When that happens, the liver can
(15:35):
stop working. You can get cancer of the liver. You
can get big blood vessels in your esophagus called esophageal varses,
and vomited blood. You can get a lot of bad
things that happen. Now, what makes heptizes be particularly insidious,
It makes it a little bit even my opinion, more
dangerous than a lot of other viral hepatides is that
(16:00):
you don't always have to go through these phases to
get to the really bad part. Like when you have
hepatitis C, for example, you get bad scarring over a
long time that can cause that cirrhosis, and that cirrhosis
can lead to cancer. But since hepatitis B is a
DNA virus, that DNA can get into the DNA of
(16:22):
your liver cells and it can cause cancer without even
having to go through those steps of cirrhosis. That's obviously terrible,
and that can happen to young people, and I've seen
it and it's awful. So I'm saying all these terrible
things about hepatitis B because it's one of these things
that does not need to be I didn't mean to
(16:43):
say that like that. No, I didn't mean to make
a play on words there, but it doesn't need to
happen because we have this great vaccine that can manage this,
and when we use this vaccine, it works. In fact,
in the US, they looked at it between nineteen ninety
it was introduced in this country like for infants in
nineteen ninety one, and when they looked from nineteen ninety
(17:04):
to two thousand and four, they saw a ninety four
percent decrease in kids and adolescents who have hepatitis being incredible,
that's amazing, that's really good. Like this is a great
success story. And part of the reason people like Trump
don't recognize that this is an issues because it's done well,
because this vaccine works and it does a good job. Now,
(17:28):
the other thing to discuss is how it is transmitted,
because that's a big part of what Trump was saying
during this press conference. Yeah, and he said it's sexually transmitted,
which is true. That is one of the ways that
you get it, but you also get it from the mother.
The mother when you're having a pregnancy and a delivery,
(17:49):
it's a messy, bloody process and that is a huge
risk factor for the infant getting hepatized B from the mother.
There's also household things that can happen. You know, people
share razors, that's a risk factor, toothbrushes, small things, bites
at daycare centers. All these things are small risks. They're
not as common as sex or the childbirth ways of transmission,
(18:13):
but there are other modes of transmission for getting hepatitis B,
not just sex like Trump was saying. So I think
that's super important to be clear that. I think that
is one of the major things he said that was wrong.
He said a lot of things are wrong, but that's
probably the biggest easiest one to point out.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
Yeah, And I think it also was interesting because that
was one of the things that got followed up on
by reporters. But the reporter was like, well, you can
also get it from like reusing needles, which like yeah,
but like not not mentioning the whole. You can get
it from being born, a thing that everyone has to do. Statistically,
this is true. The statistics bear that out.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
That is true.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Yeah, but percent rate of being born in order to exist.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
That's exactly exact, exactly right.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
You know why, I realized why Trump says this, This
is the realization I came to he doesn't even think
about this as a possible mode of transmission. If you've
ever seen a delivery, I don't know if you have mia,
but if you've ever seen someone give birth, whether it's natural,
vaginal or cesarean or whatever, whatever method, there's a lot
of fluids, blood, mucus. There's a lot of fluids happening
(19:25):
during this time exchange between mother and baby. And if
you saw that, I think you'd be like, oh, well, yeah,
that makes sense that you would get it that way.
If you do get it through sex, why couldn't you
get it through that? You know, if you could get
it by putting a penis into a vagina, for example,
why couldn't you get it from being birth from one?
So you would you would see that, you would It
(19:47):
would make sense to you inherently and automatically. My guess
is that Trump has not seen any of his kids delivered.
Speaker 2 (19:54):
That that would not surprise me.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
I mean, if he was in a nearby room, I
would be impressed in Edwa cast aspersions on our president.
I don't know. Maybe he was there, you know, cutting
the umbilical corridor. I don't know, but I get the
sense he was not, and I feel like that's why
in his mind he doesn't even register it.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
And then then the other thing that makes that's weird
about this is he's like, Oh, it's just me.
Speaker 3 (20:17):
I say that they get the shot at the age
of twelve because it's sexually transmitted, And that makes me
wonder And I'm surprised no one's brought this up. Why
does he think that's okay? Then does he think that
kids are having sex at the age of twelve and
that's okay?
Speaker 1 (20:32):
Why did why did twelve become the number for him?
It's so weird and I don't know that's truly one
of the There is something just deeply evil going on
in his mind, but I have no idea what it is,
and I can't follow the path of logic because I'm
not like a billionaire who was born in like the
(20:56):
fifties or whatever.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
I don't know that that guy has seen.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
That guy has gotten brain word from things that like
don't exist anymore.
Speaker 2 (21:09):
No, he was born in the forties.
Speaker 1 (21:10):
Sorry, my apologies for thinking he was born a full
decade later than he actually was.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
Good lord, Yeah, I mean I think the results are
still the same.
Speaker 1 (21:22):
Yeah, but I mean it's like, you know, there's just
like there's prejudices and weird stuff that he picked up
rattling around there that like who knows where they came from.
And I think also, you know, one of the other
ankles about this this sort of really distressing is this
like what feels like the sort of stigmatizing aspect of
it of just being like, oh, well, there's something you
(21:43):
can only get like sexually transmitted, so like why are
we giving this to kids? And it's like, well, yeah,
but like there's just like a bunch of other ways
that you can get it, and like only talking about
that one and then having it as an excuse to
like raise the vaccination age for no reason.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
In that you know, again goes.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
Back to the MMR thing, because you know, when we
talk about giving these doses the who the CDC, they
recommend the birth vaccine within twenty four hours are the
first at least. Then the current schedule is you get
at birth and follow up set one to two months,
and then again at six to fifteen months. And part
of the thing of stretching that out, pushing that out
(22:22):
further again, same thing as the MMR, which is the
more likely you are to not do it at all
and to have decreased uptake. Yeah, so this is the
real reason why that's a concern.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
Yeah, And it's this sort of decreased uptake is their goal, right,
Like that's what they want. Like that's why RFKI Junior,
for example, is making it increasingly difficult to get like
the COVID vaccine and the flu vaccine and stuff like that.
And it's, you know, they're doing this sort of like
double pronged approach of both establishing it from the top
(22:55):
down through the medical bureaucracy of taking control of and
also just like spreading it among their supporters and among
people who are like, oh that the President wouldn't just
like lie to me about medical stuff, right, that's unreasonable.
Speaker 3 (23:14):
And I mean if you didn't know, if you didn't
know that there was another means of transmission, what he
said is reasonable. You know, why would you give an
infant a vaccine for something they could only get through sex.
I mean, yeah, you bet sure that makes sense, but
(23:35):
it's just wrong.
Speaker 4 (23:36):
Yeah, it's kind.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
Of pointless to ask the question does he know he's
lying on this one?
Speaker 2 (23:52):
But I don't think he is.
Speaker 3 (23:54):
I honestly don't think he understands. I think he probably
did hear that there are some other modes of transmission,
and in his mind it requires some sort of blood
contact or some sort of mucosal contact in his mind,
and that's how he interpreted it. And I think he
just doesn't equate that with childbirth. I think he assumes that,
(24:18):
like because the child he sees comes out like perfectly
wrapped and cleaned and you know, looks like a little
baby in like a blanket when he sees it. Yeah,
So I think I think that's the thing. I think
he believes this. I don't think he's lying on purpose.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
On this one. Yeah, that makes sense, And I think
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
I think it's an interesting aspect of this is that
this is like it was kind of just a Trump thing, right,
Like this is like one of the parts of it
that like RFK Junior and Martin McCary didn't really talk about.
It was just Trump kind of just like started talking
about it for reasons that are deeply unclear.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (24:56):
I mean, Martin McCarry is an interesting guy, and I
think he did some good things in the past, and
it's done some not so great things, some bad things.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
Yeah, would not be so in this administration.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
This may shock you, Mia, but Trump picked somebody for
a high level position that might be a little problematic.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Well, especially this version of the administration too, where it's
like in Trump won, it was possible for them for
him to appoint someone random and it kind of be
like Department of Energy, right right, They put Rick Perry,
who famously would call to a well forgot that it
was the thing that he wanted to abolish, but then
he got in charge of it, and the Department of
(25:36):
Energy of people like explained to him this is this
is where the nuke stuff is. And then he was like, sure, whatever,
fucking go run this. I'll just stay out of everyone's way.
And that kind of works. Fine that he's not happening
this administration, you are not getting You're actualting Rick Perry
going to like a make worksipshop, letting the bureaucrats run
(25:56):
the actual stuff.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
How wild it is that we long for the days
of Rick Perry.
Speaker 5 (26:02):
Yeah, the days when someone could explain to you, hey,
this is the department that does the nukes, and they'd
be and they would change their opinion about it.
Speaker 2 (26:14):
Staggering incredible.
Speaker 3 (26:18):
So let me tell you a little bit more about
this McCrary character. Yeah, so he is a surgeon. I
don't think he practice as a surgeon anymore, but he's
sort of a health policy expertly self fashioned as one.
And he's the person that was tapped by Donald Trump.
Speaker 2 (26:34):
To leave the FDA.
Speaker 3 (26:36):
You've seen him on Fox News a lot, and he's
been very outspoken about pandemic policies in the past. He
was noted as one of the greatest perpetrators of COVID
misinformation during those times when they people fact checked him
again and again found that he was wrong. But the
thing about him that you may or may not know
(26:58):
how I first learned him and how he popped up
on my radar a while back, was he is the
person that's responsible for this claim that medical error is
the third leading cause of death in the United States.
Sometimes that's cited as second. Yes, that's him, he's the person,
oh boy, right. Which there's a lot of issues with
(27:20):
this claim. It is at best controversial. It's based on
extrapolated data. There was no formal methodology that went into
him doing this. It totally misrepresents the complexity of healthcare
and health care outcomes. But It's like the herpees of
medical misinformation because it always comes back. No matter how
(27:41):
many times it gets disproven or people talk about it,
it always comes back, and it's always used as this.
It's an inherent part of the belief structure of these
anti vaxxers. It is taken as gospel now. But back
in twenty sixteen, basically he wrote this BMJ paper that
estimated something like two hundred and fifty thousand deaths per
(28:01):
year in US hospitals were due to medical errors. But again,
was not a formal study. It presented no new data,
and it didn't have any sort of real rigorous statistical
method behind it. It kind of averaged figures from different sources.
It doesn't actually even work because death certificates don't capture
(28:23):
medical error, so it's hard to really study that even
if you wanted to. But anyways, long story short, no
matter how many times people disprove this or make arguments
that work against it, it never goes away.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
So that's him. That's McCary. Oh boy, oh boy. And
he's not running the FDA. Oh yeah, which is great.
Speaker 3 (28:43):
We put the worst people in charge of quite possibly
the most important part of our country.
Speaker 1 (28:51):
Yeah, I mean, just the Health and Human Service is
run by RFK Junior is just when he first took office,
my line on it was millions we'll die. And we
are so incredibly on track for millions to die from
just this guy and his people being put in charge.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
Yeah, I mean, I should say one more thing about
maccarury before we move on from him that claim. You know,
I wouldn't say that medical error isn't an issue. I
think it is a very serious issue. Even if there's
one or two cases in the whole country, it's a
serious issue and that should be addressed. But what he's
doing is I think harmful. I don't think that is
(29:32):
helping in any way. I think it's only made things
worse by contributing to where we're at today with our
anti vaxstance, our whole anti intellectual approach to medicine. And
that's a thing that they do. This is the thing
they take a little kernel of truth. If there is
any lack of knowledge, that there's any slight vacuum in understanding,
(29:54):
it gets filled with these bad actors, these people, and
he is, in my opinion.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
One of them, but still somehow not the worst, you know,
not The worst is one of those bars in the
Trump administration where it's not even the bar solo, it's
on the ground. The bar is so low that like
you have to go digging to get under the bar.
And it's not like a little bit of digging, it's
a lot of digging because the bar truly is below hell.
(30:22):
There's like a second hell down there to find this
bar for where these people are.
Speaker 3 (30:28):
Oh god, it's second hell. Every time I look into
any of these people. Just yeah, no, no, you're never
gonna be surprised.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Hes get hit a marine with an axe?
Speaker 1 (30:42):
Like this guy's just the Secretary of Defense now he's
like he's the guy going and yelling at the general.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
This is the guy who.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
Was on Fox News and he's just throwing an axe
and he threw it over the targy and it hit
a bunch of marines, Like what are we doing here?
Speaker 3 (30:56):
Well, whom amongst us hasn't done that? Maybe he is
the real Antifa.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
Yeah that's trutch.
Speaker 3 (31:03):
You.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
I have never hit a marine with an axe. Yeah,
so yeah, well there you go. Huh tragic.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Talma, Do you have anything else that you want to
tell our dear listeners.
Speaker 3 (31:19):
About this whole debacle. Get your vaccines, Yeah, you know,
get your vaccines. Get vaccinated. Now's the time to start
doing it for flu and COVID. If you can, talk
to your doctor. If you're having difficulty getting your vaccine
from your local places, your regular places, talk to your
(31:39):
doctor about getting it. You should still be able to
in most cases. So do it while you can. And
if you want to hear more about this stuff, make
sure to check out my podcast, The House of Pod.
We're going to talk about the stuff a lot more.
We'll talk about other stuff too, but you'll hear more
(32:00):
on this along the way as well. And you know,
I like that people are questioning some of these things.
I don't think it's unreasonable. Some of these topics are
not unreasonable to have. You know, we as I discussed
earlier on another podcast on this channel, channels that we
say on this network, I should say the title and
(32:23):
all autism question is not like a totally wacky, crazy one.
It was a decent question to ask. There was some correlation,
but the evidence when you look at it, shows that
it is very likely not a causal relationship when you
look at the evidence, And I think it's okay to
have some of these conversations, and sometimes it takes a
(32:44):
little nuance when you look at them. But I encourage
people to continue to do so, and to keep reading,
and to find trusted sources and look at those and
learn about them yourself. I think if nothing else good
comes from all this, it's that people are starting to
have an understanding of antibodies and the science behind vaccines.
And I think that's not a bad thing. So, I mean,
(33:07):
things are terrible. Things are terrible. There's so many bad
things in the world. But I will say this, I
see bright spots constantly. I see more and more people
who care about science. I see more and more people
than I ever have before care about important topics across
the world. They're not scientific, like gaza, for example. I've
seen more people care about things that I've ever seen
(33:28):
before in my long life, and I feel like that's
a good thing. There are bright spots out there and
that's what I cling to. And I see more people
interested in this. People want to talk to me about
hepatitis B and what it is and how to avoid it.
And I think that's great. So there's some good coming
from this.
Speaker 1 (33:48):
Yeah, And you know, and this is I think the
fundamental thing that both the media apparatus and the regime
are trying to conceal, which is that there are more
of us in the ear of them.
Speaker 3 (33:55):
M m.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
There always have been, and especially right now, there are
way more of us. And you know, their ability to
shape the world is disastrous, but their ability to shape
the world as fundamentally a minoritarian force in this country
right with like thirty to forty percent of the population
is always going to be limited and always is always
(34:18):
going to be in danger of simply being reversed. Yeah,
and we can be that reversal, one person.
Speaker 4 (34:25):
At a time. Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
Well, kymye, thank you for being on the show, and
go listen to House of Pod. It's great, it's all
thank you.
Speaker 3 (34:34):
Yeah, we're okay.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
You could do worse.
Speaker 6 (34:44):
It could Happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media.
For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website
Coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can
now find sources for it could Happen here. Listened to
direct episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.
It Could Happen Here News
Hosts And Creators
Robert Evans
Garrison Davis
James Stout
Show Links
AboutPopular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark
My Favorite Murder is a true crime comedy podcast hosted by Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark. Each week, Karen and Georgia share compelling true crimes and hometown stories from friends and listeners. Since MFM launched in January of 2016, Karen and Georgia have shared their lifelong interest in true crime and have covered stories of infamous serial killers like the Night Stalker, mysterious cold cases, captivating cults, incredible survivor stories and important events from history like the Tulsa race massacre of 1921. My Favorite Murder is part of the Exactly Right podcast network that provides a platform for bold, creative voices to bring to life provocative, entertaining and relatable stories for audiences everywhere. The Exactly Right roster of podcasts covers a variety of topics including historic true crime, comedic interviews and news, science, pop culture and more. Podcasts on the network include Buried Bones with Kate Winkler Dawson and Paul Holes, That's Messed Up: An SVU Podcast, This Podcast Will Kill You, Bananas and more.