Emilie Sennebogen Bryant on Sideways

Emilie and Chuck decided to go through the full catalog of one of their favorite filmmakers, the great Alexander Payne. We'll record and release these when we can, and get you started this week with our favorite Payne film, 2004's Sideways. Will we be drinking wine from the Santa Barbara region? You bet your ass we will be. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Movie Crush, a production of I Heart Radio. Hey,

(00:29):
welcome to Movie Crush. I'm Chuck Bryant. I'll be your
host today. Oh you don't want to be me? Yeah? Everyone.
We are at Pont City Market, the home studio, and
that is my lovely wife who you know by voice
by now I would imagine, right sure, Uh? And it

(00:50):
is morning, Uh it am. There is no wine being
poured right now. There's no wine being poured, but we
drank wine last night while we watched the movie add
a little bit too much, probably one glass too much.
And I'm a little that would explain some events of
the morning. Man, you asshole. I'm just saying friendly critique.
So I'm a little foggy. But um, I haven't started

(01:12):
drinking my latte yet. But we're here to do the
Filmmaker series as promised for a while now, and we're
going with Alexander Payne, one of our favorite favorite favorite filmmakers.
Delight to me, he's in the percent Club National Treasure
for sure. I think you're like you didn't love about Schmidt, right?

(01:33):
I like did I didn't? I mean I didn't madly
love it now, but I liked it a lot. I
did club for us totally. We even liked downsizing. I
loved Downsize. I thought the people who didn't like it
just didn't get it. So I totally agree. So, uh,
we decided to start with sideways. Um, just because we're
gonna jump around in sideways. I mean it's hard to

(01:55):
pick a favorite, but for better or for worse because
of how much we love wine and what it means
to us. Well, I'm living in California. It's all there. Yeah,
it's right up our alley, to our collective alley. So
that's what we started with. Everyone, I was stretching. You
held your arms up as if to say, I'm about

(02:17):
to talk stretching my wrists. All right, all right? So, um,
should we talk about Alexander Payne for a minute? Sure?
Did we see Citizen Ruth is his first film? Or
did we start with election and go backward? I'm trying
to remember. I feel like I watched Citizen Ruth when
I lived in my apartment on those vilas. Oh, we

(02:39):
might have watched it separately. Yeah, yeah, that was during
my like I f C and Channel I had to
have been, so I was not even living near you
at the time. I don't think I saw it in
ninety six, though I feel like I saw it like
on I f C And Sundance. Well, I guess it
would be late night. You know, that's when I moved
to California, So maybe sound election was I have a

(03:02):
feeling I went backwards. I don't know. I don't know
if I saw a citizen with first. But at any rate, um,
he just made an impression on me way early on.
With the one thing we both appreciate is just the
realism of his movies. Yes, his his sets are not
beautiful or there. It's real. He brings real people in.

(03:23):
He makes stuff look so so real, and that's almost
to the point that it takes you out of the
movie for a minute because you're like, wait, this isn't
polished at all, Like this looks like where this person
would live, this character, it's not glamy in the least. Yeah,
he's He talks a lot about using dirty cars, which
is something that you might not notice in movies, but
you don't see that a lot. And there's no neatly

(03:45):
curated kitchen counters. They're just full of shit. It's the
life layer layer that's come up a lot lately. Yeah,
from former guest Malory Coleman. We've been using that a
lot well because we've been putting our life layer all
over our house, leaving our DNA all over the um.

(04:07):
So yeah, the realism. He does dirty cars, and the
other thing he doesn't do that is typical is wet downs.
He does not do. We right, there's never a slick street. No,
it's never shiny. It's always everything's just covered in dirt.
And and I love that. Um. I love his real
people too. He is always casting real people around these actors,
and I feel like, I mean, you know, there were

(04:28):
a couple, a couple even in sideways where it's like
that person is no actor. Certainly the winery people were
all real because we met some of them. Yeah yeah, yeah,
but I was who was I thinking there was one
waitress maybe or something that I was like, yeah, she
didn't even see. I love it. I like it because
it is real. It is real, And I don't know.

(04:50):
He's like one of the great satirists. And his comedy
is dark, but not like it's not like a morbid comedy. No.
I like his take on things. He tackles kind of
hefty topics with some levity and yeah, and in fact
he actually, uh we watched some deleted scenes and there
was a deleted scene from Sideways where Miles hits a

(05:13):
dog in his car. I was in the bathroom during
that thing follows his dog into the woods following its whimper,
and then later there's a shot of the dog being
eaten by a buzzard and both of us are like,
that's not I mean, I know what got cut. That's
just not him. Pain doesn't do stuff. It wasn't cute,
that wasn't fun. There was nothing cute about that. And
it's weird that he shot it. Yeah, it's just not

(05:34):
his style. Well, and was it supposed to be like
a character of thing for Miles, Like you see this
other side of him, Like he's already, guys already had
a really ship week. Maybe that's it. It's just piling on,
you know, because he was devastated in the scene. Yeah,
we're way ahead of ourselves, all right, So we should
start off with the beginning, which is that great Let's

(05:54):
start at the very Oh we always sing on the
any episodes. So there you have it, um that beginning
opening bit with the that score. Alexander Pane also doesn't
use popular music. He always uses scores, which is great. Well,
I would like to add this was a note that
I made when I when I saw like the screen

(06:16):
pop up, I the marketing was pretty bad for this.
I remember when it was about to come out, the
trailer looked really hokey, with like that split screen stuff
and that kind of goofy score, which I've come to
love and appreciate. A part of the movie poster was
a little weird, Like I remember Virginia Madson looked really
like air brushed in really Yeah, there's the one with

(06:38):
a sideways bottle, and that even looked a little like
cartoony and weird. I just remember thinking that the hand
drawn one. I like it all now because I get
it and it fit with the movie, but like going
into it, I was like, oh, no, this movie is
weird and it might suck. Yeah, marketing doesn't always do
the best well, I think, if I remember, I think
you're right. I think the trailer tried to sell it

(06:59):
is a more like sort of mainstream comedy, which of
course they did. Yeah did you get a marketing guy
on an indie movie? And it's like, how are we going?
To package that. Yeah, I don't know, I just turned
into that old school keeping but that beginning bit like
I'm I talk a lot about on the show about
how efficient something can be, and it's set up and

(07:23):
during the opening credits you learn everything you need to
know about Miles from opening sequence of him running late
but not in any hurry. Yeah, but but still kind
of like there's like a chaos around him and where
he lives to move his car, he's in his house, goat, Yeah,
he's you know, he's in a hurry. And then you
see him on the toilet reading a book. Yeah, and

(07:44):
then he stops and gets a croissant spinach cissan um.
He's the guy who always pronounces everything exactly to pronounced. Yeah,
he's a bit of a pet ant, I think, Yeah,
But it's really like Alexander Paine is sort of a master.
I think, show don't Tell, and that sequence is just
sort of emblematic of what he's best at. I think

(08:05):
I was thinking though, too, like there's some other things
that came up, like what did you oh about them?
When he was explaining to Jack about the why the
Peanot noir was white and you know, great whatever it was,
and it kind of trailed off. It was you know,
like there were some wine lessons in this, but I
think they did it really well to where it wasn't like,

(08:27):
well here's the thing that you need to know. Well,
it was done through the lens. It was very cleverly
disguised as Miles is sort of wine pedantry and like
his obsession with getting everything just right with the wine.
It was like a really clever way to teach people
about wine. And then to counter that you had Thomas
Hayden Churches like, yeah, like that's neat. I like it everything. Yeah,

(08:49):
it's fine by me, tas good and boy, I hate
to say it, but like when we go to wineries,
it's there's sideways jokes flying all over the place, Like
how many times have you been in a winery with me?
And I've gone, I don't know, tastes good to me?
Or just a hint of eat any cheese and he's

(09:09):
got his finger doing the thing. Um, I think we
should at just certain points. I have favorite lines from
Jack Infy lines from the movie, but I know you
have heirs as well, but Jack and Thomas Aden Churches
is literally this is one of my favorite characters in
any movie I've ever seen. It was fantastic because he

(09:31):
really was that guy, like you know that guy. Man.
It's like he's handsome and a little bit has been
but you know, super full of himself, but also really sweet. Yeah,
and like just kind of want to have a good
time for ever. The adolescent. Yes, I mean if you
if you look beat for being in this movie. He
behaves like a twelve year old. Of course he does well,
especially the chasing of women, and the view on set

(09:52):
just has to get late, yeah or else, like his
life is, Yeah, I'm going to get my nut on
this job. He's so deadly serious about it. Well, and
it's so funny now, and like, you know, this was
what fifteen years ago, and it's like toxic masculinity about
as it can get with this constant like chasing tail

(10:14):
and that mentality of like I'm going to tap that,
I'm going to hit that. Look at that. You know,
it's even dated a little bit because yes, at one
point he says Miles, are you a homo? Which you
would like, you would never put that in a movie.
It was clearly fifteen years ago. Yeah, but I'm surprised
that's as far as he went with that stuff, like
they drew the line because he had to be likable. Yeah, well,

(10:34):
and he made it like they kind of made a
joke out of that too, Like he wasn't being he
wasn't like you're gay and your bad, but basically like
if you can't get women, then yeah, exactly, he was
being Jack. Yeah, it's weird that I'm defending him. I
just feel like I understood his intentions, and intention matters,
it does. So. I also thought that another great example
of show Don't Tell, just to set up, like crystallize

(10:55):
who these characters are, was the Champagne in the car
on the way up there. Yeah, when they finally get
on the road to Wine Country and and uh, Miles
is like, don't know, but it don't open. I've been
saving that this and that, and you know he's just
like yeah, He's like yeah, yeah, yeah, we'll wait, and
then he pops the top off they drink it warm.
It was like this, like really fabulous bottle you need

(11:16):
to know about about both of them. Yeah, in the
nature of how they are together. Yeah, Um, well, Miles
is limited and like has this like these deep boundaries
that he lives within and Thomas Hayden Church is like,
let's just have a party, man, let's make it fun,
like there aren't your rules don't apply to me? And
that I think would be his taglet that would is
what his autobiography would be called, what your roles don't
apply to Me? How many times as you say the

(11:38):
word party in the movie, So yeah, let's party. These
chicks ready to party. Um. And we also just to
step back. In the meeting with the parents, um, a
very important uh subplot is established, which is one of
two sort of through lines of destiny for Miles, which
is his book and whether or not that's going to

(11:58):
be and then his eventual like meeting with Victoria, his
ex wife, Like, these two things are the two things
that are lingering out there. I thought had not come
up at that point. Well no, no no, no, I'm saying,
those are the two things that he's going to have
to reckon with basically. And the book is introduced very
early on, in very early in that scene, it's established

(12:21):
that Miles is complicit in the lie that it's being published.
He never corrects Jack when Jack says it's being published,
which would be awkward, but he's never like, no, we
don't know yet for sure, he always goes along with
that lie. I think I never thought about it like that.
I really never thought about it like that. I thought
he was just like, well, I'm not going to get

(12:41):
into it, you know, like Jack is trying to like,
you know, pump him up, and you know, just like
it was easier to just let that stand. But maybe
you're right, maybe that they're in the back of his
mind that made him feel kind of successful. I don't know.
He clearly hates himself, like it's it's such a such
a character. Yeah, has there ever been like a more

(13:02):
just sort of Morrow. Yeah, he's so sad Sack. I mean,
no one else, but I'm not putting up with your
anxiety and your depression. Ship that we've has come into
our vernacular and that's in the lexicon of the Brian
except I think we used to say Nick had down

(13:23):
her bullshit. Yeah that's where id uh. And then they
get the one of my favorite sequences of the movie,
and one of the saddest sequences ever in movies, is
when they go to his mom's house on the way.
Oh God, it's just brutal, but not in a it's
in an Alexander payne Way sort of brutal. Yeah, it's
just so pathetic. Well, she's so needy and so delighted

(13:47):
for the companionship, even though they surprise her, and he
gives her that like that sad bouquet of flowers still
in the plastic for everything. He doesn't remember how old
he is. Remember right at the beer beginning, he was, Oh,
I don't know, seventy something. This is when they're getting
off the highway, so he doesn't know how his mom is.
He has the sad flowers. It's sad for everyone because

(14:09):
Jack is being revered as a superstar and he's drinking
that end. But that's not true either, tell me that true.
I love the part where he just sits down and
suddenly he's at his mom's house on her couch watching
the History Channel. Yeah, like you know, like that he
just goes right into that mode that he turns into
a teenager, like kind of just a surly teenager. Yeah,

(14:30):
and then we find out the reveal of why they
stopped here in the first place is to take money,
cash out of her. That's the whole drawer, like like
that's the final blow basically of that sad scene. Well,
actually not the final final blow. He steals the money,
which is brutally depressing. Oh yeah, and he's even depressed
doing it, but it does. That's awful. That's the whole thing.

(14:52):
It's just like, well, that's when you see the picture
of him in Victoria. First. That's the final blow. As
he looks up in that piano twinkles score on all
the sad moments. It's just so great. And he sees
the picture of he and his dad, which, by the way,
that's interesting. Well, and you realize later as the kind
of tortured character in his novel, right, that's part of

(15:13):
that flashback. You see three pictures, well four pictures. You
see he and his dad, you see his young parents married,
you see his sister and her family. And then finally
that wouldn't him on his wedding day. And it's just
like a gut punch. And then the final blow is
when she the mom, offers him money. Yeah, that was
like the last word. She says, any money. And I

(15:35):
think that that's kind of funny though that was so
sad that that was funny. That was kind of that
like that's Alexander Paine little like, well, that's you know, um,
and we should point out to you said he was
watching TV. There are three there's a trio of shots
of the television in this movie and the channel the
first one let's just name them as they come, but

(15:56):
the first one is Hitler, uh right, yeah, which is
Alexander Pyne again, just talking like a slide joke, I think.
So we're leaving his mom's house. Well, they get so
she really wants him to like actually spend her birthday

(16:18):
with her, and so he gets up in bales at
like six am, you know, like walks out the door
like it's so slimy. It's a really scuzzy move. Yeah.
All right, here's another Thomas adan church line. Um. There
in the diner right after this, and he goes he's
talking about Miles and like the fact that he needs
to get laid and stuff like that. And he says, well,

(16:39):
I say fuck therapy and what's that stuff you take
xan X. I say fuck that too. You need to
get your joint worked on, Miles. I mean that's the
answer for him. It's like like have random sets and
life will be better. Well, and he doesn't. Um. They
do a lot of talking to each other, but they
never hear each other because all they do is so,

(17:00):
you need to do this, you need to do that,
and the other one. And Paul Giamati is just going
like that doesn't do anything for me. This is like, well,
but that's why he keeps thinking like, you haven't seen
the light. If you just do this, your life will
be better. I kept thinking too. They both agreed on
this trip. Each of them had their own idea of
what the other person needed, but it was the trip
that they each wanted. So they each took the trips

(17:20):
like together, but separate the one that they wanted. It's
like they don't know each other at all, I know,
or don't care, or they're rutally sad. Line at the
end of the movie, we're just freshman year roommates. He
was my freshman It's like that really got that line
is just so sad. But they do, I mean, with
all of the crazy events that get packed in and

(17:41):
that's you know, twenty minutes, they do have a bond
and they do kind of get each other. And you know,
Miles is so morose and it is good for him
to be around somebody who doesn't take things quite as seriously.
I think everyone has those friends that are like some
of your oldest friends sometimes that you know each other
so well, they do become like family. Yeah. Yeah, so
it's like your brother, not your friend anymore from all

(18:04):
the formalities such that it's just like even expectations of
what an adult friend looks like. And it's just comfort
it is. It's like family. Yeah, it's nice, it's comforting.
But you can also, like I think, fall into the
trap of taking that for granted. And I think that's
what happens with these guys to a certain degree. Um.

(18:24):
So they finally get to their first winery at Stanford,
which we've been to Sanford, We've talked to Chris and
it's kind of neat. And this was pre sideways right, No,
we went right after side because I think we intentionally
went to some of the ones. Okay, yeah, and it's
since become one of our favorite areas. Santa Barbara and

(18:45):
that wine country is just like it's beautiful, that's rolling,
just sleepy hills and all the vineyards and well, what
do I always say every time we go to a winery, say,
winery doesn't grow in ugly places and other places. Yeah,
wine grows on um. Yeah, that's why wineries are great,
because it's always in the middle of some beautiful Yeah.

(19:08):
No matter what time of year it is, and no
matter where in the world you are, you know it's
going to be great. It's not like I guess you
could grow urban wine. That's the new hipster company. Of course,
straight up downtown Atlanta Grapes is going straight up the
side of a building. You're welcome anyone who went abroad
that idea. Oh, I've been given out freebies for years.

(19:28):
I'm just gotta get used to it. Um. So it
is funny to me. It occurred to me last night
after seeing this movie a dozen or more times at least, uh,
that this is a a road trip comedy about two
buddies having their bachelor party week basically, and it's nothing
like that the Anti that really in so many ways,

(19:49):
which again is Alexander Paine's sort of mastery of the
tongue in cheek thing. Yeah, because if you sold it
to me like that, I'd be like, yeah, I'm not interesting.
I know it sounds like it could. I mean, this
could have been such a bad movie, right, Um. But
he always uses a book usually as source material. Allah
Kubrick this was a book. Oh, I don't think I
knew that. Yeah, he and his writing partner, Um, we

(20:10):
should shout him out. Jim Taylor Election was a book. Um,
I think most all of his have been books. I
don't know about Citizen Ruth or maybe that was so
they optioned the rights. I didn't realize that. Yeah, yeah,
he always finds a book. Kubrick did the same thing.
Isn't either cloud through books until he found one that
he thought would be a good movie. It's not a
bad way to be no, I mean, you know, it's

(20:32):
like a proven concept, especially if you're short on ideas
like Kubrick and Alexander Bay. Yeah, dummies. Um so when
they we finally get to meet Maya, which is a
character we both just adore. Well, okay, so let's talk
about Virginia Madson for a second. So she had been
gone for a while, but she was in a couple

(20:54):
of my very favorite eighties movies. All right, let's hear
him Fire with Fire with Chraig Schaffer. Love that movie,
loved it. I haven't seen it, Craig Scheffer. Yeah. And
then Modern Girls. Do you I feel like I forced
you to watch Modern Girls Cynthia Gibb, Daphne Zuniga, um,

(21:18):
what's his name? He was like in a bunch of
eighties movies. Oh I didn't see Modern Girls. Oh god,
I loved this, Like I psychotically love this movie. It
had a kick ass soundtrack like britt pop um, just
wonderful soundtrack. It was about like these three girls in
l a what's his name? Right? Remember we saw him

(21:39):
at the movies, right, Yeah? Yeah, I mean I loved
this movie. And these were all just like these eighties
like what happened to Cynthia Gibbs. She was huge for
a minute and you know the left, Yes she's darling.
But I loved this movie, like love Love Love, and
it's crazy. Then Virginia Mason just kind of disappeared. So

(21:59):
she is in more. She was in a lot of stuff,
but it was kind of low profile. But yeah, it
felt like she she went away from the mainstream, of course,
but and she was very mainstream, like she was a
girl back then. That's um so such a great role
for her. It was a beautiful role for her to
come back. And maybe you're right, maybe she hadn't gone away.
But same with Thomas aiden Church, like he'd both of them.

(22:21):
This was kind of like a re emergence into the scene,
into like bigger roles. Yeah, I mean you get a
lot of credit in an Alexander pain film, I think totally.
Plus our performances were great. Yeah, she's great. I mean,
my is so like, she's so grounded, she's you know,
like her apartment, Like we both just go crazy, like
see the inside, the outside, magnificent, the exactly. Well, it's

(22:44):
funny and it's in start contrast to where Miles lived.
Like she, you know, she's got this beautiful walk up
and the Santa Barbara Hills, and he lives in the
int essential yeah, like kind of low rent, so cal
Sea Breeze, built like Art Deco sixties. I mean that's

(23:04):
they're all over. No not yeah, thats just that like
really noticeable apartment style. Yeah. But anyways, I was really
excited to see her, and she really is she's the
most adult of all of these people. She is, she's
the one warm and so grounded, yeah, and just lovely

(23:25):
and smart and well it's funny because he like writes
her off as just some waitress and it turns out
she's just really like, you know, studied smart. One of
the parts that kind of bugs me every time I
see it, And that's the only thing this movie that
bugs me, I think is later on when they then
we'll get to that scene. It's one of our favorite
sequences when they're back at Stephanie's house hanging out eating

(23:48):
insane cheeses. In US, we say that, um, yeah, where
those people aren't we guess? I know? But usually it
just me and news and we don't have to be
judge for that. Yeah, that's true. Uh. Is when she's
talking about wine, are they taste? They taste a wine?
And she gives her impression and he's really like shocked

(24:11):
and surprised. I mean in a sweet way, but it's
sort of like today, it kind of reeked of this
sort of male yea, like oh my, well, you do know,
and she thanks him for complimenting her palette, which is
I guess all okay, I just I don't know. It
kind of has a stink on it to me. I
totally I see what you're saying. But he'd already also

(24:32):
dismissed her very coldly at the restaurant, like what am
I gonna do? Like some waitress from Bulton, you know? Like, yeah,
so there was that. So we had already kind of
scorned her and then she reveals himself. But I felt
like she I don't feel like she was like, oh
thank you, Like she was like I found her. I
have a really sharp palette. And when he was like,
do you want to work in a wine and she

(24:53):
was like maybe, she wasn't Like I feel like she's
confident in her wine knowledge. For sure, she's confident in
her life. She's going after this math stars like she
didn't need his approval. I thought very differently, and that's
why he liked her. He's he's very he's just a mess.
He well he is, but he's also very brainy and cerebral,

(25:14):
and he needs somebody that can meet him on that level.
He's not looking for you know, yeah, yeah, for sure,
um fun. He needs somebody who can yeah and challenge him.
The way they dole out the personal details too, is
just so deft, I think, um, because just it's always
just like a single line. If you're not paying attention,

(25:35):
you miss out on something real big um. And for
her it's uh later on when he's dishonest and we'll
get to this too, But about the fact that Jack
was getting married and she's so mad, and she says,
I just spent three years trying to get out of
a relationship that was basically dishonest. And that's just one line.

(25:59):
That's all you know. But that's all you need to
know about who she is. She is wounded and then
the line first, but has rebuilt her life and is
moving forward. And yeah, she only makes a couple of
comments about her at No, I know, it's really like sly, yeah,
but understated. Yeah, it's not like she's not sitting here.
She's not an open wound. He's like you asked her.

(26:20):
And then she's talking for thirty minutes about her divorce
and she's really trying to move on with her life.
But but that's also why like she needs to meet
she I think she takes her time with him and
thinks he's safe and then find that he's And again
it's that thing. He doesn't he's not actively lied, but
he's lied by a mission. Well that's which technically is deception.

(26:41):
Since we're talking about that scene, is how appropriate is
her reaction appropriate? I think totally, because yeah I do.
I used to think it was too much because like
he you know, he did tell her the truth in
the end, and but then the more I've seen the movie,
I'm like, no, especially if it's a trigger for her, Like, well,
he's left with her before telling her and he said

(27:03):
I almost told you, and she said, but you wanted
to fuck me and that was just the case. No,
I don't think that's the case. Unfair, but it's but
she gets to her own personal you know, she doesn't
have to see his side, like he participated in this thing.
And meanwhile, her friend has been taken for a ride,
you know, like she's like thinks she's got this whole

(27:24):
new life and this whole new guy and he's at
her daughter and you know, like it's really and this
has happened in this short amount of time and he's
coming and just like blown this up. So she's she
has every right to be like, how could she participate
in that? Yeah, God, it's so good. Um, oh, well
Jack's line. I might as well go ahead and say
it because it changed the movie for me last night
after seeing it a hundred times. Is Jack we learned

(27:49):
that Miles cheated? Right? Which that was a bit is key?
It is, so it's such a quick line. Yeah, when
Jack says, remember remember the bad times with Actoria. She
made you feel small and that's why you cheated. And
it's like boom, there it is right. He wasn't left
because he was a sad man. He cheated and yeah,

(28:10):
and that's a big deal. That changes everything. It does.
You're right, and that does. I mean that is a
bit of a like a character flaw on this like
so so no longer his life just happening to him
in this sad way, like actively participated in sending his
life in his direction down the tubes and he has
to live with that. And for somebody like him, I
bet torment. And I mean so many other less uh

(28:32):
lesser filmmakers and writers. I think with hammer Home, all
this stuff with Maya's X and his ex and it's
just a boom, a little line and I don't know,
there's so much trust. I think that Alexander Payne puts
in the audience and I just love that from a filmmaker. Well,
but that's also indie filmmaking. Don't spell it out. Sometimes

(28:53):
there's like more though, you know, no indie sensibilities. I
guess it's like I tossed around indie. Wait, it's a
but he still has his indie sensibilities where he's not
he's not spoon feeding his audience. Aren't these big romantic
you know it's real, it is, but yeah, I mean
it's real as movies get um so two more, Thomas said,

(29:14):
there are jacklines that I love real quick. Uh. After
meeting Maya, she's jamming out. We know guys like this,
Yeah a little bit. Yeah, he's constantly commenting on women
and how they look and you know, god, yeah, that's
all that is he sees. That's how he sees the world.
And then the other one when they're walking back when

(29:36):
she came into the bar, she was she was not
wearing a ring. She was SNGs rocks rock. Um God,
he's just so juvenile but funny. It's funny. Yeah, it
is funny, and like he it's kind of a complex
character too, because he is he's like this, like there
is that toxic male nous of like you're not a

(29:58):
man if you're not doing this. But also he's his
biggest like cheerleader, like you can do that. You know,
he's constantly like your money, baby, your money. You know,
it's like the equivalent of that constantly Yeah, in swingers.
He's constantly trying to like pump him up, like the
fact that he's dealing with this insecure wreck. I don't
truly believe that he believes in him. I don't think
he's just saying it. I think you really think, But

(30:21):
I think he's he's a kind of guy that it
just he's a simpleton. He simplifies everything. Well he that's yeah,
it's very things are very yeah, because like when they're
talking about the book, he was like, you know, you
should just self publish it, which is actually good advice. Yeah,
I was thinking idea. Yeah, but but him is just
thatteen years ago though too, like it's way more. Well
that's true. Yeah, yeah, Well he's constantly wrecking things and

(30:45):
then offering to pay for it too, you know, like
oh yeah yeah. Like like he decides to go hang
out with um Stephanie and her daughter, He's like, oh,
here's the money for the golf game I was supposed to.
I was so mad at him for he was a
very bad friend in that scene. Well, there's a girl
code I remember in like, you know, college, like you

(31:06):
don't get your friends for the guy that you just met,
Like you stay with your friends and hang out and
you know, like, I imagine that's super cool. That's not cool, man,
Now that he was a very bad friend that day, Yeah,
that was like super super shitty. But he also made
it clear that he had one, you know, agenda item
for this trip and he was check check, check. She

(31:28):
looks like an animal, Miles. Everything is through the lens
of sex for him, which you know that blows up
in his face. Literally, what did you think. We're just
kind of jumping around now, but what did you think
of the scene where he breaks down at the end
and when he loses the wedding rings and he's like,

(31:49):
I can't lose my wife, like she's all I got,
and that really it's the only time you see him
like that. I had always that scene had always gotten
to me, But last night I was like, is he acting? No? No, no, no,
I don't think no. I kind of wondered for a minute. Well,
but here's the thing. Well, it's funny because that the
one line that we were laughing about. He was like,
I'm an actor. I'll have is my instinct, you know,

(32:09):
like you can't take that away from me. So I
was thinking, like, what would it be like to be
with somebody who acts like, how do you know what's
real and what's not? Like, in his mind, that was
all very real. He was feeling those feelings, you know,
like if he's constantly just following his instincts, that's what
leads him away. But also he did believe that. But
I think it's it's kind of like Ruby, like our
three and almost four year old, you know, the mercurial,

(32:32):
like like she's hysterically upset about something and then literally
thirty seconds later is Belly laughing. Well, he calls him.
I mean, I love that they re used. This are
one of our favorite lines from Jack. He says, you're
an infant, which is our famous Husbands and Wives from
Husbands and Wives. Um, but I was wondering, like I

(32:53):
believe it was real too. But you could almost have
shot an alt take where he does that. Miles turns
around and Tom a Saiden Church kind of laughs or something.
But he'd also just run naked through. But we were
dying because he ran from Yeah, like he was not
like five clicks. He ran five miles naked in the

(33:13):
dark and probably cold, the desert gets pretty cold at night,
and through what was in an Ostrich farm or something.
The suckers are me And that's when that's the only
time in the entire movie when Miles legitimately like gets
a good chuckle. Yeah. And it wasn't like he laughed
because like, oh, that's funny, this happened to you. I
think it was more like this. It's absurd, like this

(33:37):
he went home after getting with the ship. We haven't
even talked about that, but getting the ship beat out
of him by the one woman he screwed over, goes
and sleeps with another and gets run out by her.
I mean it is it's absurd. It's like how big
an idiot do you have to be? But also what
I feel like that shows is he is this kind
of insecure guy, like who's he always needs to be
validated by women, So it's like, you know, he's not

(34:00):
like this together guy. Now they're both insecure in their
own ways. They're both sad in their own ways. Like
Thomas Adan Churches that has been acted role on a soap,
Derek summers By that he's still claim to fame that
and like really discharge going to do the sad thing
where he goes to work for his father in law. Yeah,

(34:21):
but he's not, Hey, I don't want to knock that. No,
but he's trying to pump it up. He still wants
to be an actor, but he's like, you know, it's
the right thing to do. Like he's constantly he's trying
to pump himself up the way he's trying to pump
Miles up. But you know, he's never going to act again.
He's going to go work for his father in law
and that's his life. Well, and I think what he's
facing down is this kind of responsible maturity that he's

(34:43):
not ready for. And probably we've known guys like that
never really will be you know, he's still chasing the tree. No,
probably not. I was feeling terrible for his fiance and
you know, who's from this Armenian family of you know,
where family is really important and probably you know, like
pretty much like rules of how you product herself. And

(35:03):
then she's married this kind of like loose canon guy
who is basically because he's charming duel um another Thomas
Saydan Church line one of my favorites. After he meets Stephanie, well,
she has the great line, I know I need to
be spanked, and this is like from that point for
what um. But right after he meets her, this girl Stephanie,

(35:25):
she has got it all going on, and then Myles says,
she's cute, cute, she's fucking hot. Yeah, I know. It's like,
I mean, well, and that showed her character too, because
Myles is being such a ship at that winery. He's
you know, and she's like handling him like a pro,
like pro. Yeah, but she agrees with him. I thought
that was interesting when he dumps the thing she was

(35:48):
like And by the way, I agree with you about
the I've come to expect nothing from cab Frank and
this one is no different. Um. This is a point
where we learn and this is you know, how I
to chart out my plot points. Yeah, because screenwriter, it's
always positive, like thirty five minutes in um, to spin

(36:08):
us into attitude. We get We learned that Victoria's married
or has been married, and Yea is now married because
there was Sun's rock, there was back and forth. But no, no, no,
not that that's my oh Victoria's because that's what sends
him miles down this like spiral and literally running down

(36:31):
a hill, chugging a bottle of wine, which is it's
it's so sad. But it's also really really funny, like
what a ridiculous He literally like choose the top, pulls
the cork out with his teeth, and it's running down
this hill in one country, glug like with a bottle
of wine. It's such a Alexander Payne staple because you're
laughing and laughing, and within the same scene, it makes

(36:54):
that transition from funny to like gut puns pathos because
at the end they're old guys. He run he can't
run through a winery a supposed to be in their
thirties way well, but he's he's not in shape him.
He saw how he was doubled over breathing him. That's
the implication. But I'm just, you know, objected to Uh.
I think they're in their forties. We'll do the method,

(37:18):
but he uh. Then he stops and they're both like
doubled over out of breath, and that score starts again.
And it's just there's so many beautiful shots that sneak
up on you because Alexander Paine's not flashy, but there's
so many gorgeous shots that well, it's like, how can
it not be again country? But there's also the walking
down the Highway in Buleton, you know what I mean,

(37:40):
like the parts of wine Country where they stayed and
where they ate. No, it's very blue collar. Every time
we go to wine country, we're always just like, it's
not bougie. It's theres not California. Yeah, I mean Napa
more so, but it's you know, well, there can be
bougie ship. But you know most wineries there's like a
goat walking through the tasting room or something like that.
That's why at least a dog. Yeah, oh yeah, winery

(38:04):
dogs are the best. Um, I know, because they'll just
like remember Emily and I went on horseback riding through
a winery and there were dogs. There were dogs that
just walks with us. I love the ship of those dogs. Well,
and then they just took off, and of course I
got stressed. I'm horseback riding through wine country, like, where's
the dog, where's the dog? Where's the dog? I know?

(38:25):
They have so much freedom. Yeah, those dogs have hundreds
of acres to row right now. Well, and they just
showed up and never left too. They didn't technically like
belong to anybody. They're like, hey, I'll just live here.
That's cool. So uh, then we get a very important sequence,
which is the first double date of two, and it's
really like, as a viewer, you're like, this is miles chance.

(38:47):
He has this really great chance with a great woman,
but he's also this is his own worst enemy. Well,
but also this is he this is the day that
well victorious to tell that, and we find out later
that Myles kind of thought that there'd be a shot
for them down the red you know. So it's like,
so it's like the end of his hope and then
it was probably false hope. It sounds like, well, it's

(39:08):
like the book, those two subplots mirror one another. Just
linger in there and the hope there's still at least
when there's no resolution, there's a little bit of hope.
But he gets shut down on both ends on this trip.
Like it's it's a lot. It is a lot, especially
for a guy who's already kind of like kicked and
you know doubt. Well, we'll talk more about hope later.
But they have this great dinner and Miles is his

(39:31):
own worst enemy. He don't don't go to the dark side. Yeah,
what is he? Oh, that's that's my favorite line I
think of. If they want to drink Merlow or drinking
mer Low. I'm not drinking fucking Merlow. I mean, we
said that for years and it's funny. I like, I don't.
I've never really loved Merlow, but I probably. I bet.
I wonder if the Merlow industry took a hit from

(39:54):
statistic Yeah, I do right here. I mean, it's not
the best red grape if you ask me. It's funny
because it really like, I'm always like, I'm not sucking
drinking Low. Wait. In two thousand nineteen, it was announced
it Sideways was scheduled to be adapted for a Broadway musical,
What No Are you fucking kidding me? Why not? Souls? Rock? Wine? Wine?

(40:19):
Wine Wine. Following the film's US release, Marlow sales dropped
two percent and peanut noire sales increased six in the
Western United States. UH two thousand nine studies from Sonoma
State found that Sideways slowed the growth of Marlow sales
volume and causes price to fall, but the film's main
effect on the wine industry was arise in the sales

(40:39):
volume and price of peanut noir in overall and in
overall wine consumption. Isn't that crazy? That is crazy? And
they said possibly a four million dollar loss in Marlow
over a decade, and it said, however, even the people
that did the study admit that that is speculative's study. Yeah,
but I mean it had to. It put a dent

(41:00):
in it. Well, it goes to show how much popular
culture a fact the market not drinking any fucking Merlow
drinking any I always said fucking drinking mellow. So last
night I realized I was saying that was it backwards? Yeah,
who cares? I'm doing it my way. And in the
you yeah, I know, shock uh. And in the in
the date scene, it's funny when they they're first making
the small talk. It's the way their conversations mirror, Like

(41:23):
Jack and and Maya or I mean Maya and Miles
are already talking about wine kind of deeply, and Jack
is asking Stephanie about her side work. Yeah, but well
about her day, like what's your day like? And she's like,
you know, I just like put the glasses away. And
you know, it's so true to the character it is,
but they're really suited for each other too. She's pretty

(41:45):
like she's easy going and partying, you know, like she
likes to keep it pretty simple. Yeah, I was thinking too,
you know, she's a single mom, and you know, I'm
I doubt working in the tasting room pays a lot,
so she's you know, although she has a kickouse wine collection,
so that could be like one of them ysperity and

(42:06):
somebody like handed her. I was thinking, she's pretty you know,
like up with life, despite the fact that she probably
doesn't have. Being a single mom isn't easy, and I
presume there's no doubt in the picture she's we kind
of have know people like that California Like, it's that
California vibe. It is that California vibe. But we love

(42:26):
another favorite line from Jack after the dinner, come on, Miles,
we need to kick it up a notch. I know,
he's always trying to ratchet at everything. Is like, how
can we get this party going, man, which they do
the minute they get back to our house. It's like
the minute he walks in there like to hook up. Yeah,
they didn't even hang out. Yeah. Well, and that brings

(42:47):
us to like, I think for both of us, probably
maybe our favorite sequence of the movie, as it's Stephanie's
house and that hang when Miles and Maya talk about wine. Yeah,
and the first, well, and it's funny too because the
way his like, because she's like, why are you so
into pino? Like what's what's it? And his description of

(43:08):
the grape is so wonderful. I know, he I wrote
some stuff down. Also he is the pinot grape. But
also I was thinking maybe in two thousand five I
found that charming. But I was also like, oh god, yeah,
like you're a project man, get your ship together. My
doesn't need a project, you know. And I mean he
made pinot noir sound like a grape, sound like a project,

(43:31):
which is nice for a grape, but not necessarily for
a person. But it was it was interest. I was
having all of these thoughts about what a lovely but
he says, um, where is it? This is why I
don't do notes. I can't find it hunting and brilliant,
thrilling and subtle, you know, like this writer's brain discussing.

(43:52):
It was great that he has such an affinity for
and a connection with. Yeah, it's interesting, I think, Well,
first of all, there's a lot of metaphors lying around,
uh about the pino and like he is a pinot grape,
very tender and delicate, needs a lot of care. And
then there's just coax. It's full potential, yeah, which he's
never going to reach. But he's also a caretaker. Um.

(44:17):
That's not as cute about scenario in two nineteen um.
And then there's the metaphor I think of the sixty
one shovel blanc um because she's this is his prized
wine in the collection and right or past its peak,
she says, And I'm like, interesting, because he's not a
shovel blank, he's not this. He's never peeked, he's never peaked.

(44:38):
But this wine that he has, it's emblematic. I think
of who he is that he's holding onto it. Yeah,
of course because again for never yeah, well but for
this this perfect experience because he said, you know, like
he was saving it to drink with his wife or whatever,
had anything worth celebrating with this beautiful bottle of wine.

(44:59):
But now that's been going on for so long that
the wine might not even be good anymore. I know.
It's so like God, that's good writing. It is. It's good,
so good. They're pretty good at then. And then Maya's
but that's what that is my favorite part of that.
So when he when she talks about well, the way
they each talk about wine is really interesting because hers

(45:21):
is very personal and emotional and his is a little
more Hers is very romantic, his is a little more cerebral, right,
which is more spiritual. I think the way she talks
about it because she's like, I discovered I had a
really sharp palette, and that's where I feel like she
was like she knows what she's got at and she
didn't need his approval. Approval all um, but she you know,

(45:44):
she started talking about I liked what I what I
was thinking about when I drank the wine, and like
was the sunshining that day? Did it rain that year?
What were the people like who picked the grapes? And
you know, like if it was an old bridal maybe anymore. Yeah,
it's a very spiritual like connected to the land and
the people. You know. That really appealed to me. I'm like, well,

(46:04):
that beautiful first person shot of her just kind of
looking right at camera, it's just well, she's really yeah,
she's kind of like talking to him, she's really looking
at him, which and then remember so she finishes and
she's kind of in thought. He just snaps into well,
you know, but what's her last line though? Remember it's
really it's just tastes so fucking good, yeah, which is

(46:28):
so great. It's like she talks all romantically and then
her last line is just like she drops an fs
just like it just tastes so fun. Yeah, like boom,
that's you know, that's the simplest part of why people
enjoy wine. And he's in it, and like that was
the kiss moment and he blows it and then just
sends him into a like so awkward. But also I
was thinking that didn't have to be the kiss moment

(46:50):
for well, but that's not it was though, because he
goes to the bathroom and it's like you fucking you know,
come on, man, like he pumps himself up and he
goes out and then has the most awkward kiss in
movie history in the kitchen. Well, but that's the problem too,
because it didn't have to be his kiss moment. That
could have just been a connection between them. But he's
got Jack in the back of his head, like he

(47:11):
screwed it up. You can could have nailed or you
could have done it. I don't know that's what she
wanted out of it either. Like they both are trying
to get to know each other and then it tries
to do the thing that's not natural, but she gives him.
She kind of rejected gently rejects him. Yeah, but I
don't think I was that scene to me last night,
Like she's not rejecting him, she's rejecting that in that moment,
right because it was wrong because she don't get him

(47:32):
a really sweet hug I thought she made she tried
to make. I think, yeah, very much. So she tried
to like she was like, this isn't gonna happen right now,
but she didn't. She wasn't trying to hurt him or yeah, boy,
this is that sequence just so well acted. It's like
a masterclass. Like I'm not an actor, but that would

(47:52):
be like I would use that ship for auditions, totally
like her soliloquy. Yeah, but her kindness is what he
needs more than anything. He because he's terrible to himself
and he has so much pressure external in internal. He
needs somebody who can just be kind to him. And
you know, yeah, yeah, for sure. The life of Wine

(48:12):
soliloquy is what I call that because that's how she
enters it. She says, I think about the life of
the Wine. I love that. Oh, I know the moment
too that I've never really noticed is she's doing this
her life of the wine uh speech. And then and

(48:34):
then what freaks him out? She has his hand. Oh
does she reach over? And the camera just reveals that
there's an insert shot where it shows that she has
has been holding his hand while or not holding but
hand is on top of his hand while she's saying this.
And then he snaps out and sort of notices that,
and it's just like the you know, yeah one. You know,

(48:58):
I also like reestling and yeah, yeah, it's like it's
like the sweet Lately, I've been getting into reasonings. Um.
So then he goes with Stephanie for the day and
we get I think one of the sattest lines in
movie history is when Miles goes to the store and says,
can I get a barely legal? And then he goes,

(49:19):
oh no, no, no, the new one. Yeah. Yeah. He's
just sitting there with his glasses on, you know, like
reading it like you know, like my dad used to be,
like I replayboy for the articles, you know. But then
he wakes up like invigorated, and remember he passes out
a bit. He wakes up and it's like I'm gonna
go find I'm gonna do this, like like she gave
him just enough of a you know, like an inn.

(49:42):
But then she's not there and he drinks himself into
a stupor, and you know, I was like, oh my god,
walking down that busy highway. It's so depressing. But his
drunk walk was so believable. Of course it was. That's
why it was super depressing, because he just got slammered
and walked down the highway. Uh. So then we get
our second double date, which is the out out in
Wine Country together, which is just like everything we love

(50:03):
about going to Wine Country, like encapsulated. Yeah, the montage
of like being in the barrel room in the fields
and yeah, like I want that day. I want that
day today. Man, unbelievable. Oh and this also sets up
sort of one of the recurring motifs, which is which
direction his car turns out of that one rose. They
do that a few times because they turn separately to

(50:27):
go to Stephanie's or Maya's or no, at leaving Stephanie's,
it's left to Maya's house, right to the windmill. Yeah,
and then it happens like three times, and I think
the last one is at the wedding reception or after
the wedding. Everyone's turning right to go to the reception
and to go drink his wine at McDonald's. God, but
we forgot about the novel. So when he's like, they're leaving,

(50:49):
and she gets out to make sure he knows where
he's turning and you, and he says, you want to
read my novel. So hands are like the manuscript in
a box, and she's like thanks. It's like wait a minute,
and hands are a whole other box. So, you know,
the sucker is like a thousand pages, which is a
joke that we've loved in another favorite movie of ours,
Wonder Boys. Wonder Boys sort of the same gay of

(51:10):
like the thousand pages when somebody's like, is that single
space and it's like, yeah, it's like the like the
book that they can't stop writing. There's so much in
their head and they don't know how to be choosy,
and yeah, they have to get these thoughts out. But
the Tarantinos, Oh God, that guy. Uh and then right

(51:31):
on cue again with about thirty minutes to go. Once again,
it spends us into the third act when he busts
jack Um. You know, the big scene where he says,
you know, we've got to get back for the rehearsal
dinner and he's all of a sudden, oh, when it
slips out, Yeah, she has um, which also was one

(51:54):
of my favorite lines from Maya when she's mad and
she goes, do you have any idea what he's been
telling Singer she's the only woman who never rocked his world,
and Miles says, I'm sure he believed every word of it. Yeah,
and that's the important thing is, Yeah, he's created this
escape fantasy, you know, like he feels really Jack feels

(52:14):
really stifled by going into this new life with one woman,
and so he's created this escape patch basically. But two,
he's that guy. He's in this family all of a sudden,
he's putting the daughter to bed, he's hanging out with
her mother like he you know, like men who kind
of just like slong onto a new family. Everyone's seen

(52:35):
that really like a thing that some men can do. Yeah,
so strange it is. It's really weird to like want
to be that untethered to familiarity. I don't know, but
then tether yourself immediately, yeah to another thing. Yeah, I mean,
could there be any deeper insecurity than that, like the
new because it's new, because that's what he says at

(52:57):
one point, she smells different different. Yeah, he needs that
new because he gets to keep being new, because you know,
someone gets to know you for a while and you're like,
you know, you get to see the words well and like,
I don't know. Some people either put value in the
rewards of forever together, which are great and they're downsides,

(53:18):
or some people it's all about the new and they don't.
They just they're wired that way. Like we know people
like this. They can't help it. They can't help it
that it's like the brain jolts. What's it called the
chemical that makes your brain Yeah, like a dopamine head,
Yeah it is. It's like a constant dopamine head of
like fresh love, new love, new things like that's it's

(53:40):
becomes like a drug. Yeah, totally. It's a good way
to describe it. Um. So then they meet back up
at the hotel, and this is actually very sweet scene
the way Jack reacts to thinking Miles got laid, which
he did, Yeah, but he doesn't say, and he like
he hugs him over to the bed and lays on
and then it jumps on it. He's the very sexual again.

(54:01):
It's like, that's like how he's acting and guinea details.
I love details, and he won't give him any. And
that's what he's like. You didn't even they have disgusted
it if he had it out, that hadn't like, but
he never comes clean about that. He manages to outing Jack.
Yeah that kills me to him, I know, but it's
so funny how smoothly he does that too, Like remember yeah, yeah, um.

(54:25):
This is also the scene where we get our second
TV shot. So the first time watching Girls Gone Wild? Yeah,
so then golf was the second. Yeah, okay. When Miles
is laying in bed with find that about Victoria, that's right,
he's watching golf and Jack and Jack is watching like MTV.
Yeah yeah, it's like girls in bikini's jumping up and

(54:46):
down like that's what he has on. I know. Oh
my god. Uh. And then the it just ship starts
spinning out of control when they go to Frast Canyon,
the big a corporate winery. Yes, and this is where
the first nail in the coffin uh comes when Miles

(55:08):
learns that his book is not being published. Well, he
decides in the midst of all of this crisis to
go call his agent. Well, he said, he's been calling obsessively,
so yeah, we just finally see it. Yeah, and uh yeah,
his book didn't get published. And that's when the fucking
one of the most cringe. I still can barely watch that.

(55:29):
You're like, na, oh my god, when he takes the
poor bucket and well, so he goes to get a
poor and they give him a little wine tasting core
and that's even a small poor. That guy it was
a small port. And then the second one it was
a corporate port. But then the guy yeah, because you know,
like if you get to know the person point, they'll
us up the place of the goat exactly. But so

(55:49):
then the second poor is even a little more stingy,
and he was like, can I just get a glass?
Like I'll pay for it. So he's not trying to
be like, he's not trying to take advantage, but it's
got this corporate guys like nope, that's not how we
do think are So that he grabs the thing and
pours it, which would it made sense with that poor spot,
but whatever, we'll let that slide. Was a single poor spot. Yeah,
but he gets like a glug glug glug porn. Then
they're fighting over it and it gets all over him,

(56:10):
and then he grabs the poor Bucket and just starts
like like pouring it over his head like a cooler.
It's like, it's I just want to crawl out of
my skin every time. Most people know what a poor
bucket is, but basically it's the wine that nobody wants.
So it's a combination of all of the wines that
they people and their spit and it's like a you know,
a couple of gallons of it's usually like the bottom

(56:33):
of the wine, so there's backwash, and it's like he
starts drinking, like gulping out of it. It's I'm getting
a little nauseous, so bad, and to gum off the
floor like that would be cleaner. But it's interesting with Jack.
He's he vacillates in this movie between great friend and
terrible friend. You can be a real ship. And he's

(56:53):
he's immediately man, he sees, he hears what goes on,
and he's fucking on it and he is dragging Jack
out of there, and the last minute goes he's his
mother just died. Yeah, And It's a very subtle, little
character moment, but really important. Well, but he's trying to
give him Yeah, he's trying to like like he did
just have a death, but it wasn't one that most
people could understand, you know. I mean, this was he

(57:14):
was reacting to a crisis. But it was funny because
he was still like like it didn't even matter why
somebody would do this, like it happened in the middle
of this busy corporate winery, but he was still trying
to help him save face a little bit. Yeah, another beautiful,
sneaky shot too. Again pain not flashy, but you don't
even notice sometimes the when he's on the phone, there's

(57:36):
that really long shot of him in silhouette on the
telephone getting too bad news where he's just I guess
he isn't silhouette because he's under the porch and behind
him you just see the wine, the grapes and everything,
and it's just I don't know. It's another one of
these beautiful Alexander Payne shots. I thought he was on
the pad with all of the well he was when

(57:57):
he first called, I think, but yeah, he eventually went
out to the pad with all this in the steel trucks,
which is also a very wine country thing. Like the
industrial process. He's like, both of us love so much
and the mechanics. And it's funny too, because when you're
at wineries, if you they love to talk about all
of the mechanics. If you ask questions, you're gonna get
more than you can possibly even take it. It's great. Yeah,
one thing we've never met at a winery. When you

(58:18):
ask someone about one of their processes, they're like, you know,
we just we just make you do the thing and
the thing. Yeah, it's like a very in depth but
I'm really interested in processes because of what I do,
so and what do you do? Love your Mama dot
com and Mama about the body, homemade soap, sloan scrubs.
But you didn't say, let me pause for a moment

(58:41):
from our sponsor, Um, do you have four dollars you
can sponsor the podcast? I have like a five. Don't
you don't know how to give me change? So it's
the movies winding towards conclusion. He leaves Maya. There are
two messages left at the end of this film. Miles
leaves Maya one and Maya leaves Miles one and the
message he leaves is just so tragic and sad, but

(59:03):
he really like does right and comes clean and really
apologizes about not telling her about Jack, and like he
owns it. I think, yeah, he's still a sad, sacky
though there's still a little bit like pity me, like
you know, but but I don't know that he's trying
to manipulate her with that. It's just what he is.
This is who he is. So I guess in fairness

(59:23):
he's being real with her, like this is my lot
and you know, so sad um Stephanie beats a ship
out of of Jack and he immediately goes from like
saying he was in love whether he wants to be,
and then but I got to protect my wife, like
my wife to be like that was that was really

(59:44):
like because Chris Christine, I have to protect Christine like
you've done a really good job of that, jackass uh.
And then we get the sort of the final like
sad part of the movie when he they're eating dinner
on the way home and there's the waitress that he
uh and I think here's the thing. Alexander Pine Pine

(01:00:05):
Alexander Paine didn't even need to make the waitress, I
guess for lack of a more tender way to put
this less attractive. Yeah, it could have been anyone really,
And it's the sad fact that Jack's on the way
home and still has to get late again. Well, and
he's doing it with a waitress what he deems are
two tons of fun. She's kind of chubby. It's definitely

(01:00:26):
tight for him, below his grade in his eyes at
least and at this point, but he's damaged good, so
maybe he's like making that comparison. But again, if you're
always looking at all he's looking at is the attributes,
like the physical attributes of women. Yea, yeah uh. And
he has sex with a girl who leaves his wallet. Um,
they have to go back and get it, which we

(01:00:47):
get the great scene with the guy from Lost Leeper.
That scene is so stressful, like it was funny. I
watched it last night and not even with apprehension, but
usually I like want to like go to the bathroom
during that scene, any like where somebody's about to get
busted sneaking around someone's house just gives me anxiety that
I just don't really need in my life. So well,
we get our last TV shot there too, So when

(01:01:09):
he's he's not having sex with his wife, saying like, yeah,
you liked it when I busted you. You like the
way he had you, like the way he sucked you,
and um, I like the way he had sex with
your doing it. Um. And in the background you have
the TV of George Bush and Donald Right. I can't
remember what was on. It was so great, just like

(01:01:31):
looking off into the distance. It's very weird. Yeah. Um.
And then uh, sort of to cap off their friendship,
we uh, they wreck their own car to make it
seem like he well again, but he but he doesn't
say like, hey I need to He just like, hey,
I need to drive? Can I drive? Kind of driving?
He drives into a tree and it's one of those

(01:01:52):
very like un you know, yeah, yeah, it's not a
big impact. It's just like when you run into it.
Are you going twenty miles an hour? And I was
like what the funk? Like what did you just do?
And he's like I need this to look like an
access But then yeah, well because he's already jacked up
his car. But it's also I don't know, I feel
like he really is a good friend to him in

(01:02:13):
that moment, well, he's a good friend to him when
he agreed to go back and get his wallet, and
then when did it, Like he's but that's all so
we didn't talk about that. We talked about that stuff earlier.
But like when he cries and he's so desperate, I
think Myles finally sees like he's been this kind of
well yeah, pathetic, absolutely and vulnerable and needy in a
way that he doesn't. He doesn't usually need Miles like that.

(01:02:36):
So it was like Miles got to be useful. That
gave him a little something. Yeah. Interesting, everyone's always very
very selfish in this movie. Yeah not everyone like my
is not. She's the best, uh, Stephanie. But it's kind
of telling that's their character too, Like they're just they're
all kind of messed up enough where they haven't done
the work to get outside of their own No one's

(01:02:58):
doing the work except yes, exactly mine is doing the
work for everybody. We have our second second conclusion. He
gets the book finality disappointment, and he finally has some
meeting with Victoria at the wedding after the wedding, which
was a very sweet I thought it was a very
sweet meeting. She aboffed him when he was drunk, but
of course because she didn't know what was coming, but

(01:03:18):
she did answer, and she you know, h yeah, she's
remember well exactly, she's not the bad guy, Like she's
kind of presented to be the bad guy a little bit.
Then you find out, Um, but also Miles is somebody
who could feel small because he feels, you know, she
was a very accomplished person, it sounds like, and of course,

(01:03:41):
and she married a guy who was a lot more
success ken, who was very nice, you know. So it's
like it's like, did she make him feel small or
did he feel small as a result of his own Well,
he found out she's pregnant, and it's just a that
was a gut punch that that hit me harder last
night than it has That was really like the icing
on the cake for him. It's like, all right, not
only has she moved on, but now she's going to

(01:04:02):
start a family, the finality of all finality. And in
her mind she's like she doesn't say it, but you know,
she's like, of course we're not going to get back together.
I know. It's like no, it's like you're the only
person that thinks that you and your mom yeah or no,
her mom says someone else right, No, His mom is like,
you should get back together with Victoria. She's so delightfully wacky.

(01:04:26):
I didn't get a chance to put my face onf you. Uh.
And then we get the shovel Blanc comes full full circle.
He's sitting in like a burgerda scenes. I don't know,
I kind of thought it was I don't know, I
really liked it. I mean, I liked it, but it's
just like drinking it out of a styrofoam cup with

(01:04:48):
a past its peak with a burger. But he also
in that moment though, no, But in that moment there
was also like he wasn't he was just doing it
like that was you know what I mean, Like there
was a little like a bit of acceptance, like all
of his chips are, you know, all his cards on
the table? Well, I mean maybe that's rock bottom, is
really what it is? Well I kept thinking for both

(01:05:10):
of them, like is this rock bottom? And I think
that is because that's what leads to the final scene.
That last scene is so great when you get the
the uh. And this this movie is so wonderfully edited.
We've didn't talk about the split screen the Thomas Crown
Affair type when the shots are moving around and those segways,
there's just so fun. It was super fun. But again

(01:05:30):
that was in the trailer and I was like, what
is happening here? Like that's it's different context of the um.
But some of the editing him that I loved is
the first time where he goes to call Victoria and
drunk dial that the way that scene is intercut with
him at the table depressed and Jack looking at him
like and it shows him dialing, but then it goes

(01:05:52):
back to the table and then you hear the voiceover.
It's just such good editing. And then at the end
you get her phone message to him about his book. Uh,
cut with that dash cam shot of driving in the
rain in California, which is a really specific thing. Yeah,
if you never lived in California, well it only rains.
It rains, like to drive through the rain. Just it's

(01:06:15):
different than anywhere else. And it's just such a sweet
message she leaves. It is a really sweet message. And
again you know, like, did you really go through all
of that? You know, she like she seems to get
his book. She truly seems to you know, whatever he's
trying to accomplish, Like, I don't think she was just saying,
you know, she's not just validating, No, she's not, like

(01:06:36):
she's like this gave her a kind of a window
his soul. I want to read this book now, like
his book. I'm sure it's yeah right, yeah, never mind, um,
but it's just so great. You see the car get
off that exit, and then the beautiful stairs and with
all that moody California winter weather. Yeah, it's just wet

(01:06:58):
and just a door knock, yeah to black and then
you don't not so you don't know what the last
word I have hope hope. Yeah, that's true. It is
you're left with hope. Well, and she certainly leaves the
door open. Jerry on top hope. Yeah, like you can't.
You gotta be hopeful for Miles at the end of this.
He didn't go through all of this. Yeah, absolutely just depressed.

(01:07:22):
I know, all right, I think we did this one justice.
Oh yeah, I think so too. I had a couple
of I am dB trivia is for you real quick
that you might find interesting. George Clooney wanted to play
Jack and heavily campaigned for that, but he thought Clooney
was too big, and they totally used him in a

(01:07:45):
Descendant's next which I could do that one that was him.
Actually let me see here, Oh, Thomas satan Church had
mirrored his own thing. He was he had not acted
in a while and was doing a voice over work
just like his character. Well, and this was not dissimilar
to his character and Wings. I mean that guy was
a little bit more of like a simpleton and you know,

(01:08:06):
but just kind of like that. Yeah, he was kind
of that guy. So it wasn't out of type. But
it's funny. He's so that guy, like you just think
that's probably who he is. But then we started to
watch some of the scenes, Yeah, and it's like not
at all. Yeah. If you guys get a chance to um,
I think you have to purchase it on iTunes, which

(01:08:27):
we did because we just love it so much. There's
some good deleted scenes along with really detailed notes from
Alexander Paine on why it was cut, which is always
super instructive. I think that stay up on the screen
for a way too long grade reading level. I was like,
all right, I got it. Oh interesting. The book remained
unpublished until Alexander Payne bought the film rights, so the

(01:08:49):
actual novel was based on was released just a month
before the film premiere. Interesting. I wonder how he got
ahold of it was just like a manuscript that was
floating around or something. And Alexander Payne was I forgot
he was married to Andrew at the time. Oh remember that,
now I do. And they're no longer together. I take
it they're no longer together. Uh. Director Chris Columbus his

(01:09:10):
critique here, he said he thought it was a seventies
movie made in contemporary times, and Pain has said that too.
With the cinematography, yeah, oh yeah, because he wanted that
look of like those the seventies movies film look, and
we were we were presuming that it probably was shot
on film, because then I'm going it, I think, so

(01:09:32):
let me see here. I mean that was back when
I was still producing, and you know, like the more
established structures were still pushing for a film. Uh. And
so in the book, though, there is a different ending.
Um My shows up at Jack's wedding um to see
him in person and talk about his manuscript in person

(01:09:53):
instead of the phone message. Oh interesting, And Alexander Pain
thought that was just too kind of Hollywood. It's way
too hollywood. I completely agree with his choice. Did not
do that. There's no way she would not pursue Miles
after all of that, especially not at Jack's wedding, like
she wouldn't go to the scene of the crime. Um.
He at the very end, as he's standing there, like,
I forget when exactly he says this, Oh, it's before

(01:10:13):
he hooks up with the waitress. You understand movies, literature, wine,
but you don't understand my plate. And I was like,
what is your plate? Dode? But then it is it's
that he has no choice but to think through his penis. Yeah, well,
but it's that he's his choices are to do that
or to go grow up, and that that to him
is an enormous plate. Like but but also to grow

(01:10:34):
up means to give up his dream of acting, too.
I think that's a piece of it, which is probably
less than you know. He even discusses this was fun. Yeah,
it was super fun. All right, which one do you
want to do next? We got election? We have still election? Okay? Done? Yeah, yeah,
that's such a fun movie. All right. Everyone. That wraps

(01:10:56):
it up for the Alexander Paine Film series, Volume one
with Emily v one and we'll be back for V
two sometime in the next few months. You can take
it slow, yeah, quarterly quarterly say and thanks for listening.
We'll see you next time. Movie Crushes produced, edited, and

(01:11:25):
engineered by Ramsey unt here in our home studio at
Pont City Market, Atlanta, Georgia. For I Heart Radio. For
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