July 25, 2013 • 36 mins
Roller Derby Microbiome: Once upon a time, the word "outdoors" wasn't a thing. But then humans invented "indoors," and with it an artificial environment containing an artificial environment of microorganisms. In this episode of Stuff to Blow Your Mind, Robert and Julie discuss the ways in which we might manage or even engineer the microbiology of these indoor worlds.
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from how Stuff
Works dot com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind.
My name is Robert Lamb and I'm Julie Taglas and Julie.
What was to the title today's episode roller Derby micro Bio? Yes,
(00:23):
just like that. It's a great it's a great title.
We we put a lot of thought in disease. And
what are we talking about when we talk about roller
Derby microbiome? Well, I mean we're talking about colonization really
of various microbial teams in our universities. Our universe is
meaning like on our bodies, outside of our bodies, in
(00:45):
our workspaces, private spaces, public spaces. Yes. Now, in our
most recent episode, we talked about cubical death. We talked
about our workspaces, and we touched upon the key concept
that we're really getting into here, and that's the idea
that uh, at some point there was an individual, primordial
office worker, if you will get mythic here and yes,
(01:08):
and uh and we'll call uh, we'll call him Adam.
All right, I was gonna say, whyn't we go with
the eve, we go with the MicroB We'll go with Adam. Andy?
How about that? Yeah, so Adam and Ever out in
the in the paradise, and and they have a lot
of work to do because God has tasked them with
working up all these Excel spreadsheets about what all the
(01:29):
animals are gonna be named. They have they have to
put in a budget request, a lot of work to
get done. They have to make goals for the coming
fiscal year. And uh, they're just out there in the
midst of all this nature. Mosquitoes are coming up to them.
Unnamed animals are coming up and wanting to be named.
There's a serpent just talking NonStop about some tree. What
(01:49):
are they gonna do? They're like, we gotta get out
of this nature. So how do I get out of
this nature? Out of all this disturbing nature that's messing
with my vibe, that's potentially making me sneeze or itch.
I need to create an artificial world in which I
can work, when I can shut everything out, A nice
clean space and indoor space that will be my office,
a true human habitat. Yes, and fast forward here we
(02:13):
are now, I mean we we do not live out
in nature anymore, at least most of us do not.
Righte We have some sort of structure around us, and
therefore we have created our own little microbiomes in these
buildings that we dwell in. You know, I'm realizing now
I should have gone with Sophia as the as the
name of our mythical office worker, because I would have
(02:34):
gone into the gnostic idea that Sophia, from a primary
ideal universe falls and creates ultimately creates a flawed universe
in which we all reside now, because that's sort of
what any kind of indoor office space is, a flawed
version of the more ideal environment that exists outside these walls.
(02:54):
And of course we're talking today not just about the
microbiome on our bodies, but the environment that we see
around us in microbes. In fact, I invite everybody to
put on their micro biome vision or their goggles and
begin to imagine a world that comes alive just in germs. Right.
So look around you on the walls. There are various
(03:16):
species of microbes. They're they're on your feet, on your
on your desk surface, on your food. It's everything is
teeming with microbes. Yeah, it's it's pretty much like that
old Saturday Night Live skit where they had the fecal
vision goggles that they would put on and they would
see growing gen green substance wherever a fecal matter was present.
(03:37):
And it's just a horror show because the individual wearing
and I think it was Meadows, is just seeing just
like green stuff all over people's hands and faces, all
over a baby, all over the walls. It's just grim.
It's true. According to Stanford microbiologist Stanley Falco, the world
is covered in a fine patina of feces, and we
(03:57):
need to start thinking about that because really that is
in forming to some degree our measures of health. So
when I talk about that our health and our microbiome,
we should probably do a quick overview of what a
microbiome is. I know we've talked about it before, but
how it affects us because this is a huge field
um that is growing that that's giving us a ton
(04:18):
of information about how we operate in the world based
on these little critters around us. Yeah. I mean it
comes down to the basic principle that the human body
is not organism, but the human body is organisms living
together in some degree of unison. Yeah, and we're talking
about one trillion microbial cells. You've heard it before. You
(04:40):
are outnumbered ten to one in terms of our own
cells versus bacterial cells. Yeah, we come into this world,
we are colonized, and we remain colonized throughout our entire lives. Yeah.
In fact, when you say we come into this world
when we are born, if we are born vaginally, that's
when we get our first slathering of these acterial cells.
(05:00):
And these are really important because these bacterial cells helped
to inform our immune systems. Yeah, we've evolved with the
set situation. So in a sense, it comes what we're
talking about. Here is a natural extrapolation of this in
terms of our physical environments that we create. Because just
as the human body is not a situation of all, right,
here's the clean human, here's the infected human, it's also
(05:22):
not a clear cut situation of here is a clean
working environment, here is an infected one. All humans are
infected or colonized, and all spaces are colonized. Right, And
the Human Microbiome Project was trying to get a baseline
of what a normal microbiome looks like, and they still
don't have this, by the way, but this is their
first attempts to try to figure out what something might
(05:44):
look typically for each person. So what they did is
they took two hundred scientists at eighty institutions and they
sequenced the genetic material of bacteria taken from two hundred
and fifty healthy people, which by the way, they took
it from all various areas of their body um and
that yielded something like eleven thousand plus samples that they're
going through and again they're trying to figure out what
(06:07):
might a baseline of a normal Microme biome look like
and why does it even matter. Well, it turns out
that each human contains that the ten tho strains of
bacteria with eight million bacterial genes, and this is in
contrast to twenty two human genes. So again this idea
begainst the build that there's things going on in your
bacterial cells that are gaming not just your immune system
(06:30):
but your gut um and informing your gut about how
you feel. Right, we've talked about this before, the mind
body connection between the gut um and also um. We're
also finding out that that each person has a tailor
made combination of bacteria in their body, and bacteria differs
(06:52):
on your body depending on where it is, so it
could be like a rainforest in one area or the
desert in another area, So the workspace becomes a melting.
Each of us is kind of a ship from a
different nation, carrying its own mix of of individuals, ready
to colonize a new world. And then our skin falls off,
as it does in the office place. People break wind,
(07:13):
people's shoes fart as they walk. The pressure of your
your feet and your shoes starts shooting out. So we're
we colonize the world around us with our own particular
cocktail of microbiology. And it's true, right because we we've
talked about this again that the gut microbia that is
in there is specific to your diet. Right, So if
(07:34):
you eat a lot of sushi um then and you
live in Japan, then you have a gut microbe that
can break down seaweed. And your that gut microbe, by
the way, adapted itself from a marine animal, and it
basically took up a sequence of that genetic code of
that marine animal and then took it unto itself to
(07:56):
then be able to use the sequence in your gut,
so it could also break down seaweed. And that I
think is the amazing thing is that bacteria can swap
jeans and pieces of DNA with itself, and that makes
it highly adaptable. So not only are you walking around
in your office with your own microbiome, but it's doing
things that are specific to you. And now, let's say
(08:19):
your office is not necessarily your traditional workspace. Let's say
your office is roller Derby. Okay, what happens? Where? Where
is my desk in the roller Derby? Are you saying
I'm a roller Derby queen? You are a roller Derby queen.
What is your roller Derby name? By the way, oh um,
I like to stick with the show branding. I'll go
with Buster Stuffington. Does it need to be more lady
(08:43):
like Busty Stuffington? Yes, that's my roller Derby name. Okay.
I was going to say Lamb to the slaughter, but
I don't know if that really like shows like hey
like in the water you or is it an individual name,
individual name, individual name. I'm going with Busty Stuffington. Okay?
All right, all right, So you're you're in your office,
which is basically like a roller Derby track. Okay, And
(09:06):
let's say that you're the home team. There are two
other teams that are coming to compete with you in
this tournament. Okay, You've got your microbiome, and your team,
by the way, shares a similar microbiome. All right, So
this is evidence that when we are grouped together in
a situation, we began to share the same aspects of
(09:26):
the same profile of bacteria, which is interesting. Okay, Now,
if you are um about to start your game and
you begin elbowing someone and you just smash into one
of the opposing teams, well, what are you doing when
you come into contact with them? Well, I'm assaulting them
with my elbow bones, but I'm also colonizing them with
(09:47):
a little bit of skin flakes, at least skin flakes,
assuming nothing else comes off. Alright, So exactly now you're
you're swapping your bacterial cells and what it's right, I'm
getting some of theirs on me as well, especially get
them right in the kiss. Right. So what researchers have found,
and this is fascinating, is that, um, not only do
(10:08):
you share the same microbiome or aspects of it with
your team, but by the end of that tournament, when
you get swabbed again, you're going to find out that
the other teams microbiomes that you swapped some sweat with
are now trying to colonize your microbiome. Wow, they're trying
to take you over, at least to the skin level.
(10:31):
And not only that, but your microbiome also has aspects
similar aspects to the roller derby that you primarily work
out of. So the opposing team is taking all of
their bacteria from their roller derby hall and trying home
microbiome advantage in a sense. Well you you you have
(10:51):
the home advantage. Yeah, but they're bringing their environment with you.
So what we're talking about here is like, here's an
extreme form of let's say an office community. It is
not really an office community, but a job, you know,
per se, and they are bringing their environments with them
and they're sharing it with each other. So it becomes
(11:11):
a very interesting question of to what extent can we
affect each other with our microbiomes. So um I wanted
to bring up a New York Or article called Microbiomes
and Health, How we colonize each other with bacteria? Uh
Ball force our tour. He's a gastroenterologist at the University
of North Carolina at Cheple Hill, and he specializes in
(11:33):
inflammatory bool disease like say like crones He says that
there is a growing stack of evidence, some published, some
not that people who have lived with inflammatory boot disease
sufferers for long periods of time they have a higher
rate of it than them themselves than people in the
general population. So there's this growing idea that perhaps you
(11:55):
could be colonized over time by someone else's gut bacteria,
especially if you're exposed to that because as we know,
if you, uh, if you flush the toilet, so the
bacteria gets aerosol ized and then shot up into the
air and then gets on surfaces, and then you can
pick that up. That can that bacteria that you pick
up on your hands can go into your mouth, go
into your gut lo and behold you are and you're
(12:17):
introducing another bacterium. Huh. Now I'm thinking of now with
the posters in the works in our all of our
workspaces that you know, tell you what what sexual harassment is,
and I think one of them is inappropriate touching. Does
this count as inappropriate touching because I did not ask
anyone to invade me with your microbiome and it's happening. Well,
this is that This that's interesting because then you begin, okay,
(12:40):
let's say we have this understanding the microbiome. That's really
like in twenty years, that's really advanced, nuanced. Do people
become hyper aware of how they interact with others? Is
it aggressive to swipe at someone that you don't know
or you're trying to like get your so you have
some sort of stomach ailment and you're trying to give
(13:02):
them your gut bacteria. Don't even I don't even know
what how it got in your hands in the first place,
but you know it could just be an act of
aggression or does it become like a rite of passage.
It's kind of like welcome to the family, Welcome. It's
like being blood brothers with everyone, Like like we we
welcome you into this opera space, office space, and now
we shall have the ritual licking of the palms and
(13:24):
high fiving, so the way we may all be of
the same microbiome. Well, it's true. Just something symbolical like
a handshake becomes that much more Right you start your
first day of work and you have the handshake with people,
we should all do the cough in the hand handshake
first day, just like the solidarity. Yeah, like you might
as well say, hey, we you're gonna get colonized by
by the microbiome here at work, so just let's go
(13:46):
ahead and have at it. Yeah, hold for like five seconds,
just to make sure everybody gets on. Yeah, yeah, all right,
We're gonna take a quick break and when we come back,
we will explore the microbiome roller Derby even more. All right,
(14:10):
We're back with more roller Derby microbiome. We're back, all right.
We wanted to bring up Jessica Green and something called
bio informed design because she's taken this idea, this idea
that we're not just the germs on her skin or
inside of our body, but we're also affecting our environments,
and our environments are affecting us. And she is a
(14:32):
biodiversity scientist and director of the Biology and the Built
Environment Center at the University of Oregon. She has a
good ted talk on this and her work really is
is trying to understand the role of the microbial ecosystems
on human health. So she and her team decided to
study the Littlest building. This is on the campus of
the University of Oregon, and the reason why they wanted
(14:55):
to look at it is because it has a nice
bacterial stu in the form of classrooms, offices, and restrooms,
and so in other words, you get again that fine
patina of feces in the form of restrooms. Right in
the restroom spray. You get a nice transient population of
microbial colonies from students varying backgrounds. Yeah, yeah, who are
(15:19):
trap sing in all sorts of stuff right on their feet,
on their hands that they just ate in their hair,
in your ears, you name it. And then they have
a stable population of colonies in the form of those
who dwell in the office space. So this this is
such an interesting UM project to me because they took
(15:42):
it and they worked with an architect and they sort
of resurrected the building using computer program and then they
started working to say, okay, well if we if we
use this louver system with the windows in one part
of the building. And this louver system, if you've ever
seen them before, they're they're pretty popular like in places
like tropical places like Hawaii where you can just kind
of move these metal grates in the windows and can
(16:06):
move them so that they all line up and they're
flat and they can keep the elements out, okay, or
you could just move them and then they would open
up a bit and you could get some real fresh
air flow in. Yeah, you do seem a lot in
Hawaii where you have more of a stable constant temperature
and you can just keep things pretty pretty nice with
just the natural breeze. Yeah, So they used this um
Sometimes they had natural airfloor airflow coming in and out,
(16:29):
and sometimes they closed it and then they just used
the ventilation system. And what they found is that they
were really specific microbial colonies based on where they were,
So those classrooms had a different profile than say the
offices or even the banks of elevators. And what happened
is that when they open those lovers, they found that
(16:52):
the microbial cloud dissipated with the introduction of fresh air.
And this became really important because man is looking at
how to best uh struct or manipulate that environment to
have a really good or healthy microbial profile for people. Yeah,
it comes down to, like we we said earlier, this
is all this old, outdated idea that we're creating a
(17:15):
pristine indoor environment for our pristine indoor lives and that
that's completely cut out from the teeming living world outside. No,
we can't have it that cut and try we're gonna
have microbes living all in our environments, but we're gonna
have a different type of environment and not necessarily and
we'll certainly the research is saying not a better one, right,
And she's she's very cautious about the research because it's
(17:37):
pretty early with this, a little too cautious. The interview
I was seeing that kept like kind of trying to
seed some like really mind blowing comments and she's like,
I'm not going there just yet. Research is and which
is commendable. She's she's holding back and saying that we're
working on that that's the next phase or the research
doesn't really indicate exactly what kind of take we should
have on this just yet, right, because she's saying that
the next phase of their research is trying to lie
(18:00):
ing up to two bits of this, the environment and
the humans, the two kinds of ecosystems, and really bear
out some some research that she already has a hunch about,
but she wants to see them work together in parallel
before she says anything. And again, this is this is
sort of a new field because if this bears out
the sort of things that we think it will, then
(18:20):
architects will begin to consider this in design, so you're
not just gonna have a green building that has low
carbon emissions, but you're also going to have a green
building with a healthy microbiome in it. So it's it's
interesting because she she also is looking at the study
with Portland or a Portland hospital, and again it's that
(18:42):
mechanical ventilated rooms that is showing an increase in pathogens.
So in other words, if they didn't give this this
hospital access to outside air to help dissipate that microbial cloud,
then it turned out that those pathogens increased because again
you're manipulating in the environment and you're making it uh
(19:04):
so that these pathogens can live and actually thrive in it.
And this is a hospital setting, so that's obviously a
problem you have. You end up with your outdoor air
and then you have your indoor air, and the indoor
air is full of things as well. It's it's not
again not this pristine, clean stuff that we think it is. Uh.
They're finding that the bacterial communities and indoor environments contain
many taxes that are absent or rare outdoors, including again
(19:27):
many of those that are tidy human pathogens. So you
have this alti artificial environment, this kind of zoo of
weird things circulating in the air. And she's saying, like,
you know, in terms of a hospital environment, it's a
little like having a weed in your your backyard and
just torching the entire backyard to get rid of the weed.
The same thing as happening in these hospital environments. And
(19:50):
it's important to have the outside air come in because
you know, when you have traces of the outdoors and
you have traces of say, soil come in, that's soil.
It turns out, is really important to create that profile
of what a healthy microbiome might look like. In fact,
there is a bacterium and soil called myceo bacteria and
(20:11):
vici that scientists at the Stage Colleges of Troy, New
York found can actually reduce anxiety and increase learning capabilities.
When yes, and of course this is in mice, but
when they when they fed it to them or when
they inhaled it, yes, it increased neuron growth and it
caused the serotonin levels to increase, which reduced their anxiety.
(20:34):
And then this is so cool when they wanted to
test to see if it increased or enhance their learning abilities,
researcher Dorothey Matthews and her colleagues fed them this bacterium,
or rather one group and then a control group, and
then they let them loose on this maze. And it
turned out that the group had been that had been
dosed with the bacteria. Yes, although that would be for
(20:57):
a second era of picturing humans instead of mice. And
it was up crazy going through a maze after being
dosed with bacteria. Somehow my mind they're naked, Yes, of
course they're running naked through the maze. But those minds
that that were dosed they actually were able to run
through twice as fast with less demonstrated anxiety behaviors as
control mice. So there's this idea again that um, some
(21:21):
of these bacterium or some of this bacteria is very
helpful to the way that our bodies respond to our
environments and actually um navigate our world. Yeah, I mean,
we all know that sunlight is good, you know, and
you want of an office space that has windows in it,
you know, you can want to get some natural sunlight,
get some of that vitamin D. But but but but again,
(21:44):
we all we fall into that idea that this is
this is a clean place, and we don't want a
bunch of dirt around, but we're actually smelling the dirt,
interacting with the dirt, interacting with that outside air, far
healthier for us than that so called clean air that's
coming out of that ventilation duct. Yeah. And you've studying
after study about kids who that are exposed to dirt,
particularly kids that live in rural areas, are on farms.
(22:06):
They have a far more robust immune system than kids
who are kept in very clean and environments. And as
we you know, begin to learn more and more about
microbiome and how it is gaining us in our environment,
I think this becomes really important. And I'm very intrigued
by this idea of designing microbial environment for ourselves, particularly
(22:27):
in our human habitats, which are our homes and our
office spaces. Yeah, because that's really where we're leading with
all of this. I mean, that's the really the mind
blowing idea of it here, is that reaching an age
where you're designing a building, not only the structures they're
they're present in the the engineering of the building and
the look of the spaces and the movement of people
through it, but also the movement of micro bacteria through it,
(22:49):
the managing of the microbiome of the building almost like
it's itself a living thing, and realizing that it's an
artificial environment and finding ways to to make sure that
that skews in the positive direction instead of the negative.
You know, I would love a little beneficial bacteria to
be introduced during the winter months here in our office,
because that's when we all get sick and we don't
(23:12):
necessarily stay home when we should, and we cough all
over everything. So it would be nice to sort of say, okay,
we're going to fog the place with some good germs,
just bringing the dirt. You know, it makes me think
of the some of the vampire myths where the vampire
needs to sleep in in its own like grave soil,
it's native grave soul. I believe that this was in
the in bron Stoker's original Dracula, but he needed he
(23:33):
need some of that girl Transylvanian dirt to bring it with. Yeah,
So it's it's kind of like that, like maybe that's
what it is, that the vampires need the natural microbiome
that they knew in the grave. Just you know, new
soil and a new land is not going to do it. UM,
So in addition to our yoga room that we would
like in a meditation room, our labyrinth room, and our cafe,
(23:57):
Holly requested a human dog rund room as well. All right,
the human dog run room we'll need, um, I don't know,
some sort of like dirt play area, some sort of
backyard habitat. Yeah, or I guess like just like a
Roman atrium where it's just open to the elements and
it has plants growing in it and you know, a
(24:17):
statue of God. See when you make it all fancy.
I like it here, I am. I'm just about to, like,
you know, throwing a couple of pails for us in
the dirt. But yeah, sculptures would be nice. All right, Well,
there you have it. I think a few takeaways that
we should make here. First of all, realizing that are
the the artificiality of our indoor spaces, and how artificiality
(24:41):
UM is not certainly not always good. UM. Open a
window if you can breathe in that outdoor air. And
unless there's a warning that you need to stay indoors
depends on what kind of city you live in. Here
in the Atlanta we occasionally get those warnings. UM, smell
the dirt. If you haven't already, make sure you smell
some dirt, smells some plants. It's gonna help you. It
(25:02):
may make you your brain work better, and it may
reduce anxiety. And also take note that roller Derby girls
are not just doing battle at the physical level, but
also the sell or level, the microbial level. So when
you see the next tournament you see, just know that
there's a different kind of calling and station going on. Well,
(25:23):
they tend to look kind of grubby out there, so
it's I mean good grubby, but you know they're sweating,
there might be a little blood. You know, makeup is
getting kind of smeared. So right now, ripe for these
sort of conditions exactly for the sort of takeover one another.
Al Right, Well, on that note, let's call over our
robot here, and let's let's go with a little listener
(25:45):
mail see what people have shared with us. All right,
this one comes to us from Sha. Sha writes and says, hello,
Robert and Julie. I was pursuing past episodes the other day,
and to my delight, came across the science of gremlins
and magua. I'm all so a magua lover, Uh, the
grimlins not so much, and proceeded to listen with attentionness
(26:05):
and gusto as I performed my household duties as I
usually do, to the tune of your wonderful voices. I
was very much enjoying the science of these fascinating creatures
until about three quarters through the podcast, you, Robert, made
a grievous era and had me doubting all faith in
your scientific researchability and dedication to educating the masses with
factual information. You were discussing survival in a natural environment
(26:27):
and went on to say how pugs were selectively bred
to be ridiculous lap dogs and would not survive in
a natural environment. Well, I never you, sir, have obviously
failed to to really think about the design features of
the remarkable pug breed. Luckily for you, I am here
to fill you in. First. The eyes of the pug
are very big and sit almost to the side of
(26:48):
their cute little face. This is so that they can
see predators and pray from all angles, an essential trait
for survival. The curly tale of the pug isn't just
for being adored, but can aid in stick retrieval. Uh.
They can quite easily hold onto a stick with that curl,
and therefore achieve numerous things, such as they could build
a shelter to keep them safe from the elements. Pugs
(27:09):
are that sophisticated. If there happen to be two pugs
holding sticks, they can rub them together to spark a fire.
It could happen also holding a stick. It makes them
look larger and more threatening, perfect rewarding off predators. My pugs,
yes I'm a pug owner, have very thick coats, which
would certainly be enough installation in a milder climate, perhaps
not the Arctic, but maybe here in New Zealand. Also,
(27:30):
don't discount the use of a pug in a domesticated environment.
A pug will happily warm your lap all day if
needed in the winter. Well, I hope you have had
an eye opening experience, and we'll think again before making
such ignorant remarks. Yours truly, Shay. Well, there you go.
There's some there's some of nature's wondrous innovations in the
(27:51):
form of the pug. Um the eyes of the pug.
The eyes of the pug. I hadn't really thought about
their certainly their prey so much. Um because their prey journal.
He stays in one space, one place and squeaks when
it's poked um. But but you know, I did rag
on the pugs some in that particular podcast, and I
did have to self correct like a little like a
(28:12):
few weeks later when I saw a pug helper dog
on Marta on on the train going home from work,
which gave me a whole all new respect for the
pug is a useful breed and not merely a lap dog.
So I had to take a lot back. I have
a lot more respect for pugs, now, that's true. That's true.
You did bring that up, and you did say the
pug is worth my time or more worth my time.
(28:33):
But now I know they can build things and and
and create fire. So yeah, I mean they walk softly
and they carry big sticks. All right. Here's another one.
This one comes to us from Heather. Heather says, Hello,
I just listened to your coffee podcast and I had
to write in I'm one of those caffeine intolerant individuals.
I love coffee, but I have immediate and severe gastro
intestinal results when I drink a cup. Interestingly, I used
(28:54):
to be able to drink coffee, tea, hot cocoas, soda,
et cetera. But in college, one night I drank way
too many ups as I was at a coffee house,
around sixteen cups of coffee. I was quote unquote coffee
drunk that night, nauseous, uh, spinning room, and had a
bad hangover the next day. I had coffee, tea and
soda after that, but started to be more sensitive to
it until I finally had to stop. Now, twenty years later,
(29:17):
I'm even more sensitive to it because I have stayed
away from it for so long. I can have chocolate solid,
not hot chocolate, but I have only small amounts at
a time. Thanks for the interesting podcast, Heather. You know,
I was wondering what would happen to someone if they
drank that amount, like, you know, just excess amounts. And
now you know that's I mean, because you really have
(29:37):
to dedicate yourself to drinking coffee all day long for that. Well,
there's a Futurama episodes where Fry drinks a hundred cups
and had a hundred cups um time stops and he's
able to move around supersed and save the day. This
reminds me there was a convergence of our coffee episode
and also our Stendelf syndrome episode we had recently. We
(29:57):
had a listener right in and talk about having that
Stendahl effect when they walk into I think a costco
and overwhelmed by like the size and scope of of
commercial America and it gives them like physical unease. And
then also we talked about coffee and about how it
makes that you need to uh to poop well. UM.
I recently went to a Costco for the first time,
(30:19):
and I had been to a Sam's Club in the past,
but I've never been to a costco UM. But my
wife recently got a membership, so we we went there
to buy some things in ridiculous bulk and UH, and
we were about halfway into the store. It's a huge space,
like enormous space with just it's overwhelming, and I'm overwhelmed
by the size of things. But then there's a guy
handing out a little cups of coffee, so I take
(30:40):
one because that's what you do. And it made me
feel a little more safe because I felt like I
was back in a smaller Trader Joe's or something, and
I'm drinking a little cup of coffee, but then I
had to go uh and it was like, you are
going there, okay, yeah, yes, yes, I had the coffee,
and suddenly I really had to go to the bathroom.
And at first I thought it was just like, all right,
after I find the giant container of soysage that I
(31:02):
need to find and bring that to the cart, then
I really need to think about finding a bathroom. But
then I quickly realized, no, there's no time for so soysage.
I need to find the restaurant and the dead center
of the store, and I have no idea where it is.
So I did, and I knew that I would given
the distances involved, I would only have time to head
for one corner of the store and hope that that's
where the bathroom is and if it and if it
(31:22):
wasn't there, then I would have to create one of
my own. Fortunately it worked out and I picked the
right corner of the store, but it was it was
a very frightening experience. Wow, I mean that's yeah, seriously,
I'm glad that you dropped your soysage agenda. Yes, I
didn't have a choice. Um so with the toilet supersized um.
(31:42):
The bathrooms were nice, I was improved, but they were
not enormous toilets, and there were not an enormous amount
of them. I have heard that Costco was supposed to
be a fancier version of Sam's. Well, I haven't been
in a stams in a while, so I can't really
speak to that. But Costco was what's clean inside, and
there were lots and lots of things to buy. So
so if you ever find yourself a scout out of
(32:03):
the bathrooms, first certainly before you have any coffee. All right,
here's another one from a listener who wishes to remain anonymous. Uh.
He writes in this is high blow the mind. Guys.
When I got out of federal prison, I had three
years of probation. One of the terms of my probation
was that I not play any soccer. Considering the playing
soccer had nothing to do with my crime, it seemed
ridiculous to me to give up playing. The problem was
(32:25):
that I also have have to be polygraphed every four
to six months. As the time for my first polygraph approach,
and I was playing soccer four or five times a week,
I started to search for ways to get around it. Uh.
The TAC technique, which we've mentioned in the episode about
like putting attack in your shoe and causing some physical
pain there. The TAC technique seemed a little too obvious,
but the idea of creating a false baseline seemed like
(32:48):
the way to go. As you may not know from
watching movies and TV, the person administering a polygraph will
only ask you yes, no questions, So the question is
not what is your name, but rather is your name
in certain name? Here to create a false baseline, My
simple solution was that whenever they asked me a baseline question,
are you sitting down, do you speak English? Et cetera,
I would imagine that he had asked me did you
(33:09):
play soccer? This served the dual purpose of giving my
line a little boost for the simple question, and when
they asked the question about soccer, actually they would ask
have you done anything in the past four months to
violate your parole. I was a little relief that I
was finally being asked, and so my line wouldn't react
as much in line talking about the line that goes
up and down on the polygraphy. This all worked work
(33:32):
to charm and I easily passed all of my polygraphs.
The only trouble came at the one time I was
so focused on asking myself the wrong question that when
the polygrapher asked if I was sitting down, I immediately said, no,
I really enjoy your show. And if I ever get
arrested again in my probation states that I can't listen
to stuff to blow your mind, I am confident that
I will be able to continue listening and pass my polygraphs.
(33:53):
Uh any polygraphs they might give me cheers, Oh yeah, okay,
that I mean that was firsthand knowledge on this, right,
I mean what I love hearing that because you know,
we we do all this research, and we you know,
we have some anecdotal stuff from some of the research
that we that we call. But to be able to
hear this person's playing this sort of game with that
(34:16):
is really fascinating and how he or she went about it,
yea with high stakes. All right, And here's a final
one from Murphy. Murphy right senses high Robert and Julie.
I've been drinking coffee since I was a little over
a year old. I was begging for what mom was drinking,
and she gave me a taste to determine the plan.
Backfire caused me to grow up under the influence of caffeine.
After listening to your podcast, I wonder what life would
(34:38):
be like without my usual one to three cups in
the morning. But then I thought about I thought that
any observation of myself will change the behavior of myself,
and no accurate data will be recorded. It sounds like
somebody's been drinking coffee this morning, and writing this thought
could of course be a lie in my coffee saturated brain,
invented to keep itself from having to live a day
(34:58):
abstaining from the delicious, delicious toxins. Uh. There is no
good way to sum this up, Murphy, and people feel
very passionate about their coffee. Yeah, it's the dark brown God,
and UH, I depend on it, so I'm not gonna
attempt to toward it. So there you have it. A
few listener mails to get through. UH. Sadly we don't
have time for more in this episode, but we'll continue
(35:20):
to try and the pimp them out, and we would
love for you to keep sending them to us, particularly
in regards to this episode, UH and in our previous
ones about workspaces and the microbiome. In your workspace. Um,
how does this change your way of looking at your
work environment? How does it change the way you think
about the air that's coming in through that event versus
(35:40):
the air that comes in through that window? If you
could possibly open it on your building, Um, we would
love to hear from you. Let us know. You can
find us on a number of places. We of course
have stuff to Blow your Mind dot com, the mothership
of all the things that we do. You can also
find us on social media. We're on Facebook and tumble
and Stuff to Blow your Mind. We are on Twitter
is blow to Mind and over there on YouTube. But
we've put all of our fabulous videos up at mind
(36:02):
Stuff Show, and you can also drop us a line
let us know about your microbial adventures at below the
Mind at Discovery dot com. For more on this and
thousands of other topics, visit how Stuff Works dot com.
Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from how Stuff
Works dot com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind.
My name is Robert Lamb and I'm Julie Taglas and Julie.
What was to the title today's episode roller Derby micro Bio? Yes,
(00:23):
just like that. It's a great it's a great title.
We we put a lot of thought in disease. And
what are we talking about when we talk about roller
Derby microbiome? Well, I mean we're talking about colonization really
of various microbial teams in our universities. Our universe is
meaning like on our bodies, outside of our bodies, in
(00:45):
our workspaces, private spaces, public spaces. Yes. Now, in our
most recent episode, we talked about cubical death. We talked
about our workspaces, and we touched upon the key concept
that we're really getting into here, and that's the idea
that uh, at some point there was an individual, primordial
office worker, if you will get mythic here and yes,
(01:08):
and uh and we'll call uh, we'll call him Adam.
All right, I was gonna say, whyn't we go with
the eve, we go with the MicroB We'll go with Adam. Andy?
How about that? Yeah, so Adam and Ever out in
the in the paradise, and and they have a lot
of work to do because God has tasked them with
working up all these Excel spreadsheets about what all the
(01:29):
animals are gonna be named. They have they have to
put in a budget request, a lot of work to
get done. They have to make goals for the coming
fiscal year. And uh, they're just out there in the
midst of all this nature. Mosquitoes are coming up to them.
Unnamed animals are coming up and wanting to be named.
There's a serpent just talking NonStop about some tree. What
(01:49):
are they gonna do? They're like, we gotta get out
of this nature. So how do I get out of
this nature? Out of all this disturbing nature that's messing
with my vibe, that's potentially making me sneeze or itch.
I need to create an artificial world in which I
can work, when I can shut everything out, A nice
clean space and indoor space that will be my office,
a true human habitat. Yes, and fast forward here we
(02:13):
are now, I mean we we do not live out
in nature anymore, at least most of us do not.
Righte We have some sort of structure around us, and
therefore we have created our own little microbiomes in these
buildings that we dwell in. You know, I'm realizing now
I should have gone with Sophia as the as the
name of our mythical office worker, because I would have
(02:34):
gone into the gnostic idea that Sophia, from a primary
ideal universe falls and creates ultimately creates a flawed universe
in which we all reside now, because that's sort of
what any kind of indoor office space is, a flawed
version of the more ideal environment that exists outside these walls.
(02:54):
And of course we're talking today not just about the
microbiome on our bodies, but the environment that we see
around us in microbes. In fact, I invite everybody to
put on their micro biome vision or their goggles and
begin to imagine a world that comes alive just in germs. Right.
So look around you on the walls. There are various
(03:16):
species of microbes. They're they're on your feet, on your
on your desk surface, on your food. It's everything is
teeming with microbes. Yeah, it's it's pretty much like that
old Saturday Night Live skit where they had the fecal
vision goggles that they would put on and they would
see growing gen green substance wherever a fecal matter was present.
(03:37):
And it's just a horror show because the individual wearing
and I think it was Meadows, is just seeing just
like green stuff all over people's hands and faces, all
over a baby, all over the walls. It's just grim.
It's true. According to Stanford microbiologist Stanley Falco, the world
is covered in a fine patina of feces, and we
(03:57):
need to start thinking about that because really that is
in forming to some degree our measures of health. So
when I talk about that our health and our microbiome,
we should probably do a quick overview of what a
microbiome is. I know we've talked about it before, but
how it affects us because this is a huge field
um that is growing that that's giving us a ton
(04:18):
of information about how we operate in the world based
on these little critters around us. Yeah. I mean it
comes down to the basic principle that the human body
is not organism, but the human body is organisms living
together in some degree of unison. Yeah, and we're talking
about one trillion microbial cells. You've heard it before. You
(04:40):
are outnumbered ten to one in terms of our own
cells versus bacterial cells. Yeah, we come into this world,
we are colonized, and we remain colonized throughout our entire lives. Yeah.
In fact, when you say we come into this world
when we are born, if we are born vaginally, that's
when we get our first slathering of these acterial cells.
(05:00):
And these are really important because these bacterial cells helped
to inform our immune systems. Yeah, we've evolved with the
set situation. So in a sense, it comes what we're
talking about. Here is a natural extrapolation of this in
terms of our physical environments that we create. Because just
as the human body is not a situation of all, right,
here's the clean human, here's the infected human, it's also
(05:22):
not a clear cut situation of here is a clean
working environment, here is an infected one. All humans are
infected or colonized, and all spaces are colonized. Right, And
the Human Microbiome Project was trying to get a baseline
of what a normal microbiome looks like, and they still
don't have this, by the way, but this is their
first attempts to try to figure out what something might
(05:44):
look typically for each person. So what they did is
they took two hundred scientists at eighty institutions and they
sequenced the genetic material of bacteria taken from two hundred
and fifty healthy people, which by the way, they took
it from all various areas of their body um and
that yielded something like eleven thousand plus samples that they're
going through and again they're trying to figure out what
(06:07):
might a baseline of a normal Microme biome look like
and why does it even matter. Well, it turns out
that each human contains that the ten tho strains of
bacteria with eight million bacterial genes, and this is in
contrast to twenty two human genes. So again this idea
begainst the build that there's things going on in your
bacterial cells that are gaming not just your immune system
(06:30):
but your gut um and informing your gut about how
you feel. Right, we've talked about this before, the mind
body connection between the gut um and also um. We're
also finding out that that each person has a tailor
made combination of bacteria in their body, and bacteria differs
(06:52):
on your body depending on where it is, so it
could be like a rainforest in one area or the
desert in another area, So the workspace becomes a melting.
Each of us is kind of a ship from a
different nation, carrying its own mix of of individuals, ready
to colonize a new world. And then our skin falls off,
as it does in the office place. People break wind,
(07:13):
people's shoes fart as they walk. The pressure of your
your feet and your shoes starts shooting out. So we're
we colonize the world around us with our own particular
cocktail of microbiology. And it's true, right because we we've
talked about this again that the gut microbia that is
in there is specific to your diet. Right, So if
(07:34):
you eat a lot of sushi um then and you
live in Japan, then you have a gut microbe that
can break down seaweed. And your that gut microbe, by
the way, adapted itself from a marine animal, and it
basically took up a sequence of that genetic code of
that marine animal and then took it unto itself to
(07:56):
then be able to use the sequence in your gut,
so it could also break down seaweed. And that I
think is the amazing thing is that bacteria can swap
jeans and pieces of DNA with itself, and that makes
it highly adaptable. So not only are you walking around
in your office with your own microbiome, but it's doing
things that are specific to you. And now, let's say
(08:19):
your office is not necessarily your traditional workspace. Let's say
your office is roller Derby. Okay, what happens? Where? Where
is my desk in the roller Derby? Are you saying
I'm a roller Derby queen? You are a roller Derby queen.
What is your roller Derby name? By the way, oh um,
I like to stick with the show branding. I'll go
with Buster Stuffington. Does it need to be more lady
(08:43):
like Busty Stuffington? Yes, that's my roller Derby name. Okay.
I was going to say Lamb to the slaughter, but
I don't know if that really like shows like hey
like in the water you or is it an individual name,
individual name, individual name. I'm going with Busty Stuffington. Okay?
All right, all right, So you're you're in your office,
which is basically like a roller Derby track. Okay, And
(09:06):
let's say that you're the home team. There are two
other teams that are coming to compete with you in
this tournament. Okay, You've got your microbiome, and your team,
by the way, shares a similar microbiome. All right, So
this is evidence that when we are grouped together in
a situation, we began to share the same aspects of
(09:26):
the same profile of bacteria, which is interesting. Okay, Now,
if you are um about to start your game and
you begin elbowing someone and you just smash into one
of the opposing teams, well, what are you doing when
you come into contact with them? Well, I'm assaulting them
with my elbow bones, but I'm also colonizing them with
(09:47):
a little bit of skin flakes, at least skin flakes,
assuming nothing else comes off. Alright, So exactly now you're
you're swapping your bacterial cells and what it's right, I'm
getting some of theirs on me as well, especially get
them right in the kiss. Right. So what researchers have found,
and this is fascinating, is that, um, not only do
(10:08):
you share the same microbiome or aspects of it with
your team, but by the end of that tournament, when
you get swabbed again, you're going to find out that
the other teams microbiomes that you swapped some sweat with
are now trying to colonize your microbiome. Wow, they're trying
to take you over, at least to the skin level.
(10:31):
And not only that, but your microbiome also has aspects
similar aspects to the roller derby that you primarily work
out of. So the opposing team is taking all of
their bacteria from their roller derby hall and trying home
microbiome advantage in a sense. Well you you you have
(10:51):
the home advantage. Yeah, but they're bringing their environment with you.
So what we're talking about here is like, here's an
extreme form of let's say an office community. It is
not really an office community, but a job, you know,
per se, and they are bringing their environments with them
and they're sharing it with each other. So it becomes
(11:11):
a very interesting question of to what extent can we
affect each other with our microbiomes. So um I wanted
to bring up a New York Or article called Microbiomes
and Health, How we colonize each other with bacteria? Uh
Ball force our tour. He's a gastroenterologist at the University
of North Carolina at Cheple Hill, and he specializes in
(11:33):
inflammatory bool disease like say like crones He says that
there is a growing stack of evidence, some published, some
not that people who have lived with inflammatory boot disease
sufferers for long periods of time they have a higher
rate of it than them themselves than people in the
general population. So there's this growing idea that perhaps you
(11:55):
could be colonized over time by someone else's gut bacteria,
especially if you're exposed to that because as we know,
if you, uh, if you flush the toilet, so the
bacteria gets aerosol ized and then shot up into the
air and then gets on surfaces, and then you can
pick that up. That can that bacteria that you pick
up on your hands can go into your mouth, go
into your gut lo and behold you are and you're
(12:17):
introducing another bacterium. Huh. Now I'm thinking of now with
the posters in the works in our all of our
workspaces that you know, tell you what what sexual harassment is,
and I think one of them is inappropriate touching. Does
this count as inappropriate touching because I did not ask
anyone to invade me with your microbiome and it's happening. Well,
this is that This that's interesting because then you begin, okay,
(12:40):
let's say we have this understanding the microbiome. That's really
like in twenty years, that's really advanced, nuanced. Do people
become hyper aware of how they interact with others? Is
it aggressive to swipe at someone that you don't know
or you're trying to like get your so you have
some sort of stomach ailment and you're trying to give
(13:02):
them your gut bacteria. Don't even I don't even know
what how it got in your hands in the first place,
but you know it could just be an act of
aggression or does it become like a rite of passage.
It's kind of like welcome to the family, Welcome. It's
like being blood brothers with everyone, Like like we we
welcome you into this opera space, office space, and now
we shall have the ritual licking of the palms and
(13:24):
high fiving, so the way we may all be of
the same microbiome. Well, it's true. Just something symbolical like
a handshake becomes that much more Right you start your
first day of work and you have the handshake with people,
we should all do the cough in the hand handshake
first day, just like the solidarity. Yeah, like you might
as well say, hey, we you're gonna get colonized by
by the microbiome here at work, so just let's go
(13:46):
ahead and have at it. Yeah, hold for like five seconds,
just to make sure everybody gets on. Yeah, yeah, all right,
We're gonna take a quick break and when we come back,
we will explore the microbiome roller Derby even more. All right,
(14:10):
We're back with more roller Derby microbiome. We're back, all right.
We wanted to bring up Jessica Green and something called
bio informed design because she's taken this idea, this idea
that we're not just the germs on her skin or
inside of our body, but we're also affecting our environments,
and our environments are affecting us. And she is a
(14:32):
biodiversity scientist and director of the Biology and the Built
Environment Center at the University of Oregon. She has a
good ted talk on this and her work really is
is trying to understand the role of the microbial ecosystems
on human health. So she and her team decided to
study the Littlest building. This is on the campus of
the University of Oregon, and the reason why they wanted
(14:55):
to look at it is because it has a nice
bacterial stu in the form of classrooms, offices, and restrooms,
and so in other words, you get again that fine
patina of feces in the form of restrooms. Right in
the restroom spray. You get a nice transient population of
microbial colonies from students varying backgrounds. Yeah, yeah, who are
(15:19):
trap sing in all sorts of stuff right on their feet,
on their hands that they just ate in their hair,
in your ears, you name it. And then they have
a stable population of colonies in the form of those
who dwell in the office space. So this this is
such an interesting UM project to me because they took
(15:42):
it and they worked with an architect and they sort
of resurrected the building using computer program and then they
started working to say, okay, well if we if we
use this louver system with the windows in one part
of the building. And this louver system, if you've ever
seen them before, they're they're pretty popular like in places
like tropical places like Hawaii where you can just kind
of move these metal grates in the windows and can
(16:06):
move them so that they all line up and they're
flat and they can keep the elements out, okay, or
you could just move them and then they would open
up a bit and you could get some real fresh
air flow in. Yeah, you do seem a lot in
Hawaii where you have more of a stable constant temperature
and you can just keep things pretty pretty nice with
just the natural breeze. Yeah, So they used this um
Sometimes they had natural airfloor airflow coming in and out,
(16:29):
and sometimes they closed it and then they just used
the ventilation system. And what they found is that they
were really specific microbial colonies based on where they were,
So those classrooms had a different profile than say the
offices or even the banks of elevators. And what happened
is that when they open those lovers, they found that
(16:52):
the microbial cloud dissipated with the introduction of fresh air.
And this became really important because man is looking at
how to best uh struct or manipulate that environment to
have a really good or healthy microbial profile for people. Yeah,
it comes down to, like we we said earlier, this
is all this old, outdated idea that we're creating a
(17:15):
pristine indoor environment for our pristine indoor lives and that
that's completely cut out from the teeming living world outside. No,
we can't have it that cut and try we're gonna
have microbes living all in our environments, but we're gonna
have a different type of environment and not necessarily and
we'll certainly the research is saying not a better one, right,
And she's she's very cautious about the research because it's
(17:37):
pretty early with this, a little too cautious. The interview
I was seeing that kept like kind of trying to
seed some like really mind blowing comments and she's like,
I'm not going there just yet. Research is and which
is commendable. She's she's holding back and saying that we're
working on that that's the next phase or the research
doesn't really indicate exactly what kind of take we should
have on this just yet, right, because she's saying that
the next phase of their research is trying to lie
(18:00):
ing up to two bits of this, the environment and
the humans, the two kinds of ecosystems, and really bear
out some some research that she already has a hunch about,
but she wants to see them work together in parallel
before she says anything. And again, this is this is
sort of a new field because if this bears out
the sort of things that we think it will, then
(18:20):
architects will begin to consider this in design, so you're
not just gonna have a green building that has low
carbon emissions, but you're also going to have a green
building with a healthy microbiome in it. So it's it's
interesting because she she also is looking at the study
with Portland or a Portland hospital, and again it's that
(18:42):
mechanical ventilated rooms that is showing an increase in pathogens.
So in other words, if they didn't give this this
hospital access to outside air to help dissipate that microbial cloud,
then it turned out that those pathogens increased because again
you're manipulating in the environment and you're making it uh
(19:04):
so that these pathogens can live and actually thrive in it.
And this is a hospital setting, so that's obviously a
problem you have. You end up with your outdoor air
and then you have your indoor air, and the indoor
air is full of things as well. It's it's not
again not this pristine, clean stuff that we think it is. Uh.
They're finding that the bacterial communities and indoor environments contain
many taxes that are absent or rare outdoors, including again
(19:27):
many of those that are tidy human pathogens. So you
have this alti artificial environment, this kind of zoo of
weird things circulating in the air. And she's saying, like,
you know, in terms of a hospital environment, it's a
little like having a weed in your your backyard and
just torching the entire backyard to get rid of the weed.
The same thing as happening in these hospital environments. And
(19:50):
it's important to have the outside air come in because
you know, when you have traces of the outdoors and
you have traces of say, soil come in, that's soil.
It turns out, is really important to create that profile
of what a healthy microbiome might look like. In fact,
there is a bacterium and soil called myceo bacteria and
(20:11):
vici that scientists at the Stage Colleges of Troy, New
York found can actually reduce anxiety and increase learning capabilities.
When yes, and of course this is in mice, but
when they when they fed it to them or when
they inhaled it, yes, it increased neuron growth and it
caused the serotonin levels to increase, which reduced their anxiety.
(20:34):
And then this is so cool when they wanted to
test to see if it increased or enhance their learning abilities,
researcher Dorothey Matthews and her colleagues fed them this bacterium,
or rather one group and then a control group, and
then they let them loose on this maze. And it
turned out that the group had been that had been
dosed with the bacteria. Yes, although that would be for
(20:57):
a second era of picturing humans instead of mice. And
it was up crazy going through a maze after being
dosed with bacteria. Somehow my mind they're naked, Yes, of
course they're running naked through the maze. But those minds
that that were dosed they actually were able to run
through twice as fast with less demonstrated anxiety behaviors as
control mice. So there's this idea again that um, some
(21:21):
of these bacterium or some of this bacteria is very
helpful to the way that our bodies respond to our
environments and actually um navigate our world. Yeah, I mean,
we all know that sunlight is good, you know, and
you want of an office space that has windows in it,
you know, you can want to get some natural sunlight,
get some of that vitamin D. But but but but again,
(21:44):
we all we fall into that idea that this is
this is a clean place, and we don't want a
bunch of dirt around, but we're actually smelling the dirt,
interacting with the dirt, interacting with that outside air, far
healthier for us than that so called clean air that's
coming out of that ventilation duct. Yeah. And you've studying
after study about kids who that are exposed to dirt,
particularly kids that live in rural areas, are on farms.
(22:06):
They have a far more robust immune system than kids
who are kept in very clean and environments. And as
we you know, begin to learn more and more about
microbiome and how it is gaining us in our environment,
I think this becomes really important. And I'm very intrigued
by this idea of designing microbial environment for ourselves, particularly
(22:27):
in our human habitats, which are our homes and our
office spaces. Yeah, because that's really where we're leading with
all of this. I mean, that's the really the mind
blowing idea of it here, is that reaching an age
where you're designing a building, not only the structures they're
they're present in the the engineering of the building and
the look of the spaces and the movement of people
through it, but also the movement of micro bacteria through it,
(22:49):
the managing of the microbiome of the building almost like
it's itself a living thing, and realizing that it's an
artificial environment and finding ways to to make sure that
that skews in the positive direction instead of the negative.
You know, I would love a little beneficial bacteria to
be introduced during the winter months here in our office,
because that's when we all get sick and we don't
(23:12):
necessarily stay home when we should, and we cough all
over everything. So it would be nice to sort of say, okay,
we're going to fog the place with some good germs,
just bringing the dirt. You know, it makes me think
of the some of the vampire myths where the vampire
needs to sleep in in its own like grave soil,
it's native grave soul. I believe that this was in
the in bron Stoker's original Dracula, but he needed he
(23:33):
need some of that girl Transylvanian dirt to bring it with. Yeah,
So it's it's kind of like that, like maybe that's
what it is, that the vampires need the natural microbiome
that they knew in the grave. Just you know, new
soil and a new land is not going to do it. UM,
So in addition to our yoga room that we would
like in a meditation room, our labyrinth room, and our cafe,
(23:57):
Holly requested a human dog rund room as well. All right,
the human dog run room we'll need, um, I don't know,
some sort of like dirt play area, some sort of
backyard habitat. Yeah, or I guess like just like a
Roman atrium where it's just open to the elements and
it has plants growing in it and you know, a
(24:17):
statue of God. See when you make it all fancy.
I like it here, I am. I'm just about to, like,
you know, throwing a couple of pails for us in
the dirt. But yeah, sculptures would be nice. All right, Well,
there you have it. I think a few takeaways that
we should make here. First of all, realizing that are
the the artificiality of our indoor spaces, and how artificiality
(24:41):
UM is not certainly not always good. UM. Open a
window if you can breathe in that outdoor air. And
unless there's a warning that you need to stay indoors
depends on what kind of city you live in. Here
in the Atlanta we occasionally get those warnings. UM, smell
the dirt. If you haven't already, make sure you smell
some dirt, smells some plants. It's gonna help you. It
(25:02):
may make you your brain work better, and it may
reduce anxiety. And also take note that roller Derby girls
are not just doing battle at the physical level, but
also the sell or level, the microbial level. So when
you see the next tournament you see, just know that
there's a different kind of calling and station going on. Well,
(25:23):
they tend to look kind of grubby out there, so
it's I mean good grubby, but you know they're sweating,
there might be a little blood. You know, makeup is
getting kind of smeared. So right now, ripe for these
sort of conditions exactly for the sort of takeover one another.
Al Right, Well, on that note, let's call over our
robot here, and let's let's go with a little listener
(25:45):
mail see what people have shared with us. All right,
this one comes to us from Sha. Sha writes and says, hello,
Robert and Julie. I was pursuing past episodes the other day,
and to my delight, came across the science of gremlins
and magua. I'm all so a magua lover, Uh, the
grimlins not so much, and proceeded to listen with attentionness
(26:05):
and gusto as I performed my household duties as I
usually do, to the tune of your wonderful voices. I
was very much enjoying the science of these fascinating creatures
until about three quarters through the podcast, you, Robert, made
a grievous era and had me doubting all faith in
your scientific researchability and dedication to educating the masses with
factual information. You were discussing survival in a natural environment
(26:27):
and went on to say how pugs were selectively bred
to be ridiculous lap dogs and would not survive in
a natural environment. Well, I never you, sir, have obviously
failed to to really think about the design features of
the remarkable pug breed. Luckily for you, I am here
to fill you in. First. The eyes of the pug
are very big and sit almost to the side of
(26:48):
their cute little face. This is so that they can
see predators and pray from all angles, an essential trait
for survival. The curly tale of the pug isn't just
for being adored, but can aid in stick retrieval. Uh.
They can quite easily hold onto a stick with that curl,
and therefore achieve numerous things, such as they could build
a shelter to keep them safe from the elements. Pugs
(27:09):
are that sophisticated. If there happen to be two pugs
holding sticks, they can rub them together to spark a fire.
It could happen also holding a stick. It makes them
look larger and more threatening, perfect rewarding off predators. My pugs,
yes I'm a pug owner, have very thick coats, which
would certainly be enough installation in a milder climate, perhaps
not the Arctic, but maybe here in New Zealand. Also,
(27:30):
don't discount the use of a pug in a domesticated environment.
A pug will happily warm your lap all day if
needed in the winter. Well, I hope you have had
an eye opening experience, and we'll think again before making
such ignorant remarks. Yours truly, Shay. Well, there you go.
There's some there's some of nature's wondrous innovations in the
(27:51):
form of the pug. Um the eyes of the pug.
The eyes of the pug. I hadn't really thought about
their certainly their prey so much. Um because their prey journal.
He stays in one space, one place and squeaks when
it's poked um. But but you know, I did rag
on the pugs some in that particular podcast, and I
did have to self correct like a little like a
(28:12):
few weeks later when I saw a pug helper dog
on Marta on on the train going home from work,
which gave me a whole all new respect for the
pug is a useful breed and not merely a lap dog.
So I had to take a lot back. I have
a lot more respect for pugs, now, that's true. That's true.
You did bring that up, and you did say the
pug is worth my time or more worth my time.
(28:33):
But now I know they can build things and and
and create fire. So yeah, I mean they walk softly
and they carry big sticks. All right. Here's another one.
This one comes to us from Heather. Heather says, Hello,
I just listened to your coffee podcast and I had
to write in I'm one of those caffeine intolerant individuals.
I love coffee, but I have immediate and severe gastro
intestinal results when I drink a cup. Interestingly, I used
(28:54):
to be able to drink coffee, tea, hot cocoas, soda,
et cetera. But in college, one night I drank way
too many ups as I was at a coffee house,
around sixteen cups of coffee. I was quote unquote coffee
drunk that night, nauseous, uh, spinning room, and had a
bad hangover the next day. I had coffee, tea and
soda after that, but started to be more sensitive to
it until I finally had to stop. Now, twenty years later,
(29:17):
I'm even more sensitive to it because I have stayed
away from it for so long. I can have chocolate solid,
not hot chocolate, but I have only small amounts at
a time. Thanks for the interesting podcast, Heather. You know,
I was wondering what would happen to someone if they
drank that amount, like, you know, just excess amounts. And
now you know that's I mean, because you really have
(29:37):
to dedicate yourself to drinking coffee all day long for that. Well,
there's a Futurama episodes where Fry drinks a hundred cups
and had a hundred cups um time stops and he's
able to move around supersed and save the day. This
reminds me there was a convergence of our coffee episode
and also our Stendelf syndrome episode we had recently. We
(29:57):
had a listener right in and talk about having that
Stendahl effect when they walk into I think a costco
and overwhelmed by like the size and scope of of
commercial America and it gives them like physical unease. And
then also we talked about coffee and about how it
makes that you need to uh to poop well. UM.
I recently went to a Costco for the first time,
(30:19):
and I had been to a Sam's Club in the past,
but I've never been to a costco UM. But my
wife recently got a membership, so we we went there
to buy some things in ridiculous bulk and UH, and
we were about halfway into the store. It's a huge space,
like enormous space with just it's overwhelming, and I'm overwhelmed
by the size of things. But then there's a guy
handing out a little cups of coffee, so I take
(30:40):
one because that's what you do. And it made me
feel a little more safe because I felt like I
was back in a smaller Trader Joe's or something, and
I'm drinking a little cup of coffee, but then I
had to go uh and it was like, you are
going there, okay, yeah, yes, yes, I had the coffee,
and suddenly I really had to go to the bathroom.
And at first I thought it was just like, all right,
after I find the giant container of soysage that I
(31:02):
need to find and bring that to the cart, then
I really need to think about finding a bathroom. But
then I quickly realized, no, there's no time for so soysage.
I need to find the restaurant and the dead center
of the store, and I have no idea where it is.
So I did, and I knew that I would given
the distances involved, I would only have time to head
for one corner of the store and hope that that's
where the bathroom is and if it and if it
(31:22):
wasn't there, then I would have to create one of
my own. Fortunately it worked out and I picked the
right corner of the store, but it was it was
a very frightening experience. Wow, I mean that's yeah, seriously,
I'm glad that you dropped your soysage agenda. Yes, I
didn't have a choice. Um so with the toilet supersized um.
(31:42):
The bathrooms were nice, I was improved, but they were
not enormous toilets, and there were not an enormous amount
of them. I have heard that Costco was supposed to
be a fancier version of Sam's. Well, I haven't been
in a stams in a while, so I can't really
speak to that. But Costco was what's clean inside, and
there were lots and lots of things to buy. So
so if you ever find yourself a scout out of
(32:03):
the bathrooms, first certainly before you have any coffee. All right,
here's another one from a listener who wishes to remain anonymous. Uh.
He writes in this is high blow the mind. Guys.
When I got out of federal prison, I had three
years of probation. One of the terms of my probation
was that I not play any soccer. Considering the playing
soccer had nothing to do with my crime, it seemed
ridiculous to me to give up playing. The problem was
(32:25):
that I also have have to be polygraphed every four
to six months. As the time for my first polygraph approach,
and I was playing soccer four or five times a week,
I started to search for ways to get around it. Uh.
The TAC technique, which we've mentioned in the episode about
like putting attack in your shoe and causing some physical
pain there. The TAC technique seemed a little too obvious,
but the idea of creating a false baseline seemed like
(32:48):
the way to go. As you may not know from
watching movies and TV, the person administering a polygraph will
only ask you yes, no questions, So the question is
not what is your name, but rather is your name
in certain name? Here to create a false baseline, My
simple solution was that whenever they asked me a baseline question,
are you sitting down, do you speak English? Et cetera,
I would imagine that he had asked me did you
(33:09):
play soccer? This served the dual purpose of giving my
line a little boost for the simple question, and when
they asked the question about soccer, actually they would ask
have you done anything in the past four months to
violate your parole. I was a little relief that I
was finally being asked, and so my line wouldn't react
as much in line talking about the line that goes
up and down on the polygraphy. This all worked work
(33:32):
to charm and I easily passed all of my polygraphs.
The only trouble came at the one time I was
so focused on asking myself the wrong question that when
the polygrapher asked if I was sitting down, I immediately said, no,
I really enjoy your show. And if I ever get
arrested again in my probation states that I can't listen
to stuff to blow your mind, I am confident that
I will be able to continue listening and pass my polygraphs.
(33:53):
Uh any polygraphs they might give me cheers, Oh yeah, okay,
that I mean that was firsthand knowledge on this, right,
I mean what I love hearing that because you know,
we we do all this research, and we you know,
we have some anecdotal stuff from some of the research
that we that we call. But to be able to
hear this person's playing this sort of game with that
(34:16):
is really fascinating and how he or she went about it,
yea with high stakes. All right, And here's a final
one from Murphy. Murphy right senses high Robert and Julie.
I've been drinking coffee since I was a little over
a year old. I was begging for what mom was drinking,
and she gave me a taste to determine the plan.
Backfire caused me to grow up under the influence of caffeine.
After listening to your podcast, I wonder what life would
(34:38):
be like without my usual one to three cups in
the morning. But then I thought about I thought that
any observation of myself will change the behavior of myself,
and no accurate data will be recorded. It sounds like
somebody's been drinking coffee this morning, and writing this thought
could of course be a lie in my coffee saturated brain,
invented to keep itself from having to live a day
(34:58):
abstaining from the delicious, delicious toxins. Uh. There is no
good way to sum this up, Murphy, and people feel
very passionate about their coffee. Yeah, it's the dark brown God,
and UH, I depend on it, so I'm not gonna
attempt to toward it. So there you have it. A
few listener mails to get through. UH. Sadly we don't
have time for more in this episode, but we'll continue
(35:20):
to try and the pimp them out, and we would
love for you to keep sending them to us, particularly
in regards to this episode, UH and in our previous
ones about workspaces and the microbiome. In your workspace. Um,
how does this change your way of looking at your
work environment? How does it change the way you think
about the air that's coming in through that event versus
(35:40):
the air that comes in through that window? If you
could possibly open it on your building, Um, we would
love to hear from you. Let us know. You can
find us on a number of places. We of course
have stuff to Blow your Mind dot com, the mothership
of all the things that we do. You can also
find us on social media. We're on Facebook and tumble
and Stuff to Blow your Mind. We are on Twitter
is blow to Mind and over there on YouTube. But
we've put all of our fabulous videos up at mind
(36:02):
Stuff Show, and you can also drop us a line
let us know about your microbial adventures at below the
Mind at Discovery dot com. For more on this and
thousands of other topics, visit how Stuff Works dot com.
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