April 10, 2025 • 28 mins
Ben and Ashley are back to break down the latest Bachelor Nation headlines!
Clayton Echard called Gabby Windey a bully after what she said about his dance moves… whose side are you on??
And we try to get to the bottom of Jason Tartick and Kaitlyn Bristowe’s feud over a dog/baby name!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
This is the Ben and Ashley I Almost Famous podcast
with on our radio.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
It's time for headlines today. We have some headlines to
talk about.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Now.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Usually when we break down headlines, we'll have a whole
list like ten headlines, some of them major, some of
them minor, some of them just great updates. This episode, specifically,
we're going to concentrate on two headlines that feel like
they're dominating the airways of Bachelor Nation, and we want
to do a deep dive into both on what we know,
(00:34):
what we think, and any details that might have been
missed along the way as you've just been catching up
scrolling through your social media. The first headline is this,
it's actually what we're gonna call it a topic. It's
the Gabby versus Clayton situation going on right now. Ashley,
(00:55):
this is about a week going on that's just on
what's happened for anybody that has no idea what we're
talking about.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
All right, So Gabby was on the Lost Culture Restas
podcast and she's just you know, chatting about her life
and they brought up Clayton and she said that Clayton's
dance posts on Instagram and TikTok will make you run,
it'll it'll make you wish you didn't have eyes. And
(01:25):
then I could see there's some humor in that. But
then she says he looked like a toe, and then
it made and then she made a reference to like
the Bachelor universe, where like you're filming and you're like
wrapped up in a situation, and then like all of
a sudden, you're basically like attracted to somebody who like
(01:46):
looks like a toe, or you're like admitting feelings for
somebody that you just don't think is that much to
look at.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Let me pause you here, because this is the first
big statement made by Gabby. I don't quite know if
I know what she's talking about. So is she like
saying he looks like a toe, or is that some
like new age new verbiage that like references something else,
or is he she like literally comparing him to a toe.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
I think it might be kind of both.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
But I know that when people say you look like
a toe, like when people say that, it usually just
means like you're just not cute.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Okay, all right, so.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
There you go. And then like I totally understand why
this would be offensive to Clayton and like, I don't
know that I would personally respond because like sometimes I
feel like there's like more power and not showing that
it got to But Clayton got on his own social
media and he called her out for being a bully
(02:43):
because she's talking shit about his looks and his passions.
Like he has talked about how dancing has made him
just like a happier person and it's been an outlet
for him when he was in a deep dark depression
after the show.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
And lots of Bachelornatione came to his support.
Speaker 3 (03:01):
Joan was very vocal in the comments section Kelly Flanagan
and Dotton also he said, that's how you handle it,
my guy, mad respect you keep doing you Clayton, And
this is not where the drama ends. But Ben, do
you have anything to comment on here, because like right now,
at this point, I am definitely team Clayton, Like, you know,
(03:23):
he stood up for himself and she was being I
don't know if I like like bully, Like bully is
like what I think about when you're like like harassing
someone on the playground. But like here, I just think
she's being mean. You know, It's just she's just saying
one nice things that she could just keep to herself.
You know, if you want to make fun of your ex,
(03:45):
just say it to your friends.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
You don't have to say it on a podcast.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
I mean, I think bullying is any time anybody of
influencer power uses that influence and power over somebody else. Right,
that can be like physical strength, platform whatever. Gabby obviously
has a bigger platform than Clayton. Her following, especially coming
off of Traders, is so much greater than Clayton's that
you know, what, what is she actually doing here by
(04:12):
even speaking about Clayton, because right now she's off doing
this totally different thing. I think what I Yeah, at
this moment in the conversation, based on her podcast, I
do think it is. It is just simply mean, And
I think I would imagine Gabby could admit that, like
(04:33):
she wasn't saying this to uplift Clayton or be nice,
like this was a mean thing to say his dancing, though,
I would say, hey, if you're critical of it, I
don't know if that's necessarily a problem, Like you don't
have to watch his videos.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
I don't think it's a.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Turn on, like me watching him on Instagram dance I'd
be like, mmm, that's not That's not something that I
want to see from my husband. But I know it's okay.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
But if it's if he's doing it strictly because it
makes him happy, great, But he also has to realize
I think at this moment in time, I'm just saying
what from what I know. He also has to realize
that people are going to be critical of his dancing
if he's going to post it on social media. Like
we always say, if you share it with the public,
you're opening the public up for opinion. Not everybody has
(05:22):
to be like, Oh, Clayton, look how great you are
at doing these moves. They can be like, hey, man,
like this is weird for me to watch. That's okay.
If it was really just for his mental health, he
would keep it, you know, private, But maybe he is
getting some satisfaction out of the positive comments that do
come along the way.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
Ben totally totally agree with you her saying his dancing
post will make you ron you'll wish you didn't have eyes.
That's her being funny. I think it crosses the line
into being mean when she says, like this show is
going to make you like fall for somebody who looks
like a cow.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
Yes, one hundred percent agree. Okay, So that's where we
start this thing out at. And also moving on then
to Clayton's response to her saying these things about looking
like a toe and his dance dancing particularly and Ashley
take it away with his response.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
Okay, Well, his response was him being like, you're bullying
me over looks and passions, and that's where he got
all like the responses from bachtinnations saying, you know, way
to defend yourself.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
She's being a little bitchy.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
Which is totally good too. I will say that's totally fine.
You should defend yourself this.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Back and forth totally fine, cool, fine.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
I mean, well, you know she was being mean, but
she was also I could see her being a little
funny in there too. I can if she was going
to defend herself by saying I was being a little
funny a little bit. Okay. So then Gabby fires back
on TikTok, and this is where she loses me. I mean,
I still was more team Clayton, but yes, she definitely
loses me here when she talks about how she humiliates,
(07:01):
she goes, that's rich of you to say that I'm
bullying because you came out and humiliated me and told
everybody on national TV that we had sex.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
And I'm like, okay, but this is not the.
Speaker 3 (07:15):
Same situation because you guys were all on a reality
show and you both willingly all went into fantasy suites,
and you know that a lot of the times what
happens in fantasy sweets doesn't stay in fantasy sweets, and like,
you're on a TV show, Like, yeah, lots of parts
of that relationship that you have on a TV show,
(07:36):
it's going to be exploited.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
And this is like years ago.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
So then he can't help himself and he gets on
Instagram and he's like, this is unnecessary for you to
keep bringing up. We have talked about the fact that
I'm sorry that I brought our fantasy suite intimacy up
on TV.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Also, you know, I was the lead.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
You know that, like I, those are things that, like,
as the lead, is very difficult to keep secret.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
We're on a TV show.
Speaker 3 (08:11):
I have tried to apologize to you numbers of times,
and then he shared DMS between the two of them
in twenty twenty three where he apologized to Gabby and
by looking at the DMS, it looks as if like
she was responding to him and they were like, oh
cool too. There was some of it where she didn't respond,
but like in the midst of like all their dms,
she has like responded to him and they like seem cool.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
So that's the breakdown of the situation. The back and
forth has happened. She is, you know, I think again
I'll put words in her mouth, which isn't fair. My
assumption is she knew she was not being nice when
she made those original comments. Clayton came back with defending himself,
which he had every right to do, and defending this
thing that he says helps his mental health out a lot,
(09:05):
which is dancing, which is great. And it feels like
he's confident enough in dancing that even with the criticisms
and the critiques, he continues to do it, which makes
me go, good for you, man, Like I love it.
If I'm not good at something, I'm never posting it
on social media. But this is obviously something you care
about and that is healthy for you, and you enjoy
(09:27):
showing off kind of your progress, So great, keep running
with that, honestly. The response by Gabby, I do agree
is where I got lost in the whole thing. This
was a it felt like pulling back something way back
in the future that obviously hurt her, which again they've
talked about and they seemed to be okay with. And
(09:49):
that's where things get weirdest for me is if you've
explained yourself, both parties has talked about it, some conclusion
has been granted, you kind of hope forgiveness is given,
and then this isn't brought up years later, and it's
also weird that and I just think this is like
always odd. The person that started this dialogue, right, Gabby
(10:13):
came on this podcast Clayton wasn't really talking about Gabby
at the time. Is also the one then like doubling down.
She's done, that's the best way to say. She doubled
down on this, saying no, I had every right to
do this. I meant what I said. You called me
out for having sex with you in the fantasy suite
and that is a woman's job to share publicly.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
Which oh, yeah, that's right, that you said that. I
was like, wait a second, it goes both ways. It
just don't make this sense.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
There, Yeah, yeah, exactly, like a stretch a little bit,
but that's kind of where we're at now. Okay. So
my question for you, Ashley is is there any more
follow up from either of them on either side about
this or is this just done now and it will
kind of fade off into nowhere's.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
Laying Technically it would be Gabby's time to respond, as
Hugh did respond to her TikTok. I don't think Gabby
is gonna take it any further. So I think that,
if anything, people are trying to use this now as
a as a method to get Clinton on Dancing.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
With the Stars. Okay, I mean cool, I'm seeing in
the comments on TikTok.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
I mean all four it. If he loves dancing and
Dancing with the Stars is open to having him, I'd
say go for it. Man.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
So I say that if this goes anywhere it takes
him to Dancing with the Stars, that's good for him.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Then he can't be met. He's going to be ecstatic.
Speaker 3 (11:33):
Yeah, I know exactly, which he'll have to say, thank you,
Gabby for bringing me up in public again.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Sure you your traders high?
Speaker 2 (11:42):
Oh goodness gracious. Okay, So the next topic is this one, Ashley,
and it feels like We've talked about this topic so often,
and there's a there's an element here, as we talked
about kind of last week, that controversy seems to bring
conversation and controversy scene to keep some type of relevance.
It doesn't really feel like the healthiest path. It doesn't
(12:05):
really feel like how most want to be, you know,
what most want to be known for. But the Caitlyn
and Jason thing has lasted so much longer than Caitlin
and Shawna. I thought that thing lasted forever. There is
something about Caitlin Bristow's relationships that once they go public
and once they end. I told Jess this the other day.
(12:25):
It kind of reminds me of the Taylor Swift effect,
where it's like they're always kind of there, like they're
always kind of like the ghosts.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Of the past, a good analogy.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
It's like you can like they never fully remove themselves
from the situation. And it feels like that way with Caitlin.
It does. And Jason and Caitlin's conversation or their relationship
was brought back up again here recently on a podcast
that Caitlyn did. It was her podcast, but she had
a guest host kind of interviewing her about a situation
(12:56):
that just happened. Now, Ashley, Let's be clear, we've covered
Caitlin and Jason for a long time.
Speaker 3 (13:02):
Though.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
There has been a lot of kind of subliminal and
quiet messaging within both of their social medias and both
of their public appearances about each other. Isn't there's a
lot of love lost. I would say there is a
lot of love lost in this relationship. There is a
lot of moments of tension and the two of them
(13:25):
being upset with each other and not feeling like this
relationship with something that kind of was healthy. Well, recently
Caitlyn spoke out on this podcast about kind of what
it feels like is her tipping point, the moment that
she really is fired up over Ashley? What is it?
(13:46):
And then we'll talk about if it's a big deal
or not.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
Oh, to me, it's a big deal, all right.
Speaker 3 (13:51):
So on the first day they ever met, Caitlyn and
Jason talked about children names, talked about what she has
planned to name her child for a long time, and
she told him it was Teddy. And I'm assuming this
is a conversation that was brought up multiple times leading
up to their engagement, as at some point they were
(14:12):
planning on having children together. But she has the receipts
that on day one she told him Theodore, but it
would never be named Theodore. It would be named Teddy.
It would always go by Teddy. And then he gets
this dog, asks Instagram what he should name the dog.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
There are a.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
Couple suggestions as to Teddy, I think, and then he
announces a couple of days later that he ends up
naming the dog Teddy. This is to me, huge deal,
total no, No, this would cross This would get me
over the edge in which I would just have to
have a vinsaese publicly about this, because it was a
public relationship and I personally could not let him get
(14:58):
away with this. And you and I are totally different
when it comes to this stuff, that's all. You and
I are totally different. You're stronger willed person. I could
just tell by your facial expression that you're like, no,
this is something that you can just keep to yourself
and be the bigger person. And I'm like, absolutely no, that.
Speaker 2 (15:16):
Is not at all what I think You're really No.
I think this is really sad, but I think it's
really sad I think it is.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
Uh No, I don't this.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
You are.
Speaker 1 (15:30):
Absolutely no idea where you're gonna go.
Speaker 3 (15:32):
All I know is that you normally think that Caitlyn
and I should be more private.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
Yeah. I still I still hold onto that I don't care.
I don't back down on the fact that I think
there's like room for privacy here. Yeah. And maybe the
question of do I think this is a big deal, yes,
it is a public relationship. I do feel like at
this point Caitlyn was at her breaking point. And I
don't know that. My only advice to Kaitlyn as a
friend or in general would be, I don't know if
(16:00):
you ever speak out publicly when you feel like you're
at your breaking point, because I think what it ends
up doing is it it communicates a lot of like
drama and a lot of anger that maybe you're just
feeling in the moment. Like I don't know how this
played out, but I imagine at playing out like this.
Caitlyn sees that Jason names the dog Teddy, she calls
up her friends. She's like, you got to get over
(16:21):
here and interview me because I am mad and I'm
not going to talk about myself, and so to answer
your question, I do, though, feel like it's a big deal.
I do feel like it is. It showed a lack
of respect, It showed a lack of care for somebody
that you're obviously not like fans of right now, but you,
(16:44):
at one point in your life had a lot of
love for. And if this was an obvious conversation the
two of them had about this baby name and how
Caitlyn has always dreamed of naming her child this name,
and then you name your dog that name, and I
know that Instagram would asked, and I know people recommended Teddy.
There are ways to set that up for people to
(17:05):
send in messages like you should name it Teddy. Uh,
I don't. I'm not like playing, I'm not agreeing with
that and saying, oh, this is just a random, like
voted on name. I think this was definitely shots fired.
Do I think it needed to be handled from Caitlin
in the way that it did. I don't know. It's
up to her, but I definitely can see where she
(17:27):
would be upset and sad. My word for this would
be sad. This this if I was Kitlyn, and I'd
just be sad that this name has seemed to be
taken away from me, like that's so sad.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
Point if somebody had named if my act named their
dog Dawson, after I had it planned for fifteen years.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
I would bust. I would be so angry.
Speaker 3 (17:48):
And to me, it would feel like to me, okay,
I'm gonna be freaking honest right now, I maybe call
me like, you know, maybe people are just going to
see like my friendship with Caitlyn like obvious here, but
guess what, I don't care. This to me felt like
an intentional move to him, like an intentional move to see, like,
let's see if I can annoy her so bad that
(18:12):
and then she has to make this decision whether or
not to explode at me publicly or keep it in.
And either way I'm winning because I'm dominating space in
her mind. And if she does explode publicly, then people
are gonna there's gonna be fifty percent of the people
on my side.
Speaker 2 (18:29):
Yeah, that'd be really, that'd be a really. I mean,
I think I know how like how friends work, and
I think that's You've been a great friend, so I
like and a bit in a protector of your friendship,
which is awesome. I can't say that I think that's
how this went down, other than I will say if
(18:50):
it is what went down, and Jason does see the
headlines and he already listens to the podcast, like that
is a place that you need to check yourself, Like
you need to figure out where your intentions are and
what you're trying to actually do and how you're trying
to create space on the airwaves and in somebody else's head.
Because it is sad no matter what if this was intentional,
(19:11):
if it was a forgotten about thing by Jason and
he forgot they had this conversation or what. It is
really sad that Caitlin told him this and now this
has been taken from her outside of everything else. I
know that people had a negative reaction to her interview.
She had to come out publicly. We're going to talk
about her public apology in just a second. I get
(19:33):
that they did, and I know that they feel like
she's making a situation, a small situation, a big one,
and really creating this drama. But we have to understand
that it is sad no matter what if it was
intentional or not. This name is no longer going to
be able to be used by her, and like that
just hurts a little bit, no matter who you are.
Speaker 3 (20:05):
The most innocent way we could think about this is
that he did somehow forget that this was going to
be her name. And I just don't believe that, because
I don't believe that you can be engaged to someone
and then not remember what you were planning on naming
your kids.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Yeah, I mean, if this was intentional, I would just say, like,
that's a really tough place to be in in life
when you're making these type of decisions that will hurt
others intentionally, and I just cannot put that on somebody
without knowing that to be the case.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
So like, I'm sorry, Like this is my apology to
Jason if I am wrong, But I just find it's
hard to believe that you wouldn't remember what she was
going to name the dog.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
And now I understand that.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
Caitlin went off further in this podcast episode about Jason,
and she said, like a lot she should have ended
the relationship earlier because a lot of what they were
doing together just felt like business, like social media. They
were staying together for social media for way too long,
and she said that felt gross. Nicky, I think that's
(21:06):
kind of where people have the problem is that she's
like continuing to air out issues about their hurt their relationship,
and then she wasn't just focused on this dog name thing.
But I understand how feelings and emotions work, especially when
you're in a public relationship and people aren't seeing your
side because like sometimes it feels like the other person's
(21:26):
playing the game better or people are more tracted to
the way that they play the game.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
So I understand the frustration, and it boiled up.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
It boiled up. It boiled up for sure. And as
I've said publicly before, don't mess with Kaylen Bristow. No
matter what here is happening, I don't mess with her
because once you unleash her, she will she will make
sure the public knows how she's feeling and what she's thinking.
And that's why people love her too, It's why people
follow her show. However, this situation in this podcast interview
(22:00):
did it feel like hit a nerve with Caitlin because
she did come out on her off the Vine podcast
up kind of group and make an apology. I'll read
this apology and Ashley will get your reactions. She says,
I'm coming to my audience who means the most to me.
I take accountability for wanting to hold someone back from podcasting.
(22:21):
I knew deep down this was a me problem, and
I also knew it would start a crossover that would
be hard in a relationship. What I thought would happen
did I clearly didn't leave when he did it. Anyways,
I did more therapy around it and was just it
was just a boundary I made clear that was crossed,
(22:42):
and I tried to work through it. But there was
so much more than just that. Again, I see how
it can seem unfair. Yes, Teddy is a common dog name.
Yes he can name his dog whatever he wants. And
it's eft up that he knew it was my dream
baby Now, we talked about it.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
For years, talked about it for years.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Yes, I have major things to work on in relationships,
and I've already done so much work. I've seen tremendous
growth in myself. I'm so proud of who I am today.
My timeline of processing and being who I am doesn't
have to look like anyone else's standard for a timeline.
I see all the love and I want to give
it all back. I see all the hate and I
(23:26):
want to give them love too. No one like that
will ever understand and that's okay. I don't understand them either.
Navigating a world where sharing your story is risky, freeing,
and extremely hard, but I encourage everyone to think about it,
and yes, do not wish ill on anyone. I'm choosing
(23:50):
now to let them, and I'm glad I gave some context.
I don't like that I'm still talking about it, but
it felt good to stand up for myself. Of course,
have moved on, and it doesn't mean I can't speak
my truth. Do I have anxiety around a calculator response?
I do. Do I think that he subtly shades me
(24:10):
a lot? Yes, but I'm choosing light and prayer moving
forward for everyone.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
I love this Off.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
The Vine family so much. Thank you Upward, nonward high vibes,
wah Ashley, and closing here, this was her apology, kind
of reinstating some things that she felt strongly about, but
also admitting some things that maybe she overreacted to.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
What's your take?
Speaker 3 (24:36):
Okay, Well, I want to clarify the first paragraph of
her apology. She says she wants to take accountability for
holding somebody back from podcasting, So basically, she said really
early on Jason, I don't want you doing podcasts because
the podcasting is my thing, and she didn't want them
to be competing and podcasting. And again it was just
(24:58):
like kind of like a let's we're intermingling our romantic
relationship with a business relationship too much. So she's apologizing
for that, and I, you know, good, I would see
how people would have an issue with that.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
The teddy thing.
Speaker 3 (25:13):
I'm not gonna I still stand by what I said earlier.
And then the rest of her apology, I think like
if her audience really had a problem with her talking
about Jason in this way, I think they also need
to think about what she's told us on this podcast before,
and that is that, like our is public, and sometimes
(25:37):
when the stuff that relates back to us gets like
brought up again in the mainstream, like you know, Jason's
dog name, or like when we see it on social media,
like we have to kind of comment about it, because
it'd be weird if we have this platform in which
we like have our job is to speak and to
speak about you know, bachelor related things a lot of
(25:59):
the times, and then we just don't speak about that.
So you and I end up talking about x'es on
this podcast in a way that normal people wouldn't talk
about their exes. Still, like, it makes sense for us
to talk about people who we dated because we dated
it on TV in front of our audience, which is
why she brings.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
Him up so much.
Speaker 3 (26:19):
She wouldn't bring them up if it was just like
this guy that she dated in her early twenties.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
I agree. No, I don't really have a problem with
people talking about past relationships and clarifying, especially when it
feels like you need to do it to protect yourself.
And that goes both sides, right, that goes from that
goes on both sides. I understand that. I think there's
a respect level there. I think there is a level
(26:46):
of trust still. You know, you shared life with me,
you know a lot about me, so please don't air
things that could hurt me. And I think in this situation, particularly,
Caitlin said a lot of things podcast ask jobs all
those things, and I think the big key moment is
she felt disrespected by the dog name because it felt
(27:08):
like it was an intentional move. I think she thinks
it was an intentional move. Yeah, I can't confidently say
it because I don't know his intentions behind it. I
know friends will say, hey, this was definitely an intentional
move because they're protecting Caitlin here, But either way, I
get how she's upset. I also am glad that she
(27:29):
is coming out and saying, hey, I'm working on myself
through all this too, because I don't think she's completely
in the wrong to voice her concerns. But I just
don't know how beneficial it is to let discontinue for
too much longer, because it feels like it just keeps
them in the public tied together, and it makes it
almost incapable of them moving forward with somebody else and
(27:52):
of like romantic, serious, committed relationship when your name is
so closely tied to somebody else so often.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
I need to know whether Jason has said on Instagram yet.
Oh whoops, I totally forgot.
Speaker 3 (28:06):
I didn't know that at all, because I don't think
he has said that.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
That's probably a conversation for next week. Well, Hey, those
are the two big topics.
Speaker 3 (28:14):
This fan's like, let's move on, let's have them stop
talking about each other.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
And I'm like, okay, but has he denied this.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
We'll keep breaking this stuff down next week. We're going
to continue to get to the bottom of you here
at the Almost Famous Podcast, because that's what we do.
We talk about other people just like they talk about themselves.
Until next time, I've Been Ben, I've.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
Been Ashley SIA. Follow the Ben and Ashley I Almost
Famous Podcasts on iHeartRadio or subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts.
This is the Ben and Ashley I Almost Famous podcast
with on our radio.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
It's time for headlines today. We have some headlines to
talk about.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Now.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Usually when we break down headlines, we'll have a whole
list like ten headlines, some of them major, some of
them minor, some of them just great updates. This episode, specifically,
we're going to concentrate on two headlines that feel like
they're dominating the airways of Bachelor Nation, and we want
to do a deep dive into both on what we know,
(00:34):
what we think, and any details that might have been
missed along the way as you've just been catching up
scrolling through your social media. The first headline is this,
it's actually what we're gonna call it a topic. It's
the Gabby versus Clayton situation going on right now. Ashley,
(00:55):
this is about a week going on that's just on
what's happened for anybody that has no idea what we're
talking about.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
All right, So Gabby was on the Lost Culture Restas
podcast and she's just you know, chatting about her life
and they brought up Clayton and she said that Clayton's
dance posts on Instagram and TikTok will make you run,
it'll it'll make you wish you didn't have eyes. And
(01:25):
then I could see there's some humor in that. But
then she says he looked like a toe, and then
it made and then she made a reference to like
the Bachelor universe, where like you're filming and you're like
wrapped up in a situation, and then like all of
a sudden, you're basically like attracted to somebody who like
(01:46):
looks like a toe, or you're like admitting feelings for
somebody that you just don't think is that much to
look at.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Let me pause you here, because this is the first
big statement made by Gabby. I don't quite know if
I know what she's talking about. So is she like
saying he looks like a toe, or is that some
like new age new verbiage that like references something else,
or is he she like literally comparing him to a toe.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
I think it might be kind of both.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
But I know that when people say you look like
a toe, like when people say that, it usually just
means like you're just not cute.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Okay, all right, so.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
There you go. And then like I totally understand why
this would be offensive to Clayton and like, I don't
know that I would personally respond because like sometimes I
feel like there's like more power and not showing that
it got to But Clayton got on his own social
media and he called her out for being a bully
(02:43):
because she's talking shit about his looks and his passions.
Like he has talked about how dancing has made him
just like a happier person and it's been an outlet
for him when he was in a deep dark depression
after the show.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
And lots of Bachelornatione came to his support.
Speaker 3 (03:01):
Joan was very vocal in the comments section Kelly Flanagan
and Dotton also he said, that's how you handle it,
my guy, mad respect you keep doing you Clayton, And
this is not where the drama ends. But Ben, do
you have anything to comment on here, because like right now,
at this point, I am definitely team Clayton, Like, you know,
(03:23):
he stood up for himself and she was being I
don't know if I like like bully, Like bully is
like what I think about when you're like like harassing
someone on the playground. But like here, I just think
she's being mean. You know, It's just she's just saying
one nice things that she could just keep to herself.
You know, if you want to make fun of your ex,
(03:45):
just say it to your friends.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
You don't have to say it on a podcast.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
I mean, I think bullying is any time anybody of
influencer power uses that influence and power over somebody else. Right,
that can be like physical strength, platform whatever. Gabby obviously
has a bigger platform than Clayton. Her following, especially coming
off of Traders, is so much greater than Clayton's that
you know, what, what is she actually doing here by
(04:12):
even speaking about Clayton, because right now she's off doing
this totally different thing. I think what I Yeah, at
this moment in the conversation, based on her podcast, I
do think it is. It is just simply mean, And
I think I would imagine Gabby could admit that, like
(04:33):
she wasn't saying this to uplift Clayton or be nice,
like this was a mean thing to say his dancing, though,
I would say, hey, if you're critical of it, I
don't know if that's necessarily a problem, Like you don't
have to watch his videos.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
I don't think it's a.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Turn on, like me watching him on Instagram dance I'd
be like, mmm, that's not That's not something that I
want to see from my husband. But I know it's okay.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
But if it's if he's doing it strictly because it
makes him happy, great, But he also has to realize
I think at this moment in time, I'm just saying
what from what I know. He also has to realize
that people are going to be critical of his dancing
if he's going to post it on social media. Like
we always say, if you share it with the public,
you're opening the public up for opinion. Not everybody has
(05:22):
to be like, Oh, Clayton, look how great you are
at doing these moves. They can be like, hey, man,
like this is weird for me to watch. That's okay.
If it was really just for his mental health, he
would keep it, you know, private, But maybe he is
getting some satisfaction out of the positive comments that do
come along the way.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
Ben totally totally agree with you her saying his dancing
post will make you ron you'll wish you didn't have eyes.
That's her being funny. I think it crosses the line
into being mean when she says, like this show is
going to make you like fall for somebody who looks
like a cow.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
Yes, one hundred percent agree. Okay, So that's where we
start this thing out at. And also moving on then
to Clayton's response to her saying these things about looking
like a toe and his dance dancing particularly and Ashley
take it away with his response.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
Okay, Well, his response was him being like, you're bullying
me over looks and passions, and that's where he got
all like the responses from bachtinnations saying, you know, way
to defend yourself.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
She's being a little bitchy.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
Which is totally good too. I will say that's totally fine.
You should defend yourself this.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Back and forth totally fine, cool, fine.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
I mean, well, you know she was being mean, but
she was also I could see her being a little
funny in there too. I can if she was going
to defend herself by saying I was being a little
funny a little bit. Okay. So then Gabby fires back
on TikTok, and this is where she loses me. I mean,
I still was more team Clayton, but yes, she definitely
loses me here when she talks about how she humiliates,
(07:01):
she goes, that's rich of you to say that I'm
bullying because you came out and humiliated me and told
everybody on national TV that we had sex.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
And I'm like, okay, but this is not the.
Speaker 3 (07:15):
Same situation because you guys were all on a reality
show and you both willingly all went into fantasy suites,
and you know that a lot of the times what
happens in fantasy sweets doesn't stay in fantasy sweets, and like,
you're on a TV show, Like, yeah, lots of parts
of that relationship that you have on a TV show,
(07:36):
it's going to be exploited.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
And this is like years ago.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
So then he can't help himself and he gets on
Instagram and he's like, this is unnecessary for you to
keep bringing up. We have talked about the fact that
I'm sorry that I brought our fantasy suite intimacy up
on TV.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Also, you know, I was the lead.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
You know that, like I, those are things that, like,
as the lead, is very difficult to keep secret.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
We're on a TV show.
Speaker 3 (08:11):
I have tried to apologize to you numbers of times,
and then he shared DMS between the two of them
in twenty twenty three where he apologized to Gabby and
by looking at the DMS, it looks as if like
she was responding to him and they were like, oh
cool too. There was some of it where she didn't respond,
but like in the midst of like all their dms,
she has like responded to him and they like seem cool.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
So that's the breakdown of the situation. The back and
forth has happened. She is, you know, I think again
I'll put words in her mouth, which isn't fair. My
assumption is she knew she was not being nice when
she made those original comments. Clayton came back with defending himself,
which he had every right to do, and defending this
thing that he says helps his mental health out a lot,
(09:05):
which is dancing, which is great. And it feels like
he's confident enough in dancing that even with the criticisms
and the critiques, he continues to do it, which makes
me go, good for you, man, Like I love it.
If I'm not good at something, I'm never posting it
on social media. But this is obviously something you care
about and that is healthy for you, and you enjoy
(09:27):
showing off kind of your progress, So great, keep running
with that, honestly. The response by Gabby, I do agree
is where I got lost in the whole thing. This
was a it felt like pulling back something way back
in the future that obviously hurt her, which again they've
talked about and they seemed to be okay with. And
(09:49):
that's where things get weirdest for me is if you've
explained yourself, both parties has talked about it, some conclusion
has been granted, you kind of hope forgiveness is given,
and then this isn't brought up years later, and it's
also weird that and I just think this is like
always odd. The person that started this dialogue, right, Gabby
(10:13):
came on this podcast Clayton wasn't really talking about Gabby
at the time. Is also the one then like doubling down.
She's done, that's the best way to say. She doubled
down on this, saying no, I had every right to
do this. I meant what I said. You called me
out for having sex with you in the fantasy suite
and that is a woman's job to share publicly.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
Which oh, yeah, that's right, that you said that. I
was like, wait a second, it goes both ways. It
just don't make this sense.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
There, Yeah, yeah, exactly, like a stretch a little bit,
but that's kind of where we're at now. Okay. So
my question for you, Ashley is is there any more
follow up from either of them on either side about
this or is this just done now and it will
kind of fade off into nowhere's.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
Laying Technically it would be Gabby's time to respond, as
Hugh did respond to her TikTok. I don't think Gabby
is gonna take it any further. So I think that,
if anything, people are trying to use this now as
a as a method to get Clinton on Dancing.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
With the Stars. Okay, I mean cool, I'm seeing in
the comments on TikTok.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
I mean all four it. If he loves dancing and
Dancing with the Stars is open to having him, I'd
say go for it. Man.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
So I say that if this goes anywhere it takes
him to Dancing with the Stars, that's good for him.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Then he can't be met. He's going to be ecstatic.
Speaker 3 (11:33):
Yeah, I know exactly, which he'll have to say, thank you,
Gabby for bringing me up in public again.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Sure you your traders high?
Speaker 2 (11:42):
Oh goodness gracious. Okay, So the next topic is this one, Ashley,
and it feels like We've talked about this topic so often,
and there's a there's an element here, as we talked
about kind of last week, that controversy seems to bring
conversation and controversy scene to keep some type of relevance.
It doesn't really feel like the healthiest path. It doesn't
(12:05):
really feel like how most want to be, you know,
what most want to be known for. But the Caitlyn
and Jason thing has lasted so much longer than Caitlin
and Shawna. I thought that thing lasted forever. There is
something about Caitlin Bristow's relationships that once they go public
and once they end. I told Jess this the other day.
(12:25):
It kind of reminds me of the Taylor Swift effect,
where it's like they're always kind of there, like they're
always kind of like the ghosts.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Of the past, a good analogy.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
It's like you can like they never fully remove themselves
from the situation. And it feels like that way with Caitlin.
It does. And Jason and Caitlin's conversation or their relationship
was brought back up again here recently on a podcast
that Caitlyn did. It was her podcast, but she had
a guest host kind of interviewing her about a situation
(12:56):
that just happened. Now, Ashley, Let's be clear, we've covered
Caitlin and Jason for a long time.
Speaker 3 (13:02):
Though.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
There has been a lot of kind of subliminal and
quiet messaging within both of their social medias and both
of their public appearances about each other. Isn't there's a
lot of love lost. I would say there is a
lot of love lost in this relationship. There is a
lot of moments of tension and the two of them
(13:25):
being upset with each other and not feeling like this
relationship with something that kind of was healthy. Well, recently
Caitlyn spoke out on this podcast about kind of what
it feels like is her tipping point, the moment that
she really is fired up over Ashley? What is it?
(13:46):
And then we'll talk about if it's a big deal
or not.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
Oh, to me, it's a big deal, all right.
Speaker 3 (13:51):
So on the first day they ever met, Caitlyn and
Jason talked about children names, talked about what she has
planned to name her child for a long time, and
she told him it was Teddy. And I'm assuming this
is a conversation that was brought up multiple times leading
up to their engagement, as at some point they were
(14:12):
planning on having children together. But she has the receipts
that on day one she told him Theodore, but it
would never be named Theodore. It would be named Teddy.
It would always go by Teddy. And then he gets
this dog, asks Instagram what he should name the dog.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
There are a.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
Couple suggestions as to Teddy, I think, and then he
announces a couple of days later that he ends up
naming the dog Teddy. This is to me, huge deal,
total no, No, this would cross This would get me
over the edge in which I would just have to
have a vinsaese publicly about this, because it was a
public relationship and I personally could not let him get
(14:58):
away with this. And you and I are totally different
when it comes to this stuff, that's all. You and
I are totally different. You're stronger willed person. I could
just tell by your facial expression that you're like, no,
this is something that you can just keep to yourself
and be the bigger person. And I'm like, absolutely no, that.
Speaker 2 (15:16):
Is not at all what I think You're really No.
I think this is really sad, but I think it's
really sad I think it is.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
Uh No, I don't this.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
You are.
Speaker 1 (15:30):
Absolutely no idea where you're gonna go.
Speaker 3 (15:32):
All I know is that you normally think that Caitlyn
and I should be more private.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
Yeah. I still I still hold onto that I don't care.
I don't back down on the fact that I think
there's like room for privacy here. Yeah. And maybe the
question of do I think this is a big deal, yes,
it is a public relationship. I do feel like at
this point Caitlyn was at her breaking point. And I
don't know that. My only advice to Kaitlyn as a
friend or in general would be, I don't know if
(16:00):
you ever speak out publicly when you feel like you're
at your breaking point, because I think what it ends
up doing is it it communicates a lot of like
drama and a lot of anger that maybe you're just
feeling in the moment. Like I don't know how this
played out, but I imagine at playing out like this.
Caitlyn sees that Jason names the dog Teddy, she calls
up her friends. She's like, you got to get over
(16:21):
here and interview me because I am mad and I'm
not going to talk about myself, and so to answer
your question, I do, though, feel like it's a big deal.
I do feel like it is. It showed a lack
of respect, It showed a lack of care for somebody
that you're obviously not like fans of right now, but you,
(16:44):
at one point in your life had a lot of
love for. And if this was an obvious conversation the
two of them had about this baby name and how
Caitlyn has always dreamed of naming her child this name,
and then you name your dog that name, and I
know that Instagram would asked, and I know people recommended Teddy.
There are ways to set that up for people to
(17:05):
send in messages like you should name it Teddy. Uh,
I don't. I'm not like playing, I'm not agreeing with
that and saying, oh, this is just a random, like
voted on name. I think this was definitely shots fired.
Do I think it needed to be handled from Caitlin
in the way that it did. I don't know. It's
up to her, but I definitely can see where she
(17:27):
would be upset and sad. My word for this would
be sad. This this if I was Kitlyn, and I'd
just be sad that this name has seemed to be
taken away from me, like that's so sad.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
Point if somebody had named if my act named their
dog Dawson, after I had it planned for fifteen years.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
I would bust. I would be so angry.
Speaker 3 (17:48):
And to me, it would feel like to me, okay,
I'm gonna be freaking honest right now, I maybe call
me like, you know, maybe people are just going to
see like my friendship with Caitlyn like obvious here, but
guess what, I don't care. This to me felt like
an intentional move to him, like an intentional move to see, like,
let's see if I can annoy her so bad that
(18:12):
and then she has to make this decision whether or
not to explode at me publicly or keep it in.
And either way I'm winning because I'm dominating space in
her mind. And if she does explode publicly, then people
are gonna there's gonna be fifty percent of the people
on my side.
Speaker 2 (18:29):
Yeah, that'd be really, that'd be a really. I mean,
I think I know how like how friends work, and
I think that's You've been a great friend, so I
like and a bit in a protector of your friendship,
which is awesome. I can't say that I think that's
how this went down, other than I will say if
(18:50):
it is what went down, and Jason does see the
headlines and he already listens to the podcast, like that
is a place that you need to check yourself, Like
you need to figure out where your intentions are and
what you're trying to actually do and how you're trying
to create space on the airwaves and in somebody else's head.
Because it is sad no matter what if this was intentional,
(19:11):
if it was a forgotten about thing by Jason and
he forgot they had this conversation or what. It is
really sad that Caitlin told him this and now this
has been taken from her outside of everything else. I
know that people had a negative reaction to her interview.
She had to come out publicly. We're going to talk
about her public apology in just a second. I get
(19:33):
that they did, and I know that they feel like
she's making a situation, a small situation, a big one,
and really creating this drama. But we have to understand
that it is sad no matter what if it was
intentional or not. This name is no longer going to
be able to be used by her, and like that
just hurts a little bit, no matter who you are.
Speaker 3 (20:05):
The most innocent way we could think about this is
that he did somehow forget that this was going to
be her name. And I just don't believe that, because
I don't believe that you can be engaged to someone
and then not remember what you were planning on naming
your kids.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Yeah, I mean, if this was intentional, I would just say, like,
that's a really tough place to be in in life
when you're making these type of decisions that will hurt
others intentionally, and I just cannot put that on somebody
without knowing that to be the case.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
So like, I'm sorry, Like this is my apology to
Jason if I am wrong, But I just find it's
hard to believe that you wouldn't remember what she was
going to name the dog.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
And now I understand that.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
Caitlin went off further in this podcast episode about Jason,
and she said, like a lot she should have ended
the relationship earlier because a lot of what they were
doing together just felt like business, like social media. They
were staying together for social media for way too long,
and she said that felt gross. Nicky, I think that's
(21:06):
kind of where people have the problem is that she's
like continuing to air out issues about their hurt their relationship,
and then she wasn't just focused on this dog name thing.
But I understand how feelings and emotions work, especially when
you're in a public relationship and people aren't seeing your
side because like sometimes it feels like the other person's
(21:26):
playing the game better or people are more tracted to
the way that they play the game.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
So I understand the frustration, and it boiled up.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
It boiled up. It boiled up for sure. And as
I've said publicly before, don't mess with Kaylen Bristow. No
matter what here is happening, I don't mess with her
because once you unleash her, she will she will make
sure the public knows how she's feeling and what she's thinking.
And that's why people love her too, It's why people
follow her show. However, this situation in this podcast interview
(22:00):
did it feel like hit a nerve with Caitlin because
she did come out on her off the Vine podcast
up kind of group and make an apology. I'll read
this apology and Ashley will get your reactions. She says,
I'm coming to my audience who means the most to me.
I take accountability for wanting to hold someone back from podcasting.
(22:21):
I knew deep down this was a me problem, and
I also knew it would start a crossover that would
be hard in a relationship. What I thought would happen
did I clearly didn't leave when he did it. Anyways,
I did more therapy around it and was just it
was just a boundary I made clear that was crossed,
(22:42):
and I tried to work through it. But there was
so much more than just that. Again, I see how
it can seem unfair. Yes, Teddy is a common dog name.
Yes he can name his dog whatever he wants. And
it's eft up that he knew it was my dream
baby Now, we talked about it.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
For years, talked about it for years.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Yes, I have major things to work on in relationships,
and I've already done so much work. I've seen tremendous
growth in myself. I'm so proud of who I am today.
My timeline of processing and being who I am doesn't
have to look like anyone else's standard for a timeline.
I see all the love and I want to give
it all back. I see all the hate and I
(23:26):
want to give them love too. No one like that
will ever understand and that's okay. I don't understand them either.
Navigating a world where sharing your story is risky, freeing,
and extremely hard, but I encourage everyone to think about it,
and yes, do not wish ill on anyone. I'm choosing
(23:50):
now to let them, and I'm glad I gave some context.
I don't like that I'm still talking about it, but
it felt good to stand up for myself. Of course,
have moved on, and it doesn't mean I can't speak
my truth. Do I have anxiety around a calculator response?
I do. Do I think that he subtly shades me
(24:10):
a lot? Yes, but I'm choosing light and prayer moving
forward for everyone.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
I love this Off.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
The Vine family so much. Thank you Upward, nonward high vibes,
wah Ashley, and closing here, this was her apology, kind
of reinstating some things that she felt strongly about, but
also admitting some things that maybe she overreacted to.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
What's your take?
Speaker 3 (24:36):
Okay, Well, I want to clarify the first paragraph of
her apology. She says she wants to take accountability for
holding somebody back from podcasting, So basically, she said really
early on Jason, I don't want you doing podcasts because
the podcasting is my thing, and she didn't want them
to be competing and podcasting. And again it was just
(24:58):
like kind of like a let's we're intermingling our romantic
relationship with a business relationship too much. So she's apologizing
for that, and I, you know, good, I would see
how people would have an issue with that.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
The teddy thing.
Speaker 3 (25:13):
I'm not gonna I still stand by what I said earlier.
And then the rest of her apology, I think like
if her audience really had a problem with her talking
about Jason in this way, I think they also need
to think about what she's told us on this podcast before,
and that is that, like our is public, and sometimes
(25:37):
when the stuff that relates back to us gets like
brought up again in the mainstream, like you know, Jason's
dog name, or like when we see it on social media,
like we have to kind of comment about it, because
it'd be weird if we have this platform in which
we like have our job is to speak and to
speak about you know, bachelor related things a lot of
(25:59):
the times, and then we just don't speak about that.
So you and I end up talking about x'es on
this podcast in a way that normal people wouldn't talk
about their exes. Still, like, it makes sense for us
to talk about people who we dated because we dated
it on TV in front of our audience, which is
why she brings.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
Him up so much.
Speaker 3 (26:19):
She wouldn't bring them up if it was just like
this guy that she dated in her early twenties.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
I agree. No, I don't really have a problem with
people talking about past relationships and clarifying, especially when it
feels like you need to do it to protect yourself.
And that goes both sides, right, that goes from that
goes on both sides. I understand that. I think there's
a respect level there. I think there is a level
(26:46):
of trust still. You know, you shared life with me,
you know a lot about me, so please don't air
things that could hurt me. And I think in this situation, particularly,
Caitlin said a lot of things podcast ask jobs all
those things, and I think the big key moment is
she felt disrespected by the dog name because it felt
(27:08):
like it was an intentional move. I think she thinks
it was an intentional move. Yeah, I can't confidently say
it because I don't know his intentions behind it. I
know friends will say, hey, this was definitely an intentional
move because they're protecting Caitlin here, But either way, I
get how she's upset. I also am glad that she
(27:29):
is coming out and saying, hey, I'm working on myself
through all this too, because I don't think she's completely
in the wrong to voice her concerns. But I just
don't know how beneficial it is to let discontinue for
too much longer, because it feels like it just keeps
them in the public tied together, and it makes it
almost incapable of them moving forward with somebody else and
(27:52):
of like romantic, serious, committed relationship when your name is
so closely tied to somebody else so often.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
I need to know whether Jason has said on Instagram yet.
Oh whoops, I totally forgot.
Speaker 3 (28:06):
I didn't know that at all, because I don't think
he has said that.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
That's probably a conversation for next week. Well, Hey, those
are the two big topics.
Speaker 3 (28:14):
This fan's like, let's move on, let's have them stop
talking about each other.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
And I'm like, okay, but has he denied this.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
We'll keep breaking this stuff down next week. We're going
to continue to get to the bottom of you here
at the Almost Famous Podcast, because that's what we do.
We talk about other people just like they talk about themselves.
Until next time, I've Been Ben, I've.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
Been Ashley SIA. Follow the Ben and Ashley I Almost
Famous Podcasts on iHeartRadio or subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts.
Hosts And Creators
Ben Higgins
Ashley Iaconetti
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