September 29, 2020 • 44 mins
Great relationships are not built in a day—they’re built daily. These wise words come from today’s guest psychologist Abby Medcalf, PhD. She joins us to explain her theories on programming our own brains to have healthier and more enjoyable relationships.
The All’s Fair with Laura Wasser podcast (hereinafter referred to as the “All’s Fair”) represents the opinions of Laura Wasser and her guests to the show. All’s Fair should not be considered professional or legal advice. The content here is for informational purposes only. Views and opinions expressed on All’s Fair are our own and do not represent that of our places of work.
All’s Fair should not be used in any legal capacity whatsoever. Listeners should contact their attorney to obtain advice with respect to any particular legal matter. No listener should act or refrain from acting on the basis of information on All’s Fair without first seeking legal advice from counsel in the relevant jurisdiction. No guarantee is given regarding the accuracy of any statements or opinions made on All’s Fair. In no way does listening, reading, emailing or interacting on social media with our content establish an attorney-client relationship with Laura Wasser, or any of her guests.
Unless specifically stated otherwise, Laura Wasser does not endorse, approve, recommend, or certify any information, product, process, service, or organization presented or mentioned on All’s Fair, and information from this podcast should not be referenced in any way to imply such approval or endorsement. The third party materials or content of any third party site referenced on All’s Fair do not necessarily reflect the opinions, standards or policies of Laura Wasser.
ALL’S FAIR AND LAURA WASSER EXPRESSLY DISCLAIM ANY AND ALL LIABILITY OR RESPONSIBILITY FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR OTHER DAMAGES ARISING OUT OF ANY INDIVIDUAL'S USE OF, REFERENCE TO, RELIANCE ON, OR INABILITY TO USE, THIS PODCAST OR THE INFORMATION PRESENTED IN THIS PODCAST.
Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hi there. It's me Laura Wasser, the divorce attorney and
the founder of It's over Easy, the online divorce service.
I've been practicing family law for over twenty years and
I've worked on thousands of divorces, shepherding people through what
may be one of the most terrifying times in their lives.
(00:22):
Along the way, I often have to remind people to
lower their expectations when dealing with matters of the heart.
Rules simply don't apply. Because all's fair in love and war.
So welcome to the All's Fair Podcasts. Fasten your seatbelts
and let's go. What's up everyone. I'm Laura Wasser, I'm
Johnny Rains, and this is All's Fair. When we created
(00:45):
our show, we did so so we could explore relationships
with you and educate people with regard to the healthier
approach to divorce that we had. It's over Easy call
the Evolution of dissolution. And yeah, I'm a divorce attorney,
but I'm not here to promote divorce. In fact, if
you're determined to stay together, keep listening, because today's show
is all about how not to break up. And now,
(01:07):
at a time when we're all forced to be innovative
about how we connect and how we stay connected with
the people we love. I really can't think of a
better time for some advice on how to successfully navigate relationships,
even if that success actually means your relationship evolves into
something different. So, Johnny, you sent me a Newsweek article
about common missteps people make on the brink of divorce
(01:27):
by Susan pas Godua. I work with couples about divorce.
Here are their top five problems. One is my spouse
my friend and teammate question mark? Two Are my spouse
and I honest with each other? Three? Do we spend
quality time together? Four? Do I turn toward my marriage
for the solution of my problems? And five have we
(01:49):
asked for help? Your answers will reveal what you need
to do next, if anything. He talks about how most
of these five problems are reminiscent of the same problems
that her own parents had that led to their own divorces.
She sees them recurring in all these couples that she
works with today. The first one, and she says, is
that the couples work against each other, right, so they
(02:10):
start to become each other's enemies because again, especially if
you're isolated with each other, that will happen, especially during
these times they don't communicate with each other about their
needs and feelings. Sometimes it's easier not to talk about
something than it is too, which is why I've said
when people during this COVID time are stuck together, sometimes
they actually are speaking with each other more than they
otherwise would because they're there, they're stuck. One of the
(02:32):
things that's interesting about the communication breakdown is she says,
I've yet to meet a spouse who can read bind,
but I've met people who expect the partner to just
know what they need. And I think that's what really
is the bottom line of all these is what's at
the core of it. You know, why are you ignoring
each other? Why are you working against each other? And
why are you not spending time together? That's another one.
(02:52):
They stopped any time together. They rather than work on
the problem, they go somewhere else. And number four kind
of leads into it. They begin to see the solution
to their problems as being outside their marriage. That's why
people get into these online relationships, or they have emotional affairs.
You know, somebody makes them feel better. That's not their
spouse because the spouse already has so much water under
the bridge. And finally, they do not seek help. And
(03:15):
I know you're a big proponent of therapy, Yes, therapy,
some other intermediary objective, third party or parties that can
really assist, because the more that you repress and shove
stuff down, the worst it's gonna fester and the more
it's going to blow up in the end. I mean,
navigating relationships and the best of times is not always easy.
And now with our new normal, thank you COVID nineteen.
(03:38):
Were either spending too much time with the same person
day in and day out, or we're taking our life
into our own hands to meet in person. But like
it or not, this is where we are, and I
want people to focus on making the most of the
present moment. Like Adrian Cohler says in his article on
the It's Over Easy Insights blog, don't waste this crisis.
We have to turn this into something that is an
(03:59):
oper ratunity for us. So seriously, if you're determined to
genuinely try anything and everything to keep your current relationship,
today's show is about fixing and strengthening romantic relationships. While
you're here today may even help you find success in
the relationships to come in your next chapters. I mean,
our guest is a relationship mayven. She's also a psychologist
(04:20):
and the author of the number one Amazon best selling
book Be Happily Married Even if your partner won't do
a thing. She's the host of the top rated Relationships
Made Easy podcast, and here's a clip from her game
changing ted X talk on why relationships fail. I'm gonna
end three age old mysteries for you. These are problems
(04:42):
that have plagued the human condition for decades, and I'm
going to put them to rest. Right now, are you ready?
The correct position for the toilet seat is down, toilet
paper should absolutely roll from the top, and fork should
be placed in the dishwasher with the times up so
(05:04):
they can clean properly. Now, how have I? How do
I know these facts? How have I solved these great
dilemmas of our time? Is it my PhD? And two
master's degrees? I'm a Jew from New York. All we
do is go to school? Right? Is my pH d?
And the proper loading of dishwasher cutlery? Is it my
(05:26):
over thirty years of working directly with people and counseling them. No,
it's because I'm a control freak and I know my
way is right. Welcome to as Fair, dr Abby Medcash, Hi,
avey Hi, I'm so happy to be here. Welcome to
the show. So tell us a little bit. You've got
(05:46):
a very interesting backstory and you've definitely had a life.
You were born and raised in New York City and
you've been in long term recovery since the eighties. Now
that's through me. You are a heroinatic by the age
of twelve. Damn girl, How did that happen? I know,
you know, I don't know how it all happened. But
I started doing drugs real early. My siblings are a
(06:07):
lot older, um, when I was nine, and it just
went from there. And then I started, you know, trying
to get into treatment and twelve Step meetings back in
the day and all that when there weren't any females
and certainly no young ones in an a way back then.
So it was a real struggle getting through all that, um,
and then I eventually managed to put together a little
(06:28):
bit of time, and then actually I moved to Israel,
moved across the world and lived there for a few
years and that really helped um. That really was my
quote unquote spiritual awakening and changed everything. And I was
going to be a lawyer. I was going I have
a bachelor's and policy. I was going to be a lawyer.
And it all changed and I realized that I had this,
(06:50):
you know, pretty good of talking to people. Yeah, So
that all shifted and changed. And then over the years,
I did counseling, and I you know, was a counselor,
and then I wanted to have more impacts, so I
got into business and I started working with executives and
trouble with drug and alcohol issues mostly. And then I
decided again to pivot again when my kids were little
(07:13):
because I wasn't seeing them enough, and so I kind
of pivoted back to just doing consulting and having like
a private practice and really honing in on the whole
marriage gig because I was working with these executives and
I was, you know, you don't have a heroin problem
as an executive who's making forty million year and you're
happy at home, Like it's not. So we started talking
(07:34):
about their home lives and I was in shockingly improving
their marriages without ever meeting their husbands or wives, and
that rolled into I know and I actually I've tracked,
and I seemed to have almost better results when someone
comes in alone to work on their relationship versus when
their partner comes in, which obviously goes against what most
(07:55):
people think. Tell me about that, because again, we speak
so much about how important it is to participate in therapy,
whether it's couples group. You know, airing grievances and doing
it in front of kind of an objective party is
really helpful. But what you're saying is a different take
on it. And I want to explore that a little bit.
So what is that? Because you can really get the
person to own it if if the other one isn't there.
(08:17):
So so often I hear people saying, we went, but
she wouldn't come back because she felt like she was
getting gay. Went and this person only wanted to take
his side and so on. So now it's just you
and one party. And so how do you know, Abby,
if they're really being forthright? Like what if I mean,
can you see through the bullshit of and he always
(08:38):
does this and he always doys this. Do you say, like, well,
what do you do? What's your part in this? Dance.
That's the thing. So I tell people all the time.
I mean, yeah, right, if you're a Jew from New York,
you have a b S meter that's very high, very clear.
But what I tell people all the time is the
one and the most pain needs to change first. Okay,
if you're in the most pain, I don't care that,
then you need to change. And when you change, then
(09:01):
the changes happened on the other side. That's how it
always works a hundred percent of the time. And actually,
I hate to say it, but when couples come into therapy,
it's one of the reasons that it doesn't work is
because people start on the house without doing the foundation
and right and the talking about what we argued about
last week. All that does is restimulate all that anger
(09:25):
and all that bad stuff. It doesn't I've in my
thirty plus years of doing this, I have never seen
it help. I just haven't, other than maybe one time
kind of a you know, just letting it all out
there and getting through it. But other than that, it's
I don't let couples come in and just complains. It's
how how do you determine or how does how do
(09:45):
your clients patients determine who's the one in the most pain.
I mean often, I was married for like five seconds
in the nineties, okay, and we did try to go
to marriage counseling and what he I mean he was Spanish,
he and this is the nineties, so it wasn't any
It just kept saying is with a very heavy accent,
which I won't try to emulate. You know, these are
Laura's problems. Laura has a problem. Laura needs to change,
(10:08):
and if she does, then our marriage will be fine.
So again that marriors did not last more than fourteen months,
but still and we're still good friends. And he's a
lovely guy, and we're probably too young because we were
twenty five. But that refrain that I'm sure you here,
which is he or she needs to do the work? Here?
She needs to change? Now? Is that being said by
the person who thinks they're in the most pain. I'm
(10:29):
in so much pain because my spouse is messed up
and he or she needs to change. So now you
say to them, but you're in so much pain, what
can we do to help you? Okay? I mean, that's it.
It's it's the person who's seeking out therapy. It's the
one complaining the most. Right. Usually the other one is
just like you said, I don't have the problem. If
he would stop drinking, we wouldn't have an issue. If
(10:49):
she would do this, we wouldn't have an issue. So
guess what that that's the that's the most pain because
the other person usually doesn't think it's that big a
deal or isn't need to look at it or whatever
that is. So you have to start with personal responsibility.
You co create relationships. So what are you going to
do with your part of the co creation? You've got
to start there, got start anywhere else. And I think
(11:12):
when people come in alone they kind of get that right,
like here I am, so it's a little easier to
interject in that way. What's organizational psychology? I don't know
that I've heard about that one? Yeah, I know, weird right. Well,
when I was in NBA school and I was crying
because I hated everyone, one of my professors came to
me and said, you're in the wrong degree. I said, what,
(11:35):
what what degree do I want? He said, organizational psychology.
I've never heard of it before. Uh. And with this,
no you moved to after now? Yeah, Now I was
in New York and h they and he said, you
want a degree in organizational psychology, which is the marriage
of psychology that you know really well in your background
and counseling and how organizations work and working with executives
(11:57):
and people and all the good stuff it. And I
hate to say it, but I think the thing that
makes me different in why I do as well as
I do is because of all the work I did
in business, not in counseling is cool because you know,
you don't have I wasn't working with executives and told, oh,
work forever. If there's no changes, it's okay, just keep going.
We'll just keep paying you. And so you have to
(12:20):
come up with things. One of my clients calls them
a therapeutic jingles, like I have these little ways that
I say things so that they're you know, we'll stick
in your mindntry remember them. Yep. I love love, and
again I think so many of the people in business
can apply it more easily than all that what they
might call that wishy washy or the woo woo or whatever. Yeah, exactly,
(12:42):
I love that. Fan. So now you've got teens, I've
got I've got one between your daughter and son. I've
got a fifteen year old and a ten year old,
so that's that's a whole new is Actually, I don't
know what to say. My son actually just turned seventeen
on Friday, and I am in love with my kids.
I get along great with them. They are so into
(13:03):
each other. If you ever look at my Instagram or anything,
it's always pictures of Max, like Aga McCartney. I mean,
they are really close. We're all really close. Close to
my ex. I'm close to his wife and he and
my man were all over together for Max's birthday. I
made a big dinner because I love to cook, that's um,
you know, and we were all together, and yeah, there's
(13:24):
more people to love my kids. That's that's what I
always say. That's what I always say. A bigger support group,
a bigger tribe of bigger family and if you can
do it, and I tell people, you can do it,
like you have to actually love your kids more than
you hate your ex, and then it comes together and
then you've also got great support. I mean for the
good times like a seventeenth birthday, but also for the
(13:47):
bad times. If God forbids, something goes wrong, a parent dies,
you have those family members as support, and that's huge.
It's so big. I actually I was sick a few
months ago and Evelyn, my x's wife, was texting me,
I'm going to target you anything. I'm going to be
at the story. Do you you need anything like constantly? And
my current partner's ex wife and I are really good friends.
(14:09):
We text all the time, and my parents, his kids.
You know, it's a it's a love best it's a village.
It takes a village. It really love that I have
built a village. Yes, people who follow me and our
online divorce community, it's over easy. No that I'm a
strong proponent of therapy and couples counseling. Many couples end
(14:32):
up getting back together, but not all of them, so
I almost always insist that they try that. And yet
after couples therapy, couples separate, which I don't think is
always a bad thing, but it's interesting that after all
the work couples do in therapy in the end, many
people still go their separate ways. What abbey in your
experience is the hurdle that people just can't overcome. It's
(14:56):
that foundation which is when couple, every almost every couple,
it comes to me says, our number one problem is
that we don't communicate. We need to work on communication,
and I have to tell them that they're wrong. Number one.
They communicate all the time, just not what they want.
But but really the problem in relationships is competition. That's
the real problem in relationships. We say things like, it's
(15:16):
your turn to put away the dishes. I took Sophie
to baseball on Monday. It's your turn to take Jack
on Friday. You spent money on this, I get to
spend money on this. We we say this stuff all
the time, and it sets us up on opposite teams.
So we're not happy when our other person gets something
because we think somehow it takes away from us. One
of the things I say all the time is people
(15:37):
will say I need my guy, my man, my woman,
whatever to take things off my plate. You know, they
have to take things at my plate, and I'm always
yelling it's the same plate, right, and it's the same plate.
They can't take anything off you are moving around the
mashed potatoes. People like, it's not that's not the answer.
You have to realize that you're shared resource. So if
your partner is hurting, you're hurting if you're giving them
(15:59):
all the struck because you're exhausted. Now they're exhausted and
you're both exhausted. Okay, so so let me hypothetical. I
come to you and I say, my partner's not taking
anything off my plate. He's no value added. I've got
all the ship going on and he's not helping. And
you say, okay, how do we deal with you, Laura
and what you're doing, because again you're not seeing him.
You don't know whether he's doing his fair share or not.
(16:20):
All you know is I'm totally overwhelmed. What do you
tell me? Yep, oh, I love it. I tell you
to do one or two things. One is to add
and the other subtract. The adding is to add resources
from outside the couple in every time you think, oh,
I gotta ask my husband, you that I have to
ask my wife. Stop, go find someone that you can pay. Okay,
(16:41):
I get because because I did not marry my man
because he mowed the lawn, Well, no one does. No
one marries for that, And yet those are the things
we fight about. It's insane. And that's not the value
that our partners brings. It's a just qualitative not quantitative,
so anything quantitative put out. So still on that same hypothetical.
(17:04):
So now I working parent have hired a gardener to
mow the lawn. Okay, so I'm paying the gardener. I'm
paying most of our bills, and my good for nothing husband,
you know, isn't doing anything. And he says, I'm a
stay home dad. But either our kids are in school
full time or I've actually, on your Abbey's advice, hired
a nanny. So I've got the nanny there too. Okay,
(17:25):
so now I'm still feeling really resentful. Now what I'm
still in a lot of case because you're still keeping score, right,
So there is no score keeping in a relationship, so
this you have to get out of that because of
course everybody loses, right, So instead, how am I not
really happy that my partner has time to relax so
he can be a great partner. And we if I'm
not here what you're doing to dig deep here I'm
(17:48):
supposed to be. Okay, I am good at least that's
really the bottom line. It's not what he's doing, it's
it's who he who he is. Okay. So, and I'll
give you this really really quick example. I had a
low tire pressure on my car. You know, the air
was out. Whatever, look at me, I write, New Yorker,
(18:09):
right cars, I don't know. People say what kind of
car do you have? I say silver? So I don't
all right so and he said like, oh, you know,
the air slona time, you gotta get that fixed is dangerous.
And I was like okay, And that was teflon. I
didn't even listen. Really, I didn't know what I thought.
I had to go to the mechanic and and and
lose my car for the day. I thought all these
things and I didn't realize I was thinking them two
(18:29):
days later, same thing. He's getting mad. He's like, why
aren't you This is dangerous. You're driving kids around. You
can't do this. That Saturday, I come out and he's
pulling up in my cars, like what are you doing?
He said, Well, I realized you're the most competent person
I know, and you weren't filling the freaking air and
the tire. And I realized, I think it's because you
don't get what it is like. You don't you know
(18:50):
he thought it through. You would have thought he split
the atom. I was so grateful. I was so like, hey,
thank you. I was like losing it. Oh, it took
him five seconds. We have a gas station on our
corners five minutes. So it's not the amount of time
that he took to do something. It's the value of
feeling taken care of, a feeling loved, a feeling supported.
(19:14):
That's what we marry for. So those are the things
you want to focus on, not how much time something
takes to do. The second you start doing that, you're
screwed because you just you gotta get out of that.
So tell us a little bit about psychologist and writer
Timothy Wilson on the influence of unconscious mind and decision
making and behavior, because I know your new video that
(19:35):
you're working on for your YouTube channel incorporates that a lot,
and I want to hear how that actors into all
of this. You're gonna love this. This is the game changer. This,
This is this book Strangers to Ourselves I read years ago,
and here's the deal. Our conscious brains process information at
a rate of fifty bits per second. Okay, conscious like
what I'm thinking. What I'm saying, are unconscious brains process
(19:58):
information at a rate of a eleven million bits per second? Okay.
So here's what Here's what happens all the time. Somebody
will come to me and say, having troubled my husband.
I said, Okay, here's a tool. Go home and use
this tool. And they're like, oh, they're all excited in
the office. I got it, Abby, I'm gonna go use
this tool. And they go home. But so consciously I'm
(20:18):
gonna use this tool, it's great. Unconsciously, this little tool
is not going to do a thing. Abby doesn't realize
how bad our problems are and how long they've been
going on. Right, all the doubt, all the stuff. I
used the tool with my husband, and he doesn't hear
what I say. He hears what I mean. So he
is picking up on all the doubt, the anxiety, the resentment,
(20:41):
the worry, the frustration, and he's like, oh, I see
her doing a different thing, but let's see home on
this loss right, sort of ignoring it and not doing anything.
I do this tool for a few days and he's
not changing. So I go, I knew this wouldn't work.
And then they go back to me. They go back
to me and go, Abby, I knew it. I knew
this wouldn't work. And I said that the problem you're
(21:01):
already going in that it wasn't gonna work. You were
already setting those and everyone knows this. You have talked
to someone at work anywhere and they were saying all
the right things, but you your BS meter was going off,
and you're like, uhh, that's your unconscious brain picking up
on what people are truly laying down versus what they're
consciously saying to you. So we have that all the time.
(21:23):
We forget that. We have it with our partners. So
everything that when you react in that way to what
you know, you think you're seeing and you that's all
that reaction, and it's the keeping score. Again, Well, I'm
only doing this thing, so they do this thing, and
then I'll do this thing and then they'll It's all conditional,
and that's what has got it. How does one change that? Abbey?
(21:46):
There is there a jingle for that. There's a jingle.
I do have a jingle. I have a few. So
one is that there's something called your reticular activating system.
I don't know if you guys have heard of this.
Your maraticular short okay, your RS for short. Uh No,
it's a little different. What it is. It's a It's
a conduit between your conscious and your subconscious mind. Everybody
(22:09):
has it, and you know you have it because if
you've ever bought a new car and then suddenly you
see the new that car everywhere, you know what I'm
talking about. Its consciously you were like even thinking about
buying the car, and it was all of a sudden
you thought, are they making more of these? What happened
every time I was pregnant? Every woman was pregnant. I
don't think I've seen a pregnant woman in yours, right,
It's like it kind of is, but it's actually a
(22:31):
brain thing. So your reticular activating system, your r S,
is filtering in things that you're consciously thinking about to
tell your subconscious to look for them. Okay, and I
do have a little cute YouTube video on this, but
and so it's looking for it. So if I think
my partner is always nagging me, my RS looks for
(22:52):
my partner nagging me. And the most important part of this,
the scariest part of this, is that it will filter
out anything that doesn't matter. So when my partners appreciative,
when he or she is loving, when they say thank you,
I'm teflon it's just gone. And this is why. And
you know you've had this where people are in the
room going you didn't say that, yes I did, I
(23:13):
did it this way. No you didn't. I would have
remembered that, and that you been filter. So you have
to program the R A S. And this fits right
in with that unconscious right, the fifty bits versus eleven million.
You have to program it for what you do want,
not what you don't want. Then the brain can't think
of negative right. So I love when someone says, well,
(23:34):
I want her to nag me less. But for that
one is if there's been somebody that you know cheated,
so can we overcome this? But now all you see
is if she's looking at another another guy. All you
see is if there's somebody hot on TV and she's
paying more attention, all you see is a guy in
numbers showing up on her phone. That's all you see.
(23:55):
So when she's gazing upon you lovingly, that doesn't even compute,
not even there exactly exactly. I mean, it's it is.
And so when you really understand this, and so people
can kind of maybe pooh pooh the law of attraction.
I don't, but some people do I give them the brains.
You know, when I'm working with these executives, right, I
can't be I can't say mindfulness. I have to say
(24:17):
attention training. Right. I use different words that they like,
but this is one of them. And when you program
the area. So if you got up every day and
just set an intention for what I call it the
eighteen second shift. Setting intention, it takes I've timed it
takes an average of eighteen seconds. Everyone's got eighteen seconds.
And all you do. You don't have to breathe special,
(24:38):
you don't have to do anything. You just sort of
close your eyes for a minute, maybe take one deep
breath and think, really set intention for what you want
this next little piece to be. I before we came
on today, I set intention that I want to be
a total service. I want people to walk away with like,
oh I can do that. I can do that. I
can do that. So my brain is bringing that to me.
(25:00):
Run over during it, hopefully during this session. I'm old.
Sometimes it doesn't work, but you know what I mean,
it's uh, it's coming all the time because we're you
can program it, and you've got to get ahead of it.
You've got to program every morning is multiple times as
much as you can setting that intention. I would say
it's the big game changer. Every person comes back to
(25:21):
me with saying, I can't believe how well that works.
They're shocked. And it's because of this RS. You're you're
putting it where you want it. You're listening to All's
Fair with Laura Wasser. I'm Laura and you may know
me best as the divorce attorney in Hollywood, but let
it be known that I fully support you staying in
your relationship until death do you part, or until my
(25:44):
vacation is over. At least please in any event, I
don't want divorce to be regarded as a failure or
a nightmare. It's an evolution of the way your family functions.
And as our guest today puts it, great relationships are
not built in a day. They're built daily, especially if
you do your eighteen second re set. We're discussing all
of this today with psychologists, author and speakers after Abby
(26:04):
Medcalf and Abby. The competition and relationships notwithstanding, give us
some other quick winds. People can easily integrate into their
relationships to make them more rewarding. We've got our eighteen
second reset where you check your r I S. But
give us a couple of good tips. Please. I'm gonna
give you two really good ones right here. They're so
easy and such quick wins. One of my favorite quotes
(26:25):
of all time is from the book Little Fires. Everywhere
I'm listening, she says in that book, anger is the
bodyguard of fear. It's like an epic epic line. And
so what I tell people, it's true when you're angry, really,
every time you're angry again, frustration, any of that, What
(26:48):
am I it is? What am I afraid of? Just stop?
As soon as you're angry, your partner, at your kid,
at the mailman, at wherever. What am I afraid of?
Right now? Sometimes you're afraid because you don't have enough
time to get done stuff you want to get done.
If you're snapping at the you know, person at the
post office. But you know, and sometimes with your partner,
what are you afraid of? It's usually rejection, abandonment, uh,
(27:09):
you know, not being seen, not being heard, not being
listened to all the good things. And then you want
to do something about that because the anger, of course
just pushes people away, and and you know, it's very
effective for not connecting. Well, it's all the self fulfilling prophecy.
If the fear is abandonment, I mean, I've been in
that relationship before. A right don't agree we're over, So
(27:35):
that is so common and that's really the thing. Right
people stay angry because it's that deep art. I mean,
that's what that is. And by the way, that's really rage,
and I always separate rage. Rage is anger plus helplessness.
It's when you feel helpless, you feel like everything you've
tried nothing works, and so there too, I tell people,
don't focus on the anger, you know, don't count to ten,
(27:57):
don't do that stuff. That's why it doesn't really work.
You want to focus on feeling helpless, so that means
do something, some action, one thing, set intention, do one thing.
So that's one that's like a quick win. What am
I afraid of right now? And then my other favorite,
my little therapeutic jingle is don't sack your relationship, so
don't offer suggestions, give advice, a criticize ever, Okay, no suggestions,
(28:24):
no advice, no criticizing, think of that. I don't think
of that, exhausted me, I don't what kind of relationship
is it? Then? Without those things, Well, I'll tell you
what do you do instead? The only thing left is
you ask questions? You know, can you tell me more
about that? If there was one thing I could do
(28:44):
right now that would help move the needle, what would
it be? If there was one thing I could say
right now that would really help you feel differently, what
would it be? What's one thing you've tried that hasn't worked?
You know, what's something I can do to support you
in this? You know there's a million questions. So what
happens if by opening that door? I mean, it seems
like a logical conclusion that by opening that door, what
(29:07):
can I do to help? Or what have I have
we tried that's not working? Are you not inviting criticism
or advice or suggestion from your partner to you? And
is that not dangerous? So let's say your partner says, well,
you know you could help, you could take care of
the kids once in a while, right, And you say,
(29:27):
and then you have to stay with the love though,
you have to lean into those So what's your partner saying?
They say they're very afraid, they're feeling overwhelmed. They're right,
that's you know, let yourself really realize what that is,
So ask a question. So tell me, really what you'd
like to see. Tell me three things you'd really like
to see that would let you know I'm really take
(29:48):
care of the kids the way you think they should
be taken care of. And you don't have to agree
with them, because then you can ask more questions. But
that's the thing. What you don't want to do. What
most people do is they keep score. I'll a you know,
I don't like that you did this this When you say,
how could you say that I did this, this, this,
this in your name, all the ways I'm a fabulous wife, partner, whatever,
(30:10):
I'm not listening. It doesn't matter that I did all
these things. It only matters that you didn't do the
one thing setting me I got it exactly. And by
the way, the one thing holds more weight that you
don't do or that you screw up than all the
good thing out right, because they haven't reset their intentions yet,
so they're still focusing on it evidently, and we can't
(30:30):
suggest that they do reset their attentions because that would
be offering advice. Well this is we have a tip
for that later. But but you don't have love. You
don't be afraid if you're sitting in the conversation afraid,
right you you can't base a love relationship on fear.
So if you're sitting there, you can't be afraid. You
have to know that whatever they're coming with, their coming
(30:50):
with and you're going to lean in with love, lean
in with love. So on your podcast, Relationships Made Easy, Abby,
I think on a recent episode you gave listeners the
three rules for having an effective argument and an exercise
called the wake up exercise. Tell us about those, please,
So the wake up where it is the best. So really,
when your partner, when your fine, let me just say
(31:12):
something really quick around I'm gonna give quick science, but
we're gonna it's gonna make sense. So when you are arguing,
a part of your brain called your amygdala, part of
the Olympic system, is turned on. Right. People know about
the magala usually the fight, flight or freeze. Okay, So
that's the only things you can do. You can fight,
you can run away, or you can freeze, which is
like the hasher okay now you know, or the shrug. Okay.
(31:36):
That's it. There is no other option because the thinking
part of your brain, the rational part, the place where
your preformal cortex and your neo cortex where we think
spirituality lives, where uh, compassion, appreciation, gratitude, thinking, rational problem solving.
That part of your brain and your amigella are on
a one way highway. If it is taken up with
(31:59):
fear based impulse of any kind, this fight flight of freeze,
you can't access that other thinking part of your brain.
On an functional m r I, it actually looks like
there's a blanket over the prefinal cortex when the amygdala
is lit up, when the limbic systems lit up. Is
that crazy? So when you're really upset, and I'll give
you one for your fifteen year old here, So I
(32:21):
have my my Max, my wonderful Max really upset about
a math test at the end of last you know, semester,
and upset and he's only a teenager, can be right, see,
because he's in fight flighter freeze mode. He thinks the
lion is about to eat him. I understand that we
think that's overreacting, but that's the only thing that comes
up in that two million year old wiring is I'm
(32:41):
it's all over. It's horrible, right, That's why they escalate
so much when we come over as parents, which we
often do, and go, it's okay, buddy, we know we'll
get the tutor. Remember you did okay last time, right,
we seal it stuff. We're basically saying, oh, it's okay,
there's no tiger, you're you're, and we're dismissing. And so
what do they do. They escalate. Oh Mychael, you don't understand,
(33:02):
and they escalate. And this happens if your partner is
complaining about barbed at work. It happens that no matter
what it is, when we minimize, we're saying we don't
see the tiger, and they feel like they have to escalate.
So what you do instead is you need to intervene
right there and get that other part of the brain.
And I call it say yes first, which is basically
(33:24):
that you match emotion but not tone. So instead I
said to Max, oh god, how many chapters? Oh let
me see god nine. I didn't yell it. I didn't escalate,
but I matched his emotion, which is upset. Oh my god,
barb began at work. And so guess what happens every
(33:44):
single time. I guarantee it. You can call me in
the middle of the night. If it doesn't work, because
it will, they come down. They and sonimes you have
to do it twice, but usually not more than twice,
and they're like, right, yeah, that sucks. And they right
because they don't keep convincing you that it's here correctly,
that the tigers here, I see the lion with you.
(34:06):
We're a team. I got you right, We're going to
do this together. Men, of course, aren't always as good
at this. I say with all love my heart A
love men, because they're fixers. They think the only reason
we're even telling them a problem is to fix it. So, oh,
I feel a little My butt looks big in these jeans. Well,
have you tried walking more? Have you done this? Do
you see that? Sweetie? I know I can't just some
(34:29):
men I just can't help. But those I tried. Yeah,
I do notice that. You're oh God, and I feel
that in my butt too. Yeah. What do we do more? Yeah?
But that's fine? Back up? Okay, So I get it,
you know, right, because again that's offering suggestions advice to criticizing.
(34:50):
You see where that goes wrong? Right, It's like I
don't know how to make my butt littler, please please,
we all know, so shut up. You know you don't
have to fix this. I want you to listen. I
want you to be here with me, and it's you
know so right, I want with whatever it is. So
once we do that bond, it's beautiful now. So to
get over there, I have so you can just do that.
You can just interrupt with you know, match motion and tone.
(35:12):
But the other thing that's really super is this wake
up word, which is a neural linguistic programming technique and
LP technique, which is basically what you do is you
pick a word when you're not arguing with your partner
or your family right that everyone loves everyone makes you happy.
So like our word right now is glitter is glitter.
It's such a stupid word, right, makes halter? Right, makes
(35:33):
you happy? Glitter. Let's look glitter. A lot of couple,
that's why we love Johnny. A lot of couple of
shoes use like Christmas or words like that. I have
a wonderful couple that uses the word dildo because you
can't not smile and say dildo, dildo, right. I don't
want to yell dildo across the house right now, you
know teenagers, but whatever your word is, right. So let's
(35:56):
say your partner is losing their crap right, and you're like,
what you do, or let's say they're coming at you wrong,
you know, and you're just then what you do is
you say the word you say glitter Christmas, whatever your
word is, and the other person's job, and you've already
discussed this is to just be quiet, just literally stop
mid sentence. What it does is it wakes up that
(36:19):
it gets you out of amygdala very quickly and into
that prefunnel thinking because you have to think. You're like,
what like if something came out and left field at
you and you have to now restrategize. It's like you're
running from the tiger, but someone through banana, you know,
and you're like, I have to run this way now, right,
And so that's what that is, and it gets the
thinking brain going and then then right, so then everything
just stops. And it doesn't mean that what your partner.
(36:40):
If if I say it to my partner, it doesn't
mean he was wrong or bad or anything else. It
just means I'm not listening anymore. So you might as
well stop talking, because whatever this is is upsetting me
and then you can take a breath. And then if
you're the person that says that, either of you can
say something like, can you say that again differently? Can
you tell me? Can you try again to say that,
(37:02):
I'm just not getting what you're trying to tell me?
Can you do that a different way? Or what you know?
Can or can you? What do you think I'm feeling
right now? That's a really good one. Anytime you're lost,
if you bring someone into the moment and just say
what are you feeling right this minute? It takes them
out of that and into here, Well I don't know,
(37:22):
I'm okay, Well what are you feeling? Not? Good? Angry?
Give me something right? And so put a feelings list
on the refrigerator of stupid faces, whatever you do, and
then they have to name a feeling. Well, actually I
was feeling resentful or you know. Then you get to it.
Then then you can have a talk. Let's try again. Yeah,
it's super simple, it's incredibly effective, and it literally can
(37:43):
stop a fight in its tracks when you're doing it,
and you just have to decide the word beforehand. So
when people call in to Relationships made Easy, are they
giving you a situation and then you're giving them advice
on the podcast, like right there in real time. No,
so on the podcast what I do because I'm a
research you can tell probably right, I'm a research junkie,
(38:05):
like like my nipples are wreck talking about it like research,
it's based approach um, and so I get very excited.
So what I do is people right in all the time,
and I have like an ask dr Abby segment in
the podcast where you can just get a straight question answered.
But I also what happens usually is like I had
a bunch of people right in about what do I
(38:26):
do in the honeymoon phase ends? Right, So then I
go research all the things because I like everything to
be wins actionable. Here's the research, here's what you do.
So I do the teach and I have action steps
on every single podcast because that's the thing, right. I
feel like so many are just sort of talking, and
then it's like, well what do I do? Now? Like
(38:46):
that's nice that that worked for you, but now what
do I do? And I don't do anything that's like oh,
me and my partner, this is what we do. It's
like that's nice, but that's nice for you. That's you too.
So I'm talking. You know, I work with literally thousands
of people now, but I still see people live like
I still see people because that's where I love that
work and I will never stop doing it because that
(39:08):
and that's where I get of course, my best left
sure that I can share with others. So I'm I
know it works because of my own people plus from
the research. Put that together right, and then I put
that out in the podcast. So it's mostly me chat.
As you can tell, I can't shut up, so it's
mostly me just talking. I like that though, but it's
backed and I mean, like you said, you're a research junkie,
(39:30):
and in our own way, we could say the same
thing about lawyers, except it maybe more as in terms
of bigger picture. But the thing that makes my nipples
erect is getting information about specific individuals, whether it's in
a family law matter and we're asking our discovery questions
or it's a podcast guest. So one of the elements
of discovery is the interrogatory. So we've got the all's
(39:52):
fair interrogatories. So Abby, do you sort of tell the truth,
the whole truth, and nothing about the truth I do
which relate sationship in your life has had the most
profound impact. Mm hmm um, my dad, why because it's
a lot of how I show up in the world,
both good and bad. What's your favorite love song? I
(40:17):
supposed to already have thought of this because I've heard
these before. I think it. Oh it's Luther vand Ross.
Um uh, superstar, superstar Luther Vanders all they want. What
is the one piece of advice you'd share with your
twenty something old old self? Relax? I love it, and
I love the brevity of her answers. Okay, And finally,
(40:40):
which romantic comedy could you watch on repeat? Um? I
love When Harry met Sally. That's a big yeah, right,
and even your you know, love of research and relationships
and what makes them work. That would make sense all
the little vignettes of the people's saying how they met
and whatever. Abby, Thank you so much for sharing your
(41:03):
witty wisdom and insight into relationships with us today. Please
tell people where they can find your podcast Relationships Made Easy,
and your best selling book Be Happily Married even if
your partner won't do a thing. Tell us, well, the
whole world is at my website, which is just my name,
Abby Medcalf dot com. It's m N D guys, m
E D c A L F Medcalf. Thank you. Right,
(41:27):
that's the thing, you know. I went with that married
name because Wax was my that's my maiden name. I
was like, I'll take that. I'm in uh so, Abby
Medcalf dot com. And then my book is on Amazon
and my podcast is anywhere pretty much. You download podcast
from Pandora to Stitchard whatever, It's all over the place.
(41:47):
And my Instagram is at Abbey Medcalf thriving. Just find it.
Find it, guys, you want them to work, go talk
to Abby. Thank you very much for being here with
us today. Thank you for having me. Of course, she
was great. I liked her. She was very upbeat. This
is a woman with two teenagers and she's still like happy.
I don't know. Some of the stuff she said did
(42:09):
not immediately compute, but she looks like she's got it handled,
so I guess I mean right. I love that her
safe word as glitter. I had me right there. I
believe me. I do know that. But I also feel
like she's got it figured out, and I love that
about her. This isn't like somebody who found her love
and stayed married. To the same person forever. She's figured
(42:32):
out how to do her next chapters. I love the
research element of what she said, and I really thought
it was interesting because we haven't had somebody say before
that you can kind of do I won't call a
couple's therapy. You can do marriage therapy with just one person.
I like that. It's interesting, absolutely, And I think you
all know what I think about casting your lot with
(42:52):
one person for the rest of your life. I'm just
not sure humans are meant to mate for life or
be a monogamous But those of you who have found
your your penguin, God bless good for you. By the way,
eighteen years we just had our eighteenth anniversary thanks to
your means right, Well, I not thanks to me. I
just officiated the weddings. But but I would say thanks
(43:12):
to Michael, your spouse, because he has got to have
the fucking patience of a saint. Um in any event, Johnny,
what do you think, audience, are we humans men to
partner for life? Let us know what you think on
our social channels at It's over Easy. You can also
engage with others going through breakups and moving on in
our private Facebook group. It's over easy community. Laura and
(43:36):
other experts do live Q and a's there, Plus there's
a wealth of info and conversations about relationships and before
you go, if you haven't already tapped, subscribe on our
podcast and leave us a review. Five stars would definitely
be good. Thank you, thanks for listening, and let's do
this again next Tuesday. By everyone,
Hi there. It's me Laura Wasser, the divorce attorney and
the founder of It's over Easy, the online divorce service.
I've been practicing family law for over twenty years and
I've worked on thousands of divorces, shepherding people through what
may be one of the most terrifying times in their lives.
(00:22):
Along the way, I often have to remind people to
lower their expectations when dealing with matters of the heart.
Rules simply don't apply. Because all's fair in love and war.
So welcome to the All's Fair Podcasts. Fasten your seatbelts
and let's go. What's up everyone. I'm Laura Wasser, I'm
Johnny Rains, and this is All's Fair. When we created
(00:45):
our show, we did so so we could explore relationships
with you and educate people with regard to the healthier
approach to divorce that we had. It's over Easy call
the Evolution of dissolution. And yeah, I'm a divorce attorney,
but I'm not here to promote divorce. In fact, if
you're determined to stay together, keep listening, because today's show
is all about how not to break up. And now,
(01:07):
at a time when we're all forced to be innovative
about how we connect and how we stay connected with
the people we love. I really can't think of a
better time for some advice on how to successfully navigate relationships,
even if that success actually means your relationship evolves into
something different. So, Johnny, you sent me a Newsweek article
about common missteps people make on the brink of divorce
(01:27):
by Susan pas Godua. I work with couples about divorce.
Here are their top five problems. One is my spouse
my friend and teammate question mark? Two Are my spouse
and I honest with each other? Three? Do we spend
quality time together? Four? Do I turn toward my marriage
for the solution of my problems? And five have we
(01:49):
asked for help? Your answers will reveal what you need
to do next, if anything. He talks about how most
of these five problems are reminiscent of the same problems
that her own parents had that led to their own divorces.
She sees them recurring in all these couples that she
works with today. The first one, and she says, is
that the couples work against each other, right, so they
(02:10):
start to become each other's enemies because again, especially if
you're isolated with each other, that will happen, especially during
these times they don't communicate with each other about their
needs and feelings. Sometimes it's easier not to talk about
something than it is too, which is why I've said
when people during this COVID time are stuck together, sometimes
they actually are speaking with each other more than they
otherwise would because they're there, they're stuck. One of the
(02:32):
things that's interesting about the communication breakdown is she says,
I've yet to meet a spouse who can read bind,
but I've met people who expect the partner to just
know what they need. And I think that's what really
is the bottom line of all these is what's at
the core of it. You know, why are you ignoring
each other? Why are you working against each other? And
why are you not spending time together? That's another one.
(02:52):
They stopped any time together. They rather than work on
the problem, they go somewhere else. And number four kind
of leads into it. They begin to see the solution
to their problems as being outside their marriage. That's why
people get into these online relationships, or they have emotional affairs.
You know, somebody makes them feel better. That's not their
spouse because the spouse already has so much water under
the bridge. And finally, they do not seek help. And
(03:15):
I know you're a big proponent of therapy, Yes, therapy,
some other intermediary objective, third party or parties that can
really assist, because the more that you repress and shove
stuff down, the worst it's gonna fester and the more
it's going to blow up in the end. I mean,
navigating relationships and the best of times is not always easy.
And now with our new normal, thank you COVID nineteen.
(03:38):
Were either spending too much time with the same person
day in and day out, or we're taking our life
into our own hands to meet in person. But like
it or not, this is where we are, and I
want people to focus on making the most of the
present moment. Like Adrian Cohler says in his article on
the It's Over Easy Insights blog, don't waste this crisis.
We have to turn this into something that is an
(03:59):
oper ratunity for us. So seriously, if you're determined to
genuinely try anything and everything to keep your current relationship,
today's show is about fixing and strengthening romantic relationships. While
you're here today may even help you find success in
the relationships to come in your next chapters. I mean,
our guest is a relationship mayven. She's also a psychologist
(04:20):
and the author of the number one Amazon best selling
book Be Happily Married Even if your partner won't do
a thing. She's the host of the top rated Relationships
Made Easy podcast, and here's a clip from her game
changing ted X talk on why relationships fail. I'm gonna
end three age old mysteries for you. These are problems
(04:42):
that have plagued the human condition for decades, and I'm
going to put them to rest. Right now, are you ready?
The correct position for the toilet seat is down, toilet
paper should absolutely roll from the top, and fork should
be placed in the dishwasher with the times up so
(05:04):
they can clean properly. Now, how have I? How do
I know these facts? How have I solved these great
dilemmas of our time? Is it my PhD? And two
master's degrees? I'm a Jew from New York. All we
do is go to school? Right? Is my pH d?
And the proper loading of dishwasher cutlery? Is it my
(05:26):
over thirty years of working directly with people and counseling them. No,
it's because I'm a control freak and I know my
way is right. Welcome to as Fair, dr Abby Medcash, Hi,
avey Hi, I'm so happy to be here. Welcome to
the show. So tell us a little bit. You've got
(05:46):
a very interesting backstory and you've definitely had a life.
You were born and raised in New York City and
you've been in long term recovery since the eighties. Now
that's through me. You are a heroinatic by the age
of twelve. Damn girl, How did that happen? I know,
you know, I don't know how it all happened. But
I started doing drugs real early. My siblings are a
(06:07):
lot older, um, when I was nine, and it just
went from there. And then I started, you know, trying
to get into treatment and twelve Step meetings back in
the day and all that when there weren't any females
and certainly no young ones in an a way back then.
So it was a real struggle getting through all that, um,
and then I eventually managed to put together a little
(06:28):
bit of time, and then actually I moved to Israel,
moved across the world and lived there for a few
years and that really helped um. That really was my
quote unquote spiritual awakening and changed everything. And I was
going to be a lawyer. I was going I have
a bachelor's and policy. I was going to be a lawyer.
And it all changed and I realized that I had this,
(06:50):
you know, pretty good of talking to people. Yeah, So
that all shifted and changed. And then over the years,
I did counseling, and I you know, was a counselor,
and then I wanted to have more impacts, so I
got into business and I started working with executives and
trouble with drug and alcohol issues mostly. And then I
decided again to pivot again when my kids were little
(07:13):
because I wasn't seeing them enough, and so I kind
of pivoted back to just doing consulting and having like
a private practice and really honing in on the whole
marriage gig because I was working with these executives and
I was, you know, you don't have a heroin problem
as an executive who's making forty million year and you're
happy at home, Like it's not. So we started talking
(07:34):
about their home lives and I was in shockingly improving
their marriages without ever meeting their husbands or wives, and
that rolled into I know and I actually I've tracked,
and I seemed to have almost better results when someone
comes in alone to work on their relationship versus when
their partner comes in, which obviously goes against what most
(07:55):
people think. Tell me about that, because again, we speak
so much about how important it is to participate in therapy,
whether it's couples group. You know, airing grievances and doing
it in front of kind of an objective party is
really helpful. But what you're saying is a different take
on it. And I want to explore that a little bit.
So what is that? Because you can really get the
person to own it if if the other one isn't there.
(08:17):
So so often I hear people saying, we went, but
she wouldn't come back because she felt like she was
getting gay. Went and this person only wanted to take
his side and so on. So now it's just you
and one party. And so how do you know, Abby,
if they're really being forthright? Like what if I mean,
can you see through the bullshit of and he always
(08:38):
does this and he always doys this. Do you say, like, well,
what do you do? What's your part in this? Dance.
That's the thing. So I tell people all the time.
I mean, yeah, right, if you're a Jew from New York,
you have a b S meter that's very high, very clear.
But what I tell people all the time is the
one and the most pain needs to change first. Okay,
if you're in the most pain, I don't care that,
then you need to change. And when you change, then
(09:01):
the changes happened on the other side. That's how it
always works a hundred percent of the time. And actually,
I hate to say it, but when couples come into therapy,
it's one of the reasons that it doesn't work is
because people start on the house without doing the foundation
and right and the talking about what we argued about
last week. All that does is restimulate all that anger
(09:25):
and all that bad stuff. It doesn't I've in my
thirty plus years of doing this, I have never seen
it help. I just haven't, other than maybe one time
kind of a you know, just letting it all out
there and getting through it. But other than that, it's
I don't let couples come in and just complains. It's
how how do you determine or how does how do
(09:45):
your clients patients determine who's the one in the most pain.
I mean often, I was married for like five seconds
in the nineties, okay, and we did try to go
to marriage counseling and what he I mean he was Spanish,
he and this is the nineties, so it wasn't any
It just kept saying is with a very heavy accent,
which I won't try to emulate. You know, these are
Laura's problems. Laura has a problem. Laura needs to change,
(10:08):
and if she does, then our marriage will be fine.
So again that marriors did not last more than fourteen months,
but still and we're still good friends. And he's a
lovely guy, and we're probably too young because we were
twenty five. But that refrain that I'm sure you here,
which is he or she needs to do the work? Here?
She needs to change? Now? Is that being said by
the person who thinks they're in the most pain. I'm
(10:29):
in so much pain because my spouse is messed up
and he or she needs to change. So now you
say to them, but you're in so much pain, what
can we do to help you? Okay? I mean, that's it.
It's it's the person who's seeking out therapy. It's the
one complaining the most. Right. Usually the other one is
just like you said, I don't have the problem. If
he would stop drinking, we wouldn't have an issue. If
(10:49):
she would do this, we wouldn't have an issue. So
guess what that that's the that's the most pain because
the other person usually doesn't think it's that big a
deal or isn't need to look at it or whatever
that is. So you have to start with personal responsibility.
You co create relationships. So what are you going to
do with your part of the co creation? You've got
to start there, got start anywhere else. And I think
(11:12):
when people come in alone they kind of get that right,
like here I am, so it's a little easier to
interject in that way. What's organizational psychology? I don't know
that I've heard about that one? Yeah, I know, weird right. Well,
when I was in NBA school and I was crying
because I hated everyone, one of my professors came to
me and said, you're in the wrong degree. I said, what,
(11:35):
what what degree do I want? He said, organizational psychology.
I've never heard of it before. Uh. And with this,
no you moved to after now? Yeah, Now I was
in New York and h they and he said, you
want a degree in organizational psychology, which is the marriage
of psychology that you know really well in your background
and counseling and how organizations work and working with executives
(11:57):
and people and all the good stuff it. And I
hate to say it, but I think the thing that
makes me different in why I do as well as
I do is because of all the work I did
in business, not in counseling is cool because you know,
you don't have I wasn't working with executives and told, oh,
work forever. If there's no changes, it's okay, just keep going.
We'll just keep paying you. And so you have to
(12:20):
come up with things. One of my clients calls them
a therapeutic jingles, like I have these little ways that
I say things so that they're you know, we'll stick
in your mindntry remember them. Yep. I love love, and
again I think so many of the people in business
can apply it more easily than all that what they
might call that wishy washy or the woo woo or whatever. Yeah, exactly,
(12:42):
I love that. Fan. So now you've got teens, I've
got I've got one between your daughter and son. I've
got a fifteen year old and a ten year old,
so that's that's a whole new is Actually, I don't
know what to say. My son actually just turned seventeen
on Friday, and I am in love with my kids.
I get along great with them. They are so into
(13:03):
each other. If you ever look at my Instagram or anything,
it's always pictures of Max, like Aga McCartney. I mean,
they are really close. We're all really close. Close to
my ex. I'm close to his wife and he and
my man were all over together for Max's birthday. I
made a big dinner because I love to cook, that's um,
you know, and we were all together, and yeah, there's
(13:24):
more people to love my kids. That's that's what I
always say. That's what I always say. A bigger support group,
a bigger tribe of bigger family and if you can
do it, and I tell people, you can do it,
like you have to actually love your kids more than
you hate your ex, and then it comes together and
then you've also got great support. I mean for the
good times like a seventeenth birthday, but also for the
(13:47):
bad times. If God forbids, something goes wrong, a parent dies,
you have those family members as support, and that's huge.
It's so big. I actually I was sick a few
months ago and Evelyn, my x's wife, was texting me,
I'm going to target you anything. I'm going to be
at the story. Do you you need anything like constantly? And
my current partner's ex wife and I are really good friends.
(14:09):
We text all the time, and my parents, his kids.
You know, it's a it's a love best it's a village.
It takes a village. It really love that I have
built a village. Yes, people who follow me and our
online divorce community, it's over easy. No that I'm a
strong proponent of therapy and couples counseling. Many couples end
(14:32):
up getting back together, but not all of them, so
I almost always insist that they try that. And yet
after couples therapy, couples separate, which I don't think is
always a bad thing, but it's interesting that after all
the work couples do in therapy in the end, many
people still go their separate ways. What abbey in your
experience is the hurdle that people just can't overcome. It's
(14:56):
that foundation which is when couple, every almost every couple,
it comes to me says, our number one problem is
that we don't communicate. We need to work on communication,
and I have to tell them that they're wrong. Number one.
They communicate all the time, just not what they want.
But but really the problem in relationships is competition. That's
the real problem in relationships. We say things like, it's
(15:16):
your turn to put away the dishes. I took Sophie
to baseball on Monday. It's your turn to take Jack
on Friday. You spent money on this, I get to
spend money on this. We we say this stuff all
the time, and it sets us up on opposite teams.
So we're not happy when our other person gets something
because we think somehow it takes away from us. One
of the things I say all the time is people
(15:37):
will say I need my guy, my man, my woman,
whatever to take things off my plate. You know, they
have to take things at my plate, and I'm always
yelling it's the same plate, right, and it's the same plate.
They can't take anything off you are moving around the
mashed potatoes. People like, it's not that's not the answer.
You have to realize that you're shared resource. So if
your partner is hurting, you're hurting if you're giving them
(15:59):
all the struck because you're exhausted. Now they're exhausted and
you're both exhausted. Okay, so so let me hypothetical. I
come to you and I say, my partner's not taking
anything off my plate. He's no value added. I've got
all the ship going on and he's not helping. And
you say, okay, how do we deal with you, Laura
and what you're doing, because again you're not seeing him.
You don't know whether he's doing his fair share or not.
(16:20):
All you know is I'm totally overwhelmed. What do you
tell me? Yep, oh, I love it. I tell you
to do one or two things. One is to add
and the other subtract. The adding is to add resources
from outside the couple in every time you think, oh,
I gotta ask my husband, you that I have to
ask my wife. Stop, go find someone that you can pay. Okay,
(16:41):
I get because because I did not marry my man
because he mowed the lawn, Well, no one does. No
one marries for that, And yet those are the things
we fight about. It's insane. And that's not the value
that our partners brings. It's a just qualitative not quantitative,
so anything quantitative put out. So still on that same hypothetical.
(17:04):
So now I working parent have hired a gardener to
mow the lawn. Okay, so I'm paying the gardener. I'm
paying most of our bills, and my good for nothing husband,
you know, isn't doing anything. And he says, I'm a
stay home dad. But either our kids are in school
full time or I've actually, on your Abbey's advice, hired
a nanny. So I've got the nanny there too. Okay,
(17:25):
so now I'm still feeling really resentful. Now what I'm
still in a lot of case because you're still keeping score, right,
So there is no score keeping in a relationship, so
this you have to get out of that because of
course everybody loses, right, So instead, how am I not
really happy that my partner has time to relax so
he can be a great partner. And we if I'm
not here what you're doing to dig deep here I'm
(17:48):
supposed to be. Okay, I am good at least that's
really the bottom line. It's not what he's doing, it's
it's who he who he is. Okay. So, and I'll
give you this really really quick example. I had a
low tire pressure on my car. You know, the air
was out. Whatever, look at me, I write, New Yorker,
(18:09):
right cars, I don't know. People say what kind of
car do you have? I say silver? So I don't
all right so and he said like, oh, you know,
the air slona time, you gotta get that fixed is dangerous.
And I was like okay, And that was teflon. I
didn't even listen. Really, I didn't know what I thought.
I had to go to the mechanic and and and
lose my car for the day. I thought all these
things and I didn't realize I was thinking them two
(18:29):
days later, same thing. He's getting mad. He's like, why
aren't you This is dangerous. You're driving kids around. You
can't do this. That Saturday, I come out and he's
pulling up in my cars, like what are you doing?
He said, Well, I realized you're the most competent person
I know, and you weren't filling the freaking air and
the tire. And I realized, I think it's because you
don't get what it is like. You don't you know
(18:50):
he thought it through. You would have thought he split
the atom. I was so grateful. I was so like, hey,
thank you. I was like losing it. Oh, it took
him five seconds. We have a gas station on our
corners five minutes. So it's not the amount of time
that he took to do something. It's the value of
feeling taken care of, a feeling loved, a feeling supported.
(19:14):
That's what we marry for. So those are the things
you want to focus on, not how much time something
takes to do. The second you start doing that, you're
screwed because you just you gotta get out of that.
So tell us a little bit about psychologist and writer
Timothy Wilson on the influence of unconscious mind and decision
making and behavior, because I know your new video that
(19:35):
you're working on for your YouTube channel incorporates that a lot,
and I want to hear how that actors into all
of this. You're gonna love this. This is the game changer. This,
This is this book Strangers to Ourselves I read years ago,
and here's the deal. Our conscious brains process information at
a rate of fifty bits per second. Okay, conscious like
what I'm thinking. What I'm saying, are unconscious brains process
(19:58):
information at a rate of a eleven million bits per second? Okay.
So here's what Here's what happens all the time. Somebody
will come to me and say, having troubled my husband.
I said, Okay, here's a tool. Go home and use
this tool. And they're like, oh, they're all excited in
the office. I got it, Abby, I'm gonna go use
this tool. And they go home. But so consciously I'm
(20:18):
gonna use this tool, it's great. Unconsciously, this little tool
is not going to do a thing. Abby doesn't realize
how bad our problems are and how long they've been
going on. Right, all the doubt, all the stuff. I
used the tool with my husband, and he doesn't hear
what I say. He hears what I mean. So he
is picking up on all the doubt, the anxiety, the resentment,
(20:41):
the worry, the frustration, and he's like, oh, I see
her doing a different thing, but let's see home on
this loss right, sort of ignoring it and not doing anything.
I do this tool for a few days and he's
not changing. So I go, I knew this wouldn't work.
And then they go back to me. They go back
to me and go, Abby, I knew it. I knew
this wouldn't work. And I said that the problem you're
(21:01):
already going in that it wasn't gonna work. You were
already setting those and everyone knows this. You have talked
to someone at work anywhere and they were saying all
the right things, but you your BS meter was going off,
and you're like, uhh, that's your unconscious brain picking up
on what people are truly laying down versus what they're
consciously saying to you. So we have that all the time.
(21:23):
We forget that. We have it with our partners. So
everything that when you react in that way to what
you know, you think you're seeing and you that's all
that reaction, and it's the keeping score. Again, Well, I'm
only doing this thing, so they do this thing, and
then I'll do this thing and then they'll It's all conditional,
and that's what has got it. How does one change that? Abbey?
(21:46):
There is there a jingle for that. There's a jingle.
I do have a jingle. I have a few. So
one is that there's something called your reticular activating system.
I don't know if you guys have heard of this.
Your maraticular short okay, your RS for short. Uh No,
it's a little different. What it is. It's a It's
a conduit between your conscious and your subconscious mind. Everybody
(22:09):
has it, and you know you have it because if
you've ever bought a new car and then suddenly you
see the new that car everywhere, you know what I'm
talking about. Its consciously you were like even thinking about
buying the car, and it was all of a sudden
you thought, are they making more of these? What happened
every time I was pregnant? Every woman was pregnant. I
don't think I've seen a pregnant woman in yours, right,
It's like it kind of is, but it's actually a
(22:31):
brain thing. So your reticular activating system, your r S,
is filtering in things that you're consciously thinking about to
tell your subconscious to look for them. Okay, and I
do have a little cute YouTube video on this, but
and so it's looking for it. So if I think
my partner is always nagging me, my RS looks for
(22:52):
my partner nagging me. And the most important part of this,
the scariest part of this, is that it will filter
out anything that doesn't matter. So when my partners appreciative,
when he or she is loving, when they say thank you,
I'm teflon it's just gone. And this is why. And
you know you've had this where people are in the
room going you didn't say that, yes I did, I
(23:13):
did it this way. No you didn't. I would have
remembered that, and that you been filter. So you have
to program the R A S. And this fits right
in with that unconscious right, the fifty bits versus eleven million.
You have to program it for what you do want,
not what you don't want. Then the brain can't think
of negative right. So I love when someone says, well,
(23:34):
I want her to nag me less. But for that
one is if there's been somebody that you know cheated,
so can we overcome this? But now all you see
is if she's looking at another another guy. All you
see is if there's somebody hot on TV and she's
paying more attention, all you see is a guy in
numbers showing up on her phone. That's all you see.
(23:55):
So when she's gazing upon you lovingly, that doesn't even compute,
not even there exactly exactly. I mean, it's it is.
And so when you really understand this, and so people
can kind of maybe pooh pooh the law of attraction.
I don't, but some people do I give them the brains.
You know, when I'm working with these executives, right, I
can't be I can't say mindfulness. I have to say
(24:17):
attention training. Right. I use different words that they like,
but this is one of them. And when you program
the area. So if you got up every day and
just set an intention for what I call it the
eighteen second shift. Setting intention, it takes I've timed it
takes an average of eighteen seconds. Everyone's got eighteen seconds.
And all you do. You don't have to breathe special,
(24:38):
you don't have to do anything. You just sort of
close your eyes for a minute, maybe take one deep
breath and think, really set intention for what you want
this next little piece to be. I before we came
on today, I set intention that I want to be
a total service. I want people to walk away with like,
oh I can do that. I can do that. I
can do that. So my brain is bringing that to me.
(25:00):
Run over during it, hopefully during this session. I'm old.
Sometimes it doesn't work, but you know what I mean,
it's uh, it's coming all the time because we're you
can program it, and you've got to get ahead of it.
You've got to program every morning is multiple times as
much as you can setting that intention. I would say
it's the big game changer. Every person comes back to
(25:21):
me with saying, I can't believe how well that works.
They're shocked. And it's because of this RS. You're you're
putting it where you want it. You're listening to All's
Fair with Laura Wasser. I'm Laura and you may know
me best as the divorce attorney in Hollywood, but let
it be known that I fully support you staying in
your relationship until death do you part, or until my
(25:44):
vacation is over. At least please in any event, I
don't want divorce to be regarded as a failure or
a nightmare. It's an evolution of the way your family functions.
And as our guest today puts it, great relationships are
not built in a day. They're built daily, especially if
you do your eighteen second re set. We're discussing all
of this today with psychologists, author and speakers after Abby
(26:04):
Medcalf and Abby. The competition and relationships notwithstanding, give us
some other quick winds. People can easily integrate into their
relationships to make them more rewarding. We've got our eighteen
second reset where you check your r I S. But
give us a couple of good tips. Please. I'm gonna
give you two really good ones right here. They're so
easy and such quick wins. One of my favorite quotes
(26:25):
of all time is from the book Little Fires. Everywhere
I'm listening, she says in that book, anger is the
bodyguard of fear. It's like an epic epic line. And
so what I tell people, it's true when you're angry, really,
every time you're angry again, frustration, any of that, What
(26:48):
am I it is? What am I afraid of? Just stop?
As soon as you're angry, your partner, at your kid,
at the mailman, at wherever. What am I afraid of?
Right now? Sometimes you're afraid because you don't have enough
time to get done stuff you want to get done.
If you're snapping at the you know, person at the
post office. But you know, and sometimes with your partner,
what are you afraid of? It's usually rejection, abandonment, uh,
(27:09):
you know, not being seen, not being heard, not being
listened to all the good things. And then you want
to do something about that because the anger, of course
just pushes people away, and and you know, it's very
effective for not connecting. Well, it's all the self fulfilling prophecy.
If the fear is abandonment, I mean, I've been in
that relationship before. A right don't agree we're over, So
(27:35):
that is so common and that's really the thing. Right
people stay angry because it's that deep art. I mean,
that's what that is. And by the way, that's really rage,
and I always separate rage. Rage is anger plus helplessness.
It's when you feel helpless, you feel like everything you've
tried nothing works, and so there too, I tell people,
don't focus on the anger, you know, don't count to ten,
(27:57):
don't do that stuff. That's why it doesn't really work.
You want to focus on feeling helpless, so that means
do something, some action, one thing, set intention, do one thing.
So that's one that's like a quick win. What am
I afraid of right now? And then my other favorite,
my little therapeutic jingle is don't sack your relationship, so
don't offer suggestions, give advice, a criticize ever, Okay, no suggestions,
(28:24):
no advice, no criticizing, think of that. I don't think
of that, exhausted me, I don't what kind of relationship
is it? Then? Without those things, Well, I'll tell you
what do you do instead? The only thing left is
you ask questions? You know, can you tell me more
about that? If there was one thing I could do
(28:44):
right now that would help move the needle, what would
it be? If there was one thing I could say
right now that would really help you feel differently, what
would it be? What's one thing you've tried that hasn't worked?
You know, what's something I can do to support you
in this? You know there's a million questions. So what
happens if by opening that door? I mean, it seems
like a logical conclusion that by opening that door, what
(29:07):
can I do to help? Or what have I have
we tried that's not working? Are you not inviting criticism
or advice or suggestion from your partner to you? And
is that not dangerous? So let's say your partner says, well,
you know you could help, you could take care of
the kids once in a while, right, And you say,
(29:27):
and then you have to stay with the love though,
you have to lean into those So what's your partner saying?
They say they're very afraid, they're feeling overwhelmed. They're right,
that's you know, let yourself really realize what that is,
So ask a question. So tell me, really what you'd
like to see. Tell me three things you'd really like
to see that would let you know I'm really take
(29:48):
care of the kids the way you think they should
be taken care of. And you don't have to agree
with them, because then you can ask more questions. But
that's the thing. What you don't want to do. What
most people do is they keep score. I'll a you know,
I don't like that you did this this When you say,
how could you say that I did this, this, this,
this in your name, all the ways I'm a fabulous wife, partner, whatever,
(30:10):
I'm not listening. It doesn't matter that I did all
these things. It only matters that you didn't do the
one thing setting me I got it exactly. And by
the way, the one thing holds more weight that you
don't do or that you screw up than all the
good thing out right, because they haven't reset their intentions yet,
so they're still focusing on it evidently, and we can't
(30:30):
suggest that they do reset their attentions because that would
be offering advice. Well this is we have a tip
for that later. But but you don't have love. You
don't be afraid if you're sitting in the conversation afraid,
right you you can't base a love relationship on fear.
So if you're sitting there, you can't be afraid. You
have to know that whatever they're coming with, their coming
(30:50):
with and you're going to lean in with love, lean
in with love. So on your podcast, Relationships Made Easy, Abby,
I think on a recent episode you gave listeners the
three rules for having an effective argument and an exercise
called the wake up exercise. Tell us about those, please,
So the wake up where it is the best. So really,
when your partner, when your fine, let me just say
(31:12):
something really quick around I'm gonna give quick science, but
we're gonna it's gonna make sense. So when you are arguing,
a part of your brain called your amygdala, part of
the Olympic system, is turned on. Right. People know about
the magala usually the fight, flight or freeze. Okay, So
that's the only things you can do. You can fight,
you can run away, or you can freeze, which is
like the hasher okay now you know, or the shrug. Okay.
(31:36):
That's it. There is no other option because the thinking
part of your brain, the rational part, the place where
your preformal cortex and your neo cortex where we think
spirituality lives, where uh, compassion, appreciation, gratitude, thinking, rational problem solving.
That part of your brain and your amigella are on
a one way highway. If it is taken up with
(31:59):
fear based impulse of any kind, this fight flight of freeze,
you can't access that other thinking part of your brain.
On an functional m r I, it actually looks like
there's a blanket over the prefinal cortex when the amygdala
is lit up, when the limbic systems lit up. Is
that crazy? So when you're really upset, and I'll give
you one for your fifteen year old here, So I
(32:21):
have my my Max, my wonderful Max really upset about
a math test at the end of last you know, semester,
and upset and he's only a teenager, can be right, see,
because he's in fight flighter freeze mode. He thinks the
lion is about to eat him. I understand that we
think that's overreacting, but that's the only thing that comes
up in that two million year old wiring is I'm
(32:41):
it's all over. It's horrible, right, That's why they escalate
so much when we come over as parents, which we
often do, and go, it's okay, buddy, we know we'll
get the tutor. Remember you did okay last time, right,
we seal it stuff. We're basically saying, oh, it's okay,
there's no tiger, you're you're, and we're dismissing. And so
what do they do. They escalate. Oh Mychael, you don't understand,
(33:02):
and they escalate. And this happens if your partner is
complaining about barbed at work. It happens that no matter
what it is, when we minimize, we're saying we don't
see the tiger, and they feel like they have to escalate.
So what you do instead is you need to intervene
right there and get that other part of the brain.
And I call it say yes first, which is basically
(33:24):
that you match emotion but not tone. So instead I
said to Max, oh god, how many chapters? Oh let
me see god nine. I didn't yell it. I didn't escalate,
but I matched his emotion, which is upset. Oh my god,
barb began at work. And so guess what happens every
(33:44):
single time. I guarantee it. You can call me in
the middle of the night. If it doesn't work, because
it will, they come down. They and sonimes you have
to do it twice, but usually not more than twice,
and they're like, right, yeah, that sucks. And they right
because they don't keep convincing you that it's here correctly,
that the tigers here, I see the lion with you.
(34:06):
We're a team. I got you right, We're going to
do this together. Men, of course, aren't always as good
at this. I say with all love my heart A
love men, because they're fixers. They think the only reason
we're even telling them a problem is to fix it. So, oh,
I feel a little My butt looks big in these jeans. Well,
have you tried walking more? Have you done this? Do
you see that? Sweetie? I know I can't just some
(34:29):
men I just can't help. But those I tried. Yeah,
I do notice that. You're oh God, and I feel
that in my butt too. Yeah. What do we do more? Yeah?
But that's fine? Back up? Okay, So I get it,
you know, right, because again that's offering suggestions advice to criticizing.
(34:50):
You see where that goes wrong? Right, It's like I
don't know how to make my butt littler, please please,
we all know, so shut up. You know you don't
have to fix this. I want you to listen. I
want you to be here with me, and it's you
know so right, I want with whatever it is. So
once we do that bond, it's beautiful now. So to
get over there, I have so you can just do that.
You can just interrupt with you know, match motion and tone.
(35:12):
But the other thing that's really super is this wake
up word, which is a neural linguistic programming technique and
LP technique, which is basically what you do is you
pick a word when you're not arguing with your partner
or your family right that everyone loves everyone makes you happy.
So like our word right now is glitter is glitter.
It's such a stupid word, right, makes halter? Right, makes
(35:33):
you happy? Glitter. Let's look glitter. A lot of couple,
that's why we love Johnny. A lot of couple of
shoes use like Christmas or words like that. I have
a wonderful couple that uses the word dildo because you
can't not smile and say dildo, dildo, right. I don't
want to yell dildo across the house right now, you
know teenagers, but whatever your word is, right. So let's
(35:56):
say your partner is losing their crap right, and you're like,
what you do, or let's say they're coming at you wrong,
you know, and you're just then what you do is
you say the word you say glitter Christmas, whatever your
word is, and the other person's job, and you've already
discussed this is to just be quiet, just literally stop
mid sentence. What it does is it wakes up that
(36:19):
it gets you out of amygdala very quickly and into
that prefunnel thinking because you have to think. You're like,
what like if something came out and left field at
you and you have to now restrategize. It's like you're
running from the tiger, but someone through banana, you know,
and you're like, I have to run this way now, right,
And so that's what that is, and it gets the
thinking brain going and then then right, so then everything
just stops. And it doesn't mean that what your partner.
(36:40):
If if I say it to my partner, it doesn't
mean he was wrong or bad or anything else. It
just means I'm not listening anymore. So you might as
well stop talking, because whatever this is is upsetting me
and then you can take a breath. And then if
you're the person that says that, either of you can
say something like, can you say that again differently? Can
you tell me? Can you try again to say that,
(37:02):
I'm just not getting what you're trying to tell me?
Can you do that a different way? Or what you know?
Can or can you? What do you think I'm feeling
right now? That's a really good one. Anytime you're lost,
if you bring someone into the moment and just say
what are you feeling right this minute? It takes them
out of that and into here, Well I don't know,
(37:22):
I'm okay, Well what are you feeling? Not? Good? Angry?
Give me something right? And so put a feelings list
on the refrigerator of stupid faces, whatever you do, and
then they have to name a feeling. Well, actually I
was feeling resentful or you know. Then you get to it.
Then then you can have a talk. Let's try again. Yeah,
it's super simple, it's incredibly effective, and it literally can
(37:43):
stop a fight in its tracks when you're doing it,
and you just have to decide the word beforehand. So
when people call in to Relationships made Easy, are they
giving you a situation and then you're giving them advice
on the podcast, like right there in real time. No,
so on the podcast what I do because I'm a
research you can tell probably right, I'm a research junkie,
(38:05):
like like my nipples are wreck talking about it like research,
it's based approach um, and so I get very excited.
So what I do is people right in all the time,
and I have like an ask dr Abby segment in
the podcast where you can just get a straight question answered.
But I also what happens usually is like I had
a bunch of people right in about what do I
(38:26):
do in the honeymoon phase ends? Right, So then I
go research all the things because I like everything to
be wins actionable. Here's the research, here's what you do.
So I do the teach and I have action steps
on every single podcast because that's the thing, right. I
feel like so many are just sort of talking, and
then it's like, well what do I do? Now? Like
(38:46):
that's nice that that worked for you, but now what
do I do? And I don't do anything that's like oh,
me and my partner, this is what we do. It's
like that's nice, but that's nice for you. That's you too.
So I'm talking. You know, I work with literally thousands
of people now, but I still see people live like
I still see people because that's where I love that
work and I will never stop doing it because that
(39:08):
and that's where I get of course, my best left
sure that I can share with others. So I'm I
know it works because of my own people plus from
the research. Put that together right, and then I put
that out in the podcast. So it's mostly me chat.
As you can tell, I can't shut up, so it's
mostly me just talking. I like that though, but it's
backed and I mean, like you said, you're a research junkie,
(39:30):
and in our own way, we could say the same
thing about lawyers, except it maybe more as in terms
of bigger picture. But the thing that makes my nipples
erect is getting information about specific individuals, whether it's in
a family law matter and we're asking our discovery questions
or it's a podcast guest. So one of the elements
of discovery is the interrogatory. So we've got the all's
(39:52):
fair interrogatories. So Abby, do you sort of tell the truth,
the whole truth, and nothing about the truth I do
which relate sationship in your life has had the most
profound impact. Mm hmm um, my dad, why because it's
a lot of how I show up in the world,
both good and bad. What's your favorite love song? I
(40:17):
supposed to already have thought of this because I've heard
these before. I think it. Oh it's Luther vand Ross.
Um uh, superstar, superstar Luther Vanders all they want. What
is the one piece of advice you'd share with your
twenty something old old self? Relax? I love it, and
I love the brevity of her answers. Okay, And finally,
(40:40):
which romantic comedy could you watch on repeat? Um? I
love When Harry met Sally. That's a big yeah, right,
and even your you know, love of research and relationships
and what makes them work. That would make sense all
the little vignettes of the people's saying how they met
and whatever. Abby, Thank you so much for sharing your
(41:03):
witty wisdom and insight into relationships with us today. Please
tell people where they can find your podcast Relationships Made Easy,
and your best selling book Be Happily Married even if
your partner won't do a thing. Tell us, well, the
whole world is at my website, which is just my name,
Abby Medcalf dot com. It's m N D guys, m
E D c A L F Medcalf. Thank you. Right,
(41:27):
that's the thing, you know. I went with that married
name because Wax was my that's my maiden name. I
was like, I'll take that. I'm in uh so, Abby
Medcalf dot com. And then my book is on Amazon
and my podcast is anywhere pretty much. You download podcast
from Pandora to Stitchard whatever, It's all over the place.
(41:47):
And my Instagram is at Abbey Medcalf thriving. Just find it.
Find it, guys, you want them to work, go talk
to Abby. Thank you very much for being here with
us today. Thank you for having me. Of course, she
was great. I liked her. She was very upbeat. This
is a woman with two teenagers and she's still like happy.
I don't know. Some of the stuff she said did
(42:09):
not immediately compute, but she looks like she's got it handled,
so I guess I mean right. I love that her
safe word as glitter. I had me right there. I
believe me. I do know that. But I also feel
like she's got it figured out, and I love that
about her. This isn't like somebody who found her love
and stayed married. To the same person forever. She's figured
(42:32):
out how to do her next chapters. I love the
research element of what she said, and I really thought
it was interesting because we haven't had somebody say before
that you can kind of do I won't call a
couple's therapy. You can do marriage therapy with just one person.
I like that. It's interesting, absolutely, And I think you
all know what I think about casting your lot with
(42:52):
one person for the rest of your life. I'm just
not sure humans are meant to mate for life or
be a monogamous But those of you who have found
your your penguin, God bless good for you. By the way,
eighteen years we just had our eighteenth anniversary thanks to
your means right, Well, I not thanks to me. I
just officiated the weddings. But but I would say thanks
(43:12):
to Michael, your spouse, because he has got to have
the fucking patience of a saint. Um in any event, Johnny,
what do you think, audience, are we humans men to
partner for life? Let us know what you think on
our social channels at It's over Easy. You can also
engage with others going through breakups and moving on in
our private Facebook group. It's over easy community. Laura and
(43:36):
other experts do live Q and a's there, Plus there's
a wealth of info and conversations about relationships and before
you go, if you haven't already tapped, subscribe on our
podcast and leave us a review. Five stars would definitely
be good. Thank you, thanks for listening, and let's do
this again next Tuesday. By everyone,
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, And Charlamagne Tha God!
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.