October 24, 2025 • 32 mins
Last week was World Okapi Day, and to celebrate, hosts Rick and Marco are heading to the San Diego Safari Park to speak with Dallas Dumont and learn all about this strikingly striped mammal. While a relative of the giraffe, the okapi is not quite as tall but shares its prehensile tongue. Tune in to hear about the newest okapi addition to the zoo, the purpose of tucking, and how they use their large ears.
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
Ruby.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Hi, I'm Rich Schwartz.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
What is the world of Marco Wedds.
Speaker 3 (00:13):
And this is Amazing Wildlife, the podcast where we explore
unique stories the wildlife from around the world and uncover
fascinating animal facts. This podcast is in production with iHeartRadio's
Ruby Studio and San Diego Zoo Wildlife Alliance, an international
nonprofit conservation organization which oversees the San Diego Zoo and
Safari Park and Marco. I gotta say we've spent a
(00:33):
lot of time at Safari Park the last few episodes.
Speaker 4 (00:35):
I know, but you know what I got. Admit, man,
I was here a little earlier. I'm really enjoying this today.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
And I have to say we are at the San
Diego Zoo today. It's a nice warm summer days. We're
actually wrapping up summer most of the world, but totally
here in San Diego is still nice and warm. And
we hinted last time we were talking about a bird,
the castaway, that has this really awesome ability to do
this unique deep call that you mimic very well, right,
But the thing is when you do it, I can't
(01:00):
feel it my chest.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
So when the cast worry does it, it's such a
low frequency.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
I feel like I failed you, Sair.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
It would worry me if you could do it.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Like you're kind of worry too.
Speaker 4 (01:10):
But I mean to your point, you were talking about
the vocal it's a dense forest habitat that these animals
have to vocalize and communicate it.
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Yeah, and that was kind of our segue than to
where we are now. We are down by the hippos
and the o'copy.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
It's a dense forested area of the San Diego Zoo.
It is really awesome. And we're here today because coming
up in a few days after this episode comes out, it's.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
World of Copy Day.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
What better way to learn more about a copy is
than having an o' copy wildlife care specialist with us.
Speaker 4 (01:38):
I mean, I'm super pumped, and admittedly I don't know
a lot about O copy, so I can't wait to
learn to that.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
Then our guest will have a lot of questions from you.
Why don't you go ahead and introduce yourself to our audience.
Give them your name and your title here at the
San Diego Zoo.
Speaker 5 (01:50):
Hi, my name is Dallas Dumont and I'm a senior
wildlife care specialist here at San Diego Zoo.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
That's great.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
So we are doing o copy today, we're talking about
a copy. We're standing outside the ocopy habitat Dallas. Do
you just take care of ocopy only or do you
have several species you care for in this area?
Speaker 5 (02:07):
We actually have several species we care for. We're actually
considered part of Sunbear Forest here in San Diego Zoo,
and Sunbar Forest is comprised of the tigers, we have leopards, bears,
the hippos, and of course the o'coppies.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Well, you got a lot of that.
Speaker 4 (02:21):
I was gonna say, that's really Admittedly, I'm a big
fan of this area too.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
I mean just the trees in particular.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
I think Horraticles does a great job with the fike is,
but also this really unique animal, the ocopy that I'm
guessing there's probably someone in the world that probably has
no idea what oocopy is. Could you describe this animal
for our listeners please?
Speaker 5 (02:39):
Yeah, it's not surprising. Oh copies are relatively new to Westerners.
They really weren't discovered or studying until early nineteen hundreds,
so for US Westerners they're very relatively new animals.
Speaker 6 (02:50):
OH copies are.
Speaker 5 (02:51):
Actually a relative of the giraffe, so you're in the
giraffe day family. They have a long neck, not as
long as the giraffe. They are forced to animal, so
they're going to be living in deep forests. They have
a beautiful dark color. Their skin conve anywhere from dark
brown to almost a black purplish color.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (03:08):
I see that they stand about five feet tall at
the shoulders and a little over six feet at the
tip of the ear, so they are a little bit
taller than us people.
Speaker 1 (03:16):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 5 (03:17):
And they have that prehensile tongue or a long tongue
like the giraftes do that they use to browse with.
And being a browser, they're gonna eat leaf materials, so
they're going to eat things off of trees, and they
have probably about fifty or sixty different varieties of trees
that they can consume here at the zoo.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Wow, that's really cool.
Speaker 4 (03:34):
I mean, before we go into the eating portion, and
you mentioned prehensiuitich I want to talk about too. But
there's one physical attribute I look at. These people ask
me all the time, are the stripes? They're always asking me, Right.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
It's funny because if you are just listening to our podcast,
and you don't know what this animal looks like. I
have heard more often than not when here at the
zoo people see an okapa, they're like, oh, it's be
related to the zebra.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
I get the same thing. It's like a really tall
ze y.
Speaker 4 (03:58):
Yeah, because which is the stripes look very similar to
zebra stripes. Now they're on all the legs and the
hind parts, all the way down to right above the hoof.
Speaker 6 (04:06):
Correct, correct, Yeah, they do.
Speaker 5 (04:07):
They have those stripes, and they also help them to
blend in and they also allow them to find each
other because okopy are solitary by nature, so they're not
a group animal, not like giraffe at all. They live
alone in the forest, so to find each other maybe
during breeding season or maybe a calf following its mother,
(04:28):
those stripes are going to allow.
Speaker 6 (04:29):
Them to see each other.
Speaker 5 (04:30):
And they're also going to shade that animal when they're
in the forested areas and make them harder for predators
to see.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Oh, that's pretty cool.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
It is pretty cool.
Speaker 3 (04:38):
And it's kind of funny too, because you look at
those stripes, you think, off the top of your head, well,
it looks like a zebra related to the zebra.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
And at a distance.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
So right now they're at the far end of the
habitat for us, and at a distance you're seeing those
stripes are very obvious.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
But if you come to the zoo, and we also
have them.
Speaker 3 (04:53):
At the Fry Park as well, or if you go
to your local zoo, if you're not here in San
Diego and you see okopy, pay close attention to the
their head because, as Dallas mentioned, they are relatives of
the giraffe. They have that prehensile or grasping tongue like
the giraffe has for browsing or taking leaves off of
the trees. But there's other attributes on the head that
are very similar to the draffe as well, structure wise.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Correct.
Speaker 6 (05:15):
Yeah, that's correct.
Speaker 5 (05:16):
So they have the long elongated muzzle like a giraffe does.
They also have very long, pretty eyelashes. Everybody comments those
actually serve a purpose. Because these guys are digging up
in the trees, you're gonna have debris and pieces of
tree matter falling into your face. Those long eyelashes are
actually protecting their eyes and keeping that debris from falling
(05:39):
in their face when they're grabbing and pulling with their tongue.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Oh, that's pretty cool. You know.
Speaker 4 (05:43):
On the drive down here, I was trying to think of, like,
what's the difference between giraffe and o'copy and how are
they interacting with their habitsat We've learned that rattle sphinks
can be seed dispersers, and my brain started going like,
if you're a big mammal like an o'copy, and you're
cruising around a big forested area, you're grabbing different leaves,
is there a potential of maybe these animals being a
pollinator or a seed disperseder at all?
Speaker 1 (06:04):
They helping out the forest that we know of, You know, I.
Speaker 5 (06:06):
Believe they probably could be doing that. They're gonna disperse
a lot more through their feces obviously when they're ingesting,
because they will ingest berries and seeds and fruits and
other things they can find that are hanging from the trees.
So they're also going to disperse that through leaving piles
of feces around us. They're walking through the forest, which
is going to fertilize. You're gonna have more seeds and
(06:27):
you're gonna have more plant growth.
Speaker 4 (06:28):
Wow, that sounded more like a casseroad to me and mego,
But I mean, I love that a lot of similarities, right,
thick jungle seed dispersers. Obviously it's a mammal, so it's
a live birth, which kind of makes me want to
ask you. There is some pretty exciting happening recently here
at the San Diego Zoo, right, can you speak about
the young baby that got born here a little bit ago?
Speaker 5 (06:48):
Yeah, just about two weeks ago, we had a female
born to our female, Subira, and it was a long
wait for this baby because the gestation period on an ocapi,
similar to the draft, is about four hundred and forty days,
so you're looking at almost fourteen months of pregnancy for
these females.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Fourteen months.
Speaker 4 (07:08):
Moms hold on to the steering wheels of fourteen months?
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Are you kidding? Really?
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Wow?
Speaker 4 (07:13):
That's quite the investment and carry up babe in your
belly for that long.
Speaker 6 (07:17):
Yeah, it is.
Speaker 5 (07:17):
It's a lot of work for these girls, and it's
a lot of anticipation and they don't really obviously notice
too much when they're first starting out, But towards the
end of the pregnancy, you could tell that Subira was
getting ready to how she was getting a little bigger,
a little more uncomfortable. It took quite a while to
get there, and her appetite obviously went through the roof
as she got closer to getting well.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
We were waiting for you to come to the habitsat.
I was hearing guests talk about it.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
So everyone's really really excited about this, really happy news
here at the zoo.
Speaker 5 (07:46):
Yeah, we're really excited this year. This is Subira's fourth baby,
so she's an excellent mom. She's about twelve years old
and in captivity, Oh, copies can live up into their thirties,
so she's still.
Speaker 6 (07:58):
A young mom.
Speaker 4 (07:59):
I mean to make sense, thrown in a managed care,
got a great health system, your food right here ready
to go.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
You got amazing wildlife.
Speaker 5 (08:06):
Care happening too, exactly, and Subera was just ready for
this calf. We're really excited because this was the first
time we've had a calf born on habitat. Normally, when
Subira gives birth, it's in the winter, so it's cold,
so we can't have a baby out here in the.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Right because we're talking about their habitat and the congo
right where.
Speaker 6 (08:26):
It's between seventy and ninety all the time.
Speaker 5 (08:31):
So here when she would give birth a lot of times,
and this was just due to breeding when the males
would breede, because you have not a year, but fourteen rights, right,
Oh yeah, so a lot of times these calves are
going to come in the winter, so she would give
birth in the barn where we have heat and everything
else set up for her. But this year for breeding
with Capoo, who is the father of our calf, the
(08:53):
breeding took place earlier. This year, Capoo was on the ball,
so she actually gave birth in the summer. So we
decided to, you know, hey, let's let her have it
in the habitat where normally they.
Speaker 6 (09:04):
Would have it.
Speaker 5 (09:05):
So we're super excited that she's doing very well. The
calf's tucking, and of course our guests are just over
the moon being able to see a calf this young.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
For us, non mammal people, tucking, what is tucking means?
Speaker 5 (09:17):
So tucking is what we call with a lot of
the hoof stock, where the calves will hide and find
a nice safe space, whether it's a tall pile of
grass or in a cave or some area where there's
bushes they can get under. And obviously that's for safety, right,
Mom's not going to stay with the kid. Mom's going
to go out and eat and make milk and come back,
(09:38):
so that calf's going to be by itself, so it
finds a nice, comfortable, safe space for itself to sit
and relax. And the great thing about it is with
these kids, they don't have any smell, so there's no
scent to them, no scent.
Speaker 6 (09:51):
They're born without scent, so it's so.
Speaker 5 (09:54):
Hard for a predator to try and find these little guys, right,
it keeps them nice and safe.
Speaker 6 (09:59):
Mom obviously has a sense she's an adult.
Speaker 5 (10:01):
Animal, so she stays away from the calf when she's
not nursing or giving it a bath or caring for it,
because that's going to keep that calf safer because moms
scent could potentially attract it.
Speaker 6 (10:13):
A predator near.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
Okay, so I have two questions too, That's cool, I
didn't know that.
Speaker 3 (10:17):
First of all, I want to go back to the
fourteen months, and then I have a question about predators. Okay, So,
first of all, fourteen months, if I remember correctly, the
longer the gestation usually, then when the baby does come out,
it pretty much can rock and roll and get moving
if it needs to. Within a short period of time.
Is that the same for O copies like dirafts, like
they can stand up within a half hour an hour,
and yeah.
Speaker 5 (10:34):
Oh copy kids are going to stand up quick and
oh copy babies are going to weigh about fifty pounds
when they're born. Subira are adult female And by the way,
females are bigger than males, like.
Speaker 6 (10:47):
The connection that females are bigger than the males.
Speaker 5 (10:54):
So that calf is about fifty pounds when she was born,
and she stood probably within about thirty and it's a
birth and then was nursing within about thirty five minutes
of birth.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
Nice.
Speaker 6 (11:04):
But by talking, what she's doing is she's resting. And
when you're resting, you're growing.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
Right.
Speaker 5 (11:10):
Oh yeah, all that beautiful milk that mom's given her,
that's all going to help her get bigger and bigger
and bigger.
Speaker 6 (11:16):
So if she's just resting, she's just growing.
Speaker 5 (11:19):
And so in a few weeks she's going to be
probably about double her size, which is what we want.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
Right.
Speaker 5 (11:26):
The bigger you are, the safer you're going to be.
So by talking and resting, all of that energy that
she's getting from mom is going to growing and making herself.
Speaker 4 (11:35):
Bigger, talk about super milk. I had no idea that
females are bigger. My brain's swirling right now. But you Rick,
you had a question about a predator.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
Yeah, So we've talked a little about the importance of
talking the fact that the baby does not have a
scent to it, therefore it's harder for a predator to
find it.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
We talked about the fact that we live in a
very dense.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Forest, that these stripes on the legs help the baby
follow mom when it needs to, but also going to
help them blend into the environment as the light comes
through that worst and breaks into light and dark patterns.
What is their natural predator in the jungles of the
congo in that deep forest of Africa.
Speaker 5 (12:08):
So you're obviously going to have large cat species that
are going to be your predators. You're also going to
possibly have smaller cats, or you could even have reptiles
in that area if you're near a wire source.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
A crocodile, right, or a leopard maybe.
Speaker 5 (12:24):
Yeah, So you're going to have these different species. But again,
for these guys, they're so elusive. I mean, if you
look at the O copy and you see those big
satellite ears and those ears work independently. They can turn
different directions, so they're going to be using that sound
reference to make sure they're keeping themselves safe.
Speaker 6 (12:42):
So that's another way.
Speaker 5 (12:43):
Oh, copies keep themselves safe, and that makes them harder
to study, right because they hear.
Speaker 6 (12:47):
You, oh yeah, I'm out long before you will find that.
Speaker 3 (12:52):
I was about to say too, with the fact that
it took humans as long as it did to go,
this is a real animal that exists in the wild.
And again I think kids that they might go well
early nineteen hundreds, that was forever ago, but in the
scheme of humans understanding the world around them and documenting
taxonomy animals, that was pretty late in the game when
it comes to that process.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
So clearly, being in a dense forest, eye.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
Sight's important for finding food and things close proximity, but
that hearing is going to be most important for making
sure you stay clear of somebody like a leopard. But
leopards have good hearing too, So it does make me wonder.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
Like, how do they communicate?
Speaker 3 (13:28):
I K don't know the answer, but tell us Dallas
about how mom and baby communicate and if that's something
that comes into play for avoiding the predator.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, they do.
Speaker 6 (13:39):
Oh copies do make different sounds.
Speaker 5 (13:41):
They will make a tough sound, they'll make a bleat sound,
So they have different sounds that they can make that
we will hear oh copies. Because they are solitary, so
they spend most of their time alone, males by themselves,
females by themselves, their vocalizations are not often heard, and
it's also believed that they have subsonic noises that.
Speaker 6 (14:02):
They can make.
Speaker 5 (14:02):
So I can't hear them, you can't hear them, and
perhaps predators can't hear them as well. But again, like
a lot of post stock, they may not actually communicate
through vocalization like we do, but through scent.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (14:16):
So they actually have scent glands in between their toes.
They have the split toes, so the two toes and
they have a scent gland in between there, and so
when they walk, they're leading scent. So that's another way
for these guys to communicate. Now, whether or not a
predator can pick up on that scent, I'm not aware of.
But other ocopies can pick up on those scents as well,
(14:36):
So that's another way for them to communicate quietly.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
And we know from other animals and other studies done
that as the hormones and chemicals within a mammal's body changes,
the scent changes. So that's probably one of the really
key factors for the female to let the male know
she's cycling through and ready for a possible mate if
they're a good match, is through those scent changing on
the hooks. And then I remember reading when it comes
(15:02):
to the subsonic sound that that was a huge surprise
for scientists when they were doing some recordings and they
picked up these sounds that they believe are low enough
that the leopards can't even hear either, which is just
insane to me. It's so crazy that they've been able
to evolve this level of communication that mom and baby
can chat without the leopard even being able to tag
(15:22):
about it at all.
Speaker 4 (15:23):
I love that we learned from the previous episode of
the Castories that they're doing the same same thing. But
it makes me excited thinking all these different animals different
continents have the same sort of behavioral attributes. Survival techniques
are living in a dense, forced area, so that's really
they do.
Speaker 5 (15:36):
They find their niches in these areas, and the copies
another great adaptation they have is they're also on the move.
Speaker 6 (15:43):
During the day it's going they're going to be moving.
Speaker 5 (15:46):
They're going to be constantly foraging and constantly moving throughout
their territories.
Speaker 6 (15:50):
So if you're not standing still, that's another.
Speaker 5 (15:52):
Way that you are not going to be a potential
meal because you're constantly on the move. Females have been
known to be active almost all all day long and
maybe resting at night, and males are moving even more
than females because they're on the problem. So these guys
are constantly moving, which again that's another way for them
to avoid predators because they're not holding still with their
(16:15):
scentse and so it's a little harder to track them
if you're constantly moving.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
Yeah, oh wow, that's interesting.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
I am curious because we do know just from when
we talk about what's happening with the getting Oh wait,
hold on, we're talking.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
Just I'm excited, so I'm whispering. That's how excited a
coppy baby. But is what I'm seeing, because that's adorable.
I see when you.
Speaker 4 (16:41):
Mentioned the caver, I wasn't really clear on what you
were referencing. But so everyone's aware they're on the habitat
here we're in the VIP space byll the way, so
there is a tour you can get a really special
copy experience.
Speaker 1 (16:51):
But if you're looking at the habitat to the right.
Speaker 4 (16:53):
You can see what looks like a sort of like
mini cave structure, and we're just seeing the little youngster
starting to puck out a little bit.
Speaker 1 (16:59):
Which is it dorble place to talk.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
I mean, it's like it's almost like they plan that.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
This is for us to thank you very much.
Speaker 6 (17:06):
Those are the ideal places for the calves.
Speaker 5 (17:09):
And we just strategically put a little grass in front
of that cave just to give her more of that
tuck to look good, and she'll come out and nurse
and she'll go right back to her tuck Spox.
Speaker 1 (17:22):
Coming out, she stepping out of the cave, she's what
how high? Like three feet?
Speaker 5 (17:26):
Yeah, she's probably maybe three feet tall the shoulders, but
they basically look like a miniature adult.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
I was about to say, they come out ready to
rock and roll in thirty minutes.
Speaker 5 (17:36):
And she sees her mom over at the hay feet
or you see Superas over there eating, so she's a mom.
Speaker 6 (17:42):
I think it's time to nurse and it's interesting too.
Speaker 4 (17:44):
They have those same stripe patterns you're referencing earlier. Right,
especially on the rear end there you can see very prominent.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
He'll blend in.
Speaker 5 (17:51):
And if you watch her when she goes to nurse,
you know she's not going to mom's front. She's looking
at those stripes in the back because those stripes in
the back are covered in the milk machine, which is
the udder where she wants me.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Ask you kind of like zebras, Are they unique.
Speaker 5 (18:05):
The stripe pattern Yes, the stripe patterns are just like
that of Zebras, where everybody has a little bit different.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Cool.
Speaker 4 (18:12):
Okay, she's got a little squiggy to land the baby
on the left rear leg there.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
That's adorable. Oh wow. All right.
Speaker 3 (18:17):
So if you are listening to the podcast and you're
hearing us gush about this adorable baby, I encourage you
to go to the San Diego Zoo social media, whether
it's Facebook or Instagram or wherever. They have done some
great posts about this. Now, this guy was born about
two weeks ago, Dallas said, while we're recording this, but
this episode comes out in about two weeks, so you'll
have to go back about four weeks in the social
media to find it because they're always posting such great
(18:39):
content there. But the San Diego Zoo social media team
has already covered some great baby photos of this kid.
It is adorable and it's amazing to me. It literally
looks like an adult just miniaturized. So it goes to
show that the survival side of things, it's so important
that they can get up a walk and blend into
their environment just like mom does, so they can make
it in the wilds like they do.
Speaker 4 (18:58):
So well, it's so amazing and what a great area too.
It's well whatever eight conservation centers. You know, we have
savannahs Australia of course the Southwest, but the African forces
so many unique types of wildlife from bonobo's to gorillas
to a copy too. So what a cool experience of
that their guess gets to view this as well. As
we're talking and saying, all these guests are there taking
shots and videos of this. So you think, right now,
(19:19):
the baby is asking for some milk, possibly your little She.
Speaker 5 (19:23):
Is definitely going to be looking for a nursing opportunity.
I can see as I watched Sabira Suberra is taking
this opportunity to give the kid a bath.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
Yeah, that's a long time. You weren't kidding about.
Speaker 5 (19:33):
That fascinating which some people might find or might find gross.
Again when we're talking predators, right, Okay, baby's gonna things
go in, things come out. Yeah, okay, Well we don't
want that attracting a predator either. So Subira, being the
great mom that she is, she's going to stimulate that
(19:55):
calf to defecate, and then Subira is going to consume
all of that mater. Interesting, I mean, and that's going
to number one.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
It's actually number two, a number two.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
I was ready for that.
Speaker 5 (20:07):
At number two is not going to be around for
a predator to pick up a scent for it or
be attracted to.
Speaker 4 (20:12):
It's not that gross to be honestly. I mean, there's
other mammal species, you know, like a wall and be
as a baby, they need.
Speaker 1 (20:16):
To eat their parents.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Helps with the digest digestive system.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
Thank you very much. That's really this is just a.
Speaker 5 (20:23):
Great way for the okapi to help maintain that safety
for their calves because now there's nothing for predators.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
That's what it's like.
Speaker 4 (20:30):
Super hyper stealth is so much about blending in no
scent as a baby, right, the stripe pattern eating the
ecal matter of your baby to hide away in those forests.
Speaker 3 (20:39):
So, Dallas, do we know what their numbers are like
in the wild right now or how they're doing or
is it kind of hard to tell because it's so
hard to like even know that they're there.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
Yeah, that's it.
Speaker 5 (20:48):
They're hard to know that they're even there. Many locals
who live in the areas, a lot of them have
never even seen one. Oh wow, they know they exist.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
Yeah, And a lot of.
Speaker 6 (20:56):
People see them just on camera traps.
Speaker 5 (20:58):
They do a lot of the cameras, so they're taking
pictures of them and from looking at scat and guessing
their numbers in the Iteri forested area are probably around
thirteen thousand to fifteen thousand.
Speaker 6 (21:10):
But that's the only place in the world where these
animals are found.
Speaker 5 (21:13):
Nowhere else in Africa are okapy found but in this
one particular area in the Congo that he.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
Speaks to the success that we're doing here at San
Diego Zoo to help out with the population. Can I
ask you, is there an SSP, a species survival plan
that we're involved in here in the United States?
Speaker 5 (21:28):
There is we recently just came out with a care
manual for O copies that is being shared with different facilities,
so we've been given access to that, which is fantastic.
But most of the knowledge that we have of okapies
has only been learned from studying O copies in zoo environments,
so we've been able to garner a lot of information
(21:48):
from that, and we do have a species survival plan
for the okapies, just like many of the other animals
we have here at the zoo. And the father of
this beautiful little girl, Capo, actually came from Cans so
he's a Kansas Man. So these guys will travel around
the country and in some cases around the globe for
breeding and again we'll see different things. You could get
(22:10):
them some from Germany or you know, from the East coast.
Speaker 4 (22:14):
Also a reminder to work together and collaborate, right, it
makes you think of Sabolski's horse another shower. It's because
of zoos and aquariums that we still have these animals
alive today, so that's really really wicked.
Speaker 5 (22:23):
And Sabira has raised three boys that are now out
fathering other babies around the country as well.
Speaker 6 (22:29):
So Sabira is a grandmother.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
And so with the different copies you've worked with in
your time Dallas as a wildlife care specialist, do they
all have their own personalities? We've heard from the giraft
team at the Fireparks that they definitely all have their
own personalities.
Speaker 5 (22:43):
I think for every animal I've ever worked with, everyone
has a different personality. Subira for me, she was really
the first okopy I had experience with, and I've always
felt like she's the supermodel and I am the groveling
you know, yes, I.
Speaker 6 (23:02):
Am so in love with you. You're a fantast and
she's all, yes, I know, thank you.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
I mean I can see why because she is one.
Speaker 4 (23:10):
Absolutely, I'm assuming you have a wonderful relationship with these animals.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
Can ask you The skin feels so velvety, is it?
Speaker 5 (23:18):
So it's velvety, but it's actually has an oil to it,
so it's got a sene on it and it's kind
of greasy. It feels kind of greasy, which you again,
rainforest animal in the forest, moisture, humidity, it's going to
protect their skin. And it's also great too because if
you're moving through thickets and protecting bushes, yeah, you're you're sleek,
(23:39):
and you want to be sleek because you don't want
to get all scraped up as you're moving through the
forest area.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
That's cool.
Speaker 5 (23:45):
So she's got built in water protection as well as
being sleek so that she's not going to scratch yourself
up moving through thickets or what if she gets scared
and she runs right thicket, you know, gets cut up. Yeah,
so those things are perfect little about patients that they
have that do help protect them.
Speaker 4 (24:01):
Wow, must be so impressive if you ever get the
opportunity to see when gallop through a force, I'm sure
that is just breathtaking.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
As mom and baby are coming right by.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Though.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
Can I ask you, Dallas, do you have like a
favorite attribute or a favorite thing about the O copy Like,
is there some fun fact that you're like, Oh, this
is just the coolest thing, or just you in general,
it's not a fun fact.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
There's something about them that you love.
Speaker 5 (24:21):
I think for me, the coolest thing about the O
copies is just their ears. Oh yeah, there are these
satellites that just pick up every sound in the mornings
when there's no folks in the zoo. I can hear
Sube kind of getting a little restless and It'll take
me a few seconds, but I'll realize there's a truck
(24:42):
up at the front of the zoo.
Speaker 6 (24:43):
She's here.
Speaker 5 (24:44):
Before I out, she'll hear a noise, and maybe about
three seconds later, I'll actually hear the noise. So to me,
it's just fascinating and their ears are just so huge,
and plus that's one of the things that Suberra will
actually enjoy is getting the back of those ears rubbed.
Speaker 4 (25:04):
What a cool privilege you have with that, I gotta
ask you, because she's right here, she's everyone listening.
Speaker 1 (25:08):
She's literally eating, like right in front of us right now,
the baby. But actually look inside the mouth rig. I'm
seeing like it doesn't look like the standard dent.
Speaker 6 (25:16):
There are no teeth.
Speaker 5 (25:17):
They only have a gum on the top, oh yeah,
and on the bottom, so where the canines and the
incisors would be, it's more of a gummy effect on
the top and then on the bottom they're just small
incisors very minute.
Speaker 6 (25:30):
But in the back is where they have those large moles.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
Right all right, because it's a browser.
Speaker 4 (25:34):
Right to your point, she's picking different kinds of leafy material.
Is there a preferred plant source that you know in Africa?
That these animals are forged or is it kind of
I've read a gorillas as an example, that gorilla's in
the forest like it's like a big salad.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
Bar for whatever the gorillas.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
Yeah right, yeah, I would imagine the same thing.
Speaker 5 (25:50):
To my knowledge, there's probably over one hundred different tree
species that these guys can consume. Wow.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
Wow.
Speaker 5 (25:56):
Here in San Diego, Sube's favorite things are and elm
and grew ya. So these are some of the ones
that she really enjoys to eat. But a lot of
their daily food comes from acasha, which we have several
different species of acasha.
Speaker 6 (26:13):
That we can grow for these guys.
Speaker 5 (26:14):
And of course depends on the time of the year, right,
what's growing best at that time of the year, so
the palatability. And she of course is a big produce lover.
Everybody loves the produce, so she's a big carried eater.
Speaker 6 (26:27):
She likes yams.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
That's so cool. I almost wish you would cruntchle out
us so we can get it on the microphone. Wreck
a right.
Speaker 4 (26:34):
Oh wow, I just love it because all of us,
three of us, we've worked here for so long and
yet we still get excited to me see moments like this.
It's why animals is so amazing Tommy, Right, they connect
with us in such a cool way.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
Well, and speaking of that, Marco and all of us
working for clearly Dallas, you know so much about the species.
You've done a lot of work here at the San
Diego Zoo and working with these animals. For anybody in
our audience that would like to maybe think about you know,
I just heard ill I was talking about a copy.
I want to do that someday too.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
What was your path?
Speaker 3 (27:00):
How did you get here and be able to basically
spend every day with this incredibly unique African forest animal.
Speaker 5 (27:06):
My path actually started in the Midwest. So I grew
up on a farm. Oh so, I was a farm kid,
and I wanted to, of course continue that tradition of
working with agriculture and farm animals. So I went to
college to get a degree in animal science. Oh cool,
and I did a internship at Brookfield Zoo.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
Nice, and I left the farm.
Speaker 5 (27:30):
Because I fell in love with wildlife and I felt
like there was so much more I could do with
conservation and wildlife, and it just kind of became my passion.
Speaker 2 (27:40):
Sure makes sense to me about this.
Speaker 5 (27:43):
To learn about these incredible animals and of course bring
them to our guests and to the people that listen
to you guys, you know, just to let them know
how amazing nature really is and how much we need
to protect it and understand it.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
Definitely appreciate that, Dallas in Dallas. Before we wrap this up,
is there anything we.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
Haven't touched on yet about the old copy that you
would want to make sure our audience.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
Gets to hear.
Speaker 5 (28:07):
I think the most important thing is just that every animal,
including the O copies, they have a niche in the
world and just like we do, and I think the
O copies fill.
Speaker 6 (28:17):
That niche and so many people find them for the
first time.
Speaker 5 (28:21):
So for me, when people come to the zoo, they've
actually discovered a new species. And I love that about
the O copies because they love to be seen. Sube
loves to eat.
Speaker 6 (28:31):
And show off herself and gorgeous.
Speaker 5 (28:34):
It's kind of an all moment I see for a
lot of people who have never even heard of an
o'copy and to come here and see Sube.
Speaker 6 (28:41):
She's just such a great representative of.
Speaker 5 (28:43):
What amazing animals, plants, and creatures we have and we
share with the world.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
One hundred percent. Well, said Anika. What a cool experience.
This is the first time you see the baby sea,
so this is definitely a special one for me. Right,
this is really.
Speaker 6 (29:00):
Entire time.
Speaker 4 (29:01):
I've just been staring at these animals. And I know
I'm a bird gay, but guys, I mean, look at this.
I'm staying at the baby right now. You got to
get your butts at the zoo. Nevermind, there got a milk,
Mustag got a milk, must Rick said earlier. There's a
copy at the Safari Park. There's also at the zoo.
But if you want to see this youngster growing up
with her mama, please come down here.
Speaker 1 (29:20):
Technically, this area what it's called.
Speaker 6 (29:22):
For guests, they called the Chery Forest.
Speaker 1 (29:24):
Area Chery Forest Area.
Speaker 6 (29:25):
They're just south of the tigers, right behind the hippos.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
Don't go past.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
It's easy it is to because they're kind of tucked
in the back being next to the hippos are in
the forest area.
Speaker 3 (29:33):
And I will say this, if you come by this
area and you don't see them, make sure you plan
to come by a second time because just in the
thirty some minutes we've been here, we didn't see anybody
at first, and then we saw a mom wandering around
in the background, and then baby came out to drink,
and now they're right here.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
So yeah, hey, take your time at habitats and if
there's a species you really want.
Speaker 3 (29:52):
To see, come back multiple times to that area because
you might see something you didn't see before.
Speaker 2 (29:56):
Yeah, Dallas, thank you so much for spending time with
us today.
Speaker 6 (30:00):
Thank you for showing off our beautiful old copies.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
Yeah, you're great, and these animals are amazing, of course.
I just really appreciate your time.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
Yeah, thank you, friend, and good luck with the baby.
Thank you can see it grow up. Ooh that was
really exciting, right Rick, Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
That baby. I can't even right now, my flufy.
Speaker 4 (30:21):
On the face, the stripes, and it's like a mini
mama too, which is incredible.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
The beauty of.
Speaker 1 (30:27):
Wildlife and the uniqueness of it.
Speaker 4 (30:29):
Every animal is different, but like to Dallas's point, every
animal has a niche or role to play in our
beautiful blue planet.
Speaker 3 (30:35):
Right. Well, absolutely absolutely, And I love to the sounds
that they make. Then how there's no smell to the baby,
how all the different things they have to help survive
in the wild.
Speaker 2 (30:44):
But when she was talking about.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
How sometimes the mom will react to a sound and
then all of a sudden, she'll hear it a little
bit later. You know what.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
It reminded me of like having a dog at home
and you're like, you're relaxing.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
And they forgot because they hear.
Speaker 2 (30:56):
Something, and you're like, what, because I hearing is so
much better.
Speaker 3 (31:00):
But again, if you aren't able to come to the
zoo's fire park, and you can't visit a zoo that
hasward copy, look up what they look like.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
Go to the San Diego Zoo social media to check
these guys out. Their ears are huge and it's adorable.
They look so cute. Moms right now still in front
of us eating and it just it's so nah. I mean,
I can stay here all day, eat all day, but
I can say I know.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
I'm getting hunger myself. No, but back to just the
forested animals.
Speaker 4 (31:23):
Like earlier, we did a castory episode now with these
guys in the congo. But I believe our next episode
we're still gonna be in the theme of the deep forest.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
Right in this interview, you did mention that the gorillas
that live in a similar forests at African areas.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
Yeah, yeah, have the salad bar. They're always eating right.
Just so happens, We're gonna go back up to the.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
Safari Park next back to the Park of the I know.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
And we're gonna find out more about what's going on
with our gorillas.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
No, I can't wait, Marco what and I am Rich Schwartz.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
Thanks for listening.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
For more information about the San Diego Zoo and San
Diego Zoo Safari Park, go to SDZWA dot org. Amazing
Wildlife is a production of iHeartRadio. Our supervising producers are
Nikkia Swinton and Dylan Fagan, and our sound designers are
Sierra Spreen and Matt Russell.
Speaker 2 (32:17):
For more shows from iHeartRadio, check out the iHeartRadio
Speaker 3 (32:20):
App, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Ruby.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Hi, I'm Rich Schwartz.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
What is the world of Marco Wedds.
Speaker 3 (00:13):
And this is Amazing Wildlife, the podcast where we explore
unique stories the wildlife from around the world and uncover
fascinating animal facts. This podcast is in production with iHeartRadio's
Ruby Studio and San Diego Zoo Wildlife Alliance, an international
nonprofit conservation organization which oversees the San Diego Zoo and
Safari Park and Marco. I gotta say we've spent a
(00:33):
lot of time at Safari Park the last few episodes.
Speaker 4 (00:35):
I know, but you know what I got. Admit, man,
I was here a little earlier. I'm really enjoying this today.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
And I have to say we are at the San
Diego Zoo today. It's a nice warm summer days. We're
actually wrapping up summer most of the world, but totally
here in San Diego is still nice and warm. And
we hinted last time we were talking about a bird,
the castaway, that has this really awesome ability to do
this unique deep call that you mimic very well, right,
But the thing is when you do it, I can't
(01:00):
feel it my chest.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
So when the cast worry does it, it's such a
low frequency.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
I feel like I failed you, Sair.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
It would worry me if you could do it.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Like you're kind of worry too.
Speaker 4 (01:10):
But I mean to your point, you were talking about
the vocal it's a dense forest habitat that these animals
have to vocalize and communicate it.
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Yeah, and that was kind of our segue than to
where we are now. We are down by the hippos
and the o'copy.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
It's a dense forested area of the San Diego Zoo.
It is really awesome. And we're here today because coming
up in a few days after this episode comes out, it's.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
World of Copy Day.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
What better way to learn more about a copy is
than having an o' copy wildlife care specialist with us.
Speaker 4 (01:38):
I mean, I'm super pumped, and admittedly I don't know
a lot about O copy, so I can't wait to
learn to that.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
Then our guest will have a lot of questions from you.
Why don't you go ahead and introduce yourself to our audience.
Give them your name and your title here at the
San Diego Zoo.
Speaker 5 (01:50):
Hi, my name is Dallas Dumont and I'm a senior
wildlife care specialist here at San Diego Zoo.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
That's great.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
So we are doing o copy today, we're talking about
a copy. We're standing outside the ocopy habitat Dallas. Do
you just take care of ocopy only or do you
have several species you care for in this area?
Speaker 5 (02:07):
We actually have several species we care for. We're actually
considered part of Sunbear Forest here in San Diego Zoo,
and Sunbar Forest is comprised of the tigers, we have leopards, bears,
the hippos, and of course the o'coppies.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Well, you got a lot of that.
Speaker 4 (02:21):
I was gonna say, that's really Admittedly, I'm a big
fan of this area too.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
I mean just the trees in particular.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
I think Horraticles does a great job with the fike is,
but also this really unique animal, the ocopy that I'm
guessing there's probably someone in the world that probably has
no idea what oocopy is. Could you describe this animal
for our listeners please?
Speaker 5 (02:39):
Yeah, it's not surprising. Oh copies are relatively new to Westerners.
They really weren't discovered or studying until early nineteen hundreds,
so for US Westerners they're very relatively new animals.
Speaker 6 (02:50):
OH copies are.
Speaker 5 (02:51):
Actually a relative of the giraffe, so you're in the
giraffe day family. They have a long neck, not as
long as the giraffe. They are forced to animal, so
they're going to be living in deep forests. They have
a beautiful dark color. Their skin conve anywhere from dark
brown to almost a black purplish color.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (03:08):
I see that they stand about five feet tall at
the shoulders and a little over six feet at the
tip of the ear, so they are a little bit
taller than us people.
Speaker 1 (03:16):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 5 (03:17):
And they have that prehensile tongue or a long tongue
like the giraftes do that they use to browse with.
And being a browser, they're gonna eat leaf materials, so
they're going to eat things off of trees, and they
have probably about fifty or sixty different varieties of trees
that they can consume here at the zoo.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Wow, that's really cool.
Speaker 4 (03:34):
I mean, before we go into the eating portion, and
you mentioned prehensiuitich I want to talk about too. But
there's one physical attribute I look at. These people ask
me all the time, are the stripes? They're always asking me, Right.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
It's funny because if you are just listening to our podcast,
and you don't know what this animal looks like. I
have heard more often than not when here at the
zoo people see an okapa, they're like, oh, it's be
related to the zebra.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
I get the same thing. It's like a really tall
ze y.
Speaker 4 (03:58):
Yeah, because which is the stripes look very similar to
zebra stripes. Now they're on all the legs and the
hind parts, all the way down to right above the hoof.
Speaker 6 (04:06):
Correct, correct, Yeah, they do.
Speaker 5 (04:07):
They have those stripes, and they also help them to
blend in and they also allow them to find each
other because okopy are solitary by nature, so they're not
a group animal, not like giraffe at all. They live
alone in the forest, so to find each other maybe
during breeding season or maybe a calf following its mother,
(04:28):
those stripes are going to allow.
Speaker 6 (04:29):
Them to see each other.
Speaker 5 (04:30):
And they're also going to shade that animal when they're
in the forested areas and make them harder for predators
to see.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Oh, that's pretty cool.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
It is pretty cool.
Speaker 3 (04:38):
And it's kind of funny too, because you look at
those stripes, you think, off the top of your head, well,
it looks like a zebra related to the zebra.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
And at a distance.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
So right now they're at the far end of the
habitat for us, and at a distance you're seeing those
stripes are very obvious.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
But if you come to the zoo, and we also
have them.
Speaker 3 (04:53):
At the Fry Park as well, or if you go
to your local zoo, if you're not here in San
Diego and you see okopy, pay close attention to the
their head because, as Dallas mentioned, they are relatives of
the giraffe. They have that prehensile or grasping tongue like
the giraffe has for browsing or taking leaves off of
the trees. But there's other attributes on the head that
are very similar to the draffe as well, structure wise.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Correct.
Speaker 6 (05:15):
Yeah, that's correct.
Speaker 5 (05:16):
So they have the long elongated muzzle like a giraffe does.
They also have very long, pretty eyelashes. Everybody comments those
actually serve a purpose. Because these guys are digging up
in the trees, you're gonna have debris and pieces of
tree matter falling into your face. Those long eyelashes are
actually protecting their eyes and keeping that debris from falling
(05:39):
in their face when they're grabbing and pulling with their tongue.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Oh, that's pretty cool. You know.
Speaker 4 (05:43):
On the drive down here, I was trying to think of, like,
what's the difference between giraffe and o'copy and how are
they interacting with their habitsat We've learned that rattle sphinks
can be seed dispersers, and my brain started going like,
if you're a big mammal like an o'copy, and you're
cruising around a big forested area, you're grabbing different leaves,
is there a potential of maybe these animals being a
pollinator or a seed disperseder at all?
Speaker 1 (06:04):
They helping out the forest that we know of, You know, I.
Speaker 5 (06:06):
Believe they probably could be doing that. They're gonna disperse
a lot more through their feces obviously when they're ingesting,
because they will ingest berries and seeds and fruits and
other things they can find that are hanging from the trees.
So they're also going to disperse that through leaving piles
of feces around us. They're walking through the forest, which
is going to fertilize. You're gonna have more seeds and
(06:27):
you're gonna have more plant growth.
Speaker 4 (06:28):
Wow, that sounded more like a casseroad to me and mego,
But I mean, I love that a lot of similarities, right,
thick jungle seed dispersers. Obviously it's a mammal, so it's
a live birth, which kind of makes me want to
ask you. There is some pretty exciting happening recently here
at the San Diego Zoo, right, can you speak about
the young baby that got born here a little bit ago?
Speaker 5 (06:48):
Yeah, just about two weeks ago, we had a female
born to our female, Subira, and it was a long
wait for this baby because the gestation period on an ocapi,
similar to the draft, is about four hundred and forty days,
so you're looking at almost fourteen months of pregnancy for
these females.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Fourteen months.
Speaker 4 (07:08):
Moms hold on to the steering wheels of fourteen months?
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Are you kidding? Really?
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Wow?
Speaker 4 (07:13):
That's quite the investment and carry up babe in your
belly for that long.
Speaker 6 (07:17):
Yeah, it is.
Speaker 5 (07:17):
It's a lot of work for these girls, and it's
a lot of anticipation and they don't really obviously notice
too much when they're first starting out, But towards the
end of the pregnancy, you could tell that Subira was
getting ready to how she was getting a little bigger,
a little more uncomfortable. It took quite a while to
get there, and her appetite obviously went through the roof
as she got closer to getting well.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
We were waiting for you to come to the habitsat.
I was hearing guests talk about it.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
So everyone's really really excited about this, really happy news
here at the zoo.
Speaker 5 (07:46):
Yeah, we're really excited this year. This is Subira's fourth baby,
so she's an excellent mom. She's about twelve years old
and in captivity, Oh, copies can live up into their thirties,
so she's still.
Speaker 6 (07:58):
A young mom.
Speaker 4 (07:59):
I mean to make sense, thrown in a managed care,
got a great health system, your food right here ready
to go.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
You got amazing wildlife.
Speaker 5 (08:06):
Care happening too, exactly, and Subera was just ready for
this calf. We're really excited because this was the first
time we've had a calf born on habitat. Normally, when
Subira gives birth, it's in the winter, so it's cold,
so we can't have a baby out here in the.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Right because we're talking about their habitat and the congo
right where.
Speaker 6 (08:26):
It's between seventy and ninety all the time.
Speaker 5 (08:31):
So here when she would give birth a lot of times,
and this was just due to breeding when the males
would breede, because you have not a year, but fourteen rights, right,
Oh yeah, so a lot of times these calves are
going to come in the winter, so she would give
birth in the barn where we have heat and everything
else set up for her. But this year for breeding
with Capoo, who is the father of our calf, the
(08:53):
breeding took place earlier. This year, Capoo was on the ball,
so she actually gave birth in the summer. So we
decided to, you know, hey, let's let her have it
in the habitat where normally they.
Speaker 6 (09:04):
Would have it.
Speaker 5 (09:05):
So we're super excited that she's doing very well. The
calf's tucking, and of course our guests are just over
the moon being able to see a calf this young.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
For us, non mammal people, tucking, what is tucking means?
Speaker 5 (09:17):
So tucking is what we call with a lot of
the hoof stock, where the calves will hide and find
a nice safe space, whether it's a tall pile of
grass or in a cave or some area where there's
bushes they can get under. And obviously that's for safety, right,
Mom's not going to stay with the kid. Mom's going
to go out and eat and make milk and come back,
(09:38):
so that calf's going to be by itself, so it
finds a nice, comfortable, safe space for itself to sit
and relax. And the great thing about it is with
these kids, they don't have any smell, so there's no
scent to them, no scent.
Speaker 6 (09:51):
They're born without scent, so it's so.
Speaker 5 (09:54):
Hard for a predator to try and find these little guys, right,
it keeps them nice and safe.
Speaker 6 (09:59):
Mom obviously has a sense she's an adult.
Speaker 5 (10:01):
Animal, so she stays away from the calf when she's
not nursing or giving it a bath or caring for it,
because that's going to keep that calf safer because moms
scent could potentially attract it.
Speaker 6 (10:13):
A predator near.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
Okay, so I have two questions too, That's cool, I
didn't know that.
Speaker 3 (10:17):
First of all, I want to go back to the
fourteen months, and then I have a question about predators. Okay, So,
first of all, fourteen months, if I remember correctly, the
longer the gestation usually, then when the baby does come out,
it pretty much can rock and roll and get moving
if it needs to. Within a short period of time.
Is that the same for O copies like dirafts, like
they can stand up within a half hour an hour,
and yeah.
Speaker 5 (10:34):
Oh copy kids are going to stand up quick and
oh copy babies are going to weigh about fifty pounds
when they're born. Subira are adult female And by the way,
females are bigger than males, like.
Speaker 6 (10:47):
The connection that females are bigger than the males.
Speaker 5 (10:54):
So that calf is about fifty pounds when she was born,
and she stood probably within about thirty and it's a
birth and then was nursing within about thirty five minutes
of birth.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
Nice.
Speaker 6 (11:04):
But by talking, what she's doing is she's resting. And
when you're resting, you're growing.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
Right.
Speaker 5 (11:10):
Oh yeah, all that beautiful milk that mom's given her,
that's all going to help her get bigger and bigger
and bigger.
Speaker 6 (11:16):
So if she's just resting, she's just growing.
Speaker 5 (11:19):
And so in a few weeks she's going to be
probably about double her size, which is what we want.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
Right.
Speaker 5 (11:26):
The bigger you are, the safer you're going to be.
So by talking and resting, all of that energy that
she's getting from mom is going to growing and making herself.
Speaker 4 (11:35):
Bigger, talk about super milk. I had no idea that
females are bigger. My brain's swirling right now. But you Rick,
you had a question about a predator.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
Yeah, So we've talked a little about the importance of
talking the fact that the baby does not have a
scent to it, therefore it's harder for a predator to
find it.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
We talked about the fact that we live in a
very dense.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Forest, that these stripes on the legs help the baby
follow mom when it needs to, but also going to
help them blend into the environment as the light comes
through that worst and breaks into light and dark patterns.
What is their natural predator in the jungles of the
congo in that deep forest of Africa.
Speaker 5 (12:08):
So you're obviously going to have large cat species that
are going to be your predators. You're also going to
possibly have smaller cats, or you could even have reptiles
in that area if you're near a wire source.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
A crocodile, right, or a leopard maybe.
Speaker 5 (12:24):
Yeah, So you're going to have these different species. But again,
for these guys, they're so elusive. I mean, if you
look at the O copy and you see those big
satellite ears and those ears work independently. They can turn
different directions, so they're going to be using that sound
reference to make sure they're keeping themselves safe.
Speaker 6 (12:42):
So that's another way.
Speaker 5 (12:43):
Oh, copies keep themselves safe, and that makes them harder
to study, right because they hear.
Speaker 6 (12:47):
You, oh yeah, I'm out long before you will find that.
Speaker 3 (12:52):
I was about to say too, with the fact that
it took humans as long as it did to go,
this is a real animal that exists in the wild.
And again I think kids that they might go well
early nineteen hundreds, that was forever ago, but in the
scheme of humans understanding the world around them and documenting
taxonomy animals, that was pretty late in the game when
it comes to that process.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
So clearly, being in a dense forest, eye.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
Sight's important for finding food and things close proximity, but
that hearing is going to be most important for making
sure you stay clear of somebody like a leopard. But
leopards have good hearing too, So it does make me wonder.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
Like, how do they communicate?
Speaker 3 (13:28):
I K don't know the answer, but tell us Dallas
about how mom and baby communicate and if that's something
that comes into play for avoiding the predator.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, they do.
Speaker 6 (13:39):
Oh copies do make different sounds.
Speaker 5 (13:41):
They will make a tough sound, they'll make a bleat sound,
So they have different sounds that they can make that
we will hear oh copies. Because they are solitary, so
they spend most of their time alone, males by themselves,
females by themselves, their vocalizations are not often heard, and
it's also believed that they have subsonic noises that.
Speaker 6 (14:02):
They can make.
Speaker 5 (14:02):
So I can't hear them, you can't hear them, and
perhaps predators can't hear them as well. But again, like
a lot of post stock, they may not actually communicate
through vocalization like we do, but through scent.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (14:16):
So they actually have scent glands in between their toes.
They have the split toes, so the two toes and
they have a scent gland in between there, and so
when they walk, they're leading scent. So that's another way
for these guys to communicate. Now, whether or not a
predator can pick up on that scent, I'm not aware of.
But other ocopies can pick up on those scents as well,
(14:36):
So that's another way for them to communicate quietly.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
And we know from other animals and other studies done
that as the hormones and chemicals within a mammal's body changes,
the scent changes. So that's probably one of the really
key factors for the female to let the male know
she's cycling through and ready for a possible mate if
they're a good match, is through those scent changing on
the hooks. And then I remember reading when it comes
(15:02):
to the subsonic sound that that was a huge surprise
for scientists when they were doing some recordings and they
picked up these sounds that they believe are low enough
that the leopards can't even hear either, which is just
insane to me. It's so crazy that they've been able
to evolve this level of communication that mom and baby
can chat without the leopard even being able to tag
(15:22):
about it at all.
Speaker 4 (15:23):
I love that we learned from the previous episode of
the Castories that they're doing the same same thing. But
it makes me excited thinking all these different animals different
continents have the same sort of behavioral attributes. Survival techniques
are living in a dense, forced area, so that's really
they do.
Speaker 5 (15:36):
They find their niches in these areas, and the copies
another great adaptation they have is they're also on the move.
Speaker 6 (15:43):
During the day it's going they're going to be moving.
Speaker 5 (15:46):
They're going to be constantly foraging and constantly moving throughout
their territories.
Speaker 6 (15:50):
So if you're not standing still, that's another.
Speaker 5 (15:52):
Way that you are not going to be a potential
meal because you're constantly on the move. Females have been
known to be active almost all all day long and
maybe resting at night, and males are moving even more
than females because they're on the problem. So these guys
are constantly moving, which again that's another way for them
to avoid predators because they're not holding still with their
(16:15):
scentse and so it's a little harder to track them
if you're constantly moving.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
Yeah, oh wow, that's interesting.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
I am curious because we do know just from when
we talk about what's happening with the getting Oh wait,
hold on, we're talking.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
Just I'm excited, so I'm whispering. That's how excited a
coppy baby. But is what I'm seeing, because that's adorable.
I see when you.
Speaker 4 (16:41):
Mentioned the caver, I wasn't really clear on what you
were referencing. But so everyone's aware they're on the habitat
here we're in the VIP space byll the way, so
there is a tour you can get a really special
copy experience.
Speaker 1 (16:51):
But if you're looking at the habitat to the right.
Speaker 4 (16:53):
You can see what looks like a sort of like
mini cave structure, and we're just seeing the little youngster
starting to puck out a little bit.
Speaker 1 (16:59):
Which is it dorble place to talk.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
I mean, it's like it's almost like they plan that.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
This is for us to thank you very much.
Speaker 6 (17:06):
Those are the ideal places for the calves.
Speaker 5 (17:09):
And we just strategically put a little grass in front
of that cave just to give her more of that
tuck to look good, and she'll come out and nurse
and she'll go right back to her tuck Spox.
Speaker 1 (17:22):
Coming out, she stepping out of the cave, she's what
how high? Like three feet?
Speaker 5 (17:26):
Yeah, she's probably maybe three feet tall the shoulders, but
they basically look like a miniature adult.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
I was about to say, they come out ready to
rock and roll in thirty minutes.
Speaker 5 (17:36):
And she sees her mom over at the hay feet
or you see Superas over there eating, so she's a mom.
Speaker 6 (17:42):
I think it's time to nurse and it's interesting too.
Speaker 4 (17:44):
They have those same stripe patterns you're referencing earlier. Right,
especially on the rear end there you can see very prominent.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
He'll blend in.
Speaker 5 (17:51):
And if you watch her when she goes to nurse,
you know she's not going to mom's front. She's looking
at those stripes in the back because those stripes in
the back are covered in the milk machine, which is
the udder where she wants me.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Ask you kind of like zebras, Are they unique.
Speaker 5 (18:05):
The stripe pattern Yes, the stripe patterns are just like
that of Zebras, where everybody has a little bit different.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Cool.
Speaker 4 (18:12):
Okay, she's got a little squiggy to land the baby
on the left rear leg there.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
That's adorable. Oh wow. All right.
Speaker 3 (18:17):
So if you are listening to the podcast and you're
hearing us gush about this adorable baby, I encourage you
to go to the San Diego Zoo social media, whether
it's Facebook or Instagram or wherever. They have done some
great posts about this. Now, this guy was born about
two weeks ago, Dallas said, while we're recording this, but
this episode comes out in about two weeks, so you'll
have to go back about four weeks in the social
media to find it because they're always posting such great
(18:39):
content there. But the San Diego Zoo social media team
has already covered some great baby photos of this kid.
It is adorable and it's amazing to me. It literally
looks like an adult just miniaturized. So it goes to
show that the survival side of things, it's so important
that they can get up a walk and blend into
their environment just like mom does, so they can make
it in the wilds like they do.
Speaker 4 (18:58):
So well, it's so amazing and what a great area too.
It's well whatever eight conservation centers. You know, we have
savannahs Australia of course the Southwest, but the African forces
so many unique types of wildlife from bonobo's to gorillas
to a copy too. So what a cool experience of
that their guess gets to view this as well. As
we're talking and saying, all these guests are there taking
shots and videos of this. So you think, right now,
(19:19):
the baby is asking for some milk, possibly your little She.
Speaker 5 (19:23):
Is definitely going to be looking for a nursing opportunity.
I can see as I watched Sabira Suberra is taking
this opportunity to give the kid a bath.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
Yeah, that's a long time. You weren't kidding about.
Speaker 5 (19:33):
That fascinating which some people might find or might find gross.
Again when we're talking predators, right, Okay, baby's gonna things
go in, things come out. Yeah, okay, Well we don't
want that attracting a predator either. So Subira, being the
great mom that she is, she's going to stimulate that
(19:55):
calf to defecate, and then Subira is going to consume
all of that mater. Interesting, I mean, and that's going
to number one.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
It's actually number two, a number two.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
I was ready for that.
Speaker 5 (20:07):
At number two is not going to be around for
a predator to pick up a scent for it or
be attracted to.
Speaker 4 (20:12):
It's not that gross to be honestly. I mean, there's
other mammal species, you know, like a wall and be
as a baby, they need.
Speaker 1 (20:16):
To eat their parents.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Helps with the digest digestive system.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
Thank you very much. That's really this is just a.
Speaker 5 (20:23):
Great way for the okapi to help maintain that safety
for their calves because now there's nothing for predators.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
That's what it's like.
Speaker 4 (20:30):
Super hyper stealth is so much about blending in no
scent as a baby, right, the stripe pattern eating the
ecal matter of your baby to hide away in those forests.
Speaker 3 (20:39):
So, Dallas, do we know what their numbers are like
in the wild right now or how they're doing or
is it kind of hard to tell because it's so
hard to like even know that they're there.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
Yeah, that's it.
Speaker 5 (20:48):
They're hard to know that they're even there. Many locals
who live in the areas, a lot of them have
never even seen one. Oh wow, they know they exist.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
Yeah, And a lot of.
Speaker 6 (20:56):
People see them just on camera traps.
Speaker 5 (20:58):
They do a lot of the cameras, so they're taking
pictures of them and from looking at scat and guessing
their numbers in the Iteri forested area are probably around
thirteen thousand to fifteen thousand.
Speaker 6 (21:10):
But that's the only place in the world where these
animals are found.
Speaker 5 (21:13):
Nowhere else in Africa are okapy found but in this
one particular area in the Congo that he.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
Speaks to the success that we're doing here at San
Diego Zoo to help out with the population. Can I
ask you, is there an SSP, a species survival plan
that we're involved in here in the United States?
Speaker 5 (21:28):
There is we recently just came out with a care
manual for O copies that is being shared with different facilities,
so we've been given access to that, which is fantastic.
But most of the knowledge that we have of okapies
has only been learned from studying O copies in zoo environments,
so we've been able to garner a lot of information
(21:48):
from that, and we do have a species survival plan
for the okapies, just like many of the other animals
we have here at the zoo. And the father of
this beautiful little girl, Capo, actually came from Cans so
he's a Kansas Man. So these guys will travel around
the country and in some cases around the globe for
breeding and again we'll see different things. You could get
(22:10):
them some from Germany or you know, from the East coast.
Speaker 4 (22:14):
Also a reminder to work together and collaborate, right, it
makes you think of Sabolski's horse another shower. It's because
of zoos and aquariums that we still have these animals
alive today, so that's really really wicked.
Speaker 5 (22:23):
And Sabira has raised three boys that are now out
fathering other babies around the country as well.
Speaker 6 (22:29):
So Sabira is a grandmother.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
And so with the different copies you've worked with in
your time Dallas as a wildlife care specialist, do they
all have their own personalities? We've heard from the giraft
team at the Fireparks that they definitely all have their
own personalities.
Speaker 5 (22:43):
I think for every animal I've ever worked with, everyone
has a different personality. Subira for me, she was really
the first okopy I had experience with, and I've always
felt like she's the supermodel and I am the groveling
you know, yes, I.
Speaker 6 (23:02):
Am so in love with you. You're a fantast and
she's all, yes, I know, thank you.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
I mean I can see why because she is one.
Speaker 4 (23:10):
Absolutely, I'm assuming you have a wonderful relationship with these animals.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
Can ask you The skin feels so velvety, is it?
Speaker 5 (23:18):
So it's velvety, but it's actually has an oil to it,
so it's got a sene on it and it's kind
of greasy. It feels kind of greasy, which you again,
rainforest animal in the forest, moisture, humidity, it's going to
protect their skin. And it's also great too because if
you're moving through thickets and protecting bushes, yeah, you're you're sleek,
(23:39):
and you want to be sleek because you don't want
to get all scraped up as you're moving through the
forest area.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
That's cool.
Speaker 5 (23:45):
So she's got built in water protection as well as
being sleek so that she's not going to scratch yourself
up moving through thickets or what if she gets scared
and she runs right thicket, you know, gets cut up. Yeah,
so those things are perfect little about patients that they
have that do help protect them.
Speaker 4 (24:01):
Wow, must be so impressive if you ever get the
opportunity to see when gallop through a force, I'm sure
that is just breathtaking.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
As mom and baby are coming right by.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Though.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
Can I ask you, Dallas, do you have like a
favorite attribute or a favorite thing about the O copy Like,
is there some fun fact that you're like, Oh, this
is just the coolest thing, or just you in general,
it's not a fun fact.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
There's something about them that you love.
Speaker 5 (24:21):
I think for me, the coolest thing about the O
copies is just their ears. Oh yeah, there are these
satellites that just pick up every sound in the mornings
when there's no folks in the zoo. I can hear
Sube kind of getting a little restless and It'll take
me a few seconds, but I'll realize there's a truck
(24:42):
up at the front of the zoo.
Speaker 6 (24:43):
She's here.
Speaker 5 (24:44):
Before I out, she'll hear a noise, and maybe about
three seconds later, I'll actually hear the noise. So to me,
it's just fascinating and their ears are just so huge,
and plus that's one of the things that Suberra will
actually enjoy is getting the back of those ears rubbed.
Speaker 4 (25:04):
What a cool privilege you have with that, I gotta
ask you, because she's right here, she's everyone listening.
Speaker 1 (25:08):
She's literally eating, like right in front of us right now,
the baby. But actually look inside the mouth rig. I'm
seeing like it doesn't look like the standard dent.
Speaker 6 (25:16):
There are no teeth.
Speaker 5 (25:17):
They only have a gum on the top, oh yeah,
and on the bottom, so where the canines and the
incisors would be, it's more of a gummy effect on
the top and then on the bottom they're just small
incisors very minute.
Speaker 6 (25:30):
But in the back is where they have those large moles.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
Right all right, because it's a browser.
Speaker 4 (25:34):
Right to your point, she's picking different kinds of leafy material.
Is there a preferred plant source that you know in Africa?
That these animals are forged or is it kind of
I've read a gorillas as an example, that gorilla's in
the forest like it's like a big salad.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
Bar for whatever the gorillas.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
Yeah right, yeah, I would imagine the same thing.
Speaker 5 (25:50):
To my knowledge, there's probably over one hundred different tree
species that these guys can consume. Wow.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
Wow.
Speaker 5 (25:56):
Here in San Diego, Sube's favorite things are and elm
and grew ya. So these are some of the ones
that she really enjoys to eat. But a lot of
their daily food comes from acasha, which we have several
different species of acasha.
Speaker 6 (26:13):
That we can grow for these guys.
Speaker 5 (26:14):
And of course depends on the time of the year, right,
what's growing best at that time of the year, so
the palatability. And she of course is a big produce lover.
Everybody loves the produce, so she's a big carried eater.
Speaker 6 (26:27):
She likes yams.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
That's so cool. I almost wish you would cruntchle out
us so we can get it on the microphone. Wreck
a right.
Speaker 4 (26:34):
Oh wow, I just love it because all of us,
three of us, we've worked here for so long and
yet we still get excited to me see moments like this.
It's why animals is so amazing Tommy, Right, they connect
with us in such a cool way.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
Well, and speaking of that, Marco and all of us
working for clearly Dallas, you know so much about the species.
You've done a lot of work here at the San
Diego Zoo and working with these animals. For anybody in
our audience that would like to maybe think about you know,
I just heard ill I was talking about a copy.
I want to do that someday too.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
What was your path?
Speaker 3 (27:00):
How did you get here and be able to basically
spend every day with this incredibly unique African forest animal.
Speaker 5 (27:06):
My path actually started in the Midwest. So I grew
up on a farm. Oh so, I was a farm kid,
and I wanted to, of course continue that tradition of
working with agriculture and farm animals. So I went to
college to get a degree in animal science. Oh cool,
and I did a internship at Brookfield Zoo.
Speaker 1 (27:26):
Nice, and I left the farm.
Speaker 5 (27:30):
Because I fell in love with wildlife and I felt
like there was so much more I could do with
conservation and wildlife, and it just kind of became my passion.
Speaker 2 (27:40):
Sure makes sense to me about this.
Speaker 5 (27:43):
To learn about these incredible animals and of course bring
them to our guests and to the people that listen
to you guys, you know, just to let them know
how amazing nature really is and how much we need
to protect it and understand it.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
Definitely appreciate that, Dallas in Dallas. Before we wrap this up,
is there anything we.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
Haven't touched on yet about the old copy that you
would want to make sure our audience.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
Gets to hear.
Speaker 5 (28:07):
I think the most important thing is just that every animal,
including the O copies, they have a niche in the
world and just like we do, and I think the
O copies fill.
Speaker 6 (28:17):
That niche and so many people find them for the
first time.
Speaker 5 (28:21):
So for me, when people come to the zoo, they've
actually discovered a new species. And I love that about
the O copies because they love to be seen. Sube
loves to eat.
Speaker 6 (28:31):
And show off herself and gorgeous.
Speaker 5 (28:34):
It's kind of an all moment I see for a
lot of people who have never even heard of an
o'copy and to come here and see Sube.
Speaker 6 (28:41):
She's just such a great representative of.
Speaker 5 (28:43):
What amazing animals, plants, and creatures we have and we
share with the world.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
One hundred percent. Well, said Anika. What a cool experience.
This is the first time you see the baby sea,
so this is definitely a special one for me. Right,
this is really.
Speaker 6 (29:00):
Entire time.
Speaker 4 (29:01):
I've just been staring at these animals. And I know
I'm a bird gay, but guys, I mean, look at this.
I'm staying at the baby right now. You got to
get your butts at the zoo. Nevermind, there got a milk,
Mustag got a milk, must Rick said earlier. There's a
copy at the Safari Park. There's also at the zoo.
But if you want to see this youngster growing up
with her mama, please come down here.
Speaker 1 (29:20):
Technically, this area what it's called.
Speaker 6 (29:22):
For guests, they called the Chery Forest.
Speaker 1 (29:24):
Area Chery Forest Area.
Speaker 6 (29:25):
They're just south of the tigers, right behind the hippos.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
Don't go past.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
It's easy it is to because they're kind of tucked
in the back being next to the hippos are in
the forest area.
Speaker 3 (29:33):
And I will say this, if you come by this
area and you don't see them, make sure you plan
to come by a second time because just in the
thirty some minutes we've been here, we didn't see anybody
at first, and then we saw a mom wandering around
in the background, and then baby came out to drink,
and now they're right here.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
So yeah, hey, take your time at habitats and if
there's a species you really want.
Speaker 3 (29:52):
To see, come back multiple times to that area because
you might see something you didn't see before.
Speaker 2 (29:56):
Yeah, Dallas, thank you so much for spending time with
us today.
Speaker 6 (30:00):
Thank you for showing off our beautiful old copies.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
Yeah, you're great, and these animals are amazing, of course.
I just really appreciate your time.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
Yeah, thank you, friend, and good luck with the baby.
Thank you can see it grow up. Ooh that was
really exciting, right Rick, Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
That baby. I can't even right now, my flufy.
Speaker 4 (30:21):
On the face, the stripes, and it's like a mini
mama too, which is incredible.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
The beauty of.
Speaker 1 (30:27):
Wildlife and the uniqueness of it.
Speaker 4 (30:29):
Every animal is different, but like to Dallas's point, every
animal has a niche or role to play in our
beautiful blue planet.
Speaker 3 (30:35):
Right. Well, absolutely absolutely, And I love to the sounds
that they make. Then how there's no smell to the baby,
how all the different things they have to help survive
in the wild.
Speaker 2 (30:44):
But when she was talking about.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
How sometimes the mom will react to a sound and
then all of a sudden, she'll hear it a little
bit later. You know what.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
It reminded me of like having a dog at home
and you're like, you're relaxing.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
And they forgot because they hear.
Speaker 2 (30:56):
Something, and you're like, what, because I hearing is so
much better.
Speaker 3 (31:00):
But again, if you aren't able to come to the
zoo's fire park, and you can't visit a zoo that
hasward copy, look up what they look like.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
Go to the San Diego Zoo social media to check
these guys out. Their ears are huge and it's adorable.
They look so cute. Moms right now still in front
of us eating and it just it's so nah. I mean,
I can stay here all day, eat all day, but
I can say I know.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
I'm getting hunger myself. No, but back to just the
forested animals.
Speaker 4 (31:23):
Like earlier, we did a castory episode now with these
guys in the congo. But I believe our next episode
we're still gonna be in the theme of the deep forest.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
Right in this interview, you did mention that the gorillas
that live in a similar forests at African areas.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
Yeah, yeah, have the salad bar. They're always eating right.
Just so happens, We're gonna go back up to the.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
Safari Park next back to the Park of the I know.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
And we're gonna find out more about what's going on
with our gorillas.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
No, I can't wait, Marco what and I am Rich Schwartz.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
Thanks for listening.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
For more information about the San Diego Zoo and San
Diego Zoo Safari Park, go to SDZWA dot org. Amazing
Wildlife is a production of iHeartRadio. Our supervising producers are
Nikkia Swinton and Dylan Fagan, and our sound designers are
Sierra Spreen and Matt Russell.
Speaker 2 (32:17):
For more shows from iHeartRadio, check out the iHeartRadio
Speaker 3 (32:20):
App, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Hosts And Creators
Rick Schwartz
Marco Wendt
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