September 8, 2023 • 32 mins
Join us, as Amazing Wildlife gets ready to celebrate International Vulture Awareness Day (September 2). Rick and Marco visit Jenna Stallard, wildlife care manager of birds at the San Diego Zoo Safari Park. We’ll learn about Old World vultures (from Europe, Africa, and Asia) and New World vultures (from the Americas and the Caribbean), in addition to what makes vultures unique, and why they are vital to their ecosystems. The hosts and Jenna debunk myths about vultures—who have great personalities, despite popular belief. We also find out more about vulture breeding at the Safari Park, the threats to vultures—including poisoning—and how Egyptian vultures are surprisingly skilled at using tools.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
Hi, I'm Rick Schwartz.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
When Elsy s world, I'm Marco went.
Speaker 3 (00:08):
Welcome to Amazing Wildlife, where we explore unique stories of
wildlife from around the world and uncover fascinating animal facts.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
This podcast is a production.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
Of iHeartRadio's Ruby Studios and San Diego Zoo Wildlife Alliance
in international nonprofit conservation organization which oversees the San Diego
Zoo and Safari Bark.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Uh Marco, you okay over there?
Speaker 4 (00:28):
Oh my gosh, Rick, I feel like jumping on my seat.
I mean, is it that obvious?
Speaker 3 (00:34):
Yes, I can say just looking across the table here,
you are very excited. It wouldn't be because we're finally
focusing on a type of bird species for an episode,
would it.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
Uh? Yeah, I'm totally man. I mean, I'm vibrating right now.
I have been.
Speaker 4 (00:48):
Recently waiting all season for a bird episode, and it's fine,
really here and even better this past Saturday, it was
International Vulture Awareness Day, So what better topic than that
amazing group of birds that we call vultures?
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Right right, all right, right, okay, okay, I feel you man.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
I'm excited too, because you know, I love some vultures
inside scoop when I first and I was, I have
to work with with a turkey vulture.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
But we'll get to that.
Speaker 3 (01:12):
I just want to take a moment to bring our
audience into the flock. If you will, these fun feathered friends.
Speaker 4 (01:17):
Oh that's a good idea, bonus on the fun feathered
Friends line, everything like that.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
But then, what did you have in mind?
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Well, I want to make sure our listeners don't feel
how should I say this less than enthused about discussing
a bird that's scavenges amongst dead animals. I mean, for instance,
when I asked my friend Kristen what she thought when
I mentioned vultures, she said she thinks of them as
less cute trash pandas of the sky, which I mean
that was a pretty good description, I guess, but either way.
(01:45):
She also said it made her think of like the
scary bad death scenes or near death scenes in movies.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Really, I mean people really think that?
Speaker 3 (01:53):
Well, yes, I mean I think some people do. But
if we do this right, maybe our listeners will fall
in love with these incredibly important and intelligent birds.
Speaker 4 (02:03):
Well that's good news because I know that those listeners
out there who maybe don't have a great opinion on
vultures will definitely like them.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
After listening to this episode, all.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
That sounds awesome. So what are you thinking?
Speaker 4 (02:15):
Well, you know, man, I think to start things off,
I've lined up someone who is a fellow bird lover
like I am, has a lot of vulture experience and
has even traveled to Africa to help with vulture conservation.
Speaker 5 (02:30):
I am Jenna Stallard. I am bird manager and wildlife
care at the Santaga Zoosa Firebork.
Speaker 4 (02:36):
Jenna, I'm so excited to be doing this with you.
We've known each other for so many years now in
the bird department, and I know you're a parrot girl.
But we can talk about vultures today, right, Thanks again
for taking the time and sharing your passion about these
amazing birds.
Speaker 5 (02:50):
Yeah, thank you, Marco. I'm super excited to be here
and stoked to be talking to you guys about vultures today.
Speaker 4 (02:56):
So our guests, now, we're at the San Diego Zoo
Safari Park today. Different kind of species you can see
in the park and in the zoo. But in my opinion,
no disrespect to my brothers and sisters at the zoo.
But when I'm thinking vultures, I really want to be
here at the Safari Park. Can you describe for our
listeners today, like, what are some of the vultures that
guests can experience here at the Safari Park.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (03:15):
Absolutely, So we have multiple vultures here at the Safari Park.
Old World and New World vultures, and some that first
come to mind as the California condor. Of course they
are a legacy here, but we also have many other vultures.
So some of the smaller vultures, we have hooded and
Egyptian vultures. We have cape vultures, rupels vultures, and I
(03:38):
feel like I'm missing one, which.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
They're really cool too, right, they look like.
Speaker 5 (03:43):
They're wearing pants. Yes, that is what I was thinking about.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
I want to ask real quick just for clarification, especially
for our audience.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
You mentioned New World and Old World.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
Can you offer definition to that so people understand what
you're talking about.
Speaker 5 (03:56):
Yes, I can. So a New World is in the
Americas and the Ribbean, whereas the Old World is Europe
and Asia.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
And Africa too, right, Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5 (04:05):
Yeah, which is our primary bucket.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
The best for last, But you know, our guests can
see those variations in the body and when you look
at the California cond or, a little different foot structure
right in the beat. But when you see our old
world vultures Europe, Asia, Africa, we're seeing them their ancestors
really more from raptors like eagles, hawks, falcons, right, so
you can see a curved beak, right, a little more
curvature of their foot and their talent, which I think
is awesome, right, I mean, you and I know vultures are.
(04:31):
They're amazing and growing up. For me, you guys, it
was the Jungle Book. Do you guys remember the vultures
in the Jungle Book?
Speaker 1 (04:37):
Right?
Speaker 4 (04:37):
Yes, you know they were great, But honestly, the critique
I had was, vultures are always depicted like they're not smart,
they're dirty, they're not so.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
Right, Okay, But in all fairness, now, in a jungle book,
they did befriend Mowgli at least, right, they didn't try
to pick on them too much.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Eventually they came around and they helped out, you know,
fighting off share cons. True, that's probably the best.
Speaker 5 (04:58):
In a very dark moment the story.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
But yet yeah, right, So.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
With that being said, then understanding what the general culture
of our society tends to depict vultures as I would
love to ask you right off the bat, as someone
who spent a lot of time working with birds, you've
done a lot of work with vultures around the world.
Essentially from your perspective, what would be one of the
myths or misunderstandings our guests might have a vultures when
(05:24):
they're coming to the safari park or down to the zoo.
Speaker 5 (05:26):
Yeah, well, I think we kind of hit on a
couple of them where people think that maybe they're ugly
or they're mean, which is not the case at all,
And they have fantastic personalities that you get to know
as you work with them. So I'm glad that we
can focus on them. But I think one of the
other things is that you know they're in movies and
(05:47):
TV shows that maybe they're going after things that haven't
died yet, all right, right, So vultures. You can tell
that they are vulture based on the fact that they
don't have feathers on their head and their necks so
that they can eat carry on, which is animals that
have already passed away, and that helps keep them clean.
And with that, people think that maybe they're out there
(06:07):
circling and waiting for something to die so that they
can eat it. But that is not the case. Vultures
don't do that. They don't seek out things that are
looking sick. They go after the things that have already passed.
And they're actually a huge help that way, because there
are little cleanup crew.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Yeah, and actually I want to ask real quickly then too,
that circling behavior, that classic thing, and we see in
the movies that, oh, that person's about to die in
the desert, suddenly these birds are circling. Reality is they
only do that when they spot and or smell something
that has passed.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
So there are some species that can.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
Smell carry on or an animal that's passed away, because
obviously it starts to get stinky.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
But there's others that use only vision. Is that correct?
Speaker 5 (06:46):
That is correct. I know that turkey vultures have one
of the best sense of smell among all the vultures,
but some do rely more specifically on their site.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
Yeah, no, totally.
Speaker 4 (06:56):
I mean you and I know, like turkey vilt's like
a broadening piece of meat, you know, from ment to
piece of meter or if you want to use ten
miles away. It's incredible, it's interesting. Those different variations in
adaptability for these.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Birds, for sure.
Speaker 5 (07:10):
And I just noticed actually just getting back from South Africa,
seeing the mostly cape vultures in the area that we
were listening and hearing the calls of the other vultures
at a feed, and all of those vocalizations also bringing
them to the site.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
Oh, Jenna, I definitely want to ask you about that.
Speaker 4 (07:27):
I mean, in case our listeners don't know, we do
a lot of conservation work with vultures in California, condor
hooded vultures, Egyptians, and so many other African species, but
there's also a lot of collaborative work, right, I mean,
there are a lot of stories of us with many
species here at the Safari Park and at the zoo
with our partners out in Africa. But I'm really excited
(07:47):
about this one, you guys, because we have this really
unique relationship with this partner called Volpro. Now, this is
a South African vulture conservation organization and they do a
really great job. Their mission is to protect African cultures
through collaborating and innovating, not only rehabilitating these injured birds
that they find out there for re release, but also
helping non releasable vultures by creating this essential breeding program.
(08:11):
And it doesn't stop there, you guys, many of these
release candidates actually have GPS transmitters. This way we can
learn a lot more about these essential scavengers through their lifetime,
giving us more knowledge and this bird's eye view of
the hardships that a lot of these birds face out
in Africa.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Jenna, can you speak a.
Speaker 4 (08:30):
Little bit about our time with volpro and how it
all got started.
Speaker 5 (08:33):
Yeah, So we've been working with Volpro since twenty seventeen,
and it all started because we breed a lot of
vultures here at the Safari Park and so we do
a lot of incubation and chick rearing for those species
and Volpro wanted to start doing a lot more of that,
so they started getting incubators. It was started by yeah,
(08:54):
Carrie Ca Carrie Walter, Yeah, and she started a rehab
facility in South Africa and their mission is to protect
African vultures through collaboration and innovation. So they get a
lot of rehab birds there. But with those rehab birds,
many are amputations or they can't be released back into
the wild, so they allow them to breed at the
site and then those chicks are then released back out
into the wild to help bring more birds back into
(09:16):
the population because they are anywhere from a vulnerable species
to a critically endangered species, all the types that she
has on her property. So getting those incubators, getting her
set up for incubation, our partnership we go over every
June when they have packed incubators. I think when we
went this year there was like thirty five eggs.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
Wow, it was a lot.
Speaker 5 (09:38):
I feel like we had six in one incubator.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
In each incubator.
Speaker 5 (09:43):
It was like to compare here at the park condors
one egg to one incubator, so we don't ever have
that many eggs at one time. And when you are
doing incubation work, you do notice a lot of things
with the embryo, with the chicken stide. Sometimes they become malpositions,
sometimes they have issues hatching out. And we've done so
(10:04):
much of that breeding here that we've experienced it and
we kind of know the proper ways to go about
handling it to have a healthy check and to minimize
any losses. So we have gone every June to give
Carrie a break, help her with her incubation. More and
train her and her staff. She is amazing, she does
incredible work, but she's trying to pass that information onto
her team as well, so we want to go and
(10:26):
help her during that time, and she gets the weirdest
cases and malpositions that I've ever seen. So it's really
a learning experience for us because there's some situations that
she's had that we've never had as well.
Speaker 1 (10:40):
There's so much unpack with what you just said.
Speaker 3 (10:42):
I'm going to give a running list of my head
and I want to ask about that, and I want
to ask about that, and I want to ask about that.
But I think, first of all, I love how you
wrap that up in the sense that it's a collaboration.
We have done so much work in incubation and raising
birds in our park that that not is assisting in
helping her and her efforts and saving these birds. But
(11:05):
then also you're saying while you're there dealing with all
this stuff, you're still learning too, And there's so much
value in understanding how collaborations aren't just one sided. You know,
there's a shared goal, but everyone gets to grow and
learn and then the end result is we do better
for the birds.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
So that's awesome. But what I want to go back
to is, I guess the first part of what you said,
why are these birds that she is breeding, why are
they endangered? Why are they threatened?
Speaker 3 (11:29):
What's happening to these wild populations that there is such
a need for her to step in and for us
to step in and go we need to make more
and we need to get them back out in the
wild to keep the ecosystem balanced.
Speaker 5 (11:41):
Yeah. Absolutely, So there's multiple reasons, but one of the
big ones is poisonings. So here in the States, it's
lead poisoning for condors. If a hunter uses lead ammunition,
it spreads throughout that kill and when they eat it,
they then get lead poisoning. Same thing in Africa, but
also with the poaching that takes place there. Poachers can
(12:02):
specifically poison a kill, whether it be an elephant or
a rhino, and when a huge group of vultures come
to that kill, it can take out an entire colony
in one setting. And the reason they do that is
because the rangers look for the vultures in the sky
is a sign for a kill and they can go
to that spot. So for the rangers they're looking for
(12:23):
that the poachers know that, so they will poison the
kill so that the vultures aren't coming back, they're passing.
And again you can lose one hundred birds with one kill,
so that's a big reason and is affecting birds throughout
all of Africa. Also, there's a lot of collisions with
power lines, so when we were at Volpro, we had
quite a few birds that came in with broken wings
(12:45):
and had to be amputated, so that was also a
big problem there.
Speaker 4 (12:49):
Yeah, it really speaks to the important work that Carrie
and our team are doing a Volpro as well.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
I give these snaps to.
Speaker 4 (12:55):
The Bird Department for all the amazing work you guys.
I mean, granted, I'm a little biased.
Speaker 2 (12:59):
I know, I know everyone's their eyes right now driving,
but focus on the road, you guys.
Speaker 4 (13:03):
But seriously, the Bird Department here at the Safari Park
and of course at the San Diego Zoo, They've done
so much or these conservation projects. I'm more behavior orient
in my background, but I when joining the Bird Department,
Jenna and you and the team like watching everything that
you guys doe with incubation is incredible and some of
these like unique moments. There was a day, you and
I there was a roupels ultu in an egg that
you were waiting for it to pit. And I bring
(13:25):
that up because can you talk about two words that
I want kids to really understand.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
You have to get the science of it.
Speaker 4 (13:29):
But the malpositioning, because that was a little bit of
an issue with this chick and also pipping.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Can you talk about that really quick?
Speaker 1 (13:35):
Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 5 (13:36):
So mal positioning is when the embryo isn't in the
perfect position to hatch out. So there's a certain position
which would be really challenging to probably explain right right
without showing you, But think of it as you have
the big side of the egg and you have the
pointy side of the egg, and generally the beak should
always be going to the big side of the egg
because there's a pocketive air there and it will internally pit,
(13:57):
meaning that it's a little bit equal puncture through the
internet brain so they can take that big deep breath
and then it will break through the shell and externally
pit before it hatches out. So when it's malposition it's
unable to do that successfully. So if it's beak is
at the pointy end, there's no air down there for
it to breathe and then eventually break out. So sometimes
(14:19):
we'll not make it past that point. But it could
also be on the right side but have a leg
or a wing or something over its beak or head
so that it's unable to break through.
Speaker 4 (14:30):
Well, as Rick was mentioning, you know, we've learned this
with our experiences here at this safar. I walk over
what fifty years of conservation projects, and people know of
our condur project, but there's a lot of work with
the African and also want to point out the Easiatic
species too.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
Rick.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
You were asking what are these issues vultures are having
and you mentioned lead poisoning, right, Jenna, with California condors,
our African vulture species getting toxins and poison you know,
because of poaching, but also we have our species out
and Asia two have been effected for different reasons using
a certain drug I'm probably gonna inspronounce leuthenic actually that
was used for cattle and cows, right, But then those
vultures eating that particular animal, ingesting that chemical drastically drop
(15:07):
that population, right.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
So it really speaks to that awesome.
Speaker 4 (15:09):
Work that we're doing here at the park and how
guests are connected to right, Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 5 (15:13):
And I missed a couple that I'm thinking of as
we're going, which is another It's because vultures go after
things that are dead a lot of the time. If
you get a roadkill, you hit a deer or another
animal on the road, they might go after that and
then also have a collision with a vehicle, which is
another cause. And there are some areas where people like
to use the body parts too. There's superstitions around the
(15:36):
body parts for vultures, it specifically to the brains and
the eyes, and they think it establishes good luck, so
forecasting like the outcome of a soccer game or a
lottery like. They think it will bring them luck and winning.
So that's another one that affects them, but we don't
hear as much about it.
Speaker 4 (15:52):
Yeah, no wildlife trafficking. We had an episode with Lori
and the Tiger Team. We hit upon it a little bit.
Even animal parts mentioning too, is part of wildlife trafficing
a feather I brought that up in the past before.
When you travel you didn't know where these feathers are
being procured from, right, So you have to really think
about what you're purchasing out there in the world, right.
Speaker 5 (16:10):
Yes, we have to be very aware.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
We've kind of talked about the different species New World,
Old World and where they can be found. The immense
amount of time the Safari Park has put into understanding
the proper care. How that translates in when you head
over to Africa and other people on our team head
over there to help with volpro How we're learning more
when we're out there. We've talked about some of the
challenges they're facing in the wild, but one thing we
(16:34):
haven't talked about yet, and this is probably one of
my favorite parts about vultures is why are they important
to the environment?
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Why do we need them around?
Speaker 3 (16:42):
We often have people show up they want to see
the tiger, the lion, the elephants, the rhinos because they're
big and they're fascinating, and they'll bypass the vultures. But
from our world of looking at the whole health of
all the environment, they're really important. Jenna, cause you shed
a little light on why vultures are so important to
(17:03):
the environment, why people should care.
Speaker 5 (17:06):
Vultures, I'm sure you've heard it, are nature's cleanup crew,
so they will clean up carcasses after an animal dies,
but amongst those animals is disease, and those disease can
be spread to us or other animals. But vultures are
very unique because they have a more corrosive acid, stronger
than any other animal or bird, so that when they
(17:28):
eat the infected carcass that have that dangerous bacteria, that
acid kills those bacteria and it then doesn't hurt the vulture.
So this protects other species of wildlife, but it also
includes us and prevents us from getting these diseases.
Speaker 3 (17:43):
Yeah, It's one thing I always like to say to kids.
It's like, you know, they can eat all this nasty
disease bad stuff, and all that comes out the other
side is bird poop y, you know, and it's perfectly okay, right,
totally fine. Yeah, And I love that you started that
with their Nature's Cleanup crew. Another analogy I love to
share with kids sometimes is imagine if you took your
trash out to the curb once a week for trash Day,
but no trash truck came by, and the next week
(18:04):
you did the same thing next week and all your
neighbors what would happen.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
To your neighborhood?
Speaker 3 (18:09):
What would it be like of weeks and weeks and
weeks of all this stuff just sitting out there, and
let's say a rainstorm comes and now starts to wash
some of this into our waterways where we get our
fresh water from. What would happen? It's exactly the same
of the vultures. They take care of these diseases that
sometimes could get into our food or our water sources,
could easily affect human populations, and these birds make it.
Speaker 1 (18:29):
Go away just by having a snack, just by eating
what they're supposed to eat. So I think it's pretty cool.
Speaker 5 (18:35):
Yeah, I don't even know how we would survive without vultures.
And I don't even want to think about the smell.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
Good thing.
Speaker 4 (18:42):
We don't have smell of this, right, But that's a
fun point, all those like myths and misconceptions that people think.
I remember when I first started working with vultures, and
my Mom's like me, oh, those animals are disease rid and.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
They're dirty, but but they're not, right.
Speaker 4 (18:55):
I mean, I mean, yeah, so the clean up croup,
but they're actually remarkably clean animals, right. I mean, Early Jenny,
you're in the bald head and the bald neck. That's
for an adaptation, right, they are going inside of the
carcass and pulling out all those yummies. Right, But bald
is beautiful, right, and they are adaptable, sure is.
Speaker 5 (19:10):
And you know, there are twenty three vulture species in
the world and at least one type of vulture is
found on every continent except Australian an Arctic gas so
fourteen of those twenty three are considered threatened or endangered.
So I mean just that alone, you can kind of
see like they're everywhere and they're very much needed.
Speaker 4 (19:28):
So yeah, the colors too, right that the variability on
guess the king vulture, You guys should look at that
and talk about a beautiful bird and or you were
talking about the acid in the stomach for all these species,
so that one bearded vulture of the line, and guy
are fund in Europe beautiful species. Eighty percent of their
diet is bones. They're literally just swallowing bone.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
It's dissolving the second it goes down their throat.
Speaker 4 (19:48):
They are incredible in that regard, and guests can appreciate
these experiences right with vultures when they come in the
safari park, right, Oh can ASTI, what are your favorite
spots for the park, Like if you were a guests
right and they come up to you, Jinna Jenna, I
really want to check out the vultures.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
Where would you say they go?
Speaker 5 (20:03):
Well, I mean first obviously condo right right and have
a beautiful habitat. But I would also say hoodeds which
are more like in the Heart of Africa next to
our okopy and there is also an Egyptian vulture in there,
and sometimes we're able to put an oscar j egg
and things in there, and you can see how the
(20:24):
Egyptian vulture uses a rock as a tool to break
it open and eat the eggs. So I always love
that when we're able to give them those and show
that to the guests and can see how these birds
can use tools. But I would also say, for sure
you have to ride the tram and see we have
cakes and rup bowls and lap it face vultures. Yeah,
along the tram across from our South Africa habitat, Big
(20:47):
Field Habitat. It's a huge beautiful habitat for these birds
and it's aspiring. And when we do have our International
Vulture Awareness Days and we celebrate our hubs here for
our savannah which takes place. Actually this month, they will
put out a full carcass for them to actually feed
like they went naturally in the wild. And we have
(21:08):
our Wildlifecare specialists in front of the habitat and able
to like talk to everybody on the trams they go by,
So it's it's really cool when you're able to catch
those events as well.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
I want to ask you because I personally know from
working with vultures, but I want to get it from
you because I think you probably have a lot more
experience than I do to talk about their personalities a
little bit. You know, when you're telling people go up
to condors, go over here to Heart of Africa, go
on the tram ride, I want people to stop long
enough to not just look at the bird, but to
start look at how they're either interacting with each other
(21:40):
or the other species that they might be sharing the
habitat with, because they do have these individual personalities. And
that's something Mark when I've talked about a couple times
with different species, and I think for some people, you know,
it's all yeah, sure, tigers have different personalities, their guerrillas
have different personal Vultures do too. There's like a whole
social thing going on. When you spend enough time watching them,
you can see how they interact. What's been your experience
(22:01):
with the characteristics and the different personalities.
Speaker 5 (22:04):
Of vultures, Well, they're all unique, and the condors for sure,
if you go up there, there's a sign specifically for
every individual in that habitat. And I think the oldest
female in there is probably like most fun for me
to watch because she sure like pushes the other birds
around and you know, has a very big personality. And
if you're able to do a you know behind the
(22:25):
scenes where you get to feed them, you get to
see them all come down and eat and kind of
the hierarchies amongst them kind.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
Of really show through.
Speaker 5 (22:33):
But then also like we have one male Egyptian vulture
who I think was a hand raised bird that came
to us and he's super friendly and he comes up
and he wants to walk with you, and he likes
to peck at your shoes, and so you just you
see all the uniqueness. Whereas you look at the lap
at face vultures and they're just they're like gangsters. They're
like so tough, and the way they walk they're like
strut and not their wings out, and they look like
(22:55):
they want to kick your butt. So it's you know,
they're all just very, very different. We've lived and learned
here with all the chicks that we've raised, and we've
changed how we've done things and how we do chick
rearing and have a mentor and puppet rearing so that
they don't get imprinted, which means like get used to
people and want to be around them, because then when
they get older, they tend to be more challenging. But
(23:18):
we didn't know that necessarily in the beginning. So we
do have a couple of vultures who are a little
bit more curious and not afraid and want to come
up and mess with your rake or mess with whatever
you have. That can be a little bit more challenging
because they're not little anymore. They're very large and they
can absolutely hurt you. So you just have to be
more cautious around those individuals and just be aware of
(23:41):
the different dynamics and the different personalities and make sure
you're always making safe choices.
Speaker 3 (23:46):
That's awesome.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
That's awesome.
Speaker 4 (23:47):
I love that you brought up Einstein the Egyptian vulture.
By the way, this season referring to you guys. But
also I wanted to know, because you talked about it briefly,
that behavior that Egyptian vultures too.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
Can you talk a little bit about that for a second.
The tool.
Speaker 4 (24:00):
Last episode we talked about gorillas, Yeah, and uh Franke
and Moro pussing a button. But I want guests to
know it's not just some ammals using tools. You guys,
there's a volts or that uses a tool, JENNI speak
about this.
Speaker 5 (24:11):
So the Egyptian vultures use rocks or stones to break
open eggs. So we'll give them an ostrich egg and
provide them with different sized rocks, and you'll see them
go through and they might use a small one and
be like, Nope, this doesn't work on one, Like try
to go for the biggest one. Nope, that one's too heavy,
This one doesn't work. And then like pick the best
tool for them. And then they yeah, sit there and
(24:32):
they just hit it as hard as they can and
if it doesn't crack, they pick it up, they do
it again. They continue going until it's fully cracked and
broken and they can break it apart.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
Am I correct to the visual I have in my
head from seeing this, I think probably in a documentary.
It's not just like they hold the rock in their
mouth and like they're tapping in hammering. It's like they
swing it up high and then they throw like they
extend their neck outs as they can throw it down
at the egg right.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
Yes, yeah, it's quite a visuals.
Speaker 4 (24:58):
We might have some guests who I've been at the
Safari Park before when it was called a different name.
We had an original bird show which I was a
part of. Then we had an Egyptian vulture named Tiba,
and Tiba did this very behavior. Yeah, you were right, Jina.
He would have his very specific rock. Yeah, and if
you lost it, you better not lose that rock. But
it was really unique and that it was a learned behavior.
(25:19):
So a few kids out there basically they're not hatch
knowing this behavior. They have to watch other vultures, other
Egyptian vultures do this, so they're just so intelligent in
that regard to So thank you for sharing that.
Speaker 5 (25:29):
I love Egyptian vultures me too, and they're critically endangered species.
And we had three chicks this year, so yeah, and
we had two that were puppet raised up at condors
so puppet raised means that we have a puppet that
looks like a vulture head and mouth, and we use
that to teach them to eat so that they don't
see us taking care of them. But for the very
(25:51):
first time, we were actually able to give one of
the fertile eggs it went to incubation back to the
parents and this was their first time actually raising a
chicken out at our bird conservation center and they all
are healthy and doing fantastic. But it was very very
cool to see the parents be able to raise this
year and lets us know that.
Speaker 3 (26:10):
We can do that again next time, is right well,
as we get ready to wrap up, I always love
hearing from our specialists and those who do this work
about what it's personally for them, because so much we
talk about the importance of the conservation and how to
educate others, how others can get involved, and why they
should care. But for you, Jen, I mean here you
are working at Safari Park, and I think sometimes as
(26:32):
guests come through and they see us doing our jobs, like, well,
this is what that person does and all that, But
we're humans. We're all humans, and this is a work
of passion for you personally, to be able to be
a part of what you're doing, to travel to Africa
multiple times to help bring knowledge and learn as well
for you personally and your journey and your passions.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
What does that mean to you?
Speaker 5 (26:52):
For me, it feeds my soul, so conservation work it's
like the heart of my love and my passion and
it makes everything worthwhile and seeing how it all comes
together to the bigger picture is huge. But for me,
I love having that opportunity for our team. So our
team cares for these animals day after day and to
be able to send them out and do work with
(27:15):
our partners at Volpro. It's not only rejuvenating them and
giving that energy to come back here and continue on
with the conservation work and giving our wildlife the best
care that they can, but at the same time you
get a peace of mind as well in perspective. So
here at the Stanegazoo Spry Park, we are so lucky
(27:35):
to have basically everything we need to give our wildlife
the very best care. And when you go to another country,
you go to South Africa, the team there is like
a family. They're fantastic and they give their wildlife the
best care, but they.
Speaker 2 (27:48):
Don't have the same resources that we have.
Speaker 5 (27:50):
We don't have cameras on every nest. They don't even
have drains in their pools or hoses, so like you're
doing things by hand, and it gives you a different
perspective of I think when you are working here and
you get to go there, see the birds flying in
the wild, seeing the space and seeing how lucky you
(28:10):
are to have the tools and the things we have
here at the park, and then also if you're lucky enough,
which this year, we were able to release seven birds
back out into the wild while we were there, which
was definitely the highlight for me, and I know our
staff who've been going, who have gone in the past
have gotten to do that too. That's just like icing
on the cake. To be able to care for the
(28:32):
birds and the rehab center there, help raise chicks and
then be able to actually see it all the way
through and release them is just It's an amazing experience
and I'm glad it's something that we're able to offer
our staff and give them that full circle of how
the work they're doing here goes to the conservation work
in South Africa.
Speaker 1 (28:50):
Beautiful.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
I love it. Yeah, well said front.
Speaker 4 (28:53):
That was really great and for kids now, like this
is something you guys came involved in as well. We
all have different passions. You the benture on. I know
you're a pair of girl Jenna, right, but again everyone's
got these passions right, and we can all support these
wonderful programs like coming to the Safari Park San Diego Zoo,
spend some time with the vultures, you guys right, I
mean International Vulture Awareness Day September two this year it
(29:15):
just passed, but these are days for us to bring
awareness for a lot of different.
Speaker 2 (29:19):
Species and a wonderful way to celebrate vultures of the world.
Speaker 5 (29:22):
Absolutely, yeah, and I would encourage everyone to check out
Volpro's website and see all the different work they're doing.
They are monitoring wild breeding populations, they're breeding. They're an
amazing organization and the work they do is incredible.
Speaker 1 (29:35):
So if you're able to.
Speaker 5 (29:36):
Ever go, they do do tours and of course see
it firsthand, would be you really neat.
Speaker 4 (29:41):
That's great, Jenna, Thank you so much for spending the
time with us and sharing your passionate about these bald
and beautiful birds.
Speaker 5 (29:46):
Thank you guys for having me. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
Thanks Jenna.
Speaker 3 (29:52):
Wow, Marco, thank you so much for setting up to
interview with Jenna. Honestly, it's hard to say whose excitement
and passion for birds is stronger yours are.
Speaker 2 (30:00):
You know, maybe let's just call it a tie.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
Fair enough, fair enough, And I mean I get it.
Birds are fascinating in so many ways.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
And I'll admit vultures are high on my list of
favorite animals too.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
Oh yeah, that's right. Didn't you say something about a
favorite turkey vulture?
Speaker 3 (30:14):
Ah?
Speaker 1 (30:14):
Yes, good memory, my friend. You are correct.
Speaker 3 (30:17):
One of the very first animals I worked in close
contact with was a non releasable turkey vulture, and I
will fully admit full disclosure, I was not expecting to
be so fascinated by a vulture vulture behavior and their
social structure.
Speaker 1 (30:30):
There's so much to fall in love with.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
Oh yeah, I totally get it.
Speaker 4 (30:34):
I mean, there's so much to love And like Jenna
was discussing, we need these amazing birds and raising awareness
about their current challenges. It's really important because so many
people are unaware of what's happening to them and why
we need to help them.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
Yeah, it's true.
Speaker 3 (30:48):
And sometimes because we as humans tend to gravitate to
things that are visually considered cute, like pandas and tigers
or elephants. The animals that are sometimes thought of.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
As well in quotes, less attractive may not get the
attention they need exactly.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
And that's really why I was so excited about this
episode Rcky.
Speaker 4 (31:07):
Oftentimes in movies cartoons, vultures are depicted in a not
so great light, I gotta say. And because you know,
like a lot of other wildlife, once you spend time
getting to know them, you can't help but fall in
love with them, right, just like with you and the
Turkey vulture.
Speaker 3 (31:20):
No exactly, exactly, like bild saying goes, to know them
is to love them exactly.
Speaker 4 (31:24):
And I really hope this episode help our listeners get
to know vultures a little bit better so that maybe
they will love them too.
Speaker 1 (31:32):
Me too, Marco.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
And you know what, I'm really enjoying these episodes we're
doing that are tied to a special day to help
bring more awareness to particular.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
Species of wildlife. I think we should do another one.
Speaker 2 (31:41):
Oh yeah, what are you thinking.
Speaker 3 (31:43):
I'm thinking about the fact that our next episode of
Amazing Wildlife comes out on September twenty second, right on
the nose if you will, of World Rhino Day.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
Oh that's perfect timing, all right, Fred, Let's do it
right on.
Speaker 1 (31:57):
I can't wait.
Speaker 3 (31:59):
If you haven't already be sher, subscribe and tune into
our next episode, in which Marco and I find out
more about the different species of rhinos and why they
are in fact so amazing.
Speaker 1 (32:11):
Now Marco Lint and I'm Rick Schwartz, thanks for listening.
Speaker 3 (32:16):
For more information about the San Diego Zoo and San
Diego Zoo Safari Park, go to SVZWA dot org. Amazing
Wildlife is a production of iHeartRadio's Ruby Studios. Our supervising
producer is Nikiah Swinton, and our sound designer and editor
is Sierra Spreen.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
For more shows from iHeartRadio, check
Speaker 3 (32:34):
Out the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen
to your favorite shows.
Hi, I'm Rick Schwartz.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
When Elsy s world, I'm Marco went.
Speaker 3 (00:08):
Welcome to Amazing Wildlife, where we explore unique stories of
wildlife from around the world and uncover fascinating animal facts.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
This podcast is a production.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
Of iHeartRadio's Ruby Studios and San Diego Zoo Wildlife Alliance
in international nonprofit conservation organization which oversees the San Diego
Zoo and Safari Bark.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Uh Marco, you okay over there?
Speaker 4 (00:28):
Oh my gosh, Rick, I feel like jumping on my seat.
I mean, is it that obvious?
Speaker 3 (00:34):
Yes, I can say just looking across the table here,
you are very excited. It wouldn't be because we're finally
focusing on a type of bird species for an episode,
would it.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
Uh? Yeah, I'm totally man. I mean, I'm vibrating right now.
I have been.
Speaker 4 (00:48):
Recently waiting all season for a bird episode, and it's fine,
really here and even better this past Saturday, it was
International Vulture Awareness Day, So what better topic than that
amazing group of birds that we call vultures?
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Right right, all right, right, okay, okay, I feel you man.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
I'm excited too, because you know, I love some vultures
inside scoop when I first and I was, I have
to work with with a turkey vulture.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
But we'll get to that.
Speaker 3 (01:12):
I just want to take a moment to bring our
audience into the flock. If you will, these fun feathered friends.
Speaker 4 (01:17):
Oh that's a good idea, bonus on the fun feathered
Friends line, everything like that.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
But then, what did you have in mind?
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Well, I want to make sure our listeners don't feel
how should I say this less than enthused about discussing
a bird that's scavenges amongst dead animals. I mean, for instance,
when I asked my friend Kristen what she thought when
I mentioned vultures, she said she thinks of them as
less cute trash pandas of the sky, which I mean
that was a pretty good description, I guess, but either way.
(01:45):
She also said it made her think of like the
scary bad death scenes or near death scenes in movies.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Really, I mean people really think that?
Speaker 3 (01:53):
Well, yes, I mean I think some people do. But
if we do this right, maybe our listeners will fall
in love with these incredibly important and intelligent birds.
Speaker 4 (02:03):
Well that's good news because I know that those listeners
out there who maybe don't have a great opinion on
vultures will definitely like them.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
After listening to this episode, all.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
That sounds awesome. So what are you thinking?
Speaker 4 (02:15):
Well, you know, man, I think to start things off,
I've lined up someone who is a fellow bird lover
like I am, has a lot of vulture experience and
has even traveled to Africa to help with vulture conservation.
Speaker 5 (02:30):
I am Jenna Stallard. I am bird manager and wildlife
care at the Santaga Zoosa Firebork.
Speaker 4 (02:36):
Jenna, I'm so excited to be doing this with you.
We've known each other for so many years now in
the bird department, and I know you're a parrot girl.
But we can talk about vultures today, right, Thanks again
for taking the time and sharing your passion about these
amazing birds.
Speaker 5 (02:50):
Yeah, thank you, Marco. I'm super excited to be here
and stoked to be talking to you guys about vultures today.
Speaker 4 (02:56):
So our guests, now, we're at the San Diego Zoo
Safari Park today. Different kind of species you can see
in the park and in the zoo. But in my opinion,
no disrespect to my brothers and sisters at the zoo.
But when I'm thinking vultures, I really want to be
here at the Safari Park. Can you describe for our
listeners today, like, what are some of the vultures that
guests can experience here at the Safari Park.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (03:15):
Absolutely, So we have multiple vultures here at the Safari Park.
Old World and New World vultures, and some that first
come to mind as the California condor. Of course they
are a legacy here, but we also have many other vultures.
So some of the smaller vultures, we have hooded and
Egyptian vultures. We have cape vultures, rupels vultures, and I
(03:38):
feel like I'm missing one, which.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
They're really cool too, right, they look like.
Speaker 5 (03:43):
They're wearing pants. Yes, that is what I was thinking about.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
I want to ask real quick just for clarification, especially
for our audience.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
You mentioned New World and Old World.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
Can you offer definition to that so people understand what
you're talking about.
Speaker 5 (03:56):
Yes, I can. So a New World is in the
Americas and the Ribbean, whereas the Old World is Europe
and Asia.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
And Africa too, right, Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5 (04:05):
Yeah, which is our primary bucket.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
The best for last, But you know, our guests can
see those variations in the body and when you look
at the California cond or, a little different foot structure
right in the beat. But when you see our old
world vultures Europe, Asia, Africa, we're seeing them their ancestors
really more from raptors like eagles, hawks, falcons, right, so
you can see a curved beak, right, a little more
curvature of their foot and their talent, which I think
is awesome, right, I mean, you and I know vultures are.
(04:31):
They're amazing and growing up. For me, you guys, it
was the Jungle Book. Do you guys remember the vultures
in the Jungle Book?
Speaker 1 (04:37):
Right?
Speaker 4 (04:37):
Yes, you know they were great, But honestly, the critique
I had was, vultures are always depicted like they're not smart,
they're dirty, they're not so.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
Right, Okay, But in all fairness, now, in a jungle book,
they did befriend Mowgli at least, right, they didn't try
to pick on them too much.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Eventually they came around and they helped out, you know,
fighting off share cons. True, that's probably the best.
Speaker 5 (04:58):
In a very dark moment the story.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
But yet yeah, right, So.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
With that being said, then understanding what the general culture
of our society tends to depict vultures as I would
love to ask you right off the bat, as someone
who spent a lot of time working with birds, you've
done a lot of work with vultures around the world.
Essentially from your perspective, what would be one of the
myths or misunderstandings our guests might have a vultures when
(05:24):
they're coming to the safari park or down to the zoo.
Speaker 5 (05:26):
Yeah, well, I think we kind of hit on a
couple of them where people think that maybe they're ugly
or they're mean, which is not the case at all,
And they have fantastic personalities that you get to know
as you work with them. So I'm glad that we
can focus on them. But I think one of the
other things is that you know they're in movies and
(05:47):
TV shows that maybe they're going after things that haven't
died yet, all right, right, So vultures. You can tell
that they are vulture based on the fact that they
don't have feathers on their head and their necks so
that they can eat carry on, which is animals that
have already passed away, and that helps keep them clean.
And with that, people think that maybe they're out there
(06:07):
circling and waiting for something to die so that they
can eat it. But that is not the case. Vultures
don't do that. They don't seek out things that are
looking sick. They go after the things that have already passed.
And they're actually a huge help that way, because there
are little cleanup crew.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Yeah, and actually I want to ask real quickly then too,
that circling behavior, that classic thing, and we see in
the movies that, oh, that person's about to die in
the desert, suddenly these birds are circling. Reality is they
only do that when they spot and or smell something
that has passed.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
So there are some species that can.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
Smell carry on or an animal that's passed away, because
obviously it starts to get stinky.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
But there's others that use only vision. Is that correct?
Speaker 5 (06:46):
That is correct. I know that turkey vultures have one
of the best sense of smell among all the vultures,
but some do rely more specifically on their site.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
Yeah, no, totally.
Speaker 4 (06:56):
I mean you and I know, like turkey vilt's like
a broadening piece of meat, you know, from ment to
piece of meter or if you want to use ten
miles away. It's incredible, it's interesting. Those different variations in
adaptability for these.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Birds, for sure.
Speaker 5 (07:10):
And I just noticed actually just getting back from South Africa,
seeing the mostly cape vultures in the area that we
were listening and hearing the calls of the other vultures
at a feed, and all of those vocalizations also bringing
them to the site.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
Oh, Jenna, I definitely want to ask you about that.
Speaker 4 (07:27):
I mean, in case our listeners don't know, we do
a lot of conservation work with vultures in California, condor
hooded vultures, Egyptians, and so many other African species, but
there's also a lot of collaborative work, right, I mean,
there are a lot of stories of us with many
species here at the Safari Park and at the zoo
with our partners out in Africa. But I'm really excited
(07:47):
about this one, you guys, because we have this really
unique relationship with this partner called Volpro. Now, this is
a South African vulture conservation organization and they do a
really great job. Their mission is to protect African cultures
through collaborating and innovating, not only rehabilitating these injured birds
that they find out there for re release, but also
helping non releasable vultures by creating this essential breeding program.
(08:11):
And it doesn't stop there, you guys, many of these
release candidates actually have GPS transmitters. This way we can
learn a lot more about these essential scavengers through their lifetime,
giving us more knowledge and this bird's eye view of
the hardships that a lot of these birds face out
in Africa.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Jenna, can you speak a.
Speaker 4 (08:30):
Little bit about our time with volpro and how it
all got started.
Speaker 5 (08:33):
Yeah, So we've been working with Volpro since twenty seventeen,
and it all started because we breed a lot of
vultures here at the Safari Park and so we do
a lot of incubation and chick rearing for those species
and Volpro wanted to start doing a lot more of that,
so they started getting incubators. It was started by yeah,
(08:54):
Carrie Ca Carrie Walter, Yeah, and she started a rehab
facility in South Africa and their mission is to protect
African vultures through collaboration and innovation. So they get a
lot of rehab birds there. But with those rehab birds,
many are amputations or they can't be released back into
the wild, so they allow them to breed at the
site and then those chicks are then released back out
into the wild to help bring more birds back into
(09:16):
the population because they are anywhere from a vulnerable species
to a critically endangered species, all the types that she
has on her property. So getting those incubators, getting her
set up for incubation, our partnership we go over every
June when they have packed incubators. I think when we
went this year there was like thirty five eggs.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
Wow, it was a lot.
Speaker 5 (09:38):
I feel like we had six in one incubator.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
In each incubator.
Speaker 5 (09:43):
It was like to compare here at the park condors
one egg to one incubator, so we don't ever have
that many eggs at one time. And when you are
doing incubation work, you do notice a lot of things
with the embryo, with the chicken stide. Sometimes they become malpositions,
sometimes they have issues hatching out. And we've done so
(10:04):
much of that breeding here that we've experienced it and
we kind of know the proper ways to go about
handling it to have a healthy check and to minimize
any losses. So we have gone every June to give
Carrie a break, help her with her incubation. More and
train her and her staff. She is amazing, she does
incredible work, but she's trying to pass that information onto
her team as well, so we want to go and
(10:26):
help her during that time, and she gets the weirdest
cases and malpositions that I've ever seen. So it's really
a learning experience for us because there's some situations that
she's had that we've never had as well.
Speaker 1 (10:40):
There's so much unpack with what you just said.
Speaker 3 (10:42):
I'm going to give a running list of my head
and I want to ask about that, and I want
to ask about that, and I want to ask about that.
But I think, first of all, I love how you
wrap that up in the sense that it's a collaboration.
We have done so much work in incubation and raising
birds in our park that that not is assisting in
helping her and her efforts and saving these birds. But
(11:05):
then also you're saying while you're there dealing with all
this stuff, you're still learning too, And there's so much
value in understanding how collaborations aren't just one sided. You know,
there's a shared goal, but everyone gets to grow and
learn and then the end result is we do better
for the birds.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
So that's awesome. But what I want to go back
to is, I guess the first part of what you said,
why are these birds that she is breeding, why are
they endangered? Why are they threatened?
Speaker 3 (11:29):
What's happening to these wild populations that there is such
a need for her to step in and for us
to step in and go we need to make more
and we need to get them back out in the
wild to keep the ecosystem balanced.
Speaker 5 (11:41):
Yeah. Absolutely, So there's multiple reasons, but one of the
big ones is poisonings. So here in the States, it's
lead poisoning for condors. If a hunter uses lead ammunition,
it spreads throughout that kill and when they eat it,
they then get lead poisoning. Same thing in Africa, but
also with the poaching that takes place there. Poachers can
(12:02):
specifically poison a kill, whether it be an elephant or
a rhino, and when a huge group of vultures come
to that kill, it can take out an entire colony
in one setting. And the reason they do that is
because the rangers look for the vultures in the sky
is a sign for a kill and they can go
to that spot. So for the rangers they're looking for
(12:23):
that the poachers know that, so they will poison the
kill so that the vultures aren't coming back, they're passing.
And again you can lose one hundred birds with one kill,
so that's a big reason and is affecting birds throughout
all of Africa. Also, there's a lot of collisions with
power lines, so when we were at Volpro, we had
quite a few birds that came in with broken wings
(12:45):
and had to be amputated, so that was also a
big problem there.
Speaker 4 (12:49):
Yeah, it really speaks to the important work that Carrie
and our team are doing a Volpro as well.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
I give these snaps to.
Speaker 4 (12:55):
The Bird Department for all the amazing work you guys.
I mean, granted, I'm a little biased.
Speaker 2 (12:59):
I know, I know everyone's their eyes right now driving,
but focus on the road, you guys.
Speaker 4 (13:03):
But seriously, the Bird Department here at the Safari Park
and of course at the San Diego Zoo, They've done
so much or these conservation projects. I'm more behavior orient
in my background, but I when joining the Bird Department,
Jenna and you and the team like watching everything that
you guys doe with incubation is incredible and some of
these like unique moments. There was a day, you and
I there was a roupels ultu in an egg that
you were waiting for it to pit. And I bring
(13:25):
that up because can you talk about two words that
I want kids to really understand.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
You have to get the science of it.
Speaker 4 (13:29):
But the malpositioning, because that was a little bit of
an issue with this chick and also pipping.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Can you talk about that really quick?
Speaker 1 (13:35):
Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 5 (13:36):
So mal positioning is when the embryo isn't in the
perfect position to hatch out. So there's a certain position
which would be really challenging to probably explain right right
without showing you, But think of it as you have
the big side of the egg and you have the
pointy side of the egg, and generally the beak should
always be going to the big side of the egg
because there's a pocketive air there and it will internally pit,
(13:57):
meaning that it's a little bit equal puncture through the
internet brain so they can take that big deep breath
and then it will break through the shell and externally
pit before it hatches out. So when it's malposition it's
unable to do that successfully. So if it's beak is
at the pointy end, there's no air down there for
it to breathe and then eventually break out. So sometimes
(14:19):
we'll not make it past that point. But it could
also be on the right side but have a leg
or a wing or something over its beak or head
so that it's unable to break through.
Speaker 4 (14:30):
Well, as Rick was mentioning, you know, we've learned this
with our experiences here at this safar. I walk over
what fifty years of conservation projects, and people know of
our condur project, but there's a lot of work with
the African and also want to point out the Easiatic
species too.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
Rick.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
You were asking what are these issues vultures are having
and you mentioned lead poisoning, right, Jenna, with California condors,
our African vulture species getting toxins and poison you know,
because of poaching, but also we have our species out
and Asia two have been effected for different reasons using
a certain drug I'm probably gonna inspronounce leuthenic actually that
was used for cattle and cows, right, But then those
vultures eating that particular animal, ingesting that chemical drastically drop
(15:07):
that population, right.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
So it really speaks to that awesome.
Speaker 4 (15:09):
Work that we're doing here at the park and how
guests are connected to right, Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 5 (15:13):
And I missed a couple that I'm thinking of as
we're going, which is another It's because vultures go after
things that are dead a lot of the time. If
you get a roadkill, you hit a deer or another
animal on the road, they might go after that and
then also have a collision with a vehicle, which is
another cause. And there are some areas where people like
to use the body parts too. There's superstitions around the
(15:36):
body parts for vultures, it specifically to the brains and
the eyes, and they think it establishes good luck, so
forecasting like the outcome of a soccer game or a
lottery like. They think it will bring them luck and winning.
So that's another one that affects them, but we don't
hear as much about it.
Speaker 4 (15:52):
Yeah, no wildlife trafficking. We had an episode with Lori
and the Tiger Team. We hit upon it a little bit.
Even animal parts mentioning too, is part of wildlife trafficing
a feather I brought that up in the past before.
When you travel you didn't know where these feathers are
being procured from, right, So you have to really think
about what you're purchasing out there in the world, right.
Speaker 5 (16:10):
Yes, we have to be very aware.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
We've kind of talked about the different species New World,
Old World and where they can be found. The immense
amount of time the Safari Park has put into understanding
the proper care. How that translates in when you head
over to Africa and other people on our team head
over there to help with volpro How we're learning more
when we're out there. We've talked about some of the
challenges they're facing in the wild, but one thing we
(16:34):
haven't talked about yet, and this is probably one of
my favorite parts about vultures is why are they important
to the environment?
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Why do we need them around?
Speaker 3 (16:42):
We often have people show up they want to see
the tiger, the lion, the elephants, the rhinos because they're
big and they're fascinating, and they'll bypass the vultures. But
from our world of looking at the whole health of
all the environment, they're really important. Jenna, cause you shed
a little light on why vultures are so important to
(17:03):
the environment, why people should care.
Speaker 5 (17:06):
Vultures, I'm sure you've heard it, are nature's cleanup crew,
so they will clean up carcasses after an animal dies,
but amongst those animals is disease, and those disease can
be spread to us or other animals. But vultures are
very unique because they have a more corrosive acid, stronger
than any other animal or bird, so that when they
(17:28):
eat the infected carcass that have that dangerous bacteria, that
acid kills those bacteria and it then doesn't hurt the vulture.
So this protects other species of wildlife, but it also
includes us and prevents us from getting these diseases.
Speaker 3 (17:43):
Yeah, It's one thing I always like to say to kids.
It's like, you know, they can eat all this nasty
disease bad stuff, and all that comes out the other
side is bird poop y, you know, and it's perfectly okay, right,
totally fine. Yeah, And I love that you started that
with their Nature's Cleanup crew. Another analogy I love to
share with kids sometimes is imagine if you took your
trash out to the curb once a week for trash Day,
but no trash truck came by, and the next week
(18:04):
you did the same thing next week and all your
neighbors what would happen.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
To your neighborhood?
Speaker 3 (18:09):
What would it be like of weeks and weeks and
weeks of all this stuff just sitting out there, and
let's say a rainstorm comes and now starts to wash
some of this into our waterways where we get our
fresh water from. What would happen? It's exactly the same
of the vultures. They take care of these diseases that
sometimes could get into our food or our water sources,
could easily affect human populations, and these birds make it.
Speaker 1 (18:29):
Go away just by having a snack, just by eating
what they're supposed to eat. So I think it's pretty cool.
Speaker 5 (18:35):
Yeah, I don't even know how we would survive without vultures.
And I don't even want to think about the smell.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
Good thing.
Speaker 4 (18:42):
We don't have smell of this, right, But that's a
fun point, all those like myths and misconceptions that people think.
I remember when I first started working with vultures, and
my Mom's like me, oh, those animals are disease rid and.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
They're dirty, but but they're not, right.
Speaker 4 (18:55):
I mean, I mean, yeah, so the clean up croup,
but they're actually remarkably clean animals, right. I mean, Early Jenny,
you're in the bald head and the bald neck. That's
for an adaptation, right, they are going inside of the
carcass and pulling out all those yummies. Right, But bald
is beautiful, right, and they are adaptable, sure is.
Speaker 5 (19:10):
And you know, there are twenty three vulture species in
the world and at least one type of vulture is
found on every continent except Australian an Arctic gas so
fourteen of those twenty three are considered threatened or endangered.
So I mean just that alone, you can kind of
see like they're everywhere and they're very much needed.
Speaker 4 (19:28):
So yeah, the colors too, right that the variability on
guess the king vulture, You guys should look at that
and talk about a beautiful bird and or you were
talking about the acid in the stomach for all these species,
so that one bearded vulture of the line, and guy
are fund in Europe beautiful species. Eighty percent of their
diet is bones. They're literally just swallowing bone.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
It's dissolving the second it goes down their throat.
Speaker 4 (19:48):
They are incredible in that regard, and guests can appreciate
these experiences right with vultures when they come in the
safari park, right, Oh can ASTI, what are your favorite
spots for the park, Like if you were a guests
right and they come up to you, Jinna Jenna, I
really want to check out the vultures.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
Where would you say they go?
Speaker 5 (20:03):
Well, I mean first obviously condo right right and have
a beautiful habitat. But I would also say hoodeds which
are more like in the Heart of Africa next to
our okopy and there is also an Egyptian vulture in there,
and sometimes we're able to put an oscar j egg
and things in there, and you can see how the
(20:24):
Egyptian vulture uses a rock as a tool to break
it open and eat the eggs. So I always love
that when we're able to give them those and show
that to the guests and can see how these birds
can use tools. But I would also say, for sure
you have to ride the tram and see we have
cakes and rup bowls and lap it face vultures. Yeah,
along the tram across from our South Africa habitat, Big
(20:47):
Field Habitat. It's a huge beautiful habitat for these birds
and it's aspiring. And when we do have our International
Vulture Awareness Days and we celebrate our hubs here for
our savannah which takes place. Actually this month, they will
put out a full carcass for them to actually feed
like they went naturally in the wild. And we have
(21:08):
our Wildlifecare specialists in front of the habitat and able
to like talk to everybody on the trams they go by,
So it's it's really cool when you're able to catch
those events as well.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
I want to ask you because I personally know from
working with vultures, but I want to get it from
you because I think you probably have a lot more
experience than I do to talk about their personalities a
little bit. You know, when you're telling people go up
to condors, go over here to Heart of Africa, go
on the tram ride, I want people to stop long
enough to not just look at the bird, but to
start look at how they're either interacting with each other
(21:40):
or the other species that they might be sharing the
habitat with, because they do have these individual personalities. And
that's something Mark when I've talked about a couple times
with different species, and I think for some people, you know,
it's all yeah, sure, tigers have different personalities, their guerrillas
have different personal Vultures do too. There's like a whole
social thing going on. When you spend enough time watching them,
you can see how they interact. What's been your experience
(22:01):
with the characteristics and the different personalities.
Speaker 5 (22:04):
Of vultures, Well, they're all unique, and the condors for sure,
if you go up there, there's a sign specifically for
every individual in that habitat. And I think the oldest
female in there is probably like most fun for me
to watch because she sure like pushes the other birds
around and you know, has a very big personality. And
if you're able to do a you know behind the
(22:25):
scenes where you get to feed them, you get to
see them all come down and eat and kind of
the hierarchies amongst them kind.
Speaker 1 (22:31):
Of really show through.
Speaker 5 (22:33):
But then also like we have one male Egyptian vulture
who I think was a hand raised bird that came
to us and he's super friendly and he comes up
and he wants to walk with you, and he likes
to peck at your shoes, and so you just you
see all the uniqueness. Whereas you look at the lap
at face vultures and they're just they're like gangsters. They're
like so tough, and the way they walk they're like
strut and not their wings out, and they look like
(22:55):
they want to kick your butt. So it's you know,
they're all just very, very different. We've lived and learned
here with all the chicks that we've raised, and we've
changed how we've done things and how we do chick
rearing and have a mentor and puppet rearing so that
they don't get imprinted, which means like get used to
people and want to be around them, because then when
they get older, they tend to be more challenging. But
(23:18):
we didn't know that necessarily in the beginning. So we
do have a couple of vultures who are a little
bit more curious and not afraid and want to come
up and mess with your rake or mess with whatever
you have. That can be a little bit more challenging
because they're not little anymore. They're very large and they
can absolutely hurt you. So you just have to be
more cautious around those individuals and just be aware of
(23:41):
the different dynamics and the different personalities and make sure
you're always making safe choices.
Speaker 3 (23:46):
That's awesome.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
That's awesome.
Speaker 4 (23:47):
I love that you brought up Einstein the Egyptian vulture.
By the way, this season referring to you guys. But
also I wanted to know, because you talked about it briefly,
that behavior that Egyptian vultures too.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
Can you talk a little bit about that for a second.
The tool.
Speaker 4 (24:00):
Last episode we talked about gorillas, Yeah, and uh Franke
and Moro pussing a button. But I want guests to
know it's not just some ammals using tools. You guys,
there's a volts or that uses a tool, JENNI speak
about this.
Speaker 5 (24:11):
So the Egyptian vultures use rocks or stones to break
open eggs. So we'll give them an ostrich egg and
provide them with different sized rocks, and you'll see them
go through and they might use a small one and
be like, Nope, this doesn't work on one, Like try
to go for the biggest one. Nope, that one's too heavy,
This one doesn't work. And then like pick the best
tool for them. And then they yeah, sit there and
(24:32):
they just hit it as hard as they can and
if it doesn't crack, they pick it up, they do
it again. They continue going until it's fully cracked and
broken and they can break it apart.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
Am I correct to the visual I have in my
head from seeing this, I think probably in a documentary.
It's not just like they hold the rock in their
mouth and like they're tapping in hammering. It's like they
swing it up high and then they throw like they
extend their neck outs as they can throw it down
at the egg right.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
Yes, yeah, it's quite a visuals.
Speaker 4 (24:58):
We might have some guests who I've been at the
Safari Park before when it was called a different name.
We had an original bird show which I was a
part of. Then we had an Egyptian vulture named Tiba,
and Tiba did this very behavior. Yeah, you were right, Jina.
He would have his very specific rock. Yeah, and if
you lost it, you better not lose that rock. But
it was really unique and that it was a learned behavior.
(25:19):
So a few kids out there basically they're not hatch
knowing this behavior. They have to watch other vultures, other
Egyptian vultures do this, so they're just so intelligent in
that regard to So thank you for sharing that.
Speaker 5 (25:29):
I love Egyptian vultures me too, and they're critically endangered species.
And we had three chicks this year, so yeah, and
we had two that were puppet raised up at condors
so puppet raised means that we have a puppet that
looks like a vulture head and mouth, and we use
that to teach them to eat so that they don't
see us taking care of them. But for the very
(25:51):
first time, we were actually able to give one of
the fertile eggs it went to incubation back to the
parents and this was their first time actually raising a
chicken out at our bird conservation center and they all
are healthy and doing fantastic. But it was very very
cool to see the parents be able to raise this
year and lets us know that.
Speaker 3 (26:10):
We can do that again next time, is right well,
as we get ready to wrap up, I always love
hearing from our specialists and those who do this work
about what it's personally for them, because so much we
talk about the importance of the conservation and how to
educate others, how others can get involved, and why they
should care. But for you, Jen, I mean here you
are working at Safari Park, and I think sometimes as
(26:32):
guests come through and they see us doing our jobs, like, well,
this is what that person does and all that, But
we're humans. We're all humans, and this is a work
of passion for you personally, to be able to be
a part of what you're doing, to travel to Africa
multiple times to help bring knowledge and learn as well
for you personally and your journey and your passions.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
What does that mean to you?
Speaker 5 (26:52):
For me, it feeds my soul, so conservation work it's
like the heart of my love and my passion and
it makes everything worthwhile and seeing how it all comes
together to the bigger picture is huge. But for me,
I love having that opportunity for our team. So our
team cares for these animals day after day and to
be able to send them out and do work with
(27:15):
our partners at Volpro. It's not only rejuvenating them and
giving that energy to come back here and continue on
with the conservation work and giving our wildlife the best
care that they can, but at the same time you
get a peace of mind as well in perspective. So
here at the Stanegazoo Spry Park, we are so lucky
(27:35):
to have basically everything we need to give our wildlife
the very best care. And when you go to another country,
you go to South Africa, the team there is like
a family. They're fantastic and they give their wildlife the
best care, but they.
Speaker 2 (27:48):
Don't have the same resources that we have.
Speaker 5 (27:50):
We don't have cameras on every nest. They don't even
have drains in their pools or hoses, so like you're
doing things by hand, and it gives you a different
perspective of I think when you are working here and
you get to go there, see the birds flying in
the wild, seeing the space and seeing how lucky you
(28:10):
are to have the tools and the things we have
here at the park, and then also if you're lucky enough,
which this year, we were able to release seven birds
back out into the wild while we were there, which
was definitely the highlight for me, and I know our
staff who've been going, who have gone in the past
have gotten to do that too. That's just like icing
on the cake. To be able to care for the
(28:32):
birds and the rehab center there, help raise chicks and
then be able to actually see it all the way
through and release them is just It's an amazing experience
and I'm glad it's something that we're able to offer
our staff and give them that full circle of how
the work they're doing here goes to the conservation work
in South Africa.
Speaker 1 (28:50):
Beautiful.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
I love it. Yeah, well said front.
Speaker 4 (28:53):
That was really great and for kids now, like this
is something you guys came involved in as well. We
all have different passions. You the benture on. I know
you're a pair of girl Jenna, right, but again everyone's
got these passions right, and we can all support these
wonderful programs like coming to the Safari Park San Diego Zoo,
spend some time with the vultures, you guys right, I
mean International Vulture Awareness Day September two this year it
(29:15):
just passed, but these are days for us to bring
awareness for a lot of different.
Speaker 2 (29:19):
Species and a wonderful way to celebrate vultures of the world.
Speaker 5 (29:22):
Absolutely, yeah, and I would encourage everyone to check out
Volpro's website and see all the different work they're doing.
They are monitoring wild breeding populations, they're breeding. They're an
amazing organization and the work they do is incredible.
Speaker 1 (29:35):
So if you're able to.
Speaker 5 (29:36):
Ever go, they do do tours and of course see
it firsthand, would be you really neat.
Speaker 4 (29:41):
That's great, Jenna, Thank you so much for spending the
time with us and sharing your passionate about these bald
and beautiful birds.
Speaker 5 (29:46):
Thank you guys for having me. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
Thanks Jenna.
Speaker 3 (29:52):
Wow, Marco, thank you so much for setting up to
interview with Jenna. Honestly, it's hard to say whose excitement
and passion for birds is stronger yours are.
Speaker 2 (30:00):
You know, maybe let's just call it a tie.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
Fair enough, fair enough, And I mean I get it.
Birds are fascinating in so many ways.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
And I'll admit vultures are high on my list of
favorite animals too.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
Oh yeah, that's right. Didn't you say something about a
favorite turkey vulture?
Speaker 3 (30:14):
Ah?
Speaker 1 (30:14):
Yes, good memory, my friend. You are correct.
Speaker 3 (30:17):
One of the very first animals I worked in close
contact with was a non releasable turkey vulture, and I
will fully admit full disclosure, I was not expecting to
be so fascinated by a vulture vulture behavior and their
social structure.
Speaker 1 (30:30):
There's so much to fall in love with.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
Oh yeah, I totally get it.
Speaker 4 (30:34):
I mean, there's so much to love And like Jenna
was discussing, we need these amazing birds and raising awareness
about their current challenges. It's really important because so many
people are unaware of what's happening to them and why
we need to help them.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
Yeah, it's true.
Speaker 3 (30:48):
And sometimes because we as humans tend to gravitate to
things that are visually considered cute, like pandas and tigers
or elephants. The animals that are sometimes thought of.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
As well in quotes, less attractive may not get the
attention they need exactly.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
And that's really why I was so excited about this
episode Rcky.
Speaker 4 (31:07):
Oftentimes in movies cartoons, vultures are depicted in a not
so great light, I gotta say. And because you know,
like a lot of other wildlife, once you spend time
getting to know them, you can't help but fall in
love with them, right, just like with you and the
Turkey vulture.
Speaker 3 (31:20):
No exactly, exactly, like bild saying goes, to know them
is to love them exactly.
Speaker 4 (31:24):
And I really hope this episode help our listeners get
to know vultures a little bit better so that maybe
they will love them too.
Speaker 1 (31:32):
Me too, Marco.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
And you know what, I'm really enjoying these episodes we're
doing that are tied to a special day to help
bring more awareness to particular.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
Species of wildlife. I think we should do another one.
Speaker 2 (31:41):
Oh yeah, what are you thinking.
Speaker 3 (31:43):
I'm thinking about the fact that our next episode of
Amazing Wildlife comes out on September twenty second, right on
the nose if you will, of World Rhino Day.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
Oh that's perfect timing, all right, Fred, Let's do it
right on.
Speaker 1 (31:57):
I can't wait.
Speaker 3 (31:59):
If you haven't already be sher, subscribe and tune into
our next episode, in which Marco and I find out
more about the different species of rhinos and why they
are in fact so amazing.
Speaker 1 (32:11):
Now Marco Lint and I'm Rick Schwartz, thanks for listening.
Speaker 3 (32:16):
For more information about the San Diego Zoo and San
Diego Zoo Safari Park, go to SVZWA dot org. Amazing
Wildlife is a production of iHeartRadio's Ruby Studios. Our supervising
producer is Nikiah Swinton, and our sound designer and editor
is Sierra Spreen.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
For more shows from iHeartRadio, check
Speaker 3 (32:34):
Out the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen
to your favorite shows.
Hosts And Creators
Rick Schwartz
Marco Wendt
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