December 28, 2025 • 19 mins
The Trump-appointed board of the Kennedy Center has sent a scathing letter with notice of a forthcoming million dollar lawsuit to the lead jazz musician who canceled a decades long Christmas Eve concert in protest of the decision to put President Trump’s name on the building. Meantime, a member of Congress has now sued the Trump administration for what she calls the illegal name change and two other members of Congress have introduced legislation to try and prevent a sitting president from naming any Federal asset after themselves.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
Hey there, folks.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
It is Sunday, December twenty eighth, and letters, lawsuits, and
legislation is the most wonderful time of the year at
the DJTJFK Center for the Performing Arts in DC. And
with that, welcome to this episode of Amy A TJ Roads.
Why you laughing?
Speaker 1 (00:28):
It's the most wonderful time of the year.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
Did you have that planned or did that just roll
right out of your mouth?
Speaker 1 (00:34):
You know it?
Speaker 2 (00:34):
If you don't even have to write this stuff, it
writes itself. We are literally talking about what is supposed
to be a special time at a memorial to one
of our some would argue greatest and most influential presidents.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
I'm supposed to have holiday concerts and all this going on.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
But literally we are talking about what lawsuits, a letter,
and legislation. Let's start with the lawsuit part of it first. Yes,
someone has now sued to get Donald Trump's name down.
The legislation we're talking about is a couple of bills
floating around out there to keep this from ever happening again.
And then a scathing letter from the board to the
(01:12):
guy who just canceled the Christmas Eve concert.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Where do you want to start.
Speaker 4 (01:16):
Well, I think you just nailed it, and it is
eye popping, jaw dropping.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
It is.
Speaker 4 (01:21):
We're in a new era, and it does all seem repetitive.
That's the problem. You even pointed this out. We will
read it for you. But this letter that was written
from the board chairman the Kennedy Center board that was
appointed by President Trump. This letter to this jazz musician
who canceled the Christmas Eve concert in protest for having
Donald Trump's name put on the Kennedy Center's facade, it
(01:46):
sounds as if Donald Trump himself wrote it.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Oh yeah, this is fair familiar language.
Speaker 4 (01:50):
I would be willing to bet that he said here's
a sample draft, and.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
Then they just said, let's keep it as is.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
How do you usually send it to somebody saying you
have any notes?
Speaker 4 (02:03):
And if the president, well not just the president, but
if President Trump asked you that, you say.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
No, sir, this is perfect.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
So let's start with again. This is all. Everybody knows it,
and Rose, we're only a little over. It hasn't even been.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Two weeks since he put his name up there. Right,
everybody knows this now. It says the Donald J. Trump
and John F. Kennedy Center for the Performing.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
Arts Memorial Center. I like the word memorial is there,
like it's there's no question this is a memorial center.
Speaker 1 (02:35):
I think we don't.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
I don't know it's because it is active and ongoing.
I don't think we look at it sometimes the same
as we look at the Lincoln Memorial, the Jefferson Memorial,
the Washington Memorial. Those are just monuments sitting there. This
thing is active and work everything. But this is the equivalent.
Speaker 4 (02:51):
Yes, and I don't think either one of us realized
that it had that same status. Yes, because it is
an operating theater. There are events that take place there,
so it feels more like a theater and less like
a memorial. But it absolutely, one hundred percent is a
memorial and was dedicated specifically to honoring the legacy of
(03:13):
John F.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
Kennedy.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
So let's start with.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
They have been doing these Christmas Eve concerts for years,
for decades, and the guy who's been running them is
jazz musician Chuck Read. He's a drummer. Most people don't
know his name, but a long time international, even renowned drummer.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
He's been doing the concert.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Well robe He said specifically that he canceled the concert
because of the name change, no other reason, period, point blank.
Speaker 4 (03:41):
Yeah, he made it very clear. I appreciated his direct honesty.
He said, I think it was within It was pretty quick.
It was swept his decision once the board voted to
put Donald Trump's name up. And remember Trump's name got
put up the next day, like within hours of the
board's decision.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
Trump feigned surprise. He said he was surprised and honored.
Speaker 4 (04:02):
The lettering was ready to go and was being put
up on the building within hours of the board's decision.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
There was no surprise.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Guess they found a hobby lobby open at the right
thoughts that they needed.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Sure, that's what it was. So yes, Red made it
very clear.
Speaker 4 (04:18):
He spoke to journalists and said this is the reason
why it's a shame.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
He had been in charge of it since two thousand
and six.
Speaker 4 (04:25):
And he even said it's especially sad because they usually
honor a high school musician.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
It's a big deal.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
One lucky high schooler gets to take part in this
and that was canceled for the first time in decades.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Okay, can I stop there before we move on with
the news. The idea what do you do you do?
What's in your heart, But should you have people miss
out on the experience, on the concert, on the music,
to have some high school kid miss out on a
moment because a name is on a building, do you
carry on?
Speaker 1 (04:56):
I don't know the right answer I have.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
You guess you have to do it in your heart,
but to in some degree, I hate that people are
missing out.
Speaker 4 (05:03):
So I really do think that this is just my
personal opinion. It is a little bit of cutting off
your nose despite your face. I think going higher is
better than going lower. I know he made a point,
the musician Chuck read. He made a point. He was
making a statement, and certainly it made headlines and now
it's continuing to do so. So in some way, yes,
his form of protests had some pretty sad consequences, but
(05:25):
he is probably getting the desired result in terms of
publicity and pressure he's hoping to put on the president.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
However, that is hilarious.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
It's not It's like David and Goliath.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
It's hilarious. What are you going to do?
Speaker 4 (05:38):
You're not going to achieve anything other than creating a
firestorm in the media.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
Okay, all right, so let's go now, Chuck Red con
counsels the concert. I was surprised though there was a
letter that the board president, Richard Grenell. You don't know
his name necessarily either, but he's a close, close ally
and advisor to President Donald J.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
Trump.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
He sends a letter as the board president to mister Red,
and he robes, as we said, ripped, let loose. This
whole letter might as well have been posted in several
truth social posts. Is what it sounds like. Show to
the capital letters. I think there's no capital letters. But
other than that, this letter is hilarious. He starts, Dear
mister Red, I write to you, as president of the
(06:18):
Donald J.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
Trump and John F.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Kennedy Memorial Center for the Performing Arts, regarding your abrupt
cancelation of your scheduled performance Jazz Jam.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
For partisan political reasons.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Your decision to withdraw this last minute, explicit explicitly in
response to the Center's renaming, which honors President Trump's extraordinary
efforts to save this national treasure, is classic intolerance and
very costly to a non profit arts institution.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
That I have to kind of agree. What do we do.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
We can choose not to participate, we can choose not
to vote, We can choose all kinds of things.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Is this classic intolerance?
Speaker 4 (06:57):
Yes, in a way, yes it is, and I do
do you think he could have recused himself as the musician.
Speaker 3 (07:02):
He didn't have to cancel the whole concert.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
You make the point, that's the compromise.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
This will go on, but I want to step away
for personal reasons, but I don't want anyone else to
have to miss out.
Speaker 3 (07:14):
That would have been the right call.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
There you go.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Damn, you usually nail it, like mid episode.
Speaker 3 (07:20):
It all comes together.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
But yes, that would have been You're right, a perfect compromise.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
It really would have.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
So the letter goes on, and this is when it
really gets interesting.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
So he's upset.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
Of course, he says, regrettably, your action surrenders to this
sad bullying tactics employed by certain elements on the left
who have sought to intimidate artists into boycotting performances at
our National Cultural Center. Nevertheless, it is worth noting that
attendance for your jazz jam had been lagging considerably behind
(07:54):
our other Christmas and holiday offerings, which have drawn strong
crowds and enthusiastic response. The contrast between the public's lack
of interest in your show with the success we are
experiencing under our new chairman is drastic.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
Yeah, that's Trump.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Yeah, he maybe personally wrote that line.
Speaker 4 (08:14):
I would believe that, and I think that it continues
with perhaps the Trump speak. Our innovative Casey Speakeasy, an
intimate rooftop after hours venue featuring live jazz, has consistently
sold out, attracting diverse audiences and revitalizing the genre in
exciting ways. The most ovent, guard and well regarded performers
(08:35):
in your genre will still perform regularly, and unlike you,
they'll do it to sold out crowds, regardless of their
political leanings.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
That was unnecessary.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
Throw it insult in there.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Don't know if it's accurate or not, but it doesn't
matter if it is, because this is out there. I'm
not going and looking through all the attendance records for
the past twenty years. They just throw that stuff out there. Fine,
but it's meant to be an insult. We don't even
want you or need you. You whack nothing, get out.
We don't even want you here. You don't do anything.
Cross now, your mama's ugly.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
And that's where the board went over the line.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
They could have also just stopped it at so this
was unnecessary. Now you're taking things to a childish level,
and now you're saying nana nana boo boo, and it's
just that's when I'm like, come on, I understand what
they're doing, the letter they sent, but this is when
you lose me, and when you lose a lot of people.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
They went through and they have a lot of stuff
here about Trump's decisive intervention saving the building from what
they say was almost certain destruction.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
That I miss something.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
I actually have never heard this before.
Speaker 4 (09:43):
This note that there were apparently structural assessments that indicated
severe deterioration. There were recommendations for full demolition and rebuild.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
I had not heard that.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
Okay, what you know, it's I wouldn't mind updated modern
President John F. Kennedy Memorial Center. I wouldn't mind it
at all. But they close out this letter UH mentioning
the dismal ticket sales. They say it's cost them considerably,
and I believe the last minute cancelation probably did. But
this is the line now quote, this is your official
(10:17):
notice that we will seek one million dollars in damages
from you for this political stunt.
Speaker 4 (10:23):
And they will, no doubt, no doubt, that's one thing
we know for sure. When President Trump or any of
his affiliates say they're going to sue you, they do
follow through. This is not just a threat, this is
notice for absolutely so, yes, one million dollars in damages.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
Hey, look, we should note it's been widely reported this
year in ticket sales that that place have the words
they use are plummeted. There's some plate in New York
Times report a fifty percent reduction in sales. Ticket sales
to that place. Now, it could have a lot to
do with a lot of stuff, but when you have
the likes of East Array and lin Manuel Miranda saying
we ain't coming to that center, a lot of people
(11:04):
will not.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
Go because they'll listen to those people.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
But also those are great offerings to sell tickets at
the Kennedy Center to go see Hamilton at the Kennedy Center.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
That was supposed to be twenty twenty six.
Speaker 4 (11:15):
Hamilton was going to be at the Kennedy Center and
lin Manuel said no more.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
So that is obviously going to hurt your ticket sales. Yes,
this isn't helpful.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
And look, we talked about Trump's name on the outside.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
This is hurting artists and everybody who works at that place.
When ticket sales go down, people are losing jobs, and
a lot of those musicians are not playing to sold
out crowds and not making the money they're used to.
Speaker 4 (11:38):
Yeah, and I will say this last line of the
letter I agree with. So I do think that this
is an important part and both sides need to acknowledge this.
Speaker 3 (11:48):
They end the letter.
Speaker 4 (11:49):
This institution remains dedicated to the excellence and accessibility for
generations to come, and we will not yield to the
pressure tactics being directed at us from political performers on
our stages. True artists perform for everyone, regardless of the
political affiliation of audience members.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
Do you agree with that?
Speaker 2 (12:09):
If they would have handed us this letter for notes,
there are certain sections to cross out, and there are
certain sections we wouldn't have touched because it makes a
good point.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
That is right exactly.
Speaker 2 (12:19):
Let's have that conversation. Let's talk about that. Let's talk
about it.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
As an artist. Can you have a personal Can you
make a personal statement? Should you at all? Should it matter?
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Yes, if it's in your heart, fine, But how can
you argue haven't we done this? So?
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Hell? What? It just sounds crazy?
Speaker 2 (12:36):
Johnny Cash, he wouldn't perform for freaking prisoners, Like, how
do you make a distinction, like you're not worthy or
I'm not going to participate because you don't deserve my
art or access to it or for whatever political it's art?
Speaker 1 (12:49):
Right? Is this that the beauty of it are supposed
to be the point?
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Music, visual performance.
Speaker 4 (12:53):
It's all supposed to unite or bring us together a
shared experience, no matter what language we speak, no matter
what political affiliation we have, who we voted for, what
we think about whatever, that is supposed to be uniting.
So it's so sad to see the arts being used divisively.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
Well we talk, Yes, that was the letter part. There's
also some legislation floating around out there. Yes, folks, they
are introducing bills in Congress. They don't even want Trump
to be able to put his name on a damn
park bench. We'll explain what that's about. Stay here, all right, folks.
(13:36):
We continue on this Sunday, December twenty eighth, with all
that's going on around the jay No excuse me, let
me get it right to Donald J.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
Trump. John F.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
Kennedy Memorial Center for the Performing Arts, Center for the
Performing Arts, Okay, that's what I didn't realize. It's such
a mouthful these days. But Robes, there's some We got
a bunch of bills, okay, lawsuits and legislation. There's a
law suit at least that one Ohio congresswoman has put
out there that she wants to take his name down.
(14:06):
That's a lawsuit essentially saying he doesn't have the right
to do this, it should come down.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
Then we got at least two pieces of legislation.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
Voting around where they're trying to prevent Trump from putting
his name on anything else.
Speaker 3 (14:17):
That's right.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
Maryland Democratic Congresswoman April McLain Delaney, she's actually introduced two
bills in the House. The first one is called the
Kennedy Center Protection Act, so that would void the board's
vote to put Trump's name out there and mandate the
removal of Trump's name from all signage. And then she
also this is the big one. She's put out this legislation.
(14:41):
It's called the Federal Property Integrity Act, and that would
prohibit renaming federal assets of any kind after sitting presidents.
Speaker 3 (14:51):
That makes a lot of sense.
Speaker 4 (14:52):
And Bernie Sanders then followed through in the Senate and said,
I will be introducing legislation prohibiting the naming of federal
buildings after sitting president. So there'll be a parallel bill
in the Senate that is much like the House one
that says, hey, if you are sitting president, you don't
get to name things after yourself, period. And he started
Britty Sanders put this out on X and he said,
(15:13):
what arrogance, what narcissism.
Speaker 3 (15:15):
He added that, but what.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
A shame we have to write that bill. We need
laws to tell a sitting president not to put his
name on federal buildings. We never thought we would need that.
I don't know what's next, but it's I can't believe
of all places he would have put his name up,
that one feels especially like I actually googled this morning
to see if the JFK Eternal flame was still going.
Speaker 1 (15:40):
I swear to god I did. This. Is that guy
JFK like, who has an ego.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
Big enough that they think they can put their name
in front of JFKs and not.
Speaker 4 (15:52):
Just think it, but actually do it and have everything
ready to go hours after a board you appointed said
you could, Yeah, we know who the I really think
he might be one of the only people in the
world who would feel fully confident and entitled to do
so well, and he did it.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Can you imagine Barack Obama, I want to rename Mlkday
the Obama Mlkday. It's gonna be a new federal holiday.
Speaker 4 (16:16):
What honestly, I mean, he's basically his birthday, which is
Flag Day. I'm waiting for that now to become a
national holiday, because already now you get the free park
admission national Can he name a federal holiday for his
birthday and claim it's for Flag Day?
Speaker 3 (16:33):
In quotes?
Speaker 2 (16:34):
I just said no and laughed at myself because we
say no, he can't do that, and he keeps doing stuff.
By the way, it is not by our account, but
by every legal scholar who was looking at the law
says he cannot legally change the name of the building.
Now he has an officially, legally he can't. Then there
was a question of could he put the signage even up,
(16:55):
and they say, legally he can't do that either because
of a specific language in the law that says no
plan So memorials of any kind yet be added up
in the place. Are they going to argue it's not
a plaque, it's not really a memorial. It's not really
a name to somebody else.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (17:09):
How do you enforce that? I agree with you. I
have looked.
Speaker 4 (17:12):
There is not one person who says what President Trump
is done is legal, not one.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
You can't even put your whole the whole.
Speaker 4 (17:20):
Point of the Kennedy Center Board is that it was
supposed to be and had been up until now, bipartisan.
You can't just wipe out the whole board and put
all people.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
So you can't. That's illegal, too, said you can't.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
Yes, well okay.
Speaker 4 (17:32):
The point being is yes he did, and he yes,
I can. Okay, okay, but okay, so it's illegal. How
do you then enforce it? He's the commander in chief?
Speaker 3 (17:41):
What do you do? That's the point. You can't. Can
you enforce it?
Speaker 2 (17:45):
What somebody has to send in the military to protect
a construction worker who was taking down the D and
the O and the.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
N and the I don't know.
Speaker 4 (17:56):
This is fascinating to see what happens. I mean, people
will be studying this period in our country for generations
to come.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
Okay, can we sleep first and then get to that part?
All right?
Speaker 2 (18:09):
Folks, Well, we always appreciate you spending some time with us.
This is another fascinating but certainly sad this one. You
know what stung most Maria Schreiver. Yeah, her that tweet.
She sent a long kind of explaining that it's stung.
This is her family member, this is their memorial. This
is you equated it to putting your name on somebody's
(18:29):
tombstone above theirs.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
It's exactly what it feels like.
Speaker 4 (18:36):
And yes, and I appreciate the Kennedy's have been outspoken
but respectful, and I think that's at least some decorum
has been taking place.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
Wow, that should be That should be your slogan. What'd
you just say? Outspoken but respectful. That's that's every That
should be your campaign slogan. Hey, we're going to be
outspoken but respectful, and all we.
Speaker 3 (18:58):
Do would not be wonderful folks.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
All right, well, we.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
Always appreciate you listening to us, folks. For my dear
Amy Robock, I am T J.
Speaker 1 (19:05):
Holmes. We will talk to also
Hey there, folks.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
It is Sunday, December twenty eighth, and letters, lawsuits, and
legislation is the most wonderful time of the year at
the DJTJFK Center for the Performing Arts in DC. And
with that, welcome to this episode of Amy A TJ Roads.
Why you laughing?
Speaker 1 (00:28):
It's the most wonderful time of the year.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
Did you have that planned or did that just roll
right out of your mouth?
Speaker 1 (00:34):
You know it?
Speaker 2 (00:34):
If you don't even have to write this stuff, it
writes itself. We are literally talking about what is supposed
to be a special time at a memorial to one
of our some would argue greatest and most influential presidents.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
I'm supposed to have holiday concerts and all this going on.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
But literally we are talking about what lawsuits, a letter,
and legislation. Let's start with the lawsuit part of it first. Yes,
someone has now sued to get Donald Trump's name down.
The legislation we're talking about is a couple of bills
floating around out there to keep this from ever happening again.
And then a scathing letter from the board to the
(01:12):
guy who just canceled the Christmas Eve concert.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Where do you want to start.
Speaker 4 (01:16):
Well, I think you just nailed it, and it is
eye popping, jaw dropping.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
It is.
Speaker 4 (01:21):
We're in a new era, and it does all seem repetitive.
That's the problem. You even pointed this out. We will
read it for you. But this letter that was written
from the board chairman the Kennedy Center board that was
appointed by President Trump. This letter to this jazz musician
who canceled the Christmas Eve concert in protest for having
Donald Trump's name put on the Kennedy Center's facade, it
(01:46):
sounds as if Donald Trump himself wrote it.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Oh yeah, this is fair familiar language.
Speaker 4 (01:50):
I would be willing to bet that he said here's
a sample draft, and.
Speaker 3 (01:56):
Then they just said, let's keep it as is.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
How do you usually send it to somebody saying you
have any notes?
Speaker 4 (02:03):
And if the president, well not just the president, but
if President Trump asked you that, you say.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
No, sir, this is perfect.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
So let's start with again. This is all. Everybody knows it,
and Rose, we're only a little over. It hasn't even been.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Two weeks since he put his name up there. Right,
everybody knows this now. It says the Donald J. Trump
and John F. Kennedy Center for the Performing.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
Arts Memorial Center. I like the word memorial is there,
like it's there's no question this is a memorial center.
Speaker 1 (02:35):
I think we don't.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
I don't know it's because it is active and ongoing.
I don't think we look at it sometimes the same
as we look at the Lincoln Memorial, the Jefferson Memorial,
the Washington Memorial. Those are just monuments sitting there. This
thing is active and work everything. But this is the equivalent.
Speaker 4 (02:51):
Yes, and I don't think either one of us realized
that it had that same status. Yes, because it is
an operating theater. There are events that take place there,
so it feels more like a theater and less like
a memorial. But it absolutely, one hundred percent is a
memorial and was dedicated specifically to honoring the legacy of
(03:13):
John F.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
Kennedy.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
So let's start with.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
They have been doing these Christmas Eve concerts for years,
for decades, and the guy who's been running them is
jazz musician Chuck Read. He's a drummer. Most people don't
know his name, but a long time international, even renowned drummer.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
He's been doing the concert.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Well robe He said specifically that he canceled the concert
because of the name change, no other reason, period, point blank.
Speaker 4 (03:41):
Yeah, he made it very clear. I appreciated his direct honesty.
He said, I think it was within It was pretty quick.
It was swept his decision once the board voted to
put Donald Trump's name up. And remember Trump's name got
put up the next day, like within hours of the
board's decision.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
Trump feigned surprise. He said he was surprised and honored.
Speaker 4 (04:02):
The lettering was ready to go and was being put
up on the building within hours of the board's decision.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
There was no surprise.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Guess they found a hobby lobby open at the right
thoughts that they needed.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Sure, that's what it was. So yes, Red made it
very clear.
Speaker 4 (04:18):
He spoke to journalists and said this is the reason
why it's a shame.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
He had been in charge of it since two thousand
and six.
Speaker 4 (04:25):
And he even said it's especially sad because they usually
honor a high school musician.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
It's a big deal.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
One lucky high schooler gets to take part in this
and that was canceled for the first time in decades.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Okay, can I stop there before we move on with
the news. The idea what do you do you do?
What's in your heart, But should you have people miss
out on the experience, on the concert, on the music,
to have some high school kid miss out on a
moment because a name is on a building, do you
carry on?
Speaker 1 (04:56):
I don't know the right answer I have.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
You guess you have to do it in your heart,
but to in some degree, I hate that people are
missing out.
Speaker 4 (05:03):
So I really do think that this is just my
personal opinion. It is a little bit of cutting off
your nose despite your face. I think going higher is
better than going lower. I know he made a point,
the musician Chuck read. He made a point. He was
making a statement, and certainly it made headlines and now
it's continuing to do so. So in some way, yes,
his form of protests had some pretty sad consequences, but
(05:25):
he is probably getting the desired result in terms of
publicity and pressure he's hoping to put on the president.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
However, that is hilarious.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
It's not It's like David and Goliath.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
It's hilarious. What are you going to do?
Speaker 4 (05:38):
You're not going to achieve anything other than creating a
firestorm in the media.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
Okay, all right, so let's go now, Chuck Red con
counsels the concert. I was surprised though there was a
letter that the board president, Richard Grenell. You don't know
his name necessarily either, but he's a close, close ally
and advisor to President Donald J.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
Trump.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
He sends a letter as the board president to mister Red,
and he robes, as we said, ripped, let loose. This
whole letter might as well have been posted in several
truth social posts. Is what it sounds like. Show to
the capital letters. I think there's no capital letters. But
other than that, this letter is hilarious. He starts, Dear
mister Red, I write to you, as president of the
(06:18):
Donald J.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
Trump and John F.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Kennedy Memorial Center for the Performing Arts, regarding your abrupt
cancelation of your scheduled performance Jazz Jam.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
For partisan political reasons.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Your decision to withdraw this last minute, explicit explicitly in
response to the Center's renaming, which honors President Trump's extraordinary
efforts to save this national treasure, is classic intolerance and
very costly to a non profit arts institution.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
That I have to kind of agree. What do we do.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
We can choose not to participate, we can choose not
to vote, We can choose all kinds of things.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Is this classic intolerance?
Speaker 4 (06:57):
Yes, in a way, yes it is, and I do
do you think he could have recused himself as the musician.
Speaker 3 (07:02):
He didn't have to cancel the whole concert.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
You make the point, that's the compromise.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
This will go on, but I want to step away
for personal reasons, but I don't want anyone else to
have to miss out.
Speaker 3 (07:14):
That would have been the right call.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
There you go.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Damn, you usually nail it, like mid episode.
Speaker 3 (07:20):
It all comes together.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
But yes, that would have been You're right, a perfect compromise.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
It really would have.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
So the letter goes on, and this is when it
really gets interesting.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
So he's upset.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
Of course, he says, regrettably, your action surrenders to this
sad bullying tactics employed by certain elements on the left
who have sought to intimidate artists into boycotting performances at
our National Cultural Center. Nevertheless, it is worth noting that
attendance for your jazz jam had been lagging considerably behind
(07:54):
our other Christmas and holiday offerings, which have drawn strong
crowds and enthusiastic response. The contrast between the public's lack
of interest in your show with the success we are
experiencing under our new chairman is drastic.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
Yeah, that's Trump.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Yeah, he maybe personally wrote that line.
Speaker 4 (08:14):
I would believe that, and I think that it continues
with perhaps the Trump speak. Our innovative Casey Speakeasy, an
intimate rooftop after hours venue featuring live jazz, has consistently
sold out, attracting diverse audiences and revitalizing the genre in
exciting ways. The most ovent, guard and well regarded performers
(08:35):
in your genre will still perform regularly, and unlike you,
they'll do it to sold out crowds, regardless of their
political leanings.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
That was unnecessary.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
Throw it insult in there.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Don't know if it's accurate or not, but it doesn't
matter if it is, because this is out there. I'm
not going and looking through all the attendance records for
the past twenty years. They just throw that stuff out there. Fine,
but it's meant to be an insult. We don't even
want you or need you. You whack nothing, get out.
We don't even want you here. You don't do anything.
Cross now, your mama's ugly.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
And that's where the board went over the line.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
They could have also just stopped it at so this
was unnecessary. Now you're taking things to a childish level,
and now you're saying nana nana boo boo, and it's
just that's when I'm like, come on, I understand what
they're doing, the letter they sent, but this is when
you lose me, and when you lose a lot of people.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
They went through and they have a lot of stuff
here about Trump's decisive intervention saving the building from what
they say was almost certain destruction.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
That I miss something.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
I actually have never heard this before.
Speaker 4 (09:43):
This note that there were apparently structural assessments that indicated
severe deterioration. There were recommendations for full demolition and rebuild.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
I had not heard that.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
Okay, what you know, it's I wouldn't mind updated modern
President John F. Kennedy Memorial Center. I wouldn't mind it
at all. But they close out this letter UH mentioning
the dismal ticket sales. They say it's cost them considerably,
and I believe the last minute cancelation probably did. But
this is the line now quote, this is your official
(10:17):
notice that we will seek one million dollars in damages
from you for this political stunt.
Speaker 4 (10:23):
And they will, no doubt, no doubt, that's one thing
we know for sure. When President Trump or any of
his affiliates say they're going to sue you, they do
follow through. This is not just a threat, this is
notice for absolutely so, yes, one million dollars in damages.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
Hey, look, we should note it's been widely reported this
year in ticket sales that that place have the words
they use are plummeted. There's some plate in New York
Times report a fifty percent reduction in sales. Ticket sales
to that place. Now, it could have a lot to
do with a lot of stuff, but when you have
the likes of East Array and lin Manuel Miranda saying
we ain't coming to that center, a lot of people
(11:04):
will not.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
Go because they'll listen to those people.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
But also those are great offerings to sell tickets at
the Kennedy Center to go see Hamilton at the Kennedy Center.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
That was supposed to be twenty twenty six.
Speaker 4 (11:15):
Hamilton was going to be at the Kennedy Center and
lin Manuel said no more.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
So that is obviously going to hurt your ticket sales. Yes,
this isn't helpful.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
And look, we talked about Trump's name on the outside.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
This is hurting artists and everybody who works at that place.
When ticket sales go down, people are losing jobs, and
a lot of those musicians are not playing to sold
out crowds and not making the money they're used to.
Speaker 4 (11:38):
Yeah, and I will say this last line of the
letter I agree with. So I do think that this
is an important part and both sides need to acknowledge this.
Speaker 3 (11:48):
They end the letter.
Speaker 4 (11:49):
This institution remains dedicated to the excellence and accessibility for
generations to come, and we will not yield to the
pressure tactics being directed at us from political performers on
our stages. True artists perform for everyone, regardless of the
political affiliation of audience members.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
Do you agree with that?
Speaker 2 (12:09):
If they would have handed us this letter for notes,
there are certain sections to cross out, and there are
certain sections we wouldn't have touched because it makes a
good point.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
That is right exactly.
Speaker 2 (12:19):
Let's have that conversation. Let's talk about that. Let's talk
about it.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
As an artist. Can you have a personal Can you
make a personal statement? Should you at all? Should it matter?
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Yes, if it's in your heart, fine, But how can
you argue haven't we done this? So?
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Hell? What? It just sounds crazy?
Speaker 2 (12:36):
Johnny Cash, he wouldn't perform for freaking prisoners, Like, how
do you make a distinction, like you're not worthy or
I'm not going to participate because you don't deserve my
art or access to it or for whatever political it's art?
Speaker 1 (12:49):
Right? Is this that the beauty of it are supposed
to be the point?
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Music, visual performance.
Speaker 4 (12:53):
It's all supposed to unite or bring us together a
shared experience, no matter what language we speak, no matter
what political affiliation we have, who we voted for, what
we think about whatever, that is supposed to be uniting.
So it's so sad to see the arts being used divisively.
Speaker 2 (13:10):
Well we talk, Yes, that was the letter part. There's
also some legislation floating around out there. Yes, folks, they
are introducing bills in Congress. They don't even want Trump
to be able to put his name on a damn
park bench. We'll explain what that's about. Stay here, all right, folks.
(13:36):
We continue on this Sunday, December twenty eighth, with all
that's going on around the jay No excuse me, let
me get it right to Donald J.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
Trump. John F.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
Kennedy Memorial Center for the Performing Arts, Center for the
Performing Arts, Okay, that's what I didn't realize. It's such
a mouthful these days. But Robes, there's some We got
a bunch of bills, okay, lawsuits and legislation. There's a
law suit at least that one Ohio congresswoman has put
out there that she wants to take his name down.
(14:06):
That's a lawsuit essentially saying he doesn't have the right
to do this, it should come down.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
Then we got at least two pieces of legislation.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
Voting around where they're trying to prevent Trump from putting
his name on anything else.
Speaker 3 (14:17):
That's right.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
Maryland Democratic Congresswoman April McLain Delaney, she's actually introduced two
bills in the House. The first one is called the
Kennedy Center Protection Act, so that would void the board's
vote to put Trump's name out there and mandate the
removal of Trump's name from all signage. And then she
also this is the big one. She's put out this legislation.
(14:41):
It's called the Federal Property Integrity Act, and that would
prohibit renaming federal assets of any kind after sitting presidents.
Speaker 3 (14:51):
That makes a lot of sense.
Speaker 4 (14:52):
And Bernie Sanders then followed through in the Senate and said,
I will be introducing legislation prohibiting the naming of federal
buildings after sitting president. So there'll be a parallel bill
in the Senate that is much like the House one
that says, hey, if you are sitting president, you don't
get to name things after yourself, period. And he started
Britty Sanders put this out on X and he said,
(15:13):
what arrogance, what narcissism.
Speaker 3 (15:15):
He added that, but what.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
A shame we have to write that bill. We need
laws to tell a sitting president not to put his
name on federal buildings. We never thought we would need that.
I don't know what's next, but it's I can't believe
of all places he would have put his name up,
that one feels especially like I actually googled this morning
to see if the JFK Eternal flame was still going.
Speaker 1 (15:40):
I swear to god I did. This. Is that guy
JFK like, who has an ego.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
Big enough that they think they can put their name
in front of JFKs and not.
Speaker 4 (15:52):
Just think it, but actually do it and have everything
ready to go hours after a board you appointed said
you could, Yeah, we know who the I really think
he might be one of the only people in the
world who would feel fully confident and entitled to do
so well, and he did it.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Can you imagine Barack Obama, I want to rename Mlkday
the Obama Mlkday. It's gonna be a new federal holiday.
Speaker 4 (16:16):
What honestly, I mean, he's basically his birthday, which is
Flag Day. I'm waiting for that now to become a
national holiday, because already now you get the free park
admission national Can he name a federal holiday for his
birthday and claim it's for Flag Day?
Speaker 3 (16:33):
In quotes?
Speaker 2 (16:34):
I just said no and laughed at myself because we
say no, he can't do that, and he keeps doing stuff.
By the way, it is not by our account, but
by every legal scholar who was looking at the law
says he cannot legally change the name of the building.
Now he has an officially, legally he can't. Then there
was a question of could he put the signage even up,
(16:55):
and they say, legally he can't do that either because
of a specific language in the law that says no
plan So memorials of any kind yet be added up
in the place. Are they going to argue it's not
a plaque, it's not really a memorial. It's not really
a name to somebody else.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (17:09):
How do you enforce that? I agree with you. I
have looked.
Speaker 4 (17:12):
There is not one person who says what President Trump
is done is legal, not one.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
You can't even put your whole the whole.
Speaker 4 (17:20):
Point of the Kennedy Center Board is that it was
supposed to be and had been up until now, bipartisan.
You can't just wipe out the whole board and put
all people.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
So you can't. That's illegal, too, said you can't.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
Yes, well okay.
Speaker 4 (17:32):
The point being is yes he did, and he yes,
I can. Okay, okay, but okay, so it's illegal. How
do you then enforce it? He's the commander in chief?
Speaker 3 (17:41):
What do you do? That's the point. You can't. Can
you enforce it?
Speaker 2 (17:45):
What somebody has to send in the military to protect
a construction worker who was taking down the D and
the O and the.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
N and the I don't know.
Speaker 4 (17:56):
This is fascinating to see what happens. I mean, people
will be studying this period in our country for generations
to come.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
Okay, can we sleep first and then get to that part?
All right?
Speaker 2 (18:09):
Folks, Well, we always appreciate you spending some time with us.
This is another fascinating but certainly sad this one. You
know what stung most Maria Schreiver. Yeah, her that tweet.
She sent a long kind of explaining that it's stung.
This is her family member, this is their memorial. This
is you equated it to putting your name on somebody's
(18:29):
tombstone above theirs.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
It's exactly what it feels like.
Speaker 4 (18:36):
And yes, and I appreciate the Kennedy's have been outspoken
but respectful, and I think that's at least some decorum
has been taking place.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
Wow, that should be That should be your slogan. What'd
you just say? Outspoken but respectful. That's that's every That
should be your campaign slogan. Hey, we're going to be
outspoken but respectful, and all we.
Speaker 3 (18:58):
Do would not be wonderful folks.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
All right, well, we.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
Always appreciate you listening to us, folks. For my dear
Amy Robock, I am T J.
Speaker 1 (19:05):
Holmes. We will talk to also
Hosts And Creators
Amy Robach
T.J. Holmes
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Bobby Bones Show
Listen to 'The Bobby Bones Show' by downloading the daily full replay.