December 2, 2025 • 48 mins
Monique Samuels is back on Lip Service opening up like never before.
She breaks down the truth behind her divorce, the leaked viral video, navigating toxic co-parenting, and why she finally stopped protecting everyone but herself. Monique also talks about returning to Real Housewives of Potomac, healing through therapy and plant medicine, and what inspired her powerful new memoir Love Letters from Versions of Myself.
This is a raw, emotional conversation about self-worth, survival, and finding peace on your own terms.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Yes, it's Lip Server sided Antela yee.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
I'm Gg Maguire, Geordie George, and I'm Annie Samuel.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Yes, ladies and gentlemen, she is back. Y'all know I
love Real Housewives and Potomac. So I'm glad to see
you back on the show on your term. Thank you.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Yes, it feels good to be back.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Yeah, and your energy is like everybody's like, she's so
zen like now and I'm bothered. You know what I thought? Initially,
I was like when you first go on a show,
you learn a lot, like in retrospect when you are
like I should have did this, and like, like you said,
you know, how you react is how you react, but
you have to kind of like learn how to I guess,
(00:42):
you know, come across the way you are.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
You know. It was it was interesting because I was
so emotionally wired and I was also not as emotionally
like intelligent as I thought I was, and I had
so much on my plate that adding reality TV into
it at that time, I just didn't see it coming
and I really needed to take a step back and
just like.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
I'm like, who am I Like? What is going on?
Speaker 2 (01:08):
And I thought that I had such great control over
myself and my identity.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
But absolutely not. I said. I always say they're gonna
put you in positions like where you normally in real
life you wouldn't be in that position, but they'll place
you here, and they're like, go yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
And I felt like I always had to explain myself,
like I always had something to prove, and I'm just like, no,
it didn't happen like this. It happened like that. And
I'm in a place now where I'm so rooted in
who i am after doing all the work that I've
done on myself that i don't have anything to prove
to anybody. And I'm actually standing in my transparency and
authenticity in a way that I won't allow any shame, judgment,
(01:45):
or guilt put me in a place where I'm shaming
myself and I'm mad at myself. It's like I'm gonna
live and I'm gonna learn, just like everybody else.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
You know. I love this. You have a book coming
out January four, if that's the day after my birthday.
Just put it out there, a Catcorn book, Love Letters
from Versions of Myself, a memoir of self discovery, transformation
and healing. And you really did a deep dive into
yourself to actually write this book. So I know it
(02:15):
has to be nerve wracking to know the world is
going to be reading this.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
It's nerve wracking, and it's also exciting because when I
tell you I spent four years writing this book, it
started out as just me journaling. So I needed an outlet.
I needed to feel like my voice could be heard.
And at the time, you know, going through a divorce
and everybody not knowing why because I made an image
that looked so great that when I finally was like,
(02:40):
I can't do it anymore. Even my family couldn't understand
what was going on. So I needed an outlet. I
started to journal, and at times when it felt like
really heavy, I started writing love letters to myself. Actually,
my first letter I wrote was actually to my ex husband,
and it's the letter that I wrote to him with
the intention of never giving it to him. I just
needed to get it all off my us so and
(03:01):
to this day never gave it to him. So I
realized how much of her release that was, and I said,
you know what, I'm gonna start writing these love letters
to me. And I would notice a few months down
the road would pass and I would go back and
read it, and it was exactly what I needed to
hear in that moment. So I just kept it going
and I was like, you know what, this can be
a book.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Yeah, yeah, it is. We're going to get somewhere into that.
But first I want to talk about something that went
viral recently. Yes, okay, so you like, I'm listen because
I haven't seen you talk about this yet. Yep. But
there was some pictures of you and and you did
radio radio sisters, and I remember when you said this
was going to be a you know, you announced that
you were leaving in DCWPGC. Yep.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Oh okay, so this is the last time that you
will be tapping in with me. Today is my last
day as co host on Good Morning Show. I've been
crying all morning. I decided about a month ago, and
I had a very difficult conversation with my team, my
(04:03):
tribe about three weeks ago, and I let them know
that I decided to officially resign as co host.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
On a good morning show.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
I finally just made the decision that I need to
do with best for myself and my children.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Yep. And that was a big deal. Because it was
something that you loved doing, but you wanted to focus
on family and other things and bet on yourself. And
I know how that feels too, I'm betting on yourself.
But then recently these pictures and videos and mergy of
you and your former co host Jason, and it looked
like you guys were hugged up and people were like, Oh,
he's married, what's going on here? So what was that
(04:38):
all about?
Speaker 2 (04:39):
So first, so much and I'm an unpack it as
easily and as neatly as possible. So when I was
going through the divorce, I was separated but still living
in the same house. Jason and I were like great friends,
Like we never spent any time outside the studio, nothing
like that. As I was going through the whole divorce process,
(05:01):
the separation, everything like that, he was giving me this
advice that I was like, you have to have been
through something to be able to give me this type
of advice. We started to have like an amazing friendship
outside of work, and I started to learn some things
about what he was going through. So we connected on
that level. Him being separated living in the same house,
but people not knowing because obviously he's not you know,
(05:22):
out there like that in reality TV space. Mine was
more public and it was a friendship that was genuinely
a friendship that turned very emotionally connected and then it
turned romantic. And the reason this video is out there
right now is because my ex husband actually leaked.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
At whooh yeah, my goodness.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
Yeah, like legit. He has been showing this video to everybody.
And the bigger question is how did he get it?
Speaker 1 (05:50):
So off the cloud? The cloud?
Speaker 2 (05:52):
No, he actually got it from a former friend of
mine who you know, when you go through divorce, you
lose some friends, you lose some family. It was it
blew my mind. So for whatever reason, yes, for whatever reason,
this particular former friend, we were cool and then it
was just like and she was the only person that
I was sharing this information with her and my mom,
(06:14):
and she ended up giving it to him and he
used it as an intimidation tactic because he did not
want me back on reality TV. He's afraid of my
book coming out, so he has been showing it. So people,
like in a reality TV world on social media, they
think they know who he is, but he's a completely
different person thanks to me. People think that he is.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
What her because you know, the family life to appair
perfect than did a good job. Thank you and to
my so interesting because I feel like you've taken even
in this book. It's not like you dragged him at all.
There was a couple of truths that you have that
I feel like you expressed in a way that you
(06:55):
weren't blaming him for the way that things transpired. Yeah,
it was just he was never going to be the
person that you thought he would grow to be.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Yes, a lot of times women married potential and men
marry and want to stay the same, you know, and
it was that mixed up. And I was like, look,
it's not fair for me to keep you in this position,
like be who you are, but who you are is
just not where I want to be anymore. I'm evolved,
I'm growing. So it just got really nasty recently.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
I can't believe.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
Yeah, so there's a friend that's been on the show Cookie.
She and I stopped talking years ago.
Speaker 1 (07:32):
Cookie listen.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
And it's really interesting because it initially got leaked on
one of her very well known fake Twitter pages. So yeah,
everybody knows I can show girl. I know so much already,
so much came out, but you know what's crazy. He
tried to use that video to intimidate me from coming back,
and I got to the point where I was like,
you know what, whatever, like do what you gonna do.
(07:56):
So it was always like then it was like, well,
I ain't gonna do that you the mother and my child.
I ain't gonna do that the mother my children. But
then he still did it. But then he was even
intimidating the other parties, reached out on Instagram dms like
call me, I need to talk, and then threatening I'm
gonna put this out on social media. So this wasn't
a surprise.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
It was just didn't know when.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
But it wasn't in the video is two years years ago?
Speaker 1 (08:18):
Yeah, because I said that's what people were saying. So
he was going through his own separation at home while
you were going through what you were going through. That
is wild. And then you left the show last year.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
Yeah, I quit because I so my children. Now I'm
really getting into it. My children were not dealing with
the on and off again, week on, week off living arrangements.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
And they really needed me.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
My children are homeschool so I was literally getting up
at three in the morning going to work and then
coming back on my week having to homeschool them, I
miss listen all of that, go to bed at like
nine o'clock at night to do it again, and I
felt like I just couldn't get ahead of the schedule.
And when I tell you, out of all the jobs
I've ever had, that was the one I did not
(09:04):
want to walk away from, I loved radio. So yeah,
I made the decision. And I was like, you know what,
I'm not gonna be able to do this anymore.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
But you want a different time slot, baby, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
I really, I really want to make it work. But
my children they're at an age where they really needed me.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
And uh.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
And it was funny because once again he started this
whole rumor that I got fired. I know, it's just insane,
and it's been a lot because I actually this is
the first time I'm really putting it out there, because
he has done so much in the neighborhood, in the
streets of Potomac, and anybody that lives in Potomac that
(09:41):
has cross paths with him knows exactly what I'm saying.
Within five minutes, he will pull out his phone. My
kids even said that he has a whole folder with
screen shops and pictures of me, and at one point
it's been bad and to the point where he would
even tell me I got eyes on you.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
It's you focus on it, Like, how does it go
from we were in love to like, do you hate me?
You know what I mean? Like, what is that about?
Because I and even watching Real Housewives and seeing like
we've all seen this is kind of part of the
storyline is Stacy. People are saying that she's dating him
(10:21):
or whatever happens, she dated him and You're like, I
don't care. You haven't been together for two years and
you really seem genuinely like I literally don't care.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
I'm like, are you good with kids?
Speaker 1 (10:30):
Very much.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
Like she got a nine year old daughter. Okay, if
y'all dating, cool, the kids can't have a play date.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
When I said, you know you're when you are honestly like,
I wish you well.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
Yeah, and I really I really do wish him well.
But I will also wish for him to leave me alone.
It's like, let me live my life. You're living your life.
You're dating and doing whatever you want to do. And
what's crazy is I'm not even dating. I'm not even
to that point yet. And honestly, the way things are
paying out even with that, it's like, I would even
hate to bring somebody into a situation where he's acting
(11:02):
the way he's acting and we're trying to co parent,
you know's yeah, it's.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
A lot, and how is navigating co parenting? Who a lot? O?
Speaker 2 (11:11):
MG, Like it's gotten even worse. And what's interesting is
I stayed pretty quiet and I tried my best not
to bash because I didn't want it to affect our
co parenting. And he got to the point where he
started saying very inappropriate things to the children. He told
the children about the video that y'all saw, He actually
(11:33):
described it to them, And I'm like, why are you
telling At the time they were eleven, nine and six,
why are you telling children these crazy twisting The narrative
of why the marriage ended made it like, oh, your
mam was having an affair and she was cheating.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
No accountability, sir, no sense, like because you know, it's
one thing, like you took accountability for why things maybe
on your end, right, But he hasn't been able to
face the fact that you talk about the lack of affection,
the lack of intimacy. There was even one prayer in
a book where things did get physical that you described
on one occasion. Yeah, in the book that felt scary,
(12:09):
but witnesses were there, Yeah, to actually see him basically
lift you up by your throat. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
And it's crazy because I think what had me the
most was me rationalizing things afterward, you know, and it's like, well, well,
I did kind of it on I did kind of
instigate it, and it's just like, all right, I'm gonna
just let it go. And when you're in a marriage
and when you've seen it growing up, it's almost like yo,
like this is normal, Like okay, we'll get over it.
(12:38):
And that was one of the biggest things that led
me to get to that point where I was like,
you know what, I can't do this anymore. When I
started to think about the fact that my children are
witnessing me have behavior that's opposite of what I preached
to them, which is self love, and they're watching me
run myself and deplete myself into the dirt, and this
is being allowed, you know. And I felt like I
(12:59):
just had to keep proving myself and proving myself and
I'm like, wait, but we're married, why should I have
to prove myself to a person, you know, and we're
supposed to be equal, so it was just it's just
been a very difficult situation.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
But the reason why I speak out.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
And I'm talking more and more about it now is
because I felt so alone going through it. I didn't
realize that there were other people that had the same
experience until I started talking more about it, and then
I would have women dm me that are like all
age groups. They're like, what you're saying, you're describing exactly
how my marriage is. I thought I was the only one,
(13:35):
and that was the push for me to just you know,
I'm like, I can't keep remaining silent and protecting you know.
I feel like as black women, we're just rooted to
protect black men, but black.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Men got to step up too. We're downplaying what happened
to you so that it doesn't harm him or what
he has going on. And it's like there's even one
part where you talk about how and listen you way
for if the full book is out, so you can
read it innoc entiety, so don't worry. It's a lot
more to it. But you even talk about this scene
(14:07):
where you know you got into it on the show
and behind the scenes he was like, yeah, babe, you
you know you did that, and then on camera he
was like completely completely different and not having your back
in any way. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
And then when so when people see me react, they're
not realizing why I'm reacting that way. They're like, oh,
you being mean, Na, Chris, Oh you're being And I'm like,
y'all don't know what just happened right before these cameras
went up, or y'all don't know what was edited out
that caused me to have that reaction. And it's like,
it's like, paint a picture as if I'm this terrible
wife if you want to. But even as of this year,
(14:38):
you're still running around trying to bash me, trying to
you know, you're bitter, and it's just like, dude, like,
get over it.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
Did he want to get divorced when you brought it up?
Because I know you said that you would never bring
it up until the day that you were finally like, yeah,
let's get divorced.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
He would use it as a like, as a weapon
because he didn't believe that you would.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
He ain't really gonna do.
Speaker 2 (14:58):
It, even up until the point that we got divorced.
He told that same friend, former friend. He told her
after the divorce was finalized, and the judge was like,
all right, you know done. He told her, Well, you
know I read that you can have like maybe like
two months after the divorce is finalized to change your mind.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
And she's like she looked at him, like she's not
changing her mind, you know. So you know I wish
him well.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Like I said, at this point, you know, co parenting
has gotten so bad. I'm like, what am I protecting?
You know, It's like you want to be mad at me.
You're gonna stay mad at me. There's nothing I can
do about that. And all I need to do is
focus on my kids. That's what I've been focusing on
and doing whatever I can to support my children.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Yeah. No, listen, and thank goodness you've been doing the
work on yourself, because imagine if this would have been Monique,
you know, five years ago, what that would have been
like because of the same meanthustics that you are with
the clarity you have today, and you did go and
get therapy. Absolutely, so I want to talk about that
because all through this book it's giving I see the
(16:03):
last journey of what it is that you've learned on
this journey. Thank you.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Yes, therapy was so important. The first thing was like,
you normalize things right when you're growing up, and then
you grow up and get married and everything is normal
because you saw it when you were a kid. I
didn't realize that I had childhood trauma. Like my therapist
was listening to me retell stories and her mouth just
dropped and she was like, that's not normal, Like how
(16:28):
did you feel about that in that moment, I'm like,
I didn't feel anything.
Speaker 1 (16:31):
Yeah, it was regular. She was like, no, it's not.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
And it was like once she started pointing out how
I was responding to the situation, she said, you have
emotionally turned off. That's why you don't feel anything. And
let me tell you when I started to let myself
feel the feelings, Oh my goodness. That was chapter six.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
She's dying.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
I went through it. I had to purge all. Like
people think about healing and they think it's so great
to heal, it's not because you have to revisit everything
that has traumatized you, you know, and through therapy and
through journaling, through just being outside of nature.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Ayahuasca, Oh, yes, ayahuasca. I want to ask about the.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
Golden Teachers, still ecitement whatever. It's like, they really help
you to speed track the healing, but you still have
to go through the process. And that's why so many
people don't heal.
Speaker 1 (17:22):
Tell me about the ayahuasca because this is something that
we said years No, no, Jordan, you haven't either, because
I want to do it, but I'm also nervous and
I know you have to have like a shaman and yeah,
you know it.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
And I'm not nervous. I just haven't had the opportunity yet.
Well okay, but I wasn't able to go.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
So if you go, I have a place that I
went to that I can definitely give you. I researched
for a year before I actually took the journey and
went on the trip. And where did you go? I
went to Costa Rica and there there was a small group.
So I will not do the ones where it's a
bunch of people because that's a lot of energy experienced,
you know. So I did one that was very small
(17:59):
and intimate, and they had the shamans. The shamans weren't
people who just said, oh I love this, let me
just start my own practice. They've actually been rooted in
plant medicine since they it's a part of their generational line,
so they just were raised up in it, and I
felt very comfortable and it is amazing.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
It literally is like.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
The best way I can describe by aauasca is like
you're you're going through a tunnel and then you hit
a wall, and most people will try to figure out
how to get around that wall, and they might chisel
at it. Ayahuasca's gonna knock it down. So when it
goes into your body, it searches for your trauma blocks
because every time you've experienced anything traumatic, you store it
(18:45):
in your body somewhere. So the ayahuasca finds it and
it punches it down like with no mercy. So it's
best for you to just say, Okay, we're in this together,
like don't fight it, because then you're going to have
a hard time. So when you are basically just like okay,
let's deal with it. For me, it was like I
was watching my life on a movie screen. Like it
(19:05):
was as if I was sitting and I'm watching me
to the point where I'm remembering things that I didn't
even remember when I was there, things that were years ago.
I can see exactly what clothes I had on, how
my hair was like. It was incredibly intense, and it
allowed me to push those feelings in that blockage right
out the way, like right away. So in the way
(19:27):
that this particular company did it, they had breakdown sessions
where you were able to kind of talk about it.
They give you a chance to just kind of like
sit with yourself and process what you just experienced. And
I did like a five day so we did actually
like three ceremonies and it was incredible, Like for me,
it really changed my life. It actually put me in
a place of gratitude for where I was going through
(19:49):
my divorce with my ex husband. Even where I felt
let down by him, I was grateful to him and
I focused on what I was grateful about. If it
wasn't for him, I wouldn't even be in a position
to even open my eyes. He pushed me to that
limit to make me set those boundaries right before him.
I had no boundaries. So it was really it was
(20:11):
really deep.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
It was good. I loved it. It was great for me.
Like I'm sold listen, It's something that I always hear about.
I've always wanted to do. But of course I want
to have a good experience. Yeah, you know what I
do it, but I know it's also not like a
good fun experience and yeah, but I also know it
is life changing. They always say, yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
You have so many companies that are like popping up
and just doing them because they had a good time
or they are like, oh, this is a good money maker.
So you have to just watch out and make sure
that the ones you're going to are actual shamans who
have been raised in plant medicine. So but yeah, but
it's speed tracks. You're healing, so it will put you
on a path something that could have taken you ten
years to process and get over. You're going to process
(20:54):
it and it takes.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
You ten years.
Speaker 2 (20:57):
To find it during the long time ago.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
No, yeah, and even being married for ten years. I
think it's interesting because I always hear people say like
after marriage sometimes like the intimacy can be harder. I
want to ask you, like, when you first were together,
do you feel like it was good and then it
got worse or was it always something that you felt
like the intimacy wasn't where you needed it to be,
but you thought you would work up to it and
(21:22):
they would improve me. I thought it was going to improve. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
We actually it's so funny. We used to tell this
story to people that were close to us. But we
had one of our worst arguments on our honeymoon, and
that was the first sign.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
Wow. Yeah on our honeymoon.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Because I don't know what type of delusion I was in,
but I expected, all of a sudden, now we're married,
that he would be this like romantic person. And we
were sitting in the Maldives and I remember I was
so upset with him and I was like, you're treating
me like I'm one of the homies, Like there's no affection,
there's no like catering to me. You want me to
(21:55):
just cater to you. And we got into a bad argument.
We sent at the dinner take money of his on
the honeymoon, and we were able to kind of work
through it. But working through it was always me having
to just like push down my feelings right and just
like like all right, I guess it ain't a big deal,
and then move past it when it really was a
big deal.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Yeah. My mom said, the first time you heard my
dad yeo was their wedding day. Wow. She was like, oh,
that was yeah. She was like, that was an indication
right there that it wasn't gonna be what I thought
it would. Yeah, we I.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Ignored so many reflects.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
But you really wanted to be married? Where did that
come from?
Speaker 2 (22:32):
Growing up in a household with two parents, and because
both of my parents they they struggled. I mean, they
would have flat out arguments and don't if you saw
in the book, I detailed one and when I tell
you I was going to really kill your mother. Yeah,
I really thought in my mind, because I'm young, I'm
thinking that this just happens and people get past it
(22:54):
and they get over it. And yeah, so I always
wanted to be married. I did go through it time
where I was just like, I don't want to be
married when my parents got divorced, because I just felt like,
if y'all been through all of that and I witnessed
all of that, why are y'all divorcing now? And then
years later, here I am getting married and finding myself
in so many of the same situations I witnessed when
(23:15):
I was growing up. Maybe not as intense, but still
it's like, you know, just reinventing the wheel or reliving
the wheel that was there interesting oh.
Speaker 1 (23:24):
Go ahead. Do you think you would marry again?
Speaker 2 (23:27):
I would, but I don't necessarily think it has to
be like married on paper the government style, like because
after going through a divorce and realizing how much you
have to wait.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
The government for the government, Yes, it's crazy.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
And the only reason that I was able to even
get a divorced as quickly as I did is because
I just was like, I wasn't fighting him, I didn't
even have an attorney.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
I was like, I just want to be done.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
I was so miserable, I said, I want to be
done with this, like I just want my peace and
just let me go, leave me alone.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
Because divorce could be so ugly when people are the
terms and get every teen going back and forth. And
then also to know what you deserve, because sometimes people
try to make it seem like, well he had this
career and he did this, why does she deserve But
sometimes we make a lot of sacrifices. Yes, because you know,
raising three kids is a full time job, and master
you paid nannies and paid yeah, you know people to
(24:21):
do those things. How much that would end up being
And then there's things that you wanted to do, like
you said you didn't want to give up radio. But
at the same time, you're homeschooling your kids, you want
to make sure you're there three children at home. He
wasn't going to say, will let me you know, sacrifice?
Speaker 2 (24:36):
No, no, and no child support, no nothing. I didn't
want anything. I was like, I just I wanted to
be I don't want to be free. I wanted to
be free. I really did, and I still do. It's like,
you know, now things is changing because I'm like, you know,
we're having to modify custody, we're having to really like
we were in court, like I'm just like, this is ridiculous.
We're going through more now being over two years divorced
(24:59):
than going through the divorce process.
Speaker 1 (25:01):
So wait, no child support? So did you get any
type of like what did they call it? Alimony? Yeah? Alimony.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
We had a prenup, so I was able to get
with the prenup a lot of which when we did
the prenup, it wasn't with the mindset of us having children.
It was like, if I didn't have children and whatever
I got with the prenup, oh that would have been fine.
I would have just walked away good. But I still
walked away and I was just like, God will figure
it out. Like you're not my source. God's my source.
(25:27):
I'm going to always be good and that's what I
just have faith in the fact that I'm always gonna
be well taken care of.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
And I've been. I left my job over a year
ago and.
Speaker 2 (25:36):
I've been good. You know, everything has been so much.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
I love that for a year.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
Yeah, listen, I'm like me and my children. Since I've
been divorced, we've been to eight different countries. We still travel.
I don't tell them know when they ask for things,
because they're great kids. And I loved that I don't
have to like second guests, like, oh do I have
to because I need to pay these bills and say
I'm like, I'm blessed and I have more than enough
and I'm good. And I think some people get mad
at that.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Yeah, well, you know, what is it like now being
back on the show on Real housewiseh Potomac because it's
different now. You know, it's been a few seasons that
you've been gone. Yes, and now I did not expect this,
you know, to have either, girl, because you have a
abbit watcher of not just me, but the entire franchise.
Speaker 3 (26:21):
Yeah, and when I heard you was coming back, I
could not wait to see what's going to happen.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
And you know, it was so like unplanned, it was
very unexpected. Like literally they every year they asked me
back and I'd be like no, even this year, I
told them no about seven eight times. I talked to
the SVP at the production company, Lorraine and I love
and we talked and she was just like, look, I'm
(26:44):
gonna be in town next week. I don't even want
you to answer me. She said, don't say anything. She
said just think about it. And I was like, okay.
So I listened to her. And a week later I
was like, why am I not going back? Like what
is keeping me from it? I felt like I was
saying ain't no out of habit versus like reason. Yeah,
And I sat back and thought, and I was like,
(27:06):
I guess I can do it. This would be the
best way to see how much I've actually healed. Right,
But I've been so excited and even though there's like
drama stuff going on now, I still like I had
a great time.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
Like a lot of the job, ain't got nothing to
do because it's all like your whole situation is nothing
compared to like Aaron went to jail, Wendy. Everybody's having issues, yes, Like, look,
I'm just going through right myself is off camera. I'm like,
I'm dealing with it. It's been, it's been.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
It's been insane, but it's also been good for me
because now I'm able to go back and not feel
like I have to protect anybody cover things.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
I'm just like, I'm me, this is it. They're gonna
want you to date somebody, I'm.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
Gonna want it, but I'm gonna just force it. Look,
I ain't paying for the I ain't hiring no.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
You know, have you formed any new friendships with the
ladies that you just met this season since you've been
filming with them.
Speaker 2 (28:08):
I wouldn't say friendships, but I've been cool with everybody.
I feel like there's potential for it. I really like
Tiya Is. At first, I was just like, what's her deal?
Speaker 1 (28:21):
You know?
Speaker 2 (28:22):
But I wasn't really around that much like you'll see
me kind of in and out because I was traveling.
I still had things that were on my schedule. I
signed a contract and they were at my house filming
the next day.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
It was they really were actually happy to have you.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
Yeah, she's a cute guy.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
You know in the last episode.
Speaker 3 (28:44):
Yeah that was female drag.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
People don't give her so fun she is, but actually
she she owns her stuff. Like one thing about Ashley,
if she's being messy, she will own that she's being messy.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
Yes, she knows what she don't care. Yeah, because that's
one thing you also learned filming, and you've talked about this,
is that you gotta do like sometimes they don't pick
up on the little things and the little conversations, but
when you do something wild, you know, that's what gets
onto the actual episode.
Speaker 2 (29:19):
Absolutely absolutely, and you never know. Like filming is fun,
it's once they edit it and they create whatever, then
it's like, wait, what about when I said this?
Speaker 1 (29:28):
So what about that? You know?
Speaker 2 (29:29):
But but now I look at it from a different lens,
and like I said, I don't have to protect anything.
You know, prior when I was married. Once we're watching
the season if I said something that you know, he didn't.
Speaker 1 (29:42):
Like, and then it was like why you say that?
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Why you have to say like that? And now I
don't don't be saying d D. So now when I
film the next season, I'm second guessing myself. I'm like,
you know, it was just like the Way to the
world felt like it was on me, and I couldn't
really be me because I was afraid that I might
say the wrong.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
His image, because he's concerned about that. Yes, I forget
about the reality because that can actually help you heal too. Absolutely.
You know, people talk about the reasons why relationships don't work,
and they always say one of the top reasons is finances. Adultery,
of course is always up there too, you know, intimacy,
things like that, what would you say for you was
(30:19):
the top reason if you have to say, like this
was the number one reason why we couldn't connect.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
I felt like I was being used, Like I didn't
feel like I was really being like appreciated for what
I bought, what I brought to the relationship. And then
he didn't feel like he was being appreciated for what
he brought. He looked at it as well, I'm I'm
paying for everything that's providing, and I'm looking at him like,
but you're not, like I don't even know you something
(30:47):
you're not nursuring.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
Sometimes it's form of control too, like where people are
like I'm financially providing and that should be enough. Do
what I say. Yeah, And that was definitely the case.
Speaker 2 (30:57):
It was like if we got into an argue, it
would be because I'm expressing like my feelings on something
and expecting that emotional covering. But it was like me
bringing up or expressing my feelings or what hurt my
feelings was like I'm being ungrateful because I pay for
all of this, right. So we just couldn't see eye
to eye. And it was a constant argument where it
(31:20):
was like, you know, he's retired, he wanted to live
life and be retired, but I'm like, but we got
three kids, yeah, you know, And I'm like, and I
felt as though because he had played football and he
made this money and we were dating for half his career,
we didn't get married until after he retired, and it
(31:41):
felt like it was always his. So I never felt
like I could actually relax and I could never just
like enjoy it with him. I could organize events and trips,
but it was like, okay, yeah, he would go along
with it, but we weren't ever together in on it.
Like it was like I was doing all the doing
and he was paying for it. Ye, So and it wasn't.
Speaker 1 (32:02):
An equal balance. It was more just you doing him
pay for it. Yeah, it is. It is.
Speaker 2 (32:11):
And when people say, like like somebody said that they
felt as though I left the marriage because of his money,
And I'm like, what sense does that make? If I
wanted his money, I would have stayed for the money.
I would have saved out here balling out, it's like,
but I didn't marry your bank account. I didn't marry
you because of what you had. I really wanted us
(32:32):
to be a power comple I wanted us to really
be able to have these deep talks. And I feel
like a wall went up with him once we got married,
almost like I can't be vulnerable anymore because I have
to be the man.
Speaker 1 (32:44):
Do you think it bothered him to not be doing
for playing football anymore? Absolutely, because that's part of it
too for a lot of professional athletes. You know, He's
used to being celebrated in that way for that and
then now I'm not doing this anymore. Yeah, And I
know that's an adjustment for somebody to make. Also, Yeah,
there was a lot of I mean it was depression.
It was depression, Like pretty much our whole marriage, there
(33:06):
was depression and it was like towards the end is
when he really accepted it, but by that time I
was done, and then it was still like yes, like
I don't.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
I tried to pull him along as much as I
could in every way, and it was like, there was
nothing else I could do for you, And why am
I saving you? Why am I having to fix you?
And I don't think that that's fair to either one
of us.
Speaker 4 (33:31):
Especially feelings about he's used to being the household name
and that kind of shifted when you had your own
public persona. How did he react to that?
Speaker 2 (33:41):
You know, it's interesting because on the outside he was
always very excited about it, like, yeah, my wife, you
know this, that and the other.
Speaker 1 (33:48):
She's a star.
Speaker 2 (33:50):
But it makes me wonder if that was just what
you were saying. But what did you really feel? And
did you ever tell you he was proud of you.
He was saved in front of other people.
Speaker 1 (34:00):
But not in an intimate setting. We're in a private setting.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
No, we barely talked towards the end, like we barely
talk like when I did that second on reality show
Love and Marriage DC.
Speaker 1 (34:10):
The most the more. The most we talked was actually camera,
which was terrible being married or being in a relationship
and being lonelier than you would be if you were single,
because that is the worst. People always are you single.
You thish you that you listen, I would rather be
single than married and still alone and married and miserable.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
I have chills right now while you're saying that, because
you just took me back to a space where I
remember sitting on the couch and I'm literally sitting next
to him, and i am crying, and I'm like, i
have never felt so lonely and I'm literally sitting right
next to you. It was like we just I was
trying to find different ways of connection, and I felt
like I was always.
Speaker 1 (34:49):
The one trying. And then, you know.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
I just feel like he really did the best that
he could, you know, like I don't, I'm not. It
was like that was what he could gift based on
how he was brought up, based on the emotional connections
that he had with his own family and parents and
things like that, and he was doing in his mind,
he's doing better than what his parents did.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
Did he ever do therapy or did you suggest it?
Or yeah, oh we did everything. We tried.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
We really did. We really did try. We did We've
seen so many therapists, And wasn't.
Speaker 3 (35:24):
That something that you brought to him like maybe we
should talk to somebody, maybe we should seek therapy, yes,
to try to work on things. And was he initially
accepted of it because you know, black men feel like
they can't tell people their business. They feel like they
can't sit down in front of somebody and really be open, and.
Speaker 1 (35:38):
They feel like people take a side to that.
Speaker 3 (35:39):
Yeah, So was that something that when you brought it
to him, did he fight kind of about it or
was he agreeing?
Speaker 2 (35:44):
He didn't fight, He was like, all right, let's do
do it. He was always, let me tell you, he
was always down. Like if I brought something to him,
it was always like okay for the most part, but
it was like I was just like, okay, can you
make some suggestions?
Speaker 1 (35:59):
Can you put for it more effort? Right? Right?
Speaker 2 (36:02):
So yeah, so he definitely he would take part in it.
But that ended up being even interesting because it would
be a situation that he would he might bring up
in therapy something that we actually went through work through,
and I could have been the one that was wrong, right,
and then we would work through it, and then I
wouldn't do that thing anymore. And but then when we
(36:23):
go to therapy, he would bring that up. We passed that,
figure that out. I was like, I was like, wait,
did we solve it. He's like, well, yeah, I've done
it again.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
Yeah, let it go. He was like yes.
Speaker 2 (36:38):
It was like if I bring up a current situation,
you got an old one back in your back pocket
that you want to bring right And I'm like, no,
this is worse.
Speaker 1 (36:48):
When it happens. And we did that and he don't
bring it back up.
Speaker 3 (36:51):
Now.
Speaker 1 (36:52):
I want to ask you a couple of things about
the show. All right, So what are your thoughts about
what Wendy is going through right now? Oh my goodness. First,
I know I can't talk while you weren't on the show,
but it seems like you guys be connected and are
finding your way into friendship. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (37:07):
First of all, any when you are on reality TV,
I mean, people are going to make whatever out of nothing,
and we don't know what her side of the story is,
we don't know what Eddie's side of the story is.
And just looking at the whole circus, with the whole
like press conference and all of the its just something
about it just seems really off, And I'm always a
(37:30):
little hesitant to make any type of judgments when you
have a predominantly like black family living in a predominantly
like white neighborhood, because it just feels like, I'm like,
there's something that's missing here, you know.
Speaker 1 (37:44):
I felt that when she was saying, we didn't like
have fake credit cards, we just gave different names so
protect yeah, to get delivered to. And they were like ridiculous. Yeah,
so it wasn't So I can see that because sometimes
people don't want to give right right.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
Because we I mean, when I was still living in
Poton with my ex, we would have people literally roll
up to our house knocking on our door asking for
jobs or asking for like literally so people like public
knowledge exactly. So it's like, yeah, I can see why
you would have an alias for delivery.
Speaker 1 (38:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (38:17):
So I feel like it sucks because there it's like
they're being put on public display for everybody else's judgment
and we still haven't heard what their signed nothing, you know,
and like, why are y'all putting all of this? Why
is the state or whoever is behind this investigation? Why
are y'all feeding all of this to the public.
Speaker 1 (38:34):
Yeah, yeah, it's for them too, you know, they like
uh the yeah, the police department. They love press. Let's way,
don't get it off of me. I'm just saying now.
In addition to that, of course, Karen, Yeah, and I
know she did a sit down with Andy. Yeah, you know,
also talking about that. But she's home the Grand Diamonds back,
(38:57):
and I know you reached out to.
Speaker 2 (38:58):
Her, right, I reached out to her or two and
I haven't talked to her since, so yeah, I've just
I don't know, I haven't seen her, haven't talked to her.
Speaker 1 (39:07):
Really.
Speaker 2 (39:07):
She reached out to me, but it wasn't like on
a like let's get together type of deal. It was
like more like, hey, girl, who you use for your microblading?
Speaker 1 (39:17):
That's a good question, because I was like, but else,
that's good.
Speaker 2 (39:26):
I was like, I don't know, I just it kind
of like put me in a moment of just like
I just need to take a step back. That's what
I've been doing lately, the opposite of what I would
normally do. So instead of me jumping the gun and
trying to dissect with the situation, means I'm just gonna
put you on pause and just step back because I
don't want to put my own like feelings on something
(39:49):
that maybe weren't your intention.
Speaker 1 (39:51):
So when I see her, i'll see her, all right.
I want to do one of these heartworks from your buck.
It's not homework, but this is us, you know. Just
answer some a couple of questions, all right, because of
course you know with your letters to yourself, there's also
questions that you can ask yourself. Okay, So I want
to ask the ladies here what are you deeply afraid of?
(40:15):
And how have those fears affected your life and relationships
with others? Wow? Wow? Am I for you know? I'm
a daredev won't give a fuck. I don't know how
have those fears affected your life? I remember when Gigi,
you used to be like, I never want to get married.
That used to be definitely something, definitely something I used
(40:36):
to say a lot. Yeah, I'm open to it now.
You're open to it now. But what do you think
is something that you're afraid of? And how has that
affected your life and relationships with others? I think that
I'm afraid of.
Speaker 3 (40:50):
People not seeing me for who I truly am because
of the persona that I might put off with how
I speak like here and know on pain conversations, and
I'm just such like a wild car that I think
that people might not take me as serious as I
really am because they get that wild card affector from me.
But I'm very much serious about life. I'm a grown
as forty six year old woman. I'm a mother, you know,
(41:10):
and I do care. I know I come off as
just as easy, breezy, go with the flow, but I
have a strong foundation and I really do care a
lot about my friends and my family and just things
that happen in life.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
So I think I would say that that could be
something that you have vulnerability. Yeah, you don't want people
to see that, and you know and you care, but
maybe you don't let people know.
Speaker 3 (41:30):
I don't let people know as much as I probably should.
I kind of maybe put a guard up in every
in that case, you know, Yeah, what would you say,
Jordie Joey.
Speaker 2 (41:41):
Ones?
Speaker 4 (41:41):
I think my first one is irrational, which is my
greatest spirit, is my dad dying, which is inevitable. But
I just I'm scared for what that means for me.
I already lost my mom, I don't have any siblings,
and so I just I don't know if anyone is
ever gonna know me and accept me and love me
fully than him. So I think that's a fear. And
(42:03):
I think the other fear actually comes from reality TV,
where you know, they don't tell you when you go
into it what it's going to be like or how
mentally it changes you.
Speaker 1 (42:16):
And sometimes I feel like I.
Speaker 4 (42:18):
Was almost like bullied out of my personality and so
I'm still navigating that and I'm worried. I'm like, did
I really like kill myself off in that way?
Speaker 1 (42:29):
I don't know. I'm still figuring that out.
Speaker 2 (42:31):
It does kind of it forces you to abandon yourself
in some situations because you're having to like have your
subconscious mind on display when normally you reserve your comments
processing and then you'll come back it's like, no, we
got to cut to the chase because you always.
Speaker 1 (42:45):
Tell people think about I can't look like a punk too,
like when.
Speaker 2 (42:49):
This airs yea thought?
Speaker 1 (42:53):
You know.
Speaker 4 (42:55):
When you explain, right, there are certain things that aren't
even happening.
Speaker 1 (43:00):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (43:01):
I'm saying in confessionals, but it's it's on the overlay
of something else, and I'm like, that's not even what
I was talking about and then it makes you feel
crazy because you're like, did I say that?
Speaker 2 (43:10):
I don't remember saying that.
Speaker 1 (43:16):
I don't know. Hilarious, And you know, it's funny you
say that about your dad because my family was over
for the holidays and my dad is getting older, his
knees is messed up. He was walking so slow, you
know up and I'm not used to that, you know,
So that's a real thought, like jesh, that's you know,
that's going to be a crazy thing. And then I
(43:37):
know you how close to you when your father are
absolutely so I can't imagine that. Man, I would say,
for me, what's something that I'm scared of? I think
that a lot of times. And I was thinking about
this because I was looking at this article about Buddhism.
It's random, but anyway about not explaining yourself in situations, right,
(43:58):
and so like I know in your book you talk
a lot about like and you said it on the
show that you know your circle is now dot people
around you. And there are so many people that say things,
especially like when you have a public personality that's not
true and it's like, are you going to defend yourself
against everything? But sometimes I also hate the fact that
there's these narratives that you're not correcting, but then you
(44:22):
just can't correct everything, everything, all the time. It will
drive you crazy. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (44:26):
Yeah, I'm a firm believer now that when people hear
story and they believe it and it's negative towards you,
that's how they always felt about you. They wanted to
be They wanted to be true so bad. And if
they wanted to be true, I knew, stay over there,
if that's what you want for me, stay over there,
come over here, asking you, I'm gonna tell it. I'm
(44:48):
gonna tell my story once and I'm done. Whereas back
in the day, oh my god, Like I don't.
Speaker 1 (44:57):
Even have time for that. Now, I do want to
ask this, what relationship do you and Candice have or
any at all? None at all, None at all, none
at all.
Speaker 2 (45:06):
Yeah, I just like I apologized five years ago at.
Speaker 1 (45:09):
The reunion and it was genuine.
Speaker 2 (45:11):
And it's funny because a clip of that popped up
on my reel and I was watching myself from like,
you know, like I hadn't seen it in so long,
and it was it was like they wanted me to
be crying. They wanted me to be emotional, but I
had already been all of that and they weren't there
to see it. But I was being very genuine about
my apology. But it was like because I wasn't crying
and stuff, yeah, begging for forgiveness. Nobody wanted to believe it.
(45:36):
But yeah, but I just looked at it as look,
it is what it is. It happened, I apologize for it.
I've moved on, and I hope that she has. Everybody's
in a different space now. Yeah, I'm like, I don't
wish any bad on anybody because I realized how energy works.
Now I'm like, I wish you all.
Speaker 1 (45:59):
The all of that. Man, it's interesting to see. I
cannot wait to finish watching this season because you know,
unfortunately Chris is still a character on here. They're calling
him yesterday. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (46:14):
Now, let's let's ask ourselves a question. Why is his
name being mentioned so much?
Speaker 1 (46:19):
So much?
Speaker 2 (46:20):
And then what I didn't like, and this is only
because I know this person, so it's like the whole
I don't know what y'all talking about.
Speaker 1 (46:28):
You know, exactly.
Speaker 2 (46:29):
Yeah, And then what I didn't like is like I
ain't cool with Cookie, but I was like, dang, he
just threw cookie under the bus. And she's been his
biggest mouthpiece. He completely threw it under the bus.
Speaker 1 (46:38):
She was riding for him.
Speaker 2 (46:39):
And then you say, you don't know what they're talking about.
So I'm just like, why would.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
You do that to her? They've been mentioning his name
since episode one, wait.
Speaker 2 (46:47):
Which is why they was probably so pressed for me
to come back to seron.
Speaker 3 (46:52):
What's up?
Speaker 2 (46:53):
Bothered like, that's the situation and her damn did we
even Okay?
Speaker 1 (47:02):
I feel like she walked in, turned around and walked out.
Speaker 2 (47:06):
Oh my gosh, that that that situation is just a mess.
Speaker 1 (47:09):
And I you'll see you on the next episode.
Speaker 2 (47:12):
I give I give Stacey some wise words and I
can't wait.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
Take he well, are you having fun? I am?
Speaker 2 (47:18):
Okay, Look yeah, I'm really enjoying my life right now.
Speaker 1 (47:22):
Ok yeah, I can.
Speaker 3 (47:23):
See it on you. You look very happy, You're glowing.
You lost all his weight?
Speaker 1 (47:27):
What did you do? Did you change your diet? Did
you work out?
Speaker 2 (47:29):
You know what's crazy? This is my normal weight.
Speaker 1 (47:31):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (47:32):
And every time that I've been on in the past years,
I was either just I just had a baby or
I was pregnant. So nobody actually really saw me, like
because I've been once high school. Like I just I
can't gain weight to save my life unless I'm pregnant
and I'm done having babies. So now be back to
do some squats or find a good man to give
me some happy weight.
Speaker 1 (47:52):
You plenty of people don't apply for that job. Okay,
all right, well listen, you definitely got to come back.
I will. You know. We had a great time, and
I appreciate your openness and honesty and your positive vibes
and energy. Q. I appreciate you having me here. We'll
be we'll be watching for you, girl. And don't forget
that book, Love Letters from Versions of Myself, a memoir
of self discovery, transformation, and healing. January fourth. It's not
(48:15):
we will remind you though, no.
Speaker 2 (48:16):
Word and it actually goes on pre order December seventh.
Speaker 1 (48:19):
Okay, so ordering pre order
Yes, it's Lip Server sided Antela yee.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
I'm Gg Maguire, Geordie George, and I'm Annie Samuel.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Yes, ladies and gentlemen, she is back. Y'all know I
love Real Housewives and Potomac. So I'm glad to see
you back on the show on your term. Thank you.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Yes, it feels good to be back.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Yeah, and your energy is like everybody's like, she's so
zen like now and I'm bothered. You know what I thought? Initially,
I was like when you first go on a show,
you learn a lot, like in retrospect when you are
like I should have did this, and like, like you said,
you know, how you react is how you react, but
you have to kind of like learn how to I guess,
(00:42):
you know, come across the way you are.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
You know. It was it was interesting because I was
so emotionally wired and I was also not as emotionally
like intelligent as I thought I was, and I had
so much on my plate that adding reality TV into
it at that time, I just didn't see it coming
and I really needed to take a step back and
just like.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
I'm like, who am I Like? What is going on?
Speaker 2 (01:08):
And I thought that I had such great control over
myself and my identity.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
But absolutely not. I said. I always say they're gonna
put you in positions like where you normally in real
life you wouldn't be in that position, but they'll place
you here, and they're like, go yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
And I felt like I always had to explain myself,
like I always had something to prove, and I'm just like, no,
it didn't happen like this. It happened like that. And
I'm in a place now where I'm so rooted in
who i am after doing all the work that I've
done on myself that i don't have anything to prove
to anybody. And I'm actually standing in my transparency and
authenticity in a way that I won't allow any shame, judgment,
(01:45):
or guilt put me in a place where I'm shaming
myself and I'm mad at myself. It's like I'm gonna
live and I'm gonna learn, just like everybody else.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
You know. I love this. You have a book coming
out January four, if that's the day after my birthday.
Just put it out there, a Catcorn book, Love Letters
from Versions of Myself, a memoir of self discovery, transformation
and healing. And you really did a deep dive into
yourself to actually write this book. So I know it
(02:15):
has to be nerve wracking to know the world is
going to be reading this.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
It's nerve wracking, and it's also exciting because when I
tell you I spent four years writing this book, it
started out as just me journaling. So I needed an outlet.
I needed to feel like my voice could be heard.
And at the time, you know, going through a divorce
and everybody not knowing why because I made an image
that looked so great that when I finally was like,
(02:40):
I can't do it anymore. Even my family couldn't understand
what was going on. So I needed an outlet. I
started to journal, and at times when it felt like
really heavy, I started writing love letters to myself. Actually,
my first letter I wrote was actually to my ex husband,
and it's the letter that I wrote to him with
the intention of never giving it to him. I just
needed to get it all off my us so and
(03:01):
to this day never gave it to him. So I
realized how much of her release that was, and I said,
you know what, I'm gonna start writing these love letters
to me. And I would notice a few months down
the road would pass and I would go back and
read it, and it was exactly what I needed to
hear in that moment. So I just kept it going
and I was like, you know what, this can be
a book.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Yeah, yeah, it is. We're going to get somewhere into that.
But first I want to talk about something that went
viral recently. Yes, okay, so you like, I'm listen because
I haven't seen you talk about this yet. Yep. But
there was some pictures of you and and you did
radio radio sisters, and I remember when you said this
was going to be a you know, you announced that
you were leaving in DCWPGC. Yep.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Oh okay, so this is the last time that you
will be tapping in with me. Today is my last
day as co host on Good Morning Show. I've been
crying all morning. I decided about a month ago, and
I had a very difficult conversation with my team, my
(04:03):
tribe about three weeks ago, and I let them know
that I decided to officially resign as co host.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
On a good morning show.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
I finally just made the decision that I need to
do with best for myself and my children.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Yep. And that was a big deal. Because it was
something that you loved doing, but you wanted to focus
on family and other things and bet on yourself. And
I know how that feels too, I'm betting on yourself.
But then recently these pictures and videos and mergy of
you and your former co host Jason, and it looked
like you guys were hugged up and people were like, Oh,
he's married, what's going on here? So what was that
(04:38):
all about?
Speaker 2 (04:39):
So first, so much and I'm an unpack it as
easily and as neatly as possible. So when I was
going through the divorce, I was separated but still living
in the same house. Jason and I were like great friends,
Like we never spent any time outside the studio, nothing
like that. As I was going through the whole divorce process,
(05:01):
the separation, everything like that, he was giving me this
advice that I was like, you have to have been
through something to be able to give me this type
of advice. We started to have like an amazing friendship
outside of work, and I started to learn some things
about what he was going through. So we connected on
that level. Him being separated living in the same house,
but people not knowing because obviously he's not you know,
(05:22):
out there like that in reality TV space. Mine was
more public and it was a friendship that was genuinely
a friendship that turned very emotionally connected and then it
turned romantic. And the reason this video is out there
right now is because my ex husband actually leaked.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
At whooh yeah, my goodness.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
Yeah, like legit. He has been showing this video to everybody.
And the bigger question is how did he get it?
Speaker 1 (05:50):
So off the cloud? The cloud?
Speaker 2 (05:52):
No, he actually got it from a former friend of
mine who you know, when you go through divorce, you
lose some friends, you lose some family. It was it
blew my mind. So for whatever reason, yes, for whatever reason,
this particular former friend, we were cool and then it
was just like and she was the only person that
I was sharing this information with her and my mom,
(06:14):
and she ended up giving it to him and he
used it as an intimidation tactic because he did not
want me back on reality TV. He's afraid of my
book coming out, so he has been showing it. So people,
like in a reality TV world on social media, they
think they know who he is, but he's a completely
different person thanks to me. People think that he is.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
What her because you know, the family life to appair
perfect than did a good job. Thank you and to
my so interesting because I feel like you've taken even
in this book. It's not like you dragged him at all.
There was a couple of truths that you have that
I feel like you expressed in a way that you
(06:55):
weren't blaming him for the way that things transpired. Yeah,
it was just he was never going to be the
person that you thought he would grow to be.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Yes, a lot of times women married potential and men
marry and want to stay the same, you know, and
it was that mixed up. And I was like, look,
it's not fair for me to keep you in this position,
like be who you are, but who you are is
just not where I want to be anymore. I'm evolved,
I'm growing. So it just got really nasty recently.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
I can't believe.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
Yeah, so there's a friend that's been on the show Cookie.
She and I stopped talking years ago.
Speaker 1 (07:32):
Cookie listen.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
And it's really interesting because it initially got leaked on
one of her very well known fake Twitter pages. So yeah,
everybody knows I can show girl. I know so much already,
so much came out, but you know what's crazy. He
tried to use that video to intimidate me from coming back,
and I got to the point where I was like,
you know what, whatever, like do what you gonna do.
(07:56):
So it was always like then it was like, well,
I ain't gonna do that you the mother and my child.
I ain't gonna do that the mother my children. But
then he still did it. But then he was even
intimidating the other parties, reached out on Instagram dms like
call me, I need to talk, and then threatening I'm
gonna put this out on social media. So this wasn't
a surprise.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
It was just didn't know when.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
But it wasn't in the video is two years years ago?
Speaker 1 (08:18):
Yeah, because I said that's what people were saying. So
he was going through his own separation at home while
you were going through what you were going through. That
is wild. And then you left the show last year.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
Yeah, I quit because I so my children. Now I'm
really getting into it. My children were not dealing with
the on and off again, week on, week off living arrangements.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
And they really needed me.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
My children are homeschool so I was literally getting up
at three in the morning going to work and then
coming back on my week having to homeschool them, I
miss listen all of that, go to bed at like
nine o'clock at night to do it again, and I
felt like I just couldn't get ahead of the schedule.
And when I tell you, out of all the jobs
I've ever had, that was the one I did not
(09:04):
want to walk away from, I loved radio. So yeah,
I made the decision. And I was like, you know what,
I'm not gonna be able to do this anymore.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
But you want a different time slot, baby, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
I really, I really want to make it work. But
my children they're at an age where they really needed me.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
And uh.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
And it was funny because once again he started this
whole rumor that I got fired. I know, it's just insane,
and it's been a lot because I actually this is
the first time I'm really putting it out there, because
he has done so much in the neighborhood, in the
streets of Potomac, and anybody that lives in Potomac that
(09:41):
has cross paths with him knows exactly what I'm saying.
Within five minutes, he will pull out his phone. My
kids even said that he has a whole folder with
screen shops and pictures of me, and at one point
it's been bad and to the point where he would
even tell me I got eyes on you.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
It's you focus on it, Like, how does it go
from we were in love to like, do you hate me?
You know what I mean? Like, what is that about?
Because I and even watching Real Housewives and seeing like
we've all seen this is kind of part of the
storyline is Stacy. People are saying that she's dating him
(10:21):
or whatever happens, she dated him and You're like, I
don't care. You haven't been together for two years and
you really seem genuinely like I literally don't care.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
I'm like, are you good with kids?
Speaker 1 (10:30):
Very much.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
Like she got a nine year old daughter. Okay, if
y'all dating, cool, the kids can't have a play date.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
When I said, you know you're when you are honestly like,
I wish you well.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
Yeah, and I really I really do wish him well.
But I will also wish for him to leave me alone.
It's like, let me live my life. You're living your life.
You're dating and doing whatever you want to do. And
what's crazy is I'm not even dating. I'm not even
to that point yet. And honestly, the way things are
paying out even with that, it's like, I would even
hate to bring somebody into a situation where he's acting
(11:02):
the way he's acting and we're trying to co parent,
you know's yeah, it's.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
A lot, and how is navigating co parenting? Who a lot? O?
Speaker 2 (11:11):
MG, Like it's gotten even worse. And what's interesting is
I stayed pretty quiet and I tried my best not
to bash because I didn't want it to affect our
co parenting. And he got to the point where he
started saying very inappropriate things to the children. He told
the children about the video that y'all saw, He actually
(11:33):
described it to them, And I'm like, why are you
telling At the time they were eleven, nine and six,
why are you telling children these crazy twisting The narrative
of why the marriage ended made it like, oh, your
mam was having an affair and she was cheating.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
No accountability, sir, no sense, like because you know, it's
one thing, like you took accountability for why things maybe
on your end, right, But he hasn't been able to
face the fact that you talk about the lack of affection,
the lack of intimacy. There was even one prayer in
a book where things did get physical that you described
on one occasion. Yeah, in the book that felt scary,
(12:09):
but witnesses were there, Yeah, to actually see him basically
lift you up by your throat. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
And it's crazy because I think what had me the
most was me rationalizing things afterward, you know, and it's like, well, well,
I did kind of it on I did kind of
instigate it, and it's just like, all right, I'm gonna
just let it go. And when you're in a marriage
and when you've seen it growing up, it's almost like yo,
like this is normal, Like okay, we'll get over it.
(12:38):
And that was one of the biggest things that led
me to get to that point where I was like,
you know what, I can't do this anymore. When I
started to think about the fact that my children are
witnessing me have behavior that's opposite of what I preached
to them, which is self love, and they're watching me
run myself and deplete myself into the dirt, and this
is being allowed, you know. And I felt like I
(12:59):
just had to keep proving myself and proving myself and
I'm like, wait, but we're married, why should I have
to prove myself to a person, you know, and we're
supposed to be equal, so it was just it's just
been a very difficult situation.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
But the reason why I speak out.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
And I'm talking more and more about it now is
because I felt so alone going through it. I didn't
realize that there were other people that had the same
experience until I started talking more about it, and then
I would have women dm me that are like all
age groups. They're like, what you're saying, you're describing exactly
how my marriage is. I thought I was the only one,
(13:35):
and that was the push for me to just you know,
I'm like, I can't keep remaining silent and protecting you know.
I feel like as black women, we're just rooted to
protect black men, but black.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Men got to step up too. We're downplaying what happened
to you so that it doesn't harm him or what
he has going on. And it's like there's even one
part where you talk about how and listen you way
for if the full book is out, so you can
read it innoc entiety, so don't worry. It's a lot
more to it. But you even talk about this scene
(14:07):
where you know you got into it on the show
and behind the scenes he was like, yeah, babe, you
you know you did that, and then on camera he
was like completely completely different and not having your back
in any way. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
And then when so when people see me react, they're
not realizing why I'm reacting that way. They're like, oh,
you being mean, Na, Chris, Oh you're being And I'm like,
y'all don't know what just happened right before these cameras
went up, or y'all don't know what was edited out
that caused me to have that reaction. And it's like,
it's like, paint a picture as if I'm this terrible
wife if you want to. But even as of this year,
(14:38):
you're still running around trying to bash me, trying to
you know, you're bitter, and it's just like, dude, like,
get over it.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
Did he want to get divorced when you brought it up?
Because I know you said that you would never bring
it up until the day that you were finally like, yeah,
let's get divorced.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
He would use it as a like, as a weapon
because he didn't believe that you would.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
He ain't really gonna do.
Speaker 2 (14:58):
It, even up until the point that we got divorced.
He told that same friend, former friend. He told her
after the divorce was finalized, and the judge was like,
all right, you know done. He told her, Well, you
know I read that you can have like maybe like
two months after the divorce is finalized to change your mind.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
And she's like she looked at him, like she's not
changing her mind, you know. So you know I wish
him well.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Like I said, at this point, you know, co parenting
has gotten so bad. I'm like, what am I protecting?
You know, It's like you want to be mad at me.
You're gonna stay mad at me. There's nothing I can
do about that. And all I need to do is
focus on my kids. That's what I've been focusing on
and doing whatever I can to support my children.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Yeah. No, listen, and thank goodness you've been doing the
work on yourself, because imagine if this would have been Monique,
you know, five years ago, what that would have been
like because of the same meanthustics that you are with
the clarity you have today, and you did go and
get therapy. Absolutely, so I want to talk about that
because all through this book it's giving I see the
(16:03):
last journey of what it is that you've learned on
this journey. Thank you.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Yes, therapy was so important. The first thing was like,
you normalize things right when you're growing up, and then
you grow up and get married and everything is normal
because you saw it when you were a kid. I
didn't realize that I had childhood trauma. Like my therapist
was listening to me retell stories and her mouth just
dropped and she was like, that's not normal, Like how
(16:28):
did you feel about that in that moment, I'm like,
I didn't feel anything.
Speaker 1 (16:31):
Yeah, it was regular. She was like, no, it's not.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
And it was like once she started pointing out how
I was responding to the situation, she said, you have
emotionally turned off. That's why you don't feel anything. And
let me tell you when I started to let myself
feel the feelings, Oh my goodness. That was chapter six.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
She's dying.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
I went through it. I had to purge all. Like
people think about healing and they think it's so great
to heal, it's not because you have to revisit everything
that has traumatized you, you know, and through therapy and
through journaling, through just being outside of nature.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Ayahuasca, Oh, yes, ayahuasca. I want to ask about the.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
Golden Teachers, still ecitement whatever. It's like, they really help
you to speed track the healing, but you still have
to go through the process. And that's why so many
people don't heal.
Speaker 1 (17:22):
Tell me about the ayahuasca because this is something that
we said years No, no, Jordan, you haven't either, because
I want to do it, but I'm also nervous and
I know you have to have like a shaman and yeah,
you know it.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
And I'm not nervous. I just haven't had the opportunity yet.
Well okay, but I wasn't able to go.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
So if you go, I have a place that I
went to that I can definitely give you. I researched
for a year before I actually took the journey and
went on the trip. And where did you go? I
went to Costa Rica and there there was a small group.
So I will not do the ones where it's a
bunch of people because that's a lot of energy experienced,
you know. So I did one that was very small
(17:59):
and intimate, and they had the shamans. The shamans weren't
people who just said, oh I love this, let me
just start my own practice. They've actually been rooted in
plant medicine since they it's a part of their generational line,
so they just were raised up in it, and I
felt very comfortable and it is amazing.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
It literally is like.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
The best way I can describe by aauasca is like
you're you're going through a tunnel and then you hit
a wall, and most people will try to figure out
how to get around that wall, and they might chisel
at it. Ayahuasca's gonna knock it down. So when it
goes into your body, it searches for your trauma blocks
because every time you've experienced anything traumatic, you store it
(18:45):
in your body somewhere. So the ayahuasca finds it and
it punches it down like with no mercy. So it's
best for you to just say, Okay, we're in this together,
like don't fight it, because then you're going to have
a hard time. So when you are basically just like okay,
let's deal with it. For me, it was like I
was watching my life on a movie screen. Like it
(19:05):
was as if I was sitting and I'm watching me
to the point where I'm remembering things that I didn't
even remember when I was there, things that were years ago.
I can see exactly what clothes I had on, how
my hair was like. It was incredibly intense, and it
allowed me to push those feelings in that blockage right
out the way, like right away. So in the way
(19:27):
that this particular company did it, they had breakdown sessions
where you were able to kind of talk about it.
They give you a chance to just kind of like
sit with yourself and process what you just experienced. And
I did like a five day so we did actually
like three ceremonies and it was incredible, Like for me,
it really changed my life. It actually put me in
a place of gratitude for where I was going through
(19:49):
my divorce with my ex husband. Even where I felt
let down by him, I was grateful to him and
I focused on what I was grateful about. If it
wasn't for him, I wouldn't even be in a position
to even open my eyes. He pushed me to that
limit to make me set those boundaries right before him.
I had no boundaries. So it was really it was
(20:11):
really deep.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
It was good. I loved it. It was great for me.
Like I'm sold listen, It's something that I always hear about.
I've always wanted to do. But of course I want
to have a good experience. Yeah, you know what I
do it, but I know it's also not like a
good fun experience and yeah, but I also know it
is life changing. They always say, yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
You have so many companies that are like popping up
and just doing them because they had a good time
or they are like, oh, this is a good money maker.
So you have to just watch out and make sure
that the ones you're going to are actual shamans who
have been raised in plant medicine. So but yeah, but
it's speed tracks. You're healing, so it will put you
on a path something that could have taken you ten
years to process and get over. You're going to process
(20:54):
it and it takes.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
You ten years.
Speaker 2 (20:57):
To find it during the long time ago.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
No, yeah, and even being married for ten years. I
think it's interesting because I always hear people say like
after marriage sometimes like the intimacy can be harder. I
want to ask you, like, when you first were together,
do you feel like it was good and then it
got worse or was it always something that you felt
like the intimacy wasn't where you needed it to be,
but you thought you would work up to it and
(21:22):
they would improve me. I thought it was going to improve. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
We actually it's so funny. We used to tell this
story to people that were close to us. But we
had one of our worst arguments on our honeymoon, and
that was the first sign.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
Wow. Yeah on our honeymoon.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Because I don't know what type of delusion I was in,
but I expected, all of a sudden, now we're married,
that he would be this like romantic person. And we
were sitting in the Maldives and I remember I was
so upset with him and I was like, you're treating
me like I'm one of the homies, Like there's no affection,
there's no like catering to me. You want me to
(21:55):
just cater to you. And we got into a bad argument.
We sent at the dinner take money of his on
the honeymoon, and we were able to kind of work
through it. But working through it was always me having
to just like push down my feelings right and just
like like all right, I guess it ain't a big deal,
and then move past it when it really was a
big deal.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Yeah. My mom said, the first time you heard my
dad yeo was their wedding day. Wow. She was like, oh,
that was yeah. She was like, that was an indication
right there that it wasn't gonna be what I thought
it would. Yeah, we I.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Ignored so many reflects.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
But you really wanted to be married? Where did that
come from?
Speaker 2 (22:32):
Growing up in a household with two parents, and because
both of my parents they they struggled. I mean, they
would have flat out arguments and don't if you saw
in the book, I detailed one and when I tell
you I was going to really kill your mother. Yeah,
I really thought in my mind, because I'm young, I'm
thinking that this just happens and people get past it
(22:54):
and they get over it. And yeah, so I always
wanted to be married. I did go through it time
where I was just like, I don't want to be
married when my parents got divorced, because I just felt like,
if y'all been through all of that and I witnessed
all of that, why are y'all divorcing now? And then
years later, here I am getting married and finding myself
in so many of the same situations I witnessed when
(23:15):
I was growing up. Maybe not as intense, but still
it's like, you know, just reinventing the wheel or reliving
the wheel that was there interesting oh.
Speaker 1 (23:24):
Go ahead. Do you think you would marry again?
Speaker 2 (23:27):
I would, but I don't necessarily think it has to
be like married on paper the government style, like because
after going through a divorce and realizing how much you
have to wait.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
The government for the government, Yes, it's crazy.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
And the only reason that I was able to even
get a divorced as quickly as I did is because
I just was like, I wasn't fighting him, I didn't
even have an attorney.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
I was like, I just want to be done.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
I was so miserable, I said, I want to be
done with this, like I just want my peace and
just let me go, leave me alone.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
Because divorce could be so ugly when people are the
terms and get every teen going back and forth. And
then also to know what you deserve, because sometimes people
try to make it seem like, well he had this
career and he did this, why does she deserve But
sometimes we make a lot of sacrifices. Yes, because you know,
raising three kids is a full time job, and master
you paid nannies and paid yeah, you know people to
(24:21):
do those things. How much that would end up being
And then there's things that you wanted to do, like
you said you didn't want to give up radio. But
at the same time, you're homeschooling your kids, you want
to make sure you're there three children at home. He
wasn't going to say, will let me you know, sacrifice?
Speaker 2 (24:36):
No, no, and no child support, no nothing. I didn't
want anything. I was like, I just I wanted to
be I don't want to be free. I wanted to
be free. I really did, and I still do. It's like,
you know, now things is changing because I'm like, you know,
we're having to modify custody, we're having to really like
we were in court, like I'm just like, this is ridiculous.
We're going through more now being over two years divorced
(24:59):
than going through the divorce process.
Speaker 1 (25:01):
So wait, no child support? So did you get any
type of like what did they call it? Alimony? Yeah? Alimony.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
We had a prenup, so I was able to get
with the prenup a lot of which when we did
the prenup, it wasn't with the mindset of us having children.
It was like, if I didn't have children and whatever
I got with the prenup, oh that would have been fine.
I would have just walked away good. But I still
walked away and I was just like, God will figure
it out. Like you're not my source. God's my source.
(25:27):
I'm going to always be good and that's what I
just have faith in the fact that I'm always gonna
be well taken care of.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
And I've been. I left my job over a year
ago and.
Speaker 2 (25:36):
I've been good. You know, everything has been so much.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
I love that for a year.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
Yeah, listen, I'm like me and my children. Since I've
been divorced, we've been to eight different countries. We still travel.
I don't tell them know when they ask for things,
because they're great kids. And I loved that I don't
have to like second guests, like, oh do I have
to because I need to pay these bills and say
I'm like, I'm blessed and I have more than enough
and I'm good. And I think some people get mad
at that.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Yeah, well, you know, what is it like now being
back on the show on Real housewiseh Potomac because it's
different now. You know, it's been a few seasons that
you've been gone. Yes, and now I did not expect this,
you know, to have either, girl, because you have a
abbit watcher of not just me, but the entire franchise.
Speaker 3 (26:21):
Yeah, and when I heard you was coming back, I
could not wait to see what's going to happen.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
And you know, it was so like unplanned, it was
very unexpected. Like literally they every year they asked me
back and I'd be like no, even this year, I
told them no about seven eight times. I talked to
the SVP at the production company, Lorraine and I love
and we talked and she was just like, look, I'm
(26:44):
gonna be in town next week. I don't even want
you to answer me. She said, don't say anything. She
said just think about it. And I was like, okay.
So I listened to her. And a week later I
was like, why am I not going back? Like what
is keeping me from it? I felt like I was
saying ain't no out of habit versus like reason. Yeah,
And I sat back and thought, and I was like,
(27:06):
I guess I can do it. This would be the
best way to see how much I've actually healed. Right,
But I've been so excited and even though there's like
drama stuff going on now, I still like I had
a great time.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
Like a lot of the job, ain't got nothing to
do because it's all like your whole situation is nothing
compared to like Aaron went to jail, Wendy. Everybody's having issues, yes, Like, look,
I'm just going through right myself is off camera. I'm like,
I'm dealing with it. It's been, it's been.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
It's been insane, but it's also been good for me
because now I'm able to go back and not feel
like I have to protect anybody cover things.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
I'm just like, I'm me, this is it. They're gonna
want you to date somebody, I'm.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
Gonna want it, but I'm gonna just force it. Look,
I ain't paying for the I ain't hiring no.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
You know, have you formed any new friendships with the
ladies that you just met this season since you've been
filming with them.
Speaker 2 (28:08):
I wouldn't say friendships, but I've been cool with everybody.
I feel like there's potential for it. I really like
Tiya Is. At first, I was just like, what's her deal?
Speaker 1 (28:21):
You know?
Speaker 2 (28:22):
But I wasn't really around that much like you'll see
me kind of in and out because I was traveling.
I still had things that were on my schedule. I
signed a contract and they were at my house filming
the next day.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
It was they really were actually happy to have you.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
Yeah, she's a cute guy.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
You know in the last episode.
Speaker 3 (28:44):
Yeah that was female drag.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
People don't give her so fun she is, but actually
she she owns her stuff. Like one thing about Ashley,
if she's being messy, she will own that she's being messy.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
Yes, she knows what she don't care. Yeah, because that's
one thing you also learned filming, and you've talked about this,
is that you gotta do like sometimes they don't pick
up on the little things and the little conversations, but
when you do something wild, you know, that's what gets
onto the actual episode.
Speaker 2 (29:19):
Absolutely absolutely, and you never know. Like filming is fun,
it's once they edit it and they create whatever, then
it's like, wait, what about when I said this?
Speaker 1 (29:28):
So what about that? You know?
Speaker 2 (29:29):
But but now I look at it from a different lens,
and like I said, I don't have to protect anything.
You know, prior when I was married. Once we're watching
the season if I said something that you know, he didn't.
Speaker 1 (29:42):
Like, and then it was like why you say that?
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Why you have to say like that? And now I
don't don't be saying d D. So now when I
film the next season, I'm second guessing myself. I'm like,
you know, it was just like the Way to the
world felt like it was on me, and I couldn't
really be me because I was afraid that I might
say the wrong.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
His image, because he's concerned about that. Yes, I forget
about the reality because that can actually help you heal too. Absolutely.
You know, people talk about the reasons why relationships don't work,
and they always say one of the top reasons is finances. Adultery,
of course is always up there too, you know, intimacy,
things like that, what would you say for you was
(30:19):
the top reason if you have to say, like this
was the number one reason why we couldn't connect.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
I felt like I was being used, Like I didn't
feel like I was really being like appreciated for what
I bought, what I brought to the relationship. And then
he didn't feel like he was being appreciated for what
he brought. He looked at it as well, I'm I'm
paying for everything that's providing, and I'm looking at him like,
but you're not, like I don't even know you something
(30:47):
you're not nursuring.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
Sometimes it's form of control too, like where people are
like I'm financially providing and that should be enough. Do
what I say. Yeah, And that was definitely the case.
Speaker 2 (30:57):
It was like if we got into an argue, it
would be because I'm expressing like my feelings on something
and expecting that emotional covering. But it was like me
bringing up or expressing my feelings or what hurt my
feelings was like I'm being ungrateful because I pay for
all of this, right. So we just couldn't see eye
to eye. And it was a constant argument where it
(31:20):
was like, you know, he's retired, he wanted to live
life and be retired, but I'm like, but we got
three kids, yeah, you know, And I'm like, and I
felt as though because he had played football and he
made this money and we were dating for half his career,
we didn't get married until after he retired, and it
(31:41):
felt like it was always his. So I never felt
like I could actually relax and I could never just
like enjoy it with him. I could organize events and trips,
but it was like, okay, yeah, he would go along
with it, but we weren't ever together in on it.
Like it was like I was doing all the doing
and he was paying for it. Ye, So and it wasn't.
Speaker 1 (32:02):
An equal balance. It was more just you doing him
pay for it. Yeah, it is. It is.
Speaker 2 (32:11):
And when people say, like like somebody said that they
felt as though I left the marriage because of his money,
And I'm like, what sense does that make? If I
wanted his money, I would have stayed for the money.
I would have saved out here balling out, it's like,
but I didn't marry your bank account. I didn't marry
you because of what you had. I really wanted us
(32:32):
to be a power comple I wanted us to really
be able to have these deep talks. And I feel
like a wall went up with him once we got married,
almost like I can't be vulnerable anymore because I have
to be the man.
Speaker 1 (32:44):
Do you think it bothered him to not be doing
for playing football anymore? Absolutely, because that's part of it
too for a lot of professional athletes. You know, He's
used to being celebrated in that way for that and
then now I'm not doing this anymore. Yeah, And I
know that's an adjustment for somebody to make. Also, Yeah,
there was a lot of I mean it was depression.
It was depression, Like pretty much our whole marriage, there
(33:06):
was depression and it was like towards the end is
when he really accepted it, but by that time I
was done, and then it was still like yes, like
I don't.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
I tried to pull him along as much as I
could in every way, and it was like, there was
nothing else I could do for you, And why am
I saving you? Why am I having to fix you?
And I don't think that that's fair to either one
of us.
Speaker 4 (33:31):
Especially feelings about he's used to being the household name
and that kind of shifted when you had your own
public persona. How did he react to that?
Speaker 2 (33:41):
You know, it's interesting because on the outside he was
always very excited about it, like, yeah, my wife, you
know this, that and the other.
Speaker 1 (33:48):
She's a star.
Speaker 2 (33:50):
But it makes me wonder if that was just what
you were saying. But what did you really feel? And
did you ever tell you he was proud of you.
He was saved in front of other people.
Speaker 1 (34:00):
But not in an intimate setting. We're in a private setting.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
No, we barely talked towards the end, like we barely
talk like when I did that second on reality show
Love and Marriage DC.
Speaker 1 (34:10):
The most the more. The most we talked was actually camera,
which was terrible being married or being in a relationship
and being lonelier than you would be if you were single,
because that is the worst. People always are you single.
You thish you that you listen, I would rather be
single than married and still alone and married and miserable.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
I have chills right now while you're saying that, because
you just took me back to a space where I
remember sitting on the couch and I'm literally sitting next
to him, and i am crying, and I'm like, i
have never felt so lonely and I'm literally sitting right
next to you. It was like we just I was
trying to find different ways of connection, and I felt
like I was always.
Speaker 1 (34:49):
The one trying. And then, you know.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
I just feel like he really did the best that
he could, you know, like I don't, I'm not. It
was like that was what he could gift based on
how he was brought up, based on the emotional connections
that he had with his own family and parents and
things like that, and he was doing in his mind,
he's doing better than what his parents did.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
Did he ever do therapy or did you suggest it?
Or yeah, oh we did everything. We tried.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
We really did. We really did try. We did We've
seen so many therapists, And wasn't.
Speaker 3 (35:24):
That something that you brought to him like maybe we
should talk to somebody, maybe we should seek therapy, yes,
to try to work on things. And was he initially
accepted of it because you know, black men feel like
they can't tell people their business. They feel like they
can't sit down in front of somebody and really be open, and.
Speaker 1 (35:38):
They feel like people take a side to that.
Speaker 3 (35:39):
Yeah, So was that something that when you brought it
to him, did he fight kind of about it or
was he agreeing?
Speaker 2 (35:44):
He didn't fight, He was like, all right, let's do
do it. He was always, let me tell you, he
was always down. Like if I brought something to him,
it was always like okay for the most part, but
it was like I was just like, okay, can you
make some suggestions?
Speaker 1 (35:59):
Can you put for it more effort? Right? Right?
Speaker 2 (36:02):
So yeah, so he definitely he would take part in it.
But that ended up being even interesting because it would
be a situation that he would he might bring up
in therapy something that we actually went through work through,
and I could have been the one that was wrong, right,
and then we would work through it, and then I
wouldn't do that thing anymore. And but then when we
(36:23):
go to therapy, he would bring that up. We passed that,
figure that out. I was like, I was like, wait,
did we solve it. He's like, well, yeah, I've done
it again.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
Yeah, let it go. He was like yes.
Speaker 2 (36:38):
It was like if I bring up a current situation,
you got an old one back in your back pocket
that you want to bring right And I'm like, no,
this is worse.
Speaker 1 (36:48):
When it happens. And we did that and he don't
bring it back up.
Speaker 3 (36:51):
Now.
Speaker 1 (36:52):
I want to ask you a couple of things about
the show. All right, So what are your thoughts about
what Wendy is going through right now? Oh my goodness. First,
I know I can't talk while you weren't on the show,
but it seems like you guys be connected and are
finding your way into friendship. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (37:07):
First of all, any when you are on reality TV,
I mean, people are going to make whatever out of nothing,
and we don't know what her side of the story is,
we don't know what Eddie's side of the story is.
And just looking at the whole circus, with the whole
like press conference and all of the its just something
about it just seems really off, And I'm always a
(37:30):
little hesitant to make any type of judgments when you
have a predominantly like black family living in a predominantly
like white neighborhood, because it just feels like, I'm like,
there's something that's missing here, you know.
Speaker 1 (37:44):
I felt that when she was saying, we didn't like
have fake credit cards, we just gave different names so
protect yeah, to get delivered to. And they were like ridiculous. Yeah,
so it wasn't So I can see that because sometimes
people don't want to give right right.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
Because we I mean, when I was still living in
Poton with my ex, we would have people literally roll
up to our house knocking on our door asking for
jobs or asking for like literally so people like public
knowledge exactly. So it's like, yeah, I can see why
you would have an alias for delivery.
Speaker 1 (38:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (38:17):
So I feel like it sucks because there it's like
they're being put on public display for everybody else's judgment
and we still haven't heard what their signed nothing, you know,
and like, why are y'all putting all of this? Why
is the state or whoever is behind this investigation? Why
are y'all feeding all of this to the public.
Speaker 1 (38:34):
Yeah, yeah, it's for them too, you know, they like
uh the yeah, the police department. They love press. Let's way,
don't get it off of me. I'm just saying now.
In addition to that, of course, Karen, Yeah, and I
know she did a sit down with Andy. Yeah, you know,
also talking about that. But she's home the Grand Diamonds back,
(38:57):
and I know you reached out to.
Speaker 2 (38:58):
Her, right, I reached out to her or two and
I haven't talked to her since, so yeah, I've just
I don't know, I haven't seen her, haven't talked to her.
Speaker 1 (39:07):
Really.
Speaker 2 (39:07):
She reached out to me, but it wasn't like on
a like let's get together type of deal. It was
like more like, hey, girl, who you use for your microblading?
Speaker 1 (39:17):
That's a good question, because I was like, but else,
that's good.
Speaker 2 (39:26):
I was like, I don't know, I just it kind
of like put me in a moment of just like
I just need to take a step back. That's what
I've been doing lately, the opposite of what I would
normally do. So instead of me jumping the gun and
trying to dissect with the situation, means I'm just gonna
put you on pause and just step back because I
don't want to put my own like feelings on something
(39:49):
that maybe weren't your intention.
Speaker 1 (39:51):
So when I see her, i'll see her, all right.
I want to do one of these heartworks from your buck.
It's not homework, but this is us, you know. Just
answer some a couple of questions, all right, because of
course you know with your letters to yourself, there's also
questions that you can ask yourself. Okay, So I want
to ask the ladies here what are you deeply afraid of?
(40:15):
And how have those fears affected your life and relationships
with others? Wow? Wow? Am I for you know? I'm
a daredev won't give a fuck. I don't know how
have those fears affected your life? I remember when Gigi,
you used to be like, I never want to get married.
That used to be definitely something, definitely something I used
(40:36):
to say a lot. Yeah, I'm open to it now.
You're open to it now. But what do you think
is something that you're afraid of? And how has that
affected your life and relationships with others? I think that
I'm afraid of.
Speaker 3 (40:50):
People not seeing me for who I truly am because
of the persona that I might put off with how
I speak like here and know on pain conversations, and
I'm just such like a wild car that I think
that people might not take me as serious as I
really am because they get that wild card affector from me.
But I'm very much serious about life. I'm a grown
as forty six year old woman. I'm a mother, you know,
(41:10):
and I do care. I know I come off as
just as easy, breezy, go with the flow, but I
have a strong foundation and I really do care a
lot about my friends and my family and just things
that happen in life.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
So I think I would say that that could be
something that you have vulnerability. Yeah, you don't want people
to see that, and you know and you care, but
maybe you don't let people know.
Speaker 3 (41:30):
I don't let people know as much as I probably should.
I kind of maybe put a guard up in every
in that case, you know, Yeah, what would you say,
Jordie Joey.
Speaker 2 (41:41):
Ones?
Speaker 4 (41:41):
I think my first one is irrational, which is my
greatest spirit, is my dad dying, which is inevitable. But
I just I'm scared for what that means for me.
I already lost my mom, I don't have any siblings,
and so I just I don't know if anyone is
ever gonna know me and accept me and love me
fully than him. So I think that's a fear. And
(42:03):
I think the other fear actually comes from reality TV,
where you know, they don't tell you when you go
into it what it's going to be like or how
mentally it changes you.
Speaker 1 (42:16):
And sometimes I feel like I.
Speaker 4 (42:18):
Was almost like bullied out of my personality and so
I'm still navigating that and I'm worried. I'm like, did
I really like kill myself off in that way?
Speaker 1 (42:29):
I don't know. I'm still figuring that out.
Speaker 2 (42:31):
It does kind of it forces you to abandon yourself
in some situations because you're having to like have your
subconscious mind on display when normally you reserve your comments
processing and then you'll come back it's like, no, we
got to cut to the chase because you always.
Speaker 1 (42:45):
Tell people think about I can't look like a punk too,
like when.
Speaker 2 (42:49):
This airs yea thought?
Speaker 1 (42:53):
You know.
Speaker 4 (42:55):
When you explain, right, there are certain things that aren't
even happening.
Speaker 1 (43:00):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (43:01):
I'm saying in confessionals, but it's it's on the overlay
of something else, and I'm like, that's not even what
I was talking about and then it makes you feel
crazy because you're like, did I say that?
Speaker 2 (43:10):
I don't remember saying that.
Speaker 1 (43:16):
I don't know. Hilarious, And you know, it's funny you
say that about your dad because my family was over
for the holidays and my dad is getting older, his
knees is messed up. He was walking so slow, you
know up and I'm not used to that, you know,
So that's a real thought, like jesh, that's you know,
that's going to be a crazy thing. And then I
(43:37):
know you how close to you when your father are
absolutely so I can't imagine that. Man, I would say,
for me, what's something that I'm scared of? I think
that a lot of times. And I was thinking about
this because I was looking at this article about Buddhism.
It's random, but anyway about not explaining yourself in situations, right,
(43:58):
and so like I know in your book you talk
a lot about like and you said it on the
show that you know your circle is now dot people
around you. And there are so many people that say things,
especially like when you have a public personality that's not
true and it's like, are you going to defend yourself
against everything? But sometimes I also hate the fact that
there's these narratives that you're not correcting, but then you
(44:22):
just can't correct everything, everything, all the time. It will
drive you crazy. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (44:26):
Yeah, I'm a firm believer now that when people hear
story and they believe it and it's negative towards you,
that's how they always felt about you. They wanted to
be They wanted to be true so bad. And if
they wanted to be true, I knew, stay over there,
if that's what you want for me, stay over there,
come over here, asking you, I'm gonna tell it. I'm
(44:48):
gonna tell my story once and I'm done. Whereas back
in the day, oh my god, Like I don't.
Speaker 1 (44:57):
Even have time for that. Now, I do want to
ask this, what relationship do you and Candice have or
any at all? None at all, None at all, none
at all.
Speaker 2 (45:06):
Yeah, I just like I apologized five years ago at.
Speaker 1 (45:09):
The reunion and it was genuine.
Speaker 2 (45:11):
And it's funny because a clip of that popped up
on my reel and I was watching myself from like,
you know, like I hadn't seen it in so long,
and it was it was like they wanted me to
be crying. They wanted me to be emotional, but I
had already been all of that and they weren't there
to see it. But I was being very genuine about
my apology. But it was like because I wasn't crying
and stuff, yeah, begging for forgiveness. Nobody wanted to believe it.
(45:36):
But yeah, but I just looked at it as look,
it is what it is. It happened, I apologize for it.
I've moved on, and I hope that she has. Everybody's
in a different space now. Yeah, I'm like, I don't
wish any bad on anybody because I realized how energy works.
Now I'm like, I wish you all.
Speaker 1 (45:59):
The all of that. Man, it's interesting to see. I
cannot wait to finish watching this season because you know,
unfortunately Chris is still a character on here. They're calling
him yesterday. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (46:14):
Now, let's let's ask ourselves a question. Why is his
name being mentioned so much?
Speaker 1 (46:19):
So much?
Speaker 2 (46:20):
And then what I didn't like, and this is only
because I know this person, so it's like the whole
I don't know what y'all talking about.
Speaker 1 (46:28):
You know, exactly.
Speaker 2 (46:29):
Yeah, And then what I didn't like is like I
ain't cool with Cookie, but I was like, dang, he
just threw cookie under the bus. And she's been his
biggest mouthpiece. He completely threw it under the bus.
Speaker 1 (46:38):
She was riding for him.
Speaker 2 (46:39):
And then you say, you don't know what they're talking about.
So I'm just like, why would.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
You do that to her? They've been mentioning his name
since episode one, wait.
Speaker 2 (46:47):
Which is why they was probably so pressed for me
to come back to seron.
Speaker 3 (46:52):
What's up?
Speaker 2 (46:53):
Bothered like, that's the situation and her damn did we
even Okay?
Speaker 1 (47:02):
I feel like she walked in, turned around and walked out.
Speaker 2 (47:06):
Oh my gosh, that that that situation is just a mess.
Speaker 1 (47:09):
And I you'll see you on the next episode.
Speaker 2 (47:12):
I give I give Stacey some wise words and I
can't wait.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
Take he well, are you having fun? I am?
Speaker 2 (47:18):
Okay, Look yeah, I'm really enjoying my life right now.
Speaker 1 (47:22):
Ok yeah, I can.
Speaker 3 (47:23):
See it on you. You look very happy, You're glowing.
You lost all his weight?
Speaker 1 (47:27):
What did you do? Did you change your diet? Did
you work out?
Speaker 2 (47:29):
You know what's crazy? This is my normal weight.
Speaker 1 (47:31):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (47:32):
And every time that I've been on in the past years,
I was either just I just had a baby or
I was pregnant. So nobody actually really saw me, like
because I've been once high school. Like I just I
can't gain weight to save my life unless I'm pregnant
and I'm done having babies. So now be back to
do some squats or find a good man to give
me some happy weight.
Speaker 1 (47:52):
You plenty of people don't apply for that job. Okay,
all right, well listen, you definitely got to come back.
I will. You know. We had a great time, and
I appreciate your openness and honesty and your positive vibes
and energy. Q. I appreciate you having me here. We'll
be we'll be watching for you, girl. And don't forget
that book, Love Letters from Versions of Myself, a memoir
of self discovery, transformation, and healing. January fourth. It's not
(48:15):
we will remind you though, no.
Speaker 2 (48:16):
Word and it actually goes on pre order December seventh.
Speaker 1 (48:19):
Okay, so ordering pre order
Host
Angela Yee
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