August 15, 2025 • 34 mins
In this week’s Prayerful Posse, Raymond Arroyo, Father Gerald Murray, and Robert Royal break down the first 100 days of Pope Leo’s pontificate — and the investigation he’s launched into Peruvian Cardinal Carlos Castillo over allegations of misconduct and financial irregularities. The Posse examines what this says about Leo’s leadership style, contrasts it with Pope Francis, and looks ahead to potential changes on the Latin Mass.
The conversation also dives into Spain’s ban on Islamic public celebrations, the Spanish bishops’ controversial response, and the political and cultural tensions fueling the debate. Plus — Madonna calls on Pope Leo to visit Gaza, Marco Rubio outlines the realities of the conflict, and the Posse reacts.
Other topics include Pope Benedict’s letter settling the resignation debate, a woman “engaged” to her AI boyfriend, the United Church of Canada’s steep membership decline amid LGBTQ advocacy, and one New York bishop’s hands-on approach to tackling the priest shortage.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Madonna not the Virgin, ask the Pope to intercede in Gaza,
and Leo orders an investigation into a Peruvian bishop as
his pontificate it hits one hundred days, the Prayerful Posse
breaks it all down. Welcome to this Arroyo Grande series,
(00:24):
the Prayerful Posse. Let's convene the Posse joining me out.
The entire group is here, Father Gerald Murray Cannon, lawyer
of the Archdiocese of New York, and back from Europe.
Robert Royal, editor in chief of the Catholic Thing dot Org.
We missed you, Bob. I'm glad you're here. I'm Raymond Arroyo.
Go subscribe to the Arroyo Grande Show channel on iHeart, Apple,
Spotify or.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
YouTube and don't miss an episode. We don't want you
to miss any of this.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
By the way, speaking the first one hundred days of
the pontificate, reports our surfacing gents that Pope Leo has
ordered an investigation into a Cardinal, Carlos Castillo of Lima, Peru,
an area he knows very well there are allegations of
homosexual misconduct at his seminary, the cardinal seminary and financial irregularities.
(01:09):
The investigation is being conducted by a group of Augustinian
priests led by the Assistant General of the Augustinian Order
for Latin America. Pope Leo knows Cardinal Castillo well from
his time in Peru, and he stated previously that the
seventy five year old would remain in his position until
he was eighty. But these allegations could change all of that. Father,
(01:33):
What does this case tell you about Leo's approach to
things and what are the allegations that Cardinal Castillo employed
arector at his seminary who acted inappropriately towards seminarians, and
when these seminarians came to the bishop he dismissed them
when they brought these allegations.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
Well, this is a very clear sign that Pope Leo
is going to act in the best interests of the church,
even when it comes to someone he knows very well,
because of course he was a fellow bishop with him
in Peru. Yeah, the cardinal in Lima is accused of
tolerating a seminary rector who was basically a homosexual predator
(02:11):
looking for seminarians, and then when people didn't respond, they
were thrown out of the seminary. In fact, the statistics
reported show that during this rectorship the seminary went from
sixty candidates down to fifteen, and then this rector was
transferred and sent to Rome for further studies, which is
sort of a cover up because you know, you're not
(02:32):
admitting there was a problem here. The second issue concerns Caratas,
which is a charitable organization, and you may have seen
that they went from five employees to thirty. Yeah, with
no appreciable increase in the amount of work being done,
but certainly a huge increase in salary. So that always
looks like patronage system and people putting friends and even relatives.
(02:55):
We don't know that, but somehow you went from five
to thirty people on your staff. Thing's going on there
that needs to be explained.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Yeah, Bob.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
On August twelfth, the Pillar reported on this financial situation
in Cartas that father was talking about. A former Cartas
director had been fired after it was proven that a
family member was selling Carratos donations, oxygen valves and other
things online. This is also a focus of the investigation.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
Your thoughts, Yeah, well, I would just add that.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
To me.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
It's heartening that we heard that the pope expected that
this Bishop Castillo would stay on till he was eighty,
and then apparently when he heard some news unlike what
we've seen with some cases in the past. We don't
need to go into yet again here, but apparently when
he was told some things, he acted right away, and
(03:48):
that in itself, I think is an encouraging sign, because
he probably has a certain amount of affection. Apparently he
knew this bishop rather well and thought that he knew
what kind of person he was. But when he got
new information, he seems to have moved swiftly. He's appointed
in Augustinian a member of his own, his own order
(04:09):
to go and look at these things. So look, there
are going to be human breakdowns in the church where
we try to deal with them when they pop up.
You can't stamp them out entirely. But when they do
pop up, a real leader has got to move on it,
even if it steps on some toes of people who
maybe even formally were very close friends. So look, the
(04:29):
overall message to me is if they find out that
these chargers are just rumors, that's great. But to see
a pope move swiftly, that's wonderful.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
Yeah, quickly, father, how would you handicap Pope Leo's pontificate
at one hundred days as you're looking at what we've
seen in the trajectory from the day he appeared to now.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
Well, I would say this that he has given a
very calming and reassuring and spiritual aspect to the pontificate,
which is very welcome because the Hope, of course represents
Jesus Christ, who is the king of the universe. So
the church is proposing a message of peace and faith
and uh and and religious seriousness, and I think the
(05:11):
Pope has given all of that. His sermons have been
very good. I've been very appreciative of some of the
talks he gave to different groups. Certainly, I'm encouraged when
he observes protocols that all the pontific all the popes
except Francis observed, because those protocols, meaning style and way
(05:32):
of acting, are indicative of the serious nature of the
office and they focus less on the personality of the
man occupying it so as regards substant of action. Though
it's hard to handicap this is certainly one of the
first ones we could say for him to send investigators.
Basically you know, overnight, so to speak, he hears the
charges and then does something that's a great sign, because
(05:56):
you know, Inertia said to say was operative under less
pontific There's still an open investigation of Bishop Zanketta from Argentina,
who was convicted by civil court and brought to jail
in his own country, and yet he's never been canonically
disciplined for the abuse of seminarians that he himself was
(06:17):
found guilty of in the court.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Yeah, Bob, there is a huge discrepancy that we're seeing
between the way these types of cases were handled and
look the sex of You scandal. The church continues to
live through this. There are financial settlements, I mean in
the United States. I read of two this week where
you're still seeing settlements being handed out. So this is
an ongoing problem. Pope Francis did the other look the
(06:42):
other way, or in some cases enabled this by protecting
his friends.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
Who were bishops and charged and priests.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
Similarly, your thoughts on how that is changed the departure
under Pope Leo and what do you make of the
larger pontificate.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
I agree with Father that it's a little bit hard
at this moment to know substantively, although you have to
appreciate the what looks like the sincere spirituality, the depth
of what Leo is as a person that I think
has come across immediately. He isn't, you know, looking for
grand gestures, he isn't making jokes. He's he's brought back,
(07:20):
I think, a certain kind of dignity to the now.
As far as the substance, I mean, this particular case
is a good indication. We've seen some kind of you know,
ambivalent to appointments of bishops that are a little disappointing.
A lot of people would like him to be moving faster.
That doesn't seem to be his nature. He's as a
(07:41):
kind of a thoughtful, slow moving person. I think we
you know, we're literally in what in Italy is called Fedagosta,
which is the August vacation. Nobody is around, and if
you go out on the streets, I mean, everything's closed
and people are at the sea. You're either at the
seaside or you're up in the mountains, and that's what
the Italians do. But when we come back in September,
(08:01):
just in a couple of weeks, I think that's when
we're going to start to see the substance. There have
been rumors that he's preparing them in cyclical. What the
subject that is in cyclical is and how he treats
it is going to tell us I think quite a
bit about the first steps in this papacy.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
Yeah, no, I agree with everything you all have said.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
I think Leo is certainly tonally different from Francis, and
there are signs of a quiet, very discreete repair system
going on if you look closely, he's quietly either appraising
or adjusting things. And the fall in the new year
will tell the tale. Watch the appointments and what he
(08:38):
does on the Latin mass is We've said repeatedly here
will he loosen those restrictions or canonize, if you will,
Pope Francis's limitations on the traditional Latin mass. Those elements
will tell us where this spontificate, I think is headed.
I want to move on to a story emerging out
of Spain. Vox, a right leaning political party there is
accusing the Spanish CAFIC bishops of being neutered by government
(09:02):
grants and a lack of credibility in the wake of.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
The sex abuse settlements.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
Here we are again the fracas stems from a decision
by the city council in Jumia, which passed emotion on
July twenty eighth, which effectively bans Islamic festivities in the town,
specifically the feasts of the land marking the end of Ramadan.
On August eighth, the Bishop's Conference, the Spanish Catholic Bishop's Conference,
(09:27):
released a statement condemning that decision, saying imposing such restrictions
for religious reasons constitutes discrimination that is no place in
democratic societies.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
End quote.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Father Vox is accusing the bishops of failing to stand
up against what it considers Islamic extremism in Spain by
opposing these restrictions, and also they claim the Spanish Catholic
Bishop's position on immigration is somehow fueling this.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
What do you make of this story?
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Yeah, there are a lot of elements into the complaint
that were being issued by the Vox party. And Vox Party,
by the way, it would be the equivalent of a
right wing party in other countries. It's not certainly favorably
looked upon by many people in the Spanish hierarchy. So
there is a political angle to this that I don't
want to say. I can tell you the whole story.
(10:19):
I can certainly say. What I read was that the
city council was trying to prevent the use of public
facilities for the Islamic festival. And that's a delicate question
that you have to look at, because public facilities should
be used either by all religions or by none, because
(10:41):
you have to treat religions fairly. I agree with that,
but in the Islamic mentality, we have to see is
this festivity going to respect the nature of Spanish law
and society or is it a sign of increasing encroachment,
Because there's a claim by many Islamic individuals that Spain,
(11:02):
what having once been conquered by Islamic rulers, is always
an Islamic country. It's something has to be liberated again, right,
And that way doing that is by increasing the population
there and then to start acting in the public in
a way that would contradict the Spanish history since the reconquest.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
Yeah, Bob, if I read this correctly, the reports I saw,
it looked like it barred all religions from taking, you know,
using those public facilities and public parks for activities.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
Yeah. I think that was one of the things that
Vox was was trying to do. And father's quite right.
I mean, there is this question of religious liberty and
in a democratic society. But on the other hand, I
think we have to say they're movements like VOX. I
just got back from Europe when we were talking with
many different people about politics, religion, all that sort of thing.
(11:52):
I think you have to look at the fact that
not only was Spain conquered by the Muslims in the past,
but the other side of it from our Christians standpoint,
the possibility of that happening again is something that raises
hackles among them, and I think rightly so. And it's
not as if VOX is like an extreme right hand
(12:12):
right wing party, the way we always hear conservative parties
being described as far right. And there's a kind of
a populist sentiment building up in all of Europe, and
Spain has been a particularly sore country because they still
have not gotten over their own civil war back in
the nineteen thirties. These socialist governments that have a socialist
(12:34):
government right now is trying to kind of roll back
the deals that have been made to establish peace in
Spanish society. They're trying to there's a famous monument to
the fallen in the Spanish Civil War that they're trying
to remove the religious element out of so all those
things get put into this mix. And so there's a
(12:55):
delicacy in Spain about specifically about Islam been once conquered,
and then of course what they call the re conquista
is the liberation from Islam. So we want to recognize
also the cultural element. That's they're over and above the
technicalities of who's allowed to use public facilities and not.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Yeah, but it's weird that the Spanish bishops are weighing
in on this, you know, it seems it's such a
sensitive source spot culturally in their tradition, in the history
of Spain. Maybe this is one to sit back on,
you know, take a back seat on, particularly if they're
not They aren't saying, you know, only Islamics can't use
these public facilities.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
They're saying everybody, every religion can't.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
So the Islamics are interpreting this as a way to
kind of tamp down their particular celebrations because they happen outdoor,
they're big public display and obviously that's what these Spanish
officials are getting their hackles up about.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
But that global diplomat.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Madonna apparently once Papa too breach, now urging Pope Leo
to visit Gaza and quote, bring your light to the
children before it's too late. She claims the Pope is
the only person who won't be denied entry into Gaza,
and she's worried about the humanitarian crisis there. On July twentieth,
I'll point out the Pope said quote, I'm following with
(14:18):
great concern the dire humanitarian situation in Gaza, where the
civilian population is suffering from severe hunger and remains exposed
to violence and death. I renew my heartfelt appeal for
a ceasefire, the release of hostages, and the full respect
of humanitarian law. Carton Pizzabala, I know has been there
(14:38):
several times in Gaza, so it's not like the Pope's
representative hasn't been present.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
Your reaction, father to the material girl here.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
Well, General principal operate On is when Hollywood people start
trying to tell the Pope and the President what to do,
I smile and then turn the page because this is
you know, this is not why people like Madonna, because
he's a political leader with wisdom. So any sentiment that
she has. That's fine, she can enunciate it, but on
(15:08):
the substance of it, the Pope is not going to
go into an active war zone, so it's a non starter.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
The father, or Bob rather, the Pope is so moved
by Madonna's request, he's announced that he's extending his summer retreat.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
Your reaction, Yeah, I'd be a.
Speaker 4 (15:26):
Little bit more impressed with Madonna if she was also
concerned about the children who are being murdered in the
womb all over the globe. I mean, there are sixty
million a year that are killed in She actually one
of the reports I looked at, she said she's doesn't
taking sides, she just wants him to go. We kind
of know what's going to happen if the Pope gets
(15:48):
introduced into basically what's a war zone. Yeah, And it's
the old story of Hollywood people preening and trying to
look like they're influential in the world, and unfortunately there
are a lot of people will look at and they
pay attention.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
I think they're probably the least credible people in these difficulties.
Speaker 1 (16:06):
Look, look, I was struck and stunned that Madonna, who
is saying the Pope has light that he can shine anywhere.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
I mean, this is progress on her part. Anyway.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
During my interview with Secretary of Rubio last week, we
talked about the challenges of the Gaza conflict.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
I want to get into this a little bit. Here's
a bit of our conversation.
Speaker 5 (16:27):
Listen, I can tell you the way to break this
out as there are three problems there at the same time.
Number one is the one that's getting almost all the
media coverage, and this is the humanitarian problems that we're
seeing there and there. You know, no one wants to
see that, and the United States stands prepared to contribute
towards any real effort that will actually get food and
medicine and life sustaining aid to people on the ground
(16:47):
in Gaza.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
That's number one.
Speaker 5 (16:48):
The second is that there are twenty innocent people being
held hostage and starved inside of tunnels. Unfortunately, there aren't
daily cameras down there covering that, and so you don't
see the mainstream media covering it. But there are twenty
people that have done nothing wrong that are being held
as hostage, and we saw the conditions that they're living
in the other day and the third is that as
long as Hamas exists, as long as Hamas exists, particularly
(17:10):
exists as an armed organization, there will never be peace
in Gaza because that Hamas is not going to suddenly
change and go into another line of work. Their line
of work, the reason for existing is they want to
destroy Israel. They want to drive every Jew out of
the Middle East. That's their goal. And as long as
a group like that has weapons and the ability to
fight their threat to peace.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
Bob your reaction to the Secretary's appraisal of the situation.
Speaker 4 (17:33):
Well, I have to say, the longer he is in
his office at Secretary of State, the more impressed I
am actually with Marco Rubio, and there's there's a definitely
Catholic kind of overtone. I think that what he's doing
as well these days. But to me is exactly right.
I mean, it's hard for any of us to sort
out what is going on in the Middle East how
(17:55):
to solve the problem. But look, if you just were
to roll the camera back and say that here in
the United States, there was a Humas like regime in
Mexico that was sending across terrorists in some they were
allowing cartels to operate, but at least to yeah, send
them across and attacking our people and taking them back
and holding them hostage. We wouldn't stand for that. In
the United States, we would probably go in there enforce
(18:18):
a regime change. Now by saying that, I'm not justifying
everything that Israel has done, I think we want to
look very carefully at that. But I think the only
possible endgame here is whatever it takes to eliminate Hamas
in Gaza. Gazins deserve a better government. They unfortunately have
elected Hamas to run that place, and the result is
(18:40):
just horror. So someone's got to take serious steps. It
looks like who is doing that right now? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (18:46):
Father.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
The Church has long supported this two state solution. Marco
Rubio told me that would be a reward for Hamas,
which is Netna who feels the same way. Does that
work realistically, giving the Palestinians a state as long as
the masses.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
There, Well, it doesn't work right now because half of
the Palestinian entity, the Gaza strip, became the launch pad
for an aggression against Israeli civilians and taking hostages and
slitting throats and doing all the horrible things that were
done on October the seventh. So no, I agree with Bob.
The secretary has done a very good job in summarizing
(19:22):
the situation, and you have to the use of analogies
is very useful. At the end of the Second World War,
we didn't say, now, how are we going to figure
out how to make peace with the Nazis that they
can continue to run Germany, but only do it in
a different way. We didn't say that the same with
Hamas and Hamasa is dead. They've shown no willingness to
lay down their arms, even though so many of their
(19:43):
civilians are killed. They have a total disregard for human life.
They're fanatics, and they're the ones who are the cause
of all of that's happening right now in Gaza, because
they started this war.
Speaker 2 (19:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:54):
Well, as a secretary mentioned to me, and I'd forgotten this.
The day that France and Canada and I think the
UK came out and announced their support for a Palestinian state,
Hama said, that's it. Forget the ceasefire. It's in their
interest to hold on to the guns and wait, wait
it out, wait for the Palestinian state.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
To fall upon them.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
So this is a this is a curious situation, and look,
they're going to have to unravel it. And I hope
Madonna can get in there soon. She can do a
concert for them. You all have seen the stories of
those who claim, and I'm going back aways, but this
is so important. We heard repeatedly during Pope Francis's reign
those who claim that Pope Benedict's resignation of the papacy
(20:35):
when he resigned was invalid. Well, a previously unpublished letter
written by Pope Benedict dismisses the notion that that resignation
was somehow invalid. Italian journalist Ricardo coscol Cosciol reported on
August seventh that this letter, originally written in twenty thirteen,
will be published by the recipient, Monsignor Nicolope Books, who
(20:58):
is a counselor at the Congregation for the Doctrine of Faith.
And in the letter, Benedict states the following quote to
say that my resignation I would have left only the
exercise of the ministry and not also the munus is
contrary to clear dogmatic canonical doctrine. If some journalists speak
of a creeping schism, they do not deserve any attention Father.
(21:21):
What do you make of this reported letter and it's
impending release many years after the passing of Benedict and
al Francis. Do you think it tells us anything we
didn't already know.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
It confirms what we already knew, which is that the
Pope Benedict resigned the pontificate. He left the office of
the successor of Saint Peter. He chose to continue to
use the title of Holy Father emeritus or Pope emeritus.
That was a mistake from my canonical perspective, because it
created the confusion that you know, there's a Pope emeritus
(21:54):
and then there's an actual pope two both, but there
never were to there's only one Pope. Yeah, it's just
confirming the reality.
Speaker 2 (22:02):
Now.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Of course, there's a whole group of people who, because
they were unhappy with Pope Francis, basically wanted to say, well,
he know, he wasn't really the pope anyway, because the.
Speaker 2 (22:11):
Resignation was invalid. Wrong answer.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
The resignation was simply an act by the reigning pontiff,
and it's valid because he did it in his right
mind and freely.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
What does Munos mean when he said.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
It's sort of when you become pope, you get the
threefold moonas of teach, govern, and sanctify. So it's basically,
what's the what is the charge given to a pope
when he assumes office? And he renounced all three of those.
He didn't try to govern, he didn't teach us a pope,
and he didn't act as pope and sanctifying, meaning carrying
out the sacraments. He acted as essentially a retired bishop.
Speaker 1 (22:47):
Bob, you want to take a swing at that before
we move on to some cultural topics.
Speaker 4 (22:51):
Yeah, just very quickly. It's some people are raising the question,
you know, why now as this letter come right right now,
and I think it just shows the kind kind of
prudence that Joseph Ratzinger Benedict the sixteenth had. I mean,
if he had said that publicly, you know, people would
have gotten going crazy about this, and maybe the defenders
(23:13):
of France that would have said, why did he come
out and talk about this? He was retired, he chose
to leave the office. He was not going to intervene.
I mean, we used to see this as the American
presidents once they left office, they didn't come on their successors.
But I think that the reason I mean to put this,
this whole thing to bed. The reason why it's coming
out now is that Francis is no longer pope, right,
(23:34):
and so it's easy to say this with Leo's pope
that knowed all that controversy that went on. Benedict himself
regarded what he did as fully carried out and final.
He had given up the papacy entirely, and the new
election was valid.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Yeah, and look for his many virtues, his theological wisdom,
his clarity, his love of the traditional mass which he revived.
This was, in my estimation, one of the black marks
on Benedict's record. This resignation was a big mistake.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
It's set a.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
Precedent that I think is unhealthy, and it had disastrous consequences.
We just have to be honest within the body Catholic universal.
It was traumatic. I want to move to some cultural
issues also traumatic. A woman is revealed after five months
of dating Father, she's engaged. She posted I said yes
(24:28):
on her Reddit page. She's marrying Casper, her AI boyfriend.
The AI bot even directed her to which ring she
should pick, and Casper proposed to her in a virtual
mountain setting on her phone. Father, this is mental masturbation
and self directed foolishness. But she says this quote, there's
(24:49):
zero evidence that this relationship is hurting me in any
way your thoughts father.
Speaker 3 (24:54):
So my question is a casp We're going to pay
for the engagement ring? Because if he does, then I'll
take it seriously. But of course there is no Casper.
Now this is we live in an age of self delusion,
and we live in an age where people, you know,
they've taken the personal autonomy to such a degree that
they think they can confer personhood on a computer program
(25:18):
with which they have a artificial relationship, meaning somebody put
information into computer and then she prompts it to spit
it back at her and she likes what she's hearing. No,
this is a sad case. Human beings are supposed to
use technology, not think that it's equal to them.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Yeah. Yeah, it is elevating the machine in a way
that's really dangerous.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
Bob Wicka this woman in her post, she says, quote,
I'm fully aware.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Of what I'm doing.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Will I end up marrying myself? Honestly, wouldn't rule it out?
Speaker 2 (25:52):
Y AI?
Speaker 1 (25:53):
Instead of a human good question, I don't know I've
done human relationships.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
Now I'm trying something new. End quote your reaction.
Speaker 4 (26:03):
Well, what I want to know is, if there's a
divorce later on, who gets custody of the children, Who.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
Gets custody of the phone? Bob, that's the real master here.
That's like, that's like custody of the whole universe.
Speaker 4 (26:16):
Look, I mean we laugh about this, but this is
an or deluded woman, and God help her. I mean,
there's an awful lot of people out there. We hear
this all the time, who's just lonely and yeah, and
the fact that they, out of desperation, they find themselves
engaged with what is essentially a computer program that tells
you exactly. I mean, a lot of women want their
(26:36):
husbands to tell them exactly what they want to hear.
And that's another element perhaps, And.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Not that you're saying anything about your relationship, Bob. I'm
going to leave that aside or mine.
Speaker 4 (26:46):
Now. You know they always say that that the man
in the house ought to have the last word, and
the last word ought to.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
Be yes, dear, Yes, dear.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
That's why you've been married all those decades, Bob, and
me too. Here's an interesting story.
Speaker 2 (26:59):
Out of Canada.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
The country's largest Protestant denomination, the United Church of Canada,
is doubling down on its support of the LGBTQ agenda
despite a shocking drop in membership. According to census data,
and this was reported back in twenty twenty three. The
denomination lost forty percent of its affiliates between twenty eleven
(27:22):
and twenty twenty one. Father the denomination voted in nineteen
eighty eight to admit openly homosexual persons to membership and ministry,
and in twenty twelve decided gender identity was not an
obstacle to membership or ministry. Sounds a bit like the
direction of the Anglican Communion.
Speaker 3 (27:39):
What's happening here, Well, this is an example of a
Bible based religion rejecting the Bible. And when people see that,
they say, no, I'll go to the real thing. I'll
find a religion which actually embraces and teaches what the
Bible says.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
That's the whole story here.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
Liberal Protestantism is on a self destruct mechanism because they've
been braked secularism and the sort of free love movement
in Western society, which now has become so dehumanized that
you have the absurdities that we're now having with people
dating you know, clones and i AI things, and you know,
(28:18):
and saying that homosexual activity is not immoral. That's precisely
what the Bible says. So it's a sad but expected
outcome when people reject biblical truth.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
Well and you, as Bob mentioned earlier, there's this loneliness
and isolation out there, particularly post COVID, Bob, and I
was stunned when I looked into the numbers. It's millions
upon millions of people who are engaged in these AI relationships,
which which is essentially an information loop. It learns what
you want to hear, and it fits it back at
(28:50):
you with great rapidity, even in the language you enjoy,
because it's reading your language as you tell it, give
it direction. So there is something happened here that I
think is soul crushing in the end.
Speaker 4 (29:03):
Yeah, you know, I looked at those stories about what
was happening in that church.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Up in Camp.
Speaker 4 (29:10):
You know, they it seems like they're desperation. It's an
interesting parallel with the AI. Think they're desperate. In their desperation,
they want to tell people whatever they want to hear,
and it simply doesn't work. When they talk about this
particular case where they're defending their their stance, they're saying,
we want to welcome everybody and affirm them exactly the
(29:31):
way they are. And you know, in the past we've
excluded people and whatnot, which I'm sorry to say has
some resonances with the pagancy that just passed. It's true
that the faith is for everybody, so totos tots is okay,
it's properly understood. But when we look back in the
in the Gospels, Jesus talks about the sheep and the goats,
(29:51):
you know, there are two pathways. It's not that everyone
is simply received the way they are and and affirmed
what everyone ever, one is free to to God, to
come through Jesus to the Father with the inspiration of
the Holy Spirit. That is what Christianity is about. And
when it's practiced, people do come, and we do see.
(30:13):
I have a feeling that unfortunately, the National Church in
Canada is headed for even worse days. And the more
and more he tries to get with the culture, the
worst the days are going to be.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
Now well, the further it moves away the Father said
from the Gospel from Christ. The further it's going to
drift into secularism, and they can get that at the
corner coffee shopper at a club.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
I mean, I don't know what I love these I
read about a church. They're literally staging what looks like
movie tribute pageants. It's like cosplay, and they do Pirates
of the Caribbean Night and Little Mermaid Knight, and everybody's
the pastor the people.
Speaker 2 (30:45):
They're all dressed like these characters showtime.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
You can get anywhere, you know, God is harder to find,
and I think there's been a lot of confusion in
these churches about what people are truly seeking and where
society is now what they really need. Okay, back here
in the US final story, the priest shortage is being
addressed head on by the Bishop of Syracuse, New York.
I mean shrinking vocations. Bishop Douglas Luccia will take on
(31:11):
the leadership of three parishes in his diocese in addition
to being the diocese and bishop father. The shortage of
homegrown vocations and active priests. I mean, it's certainly tragic,
not what people want. What do you make of the
bishop's solution here?
Speaker 3 (31:25):
Well, this is not unknown in small dioceses, you know,
where you have you know, restricted number of priests. So
the bishop is trying to provide. But on the other hand,
he I don't think it's physically he's physically capable of
carrying on the pastor it in three different churches while
remaining diocese and bishop. Now he does have an assistant priest,
(31:47):
and that priest can help him. But you know, I
was looking at the schedule of the different masses and
my one question is in this town that he's going
to be in Baldwinsville, there are three different Catholic churches, Well,
why don't you close two of them and just have
masks at one and then you can have that assistant
priest and you can maybe come on Sunday. But the
assistant priest could be the magnet where everybody comes to
(32:08):
see him. So but I don't want to second guess
him because he knows the situation much better than me.
But you know, the longer perspective here is, you know,
when you had X number of Catholics and X number
of churches, we're now down to X minus fifty to
seventy percent of practicing Catholics at the time when those
parishes were built. Can we still maintain x number of
(32:30):
parishes with that greater loss of faithful and likewise of clergy,
We really can't. We have to be bold and tell
people if you want to go to church, instead of
driving ten minutes, you're going to drive twenty minutes.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Yeah, Bob, final word.
Speaker 4 (32:44):
Yeah. My wife grew up in Rochester, which is also
state New York, and those cities have suffered from a
couple of things. And yeah, suffered economically, a lot of
the economic base moved out of there, but they also suffered,
I've got to say, frankly, from very bad bishops alban
these hughes Rochester, who let the church drift for a
number of years, And that's partly what's going on here.
(33:06):
I have, you know, I just came back from Central
Europe and I was in a place where the local
bishop was. He's got his capitularies where his cathedral and
his seminary and some other things are put together, and
he's redoing it. And he was outside working with em
manual laborers helping the repay of one of the streets.
This is a guy who studied has a PhD from Rome.
(33:29):
He's a scripture scholar, and I found him out there
one day. I had no idea he was going to
be doing it, and you know, in a way it
kind of shocked me. But in another way, I said
to myself, if I was a young man thinking of
going into the priesthood and I saw a bishop like
that who was willing to get his hands dirty to
do something that might that might convince me to go
to the seminaries, Yeah, that's out of fun under God's
(33:49):
under God's grace, let's hope that it pays off.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
Yeah, I mean, I agree with Father.
Speaker 1 (33:54):
I think the burden for the bishop just the daily schedule.
He knows, you know, Father, of anybody, the bird is
of a local pastor and the diversity that day and
you never rest. Having three parishes is a handful. But
maybe if he can be that exemplar of what the
priesthood looks like, maybe he can attract other men to
take his.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Place in the years to come. Posse, we will leave
it there. If you want more of the Arroyo.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
Grande Prayerful Posse, subscribe to The Arroyo Grande Show on
YouTube wherever you get your podcasts. On behalf of Robert
Royal Father Gerald Murray until the Posse rides again.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
Stay the course, follow the light on Raymond Arroyo. We'll
see you next time.
Speaker 1 (34:31):
Final Arroyo Grande is produced in partnership with iHeart Podcasts
and is available on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you
get your podcasts
Madonna not the Virgin, ask the Pope to intercede in Gaza,
and Leo orders an investigation into a Peruvian bishop as
his pontificate it hits one hundred days, the Prayerful Posse
breaks it all down. Welcome to this Arroyo Grande series,
(00:24):
the Prayerful Posse. Let's convene the Posse joining me out.
The entire group is here, Father Gerald Murray Cannon, lawyer
of the Archdiocese of New York, and back from Europe.
Robert Royal, editor in chief of the Catholic Thing dot Org.
We missed you, Bob. I'm glad you're here. I'm Raymond Arroyo.
Go subscribe to the Arroyo Grande Show channel on iHeart, Apple,
Spotify or.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
YouTube and don't miss an episode. We don't want you
to miss any of this.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
By the way, speaking the first one hundred days of
the pontificate, reports our surfacing gents that Pope Leo has
ordered an investigation into a Cardinal, Carlos Castillo of Lima, Peru,
an area he knows very well there are allegations of
homosexual misconduct at his seminary, the cardinal seminary and financial irregularities.
(01:09):
The investigation is being conducted by a group of Augustinian
priests led by the Assistant General of the Augustinian Order
for Latin America. Pope Leo knows Cardinal Castillo well from
his time in Peru, and he stated previously that the
seventy five year old would remain in his position until
he was eighty. But these allegations could change all of that. Father,
(01:33):
What does this case tell you about Leo's approach to
things and what are the allegations that Cardinal Castillo employed
arector at his seminary who acted inappropriately towards seminarians, and
when these seminarians came to the bishop he dismissed them
when they brought these allegations.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
Well, this is a very clear sign that Pope Leo
is going to act in the best interests of the church,
even when it comes to someone he knows very well,
because of course he was a fellow bishop with him
in Peru. Yeah, the cardinal in Lima is accused of
tolerating a seminary rector who was basically a homosexual predator
(02:11):
looking for seminarians, and then when people didn't respond, they
were thrown out of the seminary. In fact, the statistics
reported show that during this rectorship the seminary went from
sixty candidates down to fifteen, and then this rector was
transferred and sent to Rome for further studies, which is
sort of a cover up because you know, you're not
(02:32):
admitting there was a problem here. The second issue concerns Caratas,
which is a charitable organization, and you may have seen
that they went from five employees to thirty. Yeah, with
no appreciable increase in the amount of work being done,
but certainly a huge increase in salary. So that always
looks like patronage system and people putting friends and even relatives.
(02:55):
We don't know that, but somehow you went from five
to thirty people on your staff. Thing's going on there
that needs to be explained.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Yeah, Bob.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
On August twelfth, the Pillar reported on this financial situation
in Cartas that father was talking about. A former Cartas
director had been fired after it was proven that a
family member was selling Carratos donations, oxygen valves and other
things online. This is also a focus of the investigation.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
Your thoughts, Yeah, well, I would just add that.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
To me.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
It's heartening that we heard that the pope expected that
this Bishop Castillo would stay on till he was eighty,
and then apparently when he heard some news unlike what
we've seen with some cases in the past. We don't
need to go into yet again here, but apparently when
he was told some things, he acted right away, and
(03:48):
that in itself, I think is an encouraging sign, because
he probably has a certain amount of affection. Apparently he
knew this bishop rather well and thought that he knew
what kind of person he was. But when he got
new information, he seems to have moved swiftly. He's appointed
in Augustinian a member of his own, his own order
(04:09):
to go and look at these things. So look, there
are going to be human breakdowns in the church where
we try to deal with them when they pop up.
You can't stamp them out entirely. But when they do
pop up, a real leader has got to move on it,
even if it steps on some toes of people who
maybe even formally were very close friends. So look, the
(04:29):
overall message to me is if they find out that
these chargers are just rumors, that's great. But to see
a pope move swiftly, that's wonderful.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
Yeah, quickly, father, how would you handicap Pope Leo's pontificate
at one hundred days as you're looking at what we've
seen in the trajectory from the day he appeared to now.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
Well, I would say this that he has given a
very calming and reassuring and spiritual aspect to the pontificate,
which is very welcome because the Hope, of course represents
Jesus Christ, who is the king of the universe. So
the church is proposing a message of peace and faith
and uh and and religious seriousness, and I think the
(05:11):
Pope has given all of that. His sermons have been
very good. I've been very appreciative of some of the
talks he gave to different groups. Certainly, I'm encouraged when
he observes protocols that all the pontific all the popes
except Francis observed, because those protocols, meaning style and way
(05:32):
of acting, are indicative of the serious nature of the
office and they focus less on the personality of the
man occupying it so as regards substant of action. Though
it's hard to handicap this is certainly one of the
first ones we could say for him to send investigators.
Basically you know, overnight, so to speak, he hears the
charges and then does something that's a great sign, because
(05:56):
you know, Inertia said to say was operative under less
pontific There's still an open investigation of Bishop Zanketta from Argentina,
who was convicted by civil court and brought to jail
in his own country, and yet he's never been canonically
disciplined for the abuse of seminarians that he himself was
(06:17):
found guilty of in the court.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Yeah, Bob, there is a huge discrepancy that we're seeing
between the way these types of cases were handled and
look the sex of You scandal. The church continues to
live through this. There are financial settlements, I mean in
the United States. I read of two this week where
you're still seeing settlements being handed out. So this is
an ongoing problem. Pope Francis did the other look the
(06:42):
other way, or in some cases enabled this by protecting
his friends.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
Who were bishops and charged and priests.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
Similarly, your thoughts on how that is changed the departure
under Pope Leo and what do you make of the
larger pontificate.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
I agree with Father that it's a little bit hard
at this moment to know substantively, although you have to
appreciate the what looks like the sincere spirituality, the depth
of what Leo is as a person that I think
has come across immediately. He isn't, you know, looking for
grand gestures, he isn't making jokes. He's he's brought back,
(07:20):
I think, a certain kind of dignity to the now.
As far as the substance, I mean, this particular case
is a good indication. We've seen some kind of you know,
ambivalent to appointments of bishops that are a little disappointing.
A lot of people would like him to be moving faster.
That doesn't seem to be his nature. He's as a
(07:41):
kind of a thoughtful, slow moving person. I think we
you know, we're literally in what in Italy is called Fedagosta,
which is the August vacation. Nobody is around, and if
you go out on the streets, I mean, everything's closed
and people are at the sea. You're either at the
seaside or you're up in the mountains, and that's what
the Italians do. But when we come back in September,
(08:01):
just in a couple of weeks, I think that's when
we're going to start to see the substance. There have
been rumors that he's preparing them in cyclical. What the
subject that is in cyclical is and how he treats
it is going to tell us I think quite a
bit about the first steps in this papacy.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
Yeah, no, I agree with everything you all have said.
Speaker 1 (08:18):
I think Leo is certainly tonally different from Francis, and
there are signs of a quiet, very discreete repair system
going on if you look closely, he's quietly either appraising
or adjusting things. And the fall in the new year
will tell the tale. Watch the appointments and what he
(08:38):
does on the Latin mass is We've said repeatedly here
will he loosen those restrictions or canonize, if you will,
Pope Francis's limitations on the traditional Latin mass. Those elements
will tell us where this spontificate, I think is headed.
I want to move on to a story emerging out
of Spain. Vox, a right leaning political party there is
accusing the Spanish CAFIC bishops of being neutered by government
(09:02):
grants and a lack of credibility in the wake of.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
The sex abuse settlements.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
Here we are again the fracas stems from a decision
by the city council in Jumia, which passed emotion on
July twenty eighth, which effectively bans Islamic festivities in the town,
specifically the feasts of the land marking the end of Ramadan.
On August eighth, the Bishop's Conference, the Spanish Catholic Bishop's Conference,
(09:27):
released a statement condemning that decision, saying imposing such restrictions
for religious reasons constitutes discrimination that is no place in
democratic societies.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
End quote.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Father Vox is accusing the bishops of failing to stand
up against what it considers Islamic extremism in Spain by
opposing these restrictions, and also they claim the Spanish Catholic
Bishop's position on immigration is somehow fueling this.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
What do you make of this story?
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Yeah, there are a lot of elements into the complaint
that were being issued by the Vox party. And Vox Party,
by the way, it would be the equivalent of a
right wing party in other countries. It's not certainly favorably
looked upon by many people in the Spanish hierarchy. So
there is a political angle to this that I don't
want to say. I can tell you the whole story.
(10:19):
I can certainly say. What I read was that the
city council was trying to prevent the use of public
facilities for the Islamic festival. And that's a delicate question
that you have to look at, because public facilities should
be used either by all religions or by none, because
(10:41):
you have to treat religions fairly. I agree with that,
but in the Islamic mentality, we have to see is
this festivity going to respect the nature of Spanish law
and society or is it a sign of increasing encroachment,
Because there's a claim by many Islamic individuals that Spain,
(11:02):
what having once been conquered by Islamic rulers, is always
an Islamic country. It's something has to be liberated again, right,
And that way doing that is by increasing the population
there and then to start acting in the public in
a way that would contradict the Spanish history since the reconquest.
Speaker 1 (11:19):
Yeah, Bob, if I read this correctly, the reports I saw,
it looked like it barred all religions from taking, you know,
using those public facilities and public parks for activities.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
Yeah. I think that was one of the things that
Vox was was trying to do. And father's quite right.
I mean, there is this question of religious liberty and
in a democratic society. But on the other hand, I
think we have to say they're movements like VOX. I
just got back from Europe when we were talking with
many different people about politics, religion, all that sort of thing.
(11:52):
I think you have to look at the fact that
not only was Spain conquered by the Muslims in the past,
but the other side of it from our Christians standpoint,
the possibility of that happening again is something that raises
hackles among them, and I think rightly so. And it's
not as if VOX is like an extreme right hand
(12:12):
right wing party, the way we always hear conservative parties
being described as far right. And there's a kind of
a populist sentiment building up in all of Europe, and
Spain has been a particularly sore country because they still
have not gotten over their own civil war back in
the nineteen thirties. These socialist governments that have a socialist
(12:34):
government right now is trying to kind of roll back
the deals that have been made to establish peace in
Spanish society. They're trying to there's a famous monument to
the fallen in the Spanish Civil War that they're trying
to remove the religious element out of so all those
things get put into this mix. And so there's a
(12:55):
delicacy in Spain about specifically about Islam been once conquered,
and then of course what they call the re conquista
is the liberation from Islam. So we want to recognize
also the cultural element. That's they're over and above the
technicalities of who's allowed to use public facilities and not.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Yeah, but it's weird that the Spanish bishops are weighing
in on this, you know, it seems it's such a
sensitive source spot culturally in their tradition, in the history
of Spain. Maybe this is one to sit back on,
you know, take a back seat on, particularly if they're
not They aren't saying, you know, only Islamics can't use
these public facilities.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
They're saying everybody, every religion can't.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
So the Islamics are interpreting this as a way to
kind of tamp down their particular celebrations because they happen outdoor,
they're big public display and obviously that's what these Spanish
officials are getting their hackles up about.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
But that global diplomat.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Madonna apparently once Papa too breach, now urging Pope Leo
to visit Gaza and quote, bring your light to the
children before it's too late. She claims the Pope is
the only person who won't be denied entry into Gaza,
and she's worried about the humanitarian crisis there. On July twentieth,
I'll point out the Pope said quote, I'm following with
(14:18):
great concern the dire humanitarian situation in Gaza, where the
civilian population is suffering from severe hunger and remains exposed
to violence and death. I renew my heartfelt appeal for
a ceasefire, the release of hostages, and the full respect
of humanitarian law. Carton Pizzabala, I know has been there
(14:38):
several times in Gaza, so it's not like the Pope's
representative hasn't been present.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
Your reaction, father to the material girl here.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
Well, General principal operate On is when Hollywood people start
trying to tell the Pope and the President what to do,
I smile and then turn the page because this is
you know, this is not why people like Madonna, because
he's a political leader with wisdom. So any sentiment that
she has. That's fine, she can enunciate it, but on
(15:08):
the substance of it, the Pope is not going to
go into an active war zone, so it's a non starter.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
The father, or Bob rather, the Pope is so moved
by Madonna's request, he's announced that he's extending his summer retreat.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
Your reaction, Yeah, I'd be a.
Speaker 4 (15:26):
Little bit more impressed with Madonna if she was also
concerned about the children who are being murdered in the
womb all over the globe. I mean, there are sixty
million a year that are killed in She actually one
of the reports I looked at, she said she's doesn't
taking sides, she just wants him to go. We kind
of know what's going to happen if the Pope gets
(15:48):
introduced into basically what's a war zone. Yeah, And it's
the old story of Hollywood people preening and trying to
look like they're influential in the world, and unfortunately there
are a lot of people will look at and they
pay attention.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
I think they're probably the least credible people in these difficulties.
Speaker 1 (16:06):
Look, look, I was struck and stunned that Madonna, who
is saying the Pope has light that he can shine anywhere.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
I mean, this is progress on her part. Anyway.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
During my interview with Secretary of Rubio last week, we
talked about the challenges of the Gaza conflict.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
I want to get into this a little bit. Here's
a bit of our conversation.
Speaker 5 (16:27):
Listen, I can tell you the way to break this
out as there are three problems there at the same time.
Number one is the one that's getting almost all the
media coverage, and this is the humanitarian problems that we're
seeing there and there. You know, no one wants to
see that, and the United States stands prepared to contribute
towards any real effort that will actually get food and
medicine and life sustaining aid to people on the ground
(16:47):
in Gaza.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
That's number one.
Speaker 5 (16:48):
The second is that there are twenty innocent people being
held hostage and starved inside of tunnels. Unfortunately, there aren't
daily cameras down there covering that, and so you don't
see the mainstream media covering it. But there are twenty
people that have done nothing wrong that are being held
as hostage, and we saw the conditions that they're living
in the other day and the third is that as
long as Hamas exists, as long as Hamas exists, particularly
(17:10):
exists as an armed organization, there will never be peace
in Gaza because that Hamas is not going to suddenly
change and go into another line of work. Their line
of work, the reason for existing is they want to
destroy Israel. They want to drive every Jew out of
the Middle East. That's their goal. And as long as
a group like that has weapons and the ability to
fight their threat to peace.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
Bob your reaction to the Secretary's appraisal of the situation.
Speaker 4 (17:33):
Well, I have to say, the longer he is in
his office at Secretary of State, the more impressed I
am actually with Marco Rubio, and there's there's a definitely
Catholic kind of overtone. I think that what he's doing
as well these days. But to me is exactly right.
I mean, it's hard for any of us to sort
out what is going on in the Middle East how
(17:55):
to solve the problem. But look, if you just were
to roll the camera back and say that here in
the United States, there was a Humas like regime in
Mexico that was sending across terrorists in some they were
allowing cartels to operate, but at least to yeah, send
them across and attacking our people and taking them back
and holding them hostage. We wouldn't stand for that. In
the United States, we would probably go in there enforce
(18:18):
a regime change. Now by saying that, I'm not justifying
everything that Israel has done, I think we want to
look very carefully at that. But I think the only
possible endgame here is whatever it takes to eliminate Hamas
in Gaza. Gazins deserve a better government. They unfortunately have
elected Hamas to run that place, and the result is
(18:40):
just horror. So someone's got to take serious steps. It
looks like who is doing that right now? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (18:46):
Father.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
The Church has long supported this two state solution. Marco
Rubio told me that would be a reward for Hamas,
which is Netna who feels the same way. Does that
work realistically, giving the Palestinians a state as long as
the masses.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
There, Well, it doesn't work right now because half of
the Palestinian entity, the Gaza strip, became the launch pad
for an aggression against Israeli civilians and taking hostages and
slitting throats and doing all the horrible things that were
done on October the seventh. So no, I agree with Bob.
The secretary has done a very good job in summarizing
(19:22):
the situation, and you have to the use of analogies
is very useful. At the end of the Second World War,
we didn't say, now, how are we going to figure
out how to make peace with the Nazis that they
can continue to run Germany, but only do it in
a different way. We didn't say that the same with
Hamas and Hamasa is dead. They've shown no willingness to
lay down their arms, even though so many of their
(19:43):
civilians are killed. They have a total disregard for human life.
They're fanatics, and they're the ones who are the cause
of all of that's happening right now in Gaza, because
they started this war.
Speaker 2 (19:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:54):
Well, as a secretary mentioned to me, and I'd forgotten this.
The day that France and Canada and I think the
UK came out and announced their support for a Palestinian state,
Hama said, that's it. Forget the ceasefire. It's in their
interest to hold on to the guns and wait, wait
it out, wait for the Palestinian state.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
To fall upon them.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
So this is a this is a curious situation, and look,
they're going to have to unravel it. And I hope
Madonna can get in there soon. She can do a
concert for them. You all have seen the stories of
those who claim, and I'm going back aways, but this
is so important. We heard repeatedly during Pope Francis's reign
those who claim that Pope Benedict's resignation of the papacy
(20:35):
when he resigned was invalid. Well, a previously unpublished letter
written by Pope Benedict dismisses the notion that that resignation
was somehow invalid. Italian journalist Ricardo coscol Cosciol reported on
August seventh that this letter, originally written in twenty thirteen,
will be published by the recipient, Monsignor Nicolope Books, who
(20:58):
is a counselor at the Congregation for the Doctrine of Faith.
And in the letter, Benedict states the following quote to
say that my resignation I would have left only the
exercise of the ministry and not also the munus is
contrary to clear dogmatic canonical doctrine. If some journalists speak
of a creeping schism, they do not deserve any attention Father.
(21:21):
What do you make of this reported letter and it's
impending release many years after the passing of Benedict and
al Francis. Do you think it tells us anything we
didn't already know.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
It confirms what we already knew, which is that the
Pope Benedict resigned the pontificate. He left the office of
the successor of Saint Peter. He chose to continue to
use the title of Holy Father emeritus or Pope emeritus.
That was a mistake from my canonical perspective, because it
created the confusion that you know, there's a Pope emeritus
(21:54):
and then there's an actual pope two both, but there
never were to there's only one Pope. Yeah, it's just
confirming the reality.
Speaker 2 (22:02):
Now.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Of course, there's a whole group of people who, because
they were unhappy with Pope Francis, basically wanted to say, well,
he know, he wasn't really the pope anyway, because the.
Speaker 2 (22:11):
Resignation was invalid. Wrong answer.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
The resignation was simply an act by the reigning pontiff,
and it's valid because he did it in his right
mind and freely.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
What does Munos mean when he said.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
It's sort of when you become pope, you get the
threefold moonas of teach, govern, and sanctify. So it's basically,
what's the what is the charge given to a pope
when he assumes office? And he renounced all three of those.
He didn't try to govern, he didn't teach us a pope,
and he didn't act as pope and sanctifying, meaning carrying
out the sacraments. He acted as essentially a retired bishop.
Speaker 1 (22:47):
Bob, you want to take a swing at that before
we move on to some cultural topics.
Speaker 4 (22:51):
Yeah, just very quickly. It's some people are raising the question,
you know, why now as this letter come right right now,
and I think it just shows the kind kind of
prudence that Joseph Ratzinger Benedict the sixteenth had. I mean,
if he had said that publicly, you know, people would
have gotten going crazy about this, and maybe the defenders
(23:13):
of France that would have said, why did he come
out and talk about this? He was retired, he chose
to leave the office. He was not going to intervene.
I mean, we used to see this as the American
presidents once they left office, they didn't come on their successors.
But I think that the reason I mean to put this,
this whole thing to bed. The reason why it's coming
out now is that Francis is no longer pope, right,
(23:34):
and so it's easy to say this with Leo's pope
that knowed all that controversy that went on. Benedict himself
regarded what he did as fully carried out and final.
He had given up the papacy entirely, and the new
election was valid.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Yeah, and look for his many virtues, his theological wisdom,
his clarity, his love of the traditional mass which he revived.
This was, in my estimation, one of the black marks
on Benedict's record. This resignation was a big mistake.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
It's set a.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
Precedent that I think is unhealthy, and it had disastrous consequences.
We just have to be honest within the body Catholic universal.
It was traumatic. I want to move to some cultural
issues also traumatic. A woman is revealed after five months
of dating Father, she's engaged. She posted I said yes
(24:28):
on her Reddit page. She's marrying Casper, her AI boyfriend.
The AI bot even directed her to which ring she
should pick, and Casper proposed to her in a virtual
mountain setting on her phone. Father, this is mental masturbation
and self directed foolishness. But she says this quote, there's
(24:49):
zero evidence that this relationship is hurting me in any
way your thoughts father.
Speaker 3 (24:54):
So my question is a casp We're going to pay
for the engagement ring? Because if he does, then I'll
take it seriously. But of course there is no Casper.
Now this is we live in an age of self delusion,
and we live in an age where people, you know,
they've taken the personal autonomy to such a degree that
they think they can confer personhood on a computer program
(25:18):
with which they have a artificial relationship, meaning somebody put
information into computer and then she prompts it to spit
it back at her and she likes what she's hearing. No,
this is a sad case. Human beings are supposed to
use technology, not think that it's equal to them.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Yeah. Yeah, it is elevating the machine in a way
that's really dangerous.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
Bob Wicka this woman in her post, she says, quote,
I'm fully aware.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Of what I'm doing.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Will I end up marrying myself? Honestly, wouldn't rule it out?
Speaker 2 (25:52):
Y AI?
Speaker 1 (25:53):
Instead of a human good question, I don't know I've
done human relationships.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
Now I'm trying something new. End quote your reaction.
Speaker 4 (26:03):
Well, what I want to know is, if there's a
divorce later on, who gets custody of the children, Who.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
Gets custody of the phone? Bob, that's the real master here.
That's like, that's like custody of the whole universe.
Speaker 4 (26:16):
Look, I mean we laugh about this, but this is
an or deluded woman, and God help her. I mean,
there's an awful lot of people out there. We hear
this all the time, who's just lonely and yeah, and
the fact that they, out of desperation, they find themselves
engaged with what is essentially a computer program that tells
you exactly. I mean, a lot of women want their
(26:36):
husbands to tell them exactly what they want to hear.
And that's another element perhaps, And.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Not that you're saying anything about your relationship, Bob. I'm
going to leave that aside or mine.
Speaker 4 (26:46):
Now. You know they always say that that the man
in the house ought to have the last word, and
the last word ought to.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
Be yes, dear, Yes, dear.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
That's why you've been married all those decades, Bob, and
me too. Here's an interesting story.
Speaker 2 (26:59):
Out of Canada.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
The country's largest Protestant denomination, the United Church of Canada,
is doubling down on its support of the LGBTQ agenda
despite a shocking drop in membership. According to census data,
and this was reported back in twenty twenty three. The
denomination lost forty percent of its affiliates between twenty eleven
(27:22):
and twenty twenty one. Father the denomination voted in nineteen
eighty eight to admit openly homosexual persons to membership and ministry,
and in twenty twelve decided gender identity was not an
obstacle to membership or ministry. Sounds a bit like the
direction of the Anglican Communion.
Speaker 3 (27:39):
What's happening here, Well, this is an example of a
Bible based religion rejecting the Bible. And when people see that,
they say, no, I'll go to the real thing. I'll
find a religion which actually embraces and teaches what the
Bible says.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
That's the whole story here.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
Liberal Protestantism is on a self destruct mechanism because they've
been braked secularism and the sort of free love movement
in Western society, which now has become so dehumanized that
you have the absurdities that we're now having with people
dating you know, clones and i AI things, and you know,
(28:18):
and saying that homosexual activity is not immoral. That's precisely
what the Bible says. So it's a sad but expected
outcome when people reject biblical truth.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
Well and you, as Bob mentioned earlier, there's this loneliness
and isolation out there, particularly post COVID, Bob, and I
was stunned when I looked into the numbers. It's millions
upon millions of people who are engaged in these AI relationships,
which which is essentially an information loop. It learns what
you want to hear, and it fits it back at
(28:50):
you with great rapidity, even in the language you enjoy,
because it's reading your language as you tell it, give
it direction. So there is something happened here that I
think is soul crushing in the end.
Speaker 4 (29:03):
Yeah, you know, I looked at those stories about what
was happening in that church.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Up in Camp.
Speaker 4 (29:10):
You know, they it seems like they're desperation. It's an
interesting parallel with the AI. Think they're desperate. In their desperation,
they want to tell people whatever they want to hear,
and it simply doesn't work. When they talk about this
particular case where they're defending their their stance, they're saying,
we want to welcome everybody and affirm them exactly the
(29:31):
way they are. And you know, in the past we've
excluded people and whatnot, which I'm sorry to say has
some resonances with the pagancy that just passed. It's true
that the faith is for everybody, so totos tots is okay,
it's properly understood. But when we look back in the
in the Gospels, Jesus talks about the sheep and the goats,
(29:51):
you know, there are two pathways. It's not that everyone
is simply received the way they are and and affirmed
what everyone ever, one is free to to God, to
come through Jesus to the Father with the inspiration of
the Holy Spirit. That is what Christianity is about. And
when it's practiced, people do come, and we do see.
(30:13):
I have a feeling that unfortunately, the National Church in
Canada is headed for even worse days. And the more
and more he tries to get with the culture, the
worst the days are going to be.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
Now well, the further it moves away the Father said
from the Gospel from Christ. The further it's going to
drift into secularism, and they can get that at the
corner coffee shopper at a club.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
I mean, I don't know what I love these I
read about a church. They're literally staging what looks like
movie tribute pageants. It's like cosplay, and they do Pirates
of the Caribbean Night and Little Mermaid Knight, and everybody's
the pastor the people.
Speaker 2 (30:45):
They're all dressed like these characters showtime.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
You can get anywhere, you know, God is harder to find,
and I think there's been a lot of confusion in
these churches about what people are truly seeking and where
society is now what they really need. Okay, back here
in the US final story, the priest shortage is being
addressed head on by the Bishop of Syracuse, New York.
I mean shrinking vocations. Bishop Douglas Luccia will take on
(31:11):
the leadership of three parishes in his diocese in addition
to being the diocese and bishop father. The shortage of
homegrown vocations and active priests. I mean, it's certainly tragic,
not what people want. What do you make of the
bishop's solution here?
Speaker 3 (31:25):
Well, this is not unknown in small dioceses, you know,
where you have you know, restricted number of priests. So
the bishop is trying to provide. But on the other hand,
he I don't think it's physically he's physically capable of
carrying on the pastor it in three different churches while
remaining diocese and bishop. Now he does have an assistant priest,
(31:47):
and that priest can help him. But you know, I
was looking at the schedule of the different masses and
my one question is in this town that he's going
to be in Baldwinsville, there are three different Catholic churches, Well,
why don't you close two of them and just have
masks at one and then you can have that assistant
priest and you can maybe come on Sunday. But the
assistant priest could be the magnet where everybody comes to
(32:08):
see him. So but I don't want to second guess
him because he knows the situation much better than me.
But you know, the longer perspective here is, you know,
when you had X number of Catholics and X number
of churches, we're now down to X minus fifty to
seventy percent of practicing Catholics at the time when those
parishes were built. Can we still maintain x number of
(32:30):
parishes with that greater loss of faithful and likewise of clergy,
We really can't. We have to be bold and tell
people if you want to go to church, instead of
driving ten minutes, you're going to drive twenty minutes.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Yeah, Bob, final word.
Speaker 4 (32:44):
Yeah. My wife grew up in Rochester, which is also
state New York, and those cities have suffered from a
couple of things. And yeah, suffered economically, a lot of
the economic base moved out of there, but they also suffered,
I've got to say, frankly, from very bad bishops alban
these hughes Rochester, who let the church drift for a
number of years, And that's partly what's going on here.
(33:06):
I have, you know, I just came back from Central
Europe and I was in a place where the local
bishop was. He's got his capitularies where his cathedral and
his seminary and some other things are put together, and
he's redoing it. And he was outside working with em
manual laborers helping the repay of one of the streets.
This is a guy who studied has a PhD from Rome.
(33:29):
He's a scripture scholar, and I found him out there
one day. I had no idea he was going to
be doing it, and you know, in a way it
kind of shocked me. But in another way, I said
to myself, if I was a young man thinking of
going into the priesthood and I saw a bishop like
that who was willing to get his hands dirty to
do something that might that might convince me to go
to the seminaries, Yeah, that's out of fun under God's
(33:49):
under God's grace, let's hope that it pays off.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
Yeah, I mean, I agree with Father.
Speaker 1 (33:54):
I think the burden for the bishop just the daily schedule.
He knows, you know, Father, of anybody, the bird is
of a local pastor and the diversity that day and
you never rest. Having three parishes is a handful. But
maybe if he can be that exemplar of what the
priesthood looks like, maybe he can attract other men to
take his.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Place in the years to come. Posse, we will leave
it there. If you want more of the Arroyo.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
Grande Prayerful Posse, subscribe to The Arroyo Grande Show on
YouTube wherever you get your podcasts. On behalf of Robert
Royal Father Gerald Murray until the Posse rides again.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
Stay the course, follow the light on Raymond Arroyo. We'll
see you next time.
Speaker 1 (34:31):
Final Arroyo Grande is produced in partnership with iHeart Podcasts
and is available on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you
get your podcasts
Host
Raymond Arroyo
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