January 15, 2024 • 32 mins
Here's a question for you, dear listener, Do you feel lucky? Punk? Punk Wow? Sorry about the punk thing and the dodgy accent. The reason I ask is because today's episode explores luck, both good and bad, although mostly bad. Muncaster Castle in Cumbria is the home to the Pennington family and the home of Tom Foolery. Court Jesters - this episode is for you!
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Here's a question for you, dear listener, Do you feel lucky?
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Punk?
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Punk Wow? Sorry about the punk thing and the dodgy accent.
The reason I ask is because today's episode explores luck,
both good and bad, although mostly bad. Moncaster Castle in
Cumbria is the home to the Pennington family, and in
(00:25):
our previous month cast episode, I was talking to you
in Frost Pennington, the soon to be owner of the castle.
We got familiar with his sausages meat wow.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
However you describe it, it has indes.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
We heard about the castle's haunted tapestry room.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
We had too many people complaining that they couldn't sleep
because of the crying child. And supposedly the bit that
I like, hate be love is that it's fine the
child crying. It's just when the nurse starts singing to
try and calm the people get too freaked out.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
And Ewan told us about Muncaster's most famous resident, Tom Fall,
the guy who drowned people in quicksand for a laugh if.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
He didn't like the look of you. Supposedly, as the
story goes, he would direct you the less convenient quicksand
invested route.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
And then they get just sucked under and never heard
of again. Yeah, he's a murderer, exact directly.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Yeah, as I say, the sixteenth century sense of humor
is probably slightly different.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
You can say that again, the.
Speaker 3 (01:32):
Sixteenth century sense of humor is probably slightly different.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Yet all right, not literally. We had our own encounter
with Tom after trying to chat to Ian Douglas Moncaster's
current four. I'm happy to say we came out alive,
but it was certainly unnerving. To be fair, Youwan did
give us a heads up.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
The kind of legend is the term Tom foolery. We
use a lot of Moncaster because quite often technology or
just weird things go wrong exit actually the wrong time.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Remote recordings can have their challenges. But what we didn't
expect three hundred miles away from Cumbria in central London
was for this to be happening. After mentoring Tom Fall.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
I used to live up the straight two years ago
when my children were young. I lived in Castle a
few times.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
So sorry, I just you know, I'm just gonna pause
you there a second.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Oh goodness, hob knobs Ewan's grandfather would suddenly appear from
a bush.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
The reception is still very, very bad at our end
I'm struggling to hear. I know there's a granddad in
a bush. That's about all I got. Tom fooled around
with us like this for quite a while. We restarted
and restarted, but in the end Tom won and we
(02:48):
gave up here.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Hello, hi as well.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
I'm here so I can't quite hear what you're saying
drops in and out, but I think we're gonna just
stop the recording for now and then bex or I'll
give you a call on it.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Really tomfoolery or just bad luck? If you ask me.
It seemed a little too well timed to be the latter.
I've been doing this podcast long enough to know when
spirits are getting up to no good. My producers willelm
and Becks did sort something out. But before we hear
from Ian, let's start this episode with some good luck.
(03:24):
Producer Willhelm has an enamel mug shaped like a tooth.
He loves it, even if it's dirty. He'll wash it
up to use it for tea Producer Chris likes his
shrimp mug from Dartmouth, and for coffee, he likes his
little red one. Oh bless him. Personally, I'm too clumsy
to be trusted with anything around here. So when I
get a coffee, they normally serve it to me in
an old shoe. But imagine your family was gifted a
(03:45):
bowl so precious that it got its own name. This
is the story of the luck of Muncas Tests. It
starts in fourteen sixty one during the War of the Roses,
Ewan's ancestor John Penny, and did a very good deed
for King Henry the sixth after one of the war's
bloodiest battles.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
So King Henry the sixth joined the War of the Roses,
was on the run and he was taken in by
the Penningtons just before he went to the Tower of London.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
Indeed, war between Yorkshire and Lancashire. Yeah, Yorkshire being the
White Rose, Bankshire being the Red Rose. And what side
he was on he was Lancastrian.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
Lancastrian, So even though he had been defeated in one
of the bloodiest battles and he was on the run,
the Penningtons took a bit of a risk, took him
in and looked after him for a few weeks and
showed great hospitality to him because even though he was
a useless fighter, per se he was a very academic
and spiritual person, like he founded King's College in Cambridge.
(04:47):
He founded Eton.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Yeah, that's why they called that the Lea's and the Roses.
That's him, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
Yeah, exactly. So he just before coming to the Tower
was Moncaster and the Pennington at the time hosted him
and he was obviously so grateful that he gave them
his only worthy possession, which was a Venetian drinking bowl.
And he said that as long as this bowl remains
intact from the or unriven, the Penningtons from Moncaster will
(05:21):
never be driven. Kind of a bit more bit more
sexy that that way we're saying.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
That is the bait, and word for word how he
said it, he started a bit he was very tired.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Yeah, at time, lots of battles and about to be
murdered in the Tower of London.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
And so this this bowl has seen a lot of
action in your family past down the generations.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
Yeah, there's all sorts of like mystique and history about it,
and it'd been lost and rebound and lost and all sorts.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
The holy grail of the Penningtons.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Have you used it yourself?
Speaker 3 (05:52):
I've never used it. I've seen it twice.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
Now, how do you mean seen it twice later?
Speaker 3 (05:57):
I'm quite clumsy in general, and.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
They don't let you near it.
Speaker 3 (06:02):
And well for me, like, I think it's a really
important like passing of the bowl right to the next generation.
It's kind of a big deal. And I now know
where it's kept, but I don't know where the key
for that secret safe is. So I think when it
gets around to me being entrusted with that key, because
I mean, I'm I found out very recently that every
(06:23):
Pennington prior to like our particular line, it was christened
using that bowl, but my parents decided not to because
they were worried that it might break the cold water
but maybe the cursed as a consequence. I'm going to
be the one to let the castle crumble, be driven
because I wasn't baptized or christened with it.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
What did you get christ with? Like a sports Direct mug,
something robust.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
Maybe hopefully it is the holy Grail and it does
give me a life. Get the key and they can
drink from it.
Speaker 1 (06:59):
Well, make sure you get the right bowl. Ewan, We've
all seen in Jenna Jones. You don't want to die
from rapid aging. You must choose, but chews wisely. It
must be nice having a good luck charm like that
around the place, even if you don't know where it is.
All I've got is this old bowl of cereal that's
been in the sink for four days. The coca pots
(07:20):
are so hard now I have to chisel them off.
We're going to leave Ewan and his lucky bowl there
for now, because our luck is about to turn. It's
time to talk about Tom fool We briefly touched on
Tom full in our first Moncaster episode, but here's all
(07:41):
you need to know. In the sixteenth century, Tom Skelton
was Muncaster's court jester, trickster and all round funny guy.
He was so popular he had his own portrait.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
But there's a.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Darker side to Tom. You've already heard the havoc he
caused last time when we tried to discuss him with
the current full of Moncaster Ian. Well, we rearranged our
chat with Ian, but as you'll hear, it seems we
weren't quite rid of Tom yet. For some reason, he
didn't want us wearing headphones. So now and then you
may hear a bit of an echo min echo min
(08:13):
Echo mineko leko Ian Douglas has been at Moncaster Castle
for the past eleven years, and I started by asking
him the question. I'm sure you're all thinking, so, how
did you become a jesture? Did you see an ad
in the paper or did you like go for a
trip around the castle and just get pissed and fall
(08:34):
through a window and went, there's our guy. How do
you like? How did she get the job?
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Well? I think traditionally at Moncaster, certainly over the last
fifteen years, there's been a competition and fools or the
performers from around the world have kind of congregated around
April time and have competed for the title.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Oh my god, So it's like the full Olympics.
Speaker 2 (08:55):
Yeah, that's it. That's exactly what it is.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
But everyone's lost their running spikes and like the baton's
gone missing and someone's got javeling through the head.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Yeah, and I've kind of watched it. I've watched it
number of times because I've been performing at the castle
during the during the vessel. But my work's quite different.
I'm not that kind of gesture. I don't juggle, I
don't I used to do fire a long time ago,
but after an accident I stopped doing it.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Oh God, do I dare I ask what the accident was.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
I was on a boat breathing fire as part of
a show on derwant Water in Cumbria, and I was
on a small wooden rib boat and the only way
I could get leaverage was to ram my feet into
the corners of the boat. So I had both my
hands free, and in one hand you have you have
the fuel, and in the other hand you have a
fire eating torch and the You put the fuel into
(09:45):
your mouth and hold it there until the appropriate moment,
and then you spray it out onto the flaming stick,
and beautiful things happen. And all was well until we
went to the I think it was the final rehearsal,
and two minutes before I was about to put the
liquid into my mouth, a large boat set off from
the top of the lake and it sent a wave
(10:06):
flight coming down towards my boat because I was on
a tiny little boat, and I put the liquid to
my lips and the wave hit the boat and I
rocked to one side and swallowed it and it went
down to my gardens. And so I was in hospital
for two weeks with that one. So I now have
a partial lung here, a part of it doesn't exist anymore.
(10:26):
So I stopped doing fire breathing at that point.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
Jesus Christ, I wasn't expecting that at all. Yeah, well,
mad Max meets the perfect storm, the.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
Thing you'll do to make a crust, my friend. But
I was Yeah, so my act, the stuff I do
as a performer is quite different. So I've worked for
the Castle as a performer for over eleven years now,
and I think two three or just before COVID, actually
they decided to dispense with the Fool's competition and they
(10:58):
decided to try and do it a different way. So
they looked at the people they were working with. So
the previous fool to me is a guy called Gary
Bridgings or Gacko. He's a showman performer and he'd entered
the competition a number of times but never was never
successful because again, like me, his act wasn't that kind
of big show acts, more musical and storytelling, right. But
(11:20):
then I think they wanted a deeper relationship with their fool,
somebody who was there more prominent and more visual and
visible at the Castle. So once Gacko finished.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
If I might say less of a gimmicky hack, yes,
I'm more of an actual artist.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Yeah, I think so. Yeah, I think that's it. I
think that's it. And I think somebody that they knew,
you know, somebody that they knew, would tell them the
truth and could be involved in thinking about the future
of the Fool and where it might come. So I
was just second in line, I suppose because of the
depth of work I was doing with them. It was
probably a natural fit.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
And so when you did get the role, what were
the first sort of main changes you think you brought
the role. Did you go in and start going, right,
this needs to go, this needs to go. I want
to have this.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Yeah. I think I was just much more interested in
So the Fools up until now, I think have been
very much on show at their festivals. Here I am,
I do my act and I leave again. Whereas the
first thing I did was put the court on and
went wandering around the grounds, meeting people and talking to
people and telling them the stories of the castle, you know,
and saying, actually, I am the fool of Moncaster. I'm
(12:26):
a real person. You can come and talk to me.
And I think that was one of the things I
think that they were interesting that there was a person
there that actually could tell stories of depth about the castle,
about the family, and about what the castle is about,
if that makes sense, and do it.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
To people on a one on one basis, not just
in a big show, so it's much more personal vibe.
Oh that's really lovely.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I think so. Yeah. I mean,
I am a performer in my own right. I'm a storyteller,
so I can do big performances for people, but also
I am very confident and comfortable work in one on
one with people and saying welcome to the castle, you know,
and suddenly they've got a face of somebody. And also
I'm quite well known in the area, so suddenly there's
(13:07):
a face that people recognize and want to come and see.
So I think it's that kind of stuff.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
That's what you want in a performer. You want somebody
who can play the palladium but also just chat your
ear off down the pub.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
Absolutely, yeah, of course, absolutely, you know, and I've got
a twinkle in the eye. I know, want to be
rude and want to be sensible, so I think they
appreciate that as well.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
I think and you said that a fool's job was
to slap the face of the king, and he was
the one member of the court who could view everyone
as equal. So when it comes to you, say, you
interact with the tourists and the public a lot, but
do you ever play tricks on the family? I'm thinking
of you, and in particular because I know you and
him have quite the relationship together. And he's quite a
(13:49):
cheeky guy as well.
Speaker 2 (13:50):
Yeah he is, he is. I haven't played tricks on
him yet, but I have had to do. You know,
I'm fifty one these days, and I've got I've got
we've got four children between me and my wife, and
I have had to bring my dad voice out on
him only yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, in a nice way.
Just you know, he's very new to the row, isn't he.
(14:11):
And I know he's grown up in the family, but
actually too, I remember sitting around the kitchen table with
the whole family. I'm sure he won't mind me telling
you this, and we were talking about Halloween projects and
various other things, and I did have to lean across
and say, now, listen, young man, I'm fifty one years
of age. Fifty one times around this planet. I've gone
so listen to my wisdom, and he listened. You know.
(14:32):
That's what's lovely about you. And you know he is
new to the role, but he's open and he's listening,
and he's and he's taking it all in and he'll
make a great front man. You know. I think the
castle is in very good hands with you.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
And the role of the fool goes back many, many years,
but the most famous one is Tom fall. Let's get
into him. So talk to me about his legend and
where he came from. How much do you know about him?
Speaker 2 (14:58):
So Skelton, it was a sixteenth century fella. And what's
really interesting about Tom Skelton It wasn't you know, it
wasn't just the fool of Moncaster. He was a really
two sided coin. You know. If he liked you and
showed favor on you, you know he would he would give
you hilarity and joy and music. He was a great
(15:18):
lover of music and pros and he could be, as
much as I understand it, incredibly charming man. He loved beer,
he loved good food, he loved good company. But wo
betide you got on the wrong side of him because
the flip side of Tom Skelton was that he was
a murderer. You know, he he was known to.
Speaker 1 (15:37):
I mean that is quite a flip side, isn't it.
Oh it's a hugeful love poetry. He was into music.
He also murdered people.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Yeah, absolutely, you know, he was known to behead people.
And he's greatest. Yeah, yeah, he beheaded there's the there's
you'd have to ask you in the full story. But
he was paid to behead somebody in their sleep.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
Okay, well, we can't just leave that story hanging. I
asked you about this, and I've got to say, I'm
not sure i'd want Tom Fall in my employment. This
guy is a loose cannon.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
So the Lord of Moncaster at the time, his daughter
was having an affair with the carpenter, and the carpenter
was awfully kind of embarrassing the family because he was
going around the local pub's bragging of how he had
a thing with the lady of the house and she
was betrothed to a local lord's son, and so that
(16:37):
was an awful embarrassment. So Tom Fall was asked to
sort this mess out and he.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
I love, He's a gun for hire. He's like a
sort of Boba Fett star Wars.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
He was right.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
We he's having done higher the Fall, And I.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
Think this is why he's such an interesting character because
he was the fool, but he was arguably the manager
of the estate and also took on loads of other
roles and jobs, including gun for har as you say.
And so anyway, he invited the carpenter around, who he
proceeded to get very drunk, and as the legend goes,
he then took the carpenter's own hammer and chisel when
(17:13):
he was drunk and asleep, and proceeded to chisel off
the carpenter's head and hide it.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
What Hang on a second, This has gone from funny
little pranks with a painting to quick sam murders. So
now he's chopping people's heads off with their own tools.
Speaker 3 (17:30):
Yeah, this guy's a lunatic a little bit, But at
the same time, I think it comes down to what
was what was done in the sixteenth century versus now.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
He also does a bit of juggling as well, and
face painting and blue animals, and he will decapitate your enemies.
Tom Fall, ladies and gentlemen, lover of beer, good food,
and good company. Also a murdering psychopath available for birthdays
and barmits. As according to you in the Ghost of
(18:01):
Tom Fall is very much still present in the castle.
So I asked Ian if he'd ever witnessed any Tom
foolery himself.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
I don't believe in ghosts. Let me get this straight.
I don't believe in ghosts. I have no truck with religion.
I gave up thinking about those things a long time ago.
The only thing I believe in on this world that
is outside of normal, So let's call it supernatural, if
you like, is the spirit of Tom. And I've been
around that castle long enough to know that Tom, he
(18:29):
still walks the carriers up there.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
How do you feel the spirit comes through in the castle?
I'm imagine like echoing laughter down hallways, or paintings falling
off stuff, things going wrong, just an energy that you feel.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
So every year we do the big hallowe In piece,
and it's not a particularly high tech piece of work,
but it takes people through the castle on a kind
of haunted tour and it's very successful and it's very
very very well attended. Last year we went a little
bit more high tech and we've decided to do the
whole show in one room with lighting, desks and computers,
(19:07):
the first time we'd ever done it with proper, real
tech stuff. And this is all brand new stuff. It's
all been pack tested, it's all been worked on, and
everything's absolutely fine. We've got a text dish in place,
and everything just stopped. Everything stopped ten minutes before the
audience is about to arrive. Nothing is working, and these
computers were going flying all over the place. We've got
(19:28):
remote lights going crazy in the place, and we're thinking, right,
the audience is five minutes away, and Peter just very
calmly as we all ran around like headless chickens, just said,
hang on a second, and he went off. And about
a minute later everything started working again, and Peter came
in and he said, it's okay. I've sorted it. And
I said, well, what did you do? Did you find
the switch? He said no, I just went and talked
(19:50):
to Tom and somebody had turned Tom's portrait light off
as a portrait light above his head, and somebody had
accidentally turned it off. He said to I've switched it
back on and lit some candles and I asked Tom
to please allow the show to can continue. We haven't
forgotten about him, and I swear down. Everything came back
on and it ran absolutely perfectly until the third night
(20:12):
a child had been in the building and again had
switched the light off on Tom Fool's portrait, and everything
went berserk again and we'd all we had to do
is go and flick the foot the switch and it
all kicked back in again. So now we have a
tradition when we go down to Moncaster, first thing we
do we go up the stairs to Tom Fool's portrait,
make sure the light's on, and I bow to him. Hello, Tom,
(20:33):
we haven't forgotten about you. And that seems to solve
the problems.
Speaker 1 (20:38):
That's amazing, But at what point does the fool actually
become the king? It seems to me like Tom's the
most powerful person in the entire place.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
Well, the fools run the castle. Peter will tell you
that it's the fools that run the castle. And it's
absolutely right.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
Ian, I'm starting to see your your ulterior motive. You
actually just certainly want to take the whole thing over yourself.
One day, by the age of sixty, you'll be living
in there on your own, with your own portrait. Oh
would you like your own portrait.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
Well, we've got our own banners. So my banner is
me on my storytelling bike. So I have a storytelling
bike that and well known for kind of traveling around
in There's quite a bit of interference going on. Sorry, yeah, yeah,
can you tell?
Speaker 1 (21:19):
Yeah, tell? I was going to ask Tom to that's right,
listeners right on que Just after Ian had told the
story about Tom full messing with some technical equipment, guess
who shows up. Luckily, your humble host is a pro
and soldiered on through the interview. How do you actually
(21:40):
design the Fools banner? Do you have your own symbol?
Is it like a coat of arms? What actually makes
up the whole design?
Speaker 2 (21:47):
So it tends to be the thing that you use
for your act. So I've got a trike called Vira,
which is my storytelling bike. So I'm presented on the
back of my bike the previous fool Gary as Dolly
his trolley. It's it's doing it again. Whatever's happening? Sorry,
(22:07):
it is doing it again, isn't it?
Speaker 4 (22:08):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (22:14):
M m m m m.
Speaker 4 (22:27):
Then yeah, it's just suddenly going off.
Speaker 1 (22:35):
And that's where Tom cut us off.
Speaker 5 (22:37):
I was talking about Tom Skelton.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
He's tricking really told you.
Speaker 5 (22:45):
Oh that's weird, is it sudden?
Speaker 4 (22:54):
All grand?
Speaker 5 (22:55):
Well, it took a couple of m Yeah, how about that,
told you Tom.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
After lighting some candles and a quick word with Tom,
we were finally reconnected.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
Hello again, Hello, we're back. Hurrah.
Speaker 1 (23:17):
Yeah, you look way more clearer. That's much better. She's
done at the beginning with Tom out of the picture
for now, at least. Ian told me one of his
favorite stories from Moncaster's history.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
One of the most famous characters at Moncaster is Mary Bragg.
She was associated with somebody in the local town, raven Glass,
and she fell in love with the guy from upstairs,
one of the possblokes, and he kind of reciprocated and
they started this secret love affair. But the housekeeper at
the time she took umbrage because she quite liked him
(23:51):
as well, and she paid some people to do her
in and they killed her and they buried her in
the grounds of Munca, and all went on quite well
until a period of time later. Her body was found
by a young boy and he reported the body being found,
and so in a panic, they took her down to
the river Esque and they laid rocks on top of
(24:13):
her and left her there to rot. Ah how respectful
I know, it gets better and worse, because she somehow
floated up and was found again. Mary brad would not
be left without letting people know that she'd been done
in badly. So they took her body and they burnt
it to ash and they buried it, as far as
(24:35):
I understand, buried it beneath a tree that stood above
the estate, and it became known as the Cursed Tree.
Skip forward in time years later, probably about ten or
fifteen years ago, there was a survey done on the
grounds and in particular the trees around the area, and
they found out that the Cursed tree was a danger.
(24:57):
It was going to fall because it was rotted through.
It stands by the side of the main busy road,
so they needed to it needed to be felled quite
quickly before it caused some damage, and they put a
call out to tree surgeons in the local area, but
nobody would touch the Cursed tree. The story of Mary
Braggan had kind of been quite prolific in the area.
(25:17):
The only man that dared do it. The only man
was a man called Murray who's the grounds keeper at
Moncaster and he's a stoic, big old boy ex soldier,
and he went up to chop down the tree with
his chainsawn. There was a crowd of people gathered, and
here is the truth that when he cut into the tree,
(25:40):
the tree spurted blood all over him, and he turned round.
They thought maybe he'd chopped his arm off or something,
and the tree fell, which is shocking enough. The truth
of it was inside the tree there were bats roosting,
and he chopped into the rooster and out came this flood.
(26:01):
But obviously the rumors and stories went around the village.
The story doesn't quite in there because the tree was felled,
and then people were offered the wood, but nobody would
burn the cursed tree would and Murray said, well, if
they're not having it, I'll have it. So he went
back again to start to chop the tree up and
the limbs up. I heard tell that he was gone
for some hours and they couldn't reach him on his radio,
(26:23):
And eventually fact he turned up clutching onto his hand.
And if you ever meet Murray and get to shake
hands with him, you'll notice that his hand as a
scar all the way from top to bottom because he
chopped his entire hand off and it was held on
only by a fleck of skin. Luckily enough, they managed
to be able to stitch it back on it and he
(26:44):
can now use it. But it's it's quite hell of it,
heavily scarred because he cut right the way through his
hand and the cursed tree. The rumor of the cursted
tree continues, and the wood I think, as far as
I understand it lay, the tree lays in the field, felled,
but nobody will nobody will touch the tree. All come
down from the curse of Mary Bragg. That's how I
understand the story.
Speaker 1 (27:03):
I'll tell you what. Mary's a braver man than I am.
If I cut into a tree that bled, I wouldn't
be going back to cut it up for firewood. I
be on the first train out of Camria. After that
disturbing story of Mary Bragg. I think we need a
(27:25):
palate cleanser. Go on, Ian, give us one more before
we go.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
Here's a great little story for you. And on the
on the flip side, in terms of favorite moments in
the Castle, Iwonna, I'm sure she won't mind me saying this,
because we are friends. Iona's reputation around the Castle is
she's quite a formidable character. And we've always got on
incredibly well with our owner and find a very warm
and a very loving character. But we've always been told
(27:50):
don't get on the wrong side of Iona. About nine
years ago, myself and my good friend Gary Bridgins, who
run the Halloween show, we were up they're working putting
the show on, and we did the whole run of shows.
It was very successful, and it was the night before Halloween,
and in the castle itself, there's a room upstairs. It's
(28:12):
called the Tapestry Room. It's a tiny little room and
it's supposedly the most haunted room in the castle.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
Oh believe me, we know about that one, don't we. Listeners.
You in scared the crap out of me with that
story in a previous mon Caster episode.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
Anyway, me and my friend Gary said, well, been us
tomorrow night's Halloween. Would you mind if me and Gary
slept in the bed in the most haunted room together?
It's this beautiful four poster and they agreed and we said, okay,
we'll go and do that. That's brilliant. And the run
of shows had ended and as a little present, Peter
and Iona presented me with a bottle of whiskey, and
(28:51):
Gary with a bottle of whiskey, and around eleven o'clock
years up the stairs, we went to the most Haunted
room and sat around, helping ourselves to a few DRAMs
of whiskey, until eventually the clock struck twelve and the
door opened. Suddenly we both jumped and it wasn't a ghost.
It was Pete Peter, and Peter escaped because his wife
(29:13):
was asleep. He said, no, boys, I'll come to join you.
I'd brought another bottle, and we dragged these bottles of whiskey,
and around three in the morning decided that the only
spirits we were going to see that night were the
spirits inside that bottle. And eventually it was time for bed.
I was going to sleep in the adjacent room and
Gary was because I can't sleep with Gary. He sings
(29:35):
in his sleep, seeing Yeah, he sings in his sleep. Yeah,
it's a shocker, it's a shocker. We were just about
to room and I said, and I said, listen, we
are the fools of Moncaster. We should at least leave
some kind of memory of this evening. There's a security
camera on the wall up there. Why don't we show
I owner our bums. That would be a nice thing
to see on an hour wee night. So we mooned
the camera, laughed and went off to bed. Now in
(29:57):
the morning we woke up with thick heads and we
sat and started to think remorsefully about what we'd done
and the rumors of obviously Iona, we're all around us,
and we were thinking, what we don't need today is
to be sacked for showing our bums. Maybe we should
admit to our crime. And we found we found Iona
out in the courtyard and said, hello, Iona, we're really sorry,
(30:19):
but last night we were all jinks and boys and
all that, and we showed our bums to your security camera.
So if you see our bums today, that's why. And
she said, oh, security camera. There isn't a security camera
in that room and we said, yes, there is in
the corner we showed our bums to each last night.
She said, no, that's not a security camera. That's the
(30:41):
world wide Web camera. And where do you think every
ghost hunter in the country was looking at midnight last night?
And that's that's the legacy we leave behind at Moncaster.
Speaker 1 (30:52):
Amazing things that go bombing the night. Yes, nice, oh
thank you so much ian.
Speaker 2 (30:59):
That was really it's pleasure to that suit pleasure.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
It's taken five months, but finally we can finish an
episode with a bump. Un just goes to show never
give up on your dreams.
Speaker 2 (31:09):
Kids.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
That's it for this episode. I'm after the full Olympics.
Until next time. Don't ask Tom full for directions, don't
show your bum on the web, but do mind your manners.
Thanks for listening to Bad Manners. If you like the pod,
please share it with your friends. Rate it on the
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Leave a review and make sure you spill the tea
(31:31):
on any of your favorite Bad Manners that we could
feature in future episodes. This podcast was produced by Atamei
Studios for iHeartRadio. It was hosted by me Tom Horton.
It was produced by William Lensky, Rebecca Rappaport, and Chris Ataway.
It was executive produced by Face Steur and Zad Rogers.
Our production manager is Caitlin Paramore and our production coordinator
(31:54):
is Bella Selini
Here's a question for you, dear listener, Do you feel lucky?
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Punk?
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Punk Wow? Sorry about the punk thing and the dodgy accent.
The reason I ask is because today's episode explores luck,
both good and bad, although mostly bad. Moncaster Castle in
Cumbria is the home to the Pennington family, and in
(00:25):
our previous month cast episode, I was talking to you
in Frost Pennington, the soon to be owner of the castle.
We got familiar with his sausages meat wow.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
However you describe it, it has indes.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
We heard about the castle's haunted tapestry room.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
We had too many people complaining that they couldn't sleep
because of the crying child. And supposedly the bit that
I like, hate be love is that it's fine the
child crying. It's just when the nurse starts singing to
try and calm the people get too freaked out.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
And Ewan told us about Muncaster's most famous resident, Tom Fall,
the guy who drowned people in quicksand for a laugh if.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
He didn't like the look of you. Supposedly, as the
story goes, he would direct you the less convenient quicksand
invested route.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
And then they get just sucked under and never heard
of again. Yeah, he's a murderer, exact directly.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Yeah, as I say, the sixteenth century sense of humor
is probably slightly different.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
You can say that again, the.
Speaker 3 (01:32):
Sixteenth century sense of humor is probably slightly different.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Yet all right, not literally. We had our own encounter
with Tom after trying to chat to Ian Douglas Moncaster's
current four. I'm happy to say we came out alive,
but it was certainly unnerving. To be fair, Youwan did
give us a heads up.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
The kind of legend is the term Tom foolery. We
use a lot of Moncaster because quite often technology or
just weird things go wrong exit actually the wrong time.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Remote recordings can have their challenges. But what we didn't
expect three hundred miles away from Cumbria in central London
was for this to be happening. After mentoring Tom Fall.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
I used to live up the straight two years ago
when my children were young. I lived in Castle a
few times.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
So sorry, I just you know, I'm just gonna pause
you there a second.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Oh goodness, hob knobs Ewan's grandfather would suddenly appear from
a bush.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
The reception is still very, very bad at our end
I'm struggling to hear. I know there's a granddad in
a bush. That's about all I got. Tom fooled around
with us like this for quite a while. We restarted
and restarted, but in the end Tom won and we
(02:48):
gave up here.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Hello, hi as well.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
I'm here so I can't quite hear what you're saying
drops in and out, but I think we're gonna just
stop the recording for now and then bex or I'll
give you a call on it.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Really tomfoolery or just bad luck? If you ask me.
It seemed a little too well timed to be the latter.
I've been doing this podcast long enough to know when
spirits are getting up to no good. My producers willelm
and Becks did sort something out. But before we hear
from Ian, let's start this episode with some good luck.
(03:24):
Producer Willhelm has an enamel mug shaped like a tooth.
He loves it, even if it's dirty. He'll wash it
up to use it for tea Producer Chris likes his
shrimp mug from Dartmouth, and for coffee, he likes his
little red one. Oh bless him. Personally, I'm too clumsy
to be trusted with anything around here. So when I
get a coffee, they normally serve it to me in
an old shoe. But imagine your family was gifted a
(03:45):
bowl so precious that it got its own name. This
is the story of the luck of Muncas Tests. It
starts in fourteen sixty one during the War of the Roses,
Ewan's ancestor John Penny, and did a very good deed
for King Henry the sixth after one of the war's
bloodiest battles.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
So King Henry the sixth joined the War of the Roses,
was on the run and he was taken in by
the Penningtons just before he went to the Tower of London.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
Indeed, war between Yorkshire and Lancashire. Yeah, Yorkshire being the
White Rose, Bankshire being the Red Rose. And what side
he was on he was Lancastrian.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
Lancastrian, So even though he had been defeated in one
of the bloodiest battles and he was on the run,
the Penningtons took a bit of a risk, took him
in and looked after him for a few weeks and
showed great hospitality to him because even though he was
a useless fighter, per se he was a very academic
and spiritual person, like he founded King's College in Cambridge.
(04:47):
He founded Eton.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Yeah, that's why they called that the Lea's and the Roses.
That's him, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
Yeah, exactly. So he just before coming to the Tower
was Moncaster and the Pennington at the time hosted him
and he was obviously so grateful that he gave them
his only worthy possession, which was a Venetian drinking bowl.
And he said that as long as this bowl remains
intact from the or unriven, the Penningtons from Moncaster will
(05:21):
never be driven. Kind of a bit more bit more
sexy that that way we're saying.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
That is the bait, and word for word how he
said it, he started a bit he was very tired.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Yeah, at time, lots of battles and about to be
murdered in the Tower of London.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
And so this this bowl has seen a lot of
action in your family past down the generations.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
Yeah, there's all sorts of like mystique and history about it,
and it'd been lost and rebound and lost and all sorts.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
The holy grail of the Penningtons.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Have you used it yourself?
Speaker 3 (05:52):
I've never used it. I've seen it twice.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
Now, how do you mean seen it twice later?
Speaker 3 (05:57):
I'm quite clumsy in general, and.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
They don't let you near it.
Speaker 3 (06:02):
And well for me, like, I think it's a really
important like passing of the bowl right to the next generation.
It's kind of a big deal. And I now know
where it's kept, but I don't know where the key
for that secret safe is. So I think when it
gets around to me being entrusted with that key, because
I mean, I'm I found out very recently that every
(06:23):
Pennington prior to like our particular line, it was christened
using that bowl, but my parents decided not to because
they were worried that it might break the cold water
but maybe the cursed as a consequence. I'm going to
be the one to let the castle crumble, be driven
because I wasn't baptized or christened with it.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
What did you get christ with? Like a sports Direct mug,
something robust.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
Maybe hopefully it is the holy Grail and it does
give me a life. Get the key and they can
drink from it.
Speaker 1 (06:59):
Well, make sure you get the right bowl. Ewan, We've
all seen in Jenna Jones. You don't want to die
from rapid aging. You must choose, but chews wisely. It
must be nice having a good luck charm like that
around the place, even if you don't know where it is.
All I've got is this old bowl of cereal that's
been in the sink for four days. The coca pots
(07:20):
are so hard now I have to chisel them off.
We're going to leave Ewan and his lucky bowl there
for now, because our luck is about to turn. It's
time to talk about Tom fool We briefly touched on
Tom full in our first Moncaster episode, but here's all
(07:41):
you need to know. In the sixteenth century, Tom Skelton
was Muncaster's court jester, trickster and all round funny guy.
He was so popular he had his own portrait.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
But there's a.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Darker side to Tom. You've already heard the havoc he
caused last time when we tried to discuss him with
the current full of Moncaster Ian. Well, we rearranged our
chat with Ian, but as you'll hear, it seems we
weren't quite rid of Tom yet. For some reason, he
didn't want us wearing headphones. So now and then you
may hear a bit of an echo min echo min
(08:13):
Echo mineko leko Ian Douglas has been at Moncaster Castle
for the past eleven years, and I started by asking
him the question. I'm sure you're all thinking, so, how
did you become a jesture? Did you see an ad
in the paper or did you like go for a
trip around the castle and just get pissed and fall
(08:34):
through a window and went, there's our guy. How do
you like? How did she get the job?
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Well? I think traditionally at Moncaster, certainly over the last
fifteen years, there's been a competition and fools or the
performers from around the world have kind of congregated around
April time and have competed for the title.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Oh my god, So it's like the full Olympics.
Speaker 2 (08:55):
Yeah, that's it. That's exactly what it is.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
But everyone's lost their running spikes and like the baton's
gone missing and someone's got javeling through the head.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Yeah, and I've kind of watched it. I've watched it
number of times because I've been performing at the castle
during the during the vessel. But my work's quite different.
I'm not that kind of gesture. I don't juggle, I
don't I used to do fire a long time ago,
but after an accident I stopped doing it.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Oh God, do I dare I ask what the accident was.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
I was on a boat breathing fire as part of
a show on derwant Water in Cumbria, and I was
on a small wooden rib boat and the only way
I could get leaverage was to ram my feet into
the corners of the boat. So I had both my
hands free, and in one hand you have you have
the fuel, and in the other hand you have a
fire eating torch and the You put the fuel into
(09:45):
your mouth and hold it there until the appropriate moment,
and then you spray it out onto the flaming stick,
and beautiful things happen. And all was well until we
went to the I think it was the final rehearsal,
and two minutes before I was about to put the
liquid into my mouth, a large boat set off from
the top of the lake and it sent a wave
(10:06):
flight coming down towards my boat because I was on
a tiny little boat, and I put the liquid to
my lips and the wave hit the boat and I
rocked to one side and swallowed it and it went
down to my gardens. And so I was in hospital
for two weeks with that one. So I now have
a partial lung here, a part of it doesn't exist anymore.
(10:26):
So I stopped doing fire breathing at that point.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
Jesus Christ, I wasn't expecting that at all. Yeah, well,
mad Max meets the perfect storm, the.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
Thing you'll do to make a crust, my friend. But
I was Yeah, so my act, the stuff I do
as a performer is quite different. So I've worked for
the Castle as a performer for over eleven years now,
and I think two three or just before COVID, actually
they decided to dispense with the Fool's competition and they
(10:58):
decided to try and do it a different way. So
they looked at the people they were working with. So
the previous fool to me is a guy called Gary
Bridgings or Gacko. He's a showman performer and he'd entered
the competition a number of times but never was never
successful because again, like me, his act wasn't that kind
of big show acts, more musical and storytelling, right. But
(11:20):
then I think they wanted a deeper relationship with their fool,
somebody who was there more prominent and more visual and
visible at the Castle. So once Gacko finished.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
If I might say less of a gimmicky hack, yes,
I'm more of an actual artist.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Yeah, I think so. Yeah, I think that's it. I
think that's it. And I think somebody that they knew,
you know, somebody that they knew, would tell them the
truth and could be involved in thinking about the future
of the Fool and where it might come. So I
was just second in line, I suppose because of the
depth of work I was doing with them. It was
probably a natural fit.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
And so when you did get the role, what were
the first sort of main changes you think you brought
the role. Did you go in and start going, right,
this needs to go, this needs to go. I want
to have this.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Yeah. I think I was just much more interested in
So the Fools up until now, I think have been
very much on show at their festivals. Here I am,
I do my act and I leave again. Whereas the
first thing I did was put the court on and
went wandering around the grounds, meeting people and talking to
people and telling them the stories of the castle, you know,
and saying, actually, I am the fool of Moncaster. I'm
(12:26):
a real person. You can come and talk to me.
And I think that was one of the things I
think that they were interesting that there was a person
there that actually could tell stories of depth about the castle,
about the family, and about what the castle is about,
if that makes sense, and do it.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
To people on a one on one basis, not just
in a big show, so it's much more personal vibe.
Oh that's really lovely.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I think so. Yeah. I mean,
I am a performer in my own right. I'm a storyteller,
so I can do big performances for people, but also
I am very confident and comfortable work in one on
one with people and saying welcome to the castle, you know,
and suddenly they've got a face of somebody. And also
I'm quite well known in the area, so suddenly there's
(13:07):
a face that people recognize and want to come and see.
So I think it's that kind of stuff.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
That's what you want in a performer. You want somebody
who can play the palladium but also just chat your
ear off down the pub.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
Absolutely, yeah, of course, absolutely, you know, and I've got
a twinkle in the eye. I know, want to be
rude and want to be sensible, so I think they
appreciate that as well.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
I think and you said that a fool's job was
to slap the face of the king, and he was
the one member of the court who could view everyone
as equal. So when it comes to you, say, you
interact with the tourists and the public a lot, but
do you ever play tricks on the family? I'm thinking
of you, and in particular because I know you and
him have quite the relationship together. And he's quite a
(13:49):
cheeky guy as well.
Speaker 2 (13:50):
Yeah he is, he is. I haven't played tricks on
him yet, but I have had to do. You know,
I'm fifty one these days, and I've got I've got
we've got four children between me and my wife, and
I have had to bring my dad voice out on
him only yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, in a nice way.
Just you know, he's very new to the row, isn't he.
(14:11):
And I know he's grown up in the family, but
actually too, I remember sitting around the kitchen table with
the whole family. I'm sure he won't mind me telling
you this, and we were talking about Halloween projects and
various other things, and I did have to lean across
and say, now, listen, young man, I'm fifty one years
of age. Fifty one times around this planet. I've gone
so listen to my wisdom, and he listened. You know.
(14:32):
That's what's lovely about you. And you know he is
new to the role, but he's open and he's listening,
and he's and he's taking it all in and he'll
make a great front man. You know. I think the
castle is in very good hands with you.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
And the role of the fool goes back many, many years,
but the most famous one is Tom fall. Let's get
into him. So talk to me about his legend and
where he came from. How much do you know about him?
Speaker 2 (14:58):
So Skelton, it was a sixteenth century fella. And what's
really interesting about Tom Skelton It wasn't you know, it
wasn't just the fool of Moncaster. He was a really
two sided coin. You know. If he liked you and
showed favor on you, you know he would he would give
you hilarity and joy and music. He was a great
(15:18):
lover of music and pros and he could be, as
much as I understand it, incredibly charming man. He loved beer,
he loved good food, he loved good company. But wo
betide you got on the wrong side of him because
the flip side of Tom Skelton was that he was
a murderer. You know, he he was known to.
Speaker 1 (15:37):
I mean that is quite a flip side, isn't it.
Oh it's a hugeful love poetry. He was into music.
He also murdered people.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Yeah, absolutely, you know, he was known to behead people.
And he's greatest. Yeah, yeah, he beheaded there's the there's
you'd have to ask you in the full story. But
he was paid to behead somebody in their sleep.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
Okay, well, we can't just leave that story hanging. I
asked you about this, and I've got to say, I'm
not sure i'd want Tom Fall in my employment. This
guy is a loose cannon.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
So the Lord of Moncaster at the time, his daughter
was having an affair with the carpenter, and the carpenter
was awfully kind of embarrassing the family because he was
going around the local pub's bragging of how he had
a thing with the lady of the house and she
was betrothed to a local lord's son, and so that
(16:37):
was an awful embarrassment. So Tom Fall was asked to
sort this mess out and he.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
I love, He's a gun for hire. He's like a
sort of Boba Fett star Wars.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
He was right.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
We he's having done higher the Fall, And I.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
Think this is why he's such an interesting character because
he was the fool, but he was arguably the manager
of the estate and also took on loads of other
roles and jobs, including gun for har as you say.
And so anyway, he invited the carpenter around, who he
proceeded to get very drunk, and as the legend goes,
he then took the carpenter's own hammer and chisel when
(17:13):
he was drunk and asleep, and proceeded to chisel off
the carpenter's head and hide it.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
What Hang on a second, This has gone from funny
little pranks with a painting to quick sam murders. So
now he's chopping people's heads off with their own tools.
Speaker 3 (17:30):
Yeah, this guy's a lunatic a little bit, But at
the same time, I think it comes down to what
was what was done in the sixteenth century versus now.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
He also does a bit of juggling as well, and
face painting and blue animals, and he will decapitate your enemies.
Tom Fall, ladies and gentlemen, lover of beer, good food,
and good company. Also a murdering psychopath available for birthdays
and barmits. As according to you in the Ghost of
(18:01):
Tom Fall is very much still present in the castle.
So I asked Ian if he'd ever witnessed any Tom
foolery himself.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
I don't believe in ghosts. Let me get this straight.
I don't believe in ghosts. I have no truck with religion.
I gave up thinking about those things a long time ago.
The only thing I believe in on this world that
is outside of normal, So let's call it supernatural, if
you like, is the spirit of Tom. And I've been
around that castle long enough to know that Tom, he
(18:29):
still walks the carriers up there.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
How do you feel the spirit comes through in the castle?
I'm imagine like echoing laughter down hallways, or paintings falling
off stuff, things going wrong, just an energy that you feel.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
So every year we do the big hallowe In piece,
and it's not a particularly high tech piece of work,
but it takes people through the castle on a kind
of haunted tour and it's very successful and it's very
very very well attended. Last year we went a little
bit more high tech and we've decided to do the
whole show in one room with lighting, desks and computers,
(19:07):
the first time we'd ever done it with proper, real
tech stuff. And this is all brand new stuff. It's
all been pack tested, it's all been worked on, and
everything's absolutely fine. We've got a text dish in place,
and everything just stopped. Everything stopped ten minutes before the
audience is about to arrive. Nothing is working, and these
computers were going flying all over the place. We've got
(19:28):
remote lights going crazy in the place, and we're thinking, right,
the audience is five minutes away, and Peter just very
calmly as we all ran around like headless chickens, just said,
hang on a second, and he went off. And about
a minute later everything started working again, and Peter came
in and he said, it's okay. I've sorted it. And
I said, well, what did you do? Did you find
the switch? He said no, I just went and talked
(19:50):
to Tom and somebody had turned Tom's portrait light off
as a portrait light above his head, and somebody had
accidentally turned it off. He said to I've switched it
back on and lit some candles and I asked Tom
to please allow the show to can continue. We haven't
forgotten about him, and I swear down. Everything came back
on and it ran absolutely perfectly until the third night
(20:12):
a child had been in the building and again had
switched the light off on Tom Fool's portrait, and everything
went berserk again and we'd all we had to do
is go and flick the foot the switch and it
all kicked back in again. So now we have a
tradition when we go down to Moncaster, first thing we
do we go up the stairs to Tom Fool's portrait,
make sure the light's on, and I bow to him. Hello, Tom,
(20:33):
we haven't forgotten about you. And that seems to solve
the problems.
Speaker 1 (20:38):
That's amazing, But at what point does the fool actually
become the king? It seems to me like Tom's the
most powerful person in the entire place.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
Well, the fools run the castle. Peter will tell you
that it's the fools that run the castle. And it's
absolutely right.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
Ian, I'm starting to see your your ulterior motive. You
actually just certainly want to take the whole thing over yourself.
One day, by the age of sixty, you'll be living
in there on your own, with your own portrait. Oh
would you like your own portrait.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
Well, we've got our own banners. So my banner is
me on my storytelling bike. So I have a storytelling
bike that and well known for kind of traveling around
in There's quite a bit of interference going on. Sorry, yeah, yeah,
can you tell?
Speaker 1 (21:19):
Yeah, tell? I was going to ask Tom to that's right,
listeners right on que Just after Ian had told the
story about Tom full messing with some technical equipment, guess
who shows up. Luckily, your humble host is a pro
and soldiered on through the interview. How do you actually
(21:40):
design the Fools banner? Do you have your own symbol?
Is it like a coat of arms? What actually makes
up the whole design?
Speaker 2 (21:47):
So it tends to be the thing that you use
for your act. So I've got a trike called Vira,
which is my storytelling bike. So I'm presented on the
back of my bike the previous fool Gary as Dolly
his trolley. It's it's doing it again. Whatever's happening? Sorry,
(22:07):
it is doing it again, isn't it?
Speaker 4 (22:08):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (22:14):
M m m m m.
Speaker 4 (22:27):
Then yeah, it's just suddenly going off.
Speaker 1 (22:35):
And that's where Tom cut us off.
Speaker 5 (22:37):
I was talking about Tom Skelton.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
He's tricking really told you.
Speaker 5 (22:45):
Oh that's weird, is it sudden?
Speaker 4 (22:54):
All grand?
Speaker 5 (22:55):
Well, it took a couple of m Yeah, how about that,
told you Tom.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
After lighting some candles and a quick word with Tom,
we were finally reconnected.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
Hello again, Hello, we're back. Hurrah.
Speaker 1 (23:17):
Yeah, you look way more clearer. That's much better. She's
done at the beginning with Tom out of the picture
for now, at least. Ian told me one of his
favorite stories from Moncaster's history.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
One of the most famous characters at Moncaster is Mary Bragg.
She was associated with somebody in the local town, raven Glass,
and she fell in love with the guy from upstairs,
one of the possblokes, and he kind of reciprocated and
they started this secret love affair. But the housekeeper at
the time she took umbrage because she quite liked him
(23:51):
as well, and she paid some people to do her
in and they killed her and they buried her in
the grounds of Munca, and all went on quite well
until a period of time later. Her body was found
by a young boy and he reported the body being found,
and so in a panic, they took her down to
the river Esque and they laid rocks on top of
(24:13):
her and left her there to rot. Ah how respectful
I know, it gets better and worse, because she somehow
floated up and was found again. Mary brad would not
be left without letting people know that she'd been done
in badly. So they took her body and they burnt
it to ash and they buried it, as far as
(24:35):
I understand, buried it beneath a tree that stood above
the estate, and it became known as the Cursed Tree.
Skip forward in time years later, probably about ten or
fifteen years ago, there was a survey done on the
grounds and in particular the trees around the area, and
they found out that the Cursed tree was a danger.
(24:57):
It was going to fall because it was rotted through.
It stands by the side of the main busy road,
so they needed to it needed to be felled quite
quickly before it caused some damage, and they put a
call out to tree surgeons in the local area, but
nobody would touch the Cursed tree. The story of Mary
Braggan had kind of been quite prolific in the area.
(25:17):
The only man that dared do it. The only man
was a man called Murray who's the grounds keeper at
Moncaster and he's a stoic, big old boy ex soldier,
and he went up to chop down the tree with
his chainsawn. There was a crowd of people gathered, and
here is the truth that when he cut into the tree,
(25:40):
the tree spurted blood all over him, and he turned round.
They thought maybe he'd chopped his arm off or something,
and the tree fell, which is shocking enough. The truth
of it was inside the tree there were bats roosting,
and he chopped into the rooster and out came this flood.
(26:01):
But obviously the rumors and stories went around the village.
The story doesn't quite in there because the tree was felled,
and then people were offered the wood, but nobody would
burn the cursed tree would and Murray said, well, if
they're not having it, I'll have it. So he went
back again to start to chop the tree up and
the limbs up. I heard tell that he was gone
for some hours and they couldn't reach him on his radio,
(26:23):
And eventually fact he turned up clutching onto his hand.
And if you ever meet Murray and get to shake
hands with him, you'll notice that his hand as a
scar all the way from top to bottom because he
chopped his entire hand off and it was held on
only by a fleck of skin. Luckily enough, they managed
to be able to stitch it back on it and he
(26:44):
can now use it. But it's it's quite hell of it,
heavily scarred because he cut right the way through his
hand and the cursed tree. The rumor of the cursted
tree continues, and the wood I think, as far as
I understand it lay, the tree lays in the field, felled,
but nobody will nobody will touch the tree. All come
down from the curse of Mary Bragg. That's how I
understand the story.
Speaker 1 (27:03):
I'll tell you what. Mary's a braver man than I am.
If I cut into a tree that bled, I wouldn't
be going back to cut it up for firewood. I
be on the first train out of Camria. After that
disturbing story of Mary Bragg. I think we need a
(27:25):
palate cleanser. Go on, Ian, give us one more before
we go.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
Here's a great little story for you. And on the
on the flip side, in terms of favorite moments in
the Castle, Iwonna, I'm sure she won't mind me saying this,
because we are friends. Iona's reputation around the Castle is
she's quite a formidable character. And we've always got on
incredibly well with our owner and find a very warm
and a very loving character. But we've always been told
(27:50):
don't get on the wrong side of Iona. About nine
years ago, myself and my good friend Gary Bridgins, who
run the Halloween show, we were up they're working putting
the show on, and we did the whole run of shows.
It was very successful, and it was the night before Halloween,
and in the castle itself, there's a room upstairs. It's
(28:12):
called the Tapestry Room. It's a tiny little room and
it's supposedly the most haunted room in the castle.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
Oh believe me, we know about that one, don't we. Listeners.
You in scared the crap out of me with that
story in a previous mon Caster episode.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
Anyway, me and my friend Gary said, well, been us
tomorrow night's Halloween. Would you mind if me and Gary
slept in the bed in the most haunted room together?
It's this beautiful four poster and they agreed and we said, okay,
we'll go and do that. That's brilliant. And the run
of shows had ended and as a little present, Peter
and Iona presented me with a bottle of whiskey, and
(28:51):
Gary with a bottle of whiskey, and around eleven o'clock
years up the stairs, we went to the most Haunted
room and sat around, helping ourselves to a few DRAMs
of whiskey, until eventually the clock struck twelve and the
door opened. Suddenly we both jumped and it wasn't a ghost.
It was Pete Peter, and Peter escaped because his wife
(29:13):
was asleep. He said, no, boys, I'll come to join you.
I'd brought another bottle, and we dragged these bottles of whiskey,
and around three in the morning decided that the only
spirits we were going to see that night were the
spirits inside that bottle. And eventually it was time for bed.
I was going to sleep in the adjacent room and
Gary was because I can't sleep with Gary. He sings
(29:35):
in his sleep, seeing Yeah, he sings in his sleep. Yeah,
it's a shocker, it's a shocker. We were just about
to room and I said, and I said, listen, we
are the fools of Moncaster. We should at least leave
some kind of memory of this evening. There's a security
camera on the wall up there. Why don't we show
I owner our bums. That would be a nice thing
to see on an hour wee night. So we mooned
the camera, laughed and went off to bed. Now in
(29:57):
the morning we woke up with thick heads and we
sat and started to think remorsefully about what we'd done
and the rumors of obviously Iona, we're all around us,
and we were thinking, what we don't need today is
to be sacked for showing our bums. Maybe we should
admit to our crime. And we found we found Iona
out in the courtyard and said, hello, Iona, we're really sorry,
(30:19):
but last night we were all jinks and boys and
all that, and we showed our bums to your security camera.
So if you see our bums today, that's why. And
she said, oh, security camera. There isn't a security camera
in that room and we said, yes, there is in
the corner we showed our bums to each last night.
She said, no, that's not a security camera. That's the
(30:41):
world wide Web camera. And where do you think every
ghost hunter in the country was looking at midnight last night?
And that's that's the legacy we leave behind at Moncaster.
Speaker 1 (30:52):
Amazing things that go bombing the night. Yes, nice, oh
thank you so much ian.
Speaker 2 (30:59):
That was really it's pleasure to that suit pleasure.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
It's taken five months, but finally we can finish an
episode with a bump. Un just goes to show never
give up on your dreams.
Speaker 2 (31:09):
Kids.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
That's it for this episode. I'm after the full Olympics.
Until next time. Don't ask Tom full for directions, don't
show your bum on the web, but do mind your manners.
Thanks for listening to Bad Manners. If you like the pod,
please share it with your friends. Rate it on the
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Leave a review and make sure you spill the tea
(31:31):
on any of your favorite Bad Manners that we could
feature in future episodes. This podcast was produced by Atamei
Studios for iHeartRadio. It was hosted by me Tom Horton.
It was produced by William Lensky, Rebecca Rappaport, and Chris Ataway.
It was executive produced by Face Steur and Zad Rogers.
Our production manager is Caitlin Paramore and our production coordinator
(31:54):
is Bella Selini
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