Aton Ben-Horin is the Global Vice President of A&R for Warner Music Group, and is a gatekeeper to a mega-industry of influence. He's also happens to be the sweetest guy ever. On this epsiode, Aton gives us a glimpse into his world, where he filters through 100's of music submissions from aspiring hopefuls every day. Aton talks about what it takes to make it in the music industry, the importance of hustling, and how he got to where he is today. Aton shares why hard work, talent, networking, and above all else, a love of music can set an artist apart.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Behind the Influence, a production of I Heart
Radio and TDC Media. It's funny because at the time
I was so sad about it, but it ended up
being one of the biggest blessings of my career. So
it's like, to give somebody the wrong advice or give
them false hope is actually the meanest thing I could
do for them. Having a great song is so important.
(00:21):
There's so many sides of music. There's publishing and songwriting,
and then there's like the live touring side and the
agents and management, so many sides to music. I'm so
excited we have Aton ben Herren in the house. You
are the global VP of warners Ay and our group. Hey,
(00:42):
that's a big deal. I'm so excited to have you
here today. The entire premise of the show is interviewing
people who are behind the influence and are of influence.
You play a huge role in the behind the scenes
of the influence and actually discovering people, which is a
big deal, and discovering not to anyone, but people in
the music industry, which is, in my opinion, the hardest
(01:03):
industry to break through. How do you do it all?
And what do you do? And we need to get
to the nitty gritty here because I've always been so
confused about how the music industry works. How does one
get to that position? So there's not one way of
becoming an A and R. We're working at a record company.
Everybody has a different journey, you know. It really was
a long journey. I've made all my money off of
(01:26):
music related stuff since I was fifteen. I've had no
other job. I did a lot of different things in
music to get to this place. And the interesting thing
is that I didn't really plan. I just kind of
followed my heart every step of the way, and it
kind of like led me to this part. I think
I was like ten years old. I was in the
school choir, so like I got a headstart on like
hearing harmonies, which actually helps you have a good voice.
(01:48):
It's it's it's background background. Okay, okay, it's better than me.
It's I'm just good for the shower. It sounds great
in the shower. Shower was a good place you have
good acoustics. And and then I took two as a piano,
but I still wasn't obsessed with music. I was actually
my life was actually ice hockey. I was obsessed with
ice hockey. I was living in Miami. I remember I
(02:08):
was at hockey camp and I left practice one day
and this is like and there was I heard like
Green Day basket Case playing out of like someone's convertible,
and I was like, and there was not. There was
nothing that sounded like that at the time, and I
was like, what is this. I've never heard of this.
I was obsessed with this is insane. I have to
(02:28):
learn more about like I wanted to hear all those songs.
So I bought the Dukie album. Yes, I could listen
to it right now, Yeah, so good, and yeah we
should play it. And my father had a like an
acoustic like nylon string guitar that was just kind of
collecting dust at the house. And I learned how to
play every song on that album. And my fingers were
(02:48):
almost bleeding. I remember, like it was nuts. When you
first started playing guitar, it's like an awkward feeling and
it hurts your fingers, so it's like they get past
that like first threshold. But I remember my fingers were
practically bleeding, and I learned every song on the album.
I was like, obsessed, How did you learn that? Where
you did someone give you. There's definitely these like tablisher
things which are very easy. So it's not like reading
like regular notes. It's like anybody could read it. It It
(03:10):
kind of almost like it's looking at like a picture
of like the strings and like, so it's pretty easy.
And I took two only took like two months of lessons,
but then learned that kind of taught myself the rest.
Once I learned how to read that, I was like, well,
I could just keep doing this and figure it out.
But but the rest of the guys in my hockey team,
we were all neighbors. They all picked up an instrument
that we started a band. What so you basically like
poached the entire ice hockey team to come and join
(03:32):
your band. We were like best friends, so we kind
of really all like that got exposed to it at
the same time, and then started a rock band. And
that turned out to be like a crazy long journey
which I could write. I don't know how long this
interview is, but to literally spend I could write a
book about every part of my journey, but just the
band stories like insane. About two years in I had
(03:54):
to lift for college, took a break from the band,
and ended up producing. Well, I got exposed to dance music,
so I became like obsessed with dance music, bought a
drum machine, brought turntable, started producing, and uh, I was
djaying locally at a bunch of places. Where were you
at the time. I moved to Orlando for college, so
it was in Orlando. So did you make your way
to Miami where a lot of the electronic music was Yeah,
(04:15):
I actually I played Ultra Music festival like three or
four years in a row. I was a DJ, and
I had developed a following in that scene at the time,
and uh, and I was also getting learning how to
produce and DJ and all that I was. I d
on air two at the at the local station and
a couple of venues. And what I started doing also
for extra money. I started throwing events downtown, so I
would book local talent and like DJs and like collect
(04:37):
the door money. So I was doing like everything, and
then the band gets back together. So at one point
I was djaying, I was in the band, and I
was throwing events downtown. I remember we'd be on tour
and I would call I would make calls back home
and there was somebody collecting door money for me and
like flying the DJs in between like shows. I would
like in between cities, I would make calls. That is
(04:57):
the definition of a hustler people. And you're in Miami,
so it just makes it even better. I went to
college in Miami, so I'm just like picturing you a
mentor like bead that happened and we were play We
did like warp tours, simple plan tours. The whole thing.
I was writing songs that didn't always fit the band,
so I I it was like pop pop songs. I
started producing for other artists and ironically, I so I
(05:20):
sold my first song as a producer to Mike Karen
at Atlantic Records. At the time, that's who ended up
like years later, I would end up hiring me to
do a hard so I told him he was at
the time, he was the vice president of an art
Atlantic Records. I started this production team called the Agency,
and that was like our first The first thing that
(05:40):
we sold was like it is like two thousand six
and then I had money saved up and I was
doing a bunch of songwriting for local people and Mudy
saved up Max all my credit cards. Took a big risk.
What became like the most popular studio in that region,
which is called Plush. It's called Plush Recording Studios. That's
kind of that's when things started picking up. Whenever the
studio wasn't booked, I would either be writing or I
(06:01):
started signing local producers and writers to management, letting them
use the rooms when it wasn't active. But but in
the studio, and we had all types of anybody that
would come through Orlando, Chris Brown and Flow Rider and
DJ Khalid and like like all it was like a
constant flow of people. I was making great contact. I
was I was leveraging the studio locally for different things.
(06:22):
How the stars aligned there is insane to me. And
you still have all these other things still going on.
You still have your band, I'm assuming you still have
your music that you're creating. You're still booking clubs and
shows and all these things. But it's just one of you.
How did one sleep or eat during all this time?
Did you not? It was kissed, but it was definitely chaos.
(06:42):
But when you do what you love, it's like fun
and it doesn't feel like work. You know. The other
thing that a lot of people say in your position,
who have been very successful. Ultimately, they literally dumped out
every penny from their bank account or max out their
cards to make it. Like we were talking to the
under of Patreon, Jack Conti, and he was saying he
(07:03):
literally max out his credit cards, like didn't have rent
money and just went for it. I feel like that's
when you know it's in your heart and you really
want to do it. Because if it's a if it's
a maybe I don't know, should I, you don't do it.
If it's a full body yes, I have to do this,
you have to do it. Yes. But to add to that,
I always say, you have to be realistic, right like
if I had just done my band, I would fell
(07:23):
on my face if I had just done DJA, if
I had just you know, done it. So it was
because I did everything, like I had a side hustle.
Basically I advised everyone, whether it's music, side hustle or not,
to get some kind of side hustle because then you
have a timeline like if I don't make it by
this amount of time, I still have this, then I'm yeah.
Or if you have a sidehusse, so you don't have
(07:43):
the timeline right exactly, because you don't care. Yeah, you're
not like, oh my god, I'm gonna, you know, be
out on the street like I have, I have something
I can continue because you don't know when things are
gonna connect, you know, so at least it gives you,
like the longevity. I believe that you always have to
have a side hustle, Like I would never just do
one thing. I don't do just one thing, you know
what I mean, because you never know, and you don't
(08:05):
want to just be fall in your face like you
said exactly. So that's kind of what what what I
guess it was for me. It was like I was
doing things I loved, but I definitely had to do
Like I mean, even the throwing the events downtown, Like
you fly in the big Act. You spend all this
money and then it rains and nobody wants to go
to and nobody wants to go out. It's like torrential
downpours and you lose money. And I was like, man,
it's so it's like there it was a lot of
(08:27):
ups and downs. It was. It was definitely stressful and
but fun at the same time. And then there was
this one artist I found and developed and signed to
a management deal and put out this song that I
wrote and produced as well, so and the whole thing
went viral. Who was the artist? It was just it
was a YouTube thing grow Avery at the time, kind
of like a young like Avril type, and she went viral.
(08:50):
It went viral. There was a big beating war. Everybody
was like trying to sign her. Um we did, ah
if we did a deal with a Universal Motown at
the time, Sylvia Rowning and Chris and day Um at
Universal Motown and uh, shout out to them. They gave
me a shot as a young manager. Shout out to
people who give others a chance. Really for real, is
(09:11):
that's what it's all about. Yeah, I got a check,
moved to l A, hired someone to run my studio
in Florida, which I still have to this day. Insane
um But but that's what got me to l A.
We were working on that album for about eight months
and I was writing with all like a lot of
local writers and producers. It's funny, a lot of people
don't realize, you know. Now they look at me, you know,
they they say, oh, that's a that's the A R guy.
(09:33):
But at the time I made a lot of the
writers and producers as a co writer or co producer
with them in the room. So it was a really
cool way to meet a lot of the writing community
at the time. What ended up happened eight months later Motown,
before we were about to go to Radio Universal, had
this whole restructuring, so a bunch of artists got dropped
and everything kind of shifted with that, and I was like, man,
(09:54):
what do I do now. I spent two and a
half years on this project. I'm in l A. And
right around that time, Mike Karen, who bought the first
beat from me, became global president of an R for
War and Music Group, so and he he's like, do
you want to try an R And I was like, yeah,
let's let's do like like a trial thing. And thank god,
it was like the dots connected. My first hit was
(10:15):
talk Dirty or Jason, I mean, come on your whole
journey just sounds like the stars were aligning the entire time,
and the universe was like, Okay, Tom, this is what
you're gonna do. But first you're gonna do this band,
Then you guys are gonna take a break, then you're
gonna do this. Then there's gonna be a trench led
downpour at your thing. You're gonna lose a hundred K.
But it's okay because in the end everything worked out.
(10:37):
I mean I think that you know, you know what
it is. It's it's uh. I'm actually I learned so
much from from the journey. I mean, first of all,
I always say, if I didn't do this part, I
wouldn't know this. If I didn't if I if I
didn't like have this issue with a tour guy, you know,
at this venue, I wouldn't know how to give my
artist this kind of advice and and everything because kind
of you connect the dots and it makes me, you know,
the best I could be at this job now, which
(10:58):
is exciting. But I also learned that, like you know,
I used to get bent out of shape, you know
about over stuff when like I mean, I I skipped
a lot of stuff. But like I actually got kicked
out of my band when I was you know, I
think it was I think it was eighteen. I was
seventeen or eighteen at the time, and for me, that
was my life at the time. And I was, so,
why did they kick you out because you weren't giving
it enough attention? That's a whole other story. But we
(11:21):
don't get into I mean we we we added a
new band member, I had to leave town at the
same time, and then like when I came back, they
had been practicing. It was a whole long story. But
but but but I love them and I forget. Did
you feel replaced? I felt, yeah, I felt really hurt.
I was really saying. I knew that we were adding
a bandman, but I didn't new that I was being replaced.
(11:41):
And I don't think that was the plan. But when
I left town for two weeks, my family happened in
a book, a vacation strategically like right at the same time.
You know, it was okay, But I think that's a
part of the stars aligning. Yeah, honestly, it's funny because
at the time I was so sad about it, but
it ended up being one of the biggest blessings of
my career. That's how I wouldn't have known that, because
if I didn't, that didn't happen. I wouldn't have gone
(12:03):
on to learn how to produce and buy a drum
machine and get exposed to dance music and get exposed
to the other side. I was. I was my world
was that band that was everything. So it really but
but but that's just one story. But I have a
ton of stories like that where like I thought something was,
you know, bad, and it turned out to be good.
Or it's just like I just learned to trust God
(12:23):
and trust that process. I was just about to get
a little God on you, but you said God, So
I'm want to say God. I have this picture. It's
my favorite in the world. Every time I lose something
that I wanted, like whether it was an opportunity or whatever,
there's this image of this little girl like reaching out
to God being like, but God, I wanted, and he's
holding a really tiny teddy bear and he's taking it
away from her, but behind his back is a huge
(12:45):
teddy bear. So it's basically saying like she's really wanting
that little tiny teddy bear, but the big one behind
the back is like just wait, it's coming. And it's
like this image I always look at when something goes wrong,
or if I think something's supposed to be one way
but then it turns out the other. I just trust
God and I'm like, you know what, I'm leaving it
up to you. I know You've got big things plan
(13:05):
I'll just sit back and just let let things happen.
You are now and so many like even me listening
to your story. The A and Our person you met
before when you're in Florida, and then and then the
global in our president is now somebody you know and
he's giving you a chance. It's like so many amazing
opportunities for you that I don't want to say fell
(13:27):
into your lap because you worked hard for those. I mean,
every relationship you made along the way. The hustle, those
connections are why you are where you are, And I
think people forget you can't just be talented and be like, guys,
I'm good at this job, like you have to. You
have to hustle and prove it. So for people who
aren't familiar about how A and Our works back in
(13:47):
the day, probably just sending in a cassette of your
favorite song or whatever. How is it today with digital
and social media and I mean you can literally go
on SoundCloud or Spotify probably find the next big thing.
Are people actually submitting things still or how does that work?
So I get about a hundred songs a day to
(14:08):
my email from all over the world from managers, producers, writers, artists, publishers, attorneys, agents.
It's like hundred songs a day and about four to
emails a day. How many do you listen to? Listen to?
As many as I can? Do you have someone else
help you? Like, yes, I have to have a team
of six under me and amazing team shout out to them.
(14:31):
But but but I listened to as much as I
can by myself. And whatever. Like a lot of the
unsolicited stuff, I'll send it to one of my trusted
years and if they love it, they'll send it back
to me. And but everything gets listened to, And I
mean there's a whole I can tell you a lot
about how I listen to the stuff, but I'll say
quickly that they're probably the most important. Well, the course
(14:52):
is the most important part of the song. So if
it's a song I skipped to the if it's just
gonna ask, do you listen to the first like ten
seconds or do you kind of up there out the
song is structured the right way, The course should come
in no later than forty five seconds. Think past that
is too long of a wait, So I try to
find the chorus. Pro tip guys, if you are going
to submit a song, to aton make it hot before seconds,
(15:15):
or he's not listening, so I'll try to skip to
the chorus. I'll find that I hear the course. If
the course is great, then I go back and hear
the whole song. But I also get a lot of instrumentals,
so like because a lot of the stuff we also
put songs together. I can't always count on somebody sending
me a hit song, so we're pretty proactive. A lot
of us, most of us come from musical background, and
on my floor, I have studios and we have constant
(15:37):
writing sessions, and uh, it's a lot of it is
putting the right people in the room. But so I mean,
we we sign, so obviously we look for new people
to sign, but we only signed a certain amount of
things per year. But most of my time is actually
spent either putting songs together from my current artists or
in the studio with them, guiding them into the recording process,
or basically, like I mean, there's there's just like the
(15:57):
two sides of any arts. There's a discovery side where
you're kind of scouting news new talent, and then there's
the record making side. So so you have to actually
follow up and develop that. Yes, I mean the most
important thing is hits, you know, and every and every
artist has a different has different needs for that. Some
of them are better songwriters than others, just totally different
talent to writing a hit song and being an artist.
(16:19):
And uh oh that's a that's a good one liner. Yes,
that's so true though, So explain that a little further
for us. The only specific people that could be artists
they have the voice that that unique and specials and
that they have the drive and because I mean, it's
seven thing being arts, especially if you succeed, it's literally
(16:39):
like you have no life. It's like so much work,
so many things. You have to love it and be
able to deliver on all that stuff. And songwriting is
a whole other thing. There's there's artists that are superstars,
but they can't write a hit song on their own,
you know they need is it because they expect others
to do it for them or they just don't know?
I mean, they all of them, you know, they love music,
(17:00):
All these the ones I work with, most of them
try their best, and some of them do write hits.
I mean a lot of them write write their own hits.
And but but but but the smart ones also know
that even if you write your own hits, Like let's
say you have a hit song, it's exploding the first
thing you do, you're going out to promote it, you're touring,
you need to follow up, so you you can't even
physically be you know, sometimes it takes, like, you know,
(17:21):
even the best writers in the world, like ninety percent
of the time they go into studio, they're not writing
a hit. It's like it's like if it was so easy,
then everybody would just have like, you know, not stuff
if you're constant. So so sometimes it takes a couple
of months in the studio to find the one record,
you know. So the artists sometimes, if I mean so
it's different each time. It's not like a set amount
of time, but you can't know when it's going to come.
(17:43):
So so if they're promoting a song or on tour
and they don't have as much time to spend, so
sometimes they need more support, even though they're amazing writers
or producers. So so it just kind of like every
every project has different needs. So I just kind of
try to care to each artists and what they need
and always respect also what they're passionate about and try
to support their visions as best I can. And you
(18:04):
know it's it's mainly also about that too. You have
to kind of find a happy medium between finding a
great song and also supporting the artist vision and their passion. Okay,
so talk me through this. I submit my song to you.
It goes to your email just so people know how
it works, and maybe maybe one day they'll reach out
to you because we are wanting to inspire, right, It's
(18:25):
all about that. Sending you an email with the song,
make sure the song is popping before forty five seconds.
And then you find something you like. After you find
something you like, what do you do with it? Do
you reach out, your team reaches out for a meeting?
How does that work? Well, Before we even get to that,
I'll say one thing I'll say is a lot of artists.
There's so many people with good voices. If it's an
(18:45):
on the if it's a new artist, so many people
as good voices, so many talented people. But I think
the one thing that really will get like someone's like
my attention, at least on the A and R side,
is like also having a great song with that, because
that's actually what separates you from like another artist is
just doing a bunch of covers, a YouTube things. There's
a lot of those types of artists. A lot of
the signings are based also around having a because the
(19:08):
song also kind of also sets the direction for the project,
and you could spend like I could sign an artist
that doesn't have that song, and that could find them
a song and they're not they don't love the song,
or they're not they're the eye to eye, or they
could spend two years in the studio trying to get
the song, they don't get the song, or they get
the song and they have to start from scratch because
the direction is totally different. So having a great song
(19:29):
is so important, So that that's definitely one tip I'll
say too, like that's a really big part of the
process because there are like a lot of I didn't
realize until the day and are really how much talent
there is. I mean, there's so much, especially here. I
mean I go to a hotel cafe and I'm like, what,
why is this person not famous? And I've interviewed so
(19:49):
many artists in l A. When I'm back in the day,
I would only do music for a different platform, and
I would interview these people and we'd go to their
music video shoots and they were here from London, in
or wherever, and then I wouldn't hear from them ever again,
Like they would be gone because the label. I don't
know what happened, But I want to get into that
with you actually, about how that works with labels and
signing people who think they're all of a sudden gonna
(20:11):
blow up and then they don't, and then they go home.
I do want to talk about that. But to close
this conversation off about the n R. You find the
person you like, you reach out Obviously, I'm sure you
do your diligence and research or Instagram and do all
that kind of stuff before you set up the meeting.
Is that a part of it? Definitely check out as
much as I can before, not just to save my
time or to save their time. Yeah, is social media
important to you? I mean, if you found someone with
(20:32):
two followers versus five million, are you going to go
to the five million or the two that's a better artists? Well?
Before that, I'm like, who has the better music? Right?
I would rather sign someone has the better music without
any followers and sign someone has a bunch of followers,
but no music unless I could there's a song that
there's that that we find that I have to happen
to have that could work for them or on file
or But but I really think the music always leads
(20:55):
the conversation. That's refreshing to hear because I think in
a lot of industries that's not the case. That's awesome.
And when you do find the person you're convinced that
that is some of that you want on the label,
do you then pass them over or you're developing them?
But then what happens to the artists they go through
all their deal stuff? Yeah, I mean, I mean I
like to just get to work first and like like
are they your artists at that point? Um, it's sometimes yes.
(21:17):
Sometimes I just like to also get some vibe with
them in the studio and see if we have a
good like mystery and stuff, because it's not about like
signing a quick deal. It's about like building something and
like you know, do you guys work together, do you
mesh together? Do your visions align? Like? So I like
to kind of then get to know them, do some
time in the studio and see what what how they work,
(21:38):
how their workflow is and how the processes and but
but yeah, if we feel everything, if we love it,
then yeah, I mean I have also a cool position
because I'm Warner Music Group is actually the parent company too,
So so, uh, we have Atlantic Records, we have Warner Records,
we have Parlophone, Electra, Big Beat, APG, we have a
bunch of companies. So cool thing about my job is,
(22:01):
you know, my team kind of sitsum in the middle,
so we're able to sign stuff to any of the companies.
Oh that's nice, it's very amazing. So you can actually
say this will probably make most sense over here, exactly,
that's great, exactly. Or I can send it to a
couple of the companies and see who's who sees the
same vision and and so some of the stuff I
I signed directly to Atlantic, some of the stuff I
(22:23):
signed with the APG with my parents company. It's different
every time, which is awesome. So that's part of what
I love is that we have a lot of options.
But yeah, I mean, so so that that's kind of
that's awesome. Is there a certain artists that you're super
excited about right now up and coming that you're working with.
I would love to hear. You don't feel like I'm cool.
You're not allowed to say, you know, I'm sure I'm
(22:44):
allowed to say. I mean, I'm just I'm in my head, like,
oh my god, they're all your children. I'm so excited that,
like I don't know who to talk about first. I
mean the newest signing for me. That that that that
is just like, actually, I'm not I don't even think
it's a public signing, so I can't even it's not
even publicly announced. But there's someone I'm very excited about.
That man in you'll tell me after the show, I'll
tell you, and then I'll just like edit it in. Yeah,
(23:06):
but I just actually came from having breakfast with Fosia.
It's spelled f A o U c i A. She
is a maniac, like in a good sign Her voice, Yeah,
her voice is publicly her project. Her voice is insane.
It's uh, I don't even know how to describe it.
It's probably one of the best voices I've ever heard. Well,
(23:27):
how about this. Right after you say it's one of
the best voices I've ever heard, I'm going to cut
in a little bit of her song. Does that sound good? Okay?
It's gonna roll right now. Um angel so mean. I'd
take it all and I will never give it. I
(23:53):
don't feel sorry if it's almost see you gros every
sun start, I'm waiting for yours used to dry. I
don't really care and done ever will That's the way.
(24:13):
I am such a fear pill. I don't really care
how my silence skills that schoolway I am. No. I
was in going out, I was I was like this, No,
(24:34):
why do you break me? No, now I blame I
wasn't with all these and many like, can't blame. I'm
(24:55):
the nightmare. I know what you mean by that was amazing.
She's actually really super sweet and humble and loves to
uh and she's a fantastic songwriter. She's I think, wow,
they're all so young now, all the like up and
coming hot artists are so young. Should people throw in
(25:18):
the towel if they're like thirty and really want to
do do the thing? I think it depends on on
the obviously that it is an advantage to having younger
But but but but I mean, there's there's no like
right or wrong, and every project is totally different. If
you're doing like not now that there's like but if
you're doing like straight pop, I think being thirty years
(25:39):
old is a lot differently. But I get what you're saying,
because you're not gonna want. Pop has a look, it
has a vibe you're not gonna want And it's not agism.
It's just the reality of it. And I also assume
some of it has to do if you want the
artists to be around for a while and not just
be like, I give up, I want to have kids
now I'm over it, right, any other artists you want
to plug, Um, I'm here for you. Well, I'm just
(26:01):
excited about this this Gatlantis faith song we just put
out with Dolly Pardon. Did you see that? We actually
we got this guy speaking of somebody who shout out
to Saints. On my Team is an incredible in our
on my on my team. He put together this this
faith record for Dolly Parton. Um and well, Galantis is
(26:22):
the act about one of our artists. He actually managed
to get Dolly Parton on the song. They're they're actually
doing a whole story about it. But but, but the
songs are doing incredible. Let's tell a little bit that
song magic, what awesome I gotta get one more. Shout
(27:08):
get one more shout out in Alec Benjamin, Alec Benjamin
his guy. Yes, I love Alex So alex is when
you know, this is why it's hard. I have like
I know it's hard. You could do this for twenty minutes. Yeah.
So Alec Benjamin has another artist I signed that I
love and uh mi guy my dear friend of my
Miles Beard. Also he's you know APG, but we work
(27:29):
on it together. But he's he's Alec is incredible. He
had to let me Down Slowly song. I'm sure you've
heard it. Yeah, yeah, he's he's on fire. So shout
out Alec and he's playing to cella. Oh yes, he's
about to put on a new album and yeah he's
a new tour announcement. It's it's exciting. And if you
guys haven't heard from him, here's a quick little clip
of Alec your boy a little symphasio. You can show
(27:54):
me if you want to go, then if you leave baby,
let me down slowly, let me, don't don't let me,
don't don't let me, don't don't let me, don't let
me do if you want to go, then if you
leave them let me done slowly. Oh, I wanted to
ask you about international music. This is a selfish question.
(28:17):
I have a cousin who has an incredible voice. We're
Armenian and so he sings at all the you know,
big Armenian events. He's a great voice, he's a great
edgy look. And I know a lot of people in
the music industry and I'm trying to figure out how
to help navigate where he should go and what he
should do. It is the move to put a bunch
of stuff on Spotify. Is the move to I don't
(28:37):
know what to say. If you send me the records,
I could tell you what the move is. Oh, do
you see what happens when you know aton you get
to directly. I'm not even gonna send it to you.
I'm physically gonna, like do old school c D. I'm
gonna burn it on the CD and I would be like,
this is my cousin, Chris, that's what we're gonna meet,
and we're gonna listen to that on a discmand just
(28:58):
so it can be really official, you know what I
think about all the time, like back then and at
that era, CDs and cassettes and all that, like I
mean A and R back then was so different because
now I sit by a computer and I can hear
thirty songs in like twenty minutes because click Back then,
I mean I would have to go out every night
(29:19):
of the week to hear to hear bands and and
do you still do that though, just to be like
a little I do for obviously I go out to
stuff for fun. But but if it's for like to
find something, you're not out there searching. I mean, you
don't have to search. Well, well, the thing is like
I could sit there for three hours and hear three
acts and not even hear what the record of music
sounds like, because probably the most important thing, at least
in the beginning. But but but I actually if I
(29:43):
like something that I that I get that gets sent
to me, then I go here alive or then I'll
go see like that. It's kind of works backwards. But
I just can't imagine doing a R back then would
have been a totally different Yeah, there's a there's literally
a male person walking by with a cart with like
CDs and just I can I believe none of those
wire listened to, Like there's no way. I don't know
(30:04):
who had the time, or they had a bunch of
interns doing it, and then some really great stars did
not become stars. But it literally you have kind of
like I would have no would you have no life
every night? I had every night doing so, So I
don't know if I would enjoyed it, but but I mean,
I'm sure I would still enjoy it. But but it's
a totally different job. So you're a person in power, obviously,
(30:24):
do you find yourself in position sometimes where you feel like,
obviously this industry can be shady. Is it hard to
kind of distinguish who friends are the real homies versus
like I'm trying to climb up the louder and and
have him help me in some way and that's the
only intention, or with women even I'll be honest, I
mean I never like, I just don't think about that stuff.
(30:45):
I'll tell you why I'm I'm a real music guy.
I will never make a decision based off of this
is somebody I like, he's a friend of mine, let
me help or let me or this is something, because
then everybody loses, you know, so I would, but that's
got to be so awkward if you have a friend
who's like you love your friend, right, and and they've
been working on this band for years and years and
years or whatever, and they're like, Aton, can you can
(31:07):
you hook it up? And how do you say? I think,
first of all, giving an honest opinion is always, I
mean that that is the best thing I could do
as a friend, because absolutely, because I'll tell you some
For some people, you know, let's talk about the flip side.
You say, you know, follow your dreams. Follow your dreams.
For some people that that don't have the talent or
(31:30):
the skill set means a lot of parts of music.
Maybe they belong on a different part of the music industry.
But I think for someone's not good enough, you know,
I have to tell them. I feel like if if
I don't, because people's like livelihood, it's their life. They
put in sacrifice and like they they give up so
much of their life, whether it's time or family or
(31:51):
whatever it is. You know this personally because you were
in a band, Yeah, I mean, I mean you give
up your life for this. So it's like to give
somebody the wrong advice or give them false hope is
actually the meanest thing I could do for them. Um.
But but but then at the same time, there's a
there's an art I'm very direct and straightforward, but there's
always there's also a way of doing it where you're
not offending somebody, you know, I think and and especially
(32:14):
with like like even even great songwriters, like I said,
most of the time, they're not sending me hits. It's
like it's like it's so you have to kind of
find the right record from each person or whether it's
a producer or writer, and I want them to keep
sending me more music. I don't want them to get discouraged,
you know. So so there's a way to Okay, so
it's constructive. It's not like you stuck, go do something else,
(32:34):
but you're like, hey, send me more music when you can. Yes,
it's definitely constructive. And and uh, always encourage everyone that
you know keeps sending and don't don't get you know,
because everyone as nice as you in the industry, because
I don't think so. I mean, I don't think so.
One of the things I always talked about with artists
because I've had many independent artists on my show as
(32:56):
well as people who are signed to a label. Obviously
there are benefits to being with the label. All you
get the money, you get the team, You've got the aton, right,
But indie artists feel like they some have sworn that
they would never sign to label because of all the
quote shady things that happened at a label. What do
you have to say to that? Um, Well, what I
(33:17):
have to say is that like the moment you are,
you know, you partner up with anybody, whether it's a
record label or a manager or at least it's there's
not like a thing where like you're not paying them
a monthly fee to like, you know, work for you.
And like, like what I'm saying is I hear, I
hear what? You don't make money unless you make money,
don't succeed unless you succeed, right, You're not paying a
(33:37):
publicist to make you feel like, why on earth would
we be a part of a partner up with anybody?
If we if we don't plan on having success? So
then why how comes so many smaller artists come to
labels and then they kind of get or I've not
experienced it personally, but they say they get put on
the back burner in a sense, and then the bigger
artists get all the money while the smaller artists are
kind of just forgotten about. I mean, that's that's not
(33:59):
that's definitely like a scorn lover would say it, right,
it's just like there, it's it's I will say, nothing
to do with like a bigger or smaller artists or
just more more like it's a more strategic thing. Like
if you if you burn through all of your budget
when you don't have the right song, then your your
longevity is going to be very short. You know that
(34:20):
makes sense better to every every time you you release
a song, And I look at it like this, like
every time you release a song, you're pulling a favor,
whether it's from a playlist or to add your song
from a podcast, to feature your song, from your fans,
to to to go support and listen to the music.
And if the song isn't great, the next time, it's
gonna be harder to do that. And then the next time,
(34:42):
I actually it's gonna be even harder. It's a lots, yeah,
I feel like and everyone actually yeah, and and not
every song has to be I mean you could you
could release some stuff just for you know, viral, you know,
from fans and stuff to keep everybody, like, you know,
entertained and to make sure that people have new content.
But I think there's also an art and a strategy
to pushing the button when you have the right thing
(35:02):
and you see that there's And the crazy thing is
we we live in a time where the moment something
comes out, you're able to see real stats. How many
people on you know, whether it's new Music Friday, whatever
the playlist is, how many people are adding this song
to the playlist when they hear it, how many people
are skipping it, how long are they listening to you?
You can see all this stuff right now. All the
data is available, so you were able to tell like
(35:23):
it's almost like a case study before you even which
is so helpful. It's amazing. Yes, you're able to see
like right away, like even if it's a smaller case study,
like even if it's with a thousand people that came
across the song, how many people added to their personal playlists,
how many people are replaying and how many people it's
there's so many things that you can data. We have
so many tools now that didn't expect ten years ago
(35:45):
from I do think that there's something to having a
following on social media is obviously you get a bigger reach.
So there's that, there's the stats you just talked about.
I mean, there's there's the community you can find, the
community that the artist vibes with. So I feel like
there's a lot of advantages and makes your job much easier.
And patients is key. Yeah, it's so key to just
have patience for any artists out there that is assigned
(36:09):
to a company. I think, I mean well, and and
and by the way, I mean there are I'm sure
there are, like, like, I know how how my team works,
you know how I don't know how you know, I
mean every team works differently, So I'm sure there are
nightmares stories as well. So so you sound like you
kind of get in there with them and really support
them like a family member. I mean, honestly, I do
it from the heart. Of course. I can tell. I'm
(36:29):
a real music fan, obsessed with music. Yeah, I love hits,
I love pop of all is your favorite artists right
now that you're not representing a song guy, Okay, So
I like songs and every genre well, I mean I
go through every every week. It's funny because there's about
I think I don't know what. I don't know if
I've counted, but it's about a hundred songs on New
Music Friday. I think I guess like each week to
(36:50):
come out and every Friday like recycles, so like all week,
I'm trying to get through the whole playlist to hear everything.
And I have my own personal playlists for every genre.
So I make like a personal playlist for the genre,
and I'll add to my personal for listening pleasure, and
then I listened to them. I get excited because there's
all this new stuff that some of it I know,
some of it I I've heard once from and I've
(37:12):
added to my so it's exciting to listen. I actually
listened as a fan too, and I get excited when
I go to the playlist. I have a like a
chill R and B playlist. Tell me what's on your
chill R and B. That's like my favorite genre? Really?
Oh yeah, one toll for days. Well there's the old
school I like old school R and B. Well, yeah,
so this is what I have, an old school R
and B play but the chill R and B is
(37:32):
more newer stuff. It was actually inspired by I heard this,
uh Sabrina Clardie who was signed to it to APG.
She had I Belonged to You song that I was like,
she's amazing. She's amazing, so that that song inspired me
to do like. I think one of my friends works
with her. I'm pretty sure. Does she have long, round,
curly hair and she's beautiful. Okay, my friend Dina, I'm
pretty sure works with her. She works with French Montana.
(37:55):
Her sister works with The Weekend. I'm pretty sure you
know them. It's in your email. But yeah, tell me
what's on here? I mean, I have oh my god,
We'll have Anne Marie and there's Funny's two een movies.
We have an Anne Marie that's like a pop ars
and it's spelled like. One of them has a space,
one has no space. There's an R and B one
that's awesome. She's not signed to our company, but he's awesome.
(38:18):
I don't know. A bunch of stuff in here. Just
tell me, Like I mean, I have a lot of
tell me one more. I want to get weird tonight
with my husband. Give me one more golden song. And
here's a bunch of different things. What's the best one
to like get? You know, a girl's over the music
is going. I think I think Anne Marie Is that
popping for you? It's just popping for all of us?
(38:39):
Is it is a vibe? All right? Well, I'm glad
we got to go through your some of your list
because you're like the music king. So what advice I
want to just wrap this up with, what advice you
would give somebody who wants to make it in this industry.
It's a very, very tough industry to get into. Obviously,
not everyone is as hands on compassionate as you helpful.
I mean, I can a million adjectives to describe you,
(39:01):
but I'm pretty sure our listeners get your vibe by now.
You are clearly very influential in the in the space
of music. That's why you're here. You literally pick people
out of hundreds of songs that you're getting a day,
and you're making stars out of them. What advice would
you give somebody who's listening to this podcast right now,
who lives, breathes, dreams music like you, and they want
(39:23):
to make it, or at least they want to do
something in music that they don't have to be like
the next Rihanna, but they want to be in the industry.
What advice do you have to give to them? Well,
my advice is I mean a couple of things. One,
if if you are an artist and you're you're set
on that, I think you have to know the importance
of having a great song origin because that will change everything.
You know, we live in a time when stuff goes viral,
and and you can't force people to make something go viral.
(39:46):
They have to like it, to replay it or to
reposted or whether it's a well. I mean, there's two
sides of something going viral. One is the actual content
and the others they actually liked the record if so,
it's two ways something go viral, and songs go viral
just because people like the song that I've seen Obviously,
like there's memes and stuff that's different. I'm talking about
like a song that actually gets replayed and stuff. So
but I think finding the right song is so important
(40:08):
because it also will establish the direction for your project.
But I think outside of that, like as a general advice,
I think you kind of have to find your lane
and be realistic. There's so many sides of music. There's
publishing and songwriting, and then there's like you know, the
the live touring side, and the agents and and and management,
and I mean there's so many sides to music. You
(40:30):
want to kind of be realistic and see where do
I fit in the best and where what I perform
the best. You know, some people are incredible at at
a marketing and creative thinking, and there's so many departments
at a record label too, so it's like there's some
people that are amazing from marketing department, not necessarily in
are some people that are better at an are It's like,
but I think you kind of got to find out
where you fit like the best, and where you can
(40:51):
be one of the best. Like what can you be
one of the best in the world at, Not like,
oh I'm good at this, Like what can you be
like incredible at and find your lane there and have
some kind of I think side hustle in the meantime
to hold you over so you don't have a timeline
like it's okay if it takes you, uh, five years,
it's okay if it takes you six months. I mean,
(41:11):
I think you don't really know how long it's going
to take. So if you have something else that actually
generates income in the meantime so that you don't have
to like kind of you know, fall on on on
your face like so early, right, because that's when people quit. Yes,
and you didn't quit, and you just kept your hustles
going and you didn't just have a side hustle. By
(41:31):
the way, it wasn't singular you. You didn't sleep, but
you loved it, so it was okay. I get that.
It was so nice having you here today. I just
to prove the point. Last time I saw him, he
was bringing one of his artists, and and now I'm
You're on the other side of the table. So I'm
really glad we got to get to know each other
a little more. Um, I want all of your artists
to come into our show, will play their music. I
(41:54):
would love that. And you have one last chance to
give a shout out to one more artist and we'll
end on them. Oh and that's and that's a big
pressure because we're ending on it. But this doesn't mean
this is your favorite one. It just means it's another
one you want people to check out. Well, yeah, so
there's this, this, there's artists I just signed kill Boy.
That's incredible. What makes it so different is that she
(42:16):
actually produces her own stuff. And she's not only an
amazing artist, she's also an amazing writer and producer. She
produces better than half the people that I get stuff from,
and she's like, you just sign her, Yeah, and she's
actually making her own hits, Like I mean, it's are
you super excited about her? And she's smart, She's also open,
she loves collaborating. She's just really really awesome, great energy
(42:38):
and just all around she She already has two songs
on Spotify. I'm gonna have to check that out, and
you guys have to check it out. But guess what
I'm gonna do, you guys, solid I'm gonna end this
show with a little kill boy baby way the fun, fun,
(43:19):
fun fun, everybody's give way the fucking biscos on phone
and kin the fact, don't leave us on a love
like a thing for crooking on even want the cut
in back. There's somebody fucker spending punching over petty percents
and now I want to just pay my bread. Don't
wn a couple of Lincoln and Pink with the purple
(43:40):
on the mesode this time he's gonna have to spend
I know nothing day once I have a point, but
I so pay me. And there's got a way, the way,
the way, the fun, the sugars, the baby's maid. Now
it's a little fish, no fading like some crazy health
not tho he was saying, I'm at the studio. I
was looking for me like white a water wait a
(44:02):
wait a water ready fu wa. I'm come turning on
(44:23):
the down thing, picking my assess, and don't never ze
me for ship, because not to stay while I still
get my house and ducking brides. A bridge is still
as an unline bases. And now we're taking down to
if I was god to step it down in the
bridges down to its last, they're just not the only
thing you know to do a range kish and fishing,
but hill because he always misses high. I really would
have never been so down there if it wasn't for
(44:45):
the wooded ship. But I never say thank you. Just
shut my dick, Can my skate up the shot kick
and leave a little ship? Don't read the fun? Got
fucking little little little? Why don't fun? Behind the influence
(45:14):
of the production of I Heart Radio and t DC
Media
Welcome to Behind the Influence, a production of I Heart
Radio and TDC Media. It's funny because at the time
I was so sad about it, but it ended up
being one of the biggest blessings of my career. So
it's like, to give somebody the wrong advice or give
them false hope is actually the meanest thing I could
do for them. Having a great song is so important.
(00:21):
There's so many sides of music. There's publishing and songwriting,
and then there's like the live touring side and the
agents and management, so many sides to music. I'm so
excited we have Aton ben Herren in the house. You
are the global VP of warners Ay and our group. Hey,
(00:42):
that's a big deal. I'm so excited to have you
here today. The entire premise of the show is interviewing
people who are behind the influence and are of influence.
You play a huge role in the behind the scenes
of the influence and actually discovering people, which is a
big deal, and discovering not to anyone, but people in
the music industry, which is, in my opinion, the hardest
(01:03):
industry to break through. How do you do it all?
And what do you do? And we need to get
to the nitty gritty here because I've always been so
confused about how the music industry works. How does one
get to that position? So there's not one way of
becoming an A and R. We're working at a record company.
Everybody has a different journey, you know. It really was
a long journey. I've made all my money off of
(01:26):
music related stuff since I was fifteen. I've had no
other job. I did a lot of different things in
music to get to this place. And the interesting thing
is that I didn't really plan. I just kind of
followed my heart every step of the way, and it
kind of like led me to this part. I think
I was like ten years old. I was in the
school choir, so like I got a headstart on like
hearing harmonies, which actually helps you have a good voice.
(01:48):
It's it's it's background background. Okay, okay, it's better than me.
It's I'm just good for the shower. It sounds great
in the shower. Shower was a good place you have
good acoustics. And and then I took two as a piano,
but I still wasn't obsessed with music. I was actually
my life was actually ice hockey. I was obsessed with
ice hockey. I was living in Miami. I remember I
(02:08):
was at hockey camp and I left practice one day
and this is like and there was I heard like
Green Day basket Case playing out of like someone's convertible,
and I was like, and there was not. There was
nothing that sounded like that at the time, and I
was like, what is this. I've never heard of this.
I was obsessed with this is insane. I have to
(02:28):
learn more about like I wanted to hear all those songs.
So I bought the Dukie album. Yes, I could listen
to it right now, Yeah, so good, and yeah we
should play it. And my father had a like an
acoustic like nylon string guitar that was just kind of
collecting dust at the house. And I learned how to
play every song on that album. And my fingers were
(02:48):
almost bleeding. I remember, like it was nuts. When you
first started playing guitar, it's like an awkward feeling and
it hurts your fingers, so it's like they get past
that like first threshold. But I remember my fingers were
practically bleeding, and I learned every song on the album.
I was like, obsessed, How did you learn that? Where
you did someone give you. There's definitely these like tablisher
things which are very easy. So it's not like reading
like regular notes. It's like anybody could read it. It It
(03:10):
kind of almost like it's looking at like a picture
of like the strings and like, so it's pretty easy.
And I took two only took like two months of lessons,
but then learned that kind of taught myself the rest.
Once I learned how to read that, I was like, well,
I could just keep doing this and figure it out.
But but the rest of the guys in my hockey team,
we were all neighbors. They all picked up an instrument
that we started a band. What so you basically like
poached the entire ice hockey team to come and join
(03:32):
your band. We were like best friends, so we kind
of really all like that got exposed to it at
the same time, and then started a rock band. And
that turned out to be like a crazy long journey
which I could write. I don't know how long this
interview is, but to literally spend I could write a
book about every part of my journey, but just the
band stories like insane. About two years in I had
(03:54):
to lift for college, took a break from the band,
and ended up producing. Well, I got exposed to dance music,
so I became like obsessed with dance music, bought a
drum machine, brought turntable, started producing, and uh, I was
djaying locally at a bunch of places. Where were you
at the time. I moved to Orlando for college, so
it was in Orlando. So did you make your way
to Miami where a lot of the electronic music was Yeah,
(04:15):
I actually I played Ultra Music festival like three or
four years in a row. I was a DJ, and
I had developed a following in that scene at the time,
and uh, and I was also getting learning how to
produce and DJ and all that I was. I d
on air two at the at the local station and
a couple of venues. And what I started doing also
for extra money. I started throwing events downtown, so I
would book local talent and like DJs and like collect
(04:37):
the door money. So I was doing like everything, and
then the band gets back together. So at one point
I was djaying, I was in the band, and I
was throwing events downtown. I remember we'd be on tour
and I would call I would make calls back home
and there was somebody collecting door money for me and
like flying the DJs in between like shows. I would
like in between cities, I would make calls. That is
(04:57):
the definition of a hustler people. And you're in Miami,
so it just makes it even better. I went to
college in Miami, so I'm just like picturing you a
mentor like bead that happened and we were play We
did like warp tours, simple plan tours. The whole thing.
I was writing songs that didn't always fit the band,
so I I it was like pop pop songs. I
started producing for other artists and ironically, I so I
(05:20):
sold my first song as a producer to Mike Karen
at Atlantic Records. At the time, that's who ended up
like years later, I would end up hiring me to
do a hard so I told him he was at
the time, he was the vice president of an art
Atlantic Records. I started this production team called the Agency,
and that was like our first The first thing that
(05:40):
we sold was like it is like two thousand six
and then I had money saved up and I was
doing a bunch of songwriting for local people and Mudy
saved up Max all my credit cards. Took a big risk.
What became like the most popular studio in that region,
which is called Plush. It's called Plush Recording Studios. That's
kind of that's when things started picking up. Whenever the
studio wasn't booked, I would either be writing or I
(06:01):
started signing local producers and writers to management, letting them
use the rooms when it wasn't active. But but in
the studio, and we had all types of anybody that
would come through Orlando, Chris Brown and Flow Rider and
DJ Khalid and like like all it was like a
constant flow of people. I was making great contact. I
was I was leveraging the studio locally for different things.
(06:22):
How the stars aligned there is insane to me. And
you still have all these other things still going on.
You still have your band, I'm assuming you still have
your music that you're creating. You're still booking clubs and
shows and all these things. But it's just one of you.
How did one sleep or eat during all this time?
Did you not? It was kissed, but it was definitely chaos.
(06:42):
But when you do what you love, it's like fun
and it doesn't feel like work. You know. The other
thing that a lot of people say in your position,
who have been very successful. Ultimately, they literally dumped out
every penny from their bank account or max out their
cards to make it. Like we were talking to the
under of Patreon, Jack Conti, and he was saying he
(07:03):
literally max out his credit cards, like didn't have rent
money and just went for it. I feel like that's
when you know it's in your heart and you really
want to do it. Because if it's a if it's
a maybe I don't know, should I, you don't do it.
If it's a full body yes, I have to do this,
you have to do it. Yes. But to add to that,
I always say, you have to be realistic, right like
if I had just done my band, I would fell
(07:23):
on my face if I had just done DJA, if
I had just you know, done it. So it was
because I did everything, like I had a side hustle.
Basically I advised everyone, whether it's music, side hustle or not,
to get some kind of side hustle because then you
have a timeline like if I don't make it by
this amount of time, I still have this, then I'm yeah.
Or if you have a sidehusse, so you don't have
(07:43):
the timeline right exactly, because you don't care. Yeah, you're
not like, oh my god, I'm gonna, you know, be
out on the street like I have, I have something
I can continue because you don't know when things are
gonna connect, you know, so at least it gives you,
like the longevity. I believe that you always have to
have a side hustle, Like I would never just do
one thing. I don't do just one thing, you know
what I mean, because you never know, and you don't
(08:05):
want to just be fall in your face like you
said exactly. So that's kind of what what what I
guess it was for me. It was like I was
doing things I loved, but I definitely had to do
Like I mean, even the throwing the events downtown, Like
you fly in the big Act. You spend all this
money and then it rains and nobody wants to go
to and nobody wants to go out. It's like torrential
downpours and you lose money. And I was like, man,
it's so it's like there it was a lot of
(08:27):
ups and downs. It was. It was definitely stressful and
but fun at the same time. And then there was
this one artist I found and developed and signed to
a management deal and put out this song that I
wrote and produced as well, so and the whole thing
went viral. Who was the artist? It was just it
was a YouTube thing grow Avery at the time, kind
of like a young like Avril type, and she went viral.
(08:50):
It went viral. There was a big beating war. Everybody
was like trying to sign her. Um we did, ah
if we did a deal with a Universal Motown at
the time, Sylvia Rowning and Chris and day Um at
Universal Motown and uh, shout out to them. They gave
me a shot as a young manager. Shout out to
people who give others a chance. Really for real, is
(09:11):
that's what it's all about. Yeah, I got a check,
moved to l A, hired someone to run my studio
in Florida, which I still have to this day. Insane
um But but that's what got me to l A.
We were working on that album for about eight months
and I was writing with all like a lot of
local writers and producers. It's funny, a lot of people
don't realize, you know. Now they look at me, you know,
they they say, oh, that's a that's the A R guy.
(09:33):
But at the time I made a lot of the
writers and producers as a co writer or co producer
with them in the room. So it was a really
cool way to meet a lot of the writing community
at the time. What ended up happened eight months later Motown,
before we were about to go to Radio Universal, had
this whole restructuring, so a bunch of artists got dropped
and everything kind of shifted with that, and I was like, man,
(09:54):
what do I do now. I spent two and a
half years on this project. I'm in l A. And
right around that time, Mike Karen, who bought the first
beat from me, became global president of an R for
War and Music Group, so and he he's like, do
you want to try an R And I was like, yeah,
let's let's do like like a trial thing. And thank god,
it was like the dots connected. My first hit was
(10:15):
talk Dirty or Jason, I mean, come on your whole
journey just sounds like the stars were aligning the entire time,
and the universe was like, Okay, Tom, this is what
you're gonna do. But first you're gonna do this band,
Then you guys are gonna take a break, then you're
gonna do this. Then there's gonna be a trench led
downpour at your thing. You're gonna lose a hundred K.
But it's okay because in the end everything worked out.
(10:37):
I mean I think that you know, you know what
it is. It's it's uh. I'm actually I learned so
much from from the journey. I mean, first of all,
I always say, if I didn't do this part, I
wouldn't know this. If I didn't if I if I
didn't like have this issue with a tour guy, you know,
at this venue, I wouldn't know how to give my
artist this kind of advice and and everything because kind
of you connect the dots and it makes me, you know,
the best I could be at this job now, which
(10:58):
is exciting. But I also learned that, like you know,
I used to get bent out of shape, you know
about over stuff when like I mean, I I skipped
a lot of stuff. But like I actually got kicked
out of my band when I was you know, I
think it was I think it was eighteen. I was
seventeen or eighteen at the time, and for me, that
was my life at the time. And I was, so,
why did they kick you out because you weren't giving
it enough attention? That's a whole other story. But we
(11:21):
don't get into I mean we we we added a
new band member, I had to leave town at the
same time, and then like when I came back, they
had been practicing. It was a whole long story. But
but but but I love them and I forget. Did
you feel replaced? I felt, yeah, I felt really hurt.
I was really saying. I knew that we were adding
a bandman, but I didn't new that I was being replaced.
(11:41):
And I don't think that was the plan. But when
I left town for two weeks, my family happened in
a book, a vacation strategically like right at the same time.
You know, it was okay, But I think that's a
part of the stars aligning. Yeah, honestly, it's funny because
at the time I was so sad about it, but
it ended up being one of the biggest blessings of
my career. That's how I wouldn't have known that, because
if I didn't, that didn't happen. I wouldn't have gone
(12:03):
on to learn how to produce and buy a drum
machine and get exposed to dance music and get exposed
to the other side. I was. I was my world
was that band that was everything. So it really but
but but that's just one story. But I have a
ton of stories like that where like I thought something was,
you know, bad, and it turned out to be good.
Or it's just like I just learned to trust God
(12:23):
and trust that process. I was just about to get
a little God on you, but you said God, So
I'm want to say God. I have this picture. It's
my favorite in the world. Every time I lose something
that I wanted, like whether it was an opportunity or whatever,
there's this image of this little girl like reaching out
to God being like, but God, I wanted, and he's
holding a really tiny teddy bear and he's taking it
away from her, but behind his back is a huge
(12:45):
teddy bear. So it's basically saying like she's really wanting
that little tiny teddy bear, but the big one behind
the back is like just wait, it's coming. And it's
like this image I always look at when something goes wrong,
or if I think something's supposed to be one way
but then it turns out the other. I just trust
God and I'm like, you know what, I'm leaving it
up to you. I know You've got big things plan
(13:05):
I'll just sit back and just let let things happen.
You are now and so many like even me listening
to your story. The A and Our person you met
before when you're in Florida, and then and then the
global in our president is now somebody you know and
he's giving you a chance. It's like so many amazing
opportunities for you that I don't want to say fell
(13:27):
into your lap because you worked hard for those. I mean,
every relationship you made along the way. The hustle, those
connections are why you are where you are, And I
think people forget you can't just be talented and be like, guys,
I'm good at this job, like you have to. You
have to hustle and prove it. So for people who
aren't familiar about how A and Our works back in
(13:47):
the day, probably just sending in a cassette of your
favorite song or whatever. How is it today with digital
and social media and I mean you can literally go
on SoundCloud or Spotify probably find the next big thing.
Are people actually submitting things still or how does that work?
So I get about a hundred songs a day to
(14:08):
my email from all over the world from managers, producers, writers, artists, publishers, attorneys, agents.
It's like hundred songs a day and about four to
emails a day. How many do you listen to? Listen to?
As many as I can? Do you have someone else
help you? Like, yes, I have to have a team
of six under me and amazing team shout out to them.
(14:31):
But but but I listened to as much as I
can by myself. And whatever. Like a lot of the
unsolicited stuff, I'll send it to one of my trusted
years and if they love it, they'll send it back
to me. And but everything gets listened to, And I
mean there's a whole I can tell you a lot
about how I listen to the stuff, but I'll say
quickly that they're probably the most important. Well, the course
(14:52):
is the most important part of the song. So if
it's a song I skipped to the if it's just
gonna ask, do you listen to the first like ten
seconds or do you kind of up there out the
song is structured the right way, The course should come
in no later than forty five seconds. Think past that
is too long of a wait, So I try to
find the chorus. Pro tip guys, if you are going
to submit a song, to aton make it hot before seconds,
(15:15):
or he's not listening, so I'll try to skip to
the chorus. I'll find that I hear the course. If
the course is great, then I go back and hear
the whole song. But I also get a lot of instrumentals,
so like because a lot of the stuff we also
put songs together. I can't always count on somebody sending
me a hit song, so we're pretty proactive. A lot
of us, most of us come from musical background, and
on my floor, I have studios and we have constant
(15:37):
writing sessions, and uh, it's a lot of it is
putting the right people in the room. But so I mean,
we we sign, so obviously we look for new people
to sign, but we only signed a certain amount of
things per year. But most of my time is actually
spent either putting songs together from my current artists or
in the studio with them, guiding them into the recording process,
or basically, like I mean, there's there's just like the
(15:57):
two sides of any arts. There's a discovery side where
you're kind of scouting news new talent, and then there's
the record making side. So so you have to actually
follow up and develop that. Yes, I mean the most
important thing is hits, you know, and every and every
artist has a different has different needs for that. Some
of them are better songwriters than others, just totally different
talent to writing a hit song and being an artist.
(16:19):
And uh oh that's a that's a good one liner. Yes,
that's so true though, So explain that a little further
for us. The only specific people that could be artists
they have the voice that that unique and specials and
that they have the drive and because I mean, it's
seven thing being arts, especially if you succeed, it's literally
(16:39):
like you have no life. It's like so much work,
so many things. You have to love it and be
able to deliver on all that stuff. And songwriting is
a whole other thing. There's there's artists that are superstars,
but they can't write a hit song on their own,
you know they need is it because they expect others
to do it for them or they just don't know?
I mean, they all of them, you know, they love music,
(17:00):
All these the ones I work with, most of them
try their best, and some of them do write hits.
I mean a lot of them write write their own hits.
And but but but but the smart ones also know
that even if you write your own hits, Like let's
say you have a hit song, it's exploding the first
thing you do, you're going out to promote it, you're touring,
you need to follow up, so you you can't even
physically be you know, sometimes it takes, like, you know,
(17:21):
even the best writers in the world, like ninety percent
of the time they go into studio, they're not writing
a hit. It's like it's like if it was so easy,
then everybody would just have like, you know, not stuff
if you're constant. So so sometimes it takes a couple
of months in the studio to find the one record,
you know. So the artists sometimes, if I mean so
it's different each time. It's not like a set amount
of time, but you can't know when it's going to come.
(17:43):
So so if they're promoting a song or on tour
and they don't have as much time to spend, so
sometimes they need more support, even though they're amazing writers
or producers. So so it just kind of like every
every project has different needs. So I just kind of
try to care to each artists and what they need
and always respect also what they're passionate about and try
to support their visions as best I can. And you
(18:04):
know it's it's mainly also about that too. You have
to kind of find a happy medium between finding a
great song and also supporting the artist vision and their passion. Okay,
so talk me through this. I submit my song to you.
It goes to your email just so people know how
it works, and maybe maybe one day they'll reach out
to you because we are wanting to inspire, right, It's
(18:25):
all about that. Sending you an email with the song,
make sure the song is popping before forty five seconds.
And then you find something you like. After you find
something you like, what do you do with it? Do
you reach out, your team reaches out for a meeting?
How does that work? Well, Before we even get to that,
I'll say one thing I'll say is a lot of artists.
There's so many people with good voices. If it's an
(18:45):
on the if it's a new artist, so many people
as good voices, so many talented people. But I think
the one thing that really will get like someone's like
my attention, at least on the A and R side,
is like also having a great song with that, because
that's actually what separates you from like another artist is
just doing a bunch of covers, a YouTube things. There's
a lot of those types of artists. A lot of
the signings are based also around having a because the
(19:08):
song also kind of also sets the direction for the project,
and you could spend like I could sign an artist
that doesn't have that song, and that could find them
a song and they're not they don't love the song,
or they're not they're the eye to eye, or they
could spend two years in the studio trying to get
the song, they don't get the song, or they get
the song and they have to start from scratch because
the direction is totally different. So having a great song
(19:29):
is so important, So that that's definitely one tip I'll
say too, like that's a really big part of the
process because there are like a lot of I didn't
realize until the day and are really how much talent
there is. I mean, there's so much, especially here. I
mean I go to a hotel cafe and I'm like, what,
why is this person not famous? And I've interviewed so
(19:49):
many artists in l A. When I'm back in the day,
I would only do music for a different platform, and
I would interview these people and we'd go to their
music video shoots and they were here from London, in
or wherever, and then I wouldn't hear from them ever again,
Like they would be gone because the label. I don't
know what happened, But I want to get into that
with you actually, about how that works with labels and
signing people who think they're all of a sudden gonna
(20:11):
blow up and then they don't, and then they go home.
I do want to talk about that. But to close
this conversation off about the n R. You find the
person you like, you reach out Obviously, I'm sure you
do your diligence and research or Instagram and do all
that kind of stuff before you set up the meeting.
Is that a part of it? Definitely check out as
much as I can before, not just to save my
time or to save their time. Yeah, is social media
important to you? I mean, if you found someone with
(20:32):
two followers versus five million, are you going to go
to the five million or the two that's a better artists? Well?
Before that, I'm like, who has the better music? Right?
I would rather sign someone has the better music without
any followers and sign someone has a bunch of followers,
but no music unless I could there's a song that
there's that that we find that I have to happen
to have that could work for them or on file
or But but I really think the music always leads
(20:55):
the conversation. That's refreshing to hear because I think in
a lot of industries that's not the case. That's awesome.
And when you do find the person you're convinced that
that is some of that you want on the label,
do you then pass them over or you're developing them?
But then what happens to the artists they go through
all their deal stuff? Yeah, I mean, I mean I
like to just get to work first and like like
are they your artists at that point? Um, it's sometimes yes.
(21:17):
Sometimes I just like to also get some vibe with
them in the studio and see if we have a
good like mystery and stuff, because it's not about like
signing a quick deal. It's about like building something and
like you know, do you guys work together, do you
mesh together? Do your visions align? Like? So I like
to kind of then get to know them, do some
time in the studio and see what what how they work,
(21:38):
how their workflow is and how the processes and but
but yeah, if we feel everything, if we love it,
then yeah, I mean I have also a cool position
because I'm Warner Music Group is actually the parent company too,
So so, uh, we have Atlantic Records, we have Warner Records,
we have Parlophone, Electra, Big Beat, APG, we have a
bunch of companies. So cool thing about my job is,
(22:01):
you know, my team kind of sitsum in the middle,
so we're able to sign stuff to any of the companies.
Oh that's nice, it's very amazing. So you can actually
say this will probably make most sense over here, exactly,
that's great, exactly. Or I can send it to a
couple of the companies and see who's who sees the
same vision and and so some of the stuff I
I signed directly to Atlantic, some of the stuff I
(22:23):
signed with the APG with my parents company. It's different
every time, which is awesome. So that's part of what
I love is that we have a lot of options.
But yeah, I mean, so so that that's kind of
that's awesome. Is there a certain artists that you're super
excited about right now up and coming that you're working with.
I would love to hear. You don't feel like I'm cool.
You're not allowed to say, you know, I'm sure I'm
(22:44):
allowed to say. I mean, I'm just I'm in my head, like,
oh my god, they're all your children. I'm so excited that,
like I don't know who to talk about first. I
mean the newest signing for me. That that that that
is just like, actually, I'm not I don't even think
it's a public signing, so I can't even it's not
even publicly announced. But there's someone I'm very excited about.
That man in you'll tell me after the show, I'll
tell you, and then I'll just like edit it in. Yeah,
(23:06):
but I just actually came from having breakfast with Fosia.
It's spelled f A o U c i A. She
is a maniac, like in a good sign Her voice, Yeah,
her voice is publicly her project. Her voice is insane.
It's uh, I don't even know how to describe it.
It's probably one of the best voices I've ever heard. Well,
(23:27):
how about this. Right after you say it's one of
the best voices I've ever heard, I'm going to cut
in a little bit of her song. Does that sound good? Okay?
It's gonna roll right now. Um angel so mean. I'd
take it all and I will never give it. I
(23:53):
don't feel sorry if it's almost see you gros every
sun start, I'm waiting for yours used to dry. I
don't really care and done ever will That's the way.
(24:13):
I am such a fear pill. I don't really care
how my silence skills that schoolway I am. No. I
was in going out, I was I was like this, No,
(24:34):
why do you break me? No, now I blame I
wasn't with all these and many like, can't blame. I'm
(24:55):
the nightmare. I know what you mean by that was amazing.
She's actually really super sweet and humble and loves to
uh and she's a fantastic songwriter. She's I think, wow,
they're all so young now, all the like up and
coming hot artists are so young. Should people throw in
(25:18):
the towel if they're like thirty and really want to
do do the thing? I think it depends on on
the obviously that it is an advantage to having younger
But but but but I mean, there's there's no like
right or wrong, and every project is totally different. If
you're doing like not now that there's like but if
you're doing like straight pop, I think being thirty years
(25:39):
old is a lot differently. But I get what you're saying,
because you're not gonna want. Pop has a look, it
has a vibe you're not gonna want And it's not agism.
It's just the reality of it. And I also assume
some of it has to do if you want the
artists to be around for a while and not just
be like, I give up, I want to have kids
now I'm over it, right, any other artists you want
to plug, Um, I'm here for you. Well, I'm just
(26:01):
excited about this this Gatlantis faith song we just put
out with Dolly Pardon. Did you see that? We actually
we got this guy speaking of somebody who shout out
to Saints. On my Team is an incredible in our
on my on my team. He put together this this
faith record for Dolly Parton. Um and well, Galantis is
(26:22):
the act about one of our artists. He actually managed
to get Dolly Parton on the song. They're they're actually
doing a whole story about it. But but, but the
songs are doing incredible. Let's tell a little bit that
song magic, what awesome I gotta get one more. Shout
(27:08):
get one more shout out in Alec Benjamin, Alec Benjamin
his guy. Yes, I love Alex So alex is when
you know, this is why it's hard. I have like
I know it's hard. You could do this for twenty minutes. Yeah.
So Alec Benjamin has another artist I signed that I
love and uh mi guy my dear friend of my
Miles Beard. Also he's you know APG, but we work
(27:29):
on it together. But he's he's Alec is incredible. He
had to let me Down Slowly song. I'm sure you've
heard it. Yeah, yeah, he's he's on fire. So shout
out Alec and he's playing to cella. Oh yes, he's
about to put on a new album and yeah he's
a new tour announcement. It's it's exciting. And if you
guys haven't heard from him, here's a quick little clip
of Alec your boy a little symphasio. You can show
(27:54):
me if you want to go, then if you leave baby,
let me down slowly, let me, don't don't let me,
don't don't let me, don't don't let me, don't let
me do if you want to go, then if you
leave them let me done slowly. Oh, I wanted to
ask you about international music. This is a selfish question.
(28:17):
I have a cousin who has an incredible voice. We're
Armenian and so he sings at all the you know,
big Armenian events. He's a great voice, he's a great
edgy look. And I know a lot of people in
the music industry and I'm trying to figure out how
to help navigate where he should go and what he
should do. It is the move to put a bunch
of stuff on Spotify. Is the move to I don't
(28:37):
know what to say. If you send me the records,
I could tell you what the move is. Oh, do
you see what happens when you know aton you get
to directly. I'm not even gonna send it to you.
I'm physically gonna, like do old school c D. I'm
gonna burn it on the CD and I would be like,
this is my cousin, Chris, that's what we're gonna meet,
and we're gonna listen to that on a discmand just
(28:58):
so it can be really official, you know what I
think about all the time, like back then and at
that era, CDs and cassettes and all that, like I
mean A and R back then was so different because
now I sit by a computer and I can hear
thirty songs in like twenty minutes because click Back then,
I mean I would have to go out every night
(29:19):
of the week to hear to hear bands and and
do you still do that though, just to be like
a little I do for obviously I go out to
stuff for fun. But but if it's for like to
find something, you're not out there searching. I mean, you
don't have to search. Well, well, the thing is like
I could sit there for three hours and hear three
acts and not even hear what the record of music
sounds like, because probably the most important thing, at least
in the beginning. But but but I actually if I
(29:43):
like something that I that I get that gets sent
to me, then I go here alive or then I'll
go see like that. It's kind of works backwards. But
I just can't imagine doing a R back then would
have been a totally different Yeah, there's a there's literally
a male person walking by with a cart with like
CDs and just I can I believe none of those
wire listened to, Like there's no way. I don't know
(30:04):
who had the time, or they had a bunch of
interns doing it, and then some really great stars did
not become stars. But it literally you have kind of
like I would have no would you have no life
every night? I had every night doing so, So I
don't know if I would enjoyed it, but but I mean,
I'm sure I would still enjoy it. But but it's
a totally different job. So you're a person in power, obviously,
(30:24):
do you find yourself in position sometimes where you feel like,
obviously this industry can be shady. Is it hard to
kind of distinguish who friends are the real homies versus
like I'm trying to climb up the louder and and
have him help me in some way and that's the
only intention, or with women even I'll be honest, I
mean I never like, I just don't think about that stuff.
(30:45):
I'll tell you why I'm I'm a real music guy.
I will never make a decision based off of this
is somebody I like, he's a friend of mine, let
me help or let me or this is something, because
then everybody loses, you know, so I would, but that's
got to be so awkward if you have a friend
who's like you love your friend, right, and and they've
been working on this band for years and years and
years or whatever, and they're like, Aton, can you can
(31:07):
you hook it up? And how do you say? I think,
first of all, giving an honest opinion is always, I
mean that that is the best thing I could do
as a friend, because absolutely, because I'll tell you some
For some people, you know, let's talk about the flip side.
You say, you know, follow your dreams. Follow your dreams.
For some people that that don't have the talent or
(31:30):
the skill set means a lot of parts of music.
Maybe they belong on a different part of the music industry.
But I think for someone's not good enough, you know,
I have to tell them. I feel like if if
I don't, because people's like livelihood, it's their life. They
put in sacrifice and like they they give up so
much of their life, whether it's time or family or
(31:51):
whatever it is. You know this personally because you were
in a band, Yeah, I mean, I mean you give
up your life for this. So it's like to give
somebody the wrong advice or give them false hope is
actually the meanest thing I could do for them. Um.
But but but then at the same time, there's a
there's an art I'm very direct and straightforward, but there's
always there's also a way of doing it where you're
not offending somebody, you know, I think and and especially
(32:14):
with like like even even great songwriters, like I said,
most of the time, they're not sending me hits. It's
like it's like it's so you have to kind of
find the right record from each person or whether it's
a producer or writer, and I want them to keep
sending me more music. I don't want them to get discouraged,
you know. So so there's a way to Okay, so
it's constructive. It's not like you stuck, go do something else,
(32:34):
but you're like, hey, send me more music when you can. Yes,
it's definitely constructive. And and uh, always encourage everyone that
you know keeps sending and don't don't get you know,
because everyone as nice as you in the industry, because
I don't think so. I mean, I don't think so.
One of the things I always talked about with artists
because I've had many independent artists on my show as
(32:56):
well as people who are signed to a label. Obviously
there are benefits to being with the label. All you
get the money, you get the team, You've got the aton, right,
But indie artists feel like they some have sworn that
they would never sign to label because of all the
quote shady things that happened at a label. What do
you have to say to that? Um, Well, what I
(33:17):
have to say is that like the moment you are,
you know, you partner up with anybody, whether it's a
record label or a manager or at least it's there's
not like a thing where like you're not paying them
a monthly fee to like, you know, work for you.
And like, like what I'm saying is I hear, I
hear what? You don't make money unless you make money,
don't succeed unless you succeed, right, You're not paying a
(33:37):
publicist to make you feel like, why on earth would
we be a part of a partner up with anybody?
If we if we don't plan on having success? So
then why how comes so many smaller artists come to
labels and then they kind of get or I've not
experienced it personally, but they say they get put on
the back burner in a sense, and then the bigger
artists get all the money while the smaller artists are
kind of just forgotten about. I mean, that's that's not
(33:59):
that's definitely like a scorn lover would say it, right,
it's just like there, it's it's I will say, nothing
to do with like a bigger or smaller artists or
just more more like it's a more strategic thing. Like
if you if you burn through all of your budget
when you don't have the right song, then your your
longevity is going to be very short. You know that
(34:20):
makes sense better to every every time you you release
a song, And I look at it like this, like
every time you release a song, you're pulling a favor,
whether it's from a playlist or to add your song
from a podcast, to feature your song, from your fans,
to to to go support and listen to the music.
And if the song isn't great, the next time, it's
gonna be harder to do that. And then the next time,
(34:42):
I actually it's gonna be even harder. It's a lots, yeah,
I feel like and everyone actually yeah, and and not
every song has to be I mean you could you
could release some stuff just for you know, viral, you know,
from fans and stuff to keep everybody, like, you know,
entertained and to make sure that people have new content.
But I think there's also an art and a strategy
to pushing the button when you have the right thing
(35:02):
and you see that there's And the crazy thing is
we we live in a time where the moment something
comes out, you're able to see real stats. How many
people on you know, whether it's new Music Friday, whatever
the playlist is, how many people are adding this song
to the playlist when they hear it, how many people
are skipping it, how long are they listening to you?
You can see all this stuff right now. All the
data is available, so you were able to tell like
(35:23):
it's almost like a case study before you even which
is so helpful. It's amazing. Yes, you're able to see
like right away, like even if it's a smaller case study,
like even if it's with a thousand people that came
across the song, how many people added to their personal playlists,
how many people are replaying and how many people it's
there's so many things that you can data. We have
so many tools now that didn't expect ten years ago
(35:45):
from I do think that there's something to having a
following on social media is obviously you get a bigger reach.
So there's that, there's the stats you just talked about.
I mean, there's there's the community you can find, the
community that the artist vibes with. So I feel like
there's a lot of advantages and makes your job much easier.
And patients is key. Yeah, it's so key to just
have patience for any artists out there that is assigned
(36:09):
to a company. I think, I mean well, and and
and by the way, I mean there are I'm sure
there are, like, like, I know how how my team works,
you know how I don't know how you know, I
mean every team works differently, So I'm sure there are
nightmares stories as well. So so you sound like you
kind of get in there with them and really support
them like a family member. I mean, honestly, I do
it from the heart. Of course. I can tell. I'm
(36:29):
a real music fan, obsessed with music. Yeah, I love hits,
I love pop of all is your favorite artists right
now that you're not representing a song guy, Okay, So
I like songs and every genre well, I mean I
go through every every week. It's funny because there's about
I think I don't know what. I don't know if
I've counted, but it's about a hundred songs on New
Music Friday. I think I guess like each week to
(36:50):
come out and every Friday like recycles, so like all week,
I'm trying to get through the whole playlist to hear everything.
And I have my own personal playlists for every genre.
So I make like a personal playlist for the genre,
and I'll add to my personal for listening pleasure, and
then I listened to them. I get excited because there's
all this new stuff that some of it I know,
some of it I I've heard once from and I've
(37:12):
added to my so it's exciting to listen. I actually
listened as a fan too, and I get excited when
I go to the playlist. I have a like a
chill R and B playlist. Tell me what's on your
chill R and B. That's like my favorite genre? Really?
Oh yeah, one toll for days. Well there's the old
school I like old school R and B. Well, yeah,
so this is what I have, an old school R
and B play but the chill R and B is
(37:32):
more newer stuff. It was actually inspired by I heard this,
uh Sabrina Clardie who was signed to it to APG.
She had I Belonged to You song that I was like,
she's amazing. She's amazing, so that that song inspired me
to do like. I think one of my friends works
with her. I'm pretty sure. Does she have long, round,
curly hair and she's beautiful. Okay, my friend Dina, I'm
pretty sure works with her. She works with French Montana.
(37:55):
Her sister works with The Weekend. I'm pretty sure you
know them. It's in your email. But yeah, tell me
what's on here? I mean, I have oh my god,
We'll have Anne Marie and there's Funny's two een movies.
We have an Anne Marie that's like a pop ars
and it's spelled like. One of them has a space,
one has no space. There's an R and B one
that's awesome. She's not signed to our company, but he's awesome.
(38:18):
I don't know. A bunch of stuff in here. Just
tell me, Like I mean, I have a lot of
tell me one more. I want to get weird tonight
with my husband. Give me one more golden song. And
here's a bunch of different things. What's the best one
to like get? You know, a girl's over the music
is going. I think I think Anne Marie Is that
popping for you? It's just popping for all of us?
(38:39):
Is it is a vibe? All right? Well, I'm glad
we got to go through your some of your list
because you're like the music king. So what advice I
want to just wrap this up with, what advice you
would give somebody who wants to make it in this industry.
It's a very, very tough industry to get into. Obviously,
not everyone is as hands on compassionate as you helpful.
I mean, I can a million adjectives to describe you,
(39:01):
but I'm pretty sure our listeners get your vibe by now.
You are clearly very influential in the in the space
of music. That's why you're here. You literally pick people
out of hundreds of songs that you're getting a day,
and you're making stars out of them. What advice would
you give somebody who's listening to this podcast right now,
who lives, breathes, dreams music like you, and they want
(39:23):
to make it, or at least they want to do
something in music that they don't have to be like
the next Rihanna, but they want to be in the industry.
What advice do you have to give to them? Well,
my advice is I mean a couple of things. One,
if if you are an artist and you're you're set
on that, I think you have to know the importance
of having a great song origin because that will change everything.
You know, we live in a time when stuff goes viral,
and and you can't force people to make something go viral.
(39:46):
They have to like it, to replay it or to
reposted or whether it's a well. I mean, there's two
sides of something going viral. One is the actual content
and the others they actually liked the record if so,
it's two ways something go viral, and songs go viral
just because people like the song that I've seen Obviously,
like there's memes and stuff that's different. I'm talking about
like a song that actually gets replayed and stuff. So
but I think finding the right song is so important
(40:08):
because it also will establish the direction for your project.
But I think outside of that, like as a general advice,
I think you kind of have to find your lane
and be realistic. There's so many sides of music. There's
publishing and songwriting, and then there's like you know, the
the live touring side, and the agents and and and management,
and I mean there's so many sides to music. You
(40:30):
want to kind of be realistic and see where do
I fit in the best and where what I perform
the best. You know, some people are incredible at at
a marketing and creative thinking, and there's so many departments
at a record label too, so it's like there's some
people that are amazing from marketing department, not necessarily in
are some people that are better at an are It's like,
but I think you kind of got to find out
where you fit like the best, and where you can
(40:51):
be one of the best. Like what can you be
one of the best in the world at, Not like,
oh I'm good at this, Like what can you be
like incredible at and find your lane there and have
some kind of I think side hustle in the meantime
to hold you over so you don't have a timeline
like it's okay if it takes you, uh, five years,
it's okay if it takes you six months. I mean,
(41:11):
I think you don't really know how long it's going
to take. So if you have something else that actually
generates income in the meantime so that you don't have
to like kind of you know, fall on on on
your face like so early, right, because that's when people quit. Yes,
and you didn't quit, and you just kept your hustles
going and you didn't just have a side hustle. By
(41:31):
the way, it wasn't singular you. You didn't sleep, but
you loved it, so it was okay. I get that.
It was so nice having you here today. I just
to prove the point. Last time I saw him, he
was bringing one of his artists, and and now I'm
You're on the other side of the table. So I'm
really glad we got to get to know each other
a little more. Um, I want all of your artists
to come into our show, will play their music. I
(41:54):
would love that. And you have one last chance to
give a shout out to one more artist and we'll
end on them. Oh and that's and that's a big
pressure because we're ending on it. But this doesn't mean
this is your favorite one. It just means it's another
one you want people to check out. Well, yeah, so
there's this, this, there's artists I just signed kill Boy.
That's incredible. What makes it so different is that she
(42:16):
actually produces her own stuff. And she's not only an
amazing artist, she's also an amazing writer and producer. She
produces better than half the people that I get stuff from,
and she's like, you just sign her, Yeah, and she's
actually making her own hits, Like I mean, it's are
you super excited about her? And she's smart, She's also open,
she loves collaborating. She's just really really awesome, great energy
(42:38):
and just all around she She already has two songs
on Spotify. I'm gonna have to check that out, and
you guys have to check it out. But guess what
I'm gonna do, you guys, solid I'm gonna end this
show with a little kill boy baby way the fun, fun,
(43:19):
fun fun, everybody's give way the fucking biscos on phone
and kin the fact, don't leave us on a love
like a thing for crooking on even want the cut
in back. There's somebody fucker spending punching over petty percents
and now I want to just pay my bread. Don't
wn a couple of Lincoln and Pink with the purple
(43:40):
on the mesode this time he's gonna have to spend
I know nothing day once I have a point, but
I so pay me. And there's got a way, the way,
the way, the fun, the sugars, the baby's maid. Now
it's a little fish, no fading like some crazy health
not tho he was saying, I'm at the studio. I
was looking for me like white a water wait a
(44:02):
wait a water ready fu wa. I'm come turning on
(44:23):
the down thing, picking my assess, and don't never ze
me for ship, because not to stay while I still
get my house and ducking brides. A bridge is still
as an unline bases. And now we're taking down to
if I was god to step it down in the
bridges down to its last, they're just not the only
thing you know to do a range kish and fishing,
but hill because he always misses high. I really would
have never been so down there if it wasn't for
(44:45):
the wooded ship. But I never say thank you. Just
shut my dick, Can my skate up the shot kick
and leave a little ship? Don't read the fun? Got
fucking little little little? Why don't fun? Behind the influence
(45:14):
of the production of I Heart Radio and t DC
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