October 7, 2025 • 44 mins
In today's episode, Sarah and Laura talk about their own tendencies to compare + despair at times, as well as what helps them to avoid this! Then, Sarah interviews Kate Strickler, creator of Naptime Kitchen and author of I Just Wish I Had a Bigger Kitchen: And Other Lies I Think Will Make Me Happy. Kate shares the areas in which she struggles the most as well as what has worked to overcome this mindset over the years.
In the Q&A, a listener writes in excited about an upcoming girls' trip, but wondering how often to FaceTime kids while gone. Will it be reassuring or invoke more stress?
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hi.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
I'm Laura Vanderkamp. I'm a mother of five, an author, journalist,
and speaker.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
And I'm Sarah hart Hunger, a mother of three, practicing physician, writer,
and courtse creator. We are two working parents who love
our careers and our families.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Welcome to best of both worlds. Here we talk about
how real women manage work, family, and time for fun.
From figuring out childcare to mapping out long.
Speaker 4 (00:33):
Term career goals.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
We want you to get the most out of life.
Speaker 4 (00:41):
Welcome to best of both worlds. This is Laura.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
This episode is airing in early October of twenty twenty five.
Sarah is going to be interviewing Kate Strickler, who is
the author of the brand new book I Just Wish
I Had a Bigger Kitchen, which is essays about comparison
being content with our own lives. Sarah, maybe you can
tell us all a little bit about it.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Yeah, I was really attracted to the concept of this
book when I saw the title. Kate is a kind
of a social media personality and a She does a
lot of cooking videos and she's known as Naptime Kitchen
is her brand, and she created that while her kids
were really little, and she talks about struggling with comparison
and how that has gotten her down in various areas
(01:22):
of life and how she is still working through that
and as someone who absolutely can fall prey.
Speaker 5 (01:28):
To these same difficulties at times.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
I just thought it was a fantastic topic for the book,
and she does a great job talking about it in
various realms of life, so from like how you look
to how much money you have to what you're doing.
Speaker 5 (01:41):
For work and all kinds of things.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
And yeah, it's just really interesting to read it because
it was done so personally. I mean, she talks about
what she's actually struggling with and what she's still struggling
with and what has helped, and you feel like you
really get to know her.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
So yeah, well that's so fascinating that she's a social
media personality give and that I think social media is
kind of the source of a lot of people's compare
and despair. I mean, how does that work out? I mean,
I know that something you've thought about in the past
and actually have exited several apps because of.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
She does talk about that, she does not say the
answer is to get off, maybe because because.
Speaker 4 (02:18):
That's how she makes her living.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Yes, I mean that's fair, that is absolutely fair. I
mean she actually does probably talk about that. I'm trying
to remember if she specifically talks about like not following
accounts which make you feel bad. I have found that
to be a fantastic tool the unsubscribe or just to
quit a platform altogether. I'm going to just also say,
if you decide that like reading someone's thing or listening
(02:41):
to them isn't serving you, you can just quietly leave.
It doesn't have to be forever. It can be an
experiment where you see if you miss that person's presence
in your life, where you're like, huh, I actually feel
better not seeing that. And also you don't have to
tell them.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
Also true with the creator.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
I've received a couple of like people flouncing out of
my website and I'm like, you could just leave, it's fine,
it's fine.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Well, and like the apps don't send you a notification
like so and so has stopped following you. I mean
that might be interesting in it of itself, but like, no,
generally they don't know at all, and so yeah, you
can just quietly put a pause on it, and if
you find it that you've been missing somebody's wonderful photos
of children and matching outfits frolicking on the beach.
Speaker 4 (03:24):
You can always follow them again. But if that thought never.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Crosses your mind once you stop seeing them, then maybe
that's something to know.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
Yes, for me, it's been the like running accounts. Even
though I respect these creators so much and there's nothing
wrong with what they're putting out there, I'm like, I
don't need this for me and for you, I feel
like your pain point is exactly what you just said.
Speaker 5 (03:44):
It's the although I think maybe.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
You just find it funny at this point, that's true,
the white you just find it, Oh, this is my children,
Like there are certain lines in the sand, and the
matching outfits is one of them. Which is why I
will never be like a big family influencer, since I
think it is a requirement to show all your children
like lined up in matching outfits in some sort of
(04:09):
natural scene. I mean your husband would have to be
in it too. It's almost you'd have to hire a
photographer because he can't just take it like you have
to show him too.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
And they have to be like white, like flat out
no want linen designer outfits. We're not talking Christmas pajamas,
like you got to like they humor.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Me on Christmas, Like we all get matching pajamas on Christmas,
and with some grumbling, everyone will wear the matching pajamas
on Christmas for like one photo and then somebody's back
in a hoodie or whatever, and you know you never
get it again.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
But yeah, well, anyway, this book is really fun and
she does talk about stuff like that and again how
you can kind of empower yourself to live your own
life and enjoy what you do have without being worried
about keeping up with the Joneses.
Speaker 5 (04:56):
So I hope you enjoy this conversation absolutely.
Speaker 4 (04:58):
Well, let's hear what Kate Strickler us to say.
Speaker 3 (05:01):
Well, I am so excited to be here with Kate Strickler,
the author of I Just Wish I had a bigger
kitchen and creator behind Naptime Kitchen.
Speaker 5 (05:09):
Welcome Kate to the show.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
Thank you, thank you so much for having me. Happy
to be here.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
So I loved reading your book, which is all about
the comparison trap as Laura and I just talked about,
and I am just wondering, Well, first, I guess give
our listeners some of them probably know you from the
various socials that you're on because you are kind of big.
But just in case they don't give us a little
hint of your career journey as it's looked so far
(05:36):
and kind of where you are with everything.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
Absolutely.
Speaker 6 (05:38):
So. My name is Kate Strickler. I am a mom
of four mary Tonate. We live in Charleston, South Carolina,
and almost ten years ago, really, which sounds so wild,
I started Naptime Kitchen, which was never meant to be
any It was just a place to post recipes I
was making, and really just a creative outlet in a
(06:00):
season where I was really lacking in creativity. My son
was napping twice a day, I was stuck at home
a lot, and so I just kind of channeled my.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
Energy into cooking.
Speaker 6 (06:10):
And it's funny because at the beginning the recipes were
like way more elaborate because it was like, hey, I
have this whole nap time, and I was really leaning
into the nap time cooking, like you cook while this
baby's asleep, because you can't cook at five PM when.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
The baby's screaming and attached to you.
Speaker 6 (06:25):
And then over time, so we now have four children
and it's like overtime as each child joined the recipes.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
Just it was an inverse relationship.
Speaker 6 (06:34):
So it went from like, here's something beautiful homemade to like,
let me show you what I threw at a crockpot
with a jar of sauce.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
So and both are useful for different phases of our lives.
Speaker 5 (06:46):
We one hundred percent get it.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
I've got three kids, Laura has five, so we are
right there with you.
Speaker 5 (06:51):
Yeah, that is awesome.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
And so this journey kind of I mean, let's just
be honest, like, You've had some awesome success in the
social media space, which is really really cool, and now
you've written a book. So what has it been like
for this to become your career.
Speaker 6 (07:09):
Yes, well it really was pretty slow, and so it
wasn't something that like overnight happened, but just this kind
of slow realization of like, wow, okay, people are following
along with this, and then like a year would go
by and I'd be like, wow, like a lot more
people are following along with this, and then I like,
remember when I got paid to do something for the
(07:31):
first time, and I was like, oh my gosh, because
before that, like somebody would send me like a bag
of almonds and I.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Would be like, this is amazing. I can't believe I
got a free bag.
Speaker 6 (07:39):
Of almonds as a veil, you know, just so funny.
And so it took a long time for me to
kind of come to terms with the fact that it
was a career, like that this could be something that
would be a job and be sustainable. And I think
it helped me when I started to name it as that,
because then I could start to be like, Okay, this
is work, Like I need to set aside time for this,
(08:02):
I need to give a certain amount of energy to this,
all of those sorts of things. But I don't even
know if I answered your question fully, but that's kind
of where just slowly over time, it wasn't this like
overnight decision. But then probably well when Alberta was born,
so that would have been, like, you know, I was
like six years in at this point. That's when it
(08:23):
really started to be like, Okay, I think this is
really something that I could build on if I was
given a little more time to do.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
So that's so cool. And then your husband ended up
joining in. I think that must have been a pivotal
moment as well.
Speaker 6 (08:36):
That was really pivotal, and you know, it's funny because
he works with me, he does his own stuff on
the side, like he's still a practicing attorney, so he
can still do law for people. He really has found
like a niche kind of in my market of doing
law for other creators, just kind of understands how the
contracts were, like because able to you know, be helpful
(08:58):
in that regard for people. But at first it was
definitely he needed like a clean break, like he couldn't
just go part time for his firm. It just didn't
work that way. So for the first few months it
was like a very clean break of like Nate no
longer works at this law firm or he was doing
in house at that not that it matters, but that
was like a pretty big like Okay, this is like
(09:20):
our schedule is really different, and Nate is very really
pretty organized and like wants to understand how the days
are going to go.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
So he wasn't like, hey, let's just like see.
Speaker 6 (09:30):
He was like, okay, I want to know like when
you expect to be working, when I should expect to
be working, Like let's create some sort of schedule. So
he really spearheaded kind of like what our days would
look like, which was good for me because I needed that.
Speaker 3 (09:46):
That is super interesting kind of behind the scenes stuff.
And I love how both of you ended up kind
of doing what we call on the show sometimes career crafting.
You know, it's like it's evolved slowly, but you're like, yeah,
let me lean into this because I'm really good at that,
and let me develop this niche. And it worked out
so well well with all the success. I guess what
I was leading up to is then you write a
book that's like, and yet I can't stop comparing myself
(10:07):
to everyone else in all of these realms, and I
one hundred percent get it. I am like, I one
hundred percent get it. But I also want you to
talk about kind of like, well, how did you realize that?
And how can that be true when you're someone who
objectively has just done so incredibly well in life.
Speaker 6 (10:24):
I know, you know, I think partly it is just
like part of the human condition that we just do
this to ourselves. I always think of that. I'm pretty
sure it was C. S. Lewis that was like envy
doesn't want the most, It just wants more than the
other person, you know, or it was it pride or
arrogance or whatever. It's like it just wants to be
above the other people, and our hearts are so bent
(10:46):
towards that. And online is a space that I really
love and I love the connection, but unfortunately it gives
you like a view into way more people's lives than
you would ever have on a normal basis. So I
think that there was kind of a perfect, a perfect
coming together. I don't even want to call it a storm,
because I feel like a storm's kind of a negative term.
(11:07):
But I was in a place where I was able
to kind of share vulnerably if I was having a
hard time with something, and then because I was online,
I would receive hundreds of DMS back of people.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
Being like, wow, I feel that way too, Like I can't.
I didn't.
Speaker 6 (11:25):
One, I can't believe you feel that way, Kate. I
would have never imagined that you would feel that way.
And two like, man, thanks for like saying that, because
I have felt really alone in it or you know,
whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
And so I.
Speaker 6 (11:37):
Started to almost have this like test case where I
was like, Okay, every time I share something like this,
there is like a huge response, and every time, like
much bigger than other things that I would share, you know,
just this kind of like desire. I think that especially
as women, we have to just know we're not alone,
that other people are feeling these things, matched with kind
(11:59):
of like a guilt. I was feeling of like, gosh,
I shouldn't be feeling this way, I should just be
happy and grateful all the time. But I have never
met a woman who has been that way. You know, like,
normally there's something that has to intersect in your life
to make you realize how good you have it, Like
something bad happens and you're like, gosh, I can't believe
(12:20):
I took that for granted. But on a daily basis,
I think that the struggle for contentment and the struggle
against comparison is just like very living an act.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
I totally can see that, and it's almost like on
a smaller scale we have that struggle, even if on
a larger scale like we know, we know, oh my gosh,
we are so lucky. I'm sitting here in a climate
controlled environment, like wearing clothes, I don't have to worry
about where my next meal comes from, like, and yet
it doesn't stop the fact that when somebody else tells
you about their kid doing something amazing, you're like, oh,
(12:52):
maybe mine didn't do that, And I feel a certain way,
and there's something very human there and something so honest,
and I love I think what you're getting out with
the responses, like you hit a nerve and the fact
that you were willing to share vulnerably because this book
is pretty is pretty raw in some of these chapters,
and I love that in a lot of these different areas,
I think is just really really valuable because I don't
(13:13):
think there's just that many people putting themselves out there
like this.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
Thanks.
Speaker 6 (13:17):
It's funny because during the writing process, I think I
was just so in it that I was doing it.
Like a month before the book came out. I was like,
oh my gosh, everyone is about to read this.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
What did I do? And I'm so great. It's like
you know, but I was like, oh, gosh, okay, here
it is.
Speaker 5 (13:38):
We're doing this.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
It's in boxes, it's going to bookstores, all right.
Speaker 3 (13:44):
But seriously, I'm so glad you did. We're going to
take a quick break and then we're going to start
delving into some of those specific areas that you talk
about in your book. All right, we are back, and
(14:04):
we were just talking about Kate's vulnerability and how she
really delved into multiple areas where I think many of
us tend to compare and despair, and she goes into
detail about like what in this area has been hard
and then has some solutions of like what has been
helping And Kate, I love how you you're never like
and this is the answer You're like and this is
(14:25):
still a continued process. Yeah, because I guess you know
this is going to be human nature. It's going to
be a forever thing. But let's dive into the first place.
And I'm going to go with the title, So Home,
I wish I had a bigger kitchen. Earn my case,
I wish I had a beautifully organized, minimalist home. Go
tell me about your struggles and some of the things
(14:46):
you've done to counteract them.
Speaker 6 (14:49):
Yes, so the home chapter really, like the bigger kitchen
title really was very honest, because so funny. I've been
on Instagram and so often cooking in like an interior kitchen,
like I have no great lighting, I don't have a
big island, I don't have ample storage, and so really
(15:09):
I would be like, oh.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
I really just wished I had a biker kitchen.
Speaker 6 (15:12):
But I think that the kitchen so much like for
so many people, just exemplifies this like level of peace
kind of for you, like you were saying a minimalist tone,
you like, look at someone who has that home and
you just think, like, man, their life is so simple,
they're probably so happy. Everything about their life is probably
better than mine. You just kind of create this whole
(15:35):
narrative based off of, like it's so funny to say,
but based off of like a clear kitchen island that
I could believe, like this whole narrative for somebody based
off of that. But I think our homes, I hope not.
You know, I really try in this chapter not to
do a disservice to the home, like not to say
it shouldn't matter, because I think it actually deeply, deeply matters,
(15:56):
Like it quite literally houses you. You know, it is
where you see spend probably more time than anywhere else.
But I think that we really have got to reframe
what we see our homes as. And so I think
about even my little girls playing with like a Barbie dollhouse.
They don't just sit the Barbie in the dollhouse, they
play with the Barbie in the dollhouse, like they move
(16:17):
it around, and they move the furniture around and they
make it whatever they need it to be for what
their barbies are doing. And I think sometimes we think
of our homes as like something that we're just gonna
sit in and not touch and have be beautiful all
the time. But really it's such a working mechanism in
our house. Like everything, it's like it needs to be moving.
(16:39):
I think furniture, there are seasons where your furniture should move,
you know, like you're gonna do something with You're gonna
have a playroom for a while, and then eventually you're
gonna be like, you know what, our kids don't need
a playroom anymore. How could we use this space differently?
Or your basement was used for something and now you're like,
you know what, the kids are older, we could really
use like a pool table down here. How do we
change this space for our season of life? And so
(17:02):
seeing your home that way is like, how is this
a tool that serves our family versus this like Christine
building that we just try and like maneuver our lives around.
Speaker 5 (17:12):
Like a symbol or something like yes, yes, agreed as.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
A human yes exactly.
Speaker 3 (17:20):
I also feel like when we see examples of others' homes,
we're either seeing them curated spaces on social media, or
even when you're invited to someone's house, unless it's like
your best friend, you're probably getting the best possible version
of their house.
Speaker 5 (17:34):
Yeah, and that probably doesn't help.
Speaker 4 (17:36):
I'm guessing no.
Speaker 6 (17:39):
And it's funny because in my real life when I
walk into my friends' houses, I see the whole picture.
You see, even if they're like countertop is clean, they
have a corner.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
Everybody's got a corner.
Speaker 6 (17:53):
Everybody has a place they're trying to like shove the
mail and that thing they need to return, and that
tupperware they got to get to somebody, and the short
that didn't fit that they got to get back to
the store. Like everybody has that somewhere. I think you
see it so much more in real life, and so
we have to like fight online remember that those corners
exist in the same way, we just might.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
Not see them.
Speaker 3 (18:15):
So your advice would be to think of your home
in terms of its utility and in terms of the
living that you're doing in it and its function, and
then also pay attention to when you can get a
taste of what other people's real environments look like.
Speaker 6 (18:28):
Yes, I would definitely pay attention when you go to
other people's homes.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
And just see like and see the different way.
Speaker 6 (18:33):
Like I would be very open minded, like how do
they deal with shoes by the door? What systems do
they have in place? But I think there is a
place for utility and like beauty to meet. But I
think very often we sacrifice utility for beauty and then
we get super frustrated at ourselves or at the people
(18:55):
that live in our home that are like, listen, I'm sorry,
I just got to put my shoes somewhere. And so
I know you want this beautiful table by the front
door that has like a few pictures on it, but
like we might really need some shoe bins, you know,
like whatever it is that, we've got to find a
way for those things to marry or else you'll drive
yourself crazy.
Speaker 5 (19:12):
Totally, all right.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
The next area we're going to talk about is the
I just Wish I was a better mom chapter. We
have definitely talked on this podcast about mom guilt and
the phenomenon how there's not a lot of dad guilt
or parenting guilt, and yet it's just so innate. Actually,
of the two hosts of the show, Laura is much
better at not succumbing to mom guilt, I think compared
to me, and even when I logically know it doesn't
(19:38):
belong there, like my kids' lives are awesome objectively, I
just sometimes have it anyway. Yeah, And I think you
do too, despite having like four kids and so much
time that you spend with them. So where does this
come from, do you think? And how can we best
fight it?
Speaker 6 (19:54):
I think a lot of the times that it comes
from like a good place. It comes from a desire
to be there for our children. But I think that
as humans, like we just have limits and so we
cannot Like it's you can't have a home that is
perfectly clean and a meal that is made and snuggle
(20:15):
your child during their nap time because during nap time
was when you were either going to clean or you
were going to prep dinner.
Speaker 1 (20:22):
Like you can't do it all.
Speaker 6 (20:24):
And so that's where I think that we can get
really down on ourselves. But it's normally something that I've
been thinking a lot about this year. It's been coming
up a lot. Is like accepting capacity. And I think
when we can accept capacity. It really can help alleviate
some of that guilt because it's not you should be
doing it all, but it's like, you know what you can't, like,
where can your capacity go today? So that is something
(20:47):
I've been thinking about a lot. And then specifically with
my kids, I've really been trying to show them that
I enjoy my job and that I enjoy them, and
that in doing two things, sometimes you just have to
make a choice. Like sometimes you want two desserts on
the dessert menu and you pick one of the two.
And I feel very lucky that I do enjoy my
(21:09):
job like ninety nine percent of the time. But I
want my kids to see a mom who made sacrifices
to be with them but also made sacrifices for our
family in terms of work. That like, that was that
that's something I'm doing also for our family, and it's not.
Speaker 1 (21:29):
Like this awful thing like that they could have a
job they.
Speaker 6 (21:33):
Love and a family they love, and they if they do,
they won't be at everything always, but that's okay. That
that's like a very natural and kind of good consequence,
Like you're just you can't be in two places, and
that's okay.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
I love that and even playing the thought experiment that
you didn't have a job just because you have four kids.
Remember that you can always be in two places, like
you might have to miss kid A's game because.
Speaker 5 (21:57):
You're at kid Be's games.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
So yeah, the capacity be question applies no matter where
you are in life. Although on the show, of course,
we love that you are making work in life fit
together in that way and that you're really enjoying both.
Speaker 6 (22:10):
So I love that, And I think when you frame
it as teaching your kids about capacity, it's like, you know,
whenever you tell your you're so much more kind to
somebody other than yourself. And so I think if you're
teaching your child like, hey, I get it, like you
want to do two things and you just can't, Like
how healthy to model that to them, versus like I
(22:32):
can do it all all the time, Like that's a
pretty hard standard to have and to So I think
it's healthy for them to see your humanity, your limits,
like those kinds of things. So I think you're teaching
something really valuable when you show them that the choices.
Speaker 5 (22:49):
Yes, I love that.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
All right, we're going to take another quick break and
then we're going to get to the category of friends
and fomo. All right, we are back and we are
(23:10):
going through some of the vulnerable categories that Kate shared
about in her book I just wish I had a
bigger kitchen in terms of comparison, and one of the
chapters that I really liked was about friends or just
feeling like I wish I had better friends or I
was in a more cohesive group, and definitely appreciated some
of the examples you used about, like you thought you
were good and then you saw somebody else on their girls'
(23:33):
chep and were like, oh, I wasn't invited to that,
And yeah, I guess would you say that this is
a category that's harder today with social media out there.
Speaker 6 (23:41):
I think so much harder, And unfortunately, I don't think
the majority of people are trying to be hurtful in
any way. They're just sharing something fun. And you just
noticed that there was a group together, especially if you
don't know the backstory of.
Speaker 1 (23:57):
Like maybe they just both showed up to the beat.
Speaker 6 (24:00):
Maybe they just decided that they were both going to
go to the beach and then they happened to be
there at the same time. But you think, oh, they
planned it, they planned it and they thought to themselves,
let's not invite Kate, you know, like or even I,
you know, especially now, like we have lots of friends
that are turning forty and doing fun things for forty.
It's and it's like you just can't have a two
(24:23):
hundred person party. And really, if you want to go
out to dinner, it's really hard to make a reservation
for more than like ten people. And so there are
there are like limiting circumstances that are going to leave
people out that I just don't think are ill intentioned.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
It's just kind of like unfortunate. That's just how life is.
But a lot of the times, if you see.
Speaker 6 (24:44):
It on social media, you don't have any of the
backstory there, and then you just you might not have
ever known it was going to happen, but now you know.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
It did happen, and you see who's together.
Speaker 6 (24:52):
And so I think that this is an area that
unfortunately is a real unfortunate negative of social media. And
I don't know, I don't know a good I don't
know a way around it. I don't know how to
make it better. But I feel very sensitive to it,
especially probably because of my following and because I know
I have lots of friends that follow me. I feel
so sensitive to like what if I have girls over
(25:16):
and a picture is posted and somebody else sees it
and they just feel like they weren't.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
Included and I don't even know who they are.
Speaker 6 (25:22):
In my head right now, I'm like, who would it
be that I forgot to include? But so it would
have never been ill intention towards that person. It would
have just been probably an oversight. But I get very,
very fearful of just people feeling left.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
Out totally, And so what would you say is the
best way to get over this?
Speaker 1 (25:42):
One?
Speaker 3 (25:42):
Just more like remember to if there's someone who I
hang out with, like make that happen that you have
agency to invite that persons.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
One. I think agency is huge.
Speaker 6 (25:54):
I think like if you're really wanting to like have
a fun dinner out and you're like wallow in.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
And I'm like, send a text, get a date on
the calendar.
Speaker 6 (26:03):
With some friends, and like be the instigator in that situation,
and then I you know, it's funny that sounds because
I actually talk about this in the husband chapter, but
I would really fight to give people the benefit of
the doubt that it was probably not something deeply against you.
It could have so easily been a capacity thing and
oversight or something that wasn't even planned to begin with
(26:27):
that just happened, you know, like very spontaneously, and you
just happen to not be there. And then I think, like,
at the end of the day, it's just you.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
You have to kind of be okay in who you are.
Speaker 6 (26:39):
And I think that friendship especially can feel so tender
and so scary because you're wondering.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
Am I not liked? Like was I not included?
Speaker 6 (26:48):
And I would say if it's something that is like
a pattern or something that you're feeling hurt by, I
would We're at the age where I'm like, we got
to have these conversations, Like if there's somebody that you're
consistently feeling hurt by, I'm like, man, you should probably
have a conversation with them. Like we just got to
at our age either, you know, you got to push
(27:09):
through it and have the kind of conversations. And I
think I would say that a lot of my closest
friends are people that I have had hard conversations with
over the years, And I think sometimes we believe friendship is.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
Just easy all the time, but I.
Speaker 6 (27:23):
Think friendship is a lot like marriage, Like you're going
to say something that hurts someone, there's going to be
something that's miscommunicated, and so as much as you can,
like I think it is, if someone were to come
to me and want to talk to me about something,
I would see that as like, Wow, they really value me.
They didn't just decide like let's just cut her out,
like I'm just not even going to mess with it anymore.
It's like, no, I want to work through this. And
(27:45):
so I guess I would say if you're in like
a season of repetitive hurt feelings or fomo feelings.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
Like I would one make your own magic.
Speaker 6 (27:55):
Out there, but two like, if it's a specific thing, gosh,
life is too short, like I would really I would
encourage you to conversation.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Yeah, yeah, totally.
Speaker 4 (28:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:06):
I mean I think we don't see those messy parts
of friendship on social media with the gaping, So you
just need to go a layer deeper, and I think
your friendships are probably going to benefit as a result anyway,
or you'll find out it's time to move on and
that's okay.
Speaker 5 (28:20):
Yeah, as you.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
Said, life is short, all right. Next section, Kate I
didn't know what you look like. I'll be honest, I
actually don't look at any social media. So I'm reading
this chapter.
Speaker 4 (28:29):
You were objectively beautiful.
Speaker 3 (28:31):
I mean, you talk about looks and body image and
all that stuff, and you do admit that, like, you
get it that sometimes coming from certain people with certain
body types talking about body image can come off certain ways,
and I like that you were sensitive to that. But
I also get it, man, you have to also live
in a world where you are presenting yourself physically every
(28:53):
day and where a lot of people are using a
lot of filters and surgery and god knows what, and
we're expected to look their until we're seventy. So this
is an area that's really really tough, and I think
especially so when you're comparing yourself to face as you
see online.
Speaker 5 (29:10):
Tell me about how you've handled that.
Speaker 6 (29:12):
Yes, well, I give some like practicals in the book
of just things that I've noticed over the years that
are really helpful for me. And so it's funny because
I am like, I just try not to look at
mirrors all the time, which is so funny, but I
really do think that, like every time you look in
a mirror, you're just reminded of what you look like.
And so if I don't look in the mirror all
(29:32):
the time, I'm just like not as like super aware
of what I look like all the time, which for
me is just kind of helpful. But it's funny because
I being on social media, I'll go some days where
I like don't get on stories, but then other days
I'm like, oh my gosh, I looked at myself like
thirty times in my phone because I was on Instagram.
So I think that I do have like a sensitive
place for people that are showing their faces online a lot,
(29:55):
because I do think that you're just you're like, oh
my teeth look more yellow, or am I I'm there?
I think I should get into aligne like whatever it is,
or I wish I had longer eyelashes, like whatever.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
The thing is.
Speaker 6 (30:05):
But I think this is an area specifically where if
you can kind of like learn things that trigger you,
it can be really helpful. So for me, again, like
I just was like I don't need to like look
at my full body in a mirror all the time,
which is very very popular on social media. It's kind
of like everybody has mirrors, like big mirrors like in
your We did not grow up where you had big
(30:26):
mirrors around everywhere. But I feel like it's like an
art statement piece.
Speaker 3 (30:32):
Now, yeah, it's thirteen year old, I must have a
full length mirror that I can pose in front of.
But you're right, I wonder, like that's not actually natural.
Speaker 1 (30:42):
No.
Speaker 6 (30:42):
I remember going to my mom's room like to look
at like if I had something, I would go to
her bathroom because she had a full length mirror. But
it was like not this big part of Now they're
like beautiful, like thousand dollars or Nate mirrors that you're
putting in your house is like a piece.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
Of art almost.
Speaker 6 (30:56):
So I don't know that was a little bit of
a tangent, but I think learning what it is that
like is triggering to you, and what is the belief
that you're kind of struggling with is really valuable and
getting a little deeper kind of like in the friendship part.
I'm sorry, guys, I'm telling you you have to go
deeper in some of these, but like kind of digging up,
(31:17):
like what am I believing about myself? What am I
believing is true about beauty?
Speaker 2 (31:22):
You know?
Speaker 1 (31:23):
What's the rub here?
Speaker 6 (31:26):
And then there's this quote that I read recently nine
I per sent. Sure it was by Laura Whiffler, but
she was just saying, whenever you start to feel this way,
you should just go out into the world.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
And it's so funny, but it is.
Speaker 6 (31:39):
When you go out, like I'm just talking, like, go
to the grocery store, go to like your local park,
and you're just you're kind of brought back to like, Wow,
there are so many types of people, with so many
different hair colors and skin colors and body types. And
actually ninety percent of people are not a size too
(32:01):
blonde with flawless skin that you're believing is true, you know,
like you're believing that that's what everyone is and that's
why I am not enough. But when you go out
into the world, it's like, actually, that is so inaccurate.
It's so inaccurate. So I think she in the last
six months has posted that. It's just something I've thought
was like such a rich wisdom of like it's so doable,
(32:23):
like a grocery store.
Speaker 4 (32:25):
No, it's a render.
Speaker 3 (32:25):
There's like not one way to look and there's so
many ways to look good too. It's so many different
ways to look good that may not be what immediately
comes to mind, so.
Speaker 6 (32:33):
And I the sorry to cut you off. The final
thing I will say is when I think about the
people that I care about the most and have just
loved the most fondly, what they look like is not
in the top fifty things that I think about them.
Speaker 1 (32:47):
It's so interesting. And when I think about like how.
Speaker 6 (32:50):
They make me feel things that they've done for me,
like nothing is ever attached to their body that makes sense.
That's a really good reset for me of just like
it is so not what is most important.
Speaker 3 (33:03):
Love that We're going to do one more category because
we cannot leave comparison without a classic discussion of keeping
up with the Joneses. And you have a great chapter
in there about money, which I think is so interesting
to think about, Tangent. I'm reading Die with Zero right now,
So just like lots of money stuff on my mind,
and how people use money and how defying conventions about
(33:26):
how one might choose to use money. But the truth
is money is a tool and beyond enough, everything else
is like relative whether you think you're doing awesome or
whether you think you are just feeling destitute, has so
much more to do with like who's next to you
than it does with any actual reality. And yet again,
(33:47):
social media but also sometimes real life can give us
all kinds of signals. So I am super interested, like
what are I don't know, what are some of the
ways you come across this and how do you get
over that? And how do you teach to your kids?
Because I'm going to be honest. One struggle I have
right now is that a couple of my kids go
to a school where, I mean, our family does very nicely,
(34:09):
but we are in the lower half of the income
spectrum at said school. So the perspective is very skewed,
and I would like to make sure that that does
not become a very faulty view of the world. That
it's like normal to have, you know, fifteen sports cards
or something like that.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
Yeah, no, I think that is so true. Our kids
are still pretty young.
Speaker 6 (34:31):
Like the only brand that they I think can recognize
at this point is Nike. Is like they notice if
people have Nikes at school and they go to a
public school, And I just think that has been helpful.
It has like the most loose, pointless uniform. It's like
wear a blue or pink shirt, like it doesn't that's
not correct. But it's like it just doesn't even really
(34:53):
make sense. Their their uniform policy, but I think that
it allows for like a ton of different But even
at my school I was growing up, we had a uniform.
But I'll tell you what, you better have been wearing
cool shoes. It's like we fit, we find a way
to like make our give.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
Ourselves some sort of standard that we must reach.
Speaker 6 (35:13):
It's like we were head to toe identical, but who
had cool shoes? Like it's so funny that we do that.
And I was before social media too, so you know,
like even at a young age at my high school,
I cared that I was wearing the cool shoes. And
so I think that with our you know, as much
as we can just help them to see what's important.
And I think it's I think it's a coming of
(35:35):
age thing that they're just looking for where they fit
in and so and money, like you said, it's a
tool to purchase things that help them feel like they're
fitting in at the end of the day. And so
it's probably more like an identity thing for them of
like helping them see like where does their worth come from?
(35:56):
How do you feel about them? And maybe even the
exercise I was saying of like, hey, who are your friends?
Speaker 1 (36:02):
Are you friends with.
Speaker 6 (36:03):
Them because they wear Nike shoes? Or are you friends
with them because of how they treat you? You know,
like very simple concepts that I think are probably tangible for.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
A kid, but in adults.
Speaker 6 (36:14):
Golly, this chapter was It was pretty hard to write
because I really wanted to be sensitive to just there
are people that I think are like I mean, right now,
groceries are expensive. Everything feels expensive, and so I did
not want to discount any of those things at all,
But I did really want to speak to the person
that is just constantly feeling like if I just had
(36:36):
a little more money, I would be happy if I
could buy that whatever that thing is, Like you were saying,
like keep up with the Joneses, And if I could
just keep up with the Joneses, then I would be happy.
And I think our environment is huge, like the same
way for your kids in school. The environment that you're
in can really lead you to feel whether you have
(37:00):
enough or if you're lacking, Like whether you feel like
you're in the upper tier of the houses in your
neighborhood or the lower tier of the houses in your neighborhood.
And how that can skew what enough is for you.
And so we talk a lot and I stole this
from Morgan Household. He talks about like the goalposts and
(37:21):
always moving the goal posts.
Speaker 1 (37:23):
To just have a little bit more.
Speaker 6 (37:25):
But I think there's probably like a really honest conversation
that you have to have of like what is enough
for us? What is enough for our family? How do
we feel and what is it that we're just wanting
because we feel like we need to keep up in
some way or another.
Speaker 5 (37:40):
Totally.
Speaker 3 (37:41):
One thing I was thinking about is like, put yourself
in your shoes when you were twenty and think about
what you have today and be like, wouldn't your twenty
year old self have been like wow, yeah, probably in
most cases, right, And then it's like, okay, well, then
maybe that bracelet I.
Speaker 5 (37:55):
Wanted really wouldn't be that big a deal because look.
Speaker 3 (37:58):
At what I already have. I don't know, It's just
one thing I was thinking about.
Speaker 6 (38:01):
I remember going to Target and being like very mich budgeted,
like walking and being like, oh, if only I could
get that new like fall pillow, you know, yes, and
now like I could, I would if I wanted a
fall pillow which is so funny because now I don't
want the fall pillow, but if I did, like it,
would You're right, it would be like I would be like, yeah,
I could get the fall pillow, like just the luxury
(38:22):
of that, when like ten years ago I would have
like salivated over the twenty dollars fall pillow.
Speaker 1 (38:28):
Yeah, you know it is. It's funny.
Speaker 5 (38:31):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 3 (38:32):
Well we got deep today, and I hope that listeners
are excited to get even deeper by checking out your book.
So tell everyone where they can find you, including the
name of your book.
Speaker 5 (38:41):
And I also have to know if is.
Speaker 3 (38:43):
There going to be a nap Time Kitchen cookbook, because
I was like, I'm assuming there's also a cookbook and
there's not yet.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
No, there's not yet. I don't know. I don't know.
I go back and forth a lot on a cookbook.
Speaker 6 (38:56):
I really love writing, and not that you don't write
in a cookbook, but I don't know. I wish I
had a better answer for you right now. I'm like, oh, gosh,
don't even ask me about another book. Oh but I do.
I have recipes on my blog, so I am Naptime
Kitchen on Instagram. My blog is Naptime Kitchen dot Com.
(39:16):
And then the book is I just wish I had
a bigger kitchen and otherwise I think will make me happy.
Speaker 3 (39:21):
And it's such a fun read. You guys, I really
enjoyed it. Thank you, thank you so much, so much
for coming on, Kate. This has been a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (39:28):
Yeah, thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 (39:30):
Well we are back. That was a wonderful interview. Sarah
interviewing Kate Strickler, author of the book I just wish
I had a bigger kitchen about comparison than how we
can deal with that.
Speaker 4 (39:39):
In our own lives.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
So this question comes from a listener who says, I
just listened to the episode about trips with friends, and
I'm inspired. I do have a trip planned in September
to travel with a friend to Croatia for a wedding.
Speaker 4 (39:52):
My husband decided it would be too much to try.
Speaker 2 (39:54):
To take our six and three year old on such
a long trip, not to mention the be in school
at that point, so my husband's staying with the kids.
I'll be away for almost nine days. My husband and
my mom and his mom are all chipping in. The
kids are going to be fine and well cared for.
Speaker 4 (40:11):
Clearly.
Speaker 2 (40:12):
She says, I'm actually more worried about myself. I've never
been away from my kids this long. My question is
should I try to FaceTime them regularly? Would it be
better to just send love messages through my husband? How
would you handle this, Sarah?
Speaker 4 (40:24):
What do you think?
Speaker 3 (40:24):
Oh? Well, first of all, I just have to say
the fact that we helped inspire this makes me so happy.
Or maybe you were already planning it, but now you
just feel better about doing it.
Speaker 4 (40:32):
Either way, that works too.
Speaker 1 (40:33):
I love it.
Speaker 4 (40:33):
We're happy anyway.
Speaker 5 (40:35):
If you have a fantastic trip.
Speaker 3 (40:36):
I think I would kind of like go in the
middle ground and be like, let's plan on a FaceTime
on this day, this day, and this day, not every
single day, because probably those facetimes will induce some emotions
and I don't know that they need to be stirred
up on a daily basis, but maybe if they have
a few days to look forward to, that would be good.
And I definitely think this is an occasion where like
(40:56):
bringing home trinkets, promising trinkets, talking about what you're bringing home,
like surprises, whatever, Like maybe you're gonna give them a
hint at each FaceTime, like why not that will kind
of turn this into something that might be a little
bit fun for them. My own memories of my dad
going on work trips is basically like, what what did
he bring me?
Speaker 4 (41:14):
So in that suitcase? As soon as he gets home? Right,
what's and then it worked?
Speaker 5 (41:20):
Is so why not?
Speaker 4 (41:21):
Yeah? Exactly?
Speaker 2 (41:23):
So I have a slightly different take, and this is
from being a parent who has been home with small
children while my husband has been away on international business
trips for significant periods of time, which is that whether
or not you FaceTime should be one hundred percent up.
Speaker 4 (41:38):
To your husband.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
Oh that makes right, okay, And because there is nothing
worse than having an evening where you are trying to
run solo and get the kids to do what they're
trying to do at the time you want them to
do it, and they're happy, and then the other parent
is expecting to talk to them and everything is messed up, right, Like,
it just is aggravating. So I would say, if he
(42:01):
wants to FaceTime you because it works in the run
of show that he is doing, then that is fine,
and you could try to make sure you take that
call whenever it is. Now, remember there's going to be
a huge time difference here, like you're five six hours
six hours yeah ahead in Eastern Europe, So there are.
Speaker 4 (42:18):
Limited times where this is even going to work.
Speaker 2 (42:20):
If the kids are in school and then they're going
to bad at like eight o'clock at night like this,
you know, because that window when they are available is
ten pm to three am.
Speaker 4 (42:29):
You know it's not going to work, right.
Speaker 2 (42:32):
But that said, so, if he does decide and you
want to take it, that would be fine, but you
should not necessarily initiate it at a time that is
convenient for you and expect him to pick up and
make it happen.
Speaker 4 (42:44):
All right. That sounds maybe a little bit harsh, but
uh no, that totally makes sense.
Speaker 3 (42:48):
I can see that I haven't experienced this personally really
because I guess Josh to go to Germany once for
a work trip, but generally, like this just isn't part
of our day to day reality. But maybe you could
meld the two by sending little videos where you talk
about the presence you're gonna bring home that he could
play at his leisure.
Speaker 4 (43:05):
That's true, And if.
Speaker 2 (43:06):
He thinks it would be helpful to have the video
for mommy, awesome, if he thinks in any given moment
that that would be the worst thing in the world
to have the video.
Speaker 3 (43:12):
For not care that just not show it right totally.
Speaker 2 (43:15):
That would be a perfect way to get a mix
between this.
Speaker 4 (43:20):
Yeah, you can send notes.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
If your six year old can read, then obviously you know,
if he texts those through your husband they can read.
He can again show them to the six year old
at his convenience and you can have that communication that way.
And yeah, bringing home presence is a great idea. Love
it all right, Well, this has been best of both worlds.
Sarah has been interviewing Kate Strickler about how I.
Speaker 4 (43:42):
Just wish I had a bigger kitchen.
Speaker 2 (43:44):
We will be back next week with more on making
work in life fit together.
Speaker 3 (43:49):
Thanks for listening. You can find me Sarah at the
shoebox dot com or at the Underscore Shoebox on Instagram.
Speaker 2 (43:57):
And you can find me Laura at Laura vander com.
This has been the best of both worlds podcasts. Please
join us next time for more on making work and
life work together.
Hi.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
I'm Laura Vanderkamp. I'm a mother of five, an author, journalist,
and speaker.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
And I'm Sarah hart Hunger, a mother of three, practicing physician, writer,
and courtse creator. We are two working parents who love
our careers and our families.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Welcome to best of both worlds. Here we talk about
how real women manage work, family, and time for fun.
From figuring out childcare to mapping out long.
Speaker 4 (00:33):
Term career goals.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
We want you to get the most out of life.
Speaker 4 (00:41):
Welcome to best of both worlds. This is Laura.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
This episode is airing in early October of twenty twenty five.
Sarah is going to be interviewing Kate Strickler, who is
the author of the brand new book I Just Wish
I Had a Bigger Kitchen, which is essays about comparison
being content with our own lives. Sarah, maybe you can
tell us all a little bit about it.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Yeah, I was really attracted to the concept of this
book when I saw the title. Kate is a kind
of a social media personality and a She does a
lot of cooking videos and she's known as Naptime Kitchen
is her brand, and she created that while her kids
were really little, and she talks about struggling with comparison
and how that has gotten her down in various areas
(01:22):
of life and how she is still working through that
and as someone who absolutely can fall prey.
Speaker 5 (01:28):
To these same difficulties at times.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
I just thought it was a fantastic topic for the book,
and she does a great job talking about it in
various realms of life, so from like how you look
to how much money you have to what you're doing.
Speaker 5 (01:41):
For work and all kinds of things.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
And yeah, it's just really interesting to read it because
it was done so personally. I mean, she talks about
what she's actually struggling with and what she's still struggling
with and what has helped, and you feel like you
really get to know her.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
So yeah, well that's so fascinating that she's a social
media personality give and that I think social media is
kind of the source of a lot of people's compare
and despair. I mean, how does that work out? I mean,
I know that something you've thought about in the past
and actually have exited several apps because of.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
She does talk about that, she does not say the
answer is to get off, maybe because because.
Speaker 4 (02:18):
That's how she makes her living.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Yes, I mean that's fair, that is absolutely fair. I
mean she actually does probably talk about that. I'm trying
to remember if she specifically talks about like not following
accounts which make you feel bad. I have found that
to be a fantastic tool the unsubscribe or just to
quit a platform altogether. I'm going to just also say,
if you decide that like reading someone's thing or listening
(02:41):
to them isn't serving you, you can just quietly leave.
It doesn't have to be forever. It can be an
experiment where you see if you miss that person's presence
in your life, where you're like, huh, I actually feel
better not seeing that. And also you don't have to
tell them.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
Also true with the creator.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
I've received a couple of like people flouncing out of
my website and I'm like, you could just leave, it's fine,
it's fine.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Well, and like the apps don't send you a notification
like so and so has stopped following you. I mean
that might be interesting in it of itself, but like, no,
generally they don't know at all, and so yeah, you
can just quietly put a pause on it, and if
you find it that you've been missing somebody's wonderful photos
of children and matching outfits frolicking on the beach.
Speaker 4 (03:24):
You can always follow them again. But if that thought never.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Crosses your mind once you stop seeing them, then maybe
that's something to know.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
Yes, for me, it's been the like running accounts. Even
though I respect these creators so much and there's nothing
wrong with what they're putting out there, I'm like, I
don't need this for me and for you, I feel
like your pain point is exactly what you just said.
Speaker 5 (03:44):
It's the although I think maybe.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
You just find it funny at this point, that's true,
the white you just find it, Oh, this is my children,
Like there are certain lines in the sand, and the
matching outfits is one of them. Which is why I
will never be like a big family influencer, since I
think it is a requirement to show all your children
like lined up in matching outfits in some sort of
(04:09):
natural scene. I mean your husband would have to be
in it too. It's almost you'd have to hire a
photographer because he can't just take it like you have
to show him too.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
And they have to be like white, like flat out
no want linen designer outfits. We're not talking Christmas pajamas,
like you got to like they humor.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Me on Christmas, Like we all get matching pajamas on Christmas,
and with some grumbling, everyone will wear the matching pajamas
on Christmas for like one photo and then somebody's back
in a hoodie or whatever, and you know you never
get it again.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
But yeah, well, anyway, this book is really fun and
she does talk about stuff like that and again how
you can kind of empower yourself to live your own
life and enjoy what you do have without being worried
about keeping up with the Joneses.
Speaker 5 (04:56):
So I hope you enjoy this conversation absolutely.
Speaker 4 (04:58):
Well, let's hear what Kate Strickler us to say.
Speaker 3 (05:01):
Well, I am so excited to be here with Kate Strickler,
the author of I Just Wish I had a bigger
kitchen and creator behind Naptime Kitchen.
Speaker 5 (05:09):
Welcome Kate to the show.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
Thank you, thank you so much for having me. Happy
to be here.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
So I loved reading your book, which is all about
the comparison trap as Laura and I just talked about,
and I am just wondering, Well, first, I guess give
our listeners some of them probably know you from the
various socials that you're on because you are kind of big.
But just in case they don't give us a little
hint of your career journey as it's looked so far
(05:36):
and kind of where you are with everything.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
Absolutely.
Speaker 6 (05:38):
So. My name is Kate Strickler. I am a mom
of four mary Tonate. We live in Charleston, South Carolina,
and almost ten years ago, really, which sounds so wild,
I started Naptime Kitchen, which was never meant to be
any It was just a place to post recipes I
was making, and really just a creative outlet in a
(06:00):
season where I was really lacking in creativity. My son
was napping twice a day, I was stuck at home
a lot, and so I just kind of channeled my.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
Energy into cooking.
Speaker 6 (06:10):
And it's funny because at the beginning the recipes were
like way more elaborate because it was like, hey, I
have this whole nap time, and I was really leaning
into the nap time cooking, like you cook while this
baby's asleep, because you can't cook at five PM when.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
The baby's screaming and attached to you.
Speaker 6 (06:25):
And then over time, so we now have four children
and it's like overtime as each child joined the recipes.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
Just it was an inverse relationship.
Speaker 6 (06:34):
So it went from like, here's something beautiful homemade to like,
let me show you what I threw at a crockpot
with a jar of sauce.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
So and both are useful for different phases of our lives.
Speaker 5 (06:46):
We one hundred percent get it.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
I've got three kids, Laura has five, so we are
right there with you.
Speaker 5 (06:51):
Yeah, that is awesome.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
And so this journey kind of I mean, let's just
be honest, like, You've had some awesome success in the
social media space, which is really really cool, and now
you've written a book. So what has it been like
for this to become your career.
Speaker 6 (07:09):
Yes, well it really was pretty slow, and so it
wasn't something that like overnight happened, but just this kind
of slow realization of like, wow, okay, people are following
along with this, and then like a year would go
by and I'd be like, wow, like a lot more
people are following along with this, and then I like,
remember when I got paid to do something for the
(07:31):
first time, and I was like, oh my gosh, because
before that, like somebody would send me like a bag
of almonds and I.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Would be like, this is amazing. I can't believe I
got a free bag.
Speaker 6 (07:39):
Of almonds as a veil, you know, just so funny.
And so it took a long time for me to
kind of come to terms with the fact that it
was a career, like that this could be something that
would be a job and be sustainable. And I think
it helped me when I started to name it as that,
because then I could start to be like, Okay, this
is work, Like I need to set aside time for this,
(08:02):
I need to give a certain amount of energy to this,
all of those sorts of things. But I don't even
know if I answered your question fully, but that's kind
of where just slowly over time, it wasn't this like
overnight decision. But then probably well when Alberta was born,
so that would have been, like, you know, I was
like six years in at this point. That's when it
(08:23):
really started to be like, Okay, I think this is
really something that I could build on if I was
given a little more time to do.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
So that's so cool. And then your husband ended up
joining in. I think that must have been a pivotal
moment as well.
Speaker 6 (08:36):
That was really pivotal, and you know, it's funny because
he works with me, he does his own stuff on
the side, like he's still a practicing attorney, so he
can still do law for people. He really has found
like a niche kind of in my market of doing
law for other creators, just kind of understands how the
contracts were, like because able to you know, be helpful
(08:58):
in that regard for people. But at first it was
definitely he needed like a clean break, like he couldn't
just go part time for his firm. It just didn't
work that way. So for the first few months it
was like a very clean break of like Nate no
longer works at this law firm or he was doing
in house at that not that it matters, but that
was like a pretty big like Okay, this is like
(09:20):
our schedule is really different, and Nate is very really
pretty organized and like wants to understand how the days
are going to go.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
So he wasn't like, hey, let's just like see.
Speaker 6 (09:30):
He was like, okay, I want to know like when
you expect to be working, when I should expect to
be working, Like let's create some sort of schedule. So
he really spearheaded kind of like what our days would
look like, which was good for me because I needed that.
Speaker 3 (09:46):
That is super interesting kind of behind the scenes stuff.
And I love how both of you ended up kind
of doing what we call on the show sometimes career crafting.
You know, it's like it's evolved slowly, but you're like, yeah,
let me lean into this because I'm really good at that,
and let me develop this niche. And it worked out
so well well with all the success. I guess what
I was leading up to is then you write a
book that's like, and yet I can't stop comparing myself
(10:07):
to everyone else in all of these realms, and I
one hundred percent get it. I am like, I one
hundred percent get it. But I also want you to
talk about kind of like, well, how did you realize that?
And how can that be true when you're someone who
objectively has just done so incredibly well in life.
Speaker 6 (10:24):
I know, you know, I think partly it is just
like part of the human condition that we just do
this to ourselves. I always think of that. I'm pretty
sure it was C. S. Lewis that was like envy
doesn't want the most, It just wants more than the
other person, you know, or it was it pride or
arrogance or whatever. It's like it just wants to be
above the other people, and our hearts are so bent
(10:46):
towards that. And online is a space that I really
love and I love the connection, but unfortunately it gives
you like a view into way more people's lives than
you would ever have on a normal basis. So I
think that there was kind of a perfect, a perfect
coming together. I don't even want to call it a storm,
because I feel like a storm's kind of a negative term.
(11:07):
But I was in a place where I was able
to kind of share vulnerably if I was having a
hard time with something, and then because I was online,
I would receive hundreds of DMS back of people.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
Being like, wow, I feel that way too, Like I can't.
I didn't.
Speaker 6 (11:25):
One, I can't believe you feel that way, Kate. I
would have never imagined that you would feel that way.
And two like, man, thanks for like saying that, because
I have felt really alone in it or you know,
whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
And so I.
Speaker 6 (11:37):
Started to almost have this like test case where I
was like, Okay, every time I share something like this,
there is like a huge response, and every time, like
much bigger than other things that I would share, you know,
just this kind of like desire. I think that especially
as women, we have to just know we're not alone,
that other people are feeling these things, matched with kind
(11:59):
of like a guilt. I was feeling of like, gosh,
I shouldn't be feeling this way, I should just be
happy and grateful all the time. But I have never
met a woman who has been that way. You know, like,
normally there's something that has to intersect in your life
to make you realize how good you have it, Like
something bad happens and you're like, gosh, I can't believe
(12:20):
I took that for granted. But on a daily basis,
I think that the struggle for contentment and the struggle
against comparison is just like very living an act.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
I totally can see that, and it's almost like on
a smaller scale we have that struggle, even if on
a larger scale like we know, we know, oh my gosh,
we are so lucky. I'm sitting here in a climate
controlled environment, like wearing clothes, I don't have to worry
about where my next meal comes from, like, and yet
it doesn't stop the fact that when somebody else tells
you about their kid doing something amazing, you're like, oh,
(12:52):
maybe mine didn't do that, And I feel a certain way,
and there's something very human there and something so honest,
and I love I think what you're getting out with
the responses, like you hit a nerve and the fact
that you were willing to share vulnerably because this book
is pretty is pretty raw in some of these chapters,
and I love that in a lot of these different areas,
I think is just really really valuable because I don't
(13:13):
think there's just that many people putting themselves out there
like this.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
Thanks.
Speaker 6 (13:17):
It's funny because during the writing process, I think I
was just so in it that I was doing it.
Like a month before the book came out. I was like,
oh my gosh, everyone is about to read this.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
What did I do? And I'm so great. It's like
you know, but I was like, oh, gosh, okay, here
it is.
Speaker 5 (13:38):
We're doing this.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
It's in boxes, it's going to bookstores, all right.
Speaker 3 (13:44):
But seriously, I'm so glad you did. We're going to
take a quick break and then we're going to start
delving into some of those specific areas that you talk
about in your book. All right, we are back, and
(14:04):
we were just talking about Kate's vulnerability and how she
really delved into multiple areas where I think many of
us tend to compare and despair, and she goes into
detail about like what in this area has been hard
and then has some solutions of like what has been
helping And Kate, I love how you you're never like
and this is the answer You're like and this is
(14:25):
still a continued process. Yeah, because I guess you know
this is going to be human nature. It's going to
be a forever thing. But let's dive into the first place.
And I'm going to go with the title, So Home,
I wish I had a bigger kitchen. Earn my case,
I wish I had a beautifully organized, minimalist home. Go
tell me about your struggles and some of the things
(14:46):
you've done to counteract them.
Speaker 6 (14:49):
Yes, so the home chapter really, like the bigger kitchen
title really was very honest, because so funny. I've been
on Instagram and so often cooking in like an interior kitchen,
like I have no great lighting, I don't have a
big island, I don't have ample storage, and so really
(15:09):
I would be like, oh.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
I really just wished I had a biker kitchen.
Speaker 6 (15:12):
But I think that the kitchen so much like for
so many people, just exemplifies this like level of peace
kind of for you, like you were saying a minimalist tone,
you like, look at someone who has that home and
you just think, like, man, their life is so simple,
they're probably so happy. Everything about their life is probably
better than mine. You just kind of create this whole
(15:35):
narrative based off of, like it's so funny to say,
but based off of like a clear kitchen island that
I could believe, like this whole narrative for somebody based
off of that. But I think our homes, I hope not.
You know, I really try in this chapter not to
do a disservice to the home, like not to say
it shouldn't matter, because I think it actually deeply, deeply matters,
(15:56):
Like it quite literally houses you. You know, it is
where you see spend probably more time than anywhere else.
But I think that we really have got to reframe
what we see our homes as. And so I think
about even my little girls playing with like a Barbie dollhouse.
They don't just sit the Barbie in the dollhouse, they
play with the Barbie in the dollhouse, like they move
(16:17):
it around, and they move the furniture around and they
make it whatever they need it to be for what
their barbies are doing. And I think sometimes we think
of our homes as like something that we're just gonna
sit in and not touch and have be beautiful all
the time. But really it's such a working mechanism in
our house. Like everything, it's like it needs to be moving.
(16:39):
I think furniture, there are seasons where your furniture should move,
you know, like you're gonna do something with You're gonna
have a playroom for a while, and then eventually you're
gonna be like, you know what, our kids don't need
a playroom anymore. How could we use this space differently?
Or your basement was used for something and now you're like,
you know what, the kids are older, we could really
use like a pool table down here. How do we
change this space for our season of life? And so
(17:02):
seeing your home that way is like, how is this
a tool that serves our family versus this like Christine
building that we just try and like maneuver our lives around.
Speaker 5 (17:12):
Like a symbol or something like yes, yes, agreed as.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
A human yes exactly.
Speaker 3 (17:20):
I also feel like when we see examples of others' homes,
we're either seeing them curated spaces on social media, or
even when you're invited to someone's house, unless it's like
your best friend, you're probably getting the best possible version
of their house.
Speaker 5 (17:34):
Yeah, and that probably doesn't help.
Speaker 4 (17:36):
I'm guessing no.
Speaker 6 (17:39):
And it's funny because in my real life when I
walk into my friends' houses, I see the whole picture.
You see, even if they're like countertop is clean, they
have a corner.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
Everybody's got a corner.
Speaker 6 (17:53):
Everybody has a place they're trying to like shove the
mail and that thing they need to return, and that
tupperware they got to get to somebody, and the short
that didn't fit that they got to get back to
the store. Like everybody has that somewhere. I think you
see it so much more in real life, and so
we have to like fight online remember that those corners
exist in the same way, we just might.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
Not see them.
Speaker 3 (18:15):
So your advice would be to think of your home
in terms of its utility and in terms of the
living that you're doing in it and its function, and
then also pay attention to when you can get a
taste of what other people's real environments look like.
Speaker 6 (18:28):
Yes, I would definitely pay attention when you go to
other people's homes.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
And just see like and see the different way.
Speaker 6 (18:33):
Like I would be very open minded, like how do
they deal with shoes by the door? What systems do
they have in place? But I think there is a
place for utility and like beauty to meet. But I
think very often we sacrifice utility for beauty and then
we get super frustrated at ourselves or at the people
(18:55):
that live in our home that are like, listen, I'm sorry,
I just got to put my shoes somewhere. And so
I know you want this beautiful table by the front
door that has like a few pictures on it, but
like we might really need some shoe bins, you know,
like whatever it is that, we've got to find a
way for those things to marry or else you'll drive
yourself crazy.
Speaker 5 (19:12):
Totally, all right.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
The next area we're going to talk about is the
I just Wish I was a better mom chapter. We
have definitely talked on this podcast about mom guilt and
the phenomenon how there's not a lot of dad guilt
or parenting guilt, and yet it's just so innate. Actually,
of the two hosts of the show, Laura is much
better at not succumbing to mom guilt, I think compared
to me, and even when I logically know it doesn't
(19:38):
belong there, like my kids' lives are awesome objectively, I
just sometimes have it anyway. Yeah, And I think you
do too, despite having like four kids and so much
time that you spend with them. So where does this
come from, do you think? And how can we best
fight it?
Speaker 6 (19:54):
I think a lot of the times that it comes
from like a good place. It comes from a desire
to be there for our children. But I think that
as humans, like we just have limits and so we
cannot Like it's you can't have a home that is
perfectly clean and a meal that is made and snuggle
(20:15):
your child during their nap time because during nap time
was when you were either going to clean or you
were going to prep dinner.
Speaker 1 (20:22):
Like you can't do it all.
Speaker 6 (20:24):
And so that's where I think that we can get
really down on ourselves. But it's normally something that I've
been thinking a lot about this year. It's been coming
up a lot. Is like accepting capacity. And I think
when we can accept capacity. It really can help alleviate
some of that guilt because it's not you should be
doing it all, but it's like, you know what you can't, like,
where can your capacity go today? So that is something
(20:47):
I've been thinking about a lot. And then specifically with
my kids, I've really been trying to show them that
I enjoy my job and that I enjoy them, and
that in doing two things, sometimes you just have to
make a choice. Like sometimes you want two desserts on
the dessert menu and you pick one of the two.
And I feel very lucky that I do enjoy my
(21:09):
job like ninety nine percent of the time. But I
want my kids to see a mom who made sacrifices
to be with them but also made sacrifices for our
family in terms of work. That like, that was that
that's something I'm doing also for our family, and it's not.
Speaker 1 (21:29):
Like this awful thing like that they could have a
job they.
Speaker 6 (21:33):
Love and a family they love, and they if they do,
they won't be at everything always, but that's okay. That
that's like a very natural and kind of good consequence,
Like you're just you can't be in two places, and
that's okay.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
I love that and even playing the thought experiment that
you didn't have a job just because you have four kids.
Remember that you can always be in two places, like
you might have to miss kid A's game because.
Speaker 5 (21:57):
You're at kid Be's games.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
So yeah, the capacity be question applies no matter where
you are in life. Although on the show, of course,
we love that you are making work in life fit
together in that way and that you're really enjoying both.
Speaker 6 (22:10):
So I love that, And I think when you frame
it as teaching your kids about capacity, it's like, you know,
whenever you tell your you're so much more kind to
somebody other than yourself. And so I think if you're
teaching your child like, hey, I get it, like you
want to do two things and you just can't, Like
how healthy to model that to them, versus like I
(22:32):
can do it all all the time, Like that's a
pretty hard standard to have and to So I think
it's healthy for them to see your humanity, your limits,
like those kinds of things. So I think you're teaching
something really valuable when you show them that the choices.
Speaker 5 (22:49):
Yes, I love that.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
All right, we're going to take another quick break and
then we're going to get to the category of friends
and fomo. All right, we are back and we are
(23:10):
going through some of the vulnerable categories that Kate shared
about in her book I just wish I had a
bigger kitchen in terms of comparison, and one of the
chapters that I really liked was about friends or just
feeling like I wish I had better friends or I
was in a more cohesive group, and definitely appreciated some
of the examples you used about, like you thought you
were good and then you saw somebody else on their girls'
(23:33):
chep and were like, oh, I wasn't invited to that,
And yeah, I guess would you say that this is
a category that's harder today with social media out there.
Speaker 6 (23:41):
I think so much harder, And unfortunately, I don't think
the majority of people are trying to be hurtful in
any way. They're just sharing something fun. And you just
noticed that there was a group together, especially if you
don't know the backstory of.
Speaker 1 (23:57):
Like maybe they just both showed up to the beat.
Speaker 6 (24:00):
Maybe they just decided that they were both going to
go to the beach and then they happened to be
there at the same time. But you think, oh, they
planned it, they planned it and they thought to themselves,
let's not invite Kate, you know, like or even I,
you know, especially now, like we have lots of friends
that are turning forty and doing fun things for forty.
It's and it's like you just can't have a two
(24:23):
hundred person party. And really, if you want to go
out to dinner, it's really hard to make a reservation
for more than like ten people. And so there are
there are like limiting circumstances that are going to leave
people out that I just don't think are ill intentioned.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
It's just kind of like unfortunate. That's just how life is.
But a lot of the times, if you see.
Speaker 6 (24:44):
It on social media, you don't have any of the
backstory there, and then you just you might not have
ever known it was going to happen, but now you know.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
It did happen, and you see who's together.
Speaker 6 (24:52):
And so I think that this is an area that
unfortunately is a real unfortunate negative of social media. And
I don't know, I don't know a good I don't
know a way around it. I don't know how to
make it better. But I feel very sensitive to it,
especially probably because of my following and because I know
I have lots of friends that follow me. I feel
so sensitive to like what if I have girls over
(25:16):
and a picture is posted and somebody else sees it
and they just feel like they weren't.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
Included and I don't even know who they are.
Speaker 6 (25:22):
In my head right now, I'm like, who would it
be that I forgot to include? But so it would
have never been ill intention towards that person. It would
have just been probably an oversight. But I get very,
very fearful of just people feeling left.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
Out totally, And so what would you say is the
best way to get over this?
Speaker 1 (25:42):
One?
Speaker 3 (25:42):
Just more like remember to if there's someone who I
hang out with, like make that happen that you have
agency to invite that persons.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
One. I think agency is huge.
Speaker 6 (25:54):
I think like if you're really wanting to like have
a fun dinner out and you're like wallow in.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
And I'm like, send a text, get a date on
the calendar.
Speaker 6 (26:03):
With some friends, and like be the instigator in that situation,
and then I you know, it's funny that sounds because
I actually talk about this in the husband chapter, but
I would really fight to give people the benefit of
the doubt that it was probably not something deeply against you.
It could have so easily been a capacity thing and
oversight or something that wasn't even planned to begin with
(26:27):
that just happened, you know, like very spontaneously, and you
just happen to not be there. And then I think, like,
at the end of the day, it's just you.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
You have to kind of be okay in who you are.
Speaker 6 (26:39):
And I think that friendship especially can feel so tender
and so scary because you're wondering.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
Am I not liked? Like was I not included?
Speaker 6 (26:48):
And I would say if it's something that is like
a pattern or something that you're feeling hurt by, I
would We're at the age where I'm like, we got
to have these conversations, Like if there's somebody that you're
consistently feeling hurt by, I'm like, man, you should probably
have a conversation with them. Like we just got to
at our age either, you know, you got to push
(27:09):
through it and have the kind of conversations. And I
think I would say that a lot of my closest
friends are people that I have had hard conversations with
over the years, And I think sometimes we believe friendship is.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
Just easy all the time, but I.
Speaker 6 (27:23):
Think friendship is a lot like marriage, Like you're going
to say something that hurts someone, there's going to be
something that's miscommunicated, and so as much as you can,
like I think it is, if someone were to come
to me and want to talk to me about something,
I would see that as like, Wow, they really value me.
They didn't just decide like let's just cut her out,
like I'm just not even going to mess with it anymore.
It's like, no, I want to work through this. And
(27:45):
so I guess I would say if you're in like
a season of repetitive hurt feelings or fomo feelings.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
Like I would one make your own magic.
Speaker 6 (27:55):
Out there, but two like, if it's a specific thing, gosh,
life is too short, like I would really I would
encourage you to conversation.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Yeah, yeah, totally.
Speaker 4 (28:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:06):
I mean I think we don't see those messy parts
of friendship on social media with the gaping, So you
just need to go a layer deeper, and I think
your friendships are probably going to benefit as a result anyway,
or you'll find out it's time to move on and
that's okay.
Speaker 5 (28:20):
Yeah, as you.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
Said, life is short, all right. Next section, Kate I
didn't know what you look like. I'll be honest, I
actually don't look at any social media. So I'm reading
this chapter.
Speaker 4 (28:29):
You were objectively beautiful.
Speaker 3 (28:31):
I mean, you talk about looks and body image and
all that stuff, and you do admit that, like, you
get it that sometimes coming from certain people with certain
body types talking about body image can come off certain ways,
and I like that you were sensitive to that. But
I also get it, man, you have to also live
in a world where you are presenting yourself physically every
(28:53):
day and where a lot of people are using a
lot of filters and surgery and god knows what, and
we're expected to look their until we're seventy. So this
is an area that's really really tough, and I think
especially so when you're comparing yourself to face as you
see online.
Speaker 5 (29:10):
Tell me about how you've handled that.
Speaker 6 (29:12):
Yes, well, I give some like practicals in the book
of just things that I've noticed over the years that
are really helpful for me. And so it's funny because
I am like, I just try not to look at
mirrors all the time, which is so funny, but I
really do think that, like every time you look in
a mirror, you're just reminded of what you look like.
And so if I don't look in the mirror all
(29:32):
the time, I'm just like not as like super aware
of what I look like all the time, which for
me is just kind of helpful. But it's funny because
I being on social media, I'll go some days where
I like don't get on stories, but then other days
I'm like, oh my gosh, I looked at myself like
thirty times in my phone because I was on Instagram.
So I think that I do have like a sensitive
place for people that are showing their faces online a lot,
(29:55):
because I do think that you're just you're like, oh
my teeth look more yellow, or am I I'm there?
I think I should get into aligne like whatever it is,
or I wish I had longer eyelashes, like whatever.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
The thing is.
Speaker 6 (30:05):
But I think this is an area specifically where if
you can kind of like learn things that trigger you,
it can be really helpful. So for me, again, like
I just was like I don't need to like look
at my full body in a mirror all the time,
which is very very popular on social media. It's kind
of like everybody has mirrors, like big mirrors like in
your We did not grow up where you had big
(30:26):
mirrors around everywhere. But I feel like it's like an
art statement piece.
Speaker 3 (30:32):
Now, yeah, it's thirteen year old, I must have a
full length mirror that I can pose in front of.
But you're right, I wonder, like that's not actually natural.
Speaker 1 (30:42):
No.
Speaker 6 (30:42):
I remember going to my mom's room like to look
at like if I had something, I would go to
her bathroom because she had a full length mirror. But
it was like not this big part of Now they're
like beautiful, like thousand dollars or Nate mirrors that you're
putting in your house is like a piece.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
Of art almost.
Speaker 6 (30:56):
So I don't know that was a little bit of
a tangent, but I think learning what it is that
like is triggering to you, and what is the belief
that you're kind of struggling with is really valuable and
getting a little deeper kind of like in the friendship part.
I'm sorry, guys, I'm telling you you have to go
deeper in some of these, but like kind of digging up,
(31:17):
like what am I believing about myself? What am I
believing is true about beauty?
Speaker 2 (31:22):
You know?
Speaker 1 (31:23):
What's the rub here?
Speaker 6 (31:26):
And then there's this quote that I read recently nine
I per sent. Sure it was by Laura Whiffler, but
she was just saying, whenever you start to feel this way,
you should just go out into the world.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
And it's so funny, but it is.
Speaker 6 (31:39):
When you go out, like I'm just talking, like, go
to the grocery store, go to like your local park,
and you're just you're kind of brought back to like, Wow,
there are so many types of people, with so many
different hair colors and skin colors and body types. And
actually ninety percent of people are not a size too
(32:01):
blonde with flawless skin that you're believing is true, you know,
like you're believing that that's what everyone is and that's
why I am not enough. But when you go out
into the world, it's like, actually, that is so inaccurate.
It's so inaccurate. So I think she in the last
six months has posted that. It's just something I've thought
was like such a rich wisdom of like it's so doable,
(32:23):
like a grocery store.
Speaker 4 (32:25):
No, it's a render.
Speaker 3 (32:25):
There's like not one way to look and there's so
many ways to look good too. It's so many different
ways to look good that may not be what immediately
comes to mind, so.
Speaker 6 (32:33):
And I the sorry to cut you off. The final
thing I will say is when I think about the
people that I care about the most and have just
loved the most fondly, what they look like is not
in the top fifty things that I think about them.
Speaker 1 (32:47):
It's so interesting. And when I think about like how.
Speaker 6 (32:50):
They make me feel things that they've done for me,
like nothing is ever attached to their body that makes sense.
That's a really good reset for me of just like
it is so not what is most important.
Speaker 3 (33:03):
Love that We're going to do one more category because
we cannot leave comparison without a classic discussion of keeping
up with the Joneses. And you have a great chapter
in there about money, which I think is so interesting
to think about, Tangent. I'm reading Die with Zero right now,
So just like lots of money stuff on my mind,
and how people use money and how defying conventions about
(33:26):
how one might choose to use money. But the truth
is money is a tool and beyond enough, everything else
is like relative whether you think you're doing awesome or
whether you think you are just feeling destitute, has so
much more to do with like who's next to you
than it does with any actual reality. And yet again,
(33:47):
social media but also sometimes real life can give us
all kinds of signals. So I am super interested, like
what are I don't know, what are some of the
ways you come across this and how do you get
over that? And how do you teach to your kids?
Because I'm going to be honest. One struggle I have
right now is that a couple of my kids go
to a school where, I mean, our family does very nicely,
(34:09):
but we are in the lower half of the income
spectrum at said school. So the perspective is very skewed,
and I would like to make sure that that does
not become a very faulty view of the world. That
it's like normal to have, you know, fifteen sports cards
or something like that.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
Yeah, no, I think that is so true. Our kids
are still pretty young.
Speaker 6 (34:31):
Like the only brand that they I think can recognize
at this point is Nike. Is like they notice if
people have Nikes at school and they go to a
public school, And I just think that has been helpful.
It has like the most loose, pointless uniform. It's like
wear a blue or pink shirt, like it doesn't that's
not correct. But it's like it just doesn't even really
(34:53):
make sense. Their their uniform policy, but I think that
it allows for like a ton of different But even
at my school I was growing up, we had a uniform.
But I'll tell you what, you better have been wearing
cool shoes. It's like we fit, we find a way
to like make our give.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
Ourselves some sort of standard that we must reach.
Speaker 6 (35:13):
It's like we were head to toe identical, but who
had cool shoes? Like it's so funny that we do that.
And I was before social media too, so you know,
like even at a young age at my high school,
I cared that I was wearing the cool shoes. And
so I think that with our you know, as much
as we can just help them to see what's important.
And I think it's I think it's a coming of
(35:35):
age thing that they're just looking for where they fit
in and so and money, like you said, it's a
tool to purchase things that help them feel like they're
fitting in at the end of the day. And so
it's probably more like an identity thing for them of
like helping them see like where does their worth come from?
(35:56):
How do you feel about them? And maybe even the
exercise I was saying of like, hey, who are your friends?
Speaker 1 (36:02):
Are you friends with.
Speaker 6 (36:03):
Them because they wear Nike shoes? Or are you friends
with them because of how they treat you? You know,
like very simple concepts that I think are probably tangible for.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
A kid, but in adults.
Speaker 6 (36:14):
Golly, this chapter was It was pretty hard to write
because I really wanted to be sensitive to just there
are people that I think are like I mean, right now,
groceries are expensive. Everything feels expensive, and so I did
not want to discount any of those things at all,
But I did really want to speak to the person
that is just constantly feeling like if I just had
(36:36):
a little more money, I would be happy if I
could buy that whatever that thing is, Like you were saying,
like keep up with the Joneses, And if I could
just keep up with the Joneses, then I would be happy.
And I think our environment is huge, like the same
way for your kids in school. The environment that you're
in can really lead you to feel whether you have
(37:00):
enough or if you're lacking, Like whether you feel like
you're in the upper tier of the houses in your
neighborhood or the lower tier of the houses in your neighborhood.
And how that can skew what enough is for you.
And so we talk a lot and I stole this
from Morgan Household. He talks about like the goalposts and
(37:21):
always moving the goal posts.
Speaker 1 (37:23):
To just have a little bit more.
Speaker 6 (37:25):
But I think there's probably like a really honest conversation
that you have to have of like what is enough
for us? What is enough for our family? How do
we feel and what is it that we're just wanting
because we feel like we need to keep up in
some way or another.
Speaker 5 (37:40):
Totally.
Speaker 3 (37:41):
One thing I was thinking about is like, put yourself
in your shoes when you were twenty and think about
what you have today and be like, wouldn't your twenty
year old self have been like wow, yeah, probably in
most cases, right, And then it's like, okay, well, then
maybe that bracelet I.
Speaker 5 (37:55):
Wanted really wouldn't be that big a deal because look.
Speaker 3 (37:58):
At what I already have. I don't know, It's just
one thing I was thinking about.
Speaker 6 (38:01):
I remember going to Target and being like very mich budgeted,
like walking and being like, oh, if only I could
get that new like fall pillow, you know, yes, and
now like I could, I would if I wanted a
fall pillow which is so funny because now I don't
want the fall pillow, but if I did, like it,
would You're right, it would be like I would be like, yeah,
I could get the fall pillow, like just the luxury
(38:22):
of that, when like ten years ago I would have
like salivated over the twenty dollars fall pillow.
Speaker 1 (38:28):
Yeah, you know it is. It's funny.
Speaker 5 (38:31):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 3 (38:32):
Well we got deep today, and I hope that listeners
are excited to get even deeper by checking out your book.
So tell everyone where they can find you, including the
name of your book.
Speaker 5 (38:41):
And I also have to know if is.
Speaker 3 (38:43):
There going to be a nap Time Kitchen cookbook, because
I was like, I'm assuming there's also a cookbook and
there's not yet.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
No, there's not yet. I don't know. I don't know.
I go back and forth a lot on a cookbook.
Speaker 6 (38:56):
I really love writing, and not that you don't write
in a cookbook, but I don't know. I wish I
had a better answer for you right now. I'm like, oh, gosh,
don't even ask me about another book. Oh but I do.
I have recipes on my blog, so I am Naptime
Kitchen on Instagram. My blog is Naptime Kitchen dot Com.
(39:16):
And then the book is I just wish I had
a bigger kitchen and otherwise I think will make me happy.
Speaker 3 (39:21):
And it's such a fun read. You guys, I really
enjoyed it. Thank you, thank you so much, so much
for coming on, Kate. This has been a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (39:28):
Yeah, thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 (39:30):
Well we are back. That was a wonderful interview. Sarah
interviewing Kate Strickler, author of the book I just wish
I had a bigger kitchen about comparison than how we
can deal with that.
Speaker 4 (39:39):
In our own lives.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
So this question comes from a listener who says, I
just listened to the episode about trips with friends, and
I'm inspired. I do have a trip planned in September
to travel with a friend to Croatia for a wedding.
Speaker 4 (39:52):
My husband decided it would be too much to try.
Speaker 2 (39:54):
To take our six and three year old on such
a long trip, not to mention the be in school
at that point, so my husband's staying with the kids.
I'll be away for almost nine days. My husband and
my mom and his mom are all chipping in. The
kids are going to be fine and well cared for.
Speaker 4 (40:11):
Clearly.
Speaker 2 (40:12):
She says, I'm actually more worried about myself. I've never
been away from my kids this long. My question is
should I try to FaceTime them regularly? Would it be
better to just send love messages through my husband? How
would you handle this, Sarah?
Speaker 4 (40:24):
What do you think?
Speaker 3 (40:24):
Oh? Well, first of all, I just have to say
the fact that we helped inspire this makes me so happy.
Or maybe you were already planning it, but now you
just feel better about doing it.
Speaker 4 (40:32):
Either way, that works too.
Speaker 1 (40:33):
I love it.
Speaker 4 (40:33):
We're happy anyway.
Speaker 5 (40:35):
If you have a fantastic trip.
Speaker 3 (40:36):
I think I would kind of like go in the
middle ground and be like, let's plan on a FaceTime
on this day, this day, and this day, not every
single day, because probably those facetimes will induce some emotions
and I don't know that they need to be stirred
up on a daily basis, but maybe if they have
a few days to look forward to, that would be good.
And I definitely think this is an occasion where like
(40:56):
bringing home trinkets, promising trinkets, talking about what you're bringing home,
like surprises, whatever, Like maybe you're gonna give them a
hint at each FaceTime, like why not that will kind
of turn this into something that might be a little
bit fun for them. My own memories of my dad
going on work trips is basically like, what what did
he bring me?
Speaker 4 (41:14):
So in that suitcase? As soon as he gets home? Right,
what's and then it worked?
Speaker 5 (41:20):
Is so why not?
Speaker 4 (41:21):
Yeah? Exactly?
Speaker 2 (41:23):
So I have a slightly different take, and this is
from being a parent who has been home with small
children while my husband has been away on international business
trips for significant periods of time, which is that whether
or not you FaceTime should be one hundred percent up.
Speaker 4 (41:38):
To your husband.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
Oh that makes right, okay, And because there is nothing
worse than having an evening where you are trying to
run solo and get the kids to do what they're
trying to do at the time you want them to
do it, and they're happy, and then the other parent
is expecting to talk to them and everything is messed up, right, Like,
it just is aggravating. So I would say, if he
(42:01):
wants to FaceTime you because it works in the run
of show that he is doing, then that is fine,
and you could try to make sure you take that
call whenever it is. Now, remember there's going to be
a huge time difference here, like you're five six hours
six hours yeah ahead in Eastern Europe, So there are.
Speaker 4 (42:18):
Limited times where this is even going to work.
Speaker 2 (42:20):
If the kids are in school and then they're going
to bad at like eight o'clock at night like this,
you know, because that window when they are available is
ten pm to three am.
Speaker 4 (42:29):
You know it's not going to work, right.
Speaker 2 (42:32):
But that said, so, if he does decide and you
want to take it, that would be fine, but you
should not necessarily initiate it at a time that is
convenient for you and expect him to pick up and
make it happen.
Speaker 4 (42:44):
All right. That sounds maybe a little bit harsh, but
uh no, that totally makes sense.
Speaker 3 (42:48):
I can see that I haven't experienced this personally really
because I guess Josh to go to Germany once for
a work trip, but generally, like this just isn't part
of our day to day reality. But maybe you could
meld the two by sending little videos where you talk
about the presence you're gonna bring home that he could
play at his leisure.
Speaker 4 (43:05):
That's true, And if.
Speaker 2 (43:06):
He thinks it would be helpful to have the video
for mommy, awesome, if he thinks in any given moment
that that would be the worst thing in the world
to have the video.
Speaker 3 (43:12):
For not care that just not show it right totally.
Speaker 2 (43:15):
That would be a perfect way to get a mix
between this.
Speaker 4 (43:20):
Yeah, you can send notes.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
If your six year old can read, then obviously you know,
if he texts those through your husband they can read.
He can again show them to the six year old
at his convenience and you can have that communication that way.
And yeah, bringing home presence is a great idea. Love
it all right, Well, this has been best of both worlds.
Sarah has been interviewing Kate Strickler about how I.
Speaker 4 (43:42):
Just wish I had a bigger kitchen.
Speaker 2 (43:44):
We will be back next week with more on making
work in life fit together.
Speaker 3 (43:49):
Thanks for listening. You can find me Sarah at the
shoebox dot com or at the Underscore Shoebox on Instagram.
Speaker 2 (43:57):
And you can find me Laura at Laura vander com.
This has been the best of both worlds podcasts. Please
join us next time for more on making work and
life work together.
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