October 29, 2024 • 40 mins
If you are trying to decide on a planner for 2025, you are in luck! Sarah provides guidelines for choosing a planner for 2025, and Laura shares her current planning systems as well. They discuss various choices/preferences that will dictate options available, some popular brands to consider, and more!
In the Q&A, a listener writes in wondering what the highest costs are in raising teens. Please note that most of the things discussed are absolutely optional, but they will give you an idea of what teens may ask for and what you may want to provide!
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hi.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
I'm Laura Vanderkamp. I'm a mother of five, an author, journalist,
and speaker.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
And I'm Sarah Hart Hunger, a mother of three, practicing physician, writer,
and course creator. We are two working parents who love
our careers and our families.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Welcome to Best of Both Worlds. Here we talk about
how real women manage work, family, and time for fun,
from figuring out childcare to mapping out long.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Term career goals.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
We want you to get the most out of life.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Welcome to Best of Both Worlds. This is Laura.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
This episode is airing in late October of twenty twenty four.
Sarah is going to be talking all things planners now.
Longtime listeners may recall that in the early years of
Best of Both Worlds, we did a handful of planner
Polu type episodes where Sarah would go over various planners
that one might purchase for the upcoming year. We started
(01:07):
doing less of that because, of course, she started her
own podcast called Best Laid Plans. For maybe the three
of our listeners who haven't checked that out, you should.
But she talks a lot about planners there, and about
the whole concept of planning and all that. But we
thought since her content over there has also started expanding
(01:28):
into different planning related topics. You know, there hasn't been
one episode recently about the planner to choose for the
next year. So here we are today doing that, Sarah
take it away.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Yeah, ooh, I'll have to like direct BLP listeners over
here too, just in case you know, they want to more.
I feel like we haven't done this like general overview discussion,
and this will be fun because I'll get Laura to
talk a little bit about her current planners as well.
But yeah, we're going to focus on considerations for using
a planner. Some of my favorite brands, and I will
not mention every brand in there. There are nine million brands,
(02:04):
some fun tools, accessories, et cetera. So to start us off, Laura,
what are you currently planning with? Like, what are your
paper tools right now?
Speaker 4 (02:14):
So?
Speaker 1 (02:15):
I have a couple.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
I have a paper calendar that is a weekly at
a glance brand calendar where you get the whole week
on one small page. It's like a pocket sized calendar,
and I use that to write down time specific commitments
sort of forward for the next however long. I tend
to buy the next year's calendar in like July, so
(02:40):
it can be anytime in sort of the next eighteen
months that I'm writing down time specific stuff on that.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
As for the.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
Bulk of my planning, I do a weekly plan do
that on Thursday or Friday looking forward to the next week.
I'm currently this year doing that on a plum paper
custom designed product. It has a nice little LV on
the cover and it was very pretty. It's been okay,
it's bigger than I was using. You would set me
(03:10):
up with the Whitney English Weekly Planner, which, for whatever reason,
being smaller, I wound up using a bit more. I
do write the week's priority list on the left side,
where they have sort of open space for writing that
in two columns, which I like. Then the right side
is the days of the week, and I guess theoretically
(03:31):
I should be putting my daily to do list for
each day there, But when I have the whole thing open,
it's just so big that I don't like it, so
I flip it over so I only have half, and
then I make my daily to do list in a
tiny little notebook, which is just a notebook from Target
that I can also jot down notes like if I
have to write a random number, like I have to
make a deposit.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
For x amount somewhere, like I write that down in there.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
So it's got random notes plus the daily to do list,
so it's really a planner stack of three things at
this point.
Speaker 4 (04:01):
So interesting.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
I actually think that sort of reveals one thing people
don't often think about, which is sometimes separate books are helpful,
especially if you want to reference one while you're writing
the other and you don't want to have it open,
or your desk real estate doesn't want to have a
two page spread open all the time. So I think
your little hack actually sounds like it makes a lot
of sense, and we've got to think about maybe a
(04:22):
smaller weekly task manager for you for the next time.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Maybe, I mean, I like all the space that I
have for the one page for the weekly thing, so
I mean maybe it's but I did recently find a
hack for what to use that other page for ah,
which little spoiler alert, we may be coming up with
an episode soon where we talk about meals that we
have eaten. So I actually recorded like I kept a
(04:52):
food journal for the first time ever in my life
over on that page which I only had to fill
in like three times a day or whatever.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
Writing what I et and so I could just flip
over for that.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
But I don't know if I will do that from
now on because I don't really like to keep a
food journal, but in the interest of future content, I
did it.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Yeah, well maybe it could be a you know, an
evergreen different type of journal, like maybe one week you
do media and another week you do.
Speaker 4 (05:18):
Cool things your kids. I don't know.
Speaker 3 (05:20):
I'll have fun thinking of ideas for that other page.
All right, Well, you have a planner stack, Laura.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
My current planner stack is also three items. So I
have my Hobonicci cousin, which is my kind of ridered
eye planner that I seem to return to again and again.
There's no video, but I'm still holding it up for Laura.
But this has monthly pages, weekly pages, and daily pages,
and I do use it to keep my calendar. So
(05:46):
it is my source of truth in terms of what
is going on in my schedule as well as our
household schedule. I have a Hobonicci five year journal that's
like more from memory keeping. Mine goes from twenty twenty
one to twenty twenty five, so I'll have one more
year in that volume that I'm super excited about.
Speaker 4 (06:03):
It's been really fun to use.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
And then finally I have kind of a like goals
and lists planner, and for that this year, I've used
a diskbound cloth and paper product that has like a
reading list and notebook pages, and I just basically have
my annual goals there, my seasonal goals there, and like
any other list that I've wanted to keep throughout the year.
I probably am going to change things up a little
bit for twenty twenty five, as one does when one
(06:28):
has a planning focus podcast, But that is what I
have right now, and we're going to talk about what
you want in a planner. But I would say right now,
my hope Anicchi Cousin is serving two big purposes. Is
my day to day task manager as well as my calendar.
And then my disc bound is more of like a
big picture goalkeeping and then the five years really just
(06:50):
for fun and like is more of like a life
scrap book. So those are kind of my stack, and
for me that's actually pretty minimal. So I'm really happy,
very streamlined.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
And I would say from my memory from talking with
you over the years and listening to bestlid plans. As
you often start the year in the Hobanici, you migrate
out of it because something triggers it, either that somebody
sent you a really cool planner or there's some you know,
(07:19):
schedule change that you want a fresh start, and then
you wind up back in the Hobaniici toward the end
of the year.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
Is that correct?
Speaker 3 (07:26):
That has been my pattern in the last two years,
And it's kind of funny. I'll end up with about
six total months or maybe six to eight months even
in the hobanichi, with like a break during this spring
and summer, And I think that does reflect that that
season has kind of like unique needs. Plus, as someone
who loves to look at different products, it does feel
like a nice time to like branch out and try
something else. I feel like for your daily planning purposes,
(07:48):
if it doesn't have your whole calendar in it, it's
very easy to switch between things and kind of play
with different things in different seasons.
Speaker 4 (07:54):
But you're right, that tends to be the current pattern.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
Well, just as throwing this out here to our listeners,
we think it's great to choose a planner for the
upcoming year, Like as you're selecting your planner for twenty
twenty five. But you don't need to be paralyzed by
indecision if you're like, oh, my goodness, this is the
thing that will either make me or break me for
my productivity over the next year. Like no, a no
(08:20):
planner does that. It's your systems, not the planner. And
two you can always change, right, Like, there's no law
against changing in the middle of the year if you
don't like what you're using, So keep that in mind.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Yes, and people will bring up costs. I mean, some
of these products do get up there. We've gotten to
the point where a lot of companies are selling like
quarterly books for forty.
Speaker 4 (08:40):
Dollars, So yeah, you can get up there.
Speaker 3 (08:43):
But in the grand scheme of things for a tool
that you use every single day, I mean, even if
you amortize the cost of your laptop or phone, like
your planner is going to be so much less than that.
So I don't know, I feel like it's probably not
as big as a factor as many people talk about
it for the amount of use that it outs, Like
that outfit that you figure out costs per wear, that
(09:04):
pair of genes that you've literally worn one thousand times
like they were worth it.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
All right, you could justify your hope and easy that way.
It's okay, Sarah. It's probably text deductible for you too, So.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
You know I flirt with that. I haven't because I
just I don't want to like. But they'll be like,
but you use it. I'm like, well, but okay, anyway,
we don't have to get into my taxes right now.
But no, I do not deduct my planners as of
this moment. Maybe some accountant will write me and say,
you are really stupid. All right, So considerations for using
a planner, So I'm going to go through a few
(09:35):
things that you might want to think about when you
are just trying to pick one out if you are
planning on starting fresh for twenty twenty five. So, first
of all, kind of Laura and I talked about what
we use our planners for. I think the biggest distinction
here is is this your calendar or not? Because for
many people they're very happy using a digital planning product
(09:56):
like Google Calendar, like the native Apple Calendar, like all
the different skins you can get for these things, fantastical,
et cetera, that they don't need their calendar portion of
the planner on paper, and that kind of is going
to influence what kind of layouts you're interested in. And
I think is kind of one of the first decision
points that you should make. So are you going to
(10:17):
use it as a calendar or is this primarily to
help you organize your kind of priorities for each day,
keep your tasks straight, keep various lists, et cetera. So
figuring out like is this your calendar and what do
you actually want to use it for, then you can
ask yourself, well, given what I actually want to use
this for, what types of views are going to be
most useful to me? And I will say that if
(10:40):
you are going to use it as your calendar, I
believe that the best way to visualize time is a
vertical weekly that has hourly markings. That is the same
view you're going to get if you pull up Google
Calendar on your laptop. Is the same view you will
get in what I make the ideal week. It allows
you to see all seven days and kind of see
how the hours are occupied. And I think if you
(11:02):
are have a lot of moving parts, this can be
the best layout if you want to keep your calendar
on your paper planner. If not, that opens up so
many more options and you can kind of play with
how you think it would best make sense to fit
your tasks. And honestly, if it's primarily a task manager,
that's probably not the layout for you because if those
are the main pages in your book, it doesn't leave
(11:23):
a lot of room for brainstorming and big lists and
things like that, so that's important. You also want to
decide how much structure you want. Do you want the
planner to give you all kinds of ideas for categories, which,
by the way, some companies sell custom options for this
so that you could have it print the categories of
your choice, like plum Paper is one example that does
(11:45):
offer that kind of customization. Or do you want the
sort of categories and structure to be very much imposed
by the planner or do you want something very very
open ended And then what kind of blank space are
you looking for?
Speaker 4 (12:00):
You kind of have an idea for what.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
You'd like in terms of kind of format and usage,
then that kind of helps start limiting your decision.
Speaker 4 (12:09):
Yeah, so were go ahead. Yeah, I was.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Gonna say, well, we're going to take a quick ad
break and then we'll hear a little bit more about
making this planner choice.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
All right, we are back, so we're starting to discuss
ways to help choose your planner for next year. And
we began with as we talked about, kind of whether
you want your calendar there or not if it's primarily
a task manager, and then.
Speaker 4 (12:42):
How open ended you want. That's the first question to
ask yourself.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
The second one, which really narrows things down further and
also is going to make a big difference on kind
of the size and scope of your book, is do
you want a fresh page for every day within your
planner or not? Because really the choices for daily planners
are much more limited compared to ones that offer weekly
in other views, but some people really really want at
(13:06):
least a page per day. So I think that's another
really important question to ask yourself. Now, Laura, you do like,
do you have a fresh notebook page per day that
you use in your in your list making notebook or
do you sometimes kind of just continue on.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
I sometimes just continue on, but it winds up being
a fresh page a lot of days, just because it's
a very tiny notebook, Like it's like a pocket sized
sort of notebook.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
And what I like about that.
Speaker 2 (13:31):
Is it's very easy to stick in my purse or
just carry around if I need to go somewhere with it.
And it's not too precious to lose either, because it's
just the daily task list and where I put random things,
so it's not that important.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
I guess this is how I would put it, So yeah,
I try to find a very small notebook for that.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
Okay, that makes sense. I love having a fresh page
for each day.
Speaker 3 (13:57):
That's like part of my planning ritual every day kind
of like look at set it up, figure out like
what my calendar items are, choose my tasks, and I
feel like I just I need that landscape. I need
that space in order to do the thinking the way
I want to do it.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
So for me, that's why I.
Speaker 3 (14:13):
Love the Hobannichi because you have that for every single
day and it is dated. But for other people that's
completely unnecessary and going to make their book way larger
than it needs to be.
Speaker 4 (14:22):
So that's that's an important question to ask yourself.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
The third is about binding in paper and size and
just kind of like what kind of do you want
this actual book to look like. Some people feel very
strongly about the type of paper, and I mentioned the
Hobanici and there are other planners in this category that
use very thin paper that is an acquired taste. And
for some people they use really like mercury pens and
(14:46):
they absolutely can't stand it because they're able to see
a lot of ghosting on the back side of the page.
So does the paper weight mean something to you? And
do you like paper that is really really rough and
toothy like certain brands have. Aaron Condre in particular is
famous for very toothy paper, or do you like your
paper to be like silky smooth Plum paper is definitely
one of the smoother papers out there. So thinking about
(15:09):
your paper, whether it is a spiral bound or like
more of a book bound can make a really big
difference to some people. For planners that are on the
larger side, I always want them to be spiral bound.
Specifically for what Laura said desk real estate. There's some
great planners out there that are kind of bigger and wider,
and if they're not spiral bound, then like a large
portion of your desk is going to be taken up
(15:30):
by the planner if you have it open, if you're
using it at all. So for me, that can be
a deal breaker for certain sizes of planners. I feel
like for me, a five and below and a five
is kind of like half a piece of notebook paper
folded A five and below. I can get away with
a non spiral, and then anything bigger I want to
have a spiral.
Speaker 4 (15:49):
I don't mean to keep going.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
But the book bound I think might also be an
acquired taste too. I mean it feels more professional in
a important maybe to have something like a hard background book.
But the problem is like getting it to completely live flat,
like it has to be very well designed for it
to lie flat.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
With that being the.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
Case, and I think a lot of people don't reach
that bar, so whereas a spiral obviously will lie flat
because that's the whole physics of how it's structured.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Yes, although if you're left handed you have that bump
in the middle. If you that's true, you have to
write over so you're absolutely right. And that was actually
my next thing, does it lay flat? Because there are
some book bound planners that do meet that bar, and
they are not every planner. The hobonicci absolutely lies flat.
The hemlock and oak, which I mentioned that absolutely you
(16:44):
have to look for ones that say something like perfect bound.
You have to look at the comments. You have to
be careful about this, because I agree with you, a
non lying flat book bound planner is kind of a
deal breaker. I mean, I guess if you enjoy having
like a book weight on your desk or something like that,
but otherwise can be just really frustrating to ride on.
And I'm a left hander, so extra important to me.
(17:05):
The fourth thing is aesthetics. So are you going to
enjoy using this planner? There are planners out there that
are absolutely Some people might think they're gorgeous and perfect
for them, and I'm like, that is so ugly. If
I had to look at it every day, I would die.
I mean, you know, like if someone handed me a
Lisa Frank planner in twenty twenty four with a zebra
(17:27):
and rainbows on it, like my kids would probably love it,
and I would not want to look at that every
single morning. Is jarring or something. And nothing against Lisa Frank.
She was awesome, she was ahead of her time. But yeah,
I think the aesthetics are important, and there are so
many aesthetics out there, I think more than there used
to be. There are a lot of very neutral and
professional looking planners. There are ones with more of like
(17:47):
a kind of professional but like more glamorous kind of look.
There is colorful and fun if that's what you were
looking for. There are more just really kind of gender
neutral looking planners, which is great.
Speaker 4 (17:58):
I feel like.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
Since the bullet journaling movement, which tends to be a
little bit less gender than the planner industry, kind of
came into being, there became more options, so there's really
a planner for everyone, but you do want to consider that,
and different brands definitely have their own vibes. Laura's nodding
when I was talking about ugly planners, you know what
I mean, right.
Speaker 2 (18:19):
Well, you know, I mean people mean to be nice
and they like sometimes give you one or something, or
like there's a freebie that you get from somewhere, the
swag that they're giving out. It's so individual that it's
really hard to choose one for someone else. I guess
you have to know what you are looking for. And yeah,
(18:40):
I wouldn't want rainbows and unicorns, but I'm sure there
are people who would.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
So you have to know yourself.
Speaker 2 (18:46):
But of course, knowing yourself as kind of the key
for having a planner that will work for you in
any case.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
And I will say that is one thing I love
about Hobuniji, which is that the books themselves are completely
like neutral, like they're paper covered, but then they sell
covers in literally every aesthetic from completely professional black leather
plane to like comic book characters to like art and flowers,
(19:13):
and I mean it's super cool, so something for everyone
in that line of products, but many other diverse aesthetic
options as well. So yeah, those are kind of like
my main considerations. And then I thought we can go
into a couple of brand recommendations just in case someone
is starting from scratch and is like, I haven't bought
up planners since Franklin Covey and like what's out there, which,
(19:34):
by the way, they're still out there and they're still
making cool stuff too. There are kind of old classic
planners from them and from Filofacts and stuff. But I'm
going to just share a few of to keep it
fairly limited. My favorite brands that you might want to
peruse right now, kind of based on what you're looking for.
Speaker 4 (19:50):
I mentioned Hobin e g. A million times.
Speaker 3 (19:52):
If you want thin paper and daily pages, that is
a great place to look You can get those on Amazon,
you can get them on jet Pens, or you can
buy them directly from Hobanichi. They now have their website
completely in English with dollars in the shopping cart, so
used to have to shop with yen, which was actually
kind of fun, but not anymore. And if you want
that thin paper but you're looking for different layouts, there
(20:14):
are a million kind of Hobunichi inspired I don't even
I don't know if any all of them would admit that,
but to me, that's what it looks like. Inspired brands
that also use the very thin paper that Hobnichi is
known for. And I'm just going to name a few
just in case you're that's what you want and you
want to look into it. Paper Test Designs, Sterling Ink,
(20:34):
Wonderland two twenty two or a Estelle, and then a
new one this.
Speaker 4 (20:38):
Year is just Scribble. So yeah, lots of options.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
You can go down that rabbit hole if you are
interested in a very thin paper planner, and these tend
to have very kind of neutral, understated aesthetics.
Speaker 4 (20:49):
Second, I want to mention.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
Hemlock and Oak because if you want a vertical weekly layout,
although they sell many others, but you don't like the
thin paper that comes in the Hopannichi. I always your
people to Hemlock and Oak. I just think they're beautifully constructed.
They are book bound, but they now have a soft
cover that makes a little bit more compact, and they
do lay perfectly flat. So just to know if you
(21:13):
want a daily planner with some structure built into it.
Full Focus is one of my favorites for that just
They actually came out with a wellness version as well
that I actually I think that one's really cool and
unique as well if there are certain kind of like
life factors that you want to track in your planner. Yeah,
they're both great, the original and the wellness. Laurel Denise
(21:35):
is a very hot planner brand, and I feel like
people are always sending me her stuff. Her stuff is
on the larger side, which is why I haven't used
them personally, But they do offer the ability to allow
you to see monthly, weekly, and a little space for
daily all at once. They have very innovative kind of
structure like that. So if you're the kind of person
(21:56):
who wants to see all the big picture in one
view and one book, you can check out Laurel Denise
Sprouted is another newer brand that's been super responsive to
customer feedback and they have very open ended layouts which
people appreciate. And then an old standard is Aaron Condren.
I mentioned her their paper before. They have a lot
(22:16):
of unique layouts, and in particular, there's one layout that
has three boxes vertically stacked for each day that has
just been great for like household management stuff. In the past,
I've used like the top row for my own scheduled things,
the middle row for to do items, and then the
bottom row for anything going on with the kids, and
then there's still enough space below that to put workouts
(22:37):
and our dinners. So just really really kind of functional
and I haven't seen anything like that from any other brand,
So that's one to know about.
Speaker 4 (22:44):
And then two more things. If you're interested in.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
Going disc bound, there are many places to do that,
but two of my favorites are with Cloth and Paper.
That's the brand that I'm using this year. They have
like just very minimalist aesthetics. I've been very impressed with
their quality, as well as ink Well Press. I think
we even had the creator of inkual Press on this podcast.
A jillion years ago Tanya Dalton and yeah, I've just
(23:06):
been around for a long time and also very well made,
very flexible. The nice thing with the disc bound is
you could punch your own pages and kind of mix
and match what you would like.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
Can you disc bound For those of us who are
like scratching our heads here, sorry, so picture like a
ring binder, except they're actually held together by discs, and
it doesn't sound like that would be very secure.
Speaker 3 (23:30):
Like picture like little circles and then the paper is
punched so that it slides into the disc.
Speaker 4 (23:38):
That's kind of a bad.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
So you could take the pages in and out is basically.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
You can take the pages in and out. It's sturdier
than it sounds, and you can move things around in
any order. So and you can even buy your own puncher,
so like you know, you get something from school, okay,
you can put that directly in your planner on paper,
So kind of a very versatile. The Staples version of
that is the ARC system. There's also the Levenger system.
There's like a million diskbound options, but those were just
(24:03):
two that I like. And then a blank notebook, don't forget,
I mean, honestly, for daily planning, I essentially, just want
a blank page.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
It's great, which can be anything.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
Can be a notebook from Target, or you could get
yourself a I don't know, one hundred dollars notebook.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
If you want to know, go all oh.
Speaker 3 (24:18):
Yes, I'm like Smithson Smithson with y they have very beautiful,
high end leather covered paper goods, so if you really
splurred on your notebook, you could get exactly.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
All right, Well, we're going to take one more quick
ad break and we'll be back with a little bit
more about the planning products you can get for twenty
twenty five and our Q and A coming up.
Speaker 3 (24:48):
All right, we are back, and I hope you're enjoying
this little romp through planner Land. We're going to go
through a couple of planner adjacent mentions and some accessories.
So I'm actually not sure what Laura uses in her household,
but one kind of planner adjacent category that I think
is relevant to our listener population, and we talk about
(25:08):
it lots, is some kind of household calendar that is
displayed somewhere. Now, we in our house have two tools
that we use. We use the Essential calendar, which is
a paper calendar that shows three months at a time.
That is very helpful. Our nanny loves us in particular
because she can kind of see where her vacations are,
see where we've asked her to cover a weekend, et cetera.
(25:30):
She can see all the big things coming up. And
then we also use a weekly whiteboard that we've had
for like a decade now that just has space for
each day with lines and the one extra blank one
that we kind of put random to dos that are lingering.
And our family would not function well without this at
this point, I mean this, everyone looks at it. It's
like who's driving, what activity is where, Like any night
(25:53):
that I might be late, everything, just everything that like
encompasses the happenings in our house that everyone needs to
know is on there, plus every night's dinner. There's also
digital options which we don't use, but people love. The skylight,
the dackboard, and the hearth. Those are all ways that
you can kind of display various digital calendars and kind
(26:15):
of home dashboards in a more high tech way. Laura,
do you guys have some kind of I don't know,
like you do it on paper and then you put
it on the counter. Is that kind of your solution?
Speaker 2 (26:24):
For this, Yeah, I mean, I don't really want to
maintain another thing. I guess is what it comes down to.
And my general sense, kids don't think that much more
than like eight to nine days ahead of time anyway,
Like even older teenagers. It's really hard to talk about
(26:44):
stuff that's much further down the line than that. So
I mean, for the older boys, if there is bigger
stuff coming up, I mean, I will talk to them
about it, but we don't really deal with it on
the level that the household is functioning until closer to it.
So every Friday I make a family schedule for the
next week. I also send the weekend schedule for the
(27:05):
upcoming weekend and I email that around to nanny's husband
older children, print up a copy, put it on the
counter so that children who are literate but not on
email can also look at it. And people have been told,
look at that. Don't ask me questions that are on that,
(27:27):
because that's really frustrating. What time do we have this, Well,
I don't know. Maybe it's in the email.
Speaker 3 (27:32):
No, that's totally your version of the whiteboard, which makes
total sense. I think I just do the same thing
writing it up in the air, and you do it.
Probably yours has even more on it, and that's why
yours might not even fit on a whiteboard at this point,
so that makes more sense. But okay, perfect, I love it.
Kind of an elegant tool actually just simple. So yeah,
kind of those are my household adjacment thoughts for some
(27:54):
kind of household management system. I feel like it's less
common to get those at the beginning of the year,
but just thought they were worth a mention.
Speaker 4 (28:00):
And then finally, some accessories.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
If you are kind of trying to up your planning
game for next year, some things to think about might
be looking at pens or even your pen case. I
love having all of my pens at my disposal, even
at work, et cetera. Doesn't take up much room in
my bag. I have the liheat lab smart fit case.
It's like twelve dollars. It's lasted for years now, and
(28:25):
you can get that on Amazon or jet Pens or wherever.
But I love it. And then some people have asked
me about photo printers for like pasting things into or
stickers to paste into my five year journal, and I
will say mine has stopped working. It stops sinking with
my phone. I think it's just the evolution of technology,
(28:46):
like the device didn't keep up with mine. So I'm
in the market for a new one, and I just
did a little bit of research and I heard great
things or read great things about the Canon Selfie Selphy
mini printer and the Fujifilm in Stacks mini link. So
if you are looking to print out cute little stickers
because you want to kind of memory keep in the
new year, than those are two to take a look at.
(29:07):
I feel like Laura's like, I will never do that.
Speaker 4 (29:10):
What do you don't think I like stickers? I don't know,
do you.
Speaker 1 (29:15):
Well, I print out all sorts of photos.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
I mean, we have photo gallery walls around here, but
it's not the sticker version.
Speaker 3 (29:20):
It's like actual photographs framed, so yeah, see, and I'm
terrible with that. So that's why I need tiny little
stickers to keep in my five year journal.
Speaker 4 (29:30):
So I have something.
Speaker 3 (29:32):
And then the last thing I wanted to mention is
digital option. So maybe you're like, I do not want
a paper planner for next year.
Speaker 4 (29:38):
I don't want to.
Speaker 3 (29:39):
Carry it around, but I want the feel of using
a planner. I highly recommend checking out the app Artful agenda.
I have a lot of best laid plans listeners who
use this and love it. Kind of combines. It looks
like a planner, but it's on the screen. You can
even buy stickers for it. You can have it in
any aesthetics that you would like, sink in various places,
(30:01):
so that is always fun to check out. And then
some planner brands sell PDF versions of their planners which
you can then use on an iPad with an Apple
like good Notes, and then write directly in them with
an Apple pencil or type stuff in Passion planner comes
to mind, but really a bunch of them are selling
digital versions now. And then there's also the option of
di y ing it. My friend Kay is a wizard
(30:21):
with her Google sheets. She like kind of has almost
a little daily planner column for every single day in
Google Sheets that she does a week at a time,
which is super cool. And we know Laura's tracked her
time in an Excel spreadsheet for many, many years. It's
not a planner, but it is a form of memory keeping,
so don't forget about your digital options.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
It's retrospective planning what actually happened versus what was planned
usually pretty similar, but In.
Speaker 4 (30:46):
The planner world, they call it memory keeping.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
Memory keeping.
Speaker 4 (30:49):
Okay, got it?
Speaker 3 (30:51):
Got it?
Speaker 1 (30:51):
Awesome.
Speaker 2 (30:53):
Well that's giving you a lot of food for thought.
So we also welcome questions about this. If you you know,
have a specific planner, need something you're looking for, If
you have a brand you want to recommend, please reach
out to us.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
You can always reach me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
And Sarah also has her podcast bestlid Plans, so be
sure to check that out. So our question today is
about sneaky teen costs.
Speaker 4 (31:22):
So this listener writes.
Speaker 2 (31:23):
In that I thought the baby years were expensive, but
I always hear parents of teens limit the costs associated
with older kids. And this listener is guessing at the
price of college or car being the most common items mentioned.
What else have you found to be expensive? Do you
wish you would save differently when your kids were young,
or since you both seem like savers, do you have
any advice for us spenders?
Speaker 3 (31:45):
So, Sarah, I mean I do save consciously. I am
not a natural saveror so just want to dispel that myth.
Anyone who's known me for a long time is like, yeah,
I wouldn't say, I spend thoughtlessly at all, but I
have to really make a concerted effort to save, which
I do because I think long term. But I also
(32:09):
enjoy spending money on things that feel worthwhile. I guess,
so I would say, I mean, for us, we have
made the choice to go private school, and but has
dwarfed everything else that is very expensive. It is a choice,
it's a complex choice, it's a choice not everybody loves,
but for us it makes the best sense. And so
(32:31):
for us that's the biggest cost by far. Nothing else
comes close with three kids. The runners up, I would
say are camps and summer experiences, particularly if you're going
to do sleepway camp, like the one year we did
a traditional sleep away camp that was a huge line
item in our budget.
Speaker 4 (32:48):
Other camps less so.
Speaker 3 (32:49):
But I mean, teens are going to be more likely
to want to do like more complex things or some
kind of academic program, and those can be very expensive.
Sports can be very you know what, really, I'll say, like,
we have one person in gymnastics, and that is pretty pricey.
Travel soccer has a lot of time commitment, but at
the current level is not super super expensive. Some families,
(33:12):
not us, pay for private training. I'm sure that adds
up very very quickly. And then music. I mean, if again,
if you're doing a lot of private lessons, different groups,
things like that can be expensive. Tutoring or other types
of like help or specialists can be expensive. And then
if you don't need childcare, it doesn't mean you're never
gonna need some kind of like driving help or logistical help,
(33:35):
so that that can be costly. And then finally, kids
can ask for expensive things. We tend to be just like,
well no, I mean, we say no more than we
say yes. Our kids are probably inherited the desire to
my stuff, but we have to teach them that they
can't have everything because they actually can't because at this
point they're asking for things that if we said yes
(33:58):
every single time, would be responsible of all of us.
So that doesn't tend to be a huge category for us,
but it takes effort to constrain it to a reasonable level.
I will say having uniforms helps a lot, because you're
just not going to need nine million outfits when you
have to wear a polo and joggers every day to school.
Speaker 4 (34:23):
Very true, very true.
Speaker 2 (34:25):
Yeah, I mean we I mean, my kids go to
public school, so we don't have that expense. We obviously
Henry's in a private preschool, but that will he'll be
in a public kindergarten next year, so that's actually quite limited,
which is great. However, I would say it's not so
much the stuff because my kids have not been particularly
(34:46):
acquisitive on the stuff level. I mean, my oldest son
is driving a thirteen year old car that was my car,
and then I was supposed to buy a new car
and I haven't gotten my head around doing that yet,
sort of using it when it's available, using the van
when that's available, and kind of just making do at
(35:08):
the moment. But it's the experiences and that can add
up quickly and sometimes comes more out of the blue,
and I would never want to have to say no
on one of those things. Like as an example, Sam
last year he qualified for the National Technology Student Alliance competition,
(35:36):
so that was you know, his school sent a team,
but it's you know, five days in Orlandos, so they
had to pay for you know, the flights down and
the hotels and the costs of that. And as we
knew that was coming up, and we're like, okay, we're
paying for that, and then as you know, right as
that hit, his robotics team got to go to the
World's competition, which was sort of out of the blue.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
We did not see that one coming. But that's great.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
And so all of a sudden, you know, we're paying
for a trip to Dallas with the airfare and the
hotels and all that, like at pretty much the exact
same time. And I was like, I am so grateful
that just dropping three thousand, four thousand dollars for the
two of these trips like in a week, like it
didn't make a problem, which is why it helps to
(36:27):
think that you will need to do stuff like that, right,
And that's you know, it's important for me to kids
be able to do like the private music lessons. But
at this point, I have three children in private music lessons,
and I will have four within a couple months, and
I will have five within a year. So it's you know,
and they're all going to be different teachers, like there's
no they're all different things, like they're all different instruments
(36:51):
or whatever, and it's just you know, you want to
be able to give them those opportunities. Or when Jasper
and Sam went to academic camps over the summer. Those
are pretty pricey, Like you're basically paying college level tuition
over a couple weeks, and you want to be able
to do that. So anyway, what all this is saying
(37:13):
is that I feel like, I mean, obviously the normal
thing is, yes, money matters, Like an average normal thought
is that money does matter. But I feel like some
of us and some people maybe grew up with a
thought that, oh no, it's not that important, you know,
and especially like where this often comes is is like
mom doesn't need to take her career seriously because that
(37:35):
money doesn't matter. It's more important that you have the
marginal extra bit of time. And I would say that
one of the things that has come out of what
I have studied is that it's not as much extra
time as you think. And you are going to probably
want to have some of those resources to be able
to give your kids the experiences that will help them
(37:59):
develop them talents over time.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
So just something to think about.
Speaker 4 (38:05):
And I know we're going to get pushed back.
Speaker 3 (38:07):
I know this is going to be a but I
didn't have any of those things and I turned out fine,
which is true. I mean I didn't have some of
these things either, am I still mad about not going
to Italy in tenth grade. Possibly, but you know what,
I did live to tell the tale and it all
worked out. And maybe that like taught me a lesson
that if I had wanted to go to Italy, I
should have babysat more or something like that.
Speaker 4 (38:28):
I don't know. I guess it's true.
Speaker 3 (38:30):
Like I guess my point is, like, not giving your
kids everything they want is not going to break them.
And so neither of us are saying that, like the
answers that you have to do all these things, these
are all optional and many many people can thrive and
not do them. But to delude yourself to thinking that
you're not going to want to do some of these
things and that they're not expensive, it's better to maybe
(38:53):
be aware that these are possibilities that you would want
to be prepared for should your kids be interested, and
it's somewhat likely that that may happen.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
Yeah, And I think that there's a big difference between saying, well,
I don't need to buy my kids designer jeans. Absolutely
you don't and I don't, But I do want to
pay for top level voice lessons, So that is a
different thing. Entirely right totally, so you can wear jeans
from Target and have the best voice teacher in town. Anyway,
all right, verdy quick, Sarah love of the week. I
(39:25):
guess you had your planners. It's gonna be hob and.
Speaker 3 (39:27):
E g sure my ride er di hope on each
cousin going strong for twenty twenty four.
Speaker 4 (39:33):
And I guess I'll share that I.
Speaker 3 (39:34):
Got the floral covered version next year that actually has
its own built in cover, so it's a little bit
more streamline. It's called the Han h O n in
the Liberty floral fabric print and it's super pretty and
I love it awesome.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
Yeah, I'll go with my weekly at a Glance calendar.
I mean, this is you know, I've literally bought a
new one of these every year for a decade plus
and it's I'm not sure what the market is.
Speaker 1 (39:58):
The market is like me. I don't think there's like
anyone else using them.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
But because who uses a paper small calendar that they
don't then use as a planner or anything, I don't know,
but for me it works. I don't want to have
a digital calendar, So there you go. All right, Well
this has been best of both Worlds. We have been
talking all things planners today. Hopefully people got some great
ideas coming out of that. We will be back next
week with more and making work and life fit together.
Speaker 4 (40:25):
Thanks for listening.
Speaker 3 (40:26):
You can find me Sarah at the shoebox dot com
or at the Underscore Shoebox on Instagram, and you can.
Speaker 4 (40:33):
Find me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. This has
been the best of both Worlds podcasts.
Speaker 2 (40:40):
Please join us next time for more on making work
and life work together.
Hi.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
I'm Laura Vanderkamp. I'm a mother of five, an author, journalist,
and speaker.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
And I'm Sarah Hart Hunger, a mother of three, practicing physician, writer,
and course creator. We are two working parents who love
our careers and our families.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Welcome to Best of Both Worlds. Here we talk about
how real women manage work, family, and time for fun,
from figuring out childcare to mapping out long.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Term career goals.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
We want you to get the most out of life.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Welcome to Best of Both Worlds. This is Laura.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
This episode is airing in late October of twenty twenty four.
Sarah is going to be talking all things planners now.
Longtime listeners may recall that in the early years of
Best of Both Worlds, we did a handful of planner
Polu type episodes where Sarah would go over various planners
that one might purchase for the upcoming year. We started
(01:07):
doing less of that because, of course, she started her
own podcast called Best Laid Plans. For maybe the three
of our listeners who haven't checked that out, you should.
But she talks a lot about planners there, and about
the whole concept of planning and all that. But we
thought since her content over there has also started expanding
(01:28):
into different planning related topics. You know, there hasn't been
one episode recently about the planner to choose for the
next year. So here we are today doing that, Sarah
take it away.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Yeah, ooh, I'll have to like direct BLP listeners over
here too, just in case you know, they want to more.
I feel like we haven't done this like general overview discussion,
and this will be fun because I'll get Laura to
talk a little bit about her current planners as well.
But yeah, we're going to focus on considerations for using
a planner. Some of my favorite brands, and I will
not mention every brand in there. There are nine million brands,
(02:04):
some fun tools, accessories, et cetera. So to start us off, Laura,
what are you currently planning with? Like, what are your
paper tools right now?
Speaker 4 (02:14):
So?
Speaker 1 (02:15):
I have a couple.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
I have a paper calendar that is a weekly at
a glance brand calendar where you get the whole week
on one small page. It's like a pocket sized calendar,
and I use that to write down time specific commitments
sort of forward for the next however long. I tend
to buy the next year's calendar in like July, so
(02:40):
it can be anytime in sort of the next eighteen
months that I'm writing down time specific stuff on that.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
As for the.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
Bulk of my planning, I do a weekly plan do
that on Thursday or Friday looking forward to the next week.
I'm currently this year doing that on a plum paper
custom designed product. It has a nice little LV on
the cover and it was very pretty. It's been okay,
it's bigger than I was using. You would set me
(03:10):
up with the Whitney English Weekly Planner, which, for whatever reason,
being smaller, I wound up using a bit more. I
do write the week's priority list on the left side,
where they have sort of open space for writing that
in two columns, which I like. Then the right side
is the days of the week, and I guess theoretically
(03:31):
I should be putting my daily to do list for
each day there, But when I have the whole thing open,
it's just so big that I don't like it, so
I flip it over so I only have half, and
then I make my daily to do list in a
tiny little notebook, which is just a notebook from Target
that I can also jot down notes like if I
have to write a random number, like I have to
make a deposit.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
For x amount somewhere, like I write that down in there.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
So it's got random notes plus the daily to do list,
so it's really a planner stack of three things at
this point.
Speaker 4 (04:01):
So interesting.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
I actually think that sort of reveals one thing people
don't often think about, which is sometimes separate books are helpful,
especially if you want to reference one while you're writing
the other and you don't want to have it open,
or your desk real estate doesn't want to have a
two page spread open all the time. So I think
your little hack actually sounds like it makes a lot
of sense, and we've got to think about maybe a
(04:22):
smaller weekly task manager for you for the next time.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Maybe, I mean, I like all the space that I
have for the one page for the weekly thing, so
I mean maybe it's but I did recently find a
hack for what to use that other page for ah,
which little spoiler alert, we may be coming up with
an episode soon where we talk about meals that we
have eaten. So I actually recorded like I kept a
(04:52):
food journal for the first time ever in my life
over on that page which I only had to fill
in like three times a day or whatever.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
Writing what I et and so I could just flip
over for that.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
But I don't know if I will do that from
now on because I don't really like to keep a
food journal, but in the interest of future content, I
did it.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Yeah, well maybe it could be a you know, an
evergreen different type of journal, like maybe one week you
do media and another week you do.
Speaker 4 (05:18):
Cool things your kids. I don't know.
Speaker 3 (05:20):
I'll have fun thinking of ideas for that other page.
All right, Well, you have a planner stack, Laura.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
My current planner stack is also three items. So I
have my Hobonicci cousin, which is my kind of ridered
eye planner that I seem to return to again and again.
There's no video, but I'm still holding it up for Laura.
But this has monthly pages, weekly pages, and daily pages,
and I do use it to keep my calendar. So
(05:46):
it is my source of truth in terms of what
is going on in my schedule as well as our
household schedule. I have a Hobonicci five year journal that's
like more from memory keeping. Mine goes from twenty twenty
one to twenty twenty five, so I'll have one more
year in that volume that I'm super excited about.
Speaker 4 (06:03):
It's been really fun to use.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
And then finally I have kind of a like goals
and lists planner, and for that this year, I've used
a diskbound cloth and paper product that has like a
reading list and notebook pages, and I just basically have
my annual goals there, my seasonal goals there, and like
any other list that I've wanted to keep throughout the year.
I probably am going to change things up a little
bit for twenty twenty five, as one does when one
(06:28):
has a planning focus podcast, But that is what I
have right now, and we're going to talk about what
you want in a planner. But I would say right now,
my hope Anicchi Cousin is serving two big purposes. Is
my day to day task manager as well as my calendar.
And then my disc bound is more of like a
big picture goalkeeping and then the five years really just
(06:50):
for fun and like is more of like a life
scrap book. So those are kind of my stack, and
for me that's actually pretty minimal. So I'm really happy,
very streamlined.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
And I would say from my memory from talking with
you over the years and listening to bestlid plans. As
you often start the year in the Hobanici, you migrate
out of it because something triggers it, either that somebody
sent you a really cool planner or there's some you know,
(07:19):
schedule change that you want a fresh start, and then
you wind up back in the Hobaniici toward the end
of the year.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
Is that correct?
Speaker 3 (07:26):
That has been my pattern in the last two years,
And it's kind of funny. I'll end up with about
six total months or maybe six to eight months even
in the hobanichi, with like a break during this spring
and summer, And I think that does reflect that that
season has kind of like unique needs. Plus, as someone
who loves to look at different products, it does feel
like a nice time to like branch out and try
something else. I feel like for your daily planning purposes,
(07:48):
if it doesn't have your whole calendar in it, it's
very easy to switch between things and kind of play
with different things in different seasons.
Speaker 4 (07:54):
But you're right, that tends to be the current pattern.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
Well, just as throwing this out here to our listeners,
we think it's great to choose a planner for the
upcoming year, Like as you're selecting your planner for twenty
twenty five. But you don't need to be paralyzed by
indecision if you're like, oh, my goodness, this is the
thing that will either make me or break me for
my productivity over the next year. Like no, a no
(08:20):
planner does that. It's your systems, not the planner. And
two you can always change, right, Like, there's no law
against changing in the middle of the year if you
don't like what you're using, So keep that in mind.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Yes, and people will bring up costs. I mean, some
of these products do get up there. We've gotten to
the point where a lot of companies are selling like
quarterly books for forty.
Speaker 4 (08:40):
Dollars, So yeah, you can get up there.
Speaker 3 (08:43):
But in the grand scheme of things for a tool
that you use every single day, I mean, even if
you amortize the cost of your laptop or phone, like
your planner is going to be so much less than that.
So I don't know, I feel like it's probably not
as big as a factor as many people talk about
it for the amount of use that it outs, Like
that outfit that you figure out costs per wear, that
(09:04):
pair of genes that you've literally worn one thousand times
like they were worth it.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
All right, you could justify your hope and easy that way.
It's okay, Sarah. It's probably text deductible for you too, So.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
You know I flirt with that. I haven't because I
just I don't want to like. But they'll be like,
but you use it. I'm like, well, but okay, anyway,
we don't have to get into my taxes right now.
But no, I do not deduct my planners as of
this moment. Maybe some accountant will write me and say,
you are really stupid. All right, So considerations for using
a planner, So I'm going to go through a few
(09:35):
things that you might want to think about when you
are just trying to pick one out if you are
planning on starting fresh for twenty twenty five. So, first
of all, kind of Laura and I talked about what
we use our planners for. I think the biggest distinction
here is is this your calendar or not? Because for
many people they're very happy using a digital planning product
(09:56):
like Google Calendar, like the native Apple Calendar, like all
the different skins you can get for these things, fantastical,
et cetera, that they don't need their calendar portion of
the planner on paper, and that kind of is going
to influence what kind of layouts you're interested in. And
I think is kind of one of the first decision
points that you should make. So are you going to
(10:17):
use it as a calendar or is this primarily to
help you organize your kind of priorities for each day,
keep your tasks straight, keep various lists, et cetera. So
figuring out like is this your calendar and what do
you actually want to use it for, then you can
ask yourself, well, given what I actually want to use
this for, what types of views are going to be
most useful to me? And I will say that if
(10:40):
you are going to use it as your calendar, I
believe that the best way to visualize time is a
vertical weekly that has hourly markings. That is the same
view you're going to get if you pull up Google
Calendar on your laptop. Is the same view you will
get in what I make the ideal week. It allows
you to see all seven days and kind of see
how the hours are occupied. And I think if you
(11:02):
are have a lot of moving parts, this can be
the best layout if you want to keep your calendar
on your paper planner. If not, that opens up so
many more options and you can kind of play with
how you think it would best make sense to fit
your tasks. And honestly, if it's primarily a task manager,
that's probably not the layout for you because if those
are the main pages in your book, it doesn't leave
(11:23):
a lot of room for brainstorming and big lists and
things like that, so that's important. You also want to
decide how much structure you want. Do you want the
planner to give you all kinds of ideas for categories, which,
by the way, some companies sell custom options for this
so that you could have it print the categories of
your choice, like plum Paper is one example that does
(11:45):
offer that kind of customization. Or do you want the
sort of categories and structure to be very much imposed
by the planner or do you want something very very
open ended And then what kind of blank space are
you looking for?
Speaker 4 (12:00):
You kind of have an idea for what.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
You'd like in terms of kind of format and usage,
then that kind of helps start limiting your decision.
Speaker 4 (12:09):
Yeah, so were go ahead. Yeah, I was.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Gonna say, well, we're going to take a quick ad
break and then we'll hear a little bit more about
making this planner choice.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
All right, we are back, so we're starting to discuss
ways to help choose your planner for next year. And
we began with as we talked about, kind of whether
you want your calendar there or not if it's primarily
a task manager, and then.
Speaker 4 (12:42):
How open ended you want. That's the first question to
ask yourself.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
The second one, which really narrows things down further and
also is going to make a big difference on kind
of the size and scope of your book, is do
you want a fresh page for every day within your
planner or not? Because really the choices for daily planners
are much more limited compared to ones that offer weekly
in other views, but some people really really want at
(13:06):
least a page per day. So I think that's another
really important question to ask yourself. Now, Laura, you do like,
do you have a fresh notebook page per day that
you use in your in your list making notebook or
do you sometimes kind of just continue on.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
I sometimes just continue on, but it winds up being
a fresh page a lot of days, just because it's
a very tiny notebook, Like it's like a pocket sized
sort of notebook.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
And what I like about that.
Speaker 2 (13:31):
Is it's very easy to stick in my purse or
just carry around if I need to go somewhere with it.
And it's not too precious to lose either, because it's
just the daily task list and where I put random things,
so it's not that important.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
I guess this is how I would put it, So yeah,
I try to find a very small notebook for that.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
Okay, that makes sense. I love having a fresh page
for each day.
Speaker 3 (13:57):
That's like part of my planning ritual every day kind
of like look at set it up, figure out like
what my calendar items are, choose my tasks, and I
feel like I just I need that landscape. I need
that space in order to do the thinking the way
I want to do it.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
So for me, that's why I.
Speaker 3 (14:13):
Love the Hobannichi because you have that for every single
day and it is dated. But for other people that's
completely unnecessary and going to make their book way larger
than it needs to be.
Speaker 4 (14:22):
So that's that's an important question to ask yourself.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
The third is about binding in paper and size and
just kind of like what kind of do you want
this actual book to look like. Some people feel very
strongly about the type of paper, and I mentioned the
Hobanici and there are other planners in this category that
use very thin paper that is an acquired taste. And
for some people they use really like mercury pens and
(14:46):
they absolutely can't stand it because they're able to see
a lot of ghosting on the back side of the page.
So does the paper weight mean something to you? And
do you like paper that is really really rough and
toothy like certain brands have. Aaron Condre in particular is
famous for very toothy paper, or do you like your
paper to be like silky smooth Plum paper is definitely
one of the smoother papers out there. So thinking about
(15:09):
your paper, whether it is a spiral bound or like
more of a book bound can make a really big
difference to some people. For planners that are on the
larger side, I always want them to be spiral bound.
Specifically for what Laura said desk real estate. There's some
great planners out there that are kind of bigger and wider,
and if they're not spiral bound, then like a large
portion of your desk is going to be taken up
(15:30):
by the planner if you have it open, if you're
using it at all. So for me, that can be
a deal breaker for certain sizes of planners. I feel
like for me, a five and below and a five
is kind of like half a piece of notebook paper
folded A five and below. I can get away with
a non spiral, and then anything bigger I want to
have a spiral.
Speaker 4 (15:49):
I don't mean to keep going.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
But the book bound I think might also be an
acquired taste too. I mean it feels more professional in
a important maybe to have something like a hard background book.
But the problem is like getting it to completely live flat,
like it has to be very well designed for it
to lie flat.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
With that being the.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
Case, and I think a lot of people don't reach
that bar, so whereas a spiral obviously will lie flat
because that's the whole physics of how it's structured.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Yes, although if you're left handed you have that bump
in the middle. If you that's true, you have to
write over so you're absolutely right. And that was actually
my next thing, does it lay flat? Because there are
some book bound planners that do meet that bar, and
they are not every planner. The hobonicci absolutely lies flat.
The hemlock and oak, which I mentioned that absolutely you
(16:44):
have to look for ones that say something like perfect bound.
You have to look at the comments. You have to
be careful about this, because I agree with you, a
non lying flat book bound planner is kind of a
deal breaker. I mean, I guess if you enjoy having
like a book weight on your desk or something like that,
but otherwise can be just really frustrating to ride on.
And I'm a left hander, so extra important to me.
(17:05):
The fourth thing is aesthetics. So are you going to
enjoy using this planner? There are planners out there that
are absolutely Some people might think they're gorgeous and perfect
for them, and I'm like, that is so ugly. If
I had to look at it every day, I would die.
I mean, you know, like if someone handed me a
Lisa Frank planner in twenty twenty four with a zebra
(17:27):
and rainbows on it, like my kids would probably love it,
and I would not want to look at that every
single morning. Is jarring or something. And nothing against Lisa Frank.
She was awesome, she was ahead of her time. But yeah,
I think the aesthetics are important, and there are so
many aesthetics out there, I think more than there used
to be. There are a lot of very neutral and
professional looking planners. There are ones with more of like
(17:47):
a kind of professional but like more glamorous kind of look.
There is colorful and fun if that's what you were
looking for. There are more just really kind of gender
neutral looking planners, which is great.
Speaker 4 (17:58):
I feel like.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
Since the bullet journaling movement, which tends to be a
little bit less gender than the planner industry, kind of
came into being, there became more options, so there's really
a planner for everyone, but you do want to consider that,
and different brands definitely have their own vibes. Laura's nodding
when I was talking about ugly planners, you know what
I mean, right.
Speaker 2 (18:19):
Well, you know, I mean people mean to be nice
and they like sometimes give you one or something, or
like there's a freebie that you get from somewhere, the
swag that they're giving out. It's so individual that it's
really hard to choose one for someone else. I guess
you have to know what you are looking for. And yeah,
(18:40):
I wouldn't want rainbows and unicorns, but I'm sure there
are people who would.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
So you have to know yourself.
Speaker 2 (18:46):
But of course, knowing yourself as kind of the key
for having a planner that will work for you in
any case.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
And I will say that is one thing I love
about Hobuniji, which is that the books themselves are completely
like neutral, like they're paper covered, but then they sell
covers in literally every aesthetic from completely professional black leather
plane to like comic book characters to like art and flowers,
(19:13):
and I mean it's super cool, so something for everyone
in that line of products, but many other diverse aesthetic
options as well. So yeah, those are kind of like
my main considerations. And then I thought we can go
into a couple of brand recommendations just in case someone
is starting from scratch and is like, I haven't bought
up planners since Franklin Covey and like what's out there, which,
(19:34):
by the way, they're still out there and they're still
making cool stuff too. There are kind of old classic
planners from them and from Filofacts and stuff. But I'm
going to just share a few of to keep it
fairly limited. My favorite brands that you might want to
peruse right now, kind of based on what you're looking for.
Speaker 4 (19:50):
I mentioned Hobin e g. A million times.
Speaker 3 (19:52):
If you want thin paper and daily pages, that is
a great place to look You can get those on Amazon,
you can get them on jet Pens, or you can
buy them directly from Hobanichi. They now have their website
completely in English with dollars in the shopping cart, so
used to have to shop with yen, which was actually
kind of fun, but not anymore. And if you want
that thin paper but you're looking for different layouts, there
(20:14):
are a million kind of Hobunichi inspired I don't even
I don't know if any all of them would admit that,
but to me, that's what it looks like. Inspired brands
that also use the very thin paper that Hobnichi is
known for. And I'm just going to name a few
just in case you're that's what you want and you
want to look into it. Paper Test Designs, Sterling Ink,
(20:34):
Wonderland two twenty two or a Estelle, and then a
new one this.
Speaker 4 (20:38):
Year is just Scribble. So yeah, lots of options.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
You can go down that rabbit hole if you are
interested in a very thin paper planner, and these tend
to have very kind of neutral, understated aesthetics.
Speaker 4 (20:49):
Second, I want to mention.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
Hemlock and Oak because if you want a vertical weekly layout,
although they sell many others, but you don't like the
thin paper that comes in the Hopannichi. I always your
people to Hemlock and Oak. I just think they're beautifully constructed.
They are book bound, but they now have a soft
cover that makes a little bit more compact, and they
do lay perfectly flat. So just to know if you
(21:13):
want a daily planner with some structure built into it.
Full Focus is one of my favorites for that just
They actually came out with a wellness version as well
that I actually I think that one's really cool and
unique as well if there are certain kind of like
life factors that you want to track in your planner. Yeah,
they're both great, the original and the wellness. Laurel Denise
(21:35):
is a very hot planner brand, and I feel like
people are always sending me her stuff. Her stuff is
on the larger side, which is why I haven't used
them personally, But they do offer the ability to allow
you to see monthly, weekly, and a little space for
daily all at once. They have very innovative kind of
structure like that. So if you're the kind of person
(21:56):
who wants to see all the big picture in one
view and one book, you can check out Laurel Denise
Sprouted is another newer brand that's been super responsive to
customer feedback and they have very open ended layouts which
people appreciate. And then an old standard is Aaron Condren.
I mentioned her their paper before. They have a lot
(22:16):
of unique layouts, and in particular, there's one layout that
has three boxes vertically stacked for each day that has
just been great for like household management stuff. In the past,
I've used like the top row for my own scheduled things,
the middle row for to do items, and then the
bottom row for anything going on with the kids, and
then there's still enough space below that to put workouts
(22:37):
and our dinners. So just really really kind of functional
and I haven't seen anything like that from any other brand,
So that's one to know about.
Speaker 4 (22:44):
And then two more things. If you're interested in.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
Going disc bound, there are many places to do that,
but two of my favorites are with Cloth and Paper.
That's the brand that I'm using this year. They have
like just very minimalist aesthetics. I've been very impressed with
their quality, as well as ink Well Press. I think
we even had the creator of inkual Press on this podcast.
A jillion years ago Tanya Dalton and yeah, I've just
(23:06):
been around for a long time and also very well made,
very flexible. The nice thing with the disc bound is
you could punch your own pages and kind of mix
and match what you would like.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
Can you disc bound For those of us who are
like scratching our heads here, sorry, so picture like a
ring binder, except they're actually held together by discs, and
it doesn't sound like that would be very secure.
Speaker 3 (23:30):
Like picture like little circles and then the paper is
punched so that it slides into the disc.
Speaker 4 (23:38):
That's kind of a bad.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
So you could take the pages in and out is basically.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
You can take the pages in and out. It's sturdier
than it sounds, and you can move things around in
any order. So and you can even buy your own puncher,
so like you know, you get something from school, okay,
you can put that directly in your planner on paper,
So kind of a very versatile. The Staples version of
that is the ARC system. There's also the Levenger system.
There's like a million diskbound options, but those were just
(24:03):
two that I like. And then a blank notebook, don't forget,
I mean, honestly, for daily planning, I essentially, just want
a blank page.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
It's great, which can be anything.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
Can be a notebook from Target, or you could get
yourself a I don't know, one hundred dollars notebook.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
If you want to know, go all oh.
Speaker 3 (24:18):
Yes, I'm like Smithson Smithson with y they have very beautiful,
high end leather covered paper goods, so if you really
splurred on your notebook, you could get exactly.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
All right, Well, we're going to take one more quick
ad break and we'll be back with a little bit
more about the planning products you can get for twenty
twenty five and our Q and A coming up.
Speaker 3 (24:48):
All right, we are back, and I hope you're enjoying
this little romp through planner Land. We're going to go
through a couple of planner adjacent mentions and some accessories.
So I'm actually not sure what Laura uses in her household,
but one kind of planner adjacent category that I think
is relevant to our listener population, and we talk about
(25:08):
it lots, is some kind of household calendar that is
displayed somewhere. Now, we in our house have two tools
that we use. We use the Essential calendar, which is
a paper calendar that shows three months at a time.
That is very helpful. Our nanny loves us in particular
because she can kind of see where her vacations are,
see where we've asked her to cover a weekend, et cetera.
(25:30):
She can see all the big things coming up. And
then we also use a weekly whiteboard that we've had
for like a decade now that just has space for
each day with lines and the one extra blank one
that we kind of put random to dos that are lingering.
And our family would not function well without this at
this point, I mean this, everyone looks at it. It's
like who's driving, what activity is where, Like any night
(25:53):
that I might be late, everything, just everything that like
encompasses the happenings in our house that everyone needs to
know is on there, plus every night's dinner. There's also
digital options which we don't use, but people love. The skylight,
the dackboard, and the hearth. Those are all ways that
you can kind of display various digital calendars and kind
(26:15):
of home dashboards in a more high tech way. Laura,
do you guys have some kind of I don't know,
like you do it on paper and then you put
it on the counter. Is that kind of your solution?
Speaker 2 (26:24):
For this, Yeah, I mean, I don't really want to
maintain another thing. I guess is what it comes down to.
And my general sense, kids don't think that much more
than like eight to nine days ahead of time anyway,
Like even older teenagers. It's really hard to talk about
(26:44):
stuff that's much further down the line than that. So
I mean, for the older boys, if there is bigger
stuff coming up, I mean, I will talk to them
about it, but we don't really deal with it on
the level that the household is functioning until closer to it.
So every Friday I make a family schedule for the
next week. I also send the weekend schedule for the
(27:05):
upcoming weekend and I email that around to nanny's husband
older children, print up a copy, put it on the
counter so that children who are literate but not on
email can also look at it. And people have been told,
look at that. Don't ask me questions that are on that,
(27:27):
because that's really frustrating. What time do we have this, Well,
I don't know. Maybe it's in the email.
Speaker 3 (27:32):
No, that's totally your version of the whiteboard, which makes
total sense. I think I just do the same thing
writing it up in the air, and you do it.
Probably yours has even more on it, and that's why
yours might not even fit on a whiteboard at this point,
so that makes more sense. But okay, perfect, I love it.
Kind of an elegant tool actually just simple. So yeah,
kind of those are my household adjacment thoughts for some
(27:54):
kind of household management system. I feel like it's less
common to get those at the beginning of the year,
but just thought they were worth a mention.
Speaker 4 (28:00):
And then finally, some accessories.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
If you are kind of trying to up your planning
game for next year, some things to think about might
be looking at pens or even your pen case. I
love having all of my pens at my disposal, even
at work, et cetera. Doesn't take up much room in
my bag. I have the liheat lab smart fit case.
It's like twelve dollars. It's lasted for years now, and
(28:25):
you can get that on Amazon or jet Pens or wherever.
But I love it. And then some people have asked
me about photo printers for like pasting things into or
stickers to paste into my five year journal, and I
will say mine has stopped working. It stops sinking with
my phone. I think it's just the evolution of technology,
(28:46):
like the device didn't keep up with mine. So I'm
in the market for a new one, and I just
did a little bit of research and I heard great
things or read great things about the Canon Selfie Selphy
mini printer and the Fujifilm in Stacks mini link. So
if you are looking to print out cute little stickers
because you want to kind of memory keep in the
new year, than those are two to take a look at.
(29:07):
I feel like Laura's like, I will never do that.
Speaker 4 (29:10):
What do you don't think I like stickers? I don't know,
do you.
Speaker 1 (29:15):
Well, I print out all sorts of photos.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
I mean, we have photo gallery walls around here, but
it's not the sticker version.
Speaker 3 (29:20):
It's like actual photographs framed, so yeah, see, and I'm
terrible with that. So that's why I need tiny little
stickers to keep in my five year journal.
Speaker 4 (29:30):
So I have something.
Speaker 3 (29:32):
And then the last thing I wanted to mention is
digital option. So maybe you're like, I do not want
a paper planner for next year.
Speaker 4 (29:38):
I don't want to.
Speaker 3 (29:39):
Carry it around, but I want the feel of using
a planner. I highly recommend checking out the app Artful agenda.
I have a lot of best laid plans listeners who
use this and love it. Kind of combines. It looks
like a planner, but it's on the screen. You can
even buy stickers for it. You can have it in
any aesthetics that you would like, sink in various places,
(30:01):
so that is always fun to check out. And then
some planner brands sell PDF versions of their planners which
you can then use on an iPad with an Apple
like good Notes, and then write directly in them with
an Apple pencil or type stuff in Passion planner comes
to mind, but really a bunch of them are selling
digital versions now. And then there's also the option of
di y ing it. My friend Kay is a wizard
(30:21):
with her Google sheets. She like kind of has almost
a little daily planner column for every single day in
Google Sheets that she does a week at a time,
which is super cool. And we know Laura's tracked her
time in an Excel spreadsheet for many, many years. It's
not a planner, but it is a form of memory keeping,
so don't forget about your digital options.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
It's retrospective planning what actually happened versus what was planned
usually pretty similar, but In.
Speaker 4 (30:46):
The planner world, they call it memory keeping.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
Memory keeping.
Speaker 4 (30:49):
Okay, got it?
Speaker 3 (30:51):
Got it?
Speaker 1 (30:51):
Awesome.
Speaker 2 (30:53):
Well that's giving you a lot of food for thought.
So we also welcome questions about this. If you you know,
have a specific planner, need something you're looking for, If
you have a brand you want to recommend, please reach
out to us.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
You can always reach me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
And Sarah also has her podcast bestlid Plans, so be
sure to check that out. So our question today is
about sneaky teen costs.
Speaker 4 (31:22):
So this listener writes.
Speaker 2 (31:23):
In that I thought the baby years were expensive, but
I always hear parents of teens limit the costs associated
with older kids. And this listener is guessing at the
price of college or car being the most common items mentioned.
What else have you found to be expensive? Do you
wish you would save differently when your kids were young,
or since you both seem like savers, do you have
any advice for us spenders?
Speaker 3 (31:45):
So, Sarah, I mean I do save consciously. I am
not a natural saveror so just want to dispel that myth.
Anyone who's known me for a long time is like, yeah,
I wouldn't say, I spend thoughtlessly at all, but I
have to really make a concerted effort to save, which
I do because I think long term. But I also
(32:09):
enjoy spending money on things that feel worthwhile. I guess,
so I would say, I mean, for us, we have
made the choice to go private school, and but has
dwarfed everything else that is very expensive. It is a choice,
it's a complex choice, it's a choice not everybody loves,
but for us it makes the best sense. And so
(32:31):
for us that's the biggest cost by far. Nothing else
comes close with three kids. The runners up, I would
say are camps and summer experiences, particularly if you're going
to do sleepway camp, like the one year we did
a traditional sleep away camp that was a huge line
item in our budget.
Speaker 4 (32:48):
Other camps less so.
Speaker 3 (32:49):
But I mean, teens are going to be more likely
to want to do like more complex things or some
kind of academic program, and those can be very expensive.
Sports can be very you know what, really, I'll say, like,
we have one person in gymnastics, and that is pretty pricey.
Travel soccer has a lot of time commitment, but at
the current level is not super super expensive. Some families,
(33:12):
not us, pay for private training. I'm sure that adds
up very very quickly. And then music. I mean, if again,
if you're doing a lot of private lessons, different groups,
things like that can be expensive. Tutoring or other types
of like help or specialists can be expensive. And then
if you don't need childcare, it doesn't mean you're never
gonna need some kind of like driving help or logistical help,
(33:35):
so that that can be costly. And then finally, kids
can ask for expensive things. We tend to be just like,
well no, I mean, we say no more than we
say yes. Our kids are probably inherited the desire to
my stuff, but we have to teach them that they
can't have everything because they actually can't because at this
point they're asking for things that if we said yes
(33:58):
every single time, would be responsible of all of us.
So that doesn't tend to be a huge category for us,
but it takes effort to constrain it to a reasonable level.
I will say having uniforms helps a lot, because you're
just not going to need nine million outfits when you
have to wear a polo and joggers every day to school.
Speaker 4 (34:23):
Very true, very true.
Speaker 2 (34:25):
Yeah, I mean we I mean, my kids go to
public school, so we don't have that expense. We obviously
Henry's in a private preschool, but that will he'll be
in a public kindergarten next year, so that's actually quite limited,
which is great. However, I would say it's not so
much the stuff because my kids have not been particularly
(34:46):
acquisitive on the stuff level. I mean, my oldest son
is driving a thirteen year old car that was my car,
and then I was supposed to buy a new car
and I haven't gotten my head around doing that yet,
sort of using it when it's available, using the van
when that's available, and kind of just making do at
(35:08):
the moment. But it's the experiences and that can add
up quickly and sometimes comes more out of the blue,
and I would never want to have to say no
on one of those things. Like as an example, Sam
last year he qualified for the National Technology Student Alliance competition,
(35:36):
so that was you know, his school sent a team,
but it's you know, five days in Orlandos, so they
had to pay for you know, the flights down and
the hotels and the costs of that. And as we
knew that was coming up, and we're like, okay, we're
paying for that, and then as you know, right as
that hit, his robotics team got to go to the
World's competition, which was sort of out of the blue.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
We did not see that one coming. But that's great.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
And so all of a sudden, you know, we're paying
for a trip to Dallas with the airfare and the
hotels and all that, like at pretty much the exact
same time. And I was like, I am so grateful
that just dropping three thousand, four thousand dollars for the
two of these trips like in a week, like it
didn't make a problem, which is why it helps to
(36:27):
think that you will need to do stuff like that, right,
And that's you know, it's important for me to kids
be able to do like the private music lessons. But
at this point, I have three children in private music lessons,
and I will have four within a couple months, and
I will have five within a year. So it's you know,
and they're all going to be different teachers, like there's
no they're all different things, like they're all different instruments
(36:51):
or whatever, and it's just you know, you want to
be able to give them those opportunities. Or when Jasper
and Sam went to academic camps over the summer. Those
are pretty pricey, Like you're basically paying college level tuition
over a couple weeks, and you want to be able
to do that. So anyway, what all this is saying
(37:13):
is that I feel like, I mean, obviously the normal
thing is, yes, money matters, Like an average normal thought
is that money does matter. But I feel like some
of us and some people maybe grew up with a
thought that, oh no, it's not that important, you know,
and especially like where this often comes is is like
mom doesn't need to take her career seriously because that
(37:35):
money doesn't matter. It's more important that you have the
marginal extra bit of time. And I would say that
one of the things that has come out of what
I have studied is that it's not as much extra
time as you think. And you are going to probably
want to have some of those resources to be able
to give your kids the experiences that will help them
(37:59):
develop them talents over time.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
So just something to think about.
Speaker 4 (38:05):
And I know we're going to get pushed back.
Speaker 3 (38:07):
I know this is going to be a but I
didn't have any of those things and I turned out fine,
which is true. I mean I didn't have some of
these things either, am I still mad about not going
to Italy in tenth grade. Possibly, but you know what,
I did live to tell the tale and it all
worked out. And maybe that like taught me a lesson
that if I had wanted to go to Italy, I
should have babysat more or something like that.
Speaker 4 (38:28):
I don't know. I guess it's true.
Speaker 3 (38:30):
Like I guess my point is, like, not giving your
kids everything they want is not going to break them.
And so neither of us are saying that, like the
answers that you have to do all these things, these
are all optional and many many people can thrive and
not do them. But to delude yourself to thinking that
you're not going to want to do some of these
things and that they're not expensive, it's better to maybe
(38:53):
be aware that these are possibilities that you would want
to be prepared for should your kids be interested, and
it's somewhat likely that that may happen.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
Yeah, And I think that there's a big difference between saying, well,
I don't need to buy my kids designer jeans. Absolutely
you don't and I don't, But I do want to
pay for top level voice lessons, So that is a
different thing. Entirely right totally, so you can wear jeans
from Target and have the best voice teacher in town. Anyway,
all right, verdy quick, Sarah love of the week. I
(39:25):
guess you had your planners. It's gonna be hob and.
Speaker 3 (39:27):
E g sure my ride er di hope on each
cousin going strong for twenty twenty four.
Speaker 4 (39:33):
And I guess I'll share that I.
Speaker 3 (39:34):
Got the floral covered version next year that actually has
its own built in cover, so it's a little bit
more streamline. It's called the Han h O n in
the Liberty floral fabric print and it's super pretty and
I love it awesome.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
Yeah, I'll go with my weekly at a Glance calendar.
I mean, this is you know, I've literally bought a
new one of these every year for a decade plus
and it's I'm not sure what the market is.
Speaker 1 (39:58):
The market is like me. I don't think there's like
anyone else using them.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
But because who uses a paper small calendar that they
don't then use as a planner or anything, I don't know,
but for me it works. I don't want to have
a digital calendar, So there you go. All right, Well
this has been best of both Worlds. We have been
talking all things planners today. Hopefully people got some great
ideas coming out of that. We will be back next
week with more and making work and life fit together.
Speaker 4 (40:25):
Thanks for listening.
Speaker 3 (40:26):
You can find me Sarah at the shoebox dot com
or at the Underscore Shoebox on Instagram, and you can.
Speaker 4 (40:33):
Find me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. This has
been the best of both Worlds podcasts.
Speaker 2 (40:40):
Please join us next time for more on making work
and life work together.
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