July 17, 2025 • 32 mins
A return trip to Colorado Springs uncovers a new betrayal. A woman who had an affair with Joel shares her experience. Karoline and her kids redefine life as a family of three.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey guys. Before we dive into the episode, we have
exciting news. Betrayal is coming to substack, which is an
online community. We're calling our substack Beyond Betrayal, a place
where we dive deeper into the stories you hear on
this show. Please consider joining our community to gain access
to exclusive content, engage with me and subjects, as well
(00:23):
as connect with others who have experienced betrayal. Just head
to Betrayal dot substack that's sub stack, or just go
to substack dot com, search beyond Betrayal and hit subscribe.
I want to go back to where we started with
(00:44):
the current family, back to early in the series, when
we learned that Caroline's husband Joel, had been caught having
sex in his police car. The day Joel was put
on disciplinary leave pending termination. He could no longer keep
his secret life a secret, so he finally came clean,
(01:05):
and after an emotional family meeting, Joel awkwardly pulled at
his wedding ring, trying to pry it off his hand.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
He never removed his wedding ring, he always kept an on,
so he struggled for a long time, but finally gets
his ring off. Inside of it, I had engraved forever
and ever, and Joel sets it down on the fireplace
and just walked out the door.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
It was April eleventh of twenty twenty two, the day
the world no longer made sense to Caroline. She was
at home with Nicole, just reeling and she needed her people.
One of those people was a woman. We're going to
call Suzanne. We've disguised her voice to protect her privacy.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
I remember exactly where we were. There was about seven
or eight of us in the car going up to
the Journey concert up in Denver. A friend was the
one who received the phone call, and I was sitting
right behind her, and her reaction was, oh my god,
is he okay?
Speaker 1 (02:09):
And I'm like, oh my god. Suzanne's first fear was
that Joel had been injured in the line of duty.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
And then this other person told me that Joel was
having an affair and that Caroline said that her life
is about to fall apart.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
I said, you know, let's go home.
Speaker 3 (02:27):
So we literally pulled off the highway and pulled into
US seven eleven.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
They jumped out of that car and got her ride
to Caroline's house. There were no words that could make
it better, so Suzanne didn't try. She just listened and
cried with Caroline.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
And we literally must have sat at the table with
you know, wine and food from about seven o'clock till
about eleven thirty that night. While we're there, Caroline said
that Joel was having an affair, was.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Having an affair with multiple people. Suzanne's chest tightened as she
watched Caroline unravel. Her heart was broken for her friend.
That night would be the first of many they'd spend
together at Caroline's kitchen table. What Suzanne could have never
imagined was that she would soon need Caroline to return
(03:20):
the favor. I'm Andrea Gunning and this is Betrayal, Season four,
Episode nine, three Little Birds. Over the past several episodes,
(03:46):
we've pulled back the curtain on Caroline's family and the
unraveling of her marriage to Joel Kern. Through conversations with relatives,
close friends, and former officers from the Colorado Springs Police Department,
we've worked a peace together a complex and often painful story.
(04:07):
Before we wrapped up this season, we decided to make
another trip out to Colorado Springs. It looked a lot
different on our last visit. The streets were blanketed in snow,
and we carefully navigated the mountain town, taking in its
winter beauty. This time, spring was in the air, and
along with the change of seasons, there were changes in
(04:28):
the lives of Caroline and her friends.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
I'm like, this just must be for you, because this
is not.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
The first time we visited Colorado Springs to meet Caroline.
We were warmly welcomed into her Sunday supper club at home,
surrounded by her close friends. We shared a meal, some wine,
and plenty of laughter, and gave us a glimpse into
her support system, the people who had stood by her
through the discovery of Joel's betrayal. Suzanne was often at
(04:59):
these dinners, but not that night. She was working training
for a new job. Her husband was there, though, and
spoke about his wife with great affection. When we returned recently,
we joined Caroline and Suzanne on a walk. It was
a windy one around a nearby lake on a typical
Colorado day. It was sunny with a view of Pike's Peak,
(05:23):
but that quickly changed to Cloud's rolling in around us.
Caroline recalled the unconditional support she had received from Suzanne
and her husband in her time of need.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
He and Suzanne had been at my house when my
life blew up.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Witnessing Caroline's distress, Suzanne and her husband held each other
a little closer. Seeing firsthand how quickly a relationship can
be decimated, has an unsettling effect.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
They were the people who said, uh, you got to
get up so that we can go to Nicole's lacross game.
We're going to sit with you in the stands. We're
going to be next to Hey, this awards thing's going
on tonight. You don't need to go to that alone.
We're going to go with you.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
They were those friends. They showed up and they were
one of those couples who truly enjoyed life together, running
marathon side by side, always up for an adventure. They
had met years earlier in another part of the country
and moved to Colorado Springs. But something beside the weather
had shifted since we were last in Colorado, something in
(06:33):
Suzanne's marriage. A few months ago, Caroline was away visiting
her daughter Nicole at college when she received a surprising
text from Suzanne. The message said.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
Okay, I just want to let you know I appreciate
you and I value what you have gone through. I've
been thinking about you a lot, and I said, I
really appreciate that. And then I got another text saying, Hey,
when you get home, let's sit down and chat.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
The words of support weren't unusual, but it wasn't like
Suzanne to wait to chat in person. Normally, she'd just call.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
Knowing what she had been through and knowing what she
was going through, I did not want to Ruin a weekend.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
While Caroline was away, Suzanne stumbled upon something in her
own home that changed her entire life. Eighteen years into
their marriage, Suzanne discovered a series of emails that crossed
the line. Messages her husband had been exchanging with women
online and he had a fetish. She knew nothing about.
(07:37):
That's all we can say legally about it. As she
kept reading, it became clear this had been going on
for a long time.
Speaker 3 (07:48):
After seeing the emails that I had seen, and I
just needed to run.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
When Caroline returned home, Suzanne shared the whole story.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
The biggest hurt for me is that he would do
this and not be open enough in our marriage after
all that we've gone through. But that after hearing Caroline's
story and going through everything for the last couple of years.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
You didn't think about.
Speaker 3 (08:14):
Sitting me down and saying, I got to tell you
something like you don't think like what kind of secret
keeping is.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
That Many women would have walked away if their husband
confessed to this behavior. Suzanne was the type of person
that would have been open to rebuilding if he had
told her the truth, and if he was committed to
addressing the behavior.
Speaker 3 (08:37):
And then in the end to find out that this
biggest secret that you had, you've kept for so many years.
Instead of getting help, he was.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
Someone who was helping and supporting Caroline, knowing full well
the entire time that he was engaging in betrayal himself.
Caroline was shaken, stunned. Really, Suzanne's husband was part of
her inner circle.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
He was an ally. He saw the pain the kids
and I went through like he witnessed the tears first hand.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
Suzanne was devastated. She had always believed her husband was
the most loyal man in the world. He was her person,
so she told him to leave. They separated, and Suzanne
was left feeling lonely, distraught, and trying to make sense
of the life she thought she knew. Caroline was furious.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
My anger toward him. I couldn't even hide it. When
she disclosed to me what happened. I had just this
utmost hurt for her because of knowing what your chapter
of life has been and how long you've been with someone,
and then to think now I have to start over
and figure life out by myself, Like how do you
(09:59):
recover from that? And knowing the array of emotions that
were about ready to come was so heartbreaking to watch.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
Caroline had first hand knowledge of what lay ahead. She
knew the grief that accompanies betrayal and how it shakes
you to your core. It doesn't just break your heart,
it takes a toll on your whole body.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
I've called her a couple of times, especially where I'm
like I just can't breathe.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
She's like, Okay, stop, what happened?
Speaker 3 (10:30):
Nothing happened.
Speaker 4 (10:31):
I just can't breathe.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
I've had panic attacks, anxiety attacks, emotional attacks.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
The weight of the separation really hit Suzanne after a
trip to visit her family.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
Coming home from visiting family is another rough day, ironically,
because you come back to a life that is not
what you used to come back to. I don't have
that confidant and that person at my.
Speaker 4 (10:55):
House to lean on.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
For Caroline, that's a familiar feeling. It's one she remembers
well from those first days of being an empty nester.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Shortly after it was just me Nicole had left for
school and it was just me lost in silence at
the house.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
So instead of being alone, Caroline would spend time with
people like Suzanne, friends who felt like family. Suzanne is
still in those early days.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
I'm new at it right now, and I don't have
three years in I'm starting to think of it like
a death. You know, it never goes away. You compartmentalize,
it's always going to be part of who you are
now and it makes you who you are in the future.
But I don't think it ever goes away.
Speaker 1 (11:44):
I wondered how long it takes for this trauma and
loss to no longer be the first thing you remember
when you open your eyes in the morning.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
I actually just had a conversation with Nicole about this today.
She her brother, and myself. We've confessed to each other
that a day does not start without remembering what he did.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
Suzanne shares the same experience.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
I can have a good time going out with friends
and doing things, and then as soon as I turn
the corner to my house. Bam, it all hits me again.
I wake up in the morning and I realize that
my house is empty.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
Having a close friend who knows that feeling.
Speaker 3 (12:33):
I wouldn't trade her for anybody in the world right now,
because she does get it and she can answer those questions.
The fact that you can have a friend that has
these conversations with you is far and few between.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
I would never ever, ever, ever wish this on anyone ever.
I would never want anyone to have the shock in
awe and have to sit and relive and then rethink
your entire life and question and if your family and
marriage was a fraud. I never want anyone to ever
experience that ever. And I think there's this piece of
(13:09):
me that feels attached to Susanna.
Speaker 4 (13:12):
As a result of this, I've learned a lot from her.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
She has taught me to be more open and honest
in my feelings about stuff. We're still being incredibly brutally honest,
where other times in friendships you don't have that opportunity
to be.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
I love you, I love you too.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
As we were getting closer to wrapping up Caroline's story,
I asked her to join me to talk about what
it has been like making this podcast. We've also seen
a lot of listener feedback this season and received emails
from people associated with the CSPD, and some of it
is pretty shocking. Here are some of our conversation. Caroline.
(14:24):
I am so grateful that you shared your story with
us this season, and I'm curious about your experience. Would
you say it's been therapeutic.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
For you doing this podcast was very helpful. I mean
it wasn't just helpful to be able to finally say
my truth, finally tell my side, but I will also
tell you what was something that was also very helpful
and very therapeutic and very cathartic. What a lot of
people don't know about this podcast is everything I say
(14:56):
is vetted. There is nothing thing that I can recount
or big moments that is not fact checked, is not
looked through by or coroborated by two, three, four other parties.
Being able to have someone validate that this occurred it
(15:16):
was extremely important.
Speaker 1 (15:18):
Yeah, I imagine that can be really powerful because it's
validating your lived experience.
Speaker 2 (15:25):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
I want to move on to some comments from listeners,
and one thing I can say is people were really
invested in your story? Are you down to hear some
of them? I'd love to, Okay. The first one I'm
going to share is from a former CSPD officer. He writes,
do your Betrayal podcast host and team. I've been listening
(15:47):
to Betrayal season four and I feel the need to
share how deeply the story affected me. I was one
class behind Joel Kern. Hearing what he did the multiple affairs,
lying to internal affairs and his family was shocking. What
devastated me even more was hearing how the department supported him. Meanwhile,
(16:07):
I served with honor for nearly fifteen years. I continuously
put my life on the line for this city. I
suffered a mental breakdown on the job and was later
diagnosed with PTSD and a traumatic brain injury, both directly
tied to my service. I never disgraced the badge. All
I did was ask for help, and I was denied
(16:29):
again and again. The department psychologist said he didn't actually
provide mental health care. I lost my job, I lost
my identity. My family and I had built our entire
life around my police career. Suddenly it was gone. I
spiraled into nearly a decade of depression. I drank heavily.
I was suicidal. At first, listening to this podcast made
(16:53):
me sick. Then I felt ashamed, ashamed that I had
ever worn the same badge. But as I kept listening,
became angry because I remember the culture and unethical behavior
among command staff. My betrayal didn't come from a spouse.
It came from the department. I loved the one I
believed would stand behind me the way I stood behind
(17:14):
the public. It didn't thank you for telling hard stories.
They matter. They remind the world that some of us
were thrown away, not because we failed, but because we
were no longer convenient. I won't share the name of
the email, but I think I think you know this individual.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
I know who this person is and what their role
was in the department, and their role was what you
think of a police officer doing. I mean, you think
of this person as engaging in heroic acts in very
dangerous situations and circumstances. And knowing what this person did
(17:52):
and what his assignment was, this email fills me with
so much emotion. It just makes me feel nauseated to
know that someone like him was cast aside and not
provided the assistance and help that truly could have saved
his career, truly could have saved him as an individual.
(18:15):
It's just incredibly disheartening to me.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
It is disheartening. I mean, I guess all I can
say is I'm grateful for this person's service and grateful
that they felt safe enough to write in and share
their story with us. And I hope this person feels
hurt and appreciated. He's very much appreciated. Okay, This next
email is interesting because it's not just from a different state,
(18:40):
it's a different country. She writes, thank you for putting
season four out. I was married to a former police
officer in Calgary who is almost the same person as
Joel Kern. The only difference is that the police service
swept it all under the rug. My ex was able
to resign in twenty twenty one while under five investigations.
(19:00):
Since he chose to resign before he was fired, he
has no record and can become a police officer anywhere
in Canada. Unfortunately, these psychopaths get away with their crimes.
Thank you for making these things known. It is wild
that someone in Canada has such a similar experience to you.
(19:23):
Is that surprising to you?
Speaker 2 (19:26):
I don't think that my story is necessarily an anomaly
in the sense that I was married to a police officer.
I knew what I was getting when I was married
to a cop. I knew that he would have to
work nights. I knew that there would be weird hours.
I knew there would be times he would not be
able to be home for holidays or special events. These
are things that I accepted. What I did not sign
up for, and I did not accept, was for him
(19:48):
to deface his badge and was for him to defy
our marital vows. I did not sign up for that, right.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
You didn't, And I think it's safe to say that
in your case, and I would argue in the case
of the person that wrote in that all the allowances
you guys made to help accommodate their job and their
work schedules were exploited.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
Yes, absolutely, one hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (20:17):
Okay, we're going to talk about one more email, and
it was one that we recently received, and it was
a shock to our team when we received it. We
said it to you, you've had some time to digest it.
I mean I should say it's a shock, but not
a complete surprise, because you know, having heard the number
of people Joel was having affairs with. It's tough, But
(20:41):
to your point earlier about validation, I think it's important
for us to discuss it. Okay, okay, here we go
to the host of Betrayal podcast. I don't know if
my conscience will ever be clean, but writing you is
a first step. I am one of Joel Kern's affairs.
Was my lieutenant, and he held power. He also made
(21:03):
me believe we were in a relationship and had a future.
I remember seeing Caroline and talked to her a few times.
She'd show up to the substation with dinner for him
or cake and ice cream for everyone. For special occasions.
She told our shift that everyone was welcome to eat
Thanksgiving dinner at their home if we had nowhere to go.
One year, she made Christmas dinner for the entire shift
(21:25):
and set up a photo booth. I guess that's why
it was flattering. When Joel started complimenting me. He started
flirting with me and sending messages. When I was out,
he asked what I looked like in regular clothes. Then
he asked me to meet him for dinner on shift.
Things started crossing the line and getting romantic. I told
him that I couldn't believe he wanted someone like me
(21:47):
when he had a pretty wife and kids. He told
me that Caroline was only good to look at and
said that she was sick with arthritis and didn't pay
attention to him. Joel said she couldn't do anything or
go anywhere. He said she was always in bed and
he couldn't divorce her since she was so sick. I
believed him. We had sex at my house after work
(22:08):
and a few times before. I felt guilty when we
had sex in his office because of all the pictures
of his wife and kids around. He told me the
pictures were for show. I started to realize I wasn't
the only one he was sleeping with. I was embarrassed
and ashamed. A friend showed his Facebook page. I was
so mad when I saw pictures of Joel and Caroline
(22:30):
after she ran a marathon. I confronted him about her
being sick. How did she run a marathon if she
was so sick. He laughed at me and told me
I didn't know what I was talking about. I know
I'm not the only affair he had at CSPD, but
every day I wish I wasn't one of the people
on his roster. If Caroline gets these emails, then I
want her to know that I'm very sorry and hope
(22:51):
she can move forward. This email is a great example
of you know, what we explored in this season is
you know, as you're trying to move forward and just
live your life, you know, you take three steps and
then bam, new information, a new affair you didn't see coming,
(23:12):
and it's just another blow. It's just another hit.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
I'm desensitized to hearing about affairs like that. Part doesn't
hit my soul hearing this email. The part that just
as a gut punch to me is hearing the manipulation
tactics and the lies used to garner his sexual affairs.
(23:40):
Very few people know that I have rheumatoid arthritis. Very
few people know that about me. It is not something
that debilitates me and puts me bedridden. But for him
to have used that and told someone that to manipulate
them to have sex with him, it just sickens me.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
It honestly just feels like nothing was off limits in
his pursuit. I mean, it's it's fascinating and horrifying how
much Joel was manipulating everyone in his orbit.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
So a new friend from my women's group said something
to me that had just really stuck with me. She said,
it's like we were living in the Truman Show. Joel
was the director and the rest of us were just
cast members, just going along with the script without even
knowing it. There was the life that he lived with us,
or the one you know that he pretended to live
(24:37):
with us, and then there was this version he showed
to people at work. None of it was real, all
of it was a performance.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
I think this is a good time to mention. We
did reach out to Joel to give him the opportunity
to share on the podcast, but he did decline our
request for an interview. However, he did send us a
written statement, and I'm going to read that now. Thank
you for reaching out. I understand the nature of the
series and appreciate the opportunity to respond. However, I've decided
(25:12):
not to participate in the podcast. I do want to
acknowledge that I've made mistakes and that others have their
own stories to tell. While I will not be adding
to the conversation publicly, I continue to reflect and work
on becoming a better version of myself. I ask that
this message be taken as my only comment. Sincerely, Joel,
(25:36):
I think it's fair to say that we're probably never
going to get to the bottom of why Joel did
what he did, why he did this to your family,
why he did this to you.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
But here's what I do know.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
There are so many people who've been betrayed by a partner,
and it's isolating, and it's deeply lonely. In hearing your story,
your honesty, your strength, your vulnerability, it might be the
moment someone else realizes that they're not alone.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
Thank you for giving me the platform to do it.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
After months getting to know Caroline and her world, we
had one more trip that we wanted to take to
watch her son run the Boston Marathon. It wasn't his
first time running, but this was the first time Caroline
and Nicole would get to see him cross the finish line.
We were excited to go along. Before race day, we
all sat down at dinner together. Nicole was grateful not
(26:52):
just to have the whole family in one place, but
to finally share this experience and to talk together for
the podcast. By the way, you'll hear the sounds of
the restaurant in the background. This is our first time
talking all three of us. Now that I had them
all at one table, I wanted to ask them about
something I noticed. Caroline has lots of images of birds
(27:13):
around in her home and even in a tattoo. I
asked the family about it, and no, I would probably
be the best for that.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
So life blows up and we would check in with
each other every day and we started talking about, you know,
just different mantras and how we kept going. And one
day my son said, I keep hearing the Bob Marley
(27:43):
song and it just keeps chanting like everything's going to
be all right. I actually thought to myself, how fitting that.
Obviously the chorus is Everything's going to be all right.
But the title of the song is three Little birds.
And so we were a family of four, but we
really dwindled down to three and it just became three
(28:05):
little birds. And after that our mantra has been three
little birds, or we sign everything off on to each
other TL it just has become our thing.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
The next morning, we were off to the Boston Marathon.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
His freshman year, he had the goal of doing this
and it was a big deal for him to train
and cross the finish line, and he was scheduled to
do this in April of twenty twenty two, and so
just a week before that was our designated D day
when Joel blew up our lives and we didn't know
(28:45):
if he would follow through with it, and he said
that it was a big deal for him to do it,
that training and being a part of something bigger was
just kind of keeping him on a path to heal
for himself since he was so far away, and to
keep his mind off of certain things. And so he
did it.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
The first time he ran the marathon, Jewel's betrayal was
painfully fresh.
Speaker 2 (29:10):
In the day that he did the race, Jewel called
in the middle of the conversation. We were sitting in
a car, and Nicole actually had to say, you do
know that today is a bigger day than you. My
brother's doing this marathon and you completely forgot about it.
There's so much more that's bigger than you.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
Well, this is the first year that we have actually
gotten Intisim across the finish line.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
It's just been a slow just to slow burn, a
slow achievement to try to keep going. And if I
were to tell you that I think the kids and
I will ever cross like a finish line from the
trauma that was caused. I just don't think that's realistic.
I think we can keep going, and I think we
can continue to figure out our way through it. But
(30:04):
I'm not sure that we'll really truly ever understand no
reasons why or.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Really get over anything.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
But we will get through it.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
But today was a good day. Standing on the streets
of Boston near the finish line, the sky was clear,
and we cheered runners as they crossed. I was holding
a sign that said free beer at finish line, and
we waited with anthicipation for Caroline soun.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
A beer sounds been after line. The three of us
have been through something that no three other people will
ever have gone exactly through. And so to be able
to say that we're still here, still standing, still achieving,
(30:56):
and still together, I think that's incredible.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
Pure joy, pure love. Maybe every little thing is imperfect,
but these three little birds are doing all right, just
like the song said.
Speaker 2 (31:13):
That might be my baby boy.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
Thank you for listening to Betrayal season four. If you
would like to reach out to the Betrayal team, email
us at Betrayal pod at gmail dot com. That's Betrayal
Pod at gmail dot com. Also, please be sure to
follow us on Instagram at Betrayal Pod and me Andrea H.
Gunning for all Betrayal content, news and updates. One way
(31:49):
to support the series is by subscribing to our show
on Apple Podcasts. Please rate and review Betrayal five star
reviews help us know you appreciate what we do. Betrayal
is a production of Glass Podcasts, a division of Glass
Entertainment Group, in partnership with iHeart Podcasts. The show is
executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Fason. Betrayal is
(32:11):
hosted and produced by me Andrea Gunning, written and produced
by Carrie Hartman, also produced by Ben Fetterman. Our associate
producers are Caitlin Golden and Kristin Melcurie. Our iHeart team
is Ali Perry and Jessica Crincheck. Story editing by Monique Leboard,
audio editing by mattel Vecchio and Tanner Robbins and mixed
(32:31):
by mattal Vecchio and special thanks to Caroline and her family.
Betrayal's theme is composed by Oliver Baines. Music library provided
by my Music and for more podcasts from iHeart visit
the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hey guys. Before we dive into the episode, we have
exciting news. Betrayal is coming to substack, which is an
online community. We're calling our substack Beyond Betrayal, a place
where we dive deeper into the stories you hear on
this show. Please consider joining our community to gain access
to exclusive content, engage with me and subjects, as well
(00:23):
as connect with others who have experienced betrayal. Just head
to Betrayal dot substack that's sub stack, or just go
to substack dot com, search beyond Betrayal and hit subscribe.
I want to go back to where we started with
(00:44):
the current family, back to early in the series, when
we learned that Caroline's husband Joel, had been caught having
sex in his police car. The day Joel was put
on disciplinary leave pending termination. He could no longer keep
his secret life a secret, so he finally came clean,
(01:05):
and after an emotional family meeting, Joel awkwardly pulled at
his wedding ring, trying to pry it off his hand.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
He never removed his wedding ring, he always kept an on,
so he struggled for a long time, but finally gets
his ring off. Inside of it, I had engraved forever
and ever, and Joel sets it down on the fireplace
and just walked out the door.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
It was April eleventh of twenty twenty two, the day
the world no longer made sense to Caroline. She was
at home with Nicole, just reeling and she needed her people.
One of those people was a woman. We're going to
call Suzanne. We've disguised her voice to protect her privacy.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
I remember exactly where we were. There was about seven
or eight of us in the car going up to
the Journey concert up in Denver. A friend was the
one who received the phone call, and I was sitting
right behind her, and her reaction was, oh my god,
is he okay?
Speaker 1 (02:09):
And I'm like, oh my god. Suzanne's first fear was
that Joel had been injured in the line of duty.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
And then this other person told me that Joel was
having an affair and that Caroline said that her life
is about to fall apart.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
I said, you know, let's go home.
Speaker 3 (02:27):
So we literally pulled off the highway and pulled into
US seven eleven.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
They jumped out of that car and got her ride
to Caroline's house. There were no words that could make
it better, so Suzanne didn't try. She just listened and
cried with Caroline.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
And we literally must have sat at the table with
you know, wine and food from about seven o'clock till
about eleven thirty that night. While we're there, Caroline said
that Joel was having an affair, was.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Having an affair with multiple people. Suzanne's chest tightened as she
watched Caroline unravel. Her heart was broken for her friend.
That night would be the first of many they'd spend
together at Caroline's kitchen table. What Suzanne could have never
imagined was that she would soon need Caroline to return
(03:20):
the favor. I'm Andrea Gunning and this is Betrayal, Season four,
Episode nine, three Little Birds. Over the past several episodes,
(03:46):
we've pulled back the curtain on Caroline's family and the
unraveling of her marriage to Joel Kern. Through conversations with relatives,
close friends, and former officers from the Colorado Springs Police Department,
we've worked a peace together a complex and often painful story.
(04:07):
Before we wrapped up this season, we decided to make
another trip out to Colorado Springs. It looked a lot
different on our last visit. The streets were blanketed in snow,
and we carefully navigated the mountain town, taking in its
winter beauty. This time, spring was in the air, and
along with the change of seasons, there were changes in
(04:28):
the lives of Caroline and her friends.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
I'm like, this just must be for you, because this
is not.
Speaker 1 (04:37):
The first time we visited Colorado Springs to meet Caroline.
We were warmly welcomed into her Sunday supper club at home,
surrounded by her close friends. We shared a meal, some wine,
and plenty of laughter, and gave us a glimpse into
her support system, the people who had stood by her
through the discovery of Joel's betrayal. Suzanne was often at
(04:59):
these dinners, but not that night. She was working training
for a new job. Her husband was there, though, and
spoke about his wife with great affection. When we returned recently,
we joined Caroline and Suzanne on a walk. It was
a windy one around a nearby lake on a typical
Colorado day. It was sunny with a view of Pike's Peak,
(05:23):
but that quickly changed to Cloud's rolling in around us.
Caroline recalled the unconditional support she had received from Suzanne
and her husband in her time of need.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
He and Suzanne had been at my house when my
life blew up.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Witnessing Caroline's distress, Suzanne and her husband held each other
a little closer. Seeing firsthand how quickly a relationship can
be decimated, has an unsettling effect.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
They were the people who said, uh, you got to
get up so that we can go to Nicole's lacross game.
We're going to sit with you in the stands. We're
going to be next to Hey, this awards thing's going
on tonight. You don't need to go to that alone.
We're going to go with you.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
They were those friends. They showed up and they were
one of those couples who truly enjoyed life together, running
marathon side by side, always up for an adventure. They
had met years earlier in another part of the country
and moved to Colorado Springs. But something beside the weather
had shifted since we were last in Colorado, something in
(06:33):
Suzanne's marriage. A few months ago, Caroline was away visiting
her daughter Nicole at college when she received a surprising
text from Suzanne. The message said.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
Okay, I just want to let you know I appreciate
you and I value what you have gone through. I've
been thinking about you a lot, and I said, I
really appreciate that. And then I got another text saying, Hey,
when you get home, let's sit down and chat.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
The words of support weren't unusual, but it wasn't like
Suzanne to wait to chat in person. Normally, she'd just call.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
Knowing what she had been through and knowing what she
was going through, I did not want to Ruin a weekend.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
While Caroline was away, Suzanne stumbled upon something in her
own home that changed her entire life. Eighteen years into
their marriage, Suzanne discovered a series of emails that crossed
the line. Messages her husband had been exchanging with women
online and he had a fetish. She knew nothing about.
(07:37):
That's all we can say legally about it. As she
kept reading, it became clear this had been going on
for a long time.
Speaker 3 (07:48):
After seeing the emails that I had seen, and I
just needed to run.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
When Caroline returned home, Suzanne shared the whole story.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
The biggest hurt for me is that he would do
this and not be open enough in our marriage after
all that we've gone through. But that after hearing Caroline's
story and going through everything for the last couple of years.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
You didn't think about.
Speaker 3 (08:14):
Sitting me down and saying, I got to tell you
something like you don't think like what kind of secret
keeping is.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
That Many women would have walked away if their husband
confessed to this behavior. Suzanne was the type of person
that would have been open to rebuilding if he had
told her the truth, and if he was committed to
addressing the behavior.
Speaker 3 (08:37):
And then in the end to find out that this
biggest secret that you had, you've kept for so many years.
Instead of getting help, he was.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
Someone who was helping and supporting Caroline, knowing full well
the entire time that he was engaging in betrayal himself.
Caroline was shaken, stunned. Really, Suzanne's husband was part of
her inner circle.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
He was an ally. He saw the pain the kids
and I went through like he witnessed the tears first hand.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
Suzanne was devastated. She had always believed her husband was
the most loyal man in the world. He was her person,
so she told him to leave. They separated, and Suzanne
was left feeling lonely, distraught, and trying to make sense
of the life she thought she knew. Caroline was furious.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
My anger toward him. I couldn't even hide it. When
she disclosed to me what happened. I had just this
utmost hurt for her because of knowing what your chapter
of life has been and how long you've been with someone,
and then to think now I have to start over
and figure life out by myself, Like how do you
(09:59):
recover from that? And knowing the array of emotions that
were about ready to come was so heartbreaking to watch.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
Caroline had first hand knowledge of what lay ahead. She
knew the grief that accompanies betrayal and how it shakes
you to your core. It doesn't just break your heart,
it takes a toll on your whole body.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
I've called her a couple of times, especially where I'm
like I just can't breathe.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
She's like, Okay, stop, what happened?
Speaker 3 (10:30):
Nothing happened.
Speaker 4 (10:31):
I just can't breathe.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
I've had panic attacks, anxiety attacks, emotional attacks.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
The weight of the separation really hit Suzanne after a
trip to visit her family.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
Coming home from visiting family is another rough day, ironically,
because you come back to a life that is not
what you used to come back to. I don't have
that confidant and that person at my.
Speaker 4 (10:55):
House to lean on.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
For Caroline, that's a familiar feeling. It's one she remembers
well from those first days of being an empty nester.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Shortly after it was just me Nicole had left for
school and it was just me lost in silence at
the house.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
So instead of being alone, Caroline would spend time with
people like Suzanne, friends who felt like family. Suzanne is
still in those early days.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
I'm new at it right now, and I don't have
three years in I'm starting to think of it like
a death. You know, it never goes away. You compartmentalize,
it's always going to be part of who you are
now and it makes you who you are in the future.
But I don't think it ever goes away.
Speaker 1 (11:44):
I wondered how long it takes for this trauma and
loss to no longer be the first thing you remember
when you open your eyes in the morning.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
I actually just had a conversation with Nicole about this today.
She her brother, and myself. We've confessed to each other
that a day does not start without remembering what he did.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
Suzanne shares the same experience.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
I can have a good time going out with friends
and doing things, and then as soon as I turn
the corner to my house. Bam, it all hits me again.
I wake up in the morning and I realize that
my house is empty.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
Having a close friend who knows that feeling.
Speaker 3 (12:33):
I wouldn't trade her for anybody in the world right now,
because she does get it and she can answer those questions.
The fact that you can have a friend that has
these conversations with you is far and few between.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
I would never ever, ever, ever wish this on anyone ever.
I would never want anyone to have the shock in
awe and have to sit and relive and then rethink
your entire life and question and if your family and
marriage was a fraud. I never want anyone to ever
experience that ever. And I think there's this piece of
(13:09):
me that feels attached to Susanna.
Speaker 4 (13:12):
As a result of this, I've learned a lot from her.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
She has taught me to be more open and honest
in my feelings about stuff. We're still being incredibly brutally honest,
where other times in friendships you don't have that opportunity
to be.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
I love you, I love you too.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
As we were getting closer to wrapping up Caroline's story,
I asked her to join me to talk about what
it has been like making this podcast. We've also seen
a lot of listener feedback this season and received emails
from people associated with the CSPD, and some of it
is pretty shocking. Here are some of our conversation. Caroline.
(14:24):
I am so grateful that you shared your story with
us this season, and I'm curious about your experience. Would
you say it's been therapeutic.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
For you doing this podcast was very helpful. I mean
it wasn't just helpful to be able to finally say
my truth, finally tell my side, but I will also
tell you what was something that was also very helpful
and very therapeutic and very cathartic. What a lot of
people don't know about this podcast is everything I say
(14:56):
is vetted. There is nothing thing that I can recount
or big moments that is not fact checked, is not
looked through by or coroborated by two, three, four other parties.
Being able to have someone validate that this occurred it
(15:16):
was extremely important.
Speaker 1 (15:18):
Yeah, I imagine that can be really powerful because it's
validating your lived experience.
Speaker 2 (15:25):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
I want to move on to some comments from listeners,
and one thing I can say is people were really
invested in your story? Are you down to hear some
of them? I'd love to, Okay. The first one I'm
going to share is from a former CSPD officer. He writes,
do your Betrayal podcast host and team. I've been listening
(15:47):
to Betrayal season four and I feel the need to
share how deeply the story affected me. I was one
class behind Joel Kern. Hearing what he did the multiple affairs,
lying to internal affairs and his family was shocking. What
devastated me even more was hearing how the department supported him. Meanwhile,
(16:07):
I served with honor for nearly fifteen years. I continuously
put my life on the line for this city. I
suffered a mental breakdown on the job and was later
diagnosed with PTSD and a traumatic brain injury, both directly
tied to my service. I never disgraced the badge. All
I did was ask for help, and I was denied
(16:29):
again and again. The department psychologist said he didn't actually
provide mental health care. I lost my job, I lost
my identity. My family and I had built our entire
life around my police career. Suddenly it was gone. I
spiraled into nearly a decade of depression. I drank heavily.
I was suicidal. At first, listening to this podcast made
(16:53):
me sick. Then I felt ashamed, ashamed that I had
ever worn the same badge. But as I kept listening,
became angry because I remember the culture and unethical behavior
among command staff. My betrayal didn't come from a spouse.
It came from the department. I loved the one I
believed would stand behind me the way I stood behind
(17:14):
the public. It didn't thank you for telling hard stories.
They matter. They remind the world that some of us
were thrown away, not because we failed, but because we
were no longer convenient. I won't share the name of
the email, but I think I think you know this individual.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
I know who this person is and what their role
was in the department, and their role was what you
think of a police officer doing. I mean, you think
of this person as engaging in heroic acts in very
dangerous situations and circumstances. And knowing what this person did
(17:52):
and what his assignment was, this email fills me with
so much emotion. It just makes me feel nauseated to
know that someone like him was cast aside and not
provided the assistance and help that truly could have saved
his career, truly could have saved him as an individual.
(18:15):
It's just incredibly disheartening to me.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
It is disheartening. I mean, I guess all I can
say is I'm grateful for this person's service and grateful
that they felt safe enough to write in and share
their story with us. And I hope this person feels
hurt and appreciated. He's very much appreciated. Okay, This next
email is interesting because it's not just from a different state,
(18:40):
it's a different country. She writes, thank you for putting
season four out. I was married to a former police
officer in Calgary who is almost the same person as
Joel Kern. The only difference is that the police service
swept it all under the rug. My ex was able
to resign in twenty twenty one while under five investigations.
(19:00):
Since he chose to resign before he was fired, he
has no record and can become a police officer anywhere
in Canada. Unfortunately, these psychopaths get away with their crimes.
Thank you for making these things known. It is wild
that someone in Canada has such a similar experience to you.
(19:23):
Is that surprising to you?
Speaker 2 (19:26):
I don't think that my story is necessarily an anomaly
in the sense that I was married to a police officer.
I knew what I was getting when I was married
to a cop. I knew that he would have to
work nights. I knew that there would be weird hours.
I knew there would be times he would not be
able to be home for holidays or special events. These
are things that I accepted. What I did not sign
up for, and I did not accept, was for him
(19:48):
to deface his badge and was for him to defy
our marital vows. I did not sign up for that, right.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
You didn't, And I think it's safe to say that
in your case, and I would argue in the case
of the person that wrote in that all the allowances
you guys made to help accommodate their job and their
work schedules were exploited.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
Yes, absolutely, one hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (20:17):
Okay, we're going to talk about one more email, and
it was one that we recently received, and it was
a shock to our team when we received it. We
said it to you, you've had some time to digest it.
I mean I should say it's a shock, but not
a complete surprise, because you know, having heard the number
of people Joel was having affairs with. It's tough, But
(20:41):
to your point earlier about validation, I think it's important
for us to discuss it. Okay, okay, here we go
to the host of Betrayal podcast. I don't know if
my conscience will ever be clean, but writing you is
a first step. I am one of Joel Kern's affairs.
Was my lieutenant, and he held power. He also made
(21:03):
me believe we were in a relationship and had a future.
I remember seeing Caroline and talked to her a few times.
She'd show up to the substation with dinner for him
or cake and ice cream for everyone. For special occasions.
She told our shift that everyone was welcome to eat
Thanksgiving dinner at their home if we had nowhere to go.
One year, she made Christmas dinner for the entire shift
(21:25):
and set up a photo booth. I guess that's why
it was flattering. When Joel started complimenting me. He started
flirting with me and sending messages. When I was out,
he asked what I looked like in regular clothes. Then
he asked me to meet him for dinner on shift.
Things started crossing the line and getting romantic. I told
him that I couldn't believe he wanted someone like me
(21:47):
when he had a pretty wife and kids. He told
me that Caroline was only good to look at and
said that she was sick with arthritis and didn't pay
attention to him. Joel said she couldn't do anything or
go anywhere. He said she was always in bed and
he couldn't divorce her since she was so sick. I
believed him. We had sex at my house after work
(22:08):
and a few times before. I felt guilty when we
had sex in his office because of all the pictures
of his wife and kids around. He told me the
pictures were for show. I started to realize I wasn't
the only one he was sleeping with. I was embarrassed
and ashamed. A friend showed his Facebook page. I was
so mad when I saw pictures of Joel and Caroline
(22:30):
after she ran a marathon. I confronted him about her
being sick. How did she run a marathon if she
was so sick. He laughed at me and told me
I didn't know what I was talking about. I know
I'm not the only affair he had at CSPD, but
every day I wish I wasn't one of the people
on his roster. If Caroline gets these emails, then I
want her to know that I'm very sorry and hope
(22:51):
she can move forward. This email is a great example
of you know, what we explored in this season is
you know, as you're trying to move forward and just
live your life, you know, you take three steps and
then bam, new information, a new affair you didn't see coming,
(23:12):
and it's just another blow. It's just another hit.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
I'm desensitized to hearing about affairs like that. Part doesn't
hit my soul hearing this email. The part that just
as a gut punch to me is hearing the manipulation
tactics and the lies used to garner his sexual affairs.
(23:40):
Very few people know that I have rheumatoid arthritis. Very
few people know that about me. It is not something
that debilitates me and puts me bedridden. But for him
to have used that and told someone that to manipulate
them to have sex with him, it just sickens me.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
It honestly just feels like nothing was off limits in
his pursuit. I mean, it's it's fascinating and horrifying how
much Joel was manipulating everyone in his orbit.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
So a new friend from my women's group said something
to me that had just really stuck with me. She said,
it's like we were living in the Truman Show. Joel
was the director and the rest of us were just
cast members, just going along with the script without even
knowing it. There was the life that he lived with us,
or the one you know that he pretended to live
(24:37):
with us, and then there was this version he showed
to people at work. None of it was real, all
of it was a performance.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
I think this is a good time to mention. We
did reach out to Joel to give him the opportunity
to share on the podcast, but he did decline our
request for an interview. However, he did send us a
written statement, and I'm going to read that now. Thank
you for reaching out. I understand the nature of the
series and appreciate the opportunity to respond. However, I've decided
(25:12):
not to participate in the podcast. I do want to
acknowledge that I've made mistakes and that others have their
own stories to tell. While I will not be adding
to the conversation publicly, I continue to reflect and work
on becoming a better version of myself. I ask that
this message be taken as my only comment. Sincerely, Joel,
(25:36):
I think it's fair to say that we're probably never
going to get to the bottom of why Joel did
what he did, why he did this to your family,
why he did this to you.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
But here's what I do know.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
There are so many people who've been betrayed by a partner,
and it's isolating, and it's deeply lonely. In hearing your story,
your honesty, your strength, your vulnerability, it might be the
moment someone else realizes that they're not alone.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
Thank you for giving me the platform to do it.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
After months getting to know Caroline and her world, we
had one more trip that we wanted to take to
watch her son run the Boston Marathon. It wasn't his
first time running, but this was the first time Caroline
and Nicole would get to see him cross the finish line.
We were excited to go along. Before race day, we
all sat down at dinner together. Nicole was grateful not
(26:52):
just to have the whole family in one place, but
to finally share this experience and to talk together for
the podcast. By the way, you'll hear the sounds of
the restaurant in the background. This is our first time
talking all three of us. Now that I had them
all at one table, I wanted to ask them about
something I noticed. Caroline has lots of images of birds
(27:13):
around in her home and even in a tattoo. I
asked the family about it, and no, I would probably
be the best for that.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
So life blows up and we would check in with
each other every day and we started talking about, you know,
just different mantras and how we kept going. And one
day my son said, I keep hearing the Bob Marley
(27:43):
song and it just keeps chanting like everything's going to
be all right. I actually thought to myself, how fitting that.
Obviously the chorus is Everything's going to be all right.
But the title of the song is three Little birds.
And so we were a family of four, but we
really dwindled down to three and it just became three
(28:05):
little birds. And after that our mantra has been three
little birds, or we sign everything off on to each
other TL it just has become our thing.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
The next morning, we were off to the Boston Marathon.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
His freshman year, he had the goal of doing this
and it was a big deal for him to train
and cross the finish line, and he was scheduled to
do this in April of twenty twenty two, and so
just a week before that was our designated D day
when Joel blew up our lives and we didn't know
(28:45):
if he would follow through with it, and he said
that it was a big deal for him to do it,
that training and being a part of something bigger was
just kind of keeping him on a path to heal
for himself since he was so far away, and to
keep his mind off of certain things. And so he
did it.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
The first time he ran the marathon, Jewel's betrayal was
painfully fresh.
Speaker 2 (29:10):
In the day that he did the race, Jewel called
in the middle of the conversation. We were sitting in
a car, and Nicole actually had to say, you do
know that today is a bigger day than you. My
brother's doing this marathon and you completely forgot about it.
There's so much more that's bigger than you.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
Well, this is the first year that we have actually
gotten Intisim across the finish line.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
It's just been a slow just to slow burn, a
slow achievement to try to keep going. And if I
were to tell you that I think the kids and
I will ever cross like a finish line from the
trauma that was caused. I just don't think that's realistic.
I think we can keep going, and I think we
can continue to figure out our way through it. But
(30:04):
I'm not sure that we'll really truly ever understand no
reasons why or.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Really get over anything.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
But we will get through it.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
But today was a good day. Standing on the streets
of Boston near the finish line, the sky was clear,
and we cheered runners as they crossed. I was holding
a sign that said free beer at finish line, and
we waited with anthicipation for Caroline soun.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
A beer sounds been after line. The three of us
have been through something that no three other people will
ever have gone exactly through. And so to be able
to say that we're still here, still standing, still achieving,
(30:56):
and still together, I think that's incredible.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
Pure joy, pure love. Maybe every little thing is imperfect,
but these three little birds are doing all right, just
like the song said.
Speaker 2 (31:13):
That might be my baby boy.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
Thank you for listening to Betrayal season four. If you
would like to reach out to the Betrayal team, email
us at Betrayal pod at gmail dot com. That's Betrayal
Pod at gmail dot com. Also, please be sure to
follow us on Instagram at Betrayal Pod and me Andrea H.
Gunning for all Betrayal content, news and updates. One way
(31:49):
to support the series is by subscribing to our show
on Apple Podcasts. Please rate and review Betrayal five star
reviews help us know you appreciate what we do. Betrayal
is a production of Glass Podcasts, a division of Glass
Entertainment Group, in partnership with iHeart Podcasts. The show is
executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Fason. Betrayal is
(32:11):
hosted and produced by me Andrea Gunning, written and produced
by Carrie Hartman, also produced by Ben Fetterman. Our associate
producers are Caitlin Golden and Kristin Melcurie. Our iHeart team
is Ali Perry and Jessica Crincheck. Story editing by Monique Leboard,
audio editing by mattel Vecchio and Tanner Robbins and mixed
(32:31):
by mattal Vecchio and special thanks to Caroline and her family.
Betrayal's theme is composed by Oliver Baines. Music library provided
by my Music and for more podcasts from iHeart visit
the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
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