Better Offline CES 2025: Day 3 - Pt. 1 - Better Offline

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Also media.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
When I was a young boy, my father he took
me to the Las Vegas based consumer electronics show and
he left me here for days. Welcome to Better Offline.
I'm your host ed zitpon and we are back talking

(00:28):
about the consumer electronics show. I slept five hours yesterday,
so I was a little low energy. Today I am
way higher energy. So this is what you have to
expect today. But I'm joined by another dynamic coachie of guests.
On my left here I have Tom McKay's, a senior
reporter at it brew. Tom, Thank you so much for
joining us.

Speaker 1 (00:46):
Awesome, it's great to be here.

Speaker 2 (00:48):
Hell yeah. And across from me, I have Jesse Ferrara
of your Kickstarter sucks.

Speaker 1 (00:52):
Hello.

Speaker 2 (00:53):
I have loved ykas for years. But also tell people
a little bit about what YKS is because it's so
germane to the show.

Speaker 3 (01:02):
Well, thank you, you know it's uh. I guess it
has morphed into something that is a tech skeptic show,
you know, which you're familiar with, and it's it. It
wasn't supposed to be that. It was supposed to be
about crowdfunding. But what happens when we get sucked into
these worlds. You know, you often find, you know, maybe
there's some more here than I really thought. And such

(01:22):
is the way of crowdfunding, because now it's it's mostly
AI stuff, or it's you know, a little robot that
spins around on a wheel and says how you doing
or whatever. So uh so, mostly, okay, that was a
bad example because obviously that's awesome and we all want that.

Speaker 2 (01:39):
But there's so much of this.

Speaker 3 (01:40):
There's a big overlap I guess, between bad tech and
what's on our show.

Speaker 2 (01:44):
And you got a lot of your start as well,
was talking about just the shit that people were promising
on crowdfunding campaigns. Yeah, I think that's what that's like.

Speaker 3 (01:52):
It shares like a particular DNA with cees, which we
were talking a little bit earlier before we got started,
which is, hey, I remember this stuff from last year,
and then you show up and it's not here, right yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:02):
And also it's not anywhere. And that's what kickstarter is, right.

Speaker 3 (02:05):
There's somebody who says, what if we did this, and
you go, well, I don't know, man, I mean I
guess try it, and they go okay, and then nothing
happens after that at all, and the only record of
it sometimes is our stupid.

Speaker 2 (02:14):
Show saying how much it sucks, so so really doing
the pure journalism there, it's anthropology as well that I
you know, I don't want to sell it short but
all right, so, oh my right, I have Henry Casey,
electronics writer at CNN underscored Henry, thank you for being here.

Speaker 1 (02:29):
Thank you for having me.

Speaker 2 (02:30):
So a lot of your stuff is just you. You
have one of the more honest jobs I would say
of the people that we've had on so far, which
is not meant to sound like an insult though it does,
okay in the sense that you're just like, I'm gonna
look at stuff like It's not like you're doing like
a trend piece. It's like, I'm gonna look at some
stuff that sounds or looks away.

Speaker 4 (02:49):
Is it something that is either gonna be released and
has a price or life to be likely to be
released and has a price, but well, we're all afraid
of tariff so we're not gonna give a price yet.
Or is it really cool and you're gonna want to
click on it? And I'm sorry that we're gonna say
this as a concept that we're gonna tell you that upfront.
Those are the three categories of what I do. But

(03:10):
for mostly I'm proc reviews. Guy, I am we have
a customer, we have an audience. It's like, oh, I
want to get something that improves X, Y or Z.
And that's how I get to not cover stuff that
isn't going to help anybody or anything. And how I
got to avoid talking about the Rabbit last year because
it didn't have any dreamanness to anybody.

Speaker 2 (03:28):
And you made a point before we got on as well.
So the Rabbit r one for people that don't know,
is this little box that promised to you could be like, oh,
I need a McDonald and I need a chicken nugget
from McDonald and then you talked into it and the
nugget would appear. Except by the way and the launch
of the Rabbit. When he tried to do this, it
broke of all the shit to do, like a live
demo of your very broken thing, and it turned out

(03:49):
that behind the scenes all it was was triggering like
these scripts. Nothing from Rabbit this year, but also nothing
like Rabbit this year. No one has done a big
cause I lie. No one's just come up with a
fake thing than this selling, which is very disappointing. I
was looking for some dog shit.

Speaker 3 (04:04):
Yeah you normally in these times I find you know,
we look to the helpers, and so I looked for
will I Am and I found him and I was
able to take a creepshot of him from really far away.
So if that helps anybody, I'd be happy to share.
But it doesn't seem like even will I Am had something.
It was like a speaker thing or some kind of headphones, right.

Speaker 4 (04:24):
Like even and speakers and a little bit of headphones
with LG they had an event. I didn't get coded
it last night. But yeah, they're doing a whole partnership.

Speaker 3 (04:32):
That's great. I feel like, maybe I don't know, is
maybe this is too cynical. I almost feel like we're
good on speakers. I think maybe I have enough ways
to like play music in my house and I probably
don't need to iterate on that anymore. But yeah, these
guys didn't get the message on that for sure. So
Tom McKay, so it, bro, what are you doing here?
What are you actually looking into? Because it seems like

(04:52):
you might have a slightly different remit.

Speaker 1 (04:54):
So I mostly cover enterprise technology, so I'm here mostly
to cover know what there is of the B two
B segment here and cybersecurity stuff I don't know. Yesterday
I interviewed a guy, Brandon Lucca, who does his company
called Efficient Computing or Efficient Computer. Uh it you know,

(05:16):
dramatically lowers the power requirements of processing stuff.

Speaker 2 (05:21):
Yeah, that doesn't I mean.

Speaker 1 (05:24):
Uh, And I've spent a lot of time just wandering
around the floor.

Speaker 2 (05:26):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (05:27):
The AI pavilion is baffling in harf Is that in
the LVCC. Yeah, that's the that's a big LG one
where they have I forget if it's LG's branding, but
there's like one that's like the rebranding it is Affectionate
Intelligence and it's just absolute dog shit.

Speaker 2 (05:42):
Well does that mean?

Speaker 5 (05:44):
Uh?

Speaker 1 (05:44):
Well, from what I can see, there's like a big
board you go in there, or a big TV when
you go in there, and it's like playing CGI clips
of like a family being like it's cold today? What
should I cook? And the fridge starts talking. It's like wow,
I the fuck I know? And it's like or like
there's another clip that plays on it where it's like
a girl like tossing a baseball and the Dad's like

(06:06):
I need recommendations for TV and lo and behold the
TV recommends baseball clips.

Speaker 6 (06:11):
Well.

Speaker 2 (06:11):
I love about this as well as the assumption that
there are assumptions being made by people that have not
talked to a person in some time. They're just like,
they're just like, what the fuck did dads do with
their daughters? Did they throw a ball? I guess what
do I make?

Speaker 1 (06:27):
Is like baby talking adults. It's it feels insane.

Speaker 2 (06:31):
I'm sure we all walk up to the fridge and go, well,
there's one thing in there. It's a pack of ham.
I don't know if it's ten days or ten weeks old.
Maybe I could make dinner with that. But also I
don't know who is walking up to fridge and going like, man,
I wish someone would tell me what to make with
all this fee.

Speaker 1 (06:48):
I wish the fridge would tell me don't eat that
it's been there for seven days. But none of this does.

Speaker 2 (06:53):
That, no, because that's an actual problem. Yeah, versus there's
no Bachelor fridge. I did, however, see a Bachelor dish
washer A dish so this is really.

Speaker 1 (07:02):
Finn It's marketed as four batchelor.

Speaker 2 (07:04):
It should be it's a five second dish washer, So
I walked up and this is this is very me.
I walked up and go all right, how much that
four hundred bucks? I'm like okay, I'm like is it
out here only in China right now? Coming next year?
And I said, all right, can you show me? And
he puts the plate in the I'm like, you put
the dirty one. He's like, oh, I'm already doing this one.
I'm like, well it's pretty short, and he just like
stares there and goes, okay, well I'm going to put

(07:25):
this one. And I'm like okay, so the clean one,
and he goes I'm like, how long? Five seconds? Like
great one, two, three, four, five, six seven. And the
guy's just like, oh god, because no one's walked up
and timed it. Yeah, And he just like looks at
me like it just it's a dish. I'm like, no,

(07:45):
this is great. It's for like like sad guys, right,
and he just he goes, I sure, he's like this.
This guy's already out timed the.

Speaker 1 (07:52):
Miss Still it cleans a single plate at a time.

Speaker 2 (07:54):
No, you can do like a few, but it actually
looked like genuinely I was like I could see using this.
But the reason I choose the bachelor thing is who
is cleaning like three plates? Like it's like but also
absolutely like this is like when you're making one set
off one set, gentleman talking about myself and uh yeah,
but what's weird was that's arguably one of the most

(08:16):
useful things I've seen. Appliances are useful.

Speaker 3 (08:18):
Yeah, like we've yeah, we figured out Okay, it's good
when you wash the dish or you make the food
or whatever. So like we're all on board with how
to do that kind of stuff. So if they put
a different screen on it, you're gonna get me to stop.
I'll look at the new screen on the fridge.

Speaker 2 (08:31):
I really do like all the AI screen stuff though,
Like so it's just like they haven't worked out why
screens are useful. Eth Yeah, that's also a problem.

Speaker 4 (08:39):
I do in theory, like the idea of like tell
me or I could make with this because I make
the same sheet pan dish a lot, and if I
could have a thing that could tell me, hey, who
the new thing you could make with some of these ingredients.
Just get one new thing.

Speaker 2 (08:51):
But you're saying you already have the ingredients.

Speaker 4 (08:53):
Yeah, what or like it could suggest hey, half of
these ingredients, get this other thing, make this other dish something.
They push it to be more creative with what you
do because you think they're all taking over our imagination.

Speaker 2 (09:04):
Correct, that's what the whole gimmick is.

Speaker 4 (09:06):
AI is imagination that executives can buy an outsource human
work to. Okay, that's that's the methods that nobody's saying about,
like help me be a more adventurous call.

Speaker 3 (09:18):
But it starts to telling you before you go to
the store, though, right, you can't. There's no world where
you have like you don't have like leaks in your fridge,
and like what am I gonna do all these leaks?
Like you fucking bought the leaks right now?

Speaker 4 (09:29):
Yeah, there are leaks in the shield.

Speaker 2 (09:32):
Okay, well you know what leaks are?

Speaker 1 (09:33):
Good?

Speaker 2 (09:34):
So bad? Example by me? Well I like them? Okay,
that's all right, Well i'll see you later.

Speaker 3 (09:40):
Then here is like helpful who doesn't feels like there's
a team leak and like a team anti leak.

Speaker 2 (09:49):
So I did see one thing I like though, and
I think it confused them because so I found so
you know those golf simulators where you knock the ball
into a screen and it has like senses. They had
one for baseball. Oh so it was all of these
like Korean guys and I walk up, like are you
doing and they're like already just like British guy. This
guy doesn't know anything about the baseball or absolutely did

(10:10):
so have you got partnerships with the KBO And they're like,
oh uh, like does this work? Is this like hit tracks?
So to explain some baseball tech for you, it's actually
fucking cool if you go to like local bat in
cages z cages here in Vegas just doing ads. They
did not pay me, in fact I pay them, and
they're very hard to schedule with sometimes. Anyway. What they
have is a thing called hit tracks, so when you
hit it, it sees the lolosty of the ball and

(10:31):
like where you hit it and such, and this stuff's
fairly easily available. The thing is it requires a natural
bat in case you build around this. One is kind
of like the golfing thing. It's like fifteen grand and
they're like, hey you good bye one. I'm like no, no, no,
but and I was like, this is the only thing
I'd like to see. Yes, And they seem so happy.
They seemed genuinely happy and then they really wanted to

(10:52):
sell me when I was like, and then they seemed
less happy. Are they trying to sell it to people
or just like bars, they're trying to sell it to
teams and and I assume, like dying looking British men
right and sadly that it's very small market there. But
that was really cool, and it's like, I did get
this feeling walking around. I've spent the day in the
Venetian expo hole, so the one right connected to the

(11:14):
Venetian I did get this weird feeling. Though CS gets
done dirty because most of CS is so fucking boring.
It's but not in a bad way. It's like more
efficiency driving, battery technology, mobility for this, like and urine
sensors and such, and I wanted to make if I
saw urine, and naturally I'm just like a photo. I'm like,
oh wait, this is useful and it's good to look

(11:36):
at p Yeah, I have to I love looking at
the piss Yeah.

Speaker 1 (11:39):
But then you gave me one of the p test kits.
I haven't used it yet, yeah, I did. I gotta
see how my pots states are.

Speaker 2 (11:44):
I guess I was walking out of a CS once
and I saw like an ai semen. It's like and
I really want to walk up and be like, hey,
do you want to Can I have a go?

Speaker 1 (11:53):
There is? Actually I saw a booth that's like selling
like a I guess it's a machine that like measures
your spur motility orso. And you know, I don't think
they were doing products on site, but whose well I
didn't see If there's a little booth in the corner.

Speaker 2 (12:10):
Yeah, can I just hey, I got some with me.
But also I did see a few things that really
bothered me. And there was one where they had this
VR glasses thing and it said a new hope for
autism and dyslexia. And I'm gonna be talking about this
a few times on this show. Move a VR and
I walk over. I'm like, hey, so have you talked

(12:31):
to the FDA about this? And the one goes, what's that?
Which is a good start, and I'm like, okay, well,
they're the ones you'd have to work with to make
this legal in America. Oh, we're not a medical device.
I'm like, oh, okay, so how is this good for autism? Well,
it's great for autism and dyslexia. I just paused. My
guy so I have someone in a fan with the autism.

(12:52):
So I started getting a little bit pissed off, and
I was like, Okay, do you think those are the
same things? And sheid, no, they're different. How pause again,
I go, what clinical trials have you done? Well, we've
done clinical trials. I'm like, where where France, I'm like, oh,
what are you talking about? And just to be clear,
the classic thing that autistic people love is putting new

(13:14):
things on and new experiences. And this thing was by
the way you put the glasses on and you had
to move a character through letters to like do something. Okay,
uh huh. And let me just be clear. This person
who I talked to clearly had not been asked a
single question in their life, because they were very confused

(13:36):
that I kept saying, what do you How does this
help autistic people? And they're like, they do they play
the game. And I just want to say, if you
were on this floor and you have anything to do
with autism and I find you, I'm putting you on
this fucking show and putting your assd on fucking blast
because it's disgusting.

Speaker 3 (13:52):
I have noticed not through Kickstarter, well some through Kickstarter,
but the impulse to make it easy on devices or
products or whatever that are ostensibly for people who need
help in various areas. Is like, that's tempting, right yea,
to say like, oh cool, somebody's trying to figure something out.
But a lot of times there's so much worse than

(14:15):
just the normal jackof tech that it feels bad to
evaluate them at all.

Speaker 4 (14:20):
Wasn't this the thing that Lena Connan you were talking
out ed about, how like, oh, we're in a new
area of technology. We want we want less criticism, we
want we want more protection, less scrutiny.

Speaker 2 (14:29):
And this one is just a bit And you're right, Jesse,
there's a lot of stuff here where it's just like, oh, yeah,
we're helping people, so give us a break. Okay. Now,
I talked with Ben Woolf who's a friend of the show,
and he sent a quote through about this company said
where I think they're utterly full of shit. Is the
other testimonial on the website movie via The principles of
the experience offered by movear is to address the visual

(14:50):
constraints found, according to the TVPS four manual in diagnosed
learning disorders such as dyslexia, ADHD and DCD. This is
frankly crap. Dyslexia is enormously variable, and immersive environments are nonsensical.
Quote treatment. He's doing little air quotes around that. ADHD
has no reason to be mechanicalistically vulnerable to this kind
of intervention. The point is that none of these people

(15:11):
talk to any fucking scientists, and the tech media needs
to go and harass them because you should not be
able to come onto this floor and feel safe. Okay,
I don't mean physically from criticism. There we go because
it just really bothers me. And a lot of what's
in the expo hare in the Venetian is this stuff.
There's so much health stuff. It's we were talking about yesterday.

(15:32):
It's disgusting. Oh you guys love health. I no, I
want to diet, like just we will kill you.

Speaker 4 (15:40):
In like you've been asked like, oh, talk about something
you're excited and happy about with tech, that.

Speaker 2 (15:45):
The baseball thing and the workout, the any workout shit.
But you post you're like, yeah, good jack, that stuff
is the stuff.

Speaker 4 (15:54):
I'm like, I'm using the supernatural VR thing right that's
actually getting my heart rate up and I see the
char whatever its suitable alternative to going to the gym.
It's to avoid the weirdos. It's there is good stuff
out there to get healthy intech, but it's the the
Venetian floor is really condensed and too tight to make
any sense of unless you're a team of twenty five people,

(16:17):
and the Verge doesn't have a twenty five person health team.

Speaker 2 (16:21):
They got Victoria's song one of the best. She's christ
she's one of the best. Or yeah, she's got one
of the single best. She's like the remaining wearable reporter.
She's so good. And now here's the thing. I'm just
gonna read you what this company, wishtails Ai had on
that thing is so empowering creators and consumers. With multimodal AI,
the iPhone turned anyone into a photographer. Wishtails empowers everyone

(16:41):
to be a creator. I could not make heads or
tails of what this company did. I do not know.
They just the music art automations create multimodal AI videos
in mins, in twenty eight languages, and it just says
ignite multimodal creativity. Imagine if they had any quality control.

Speaker 1 (17:00):
I mean, this just sounds like stuff the iPhone already does.

Speaker 2 (17:02):
Yeah, but also you create multimodal video. No you don't,
we model you fucking to these people.

Speaker 3 (17:08):
The iPhone is mostly single modal, right, so that's like
a huge because if you do more of the models
then won't that be like better and stuff?

Speaker 2 (17:16):
Yeah, you know, like a hundred models going right now.
That's insane. It's like really cool. I'm spinning them up.

Speaker 1 (17:21):
I don't believe that's possible.

Speaker 2 (17:23):
Anything is possible if you lie. So Tom, you mean
looking and surprise stuff? Is there anything good? Is there
any any joys?

Speaker 1 (17:31):
I mean for the most I mean like this is
mostly you know, consumer electronics. I've been going around, like
there's a lot of interesting drones that are intended for
I guess like the B to B market. Interesting how
like industrial scanning and stuff that's interesting. I mean the
big themes this year are AI and robotics. I think, uh,
there's just a lot of sony robots. I mean it's

(17:53):
funny though, so I forget what it's called. But I
saw this one drone that's like a I don't know, tetra,
don't know the big uh the sphere with like I
can't remember the name of the shape. But yes, like
a spear and it rolls around and then it can
also fly. But I was talking with the guys that
made this, and I was like, all right, so you know,

(18:14):
what's what's the application of this And he's like, actually,
we're here to you know, get ideas. That's what the
potential applications are. Like, you built this before.

Speaker 2 (18:22):
Coming up with a business plan. Yeah, we're pre we
have pre reason.

Speaker 1 (18:28):
We just I mean the only thing they had was
like they gave me a brochure where it was like
a little diagram of a pile of rocks and uh
they like it just said search and rescue and then
it had a picture of a tube and it's like
not real inspection. And I'm like, okay, I guess if
you have a really big tube that you need inspected.

(18:50):
I love all them down large tubes.

Speaker 2 (18:53):
I hope there's so many corners.

Speaker 3 (18:55):
Tube guys are eating good this year's cube issues.

Speaker 2 (19:00):
I'm glad my tube's going to be sorted by the
end of this trip. This is a bad location to be.
I also got this At every CS I do look
up names. I have a lot of fun looking at names.
Everyone called skip up and the AI spot stethoscope And
when I showed this to Phil, a resident safety expert.
He made this Noise EDGEAI Technology application Primary Screening by

(19:25):
AI for heart and lung health abnormalities. So I'm gonna
stop there before I get angry. What everyone is doing
is they just like, we had an algorithm before, and
we are just saying AI because otherwise they will realize
it's the same thing from four years ago. And in fact,
I feel like the theme right now for CS is dang,

(19:46):
we did this a year ago.

Speaker 1 (19:47):
And a lot of it is we had an algorithm
and now we're slapping an additional layer on top best
like chat GPT. So basically it does the exact same
thing it did before, except you have an inaccurate robot
relaying what's happening.

Speaker 2 (19:59):
And that's the thing you can fine dumb guys do
not understand stuff for free. You can just get a
bloke Becau's just like, I think, what okay, all right?

Speaker 1 (20:08):
Yeah, yeah, I mean I read into one that was
like a like AI enabled like scuba diver kit with
like the dive watches and stuff, and it's like, yeah,
I could just like I could just like swim over
in a panic to the other diver and point at
the watch and be like, oh, what does this mean?

Speaker 2 (20:21):
And I missed. I was really upset that I didn't
hit the floor yesterday because there was apparently a speech
in the Web three tokenization fintech section just called metaverse
and quantum ai. Oh my god, I'm so mad.

Speaker 4 (20:33):
I we're still using the word metaverse in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 5 (20:37):
I love.

Speaker 1 (20:38):
I never understood why anyone fell for that shit in
the first place, but the fact that some people are
still chasing it is wild to me.

Speaker 2 (20:45):
I'm also going to give a shout out to the
only good booth here, the hang Joe Hyoshi Lighting Cone Limited.
Just a big son that said Wooden Lamb Nice. I
just loved that because it's like everyone else is just
I was just making shit up. It's like they I've
got a fucking lamp you want to Oh no, sorry.

(21:06):
I finally found it the thing that I love the most.
So I walked up to a booth where the sign
said bridging Massage and Purification for your pet. And I
walked up and I'm just showing everyone right now. It
is an air purifier with what looks like a spike
on the end. Oh yeah, my dog would like that,
that's what they told me. Yeah, because I walked up
and said, hi, so I just was reading your sign.

(21:28):
What does that mean? She's oh, of course, very ready
for the question, alarmingly so. And because will you see
the pet wall kind of massage themselves, I'm like, on
the spike and they will just so the dog just
just does this, and she's like yeah, and we have
a lower one for smaller dogs. I'm like, right, so
the dog just shoves itself.

Speaker 3 (21:49):
Well, have you ever seen that with cows that they have,
like the big brushes on the farms that the cows
walk up to and scratch their back.

Speaker 2 (21:54):
I've never seen a dog do this. I've never seen
a dog massage.

Speaker 1 (21:58):
Do you attach spikes to your whilst yes.

Speaker 2 (22:01):
Of course right, but I've never seen a dog well no,
those are fither and paling. But it's a prince of
purchase situation. We'll get to it later. But it's I've
never seen a dog massage themselves against something anyone's seen.
My dog will come in and kind of rub his
back on the couch, not on the spike if the
couch had a spike, you know. But it's also the
spike is coming down. Yeah, I don't know. And this

(22:23):
is a big booth as well. These people have spent
tens of thousands of dollars being like, well, I've got
to get the dog spike air purifier? Is that?

Speaker 1 (22:30):
I don't know? Have you?

Speaker 3 (22:31):
Have you talked about that a lot, like the actual
economics of putting on a booth, like sponsoring something.

Speaker 2 (22:36):
He probably should have looked that up. Yeah, what does
it take to show up? I mean tens of thousands
of dollars, it's like one hundred thousand dollars for main
hol Yes, absolutely, wow, And it's crazy. It's like there's
so much stuff that's theoretical yeah or pre idea like
like I don't know, and it's just so strange. But so, Tom,

(22:57):
did you see anything you like yet? Did you see
anything good?

Speaker 1 (23:00):
Good? I like the massage chairs.

Speaker 2 (23:04):
I nearly thought that every year though, the massage chairs
fucking rock. They go they scam guys who are going
to see yes to the first time, like, oh yeah
it's four thousand dollars, we'll there for two and it
cost them three hundred dollars And.

Speaker 1 (23:14):
Yeah, it kind of like locked me into the chair.
There was like panels that compressed me and I couldn't
leave it nearly fell asleep. That was great.

Speaker 2 (23:20):
Yeah, anything else.

Speaker 1 (23:23):
Uh, can we get back to me?

Speaker 2 (23:27):
No, but it's fine if you don't have an on stuff.

Speaker 1 (23:29):
Because I didn't, you know, I saw, you know, some
robots that were cool. There's this one company, I think
be Bot, that was working on a robotic turtle for
like environmental research.

Speaker 2 (23:39):
Sorry, that sounds really good. Sorry, I thought you meant
a member of It looks like a turtle, don't.

Speaker 1 (23:46):
I don't know. I don't know why it needs to
look like a turtle, but it but it apparently swims
and everything, and you can launch it into the sea
and it does it somehow does environmental reasons When we
kill When.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
We kill all the turtles, dude, global warming, We're just
gonna replace them with just.

Speaker 1 (24:03):
Some post apocalyptic future. This will be like Level one enemies,
just swarms of like little robot turtles. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (24:12):
Yeah, right Now I have to kill the rats in
the Vegas in the Vegas at queducts to Vegas sewers.

Speaker 1 (24:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (24:18):
I go down there with kill a fee rats. Then
there's a giant one and I have to run out
to the cops and they shoot me Jesse, anything good.

Speaker 3 (24:26):
I well, I was wondering. I was thinking maybe Tom
would bring these guys up. I accidentally got sucked into
the Soul Semiconductor.

Speaker 2 (24:33):
Booth that yet.

Speaker 3 (24:35):
Okay, so these guys basically make the most baller semiconductors
you've ever seen in your life.

Speaker 2 (24:40):
Sake.

Speaker 3 (24:41):
I I walked it. It's a pretty big booth. They
did a cool thing where it was like they had
some really like uh, post apocalyptic messaging almost on the walls,
but I think in like a cool way, like an
environmental type of way. The thing they had on the
sign at the top was like like birth does not
guarantee six something like really you saw it.

Speaker 4 (25:04):
Wow, It's like it's almost a unity, like it's a
people empowerment. Yeah yeah, and like people are meming the Okay.

Speaker 2 (25:12):
I want to meet the guy you can swear like
you can say fucking shit and bowls and all the
other ones. H I love that as well, because I
want to meet the post thing reads then and goes
fuck well damn. Other than Jesse. I thought it was great.

Speaker 3 (25:25):
So I walk immediately in and it's like a super
serious guy and he's like, hey, how's it going?

Speaker 2 (25:29):
And I was like, hey, what's up?

Speaker 3 (25:31):
You know, what are you guys doing, and like immediately
looking around and realizing there's nothing here that I know
what it is. So but he was saying like, hey,
we make all the LED backlights for like all of
the TVs.

Speaker 2 (25:43):
I'm like, hey, I actually actually useful.

Speaker 3 (25:45):
Great, you know, or they do like, you know, most
a lot of cars, new cars now especially have the
the LED headlights, tail lights and all that kind of stuff.
So clearly they do that stuff too. That's great. I
can't really make a joke about LED headlights. So I
kind of got stuck in a conversation with him for
about ten or fifteen minutes. But if you're just waiting
to make a joke, I just truly trying to get

(26:05):
out of there with yeah anything as just trying to
do something I didn't. I almost said like, oh, so
you're the guy I should be mad at when I
you know, the lights are really bright on the road
at night. But it looked like he wasn't even willing to,
like I wasn't gonna go.

Speaker 2 (26:21):
Over at all. You'd just be like no, And then
he scanned.

Speaker 1 (26:23):
My badge, Ah, he's going to send you an email.

Speaker 2 (26:26):
I had to run away really fast from the badge.
The good thing is that with me, especially today, like
I'm fully energetic. So I'm just walking around with a
black mask and my eyes just fucking bulging out my
head and i walk really fast because I've done this
show so many times, I just I know exactly the route.
So you just see this high speed British man in
a Jensen hung style leather jacket, just fucking making a

(26:49):
beeline for you, taking three photos, going what's this? And
it's I actually apologize to anyone I've.

Speaker 1 (26:55):
It sounds like a two dollars Horrd game on Steam.

Speaker 2 (27:00):
But it becomes a hen Ti one lights out Henry.
What is so? Is that anything you've.

Speaker 4 (27:05):
Liked as much as it can be the negative person
in any conversation actually.

Speaker 2 (27:09):
Have three So that's three more than most tcl is. Do.

Speaker 4 (27:14):
They have these next paper devices. They've then Matt screens
and stuff. Now they're doing something really actually great with it.
I think I expect Apple will have their own version
of in two to three years. This thing is the
next paper eleven plus tablet, which basically has a mode
where it switches into basically an e ink like screen mode,
which will a incredibly good battery life. Probably be let

(27:36):
your regular Android tablet become an e reader looking thing
has a Matt screen device. You know how Apple's got
the iMac and the iPad. Now with Matt screens, past
that technology onto an iPhone screen, put this mode on it,
and they're going to have battery life better than they've
ever had.

Speaker 1 (27:53):
And then.

Speaker 4 (27:55):
I'm not a huge fan of suitcase turntables. There's good reason.
I think Crosley's sort of ruined the idea of a
two kase certain table. But Victrola has one that has Hilariously,
I think it's has lighting in the front that.

Speaker 2 (28:06):
You can sync up to the music. And it's seventy
five bucks, which called the Journey Glow I believe.

Speaker 4 (28:12):
And it's like, if it's Victrolla is a trustable brand,
I feel like in sound. So it's like a a
s Kate ceranin table that doesn't ruin your records. And
they played Daft Punk on it. It sounds pretty good.
And then I told you about this earlier. Lenovo's got
a think Book plus Gen sixteen laptop, mouthful of a name,
but the laptop screen raises it basically rolls up inside
so you can give them more vertical but in the

(28:34):
same size. It's your normal laptop. I didn't get to
actually demo it because I had to run, but like,
that's the laptop changing in a great way, which we
don't say that often in this tech reviewer industry that
I get to play in.

Speaker 2 (28:47):
Oh well, yeah, it feels kind of strange having someone
who remembers stuff they like, though.

Speaker 1 (28:54):
I mean, actually, I'd be remiss not to bring this up.
Some of the stuff I liked here isn't even like electronics, Like, well,
half the stuff here is ant even electronics. It's like
the consumer product show. But there was this one company
they were the most popular booth at this event last
night that was selling like little metal strips that you
are advertising, little metal strips that you put on your
nose to like sleep better at night, and they work

(29:16):
fantastically better that I like, I've got sleep apne I
assume eighty percent of people that go see s of
sleep apia, So I mean it was it was wild.
There's like twenty people lined up and this guy was
like doing his like carny thing of like gluing these
two people's noses.

Speaker 2 (29:30):
Well, this has been such a wonderful episode. We'll start
with you, Tom Tom. Where can People find You?

Speaker 1 (29:36):
People can find me on x dot com at the
Tom Zone, or they can find me at Blue Sky
at Don't Judge Me, Captured two dot Besky dot Social.

Speaker 2 (29:47):
He is kat Ted Jesse, where can People find You?

Speaker 3 (29:50):
Your Kickstarter sucks is the podcast and go off Kings'
is the twitch stream. Jesse it's I think it's jessefar
dot com on Blue Sky and yell the links are
from there.

Speaker 4 (30:01):
And Henry, I write primarily for CNN Underscored, which you
can open instantly just by typing in underscore dot com.
I also have a newsletter and all sorts of stuff
which is accessible if I'm Henry tkacy dot net. That's
Henry tca s e y dot net. And also that's
my luseky name too.

Speaker 2 (30:18):
And as we close off this blook of the episode,
I just want to say something really quick before we
go to an ad break. Just want to say Henry
brought up daft punk. Daft Punk have not made a
good album since Discovery. Human after all is dogshit. It
is repeated bits, and I thought the soundtrack of Tron
was kind of boring. Come at me. I'm sick of
hearing about daft punk being good anytime. Recently Human after

(30:39):
all pissed me off so much. Anyway, coming up after
this ad break, we're gonna have even more wonderful people
from CES. And if Doppunk is listening, try not looping,
Try doing something interesting with your electronic music. You and me,
doph Punk. I'm sick of it. I just counted us

(31:07):
back in for an episode and I went three two one,
and I just want to be clear to the listeners
that I did two three four, I did four fingers up.
My brain is coming out of my goddamn ears. I
am dying, but I'm joined by amazing people. Nevertheless, ed
on Gwaiso Junior is to my right, of.

Speaker 7 (31:24):
Course, Hello, how's everyone doing?

Speaker 2 (31:28):
Jesse for of course your kickstarter sucks. Hello, And we
have the other one, Mike Hale from YKS, who is
fresh from a tech company called Cole's Tom McKay of
course from it Brow and we're back talking about CS.
But ed on Giso Junior, you've been on the main
the main hall, the main floor. How was how was that?

Speaker 7 (31:50):
I mean, no, you would you be surprised if I
told you everything? Is powered by AI. Now every single thing,
please elaborate. You know I refrigerators.

Speaker 2 (32:01):
Okay, to what ends?

Speaker 7 (32:04):
Well, you know you you need something that recognizes what
time of day you decide to have certain types of
coffee and how much of that to keep.

Speaker 2 (32:15):
And morning, right morning, right morning? Okay?

Speaker 1 (32:18):
You know.

Speaker 2 (32:20):
Freaking chica want to have it at lunch, you know?

Speaker 7 (32:23):
Or whoa So you know there was a legal text, right,
But one that I was really interested in is this
company that is saying, hey, look, the future of technology
it's minimalism. We want to reconnect you with human nature.
And the way that we're going to do that the
way we're going to get you off your screen. We're
going to give you a headset that you have to
keep on for nine hours a day, and it will

(32:46):
give you uninterrupted access to your artificial intelligence suite of
arapists productivity assistance.

Speaker 2 (32:55):
With human is with AI. Yes, but that's.

Speaker 7 (32:58):
So that you can reconnect with you in nature, and
it will give you notifications by calling you. It will
forward you to therapists that you talk to, friends that
you talk to powered by Claude almost exclusively.

Speaker 1 (33:11):
That sounds like something you pick up in the tutorial.
Level of like BioShock.

Speaker 8 (33:15):
Yeah, yeah, you know, this is this is the tutorial.
Is this a big company or no, they are connected
with this other company. This is a this is a
side venture of another company.

Speaker 2 (33:30):
Because it was the main hole. So the LVCC is
it's remarkable because it's it's so expensive to be that,
like we're talking about the economic cella. You're talking one
hundred grands through the dorm show. Yeah, and it's like,
so we're doing one hundred grand for this thing that
is just barely conceptual. Yeah.

Speaker 7 (33:48):
That's also the thing, as they emphasize, most of these
things do not exist yet they have demos that the
demo did not work when I was there, what happened,
what happened, couldn't just couldn't even hear me, couldn't connect
to the internet, couldn't recognize any command whatsoever. They were like, well,
you know, see, actually the thing that happened is one
of our guys took the mic home, so it actually

(34:09):
works really well.

Speaker 2 (34:10):
Come back with it. I have no idea that didn't
swing on it. He gets nervous, you know, he's playing
with it, you know.

Speaker 7 (34:20):
But yeah, so this idea here is uninterrupted access to
an AI so that you can reconnect to your human nature,
which is to talk to a bunch of assistants.

Speaker 1 (34:30):
Did they explain why this reconnections?

Speaker 2 (34:32):
Yeah? Why would you? Don't you look at your screen? Okay,
so you talk to your microphone though, yeah, and that's different. Yeah,
it's very different. So you're no dopamine loop. Okay, so
you're looking at you you're not looking at a screen, right,
but you all talking to the microphone. Are you just
staring into the abyss y?

Speaker 7 (34:50):
No, you're just walking around daily life, just like it's
just like doing something else he likes. But then he was,
you know, then they also you know, admit that. Oh yeah,
also to ask you to get on your phone a lot,
you know, way ahead.

Speaker 2 (35:04):
Of you already on my phone.

Speaker 1 (35:06):
Yeah. Yeah, it's it's a movie, except she's constantly remind you.

Speaker 7 (35:11):
It's like, hey, remember to go on this website of
buy Gibbs. Hey, go take a picture of this. I
can analyze it and put it at a search engine. Hey,
go on this discord channel. Hey, you know, talk to
another you know, always constant notifications to.

Speaker 2 (35:23):
Get back on your phone. But it's about getting off
your phone, right, And that's the thing. Katie the top
of the Severe Business Inside have said this last year
very thing. It's like, I love my phone. It's where
all my stuff is. Yeah, I like I'm on my
phone because I don't know, I don't have to look
at the real world. And who wants to do that.

Speaker 3 (35:39):
The ultimate use case for the voice activated technology, right
has always been being in the car. Because we're in America.
Everyone drives a car. It's the most dangerous thing to do,
except for to try to put your drink on a
side table.

Speaker 2 (35:53):
Okay, Jesse, I'm bost on my fucking podcast, Jesus Christ.
I just I just a party foul and it went
out and it went down like perfectly as well. So
it's like a really like it's a real.

Speaker 1 (36:07):
Splute classic cartoon spill.

Speaker 3 (36:10):
Well, well, well, it's really not your fault because the
side table has a slight rate.

Speaker 9 (36:15):
It's like a there's a slight raised area in the
middle of the side table.

Speaker 2 (36:19):
I mean, yeah, I'm like, I like have a knife
out and I'm just pointing to. When you think about it,
it's the table's fault. Yeah, the table that Yeah, that's right.
We're all met at the table obviously.

Speaker 7 (36:30):
Yeah, that's right, Okay, that's why you should have picked
up a Semen smart table from.

Speaker 2 (36:36):
A smart table. Did I wish that was real? I
wish there was a smart table a few years ago.
It was just a table the vessel table of course.
Thank you the beautiful ball tend to Phil brought and
I say it to clean up my mess? May I
have another place? I'm drinking something over the Laha, which
is Phill's Black Blood of the Earth with some vodka

(36:56):
and Irish cream. Thank you Phil. Anyway, what were we
talking about, ed so?

Speaker 7 (37:00):
Oh yeah, And the name of the thing is it's
Italian for human nature. I'm forgetting this human nature natural
Jesus Christ. Do you see what else? What else was it?

Speaker 2 (37:13):
I feel like finding out my coming home and finding
my kid is fucked up a bunch of shit, Like
like what else did you see that? I mean?

Speaker 7 (37:20):
That was that was the one that pulled me in
because they had a giant banner that said AI people
underneath above it. Oh good, And I was like, oh okay,
so you know, I walked up and it's like, well,
where are the AI people? And then it's like, you know,
they have five or they have five phones on a
table and then another five us were some iPads and
then like they're in here and you.

Speaker 2 (37:40):
Just put this on and they talk to you, but
they don't.

Speaker 1 (37:43):
Yeah, this is something I noticed that all the AI
like this year seems to be marketed is like AI
for people, Like like they're like because it's finally reaching
a point where they're trying to create It feels like
they're trying to create the market for AI stuff by
forcing it on people. Yes, and in doing so they
kind of have to reassure them that this is not like.

Speaker 2 (38:03):
You think it is.

Speaker 1 (38:05):
Yeah it is, and it's like some of it's really bad.

Speaker 2 (38:08):
Yeah, it's so funny as well, because I'm really like
the pig that they would sell slop to, Like I
love my gizmos and dudeads and apps and such. If
there was anyone to sell ship to, it's me. And
it's just not fun. It's boring. Like no use case.

Speaker 9 (38:25):
Yeah, there's there's still no use It's like a fucking
whole industry built around finding the use case the technology,
and it just doesn't exact the entire show I met
with Coals and great cases for AI like if you
if you want say like a you know a larger
than normal type of hoodie sweater and they might not
have it. But you speak to an AI agent and

(38:46):
it will tell you to breathe.

Speaker 2 (38:48):
I did walk over to important. I walked over to
a booth earlier that said AI agent. And this is
kind of me being a dickhead, but I spent what
kind of agent? Because uh, I'm like, oh, good, so
what model chat GPT? And like, great, so how is
this agentic? He goes I you talk to him like

(39:09):
that just sounds like chat GPT because yeah, but it's
an agent. I'm like, how he just looks at me terrified.

Speaker 9 (39:14):
I don't understand how everybody's building these industries and businesses
and stuff around GPT subscriptions. Yes, it's like you're hooked
into like the chagp api and you're building a business
on top of that.

Speaker 2 (39:27):
How.

Speaker 9 (39:27):
I don't understand how.

Speaker 2 (39:28):
And then the magic a venture.

Speaker 1 (39:31):
I mean, I forget uh what economists I wrote about
for uh that said this, But it was like the
idea that like AI is almost now like a tax
on on like the rest of the tech industry, Like
it's like a software tax where you need to pay
to have it in your product because everybody else does,
and all it really does is is suck money out
of you know, everything else.

Speaker 2 (39:51):
And it's great though, So I'm going to assume you
saw nothing useful, Like.

Speaker 7 (39:55):
It's actually really funny because I was walking towards something
that's an AI agent, kind of like the Promised Land
when you hit me up and you said come back.

Speaker 9 (40:03):
Did you guys see the toaster where you can print
uh photos of your loved ones.

Speaker 2 (40:08):
On pieces that is actually real? Did you really see that?

Speaker 7 (40:14):
We've actually yeah, you got me.

Speaker 2 (40:21):
It's in the menu. You remember that we're gonna do
a few miracle Yeah, we're building up to the final
episode where I'm going to do something called the menu.
Hope everyone joins men lock the doors.

Speaker 7 (40:34):
I think also the thing with the sunnatural Omana, whatever
the hell you know? The Italian name is similar to
your point about making markets. I feel like this one
is trying because they are like, the end goal is
to be able to make it connect to apps for you,
so you could go to your mom's house, you could
order movies or order in and it's like okay. So
I feel like they're trying to pretend as if or

(40:56):
they're trying to train people into accepting the discoppointment that
comes with insisting agents or around the corners exactly.

Speaker 2 (41:05):
No, you're right, so AI agents are meant to be
these autonomous things and then never are.

Speaker 7 (41:10):
But that's what we talked about that other episode. They're not,
but they keep misnaming things or presenting bullshit. So then
you know, I think this is part of the training
process where it's like, Okay, get with.

Speaker 2 (41:21):
The training customers.

Speaker 1 (41:23):
Like it feels like they're basically just like prepping people
to have Netflix scream at either.

Speaker 7 (41:27):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, this is a this is a this
is pedantic, but like, this is the thing that really
drives me nuts.

Speaker 3 (41:34):
Is is, like you were saying, training people to expect
certain things or to hear words and actually imagine something else,
Like algorithm is something that now means a bunch of
different things, where it's like now people like people who
I think for the most part share our mindset sort
of a skeptical mindset towards tech and and all that
kind of stuff. When we hear the word algorithm, like
our back gets up immediately because we think, oh, that's bad.

(41:55):
But it's like algorithm is not even bad. It's just
it's like a thought process and everything you like saying database, yeah, yeah, right, exactly,
everything has an algorithm in it. You're using an algorithm
when you make a decision. But now it's become it's
got this text stink grafted on to it, and now
we have to turn away. So eventually we'll go away
from AI, right, and it'll be like there's no algorithms
in this at all, And it's like, well, I don't know,

(42:17):
how's that possible?

Speaker 2 (42:18):
It's smart. Well, It's what I like about that is
it's also describing a bunch of things that are not problems. Yeah,
Like no one is like, oh I had to go
if it's my fucking mom's house and not to another
movie that took I was like, oh fuck it, that
took me several seconds, Like that is a solved problem.
I'm not none of the things they've just gotten. Well,
how are you going to order dinner? I don't know,

(42:41):
I've never done that before.

Speaker 1 (42:43):
Also, the idea that like if you and your spouse,
like let's say you and your spouse like take a
long time to set on a movie, that a robot
like interjecting in the middle of the conversation. It's gonna
speed this up.

Speaker 2 (42:54):
It reminds me of one of my favorite click hole pieces.
Which of my garbage sons are you? And they're like, yeah,
we named one of our sons Launce and Blake. And
the reason they did that was because they picked two
names they didn't like and named that for one son,
which I think is kind of addicative of the Consumer
Electronics show entirely. It's like, we can't come up with
a good idea, so we chose five bad ones. So

(43:15):
what anything else you see over there?

Speaker 7 (43:18):
I saw something where they were scanning your face to
present what your internal health looked like as an interactive
city where organs, what your organs, they interacted with each
other were depicted on the screen as if they were a.

Speaker 1 (43:38):
Little cells walking around us.

Speaker 3 (43:40):
No, it's literally just a city my doctor has been
wanting me to do, telling me it's like.

Speaker 7 (43:45):
Hey, that abandoned part of town, you gotta get that
checked out.

Speaker 2 (43:49):
Red. You're in a red state, just like your legs
just fucking fallen off. Deliver and it explained they say,
in a red state. I'm not saying I'm not saying
it's a problem other than the fact that the governance
might not be so big on the social services. Yeah,
we actually get vouchers for those, so it's not I

(44:10):
mean I get I get mine from every.

Speaker 7 (44:12):
Time she asked to scan my face that I just
felt like I was being asked to put my skull
up to a measuring device.

Speaker 10 (44:20):
It was just sit away from me.

Speaker 2 (44:23):
I thought you were going to say that it scanned,
and it just went no no.

Speaker 7 (44:26):
Every time it's like please, no, no, no, just an
oh wow, you know, would you step to the side.
You mentioned the waight here? Yeah, but what else?

Speaker 2 (44:37):
Come on? There must be a thing I.

Speaker 7 (44:40):
You know, I spent some time trying to look at
There's a lot of virtual twin digital twin stuff in
manufacturing and optimizing industrial operations, and this health system was,
uh was offshoot of this virtual twin thing where you know,
there were there were two or three boots set up
new to each other. Their idea is, if we can

(45:01):
scan you rea set up your virtual twin, you can
tweak with it, you can experiment with it. We'll give
you more insight into you. There were AI medical assistance
and AI caregivers kind of extending off what we were
talking about the other day, where it's like we are
going to give you very colorful, detailed and graphically designed

(45:23):
data and convince you to data. You know a lot
of it. It seemed to be basic metabolic.

Speaker 2 (45:30):
Stuff, the stuff you could get likely already have.

Speaker 7 (45:33):
Yes, right, but if you buy into you know, this
product or this application, buy into the ecosystem again, then
you'll be able to gain more insight into your your
stress or into concerning health.

Speaker 2 (45:47):
Next time you see one of these companies, can you
just ask a very simple question, what am I meant
to do with all this data? Be healthy? Okay?

Speaker 1 (45:55):
It metabolic health by scanning your nose?

Speaker 2 (46:00):
These ones are different, these ones? Yeah that no, not
that that's insane, that would never happen.

Speaker 1 (46:04):
Yes, yeah, yeah, yes, isn't that basically phrenology?

Speaker 2 (46:09):
Yes?

Speaker 7 (46:10):
In fact, I mean you know, yesterday I saw calipers
that was like, well, we are not a medical device,
but if you let us scan your skin, not if
you're black, because we don't have the technology for that.
But if you let us scan your skin, we can
tell what your blood sugar is, we can tell what
a host of other you know, metabolic indices are for you,

(46:32):
and we can determine what you stress is. You know,
whether you are eating correctly. What you need to do
to reind it back in?

Speaker 3 (46:38):
Well, this is that's so sorry, that's what you said
is a huge problem. I mean that's like that's.

Speaker 1 (46:45):
Currently does not support black people.

Speaker 2 (46:47):
That's yeah, insane. Microsoft Connect Baby, there was a connect
on the floor, which I don't know if you saw.
Why well, because why not? We demoed a well so
this we what is that?

Speaker 7 (47:02):
The court one the app there was like an abic
court thing where you like could ball ball up with
some people in we sports.

Speaker 3 (47:08):
It wasn't it actually wasn't that good. So I thought,
as an outsider, I always thought.

Speaker 9 (47:14):
See a snowboard game and it tests your depression levels.

Speaker 2 (47:20):
We've never had readings this high before. Your score is wellness,
we are calling your mother.

Speaker 3 (47:31):
It was so it's just a big TV or well
it was a big gaming monitor, so already we're I thought.
Ce S was like, this is where the newest, biggest
TVs are, And that's true. I don't know where they are,
but they're probably somewhere I see. I mean they're in
the Las Vegas Convention cent Yeah.

Speaker 7 (47:44):
Yeah, there were some big us.

Speaker 2 (47:45):
There's DV.

Speaker 3 (47:47):
So this instead of being a TV, this was an
eighty five inch gaming monitor. Okay, yeah, yeah, like crazy
positive reaction to what I assumed was basically an impossible
thing to use, because even like a forty inch TV
in front of your face on the desk is like crazy.

Speaker 2 (48:04):
Ye yeah, this is not a desktop. This is like
but why was sorry?

Speaker 1 (48:07):
I use a fifty inch screens like you are and
a half in front of my BA you are crazed.
I have to have to have windows at like one
hundred and fifty percent zoom.

Speaker 2 (48:18):
My ex videos corner.

Speaker 3 (48:21):
Tom is laying down on the floor dangling over it.
So it's really huge for a monitor. But also, if
you want an eighty five inch thing, just get a TV.
If you're gonna play console stuff on it, just get
a TV. You don't need the super high refresh rate.
And it's five K, it's not eight K. If you're
gonna do something stupid, make it eight K. It makes
no sense. Anyways. They seem like perfectly nice people, but

(48:41):
it's a five K eighty five inch monitor and they
had to demo it. They had like these little skis
on the ground that I stepped on to dutifully, and
I played an Xbox Connect game modded to run off
of like a little Tashiba laptop that was plugged. It
wasn't a fucking little first of all, it was my
guy kept getting messed up because they put the wood
on the on the ski slopes, which is like, why

(49:04):
would there be wood on those downslope?

Speaker 1 (49:05):
Dude?

Speaker 2 (49:06):
This is a really high on the depression score, but
why would you have that? Can we talk about the
thing though, like, so, so you were bad at the
ski game, we've established that.

Speaker 3 (49:22):
I don't think that's like that's what he said, that
saying it's the worst debated narrative.

Speaker 2 (49:28):
I don't know if I believe it, but it was.

Speaker 3 (49:30):
Yeah, it was the demo, this gaming monitor, but using
technology that's like fifteen years old.

Speaker 2 (49:34):
Didn't they just play an xpokes game?

Speaker 1 (49:36):
I don't know in the same uh kind of area.

Speaker 9 (49:39):
There was like a I tried on like an eyeglass
thing or whatever, and it was like an Android app
or something that was like nine by sixteen on like
a display, and it was very it was cropped vertically
and stuff.

Speaker 1 (49:50):
It looked very bad.

Speaker 2 (49:51):
But it was just like, you know.

Speaker 3 (49:53):
It's to Ed's point, why would you Okay, you're going
to spend a ton of money, and it's a slush
fund for the executive. Is okay, that's fine, have a
good time or whatever. Why would it not be like,
why wouldn't it not be like a finished product at
any point in the thing?

Speaker 2 (50:06):
Yeah, I just don't. It feels like, just so, if
you're demo ing a monitor, why not get something that
looks good in this start to play?

Speaker 7 (50:12):
I think one thing I've been realizing and I didn't
actually realize, is the case most of these things do
not seem to be finished, and everyone's fine with that.
I would have I actually like would look. I loved
standing next to people and listening to them as they
dealt with a fully unfinished product and be like.

Speaker 1 (50:30):
Oh well, I mean, it feels like a lot of
this stuff is like ostensibly supposed to be a preview
of what's coming, but the what's coming depends on whether
anybody pays attention to their booth.

Speaker 2 (50:40):
Yeah, so I just pardon me for interrupting here on
my podcast. I was looking through my pictures of things
that had taken pictures of today, otherwise known as the
photos app on my phone, and I found this thing
called Alisa, Your Choice, Your Companion, and just showing everyone.
It appears to be like some sort of horrifying metal
face you put you and has some sort of AI companion.

(51:01):
But I didn't read any of the highlighted characteristics, which,
by the way, is what it says, and you go.
It's a speaks your way, instantly, mimics and plays any
voice you love, big promise, expressive and natural, sinks facial
expressions perfectly with her speech and based on this image,
No it does not. I want to fuck her.

Speaker 1 (51:18):
I was just gonna say, I already predict a primary market.

Speaker 2 (51:21):
Well, Jesse, you're about to regret saying that behaves different personalities. Yes,
it behaves different personalities.

Speaker 3 (51:29):
There is a surprise from the back of attention to
detail on stuff that's written.

Speaker 2 (51:33):
Well, there is some detail you wouldn't love, from a
playful lolly to a confident bus lady, confident boss lady.
I could see myself. Yeah, well, the lollipid much smart
with a memory powered by advanced day I that remembers
and adapts more customized service in replaceable silicon facial masks.

Speaker 3 (51:51):
You just got like a Oh, so it's a physical
mass too, Yeah, but wait, is this just like a
head that's yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 7 (51:57):
Yeah, I'm showing back Sophia and we're bringing back.

Speaker 2 (52:01):
And this is tring your back body heart. So for
people who are at C yes, I think you mentioned
this before. The best ship you can find is on
the fringes. You need to go to the back. You
need to go to back and find the guy who's
like Wooden Lamp, Like, the only honest guy at CS
is the guy with And there was one there was
one that just said Felix is hot. That's true, it
is true. And I also love the names that power cube,

(52:24):
semi ink, potential convergence smart Oh I need that.

Speaker 1 (52:28):
I need that.

Speaker 2 (52:29):
And there's a whole Kurzakhstan thing. Empower your innovations with
like active polymers. Actually that sounds real. Manage your neck,
shoulders and back through acupressure, massage and moxibustin. I fucking
every time I walk around the show, I just see
ship and I'm like, what do you did? You?

Speaker 1 (52:45):
Did you see the portable air conditioner you wear around
your neck?

Speaker 2 (52:49):
It just like otherwise known as a fan.

Speaker 1 (52:52):
Last air at your ears.

Speaker 2 (52:53):
Yeah, that's a fan, we have those.

Speaker 1 (52:56):
But you you wear a fan around your neck? Huh? Yes?

Speaker 7 (52:58):
Hey, a fan is not gonna give you tenonitis.

Speaker 2 (53:01):
So I don't I have that already. I have that.
I've had that since I was a child. Every moment
is pain for me. So that's why we hit them. Yeah,
so within this AI stuff, did you find the same
thing as me, where it's just no one really knows
what they're talking about, and when you ask them questions,
they go chat GPT and if you ask them another question,
they start having a panic attack or it.

Speaker 7 (53:24):
Seems a little frustration with asking why like the AI,
And I'm like, well, it's because, like I'm trying to
figure out if your it's generative bullshit or if it's
an actual thing underneath.

Speaker 1 (53:33):
And when I'm talking to like industry experts, like analysts
or like people that like are like has like trade
associations and stuff, I get the strong sense that it's
frustrating for them too, because they're being asked to weigh
in on this market that's so nebulous and like and
like it's impossible to tell whether any of this is
actually going to pay off.

Speaker 2 (53:52):
Like it's just insane to me. We're like I was
into this shit, Like my soul is being ripped away.

Speaker 3 (54:00):
There's something for that. If you go to the convention
centers for they put the soul back into you.

Speaker 2 (54:04):
Oh yeah, actually you should.

Speaker 7 (54:05):
You should check out the demo for this human nature
thing I was talking about. You know, you can talk
to Athena, which is like the the wellness uh a
ip boons a terrible.

Speaker 1 (54:16):
I like this. I like the soul cube idea. The
thing that CS hasn't really gotten into yet is like
crystals and energies. We need to bring that.

Speaker 2 (54:23):
I actually wonder how far you could go just making
up ship.

Speaker 9 (54:26):
Get credits for how clean your soul is credit.

Speaker 1 (54:31):
Social yeah, soul based social credit system.

Speaker 2 (54:34):
I just think that I think that that's what pisses
me off. This obviously some quasi fraulture that thing. Where
is the real fraud? Where are the people? It's just like, yep,
it's the soul cube.

Speaker 9 (54:42):
Do you ever see those guys who make those devices
that are like like just measurers for like various body
ship It's like this the pseudo.

Speaker 2 (54:53):
Science right right right yeah, yeah, and they still.

Speaker 9 (54:55):
Like the e meters or whatever.

Speaker 1 (54:56):
Yeah, yeah, why aren't they here?

Speaker 3 (54:58):
I actually get scientif booth or yeah, ghost hunting technology
like your whole.

Speaker 1 (55:04):
Ghost's Probably they'll insist that CS is haunted.

Speaker 2 (55:09):
Y honestly, I want to do that one.

Speaker 1 (55:11):
Yeah, that's what the product demo fails are like. Actually,
this is a good thing.

Speaker 7 (55:16):
The ghost is telling me you should invest forty million dollars.

Speaker 2 (55:21):
It's never done that. Yeah, Tam Tom, give me your
phone right now. The ghost needs to see your idea,
what's your what's yours?

Speaker 1 (55:34):
The ghost wants to scan your badge, shut your email address. Maybe.

Speaker 2 (55:38):
Yeah, it's that's the thing, Like, I don't mind if
someone's just obviously scamming, Like, yeah, I'm a ghostbuster. I'm
a ghostbuster. I'm with the ghostbusters and that's what I
do here at CES. We spend one hundred and fifty
thousand dollars in ghostbusting and if it breaks, you just go,
you kind of ghost that's what you need us.

Speaker 3 (55:55):
Yeah, I think in reality, the real the really answer.
I think maybe you knowing more about this than me.
Probably somebody knows more than I do about something, although
it's hard to imagine. I feel like the the reason
that there's not like the level one gimmick grift guy
on the floor is because, like with everything else, there's
so many levels of detachment. Like you have a problem

(56:16):
and you want to call somebody and yell at them
about it or get it fixed, I guess if you want,
But you can't because the person you talk to is
not empowered to do anything for you.

Speaker 2 (56:23):
And that's on purpose.

Speaker 3 (56:24):
And now there's an extra layer of AI stuck in
between you and even that person. But the people who
show up on the floor, just like when you ask
what is this chat GPT, that's literally all they know
because the guy who makes the decision is so far away.

Speaker 2 (56:35):
And so it does not work. It doesn't work either, right, Yeah,
But I think actually what I'm gonna stop doing is
anytime I see AI, now I'm just going to replace
the word with ghost. Yeah, okay, ghost, just like oh
we have ghosts the machine. I might actually just stop
peaking asking people about it, and I'll be like, is
chech ghost? What's the ghost to? Just like that's chet GPT? Yeah,

(56:59):
the ghost? The spirit? How do you get the spirit out? What?

Speaker 1 (57:05):
Why would you want to spirit out? The spirit does
all the thinking for you.

Speaker 2 (57:08):
Just walk over. I'm very haunted. How are you gonna help?
I generally don't do bits with any of the people
here because just to be clear, the reason that no
one should and some listeners have brought this up like oh,
you should go and like yell at them. The poor
fuckers who are on the floor. These are PR people,
sometimes external PR people, or they're just like a marketing

(57:28):
person who, to Jesse's point, is not empowered to answer
a real question, and they have to deal with everyone
at CS, and fifty percent of the people at CS
are trying to make partnerships with other people that can't
tell you what their products do. And it's like, oh,
these and I admit, with the the company that claimed
to like be a new hope for autism and dyslexia,
I got a little heated, which is why I walked away.

(57:50):
And do you want here for this? They claimed that
they're smart glasses would help both dyslexia and autism, and
my experience with that is that's bullshit. But it's yeah,
there's a reason that you can't really put the boots
these people, And I actually think it's deliberate. They want
to put a layer of abstraction between them and the
responsibility for their thing actually doing anything. So they've got
a fucking marketing person and these people are there, and

(58:12):
they're working like ten hour days doing like just standing
there and if it's a bad show, you're just standing alone. Well,
the marketers are the real heroes, aren't they, don't you
find ye?

Speaker 1 (58:21):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (58:21):
Basically troops.

Speaker 1 (58:22):
Yeah that's what.

Speaker 2 (58:23):
Except they drops more dangerous right than the troops. Okay,
as we trundle towards the end. Edward Graso Junior. Where
can people find you?

Speaker 7 (58:31):
You can find me on Twitter and blue Sky, Big
Black Jacobin. You can find me my newsletter The Tech
Bubble dot substack dot com, and my podcast dis Mission
Kills where we talk about tech.

Speaker 2 (58:42):
Jesse Ferrah, Michael Hale. Where can people find you?

Speaker 3 (58:45):
Mike and myself host You're a Kickstarter Sucks and Mike,
did we get the custom domain on blue Sky your
kickstarter sucks dot com?

Speaker 1 (58:52):
I believe we did.

Speaker 6 (58:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 9 (58:53):
You can also find me at calls dot com, slash about,
slash people dot html.

Speaker 11 (58:59):
No.

Speaker 3 (58:59):
I think Coles took on the about page because of
the stuff that's going on.

Speaker 2 (59:02):
So you're not gonna they don't want people to find you,
Just be clear. Michael's name is commonly dog Boner, Tom
Where can people find You?

Speaker 1 (59:11):
You can find me at ibrew dot com or on
Twitter at twitter dot com, slash the Tom zone, or
on blue Sky at captured two dot beskuy dot social.
That's embarrassing, enjoyed the blue guy and was like posting
about how there's a scammer about like warning his people

(59:33):
before immediately getting banned.

Speaker 2 (59:36):
And as the listeners know, I am your cult leader
and you can find me. If there's an ad xetron,
it's probably me, unless it isn't. And if you choose
the wrong one, well that means you're not chosen. But
if you need to spend your money from your hog
slop job where you go out and you smash windows
and you steal thinks some cars and new Conn people
and you're walking around the street thinking where's my next victim, Well, well,

(59:59):
I extract value from the well when you get your
ill gotten gains, the next ads will probably be for
something you can spend them on. Ideally, you want to
operate in cash. If the's a digital you need a
prepaid debit card, email me at was it Tom dot
McKay no, sorry ed at East No, No, just a
Google crime and that's where you find my email. And

(01:00:35):
we're back and I assume you have bought or downloaded
whatever it was. They just said if you didn't, that's
a real personal insult to me, and you know, you
know how I feel about that. So we've had a
slight rotation. To my right is Tom McKay of it
Brew of course.

Speaker 1 (01:00:47):
Eh, how's it going?

Speaker 2 (01:00:48):
And actually over across from me is Max Journey of Reuters. Hello, Internet,
and thank you. I'm glad someone respects the computer. And
Jesse fer Our of your Kickstarter sucks. Of course he's back.
Well now I'll be on the left. He's on the
left as he has not been. No, okay, come on,
come on, whoa. So Max, I'm actually really excited to
have you here because we've spent like several hours just

(01:01:11):
like dunking on this. They're just like making fun of
stuff and being annoyed at stuff. But you you are
here covering chips and silicon and such. What have you seen?
What has Nvidia done? Actually that's a great point. What's
Nvidia come at this trip? Sure? Absolutely?

Speaker 12 (01:01:27):
I mean they've unveiled a few new things in terms
of silicon. Specifically, they launched a computer called Digits, which
is essentially one of their supercomputers compressed in some in
something even smaller than Mac Minnie.

Speaker 2 (01:01:40):
And that's like the three thousand dollars one, right.

Speaker 12 (01:01:42):
That's the three thousand dollars one, Yeah, exactly, And so
that that was kind of an interesting thing there. There
have been we've reported that they're going to make PC
chips themselves. So this is potentially on the road to
producing some kind of laptop or our desktop PC trip themselves.

Speaker 2 (01:02:01):
So when you say, what is this machine for? This
three thousand dollars in video compute, because I've seen a
ton of coverage but no one will actually tell me
what it's for.

Speaker 12 (01:02:09):
Well, it looks like mostly it's for researchers and people
that want to do experiments with AI or code with AI,
or essentially just do things that require giant computers sort
of on a smaller on a small scale.

Speaker 2 (01:02:27):
So is it generative AI focused or well, I mean.

Speaker 12 (01:02:31):
Of course you can run generative AI apps with it,
but they they've sort of pitched it as something that
that was geared for researchers and develop testing.

Speaker 2 (01:02:39):
Yeah, because the way it's being reported is by other
people is that it's some sort of replacement for the
large scale GPUs that are being used for like inference
for so, inference being the thing when you make a
request from chat GPT for example, and it generates NONSA.
So it's not really for that. That's not the business
use case.

Speaker 12 (01:02:57):
It didn't look like it to me. It looked like,
I mean, maybe you can run of course, I'm sure
you could probably run out on it, but of course,
but it looks like it's set up design for you know,
somebody who wants a computer in their office or I
don't know, at their university or whatever, just given the
price point. And you know, the setup it showed was
with a monitor and a keyboard and a mouse, and
so it's it's definitely like a it's like a personal computer.

Speaker 2 (01:03:20):
Effectively. It runs Linux.

Speaker 12 (01:03:22):
So that also means it's probably not a consumer machine,
right because most consumers are not gonna are not willing
to learn how to use Linux or won't do it
or whatever.

Speaker 2 (01:03:29):
So it should be able to run like eleven Chrome
tabs on it. So so I hate to do this,
Maxie mind turning a microphone just slightly. We've had a
late entrant. We've had we have the wonderful Matt Benda
who made his way up here. Thank you man, Matt,
thanks for having me.

Speaker 10 (01:03:43):
Yet it's finally we met you.

Speaker 2 (01:03:46):
Matt Bender and I have been on this podcast like
three or four times of course scam Economy.

Speaker 10 (01:03:50):
Yes, yes, and we've never met him, he's.

Speaker 2 (01:03:53):
Never met in personal and now we have he's on
my podcast. So Max, back to back to you for
a question. So what else was announced in general with
Silicon on this with the hardware in general?

Speaker 12 (01:04:02):
Absolutely, I mean the as always with the big chip makers,
they announce new PC usually Gaming Stuff and Video announced
a bunch of new new line of gaming chips, the
RTX fifty series. They're claiming the low end on that
series is able to deliver performance that's capable of what

(01:04:25):
the high end of the current RTX series really So yeah,
they use a technique called d LSS, which is just
a fancy way of saying they use AI to predict
what the next frame in the game is going to
look like. At the moment they're rendering two frames at once.
This one can render four frames it once. But it's
on the hardware side, not on the hardware side.

Speaker 2 (01:04:40):
Yeah, yeah, it's all This is all hardware. And this
is differentiated from when you say I AI. This is
separate to generative AI this. I don't know exactly how
it works, right, just because the DLSS has been around
for longer than the current boom though, yeah oh yeah
yeah ds D LSS has been around for I don't know,
four or five years. I want to say, but don't
on that on that particul we don't know things say

(01:05:00):
don't worry, but okay, let's move you up to Matt Binder.
Of course, Matt, what have you seen so far? What
have you been cursed with on this eternal trip?

Speaker 11 (01:05:09):
I've been covering a lot of like weird stuff, and
I do a lot of AR glasses And how are those?

Speaker 1 (01:05:15):
You know?

Speaker 2 (01:05:16):
Uh?

Speaker 11 (01:05:17):
I have yet to find one that I could actually
what it would actually use. Like, sure, you put them
on and they're cool to like see because some of
them have different ways of doing things, but like there
was one for example that like there's there's no lens
and usually the the it's the holiday.

Speaker 2 (01:05:33):
Glasses, and usually holiday glass holidays.

Speaker 11 (01:05:36):
So there are basically aar glasses where the mean holiday
like a name holiday.

Speaker 2 (01:05:42):
Yes that's what I'm just British, that's my problem.

Speaker 11 (01:05:44):
Yes, uh so basically the AR part isn't built into
the lens, It's built into the rim. Okay, so it's
a little like, uh a circular screen where basically put
the glasses on and your eye is meant to look
at the circular screen.

Speaker 10 (01:05:58):
Above the lens.

Speaker 2 (01:05:59):
That's where generally look.

Speaker 11 (01:06:00):
Yeah, of course, and I I couldn't use it without
going cross eyed.

Speaker 10 (01:06:05):
I immediately was.

Speaker 2 (01:06:05):
Going say, I love the experience of being heard by things.

Speaker 11 (01:06:10):
Right right, So, I mean the idea is interesting, but
you know, I think for me, though, the thing at
CES is always what's not here anymore?

Speaker 2 (01:06:19):
How do you mean?

Speaker 11 (01:06:19):
Like what like like you can see where the tech
industry thinks it's going based on what has just disappeared
from the previous years, like what buzzwords? Are companies staying
away from that they used to proudly say they were back,
you know, last year or the year before, like what
Like I came here two years ago for the first time,
and every company had to say they were doing something

(01:06:41):
in the metaverse. Hell yeah, every company was a metaverse company.

Speaker 10 (01:06:46):
And this year I don't think you could even find
the word.

Speaker 2 (01:06:49):
Well I did. I found a metaverse and quant to
my panel that I missed a panel though is there
actually any metaverse product. I don't know because I missed it,
which makes the trip of failure. So did you see
any thing you enjoyed? Was it mostly pain?

Speaker 11 (01:07:03):
I mean there's stuff that I've seen that worked, but
I don't think i'd ever heard, like, like, the weirdest
thing I saw is hands down that I don't know
if you've seen it, the electric salt spoon. No, okay,
it's by this Japanese company named Kiran, and it's actually

(01:07:23):
available in Japan, So that's already ticking off a rarity
at a ces.

Speaker 10 (01:07:28):
It's something that's actually in stores and available.

Speaker 11 (01:07:32):
So basically their goal is to let have people eat
less salt, and they want to make your low sodium
food taste saltier without actually adding salt. So how do
they make it taste better? They send an electric current
through the spoon to your tongue.

Speaker 2 (01:07:49):
So just so we're clear, Yeah, just so we're clear,
thinking to disassociate life on air, it's a special spoon.

Speaker 10 (01:07:57):
It's a special spoon.

Speaker 11 (01:07:58):
Oh good, And I mean listen, it worked. Wow, Like
the food did taste a bit saltier. And I know
because I thought at first I thought it was like
a placebo effect, like, oh, they told me it tastes saltier,
so my brain now thinks it's saltier.

Speaker 10 (01:08:12):
But then I fucked up the usage.

Speaker 2 (01:08:13):
Of Merovingian shit.

Speaker 11 (01:08:14):
Yeah, but then I messed up while using it and
it turned off midi soup.

Speaker 10 (01:08:18):
They provided, and then so my spoon broke right.

Speaker 11 (01:08:24):
So the soup actually did taste less saltier as I'm
drinking it when the machine shut off. So I was like, oh, wow,
it works. But also I would never buy this one
hundred and thirty dollars spoon.

Speaker 1 (01:08:33):
Wetter My spoon's uncharged.

Speaker 2 (01:08:36):
But actually, yeah, so did they have a battery?

Speaker 10 (01:08:39):
It was like, yeah, it was a battery powered spoon. Yeah,
so assuming.

Speaker 2 (01:08:45):
You have multiple people eating in your house.

Speaker 11 (01:08:48):
Right, So the spoon handle and the the actual ladle
or whatever you'd call it, they're separate parts, so you
can replace.

Speaker 2 (01:08:55):
Oh good, I love my spoon to be multi multiple parts.

Speaker 11 (01:08:58):
Yes, yes, safely, only two, though they could have went
really crazy with.

Speaker 2 (01:09:02):
It, so you'd need like these Was it actually one
hundred and thirty dollars?

Speaker 11 (01:09:07):
I believe it was like one hundred in Japan, though
they're not stunging in the us yet.

Speaker 2 (01:09:10):
Yeah they got money though. Yeah.

Speaker 10 (01:09:11):
Uh, I mean then the to me, it's like the ideas.

Speaker 2 (01:09:16):
I find, I must find the spoon. Where's the spoon?

Speaker 10 (01:09:18):
It was at the first night the media Knight unveiled.
I don't know where you're from.

Speaker 2 (01:09:23):
Me. I don't made a look at that spoons. You
need to buy multiple ones of these extensively. You're right, right,
some rich oss guys like, yeah, now you don't need
much salt at all.

Speaker 11 (01:09:33):
I mean you could, I guess, you know, eat your
food one at a time and just wash the spoon
after every.

Speaker 2 (01:09:38):
Year and find a bunch of people over in bath
combined with So does it work with not soup?

Speaker 11 (01:09:44):
Uh? They just had soup there to try, and I'm
assuming it's got to work with things that are not
too But otherwise.

Speaker 2 (01:09:51):
Well okay, no, no, no, no, no no.

Speaker 11 (01:09:53):
I mean what if you pick up the soup but
the spoon by what else you eating?

Speaker 2 (01:09:57):
Where you would reduce the salt that wasn't soup?

Speaker 1 (01:10:02):
A lot of a lot of things like what but
what is the thing I'm just thinking?

Speaker 2 (01:10:07):
Yeah, but like wait are you where are you adding
the salt with fried rice?

Speaker 1 (01:10:12):
Okay, that's a good point. I don't know, And.

Speaker 2 (01:10:13):
Why are you eating with a spoon? Yeah?

Speaker 11 (01:10:15):
That's fork coded like you don't need the you don't
need this one to eat ice cream, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:10:24):
So this is just a very expensive soup related technology.

Speaker 11 (01:10:27):
I mean again, Japanese company, they'd a lot of soup
over there.

Speaker 9 (01:10:31):
They do.

Speaker 2 (01:10:33):
I'm just thinking about this spoon, and I really fit.
There's always a point, a see, yes, where I begin
to go insane, when I begin to just like think
of the special salt spoon, and then I call my
therapist and I say, I'm thinking of the spoon. Anyway,
did you see anything you like? Though everyone has the
same answer, it's a it's a sigh and then a

(01:10:54):
space of time.

Speaker 12 (01:10:55):
Right, Well, hey, wait a second, I mean the some
of the chips look pretty cool.

Speaker 2 (01:10:58):
Actually yeah, I mean you take a question so Matt
can try and think of something he liked.

Speaker 12 (01:11:02):
I mean, you know, I don't you know, chill for
any of these companies, but they you know.

Speaker 2 (01:11:06):
AMD, if you liked something, please tell us, well.

Speaker 12 (01:11:09):
AMD, intele and Nvidia did all announce new Chipsbly arguably,
they all look pretty interesting for different different reasons. AMB
did something pretty unique. They added this technology called unified
memory to their latest gaming process or what is that?
Apple did it a few years ago. It basically just
makes the chip faster. It means that the memory in
this and the CPU can talk to each other much

(01:11:30):
more quickly, which allows uh, you know, more more speedy
graphics and more speedy you know, computing power. But it
is actually an interesting thing. I don't I haven't tried it.
I don't know how would have any benchmarks, so I
have no earthly idea how it performs in the real world.
But theoretically the technology is pretty good.

Speaker 2 (01:11:46):
So as I'm speaking for the listeners that don't know
stuff and myself, how does that manifest in something good?
Is it just that the hardware and the software the
hardware pots talk to each other.

Speaker 3 (01:11:56):
So I think I can take this one basically he's
trying to say it basically, is it goes like so
the chip goes into more tabs.

Speaker 2 (01:12:03):
Yeah, it's browser tabs. And to be clear, this is
for computer.

Speaker 3 (01:12:08):
Oh okay, yeah, So if you just think about whenever
you you probably have a computer at home right now.

Speaker 2 (01:12:13):
Right done, right now. But well a lot of people may.

Speaker 3 (01:12:15):
Have computers, and these chips basically can go in them,
so it's from there. It's just pretty cool stuff. Actually,
damn I love.

Speaker 2 (01:12:21):
Logan on Okay, Matt, anything enjoyable.

Speaker 11 (01:12:23):
I mean the TVs are cool like okay yah yeah,
I mean how can you and the gaming monitors that
really big curved monitors like I would never buy these
things because they cost like thousands of Oh yeah, you're
in journalism, right, right right? I mean one thing I like,
is that coming to see? Yes, it is now clear
that at least as a technology.

Speaker 10 (01:12:44):
Product, crypto is dead.

Speaker 11 (01:12:47):
There is no crulls, nothing absent completely. Now I mentioned
metaverse and like you know, metaverse is just like Zilly,
but like it is actually a breath of fresh air
to finally see that the tech industry, at least that
represented by ce S has seemed to move on, moved on.

Speaker 10 (01:13:04):
Completely from crypto blockchain.

Speaker 11 (01:13:07):
I remember two years ago, every company, whether it doesn't
matter if they were like a special electronic dental floss
company whatever, they all wanted to give you a free
NFT if you come to their booth. There is not
a single and I don't think the words n F
or T or even here at CEES.

Speaker 2 (01:13:24):
If you find them, please email me easy at Better
off Line dot Com. I want to find them and
ask them some questions. I want to know what they're
doing here, right, you know.

Speaker 11 (01:13:33):
I think people realize like this is if anything. It's
like it's a financial day trading scam. It's not a
tech product. But it's pretty cool though.

Speaker 2 (01:13:43):
It is really cool.

Speaker 11 (01:13:44):
Jesse, would you like to shif for crypto as the
crypto ex put for the show.

Speaker 3 (01:13:50):
I think it's just kind of cool because they're like
little pictures or something. So it's like, I don't know,
I just think that's like I hear what you're saying.
It's like, Okay, the tech companies have moved on from
the little pictures, but it's like we're always gonna have
little pictures, you know types you know what I'm saying,
Like it's been forever we've had these little pictures. So
I just think, like, Okay, maybe it's waned right now,
but there's gonna be a time where we come back

(01:14:10):
to CEES and we see the little pictures again, and
I think that's gonna be really cool.

Speaker 2 (01:14:15):
I think it is funny as well that like Max
is probably the only person who has been at c
S who has found the real stuff because like it's
just because you can't really fake silicon. No you can't you.
I mean, you can fake it up up until a
certain point. You can.

Speaker 12 (01:14:29):
You can rag about how good it's gonna be or whatever,
your what your what your startup's doing, and you can
claim performance. But if at a certain point you have
to send a chip to the fab and make it
and if it doesn't do what you say it will,
well then that's that.

Speaker 2 (01:14:42):
And the thing is that's really important. It's actually good
like good education for the listeners as well, is it
they give him back the microphone? Just come on, all right?
But the important it's actually important like foundation people to
know with a lot of these companies talking about like
a six so especial chips and like oh open aiy
or whomever will simply build a chip. It is not

(01:15:04):
that easy, right, it is not that easy. So what
is the process of a chip getting done?

Speaker 12 (01:15:08):
And you know a lot more about this than I
think you're letting on. I mean, and you know what
an ASIK.

Speaker 2 (01:15:12):
Is and I just don't know what it stands for, candidly,
Application specific integrated circuit Thank you, whooh someone knows stuff.
You're right, But you're really right.

Speaker 12 (01:15:23):
It's it's it's super complicated and expensive to make even
a basic AI chip, and we're talking a couple of
years from scratch, a couple of years minimum at least
half a billion dollars if you're if you're lucky, another
half a billion to build a hardware around it, because
that's something people forget often. When you make a chip,
you make the actual piece of silicon. If you look
at any Nvidia product or many others, they've got a

(01:15:44):
whole board around it with a bunch of other chips
and other stuff, and that to make that is probably
another half billion dollars. So this is these are not
inexpensive ideas.

Speaker 2 (01:15:53):
And then when it comes to the actual integration and
putting these into service, you have to do a bunch
more cooling and actual and there is failure rate as well.

Speaker 12 (01:16:01):
Absolutely, and you have to write the software on top
of it. I mean the whole way, Like having the
idea to make a chip is like it's a multi
year and if you only make one, you've just wasted
your time and money.

Speaker 2 (01:16:10):
So you have to as a company, you generally have
to do multiple.

Speaker 12 (01:16:13):
Absolutely, Yeah, you want to you want a roadmap because
that's the whole. I mean, if anybody that's buying AI
chips for any reason, they're not buying the current generation,
they're buying Gen two, Gen three and maybe.

Speaker 2 (01:16:23):
Chest thing, so they're buying ahead. Absolutely. Yeah, So I'm glad.
I'm really glad you're here for many reasons. But I
like putting this stuff down because the reason that there
is like the real and the fake parts of CS
is as I said, you can't really fake chips. You
can be like, oh, yeah, we're doing an AI stethoscope,
or we're going to claim to cure autism with VR
or whatever, but you can't really be like we're going

(01:16:44):
to do a chip because the actual chips people would
just be like, no, you're not. There is like very
clear boundaries with what you can actually do, which is
what's so interesting because you have this chunk of CS
was just the no bullshit zone because you really you
could not be making like Nvidio pumps themselves up up
and says all this stuff, but ultimately is what it does.

Speaker 12 (01:17:03):
It does have to deliver, has to exit at a
certain point. I mean, people will buy them, put them
in the field, try all the hardware, try the software,
and the claims have to a certain point live up
to there whatever they're.

Speaker 2 (01:17:14):
You know, saying. So forgive me for a very direct question,
but how realistic is it for someone like Sam Oltman
to build out an AI chip? Like how it's years ahead?

Speaker 12 (01:17:23):
Right, it's years ahead. I mean, it's more of a
talent question than a money question. I think they're only
maybe ten to twelve teams of people around the world
that can build cutting edge, world class chips, and all
of the people that lead those teams have jobs that
they probably like or enjoy, and so you have to

(01:17:45):
find the right people in order to do that. Find
disgruntle people or whatever. The reason why is why they're leaving.
But you have to assemble the right group of people
to be able to build a chip. And even if
you get the right group of people with the amount
of money that you need, there's still just risks with
building a chip like Well, you could think the design works,
you could, for example, you could virtually verify that it works,

(01:18:07):
you could test it, you could do all the computer
simulations and other simulations that you want. When you send
it to the fab to the factory to print, it
might not come out exactly how you think it will.

Speaker 2 (01:18:16):
And that will mean it doesn't work as well, it
doesn't cool as efficiently. It might not work at all.
Oh it might not. Yeah, there might be. It might
You can get like billions into this and like and
you might not. I mean it does happen frequently with
the first generation of chips. Most companies that try them
for the first time, the first version will not be amazing.
It'll do certain things effectively and well, but it probably

(01:18:40):
won't be able to achieve you know, and Video just
for example, and Videos spent twenty years, thirty years, whatever
whatever it is, you know, working on its designs. So
to expect that a company can come in in two
years replicate the performance or whatever of you know, somebody
who's been doing it for a long time, it's kind
of unrealistic. So it usually takes several generations. And Video
has their own software, Kuda, for making gus do stuff.

(01:19:01):
It took quite a while for that to kind of scale, right.

Speaker 12 (01:19:04):
I mean they started in ninety five, I want to say, yeah,
building Kuda, and they've been working on it ever since.
I mean it used to be centered around their g
fours graphics cards, and now it's obviously a little bigger.

Speaker 2 (01:19:16):
A little bigger.

Speaker 12 (01:19:17):
Yeah, I mean maybe not as big as the Electric
Soup spoon, but you potentially one day, maybe they'll have
that success and they can do more than just soup,
that's for sure.

Speaker 2 (01:19:28):
So Matt bringing back to you.

Speaker 11 (01:19:30):
But the chips you're talking about, you can't even taste, so,
I mean, come on, there are there are.

Speaker 2 (01:19:35):
There are probably chips in the spoon though, and there
are chips that the salty. So anything hurt any seen
on the you just saw it and upset you.

Speaker 10 (01:19:44):
Oh, I thought you meant physically like.

Speaker 2 (01:19:47):
I mean just walking Its pre rough, mate. I'm not
gonna lie I'm in pain, but.

Speaker 10 (01:19:51):
Geez, I need a second. I'm trying to think.

Speaker 2 (01:19:55):
Anything just upsetting or annoying.

Speaker 10 (01:19:57):
Yeah, I mean it does.

Speaker 11 (01:19:58):
It does pain me to see the AI integration and everything,
like I don't need AI to be like the most
random things like I was actually surprised that the spoon
didn't say claim AI integration or anything, you know, uh,
the smart glasses. I mean, I guess I could see
with the glasses like the AI integration for like translations

(01:20:20):
is a use case if you're someone who would wear
AR glasses to begin with. But I mean, do you
really need like generative AI and things like that, Like no, Like.

Speaker 2 (01:20:29):
I find the rape bends discussed PUDTE disgusting. I think
if you're walking around looking at things and trying to
work out using the computer or a pervert, like what
are you? What are you doing?

Speaker 11 (01:20:39):
Right?

Speaker 2 (01:20:39):
Right?

Speaker 13 (01:20:40):
Like stuff too, though, are a hugetable market market many
of them, many of them listen to the show, speaking
of which, I think this might be the first CEES
where they're the sex toy industry is here.

Speaker 2 (01:20:53):
That's the thing.

Speaker 1 (01:20:54):
Wait, they weren't here before they were.

Speaker 11 (01:20:55):
There was a huge thing a year or two ago
where some company applied for CES and they were told
we do not this industry here and they smartly, I
mean you used it to their advantage like with press,
and they were like it got tons of I think
on top of this, this was like a sex positive
woman owned business.

Speaker 2 (01:21:16):
There's nothing wrong with it.

Speaker 10 (01:21:17):
Yeah, no, nothing wrong at all.

Speaker 11 (01:21:18):
But like that company used that to their advantage and said,
like CS tells you know women owned.

Speaker 10 (01:21:23):
Sex Yeah yeah.

Speaker 11 (01:21:26):
And so for the first time I'm seeing these sex
toy companies on the floor of CES.

Speaker 10 (01:21:29):
It's like, why not I.

Speaker 2 (01:21:30):
Feel like Vegas is something, something's economically breaking. I haven't
seen the guys with the flappy cards. I didn't see
the flappy guys either, back back, get back. So these
guys who are I think it's stripped cups personally never.

Speaker 10 (01:21:45):
Heading out like the yeah, yeah, and I haven't seen.

Speaker 2 (01:21:47):
Them for years. And that the back clapping, the back
they're flipping to the clap clap. They I saw them.
They put they like took a fan.

Speaker 3 (01:21:53):
It was actually it's actually kind of nice, very industri
They took all the nasty little cards and they put
them like on a streets sign and made a little fans.

Speaker 2 (01:22:00):
Yeah, I saw that kind of cute. They have been
gone for years. In fact, they're back is probably not
a great sign. But I must be clear, there's nothing
wrong with being a perverse as long as.

Speaker 3 (01:22:09):
You don't think there's something wrong with that industry, particularly
that industry.

Speaker 1 (01:22:12):
I do not know about QR codes, like, right.

Speaker 2 (01:22:17):
You're supposed to scan the porno, right, But that's the thing.
Nothing wrong with being horny as long as it's not
anyone else it's problem. Let's go around right now. Let's
just say who's horny in the room. So ed or Nope,
not Tom, I love this. This is really good. Writers
declines comment on this one. Okay, Matt, when you walk in,

(01:22:38):
I was like, no, can we quote that? Cand I
write this up and quote.

Speaker 10 (01:22:45):
On the question of horniness, Reuters declimb.

Speaker 2 (01:22:47):
No, stop it. I'm sorry. Why did I just didn't
say anything for a minute, so I want to well,
we didn't get mad on the record here, so.

Speaker 10 (01:22:57):
Well, I can quote Mashable here Mashable very horny.

Speaker 2 (01:23:00):
My god, so sorry. Everyone every had Robert Evans listing
all the crimes I commit every every episode. Listeners were
the criminals I know. And I made a joke about
stealing stuff once and it's all that's in the reddit
and even saying this, there's gonna be another thread and

(01:23:21):
they're gonna be like, oh, I did this crime. I
run the reddit, baby, Okay, I'm on the top of
that ship.

Speaker 1 (01:23:28):
Isn't that kind of a conflict of interest? No?

Speaker 2 (01:23:30):
No, no, well yes, but no. The reddit was created
by someone called comic Con and all it was for
the first month was just like the show fucking sucks.
So I went in there and just argued with everyone.
And now it's great. They love me because they know
all fucking respond Yeah, culture of fear. Baby, So Max,

(01:23:51):
how long are you here for? How how long are
you you suffering with this? I'm leaving tonight.

Speaker 12 (01:23:55):
That's probably for the best, just enough time to see
the silicon and get out.

Speaker 2 (01:24:01):
Yeah, and then with the wholely levels then we don't
even know what kind of silicon. I'm so sorry, Max,
I'm I'm sorry. But so do you like see is
this your first how many of you? I've been twice now, right,
So how do I feel?

Speaker 12 (01:24:16):
I mean, Vegas is a is a city that I
think you just have to accept, yes, And when you
do that, especially this part of Las Vegas, then then
I think it's a lot more enjoyable, right personally, because
like I don't visit Vegas very often, you know, so
it's kind of a novelty for me. I get to
go see the crazy casinos and walk around the room,
see all the different people who were here and degenerates okay,

(01:24:41):
most yeah, exactly most so, I mean, and it is
kind of cool to see like all this technology, you know,
sort of stuck into like sixteen different convention centers or
whatever the number is these days, you know, but you
know this is visit number two. I'm saying for two days,
so I don't have the uh, you know, tenure to
be able to to talk about it like I'm a

(01:25:01):
twenty year veteran and some people certainly have.

Speaker 1 (01:25:03):
I know.

Speaker 2 (01:25:03):
I find it fascinating when people haven't got much experience
how they feel. But you also deal with the real things,
which is which is fun because everyone else is just
going and being like, yeah, I saw an AI dil though,
and I can't. They wouldn't let me use it.

Speaker 12 (01:25:18):
Well, I mean, you know, the PC chips and and
and so on. Our are pretty exciting, but a lot
of the stuff that we report on is the data
center chips that power most of AI. Right now, they
hear as well, no, this is this is all consumer stuff,
the most I mean, the biggest thing that tends to
get talked about. Now you're you know, we're talking about
things that aren't discussed or weren't discussed before, Matt or

(01:25:40):
are the these AI PCs. This is like one of
these things that the industry has been trying to make
happen for a little over a year now, and you know,
supposed to start lifting PC A PC sales this year and.

Speaker 2 (01:25:52):
What these chips meant to do.

Speaker 1 (01:25:53):
Just to be clear, I wish I could have a
good as I have the demo later today, I'll let
you know I'm clear to me.

Speaker 12 (01:26:04):
I mean I think the I mean I'm saying that
because I think the answer is is that this is
one of those situations where if you don't build the
hardware to do the thing, then nobody can make the
software to do the thing right. Right, So if you
if the capability doesn't exist, then nobody can code on
top of it to make the cool application for whatever.

Speaker 2 (01:26:18):
AI think.

Speaker 12 (01:26:19):
Okay, I'll buy that, right, Like I mean, I mean,
I have no idea if it'll succeed or not. I mean,
I don't predict the future, but I think it is
true with any generation of hardware, like for example, real
time rate tracing that in video made a few years
ago when they launched it, and real time rate tracing
just makes light look better, video game graphics look better.

Speaker 2 (01:26:34):
So for when they launched it.

Speaker 12 (01:26:36):
There was like one, yeah, I don't remember how many games,
but it was like a small handful, you know, very
very few, and you know, it was like cool, but
not widely adopted. It took until I think the video
game consoles. The Xbox Series X and the PS five
included the tech in their systems for it to become
like very widely adopted by developers. You know, So this

(01:26:56):
is I think with AIPC chips. It's like kind of similar.

Speaker 2 (01:27:00):
How long will this bubble lost? Right?

Speaker 12 (01:27:02):
I mean I would give it a few years, Like
I would give it two or three years for the
software software ecosystem to like actually build out. But I mean,
you know, at the moment, arguably the most interesting thing
that Microsoft talked about when they launched their Copilot plus
program was the what is that?

Speaker 2 (01:27:17):
Historically it's their AI PC platform.

Speaker 12 (01:27:21):
The PCs that are part of it have to have
a certain spec in order to run the applications. Was
this thing called recall, which allowed you to look back, Oh,
everyone loved that.

Speaker 2 (01:27:28):
Everybody loved that. They killed it. They're relaunching it now.
But I mean, yes, you know, so yeah, I just
it's but like you see, you.

Speaker 11 (01:27:37):
See this blowback even from like regular consumers, not just
the disgruntled people in the room right here right now,
like the five of us, but like regular consumers are
not upgrading to like Windows eleven, for example, They're choosing
to stick with the non AI operating system and like, listen,
I don't think they are aware that they're like, oh
I don't want AI for the most part. But also
the AI has not been a draw for them to

(01:27:59):
get them to upgrade, Like they don't care about it.

Speaker 1 (01:28:02):
And when it comes to enterprise stuff, especially like what
you're talking about, like trying to sell like business like
laptops with like integrated you know, I think they call
them NPUs neuroprocessing unit. Is okay, all this stuff is
already running in the cloud. I can't think of any
other like you know, sort of like function where they
offloaded it from the cloud to like your local PC. Like,

(01:28:24):
what's the business value in running chat GPT on like
your laptop?

Speaker 2 (01:28:28):
Actually I can actually answer that one in the sense
that it will kill chat GPT, because when you realize
what you can run on your laptop, you'll fuck around
with it and be like, oh, this doesn't do that matter.

Speaker 11 (01:28:36):
Yeah, there's all these like software as service companies that
are like speak and it'll text a voice right away
for you. Well, there are models that you could just
run off your computer. You don't have to pay a
monthly fee to do that. You could just literally download
the free like language model and there you go your set.
It's they don't want people to know this for real.

Speaker 1 (01:28:56):
Yeah, I mean, but in a lot of cases, you
can already run this stuff on afficiently powerful computer with
that just has like the GPU.

Speaker 11 (01:29:03):
Oh yeah, yeah, you could get right now, like a
probably a two three hundred dollars M one Macminie because
they're now at M four and even that's five hundred
bucks and your set. You could run all this stuff
right off your your silicon uh, the Macca chipset if
you want.

Speaker 1 (01:29:19):
Yeah, I just haven't seen the use cases to like
justify like these, like like buying a new generation of
AI PC's. It doesn't like really stand out to me
as so why you would do this.

Speaker 12 (01:29:29):
I mean, I think what's really going to drive people
to buy new computers is the fact that Windows ten
is end of life.

Speaker 2 (01:29:35):
Yeah, I mean, no, my dad has to buy a
new laptop of it stops the lessons. He loves his laptop.
It's like he loves this weird surface thing.

Speaker 12 (01:29:43):
Unfortunately not very funny or interesting. The fact that you know,
that's the reason why people are gonnaup grade.

Speaker 2 (01:29:47):
Also, my dad Jeff, Hi dad. You sometimes listen to
these hi head's dad, Everyone say HWI I to my
dad and Jeff, let's get a horny check on you
as well, if you don't mind not, I am going
to have to talk to my father about that.

Speaker 1 (01:30:03):
On a scale of chase.

Speaker 2 (01:30:04):
To Randy to tell. I'm going to tell the group
chat I have with my siblings that I am shortly
going to have to find out morning.

Speaker 10 (01:30:15):
That is, I can go down to that power they
hook your dad up with.

Speaker 2 (01:30:19):
I need you to send me the booth numbers chat.

Speaker 1 (01:30:21):
I'm going to FaceTime your dad right now.

Speaker 2 (01:30:25):
It's ten pm in GMT. Just going for that. Okay,
we've got to wrap up them. So Tom McKay, where
can people find you?

Speaker 5 (01:30:33):
Uh?

Speaker 1 (01:30:34):
You can find me at ibrew dot com. You can
also find me on Twitter at Twitter dot com, slash
the Tom zone or x dot com whatever and uh
on blue sky as cattured two dots guy do at
social so good.

Speaker 2 (01:30:47):
So I bet you're loving that you chose that name.

Speaker 1 (01:30:50):
I am not. It's so good. I'm on a bunch
of blacklists. I remember everybody thinks that I'm the Actually.

Speaker 2 (01:30:56):
I remember when you picked it, being like he is
going to get by people. It's so good, Max Chenney
web can people find you anywhere where there's a chip?
But Okaynell, that's not even factually true. And what's great?
By the way, my brother just responded to the thing
of I am surely My other brother responded with, what
the fuck? I can't wait to explain why my dad
is going to have to do a horny check to

(01:31:18):
my siblings. Max to Cheney, weckon people find you, Sorry
at Churn and burn on X and Blue Sky and
then on LinkedIn. If you want, just look look up
my name. Very good, Matt Band to weaken people find you.

Speaker 11 (01:31:29):
First of all, I'm sorry for bringing up the sex
toys being at CES this year, but yeah, you.

Speaker 10 (01:31:34):
Can find me well my Mashable.

Speaker 11 (01:31:35):
My CES coverage will be at mashablemashable dot com, and
you can find me on you know, all sorts of
social media, Blue Sky X, the Everything app, threads at
Matt Bender, very good, Jesse for wrong.

Speaker 3 (01:31:48):
Yeah, your Kickstarter sucks is the podcast go off Kings
is my stream, Yeah, and I'm not on the everything app,
but yeah on Blue Sky, jessefar dot com.

Speaker 2 (01:31:56):
I probably need to change the episode links because I
linked to you on x and I'm of course ed Zeitron.
I am now going to have a very uncomfortable conversation
with several of my siblings about this episode. Thank you
for listening to the first part of the two part
Day three Better Offline CS experience was so grateful for you.
We love you all. I am ed Zeitron. You can
find me everywhere where it says ed Zeitron, other than

(01:32:19):
the parts that make me look bad. Thanks for listening
and we'll see you soon. Thank you for listening to
Better Offline.

Speaker 5 (01:32:32):
The editor and composer of the Better Offline theme song
is Mattasowski. You can check out more of his music
and audio projects at Mattasowski dot com, m A T
T O S O W s ki dot com. You
can email me at easy at Better offline dot com
or visit better offline dot com to find more podcast
links and of course, my newsletter. I also really recommend

(01:32:54):
you go to chat dot Where's youreed dot at to
visit the discord, and go to our slash.

Speaker 2 (01:32:58):
Better Offline to check out our reddit. Thank you so
much for listening.

Speaker 6 (01:33:03):
Better Offline is a production of cool Zone Media. For
more from cool Zone Media. Visit our website coolzonmedia dot com,
or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you get your podcasts.

All Episodes

Better Offline CES 2025: Day 3 - Pt. 1

Episode Transcript

Host

Ed Zitron

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Better Offline CES 2025: Day 3 - Pt. 1