February 25, 2025 • 37 mins
Today's guest is award-winning filmmaker Stephanie Calabrese, producer and director of the documentary feature film, "UNSPOKEN".
UNSPOKEN explores the racial divide in America, through the experiences of one small southern town. Resident filmmaker Stephanie Calabrese offers an insider's perspective and an intimate journey that digs deep into the roots of this divide, entrenched by the 1946 Moores Ford Lynching, and the impact of racial injustice on the community.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Can a town marked by the last mass lynching, make
peace with its past. Unspoken is a documentary feature film
that traces the journey of resident Stephanie Calabrisse, who picks
up an iPhone camera to uncover baried truths and explore
how the community has been impacted by its racial divide
through the lens of her own whiteness. Stephanie's foray into
(00:20):
filmmaking offers an intimate insider's look at the impact of
the nineteen forty six quadruple lynching, segregation and integration through
today in Monroe, Georgia, and shatters a code of silence
that has distanced neighbor from neighbor for generations. Our guest
is writer, director, producer, editor, and cinematographer Stephanie Calabresse. She
(00:42):
is an award winning interdisciplinary artist and filmmaker. Her photography
series Hometown, a documentary of Monroe, Georgia, featured on the
New York Times Lens site in twenty seventeen, helped inspire Unspoken,
the very film we are discussing today.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
This is the BLAE Information Network daily podcast.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
I am your host, Rams's job, All right, Stephanie Calabrese,
Welcome to today's show.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
How are you doing today?
Speaker 3 (01:10):
I'm doing great. Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
It's a pleasure to have you here.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
So around here, what we do is we try to
introduce our guests to our listeners. Often we use our
guests to do that. So I've given you a little
bit of background, but you know, just so that our
listeners are a little bit more familiar with who they're
listening to today. Talk to us a little bit about
your background. Maybe you know where you grew up, went
(01:35):
to school, what inspired you to walk the path that
you're walking right now.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Just a little bit more about yourself.
Speaker 3 (01:40):
Yeah, sure, Well I was actually born in New Jersey.
I lived there until I was about twelve years old.
I would say not super urban, but fairly urban community.
Lots of pockets of different cultures, you know, Polish, Jewish, Italian.
And I moved to the South when I was about
thirteen years old with my family and moved to South Carolina.
(02:05):
It was definitely culture shock, a very different environment. And
I think, you know, one of the things that really
struck me in moving to South Carolina was sort of
the heat of racism. I mean I could feel that immediately.
I moved to the state, so I had my high
school years in South Carolina. I went to the University
(02:27):
of Georgia, moved to Atlanta after that, and then out
to Monroe, Georgia, which is about an hour east of Atlanta,
in a much more rural environment.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Sure, so talk to us a little bit about why
you created this film, or maybe why you thought this
film was, why you thought this story was necessary to tell.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
Yep, Well, I'd spent much of my career doing documentary work,
documentary photography and video work, and I think and travel
to different parts in the world, all over the country
doing this work. And you know, I realized right around
twenty sixteen, twenty seventeen that I had spent very little
(03:12):
time studying my own community, and so I started with
a documentary photography project, just shooting moments in the town.
That was the piece that was shared in the New
York Times, and one of the commenters on that post
that they did about the series mentioned that it felt
(03:32):
like a romanticized version of the town and neglected to
talk about racial injustice that had happened there, particularly the
more sport lynching. And so, you know, I remember reading
that comment and thinking, you know what, there's a lot
that I don't know. And it began to kind of
set me on a path to dig in deeper, to see,
(03:55):
you know, what's beneath the surface of these you know,
sort of cool and poignant things we see in the town,
like what's under it? And that started the journey.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Sure, if I may, When when did this take place?
When did you start? You know this this filming?
Speaker 3 (04:12):
I started filming in twenty eighteen, and I really didn't
set out to create a documentary future film. I didn't
have like a storyline or even an outline. I thought
initially I would create a short piece that would document
the Morse Forward lynching story. It was a story that
was not talked about here in our community, and I thought,
(04:33):
let me just make a little piece that I could
at least share in the community to help educate people
about what happened here. And so yeah, I started on
that journey in twenty eighteen, and as I began to
kind of uncover that story, it started to, you know,
kind of shape its way into a lot of different
(04:55):
threads about segregation here in this community, the integrated of school,
and I just kind of kept following the thread and
it actually became a film.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
Now, now, how about this. On the other side of
that question is when did you wrap principal photography?
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Give me a timeline.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
There, say again, when did you wrap you know, principal
all the shot?
Speaker 3 (05:22):
Yeah, yeah, So I began shooting in twenty eighteen. I
thought I was done in twenty twenty. So when COVID hit,
I already sat down, I was editing, I was going
through forty interviews I had shot. And then the George
Floyd tragedy happened, and there were protests here Monroe, Georgia,
And as long as I've lived here, I've never seen
(05:44):
a protest against racial injustice here in our community. And
I thought, you know what, the story is not done.
So I shot that and continued to sort of leave
the story open for another six months until the ending
was very clear. And I don't want to spoil the
ending of the film, but I stopped shooting, I would say,
(06:06):
at the end of twenty twenty.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
The reason I ask is because I feel like at
some point you had to come to terms with the
fact that there was an attack, a full frontal attack
on the telling of the fullness of American history. Rebranded
as critical race theory, you had to confront the fact
(06:32):
that this country was moving toward book burnings and book
bannings and things like this that really encapsulated the fullness
of American history, and that intersection may have been challenging
for you. And I guess my next question is who
(06:57):
did you make this film for? Who were you wanting
to see this film?
Speaker 3 (07:02):
You know, I would say right around twenty sixteen, so
before I started shooting the film, I began to sort
of have more heart to heart conversations with my black friends.
So there was a lot of much more vocal racism
(07:23):
happening in our country. I say vocal from very high
levels right around twenty sixteen, and so it began to
kind of scratch the surface of me thinking, you know what,
like I've always thought that there are laws in place
to protect everyone. I always thought that, you know, the
(07:43):
civil rights movement was behind us, racism is largely behind us.
I felt that way for really much of my life.
And I would say twenty sixteen is when you know
that Veneer started to sort of crack yes in those conversations.
You know, I started thinking, like I go, gosh, okay,
there's a lot that I don't know, and it kind
(08:04):
of started on a journey of listening to podcasts like
code Switch, you know, watching documentary films, reading books like
really immersing myself to learn as much as I could
about black history, about what people in this country have
been experiencing. That was, you know, beyond my perspective, and
(08:26):
it was wildly helpful and insightful and absolutely fueled the
creation of the film.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
If I may, I work in the ally Ship space,
and you know, my co host, we we work in
the ally Ship space.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
That's what we call it.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
We have a radio show that we do as well,
and that it exists to foster Allyship. We intentionally targeted
where non black people will participate in black culture because
we feel like they're more likely to receive a message
(09:08):
as opposed to just kind of having it in only
a decidedly black space. I say that to say that
working with allies, allies, you know, they have varying levels
of allyeship. You know, we all have varying levels of
engagement with many things in our lives, and we don't
hold that against people. And you know, some people they
(09:32):
show up and they want to be the star of
the show. Some people want to show up and you know,
hinder the movement, or they want to tell us how
we should you know, protest and fight for our own
you know, path forward. Some people, you know, and rarely
do I have a conversation with someone with such humility,
someone who really authentically shows up as as my sister,
(09:53):
as our sister. And so I wanted to take a
moment to say to you that I appreciate that either
you know, this is a story that you don't need
to tell, and you're telling it and that feels special,
you know.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
Appreciate that.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Oh yeah, of course, of course.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
And you know, for some people, you know, I was
having a conversation the other day with a friend of mine.
For some people, it's it's very easy to just live
their life. They kind of already won the game, or
won much of the game, I should say. Now, everybody
has their own struggles, but they're not starting behind the
start line in a manner of speaking, they're starting kind
(10:31):
of right at the zero, and they get to run
the race fair and so forth.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
They don't have hurdles and roadblocks.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
They're not starting ten feet behind everyone else and the
and so for those people to take a moment to
tell a story like this one for those people to
take a moment to sit in the middle of their
reality and acknowledge that, Hey, these scores of people from
this other tribe are telling us something and they're not.
(10:57):
This cannot be collective delusion, This cannot be collective victim mentality.
There's got to be something here, uh that that in
today's climate is rare and it should be acknowledged. And
so again I wanted to take a moment to say
that the human being in me appreciates the human being
in you, and and so again that that needs to
(11:17):
be pointed out.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
And so let's take that a little bit further.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
You know, you were talking about you know who we're
asking rather who you were hoping to see the film.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
Let's let's go a little further with that.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
What what impact are you hoping the film will have
on the people who ultimately do see it?
Speaker 3 (11:38):
Yep. Well, first I want to say I appreciate you,
Thank you so much for those words, super generous, grateful
for it. I'm grateful for your show and everything that
you have to share too, for I made this film honestly,
you know, for people like me. I think you know,
(12:00):
when we listen to Doctor King's you know reference of
like the white majority. That's really who this film is for.
And I think, you know, much of my life I've
lived in what I'll call a blissful ignorance, not a
blissful life, but in ignorance to what you know, many
(12:20):
of my friends have experienced their parents, their grandparents, and
you know, it is a really happy life to just
walk around and think everything's great, and to focus on
your own family, and focus on your own work and
your own you know, social calendar. And I think that
it's also somewhat it's a very selfish existence. And while
(12:46):
it is, you know, you're putting yourself in a position
to feel great pain when you actually pay attention and
listen and take these stories in very deeply. And honestly,
it wasn't until I really spent the time talking with
people about this film and hearing their stories and hearing
their tragedies, and honestly, you know, I'm pissed that it
(13:08):
took that for me to get it right. I mean,
to have Dorcus Jernigan, who integrated schools here, for her
to have to tell me her stories of kids stealing
her books, you know, and feeling unwelcome in the lunch room,
like I'm pissed that I had to hear Johnny Smith
tell me about how he got run out of a
gym for wanting to play basketball with white boys, like
(13:31):
I hate it that I needed that level of depth
and human to human connection to hear those stories for
it to really like pierce my heart. And I tried
to really convey that in this film because I know
how much it moved me and hearing these truths even
though it was difficult to hear, like I am hoping
(13:52):
that if people hear what I heard, that it will
move and change them as well, and change them in
the way that they think about their relationships, the way
that they think about their own life, the decisions they make,
you know, where they do business, who they choose to
do business with. I hope it changes people like me.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
We are here today with writer, director, producer, editor, and
cinematographer of the film Unspoken, Stephanie Calabrese.
Speaker 2 (14:27):
You know, I think that again, that is a very
special intentional.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
Move to make when you're making a film that is
targeted toward people who have lived your experience, who people
who they see a couple of points. They hit the highlights. Okay,
black people were slaves. That's not our favorite. Then there
was a civil rights movement. It's gipping over Jim Crow
(14:58):
and all the terrorism it took place for, you know,
all that time in the South and the rest of
the country as well, but primarily in the South. Civil
rights movement. I have a dream. Okay, now black people
are more or less equal. And then Obama, Okay, racism
is all the way over. You know, they hit the highlights,
and then they're good to make a film for those
people where you know, they don't feel.
Speaker 2 (15:25):
Racism in their day to day lives. They cannot feel it.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
They can be generally aware of it, but the people
they know who are racist don't typically interact with the
people who they can impose any sort of fear on
or terror.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
Or restrictions or anything like that.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
And so they think, in their mind, Okay, these people
are old and they're going to die off right, these
people are not subjected to forces because racism, You're right,
it has kind of.
Speaker 2 (15:59):
It has what's the word I'm looking for, evolved.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
It has been relegated to the shadows less so lately,
but for the most part that has been the trend
in this country, and so because it isn't as visible,
because it isn't front page news every single week, many
people like yourself, once upon a time, feel like we're
in a post racial society because that's a more comfortable
(16:26):
thought for them to think of it. And then when
they ignore, either willingly or they're just based on their
own ignorance, they cannot know. But otherwise they are ignorant
to the reality of the situation. They're ignorant to the
(16:47):
forces of housing discrimination, They're ignorant to the forces of
the lack of the teaching we discussed earlier in the call,
where you know the fullness of black history isn't taught,
and therefore context is not taught, and therefore there end
up being microaggressions in the workplace. People harbor prejudices more
easily because they cannot know. And of course, in this country,
(17:09):
most of the money, most of the power is concentrated
in the hands of white men, overwhelmingly wealthy, healthy Christian
and they themselves can live a life not knowing that
they are racist.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
I believe that to be true. Those are my brothers
as well.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
And they can impose racist restrictions the decisions, you name
it on communities. These are your police, these are your judges,
these are people in power, your CEOs, etc. Because people
are not aware of the history of this country. They're
not aware of how the GI Bill was disseminated unfairly
and black people were left out of that because they're
(17:47):
not familiar with redlining, because they're not familiar with, you know,
the War on drugs and how that disproportionately affected you know,
black people and hippies and disrupted those communities for you know, political.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
Political agenda. And you know, that's a long list.
Speaker 1 (18:02):
We can talk about healthcare, we talk about education, we
could talk about environmental racism, we could talk about a
number of things.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
That's a long list there. Because many people aren't aware
of all.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Those things, they will often assume that a lot of
this stuff is imagined. And you can look at individuals.
You could look at Ramses, you could look at Michael Jordan,
you could look at Oprah, you could look at Lebron
and say, well, these guys have all this money. You know,
Ramses is successful. He as his own show. You know,
I wish I had a show. I wish I could
play ball like Jordan and they're not looking at the
(18:32):
data which suggests, hey, this community is doing way better
than this community, and we can make some connections as
to why this community benefited from this community. And this
community never had an honest shot. They never had the
forty acres, nor did they have the mule.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
Right.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
So well, all that said, it's only going to be effective.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
If people are ready to have that conversation.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
And that's not a question that I expect you to
be able to give me a full answer to. But
help us out. Take us into Monroe. Tell us how
Monroe is today. Are they kind of still the way
that they're depicted in the film, because we're all kind
of assessing, politically speaking, what journey lies ahead, and to
(19:21):
know what's going on in Monroe today will certainly give
us some insight into whether or not the people may
be ready to have this conversation. And if so, maybe
there's some hope we can have there in fact, and
we'll know otherwise.
Speaker 3 (19:37):
Well, you know, and I'll tell you the stories that
I tell from Monroe. I mean, you can clone stamp
and it's happened all of the United States. Oh yeah, right,
the rise of private schools. You know, in the sixties,
when you know, schools are integrated. I'm integrated. So you know,
Monroe is really not unique, you know, in a lot
(20:01):
of ways. So I think what's happening in a row,
you know, may be an indicator of what could be
happening in other areas around the country. I think in general,
and obviously I can't speak for all white people, but
I think that I think that people number one, are
resistant to change, and I think people also have sort
(20:24):
of an innate defensiveness when it comes to conversation around racism.
Right as soon as you hear, you know, someone talking
about racism or racist, the first thing that some white
person's going to most white people do is back up,
you know, and defend themselves. And what I hope, what
(20:45):
I wish is that people would be more curious about
those conversations. Right, So instead of the knee jerk of
well I'm not racist, this is not racist, that's not racist,
let's be curious about it, right, Let's say, well, gosh, okay,
help me understand that. What are you feeling, what are
you experiencing? Like, Let it be more of a conversation
(21:06):
of curiosity. What can I learn from you? What don't
I know, of course, me as a white person, I
can't even understand the depths and a true definition of racism, right.
I might experience some challenges being a woman largely in
male dominated careers in my history, but in terms of racism,
you know, no, I'm not the expert on that. So
(21:30):
I think that I think that the film in our community.
You know, I was really worried. I was scared. I
didn't know how my community would react to it. I
assumed a lot of people would be unhappy about it.
I assumed a lot of people would be upset with me,
right for churning up this history, for trying to have
these conversations, And you know, honestly, I was pleasantly surprised.
(21:54):
We had four screenings here, all were sold out. We
had a nice diverse crowd, I would say at most
of the screenings, but I'll say majority white people came
to the screenings. We had a community dialogue that was
led by Hailey Smith, who's the director of Diversity Inclusion
(22:16):
at Very College here in Georgia. She led that for us.
That was an excellent engagement. We had fifty people from
the community, very heartfelt stories. Connections were established so I
felt a lot of hope that people seem to be
interested to see the film, to take it in, to
tell other people about it, to come to the dialogue.
(22:40):
You know, am I seeing great change in the community
as a result of it? No, I would say no.
I mean, we have gentrification happening here, just like many
cities all over the country. But I think on a
human to human level, I see changes when I have
conversations with individuals who've seen the film, and that me hope.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
Yeah, I'd argue that that's more impactful because if you
can see people's you know, light bulb turning on, and
you know, people backing down off of that, you know,
that kind of knee jerk defense that they.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
Enact.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
When you know, pressed on those issues, you start to
have a real conversation. Indeed, you know, personally speaking, I am.
I had a conversation with a friend of mine and
I learned what the experience of a straight white Christian
(23:44):
man is like. And you know, it's important, you know,
it's it's it's it's important to recognize nobody gets out
of here unscathed. And so even for that person, this
person who is a business owner, this person who is
again white male, you know, an imposing figure. You know,
(24:06):
for the most part, you know Christian or you know,
from that background. Whenever this individual has a challenge, the
last thing that they want to hear is that they
have some sort of privilege.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
They're like, you know, I'm working hard. What I wish
I had some privilege right for that person.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
When they're when they're pressed on, you know, challenging you know,
racism in their own you know, lives in their own minds,
they're like, look, man, this I was given this system,
the same as everyone else, and I'm doing my best
to try to make the most of it.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
If anything, blame the forces of capitalism.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
And while their argument, in my opinion, is not well
founded by that, I mean founded in.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
Human decency and.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
You know, human connection, they can make a case that,
you know, their priorities are different from mine, and that
they are trying to survive or trying to thrive or
whatever the case is. And understanding that allowed me to
understand how they indeed distance themselves from their responsibility in
the equation their influence, the gravity that they have, and
(25:20):
when you add to that that they have, they're very
very easily to manipulate because everyone's pointing at them like
they're the source of all that plagues the world in
their estimation, and they can then, you know, be manipulated
very easily to say, hey, look, you know, these are
(25:44):
the people that are really the source of your problems.
These are the people that are blaming you for you
know whatever. And everything was fine the way that it
was before before all of this started happening, and that
started happening, it's easy for them to find a sense
of unity where they feel like they belong and they
feel like they're not attacked, and they will vote for
(26:07):
a figure like a Donald Trump because Donald Trump will
slow the dispossession of the United States from white men
if his policies are fully implemented, meaning that these white
men that we have these conversations with will.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
Still be able to.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
Hold on to the power that they feel like they're
desperately clinging to now. So sharing in a lot of
instances feels like a step, like a bridge too far.
You know, they look, this is all I got. If
everybody's gonna hate me, at least I can move around,
you know what I mean. And so their lives are
complicated as well, and understanding that again the human in
me says Okay, well, I appreciate you listening. This is
(26:52):
going to be a twelve part series, but we had
a first foot and that's not nothing. And so to
your point about you know, people kind of changing on
an individual level rather than just kind of everybody watched
this and now we've cured racism, I think that would
be kind of more naive for us to think that.
But to know that the film is having some impact,
(27:14):
I think that that matters. Now we've talked a lot
about the film, let's talk about where people can go to.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
Get the film.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
You know, that's that's for you, and then of course
I want you to share your social media. I'm not
done talking to you, but you know, let's make sure
we get this in here.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (27:33):
I appreciate that. Well, people can sort of follow the
film on the film website, which is just unspoken dot film. Currently,
if you have a library card or student ID and
either your library or the school has a Canopy subscription,
you can watch the film now. So it's available in
those two channels video on demand distribution I'm still working on.
(27:56):
It's also broadcasting on GPB, which is Georgia PBS station
and so it airs periodically. So if you sign up
for email updates on the film site, I always send
emails when the next screening is happening or when VOD
distribution will be there. So that's a great way to
stay connected to see it if you don't have access
(28:17):
to it right now.
Speaker 1 (28:19):
Got it? And I don't know if this is going
to come out the way that I want to, but
for folks that are concerned about what they feel is
a growing divide in this country, perhaps since about twenty sixteen,
(28:41):
we'll call it twenty fifteen, because there was a whole
campaign there. Do you think that this film will provide
inside perspective context, maybe a historical framework that helps people
to further understand kind of how we ended up where
(29:02):
we are.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
Yes, absolutely, I truly do, you know. I think I
think really understand. You know, it's like has the divide
gotten greater? I don't know, but you know what it's
it's clearly present. I think it's always been present. I
think that around twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen, uh, it was
(29:26):
much more vocalized at very high levels in our country.
So I think the film truly helps and for me,
you know, it's really understanding the history, because if you
understand the history, then you you can you can understand
why we still have problems today. I mean, many people
(29:48):
in our country who still live during a time of
segregation and the integration of schools are still with us today.
So it's very much a present day challenge. And so
the challenges in the trauma that those people experienced, I mean,
being told you can't go to the counter to order
a sandwich, you got to go to the back door
(30:09):
and knock at the back door and pay your money
and wait. I mean, and that's just a small example.
I mean incredible trauma that people have experienced in the
country who live here today, alive today, their children, their grandchildren.
That trauma passes down. And so I think when when
you it's like you know, when you were talking about
(30:31):
conversations with your friend, I mean and white people saying,
you know that they hate the concept of white privilege
and I'm working hard too, And I mean, I think
it's like, I hope people understand that, you know, both
things can be true. We can still be experiencing our
black communities can be experiencing incredible racism today, and white
(30:56):
people can be working hard. You can have white privilege
and you can be working hard like those two things
can exist together. And I think without a doubt, if
you understand the history, it gives you much more context
to understand why we still have challenges today.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
Yeah, yeah, no, I appreciate that. I think that where
I am now, you know, this is a journey. We're
all we're all on a human journey having a human experience, right, Yes,
where I am now is you know, Historically on this show,
I've been very critical of a capitalistic model, of capitalistic
(31:35):
framework for society. But you know, I don't think anyone
one model economic model is without its laws.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
But this is the one that we have. This is
the idea that has one out soil.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
We're here, and a consequence of that is everybody is
always pushing for themselves. Everyone is all you know what
I mean, And there's less in the way of community,
there's less than the way of love, and a lot
more human of the experiences. So we have an iPhone,
but overall we're less happy as a species in this
(32:10):
at least in this country, right And so you know
it's an iPhone is very shiny and we can be like, man,
I can't live without my iPhone because we're now addicted
to that. But you know, we laugh less, right, and
we're more isolated, and we use our own we hear
our own voice less. Because we have less friends, we
spend more time alone. And so you know what, really,
(32:31):
what has the human experience become as a result of
capitalism and now and to your point, a divide can
exist and indeed grow, it can become very cancerous. And
so you know, here we are, and you know there
are people like me that have to be aware of
that because I walk this afro into every room I
(32:52):
go into, and there are people like you that go
out of your way. I would imagine to make yourself
aware of it and indeed try to enlighten other folks.
And you know, for me, is it is part and
parcel to my existence. I was born this way, I'll
die this way, my children will be this way. For you,
it is that doesn't necessarily have to be true. We
(33:13):
saw the way that you know, white women voted in
the past election and in the election in twenty sixteen.
And you know, in twenty sixteen, there was a gentleman
talking to the would be president and the president said,
you know, you can just walk up to them and
grab him by the blank. And then women still supported
(33:37):
that man, white women especially, And so that to me
suggested it is not impossible for white women to say,
you know what, I'm close enough to the source to
where I don't have to walk my own path. I
could just latch onto to my husband's or my sons
or my father's or whatever, you know, and as long
(33:58):
as there's he's doing, okay, I'll be. I don't need
to be self determined in this way. And so this
is just the world that I'm going to live in
and actually push for that, And then there are other
white women who say, no, absolutely, that is not how
things should be. I am, indeed a homo sapient sapien.
I am able to determine my own path forward, and
(34:19):
I do not need to be subjected to anyone who
speaks like that, nor anyone who you know, moves in
that way or whatever. And and you know, I would
imagine that to stake out on your own and to
decide that, you know, I'm going to take the more
(34:40):
challenging path because it holds a greater reward for me.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
In terms of my.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
You know, my my self image. You know my sense
of what I can accomplish on my own and my story.
You know, it's a tougher path, and you know, we
welcomed everyone, but it's a it's indeed a tougher path.
And for a person like you who chose I would
imagine chose that path. You know again, it just it
(35:09):
feels very special, and so I couldn't let you go
without just restating that one more time before you go. Please,
you know, share whatever social media emails, website again for
how people can get the film, and let's make sure
that you know, folks can can actually get out there
and support that film.
Speaker 3 (35:27):
Yeah, that sounds great. The film website is Unspoken dot film.
You can also follow me on Instagram LinkedIn always sharing
information about the film there too. It's just at Stephanie
Calibrays in Instagram at Little Purple Cow.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
Purple cow is that a marketing term?
Speaker 3 (35:51):
Well, you know what, when I first moved here, it
was very much a rural community, so lots of cows everywhere,
and I never felt like the other cows. Okay, gotcha,
that's where they came from.
Speaker 1 (36:06):
Yeah. I had to read a book when I was
in college about there was a marketing book. I went
to school for marketing, my undergrad marketing, my master's in management.
But we had a it was a book about a
purple cow or something like that, so I just kind
of made the connection. But anyway, I want to thank
you again for for your time and that awesome h Instagram.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
Handle as well. That was pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (36:29):
I gave me a little laugh, and you know, I
can't wait for all of us to get out there
and check out the film. Please come back as you
continue to release more works, especially if it's you know,
stuff that we can help you promote. I hope that
that we can work on our sibling ship here, yeah,
(36:49):
foster growth. I think that would be very special. So
I'll let you get back to your life once again.
Today's guest is writer, director, producer, editor, and cinematographer of
the film Unspoken, Stephanie Calabrese.
Speaker 3 (37:02):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
This has been a production of the Black Information Network.
Today's show was produced by Chris Thompson and q Ward.
Have some thoughts you'd like to share, use the red
microphone talkback feature on the iHeartRadio app. While you're there,
be sure to hit subscribe and download all of our episodes.
I am your host Ramsey's Jaw on all social media
and join us tomorrow as we share our news with
(37:25):
our voice from our perspective right here on the Black
Information Network Daily podcast
Can a town marked by the last mass lynching, make
peace with its past. Unspoken is a documentary feature film
that traces the journey of resident Stephanie Calabrisse, who picks
up an iPhone camera to uncover baried truths and explore
how the community has been impacted by its racial divide
through the lens of her own whiteness. Stephanie's foray into
(00:20):
filmmaking offers an intimate insider's look at the impact of
the nineteen forty six quadruple lynching, segregation and integration through
today in Monroe, Georgia, and shatters a code of silence
that has distanced neighbor from neighbor for generations. Our guest
is writer, director, producer, editor, and cinematographer Stephanie Calabresse. She
(00:42):
is an award winning interdisciplinary artist and filmmaker. Her photography
series Hometown, a documentary of Monroe, Georgia, featured on the
New York Times Lens site in twenty seventeen, helped inspire Unspoken,
the very film we are discussing today.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
This is the BLAE Information Network daily podcast.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
I am your host, Rams's job, All right, Stephanie Calabrese,
Welcome to today's show.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
How are you doing today?
Speaker 3 (01:10):
I'm doing great. Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
It's a pleasure to have you here.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
So around here, what we do is we try to
introduce our guests to our listeners. Often we use our
guests to do that. So I've given you a little
bit of background, but you know, just so that our
listeners are a little bit more familiar with who they're
listening to today. Talk to us a little bit about
your background. Maybe you know where you grew up, went
(01:35):
to school, what inspired you to walk the path that
you're walking right now.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Just a little bit more about yourself.
Speaker 3 (01:40):
Yeah, sure, Well I was actually born in New Jersey.
I lived there until I was about twelve years old.
I would say not super urban, but fairly urban community.
Lots of pockets of different cultures, you know, Polish, Jewish, Italian.
And I moved to the South when I was about
thirteen years old with my family and moved to South Carolina.
(02:05):
It was definitely culture shock, a very different environment. And
I think, you know, one of the things that really
struck me in moving to South Carolina was sort of
the heat of racism. I mean I could feel that immediately.
I moved to the state, so I had my high
school years in South Carolina. I went to the University
(02:27):
of Georgia, moved to Atlanta after that, and then out
to Monroe, Georgia, which is about an hour east of Atlanta,
in a much more rural environment.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Sure, so talk to us a little bit about why
you created this film, or maybe why you thought this
film was, why you thought this story was necessary to tell.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
Yep, Well, I'd spent much of my career doing documentary work,
documentary photography and video work, and I think and travel
to different parts in the world, all over the country
doing this work. And you know, I realized right around
twenty sixteen, twenty seventeen that I had spent very little
(03:12):
time studying my own community, and so I started with
a documentary photography project, just shooting moments in the town.
That was the piece that was shared in the New
York Times, and one of the commenters on that post
that they did about the series mentioned that it felt
(03:32):
like a romanticized version of the town and neglected to
talk about racial injustice that had happened there, particularly the
more sport lynching. And so, you know, I remember reading
that comment and thinking, you know what, there's a lot
that I don't know. And it began to kind of
set me on a path to dig in deeper, to see,
(03:55):
you know, what's beneath the surface of these you know,
sort of cool and poignant things we see in the town,
like what's under it? And that started the journey.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
Sure, if I may, When when did this take place?
When did you start? You know this this filming?
Speaker 3 (04:12):
I started filming in twenty eighteen, and I really didn't
set out to create a documentary future film. I didn't
have like a storyline or even an outline. I thought
initially I would create a short piece that would document
the Morse Forward lynching story. It was a story that
was not talked about here in our community, and I thought,
(04:33):
let me just make a little piece that I could
at least share in the community to help educate people
about what happened here. And so yeah, I started on
that journey in twenty eighteen, and as I began to
kind of uncover that story, it started to, you know,
kind of shape its way into a lot of different
(04:55):
threads about segregation here in this community, the integrated of school,
and I just kind of kept following the thread and
it actually became a film.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
Now, now, how about this. On the other side of
that question is when did you wrap principal photography?
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Give me a timeline.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
There, say again, when did you wrap you know, principal
all the shot?
Speaker 3 (05:22):
Yeah, yeah, So I began shooting in twenty eighteen. I
thought I was done in twenty twenty. So when COVID hit,
I already sat down, I was editing, I was going
through forty interviews I had shot. And then the George
Floyd tragedy happened, and there were protests here Monroe, Georgia,
And as long as I've lived here, I've never seen
(05:44):
a protest against racial injustice here in our community. And
I thought, you know what, the story is not done.
So I shot that and continued to sort of leave
the story open for another six months until the ending
was very clear. And I don't want to spoil the
ending of the film, but I stopped shooting, I would say,
(06:06):
at the end of twenty twenty.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
The reason I ask is because I feel like at
some point you had to come to terms with the
fact that there was an attack, a full frontal attack
on the telling of the fullness of American history. Rebranded
as critical race theory, you had to confront the fact
(06:32):
that this country was moving toward book burnings and book
bannings and things like this that really encapsulated the fullness
of American history, and that intersection may have been challenging
for you. And I guess my next question is who
(06:57):
did you make this film for? Who were you wanting
to see this film?
Speaker 3 (07:02):
You know, I would say right around twenty sixteen, so
before I started shooting the film, I began to sort
of have more heart to heart conversations with my black friends.
So there was a lot of much more vocal racism
(07:23):
happening in our country. I say vocal from very high
levels right around twenty sixteen, and so it began to
kind of scratch the surface of me thinking, you know what,
like I've always thought that there are laws in place
to protect everyone. I always thought that, you know, the
(07:43):
civil rights movement was behind us, racism is largely behind us.
I felt that way for really much of my life.
And I would say twenty sixteen is when you know
that Veneer started to sort of crack yes in those conversations.
You know, I started thinking, like I go, gosh, okay,
there's a lot that I don't know, and it kind
(08:04):
of started on a journey of listening to podcasts like
code Switch, you know, watching documentary films, reading books like
really immersing myself to learn as much as I could
about black history, about what people in this country have
been experiencing. That was, you know, beyond my perspective, and
(08:26):
it was wildly helpful and insightful and absolutely fueled the
creation of the film.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
If I may, I work in the ally Ship space,
and you know, my co host, we we work in
the ally Ship space.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
That's what we call it.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
We have a radio show that we do as well,
and that it exists to foster Allyship. We intentionally targeted
where non black people will participate in black culture because
we feel like they're more likely to receive a message
(09:08):
as opposed to just kind of having it in only
a decidedly black space. I say that to say that
working with allies, allies, you know, they have varying levels
of allyeship. You know, we all have varying levels of
engagement with many things in our lives, and we don't
hold that against people. And you know, some people they
(09:32):
show up and they want to be the star of
the show. Some people want to show up and you know,
hinder the movement, or they want to tell us how
we should you know, protest and fight for our own
you know, path forward. Some people, you know, and rarely
do I have a conversation with someone with such humility,
someone who really authentically shows up as as my sister,
(09:53):
as our sister. And so I wanted to take a
moment to say to you that I appreciate that either
you know, this is a story that you don't need
to tell, and you're telling it and that feels special,
you know.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
Appreciate that.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Oh yeah, of course, of course.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
And you know, for some people, you know, I was
having a conversation the other day with a friend of mine.
For some people, it's it's very easy to just live
their life. They kind of already won the game, or
won much of the game, I should say. Now, everybody
has their own struggles, but they're not starting behind the
start line in a manner of speaking, they're starting kind
(10:31):
of right at the zero, and they get to run
the race fair and so forth.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
They don't have hurdles and roadblocks.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
They're not starting ten feet behind everyone else and the
and so for those people to take a moment to
tell a story like this one for those people to
take a moment to sit in the middle of their
reality and acknowledge that, Hey, these scores of people from
this other tribe are telling us something and they're not.
(10:57):
This cannot be collective delusion, This cannot be collective victim mentality.
There's got to be something here, uh that that in
today's climate is rare and it should be acknowledged. And
so again I wanted to take a moment to say
that the human being in me appreciates the human being
in you, and and so again that that needs to
(11:17):
be pointed out.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
And so let's take that a little bit further.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
You know, you were talking about you know who we're
asking rather who you were hoping to see the film.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
Let's let's go a little further with that.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
What what impact are you hoping the film will have
on the people who ultimately do see it?
Speaker 3 (11:38):
Yep. Well, first I want to say I appreciate you,
Thank you so much for those words, super generous, grateful
for it. I'm grateful for your show and everything that
you have to share too, for I made this film honestly,
you know, for people like me. I think you know,
(12:00):
when we listen to Doctor King's you know reference of
like the white majority. That's really who this film is for.
And I think, you know, much of my life I've
lived in what I'll call a blissful ignorance, not a
blissful life, but in ignorance to what you know, many
(12:20):
of my friends have experienced their parents, their grandparents, and
you know, it is a really happy life to just
walk around and think everything's great, and to focus on
your own family, and focus on your own work and
your own you know, social calendar. And I think that
it's also somewhat it's a very selfish existence. And while
(12:46):
it is, you know, you're putting yourself in a position
to feel great pain when you actually pay attention and
listen and take these stories in very deeply. And honestly,
it wasn't until I really spent the time talking with
people about this film and hearing their stories and hearing
their tragedies, and honestly, you know, I'm pissed that it
(13:08):
took that for me to get it right. I mean,
to have Dorcus Jernigan, who integrated schools here, for her
to have to tell me her stories of kids stealing
her books, you know, and feeling unwelcome in the lunch room,
like I'm pissed that I had to hear Johnny Smith
tell me about how he got run out of a
gym for wanting to play basketball with white boys, like
(13:31):
I hate it that I needed that level of depth
and human to human connection to hear those stories for
it to really like pierce my heart. And I tried
to really convey that in this film because I know
how much it moved me and hearing these truths even
though it was difficult to hear, like I am hoping
(13:52):
that if people hear what I heard, that it will
move and change them as well, and change them in
the way that they think about their relationships, the way
that they think about their own life, the decisions they make,
you know, where they do business, who they choose to
do business with. I hope it changes people like me.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
We are here today with writer, director, producer, editor, and
cinematographer of the film Unspoken, Stephanie Calabrese.
Speaker 2 (14:27):
You know, I think that again, that is a very
special intentional.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
Move to make when you're making a film that is
targeted toward people who have lived your experience, who people
who they see a couple of points. They hit the highlights. Okay,
black people were slaves. That's not our favorite. Then there
was a civil rights movement. It's gipping over Jim Crow
(14:58):
and all the terrorism it took place for, you know,
all that time in the South and the rest of
the country as well, but primarily in the South. Civil
rights movement. I have a dream. Okay, now black people
are more or less equal. And then Obama, Okay, racism
is all the way over. You know, they hit the highlights,
and then they're good to make a film for those
people where you know, they don't feel.
Speaker 2 (15:25):
Racism in their day to day lives. They cannot feel it.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
They can be generally aware of it, but the people
they know who are racist don't typically interact with the
people who they can impose any sort of fear on
or terror.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
Or restrictions or anything like that.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
And so they think, in their mind, Okay, these people
are old and they're going to die off right, these
people are not subjected to forces because racism, You're right,
it has kind of.
Speaker 2 (15:59):
It has what's the word I'm looking for, evolved.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
It has been relegated to the shadows less so lately,
but for the most part that has been the trend
in this country, and so because it isn't as visible,
because it isn't front page news every single week, many
people like yourself, once upon a time, feel like we're
in a post racial society because that's a more comfortable
(16:26):
thought for them to think of it. And then when
they ignore, either willingly or they're just based on their
own ignorance, they cannot know. But otherwise they are ignorant
to the reality of the situation. They're ignorant to the
(16:47):
forces of housing discrimination, They're ignorant to the forces of
the lack of the teaching we discussed earlier in the call,
where you know the fullness of black history isn't taught,
and therefore context is not taught, and therefore there end
up being microaggressions in the workplace. People harbor prejudices more
easily because they cannot know. And of course, in this country,
(17:09):
most of the money, most of the power is concentrated
in the hands of white men, overwhelmingly wealthy, healthy Christian
and they themselves can live a life not knowing that
they are racist.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
I believe that to be true. Those are my brothers
as well.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
And they can impose racist restrictions the decisions, you name
it on communities. These are your police, these are your judges,
these are people in power, your CEOs, etc. Because people
are not aware of the history of this country. They're
not aware of how the GI Bill was disseminated unfairly
and black people were left out of that because they're
(17:47):
not familiar with redlining, because they're not familiar with, you know,
the War on drugs and how that disproportionately affected you know,
black people and hippies and disrupted those communities for you know, political.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
Political agenda. And you know, that's a long list.
Speaker 1 (18:02):
We can talk about healthcare, we talk about education, we
could talk about environmental racism, we could talk about a
number of things.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
That's a long list there. Because many people aren't aware
of all.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Those things, they will often assume that a lot of
this stuff is imagined. And you can look at individuals.
You could look at Ramses, you could look at Michael Jordan,
you could look at Oprah, you could look at Lebron
and say, well, these guys have all this money. You know,
Ramses is successful. He as his own show. You know,
I wish I had a show. I wish I could
play ball like Jordan and they're not looking at the
(18:32):
data which suggests, hey, this community is doing way better
than this community, and we can make some connections as
to why this community benefited from this community. And this
community never had an honest shot. They never had the
forty acres, nor did they have the mule.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
Right.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
So well, all that said, it's only going to be effective.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
If people are ready to have that conversation.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
And that's not a question that I expect you to
be able to give me a full answer to. But
help us out. Take us into Monroe. Tell us how
Monroe is today. Are they kind of still the way
that they're depicted in the film, because we're all kind
of assessing, politically speaking, what journey lies ahead, and to
(19:21):
know what's going on in Monroe today will certainly give
us some insight into whether or not the people may
be ready to have this conversation. And if so, maybe
there's some hope we can have there in fact, and
we'll know otherwise.
Speaker 3 (19:37):
Well, you know, and I'll tell you the stories that
I tell from Monroe. I mean, you can clone stamp
and it's happened all of the United States. Oh yeah, right,
the rise of private schools. You know, in the sixties,
when you know, schools are integrated. I'm integrated. So you know,
Monroe is really not unique, you know, in a lot
(20:01):
of ways. So I think what's happening in a row,
you know, may be an indicator of what could be
happening in other areas around the country. I think in general,
and obviously I can't speak for all white people, but
I think that I think that people number one, are
resistant to change, and I think people also have sort
(20:24):
of an innate defensiveness when it comes to conversation around racism.
Right as soon as you hear, you know, someone talking
about racism or racist, the first thing that some white
person's going to most white people do is back up,
you know, and defend themselves. And what I hope, what
(20:45):
I wish is that people would be more curious about
those conversations. Right, So instead of the knee jerk of
well I'm not racist, this is not racist, that's not racist,
let's be curious about it, right, Let's say, well, gosh, okay,
help me understand that. What are you feeling, what are
you experiencing? Like, Let it be more of a conversation
(21:06):
of curiosity. What can I learn from you? What don't
I know, of course, me as a white person, I
can't even understand the depths and a true definition of racism, right.
I might experience some challenges being a woman largely in
male dominated careers in my history, but in terms of racism,
you know, no, I'm not the expert on that. So
(21:30):
I think that I think that the film in our community.
You know, I was really worried. I was scared. I
didn't know how my community would react to it. I
assumed a lot of people would be unhappy about it.
I assumed a lot of people would be upset with me,
right for churning up this history, for trying to have
these conversations, And you know, honestly, I was pleasantly surprised.
(21:54):
We had four screenings here, all were sold out. We
had a nice diverse crowd, I would say at most
of the screenings, but I'll say majority white people came
to the screenings. We had a community dialogue that was
led by Hailey Smith, who's the director of Diversity Inclusion
(22:16):
at Very College here in Georgia. She led that for us.
That was an excellent engagement. We had fifty people from
the community, very heartfelt stories. Connections were established so I
felt a lot of hope that people seem to be
interested to see the film, to take it in, to
tell other people about it, to come to the dialogue.
(22:40):
You know, am I seeing great change in the community
as a result of it? No, I would say no.
I mean, we have gentrification happening here, just like many
cities all over the country. But I think on a
human to human level, I see changes when I have
conversations with individuals who've seen the film, and that me hope.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
Yeah, I'd argue that that's more impactful because if you
can see people's you know, light bulb turning on, and
you know, people backing down off of that, you know,
that kind of knee jerk defense that they.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
Enact.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
When you know, pressed on those issues, you start to
have a real conversation. Indeed, you know, personally speaking, I am.
I had a conversation with a friend of mine and
I learned what the experience of a straight white Christian
(23:44):
man is like. And you know, it's important, you know,
it's it's it's it's important to recognize nobody gets out
of here unscathed. And so even for that person, this
person who is a business owner, this person who is
again white male, you know, an imposing figure. You know,
(24:06):
for the most part, you know Christian or you know,
from that background. Whenever this individual has a challenge, the
last thing that they want to hear is that they
have some sort of privilege.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
They're like, you know, I'm working hard. What I wish
I had some privilege right for that person.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
When they're when they're pressed on, you know, challenging you know,
racism in their own you know, lives in their own minds,
they're like, look, man, this I was given this system,
the same as everyone else, and I'm doing my best
to try to make the most of it.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
If anything, blame the forces of capitalism.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
And while their argument, in my opinion, is not well
founded by that, I mean founded in.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
Human decency and.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
You know, human connection, they can make a case that,
you know, their priorities are different from mine, and that
they are trying to survive or trying to thrive or
whatever the case is. And understanding that allowed me to
understand how they indeed distance themselves from their responsibility in
the equation their influence, the gravity that they have, and
(25:20):
when you add to that that they have, they're very
very easily to manipulate because everyone's pointing at them like
they're the source of all that plagues the world in
their estimation, and they can then, you know, be manipulated
very easily to say, hey, look, you know, these are
(25:44):
the people that are really the source of your problems.
These are the people that are blaming you for you
know whatever. And everything was fine the way that it
was before before all of this started happening, and that
started happening, it's easy for them to find a sense
of unity where they feel like they belong and they
feel like they're not attacked, and they will vote for
(26:07):
a figure like a Donald Trump because Donald Trump will
slow the dispossession of the United States from white men
if his policies are fully implemented, meaning that these white
men that we have these conversations with will.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
Still be able to.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
Hold on to the power that they feel like they're
desperately clinging to now. So sharing in a lot of
instances feels like a step, like a bridge too far.
You know, they look, this is all I got. If
everybody's gonna hate me, at least I can move around,
you know what I mean. And so their lives are
complicated as well, and understanding that again the human in
me says Okay, well, I appreciate you listening. This is
(26:52):
going to be a twelve part series, but we had
a first foot and that's not nothing. And so to
your point about you know, people kind of changing on
an individual level rather than just kind of everybody watched
this and now we've cured racism, I think that would
be kind of more naive for us to think that.
But to know that the film is having some impact,
(27:14):
I think that that matters. Now we've talked a lot
about the film, let's talk about where people can go to.
Speaker 2 (27:23):
Get the film.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
You know, that's that's for you, and then of course
I want you to share your social media. I'm not
done talking to you, but you know, let's make sure
we get this in here.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (27:33):
I appreciate that. Well, people can sort of follow the
film on the film website, which is just unspoken dot film. Currently,
if you have a library card or student ID and
either your library or the school has a Canopy subscription,
you can watch the film now. So it's available in
those two channels video on demand distribution I'm still working on.
(27:56):
It's also broadcasting on GPB, which is Georgia PBS station
and so it airs periodically. So if you sign up
for email updates on the film site, I always send
emails when the next screening is happening or when VOD
distribution will be there. So that's a great way to
stay connected to see it if you don't have access
(28:17):
to it right now.
Speaker 1 (28:19):
Got it? And I don't know if this is going
to come out the way that I want to, but
for folks that are concerned about what they feel is
a growing divide in this country, perhaps since about twenty sixteen,
(28:41):
we'll call it twenty fifteen, because there was a whole
campaign there. Do you think that this film will provide
inside perspective context, maybe a historical framework that helps people
to further understand kind of how we ended up where
(29:02):
we are.
Speaker 3 (29:03):
Yes, absolutely, I truly do, you know. I think I
think really understand. You know, it's like has the divide
gotten greater? I don't know, but you know what it's
it's clearly present. I think it's always been present. I
think that around twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen, uh, it was
(29:26):
much more vocalized at very high levels in our country.
So I think the film truly helps and for me,
you know, it's really understanding the history, because if you
understand the history, then you you can you can understand
why we still have problems today. I mean, many people
(29:48):
in our country who still live during a time of
segregation and the integration of schools are still with us today.
So it's very much a present day challenge. And so
the challenges in the trauma that those people experienced, I mean,
being told you can't go to the counter to order
a sandwich, you got to go to the back door
(30:09):
and knock at the back door and pay your money
and wait. I mean, and that's just a small example.
I mean incredible trauma that people have experienced in the
country who live here today, alive today, their children, their grandchildren.
That trauma passes down. And so I think when when
you it's like you know, when you were talking about
(30:31):
conversations with your friend, I mean and white people saying,
you know that they hate the concept of white privilege
and I'm working hard too, And I mean, I think
it's like, I hope people understand that, you know, both
things can be true. We can still be experiencing our
black communities can be experiencing incredible racism today, and white
(30:56):
people can be working hard. You can have white privilege
and you can be working hard like those two things
can exist together. And I think without a doubt, if
you understand the history, it gives you much more context
to understand why we still have challenges today.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
Yeah, yeah, no, I appreciate that. I think that where
I am now, you know, this is a journey. We're
all we're all on a human journey having a human experience, right, Yes,
where I am now is you know, Historically on this show,
I've been very critical of a capitalistic model, of capitalistic
(31:35):
framework for society. But you know, I don't think anyone
one model economic model is without its laws.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
But this is the one that we have. This is
the idea that has one out soil.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
We're here, and a consequence of that is everybody is
always pushing for themselves. Everyone is all you know what
I mean, And there's less in the way of community,
there's less than the way of love, and a lot
more human of the experiences. So we have an iPhone,
but overall we're less happy as a species in this
(32:10):
at least in this country, right And so you know
it's an iPhone is very shiny and we can be like, man,
I can't live without my iPhone because we're now addicted
to that. But you know, we laugh less, right, and
we're more isolated, and we use our own we hear
our own voice less. Because we have less friends, we
spend more time alone. And so you know what, really,
(32:31):
what has the human experience become as a result of
capitalism and now and to your point, a divide can
exist and indeed grow, it can become very cancerous. And
so you know, here we are, and you know there
are people like me that have to be aware of
that because I walk this afro into every room I
(32:52):
go into, and there are people like you that go
out of your way. I would imagine to make yourself
aware of it and indeed try to enlighten other folks.
And you know, for me, is it is part and
parcel to my existence. I was born this way, I'll
die this way, my children will be this way. For you,
it is that doesn't necessarily have to be true. We
(33:13):
saw the way that you know, white women voted in
the past election and in the election in twenty sixteen.
And you know, in twenty sixteen, there was a gentleman
talking to the would be president and the president said,
you know, you can just walk up to them and
grab him by the blank. And then women still supported
(33:37):
that man, white women especially, And so that to me
suggested it is not impossible for white women to say,
you know what, I'm close enough to the source to
where I don't have to walk my own path. I
could just latch onto to my husband's or my sons
or my father's or whatever, you know, and as long
(33:58):
as there's he's doing, okay, I'll be. I don't need
to be self determined in this way. And so this
is just the world that I'm going to live in
and actually push for that, And then there are other
white women who say, no, absolutely, that is not how
things should be. I am, indeed a homo sapient sapien.
I am able to determine my own path forward, and
(34:19):
I do not need to be subjected to anyone who
speaks like that, nor anyone who you know, moves in
that way or whatever. And and you know, I would
imagine that to stake out on your own and to
decide that, you know, I'm going to take the more
(34:40):
challenging path because it holds a greater reward for me.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
In terms of my.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
You know, my my self image. You know my sense
of what I can accomplish on my own and my story.
You know, it's a tougher path, and you know, we
welcomed everyone, but it's a it's indeed a tougher path.
And for a person like you who chose I would
imagine chose that path. You know again, it just it
(35:09):
feels very special, and so I couldn't let you go
without just restating that one more time before you go. Please,
you know, share whatever social media emails, website again for
how people can get the film, and let's make sure
that you know, folks can can actually get out there
and support that film.
Speaker 3 (35:27):
Yeah, that sounds great. The film website is Unspoken dot film.
You can also follow me on Instagram LinkedIn always sharing
information about the film there too. It's just at Stephanie
Calibrays in Instagram at Little Purple Cow.
Speaker 2 (35:45):
Purple cow is that a marketing term?
Speaker 3 (35:51):
Well, you know what, when I first moved here, it
was very much a rural community, so lots of cows everywhere,
and I never felt like the other cows. Okay, gotcha,
that's where they came from.
Speaker 1 (36:06):
Yeah. I had to read a book when I was
in college about there was a marketing book. I went
to school for marketing, my undergrad marketing, my master's in management.
But we had a it was a book about a
purple cow or something like that, so I just kind
of made the connection. But anyway, I want to thank
you again for for your time and that awesome h Instagram.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
Handle as well. That was pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (36:29):
I gave me a little laugh, and you know, I
can't wait for all of us to get out there
and check out the film. Please come back as you
continue to release more works, especially if it's you know,
stuff that we can help you promote. I hope that
that we can work on our sibling ship here, yeah,
(36:49):
foster growth. I think that would be very special. So
I'll let you get back to your life once again.
Today's guest is writer, director, producer, editor, and cinematographer of
the film Unspoken, Stephanie Calabrese.
Speaker 3 (37:02):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
This has been a production of the Black Information Network.
Today's show was produced by Chris Thompson and q Ward.
Have some thoughts you'd like to share, use the red
microphone talkback feature on the iHeartRadio app. While you're there,
be sure to hit subscribe and download all of our episodes.
I am your host Ramsey's Jaw on all social media
and join us tomorrow as we share our news with
(37:25):
our voice from our perspective right here on the Black
Information Network Daily podcast
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