May 19, 2025 • 41 mins
A.R. Shaw, Author and Executive Director of the Atlanta Daily World joins Hosts Ramses Ja and Q Ward to discuss the major news stories of the past weekend.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Here at the Black Information Network, we know how important
it is for you to start your week off energized, engaged,
and enlightened. There are always major stories that break over
the weekend, and we feel you should know about the
ones we are talking about today, So stay tuned for
our weekend recap featuring the author of the book Trap
History and the executive editor of Atlanta Daily World, mister A. R. Shaw.
(00:21):
This is the Black Information Network Daily Podcast. I am
ramses Jah and I am q Ward. All Right, mister A. R. Shaw,
author of the book Trap History, talk to me, man,
what's the ladies?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Man, it's a live going on.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
Man.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
We made it. We made it to spring. Let's see
we can make it the summer.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Yeah, man, yes, well, I know, and I'm just kind
of I'm not prepared to talk about it, but I'm
kind of going through the details of the announcement of
Joe Biden with the aggressive prostate cancer. Man. So we'll
definitely put something together and have a more in depth,
(01:00):
uh segment to offer, but for now, that just is,
you know, it's kind of a shock and also not
at the same time. I don't know how that would
hit you.
Speaker 4 (01:10):
Yeah, I mean, it's I mean there's been you know,
mumblings that Biden hasn't been at the best of health
for a few years now.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
You know, we just hate to hear this news.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
You know.
Speaker 4 (01:20):
Of course we're going to get more details in the
days to come, but all we can do now is
just pray for President Biden.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
And his family. Yeah, any thoughts here.
Speaker 5 (01:29):
You know, as a child of a cancer survivor and
a you know, a cancer fighter, that's never easy news
to deal with, no matter the context, no matter the timing,
no matter what stage it is, uh, you know, terminal
illness and and you know, disease that has kind of
won its battle against medicine for all of you, you know,
(01:50):
all of human time. It's impossible news to receive. And
even when it's treatable, even when there's a chance that
you can beat it, how it feels when you the
news is not easy, man, So prayers up to not
just his family, but anybody that's dealing with the fight
against cancer.
Speaker 6 (02:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Absolutely, well, we'll obviously be keeping an eye on that,
but for now, let's get to the news for today.
So this comes from Black Enterprise Wes Moore, the nation's
only black governor and a Democrat, voted a bill vetoed
sorry a bill in the late hours on May sixteenth
that would have created a commission to explore reparations for
(02:29):
black Marylanders and formally recognize the economic harm inflicted on
descendants of enslaved people in the state. According to The
Washington Post, while the bill was one among twenty three
vetos issued by Moore, it ignited a firestorm of criticism
of Moore's decision from other black leaders in the state
who had counted on More to be an ally in
their fight for reparations, given his stance on repairing the
(02:52):
racial wealth gap, which itself stems from the enslavement of
black people. Moore, however, defended his decision by saying, among
other things, that he needed to keep an eye on
the budget and that he didn't want to wait two
years to set up a commission to study reparations. Quote.
I was very transparent with the leadership and members of
the General Assembly that anything that fails to meet the
urgency of this moment, I will not sign it and
(03:13):
it must wait for another time. He goes on to
say that his decision regarding the reparation study was the
most challenging of his vetos. It goes on to say
a study group that is saying that they're going to
present reports to the governor in two years is fine,
but the governor is ready to engage now. So I
know there was a lot of back and forth. Q
(03:34):
and I kind of had a little bit of a
conversation on this. It was over text, so I don't
know what what twose thoughts are, but let's let's have
you go first here and tell us, you know a
little bit more about this story. Emir.
Speaker 4 (03:48):
Yeah, So, I mean Wes Moore man, he's you know,
he's one of our brightest leaders. I could see him,
you know, making a strong presidential run in a few years.
That he's that writing and prepared for the moment. This
was very perplexing in a lot of ways, right because
it was like he was kind of like almost double
(04:11):
dush in this topic in a sense where he's like,
you know, going back and forth saying that you know,
of course he doesn't want to just wait for two years.
He wants to engage now. And that was like, you know,
as a journalist, for me, it's like I take every
word seriously, every Senate seriously.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
What does that mean?
Speaker 4 (04:30):
Does that mean you're you have something that you want
to present now in the next six to twelve months.
That's that's going to make this go faster than the
two years. Like what does that mean when you say
engaged now? So that was that was very perplexing. And
you know, you think about Maryland and in that that
particular region, there are numerous ways where you can pretty
(04:51):
much trace how slavery impact this institutions that continue to
this day. I mean University of Maryland. Uh, they talked about,
you know, their connections to slavery. John Hopkins talked about
their connections to slavery and their families in Maryland today
that are still wealthy. They still have land based off
of enslaved individuals. And so there's a direct connection in
(05:14):
the Maryland region where we can pretty much draw on
a start of how do we repair the damages from
individuals who were enslaved in their family and their families
for generations as generations.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
So this, like I said, it was very perplacing.
Speaker 4 (05:27):
Don't I don't know where where it's Moore stands when
he says he's ready to engage now.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
So for me, it was like, Okay, what does that mean?
Speaker 5 (05:34):
Yeah, I'm like ar, I'm kind of torn on the
position that he took. First of all, the headline, it's
like without context on purpose, you know, so that someone
like me could read it and be as upset as possible.
But I also wonder, why not propose what you're saying
instead of vetoing it makes them change it. If you
(05:56):
guys want to do a study for reparations right now,
I'll sign it.
Speaker 6 (06:00):
If we have to wait two years, then propose it
in two years.
Speaker 5 (06:03):
It's how I think the conversation should have gone, instead
of just vetoing it with no alternative and no solution.
Don't don't kill my solution if you don't have one, Yeah,
you don't. Just don't introduce an obstacle when you could
just remove it. If you're the person that has the
veto power, propose the same thing they're talking about doing.
(06:24):
Stipulate that they do it right now, and sign it.
And maybe it's not that easy. I won't pretend that
I'm an expert at how government works. I have not
worked in that space. I just I wish instead of
vetoing something like that, because he said talked about how
hard the decision is, and I think that's because he
understands the headline's going to say, the black governor vetoed
(06:45):
the reparations. Yeah, exactly, So don't come up and help
make them come up with a better a better one
and sign it.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
I think that's more than fair too. The one thing
that I think is missing from the article that I've read,
or maybe it's in the article, but the part of
the article that I read that comes to mind is
that or maybe we did touch on it, but he
didn't go into detail, was that there was an issue
(07:14):
with their budget. And if they are if they don't
have the budget to carry out the normal government functions
and to address the immediate concerns of the people of Maryland,
then something like that might not make sense, you know.
(07:36):
And so you know, again, like you said, Q, it's
impossible to know all of the details because we're even
if we did work in government, you know, they have
privileged information and they have a better idea of what
their agenda is in that state than we do. We
only visit there. But you know, this has to be
(07:57):
more than, like you said, what the headline reads, because
I think you and I both had a similar reaction
when we saw the headliner. We're like, whoa this, this
doesn't make sense. This guy is you know, he's one
of the good ones. I guess I don't know, you know,
because there are people who are turncoats, there are people
(08:17):
who do all kinds of stuff.
Speaker 4 (08:18):
But.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
He doesn't. It doesn't feel like that Veto is consistent
with his brand of politics. That's probably the best way
to say it. And you know, I know that there
are some people who are critical of this move. Some
people might ultimately come around and understand it. Some people
are just very passionate about this one issue and so
they're going to take take exception to it. But there
(08:43):
are some people who really are looking for the Trump
style leadership that has been established well established in politics
of the past, you know, nearly decade in this country
and have a let's call it a pro white agenda
(09:03):
under Donald Trump's leadership kind of there's some people that
feel like there should be a pro black leadership where possible,
when possible, And you know, I still feel like that's
just a couple of steps away, if that's ever a thing.
I think that sensible people are still trying to kind
(09:26):
of get us back to the form of government where
we all kind of have a place under the same
government and are all kind of working together as a
collective in this country. And so you know, there are
people who've given in to Okay, this is the new norm,
and there are people who's still fighting to preserve let's
call it a democracy. And so you know, a lot
(09:47):
of opinions, a lot of takes, and I want to
make sure that you get a chance to respond because
I know that I mentioned that headline when we have
that conversation yesterday, So go ahead, Q.
Speaker 5 (09:57):
I just want to say it's interesting how who's going
to pay for it? Or budget always comes up when
it's something that helps or benefits US Police, Department of Defense. Again,
like you said, all the pro white anti DEI, all
those initiatives, we never have to figure out where we're
going to get the money from sending money to other countries.
(10:18):
I mean, on every level of government, when things need
to get funded, they find a way. But when it
comes to helping us, it's like, hey man, what do
you want us to do with the budget? That's how
are we supposed to pay for that? And what we've
always thought for all of our collective lives is that
there's all these bureaucracies and steps and red tape that
people have to go through to get things done, and
(10:39):
then we watch the current administration say just do it.
Speaker 6 (10:42):
We just do what we want.
Speaker 5 (10:44):
So it just it becomes very confusing when it's like, man,
when it's time to help us, Ah, man, my hands
are tired.
Speaker 6 (10:50):
What can I do?
Speaker 5 (10:50):
You know the budget and how we're going to pay
for it. And when we see things that are contrary
to our well being, contrary to our health, to our education,
to our you know, our pursuit of happiness, we just
those things get green lit and no one ever asked, Hey,
where are we going to get the money for that?
Speaker 6 (11:08):
They just do it, And.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Funnily enough, we end up paying for that too.
Speaker 6 (11:14):
About that, Yeah, that way all right?
Speaker 1 (11:16):
Next up, this from the Black Information Network. The largest
remaining Antebellum plantation in the United States has burned to
the ground. People reports on Thursday, May fifteenth, the south
wing of not Away Resort of former Antebellum plantation turned
travel destination and wedding venue, was engulfed in flames. The
sixty four room, fifty three thousand square foot structure was
(11:36):
a pile of rubble by ten PM. The cause of
the fire remains unknown. There have been no reported injuries.
My response to this is very short. Good ar, your
thoughts good.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
But I'm gonna get some contexts.
Speaker 4 (11:52):
So good, that's right here, But just give you some
contexts on the particular plantation. Actually got an opportunity before
we were assigned this segment. I watched the documentary on
this particular plantation, and so it was an owner by
the slave owner by the name of John Randolph. And
for those who are not familiar with I guess you
(12:13):
know pretty much the crops that were significant during slavery times.
You had sugar cane, you had tobacco, you had cotton.
Those are like the primary crops. So sugar cane was
by far the most brutal, needed, the most brutal form
of labor out of all of that. It was more
brutal than tobacco, more brutal than brutal than cotton.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
Sugar cane.
Speaker 4 (12:38):
You know, individuals who were forced to toy you on
sugar cane, they usually didn't live long. So you know,
if you look at the documents, he had like over
one hundred and fifty five slaves enslaved people on that
plantations because I'm sure the turnover rate was high, because
you know, it's just a lot of lives lost because
of the sugar cane. It was just a hard, harsh
(12:59):
form of labor. And so I just think about all
of the individuals who passed and all of the their
family members who will never compensated. And so after slavery,
this this particular plantation becomes this site where weddings and
a lot of festivities are thrown, and it's almost like,
you know, there's you know, me being in it from Atlanta.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
Uh.
Speaker 4 (13:19):
You know, if you go outside of Atlanta, you can
see you know, you can you can still see plantations
and places that work where ensulaved people work.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
You still see cotton fields of cot till this day.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
So we see how certain individuals, certain groups still hold
on to the ideas of slavery, and this is one
of those.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
Places that did that.
Speaker 4 (13:39):
Now all of they were still making money from you know,
the tourism, the weddings that were there, the events.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
None of that money went to the to the families
of the enslaved people.
Speaker 4 (13:50):
So we still see this this uh, you know, this
taking place in terms of we just talked about reparations.
The family is still not getting repairs for the damages
that were done for generations. And so, like you said,
I'm happy that it's burned down, but but at the
same time, it's a mentality that remains, particularly in the
South of holding on to these, uh these monuments of
(14:13):
a past where black people were oppressed openly and legally.
So uh, yeah, kudos to to this, you know fire.
And I'm a realistic I'm a realist, you know, I
don't really go into superstitions and things of that nature. Yeah,
but this is by fall, you know, I see this.
This is something that the ancestors man ten ten ten
(14:33):
fire departments had to control this fire. So you know,
this is this is something very deep, you know. And
like I said, I'm with you. I'm glad that it burned,
but let's let's work on burning this mentality.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
That allowed it. I love that. Q.
Speaker 5 (14:49):
It's really hard to speak after ar Yeah he got
it because yeah, what what my brother just finished saying
that Ryan Coogler could be Jordan for the prelude to
the to the plantation burned down. I feel like, man,
it got us ready and the ancestors brought us home.
Speaker 6 (15:07):
So Shout out to the Ancestral Plane. Shout out to
Michael B.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
Jordan, Jengo Jego, shout.
Speaker 5 (15:13):
Out to Joy, Shout out to Ryan Coogler Man, shout
out to ar Shaw, you know, the ancestors. Man, it
should be celebratory, but in a in a less light
hearted tone.
Speaker 6 (15:24):
Man.
Speaker 5 (15:25):
It's it's what they are said that that should be
a symbol of something deeper. That entire mindset, that entire
period of our history, UH needs to be reconciled with,
and we need to keep We need to stop, I'm
sorry pretending that it was nine thousand years ago and
that people who were affected by that are not still
walking around in this world and in this country.
Speaker 6 (15:44):
Now.
Speaker 5 (15:45):
You know, it's not our great great grandparents. You know,
some of us are one generation removed. There are people
who were alive during that time still, so you know,
burn the whole thing down, not just the building.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Yeah, I like that. You sound like meek you. Hey,
what's up?
Speaker 5 (16:03):
This is ramses Ja and I am q Ward and
we're inviting you to subscribe to Civic Cipher, our weekly
social justice podcast.
Speaker 6 (16:09):
Right here in the app.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
We pride ourselves on creating a show that fusters allyship
empathy and understanding, all the while conducting journalistically credible research
featuring influential, noteworthy guests, and empowering historically marginalized communities.
Speaker 5 (16:22):
The African proverb breeds, if you want to go far,
go together. So we are asking you to search for
and subscribe to Civic Cipher.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
That's civ c cip h e R right here in
the app. Today's guest is the author of the book
Trap History and the executive editor of Atlanta Daily World,
Mister A. R. Shaw. All right, next step from the
Atlanta Black Star. I'm gonna this is going to be
(16:51):
a lengthy one, but we want you to give your
thoughts here. I know that you know of the story
better than the rest of us.
Speaker 6 (16:56):
All right.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
Even after Dallas police realized they had arrested and abuse
the wrong black man, they still insisted on filing criminal
charges against Sylvester Hayes to justify their mistake, incarcerating him
for several days, causing the single father of four children
to lose his job as a security guard, and even
after all charges were dismissed against aspiring police officer more
than a year later, enabling him to file a lawsuit
(17:20):
for the brutal arrest. A federal judge last month dismissed
the case, claiming the cops have qualified immunity and had
probable cause to arrest him because he had failed to
use a turn signal within one hundred feet of a
stop sign. But the video shows the cops turned a
minor traffic infraction into a violent arrest simply because they
failed to compare the information on his driver's license to
(17:42):
that listed sorry that listed him as Sylvester Hayes third
to the information in their database listing another black man
named Sylvester Hayes wanted on a Feller Nay warrant for
domestic violence. US District Judge Karen Grinn sorry Karen Grin Scholar,
ruled the arrest to be lawful because she said Hayes
(18:03):
resisted arrest when Dallas cop pulled him out of his
car without telling him the reason why, and after failing
to confirm if he was the right suspect, which would
have cleared up the mistake in seconds. The judge also
determined Hayes had no grounds to sue because cops used
relatively minor force and acted reasonable when pulling him out
of his car on the side of the road, planting
(18:23):
a knee on his face, and stepping him into the
back of a patrol car. But that is a questionable
opinion to anybody watching the body camera footage, which shows
a distraught Hayes repeatedly yelling for help as several cops
piled on top of him quote outside of one officer
momentarily grabbing Plaintiff's throat and possibly hitting plaintiff in the
stomach with his knee, the officers used relatively minor force,
(18:45):
even as Plaintiff's screamed, resisted restraint, and refused to get
in the police car, Sculler wrote in her twenty page opinion.
But the lawsuit obtained by the Atlanta Black Star, which
was filed against Dallas police officers Walter gob and Holly Harris,
the cops who initiated the traffic stock stop, among sorry
(19:06):
along with several unnamed cops, states the arrest was overly
aggressive and unconstitutional, leaving Hayes with permanent injuries and trauma
quote in a blur of excessive force, all of which
was documented by defendant officers Gob and Harris, as well
as defendant Dallas police officers does three through ten's body cams,
the officers began to kick, punch, and unnecessarily use their
(19:28):
tasers on plaintive Hayes. The lawsuit states those hot to
say moreover, one or more of the officers can be
seen dangerously pinning plaintiff Hayes down with their knees on
his skull, neck, and back. One of the officers at
the scene pulled plaintiff Hayes' arm out of his shoulder socket,
which has caused him ongoing pain and mobility issues to
this day. Now, Hayes's attorney, Mark Robiness, plans to file
(19:50):
an appeal. According to the Dallas Morning News, all right,
sorry about that. I had to get all that out
because I didn't want you have to paint the picture
any further than the article had. But you know, talk
to us a little bit about this are This one
obviously is a little disturbing, so yours.
Speaker 4 (20:06):
I mean, yeah, we've been dealing with this for for
for you know, forever. Right, we would think that after
George Floyd, after Sandra Bland and so many kind of
countless others who have been impacted by brutality, that we
that the you know, the court systems will find ways
to correct themselves, and you get someone like a judge
(20:27):
Karen if it's schuler, a scholar.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
That's try to pronounce her last year, I didn't I
didn't know, yes, So it just.
Speaker 4 (20:34):
Shows a lack of empathy you know her, you know,
basically in her you know UH report is basically saying
that it was minded, it was a minor UH force
that was used against this black man. It's just like
when you look at the video, it's it's totally different
if we put carrying Karen in the same situation, would
she still feel like this was minor aggression that was
(20:58):
used on the minor force that was used. I say
it just it's so it's just a it's a lack
of empathy on the judge's part and we're seeing that,
you know how, why does a minor traffic stop go
you know, escalate to this farm or escalate to a
point of brutality And we we've only seen this with
you know, for the most part, black people being you know,
(21:19):
harassed for decades, and it's unfortunate and I you know,
for me, I just hope that with this appeal, hopefully,
hopefully it goes to another judge a judge that's more reasonable,
a judge that actually can see what you know, the officers,
what they did was wrong, and hopefully this individual was
compensated for what he had to endure.
Speaker 1 (21:43):
Yeah, we we covered this story a lot.
Speaker 5 (21:50):
Yeah, the city changes, the name of the victim, changes,
the story pretty much says the same. As long as
the victim looks like us, then the police are always
well within their rights to do whatever they want to
do and use whatever level of force and violence that
they deem appropriate at the time. They make a mistake,
(22:13):
they commit a crime, they cover it up. Everyone says
nothing to see here, And to say that it's an
exhausting story doesn't articulate the emotion well enough. The stories
like this are part of the reason that we do
this job. Stories like this are the reason this job
is so hard, because we're expected to just take it
(22:34):
on the chin every time. Point out the hypocrisy, point
out that it's illegal, point out the violations of rights,
and then we move onto the next story. And so
does the rest of the country, and so does the
legal system, and so do all these police unions and
police departments. We said, defund the police, and the entire
other side of the road got angry and afraid and
made other people angry and afraid, and made those brutalized
(22:57):
by that system angry and afraid. As defund the police,
then who's going to be there for you when you
need help? And that's a legitimate question to a population
that's underinformed and under educated about how these things work.
The term defund the police in and of itself, I
always thought was not workshopped enough because it was too
easy to make it a pejorative and to make people
(23:18):
afraid to do something that would have positive impact and
positive effects. So what we've done since that movement is
double and triple down on our investment in law enforcement
because we want less crime. Right, if we give the
police more money and more guns and more tanks and
more technology and more access, then we're going to be
more safe because when we see the police, we feel safe,
and when we get in trouble and we're afraid, we
call nine to one one. Except all the research and
(23:40):
all the data shows us that that's not true. And
until we find a way to one properly articulate that
to populations and rebrand what would be a better idea,
we're going to continue to cover this story. You, myself
and are will cover this story again, unfortunately soon, and
we'll feel how we feel right now, and the outcome
(24:01):
will be the same. Some judge and some prosecutor will
say nothing to see here, and those police were justified.
And even when civil agreements are reached and civil sentiments
are reached, those same taxpayers pay for it. Those police
unions wipe their hands and send those guys back to work.
So I don't know that we ever solve this. I
don't know that we ever saw a lot of the
things that we're dealing.
Speaker 6 (24:20):
With right now.
Speaker 5 (24:20):
Man, Like all the hope I used to have that
we were making on this progress daily kind of drips
down the drain.
Speaker 6 (24:27):
Man. I don't know. I don't know what to say.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
Well, you're not crazy. I think it's important to start there.
You know, people that feel that hopelessness. I think that
that's probably the most important thing, is to make sure
that people don't feel like they're the only ones feeling
that way. That does make sense, I uh, you know,
(24:57):
I get it, man, This is you know. The thing
about this story is that without knowing anything about the
judges involved, I know that they're white, they're Trump supporters
(25:19):
or both. There's no reality where they could see this
happen to a human being and not have those particular
blinders on, and the results show exactly who they are.
(25:40):
Like you have to have you have to be blind
to the humanity. And I think that a lot of
times whiteness can insulate a person from, you know, our
shared humanity, especially when it's when you're when you're white
(26:00):
and looking down right and not looking across. And that's
a very easy position to find yourself in in this
country because you're really taught that all the crime comes
from black people, not from poor people black people, right,
so crime looks a certain way, you know, brown people,
et cetera, not from poor people. That's not how it's
(26:22):
communicated to you. You're taught that, you know, white people
are the great conquerors in the world, right and not
these these tyrants and these colonizers. And so you're not
taught that part of it, and that that's not how
it comes across. And so you might not consider yourself
a white supremacist. You might not feel like white privilege
(26:44):
is a thing that you have. But the way that
you understand your place in society and the place of
your people in society is that you just are somehow better.
You got everything honestly and fair, and that is the
result of you just being of superior stock or something
(27:04):
like that. And so again it's very easy to look
down and to be blind to the humanity of other
people in that predicament. And to your point, Q, I
think that you know this is I want to share
a quick story. You know. I know that this is
a tale as long as time for black people in
this country. But I think the moment when like the
(27:27):
lights kind of clicked on for me, I was very young.
This might have been before the Rodney King riots because
I was really like paying attention then, So this might
have been in the early nineties or sometime around there.
But I want to say it's like the early nineties.
But what happened was I was watching an episode of
(27:48):
The Fresh Prince of bel Air and Jazz or DJ
Jazzy Jeff, who I've come to know, but Jazz on
the show, was in a scene and he was supposed
to like approach the bench and there was a peace
officer in the court that was holding a bible for
(28:09):
him to swear on or something like that, and he
approached the bench and he had both of his hands
up like freeze, you know, stick your hands up like
that type of pose. And someone asked him, like, yo,
why are your hands up? You know you're not under
arrest or anything like that, and he says, effectually, he says,
you know, I've been in this situation before. I know
how to approach it, and I better do it the
(28:30):
right way before I get And this is the part
I remember before I get six warning shots in the back,
and of course everyone laughs because it's a sitcom. It's
a comedy, right, But I was like six warning shots
in the back and everyone's laughing at it, and I
just remember that moment where I was like whoa. And
then everything that I had heard in the past kind
(28:50):
of like like lined up and it was in sync,
and I was like, this is a real thing. And
of course you get older, you learn your history and
you realize it goes all the way back to you know,
slave patrols and so forth. That was the moment for me.
And if that moment was call it thirty, I don't know,
four thirty decades ago, right then, looking at this story again,
(29:15):
your point is well made, is that progresses I'm more
of an optimist, so I'll call it slow all right. Finally,
this story comes from US Weekly. Former Danity Kin singer
Don Richard took the stand in the trial of Sean
Diddy Combs on Friday May sixteenth. Richard, forty one, was
(29:35):
sworn in late Friday, shortly before court adjoined for the day.
Prosecution asked her about an alleged incident in two thousand
and nine where she saw Diddy fifty five threatening Cassidy
Cassie in his Los Angeles home Dannity Knes. Don Richards
testifies that he came downstairs screaming belligerent, asking where his
(29:59):
food was and continued to hit her in the head
and kick her on the ground in front of us.
She claimed that she was visiting Diddy and was in
the kitchen with Cassie during the alleged attack. Quote. He
came downstairs angry and was saying where the f was
his eggs? And he was telling Cassie she never gets
anything right, and where the f was his food? Then
(30:22):
he came over to the skillet with the ex init
and tried to hit her over the head and she
fell to the ground. All right, Richard claimed did He
continue to beat Cassie while she was on the floor,
then proceeded to take his arm around her neck and
dragged her by the hair up the stairs. The following day,
did He allegedly invited Richard and her Dirty Money bandmate
(30:43):
to record with him in the studio, where he told
them the attack they'd both seen was passion. Richard said
he threatened them, saying people who say something can end
up missing. After she finished her testimony, Diddy's attorney asked
a judge to strike it from the record, arguing that
it does not support the charge of sex trafficking. The prosecution, meanwhile,
has argued that Ditty's alleged abuse created a culture that
(31:05):
allowed him to carry out more serious crimes. So the
plot thickens. But I think we knew it was going
to give us your thoughts, your ar all right.
Speaker 4 (31:14):
So I'm gonna I'm gonna kind of take a different angle.
I'm gonna go one place and I'm gonna bring us
to where we are now, particularly me, you know, being
just like a lover of hip hop and just you know,
I've pretty much followed hip hop, you know, since I
was a kid, and I just love how black people
was able to create this art form that pretty much
(31:35):
impacted the world. We go to the nineties where we
get the birth of the hip hop mogul. Right, we
get the Russell Simmons, we get Diddy, we get Shunned,
we get shug Night, and those three individuals. There was
a few more, but those three individuals kind of set
the stage of Okay, we can now have this art
form and then you know, control it from a business standpoint.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Fast forward.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
We look at where sug Night is, we look at
where Russell Simmons is, and now we look at where
Ditty is and it's like three of the most powerful
businessmen to pretty much profit from this art form are
now in pretty much dire situations.
Speaker 4 (32:15):
And it's just like, how did they get there? How
did we you know, three of the most powerful businessman's
businessmen of our culture, of hip hop culture get put
in this predicament, and you know, when I think about it,
I'm like nobody held them accountable. And it was like
all of this stuff went unchecked for years. And we
(32:35):
go back to like even like making a band, like
that microaggression act of having his band members of people
who are desiring to be a part of this culture
to walk miles to get him a piece of cheesecake.
You know, there was a microaggression. I mean we laughed
at it, we all thought it was entertainment, but you
know that was really an aggressive act towards people who
(32:58):
are just really trying to make music to go walk
in and get some cheesecake for him, not for not
for the group, but just for him. So it just
shows you, you know, from that, you know, for those
small things like that, how manipulative he was, and how
he how manipulative, manipulative he could be towards people, and
all of this stuff that's coming out now with this case,
(33:20):
it shows you that you know that there's a lot
of things that went unchecked from the people around him,
and you know someone needed to save him from himself,
and no one stood up to say, look, all of
this is wrong. Like, you know, you got so many
people who are employed by you, Black people who are
employed by you, who are going to be out of
a job because of your mishandling of a situation or situations.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
Now going back to this case is just you know,
I wasn't prepared.
Speaker 4 (33:49):
I'm sure none of us were prepared for the details
of what was happening within these freak offs and what
was going back and forth in terms of the abuse,
and and you know, just to you know, it's just
it's just a lot that's happening within this case. Particularly
I you know, I see him as as a horrible person,
(34:10):
as someone who's abusive, who's done a lot, a lot
of wrong a lot of wrongdoings. But when I think
about it from a legal standpoint, I covered two rico
trials here in the State of Georgia, the Donald Trump
Rico case and also the Young Thug while I say
Rico case, and within both of those Rico cases, it
was basically trying to prove that there was some form
(34:31):
of racketeering, racketeering for the furtherance of criminal activity. Right now,
with this case, I'm not really seeing that, and I'm
not sure that you know, what's going to happen. You know,
there's there's still some weeks to go within this case,
but right now, it just feels like this was probably
a state case that I'm not sure the federal government
is doing a bit of overreaching right now. I'm just
(34:54):
looking at it from from that standpoint, that racket standpoint,
I'm not I haven't connected the dots shit in terms
of this criminal organization. It seems like this was just
a mess up individual who was very abusive.
Speaker 1 (35:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (35:08):
Yeah, I'm not resieing a racketeering point yet. So, like
I said, we just have to kind of just sit
back and see what happens. But yeah, it's just, you know,
from a hip hop and cultural standpoint, it's just sad
to see that, you know, several of our biggest business
leaders within our communities have now fallen pretty.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
Much to the whiteside.
Speaker 5 (35:32):
Yeah, anything, you know, it's interesting to see an individual
reco case that's that's not normal, Like Rico typically gives
you the impression that it's an organizational thing and that
there are a lot of parties involved in this reco
case seems to be against one person. So that's the
thing that stands out the most to me. With regards
(35:52):
to the legal part, I think what we have to
acknowledge is that there are multiple things happening at the
same time.
Speaker 6 (35:58):
Here. You know, Shan Kan is on trial.
Speaker 5 (36:02):
For a crime, but Diddy is on trial in the
court of public opinion, and that case is over like that,
you don't ever recover the video by itself would have
sealed that deal, but the details coming out in this
hearing disgusting is one way to say it brutal.
Speaker 6 (36:21):
Abusive.
Speaker 5 (36:23):
So again there's two really separate trials happening simultaneously. The
thing that disturbs me the most, father of a daughter,
son of a single mom, brother, the six sisters, is that, well,
why didn't she just leave?
Speaker 6 (36:39):
Why didn't she just go?
Speaker 5 (36:41):
And you can tell that that's coming from people who
are either okay with abuse or have never experienced it
and don't understand it's not always as simple as just
picking up and leaving. I mean, the video that made
this from she must just be trying to get some
money to oh no, maybe he was abusing her, shows
her trying to just go, and it shows you an
(37:04):
example of what happens when you try to just go
from someone who has decided that you are theirs and
theirs alone. If they can't have you, no one can.
You will do what they say, You will bend to
their will. And we saw her get I don't even
want to describe what we saw enough people have seen
that video of her trying to get on the elevator
with her bag.
Speaker 6 (37:23):
While I guess it seems.
Speaker 5 (37:24):
He was either in the shower or you know, busy
with one of their you know, the way they entertained
themselves and noticed that she was missing and came after
her and made it clear that you don't get to
just leave because you want to. So, you know, there's
a thing that happens when people have your dream in
their hands, everything you ever wanted to do, They have
(37:47):
the power to make it real. They can get you
to walk to another borough to get them a piece
of cheesecake, even when it has nothing to do with
the career you're pursuing. Because if you want to be
a doctor, you go to school, you go to undergrad,
you study the sciences, you go to grad school, you
go to med school, and you get that license and
you're a doctor.
Speaker 6 (38:07):
No one else gets to control that.
Speaker 5 (38:09):
When you're pursuing what we're doing right now, there is
no direct path where you just do ABC and then
you're there. We have to have a lot of luck, mentorship,
you know, blessings, the universe, like all these things have
to come together for the three of us to be
having this conversation right now, and then hundreds of thousands
or millions of people will hear us have this conversation.
That's not a normal outcome, and neither of the three
(38:31):
of us could give someone else the direct path to
get to where we are today. Someone like Sean Combs
could by himself turn you into the star you wanted
to be, And there is no other path, There is
no Plan B.
Speaker 6 (38:47):
So people.
Speaker 5 (38:49):
Make decisions that, if you gave them a chance to
write it down, would tell you I would never do
A B and C until they're faced with you make
that decision, or that dream you've been pursuing your whole
life goes away forever. And if you think on the
other side of this decision that dream might come true.
You make decisions you never thought you would make, except
(39:10):
you make them, then the dream still doesn't happen. Now,
you know, there's the fallacy of loss, Like, well, I
already compromised myself. I can't walk away. Now I have
to see this thing through or sunken costs. I think
that fallacy is called where I've already paid this cost.
I've already paid this price, so now I have to
(39:30):
see this thing through or what did I do that for?
And then there's a bit of Stockholm syndrome where you
start to enjoy the perversions, or you start to empathize
or sympathize with your capturer or your abuser. Like, there's
a lot of psychological things happening in this story, and
for people to kind of you know, she signed up
for that, she knew what she was getting herself into,
(39:52):
that just comes with it.
Speaker 6 (39:54):
Sure is an easy.
Speaker 5 (39:55):
Thing to say when you're not the person that's in
that situation. So it's a it's a far more complicated
story than people want to acknowledge that it is. But
I think what we can kind of all agree on
is that in the court of public opinion, Sean Colms
will never be who he was no matter how this
case turns out.
Speaker 1 (40:13):
Well, we're going to keep watching. We have a couple
of cases to keep eyes on, and then of course
the health of the former president. So be sure to
check in with us for the midweek memo because hopefully
we'll have updates on all of this stuff in the meantime.
I'd like to thank you very much for sharing all
of your thoughts, mister Aarshaw, so hopefully we get to
(40:35):
do it again real soon. All Right, this has been
a production of the Black Information Network Today's show is
produced by Chris Thompson. Have some thoughts you'd like to share,
use the red microphone talkback feature on the iHeartRadio app.
While you're there, be sure to hit subscribe and download
all of our episodes. I am your Host Ramsey's Job
on all social media.
Speaker 6 (40:56):
I am q Ward on all social media as well.
Speaker 1 (40:58):
And join us tomorrow as we share our news with
our voice from our perspective right here on the Black
Information Network Daily Podcast
Here at the Black Information Network, we know how important
it is for you to start your week off energized, engaged,
and enlightened. There are always major stories that break over
the weekend, and we feel you should know about the
ones we are talking about today, So stay tuned for
our weekend recap featuring the author of the book Trap
History and the executive editor of Atlanta Daily World, mister A. R. Shaw.
(00:21):
This is the Black Information Network Daily Podcast. I am
ramses Jah and I am q Ward. All Right, mister A. R. Shaw,
author of the book Trap History, talk to me, man,
what's the ladies?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Man, it's a live going on.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
Man.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
We made it. We made it to spring. Let's see
we can make it the summer.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Yeah, man, yes, well, I know, and I'm just kind
of I'm not prepared to talk about it, but I'm
kind of going through the details of the announcement of
Joe Biden with the aggressive prostate cancer. Man. So we'll
definitely put something together and have a more in depth,
(01:00):
uh segment to offer, but for now, that just is,
you know, it's kind of a shock and also not
at the same time. I don't know how that would
hit you.
Speaker 4 (01:10):
Yeah, I mean, it's I mean there's been you know,
mumblings that Biden hasn't been at the best of health
for a few years now.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
You know, we just hate to hear this news.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
You know.
Speaker 4 (01:20):
Of course we're going to get more details in the
days to come, but all we can do now is
just pray for President Biden.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
And his family. Yeah, any thoughts here.
Speaker 5 (01:29):
You know, as a child of a cancer survivor and
a you know, a cancer fighter, that's never easy news
to deal with, no matter the context, no matter the timing,
no matter what stage it is, uh, you know, terminal
illness and and you know, disease that has kind of
won its battle against medicine for all of you, you know,
(01:50):
all of human time. It's impossible news to receive. And
even when it's treatable, even when there's a chance that
you can beat it, how it feels when you the
news is not easy, man, So prayers up to not
just his family, but anybody that's dealing with the fight
against cancer.
Speaker 6 (02:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Absolutely, well, we'll obviously be keeping an eye on that,
but for now, let's get to the news for today.
So this comes from Black Enterprise Wes Moore, the nation's
only black governor and a Democrat, voted a bill vetoed
sorry a bill in the late hours on May sixteenth
that would have created a commission to explore reparations for
(02:29):
black Marylanders and formally recognize the economic harm inflicted on
descendants of enslaved people in the state. According to The
Washington Post, while the bill was one among twenty three
vetos issued by Moore, it ignited a firestorm of criticism
of Moore's decision from other black leaders in the state
who had counted on More to be an ally in
their fight for reparations, given his stance on repairing the
(02:52):
racial wealth gap, which itself stems from the enslavement of
black people. Moore, however, defended his decision by saying, among
other things, that he needed to keep an eye on
the budget and that he didn't want to wait two
years to set up a commission to study reparations. Quote.
I was very transparent with the leadership and members of
the General Assembly that anything that fails to meet the
urgency of this moment, I will not sign it and
(03:13):
it must wait for another time. He goes on to
say that his decision regarding the reparation study was the
most challenging of his vetos. It goes on to say
a study group that is saying that they're going to
present reports to the governor in two years is fine,
but the governor is ready to engage now. So I
know there was a lot of back and forth. Q
(03:34):
and I kind of had a little bit of a
conversation on this. It was over text, so I don't
know what what twose thoughts are, but let's let's have
you go first here and tell us, you know a
little bit more about this story. Emir.
Speaker 4 (03:48):
Yeah, So, I mean Wes Moore man, he's you know,
he's one of our brightest leaders. I could see him,
you know, making a strong presidential run in a few years.
That he's that writing and prepared for the moment. This
was very perplexing in a lot of ways, right because
it was like he was kind of like almost double
(04:11):
dush in this topic in a sense where he's like,
you know, going back and forth saying that you know,
of course he doesn't want to just wait for two years.
He wants to engage now. And that was like, you know,
as a journalist, for me, it's like I take every
word seriously, every Senate seriously.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
What does that mean?
Speaker 4 (04:30):
Does that mean you're you have something that you want
to present now in the next six to twelve months.
That's that's going to make this go faster than the
two years. Like what does that mean when you say
engaged now? So that was that was very perplexing. And
you know, you think about Maryland and in that that
particular region, there are numerous ways where you can pretty
(04:51):
much trace how slavery impact this institutions that continue to
this day. I mean University of Maryland. Uh, they talked about,
you know, their connections to slavery. John Hopkins talked about
their connections to slavery and their families in Maryland today
that are still wealthy. They still have land based off
of enslaved individuals. And so there's a direct connection in
(05:14):
the Maryland region where we can pretty much draw on
a start of how do we repair the damages from
individuals who were enslaved in their family and their families
for generations as generations.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
So this, like I said, it was very perplacing.
Speaker 4 (05:27):
Don't I don't know where where it's Moore stands when
he says he's ready to engage now.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
So for me, it was like, Okay, what does that mean?
Speaker 5 (05:34):
Yeah, I'm like ar, I'm kind of torn on the
position that he took. First of all, the headline, it's
like without context on purpose, you know, so that someone
like me could read it and be as upset as possible.
But I also wonder, why not propose what you're saying
instead of vetoing it makes them change it. If you
(05:56):
guys want to do a study for reparations right now,
I'll sign it.
Speaker 6 (06:00):
If we have to wait two years, then propose it
in two years.
Speaker 5 (06:03):
It's how I think the conversation should have gone, instead
of just vetoing it with no alternative and no solution.
Don't don't kill my solution if you don't have one, Yeah,
you don't. Just don't introduce an obstacle when you could
just remove it. If you're the person that has the
veto power, propose the same thing they're talking about doing.
(06:24):
Stipulate that they do it right now, and sign it.
And maybe it's not that easy. I won't pretend that
I'm an expert at how government works. I have not
worked in that space. I just I wish instead of
vetoing something like that, because he said talked about how
hard the decision is, and I think that's because he
understands the headline's going to say, the black governor vetoed
(06:45):
the reparations. Yeah, exactly, So don't come up and help
make them come up with a better a better one
and sign it.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
I think that's more than fair too. The one thing
that I think is missing from the article that I've read,
or maybe it's in the article, but the part of
the article that I read that comes to mind is
that or maybe we did touch on it, but he
didn't go into detail, was that there was an issue
(07:14):
with their budget. And if they are if they don't
have the budget to carry out the normal government functions
and to address the immediate concerns of the people of Maryland,
then something like that might not make sense, you know.
(07:36):
And so you know, again, like you said, Q, it's
impossible to know all of the details because we're even
if we did work in government, you know, they have
privileged information and they have a better idea of what
their agenda is in that state than we do. We
only visit there. But you know, this has to be
(07:57):
more than, like you said, what the headline reads, because
I think you and I both had a similar reaction
when we saw the headliner. We're like, whoa this, this
doesn't make sense. This guy is you know, he's one
of the good ones. I guess I don't know, you know,
because there are people who are turncoats, there are people
(08:17):
who do all kinds of stuff.
Speaker 4 (08:18):
But.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
He doesn't. It doesn't feel like that Veto is consistent
with his brand of politics. That's probably the best way
to say it. And you know, I know that there
are some people who are critical of this move. Some
people might ultimately come around and understand it. Some people
are just very passionate about this one issue and so
they're going to take take exception to it. But there
(08:43):
are some people who really are looking for the Trump
style leadership that has been established well established in politics
of the past, you know, nearly decade in this country
and have a let's call it a pro white agenda
(09:03):
under Donald Trump's leadership kind of there's some people that
feel like there should be a pro black leadership where possible,
when possible, And you know, I still feel like that's
just a couple of steps away, if that's ever a thing.
I think that sensible people are still trying to kind
(09:26):
of get us back to the form of government where
we all kind of have a place under the same
government and are all kind of working together as a
collective in this country. And so you know, there are
people who've given in to Okay, this is the new norm,
and there are people who's still fighting to preserve let's
call it a democracy. And so you know, a lot
(09:47):
of opinions, a lot of takes, and I want to
make sure that you get a chance to respond because
I know that I mentioned that headline when we have
that conversation yesterday, So go ahead, Q.
Speaker 5 (09:57):
I just want to say it's interesting how who's going
to pay for it? Or budget always comes up when
it's something that helps or benefits US Police, Department of Defense. Again,
like you said, all the pro white anti DEI, all
those initiatives, we never have to figure out where we're
going to get the money from sending money to other countries.
(10:18):
I mean, on every level of government, when things need
to get funded, they find a way. But when it
comes to helping us, it's like, hey man, what do
you want us to do with the budget? That's how
are we supposed to pay for that? And what we've
always thought for all of our collective lives is that
there's all these bureaucracies and steps and red tape that
people have to go through to get things done, and
(10:39):
then we watch the current administration say just do it.
Speaker 6 (10:42):
We just do what we want.
Speaker 5 (10:44):
So it just it becomes very confusing when it's like, man,
when it's time to help us, Ah, man, my hands
are tired.
Speaker 6 (10:50):
What can I do?
Speaker 5 (10:50):
You know the budget and how we're going to pay
for it. And when we see things that are contrary
to our well being, contrary to our health, to our education,
to our you know, our pursuit of happiness, we just
those things get green lit and no one ever asked, Hey,
where are we going to get the money for that?
Speaker 6 (11:08):
They just do it, And.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Funnily enough, we end up paying for that too.
Speaker 6 (11:14):
About that, Yeah, that way all right?
Speaker 1 (11:16):
Next up, this from the Black Information Network. The largest
remaining Antebellum plantation in the United States has burned to
the ground. People reports on Thursday, May fifteenth, the south
wing of not Away Resort of former Antebellum plantation turned
travel destination and wedding venue, was engulfed in flames. The
sixty four room, fifty three thousand square foot structure was
(11:36):
a pile of rubble by ten PM. The cause of
the fire remains unknown. There have been no reported injuries.
My response to this is very short. Good ar, your
thoughts good.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
But I'm gonna get some contexts.
Speaker 4 (11:52):
So good, that's right here, But just give you some
contexts on the particular plantation. Actually got an opportunity before
we were assigned this segment. I watched the documentary on
this particular plantation, and so it was an owner by
the slave owner by the name of John Randolph. And
for those who are not familiar with I guess you
(12:13):
know pretty much the crops that were significant during slavery times.
You had sugar cane, you had tobacco, you had cotton.
Those are like the primary crops. So sugar cane was
by far the most brutal, needed, the most brutal form
of labor out of all of that. It was more
brutal than tobacco, more brutal than brutal than cotton.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
Sugar cane.
Speaker 4 (12:38):
You know, individuals who were forced to toy you on
sugar cane, they usually didn't live long. So you know,
if you look at the documents, he had like over
one hundred and fifty five slaves enslaved people on that
plantations because I'm sure the turnover rate was high, because
you know, it's just a lot of lives lost because
of the sugar cane. It was just a hard, harsh
(12:59):
form of labor. And so I just think about all
of the individuals who passed and all of the their
family members who will never compensated. And so after slavery,
this this particular plantation becomes this site where weddings and
a lot of festivities are thrown, and it's almost like,
you know, there's you know, me being in it from Atlanta.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
Uh.
Speaker 4 (13:19):
You know, if you go outside of Atlanta, you can
see you know, you can you can still see plantations
and places that work where ensulaved people work.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
You still see cotton fields of cot till this day.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
So we see how certain individuals, certain groups still hold
on to the ideas of slavery, and this is one
of those.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
Places that did that.
Speaker 4 (13:39):
Now all of they were still making money from you know,
the tourism, the weddings that were there, the events.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
None of that money went to the to the families
of the enslaved people.
Speaker 4 (13:50):
So we still see this this uh, you know, this
taking place in terms of we just talked about reparations.
The family is still not getting repairs for the damages
that were done for generations. And so, like you said,
I'm happy that it's burned down, but but at the
same time, it's a mentality that remains, particularly in the
South of holding on to these, uh these monuments of
(14:13):
a past where black people were oppressed openly and legally.
So uh, yeah, kudos to to this, you know fire.
And I'm a realistic I'm a realist, you know, I
don't really go into superstitions and things of that nature. Yeah,
but this is by fall, you know, I see this.
This is something that the ancestors man ten ten ten
(14:33):
fire departments had to control this fire. So you know,
this is this is something very deep, you know. And
like I said, I'm with you. I'm glad that it burned,
but let's let's work on burning this mentality.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
That allowed it. I love that. Q.
Speaker 5 (14:49):
It's really hard to speak after ar Yeah he got
it because yeah, what what my brother just finished saying
that Ryan Coogler could be Jordan for the prelude to
the to the plantation burned down. I feel like, man,
it got us ready and the ancestors brought us home.
Speaker 6 (15:07):
So Shout out to the Ancestral Plane. Shout out to
Michael B.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
Jordan, Jengo Jego, shout.
Speaker 5 (15:13):
Out to Joy, Shout out to Ryan Coogler Man, shout
out to ar Shaw, you know, the ancestors. Man, it
should be celebratory, but in a in a less light
hearted tone.
Speaker 6 (15:24):
Man.
Speaker 5 (15:25):
It's it's what they are said that that should be
a symbol of something deeper. That entire mindset, that entire
period of our history, UH needs to be reconciled with,
and we need to keep We need to stop, I'm
sorry pretending that it was nine thousand years ago and
that people who were affected by that are not still
walking around in this world and in this country.
Speaker 6 (15:44):
Now.
Speaker 5 (15:45):
You know, it's not our great great grandparents. You know,
some of us are one generation removed. There are people
who were alive during that time still, so you know,
burn the whole thing down, not just the building.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Yeah, I like that. You sound like meek you. Hey,
what's up?
Speaker 5 (16:03):
This is ramses Ja and I am q Ward and
we're inviting you to subscribe to Civic Cipher, our weekly
social justice podcast.
Speaker 6 (16:09):
Right here in the app.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
We pride ourselves on creating a show that fusters allyship
empathy and understanding, all the while conducting journalistically credible research
featuring influential, noteworthy guests, and empowering historically marginalized communities.
Speaker 5 (16:22):
The African proverb breeds, if you want to go far,
go together. So we are asking you to search for
and subscribe to Civic Cipher.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
That's civ c cip h e R right here in
the app. Today's guest is the author of the book
Trap History and the executive editor of Atlanta Daily World,
Mister A. R. Shaw. All right, next step from the
Atlanta Black Star. I'm gonna this is going to be
(16:51):
a lengthy one, but we want you to give your
thoughts here. I know that you know of the story
better than the rest of us.
Speaker 6 (16:56):
All right.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
Even after Dallas police realized they had arrested and abuse
the wrong black man, they still insisted on filing criminal
charges against Sylvester Hayes to justify their mistake, incarcerating him
for several days, causing the single father of four children
to lose his job as a security guard, and even
after all charges were dismissed against aspiring police officer more
than a year later, enabling him to file a lawsuit
(17:20):
for the brutal arrest. A federal judge last month dismissed
the case, claiming the cops have qualified immunity and had
probable cause to arrest him because he had failed to
use a turn signal within one hundred feet of a
stop sign. But the video shows the cops turned a
minor traffic infraction into a violent arrest simply because they
failed to compare the information on his driver's license to
(17:42):
that listed sorry that listed him as Sylvester Hayes third
to the information in their database listing another black man
named Sylvester Hayes wanted on a Feller Nay warrant for
domestic violence. US District Judge Karen Grinn sorry Karen Grin Scholar,
ruled the arrest to be lawful because she said Hayes
(18:03):
resisted arrest when Dallas cop pulled him out of his
car without telling him the reason why, and after failing
to confirm if he was the right suspect, which would
have cleared up the mistake in seconds. The judge also
determined Hayes had no grounds to sue because cops used
relatively minor force and acted reasonable when pulling him out
of his car on the side of the road, planting
(18:23):
a knee on his face, and stepping him into the
back of a patrol car. But that is a questionable
opinion to anybody watching the body camera footage, which shows
a distraught Hayes repeatedly yelling for help as several cops
piled on top of him quote outside of one officer
momentarily grabbing Plaintiff's throat and possibly hitting plaintiff in the
stomach with his knee, the officers used relatively minor force,
(18:45):
even as Plaintiff's screamed, resisted restraint, and refused to get
in the police car, Sculler wrote in her twenty page opinion.
But the lawsuit obtained by the Atlanta Black Star, which
was filed against Dallas police officers Walter gob and Holly Harris,
the cops who initiated the traffic stock stop, among sorry
(19:06):
along with several unnamed cops, states the arrest was overly
aggressive and unconstitutional, leaving Hayes with permanent injuries and trauma
quote in a blur of excessive force, all of which
was documented by defendant officers Gob and Harris, as well
as defendant Dallas police officers does three through ten's body cams,
the officers began to kick, punch, and unnecessarily use their
(19:28):
tasers on plaintive Hayes. The lawsuit states those hot to
say moreover, one or more of the officers can be
seen dangerously pinning plaintiff Hayes down with their knees on
his skull, neck, and back. One of the officers at
the scene pulled plaintiff Hayes' arm out of his shoulder socket,
which has caused him ongoing pain and mobility issues to
this day. Now, Hayes's attorney, Mark Robiness, plans to file
(19:50):
an appeal. According to the Dallas Morning News, all right,
sorry about that. I had to get all that out
because I didn't want you have to paint the picture
any further than the article had. But you know, talk
to us a little bit about this are This one
obviously is a little disturbing, so yours.
Speaker 4 (20:06):
I mean, yeah, we've been dealing with this for for
for you know, forever. Right, we would think that after
George Floyd, after Sandra Bland and so many kind of
countless others who have been impacted by brutality, that we
that the you know, the court systems will find ways
to correct themselves, and you get someone like a judge
(20:27):
Karen if it's schuler, a scholar.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
That's try to pronounce her last year, I didn't I
didn't know, yes, So it just.
Speaker 4 (20:34):
Shows a lack of empathy you know her, you know,
basically in her you know UH report is basically saying
that it was minded, it was a minor UH force
that was used against this black man. It's just like
when you look at the video, it's it's totally different
if we put carrying Karen in the same situation, would
she still feel like this was minor aggression that was
(20:58):
used on the minor force that was used. I say
it just it's so it's just a it's a lack
of empathy on the judge's part and we're seeing that,
you know how, why does a minor traffic stop go
you know, escalate to this farm or escalate to a
point of brutality And we we've only seen this with
you know, for the most part, black people being you know,
(21:19):
harassed for decades, and it's unfortunate and I you know,
for me, I just hope that with this appeal, hopefully,
hopefully it goes to another judge a judge that's more reasonable,
a judge that actually can see what you know, the officers,
what they did was wrong, and hopefully this individual was
compensated for what he had to endure.
Speaker 1 (21:43):
Yeah, we we covered this story a lot.
Speaker 5 (21:50):
Yeah, the city changes, the name of the victim, changes,
the story pretty much says the same. As long as
the victim looks like us, then the police are always
well within their rights to do whatever they want to
do and use whatever level of force and violence that
they deem appropriate at the time. They make a mistake,
(22:13):
they commit a crime, they cover it up. Everyone says
nothing to see here, And to say that it's an
exhausting story doesn't articulate the emotion well enough. The stories
like this are part of the reason that we do
this job. Stories like this are the reason this job
is so hard, because we're expected to just take it
(22:34):
on the chin every time. Point out the hypocrisy, point
out that it's illegal, point out the violations of rights,
and then we move onto the next story. And so
does the rest of the country, and so does the
legal system, and so do all these police unions and
police departments. We said, defund the police, and the entire
other side of the road got angry and afraid and
made other people angry and afraid, and made those brutalized
(22:57):
by that system angry and afraid. As defund the police,
then who's going to be there for you when you
need help? And that's a legitimate question to a population
that's underinformed and under educated about how these things work.
The term defund the police in and of itself, I
always thought was not workshopped enough because it was too
easy to make it a pejorative and to make people
(23:18):
afraid to do something that would have positive impact and
positive effects. So what we've done since that movement is
double and triple down on our investment in law enforcement
because we want less crime. Right, if we give the
police more money and more guns and more tanks and
more technology and more access, then we're going to be
more safe because when we see the police, we feel safe,
and when we get in trouble and we're afraid, we
call nine to one one. Except all the research and
(23:40):
all the data shows us that that's not true. And
until we find a way to one properly articulate that
to populations and rebrand what would be a better idea,
we're going to continue to cover this story. You, myself
and are will cover this story again, unfortunately soon, and
we'll feel how we feel right now, and the outcome
(24:01):
will be the same. Some judge and some prosecutor will
say nothing to see here, and those police were justified.
And even when civil agreements are reached and civil sentiments
are reached, those same taxpayers pay for it. Those police
unions wipe their hands and send those guys back to work.
So I don't know that we ever solve this. I
don't know that we ever saw a lot of the
things that we're dealing.
Speaker 6 (24:20):
With right now.
Speaker 5 (24:20):
Man, Like all the hope I used to have that
we were making on this progress daily kind of drips
down the drain.
Speaker 6 (24:27):
Man. I don't know. I don't know what to say.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
Well, you're not crazy. I think it's important to start there.
You know, people that feel that hopelessness. I think that
that's probably the most important thing, is to make sure
that people don't feel like they're the only ones feeling
that way. That does make sense, I uh, you know,
(24:57):
I get it, man, This is you know. The thing
about this story is that without knowing anything about the
judges involved, I know that they're white, they're Trump supporters
(25:19):
or both. There's no reality where they could see this
happen to a human being and not have those particular
blinders on, and the results show exactly who they are.
(25:40):
Like you have to have you have to be blind
to the humanity. And I think that a lot of
times whiteness can insulate a person from, you know, our
shared humanity, especially when it's when you're when you're white
(26:00):
and looking down right and not looking across. And that's
a very easy position to find yourself in in this
country because you're really taught that all the crime comes
from black people, not from poor people black people, right,
so crime looks a certain way, you know, brown people,
et cetera, not from poor people. That's not how it's
(26:22):
communicated to you. You're taught that, you know, white people
are the great conquerors in the world, right and not
these these tyrants and these colonizers. And so you're not
taught that part of it, and that that's not how
it comes across. And so you might not consider yourself
a white supremacist. You might not feel like white privilege
(26:44):
is a thing that you have. But the way that
you understand your place in society and the place of
your people in society is that you just are somehow better.
You got everything honestly and fair, and that is the
result of you just being of superior stock or something
(27:04):
like that. And so again it's very easy to look
down and to be blind to the humanity of other
people in that predicament. And to your point, Q, I
think that you know this is I want to share
a quick story. You know. I know that this is
a tale as long as time for black people in
this country. But I think the moment when like the
(27:27):
lights kind of clicked on for me, I was very young.
This might have been before the Rodney King riots because
I was really like paying attention then, So this might
have been in the early nineties or sometime around there.
But I want to say it's like the early nineties.
But what happened was I was watching an episode of
(27:48):
The Fresh Prince of bel Air and Jazz or DJ
Jazzy Jeff, who I've come to know, but Jazz on
the show, was in a scene and he was supposed
to like approach the bench and there was a peace
officer in the court that was holding a bible for
(28:09):
him to swear on or something like that, and he
approached the bench and he had both of his hands
up like freeze, you know, stick your hands up like
that type of pose. And someone asked him, like, yo,
why are your hands up? You know you're not under
arrest or anything like that, and he says, effectually, he says,
you know, I've been in this situation before. I know
how to approach it, and I better do it the
(28:30):
right way before I get And this is the part
I remember before I get six warning shots in the back,
and of course everyone laughs because it's a sitcom. It's
a comedy, right, But I was like six warning shots
in the back and everyone's laughing at it, and I
just remember that moment where I was like whoa. And
then everything that I had heard in the past kind
(28:50):
of like like lined up and it was in sync,
and I was like, this is a real thing. And
of course you get older, you learn your history and
you realize it goes all the way back to you know,
slave patrols and so forth. That was the moment for me.
And if that moment was call it thirty, I don't know,
four thirty decades ago, right then, looking at this story again,
(29:15):
your point is well made, is that progresses I'm more
of an optimist, so I'll call it slow all right. Finally,
this story comes from US Weekly. Former Danity Kin singer
Don Richard took the stand in the trial of Sean
Diddy Combs on Friday May sixteenth. Richard, forty one, was
(29:35):
sworn in late Friday, shortly before court adjoined for the day.
Prosecution asked her about an alleged incident in two thousand
and nine where she saw Diddy fifty five threatening Cassidy
Cassie in his Los Angeles home Dannity Knes. Don Richards
testifies that he came downstairs screaming belligerent, asking where his
(29:59):
food was and continued to hit her in the head
and kick her on the ground in front of us.
She claimed that she was visiting Diddy and was in
the kitchen with Cassie during the alleged attack. Quote. He
came downstairs angry and was saying where the f was
his eggs? And he was telling Cassie she never gets
anything right, and where the f was his food? Then
(30:22):
he came over to the skillet with the ex init
and tried to hit her over the head and she
fell to the ground. All right, Richard claimed did He
continue to beat Cassie while she was on the floor,
then proceeded to take his arm around her neck and
dragged her by the hair up the stairs. The following day,
did He allegedly invited Richard and her Dirty Money bandmate
(30:43):
to record with him in the studio, where he told
them the attack they'd both seen was passion. Richard said
he threatened them, saying people who say something can end
up missing. After she finished her testimony, Diddy's attorney asked
a judge to strike it from the record, arguing that
it does not support the charge of sex trafficking. The prosecution, meanwhile,
has argued that Ditty's alleged abuse created a culture that
(31:05):
allowed him to carry out more serious crimes. So the
plot thickens. But I think we knew it was going
to give us your thoughts, your ar all right.
Speaker 4 (31:14):
So I'm gonna I'm gonna kind of take a different angle.
I'm gonna go one place and I'm gonna bring us
to where we are now, particularly me, you know, being
just like a lover of hip hop and just you know,
I've pretty much followed hip hop, you know, since I
was a kid, and I just love how black people
was able to create this art form that pretty much
(31:35):
impacted the world. We go to the nineties where we
get the birth of the hip hop mogul. Right, we
get the Russell Simmons, we get Diddy, we get Shunned,
we get shug Night, and those three individuals. There was
a few more, but those three individuals kind of set
the stage of Okay, we can now have this art
form and then you know, control it from a business standpoint.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Fast forward.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
We look at where sug Night is, we look at
where Russell Simmons is, and now we look at where
Ditty is and it's like three of the most powerful
businessmen to pretty much profit from this art form are
now in pretty much dire situations.
Speaker 4 (32:15):
And it's just like, how did they get there? How
did we you know, three of the most powerful businessman's
businessmen of our culture, of hip hop culture get put
in this predicament, and you know, when I think about it,
I'm like nobody held them accountable. And it was like
all of this stuff went unchecked for years. And we
(32:35):
go back to like even like making a band, like
that microaggression act of having his band members of people
who are desiring to be a part of this culture
to walk miles to get him a piece of cheesecake.
You know, there was a microaggression. I mean we laughed
at it, we all thought it was entertainment, but you
know that was really an aggressive act towards people who
(32:58):
are just really trying to make music to go walk
in and get some cheesecake for him, not for not
for the group, but just for him. So it just
shows you, you know, from that, you know, for those
small things like that, how manipulative he was, and how
he how manipulative, manipulative he could be towards people, and
all of this stuff that's coming out now with this case,
(33:20):
it shows you that you know that there's a lot
of things that went unchecked from the people around him,
and you know someone needed to save him from himself,
and no one stood up to say, look, all of
this is wrong. Like, you know, you got so many
people who are employed by you, Black people who are
employed by you, who are going to be out of
a job because of your mishandling of a situation or situations.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
Now going back to this case is just you know,
I wasn't prepared.
Speaker 4 (33:49):
I'm sure none of us were prepared for the details
of what was happening within these freak offs and what
was going back and forth in terms of the abuse,
and and you know, just to you know, it's just
it's just a lot that's happening within this case. Particularly
I you know, I see him as as a horrible person,
(34:10):
as someone who's abusive, who's done a lot, a lot
of wrong a lot of wrongdoings. But when I think
about it from a legal standpoint, I covered two rico
trials here in the State of Georgia, the Donald Trump
Rico case and also the Young Thug while I say
Rico case, and within both of those Rico cases, it
was basically trying to prove that there was some form
(34:31):
of racketeering, racketeering for the furtherance of criminal activity. Right now,
with this case, I'm not really seeing that, and I'm
not sure that you know, what's going to happen. You know,
there's there's still some weeks to go within this case,
but right now, it just feels like this was probably
a state case that I'm not sure the federal government
is doing a bit of overreaching right now. I'm just
(34:54):
looking at it from from that standpoint, that racket standpoint,
I'm not I haven't connected the dots shit in terms
of this criminal organization. It seems like this was just
a mess up individual who was very abusive.
Speaker 1 (35:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (35:08):
Yeah, I'm not resieing a racketeering point yet. So, like
I said, we just have to kind of just sit
back and see what happens. But yeah, it's just, you know,
from a hip hop and cultural standpoint, it's just sad
to see that, you know, several of our biggest business
leaders within our communities have now fallen pretty.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
Much to the whiteside.
Speaker 5 (35:32):
Yeah, anything, you know, it's interesting to see an individual
reco case that's that's not normal, Like Rico typically gives
you the impression that it's an organizational thing and that
there are a lot of parties involved in this reco
case seems to be against one person. So that's the
thing that stands out the most to me. With regards
(35:52):
to the legal part, I think what we have to
acknowledge is that there are multiple things happening at the
same time.
Speaker 6 (35:58):
Here. You know, Shan Kan is on trial.
Speaker 5 (36:02):
For a crime, but Diddy is on trial in the
court of public opinion, and that case is over like that,
you don't ever recover the video by itself would have
sealed that deal, but the details coming out in this
hearing disgusting is one way to say it brutal.
Speaker 6 (36:21):
Abusive.
Speaker 5 (36:23):
So again there's two really separate trials happening simultaneously. The
thing that disturbs me the most, father of a daughter,
son of a single mom, brother, the six sisters, is that, well,
why didn't she just leave?
Speaker 6 (36:39):
Why didn't she just go?
Speaker 5 (36:41):
And you can tell that that's coming from people who
are either okay with abuse or have never experienced it
and don't understand it's not always as simple as just
picking up and leaving. I mean, the video that made
this from she must just be trying to get some
money to oh no, maybe he was abusing her, shows
her trying to just go, and it shows you an
(37:04):
example of what happens when you try to just go
from someone who has decided that you are theirs and
theirs alone. If they can't have you, no one can.
You will do what they say, You will bend to
their will. And we saw her get I don't even
want to describe what we saw enough people have seen
that video of her trying to get on the elevator
with her bag.
Speaker 6 (37:23):
While I guess it seems.
Speaker 5 (37:24):
He was either in the shower or you know, busy
with one of their you know, the way they entertained
themselves and noticed that she was missing and came after
her and made it clear that you don't get to
just leave because you want to. So, you know, there's
a thing that happens when people have your dream in
their hands, everything you ever wanted to do, They have
(37:47):
the power to make it real. They can get you
to walk to another borough to get them a piece
of cheesecake, even when it has nothing to do with
the career you're pursuing. Because if you want to be
a doctor, you go to school, you go to undergrad,
you study the sciences, you go to grad school, you
go to med school, and you get that license and
you're a doctor.
Speaker 6 (38:07):
No one else gets to control that.
Speaker 5 (38:09):
When you're pursuing what we're doing right now, there is
no direct path where you just do ABC and then
you're there. We have to have a lot of luck, mentorship,
you know, blessings, the universe, like all these things have
to come together for the three of us to be
having this conversation right now, and then hundreds of thousands
or millions of people will hear us have this conversation.
That's not a normal outcome, and neither of the three
(38:31):
of us could give someone else the direct path to
get to where we are today. Someone like Sean Combs
could by himself turn you into the star you wanted
to be, And there is no other path, There is
no Plan B.
Speaker 6 (38:47):
So people.
Speaker 5 (38:49):
Make decisions that, if you gave them a chance to
write it down, would tell you I would never do
A B and C until they're faced with you make
that decision, or that dream you've been pursuing your whole
life goes away forever. And if you think on the
other side of this decision that dream might come true.
You make decisions you never thought you would make, except
(39:10):
you make them, then the dream still doesn't happen. Now,
you know, there's the fallacy of loss, Like, well, I
already compromised myself. I can't walk away. Now I have
to see this thing through or sunken costs. I think
that fallacy is called where I've already paid this cost.
I've already paid this price, so now I have to
(39:30):
see this thing through or what did I do that for?
And then there's a bit of Stockholm syndrome where you
start to enjoy the perversions, or you start to empathize
or sympathize with your capturer or your abuser. Like, there's
a lot of psychological things happening in this story, and
for people to kind of you know, she signed up
for that, she knew what she was getting herself into,
(39:52):
that just comes with it.
Speaker 6 (39:54):
Sure is an easy.
Speaker 5 (39:55):
Thing to say when you're not the person that's in
that situation. So it's a it's a far more complicated
story than people want to acknowledge that it is. But
I think what we can kind of all agree on
is that in the court of public opinion, Sean Colms
will never be who he was no matter how this
case turns out.
Speaker 1 (40:13):
Well, we're going to keep watching. We have a couple
of cases to keep eyes on, and then of course
the health of the former president. So be sure to
check in with us for the midweek memo because hopefully
we'll have updates on all of this stuff in the meantime.
I'd like to thank you very much for sharing all
of your thoughts, mister Aarshaw, so hopefully we get to
(40:35):
do it again real soon. All Right, this has been
a production of the Black Information Network Today's show is
produced by Chris Thompson. Have some thoughts you'd like to share,
use the red microphone talkback feature on the iHeartRadio app.
While you're there, be sure to hit subscribe and download
all of our episodes. I am your Host Ramsey's Job
on all social media.
Speaker 6 (40:56):
I am q Ward on all social media as well.
Speaker 1 (40:58):
And join us tomorrow as we share our news with
our voice from our perspective right here on the Black
Information Network Daily Podcast
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