On part 2 of today's podcast, Hosts Ramses Ja and Q Ward offer thoughts on how to have positive discussions with people that have different political views.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Still broadcasting from the Civic Cipher studios. This is a
QR code where we share perspective, seek understanding, and shape outcomes.
I go by the name ramsy.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Y'ah and they call me Qward.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
And we want you to keep hanging out with us,
because we got some more to talk about. Of course,
as I mentioned before, we're going to talk about dealing
with folks, at least some of the ways that we
found dealing with folks that hold the opposing political position.
I know that's a tough one, but you know, we've
we're still working through it, but we maybe have some
(00:32):
of that might help. We're also going to ask the question,
was Jackie Robinson and DEI hire? You know, I know
how crazy that sounds, but I think it's worth sticking
around for. I think that if you don't have a
proper framework for what DEI is, I think it could
certainly help. And if you do, I think it can
help as well. And Q had something that he really
(00:53):
wanted to share today and I'm really excited to listen
to it. In fact, let's get to it right now.
We are going to listen to Q words clapback as
he shares with us his thoughts on the Republican attacks
on education, science, and facts.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
So it's an interesting time right now.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
Man, This.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
I never imagine at any point growing up. I never
imagined at any point as an adult, and definitely never
imagined when I was so excited about becoming a father
that myself or my children would have to grow up
in this version of America. And as we see bands
(01:35):
on books and the mocking of science, the contrarian position
that has become popular on almost every topic, especially things
rooted in fact, in science and research, that there's like
a smugness to being the person that questions everything, provides
(01:58):
no answers, no resources, provides no actual alternative information, just
brings everything up for question in a way that makes
you seem like the smartest person in the room. So
they're now trying to point they're simultaneously looking down their
nose but calling the educated of the elite, so that
(02:21):
the larger population can consider themselves somehow the underdog or
the victim of those who are educated. So we're now
in a position We're being educated doesn't make you an elitist,
but the loudly resenting it might right, So sometimes knowing
(02:43):
things it's not being framed as bad, like somehow it's
become suspicious to be an expert about something. You know,
having a degree makes you an elitist and thinking critically, well,
you know, that makes you Unamerican. Somehow, there's a very
very loud movement Rams that we have to deal with
(03:05):
that's trying to convince people that education is the enemy,
curiosity is dangerous, that expertise is oppression. But how do
we get here? So this isn't new. The far rights
war on education has been decades in the making.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
It started on talk radio, grew on cable.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
News mostly Fox, and ecstaticized through social media and what
Rams and I always call out echo chambers pushing the
ideas that you know, college professors are brainwashing people, that
public schools are indoctrinating kids. And then if you're a
(03:49):
person with a degree, especially if you're black, liberal, you know,
queer or female, that you're destroying America. And you know,
affirmative action is the only reason you had access to education.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Anyway.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
So our president set on camera and somehow did not
offend anyone that he loves the poorly educated. I think
some people thought he was joking, but he was dead
serious that wasn't a punchline. That was a message. Because
the less you know, the easier you are to manipulate
(04:22):
and control. So they'll say it's about arrogance. You know,
people that are educated are arrogant, But that's not what
it's about. They're mad not because education creates arrogance, but
because it creates autonomy and independence. It causes people to
ask questions and challenge narratives and resist manipulation, and they
(04:43):
don't want that. They don't hate knowledge because it makes
people smug. They hate it because it makes people harder
to manage. And for what, like who benefits from this?
Speaker 1 (04:57):
Rams?
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Like to what end from the fear from the infusion
from a population thinking that education is the biggest threat,
So who wants to weaponize it? Actually, well, mostly elitists.
They'll say, I don't need some liberal professor teaching me
(05:17):
how to live or telling me what to do. But
are they really mad at what they're pretending to consider elites?
Because they're not mad at billionaires. They vote for billionaires,
they cheer for them. They want to be them, where
their names on red hats and go sneakers. Man, Their
problem isn't with the wealthy and it's not actually with
(05:43):
the educated. They're not actually rejecting or resenting curiosity and education.
They are pushing anti intellectualism very intentionally. They went to Yale,
Rams they went to Harvard, they went to.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
The Ivy League.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Oh yeah, so how come they're trying to convince everyone
else that higher education is bad.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
They don't actually resent intelligence, Ramses. They just know that
they can exploit other people's resentment of it. Yeah, because
they know when you start asking questions, you demand answers.
When you understand history, you're far less likely to repeat it.
(06:31):
When you know how the systems work, you stop settling
for the scraps that they give you. You stop looking to
your left and your right for an enemy, and you
look across at those who oppress you and realize that
you've been under their thumb the whole time. So Ramses
and I will not apologize for being educated. We won't
pretend that ignorance deserves equal footing with truth because it
(06:54):
hurts your feelings. The moment we do that, we hand
over the future of our ourselves, our country, and our
children to the people who never feared knowledge for themselves.
They just never wanted to unlock it for you.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
That's about as potent as i've heard, you know, and
I recognize that I'm very fortunate that I got to
go to school a bunch of times and get a
bunch of degrees. And you're absolutely right, not just what
you learn, but the people that you learn and the
ideas that they share. It helps you become a more
(07:39):
powerful human being and a more powerful citizen, and as
a result, you're less likely to, just as you mentioned,
deal with the scraps that they're giving you. You demand
that you're elected officials do what they are elected to do,
and that has got to be tough, especially for folks
on the trying to make such huge shifts in the
(08:04):
country right now. So moving on and speaking of folks
on the right, talking to folks with you know, opposing
political opinion, someone with a different political opinion than you.
You know, politics and religion, I mean, there's like a
handful of things where you could have a conversation with
the person that you've known for years, have that one conversation,
(08:26):
and then you're never friends again.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Right.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Politics and religion definitely are two of them, right, And
for a lot of people it might not come up.
They don't want to bring it up because they don't
want to run that risk. But for some people it's inevitable.
Especially nowadays, more and more people find themselves having to
confront the reality of their situation. Listen, my belief is
(08:50):
that your vote for Kamala Harris is going to ruin
the country. And then the opposing side is, my reality
is made worse by your vote for Donald Trump. It
emboldens not just Trump and Republicans, but it emboldens the
people on the ground who vote for him. Once he's
(09:11):
in office, they feel way more up and they show
their guns off, and they think this is their country,
and they you know, and it makes my reality a
lot more scarier. Right, So for some folks who live
in those realities, they have to now talk about politics, right,
and that can be a very challenging thing for folks
(09:31):
to do. And I'm gonna try to go into this
as unbiased as possible. And Q, I'm gonna ask you
to remain true to Q because you're going to keep
us on our line. But for me, I have made
(09:53):
a commitment to at least one person. I won't share
his name, but eventually he's going to be on the show.
He's been on our show those plenty of times, but
I don't like to talk about him if he's not here,
and he hasn't been on the show yet. So, but
he's a differend of mine, and he thinks he's a conservative,
(10:13):
white presenting Jewish man. He works in the same space
as me. He is a person that I would consider
an intellectual. He is well researched. He stands on business right,
and I think that everything that he says is wrong.
And I can demonstrate to him every single time that
(10:34):
everything that he says is absolutely wrong. I have no
problem doing it. I'll do it again, and I'm gonna
love him through it, all right. He's not made this
commitment to him. It is because he like I provide
insight into what it is that people over there think,
which is something we need to know about. And I
(10:56):
provide him insight into the reality of the situation, you
know what I mean. And we're appreciative of that. You know.
Whenever he comes into town, you know, we grab a meal,
we sit down and we argue for a couple of hours.
At the end of the night, we give each other
a hug. He goes back where he's going I'm go
back to where I'm going. You know, a few times
(11:16):
throughout the year, if we're not you know, on a
show together, we're checking up on each other's kids, each
other's mom's that sort of stuff, right, or his mom,
I check up on her. And you know, I see
him doing his journalistic work from time to time and
pop up on Fox News or pop up somewhere. You know,
I'm like, Okay, good, good for him. And of course
he sees me. I'll go viral or something like that.
(11:38):
You know, that's just how it goes. But no matter what,
I've committed to seeing the world using his lens to
peek into his world from time to time. Now, when
it comes to talking to him, one of the things
that I've done is I've established that no matter what
this man says out of his mouth, that I I'm
(12:02):
going to acknowledge his humanity. I'm going to give what
he says the benefit of the doubt. And and that's
very very difficult for me to do, right Q. You
keep the line. But I'm sharing this, this this story
the way that it happens. So he says some crazy
stuff and I, unfortunately have to dignify it. I have
(12:24):
to meet him where he is, and that's a that's
a very taxing exercise. But I found, believe it or not,
that I actually learned some stuff from him. I don't
learn anything about my material reality, but I learned something
about how he thinks the world works, and that fear
shapes the world that I live in. So understanding that
(12:44):
fear and by in order to understand it, I have
to dignify it. I have to acknowledge it. But understanding
it helps me become a better journalist and and and
share things that I feel will help dismantle the things
that have caused him to be afraid. Okay, something that
I know to be true is that a lot of
people will pick white presenting, Christian, heterosexual male Republicans for
(13:10):
this example, because not just because they're you know, talked
about quite a bit, but because you know, I think
they fit the mold. Here. Some of these folks will say,
I'm not a racist. I'm absolutely not a racist person.
I just don't care about your people's problems enough to
(13:34):
not care about my own. In other words, I'm not racist.
But I'm going through some stuff and if this dude
that I'm voting for says he's gonna help me with
my stuff. I'm hurting, so I'm gonna vote for him.
I know it's gonna make it harder on y'all, but
it might make it easier on me, and I just
(13:56):
I hope that it doesn't make it harder on y'all.
That's not why I'm doing it, but I'm trying to
let some air out of the ball over here. Right.
That doesn't make me racist. That means that I'm just
overlooking racism right now. Of course they wouldn't admit that
last part, but that's effectually what they're trying to say,
and that's how they circumvent the conversation about race. Right.
So let's say, for instance, I accept that I accept it, Okay,
(14:17):
you're not a racist person. You are simply trying to
figure out how this administration is going to benefit you
and your material reality over this other administration. I now
have to have a different conversation. It's not a conversation
about race, even if that person does harbor some racist thoughts.
(14:39):
They have changed the state of play, so I now
have to play their game, and learning how to play
that game without introducing race is a strategy that I
had to become very good at and that is one
way that I've learned to talk with someone with a
different political opinion, what is it that's making you do
(15:02):
this thing, and how do you think it will benefit you?
And then I knowing how to do the research that
I know how to do again journalistically credible research. This is
what we always say, and this is what we do
every day. Know how to get the things and present
them if they're willing to listen. Some folks aren't to
be fair, and you know, if they're your friends and
you've made a permanent decision, then you have to deal
(15:24):
with that. But if they're willing to listen, baby steps,
maybe one two articles a week, you let them know, Hey,
what you're imagining might end up being true, but it
might not end up being true. And if it doesn't
end up being true, not only did you not get
what you wanted, but you've made my material reality worse
(15:45):
and it's more likely that you're getting duped and devoting
some voting for something that is not in your best interest.
That will also negatively affect me and my family and
my capacity to raise my children, and it makes everyone
worse off. So I've said enough to I know you
want to jump in here, so any thoughts so far?
Speaker 2 (16:10):
It's hard for me because I think it's a false
premise to begin with. This conversation is not about people
disagreeing on politics, and it's intentionally framed that way to
make the person who's most affected by it emotionally seem
ridiculous and charged up. And it's a gaslight. The question
has nothing to do with us agreeing or disagreeing on politics.
(16:32):
In most cases, this question is posed when people disagree
on humanity, on empathy, on compassion, and unlike my brother Ramsay's,
I've made no such commitment to honor or dignify people
sit across from me and share those types of opinions. Right, So,
if the preservation of you and your house is worth
(16:55):
the demise of everyone else, you and I are not
the same. Not reserve a space for you, because my
reality is shaken to its core.
Speaker 1 (17:05):
Mine, not the people I see on TV.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
Me and I have sleepless nights and uncomfortable drives to
work and have to worry about my children and my
family in a way that I've never had to before.
So I have no interest in your differing political opinions
right now, because you knew when you cast that vote
that it wasn't just about politics. And I don't want
to hear that it's not about race, because when has
(17:31):
it ever not been about race? So your skin color
is not political, mine is. So they play both games. Well,
I'm not a political person, or I should be able
to disagree with you politically and still be your friend.
I have no interest in playing either of those twisted
(17:52):
semantic games. It is very very clear that their line
has been drawn, and if we stand on our sides
of it, so be it.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Well, again, I appreciate us both being able to tackle that,
and as I mentioned, I needed you to hold that
line because that needs to be said. I think that
needs to be said the loudest and at the end.
But clockworks the way the clockworks. Is time to move
on for entertainment, We're gonna be talking about Jackie Robinson.
Uh and, and was Jackie Robinson a Dee Higher d
(18:26):
I hire? And that's that's kind of the question that
kind of prompted this segment. Our thoughts on this segment. So,
if you're, like me, not a sports person, I'm not
a sports person, but I know who Jackie Robinson is.
But let's say you don't know who Jackie Robinson. I'm
gonna share a bit just to bring you up to speed. So, uh,
this and and and just so you know, this came
about because I was talking to you. Uh. And this
(18:48):
is like a sports person fact a sport. A person
that knows a lot about sports would know this fact.
In the in the MLB or Major yeah, major League Baseball. Uh,
all of the teams, any team you go to, you
can't wear number forty two. And that's because Jackie Robinson
(19:10):
wore number forty two when he played baseball, and the
whole league retired that jersey number in honor of him. Right,
And that's such a profound thing, Like normally your team
will hang your jersey, but the whole league. So when
Q mentioned that to me, then this question came up.
Was he a DEI hire? And then we got to
(19:32):
you know, talking about him. We thought it would make
great radio. So I'll share a bit for the gain
for those that don't know Jackie. This is from Jackie
Robinson Museum dot com. Jackie Robinson was born on January
thirty first, nineteen nineteen, in Cairo, Georgia, the son of
a sharecropper and the grandson of former slaves. Young Jackie
grew up in Pasadena, California, raised by a single working
mother of five. After graduating from Pasadenia and Junior College,
(19:53):
Jackie attended the University of California at Los Angeles. A
star athlete, Jackie became the university's first four short letter winner,
excelling in football, basketball, track and field, and baseball. After
leaving UCLA, he served in the US Army during World
War Two, but was court martialed and honorably discharged for
standing up for his rights and refusing to move to
the back of a segregated military bus. I didn't know that, Nope.
(20:17):
Upon returning home from the military, Jackie Robinson set his
sights on joining baseball's and negro leagues and began playing
shortstop for the Kansas City Monarchs in nineteen forty five.
Later that year, opportunity Becken went branch Ricky, the general
manager of the Brooklyn Dodgers, invited Robinson to become the
first African American to play for the all white Dodgers
farm team, the Montreal Royals. Anticipating the great adversity that
(20:39):
Robinson would face. As he integrated modern baseball, Ricky professed
he needed a player who could bear the torment, famously
telling Robinson he was looking for a ballplayer with guts
enough not to fight back. On April fifteenth, nineteen forty seven,
Jackie Robinson stepped onto Ebbittsfield for his first game with
the Brooklyn Dodgers. It was the beginning of an unparalleled
(21:00):
career in baseball. At the end of his explosive ten
years as a Dodger, he's recorded or sorry. His record
included a point three to one to one batting average,
one hundred and thirty seven home runs, seven hundred and
thirty four runs batted in, and one hundred ninety seven
stolen bases. In nineteen fifty five, he helped the Dodgers
beat the New York Yankees to win their first World
(21:21):
Series championship. Robinson took home the Rookie of the Year
Award in nineteen forty seven, the MVP Award in nineteen
forty nine, and in nineteen sixty two became the first
African American inducted into the Baseball Hall of Fame. Okay,
so that's who Jackie Robinson is Q. Was Jackie Robinson
A DEEI.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
Higher, So I'll take a couple of steps back first. Okay,
for the baseball fans listening, you heard that. So Jackie
Robinson batted three eleven. That's how point three to one
one is red and batting average.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Ok. Sorry about that.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
At the school, my brother on his sports take, I'm
getting there. So something keeps happening, and I'd never seen
it happen before about ten years ago, and now it
happens all the time, and we just keep.
Speaker 1 (22:20):
Letting it happen. Just really really really disturbing.
Speaker 2 (22:26):
Once upon a time, one of my good friends, his
son was going to college, and as he was getting
ready to go to college, I was telling him a
story about, you know, my experiences, you know, leaving the city,
going to college and dealing with racism for the first
(22:47):
time and having a classmate where I was the first
black person he'd ever met, and all the different struggles
that come with leaving home, leaving the watch of your parents,
and you know, going out into the world to claim
you're a time to me and to experience life. And
when you come from a city like mine, Detroit, Michigan,
where most of your life you're surrounded by blackness. Stepping
(23:10):
out in the world into the world can be a
much different experience than you expect. And his response was
don't even worry about it. Q. He woke, And that
was the highest compliment he could pay his son, and
everyone that would have heard it would have understood that,
(23:30):
don't even worry about it, bro.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
He woke. He's enlightened. I like that.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
He's informed. He's plugged in. He's not asleep or unplugged,
however you want to use that, like Ramsey said, He's
not asleep, he's aware, bro, he knows what's going on.
And the right took that word and made it a
contextless pejorative where they use it just as an insult,
(24:02):
having no idea its roots or what it's supposed to mean.
And what we did is we let them get that off.
So now when they call someone a woke liberal, that
woke liberal pushes back like they've been insulted or like
they've been called something bad, like we let them hijack
and reappropriate the word, the same thing we let them
(24:25):
do with the firmative action, the same thing we let
them do with critical race theory. And now once again
we're letting them do to DEI. So someone in an
effort to insult Jackie Robinson and they didn't say the words,
(24:46):
but their actions showed it. Removed him from I think
it was the United States Armies archives. And then you know,
some right wing extremists and just flat out jerks accused
him of being a d higher on television and in print,
and we collectively got upset, No he's not, and it's
(25:10):
like people, yes, he absolutely was. And that's the point. Bingo,
one of the most qualified and talented athletes in the
history of the world, lived in a world that would
have never even given him a chance because they had
determined before he showed up that he was underqualified because
he was black. DEI gave him a chance. Shout to
(25:34):
branch Ricky and showed the world that y'all tripping, y'all
might want to get a little piece of this black
in y'all sports because they're brilliant and talented and beautiful
and they make the game look like art. We once
again have let them co opt something determine what it means.
(25:55):
So now when we see an American flag wave, we
think right wing maga racist instead of American, or maybe
that's what American is becoming. You know, maybe that's what
that is becoming. But initially we just let them take it.
We let them take the church, they're the they're the
(26:18):
party of God and guns. We let them get we
let them be both whole life, but anti feeding children
launch at school.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
You know.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
So in another instance, DEI is exactly what Jackie Robinson represented,
an all white league being integrated, some diversity, some inclusion,
and eventually some equity, at least in that space. Because today,
(26:55):
if you're as good as Jackie Robinson was back then,
you might earn two three four, five hundred million dollars
to play a game. And now you know, Afro Cuban,
Afro Dominican, Afro inspired Spanish speaking people from all over
(27:15):
the world dominate that game a lot more than the
African Americans do. But we all come from the same source.
And Jackie Robinson was the bridge and the gateway and
the door for all of these people, for all of
these ethnicities, all these backgrounds, all of these cultures, to
play a game that they love, a child's game for
(27:35):
a king's ransom, because of DEI. Let's not let them
continue to co op, rebrand and reprogram us on everything
that we know to be true. We got to do
better than that. My opinion and one that I picked
up from somebody I admired greatly, the great nick wright
(27:56):
Jackie Robinson, was absolutely a DEI hied.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Well, thank you for that take, Q I want to
let you know that I love you so much. I
appreciate you, and thank you for being my brother and
for teaching me and just walking this journey with me. Man,
You're very special to me and you're a gift to me.
So I want to make sure I said that love
(28:22):
you too. Thanks for allowing me to do so. No,
I know we got a journey, man, but we on it.
At least we not alone. We got each other, all right.
All right, Well, that's it for us on the QR Code.
Today's show is produced by Chris Thompson. If you asked
me about you'd like to share, use a red microphone
talk back feature on the iHeartRadio app. While you're there,
you can get subscribe and download all of our episodes.
Be sure to check us out on all social media
(28:43):
at Civic Sipher. You can find me on all social
media at rams's jah.
Speaker 2 (28:47):
I am q Ward and on social media as well
Speaker 1 (28:50):
And we want to say thank you for tuning in
and continuing into tune in and be sure to check
us out next time as we share our news with
our voice from our perspective right here on the QR
code
Still broadcasting from the Civic Cipher studios. This is a
QR code where we share perspective, seek understanding, and shape outcomes.
I go by the name ramsy.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Y'ah and they call me Qward.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
And we want you to keep hanging out with us,
because we got some more to talk about. Of course,
as I mentioned before, we're going to talk about dealing
with folks, at least some of the ways that we
found dealing with folks that hold the opposing political position.
I know that's a tough one, but you know, we've
we're still working through it, but we maybe have some
(00:32):
of that might help. We're also going to ask the question,
was Jackie Robinson and DEI hire? You know, I know
how crazy that sounds, but I think it's worth sticking
around for. I think that if you don't have a
proper framework for what DEI is, I think it could
certainly help. And if you do, I think it can
help as well. And Q had something that he really
(00:53):
wanted to share today and I'm really excited to listen
to it. In fact, let's get to it right now.
We are going to listen to Q words clapback as
he shares with us his thoughts on the Republican attacks
on education, science, and facts.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
So it's an interesting time right now.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
Man, This.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
I never imagine at any point growing up. I never
imagined at any point as an adult, and definitely never
imagined when I was so excited about becoming a father
that myself or my children would have to grow up
in this version of America. And as we see bands
(01:35):
on books and the mocking of science, the contrarian position
that has become popular on almost every topic, especially things
rooted in fact, in science and research, that there's like
a smugness to being the person that questions everything, provides
(01:58):
no answers, no resources, provides no actual alternative information, just
brings everything up for question in a way that makes
you seem like the smartest person in the room. So
they're now trying to point they're simultaneously looking down their
nose but calling the educated of the elite, so that
(02:21):
the larger population can consider themselves somehow the underdog or
the victim of those who are educated. So we're now
in a position We're being educated doesn't make you an elitist,
but the loudly resenting it might right, So sometimes knowing
(02:43):
things it's not being framed as bad, like somehow it's
become suspicious to be an expert about something. You know,
having a degree makes you an elitist and thinking critically, well,
you know, that makes you Unamerican. Somehow, there's a very
very loud movement Rams that we have to deal with
(03:05):
that's trying to convince people that education is the enemy,
curiosity is dangerous, that expertise is oppression. But how do
we get here? So this isn't new. The far rights
war on education has been decades in the making.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
It started on talk radio, grew on cable.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
News mostly Fox, and ecstaticized through social media and what
Rams and I always call out echo chambers pushing the
ideas that you know, college professors are brainwashing people, that
public schools are indoctrinating kids. And then if you're a
(03:49):
person with a degree, especially if you're black, liberal, you know,
queer or female, that you're destroying America. And you know,
affirmative action is the only reason you had access to education.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Anyway.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
So our president set on camera and somehow did not
offend anyone that he loves the poorly educated. I think
some people thought he was joking, but he was dead
serious that wasn't a punchline. That was a message. Because
the less you know, the easier you are to manipulate
(04:22):
and control. So they'll say it's about arrogance. You know,
people that are educated are arrogant, But that's not what
it's about. They're mad not because education creates arrogance, but
because it creates autonomy and independence. It causes people to
ask questions and challenge narratives and resist manipulation, and they
(04:43):
don't want that. They don't hate knowledge because it makes
people smug. They hate it because it makes people harder
to manage. And for what, like who benefits from this?
Speaker 1 (04:57):
Rams?
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Like to what end from the fear from the infusion
from a population thinking that education is the biggest threat,
So who wants to weaponize it? Actually, well, mostly elitists.
They'll say, I don't need some liberal professor teaching me
(05:17):
how to live or telling me what to do. But
are they really mad at what they're pretending to consider elites?
Because they're not mad at billionaires. They vote for billionaires,
they cheer for them. They want to be them, where
their names on red hats and go sneakers. Man, Their
problem isn't with the wealthy and it's not actually with
(05:43):
the educated. They're not actually rejecting or resenting curiosity and education.
They are pushing anti intellectualism very intentionally. They went to Yale,
Rams they went to Harvard, they went to.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
The Ivy League.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Oh yeah, so how come they're trying to convince everyone
else that higher education is bad.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
They don't actually resent intelligence, Ramses. They just know that
they can exploit other people's resentment of it. Yeah, because
they know when you start asking questions, you demand answers.
When you understand history, you're far less likely to repeat it.
(06:31):
When you know how the systems work, you stop settling
for the scraps that they give you. You stop looking to
your left and your right for an enemy, and you
look across at those who oppress you and realize that
you've been under their thumb the whole time. So Ramses
and I will not apologize for being educated. We won't
pretend that ignorance deserves equal footing with truth because it
(06:54):
hurts your feelings. The moment we do that, we hand
over the future of our ourselves, our country, and our
children to the people who never feared knowledge for themselves.
They just never wanted to unlock it for you.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
That's about as potent as i've heard, you know, and
I recognize that I'm very fortunate that I got to
go to school a bunch of times and get a
bunch of degrees. And you're absolutely right, not just what
you learn, but the people that you learn and the
ideas that they share. It helps you become a more
(07:39):
powerful human being and a more powerful citizen, and as
a result, you're less likely to, just as you mentioned,
deal with the scraps that they're giving you. You demand
that you're elected officials do what they are elected to do,
and that has got to be tough, especially for folks
on the trying to make such huge shifts in the
(08:04):
country right now. So moving on and speaking of folks
on the right, talking to folks with you know, opposing
political opinion, someone with a different political opinion than you.
You know, politics and religion, I mean, there's like a
handful of things where you could have a conversation with
the person that you've known for years, have that one conversation,
(08:26):
and then you're never friends again.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Right.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Politics and religion definitely are two of them, right, And
for a lot of people it might not come up.
They don't want to bring it up because they don't
want to run that risk. But for some people it's inevitable.
Especially nowadays, more and more people find themselves having to
confront the reality of their situation. Listen, my belief is
(08:50):
that your vote for Kamala Harris is going to ruin
the country. And then the opposing side is, my reality
is made worse by your vote for Donald Trump. It
emboldens not just Trump and Republicans, but it emboldens the
people on the ground who vote for him. Once he's
(09:11):
in office, they feel way more up and they show
their guns off, and they think this is their country,
and they you know, and it makes my reality a
lot more scarier. Right, So for some folks who live
in those realities, they have to now talk about politics, right,
and that can be a very challenging thing for folks
(09:31):
to do. And I'm gonna try to go into this
as unbiased as possible. And Q, I'm gonna ask you
to remain true to Q because you're going to keep
us on our line. But for me, I have made
(09:53):
a commitment to at least one person. I won't share
his name, but eventually he's going to be on the show.
He's been on our show those plenty of times, but
I don't like to talk about him if he's not here,
and he hasn't been on the show yet. So, but
he's a differend of mine, and he thinks he's a conservative,
(10:13):
white presenting Jewish man. He works in the same space
as me. He is a person that I would consider
an intellectual. He is well researched. He stands on business right,
and I think that everything that he says is wrong.
And I can demonstrate to him every single time that
(10:34):
everything that he says is absolutely wrong. I have no
problem doing it. I'll do it again, and I'm gonna
love him through it, all right. He's not made this
commitment to him. It is because he like I provide
insight into what it is that people over there think,
which is something we need to know about. And I
(10:56):
provide him insight into the reality of the situation, you
know what I mean. And we're appreciative of that. You know.
Whenever he comes into town, you know, we grab a meal,
we sit down and we argue for a couple of hours.
At the end of the night, we give each other
a hug. He goes back where he's going I'm go
back to where I'm going. You know, a few times
(11:16):
throughout the year, if we're not you know, on a
show together, we're checking up on each other's kids, each
other's mom's that sort of stuff, right, or his mom,
I check up on her. And you know, I see
him doing his journalistic work from time to time and
pop up on Fox News or pop up somewhere. You know,
I'm like, Okay, good, good for him. And of course
he sees me. I'll go viral or something like that.
(11:38):
You know, that's just how it goes. But no matter what,
I've committed to seeing the world using his lens to
peek into his world from time to time. Now, when
it comes to talking to him, one of the things
that I've done is I've established that no matter what
this man says out of his mouth, that I I'm
(12:02):
going to acknowledge his humanity. I'm going to give what
he says the benefit of the doubt. And and that's
very very difficult for me to do, right Q. You
keep the line. But I'm sharing this, this this story
the way that it happens. So he says some crazy
stuff and I, unfortunately have to dignify it. I have
(12:24):
to meet him where he is, and that's a that's
a very taxing exercise. But I found, believe it or not,
that I actually learned some stuff from him. I don't
learn anything about my material reality, but I learned something
about how he thinks the world works, and that fear
shapes the world that I live in. So understanding that
(12:44):
fear and by in order to understand it, I have
to dignify it. I have to acknowledge it. But understanding
it helps me become a better journalist and and and
share things that I feel will help dismantle the things
that have caused him to be afraid. Okay, something that
I know to be true is that a lot of
people will pick white presenting, Christian, heterosexual male Republicans for
(13:10):
this example, because not just because they're you know, talked
about quite a bit, but because you know, I think
they fit the mold. Here. Some of these folks will say,
I'm not a racist. I'm absolutely not a racist person.
I just don't care about your people's problems enough to
(13:34):
not care about my own. In other words, I'm not racist.
But I'm going through some stuff and if this dude
that I'm voting for says he's gonna help me with
my stuff. I'm hurting, so I'm gonna vote for him.
I know it's gonna make it harder on y'all, but
it might make it easier on me, and I just
(13:56):
I hope that it doesn't make it harder on y'all.
That's not why I'm doing it, but I'm trying to
let some air out of the ball over here. Right.
That doesn't make me racist. That means that I'm just
overlooking racism right now. Of course they wouldn't admit that
last part, but that's effectually what they're trying to say,
and that's how they circumvent the conversation about race. Right.
So let's say, for instance, I accept that I accept it, Okay,
(14:17):
you're not a racist person. You are simply trying to
figure out how this administration is going to benefit you
and your material reality over this other administration. I now
have to have a different conversation. It's not a conversation
about race, even if that person does harbor some racist thoughts.
(14:39):
They have changed the state of play, so I now
have to play their game, and learning how to play
that game without introducing race is a strategy that I
had to become very good at and that is one
way that I've learned to talk with someone with a
different political opinion, what is it that's making you do
(15:02):
this thing, and how do you think it will benefit you?
And then I knowing how to do the research that
I know how to do again journalistically credible research. This is
what we always say, and this is what we do
every day. Know how to get the things and present
them if they're willing to listen. Some folks aren't to
be fair, and you know, if they're your friends and
you've made a permanent decision, then you have to deal
(15:24):
with that. But if they're willing to listen, baby steps,
maybe one two articles a week, you let them know, Hey,
what you're imagining might end up being true, but it
might not end up being true. And if it doesn't
end up being true, not only did you not get
what you wanted, but you've made my material reality worse
(15:45):
and it's more likely that you're getting duped and devoting
some voting for something that is not in your best interest.
That will also negatively affect me and my family and
my capacity to raise my children, and it makes everyone
worse off. So I've said enough to I know you
want to jump in here, so any thoughts so far?
Speaker 2 (16:10):
It's hard for me because I think it's a false
premise to begin with. This conversation is not about people
disagreeing on politics, and it's intentionally framed that way to
make the person who's most affected by it emotionally seem
ridiculous and charged up. And it's a gaslight. The question
has nothing to do with us agreeing or disagreeing on politics.
(16:32):
In most cases, this question is posed when people disagree
on humanity, on empathy, on compassion, and unlike my brother Ramsay's,
I've made no such commitment to honor or dignify people
sit across from me and share those types of opinions. Right, So,
if the preservation of you and your house is worth
(16:55):
the demise of everyone else, you and I are not
the same. Not reserve a space for you, because my
reality is shaken to its core.
Speaker 1 (17:05):
Mine, not the people I see on TV.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
Me and I have sleepless nights and uncomfortable drives to
work and have to worry about my children and my
family in a way that I've never had to before.
So I have no interest in your differing political opinions
right now, because you knew when you cast that vote
that it wasn't just about politics. And I don't want
to hear that it's not about race, because when has
(17:31):
it ever not been about race? So your skin color
is not political, mine is. So they play both games. Well,
I'm not a political person, or I should be able
to disagree with you politically and still be your friend.
I have no interest in playing either of those twisted
(17:52):
semantic games. It is very very clear that their line
has been drawn, and if we stand on our sides
of it, so be it.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Well, again, I appreciate us both being able to tackle that,
and as I mentioned, I needed you to hold that
line because that needs to be said. I think that
needs to be said the loudest and at the end.
But clockworks the way the clockworks. Is time to move
on for entertainment, We're gonna be talking about Jackie Robinson.
Uh and, and was Jackie Robinson a Dee Higher d
(18:26):
I hire? And that's that's kind of the question that
kind of prompted this segment. Our thoughts on this segment. So,
if you're, like me, not a sports person, I'm not
a sports person, but I know who Jackie Robinson is.
But let's say you don't know who Jackie Robinson. I'm
gonna share a bit just to bring you up to speed. So, uh,
this and and and just so you know, this came
about because I was talking to you. Uh. And this
(18:48):
is like a sports person fact a sport. A person
that knows a lot about sports would know this fact.
In the in the MLB or Major yeah, major League Baseball. Uh,
all of the teams, any team you go to, you
can't wear number forty two. And that's because Jackie Robinson
(19:10):
wore number forty two when he played baseball, and the
whole league retired that jersey number in honor of him. Right,
And that's such a profound thing, Like normally your team
will hang your jersey, but the whole league. So when
Q mentioned that to me, then this question came up.
Was he a DEI hire? And then we got to
(19:32):
you know, talking about him. We thought it would make
great radio. So I'll share a bit for the gain
for those that don't know Jackie. This is from Jackie
Robinson Museum dot com. Jackie Robinson was born on January
thirty first, nineteen nineteen, in Cairo, Georgia, the son of
a sharecropper and the grandson of former slaves. Young Jackie
grew up in Pasadena, California, raised by a single working
mother of five. After graduating from Pasadenia and Junior College,
(19:53):
Jackie attended the University of California at Los Angeles. A
star athlete, Jackie became the university's first four short letter winner,
excelling in football, basketball, track and field, and baseball. After
leaving UCLA, he served in the US Army during World
War Two, but was court martialed and honorably discharged for
standing up for his rights and refusing to move to
the back of a segregated military bus. I didn't know that, Nope.
(20:17):
Upon returning home from the military, Jackie Robinson set his
sights on joining baseball's and negro leagues and began playing
shortstop for the Kansas City Monarchs in nineteen forty five.
Later that year, opportunity Becken went branch Ricky, the general
manager of the Brooklyn Dodgers, invited Robinson to become the
first African American to play for the all white Dodgers
farm team, the Montreal Royals. Anticipating the great adversity that
(20:39):
Robinson would face. As he integrated modern baseball, Ricky professed
he needed a player who could bear the torment, famously
telling Robinson he was looking for a ballplayer with guts
enough not to fight back. On April fifteenth, nineteen forty seven,
Jackie Robinson stepped onto Ebbittsfield for his first game with
the Brooklyn Dodgers. It was the beginning of an unparalleled
(21:00):
career in baseball. At the end of his explosive ten
years as a Dodger, he's recorded or sorry. His record
included a point three to one to one batting average,
one hundred and thirty seven home runs, seven hundred and
thirty four runs batted in, and one hundred ninety seven
stolen bases. In nineteen fifty five, he helped the Dodgers
beat the New York Yankees to win their first World
(21:21):
Series championship. Robinson took home the Rookie of the Year
Award in nineteen forty seven, the MVP Award in nineteen
forty nine, and in nineteen sixty two became the first
African American inducted into the Baseball Hall of Fame. Okay,
so that's who Jackie Robinson is Q. Was Jackie Robinson
A DEEI.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
Higher, So I'll take a couple of steps back first. Okay,
for the baseball fans listening, you heard that. So Jackie
Robinson batted three eleven. That's how point three to one
one is red and batting average.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Ok. Sorry about that.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
At the school, my brother on his sports take, I'm
getting there. So something keeps happening, and I'd never seen
it happen before about ten years ago, and now it
happens all the time, and we just keep.
Speaker 1 (22:20):
Letting it happen. Just really really really disturbing.
Speaker 2 (22:26):
Once upon a time, one of my good friends, his
son was going to college, and as he was getting
ready to go to college, I was telling him a
story about, you know, my experiences, you know, leaving the city,
going to college and dealing with racism for the first
(22:47):
time and having a classmate where I was the first
black person he'd ever met, and all the different struggles
that come with leaving home, leaving the watch of your parents,
and you know, going out into the world to claim
you're a time to me and to experience life. And
when you come from a city like mine, Detroit, Michigan,
where most of your life you're surrounded by blackness. Stepping
(23:10):
out in the world into the world can be a
much different experience than you expect. And his response was
don't even worry about it. Q. He woke, And that
was the highest compliment he could pay his son, and
everyone that would have heard it would have understood that,
(23:30):
don't even worry about it, bro.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
He woke. He's enlightened. I like that.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
He's informed. He's plugged in. He's not asleep or unplugged,
however you want to use that, like Ramsey said, He's
not asleep, he's aware, bro, he knows what's going on.
And the right took that word and made it a
contextless pejorative where they use it just as an insult,
(24:02):
having no idea its roots or what it's supposed to mean.
And what we did is we let them get that off.
So now when they call someone a woke liberal, that
woke liberal pushes back like they've been insulted or like
they've been called something bad, like we let them hijack
and reappropriate the word, the same thing we let them
(24:25):
do with the firmative action, the same thing we let
them do with critical race theory. And now once again
we're letting them do to DEI. So someone in an
effort to insult Jackie Robinson and they didn't say the words,
(24:46):
but their actions showed it. Removed him from I think
it was the United States Armies archives. And then you know,
some right wing extremists and just flat out jerks accused
him of being a d higher on television and in print,
and we collectively got upset, No he's not, and it's
(25:10):
like people, yes, he absolutely was. And that's the point. Bingo,
one of the most qualified and talented athletes in the
history of the world, lived in a world that would
have never even given him a chance because they had
determined before he showed up that he was underqualified because
he was black. DEI gave him a chance. Shout to
(25:34):
branch Ricky and showed the world that y'all tripping, y'all
might want to get a little piece of this black
in y'all sports because they're brilliant and talented and beautiful
and they make the game look like art. We once
again have let them co opt something determine what it means.
(25:55):
So now when we see an American flag wave, we
think right wing maga racist instead of American, or maybe
that's what American is becoming. You know, maybe that's what
that is becoming. But initially we just let them take it.
We let them take the church, they're the they're the
(26:18):
party of God and guns. We let them get we
let them be both whole life, but anti feeding children
launch at school.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
You know.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
So in another instance, DEI is exactly what Jackie Robinson represented,
an all white league being integrated, some diversity, some inclusion,
and eventually some equity, at least in that space. Because today,
(26:55):
if you're as good as Jackie Robinson was back then,
you might earn two three four, five hundred million dollars
to play a game. And now you know, Afro Cuban,
Afro Dominican, Afro inspired Spanish speaking people from all over
(27:15):
the world dominate that game a lot more than the
African Americans do. But we all come from the same source.
And Jackie Robinson was the bridge and the gateway and
the door for all of these people, for all of
these ethnicities, all these backgrounds, all of these cultures, to
play a game that they love, a child's game for
(27:35):
a king's ransom, because of DEI. Let's not let them
continue to co op, rebrand and reprogram us on everything
that we know to be true. We got to do
better than that. My opinion and one that I picked
up from somebody I admired greatly, the great nick wright
(27:56):
Jackie Robinson, was absolutely a DEI hied.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Well, thank you for that take, Q I want to
let you know that I love you so much. I
appreciate you, and thank you for being my brother and
for teaching me and just walking this journey with me. Man,
You're very special to me and you're a gift to me.
So I want to make sure I said that love
(28:22):
you too. Thanks for allowing me to do so. No,
I know we got a journey, man, but we on it.
At least we not alone. We got each other, all right.
All right, Well, that's it for us on the QR Code.
Today's show is produced by Chris Thompson. If you asked
me about you'd like to share, use a red microphone
talk back feature on the iHeartRadio app. While you're there,
you can get subscribe and download all of our episodes.
Be sure to check us out on all social media
(28:43):
at Civic Sipher. You can find me on all social
media at rams's jah.
Speaker 2 (28:47):
I am q Ward and on social media as well
Speaker 1 (28:50):
And we want to say thank you for tuning in
and continuing into tune in and be sure to check
us out next time as we share our news with
our voice from our perspective right here on the QR
code
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