October 31, 2025 • 10 mins
Nicky Saunders, Content Strategist at Deeper Than The Brand, and is best known for scaling motivational speaker Eric Thomas’s online community from 300K to 2M.
Follow Will Lucas on Instagram at @willlucas
Learn more at AfroTech.com https://instagram.com/afro.tech
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
So my question is this, like how timing matters, Like,
now you go to aprote, everybody's doing that. When I
was when I did in twenty seventeen, it was like
one of maybe two people. And so if I want
to jump off the bridge on YouTube, So there was
a day where people would just say, you know, I'm
gonna do thirty days straight of YouTube content, i'member like
shameless Maya did this some years ago. It might have
(00:21):
even been a year, but I think she for sut
did it every day for a month and she blew up.
Does that still work today? So if I said, you know,
I want to pop on YouTube, I'm gonna go hard.
I'm gonna do thirty days, I'm in and hopefully by
the end of that thirty days, I'm up. I got
my YouTube platu coming.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
It's up.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
So I wouldn't say you probably get a YouTube flat guaranteed, right,
But I will say it does work for a few reasons. One,
most people who do that weren't consistent on it anyways.
So now you're building consistency. Any platform respects consistency, and
once they start seeing you post more and more, they're like,
(01:04):
hold on, let me, let me push you out because
you're here every single day.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Now, Hello, I kind of like you.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Now before I wasn't taking you serious, but now I
kind of like you.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
So let me post it to As a as a creator,
you get better.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Right, your day one to your day twenty five is
going to be completely different. So you're going to now
start having data of what works and what doesn't, and
you're going hopefully, hopefully you're going to change up some
of your content based off Okay, this got seven views,
this one got five thousand views? Hold on, what did
(01:43):
I do? Let's do this over right. So between the
platform taking you serious and then you figuring out exactly
what your your audience and the platform wants. On top
of that, you're building a community. Because people love journeys.
They're either a trying to champion you, B trying to
(02:05):
see if you're gonna.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Finish or not, but they gonna watch you.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
They gonna watch you regardless, And so you're like, Yo,
this is day seventeen and I feel like quitting right,
but I'm a post it. It's only probably gonna be
two minute long vlog today, but a we hear people
are gonna watch Okay, yo is he gonna it's gonna
make it to thirty up, we're eighteen, We're nineteen.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Oh okay cool.
Speaker 3 (02:32):
And then also you're giving inspiration for other people to
be like, oh, they did that, I could do this too, right,
And so the community, if anything, if you don't get
your plaque, you get a community that the second that
these thirty days finished, you could probably drop some merch,
you could probably do a paid community, you could probably
(02:55):
do an event, and they're going to be like, I'm invested,
Like I want to be a part of whatever else
you're doing. So there's a lot of benefits of doing
that if you are open to the totality of doing
things on a like a challenge base.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
But yeah, yeah, I like that.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
I like that.
Speaker 1 (03:16):
You know, I was reading an interview you this some
time ago, and you said that your goal was to
help people feel comfortable telling their stories in a way
that feels true to them. There's a lot of vulnerability
that comes with being truly authentic online. We talked about,
you know, if I'm failing right now, there's this meme
you know, you talk about the day in the life
of an entrepreneur, like I'm killing it. It's killing me.
(03:37):
You know I'm doing it. It's like I'm done, like
you know what I mean, And so like there's real
vulnerability with being authentic. How do people get over that
and share themselves publicly? And when I got to go
look at these people in the phase Now.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
Yeah, it's setting boundaries, right, You don't have to social
media is not a reality TV show. If you don't
want it to be right, you can do. Like for me,
You're probably not going to see much of my mom,
much of my Grandma. Doesn't mean I don't love them.
It's just a boundary that I have. You may not
(04:17):
always see twenty four to seven of my relationship. It's
a boundary that I have. But you may hear in
certain seasons that I suffer through depression. Right, I'm not
gonna say that every single day, but there are certain seasons,
especially if I know it's kind of heavy and the
creator burnout kind of season, that I may talk about that. Right,
there's certain I kind of do a list of what
(04:40):
I'm able to talk about and what is non negotiable
in this season, and then what I may say depending
on how I feel, how the audience needs it, and
it may stretch me. But I'll be open to it
to talk about it. Right, changes with every single season.
(05:03):
Like some people are like my kids are like non negotiable.
I'm not putting out my kids at all.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
And then they.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
Become fifteen years old and they became champion of something
and they want to just show them to just say, hey,
I love my baby right, Like I don't really show
show him, but I love my baby right. Yeah, it's
gonna change. But you as a creator, you as a
business owner turn creator too, gotta go. Okay, Yes, the
(05:34):
main part is the brand awareness. The main part is
the expertise, experiences, all that great stuff. But I'm open
to this and I'll say it here and there or
I'll show it here and there because you're going to
receive energy of man, I didn't know that about you.
(05:56):
That's so amazing, Yo, I rock with you even more.
Like remember and sometimes it won't be in the comments.
It will be like when you meet a person, Yo,
I love the when you said this, you're like you
watch that. You didn't comment even like that he can
know you followed like what are you talking about? Nah?
Speaker 2 (06:17):
That really hit home to me.
Speaker 3 (06:19):
Boom, Like you don't know the impact that you truly
have and as long as you feel comfortable showing it
talking about it, do it. But if you don't feel
comfortable at all, do not stress yourself out because that's
just not authentic to you, and so you're going to
be inconsistent with it.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
What is some general and specific things. When you go
to an entrepreneur, you go to the page on TikTok,
they Instagram, you're like, you should stop doing that, Like
that's why that's killing your success, It's limiting your opportunities.
Stop doing that.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
What do we do?
Speaker 3 (07:00):
There's a few things, and it's a preference, right. My
thing is, I'm never gonna tell you not to do
something unless data shares that you shouldn't, right, because I
may not be your audience, regardless if I'm auditing it,
I'm looking at it as.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
A friend whatever, I may not be your audience.
Speaker 3 (07:20):
But if your data shows that this is low numbers
every single solitary time, FAM, you may have to like,
I know, we don't want to quit, but this one
you may have to like put on the bench for
a little bit, like focus on what does numbers right?
And so it's just it's a true sit down. Every
(07:42):
single month a I've put out between thirty to ten
pieces of content today, depending on how consistent you are.
Right this month I put out that amount. Which ones
were the highest, which one were the lowest? What are
my average numbers? Right? My lowest pieces of content? I
(08:02):
really need to sit down and be like, is it
time to cut that out? Or do we go one
more month? If we're in two months and we're not
doing no numbers, chill out, let it go. Maybe try
it in another season. I'm not saying let the idea go,
but let's try it a different season, or let's try
to create it in a different way, in a different environment,
(08:23):
in different kind of content formats.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Maybe that doesn't need to be a video. Maybe that
needs to be an article.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
Maybe that needs to be a long thread, right, maybe
that needs to be pictures. But it goes data should
run the way you move certain things. When it comes
to should I create this type of content or not?
Speaker 1 (08:46):
Does production quality matter anymore?
Speaker 2 (08:49):
No?
Speaker 3 (08:50):
No, no, We've seen too many videos go viral.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
That was on a bad android. Sorry, and I love you,
but it.
Speaker 3 (09:01):
Doesn't really matter. It goes like, like I have these
three stages of content creation. There's consistency, quality, and connection. Right,
So consistency means the most, and those made people are
just so bored of hearing of that. You're bored, but
you haven't done it, so I don't know what I'm
(09:22):
going to continue to tell you, right, So, consistency is
like and that doesn't mean every single day, just the
timeframe that you committed to. So if you're saying, yo,
I'm going to show up Monday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday and
all you have is your phone, okay, do that, right,
because your audience is going to care more about the
presence than the quality. Now, the quality does matter when
(09:47):
you're trying to be taken a little bit more serious, right,
So but I will still grab my phone and do
a green screen because I connect with the people more.
You don't want to be too too high highly produced
because then you lose a connection with the community. You've
seem too big time, right, and you don't want to
(10:10):
just do lower quality all the time because then it's like, ah,
you haven't really grown. Right. If we look at Keith Lee,
Keith Lee will forever do the phone videos, but he's
taken a little bit serious because other content that he's
collabed with has the highly produced content. Right He's doing series,
(10:31):
he's doing shows, he's doing commercials and all these different things.
So there's still a level of high production, but still
let me keep to the core of how I grew
my audience to over millions of followers, right. So, Keith
Lee is a perfect example of how production isn't necessarily needed.
It's great for balance, but it's not needed to really
(10:55):
have the brand that you want.
So my question is this, like how timing matters, Like,
now you go to aprote, everybody's doing that. When I
was when I did in twenty seventeen, it was like
one of maybe two people. And so if I want
to jump off the bridge on YouTube, So there was
a day where people would just say, you know, I'm
gonna do thirty days straight of YouTube content, i'member like
shameless Maya did this some years ago. It might have
(00:21):
even been a year, but I think she for sut
did it every day for a month and she blew up.
Does that still work today? So if I said, you know,
I want to pop on YouTube, I'm gonna go hard.
I'm gonna do thirty days, I'm in and hopefully by
the end of that thirty days, I'm up. I got
my YouTube platu coming.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
It's up.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
So I wouldn't say you probably get a YouTube flat guaranteed, right,
But I will say it does work for a few reasons. One,
most people who do that weren't consistent on it anyways.
So now you're building consistency. Any platform respects consistency, and
once they start seeing you post more and more, they're like,
(01:04):
hold on, let me, let me push you out because
you're here every single day.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Now, Hello, I kind of like you.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Now before I wasn't taking you serious, but now I
kind of like you.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
So let me post it to As a as a creator,
you get better.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Right, your day one to your day twenty five is
going to be completely different. So you're going to now
start having data of what works and what doesn't, and
you're going hopefully, hopefully you're going to change up some
of your content based off Okay, this got seven views,
this one got five thousand views? Hold on, what did
(01:43):
I do? Let's do this over right. So between the
platform taking you serious and then you figuring out exactly
what your your audience and the platform wants. On top
of that, you're building a community. Because people love journeys.
They're either a trying to champion you, B trying to
(02:05):
see if you're gonna.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Finish or not, but they gonna watch you.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
They gonna watch you regardless, And so you're like, Yo,
this is day seventeen and I feel like quitting right,
but I'm a post it. It's only probably gonna be
two minute long vlog today, but a we hear people
are gonna watch Okay, yo is he gonna it's gonna
make it to thirty up, we're eighteen, We're nineteen.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Oh okay cool.
Speaker 3 (02:32):
And then also you're giving inspiration for other people to
be like, oh, they did that, I could do this too, right,
And so the community, if anything, if you don't get
your plaque, you get a community that the second that
these thirty days finished, you could probably drop some merch,
you could probably do a paid community, you could probably
(02:55):
do an event, and they're going to be like, I'm invested,
Like I want to be a part of whatever else
you're doing. So there's a lot of benefits of doing
that if you are open to the totality of doing
things on a like a challenge base.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
But yeah, yeah, I like that.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
I like that.
Speaker 1 (03:16):
You know, I was reading an interview you this some
time ago, and you said that your goal was to
help people feel comfortable telling their stories in a way
that feels true to them. There's a lot of vulnerability
that comes with being truly authentic online. We talked about,
you know, if I'm failing right now, there's this meme
you know, you talk about the day in the life
of an entrepreneur, like I'm killing it. It's killing me.
(03:37):
You know I'm doing it. It's like I'm done, like
you know what I mean, And so like there's real
vulnerability with being authentic. How do people get over that
and share themselves publicly? And when I got to go
look at these people in the phase Now.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
Yeah, it's setting boundaries, right, You don't have to social
media is not a reality TV show. If you don't
want it to be right, you can do. Like for me,
You're probably not going to see much of my mom,
much of my Grandma. Doesn't mean I don't love them.
It's just a boundary that I have. You may not
(04:17):
always see twenty four to seven of my relationship. It's
a boundary that I have. But you may hear in
certain seasons that I suffer through depression. Right, I'm not
gonna say that every single day, but there are certain seasons,
especially if I know it's kind of heavy and the
creator burnout kind of season, that I may talk about that. Right,
there's certain I kind of do a list of what
(04:40):
I'm able to talk about and what is non negotiable
in this season, and then what I may say depending
on how I feel, how the audience needs it, and
it may stretch me. But I'll be open to it
to talk about it. Right, changes with every single season.
(05:03):
Like some people are like my kids are like non negotiable.
I'm not putting out my kids at all.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
And then they.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
Become fifteen years old and they became champion of something
and they want to just show them to just say, hey,
I love my baby right, Like I don't really show
show him, but I love my baby right. Yeah, it's
gonna change. But you as a creator, you as a
business owner turn creator too, gotta go. Okay, Yes, the
(05:34):
main part is the brand awareness. The main part is
the expertise, experiences, all that great stuff. But I'm open
to this and I'll say it here and there or
I'll show it here and there because you're going to
receive energy of man, I didn't know that about you.
(05:56):
That's so amazing, Yo, I rock with you even more.
Like remember and sometimes it won't be in the comments.
It will be like when you meet a person, Yo,
I love the when you said this, you're like you
watch that. You didn't comment even like that he can
know you followed like what are you talking about? Nah?
Speaker 2 (06:17):
That really hit home to me.
Speaker 3 (06:19):
Boom, Like you don't know the impact that you truly
have and as long as you feel comfortable showing it
talking about it, do it. But if you don't feel
comfortable at all, do not stress yourself out because that's
just not authentic to you, and so you're going to
be inconsistent with it.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
What is some general and specific things. When you go
to an entrepreneur, you go to the page on TikTok,
they Instagram, you're like, you should stop doing that, Like
that's why that's killing your success, It's limiting your opportunities.
Stop doing that.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
What do we do?
Speaker 3 (07:00):
There's a few things, and it's a preference, right. My
thing is, I'm never gonna tell you not to do
something unless data shares that you shouldn't, right, because I
may not be your audience, regardless if I'm auditing it,
I'm looking at it as.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
A friend whatever, I may not be your audience.
Speaker 3 (07:20):
But if your data shows that this is low numbers
every single solitary time, FAM, you may have to like,
I know, we don't want to quit, but this one
you may have to like put on the bench for
a little bit, like focus on what does numbers right?
And so it's just it's a true sit down. Every
(07:42):
single month a I've put out between thirty to ten
pieces of content today, depending on how consistent you are.
Right this month I put out that amount. Which ones
were the highest, which one were the lowest? What are
my average numbers? Right? My lowest pieces of content? I
(08:02):
really need to sit down and be like, is it
time to cut that out? Or do we go one
more month? If we're in two months and we're not
doing no numbers, chill out, let it go. Maybe try
it in another season. I'm not saying let the idea go,
but let's try it a different season, or let's try
to create it in a different way, in a different environment,
(08:23):
in different kind of content formats.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Maybe that doesn't need to be a video. Maybe that
needs to be an article.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
Maybe that needs to be a long thread, right, maybe
that needs to be pictures. But it goes data should
run the way you move certain things. When it comes
to should I create this type of content or not?
Speaker 1 (08:46):
Does production quality matter anymore?
Speaker 2 (08:49):
No?
Speaker 3 (08:50):
No, no, We've seen too many videos go viral.
Speaker 2 (08:54):
That was on a bad android. Sorry, and I love you,
but it.
Speaker 3 (09:01):
Doesn't really matter. It goes like, like I have these
three stages of content creation. There's consistency, quality, and connection. Right,
So consistency means the most, and those made people are
just so bored of hearing of that. You're bored, but
you haven't done it, so I don't know what I'm
(09:22):
going to continue to tell you, right, So, consistency is
like and that doesn't mean every single day, just the
timeframe that you committed to. So if you're saying, yo,
I'm going to show up Monday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday and
all you have is your phone, okay, do that, right,
because your audience is going to care more about the
presence than the quality. Now, the quality does matter when
(09:47):
you're trying to be taken a little bit more serious, right,
So but I will still grab my phone and do
a green screen because I connect with the people more.
You don't want to be too too high highly produced
because then you lose a connection with the community. You've
seem too big time, right, and you don't want to
(10:10):
just do lower quality all the time because then it's like, ah,
you haven't really grown. Right. If we look at Keith Lee,
Keith Lee will forever do the phone videos, but he's
taken a little bit serious because other content that he's
collabed with has the highly produced content. Right He's doing series,
(10:31):
he's doing shows, he's doing commercials and all these different things.
So there's still a level of high production, but still
let me keep to the core of how I grew
my audience to over millions of followers, right. So, Keith
Lee is a perfect example of how production isn't necessarily needed.
It's great for balance, but it's not needed to really
(10:55):
have the brand that you want.
Host
Will Lucas
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