September 23, 2021 • 35 mins
As the 1970s wore on, John Lennon found himself at a crossroads. Was he a pop singer or an artist? Would he continue to be a musician at all, or instead would he retreat into quiet family life? Enter David Bowie, who managed to find a way to help John be all of those things at once, while at the same time making Bowie bigger than ever in the United States. Bowie’s tales about John involve the usual vices, drugs like cocaine – but also some very unexpected and unorthodox hallucinogens on the backstreets of Hong Kong.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Blood on the Tracks is a production of I Heart
Radio and Double Elvis. John Lennon was a musical genius
and one of the most beloved cultural figures of the
twentieth century. His songs inspired dreamers to imagine, his search
for the truth gave power to the people. But some
thought he dreamed too much. Others thought he was too powerful.
(00:23):
So he was followed, he was threatened, he was declared
a danger to the United States, and in night he
was assassinated. This is his story told by his so
called friends. This is Special Agent Jim Steele with the
(00:46):
Federal Bureau of Investigation work in case number double oh
nine's zero eight zero four nine one. Case subject is Lennon,
John Winston oh No. This information pertains to a period
ending December. Interview subject as the Jones David Robert a
k A. David Bowie Interview number nine Dash nine three
day zero eight four day zero one Recall number two
(01:09):
December twenty two. John was the omnique pistle I got
to know. Unfortunately it was near the end of his life.
I must have made young Americans. It was one of
(01:31):
those associations that lost at about the length of the
recording sessions, and then we didn't see each other for
about a year. But when we didn't reconnect, we started
to pick up a woman was quickly becoming a very
instructive and deep relationship. He was from an art school,
and a lot of our conversations were about the world
(01:52):
of the arts and my an artist wants to do
things in the first place, very dramatic and philosophical two
o'clock a morning conversations, that sort of thing. He would
rifle through the avant garde, look for ideas that were
on the outside, on on the preferey of the mainstream,
and then he'd applied those ideas in a functional manner
(02:13):
to something that was considered populist and make it work.
Can take the honest idea and make it work for
the masses. That was like making old work for the
people and for the elite. And the people responded some
with adoration humanity, and then they were those who thought
the John was the elitist, that he was bamboozling with them.
(02:37):
In the response to those people of one person in particular,
Al that's the reason why there's so much blood in
the tract m Yeah, chapter seven, John Lennon and Deep
(03:11):
at Bowie was a monumental year for me because perhaps
the most important year in my professional life. Many people
(03:33):
don't know this. You see, most people think I had
my act together from day one and it was all
calculated that I'm morphed and evolved with ease Major Tom
to Ziggy Stardust, Ziggy Stardust to a lad Insane. But
I was winging it. I was making chance look calculated.
(03:54):
What does it do say in America? Fake it till
you make it right by n I couldn't keep faking.
I had to make it. So that year everything changed,
and it changed because I met John Lennon. Unfortunately it
was near the end of his life. John Lennon took
(04:14):
one look at me and new I had something to give.
I had to tear it all down start over. So
I killed Ziggy Stardust and I drew the curtain on
a lad Insane. But the best lesson John gave me
it wasn't it just about the music or the character
I was playing. It was about the business of arts
and the people I was working with. Instructive John looked
(04:39):
me dead in the eyes and said, you're being shafted
by your present manager. He was talking about my manager,
Tony de three, of course main main management. My relationship
with Tony had deteriorated over the years. I had become
increasingly concerned that I was being taken advantage of. John
(05:00):
knew of all about these sorts of concerns and paranoias,
after all that business with the Beatles and Alan Klein
philosophical And it was just a month earlier, in December
of the Beatles officially dissolved, each of them, untangling himself
from the acrimonious web that Alan Klein had spun. Derek
(05:22):
is a true Are the Beatles really finished? No, not
until they die. As long as they live and as
long as they like each other, anything could happened. And
so John saw tony stranglehold on my career is unhealthy.
Naturally he over my eyes to the fact that it
wasn't just Tony, you see, was the concept of managers
(05:44):
in general. There's too much powerful one person. In John's eyes,
there was no such thing as good management. All management
was shit. Well, I have one person control every aspect
of my career when I could simply in ploy individuals
is needed to help me with specific wants. Well, that
was the question to talk of the morning conversations. John
(06:09):
had been through all that. He was wise, He was
like an older brother. Really. He completely changed my perspective
on the business of art. And then we made a
song out of the whole atle deal like a middle
finger of a song that was directed not just at
people like Tony d'free and Alan Klein, but at the
intequated notion that an artist must be controlled by someone
(06:31):
with business since and we arrived at that song entirely
by chance. It was January. I was in New York
City Electric Lady Studios. Sessions had resumed for my new album,
Young Americans. I've been introduced to John not long before,
(06:52):
I Believe in Los Angeles by Elizabeth Taylor Rule People.
She was trying to get me to start in a
movie Villa God bless John's on me. Be sure, I
want to know. That's another story entirely. I knew that
John lived in New York, so I reached out to him.
I told him I was planning to record a cover
of Across the Universe, that beautiful song of his from
(07:14):
Let It Be. I asked if he wanted to come
by the studio and play on the track. It was
during the session for Across the Universe that we hit
upon this other song. By chance, my guitarist Carlos Alamar
was fooling around with this old R and B riff.
I think it was called foot stomping, one of the
riffs he perfected when he played with James Brown, but
(07:36):
he slowed it down, made it something new. I heard
him keep playing it, repeating it, and before I knew it,
John was shouting aim in this falseesso hook over the guitar,
and that's how fame began, completely organic, out of thin
air and rifle through the avant guls. Of course, it
(07:58):
wasn't out of thin air. I know that now we're
on the outside. We've been talking about bad managers and
bad business deals and the whole bloody concept of being famous.
John and I those conversations, along with my change perspective
on what became my new reality as an artist and
a businessman, there was all fuel that went into the
(08:21):
creative engine. Who part those ideas in a functional manner.
Carlos was the perfect collaborator. Like I said, he played
with James Brown back in the late sixties, and so
he had his own personal history with this sort of
controlling figure that John and I wanted to rail against.
He left James Brown after James doctors paycheck for missing
(08:42):
one of his musical cues. Carlos said, fuck this, I'm gone.
Last fame. Funk this, We're gone. That was like making
old work for the people and for the elite, because
what is fame? After all? Was it good for a
good seat in a restaurant? That's about it. People who
(09:04):
don't have fame are the ones who wanted. People who
have fame are always looking for our way to get
rid of it. It's worth noting that a half year
after we released Fame, James Brown himself borrowed Carlos as
lick for his song hot I Need to be Loved, Love, Love, Love,
and the Carlos ever saw a dime off that as
(09:26):
far as the song Fame goes, this would prove to
be my first number one hit in America and the
people whisper It also redefined who John was as an artist.
Fame saved him from becoming some old time rock and
roll nostalgia peddler and lifted him into the upper echelon
of the New York City avant garde. The honest idea
(09:48):
and make it work for the masters a moment in time,
the song, the session, the wisdom might gleaned from John.
And that was my turning point. I took the young
Americans masters and I locked them in a bankful I
didn't want Tony too free touching them. And then I
told our CIA that I wanted to go separate ways
with Tony, and then I needed the complete support, which
(10:11):
I got. People responded, you know what our CIA said
to Tony when they asked him why they were siding
with me over him in the split because Tony, they said,
you can't see the details of mar Setselman with Tony
have been and will always be confidential. You see. But
(10:33):
everything that lay ahead for me, station to station, low heroes, Lodger,
scary monsters, that was all made with an autonomy and
a confidence that I never would have had if it
were not for John Lennon, very instructive and deep relationship. Now,
unbeknownst to me, John was continuing to struggle with his
(10:55):
own concept of fame. Have fame affected every single as
fact of his life, Even in New York City where
he could walk down the street and remain relatively unbothered.
Fame got to him, It got to others close to him.
Another song says fame can take you over, drive you
(11:16):
to crime, and even make you the target of others.
(11:51):
One very tangible thing that fame almost always leads to
is cocaine. My own daily diet around was coffee, four
packs of kit Hans, Bell peppers, milk straight from the carton,
and cocaine. John and I shared an affinity for this stuff.
It's funny you get access to all these drugs when
(12:12):
you become famous, but then it begins to feel as
if the reason you're taking the drugs is to forget
the fact that you are famous. Cocaine help me cope.
It helped me disappear into whatever role I was playing
at the time. It helped me to adjust to the
increased pressures, the NonStop schedules, the attention from mainstream. And
(12:37):
then when you get used to the pressures and schedules
and attention, you don't want it anymore, any of them.
That's when cocaine comes in head you once again, when
it's lonely at the top. Drugs make you forget that
you're famous, the fact that you have the very thing
you thought you wanted only to find it's not at
(12:59):
all how you are may and it would be personally.
I was entering into what the medical community would probably
refer to as cocaine psychosis around this time, not that
I knew what there was or that I was experiencing it.
I think I called Hitler, the world's first rock star,
said that I love fascism, so my analytist wants to
(13:20):
do things. I seriously thought that one of my business
advisors was secretly a CIA agent, and that one of
my backing singers was actually a vampire. John's grash course
in how to take control of my career was invaluable,
but I still didn't have control over myself, and John
(13:42):
had no control over himself either. Now in John had
a lot to be happy about. He had a brand
new son, Sean, who stole his heart. His fight against
the United States had come to a positive conclusion, which
would directly lead to his green card and citizenship. But
(14:05):
good news doesn't tame the beast. You don't walk into
a hotel room stuck to the guilt with cocaine and
champagne and think, now you know what, I've got a
new son and new lease on life. I'll pass now
you say I'm up, I've gone next to and pock
of the morning, and then you roll up a dollar
(14:27):
bill and you make a count. When faced with a party,
John party just as hard as the rest of us.
He went as hard as some of them notorious figures
who didn't survive the party from law school. But it
could have been any of us who didn't survive the party.
That could have been John Lennon in Bonzos shoes. Right,
(14:47):
Fate rolled the dice, and Fate decided that Bonham will
be the one who left the proverbial building. Before that happened, however,
the two John's found themselves in the same room in
the same way, both equally tempting fate. In six John
and his friend Jesse A. Davis, the guitarist who was
(15:08):
so great in taj Mahals Band, walked into led Zeppelin's
hotel suite at the Plaza in New York, only to
find the greatest rock drummer in the world up to
his sinus cavity in Heroin Well. Technically, when John arrived,
Bornom was on his knees, hands desperately clutching the cold,
damp toilet, absolutely puking his guts. Out. Johna found himself
(15:32):
in similar positions throughout his life, though he didn't have
the same herculean stamina as Bonhom. Barnham was a heavyweight
in that regard, a man who could take three, four,
even five times more than what the average rock star
could take before he found himself praying to a porcelain
guard on the outside. Bonhom, they've been doing China White
(15:53):
that night. China White was no joke. It was Bonhom
great junk, forty to pure rather than the usual ten
percent pure smack you'd find on the streets. But even
for Bottom it proved to be too much. Every time
he'd snort the stuff, he'd be back puking into the toilet.
(16:15):
The fact that one of rock and roll's most undefeated
imbibers was having a rough go of it didn't face John,
though one bit reply those ideas. In a functional matter,
John thought himself invincible, which is another side effect of fame,
and no sooner did he snorts of bottom sized snorts
of China White that he too was on his knees
(16:37):
pushing Bottom out of the way. The two Johns sick
as dogs in Zeppelin's suite of the Plaza. We're fighting
for air and jockeying for position of the toilet. Instructive
and deep relationship. They made it through that moment and
through the night. Bonzo probably walked out of that room
(16:59):
and played a show at masin Square Garden in front
of thousands. He wouldn't always be that lucky. Lifestyle caught
up with him in the end. There he caught up
with me too. Across I was seeing things, imagining things,
believing things that weren't to be believed. One thing I
(17:22):
still believe is that there is an evil in this world.
And I'm not talking about shady managers. You don't need
to be in cocaine psychosis to know that evil walks
among us. An evil is what would eventually catch up
to John, long before his rock and roll lifestyle ever.
(17:43):
Could We'll be right back after this world word word.
(18:04):
It was the summer of n when I ran into
John again Hong Kong. Why I was in Hong Kong,
I can't quite remember. Was I on holiday touring? Maybe
I was touring with Iggy. Actually, that's all we did
for the idiots. His first solo record are produced after
the Stooges broke up. Comical, that's not important. But John
(18:28):
was there too, It turns out, in Hong Kong, vacationing
with his son Sean, who was only a few years
old at the time. They'd stop to explore the city
for a few days before they meet up with Yoko
in Japan, and so we quickly picked up where we'd
left off and bonded over being two Englishmen in Hong Kong.
We started to pick up. John continued to teach me
(18:52):
so much without even trying to teach me. I don't
even know that he realized what he was doing, but
he was continuing to get me free lessons in fame.
We'll be walking down the street and someone would stop
us and say to John, excuse me, but aren't you
John Lennon, And John will give them this confused look,
(19:12):
absolutely straight faced, like he'd never received that question before
in his life and never in a million years expected to.
And then he'd say, no, I'm not John Lennon, but
I wish I had his money. And then the person
asking if John was John would realize, well, ship, of
(19:33):
course it wasn't John. It was like John had this
mind control to make a person doubt their own belief
with mere words. So of course I stole that line.
It was. It was just too good. It deflected any
and all unwanted attention you received out in public. And
I swear to God that this happened. Just months later
(19:55):
in New York City. I was walking down the street,
so I believe, when someone passed me by and shouted,
are you David Bowie, to which I gave the reply, well, no,
but I wish I had his money, You lying bastard.
The voice shot back of me, you wish you had
(20:15):
my money. I thought, wait a minute, I know that voice,
so I looked up. Bloody Yeah it was John, honest
to God. But back in Hong Kong things got weird
more often than not. We had fame to thank for that,
not the not the song, but the fact that we
(20:36):
were famous. Because as much as we like to actively
try to disassociate ourselves from the spotlight, fame gave us opportunity,
like the opportunity to be in Hong Kong at that moment.
John would dote on Shaun during the day, showing the sights.
At night, you'd often leave him with a nanny who
was traveling with them, and then John and I would
(20:58):
go and get ripped roaring drunk, obnoxiously drunk, really and
a functional on it. The kind of drunk you get
in public only when you're famous, because the fame or
the money, whatever it is, it provides a safety net,
or an illusion of a safety net. And what's the
worst thing is going to happen? We get tossed out
(21:20):
of a strip club for being too rowdy? This this
is It's not like we're going to lose our jobs
because of some drunken shenanigans. We weren't going to cease
being famous. Now have we known we were being tossed
out of strip clubs by members of trying gangs. Yeah,
(21:41):
maybe we would have minded our men as a bit more.
But your most oblivious to the world around you when
you yourself are on your way to oblivion. One of
those nights, oblivion came calling on the property of the mainstream.
John got a hankering to try monkey brains. I think
(22:05):
the whole thing is a myth, perhaps an urban legend,
not to mention downright ghastly, But I was both curious
and drunk, and I was hanging out with John Lennon
after all, so of course I was going We went
trotting drunkenly around these backstreets looking for a place that
served monkey brains. And we found a place, but it's
been late in the evening. They overclosed, which was probably
(22:27):
for the best because we looked in through the windows
and saw all these small tables with holes cutting them,
and my stomach just knotted up. John was pointing at
the tables and explaining how they would put the monkey
under the table and stick its head up through the hole.
And while my imagination was just running away with me
(22:49):
and I was thinking about what supposedly happens next once
you get the monkey up through the table in the
hole you want, these two guys in the restaurant walked
towards us and unlocked the door. Well, they knew it
was John Lennon, and unlike those other times that he
denied it, John fessed up. Yes, of course he was
(23:12):
that John Lennon. People were sponded their motioned for him
to come inside. I tried to follow, but they shut
the door in my face and made me wait. They
were talking to John, but they were speaking in Cantonese,
and I know for a fact that John didn't speak Cantonese.
(23:32):
He was nodding along as if he understood, and then
he followed them back into the back of the restaurant,
the kitchen. I imagine a few minutes went by. I
started to panics. I didn't know who these men were.
I didn't know what their plans were, their intentions. I
didn't know why they wanted John, if he was being
that to safety or danger. They'd locked the door behind them.
(23:58):
Of course, I'm haste and chain smoked downside. What what
else could I do? And then we didn't see And
then just a few minutes later, John emerged from the
back room. One of the men walked him straight to
the front door, unlocked it, and led him outside. John
was beyond drunk. He was terribly high. He was grinning.
(24:23):
He was grinning, but there was a look of consternation
behind his smile, almost as if he wasn't happy that
he was happy. I asked him, what had happened? What
did what they've done back there? He looked at me.
We loved eyes philosophical two o'clock in the morning. His
eyes were spinning, His lids were bobbing up and down,
(24:45):
like they were on a bungee cord. The snake, he said,
and his eyes went wild. They had me drink the
bloods of a snake on the periphery of the mainstream.
I admit I was a bit jealous about that monkey brains.
Not interested blood of a snake. I mean, come on,
(25:05):
sign me up. And as stones as he was, John
could tell I wasn't hiding my disappointment. Well, be playing
for it. He had returned with a gift. He told
me to close my eyes, so I did, and then
he told me to open my mouth, which I did.
(25:29):
Why don't, he said, And then I felt something insund
my mouth. It was cold and moist. I immediately regretted
playing along from school. John's hand shoved the gelatinous oval
down my throat, so I swallowed, and then I nearly
vomited it all back up. Well the funk was there,
(25:50):
I asked, opening my eyes. The taste of sulfur and
dirt and ammonia coated my tongue. He of me it
was a thousand day old egg. It was just the name.
It wasn't actually one thousand days old. But it was
an egg that had been cooked in horse urane, coated
(26:10):
in manure, and buried in the fucking ground for a
few days. Why someone would do. That is beyond me.
And how John knew so many details about precisely how
the egg was prepared for men speaking a language he
didn't speak is also beyond me. But then John was
(26:32):
beyond me. An artist wants to do things in the
first place. I may have done well for myself in
the years to follow, but I always felt the shadow
of John Lennon Loomy over my shoulder, near my feet.
Now that was fame, the kind of fame that can
(26:54):
be immortal in your mind, even if in real life
it rooves to be deadly. Los Angeles, January six. Mel
(27:37):
Evans giant hands dwarfed the little value pills he held
in his palm. They were so small, mau was so big.
He wondered whether they would even make a difference if
he swallowed them. How could something so tiny have any
kind of noticeable effect on a man of his size.
He'd find out soon enough. Mouth threw the pills into
(27:57):
his mouth and chased them with whatever clear liquor was
in the glass. And his other hand he felt woozy, groggy,
and that was just the alcohol. Soon those little pills
would make their appearance after all, and that would be
when everything Mal thoughts said or did just felt gooey.
Mal's girlfriend, Fran was worried. Mause seemed more despondent than usual.
(28:21):
He wasn't making any sense. She called a friend. Mel
picked up his thirty thirty rifle, walked upstairs and barricaded
himself inside the bedroom of his rented duplex. That's when
Fran called the police. Mal wasn't sure how he'd gotten here.
He was a long way from London, years removed from Beatlemania,
(28:41):
though he remembered those days like they were yesterday because
he was there just about every day. People called George
Martin the Fifth Beatle or Billy Preston, but wasn't Mal Evans,
jack of all trades and master of none, the true
fifth Beatle. He'd been the Lad's bodyguard, then road manager,
then person and little assistant. He helped put together the
(29:02):
album cover collage of Sergeant Pepper's Only Hearts Club band.
He sang in the chorus of Yellow Submarine. He rang
the alarm clock during the sessions for a Day in
the Life. He hit the anvil during the sessions from
Maxwell's Silver Hammer. He produced No Matter What, one of
Bad Fingers biggest hits for Apple Records. That was then,
This was now, and now wasn't so great? Where Mao
(29:25):
had once again become a regular companion of his old
friend John Lennon during that period of time when John
became a lone wolf resident of l A. Now Mao
was alone again. Naturally, John was gone back to New
York and presumably back to his wife Yoko. Meanwhile, Mao's
wife didn't want him anymore and they were separated. She
(29:48):
wanted a divorce. Mau thought that his friend Keith Moon
would give him purpose again. Mooney hired Big Mal to
produce his solo album, Two Sides of the Moon, but
m c A Records fired Maw when it be came
a parent that moons wild antics and Mao's excessive drinking
we're going to yield less than desirable results. And so
now mal Evans was holed up inside the bedroom at
(30:11):
eight one to to West fourth Street in l A.
He didn't remember how many value he'd taken, or how
many drinks he'd had, or why exactly he was holding
the thirty thirty rifle in his hands. He heard voices
coming from downstairs. It was more than just Fran, more
than just Frand and a friend that she had called.
Mal heard four or five, maybe six different voices, and
(30:34):
then Mal heard footsteps. They were coming upstairs. He checked
the chamber of the rifle and realized that it wasn't loaded.
Probably for the best. Mal Evans may have been a
lot of things, but he wasn't the type to shoot
a man. The LAPD cops who burst into the bedroom
didn't know this about Mao. They didn't know that Mal's
rifle wasn't loaded, and also didn't know that Mal wouldn't
(30:57):
fire the damn thing if it was. The cops were armed,
and there were two of them, and they pointed their
police issued thirty eights at Male's big frame. Put it down,
Put the weapon down. They both yelled ultimatum and stereo.
Mal just stood there holding the unloaded rifle, his hands
gone gooey on the long, cold barrel, his head numbed
by pills and alcohol. Mal couldn't feel the rifle in
(31:18):
his hands. He couldn't feel anything as he moved his
body to one side and absentmindedly aimed the butt of
the rifles squarely at the cops. He did hear the
six gunshots as they rang out from the cops. Police
issued thirty eights, but he never felt the four bullets
center his body. Back in New York City, John Lennon
(31:41):
heard about mal evans Is unexpected and untimely death at
the age of forty. Like the rest of the Beatles
and just about everyone else who knew mal John was
gut it. The death of the Beatles manager Brian Epstein
in seven have been tragic, especially for John, but Male's
death was more than tragic. It was violent, twisted. John
(32:04):
thought back to the day in l a when he
himself hid from the L A. P D On the
second floor of an apartment. How they had chased him upstairs,
shotguns locked and loaded. How close John Lennon's life came
to ending in the same way mel Evans's life had ended.
It was shocking. But what shocked John even more was
the news that he received just days later. The phone
(32:26):
inside John and Yoko's apartment at the Dakota Building rang out.
John was no longer paranoid that the US government will
be waiting on the line to listen in to his
every conversation. Nixon had resigned. John's phones were no longer bugged.
In just a matter of months, he'd received his green
card and become an American once and for all. John
(32:47):
answered the phone. It was Neil aspen All, the Beatles
former road manager, personal assistant and later a manager of
Apple Corps, calling from London. John could hear the fear
and concern in Neil's voice all the way across the
Atlantic as he frantically told John that Mao's remains had
gone missing. Mal had been cremated in Los Angeles, after
(33:09):
which Harry Nilson had been tasked with mailing males ashes
back to his wife and mother in London. Harry put
the ashes in the box just like he put the
lime in the coconut, and then he sent them on
their trip abroad. But they never arrived. There was no
record that they had ever existed. Big Mal had vanished
just like that, And Neil Aspinall and John Lennon and
(33:32):
all the others were left behind. Wonder what had happened?
Why it was that one day someone was here and
the next they were gone. And then how just days
after that their memory was gone, to the thing they
had left behind, no trace, No blood on the tracks.
(34:04):
All right, everybody, thanks for listening to Blood on the Tracks.
If you like what you hear, be sure to find
and follow Blood on the Tracks on Apple podcast, I
Heart Radio, app, Amazon Music, or wherever you get your podcasts.
On this season two of Blood on the Tracks, we'll
be releasing ten episodes on the Incredible Life of John Lennon,
with a new episode every Thursday. You can also binge
(34:25):
all ten episodes of season one on the insane story
of the notorious record producer Phil Spector right now. It's
available wherever you get your podcast. This episode of Blood
on the Tracks was written by Zeth Lundie and hosted
an executive produced by me Jake Brennan, also executive produced
by Brady sad Story and copy editing by Pat Heally.
This episode was mixed by Colin Fleming. Additional music and
(34:48):
score elements by Ryan Spreaker. In this episode featured Rob
Kendrick as David Bowie. Blood on the Tracks is produced
by Double Elvis and partnership with I Heart Radio. Sources
for this episode are available at Double Elvis dot com
on the Blood on the Track series page. If you
want to chat about this show or hear more about
the other shows, we're making a Double Elvis tap in
(35:09):
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Land is available only on the free Amazon Music. To
(35:30):
hear tons of insane stories about your favorite musicians getting
away with murder and behaving very badly, go to Amazon
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Echo device, just say Alexa play the disgrace Land podcast.
Rock Am Dad
Blood on the Tracks is a production of I Heart
Radio and Double Elvis. John Lennon was a musical genius
and one of the most beloved cultural figures of the
twentieth century. His songs inspired dreamers to imagine, his search
for the truth gave power to the people. But some
thought he dreamed too much. Others thought he was too powerful.
(00:23):
So he was followed, he was threatened, he was declared
a danger to the United States, and in night he
was assassinated. This is his story told by his so
called friends. This is Special Agent Jim Steele with the
(00:46):
Federal Bureau of Investigation work in case number double oh
nine's zero eight zero four nine one. Case subject is Lennon,
John Winston oh No. This information pertains to a period
ending December. Interview subject as the Jones David Robert a
k A. David Bowie Interview number nine Dash nine three
day zero eight four day zero one Recall number two
(01:09):
December twenty two. John was the omnique pistle I got
to know. Unfortunately it was near the end of his life.
I must have made young Americans. It was one of
(01:31):
those associations that lost at about the length of the
recording sessions, and then we didn't see each other for
about a year. But when we didn't reconnect, we started
to pick up a woman was quickly becoming a very
instructive and deep relationship. He was from an art school,
and a lot of our conversations were about the world
(01:52):
of the arts and my an artist wants to do
things in the first place, very dramatic and philosophical two
o'clock a morning conversations, that sort of thing. He would
rifle through the avant garde, look for ideas that were
on the outside, on on the preferey of the mainstream,
and then he'd applied those ideas in a functional manner
(02:13):
to something that was considered populist and make it work.
Can take the honest idea and make it work for
the masses. That was like making old work for the
people and for the elite. And the people responded some
with adoration humanity, and then they were those who thought
the John was the elitist, that he was bamboozling with them.
(02:37):
In the response to those people of one person in particular,
Al that's the reason why there's so much blood in
the tract m Yeah, chapter seven, John Lennon and Deep
(03:11):
at Bowie was a monumental year for me because perhaps
the most important year in my professional life. Many people
(03:33):
don't know this. You see, most people think I had
my act together from day one and it was all
calculated that I'm morphed and evolved with ease Major Tom
to Ziggy Stardust, Ziggy Stardust to a lad Insane. But
I was winging it. I was making chance look calculated.
(03:54):
What does it do say in America? Fake it till
you make it right by n I couldn't keep faking.
I had to make it. So that year everything changed,
and it changed because I met John Lennon. Unfortunately it
was near the end of his life. John Lennon took
(04:14):
one look at me and new I had something to give.
I had to tear it all down start over. So
I killed Ziggy Stardust and I drew the curtain on
a lad Insane. But the best lesson John gave me
it wasn't it just about the music or the character
I was playing. It was about the business of arts
and the people I was working with. Instructive John looked
(04:39):
me dead in the eyes and said, you're being shafted
by your present manager. He was talking about my manager,
Tony de three, of course main main management. My relationship
with Tony had deteriorated over the years. I had become
increasingly concerned that I was being taken advantage of. John
(05:00):
knew of all about these sorts of concerns and paranoias,
after all that business with the Beatles and Alan Klein
philosophical And it was just a month earlier, in December
of the Beatles officially dissolved, each of them, untangling himself
from the acrimonious web that Alan Klein had spun. Derek
(05:22):
is a true Are the Beatles really finished? No, not
until they die. As long as they live and as
long as they like each other, anything could happened. And
so John saw tony stranglehold on my career is unhealthy.
Naturally he over my eyes to the fact that it
wasn't just Tony, you see, was the concept of managers
(05:44):
in general. There's too much powerful one person. In John's eyes,
there was no such thing as good management. All management
was shit. Well, I have one person control every aspect
of my career when I could simply in ploy individuals
is needed to help me with specific wants. Well, that
was the question to talk of the morning conversations. John
(06:09):
had been through all that. He was wise, He was
like an older brother. Really. He completely changed my perspective
on the business of art. And then we made a
song out of the whole atle deal like a middle
finger of a song that was directed not just at
people like Tony d'free and Alan Klein, but at the
intequated notion that an artist must be controlled by someone
(06:31):
with business since and we arrived at that song entirely
by chance. It was January. I was in New York
City Electric Lady Studios. Sessions had resumed for my new album,
Young Americans. I've been introduced to John not long before,
(06:52):
I Believe in Los Angeles by Elizabeth Taylor Rule People.
She was trying to get me to start in a
movie Villa God bless John's on me. Be sure, I
want to know. That's another story entirely. I knew that
John lived in New York, so I reached out to him.
I told him I was planning to record a cover
of Across the Universe, that beautiful song of his from
(07:14):
Let It Be. I asked if he wanted to come
by the studio and play on the track. It was
during the session for Across the Universe that we hit
upon this other song. By chance, my guitarist Carlos Alamar
was fooling around with this old R and B riff.
I think it was called foot stomping, one of the
riffs he perfected when he played with James Brown, but
(07:36):
he slowed it down, made it something new. I heard
him keep playing it, repeating it, and before I knew it,
John was shouting aim in this falseesso hook over the guitar,
and that's how fame began, completely organic, out of thin
air and rifle through the avant guls. Of course, it
(07:58):
wasn't out of thin air. I know that now we're
on the outside. We've been talking about bad managers and
bad business deals and the whole bloody concept of being famous.
John and I those conversations, along with my change perspective
on what became my new reality as an artist and
a businessman, there was all fuel that went into the
(08:21):
creative engine. Who part those ideas in a functional manner.
Carlos was the perfect collaborator. Like I said, he played
with James Brown back in the late sixties, and so
he had his own personal history with this sort of
controlling figure that John and I wanted to rail against.
He left James Brown after James doctors paycheck for missing
(08:42):
one of his musical cues. Carlos said, fuck this, I'm gone.
Last fame. Funk this, We're gone. That was like making
old work for the people and for the elite, because
what is fame? After all? Was it good for a
good seat in a restaurant? That's about it. People who
(09:04):
don't have fame are the ones who wanted. People who
have fame are always looking for our way to get
rid of it. It's worth noting that a half year
after we released Fame, James Brown himself borrowed Carlos as
lick for his song hot I Need to be Loved, Love, Love, Love,
and the Carlos ever saw a dime off that as
(09:26):
far as the song Fame goes, this would prove to
be my first number one hit in America and the
people whisper It also redefined who John was as an artist.
Fame saved him from becoming some old time rock and
roll nostalgia peddler and lifted him into the upper echelon
of the New York City avant garde. The honest idea
(09:48):
and make it work for the masters a moment in time,
the song, the session, the wisdom might gleaned from John.
And that was my turning point. I took the young
Americans masters and I locked them in a bankful I
didn't want Tony too free touching them. And then I
told our CIA that I wanted to go separate ways
with Tony, and then I needed the complete support, which
(10:11):
I got. People responded, you know what our CIA said
to Tony when they asked him why they were siding
with me over him in the split because Tony, they said,
you can't see the details of mar Setselman with Tony
have been and will always be confidential. You see. But
(10:33):
everything that lay ahead for me, station to station, low heroes, Lodger,
scary monsters, that was all made with an autonomy and
a confidence that I never would have had if it
were not for John Lennon, very instructive and deep relationship. Now,
unbeknownst to me, John was continuing to struggle with his
(10:55):
own concept of fame. Have fame affected every single as
fact of his life, Even in New York City where
he could walk down the street and remain relatively unbothered.
Fame got to him, It got to others close to him.
Another song says fame can take you over, drive you
(11:16):
to crime, and even make you the target of others.
(11:51):
One very tangible thing that fame almost always leads to
is cocaine. My own daily diet around was coffee, four
packs of kit Hans, Bell peppers, milk straight from the carton,
and cocaine. John and I shared an affinity for this stuff.
It's funny you get access to all these drugs when
(12:12):
you become famous, but then it begins to feel as
if the reason you're taking the drugs is to forget
the fact that you are famous. Cocaine help me cope.
It helped me disappear into whatever role I was playing
at the time. It helped me to adjust to the
increased pressures, the NonStop schedules, the attention from mainstream. And
(12:37):
then when you get used to the pressures and schedules
and attention, you don't want it anymore, any of them.
That's when cocaine comes in head you once again, when
it's lonely at the top. Drugs make you forget that
you're famous, the fact that you have the very thing
you thought you wanted only to find it's not at
(12:59):
all how you are may and it would be personally.
I was entering into what the medical community would probably
refer to as cocaine psychosis around this time, not that
I knew what there was or that I was experiencing it.
I think I called Hitler, the world's first rock star,
said that I love fascism, so my analytist wants to
(13:20):
do things. I seriously thought that one of my business
advisors was secretly a CIA agent, and that one of
my backing singers was actually a vampire. John's grash course
in how to take control of my career was invaluable,
but I still didn't have control over myself, and John
(13:42):
had no control over himself either. Now in John had
a lot to be happy about. He had a brand
new son, Sean, who stole his heart. His fight against
the United States had come to a positive conclusion, which
would directly lead to his green card and citizenship. But
(14:05):
good news doesn't tame the beast. You don't walk into
a hotel room stuck to the guilt with cocaine and
champagne and think, now you know what, I've got a
new son and new lease on life. I'll pass now
you say I'm up, I've gone next to and pock
of the morning, and then you roll up a dollar
(14:27):
bill and you make a count. When faced with a party,
John party just as hard as the rest of us.
He went as hard as some of them notorious figures
who didn't survive the party from law school. But it
could have been any of us who didn't survive the party.
That could have been John Lennon in Bonzos shoes. Right,
(14:47):
Fate rolled the dice, and Fate decided that Bonham will
be the one who left the proverbial building. Before that happened, however,
the two John's found themselves in the same room in
the same way, both equally tempting fate. In six John
and his friend Jesse A. Davis, the guitarist who was
(15:08):
so great in taj Mahals Band, walked into led Zeppelin's
hotel suite at the Plaza in New York, only to
find the greatest rock drummer in the world up to
his sinus cavity in Heroin Well. Technically, when John arrived,
Bornom was on his knees, hands desperately clutching the cold,
damp toilet, absolutely puking his guts. Out. Johna found himself
(15:32):
in similar positions throughout his life, though he didn't have
the same herculean stamina as Bonhom. Barnham was a heavyweight
in that regard, a man who could take three, four,
even five times more than what the average rock star
could take before he found himself praying to a porcelain
guard on the outside. Bonhom, they've been doing China White
(15:53):
that night. China White was no joke. It was Bonhom
great junk, forty to pure rather than the usual ten
percent pure smack you'd find on the streets. But even
for Bottom it proved to be too much. Every time
he'd snort the stuff, he'd be back puking into the toilet.
(16:15):
The fact that one of rock and roll's most undefeated
imbibers was having a rough go of it didn't face John,
though one bit reply those ideas. In a functional matter,
John thought himself invincible, which is another side effect of fame,
and no sooner did he snorts of bottom sized snorts
of China White that he too was on his knees
(16:37):
pushing Bottom out of the way. The two Johns sick
as dogs in Zeppelin's suite of the Plaza. We're fighting
for air and jockeying for position of the toilet. Instructive
and deep relationship. They made it through that moment and
through the night. Bonzo probably walked out of that room
(16:59):
and played a show at masin Square Garden in front
of thousands. He wouldn't always be that lucky. Lifestyle caught
up with him in the end. There he caught up
with me too. Across I was seeing things, imagining things,
believing things that weren't to be believed. One thing I
(17:22):
still believe is that there is an evil in this world.
And I'm not talking about shady managers. You don't need
to be in cocaine psychosis to know that evil walks
among us. An evil is what would eventually catch up
to John, long before his rock and roll lifestyle ever.
(17:43):
Could We'll be right back after this world word word.
(18:04):
It was the summer of n when I ran into
John again Hong Kong. Why I was in Hong Kong,
I can't quite remember. Was I on holiday touring? Maybe
I was touring with Iggy. Actually, that's all we did
for the idiots. His first solo record are produced after
the Stooges broke up. Comical, that's not important. But John
(18:28):
was there too, It turns out, in Hong Kong, vacationing
with his son Sean, who was only a few years
old at the time. They'd stop to explore the city
for a few days before they meet up with Yoko
in Japan, and so we quickly picked up where we'd
left off and bonded over being two Englishmen in Hong Kong.
We started to pick up. John continued to teach me
(18:52):
so much without even trying to teach me. I don't
even know that he realized what he was doing, but
he was continuing to get me free lessons in fame.
We'll be walking down the street and someone would stop
us and say to John, excuse me, but aren't you
John Lennon, And John will give them this confused look,
(19:12):
absolutely straight faced, like he'd never received that question before
in his life and never in a million years expected to.
And then he'd say, no, I'm not John Lennon, but
I wish I had his money. And then the person
asking if John was John would realize, well, ship, of
(19:33):
course it wasn't John. It was like John had this
mind control to make a person doubt their own belief
with mere words. So of course I stole that line.
It was. It was just too good. It deflected any
and all unwanted attention you received out in public. And
I swear to God that this happened. Just months later
(19:55):
in New York City. I was walking down the street,
so I believe, when someone passed me by and shouted,
are you David Bowie, to which I gave the reply, well, no,
but I wish I had his money, You lying bastard.
The voice shot back of me, you wish you had
(20:15):
my money. I thought, wait a minute, I know that voice,
so I looked up. Bloody Yeah it was John, honest
to God. But back in Hong Kong things got weird
more often than not. We had fame to thank for that,
not the not the song, but the fact that we
(20:36):
were famous. Because as much as we like to actively
try to disassociate ourselves from the spotlight, fame gave us opportunity,
like the opportunity to be in Hong Kong at that moment.
John would dote on Shaun during the day, showing the sights.
At night, you'd often leave him with a nanny who
was traveling with them, and then John and I would
(20:58):
go and get ripped roaring drunk, obnoxiously drunk, really and
a functional on it. The kind of drunk you get
in public only when you're famous, because the fame or
the money, whatever it is, it provides a safety net,
or an illusion of a safety net. And what's the
worst thing is going to happen? We get tossed out
(21:20):
of a strip club for being too rowdy? This this
is It's not like we're going to lose our jobs
because of some drunken shenanigans. We weren't going to cease
being famous. Now have we known we were being tossed
out of strip clubs by members of trying gangs. Yeah,
(21:41):
maybe we would have minded our men as a bit more.
But your most oblivious to the world around you when
you yourself are on your way to oblivion. One of
those nights, oblivion came calling on the property of the mainstream.
John got a hankering to try monkey brains. I think
(22:05):
the whole thing is a myth, perhaps an urban legend,
not to mention downright ghastly, But I was both curious
and drunk, and I was hanging out with John Lennon
after all, so of course I was going We went
trotting drunkenly around these backstreets looking for a place that
served monkey brains. And we found a place, but it's
been late in the evening. They overclosed, which was probably
(22:27):
for the best because we looked in through the windows
and saw all these small tables with holes cutting them,
and my stomach just knotted up. John was pointing at
the tables and explaining how they would put the monkey
under the table and stick its head up through the hole.
And while my imagination was just running away with me
(22:49):
and I was thinking about what supposedly happens next once
you get the monkey up through the table in the
hole you want, these two guys in the restaurant walked
towards us and unlocked the door. Well, they knew it
was John Lennon, and unlike those other times that he
denied it, John fessed up. Yes, of course he was
(23:12):
that John Lennon. People were sponded their motioned for him
to come inside. I tried to follow, but they shut
the door in my face and made me wait. They
were talking to John, but they were speaking in Cantonese,
and I know for a fact that John didn't speak Cantonese.
(23:32):
He was nodding along as if he understood, and then
he followed them back into the back of the restaurant,
the kitchen. I imagine a few minutes went by. I
started to panics. I didn't know who these men were.
I didn't know what their plans were, their intentions. I
didn't know why they wanted John, if he was being
that to safety or danger. They'd locked the door behind them.
(23:58):
Of course, I'm haste and chain smoked downside. What what
else could I do? And then we didn't see And
then just a few minutes later, John emerged from the
back room. One of the men walked him straight to
the front door, unlocked it, and led him outside. John
was beyond drunk. He was terribly high. He was grinning.
(24:23):
He was grinning, but there was a look of consternation
behind his smile, almost as if he wasn't happy that
he was happy. I asked him, what had happened? What
did what they've done back there? He looked at me.
We loved eyes philosophical two o'clock in the morning. His
eyes were spinning, His lids were bobbing up and down,
(24:45):
like they were on a bungee cord. The snake, he said,
and his eyes went wild. They had me drink the
bloods of a snake on the periphery of the mainstream.
I admit I was a bit jealous about that monkey brains.
Not interested blood of a snake. I mean, come on,
(25:05):
sign me up. And as stones as he was, John
could tell I wasn't hiding my disappointment. Well, be playing
for it. He had returned with a gift. He told
me to close my eyes, so I did, and then
he told me to open my mouth, which I did.
(25:29):
Why don't, he said, And then I felt something insund
my mouth. It was cold and moist. I immediately regretted
playing along from school. John's hand shoved the gelatinous oval
down my throat, so I swallowed, and then I nearly
vomited it all back up. Well the funk was there,
(25:50):
I asked, opening my eyes. The taste of sulfur and
dirt and ammonia coated my tongue. He of me it
was a thousand day old egg. It was just the name.
It wasn't actually one thousand days old. But it was
an egg that had been cooked in horse urane, coated
(26:10):
in manure, and buried in the fucking ground for a
few days. Why someone would do. That is beyond me.
And how John knew so many details about precisely how
the egg was prepared for men speaking a language he
didn't speak is also beyond me. But then John was
(26:32):
beyond me. An artist wants to do things in the
first place. I may have done well for myself in
the years to follow, but I always felt the shadow
of John Lennon Loomy over my shoulder, near my feet.
Now that was fame, the kind of fame that can
(26:54):
be immortal in your mind, even if in real life
it rooves to be deadly. Los Angeles, January six. Mel
(27:37):
Evans giant hands dwarfed the little value pills he held
in his palm. They were so small, mau was so big.
He wondered whether they would even make a difference if
he swallowed them. How could something so tiny have any
kind of noticeable effect on a man of his size.
He'd find out soon enough. Mouth threw the pills into
(27:57):
his mouth and chased them with whatever clear liquor was
in the glass. And his other hand he felt woozy, groggy,
and that was just the alcohol. Soon those little pills
would make their appearance after all, and that would be
when everything Mal thoughts said or did just felt gooey.
Mal's girlfriend, Fran was worried. Mause seemed more despondent than usual.
(28:21):
He wasn't making any sense. She called a friend. Mel
picked up his thirty thirty rifle, walked upstairs and barricaded
himself inside the bedroom of his rented duplex. That's when
Fran called the police. Mal wasn't sure how he'd gotten here.
He was a long way from London, years removed from Beatlemania,
(28:41):
though he remembered those days like they were yesterday because
he was there just about every day. People called George
Martin the Fifth Beatle or Billy Preston, but wasn't Mal Evans,
jack of all trades and master of none, the true
fifth Beatle. He'd been the Lad's bodyguard, then road manager,
then person and little assistant. He helped put together the
(29:02):
album cover collage of Sergeant Pepper's Only Hearts Club band.
He sang in the chorus of Yellow Submarine. He rang
the alarm clock during the sessions for a Day in
the Life. He hit the anvil during the sessions from
Maxwell's Silver Hammer. He produced No Matter What, one of
Bad Fingers biggest hits for Apple Records. That was then,
This was now, and now wasn't so great? Where Mao
(29:25):
had once again become a regular companion of his old
friend John Lennon during that period of time when John
became a lone wolf resident of l A. Now Mao
was alone again. Naturally, John was gone back to New
York and presumably back to his wife Yoko. Meanwhile, Mao's
wife didn't want him anymore and they were separated. She
(29:48):
wanted a divorce. Mau thought that his friend Keith Moon
would give him purpose again. Mooney hired Big Mal to
produce his solo album, Two Sides of the Moon, but
m c A Records fired Maw when it be came
a parent that moons wild antics and Mao's excessive drinking
we're going to yield less than desirable results. And so
now mal Evans was holed up inside the bedroom at
(30:11):
eight one to to West fourth Street in l A.
He didn't remember how many value he'd taken, or how
many drinks he'd had, or why exactly he was holding
the thirty thirty rifle in his hands. He heard voices
coming from downstairs. It was more than just Fran, more
than just Frand and a friend that she had called.
Mal heard four or five, maybe six different voices, and
(30:34):
then Mal heard footsteps. They were coming upstairs. He checked
the chamber of the rifle and realized that it wasn't loaded.
Probably for the best. Mal Evans may have been a
lot of things, but he wasn't the type to shoot
a man. The LAPD cops who burst into the bedroom
didn't know this about Mao. They didn't know that Mal's
rifle wasn't loaded, and also didn't know that Mal wouldn't
(30:57):
fire the damn thing if it was. The cops were armed,
and there were two of them, and they pointed their
police issued thirty eights at Male's big frame. Put it down,
Put the weapon down. They both yelled ultimatum and stereo.
Mal just stood there holding the unloaded rifle, his hands
gone gooey on the long, cold barrel, his head numbed
by pills and alcohol. Mal couldn't feel the rifle in
(31:18):
his hands. He couldn't feel anything as he moved his
body to one side and absentmindedly aimed the butt of
the rifles squarely at the cops. He did hear the
six gunshots as they rang out from the cops. Police
issued thirty eights, but he never felt the four bullets
center his body. Back in New York City, John Lennon
(31:41):
heard about mal evans Is unexpected and untimely death at
the age of forty. Like the rest of the Beatles
and just about everyone else who knew mal John was
gut it. The death of the Beatles manager Brian Epstein
in seven have been tragic, especially for John, but Male's
death was more than tragic. It was violent, twisted. John
(32:04):
thought back to the day in l a when he
himself hid from the L A. P D On the
second floor of an apartment. How they had chased him upstairs,
shotguns locked and loaded. How close John Lennon's life came
to ending in the same way mel Evans's life had ended.
It was shocking. But what shocked John even more was
the news that he received just days later. The phone
(32:26):
inside John and Yoko's apartment at the Dakota Building rang out.
John was no longer paranoid that the US government will
be waiting on the line to listen in to his
every conversation. Nixon had resigned. John's phones were no longer bugged.
In just a matter of months, he'd received his green
card and become an American once and for all. John
(32:47):
answered the phone. It was Neil aspen All, the Beatles
former road manager, personal assistant and later a manager of
Apple Corps, calling from London. John could hear the fear
and concern in Neil's voice all the way across the
Atlantic as he frantically told John that Mao's remains had
gone missing. Mal had been cremated in Los Angeles, after
(33:09):
which Harry Nilson had been tasked with mailing males ashes
back to his wife and mother in London. Harry put
the ashes in the box just like he put the
lime in the coconut, and then he sent them on
their trip abroad. But they never arrived. There was no
record that they had ever existed. Big Mal had vanished
just like that, And Neil Aspinall and John Lennon and
(33:32):
all the others were left behind. Wonder what had happened?
Why it was that one day someone was here and
the next they were gone. And then how just days
after that their memory was gone, to the thing they
had left behind, no trace, No blood on the tracks.
(34:04):
All right, everybody, thanks for listening to Blood on the Tracks.
If you like what you hear, be sure to find
and follow Blood on the Tracks on Apple podcast, I
Heart Radio, app, Amazon Music, or wherever you get your podcasts.
On this season two of Blood on the Tracks, we'll
be releasing ten episodes on the Incredible Life of John Lennon,
with a new episode every Thursday. You can also binge
(34:25):
all ten episodes of season one on the insane story
of the notorious record producer Phil Spector right now. It's
available wherever you get your podcast. This episode of Blood
on the Tracks was written by Zeth Lundie and hosted
an executive produced by me Jake Brennan, also executive produced
by Brady sad Story and copy editing by Pat Heally.
This episode was mixed by Colin Fleming. Additional music and
(34:48):
score elements by Ryan Spreaker. In this episode featured Rob
Kendrick as David Bowie. Blood on the Tracks is produced
by Double Elvis and partnership with I Heart Radio. Sources
for this episode are available at Double Elvis dot com
on the Blood on the Track series page. If you
want to chat about this show or hear more about
the other shows, we're making a Double Elvis tap in
(35:09):
on Instagram at double Elvis, on Twitter at double Elvis Fm,
and now on Twitch where we're streaming three days a
week at Twitch dot tv slash double Elvis Podcasts. And finally,
be sure to check out disgrace Land, the award winning
music and true crime podcast that I also host. Disgrace
Land is available only on the free Amazon Music. To
(35:30):
hear tons of insane stories about your favorite musicians getting
away with murder and behaving very badly, go to Amazon
dot com slash disgrace Land, or if you have an
Echo device, just say Alexa play the disgrace Land podcast.
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