June 13, 2025 • 46 mins
Hannah and Matt welcome automotive journalist and filmmaker Matt Hardigree to talk about the star drivers, cars, grit and drama of the 24 Hours of Le Mans. Also, insider tips for how to get the best out of the race.
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
I'm Matt Miller and I'm Hannah Elliott, and this is
Hot Pursuit.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
All right, Hannah, you and I are like literally in
the next couple hours rushing off to the airport to
get our flights to Paris because we're going to Lamar
this weekend.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Lama, my bags are packed. I've got my passport, I've
got my sunscreen, I've got my baseball hat. I'm ready.
Speaker 4 (00:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
We have a twenty four hour race to go to
and we're doing a full day of live broadcast on Friday,
June thirteenth, the day this podcast comes out.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
I can't believe the guest lineup we have. We have
people from Forsha Ford, role X, who else?
Speaker 3 (00:54):
We have Jensen Button for one thing, Formula One Champion,
have Tom Wagner, He's been on this program before. He
owns Nighthead, he owns Joda, he owns Singer, a number
of other really important company Now at track right, in
a sense, he owns what's that track called that you
like out there? Willow? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Is he behind that too? Or is that that's a
capital different one?
Speaker 3 (01:19):
He's he's behind that, He's behind that Okay. Behind that,
we have I'll just list. We have Jamie Chadwick, she's
a driver. We have Roger Penske. We're going to talk
about his new car. We have Gil West, he runs Hurts.
Michael Steiner, you mentioned Portia, he's a board member there.
We have Adrian Hallmark, the CEO of Aston Martin. By
(01:39):
the way, quick aside, Quick Tangent, a buddy of mine
went to a party at Billy Zane's house this weekend.
Hey Billy Zaine, he was the bad guy from Titanic. Right.
Apparently he's like an artiste now and you can get
his artwork as an option on your Aston Martin.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Okay, is that not like it's incredibly random?
Speaker 3 (02:04):
I don't know, it's so random. Okay. We have Sarah Boviie.
She's a Belgian racing driver. She drives for the Iron
Dames team. We have Florentman Joe the CEO of Michelin,
the CEO of Goodyear, Mark Stewart. We have Rob Dickinson
from Singer. We have the CEO of Rolex. I mean
we're just loaded up with guests.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Most importantly, we need to tell people where and when
they can watch. Do you have that on your document.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
Well, you can watch all day long on Bloomberg Television
on Friday if you're so inclined, and you can see
it on Bloomberg dot com.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
We're also doing a special July nineteenth, June nineteenth.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
June nineteenth, we're doing a well, we're doing a June nineteenth.
We're going to do a Bloomberg Television thing, and then
the following weekend we're going to release a special. So
there's a lot of content coming out.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
From us watch Out, watch Out.
Speaker 3 (02:54):
But it's not like I don't expect it to be
Matt hardegree level film.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
Which is, oh, well, he's a filmmaker, he's I mean,
we're not cinematic.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
Definitely was so my old friend Matt Hart agree and
your old friend as well. I first met him when
he was running Jelopnick. I feel like he was the
first important editor of Jelopnick.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Hopefully he's the only editor I know.
Speaker 3 (03:20):
And then he went on to make films and work
for another number of entrepreneurial organizations, and now he's running
The Utopian, which is a website, a community really of
car lovers.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Yeah, and I have to say it's a very refreshing
look at the car world, emphasizing what you and I
always believe, which is cars should be fun, but it's smart.
Like I know Matt heart Degree is going to say,
we just like to have fun with cars. But don't
let that fool you.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
It's true. He's always coming through the data. He is
into the minutia. He brought up when he came into
the studio a Bank America report, so he's reading all
the Wall Street research.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
He's going to try try to make it just sound
like it's fun in games, but there's a lot of
intelligence and history behind it. All.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
Right, let's get to Matt Hardegree now he's with us
here in the studio, and I just want to ask
for one quick story before we get into the Lamont coverage.
And that is something I heard you at one point
were there and you've been there many times, and a
team offered you race gas for your rental car. How
did that work out?
Speaker 1 (04:27):
I think the statute of limitations on this is past
so basically in France, and it's not a track rule necessarily,
it's a national rule like in most places, like you
can only have so much gasoline just stored in random
containers around for very obvious safety reasons. This team, for
some reason was really obsessed about not having too much
fuel in their tank, and so they did a lot
of fuel tests, which means they're just putting expensive race
(04:47):
fuel in and then letting it come back out and
then draining it. Problem is they realized, oh no, now
we have too much race fuel. So it just happens.
I had rented a cheap card that wasn't the diesel
because so many of the cars were diesels. We had
a big diesel van, and then I had a Opal
and so they were like, hey, come here real quick,
could we do you need fuel? And I was like, actually, yeah,
I was about to go pay way too much money
for like gasoline, and they were like, no, no, we
(05:09):
got you hooked up. And so I got twelve or
thirteen gallons of race fuel in a in a little
Opal manual. Oh my god, that thing was so fast,
like you can actually drive when you drive out of
the track, you drive on part of the race circuit
of the Bugatti circuit, and they have the curbs and
I might have just it was like late, nobody was around,
and I hit it and I felt like I got
an extra fifty horse power and I almost crashed at
(05:32):
Laman in an opal which in the outside the track,
which would have been embarrassing, but it was fun. And
that's you know, that's the magical Laman. You never know
what's going to happen. You might have race fuel in
your crappy little opal.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
Here's the deal, right, We're going to Lamon. Me and
Hannah are going to Lamar. We're doing a whole broadcast
special from there on Friday. We're recording a special for
the following weekend. And I mean, she probably is steeped
in this stuff, but I know nothing about it out
racing that's not on two wheels, right, So that's why
(06:04):
I thought it'd be cool to get you in here.
This is obviously an historic race, and I imagine the
original point was to prove that cars could go for
twenty four hours so that they could then sell them
with a good reputation. So is that how it all started?
Speaker 1 (06:20):
That is how it all started. Lamon was one of
the original proving grounds for automobiles, along with the Paris
to Peaking race. The problem with the Paris to Peaking
race was that you had to go to peaking first
and then get all the cars back, and it turned
out to be an enormous hassle and so around logistically
it was not very easy. And so someone had the
bright idea that instead of trying to go all the
(06:41):
way across a continent, why don't we just go a
couple hours west of Paris and then just do it
in a circle for twenty four hours. And that was
enough and that was enough, and that along with the
eighty five hundred, are kind of like the original races,
the original proof of concepts of the automobile as something
that's better than a train, better than a horse, and
better than a bike.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
And I think we should say too people may know,
you know, Ford versus Ferrari is set at the twenty
four hour of Lamon race. I mean, that's like a
very cultural touch point that if if people might have
heard of that, then it's that race.
Speaker 3 (07:13):
Well, and I'll also I think Steve McQueen probably made
Lamon famous for people of my generation right because he
made a drunken, drug fueled movie about it.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
He did it is It is a movie. It is
a motorsports movie of all time. It is not the best,
but it is a movie and it's great to put
on in the background. It is probably the best movie
to just put on a wall with sound because there's
very little dialogue in the movie while you do anything
else other than just sit down and watch the movie.
Speaker 3 (07:43):
But Ford versus Ferrari, what's your take on that? One?
Speaker 1 (07:46):
Great movie? Great movie? They did?
Speaker 4 (07:47):
Want it?
Speaker 1 (07:48):
What?
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Keep going? Keep going? I'm just providing a counterpoint.
Speaker 3 (07:53):
I think she said hated it.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
You hated it? Okay, they did one Ford executive dirty
and they like they hand waved over so much about
the actual history. Also, they made Carol Shelby kind of
the nicer one and Ken Miles kind of the jerk,
which is maybe historically not always the most accurate. Thing.
They do do a little hint at Carol Shelby's, you know,
very creative business practices. So all of that is yes,
(08:17):
if you actually know the real story and you read
the AJ. But if you want the real story, read
AJ's book and it's great and you'll get the absolute
real story. If you just want the vibes of what
Laman is like and why people care, and the vibes
of what it's like to try to compete against an
Italian automaker. I think it gets that the vibes very
very correct.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
Why didn't you like it, Hannah?
Speaker 2 (08:36):
For all the reasons that Matt said, You're one hundred
percent right, Matt, and just I think it probably just
brought up how completely white, male dominated everything was at
the time, which is just kind of disgusting to watch unfold.
It Really it did trigger me. I think it was
(08:59):
just it was so unapologetically about these guys. You know,
I can go down down the road there.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
But but is that any different now? Isn't it still?
I mean, I'm putting together the rundown for the show.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
I'm saying it's perfect, but it's The Iron Dames are
leading the European Lamon Series Championship right now in their class, and.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
I got us an interview with one of their drivers,
So I'm excited about that.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
They're awesome.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
But everybody else that I'm talking to there, that we're
talking to there is a dude, you know.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Yeah, but that's not for lack of trying. I mean, look,
we still have a long way to go, but it's
great when we can at least count that there are
people of color and women making some decisions in the
racing world. I mean, it's not like it's not perfect,
but it's better than it was.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Wait, just to clarify it, one of the most successful
race engineers of all time, Lean Gate was a woman,
like one of the best limp Laman engineers who ran
the AUDI program successfully during Audi's crazy run as a woman.
So I so, actually European sports car racing and sports
car racing in general has a way better. I mean,
you know, representation is in everything, and I'm not trying
to say that it is, and there's still an insane
(10:11):
amount of work. Yeah, but I mean they're they're they're
kicking butt like That's what I'm just saying is that
there's there's a history of Iron Dames is great and
I think they're one of the teams that could win
this that you'll see there. I think that they're extraordinarily competitive.
And I you know, I've been there. I've been to
them on you know a couple of times, and I
followed a team and I did it, made a documentary
about it that no one will overseee And there were
(10:32):
you know, mechanics engineers that the team's uh main engineer
you know, was from Ferrara and was a woman. I mean,
it's it's better. But again, also we're talking a percentage
of game. The percentage of women in the field versus
men in the field is obviously skewed. But it's better
than NASCAR, It's better than It's way better than F one.
Let's just say that.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
And I'm going to say better than Moto GP, although
there is a woman who owns Grasini. But listen, we're
getting off track. I think a little bit in terms
of what to expect. Wait, Hannah, have you been to
the race to the twenty four hours at Lamar I.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Have driven on the track, but I haven't been to
the race.
Speaker 3 (11:08):
Okay, So, Matt, among the three of us, you're the
only who's been there, and you were making a documentary
at least one of the times you were there. But
tell us about your experience, Like, what is it like?
There must be three hundred thousand people that show up.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
Indeed, especially this year, this year will probably you I'm
so jealous. I'm not going this year. This is the
best year to go. This is the absolute best year.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Why do you say that, Matt.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
Oh, it's gonna be so good. For very complicated reasons.
We can get into the sport of like, endurance racing
has made a bunch of extraordinarily complex decisions that have
actually made it just very simple for competitors, for automakers,
and for fans. It's never been easier to watch, It's
never been easier to compete in the race. It is
(11:53):
the it is. I mean, I love Daytona, i love
the Nurburgring twenty four and I've been able to go
to a lot of my bucket races, but there's nothing
like Laman, like Selo. It is the best, like it
is absolutely insane. The crowds are remarkable, hundreds of thousands
of people. Like you said, it is a party in
the infield and not like a seabring party. Sea brings
also kind of a party, but it's just people raving
(12:16):
in the middle of the track. You know, there's everyone,
not you, Matt probably obviously, but everyone's got an apparol
or a beer or logger like there hand, I'll have
a good time. It's it's an amazing environment in this here.
There are so many cars. There are so many cars,
and there are so many different cars, and there are
so many brands, and there are so many makes, and
there are so many things to root for It's incredible.
(12:36):
I mean it really. It's people say that the like
eighties nineties group Sierra for race car fans was the
golden era. People are now saying, and I believe this,
many people are saying it is the platinum era of racing.
You're you're going at the absolute best time maybe ever.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
Matt, what do you think American car people might be
missing about Laman? Because admittedly it's obscure. Every time I
try to pitch Lamon's stories to my editors, it's I'm
always pushed back. It's too obscure. No one knows about it,
no one cares. And we are admittedly talking about a
very rarefied small group of car enthusiasts. So what do
(13:14):
you think American car lovers in general don't get about Laman?
And what should they understand?
Speaker 3 (13:20):
By the way she's addressing you, we're both called Matt.
Oh yeah, if you say Matt to.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
Either one can take it.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
Cardie, Yeah, okay, I'll take this one. First of all,
are those editors in this building? And can I fight them?
Are they here right now? Can I find them?
Speaker 2 (13:35):
No?
Speaker 1 (13:35):
I think that's fair. It's it's it's a reasonable thing
to say because in the last few years it's gotten bad.
European sports are racing. Endurance racing got bad, I got
too complicated, there were way fewer teams, and motorsports in
general started to die. And it's been said before, it's
been said before. I think on this podcast we all
know the drive to survive factor has made motorsports more interesting. However,
(13:58):
also Americans care. Americans care about F one, that is
a crazy thing. Americans are starting to care about MOTOJPGP
that is also a crazy thing. And so the difference
is is that there aren't that many American brands and
Mars really in Formula One, and there are not many
American team There's one kind of at the moment, but
more are coming. You know, if you look at it.
F one is not actually really that accessible to an American.
(14:20):
It's just that it had this great thing where it
made the driver stars. The cars aren't the stars. The
drivers are the stars in this series. The cars are
the stars. Still, the drivers aren't quite as interesting. I
think that's the problem, right, The drivers aren't celebrities to Americans.
No one's like maybe some people are like, hey, Nick Tandy, right,
the most famous race card this will make that happy.
The most famous race car driver there is vounting to Rossi,
(14:42):
who is a motorcycle rider. Like like the most famous
person there for motorsports is someone who does not normally
drive until now it's so recently like sports cars, so
that is a thing. But I think that people are
going to see Cadillacs, they're going to see Ford Mustangs,
they're going to see Porschas, they're going to see McLaren's,
they're going to see BMW's corvettes. They're going to I
see freaking corvettes. Like it's going to be a party.
And if you're if you have any amount of patriotism
(15:06):
or any amount of soul, or you even like a car,
and that's why you're listening to this. If you sit
down and watch any hour of the race where it's
not raining or red flagged, you're gonna have an amazing time.
And also they're gonna try to race. I will say
this also about Lamm and you probably have to think,
hany've had experience in Daytona. It rains, sometimes they slow
it down. They have banking at LAMM they're going like
you know, really bad accident, they'll slow it down. Their
(15:27):
goal is to race, race, race, race, race, and so
I just think there's so much there. And I think
as it gets better, as the cars get more famous,
as people start to latch onto it and find it
more accessible in a lot of ways. In Formula One,
I think it's going to get more interesting.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
Based on that. Can we talk about how cool it
is that Jim Farley, the head of Ford, is also racing. Yes,
I mean, how many car executives do we know are racing?
Speaker 3 (15:50):
Also a little bit behind the scenes, a little bit
of behind the scenes intel. We have an interview with
Jim Farley on Friday morning. I think it's in the
serve valance seven o'clock hour, New York Times, so that
makes it one pm Lamon time. And Dan Barbosa said, dude,
(16:11):
can we make it like one fifteen or even one twenty,
because if Jim wins, he's going to be like coming
to the interview from the podium, So he's still going
to be wearing his fire suit. He's still going to
be like covered in sweat and not no makeup on yet.
This is live TV, right, So I was like, no,
we want him to come in his fire suit full
(16:33):
of sweat and no makeup. It's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
It's it's great. It's so much fun.
Speaker 4 (16:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:38):
So he's in the Mustang Invitational race that's running with
a bunch of Rustlings. The French love Mustangs, the friend
when I'm in Europe, they love Mustang It's true, they do.
You know, everyone loves a Mustang. And seeing a bunch
of them like, it's just it's pride. Like a couple
of years ago, they ran a NASCAR around Lamon, and
I have friends with the team and people who were there,
journalists covering it, and it was just a one off
thing they were doing for fun. It was the favor car.
(17:00):
It was absolutely the frame of car. Everyone loved it.
You know, if we're going to solve world's trade problems,
I think Lamon's a good place to start. I think
let's get beset, let's get everybody there, and let's just say,
let's look at the cars. Maybe shall meee can get
in the race. We'll just toss one in. I think
people would be very excited.
Speaker 3 (17:14):
I'm pretty pumped to see. Really, the amateurs are going
to be racing with the pros this time, right, They're
not separating like rich dudes versus hired guns. It's all
one in one go, one class.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
Yes, which is so good. I was there the last
year that they did pro and am and non pro,
which is always like it's see this is where again
it's complicated behind the scenes because you have all these
drivers with different rankings and it's been all these complex things.
If you can have a bronze driver, you can't have
a silver driver. None of that matters to you. All
the cars are racing against each other and it's likely
that a pro team is going to win without a
(17:51):
you know, like a bronze or you know, a gentleman
driver as they say, a paid driver. But it's actually
not a guaranteed. Laman is crazy. It's twenty four hours,
like you have to serve vibe twenty three hours to
win the race. You'll just have twenty three hours of
racing of being exhausted to just get to that last hour.
And a bunch of pro teams, a bunch of people
who had spent all this money and all this time
and all they have these dreams of racing at Laman
(18:13):
are going to be out in the first twenty six
minutes first turn. Some years people don't make it past
the first turn, and then it's just some you know,
mix of a professional driver and some amateur, just someone
who just really cares, who just right timing it, rained
at the right moment, and they have a chance because
at twenty three hours they're in it and somebody a
pro can still make a mistake. It's amazing. You don't
get that an amateur is not going to win an.
Speaker 3 (18:34):
Ass So separate it out for us, because the thing
that always confuses me is all the different classes have
these acronyms. And I mean Scott eighth or ten used
to always confuse me at IMSA as well. Right, it's
there's the top level is LMP one.
Speaker 1 (18:51):
Now it's now it's it's hypercar.
Speaker 3 (18:54):
Okay, it's just called hypercar. That's like the best that.
These are the cars that like Hannah test drives in
Los Angeles, right, these are the Matty Reemock's car.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
I think this is more like nine six three level.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
Yes, this is nine six three. Although actually if you drive,
if you write a Valkyrie, if you do the if
you do the Aston Martin, actually they do have a
version of that. So again complicated behind the scenes. Simple,
all you need to know the fastest cars and they
can race. And this is a new thing. We talked
you talk about Scott aster're talking about INMS. So before
what was the problem is you could watch American prototypes race.
(19:29):
So these are prototypes, the fastest cars they give, like
an F one car with a roof. They couldn't race
at Laman, and then their cars couldn't race here. Now
they said, forget that, that's too complicated. There's one class hypercar.
Maybe it's a European racing LMDh car, maybe it's an
American racing LMH car. It doesn't matter. Their hypercrs. So
the fastest they are, they have a hybrid system. They
(19:49):
might be rear wheel drive, they might be all wheel drive,
they might have a big stung. Here's the thing you're
gonna know the second that Cadillact goes by. This is
what's so much fun about Laman. Go stand at ted Ruz,
Go stand at the Porsha curves. You're gonna close your
eye and you're gonna hear it where we are. Okay,
it's probably a Ferrari. Right, You're gonna hear little buzzy engines.
You're gonna hear all sorts of things. You know, but
then you're gonna hear that Cadillac vight come around the
corner and everyone's gonna know. You're gonna feel it in
(20:10):
your stomach. It's a Cadillac V eight and it's gonna
make boom like it's gonna make an amazing sound, and
you're gonna have that, and then you'll have that. That's
the fastest class.
Speaker 3 (20:19):
Then the next fastest class is like everybody can choose
one of the same. Uh, one of the same.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
What?
Speaker 3 (20:28):
Yeah? So the names chassiss like a yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
So there's l m P two, which has kind of
always been l m P two and that stands for
LAMM Prototype two. So they're the slower cars. It's a
mix of amateurs and pros.
Speaker 3 (20:39):
All the cars look the same.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
All the cars look the same, they have the same
mode of the same gearbox, the same Chassias in Arica,
like it's all Urica, So it's all the same thing.
You can pay attention to that or pay attention to that.
AO racing an American team, which is really exciting, is
gonna be racing there. So I would say pick one,
pick one l m P two team, and then that's it.
That's it. And also that's a great looking car. So
you're gonna pick AO Racing. That's gonna be your team,
(21:01):
you know, or whoever. I don't care who does, but
that's gonna be your team. And then you to Hannah's point,
all all the cars now racing in the GT class,
these are cars that are based on like road cars.
They are all all mixed up pros non pros, and
those are cars theoretically you can go buy. Those are cars.
Both of you get to drive before I get to drive.
By the way, I know, it's like Hannah gets the
(21:21):
car first and the mat gets cut the second. Matt
Hardiger gets the car third. We all know this.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
Hannah gets usually like the you know, the Penan Farina Batista,
and I get like the Suberu outback.
Speaker 4 (21:32):
You know.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
Usually that's fine, that's fine with that breakdown. I'm just
fine with that.
Speaker 3 (21:37):
No. Wait, so that's the only three classes. There's hyper cars,
l m P two and then the GT three cars.
Speaker 1 (21:42):
Essentially, yes, there are, if you want to be really pedantic,
there are actually within the hypercar class or LMH cars
and LMDh cars, But who cares. They made it simple.
It's three cars. All the cars have different colors on
the numbers. That's all you gotta do. That's what's gonna
make it so much fun, and that's why they're and
it also made they think so much cheaper, which is
why there are so many cars this year, and there
are so many different brands and manufacturers. It was sad
(22:04):
before it was sad.
Speaker 2 (22:06):
Can you talk a little bit about who you think
is going to win the outright race? I mean it's
been Ferrari. Can we assume it's gonna be Ferrari again?
I think Farra is leading right now in the championship series.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
Yes, so okay, I'm I'm gonna. I was not sure
I was gonna bring this acronym up, but here we go, bop.
Balance of performance. The other reason why this is exciting
is that they are constantly behind the scenes tweaking how
much power you have, how much total power you get
for a lap, and how much weight you have to
try to keep the cars relatively even. Now. Historically some
people have said, no one in this room certainly have
(22:40):
said that maybe Ferrari sandbags throughout the year so that
they can get extra to the top end speed at leman,
so that they can win. No One here can prove
that that has ever happened. I'm looking around for snipers.
Maybe I'm okay, that's that's certainly no one has ever
said that's happened. No one here in this room is saying,
maybe that's happening again. But this year they've actually won
a few races coming in, so perhaps that's not the case.
Do you think Ferrari is the favorite going into this? However,
(23:03):
if you look at the BOP adjustments that were made,
so this is who gets weight and who gets power.
I actually think that, you know, Cadillac does have a
real chance this year. I I my money is on
cadillact this in the hypercar or hypercar. Yeah, that's it Hypercarillac.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
Doesn't have a GT three team. They don't raise a
black wing at five.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
They don't that would blackwing would be awesome. Bring a sedan, please,
more sedans more?
Speaker 2 (23:24):
No?
Speaker 1 (23:24):
I so Cadillac I think for the overall is my
sleeper pick. If I had to put all my money
on it, I put it on Ferrari. Ask the Marnate
win in some really terrible things have to happen. They
are new teams.
Speaker 3 (23:33):
What about the in the GT three class? The Mustangs.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
Are they Mustangs are competitive? Look on numbers you want
to win in the GT class LP two, we don't care.
We're gonna say're gonna say oo racing, God bless them.
I hope they do well in GT three. I personally
do I want the Mustangs to win?
Speaker 2 (23:48):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (23:48):
I want the must Thanks to win. Do I think
the Proton team is very competitive?
Speaker 3 (23:51):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (23:51):
I think they're very competitive. Is the smart money always
on a Porsche? Yes, the smart money is always on
a nine to eleven winning Laman if you more times
than not. If you you know, if you make that investment,
you're going to be you're gonna pay off. So you
know if you're if you're a gambling person to do that.
But the Corvett's super competitive, you know.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
Side note? What do you think of the nine sixty
three RSP.
Speaker 3 (24:20):
So we're back to hypercars now?
Speaker 2 (24:22):
Yess? One of one car they made for Roger Pinski
that's based on their race car thoughts?
Speaker 1 (24:30):
Why did they only make one? Make make a twenty one?
There are twenty customers for it?
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Completely agree? Why make only one? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (24:38):
Are you going to get to drive it and think
they'll let you drive it? They're not gonna let me out.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
I do. I did see they let a few people
in Europe drive it, a few journalists, so and I
am in touch with them, so I might see if
I can scoot over and get a little a little
even if it's in the parking lot, I'll take it.
I don't care. I would love to drive it.
Speaker 4 (24:55):
For me.
Speaker 3 (24:56):
That's the most exciting thing. The thing I'm looking forward
to you the most probably is seeing that car.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
I will say, I wish they had made it look cooler.
I mean, I understand the concept, but Matt, Matt Miller,
to your point when you texted me about it, like
anything beside the nine seventeen does not look great.
Speaker 3 (25:17):
Never did a nine picture taken next to a nine seventeen, Because.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
Yes, I just wish we it like, I just wish
it looked like nicer. You know, it's going to be
a road car.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
It's a heritage play, right, That is definitely a nostalgia play.
It is not saying we it's like it's less future focused.
I agree, And nine to seventeen is future focused. This
is not future focused. This is very much reaching back
to the past. So that's always the thing with all
of these sports right with F one. To get a
trillion new fans, it had to piss off the thirty
people that really cared so much and are so mad
(25:53):
that like Lenny Kravitz is at the racer, you know whatever,
random celebrity right like that, They're like, ohh is that?
Like you know, like that's the because that's the only
celebrity they recognize, right. They don't know any any K
pop stars, And I think you're gonna probably have a
little bit of that with this. So this is Portia saying, look, people,
we still remember our history and this is still important
to us, assuming that new fans are maybe coming. That's
(26:13):
my read on it. But who cares. It looks cool,
it's super fast.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
I agree. This isn't getting new fans. No, this is
getting This is only us talking about.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
I mean, because of the looks of these things, and
I'm sure some people like the hyper cars the best.
For me, the GT three cars are the most exciting
because that's a car that I could actually buy. And
actually Barbosa told me the GTD that you can buy
is actually a faster car, maybe a better car than
(26:43):
the GT three Because of the bop thing that you
were talking about right. So that's awesome. I could watch
these Mustangs maybe win at Lament, and then I could
go if I had, however much it is three hundred
fifty thousand dollars and buy one.
Speaker 1 (26:56):
Yes, agreed. Also I think the GT honestly, the GT
racing I think is also more exciting. You know, in person,
the cars, the hypercars are more impressive and they sound louder,
but the actual wheel to wheel racing with the GT
three cars. Problem is if you you new cars are
more robust than they used to be. The prototypes are
more robust. But you see you with F one like
(27:17):
you're like that you're having to get out of the
race for that, Like you know, the two cars barely touched,
and all of a sudden they're like there's an angry
like you know, Belgian dude being like I can't do
this anymore, angly German guy. At at Laman, you will
see people mess up cars, especially GT cars. You will
see them. You'll go like that car is never going again,
and then they're gonna limp on three wheels five miles
(27:38):
back to the pits and then a bunch of people
are gonna crush on that top of that car and
then three laps later that car is gonna be out
there again, and it's gonna look like it lost a fight.
It's look at what I'm gonna fight. It looks gonna
look like it really got its butt kicked, but it's
gonna do incredible I do. I'm with you. And also,
there's just so many good cars and so many good
drivers in that class.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
This Homer. If it's not Robin, it's not racing, right,
I mean, can we can't we say that? Yes, I'm
still high on the Dale Earnhardt documentary that I'm obsessed with.
Did you see that?
Speaker 3 (28:06):
I still haven't watched it. I really want to watch it.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
It's heart degree thoughts. Did you see it?
Speaker 1 (28:12):
No, I haven't seen it yet, but all my friends
who are in NASCAR are like, you got to watch it.
It's so good. Like the Problems, there's a Netflix NASCAR
series and it's fine, but it's very sanitized. And this
gets back to the point of like, f one you
care about the drivers. They have made them celebrities, which
is amazing because some of them are so weird.
Speaker 3 (28:28):
Yea, because it's all about the car, like doesn't matter
as much who the driver is in f one. It's
about the Yeah, it's a Errow package.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
Yeah, So like you have, they've created the drama very well,
and they've staged that very well. Nascar. All of the
drama exists, but you have to see it on a delay.
So what I hear from the Dale documentar and you
tell me is that you can see how hard it
is and what's actually going on behind the scenes in
a way that people want to see.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
They's it's amazing and we should say this is a
Ron Howard Brian Glazer production, so of course it's really
well done, and it really it's the thing that I've
seen that most made me realize what these guys are
going through when they're in the car. It really is insane,
(29:12):
the edge that they're walking. And of course we all
know how it ends, so we don't have to get
into that, but like you really really see they're on
a tight rope in front of everyone. It's it's pretty incredible.
Speaker 3 (29:24):
Har does he never know what to do with his hands?
Speaker 2 (29:29):
Did make me want to watch Telladaga Nights again?
Speaker 3 (29:32):
I will say his mustache was impressive. But I'm looking
at a picture of Graham Hill right now, and that
is a thing of beauty on his upper lip. This
is apparently the only guy who's ever won the triple crown,
which is I the Grand Prix, Monico Grand Prix, the
DY five hundred that you mentioned, and twenty four hours
(29:54):
of Lamon. We're going to talk to Jensen Button on Friday.
If he wins at Lamar, then he only has five hundred.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
He only has the hardest one to go.
Speaker 3 (30:05):
Is it the hardest one? Indie?
Speaker 1 (30:07):
Yeah, on an individual so on a team level, Laman
is probably harder. But like, if you get in the
right car in F one, you can win. I mean,
you all know how Monico is, right, if you can
get qualified qualif you win the race, probably Indy five
hundred is definitely the hardest on a human being, And
it's also the thing that a person should not do
after probably a certain age. And I love Jets and
Button he's such a nice guy, but he's probably getting
(30:28):
close to the age where I would not strap myself
into an Indy five hundred car, So.
Speaker 3 (30:33):
It's unlikely that he will pull off the triple crown.
I can't believe only one person has done it, Like
that's pretty It's pretty wild.
Speaker 1 (30:42):
Right, Mario think about it this way. Mario Andretti was
not success. We think of him as like this great
race car driver, which he is and awesome and such
a cool story. He had such a hard time winning
the Indy five hundred, He had such a like even
get like like, think about how hard it was for
Mario Andretti, and think how hard it is for so
many eight drivers throughout history who have tried to win
the Indy five hundred and have not. That's why it's
(31:04):
still I love Laman and Laman is so much fun.
But like Indy five hundred, if you get, if you
can win one thing in your life in motorsports besides
an F one championship, because of all of the money
and then all the things that come with that money,
I would want to get in Indy five undy.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
By the way, walk us through how this actually works.
Say that Hannah and I enter a Mustang GT three.
We have to drive it for twenty four hours to driver.
There is there a third driver, yes, driver, three drivers? Okay,
so you me and Hannah? Yeah, and then do we
(31:37):
do like four every four hours or two hours eight hours?
Can we choose?
Speaker 1 (31:42):
You can sort of choose. And so this gets into
the complicated thing, the complicated and simple. The complicated answer
is that drivers all have to drive certain minimums so
that if you do have a person who is paying
for this program who is not as fast as professional
drivers for no reason other than they are not professional
race car drivers, then you want them to probably drive
the limited amount of time, the most limited amount of time.
(32:04):
But that means there's a minimum number of stints. They
can't just go out and drive for six hours and
it's like I'm done, Like you know, there have to
be a certain number of stints. They have to run
a certain minimum time. Also, the problem isn't actually minimums there,
it's maximums.
Speaker 2 (32:15):
Right.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
If someone's on a heater and they're having a great day,
you want to keep them in the car as long
as possible, but for reasons of competitiveness and also so
that somebody doesn't get really tired and fly out of Lasar,
you know, out of the Mulson Straight at two hundred
miles an hour. They also have to take breaks in between,
so we would split it up. We would probably have
let's say I'm the slow driver of the three, I'm
(32:36):
the one who's paying to be there, which is probably
not the case. But let's say I'm the one paying
to be there, you might have me go first. You
know there's a lot of traffic, it's going to be slow.
My whole goal is to just survive and then just
put in lap times the second driver. Then the two
other drivers might switch back and forth. But if it's
a pro team, you might go with a different strategy.
At the end, you do want your fastest driver. You
almost always want your fastest driver at the end of
(32:59):
the race. But you don't know how that's going to happen.
Because if you have your fastest driver in the middle
of the race, there's a wreck and they're just doing
three laps over thirty minutes slow, that time all counts
and so now you have to then adjust. And so
I will say this. You will sleep during the twenty
four hours. The drivers will sleep on the floor, The mechanics,
the people changing the tires, they will sleep. The only
people who will be awake, other than maybe documentarians, are
(33:21):
the people who are the actual race engineers. They will
sit on those pit boxes for twenty four hours because
they have to know what's happening, because they any small
change in air temperature, in weather, in pits will completely
change the strategy, so they're constantly having to just just
move on the fly. So that's the real thing and
the strategy part of it. It's a little harder to understand,
(33:42):
but I will say little pro tip. If you listen
to Radio Laman, Like there's a thing called Radio Lamon
in your ear set, if you get an ear set
there to listen to it, or you listen to the radio,
they actually do a really great job of providing the
context that the TV does an okay job, but the radio,
I actually think does a really good job.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
I'm looking at the Iron Dames site. By the way, Hannah,
it says Bronze rated drivers, which is like the zero right,
the rich guy or gal in the group have to
drive for a minimum of six hours across the entire
twenty four hour period, and then no driver is allowed
to be behind the wheel for more than four hours
(34:19):
in any six hour period, or more than fourteen hours total.
So that's pretty that's pretty easy to understand.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
Yeah, and easy to do. I mean, we could all
of us could do fourteen hours racing in a car
right now, right, we could just the constant g forces
on your neck, you know, it's funny. They actually have
little little trailers that are kind of off from the paddock,
and they have like a little village of these little campers,
and so the race car drivers will just go back
there and sleep and try it and they'll sleep. It's amazing.
They'll go back and they'll sleep for like two or
three hours and then come back and they'll get a
(34:47):
little pasta with chickens, just like the little pasta with chicken,
get some protein, gets some carbs, and they'll just go
out there. Whereas like even as just a fan, like
at three o'clock in the morning, like you're dead, Which
is also my second piece of advice, besides listening to
Raide Lamon, I was going to ask three o'clock, three
o'clock in the morning, you're getting tired, you got a rally,
don't go to the rave because there is a rave,
an electronic EDM that's happening. Do that early, get that
(35:09):
out of your system early, or do that right at
the end when you're deliriously tired. Go to there's a
little crape place up at tet Rouge, and it's not
hard to get to from like the media center, main
paddock area, wherever you are, and you're just gonna walk
basically kind of walk north, and you're gonna go and
you're gonna sit there and you get a grandmar and
you a cape, crape maybe or any crap, and to
tell a crape, whatever your your flavor of crape is,
(35:30):
and you're just gonna sit there and you're just gonna
eat a crape and you're just gonna see the lights
go by, and you're just gonna hear the cars and
it's gonna be heaven. You're gonna just be rejuvenated. You're
just gonna feel life. And that advice isn't my advice
that originally I did that, but that came from Bill Riley,
who is one of the most successful race car team
managers ever. And he's this big, gruff dude and he
(35:50):
sits on that wall on that pit box all day.
He takes one break and he walks up to go
get a crape and then he comes back. That's in
twenty four hours. It's his only break, and it's enough
plus a lot of coffee to read you himself. And
I did it last time I was there, and it
was it was magical.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
I love that now. Hardgre I want to ask you
about the tramway train system in the city, and I'm
thinking about our listeners who may want to end up
going to the race next year or whatever, Like how
is it getting to the track from the city and
do you have any recommendations about how people should do that?
Speaker 1 (36:21):
Yeah, camp, My recommendation is camp. So yeah, I would camp.
I would park there. Camping is the absolute best way
to experience Laman. You know, I slept in a van,
like it's it's it's the best way to do it.
You can pop in. Actually it's not as inaccessible as
you would think. You can pop in and pop out.
You can take a tram, you can get a cab
or an uber like, it's not it's not terrible. I
(36:42):
will say, you want to get early enough and you
all should do this as well. So the track is
on city streets for a lot of it, and in
between practices and qualifying it's open and there's like the
curbs and everything, so you can go drive on the
actual racetrack as you know you've been there. You can
drive on the race track when the race track is
an in session, and that's like incredible. So like I
(37:03):
would rent a car buy a cheap from the care
floor or whatever, or a motorcycle, buy a cheap sleeping
bag and then just do it that way. That's what
the Brits all do when they go, and it's it's
the best way to experience it because you want to
be there, like no offense to Lamon. Lamon itself is
like a cute town. If you go early for scrutineering
with a called the Passage, you can like go see
all that fun stuff. But like it's just every other
(37:24):
little European town. There's a church, there's eighteen lingerie shops
and only one toy store for some reason when you
trying to get something for Edith and the kids, like
you know, like there's just you know, like like you know,
it's fun, it's fine, but the track is where you
want to be. Except for Friday, they do a parade
around the city and that's that's what's going to.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
We're going to broadcast live at the track during the parade,
so we'll miss that. But luckily we're done with our
work pretty much our work duties by the time the
race starts at four pm on Saturday. Yeah, at we'll
be free but tired.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
I'd be doing a lot of Red Bull.
Speaker 1 (37:59):
It's a red Bull of it.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
I love red Bull. I love myself a red Bull,
I always have.
Speaker 3 (38:05):
I don't. I don't like that any of those energy drinks.
They make me feel like I'm on bad, bad drugs,
you know. So I'm not down to clown and I
don't drink anymore. So I'm not going to be hanging
out with the Brits at the camp.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
Yeah, oh man. And I will say also, when it
gets hot in the afternoon a little there's like a
whole aparaol tent operol spirits of the afternoon. That's also
a recommendation. You could have a great time.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
You can have such good you know Aaron keating at
Cox Automotive.
Speaker 3 (38:32):
Of course.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
Now Aaron said that she got a fish pedicure in
the Outing tint one year. Do you know about this Matt.
Speaker 4 (38:40):
Fish pedicure like p h I s h or f
fish the little gold they eat the calluses like piranhas.
Speaker 1 (38:52):
Yes, much much smaller piranhas.
Speaker 3 (38:54):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (38:54):
And I will say this, you know, like that ain't
happening at Seabring, no offense. I love Sea bring. You
can get an natty light pedicure. You can probably get
a pH fish paddicure pedicure from someone there. Yeah, no,
I mean there's just so many opportunities, and like, let's
be honest, like you either can spend a lot of
money or you can be a schlubby journalist like us,
and as a slubby journalist like us, you get access
to all of that stuff. But even then everyone has
(39:15):
access to the apparaol tent, and the aparaol tent at
like Laguna Seka is not as good as necessarily the
operole tent there. Like like I shouldn't say Alex did
Lgunasak is great at Pocono. Let's say at Pocono you
ain't getting an apparol tent. You ain't getting a operol sprits.
Speaker 3 (39:27):
Dude, tell us what you're doing now? Tell us about
the autopian When when you and I first met, you
were running Jelopnik, which was like an amazing time to
be a car lover. And then things kind of went haywire.
You did some documentaries, you did a lot of TV
and film. What do you what are your focus is
(39:49):
right now? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (39:50):
That was thank you for I love to be able
to plug the autopian. Yeah, Gelot mcdays were really fun.
I tried to hire Hannah. She took this job instead
and made the right choice. Historically, you've definitely made the
right decision given what happened. Yeah. So the Autopian is,
you know, we've been around for about three years. It
was founded by two Chilopnak writers, David Tracy and Jason Twortinski,
and then Bo Bachman Helliott. I think you know, boh
(40:13):
Elliott says, Elliott there, Hanna.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
You know, but everyone calls my real friends call me Elliott.
Speaker 1 (40:17):
There you go. Hopefully I'm a real friend.
Speaker 3 (40:20):
I bought a car from Bo.
Speaker 1 (40:21):
You bought a car, right, and you're an Autopian member
as well, So you're getting all So yeah, I mean
we just we all remember how great websites were like
eight or nine years ago, and because of programmatic advertising,
because of social media, and I don't think it's like
websites have gotten bad. They're not fan hold Cogan and
Hull Cogan. They've gotten harder to read, harder to get to.
(40:41):
Facebook tells you what to read. We were just like,
what if we did a website for people who just
love cars and just want to read about cars and
want to enjoy the company of other car enthusiasts and
want to do it on a site that will actually
load on their phone before like sixteen pop up bads
load up on their phone. And so we're trying it.
So remember supported, we do have advertising, but if you
become a member, there's no advertising anymore. And that's done
(41:02):
really well for us, and you know, it's it's launching
a media company in the twenty twenties sounded like an
insane idea, and it was an insane idea, but you know,
we've hoped proven that you can build a sustainable enterprise
if you put the reader first and you don't try
to like just say like, let's do an SEO garbage
play and make everything an arbitrage for Facebook traffic. Like
if you're just like, what if we wrote good stories
(41:24):
that people like and we wrote about weird cars that
people like, maybe we could be successful. And it's we're
not gonna have four hundred million readers, probably, but I
don't care. The readers we have. I love them, and
they're growing every month, and that's where we want to be.
Speaker 3 (41:34):
Did you do like an MBA or something, because you know,
all of these high falutin business terms, and but you're
just a car fanboy at heart.
Speaker 1 (41:43):
So there's a large part of me that wishes I
didn't know any of this. The problem is is that
to survive as a journalist these days, you know, unless
you're enormously talented like the two of you, if you're
the rest of us, then you have to understand all
this stuff if you want to survive, because you're otherwise.
If you don't learn this stuff, you're kind of at
the behest and at the whim of everyone else. And
I've been through enough layoffs, I've been through enough terrible
(42:06):
times in media that we basically just decided, let's take
control of it ourselves. So we had to learn all
this stuff, and we made lots of mistakes. We're probably
still doing a lot of stuff wrong, but we just
had to learn it. And so, yeah, no, do I
wish I knew what an RPM CPM do? I wish
I knew what agentic AI was. No, I wish I
knew none of that stuff, But somebody has to. So
it's me cool.
Speaker 2 (42:26):
I love it and I respect that completely. And I
also love that you have a piece about Sabrina Carpenter
on the front page of the autopian.
Speaker 1 (42:35):
She's so good and also she loves the weird cars
like her and her artistic contribute collaborators. I don't know,
but like she's got an eye for like the very
I mean, you've gotta you gotta see three Corvette, right, yeah, yes,
I do.
Speaker 3 (42:48):
You're cool. She has more than one C three Corvette.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
Thanks, criminally underrated. I will say it till the day
I A.
Speaker 1 (42:56):
I think Blaze is cool again. I mean she's like
the queen of Blaze, like that that whole video. The
new video is Almalay's cars. But actually it makes sense
both from a just time shifts, so not everyone wants
sixties cars anymore and seventies cars are bad. But like,
if you just want to go cruise, do you care
that it has a smog choked V eight? Like does
it matter to you that your C three does not
have five hundred horse power?
Speaker 2 (43:15):
No?
Speaker 1 (43:15):
It looks awesome, You look awesome in it? Who cares?
Speaker 3 (43:18):
Sabrina Carpenter is a pop music person or who is that?
Speaker 2 (43:23):
Matt? I'll send you the video.
Speaker 3 (43:25):
Is she related to the Carpenters?
Speaker 2 (43:28):
I don't think so.
Speaker 3 (43:29):
Like the very depressing yeah, seventies.
Speaker 2 (43:32):
Bachild Google Sabrina Carpenter Manchild and you'll see a video
with cool cool cars on it.
Speaker 3 (43:39):
All right. One other thing, aside from Lament, and aside
from the autopian that I wanted to talk to you about,
was all this crazy autocross stuff that you do. Because
you're always asking me to go up to Limerock, which
is awesome, but you're driving the oddest cars. A lot
of time on track. You were in an M five
station wagon, which is like a luxury sedan made bigger.
(44:01):
And why that? Why choose that car for autocross?
Speaker 1 (44:05):
So some of that was just timing. We had the car. Also,
if BMW asks for tire reasons, we barely put it
on the track. It was only for like a hot
minute because we said we would not we would leave
the tires.
Speaker 3 (44:14):
Oh should we cut this cart down?
Speaker 1 (44:15):
No, No, it's fine, it's fine, and we had a portion.
Speaker 2 (44:18):
No.
Speaker 1 (44:18):
Actually, I want to bring a minivan next. Look, I
am not going to be at Laman. I am not
a great driver, it is I As you know, these
cars have gotten so fast that finding the limit of
the car now is very scary. That's why a Miata
is so much fun, because you can find the limit
of a Miata really fun. I mean, you're your challenger right,
like you're just there's so much power, you're traction limited.
(44:39):
Like you know where the edge of that car is
because you can find it by just pushing down the
skinny pedal and you're there.
Speaker 3 (44:43):
I'm always close to the edge of that car.
Speaker 1 (44:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (44:46):
No, but it makes it fun at forty five right
right now, I'm driving the Carrera GTS T hybrid, which
is amazing, right, but you have to be triple digits
before it's kind of exciting, and then you're already in trouble.
Speaker 1 (45:01):
You know what car's fast at twenty miles an hour
around a racetrack, Yata Toyota, Siena Toyota.
Speaker 2 (45:08):
Yeah, there you go.
Speaker 1 (45:09):
So that's fun. Like I liked it. I just like
to have fun with cars, and fun with cars is
doing things that are not Like, if you want to
go read about how the latest Corvette does around a
racetrack roadent track, is going to do a better job
than I'm probably gonna do if you want to, but
they're not going to necessarily. Actually they did once. That
sounds surely entirely true, but like it's more fun. It's
just more fun to slow. Car fast is faster than
fast car slow if you are not racing at them
(45:31):
on this weekend. That's just the reality.
Speaker 2 (45:34):
That's the headline of this entire conversation.
Speaker 3 (45:37):
All right, Hannah, you have to run and catch your flight.
Speaker 2 (45:40):
Yes, Matt haartegree. Thank you for joining us. Come back
and talk to us more. This was really great. We
really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (45:47):
Bom voyage. Enjoy, Enjoy a crepe for me, take a picture,
Send me a picture I want to put on Instagram.
Speaker 3 (45:53):
Okay, all right, well, Hannah's got to run and catch
her flight. I am going to run and catch my flight.
So I guess we'll end it here, but we will
probably be broadcasting our next episode could be from Lament.
Speaker 2 (46:08):
It might be also we have a very big guest
next week that all of my girlfriends are obsessed with.
Speaker 3 (46:15):
Oh yeah, the producer. Yes, catch us next time with Total.
Speaker 1 (46:21):
It would be such a good episode. You have to
listen to the episode, Michael, it'd be so great.
Speaker 3 (46:29):
That's Schwartz and I love. All right, that's it. I'm
Matt Miller and
Speaker 2 (46:33):
I'm Hannah Elliott, and this is Bloomberg
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
I'm Matt Miller and I'm Hannah Elliott, and this is
Hot Pursuit.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
All right, Hannah, you and I are like literally in
the next couple hours rushing off to the airport to
get our flights to Paris because we're going to Lamar
this weekend.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Lama, my bags are packed. I've got my passport, I've
got my sunscreen, I've got my baseball hat. I'm ready.
Speaker 4 (00:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
We have a twenty four hour race to go to
and we're doing a full day of live broadcast on Friday,
June thirteenth, the day this podcast comes out.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
I can't believe the guest lineup we have. We have
people from Forsha Ford, role X, who else?
Speaker 3 (00:54):
We have Jensen Button for one thing, Formula One Champion,
have Tom Wagner, He's been on this program before. He
owns Nighthead, he owns Joda, he owns Singer, a number
of other really important company Now at track right, in
a sense, he owns what's that track called that you
like out there? Willow? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Is he behind that too? Or is that that's a
capital different one?
Speaker 3 (01:19):
He's he's behind that, He's behind that Okay. Behind that,
we have I'll just list. We have Jamie Chadwick, she's
a driver. We have Roger Penske. We're going to talk
about his new car. We have Gil West, he runs Hurts.
Michael Steiner, you mentioned Portia, he's a board member there.
We have Adrian Hallmark, the CEO of Aston Martin. By
(01:39):
the way, quick aside, Quick Tangent, a buddy of mine
went to a party at Billy Zane's house this weekend.
Hey Billy Zaine, he was the bad guy from Titanic. Right.
Apparently he's like an artiste now and you can get
his artwork as an option on your Aston Martin.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Okay, is that not like it's incredibly random?
Speaker 3 (02:04):
I don't know, it's so random. Okay. We have Sarah Boviie.
She's a Belgian racing driver. She drives for the Iron
Dames team. We have Florentman Joe the CEO of Michelin,
the CEO of Goodyear, Mark Stewart. We have Rob Dickinson
from Singer. We have the CEO of Rolex. I mean
we're just loaded up with guests.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Most importantly, we need to tell people where and when
they can watch. Do you have that on your document.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
Well, you can watch all day long on Bloomberg Television
on Friday if you're so inclined, and you can see
it on Bloomberg dot com.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
We're also doing a special July nineteenth, June nineteenth.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
June nineteenth, we're doing a well, we're doing a June nineteenth.
We're going to do a Bloomberg Television thing, and then
the following weekend we're going to release a special. So
there's a lot of content coming out.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
From us watch Out, watch Out.
Speaker 3 (02:54):
But it's not like I don't expect it to be
Matt hardegree level film.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
Which is, oh, well, he's a filmmaker, he's I mean,
we're not cinematic.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
Definitely was so my old friend Matt Hart agree and
your old friend as well. I first met him when
he was running Jelopnick. I feel like he was the
first important editor of Jelopnick.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Hopefully he's the only editor I know.
Speaker 3 (03:20):
And then he went on to make films and work
for another number of entrepreneurial organizations, and now he's running
The Utopian, which is a website, a community really of
car lovers.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Yeah, and I have to say it's a very refreshing
look at the car world, emphasizing what you and I
always believe, which is cars should be fun, but it's smart.
Like I know Matt heart Degree is going to say,
we just like to have fun with cars. But don't
let that fool you.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
It's true. He's always coming through the data. He is
into the minutia. He brought up when he came into
the studio a Bank America report, so he's reading all
the Wall Street research.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
He's going to try try to make it just sound
like it's fun in games, but there's a lot of
intelligence and history behind it. All.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
Right, let's get to Matt Hardegree now he's with us
here in the studio, and I just want to ask
for one quick story before we get into the Lamont coverage.
And that is something I heard you at one point
were there and you've been there many times, and a
team offered you race gas for your rental car. How
did that work out?
Speaker 1 (04:27):
I think the statute of limitations on this is past
so basically in France, and it's not a track rule necessarily,
it's a national rule like in most places, like you
can only have so much gasoline just stored in random
containers around for very obvious safety reasons. This team, for
some reason was really obsessed about not having too much
fuel in their tank, and so they did a lot
of fuel tests, which means they're just putting expensive race
(04:47):
fuel in and then letting it come back out and
then draining it. Problem is they realized, oh no, now
we have too much race fuel. So it just happens.
I had rented a cheap card that wasn't the diesel
because so many of the cars were diesels. We had
a big diesel van, and then I had a Opal
and so they were like, hey, come here real quick,
could we do you need fuel? And I was like, actually, yeah,
I was about to go pay way too much money
for like gasoline, and they were like, no, no, we
(05:09):
got you hooked up. And so I got twelve or
thirteen gallons of race fuel in a in a little
Opal manual. Oh my god, that thing was so fast,
like you can actually drive when you drive out of
the track, you drive on part of the race circuit
of the Bugatti circuit, and they have the curbs and
I might have just it was like late, nobody was around,
and I hit it and I felt like I got
an extra fifty horse power and I almost crashed at
(05:32):
Laman in an opal which in the outside the track,
which would have been embarrassing, but it was fun. And
that's you know, that's the magical Laman. You never know
what's going to happen. You might have race fuel in
your crappy little opal.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
Here's the deal, right, We're going to Lamon. Me and
Hannah are going to Lamar. We're doing a whole broadcast
special from there on Friday. We're recording a special for
the following weekend. And I mean, she probably is steeped
in this stuff, but I know nothing about it out
racing that's not on two wheels, right, So that's why
(06:04):
I thought it'd be cool to get you in here.
This is obviously an historic race, and I imagine the
original point was to prove that cars could go for
twenty four hours so that they could then sell them
with a good reputation. So is that how it all started?
Speaker 1 (06:20):
That is how it all started. Lamon was one of
the original proving grounds for automobiles, along with the Paris
to Peaking race. The problem with the Paris to Peaking
race was that you had to go to peaking first
and then get all the cars back, and it turned
out to be an enormous hassle and so around logistically
it was not very easy. And so someone had the
bright idea that instead of trying to go all the
(06:41):
way across a continent, why don't we just go a
couple hours west of Paris and then just do it
in a circle for twenty four hours. And that was
enough and that was enough, and that along with the
eighty five hundred, are kind of like the original races,
the original proof of concepts of the automobile as something
that's better than a train, better than a horse, and
better than a bike.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
And I think we should say too people may know,
you know, Ford versus Ferrari is set at the twenty
four hour of Lamon race. I mean, that's like a
very cultural touch point that if if people might have
heard of that, then it's that race.
Speaker 3 (07:13):
Well, and I'll also I think Steve McQueen probably made
Lamon famous for people of my generation right because he
made a drunken, drug fueled movie about it.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
He did it is It is a movie. It is
a motorsports movie of all time. It is not the best,
but it is a movie and it's great to put
on in the background. It is probably the best movie
to just put on a wall with sound because there's
very little dialogue in the movie while you do anything
else other than just sit down and watch the movie.
Speaker 3 (07:43):
But Ford versus Ferrari, what's your take on that? One?
Speaker 1 (07:46):
Great movie? Great movie? They did?
Speaker 4 (07:47):
Want it?
Speaker 1 (07:48):
What?
Speaker 2 (07:50):
Keep going? Keep going? I'm just providing a counterpoint.
Speaker 3 (07:53):
I think she said hated it.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
You hated it? Okay, they did one Ford executive dirty
and they like they hand waved over so much about
the actual history. Also, they made Carol Shelby kind of
the nicer one and Ken Miles kind of the jerk,
which is maybe historically not always the most accurate. Thing.
They do do a little hint at Carol Shelby's, you know,
very creative business practices. So all of that is yes,
(08:17):
if you actually know the real story and you read
the AJ. But if you want the real story, read
AJ's book and it's great and you'll get the absolute
real story. If you just want the vibes of what
Laman is like and why people care, and the vibes
of what it's like to try to compete against an
Italian automaker. I think it gets that the vibes very
very correct.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
Why didn't you like it, Hannah?
Speaker 2 (08:36):
For all the reasons that Matt said, You're one hundred
percent right, Matt, and just I think it probably just
brought up how completely white, male dominated everything was at
the time, which is just kind of disgusting to watch unfold.
It Really it did trigger me. I think it was
(08:59):
just it was so unapologetically about these guys. You know,
I can go down down the road there.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
But but is that any different now? Isn't it still?
I mean, I'm putting together the rundown for the show.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
I'm saying it's perfect, but it's The Iron Dames are
leading the European Lamon Series Championship right now in their class, and.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
I got us an interview with one of their drivers,
So I'm excited about that.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
They're awesome.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
But everybody else that I'm talking to there, that we're
talking to there is a dude, you know.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Yeah, but that's not for lack of trying. I mean, look,
we still have a long way to go, but it's
great when we can at least count that there are
people of color and women making some decisions in the
racing world. I mean, it's not like it's not perfect,
but it's better than it was.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Wait, just to clarify it, one of the most successful
race engineers of all time, Lean Gate was a woman,
like one of the best limp Laman engineers who ran
the AUDI program successfully during Audi's crazy run as a woman.
So I so, actually European sports car racing and sports
car racing in general has a way better. I mean,
you know, representation is in everything, and I'm not trying
to say that it is, and there's still an insane
(10:11):
amount of work. Yeah, but I mean they're they're they're
kicking butt like That's what I'm just saying is that
there's there's a history of Iron Dames is great and
I think they're one of the teams that could win
this that you'll see there. I think that they're extraordinarily competitive.
And I you know, I've been there. I've been to
them on you know a couple of times, and I
followed a team and I did it, made a documentary
about it that no one will overseee And there were
(10:32):
you know, mechanics engineers that the team's uh main engineer
you know, was from Ferrara and was a woman. I mean,
it's it's better. But again, also we're talking a percentage
of game. The percentage of women in the field versus
men in the field is obviously skewed. But it's better
than NASCAR, It's better than It's way better than F one.
Let's just say that.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
And I'm going to say better than Moto GP, although
there is a woman who owns Grasini. But listen, we're
getting off track. I think a little bit in terms
of what to expect. Wait, Hannah, have you been to
the race to the twenty four hours at Lamar I.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Have driven on the track, but I haven't been to
the race.
Speaker 3 (11:08):
Okay, So, Matt, among the three of us, you're the
only who's been there, and you were making a documentary
at least one of the times you were there. But
tell us about your experience, Like, what is it like?
There must be three hundred thousand people that show up.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
Indeed, especially this year, this year will probably you I'm
so jealous. I'm not going this year. This is the
best year to go. This is the absolute best year.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Why do you say that, Matt.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
Oh, it's gonna be so good. For very complicated reasons.
We can get into the sport of like, endurance racing
has made a bunch of extraordinarily complex decisions that have
actually made it just very simple for competitors, for automakers,
and for fans. It's never been easier to watch, It's
never been easier to compete in the race. It is
(11:53):
the it is. I mean, I love Daytona, i love
the Nurburgring twenty four and I've been able to go
to a lot of my bucket races, but there's nothing
like Laman, like Selo. It is the best, like it
is absolutely insane. The crowds are remarkable, hundreds of thousands
of people. Like you said, it is a party in
the infield and not like a seabring party. Sea brings
also kind of a party, but it's just people raving
(12:16):
in the middle of the track. You know, there's everyone,
not you, Matt probably obviously, but everyone's got an apparol
or a beer or logger like there hand, I'll have
a good time. It's it's an amazing environment in this here.
There are so many cars. There are so many cars,
and there are so many different cars, and there are
so many brands, and there are so many makes, and
there are so many things to root for It's incredible.
(12:36):
I mean it really. It's people say that the like
eighties nineties group Sierra for race car fans was the
golden era. People are now saying, and I believe this,
many people are saying it is the platinum era of racing.
You're you're going at the absolute best time maybe ever.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
Matt, what do you think American car people might be
missing about Laman? Because admittedly it's obscure. Every time I
try to pitch Lamon's stories to my editors, it's I'm
always pushed back. It's too obscure. No one knows about it,
no one cares. And we are admittedly talking about a
very rarefied small group of car enthusiasts. So what do
(13:14):
you think American car lovers in general don't get about Laman?
And what should they understand?
Speaker 3 (13:20):
By the way she's addressing you, we're both called Matt.
Oh yeah, if you say Matt to.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
Either one can take it.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
Cardie, Yeah, okay, I'll take this one. First of all,
are those editors in this building? And can I fight them?
Are they here right now? Can I find them?
Speaker 2 (13:35):
No?
Speaker 1 (13:35):
I think that's fair. It's it's it's a reasonable thing
to say because in the last few years it's gotten bad.
European sports are racing. Endurance racing got bad, I got
too complicated, there were way fewer teams, and motorsports in
general started to die. And it's been said before, it's
been said before. I think on this podcast we all
know the drive to survive factor has made motorsports more interesting. However,
(13:58):
also Americans care. Americans care about F one, that is
a crazy thing. Americans are starting to care about MOTOJPGP
that is also a crazy thing. And so the difference
is is that there aren't that many American brands and
Mars really in Formula One, and there are not many
American team There's one kind of at the moment, but
more are coming. You know, if you look at it.
F one is not actually really that accessible to an American.
(14:20):
It's just that it had this great thing where it
made the driver stars. The cars aren't the stars. The
drivers are the stars in this series. The cars are
the stars. Still, the drivers aren't quite as interesting. I
think that's the problem, right, The drivers aren't celebrities to Americans.
No one's like maybe some people are like, hey, Nick Tandy, right,
the most famous race card this will make that happy.
The most famous race car driver there is vounting to Rossi,
(14:42):
who is a motorcycle rider. Like like the most famous
person there for motorsports is someone who does not normally
drive until now it's so recently like sports cars, so
that is a thing. But I think that people are
going to see Cadillacs, they're going to see Ford Mustangs,
they're going to see Porschas, they're going to see McLaren's,
they're going to see BMW's corvettes. They're going to I
see freaking corvettes. Like it's going to be a party.
And if you're if you have any amount of patriotism
(15:06):
or any amount of soul, or you even like a car,
and that's why you're listening to this. If you sit
down and watch any hour of the race where it's
not raining or red flagged, you're gonna have an amazing time.
And also they're gonna try to race. I will say
this also about Lamm and you probably have to think,
hany've had experience in Daytona. It rains, sometimes they slow
it down. They have banking at LAMM they're going like
you know, really bad accident, they'll slow it down. Their
(15:27):
goal is to race, race, race, race, race, and so
I just think there's so much there. And I think
as it gets better, as the cars get more famous,
as people start to latch onto it and find it
more accessible in a lot of ways. In Formula One,
I think it's going to get more interesting.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
Based on that. Can we talk about how cool it
is that Jim Farley, the head of Ford, is also racing. Yes,
I mean, how many car executives do we know are racing?
Speaker 3 (15:50):
Also a little bit behind the scenes, a little bit
of behind the scenes intel. We have an interview with
Jim Farley on Friday morning. I think it's in the
serve valance seven o'clock hour, New York Times, so that
makes it one pm Lamon time. And Dan Barbosa said, dude,
(16:11):
can we make it like one fifteen or even one twenty,
because if Jim wins, he's going to be like coming
to the interview from the podium, So he's still going
to be wearing his fire suit. He's still going to
be like covered in sweat and not no makeup on yet.
This is live TV, right, So I was like, no,
we want him to come in his fire suit full
(16:33):
of sweat and no makeup. It's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
It's it's great. It's so much fun.
Speaker 4 (16:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:38):
So he's in the Mustang Invitational race that's running with
a bunch of Rustlings. The French love Mustangs, the friend
when I'm in Europe, they love Mustang It's true, they do.
You know, everyone loves a Mustang. And seeing a bunch
of them like, it's just it's pride. Like a couple
of years ago, they ran a NASCAR around Lamon, and
I have friends with the team and people who were there,
journalists covering it, and it was just a one off
thing they were doing for fun. It was the favor car.
(17:00):
It was absolutely the frame of car. Everyone loved it.
You know, if we're going to solve world's trade problems,
I think Lamon's a good place to start. I think
let's get beset, let's get everybody there, and let's just say,
let's look at the cars. Maybe shall meee can get
in the race. We'll just toss one in. I think
people would be very excited.
Speaker 3 (17:14):
I'm pretty pumped to see. Really, the amateurs are going
to be racing with the pros this time, right, They're
not separating like rich dudes versus hired guns. It's all
one in one go, one class.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
Yes, which is so good. I was there the last
year that they did pro and am and non pro,
which is always like it's see this is where again
it's complicated behind the scenes because you have all these
drivers with different rankings and it's been all these complex things.
If you can have a bronze driver, you can't have
a silver driver. None of that matters to you. All
the cars are racing against each other and it's likely
that a pro team is going to win without a
(17:51):
you know, like a bronze or you know, a gentleman
driver as they say, a paid driver. But it's actually
not a guaranteed. Laman is crazy. It's twenty four hours,
like you have to serve vibe twenty three hours to
win the race. You'll just have twenty three hours of
racing of being exhausted to just get to that last hour.
And a bunch of pro teams, a bunch of people
who had spent all this money and all this time
and all they have these dreams of racing at Laman
(18:13):
are going to be out in the first twenty six
minutes first turn. Some years people don't make it past
the first turn, and then it's just some you know,
mix of a professional driver and some amateur, just someone
who just really cares, who just right timing it, rained
at the right moment, and they have a chance because
at twenty three hours they're in it and somebody a
pro can still make a mistake. It's amazing. You don't
get that an amateur is not going to win an.
Speaker 3 (18:34):
Ass So separate it out for us, because the thing
that always confuses me is all the different classes have
these acronyms. And I mean Scott eighth or ten used
to always confuse me at IMSA as well. Right, it's
there's the top level is LMP one.
Speaker 1 (18:51):
Now it's now it's it's hypercar.
Speaker 3 (18:54):
Okay, it's just called hypercar. That's like the best that.
These are the cars that like Hannah test drives in
Los Angeles, right, these are the Matty Reemock's car.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
I think this is more like nine six three level.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
Yes, this is nine six three. Although actually if you drive,
if you write a Valkyrie, if you do the if
you do the Aston Martin, actually they do have a
version of that. So again complicated behind the scenes. Simple,
all you need to know the fastest cars and they
can race. And this is a new thing. We talked
you talk about Scott aster're talking about INMS. So before
what was the problem is you could watch American prototypes race.
(19:29):
So these are prototypes, the fastest cars they give, like
an F one car with a roof. They couldn't race
at Laman, and then their cars couldn't race here. Now
they said, forget that, that's too complicated. There's one class hypercar.
Maybe it's a European racing LMDh car, maybe it's an
American racing LMH car. It doesn't matter. Their hypercrs. So
the fastest they are, they have a hybrid system. They
(19:49):
might be rear wheel drive, they might be all wheel drive,
they might have a big stung. Here's the thing you're
gonna know the second that Cadillact goes by. This is
what's so much fun about Laman. Go stand at ted Ruz,
Go stand at the Porsha curves. You're gonna close your
eye and you're gonna hear it where we are. Okay,
it's probably a Ferrari. Right, You're gonna hear little buzzy engines.
You're gonna hear all sorts of things. You know, but
then you're gonna hear that Cadillac vight come around the
corner and everyone's gonna know. You're gonna feel it in
(20:10):
your stomach. It's a Cadillac V eight and it's gonna
make boom like it's gonna make an amazing sound, and
you're gonna have that, and then you'll have that. That's
the fastest class.
Speaker 3 (20:19):
Then the next fastest class is like everybody can choose
one of the same. Uh, one of the same.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
What?
Speaker 3 (20:28):
Yeah? So the names chassiss like a yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
So there's l m P two, which has kind of
always been l m P two and that stands for
LAMM Prototype two. So they're the slower cars. It's a
mix of amateurs and pros.
Speaker 3 (20:39):
All the cars look the same.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
All the cars look the same, they have the same
mode of the same gearbox, the same Chassias in Arica,
like it's all Urica, So it's all the same thing.
You can pay attention to that or pay attention to that.
AO racing an American team, which is really exciting, is
gonna be racing there. So I would say pick one,
pick one l m P two team, and then that's it.
That's it. And also that's a great looking car. So
you're gonna pick AO Racing. That's gonna be your team,
(21:01):
you know, or whoever. I don't care who does, but
that's gonna be your team. And then you to Hannah's point,
all all the cars now racing in the GT class,
these are cars that are based on like road cars.
They are all all mixed up pros non pros, and
those are cars theoretically you can go buy. Those are cars.
Both of you get to drive before I get to drive.
By the way, I know, it's like Hannah gets the
(21:21):
car first and the mat gets cut the second. Matt
Hardiger gets the car third. We all know this.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
Hannah gets usually like the you know, the Penan Farina Batista,
and I get like the Suberu outback.
Speaker 4 (21:32):
You know.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
Usually that's fine, that's fine with that breakdown. I'm just
fine with that.
Speaker 3 (21:37):
No. Wait, so that's the only three classes. There's hyper cars,
l m P two and then the GT three cars.
Speaker 1 (21:42):
Essentially, yes, there are, if you want to be really pedantic,
there are actually within the hypercar class or LMH cars
and LMDh cars, But who cares. They made it simple.
It's three cars. All the cars have different colors on
the numbers. That's all you gotta do. That's what's gonna
make it so much fun, and that's why they're and
it also made they think so much cheaper, which is
why there are so many cars this year, and there
are so many different brands and manufacturers. It was sad
(22:04):
before it was sad.
Speaker 2 (22:06):
Can you talk a little bit about who you think
is going to win the outright race? I mean it's
been Ferrari. Can we assume it's gonna be Ferrari again?
I think Farra is leading right now in the championship series.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
Yes, so okay, I'm I'm gonna. I was not sure
I was gonna bring this acronym up, but here we go, bop.
Balance of performance. The other reason why this is exciting
is that they are constantly behind the scenes tweaking how
much power you have, how much total power you get
for a lap, and how much weight you have to
try to keep the cars relatively even. Now. Historically some
people have said, no one in this room certainly have
(22:40):
said that maybe Ferrari sandbags throughout the year so that
they can get extra to the top end speed at leman,
so that they can win. No One here can prove
that that has ever happened. I'm looking around for snipers.
Maybe I'm okay, that's that's certainly no one has ever
said that's happened. No one here in this room is saying,
maybe that's happening again. But this year they've actually won
a few races coming in, so perhaps that's not the case.
Do you think Ferrari is the favorite going into this? However,
(23:03):
if you look at the BOP adjustments that were made,
so this is who gets weight and who gets power.
I actually think that, you know, Cadillac does have a
real chance this year. I I my money is on
cadillact this in the hypercar or hypercar. Yeah, that's it Hypercarillac.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
Doesn't have a GT three team. They don't raise a
black wing at five.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
They don't that would blackwing would be awesome. Bring a sedan, please,
more sedans more?
Speaker 2 (23:24):
No?
Speaker 1 (23:24):
I so Cadillac I think for the overall is my
sleeper pick. If I had to put all my money
on it, I put it on Ferrari. Ask the Marnate
win in some really terrible things have to happen. They
are new teams.
Speaker 3 (23:33):
What about the in the GT three class? The Mustangs.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
Are they Mustangs are competitive? Look on numbers you want
to win in the GT class LP two, we don't care.
We're gonna say're gonna say oo racing, God bless them.
I hope they do well in GT three. I personally
do I want the Mustangs to win?
Speaker 2 (23:48):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (23:48):
I want the must Thanks to win. Do I think
the Proton team is very competitive?
Speaker 3 (23:51):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (23:51):
I think they're very competitive. Is the smart money always
on a Porsche? Yes, the smart money is always on
a nine to eleven winning Laman if you more times
than not. If you you know, if you make that investment,
you're going to be you're gonna pay off. So you
know if you're if you're a gambling person to do that.
But the Corvett's super competitive, you know.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
Side note? What do you think of the nine sixty
three RSP.
Speaker 3 (24:20):
So we're back to hypercars now?
Speaker 2 (24:22):
Yess? One of one car they made for Roger Pinski
that's based on their race car thoughts?
Speaker 1 (24:30):
Why did they only make one? Make make a twenty one?
There are twenty customers for it?
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Completely agree? Why make only one? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (24:38):
Are you going to get to drive it and think
they'll let you drive it? They're not gonna let me out.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
I do. I did see they let a few people
in Europe drive it, a few journalists, so and I
am in touch with them, so I might see if
I can scoot over and get a little a little
even if it's in the parking lot, I'll take it.
I don't care. I would love to drive it.
Speaker 4 (24:55):
For me.
Speaker 3 (24:56):
That's the most exciting thing. The thing I'm looking forward
to you the most probably is seeing that car.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
I will say, I wish they had made it look cooler.
I mean, I understand the concept, but Matt, Matt Miller,
to your point when you texted me about it, like
anything beside the nine seventeen does not look great.
Speaker 3 (25:17):
Never did a nine picture taken next to a nine seventeen, Because.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
Yes, I just wish we it like, I just wish
it looked like nicer. You know, it's going to be
a road car.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
It's a heritage play, right, That is definitely a nostalgia play.
It is not saying we it's like it's less future focused.
I agree, And nine to seventeen is future focused. This
is not future focused. This is very much reaching back
to the past. So that's always the thing with all
of these sports right with F one. To get a
trillion new fans, it had to piss off the thirty
people that really cared so much and are so mad
(25:53):
that like Lenny Kravitz is at the racer, you know whatever,
random celebrity right like that, They're like, ohh is that?
Like you know, like that's the because that's the only
celebrity they recognize, right. They don't know any any K
pop stars, And I think you're gonna probably have a
little bit of that with this. So this is Portia saying, look, people,
we still remember our history and this is still important
to us, assuming that new fans are maybe coming. That's
(26:13):
my read on it. But who cares. It looks cool,
it's super fast.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
I agree. This isn't getting new fans. No, this is
getting This is only us talking about.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
I mean, because of the looks of these things, and
I'm sure some people like the hyper cars the best.
For me, the GT three cars are the most exciting
because that's a car that I could actually buy. And
actually Barbosa told me the GTD that you can buy
is actually a faster car, maybe a better car than
(26:43):
the GT three Because of the bop thing that you
were talking about right. So that's awesome. I could watch
these Mustangs maybe win at Lament, and then I could
go if I had, however much it is three hundred
fifty thousand dollars and buy one.
Speaker 1 (26:56):
Yes, agreed. Also I think the GT honestly, the GT
racing I think is also more exciting. You know, in person,
the cars, the hypercars are more impressive and they sound louder,
but the actual wheel to wheel racing with the GT
three cars. Problem is if you you new cars are
more robust than they used to be. The prototypes are
more robust. But you see you with F one like
(27:17):
you're like that you're having to get out of the
race for that, Like you know, the two cars barely touched,
and all of a sudden they're like there's an angry
like you know, Belgian dude being like I can't do
this anymore, angly German guy. At at Laman, you will
see people mess up cars, especially GT cars. You will
see them. You'll go like that car is never going again,
and then they're gonna limp on three wheels five miles
(27:38):
back to the pits and then a bunch of people
are gonna crush on that top of that car and
then three laps later that car is gonna be out
there again, and it's gonna look like it lost a fight.
It's look at what I'm gonna fight. It looks gonna
look like it really got its butt kicked, but it's
gonna do incredible I do. I'm with you. And also,
there's just so many good cars and so many good
drivers in that class.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
This Homer. If it's not Robin, it's not racing, right,
I mean, can we can't we say that? Yes, I'm
still high on the Dale Earnhardt documentary that I'm obsessed with.
Did you see that?
Speaker 3 (28:06):
I still haven't watched it. I really want to watch it.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
It's heart degree thoughts. Did you see it?
Speaker 1 (28:12):
No, I haven't seen it yet, but all my friends
who are in NASCAR are like, you got to watch it.
It's so good. Like the Problems, there's a Netflix NASCAR
series and it's fine, but it's very sanitized. And this
gets back to the point of like, f one you
care about the drivers. They have made them celebrities, which
is amazing because some of them are so weird.
Speaker 3 (28:28):
Yea, because it's all about the car, like doesn't matter
as much who the driver is in f one. It's
about the Yeah, it's a Errow package.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
Yeah, So like you have, they've created the drama very well,
and they've staged that very well. Nascar. All of the
drama exists, but you have to see it on a delay.
So what I hear from the Dale documentar and you
tell me is that you can see how hard it
is and what's actually going on behind the scenes in
a way that people want to see.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
They's it's amazing and we should say this is a
Ron Howard Brian Glazer production, so of course it's really
well done, and it really it's the thing that I've
seen that most made me realize what these guys are
going through when they're in the car. It really is insane,
(29:12):
the edge that they're walking. And of course we all
know how it ends, so we don't have to get
into that, but like you really really see they're on
a tight rope in front of everyone. It's it's pretty incredible.
Speaker 3 (29:24):
Har does he never know what to do with his hands?
Speaker 2 (29:29):
Did make me want to watch Telladaga Nights again?
Speaker 3 (29:32):
I will say his mustache was impressive. But I'm looking
at a picture of Graham Hill right now, and that
is a thing of beauty on his upper lip. This
is apparently the only guy who's ever won the triple crown,
which is I the Grand Prix, Monico Grand Prix, the
DY five hundred that you mentioned, and twenty four hours
(29:54):
of Lamon. We're going to talk to Jensen Button on Friday.
If he wins at Lamar, then he only has five hundred.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
He only has the hardest one to go.
Speaker 3 (30:05):
Is it the hardest one? Indie?
Speaker 1 (30:07):
Yeah, on an individual so on a team level, Laman
is probably harder. But like, if you get in the
right car in F one, you can win. I mean,
you all know how Monico is, right, if you can
get qualified qualif you win the race, probably Indy five
hundred is definitely the hardest on a human being, And
it's also the thing that a person should not do
after probably a certain age. And I love Jets and
Button he's such a nice guy, but he's probably getting
(30:28):
close to the age where I would not strap myself
into an Indy five hundred car, So.
Speaker 3 (30:33):
It's unlikely that he will pull off the triple crown.
I can't believe only one person has done it, Like
that's pretty It's pretty wild.
Speaker 1 (30:42):
Right, Mario think about it this way. Mario Andretti was
not success. We think of him as like this great
race car driver, which he is and awesome and such
a cool story. He had such a hard time winning
the Indy five hundred, He had such a like even
get like like, think about how hard it was for
Mario Andretti, and think how hard it is for so
many eight drivers throughout history who have tried to win
the Indy five hundred and have not. That's why it's
(31:04):
still I love Laman and Laman is so much fun.
But like Indy five hundred, if you get, if you
can win one thing in your life in motorsports besides
an F one championship, because of all of the money
and then all the things that come with that money,
I would want to get in Indy five undy.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
By the way, walk us through how this actually works.
Say that Hannah and I enter a Mustang GT three.
We have to drive it for twenty four hours to driver.
There is there a third driver, yes, driver, three drivers? Okay,
so you me and Hannah? Yeah, and then do we
(31:37):
do like four every four hours or two hours eight hours?
Can we choose?
Speaker 1 (31:42):
You can sort of choose. And so this gets into
the complicated thing, the complicated and simple. The complicated answer
is that drivers all have to drive certain minimums so
that if you do have a person who is paying
for this program who is not as fast as professional
drivers for no reason other than they are not professional
race car drivers, then you want them to probably drive
the limited amount of time, the most limited amount of time.
(32:04):
But that means there's a minimum number of stints. They
can't just go out and drive for six hours and
it's like I'm done, Like you know, there have to
be a certain number of stints. They have to run
a certain minimum time. Also, the problem isn't actually minimums there,
it's maximums.
Speaker 2 (32:15):
Right.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
If someone's on a heater and they're having a great day,
you want to keep them in the car as long
as possible, but for reasons of competitiveness and also so
that somebody doesn't get really tired and fly out of Lasar,
you know, out of the Mulson Straight at two hundred
miles an hour. They also have to take breaks in between,
so we would split it up. We would probably have
let's say I'm the slow driver of the three, I'm
(32:36):
the one who's paying to be there, which is probably
not the case. But let's say I'm the one paying
to be there, you might have me go first. You
know there's a lot of traffic, it's going to be slow.
My whole goal is to just survive and then just
put in lap times the second driver. Then the two
other drivers might switch back and forth. But if it's
a pro team, you might go with a different strategy.
At the end, you do want your fastest driver. You
almost always want your fastest driver at the end of
(32:59):
the race. But you don't know how that's going to happen.
Because if you have your fastest driver in the middle
of the race, there's a wreck and they're just doing
three laps over thirty minutes slow, that time all counts
and so now you have to then adjust. And so
I will say this. You will sleep during the twenty
four hours. The drivers will sleep on the floor, The mechanics,
the people changing the tires, they will sleep. The only
people who will be awake, other than maybe documentarians, are
(33:21):
the people who are the actual race engineers. They will
sit on those pit boxes for twenty four hours because
they have to know what's happening, because they any small
change in air temperature, in weather, in pits will completely
change the strategy, so they're constantly having to just just
move on the fly. So that's the real thing and
the strategy part of it. It's a little harder to understand,
(33:42):
but I will say little pro tip. If you listen
to Radio Laman, Like there's a thing called Radio Lamon
in your ear set, if you get an ear set
there to listen to it, or you listen to the radio,
they actually do a really great job of providing the
context that the TV does an okay job, but the radio,
I actually think does a really good job.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
I'm looking at the Iron Dames site. By the way, Hannah,
it says Bronze rated drivers, which is like the zero right,
the rich guy or gal in the group have to
drive for a minimum of six hours across the entire
twenty four hour period, and then no driver is allowed
to be behind the wheel for more than four hours
(34:19):
in any six hour period, or more than fourteen hours total.
So that's pretty that's pretty easy to understand.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
Yeah, and easy to do. I mean, we could all
of us could do fourteen hours racing in a car
right now, right, we could just the constant g forces
on your neck, you know, it's funny. They actually have
little little trailers that are kind of off from the paddock,
and they have like a little village of these little campers,
and so the race car drivers will just go back
there and sleep and try it and they'll sleep. It's amazing.
They'll go back and they'll sleep for like two or
three hours and then come back and they'll get a
(34:47):
little pasta with chickens, just like the little pasta with chicken,
get some protein, gets some carbs, and they'll just go
out there. Whereas like even as just a fan, like
at three o'clock in the morning, like you're dead, Which
is also my second piece of advice, besides listening to
Raide Lamon, I was going to ask three o'clock, three
o'clock in the morning, you're getting tired, you got a rally,
don't go to the rave because there is a rave,
an electronic EDM that's happening. Do that early, get that
(35:09):
out of your system early, or do that right at
the end when you're deliriously tired. Go to there's a
little crape place up at tet Rouge, and it's not
hard to get to from like the media center, main
paddock area, wherever you are, and you're just gonna walk
basically kind of walk north, and you're gonna go and
you're gonna sit there and you get a grandmar and
you a cape, crape maybe or any crap, and to
tell a crape, whatever your your flavor of crape is,
(35:30):
and you're just gonna sit there and you're just gonna
eat a crape and you're just gonna see the lights
go by, and you're just gonna hear the cars and
it's gonna be heaven. You're gonna just be rejuvenated. You're
just gonna feel life. And that advice isn't my advice
that originally I did that, but that came from Bill Riley,
who is one of the most successful race car team
managers ever. And he's this big, gruff dude and he
(35:50):
sits on that wall on that pit box all day.
He takes one break and he walks up to go
get a crape and then he comes back. That's in
twenty four hours. It's his only break, and it's enough
plus a lot of coffee to read you himself. And
I did it last time I was there, and it
was it was magical.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
I love that now. Hardgre I want to ask you
about the tramway train system in the city, and I'm
thinking about our listeners who may want to end up
going to the race next year or whatever, Like how
is it getting to the track from the city and
do you have any recommendations about how people should do that?
Speaker 1 (36:21):
Yeah, camp, My recommendation is camp. So yeah, I would camp.
I would park there. Camping is the absolute best way
to experience Laman. You know, I slept in a van,
like it's it's it's the best way to do it.
You can pop in. Actually it's not as inaccessible as
you would think. You can pop in and pop out.
You can take a tram, you can get a cab
or an uber like, it's not it's not terrible. I
(36:42):
will say, you want to get early enough and you
all should do this as well. So the track is
on city streets for a lot of it, and in
between practices and qualifying it's open and there's like the
curbs and everything, so you can go drive on the
actual racetrack as you know you've been there. You can
drive on the race track when the race track is
an in session, and that's like incredible. So like I
(37:03):
would rent a car buy a cheap from the care
floor or whatever, or a motorcycle, buy a cheap sleeping
bag and then just do it that way. That's what
the Brits all do when they go, and it's it's
the best way to experience it because you want to
be there, like no offense to Lamon. Lamon itself is
like a cute town. If you go early for scrutineering
with a called the Passage, you can like go see
all that fun stuff. But like it's just every other
(37:24):
little European town. There's a church, there's eighteen lingerie shops
and only one toy store for some reason when you
trying to get something for Edith and the kids, like
you know, like there's just you know, like like you know,
it's fun, it's fine, but the track is where you
want to be. Except for Friday, they do a parade
around the city and that's that's what's going to.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
We're going to broadcast live at the track during the parade,
so we'll miss that. But luckily we're done with our
work pretty much our work duties by the time the
race starts at four pm on Saturday. Yeah, at we'll
be free but tired.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
I'd be doing a lot of Red Bull.
Speaker 1 (37:59):
It's a red Bull of it.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
I love red Bull. I love myself a red Bull,
I always have.
Speaker 3 (38:05):
I don't. I don't like that any of those energy drinks.
They make me feel like I'm on bad, bad drugs,
you know. So I'm not down to clown and I
don't drink anymore. So I'm not going to be hanging
out with the Brits at the camp.
Speaker 1 (38:19):
Yeah, oh man. And I will say also, when it
gets hot in the afternoon a little there's like a
whole aparaol tent operol spirits of the afternoon. That's also
a recommendation. You could have a great time.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
You can have such good you know Aaron keating at
Cox Automotive.
Speaker 3 (38:32):
Of course.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
Now Aaron said that she got a fish pedicure in
the Outing tint one year. Do you know about this Matt.
Speaker 4 (38:40):
Fish pedicure like p h I s h or f
fish the little gold they eat the calluses like piranhas.
Speaker 1 (38:52):
Yes, much much smaller piranhas.
Speaker 3 (38:54):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (38:54):
And I will say this, you know, like that ain't
happening at Seabring, no offense. I love Sea bring. You
can get an natty light pedicure. You can probably get
a pH fish paddicure pedicure from someone there. Yeah, no,
I mean there's just so many opportunities, and like, let's
be honest, like you either can spend a lot of
money or you can be a schlubby journalist like us,
and as a slubby journalist like us, you get access
to all of that stuff. But even then everyone has
(39:15):
access to the apparaol tent, and the aparaol tent at
like Laguna Seka is not as good as necessarily the
operole tent there. Like like I shouldn't say Alex did
Lgunasak is great at Pocono. Let's say at Pocono you
ain't getting an apparol tent. You ain't getting a operol sprits.
Speaker 3 (39:27):
Dude, tell us what you're doing now? Tell us about
the autopian When when you and I first met, you
were running Jelopnik, which was like an amazing time to
be a car lover. And then things kind of went haywire.
You did some documentaries, you did a lot of TV
and film. What do you what are your focus is
(39:49):
right now? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (39:50):
That was thank you for I love to be able
to plug the autopian. Yeah, Gelot mcdays were really fun.
I tried to hire Hannah. She took this job instead
and made the right choice. Historically, you've definitely made the
right decision given what happened. Yeah. So the Autopian is,
you know, we've been around for about three years. It
was founded by two Chilopnak writers, David Tracy and Jason Twortinski,
and then Bo Bachman Helliott. I think you know, boh
(40:13):
Elliott says, Elliott there, Hanna.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
You know, but everyone calls my real friends call me Elliott.
Speaker 1 (40:17):
There you go. Hopefully I'm a real friend.
Speaker 3 (40:20):
I bought a car from Bo.
Speaker 1 (40:21):
You bought a car, right, and you're an Autopian member
as well, So you're getting all So yeah, I mean
we just we all remember how great websites were like
eight or nine years ago, and because of programmatic advertising,
because of social media, and I don't think it's like
websites have gotten bad. They're not fan hold Cogan and
Hull Cogan. They've gotten harder to read, harder to get to.
(40:41):
Facebook tells you what to read. We were just like,
what if we did a website for people who just
love cars and just want to read about cars and
want to enjoy the company of other car enthusiasts and
want to do it on a site that will actually
load on their phone before like sixteen pop up bads
load up on their phone. And so we're trying it.
So remember supported, we do have advertising, but if you
become a member, there's no advertising anymore. And that's done
(41:02):
really well for us, and you know, it's it's launching
a media company in the twenty twenties sounded like an
insane idea, and it was an insane idea, but you know,
we've hoped proven that you can build a sustainable enterprise
if you put the reader first and you don't try
to like just say like, let's do an SEO garbage
play and make everything an arbitrage for Facebook traffic. Like
if you're just like, what if we wrote good stories
(41:24):
that people like and we wrote about weird cars that
people like, maybe we could be successful. And it's we're
not gonna have four hundred million readers, probably, but I
don't care. The readers we have. I love them, and
they're growing every month, and that's where we want to be.
Speaker 3 (41:34):
Did you do like an MBA or something, because you know,
all of these high falutin business terms, and but you're
just a car fanboy at heart.
Speaker 1 (41:43):
So there's a large part of me that wishes I
didn't know any of this. The problem is is that
to survive as a journalist these days, you know, unless
you're enormously talented like the two of you, if you're
the rest of us, then you have to understand all
this stuff if you want to survive, because you're otherwise.
If you don't learn this stuff, you're kind of at
the behest and at the whim of everyone else. And
I've been through enough layoffs, I've been through enough terrible
(42:06):
times in media that we basically just decided, let's take
control of it ourselves. So we had to learn all
this stuff, and we made lots of mistakes. We're probably
still doing a lot of stuff wrong, but we just
had to learn it. And so, yeah, no, do I
wish I knew what an RPM CPM do? I wish
I knew what agentic AI was. No, I wish I
knew none of that stuff, But somebody has to. So
it's me cool.
Speaker 2 (42:26):
I love it and I respect that completely. And I
also love that you have a piece about Sabrina Carpenter
on the front page of the autopian.
Speaker 1 (42:35):
She's so good and also she loves the weird cars
like her and her artistic contribute collaborators. I don't know,
but like she's got an eye for like the very
I mean, you've gotta you gotta see three Corvette, right, yeah, yes,
I do.
Speaker 3 (42:48):
You're cool. She has more than one C three Corvette.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
Thanks, criminally underrated. I will say it till the day
I A.
Speaker 1 (42:56):
I think Blaze is cool again. I mean she's like
the queen of Blaze, like that that whole video. The
new video is Almalay's cars. But actually it makes sense
both from a just time shifts, so not everyone wants
sixties cars anymore and seventies cars are bad. But like,
if you just want to go cruise, do you care
that it has a smog choked V eight? Like does
it matter to you that your C three does not
have five hundred horse power?
Speaker 2 (43:15):
No?
Speaker 1 (43:15):
It looks awesome, You look awesome in it? Who cares?
Speaker 3 (43:18):
Sabrina Carpenter is a pop music person or who is that?
Speaker 2 (43:23):
Matt? I'll send you the video.
Speaker 3 (43:25):
Is she related to the Carpenters?
Speaker 2 (43:28):
I don't think so.
Speaker 3 (43:29):
Like the very depressing yeah, seventies.
Speaker 2 (43:32):
Bachild Google Sabrina Carpenter Manchild and you'll see a video
with cool cool cars on it.
Speaker 3 (43:39):
All right. One other thing, aside from Lament, and aside
from the autopian that I wanted to talk to you about,
was all this crazy autocross stuff that you do. Because
you're always asking me to go up to Limerock, which
is awesome, but you're driving the oddest cars. A lot
of time on track. You were in an M five
station wagon, which is like a luxury sedan made bigger.
(44:01):
And why that? Why choose that car for autocross?
Speaker 1 (44:05):
So some of that was just timing. We had the car. Also,
if BMW asks for tire reasons, we barely put it
on the track. It was only for like a hot
minute because we said we would not we would leave
the tires.
Speaker 3 (44:14):
Oh should we cut this cart down?
Speaker 1 (44:15):
No, No, it's fine, it's fine, and we had a portion.
Speaker 2 (44:18):
No.
Speaker 1 (44:18):
Actually, I want to bring a minivan next. Look, I
am not going to be at Laman. I am not
a great driver, it is I As you know, these
cars have gotten so fast that finding the limit of
the car now is very scary. That's why a Miata
is so much fun, because you can find the limit
of a Miata really fun. I mean, you're your challenger right,
like you're just there's so much power, you're traction limited.
(44:39):
Like you know where the edge of that car is
because you can find it by just pushing down the
skinny pedal and you're there.
Speaker 3 (44:43):
I'm always close to the edge of that car.
Speaker 1 (44:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (44:46):
No, but it makes it fun at forty five right
right now, I'm driving the Carrera GTS T hybrid, which
is amazing, right, but you have to be triple digits
before it's kind of exciting, and then you're already in trouble.
Speaker 1 (45:01):
You know what car's fast at twenty miles an hour
around a racetrack, Yata Toyota, Siena Toyota.
Speaker 2 (45:08):
Yeah, there you go.
Speaker 1 (45:09):
So that's fun. Like I liked it. I just like
to have fun with cars, and fun with cars is
doing things that are not Like, if you want to
go read about how the latest Corvette does around a
racetrack roadent track, is going to do a better job
than I'm probably gonna do if you want to, but
they're not going to necessarily. Actually they did once. That
sounds surely entirely true, but like it's more fun. It's
just more fun to slow. Car fast is faster than
fast car slow if you are not racing at them
(45:31):
on this weekend. That's just the reality.
Speaker 2 (45:34):
That's the headline of this entire conversation.
Speaker 3 (45:37):
All right, Hannah, you have to run and catch your flight.
Speaker 2 (45:40):
Yes, Matt haartegree. Thank you for joining us. Come back
and talk to us more. This was really great. We
really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (45:47):
Bom voyage. Enjoy, Enjoy a crepe for me, take a picture,
Send me a picture I want to put on Instagram.
Speaker 3 (45:53):
Okay, all right, well, Hannah's got to run and catch
her flight. I am going to run and catch my flight.
So I guess we'll end it here, but we will
probably be broadcasting our next episode could be from Lament.
Speaker 2 (46:08):
It might be also we have a very big guest
next week that all of my girlfriends are obsessed with.
Speaker 3 (46:15):
Oh yeah, the producer. Yes, catch us next time with Total.
Speaker 1 (46:21):
It would be such a good episode. You have to
listen to the episode, Michael, it'd be so great.
Speaker 3 (46:29):
That's Schwartz and I love. All right, that's it. I'm
Matt Miller and
Speaker 2 (46:33):
I'm Hannah Elliott, and this is Bloomberg
Hosts And Creators
Hannah Elliott
Matt Miller
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