May 8, 2025 • 13 mins
Bill Gates, founder of the The Gates Foundation plans to give away $200 billion over the next 20 years before shutting down entirely in 2045, marking a new deadline for one of history’s largest and most influential charities. He is joined by Bloomberg's Francine Lacqua.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Bill Gates, thank you so much for joining us big
news today. The Gates Foundation will spend over two hundred
billion dollars over the next twenty years. It'll close in
twenty forty five, and you'll give away virtually all of
your wealth to save and improve lives around the world.
Is that a consequence of Trump policies and Doge?
Speaker 3 (00:23):
No, this is a decision I've been thinking about for
several years. You know, we're celebrating our twenty fifth annivers three.
The results we've had from our giving, particularly and global
health have been far beyond what I expected, cutting childhood
deaths from over ten million a year down under five million.
(00:44):
So it's doubling down on what's worked well. And that's
despite the fact that in the near term things may
go backwards because of these funding cuts.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
The decision means you'll probably see the impact of your
gifts in your lifetime. Was that a motivation for.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
You, Well, I think the Gage Foundation's got an incredible
team of people and being able to give them as
much resources as possible during this key period and actually.
Speaker 1 (01:17):
Finish off malaria.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
So so nobody has to think about that finish off polio.
So it's a done thing. You know, it's thrilling that
we can make more progress in the next twenty years
than even what we've done so far. And so it's
a vote of confidence. And you know, I know that
(01:39):
there'll be more rich people in the future who can
take whatever we haven't finished and take that on.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
How are you addressing the pullback in USAIDS and other
government development aid.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Well, the Foundation will be a strong voice in how
impactful that generosity has been. The United States, starting with
President Bush in the year two thousand, supported HIV medicine
so that people wouldn't die, and that's been a bipartisan thing.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
It's made a huge difference. The Congress is it's doing.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
The next budget will decide whether the US supports polio
eradication or vaccines for the children in the poorest countries.
It's less than one percent to the US budget, and
so I'm hoping that we can keep that money in
place or only have modest reductions, not the gigantic cut
(02:44):
that some people are proposing.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
You had some pretty strong words for Elon Musk, saying
he's involved in the depths of the world's poorest children.
Do you think this withdrawal of government support is permanent, Well.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
There's no doubt at the USAID payment cutoffs that Elon
drove have resulted in dramatic increase in childhood death and
children that would have been protected from getting HIV from
their mothers during birth that money has been cut off.
(03:19):
In fact, they attacked a grant that was actually in
gozam Mozambique for being up in Gaza in the Middle East,
but in fact it was hide prevention money that was
cut off. And so we need to look at how
(03:42):
this money represents the moral leadership of the US and
the relationships we get. And it's not only to save lives,
it's to stabilize these countries. It's to have health systems
that will catch potential pandemics early and avoid them coming
to the United States. So there's a lot of great
reasons this less than one percent of the budget shouldn't
(04:05):
be cut off.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Have you had any conversation with any Trump officials about this.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
I've had two meetings with President Trump, and the main
focus of those conversations where the great work the US
is done on HID and how we can do even
better with that drive innovations, including a HIV cure. I
talked about the need for the US to stay in Polio,
that they're a critical partner, and so you know, I
(04:36):
think when push comes to shove, this money should be maintained,
although the final word on that will come from the Congress.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
What has that dialogue looked like from the other side?
And have you met with Elon musk I.
Speaker 3 (04:53):
Haven't met with Elon about this. I mean, you know,
in terms of usc I D I'm out in Nigeria
and Democratic Republic of Congo and meeting the amazing people
who did that work for USAID and understanding the impact
that it has. So you know, that's my hands on
focuses is Global Hull. Elon has done great private sector work,
(05:19):
but I've never talked to him about what the cuts
that he drove on in USAID.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
Do you want to have you talked him about anything
else recently?
Speaker 3 (05:32):
Well, he's not actively engaged now, so the decisions will
be people like Secretary Rubio, who was in Africa around
twenty twelve and saw the amazing work that Pep Park
did there, and so I hope he'll be a voice
for maintaining this money. You know, in the US, you
(05:54):
have people like Rotary International who've been in the polio
eradication fight the very beginning, and you know, I think
they'll support the US stayin because the US is an
absolutely necessary participant in order for US to finish that eradication.
So a lot of voices will come in to this budget,
(06:18):
including the global health miracle that the US has been
part of.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Given where we are, how are you now prioritizing programs
or countries or diseases?
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Well, the Gates Foundation spends about an equal amount on
discovery new tools like a TV vaccine or way to
help newborns be able to breed so they survive, or
avoiding mothers bleeding to death by using very cheap drugs
(06:53):
only a couple of dollars.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
So it's kind of mind.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
Blowing the innovation pipeline that we have, including what's coming
where we use AI not just for the discovery, but
also to give medical advice or agricultural advice or help
and education. So we're doubling down by spending all the
(07:17):
money in the next twenty years because of the impact
that's possible. We're not able to match the money that
the US could cut.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Here.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
You know, they're just they have more resources than a
single individual.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
But if you look, there's also climate change. So is
there a single topic that your foundation is most concerned
about right now?
Speaker 3 (07:45):
Well, our biggest area funding is poli eradication, followed by HIV,
malaria nutrition. We basically follow the numbers where there's the
most burden, that's where we go. Sadly, these diseases aren't
market driven. That is that people who have them are
(08:06):
so poor that you know, with malaria, when we gave
our first thirty million, we became the biggest funder of
reducing malaria deaths, and you know, so it's really driven
by this stuff that philanthropy and government aid budgets are
(08:29):
absolutely critical to lifting these countries up, helping them become
self sufficient and having strong health systems there to drive
stability and growth.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
The Giving Pledge is also nearing a milestone anniversary. But
pledgers are not legally obligated actually to give anything. It's
more of a good faith pact. So how do you
measure its impact?
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Well, I would never want to take credit for anybody
else's philanthropy.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
The fact that we've gotten.
Speaker 3 (09:02):
Over two hundred and forty people to join in to
the commitment to give.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
The majority of their wealth the way. I do think
it's setting an expectation for everyone.
Speaker 3 (09:13):
Who's very rich to look at being very philanthropic. You know,
in that pledge, we have amazing givers like Michael Bloomberg,
Chris Vahn, and many others, and we learn from each other,
we share.
Speaker 1 (09:29):
Best practices, We've talked about things that have.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Not worked, and so we want to improve the quality
and quantity of philanthropy.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
And I see that happening all over.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
The world, mister Gate. I also wanted to ask you
about clean energy and the green transition. China was probably
already winning the race to develop low carbon economy and
energy sources of the future. With the US's new direction
under Trump, has America actually squandered whatever slim chance it
had of catching up. We're being competitive in that space.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
Well.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
Climate change involves a lot of innovation. We have to
make products that are clean that eventually cost less than
the dirty weight's done today. So that includes, of course
making electricity. That is one area where I think this
administration will be a stronger supporter of nuclear fission and
(10:23):
fusion than what.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
We've had before. I do worry that.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
Some of the key tax credits for new technologies like
carbon capture and hydrogen and storage.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
That those could be eliminated.
Speaker 3 (10:42):
But when my group that drives Climb Innovation Breakthrough Energy
went out to find the best companies, almost ninety percent
of those are here in the United States and they've
gotten government support. Some of that's maybe canceled, so it
could be tough for them.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
But.
Speaker 3 (11:03):
US innovation will play an incredible role in helping US
avoid climate change.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
Trump's administration is also discussing we're sending tax exempt status
for nonprofits or foundations, particularly those focused on climate or
social justice. What would be the consequence is actually of.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
That, Well, it's hard to speculate what might happen.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
The tax code is created by Congress and you're actually
allowed to get money to save children's lives. It's kind
of an amazing thing, you know, as opposed to buy
a big boat. You can buy vaccines, you can buy bednets,
and you know, that's a miracle of the economic freedom
that the US stands for.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
I was going to ask you, how do you balance
continuing to do this work with avoids, you know, whilst
at the same time avoiding being targeted or pursued by
the Trump administration for things that are now seen as
politically unacceptable.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
Well, I'm hopeful that help even when you're helping women,
and you're helping people in Africa, and you're helping people
who've got made IV I hope that's.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
Not a political thing.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
I hope that's you know, sort of the golden rule
that is part of all religion, that we should treat
others like we'd like to be treated ourselves. And you know,
I'm hopeful that people will go out and see this work.
You know, once you do, you can't help but stay
involved in it. So you know, this is about the
(12:44):
US value system, and we've been a leader both are
philanthropists and our government.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
I hate to see.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
That go away, mister Gates. Just one final question, because
you know there's a lot going on in the economy
on tariffs, trade, and are you know, on the one hand,
do you think investors are diluting themselves and saying, actually,
as long as we know what terrors we're getting, will
be okay. And also, twenty years ago you joined Warren
Buffett and predicting the dollar's decline. Warren Buffett this year
(13:14):
wondered about the dollar. What do you think about the
dollar today.
Speaker 3 (13:19):
Well, I'm not a macroeconomics expert. I do think we're
going to experience a lot of turmoil because the uncertainty
that we have now, including what's going on with tariffs,
you know.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
I think because of things like AI advances, that overall
will have we will have
Speaker 3 (13:44):
Economic growth, and that we should make sure that even
the ports in the world are benefiting from that.
Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Bill Gates, thank you so much for joining us big
news today. The Gates Foundation will spend over two hundred
billion dollars over the next twenty years. It'll close in
twenty forty five, and you'll give away virtually all of
your wealth to save and improve lives around the world.
Is that a consequence of Trump policies and Doge?
Speaker 3 (00:23):
No, this is a decision I've been thinking about for
several years. You know, we're celebrating our twenty fifth annivers three.
The results we've had from our giving, particularly and global
health have been far beyond what I expected, cutting childhood
deaths from over ten million a year down under five million.
(00:44):
So it's doubling down on what's worked well. And that's
despite the fact that in the near term things may
go backwards because of these funding cuts.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
The decision means you'll probably see the impact of your
gifts in your lifetime. Was that a motivation for.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
You, Well, I think the Gage Foundation's got an incredible
team of people and being able to give them as
much resources as possible during this key period and actually.
Speaker 1 (01:17):
Finish off malaria.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
So so nobody has to think about that finish off polio.
So it's a done thing. You know, it's thrilling that
we can make more progress in the next twenty years
than even what we've done so far. And so it's
a vote of confidence. And you know, I know that
(01:39):
there'll be more rich people in the future who can
take whatever we haven't finished and take that on.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
How are you addressing the pullback in USAIDS and other
government development aid.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Well, the Foundation will be a strong voice in how
impactful that generosity has been. The United States, starting with
President Bush in the year two thousand, supported HIV medicine
so that people wouldn't die, and that's been a bipartisan thing.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
It's made a huge difference. The Congress is it's doing.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
The next budget will decide whether the US supports polio
eradication or vaccines for the children in the poorest countries.
It's less than one percent to the US budget, and
so I'm hoping that we can keep that money in
place or only have modest reductions, not the gigantic cut
(02:44):
that some people are proposing.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
You had some pretty strong words for Elon Musk, saying
he's involved in the depths of the world's poorest children.
Do you think this withdrawal of government support is permanent, Well.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
There's no doubt at the USAID payment cutoffs that Elon
drove have resulted in dramatic increase in childhood death and
children that would have been protected from getting HIV from
their mothers during birth that money has been cut off.
(03:19):
In fact, they attacked a grant that was actually in
gozam Mozambique for being up in Gaza in the Middle East,
but in fact it was hide prevention money that was
cut off. And so we need to look at how
(03:42):
this money represents the moral leadership of the US and
the relationships we get. And it's not only to save lives,
it's to stabilize these countries. It's to have health systems
that will catch potential pandemics early and avoid them coming
to the United States. So there's a lot of great
reasons this less than one percent of the budget shouldn't
(04:05):
be cut off.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Have you had any conversation with any Trump officials about this.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
I've had two meetings with President Trump, and the main
focus of those conversations where the great work the US
is done on HID and how we can do even
better with that drive innovations, including a HIV cure. I
talked about the need for the US to stay in Polio,
that they're a critical partner, and so you know, I
(04:36):
think when push comes to shove, this money should be maintained,
although the final word on that will come from the Congress.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
What has that dialogue looked like from the other side?
And have you met with Elon musk I.
Speaker 3 (04:53):
Haven't met with Elon about this. I mean, you know,
in terms of usc I D I'm out in Nigeria
and Democratic Republic of Congo and meeting the amazing people
who did that work for USAID and understanding the impact
that it has. So you know, that's my hands on
focuses is Global Hull. Elon has done great private sector work,
(05:19):
but I've never talked to him about what the cuts
that he drove on in USAID.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
Do you want to have you talked him about anything
else recently?
Speaker 3 (05:32):
Well, he's not actively engaged now, so the decisions will
be people like Secretary Rubio, who was in Africa around
twenty twelve and saw the amazing work that Pep Park
did there, and so I hope he'll be a voice
for maintaining this money. You know, in the US, you
(05:54):
have people like Rotary International who've been in the polio
eradication fight the very beginning, and you know, I think
they'll support the US stayin because the US is an
absolutely necessary participant in order for US to finish that eradication.
So a lot of voices will come in to this budget,
(06:18):
including the global health miracle that the US has been
part of.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Given where we are, how are you now prioritizing programs
or countries or diseases?
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Well, the Gates Foundation spends about an equal amount on
discovery new tools like a TV vaccine or way to
help newborns be able to breed so they survive, or
avoiding mothers bleeding to death by using very cheap drugs
(06:53):
only a couple of dollars.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
So it's kind of mind.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
Blowing the innovation pipeline that we have, including what's coming
where we use AI not just for the discovery, but
also to give medical advice or agricultural advice or help
and education. So we're doubling down by spending all the
(07:17):
money in the next twenty years because of the impact
that's possible. We're not able to match the money that
the US could cut.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Here.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
You know, they're just they have more resources than a
single individual.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
But if you look, there's also climate change. So is
there a single topic that your foundation is most concerned
about right now?
Speaker 3 (07:45):
Well, our biggest area funding is poli eradication, followed by HIV,
malaria nutrition. We basically follow the numbers where there's the
most burden, that's where we go. Sadly, these diseases aren't
market driven. That is that people who have them are
(08:06):
so poor that you know, with malaria, when we gave
our first thirty million, we became the biggest funder of
reducing malaria deaths, and you know, so it's really driven
by this stuff that philanthropy and government aid budgets are
(08:29):
absolutely critical to lifting these countries up, helping them become
self sufficient and having strong health systems there to drive
stability and growth.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
The Giving Pledge is also nearing a milestone anniversary. But
pledgers are not legally obligated actually to give anything. It's
more of a good faith pact. So how do you
measure its impact?
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Well, I would never want to take credit for anybody
else's philanthropy.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
The fact that we've gotten.
Speaker 3 (09:02):
Over two hundred and forty people to join in to
the commitment to give.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
The majority of their wealth the way. I do think
it's setting an expectation for everyone.
Speaker 3 (09:13):
Who's very rich to look at being very philanthropic. You know,
in that pledge, we have amazing givers like Michael Bloomberg,
Chris Vahn, and many others, and we learn from each other,
we share.
Speaker 1 (09:29):
Best practices, We've talked about things that have.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Not worked, and so we want to improve the quality
and quantity of philanthropy.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
And I see that happening all over.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
The world, mister Gate. I also wanted to ask you
about clean energy and the green transition. China was probably
already winning the race to develop low carbon economy and
energy sources of the future. With the US's new direction
under Trump, has America actually squandered whatever slim chance it
had of catching up. We're being competitive in that space.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
Well.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
Climate change involves a lot of innovation. We have to
make products that are clean that eventually cost less than
the dirty weight's done today. So that includes, of course
making electricity. That is one area where I think this
administration will be a stronger supporter of nuclear fission and
(10:23):
fusion than what.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
We've had before. I do worry that.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
Some of the key tax credits for new technologies like
carbon capture and hydrogen and storage.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
That those could be eliminated.
Speaker 3 (10:42):
But when my group that drives Climb Innovation Breakthrough Energy
went out to find the best companies, almost ninety percent
of those are here in the United States and they've
gotten government support. Some of that's maybe canceled, so it
could be tough for them.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
But.
Speaker 3 (11:03):
US innovation will play an incredible role in helping US
avoid climate change.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
Trump's administration is also discussing we're sending tax exempt status
for nonprofits or foundations, particularly those focused on climate or
social justice. What would be the consequence is actually of.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
That, Well, it's hard to speculate what might happen.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
The tax code is created by Congress and you're actually
allowed to get money to save children's lives. It's kind
of an amazing thing, you know, as opposed to buy
a big boat. You can buy vaccines, you can buy bednets,
and you know, that's a miracle of the economic freedom
that the US stands for.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
I was going to ask you, how do you balance
continuing to do this work with avoids, you know, whilst
at the same time avoiding being targeted or pursued by
the Trump administration for things that are now seen as
politically unacceptable.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
Well, I'm hopeful that help even when you're helping women,
and you're helping people in Africa, and you're helping people
who've got made IV I hope that's.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
Not a political thing.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
I hope that's you know, sort of the golden rule
that is part of all religion, that we should treat
others like we'd like to be treated ourselves. And you know,
I'm hopeful that people will go out and see this work.
You know, once you do, you can't help but stay
involved in it. So you know, this is about the
(12:44):
US value system, and we've been a leader both are
philanthropists and our government.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
I hate to see.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
That go away, mister Gates. Just one final question, because
you know there's a lot going on in the economy
on tariffs, trade, and are you know, on the one hand,
do you think investors are diluting themselves and saying, actually,
as long as we know what terrors we're getting, will
be okay. And also, twenty years ago you joined Warren
Buffett and predicting the dollar's decline. Warren Buffett this year
(13:14):
wondered about the dollar. What do you think about the
dollar today.
Speaker 3 (13:19):
Well, I'm not a macroeconomics expert. I do think we're
going to experience a lot of turmoil because the uncertainty
that we have now, including what's going on with tariffs,
you know.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
I think because of things like AI advances, that overall
will have we will have
Speaker 3 (13:44):
Economic growth, and that we should make sure that even
the ports in the world are benefiting from that.
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