June 12, 2025 • 13 mins
Czech President, Petr Pavel, on the Europe's security and securing peace in Ukraine. He said European nations can't secure peace without American help, but the continent needs more time and realistic goals. He speaks with Bloomberg's Kriti Gupta in Prague.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Bloomberg, Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Czech Republic prism Petter Povel says he believes his country
will adot the Euro, but it will take some time.
He spoke exclusively to Bloomberg's critique dub a subject that
has been a point of contention here in the Czech Republic,
which is, of course, the Euro and the potential adoption
of the Euro. You've talked about this and reopened the debate,
(00:29):
and I'm curious where you think that debate is going.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
This debate has become truly emotional and irrational. My simple
argument to our population is that we are dependent on
your zone, if you like it or not, most of
our trade is with the euro Zone, and in that sense,
it doesn't make too much sense. When Eurozone discusses future
(00:58):
steps and rules, we are behind the door. The sentiments
are mostly negative because people were told by a number
of politicians that by adopting Euro they will become poorer
and everything will be more expensive and we will have
no freedom and autonomy to adjust the courses. In reality,
(01:22):
the room for adjusting courses with our own currency is
so narrow that it really doesn't make too much benefit.
So sooner or later. I believe that rational reasons will
bring us to the adoption of Europe, but it will
take some time.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
How can you sway public opinion from your perch.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
I would say by pointing to examples of countries which
are often visited by our citizens, like Slovakia. Now Bulgaria
will also become a country of herosone. And of course
we look at these countries as some that followed the
(02:06):
same destiny as we did in the past, and I
believe if they are successful in adopting euro then why
shouldn't do we.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
A lot of the strength of the euro at the moment,
unprecedented strength through the momentum in the last couple of months,
has come as a reaction function to two key factors,
and that is perhaps policy decisions coming out of the
United States and also a massive fiscal impulse from from
Germany and other countries. As across Europe, where do you
feel like perhaps the risk is largest from the west
(02:39):
or from the east.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
They are different these pressures. On the one hand, from
the East we face a tremendous security pressure, while from
the West special especially from the United States, it's more
political financial. Both of these pressures should lead us to
an understanding that we shouldn't behave as a spoiled child,
(03:07):
that we have to take care about ourselves economically, politically, diplomatically,
and even military wise. And in that sense, I feel
a growing understanding that Europe has to take its own
destiny to our own hands and to develop our own
(03:29):
capacities for defense, to develop a further common market, make
it more efficient and flexible so that we can face
pressures from any side, and at the same time that
Europeans should become our own zone of influence.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
The Czech Republic has been crucial in some of that
aid that you're referencing in terms of Ukraine, specifically in
the field of ammunition and coordinating some of that. Can
you talk us about the goals there and what that
procurement plan basically looks like into going into this year
but also into twenty twenty six.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
The primary reason for initiating this activity to provide Ukraine
with ammunition was a feeling of frustration that we cannot
give them more from our own resources. But we knew
where this ammunition was to be found, and we found
(04:29):
the ways and procedures how to deliver it, and we
got in tounship with partners who were willing to provide
financial resources and have an oversight of the overall activity.
And in the meantime we have developed a procedure with
the involvement of number of allies who are providing significant resources,
(04:51):
we can ensure a study flow of so much needed
ammunition to Ukraine. This year, we will't be able to
guarante the one point eight million rounds of large caliber
ammunition in average at about eighty thousand rounds one fifty
five caliber every month, which gives Ukraine a sense of
(05:14):
stability and guarantee, and of course it gives them clear
parameters for planning. And we will continue continue that not
only through this year, but we are also ready to
continue next year if necessary.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
So it suffice to say that there is a possibility
this war extends into into twenty twenty six, despite efforts
from around the world to find a peaceful solution. Talk
to us about what a peaceful solution looks like.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
I think many of us wish Ukraine in the best
that means full restoration of their territory, integrity and sovereignty.
But we are also realistic and we see that it
will not be possible in full. And that's why we
understand that part of the territory will be for some
(06:05):
time temporarily occupied by Russia and that there will be
necessary concession to be made by Ukraine. But at the
same time, now I mean all the countries supporting Ukraine,
we should all collectively strive for the best possible result
for Ukraine that will be as just for Ukraine as possible,
(06:28):
recognizing that Russia is an aggressor and Ukraine is a victim,
and aggressor shouldn't be rewarded for his aggression. And that's
why we shouldn't allow the situation where Russia would clearly
declare the victory by imposing all other conditions and Ukraine
(06:51):
losing almost everything.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Is a peaceful solution something that can be found without
the support of the United States. Is this something that
you're leaders can achieve.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
I don't think so. Russia is a country that respects
power in all senses of definition, and they see the
power in the United States, not in Europe. And President
put In clearly shows that he is only ready to
(07:25):
talk to his counterpart in the United States, regardless what
European leaders think. I believe that in that sense, we
have to coordinate very closely with the United States because
it is also in their interest not to let Russia
prevail in this conflict, because otherwise they would see it
(07:47):
as a confirmation of their approach to foreign policy, to
their security requirements, and sooner or later it will turn
against the interests of the United States. That's why we
are trying to coordinate as much as possible with the
United States. Our views make our American alliance understanding the
(08:12):
context in which this war isn't going and what different
outcomes would mean for United States as well as for
Europe and the world. Right now, I believe there are
two major avenues how to push Russia to the table.
(08:34):
One is obviously on the battlefield, supporting Ukraine militarily and
financially to hold the territory and hold the defense strong
to create conditions for peace negotiations that will be favorable
for Ukraine. And on the other hand, and it's even
stronger in my view, it's economic and financial pressure on
(08:58):
Russia to sit to the table because right now they
are not showing any willingness to negotiate the piece because
they still see that they can prevailer.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
In the interim. There has been a big conversation, of course,
about defense spending and ramping it up across the European continent,
perhaps creating or filling some of the gap that the
United States has pulled out of ours astempting to pull
out it. When it comes to NATO spending, I am
curious though, how long that process will take. A defense
ramp up, as you know from your former percheon NATO
can take years. What can the EU and NATO do
(09:31):
within the next couple of months to affect the outcome.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Well, first, we will have to preserve unity a NATO
summit in the Haguen couple of weeks to keep American
allies engaged in Europe both politically and militarily. And we
all understand that European allies will have to take a
(09:58):
much greater responsibility for our own defense. But this transition,
the handover of responsibility from the United States and more
to Europeans, will require some time. And even if we
adopt the decision to increase significantly defense pending, even if
(10:19):
we apply all the measures of flexibility and efficiency, it
will really take years to replace some of US strategic
enablers such as strategic intelligence, communications, logistics, and some others,
(10:40):
and of course, if we don't want any security gap
to be created in Europe, we will have to seriously
negotiate with our American allies about our good transition plan.
What is realistic to achieve? I understand that United States
(11:01):
will not try to exert pressure on Europeans to do
it faster, but even if we do our best, we
will not be able to do it in just a
couple of months or or just units of years. Uh.
Some like strategic intelligence and targeting will may easily try
(11:26):
to take a decade to achieve that capability. But I
truly believe that we can achieve good results if we
have a good and coordinated plan.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
A final question to you, as you say that you
will be attending that NATO summit, there are reports that
Donald Trump will be attending as well. What do you
expect to hear from President of the United States.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
I expect continuation of his approach from his first term,
which I witnessed in person, uh, and it's even stronger
now during his second term. He will be pushing on
European allies and also on Canada to do more and faster.
(12:12):
So we can expect the push for commitment to defense
spending at five percent, we can expect some short timelines
for taking over this responsibility. We can also expect more
commitments from European allies in terms of support to Ukraine.
(12:34):
But I personally don't expect any negative surprise because I
believe that the agenda of the summit is deliberately kept
to a minimum extent so that we have an agreement.
(12:55):
And that's that's why I believe that the summit will
nar iterate unity of NATO, commitment of the United States
to Article five and a commitment of all of US
to increase defense spending and overall capability for defense.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
We look forward to seeing what that NATO Summit brings present.
Thank you so much for your time, a pleasure to
have this conversation.
Speaker 1 (13:20):
Thank you
Bloomberg, Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Czech Republic prism Petter Povel says he believes his country
will adot the Euro, but it will take some time.
He spoke exclusively to Bloomberg's critique dub a subject that
has been a point of contention here in the Czech Republic,
which is, of course, the Euro and the potential adoption
of the Euro. You've talked about this and reopened the debate,
(00:29):
and I'm curious where you think that debate is going.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
This debate has become truly emotional and irrational. My simple
argument to our population is that we are dependent on
your zone, if you like it or not, most of
our trade is with the euro Zone, and in that sense,
it doesn't make too much sense. When Eurozone discusses future
(00:58):
steps and rules, we are behind the door. The sentiments
are mostly negative because people were told by a number
of politicians that by adopting Euro they will become poorer
and everything will be more expensive and we will have
no freedom and autonomy to adjust the courses. In reality,
(01:22):
the room for adjusting courses with our own currency is
so narrow that it really doesn't make too much benefit.
So sooner or later. I believe that rational reasons will
bring us to the adoption of Europe, but it will
take some time.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
How can you sway public opinion from your perch.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
I would say by pointing to examples of countries which
are often visited by our citizens, like Slovakia. Now Bulgaria
will also become a country of herosone. And of course
we look at these countries as some that followed the
(02:06):
same destiny as we did in the past, and I
believe if they are successful in adopting euro then why
shouldn't do we.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
A lot of the strength of the euro at the moment,
unprecedented strength through the momentum in the last couple of months,
has come as a reaction function to two key factors,
and that is perhaps policy decisions coming out of the
United States and also a massive fiscal impulse from from
Germany and other countries. As across Europe, where do you
feel like perhaps the risk is largest from the west
(02:39):
or from the east.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
They are different these pressures. On the one hand, from
the East we face a tremendous security pressure, while from
the West special especially from the United States, it's more
political financial. Both of these pressures should lead us to
an understanding that we shouldn't behave as a spoiled child,
(03:07):
that we have to take care about ourselves economically, politically, diplomatically,
and even military wise. And in that sense, I feel
a growing understanding that Europe has to take its own
destiny to our own hands and to develop our own
(03:29):
capacities for defense, to develop a further common market, make
it more efficient and flexible so that we can face
pressures from any side, and at the same time that
Europeans should become our own zone of influence.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
The Czech Republic has been crucial in some of that
aid that you're referencing in terms of Ukraine, specifically in
the field of ammunition and coordinating some of that. Can
you talk us about the goals there and what that
procurement plan basically looks like into going into this year
but also into twenty twenty six.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
The primary reason for initiating this activity to provide Ukraine
with ammunition was a feeling of frustration that we cannot
give them more from our own resources. But we knew
where this ammunition was to be found, and we found
(04:29):
the ways and procedures how to deliver it, and we
got in tounship with partners who were willing to provide
financial resources and have an oversight of the overall activity.
And in the meantime we have developed a procedure with
the involvement of number of allies who are providing significant resources,
(04:51):
we can ensure a study flow of so much needed
ammunition to Ukraine. This year, we will't be able to
guarante the one point eight million rounds of large caliber
ammunition in average at about eighty thousand rounds one fifty
five caliber every month, which gives Ukraine a sense of
(05:14):
stability and guarantee, and of course it gives them clear
parameters for planning. And we will continue continue that not
only through this year, but we are also ready to
continue next year if necessary.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
So it suffice to say that there is a possibility
this war extends into into twenty twenty six, despite efforts
from around the world to find a peaceful solution. Talk
to us about what a peaceful solution looks like.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
I think many of us wish Ukraine in the best
that means full restoration of their territory, integrity and sovereignty.
But we are also realistic and we see that it
will not be possible in full. And that's why we
understand that part of the territory will be for some
(06:05):
time temporarily occupied by Russia and that there will be
necessary concession to be made by Ukraine. But at the
same time, now I mean all the countries supporting Ukraine,
we should all collectively strive for the best possible result
for Ukraine that will be as just for Ukraine as possible,
(06:28):
recognizing that Russia is an aggressor and Ukraine is a victim,
and aggressor shouldn't be rewarded for his aggression. And that's
why we shouldn't allow the situation where Russia would clearly
declare the victory by imposing all other conditions and Ukraine
(06:51):
losing almost everything.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Is a peaceful solution something that can be found without
the support of the United States. Is this something that
you're leaders can achieve.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
I don't think so. Russia is a country that respects
power in all senses of definition, and they see the
power in the United States, not in Europe. And President
put In clearly shows that he is only ready to
(07:25):
talk to his counterpart in the United States, regardless what
European leaders think. I believe that in that sense, we
have to coordinate very closely with the United States because
it is also in their interest not to let Russia
prevail in this conflict, because otherwise they would see it
(07:47):
as a confirmation of their approach to foreign policy, to
their security requirements, and sooner or later it will turn
against the interests of the United States. That's why we
are trying to coordinate as much as possible with the
United States. Our views make our American alliance understanding the
(08:12):
context in which this war isn't going and what different
outcomes would mean for United States as well as for
Europe and the world. Right now, I believe there are
two major avenues how to push Russia to the table.
(08:34):
One is obviously on the battlefield, supporting Ukraine militarily and
financially to hold the territory and hold the defense strong
to create conditions for peace negotiations that will be favorable
for Ukraine. And on the other hand, and it's even
stronger in my view, it's economic and financial pressure on
(08:58):
Russia to sit to the table because right now they
are not showing any willingness to negotiate the piece because
they still see that they can prevailer.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
In the interim. There has been a big conversation, of course,
about defense spending and ramping it up across the European continent,
perhaps creating or filling some of the gap that the
United States has pulled out of ours astempting to pull
out it. When it comes to NATO spending, I am
curious though, how long that process will take. A defense
ramp up, as you know from your former percheon NATO
can take years. What can the EU and NATO do
(09:31):
within the next couple of months to affect the outcome.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Well, first, we will have to preserve unity a NATO
summit in the Haguen couple of weeks to keep American
allies engaged in Europe both politically and militarily. And we
all understand that European allies will have to take a
(09:58):
much greater responsibility for our own defense. But this transition,
the handover of responsibility from the United States and more
to Europeans, will require some time. And even if we
adopt the decision to increase significantly defense pending, even if
(10:19):
we apply all the measures of flexibility and efficiency, it
will really take years to replace some of US strategic
enablers such as strategic intelligence, communications, logistics, and some others,
(10:40):
and of course, if we don't want any security gap
to be created in Europe, we will have to seriously
negotiate with our American allies about our good transition plan.
What is realistic to achieve? I understand that United States
(11:01):
will not try to exert pressure on Europeans to do
it faster, but even if we do our best, we
will not be able to do it in just a
couple of months or or just units of years. Uh.
Some like strategic intelligence and targeting will may easily try
(11:26):
to take a decade to achieve that capability. But I
truly believe that we can achieve good results if we
have a good and coordinated plan.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
A final question to you, as you say that you
will be attending that NATO summit, there are reports that
Donald Trump will be attending as well. What do you
expect to hear from President of the United States.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
I expect continuation of his approach from his first term,
which I witnessed in person, uh, and it's even stronger
now during his second term. He will be pushing on
European allies and also on Canada to do more and faster.
(12:12):
So we can expect the push for commitment to defense
spending at five percent, we can expect some short timelines
for taking over this responsibility. We can also expect more
commitments from European allies in terms of support to Ukraine.
(12:34):
But I personally don't expect any negative surprise because I
believe that the agenda of the summit is deliberately kept
to a minimum extent so that we have an agreement.
(12:55):
And that's that's why I believe that the summit will
nar iterate unity of NATO, commitment of the United States
to Article five and a commitment of all of US
to increase defense spending and overall capability for defense.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
We look forward to seeing what that NATO Summit brings present.
Thank you so much for your time, a pleasure to
have this conversation.
Speaker 1 (13:20):
Thank you
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, And Charlamagne Tha God!
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.