April 2, 2025 • 36 mins
What happens when you’re a top media executive and you choose to leave the corporate world to start a food company… with no prior food experience? What happens when you set out to build a brand based on passion and purpose, not playbooks?
If you’re Gail Becker, you turn cauliflower into Caulipower: the brand that invented a whole new category in an industry that can be a little … crusty. In this episode, Marisa and Steven talk to Gail about what she learned from a life in corporate America - and what she actually had to unlearn - to get past a LOT of “no’s” to unlock that first “yes” as a later-in-life female entrepreneur. Give this a taste!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
Hello, and thanks for joining us on brand New from
the iHeart Podcast Network and brand New Labs. I'm Marissa
Fahlberg and.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
I'm Stephen Wolf Betida. I am zooming in from the
Dominican Republic, Marisa from Santo.
Speaker 1 (00:23):
Domingo, one of my favorite places to vacation, as you know,
but for you, it's a lot more personal than that,
isn't it.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
Yeah, this is home. This is where my mother's from.
My mother was born in Santiago Denos Caritos, which is
in the northern part of the island. By myself, a
ton of family here, and you know, it's just really
important spring break and at least for us in La
and so bringing the kids here, connecting the family, having
some really good food Dominican food is just amazing, but
also just you know, kind of recharging the batteries and
(00:51):
it's fun. But you know, certainly the life of an
entrepreneur you're always on as well, right, But I know
you just took some time as well, now that you're
back in the saddle, where were you.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Yeah, we're definitely in entrepreneur story mode today, So I
think it is interesting that you are so in founder
builder mode right now. But good for you. I know
how hard you're working that you're able to take a
little time. Make sure you're with the family for sure.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Yeah, but you're working hard as well. I mean, where
were you. I just saw it like you were sun
and you had some fun. You took some time.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
This was my first, really first time just going away.
I mean maybe for a weekend or something in the past.
But David and I my husband, David and I said
we're going to go away, just the two of us
because we are as I've mentioned empty nesters for the
first time this year, but it was important for me
to plan that for us. And the interesting lesson was
(01:47):
it was just five days, effectively an extended weekend. It
really worked. It really worked in terms of recharging my battery,
having important couple time because I've been traveling so much.
Nothing makes me happier than the sun and the sea,
the sand. So you have to know what fills your cup.
That fills my cup and it was nice.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Did you have to be on as well or could
you really disconnect it at least a little bit?
Speaker 1 (02:12):
I felt that I didn't totally disconnect, and I feel
like there is an expectation and responsibility as you know,
a senior executive, but frankly, for sure, when you're the
only executive, yeah, I'm sure you don't feel you can
totally turn off. But for me it was enough. I
was connected enough that I didn't feel like, oh my god,
what am I coming back to? But I was disconnected
(02:33):
enough that it worked. And I think it was a
good reminder that this American guilt we have for taking
any time and the way we marder ourselves. And I
was feeling that I didn't feel and you just merge
this company and felt like I could take a whole week,
although I could of, but the fact that it was
five days, it was a good lesson for me that
(02:54):
everyone in a while, I can't.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Do that, not five days, right, you had a weekend
in there, so.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Well, I had a long weekend. And probably now I'm
kind of hating myself for saying it this way because
I'm sounding like, oh, it was only I'm doing that right,
I'm sort of like, oh, it was only five days.
I'm not trying to make that point. I'm actually trying
to make a better point, which is that yes, I
plan on taking a proper vacation or vacations with my family,
but to be able to have and look, it is
(03:22):
a privilege to be in place of means to do this,
and I recognize that privilege. But to go away just
for five days, including a weekend, and realize that it
can work in terms of what you need out of
that time, just to feel restored. I was really sick
for January and February, all the airplanes, like so many
(03:44):
rounds of antibiotics. I just feel healthier again. So notck
wood that I'll remember that lesson and let it be
a reminder for others too who are struggling with it.
You go away and you can still be accountable to
your responsibilities without feeling like it's an extreme choice of
one or the other.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
Maybe it's also just so important to get away with
your partner.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Yeah right, I.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
Mean you got to go away. Your kids are older,
so I haven't done that. They're at a different stage,
you know, even just having young kids, right, I mean,
like I need to have you know, a loone time with.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Nury, and you're good about that.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
But again back in founder mode, like it is hard,
right because I'm on the road every week and just
making the space and just yeah, maybe we have like
a little bit of a you know, a relationship pod
or you talk about because you're partners that are working professionals,
it's difficult, right, and like no one talks about that, right.
Or if you're a single parent, that's hard as well, right,
And so just all these treasures as you're navigating your career.
(04:42):
There is no kind of way to compartmental life. This
is my professional life, this is my personal life. I
don't believe in that you have to be holistic, but
you got to find a way to balance it. And
so another pod, for.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
Sure, I think that's right. And listen, As someone who
built an organization around being a working mother, I perhaps
over indexed in the need to try to reconcile and
be comfortable with the integration of being a mother or
a parent and also having an intense career that took
(05:13):
a lot from me. But you're right in saying mom
and parent. You know, there's also if you're married, like
I am, a relationship that you're trying to nurture, and
by the way, lots of other things too. I mean
it's been discussed before, but I mean I peaked early,
unfortunately in having to be a caregiver with a parent.
Unfortunately lost my parents young. But I was juggling that
(05:36):
earlier and a lot of my friends are juggling that now.
You both talk about that as well, right, we both did, so.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
We need a relationship pop a special No. I think
it's really important because I think so many folks struggle
with it, and relationship across a couple of different dimensions,
right because you know, certainly the relationship with your kids,
you know, with your parents or taking care of elderly parents,
but also just with your part because it's something that
is just really not I think recognized as much. And
(06:05):
you're at the other end of the spectrum. You got
to a place where I think someone just want to
where you have this incredible relationship with your kids. Your
two daughters are just successful and they're working or in college,
like you know, they're set right in terms of you've
done great job parenting, But now where is your relationship
and now you need to spend time. Yeah, you know,
it shouldn't be like, oh, I'm going to put aside
(06:26):
my relationship and then just focus on my career and
kids for twenty years and then pop back up on
the other end of that and then oh, yeah, where
am I with my partner like, that's really hard. You
got to really give an actual focus effort to make
it work every day.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
Very true. I think it speaks to this idea that
is a recurring theme certainly for me, for us on
this pot of chapters. And you know the other thing,
I know we get asked a lot, and we should
talk about this in a future episode, is this whole
idea of identity and your own brand relative to if
minute your identity is attached to a big corporate job
(07:03):
and then the next you're in founder mode. And we'll
have to go there more. But you know, we have
a perfect example today. I mean, what happens when you're
a former top top media executive and then you leave
the corporate world start a food company with no food experience.
I mean, what happens when you do that? What happens
when you then set out to build a brand based
(07:25):
on passion and not necessarily a playbook. If you're lucky,
you might get something like Collie Power, which is a
brand that turned the califower crust into an enormous new
category and food. So when we come back, we're going
to talk to the person that actually did just that.
(07:48):
We are back and ending this month about women, although
of course, you know I feel that should be every
month with the fabulous Gail Becker, who is the founder
of Collie Power. And let me tell you Gail is
on her second career, which is part of what we're
going to talk about. Her first career was beyond Major
It's band, media, politics business. She held executive roles at
(08:10):
Warner Brothers Global pr Powerhouse from Edelman that's when we met,
and even at the US Department of Health and Human Services.
But at the same time, she become a mom of
two boys, both of whom had Celiac disease, and after
growing tired of searching for healthier alternatives that were easy
to make and tasted great, she knew she going to
be alone, left her big corporate job and launched Colliepower
(08:32):
in twenty seventeen. And this is going to make it
sound easy, and when we talk to Gail, I'm sure
she will tell us it was not. But today Colliepower
is America's are you ready for this? Number one? Better
for You Frozen Pizza. Beyond That has become one of
America's fastest growing food brands, with sales already at over
one hundred million dollars. So it's an incredible story. Gail,
(08:53):
Thank you so much for joining us. I'm so happy
to have you here.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
Thank you so much for having me. It's nice to
do these things, but really nice to do them with friends.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Oh. Absolutely, Steve and I are thrilled you're here, real,
you're here.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Now I'm obviously going to be getting all of your
Collie power for my kids.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Okay, my job has done. Then you'll get a little
bit of Collie power and a little bit of entrepreneur advice,
right because we're going to be talking about that to
my other favorite entrepreneur on this podcast. So you and
I first met when you were truly a big time executive,
largest PR firm in the world. Hi to our friend
Richard Edelman, and then suddenly I remember you. Now you're
leaving to start something, and I thought, just because every
(09:34):
brand has an origin story, I mean, I gave a
little bit of your backstory, but really to hear from
you tell us the real argin story of this now
megabrand called Collie Power.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Yeah, boy, I remember those times well. So it was
really three things happening in my life at the same time.
One you know, I'd worked my way up the proverbial
corporate ladder, and when I got to the top, I
realize maybe I didn't really want to be there. My
father had just passed away, and I think when someone
close to you dies, you decide that you want to
(10:06):
look at your life and change it in some way
and do something more meaningful. And that was certainly the
case for me. And three, I'm the mom of two
boys with Celiac disease, as you said, and I just
got really tired of.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
Yeah, can you define that for folks? Maybe not everyone
knows what that is.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
Yeah, Celiac disease is an autoimmune disorder that just means
that your body can't process gluten. So but they were
diagnosed at such a young age that I had to
make all of their food. There was nothing in the store.
So it did give me a really good perch from
which to watch the gluten free industry evolve. And what
I began to notice was how much junk the industry
(10:44):
was putting in gluten free food. And probably like a
lot of your listeners, I heard of thought, oh, well,
one day someone will do something about that, and no
one ever did. So I put all of those three
things together, my disenchantment with the corporate world and the
passing of my father, the realization that I can't be
alone wanting something better, and I put all those things together.
(11:07):
In twenty sixteen, I left my job and start a
company called Collie Power, which we launched in twenty seventeen.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
It's so awesome for you to go from zero to one,
for you to become an entrepreneur. It's not for the
faint of heart, and I always tell people it is
so much harder than it seems. But it's probably the
most gratifying, exhilarating experience that anyone can do because you're
building something from scratch. But on top of this, you
had no food or CpG experience, which I believe is
(11:36):
a good thing. Right. I mean, you look at some
of the great entrepreneurs that didn't have any experience building
any of the companies that they did. I mean, certainly
Brian Chesky didn't have any lodging experience when he built
air in BnB, for example. Right, So I'm so curious, like,
what was that life with no experience and how did
you kind of persevere? Because I have to imagine people
were telling you you don't have any experience. Why are
(11:58):
you doing this?
Speaker 3 (11:59):
Wow? So many great points you made, Steven, and all
really resonate, so one. Yes, you're right. A lot of
people said, what the hell are you doing? And in fact,
it was really why I didn't tell a lot of
people what I was doing, So you're right, Marissa, I
did tell people I was leaving, but no one really
knew what I was doing. And in fact, just because
(12:20):
your audience might find those interesting, everybody thought I was
going to open my own PR firm, which I just
found so funny because here I was, you know, what
I think was the best, and I wasn't certainly wasn't
going to open my own but that was interesting. That's
probably another podcast. But it was so interesting because Stephen,
you said something. It was my ignorance about the industry
(12:42):
that probably allowed me to do what I did, because
if you think about it, look, Big Food spends hundreds
of millions of dollars on innovation every year. This was
an idea hiding in plain sight right the day I
made my first call. It my first and only cauliflower
cross pizza from scratch. There were five hundred and sixty
(13:05):
nine thousand recipes on the internet, all because people couldn't
find what they wanted in the store. When I started callipower,
I had so many people tell me, lady, this can't
be done. You can't make a crust out of cauliflower.
No one's gonna buy a crust out of a cauliflower.
What do you know about making frozen pizza? But it
was almost like that lack of knowledge, that entrepreneurial spirit,
(13:29):
that ignorance that allowed me to do it, because otherwise
the industry should have done it. Quite frankly, shouldn't have
been left to some woman living in la at the time.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
How did that not deter you? How did you get
over the fear when the experts were saying it can't
be done? What enabled you to persevere? And did you
know you were basically going to launch a category when
you set out? Or was there a little bit of
the blissful ignorance in the beginning.
Speaker 3 (13:56):
I sure wish I could say I knew, Oh God,
it just kills me. Of course I didn't know. How
would I know? I had no idea that you know,
we would create a category and where we would be today?
What kept me going in the face of being told
it can't be done. I think it was really my mission,
(14:17):
which was I wanted to do something, no matter how
small it was. I wanted to make the world better
in some way. Now it could have been by making
a cauliflower crest pizza and making nutritious food more accessible
to all, or it could have been something else, but
it was for me. I was at a time in
my life where I had to try. It was almost
(14:39):
like a calling. I just somehow thought, well, if I
don't do this now, I'm just going to end up
with a lot of regret. And when I left Edelman,
to your point, where's the name of the blog that
I announced my departure in was called better to say
oops than what if? And that was really my thinking.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
I love that. You know, it's so interesting because there
is a school of thought that you need to have
the expert either experience, or you need to have all
your ducks in a row. But sometimes you just have
to launch something. You just have to try. And I'm
so curious, like, what was the obstacles, whether it was capital,
you know, kind of when you were trying to really
(15:19):
bootstrap this, you know, give us a concrete example of
a really early obstacle, you know, kind of in the
early days of the launch, because I can't imagine it
was easy.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
Yeah, and just how did you start? Like on top
of Steven's question, I feel like that is so fascinating
because the idea of just going yeah, I've learned that
from Stephen by the way he's taught me just kind
of a little bit of that. Just do it and
put it out there, but tell us how you did that.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Yeah, it's so funny, I do think to your point,
sometimes people wait for some magical sign right, Oh my gosh,
I'm going to hear angels singing, bells are going to ring.
It doesn't happen. It's kind of like having kids. There's
no right time, so you might as well start. And
that was absolutely my think. In addition, while I didn't
have the expertise, I was far enough along in my
(16:07):
career to feel comfortable in admitting what I didn't know.
In fact, I had to, and so I hired lots
of people, lots of experts in the field to teach me.
I was like a sponge. Quite frankly, I'm still a
sponge to teach me about the industry, to teach me
about sales to teach me about manufacturing all contractors, and
(16:29):
I hired them and eventually built a team. And you know,
today we have people who work for Collie Power who
come from you know, the largest food companies in the world,
which is still remarkable to me. But that's really how
I did it. And I think entrepreneurs the superpower is
not being afraid to not have all the answers. In fact,
(16:51):
you shouldn't. But the biggest challenge, I would say early on,
in addition to money, of course, because money is always
a challenge, was trying to find someone to make pizza.
Trying to find a manufacturer to make the pizza. Lots
of people turned me down.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
And I mean lots were they turning you down because
you know, you weren't established because you know, I don't
know you were a woman, Like what do you know
about this? Or like what were those kind of pushbacks? Right?
Speaker 3 (17:15):
Yeah, yes, yes, and yes, I would say, basically fell
into three buckets. One, lady, it can't be done. You
can't make a pizza cress at a cauliflower. Two you
don't have enough volume for us. You know, when you
think about pizza manufacturing in the United States is pretty
small group. Then you narrow it to a gluten free facility,
(17:37):
much smaller group. So the universe of people that I
was dealing with was small, and most of them didn't
have the capacity to take on a new customer or
we were too small, Like what kind of volume is that,
I'm not going to do that. So that was like
the second bucket, and the third bucket was, you know, look,
nice idea and all, but what what the hell do
(17:57):
you know about making frozen pizza. I've been doing it
for years, lady. So I would say the roadblocks fell
into those three categories.
Speaker 1 (18:06):
And how did you get over them? Really?
Speaker 3 (18:08):
Well, it was actually the very very last manufacturer who
turned me down, and I remember because just happenstance. I
was in Japan at the time when I got the notice,
and I picked up the phone, most expensive phone call
of my life, and I talked to that for like
two and a half hours. I basically begged, pleaded, talked
(18:31):
about ways that we could do it. Try again. It
was probably the most I have ever pleaded in business.
And I got them to try one more time and
we were able to do it.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
We are That's the perseverance, and I think that truly
at the heart of every entrepreneur. It's really about that
perseverance because you are going to get a thousand no's
and for you to still get up in the morning
and try to do something and move forward and try
to way. You just don't take a no from somebody
that either can't give you the s yeah, or you
(19:06):
know you're just gonna be held after finding a way
and the ability to just kind of launch now, I
just love the fact that you launched this. How difficult
was like distribution because you know, one thing is making
the product, but then you got to get your product
to be bought to be seen, yes, right, So like
how hard it was getting distribution?
Speaker 3 (19:23):
Well, it's interesting in many ways, you know that was
the easier part. I didn't know that. So first of all,
in the world of manufacturing and CpG, you have to
make the product before you can sell it. So I
had to make samples of what I call the world's
most expensive pizzas because I didn't know if they were
(19:44):
ever going to go anywhere. So I made samples and
my first Whole Foods has this wonderful program where if
you live in the region where you can pitch the
local region to carry your product. So I lived in
the Soapac region at the time, and you bring your
samples to the regional headquarters, which is kind of like
I like to say, it's like dropping off your kids
(20:06):
at daycare, only worse. You bring your product to like
the receptionist, which is like handing over your life. Because
I had like already worked on this ten months and
you don't get a meeting. You're literally dropping like close
to a million dollars to make these samples. Wow, not
to mention how many hours, and you know all of that,
(20:26):
and you're dropping them off. I didn't know if they
were going to go anywhere. A week later, I heard
from the buyer there. Of course I memorized the email
by now, and it's like, we tried your pizzas, we
love them, we want to bring them into thirty stores.
And so they went into those thirty stores and everything
sold out. And then we went to Expo West, two
(20:49):
employees and my son at the time, and we made
eighteen hundred pizzas in a weekend and people loved them
and bought them. And so the distribution part was easy
year than I thought it would be.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
I have to imagine all this has been a slaver
of love. And you actually didn't just build a company,
you built a BRANDMRSA. We're all about brand new. So
what was your biggest aha? Because you've been working with
brands for such a long time. You obviously had been
in media, and obviously you know pr and all these
different vectors, but now you're building your own brand. And
(21:23):
how difficult was it for you to maybe have other
people playing with your baby, give you advice on your baby,
tell your baby's ugly. Maybe I mean to help us
understand the shaping of the brand.
Speaker 3 (21:34):
It's such an interesting question because I think working as
a consultant or right at an agency was such a
good background. Oddly enough, because as you both know, you
get a perch and a great view into a lot
of different companies and a lot of different brands, and
(21:55):
you see what you like, and you see what you
don't like, and you see what works, and you see
what fails, and you also see sometimes they take your
advice and sometimes they don't. What was so interesting coming
from that world is all of the the handcuffs were
off and I got to listen to my own advice
(22:17):
and I got to try things that a lot of
the clients I had had all over the years never
wanted to try.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
Isn't that gratifying? Oh my god, it's got to be
so exhilarating. We're like, Okay, these people didn't listen to me.
I'm going to do it, and I'm going to do
it my way.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
I mean, especially when you're obviously right.
Speaker 4 (22:38):
Well, it makes it easier on this side, but who
the hell knows, but the fact that it is incredibly
gratifying because and also it's like, that's the best.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
Time of building a brand, right. It's funny. Even when
I worked at Edelman, you know, everyone liked working on
the big companies, the big brands. I was always drawn
to the upstarts. I was always drawn to the sort
of disruptors. I didn't know what that meant at the time.
I just knew that's what I like because you have
a lot more flexibility you can try. I think sometimes
(23:10):
they work, sometimes they fail. But that notion of being
able to try and shape the brand that you know
when it's yours is pretty much in your soul and
your blood. It's almost intuitive for me. It's very hard
to separate, maybe too much so, but hard to separate
(23:30):
me from the brand. On a personal level, I always
call Colleiepower my third child and definitely the most difficult
of the three.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
But you know, Gail, it's funny because for all the
dimensions of brand we talk about, I'm very sort of
aesthetically and visually in voice oriented, and we don't talk
about that as much as an observer of what you've
built for me. Has to be one of the things
that has been no pun intended, the secret sauce of
the pizza brand is I mean, brilliant logo, brilliant packaging,
(24:03):
brilliant voice. And I would love now your take, having
done it in a consulting capacity for so many years.
But now, as we just said, starting it, how much
can you honestly now say you know what? That really
was a big part of it, because I'll walk down
the freezer aisle. I'm sorry to me, and maybe I'm
biased because I know you, but that brand pops, It
(24:24):
just pops right off the shelf and out of the case.
And maybe we still underestimate that a little bit.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
It's such an interesting point, Marissa, And it's funny because
I remember in the early days when I wanted to
do the packaging. I wanted to put sort of the
big black meme on the packaging, in those letters, big
black letters. Boy did I have lots of people tell
me no, like, oh, no, you can't do that, No
you shouldn't do that. No, here's all the reasons why
(24:51):
it wouldn't work. And I think as an entrepreneur in
any field, you have to sort of make a deal
with yourself. You have to say, here are the rules
I need to follow. There are brand guidelines you need
to follow. There are rules about building a brand that
we know intuitively, we know from experts. All of that
(25:12):
that's really important. You have to agree which ones of
those are you going to keep true to? But you
also have to say, what am I going to do differently?
How am I going to stand out? What is going
to be unique about what I'm offering? Otherwise why the
hell do it? And so for me, maybe one of
(25:33):
not only was the first action creating a category that
didn't exist, but it really was putting those letters and
those memes on the front of the box. Because my
insight at the time was, Wow, when was the last
time anyone walked down the freezer aisle and smiled.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
Well, it's always so cold, right, So you know you're
walking down the aisle, Yeah, it's always so cold.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
Yeah, you're like, you're not in a good mood, right,
And I thought, wouldn't it be great if people could
like walk by the freezer door and smile or laugh
or want to take their picture with the box. So
I held true to that despite a lot of naysayers,
and I'm glad we did because we just went through
(26:17):
a whole packaging refresh. We've tested some new packaging because
you know, you have to do that, and it's interesting
because our old packaging came up on the top. So
it was nice to see.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
We're going to get some more of these insights quick break.
When we come back, we're going to get ready for
cool or cringe as well.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Okay, we're back with Gail, and I want to shift
gears a little bit and just talk about this idea
that you spent such a big part of your career.
I mean, what for many people would be an entire
career in corporate life, although government and other things too,
and then you reinvent yourself as an entrepreneur. I think
(27:02):
that alone is so inspiring to people as we think
about and I talk about my career having been continuing
to be chapters all the time. But what I think
is so interesting. It was clearly a decision to say
I'm done with that, I want to do this. But
what did corporate life teach you? And maybe what did
you have to unlearn from that? As a founder?
Speaker 3 (27:23):
Oh boy, it taught me a lot, and I was
very blessed in the sense that I worked at some
amazing companies with great leaders. It taught me how to
be fair, It taught me how to be thought provoking,
how to give counsel, how to make impact, and you know,
when I met some incredible people. I think the thing
(27:46):
I had to unlearn, particularly when you're on your own
in the early days, you didn't have a lot of
people to talk to. Like it was myself and my
conscious and my gut and my tears, you know, in
the car thinking you know, what have I done. It's
funny because your instinct is to be tentative and pressure
(28:09):
test it with all of your colleagues. You don't have that,
so you have to trust your gut. You certainly don't
have money to do research or get insights, so you
have to trust your guts and more importantly, you have
to believe in your mission, because if you don't, then
(28:33):
you're never gonna succeed. You're gonna let those naysayers win.
You're gonna always be questioning yourself. So if you just
always remember what you're doing, it for the rest you
know falls very naturally. It's painstaking though, no question, and
it's still painstaking, and just in a different way. Well.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
The perseverance, the listening to your gut, but also staying
fruit a mission, I think is perhaps one of the
ultimate lessons, whether you're helming a big brand or whether
you're helming a brand that you're first inventing yourself. Probably
one of the best pieces of advice with Gail. Thank
you so much. I learned so much from you and
(29:17):
watching your journey has been amazing. Can we switch and
now play a little fun cooler, cringe speed round of you.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
I learned a long time ago just to do whatever
you said. So I'm all yours.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
I love it. I love it.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Oh my gosh. Ifpdingly all right, Steve, and you want
to go for the first.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
One, I'm gonna kick it awesome, Okay, colliflower ice cream?
Cool or cringe?
Speaker 1 (29:41):
Is that real?
Speaker 3 (29:42):
I had someone come to me at Expo West with
a tub of ice cream a spoon and said would
you please try it? And it had cauliflower in it,
and I did and it was good and it was good.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (29:55):
I love to celebrate innovation. That doesn't mean I know
whether consumers will listen, but for someone to try, I
know how hard it was to make that pint, So
it's always gonna be cool.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
All right, enough, all.
Speaker 3 (30:08):
Right my kids?
Speaker 2 (30:11):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (30:11):
Really, Expost, which for people don't know, is one of
the biggest food trade shows. Yes, so let's go there.
Cooler cringe trade shows in twenty twenty five.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
I'm going to another one soon and I just got
back from xbois always cool. It is my happy place.
It's always my happy place. I sit there for three
days and I get to shove pizza in people's mouths.
The best thing is you get to see how they
react because when you're in CpG, you're not in their
(30:45):
homes when they're having dinner, you're not in their homes
when they're using your toothpaste or whatever. You get to
interact with people in real time trying your product. There
is no place I'd rather be.
Speaker 2 (30:57):
I love that. I love that. See that is a
product person there, that is a true founder. And speaking
of founders, you know, I'm curious. You know we asked
this question in our last pot with Shelley's Alice, But
I'm curious. You know you are a founder, you're an entrepreneur.
How do you feel about the label girl boss or
how would you want to be described as a founder?
(31:17):
That cooler? Cringe?
Speaker 3 (31:19):
Girl bosses cringe. I don't like the word girl unless
you're talking about someone who's under eighteen.
Speaker 2 (31:26):
Or how about female founder?
Speaker 3 (31:27):
I think for the moment that we're living in, it's appropriate.
Why because female founders get three percent of all venture
capital dollars, less than three percent, sorry, less than three percent.
So until that number becomes a heck of a lot higher,
(31:48):
we need to call it out. And we need to
support female founders by cheering them on, supporting them on
social media, sharing their stories, buying their products. That's what
we can do. So love that. But do I long
for a day when we don't need that Moniker, when
(32:08):
we don't need International Women's Month or Women's Day or
all of that. You bet I do. And nothing would
make me happier than for colleiae power to be used
as an example of how women can deliver great ROI,
because that is a fact, has nothing to do with colleigepower. Women,
(32:29):
female founders, female lied companies deliver a better ROI than
their male counterparts, full stop. That is not conjecture, that
is fact.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
Aimen to that, Gail, thank you so much for joining us.
Thank you for being an amazing female founder, but truly
an amazing founder. And to that point, I hope everyone
learned a little bit enjoyed hearing about your story. You're
so happy to have had you on.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Thank you, Gil, thank you so much for having me.
Thank you, what a pleasure.
Speaker 2 (33:00):
And now it's time for what's on your minds? And
so this is a really fun, I think thought provoking question, Marisa.
So we have a question from Renee, which is, if
you could have dinner with any business leader, dead or alive,
who would it be.
Speaker 1 (33:19):
I love, I love and hate questions like this because
I always want to say a million different answers. Are
you going first? Or am I I think you go first? Okay,
I'm pausing to think. Okay, here's my answer. I think
it would be off brand for me if I didn't
answer with a great female business leader. So I think, look,
(33:42):
having spent almost a decade of my career, a very
formative part of my career at the Esday Latter Companies,
and having read her autobiography just recently, you know, this
has been going. I've just recently read a piece of
historical fiction that was totally modeled after her. I think
I'd really like to have dinner with Esdae Lauder.
Speaker 2 (34:03):
That's a great answer because.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
She was iconic. It kind of goes from the conversation
we just have with Gail, like would she want to
be seen today as a female founder or just a founder?
And she shares my ethnic identity with me, and I'll say,
this is a woman if you know this word kutzba, right, Like,
she had gumption, she had courage, she had guts, and
she broke through so many so many glass ceilings and
(34:28):
so many doors. So I think that's my answer.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
It's a great one.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
I would have many more, but that's a good one.
How about yours?
Speaker 2 (34:35):
Mine is personal and it's it's a little bit melancholy,
but I would want to really just have the opportunity
to have dinner with a guy by the name of
Danny Lillin, who was the co founder of Akamie, and
he was my friend. He was just an incredible technologist.
But he was the first person coded nine to eleven.
(34:58):
And it was the kind of thing where he was
so brilliant and he was you know PhD in you know,
machine learning computer science from MIT, but built like a
football player, and he was just such an incredible leader
and spirit, and he was funny, and he was intense,
and he pushed you and and you know, he kind
(35:20):
of built so much of the foundational technology of the Internet.
That is, you know, we are all leveraging and using today.
And the incredible irony the day that he died, the
technology that he built staved the Internet. Like literally, you
cannot access a website on nine to eleven if it
wasn't using akamized technology, Like every single site was calling
(35:41):
akama cell. It proved the value of what he built
in spades. But he didn't get to see all of this,
and would just be so curious in this moment that
we're in, obviously with the dawn of the AI era,
for someone like him to see this, I think that
would be this, you know, an incredible, incredible opportunity.
Speaker 1 (36:01):
Well, let us know who you'd have at your dinner
table in terms of great business leaders, Pastor President, I said,
Pastor President, thanks for joining us. If you'd like us
to answer one of your questions, of course, tell us
what's on your mind by emailing us at ideas at
brand dashnew dot com, or you can just drop a
(36:23):
comment on one of our social channels. Thanks for joining us,
and we'll see you next time on brand New
Hello, and thanks for joining us on brand New from
the iHeart Podcast Network and brand New Labs. I'm Marissa
Fahlberg and.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
I'm Stephen Wolf Betida. I am zooming in from the
Dominican Republic, Marisa from Santo.
Speaker 1 (00:23):
Domingo, one of my favorite places to vacation, as you know,
but for you, it's a lot more personal than that,
isn't it.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
Yeah, this is home. This is where my mother's from.
My mother was born in Santiago Denos Caritos, which is
in the northern part of the island. By myself, a
ton of family here, and you know, it's just really
important spring break and at least for us in La
and so bringing the kids here, connecting the family, having
some really good food Dominican food is just amazing, but
also just you know, kind of recharging the batteries and
(00:51):
it's fun. But you know, certainly the life of an
entrepreneur you're always on as well, right, But I know
you just took some time as well, now that you're
back in the saddle, where were you.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Yeah, we're definitely in entrepreneur story mode today, So I
think it is interesting that you are so in founder
builder mode right now. But good for you. I know
how hard you're working that you're able to take a
little time. Make sure you're with the family for sure.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Yeah, but you're working hard as well. I mean, where
were you. I just saw it like you were sun
and you had some fun. You took some time.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
This was my first, really first time just going away.
I mean maybe for a weekend or something in the past.
But David and I my husband, David and I said
we're going to go away, just the two of us
because we are as I've mentioned empty nesters for the
first time this year, but it was important for me
to plan that for us. And the interesting lesson was
(01:47):
it was just five days, effectively an extended weekend. It
really worked. It really worked in terms of recharging my battery,
having important couple time because I've been traveling so much.
Nothing makes me happier than the sun and the sea,
the sand. So you have to know what fills your cup.
That fills my cup and it was nice.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Did you have to be on as well or could
you really disconnect it at least a little bit?
Speaker 1 (02:12):
I felt that I didn't totally disconnect, and I feel
like there is an expectation and responsibility as you know,
a senior executive, but frankly, for sure, when you're the
only executive, yeah, I'm sure you don't feel you can
totally turn off. But for me it was enough. I
was connected enough that I didn't feel like, oh my god,
what am I coming back to? But I was disconnected
(02:33):
enough that it worked. And I think it was a
good reminder that this American guilt we have for taking
any time and the way we marder ourselves. And I
was feeling that I didn't feel and you just merge
this company and felt like I could take a whole week,
although I could of, but the fact that it was
five days, it was a good lesson for me that
(02:54):
everyone in a while, I can't.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Do that, not five days, right, you had a weekend
in there, so.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Well, I had a long weekend. And probably now I'm
kind of hating myself for saying it this way because
I'm sounding like, oh, it was only I'm doing that right,
I'm sort of like, oh, it was only five days.
I'm not trying to make that point. I'm actually trying
to make a better point, which is that yes, I
plan on taking a proper vacation or vacations with my family,
but to be able to have and look, it is
(03:22):
a privilege to be in place of means to do this,
and I recognize that privilege. But to go away just
for five days, including a weekend, and realize that it
can work in terms of what you need out of
that time, just to feel restored. I was really sick
for January and February, all the airplanes, like so many
(03:44):
rounds of antibiotics. I just feel healthier again. So notck
wood that I'll remember that lesson and let it be
a reminder for others too who are struggling with it.
You go away and you can still be accountable to
your responsibilities without feeling like it's an extreme choice of
one or the other.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
Maybe it's also just so important to get away with
your partner.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Yeah right, I.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
Mean you got to go away. Your kids are older,
so I haven't done that. They're at a different stage,
you know, even just having young kids, right, I mean,
like I need to have you know, a loone time with.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Nury, and you're good about that.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
But again back in founder mode, like it is hard,
right because I'm on the road every week and just
making the space and just yeah, maybe we have like
a little bit of a you know, a relationship pod
or you talk about because you're partners that are working professionals,
it's difficult, right, and like no one talks about that, right.
Or if you're a single parent, that's hard as well, right,
And so just all these treasures as you're navigating your career.
(04:42):
There is no kind of way to compartmental life. This
is my professional life, this is my personal life. I
don't believe in that you have to be holistic, but
you got to find a way to balance it. And
so another pod, for.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
Sure, I think that's right. And listen, As someone who
built an organization around being a working mother, I perhaps
over indexed in the need to try to reconcile and
be comfortable with the integration of being a mother or
a parent and also having an intense career that took
(05:13):
a lot from me. But you're right in saying mom
and parent. You know, there's also if you're married, like
I am, a relationship that you're trying to nurture, and
by the way, lots of other things too. I mean
it's been discussed before, but I mean I peaked early,
unfortunately in having to be a caregiver with a parent.
Unfortunately lost my parents young. But I was juggling that
(05:36):
earlier and a lot of my friends are juggling that now.
You both talk about that as well, right, we both did, so.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
We need a relationship pop a special No. I think
it's really important because I think so many folks struggle
with it, and relationship across a couple of different dimensions,
right because you know, certainly the relationship with your kids,
you know, with your parents or taking care of elderly parents,
but also just with your part because it's something that
is just really not I think recognized as much. And
(06:05):
you're at the other end of the spectrum. You got
to a place where I think someone just want to
where you have this incredible relationship with your kids. Your
two daughters are just successful and they're working or in college,
like you know, they're set right in terms of you've
done great job parenting, But now where is your relationship
and now you need to spend time. Yeah, you know,
it shouldn't be like, oh, I'm going to put aside
(06:26):
my relationship and then just focus on my career and
kids for twenty years and then pop back up on
the other end of that and then oh, yeah, where
am I with my partner like, that's really hard. You
got to really give an actual focus effort to make
it work every day.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
Very true. I think it speaks to this idea that
is a recurring theme certainly for me, for us on
this pot of chapters. And you know the other thing,
I know we get asked a lot, and we should
talk about this in a future episode, is this whole
idea of identity and your own brand relative to if
minute your identity is attached to a big corporate job
(07:03):
and then the next you're in founder mode. And we'll
have to go there more. But you know, we have
a perfect example today. I mean, what happens when you're
a former top top media executive and then you leave
the corporate world start a food company with no food experience.
I mean, what happens when you do that? What happens
when you then set out to build a brand based
(07:25):
on passion and not necessarily a playbook. If you're lucky,
you might get something like Collie Power, which is a
brand that turned the califower crust into an enormous new
category and food. So when we come back, we're going
to talk to the person that actually did just that.
(07:48):
We are back and ending this month about women, although
of course, you know I feel that should be every
month with the fabulous Gail Becker, who is the founder
of Collie Power. And let me tell you Gail is
on her second career, which is part of what we're
going to talk about. Her first career was beyond Major
It's band, media, politics business. She held executive roles at
(08:10):
Warner Brothers Global pr Powerhouse from Edelman that's when we met,
and even at the US Department of Health and Human Services.
But at the same time, she become a mom of
two boys, both of whom had Celiac disease, and after
growing tired of searching for healthier alternatives that were easy
to make and tasted great, she knew she going to
be alone, left her big corporate job and launched Colliepower
(08:32):
in twenty seventeen. And this is going to make it
sound easy, and when we talk to Gail, I'm sure
she will tell us it was not. But today Colliepower
is America's are you ready for this? Number one? Better
for You Frozen Pizza. Beyond That has become one of
America's fastest growing food brands, with sales already at over
one hundred million dollars. So it's an incredible story. Gail,
(08:53):
Thank you so much for joining us. I'm so happy
to have you here.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
Thank you so much for having me. It's nice to
do these things, but really nice to do them with friends.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Oh. Absolutely, Steve and I are thrilled you're here, real,
you're here.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Now I'm obviously going to be getting all of your
Collie power for my kids.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Okay, my job has done. Then you'll get a little
bit of Collie power and a little bit of entrepreneur advice,
right because we're going to be talking about that to
my other favorite entrepreneur on this podcast. So you and
I first met when you were truly a big time executive,
largest PR firm in the world. Hi to our friend
Richard Edelman, and then suddenly I remember you. Now you're
leaving to start something, and I thought, just because every
(09:34):
brand has an origin story, I mean, I gave a
little bit of your backstory, but really to hear from
you tell us the real argin story of this now
megabrand called Collie Power.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Yeah, boy, I remember those times well. So it was
really three things happening in my life at the same time.
One you know, I'd worked my way up the proverbial
corporate ladder, and when I got to the top, I
realize maybe I didn't really want to be there. My
father had just passed away, and I think when someone
close to you dies, you decide that you want to
(10:06):
look at your life and change it in some way
and do something more meaningful. And that was certainly the
case for me. And three, I'm the mom of two
boys with Celiac disease, as you said, and I just
got really tired of.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
Yeah, can you define that for folks? Maybe not everyone
knows what that is.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
Yeah, Celiac disease is an autoimmune disorder that just means
that your body can't process gluten. So but they were
diagnosed at such a young age that I had to
make all of their food. There was nothing in the store.
So it did give me a really good perch from
which to watch the gluten free industry evolve. And what
I began to notice was how much junk the industry
(10:44):
was putting in gluten free food. And probably like a
lot of your listeners, I heard of thought, oh, well,
one day someone will do something about that, and no
one ever did. So I put all of those three
things together, my disenchantment with the corporate world and the
passing of my father, the realization that I can't be
alone wanting something better, and I put all those things together.
(11:07):
In twenty sixteen, I left my job and start a
company called Collie Power, which we launched in twenty seventeen.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
It's so awesome for you to go from zero to one,
for you to become an entrepreneur. It's not for the
faint of heart, and I always tell people it is
so much harder than it seems. But it's probably the
most gratifying, exhilarating experience that anyone can do because you're
building something from scratch. But on top of this, you
had no food or CpG experience, which I believe is
(11:36):
a good thing. Right. I mean, you look at some
of the great entrepreneurs that didn't have any experience building
any of the companies that they did. I mean, certainly
Brian Chesky didn't have any lodging experience when he built
air in BnB, for example. Right, So I'm so curious, like,
what was that life with no experience and how did
you kind of persevere? Because I have to imagine people
were telling you you don't have any experience. Why are
(11:58):
you doing this?
Speaker 3 (11:59):
Wow? So many great points you made, Steven, and all
really resonate, so one. Yes, you're right. A lot of
people said, what the hell are you doing? And in fact,
it was really why I didn't tell a lot of
people what I was doing, So you're right, Marissa, I
did tell people I was leaving, but no one really
knew what I was doing. And in fact, just because
(12:20):
your audience might find those interesting, everybody thought I was
going to open my own PR firm, which I just
found so funny because here I was, you know, what
I think was the best, and I wasn't certainly wasn't
going to open my own but that was interesting. That's
probably another podcast. But it was so interesting because Stephen,
you said something. It was my ignorance about the industry
(12:42):
that probably allowed me to do what I did, because
if you think about it, look, Big Food spends hundreds
of millions of dollars on innovation every year. This was
an idea hiding in plain sight right the day I
made my first call. It my first and only cauliflower
cross pizza from scratch. There were five hundred and sixty
(13:05):
nine thousand recipes on the internet, all because people couldn't
find what they wanted in the store. When I started callipower,
I had so many people tell me, lady, this can't
be done. You can't make a crust out of cauliflower.
No one's gonna buy a crust out of a cauliflower.
What do you know about making frozen pizza? But it
was almost like that lack of knowledge, that entrepreneurial spirit,
(13:29):
that ignorance that allowed me to do it, because otherwise
the industry should have done it. Quite frankly, shouldn't have
been left to some woman living in la at the time.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
How did that not deter you? How did you get
over the fear when the experts were saying it can't
be done? What enabled you to persevere? And did you
know you were basically going to launch a category when
you set out? Or was there a little bit of
the blissful ignorance in the beginning.
Speaker 3 (13:56):
I sure wish I could say I knew, Oh God,
it just kills me. Of course I didn't know. How
would I know? I had no idea that you know,
we would create a category and where we would be today?
What kept me going in the face of being told
it can't be done. I think it was really my mission,
(14:17):
which was I wanted to do something, no matter how
small it was. I wanted to make the world better
in some way. Now it could have been by making
a cauliflower crest pizza and making nutritious food more accessible
to all, or it could have been something else, but
it was for me. I was at a time in
my life where I had to try. It was almost
(14:39):
like a calling. I just somehow thought, well, if I
don't do this now, I'm just going to end up
with a lot of regret. And when I left Edelman,
to your point, where's the name of the blog that
I announced my departure in was called better to say
oops than what if? And that was really my thinking.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
I love that. You know, it's so interesting because there
is a school of thought that you need to have
the expert either experience, or you need to have all
your ducks in a row. But sometimes you just have
to launch something. You just have to try. And I'm
so curious, like, what was the obstacles, whether it was capital,
you know, kind of when you were trying to really
(15:19):
bootstrap this, you know, give us a concrete example of
a really early obstacle, you know, kind of in the
early days of the launch, because I can't imagine it
was easy.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
Yeah, and just how did you start? Like on top
of Steven's question, I feel like that is so fascinating
because the idea of just going yeah, I've learned that
from Stephen by the way he's taught me just kind
of a little bit of that. Just do it and
put it out there, but tell us how you did that.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Yeah, it's so funny, I do think to your point,
sometimes people wait for some magical sign right, Oh my gosh,
I'm going to hear angels singing, bells are going to ring.
It doesn't happen. It's kind of like having kids. There's
no right time, so you might as well start. And
that was absolutely my think. In addition, while I didn't
have the expertise, I was far enough along in my
(16:07):
career to feel comfortable in admitting what I didn't know.
In fact, I had to, and so I hired lots
of people, lots of experts in the field to teach me.
I was like a sponge. Quite frankly, I'm still a
sponge to teach me about the industry, to teach me
about sales to teach me about manufacturing all contractors, and
(16:29):
I hired them and eventually built a team. And you know,
today we have people who work for Collie Power who
come from you know, the largest food companies in the world,
which is still remarkable to me. But that's really how
I did it. And I think entrepreneurs the superpower is
not being afraid to not have all the answers. In fact,
(16:51):
you shouldn't. But the biggest challenge, I would say early on,
in addition to money, of course, because money is always
a challenge, was trying to find someone to make pizza.
Trying to find a manufacturer to make the pizza. Lots
of people turned me down.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
And I mean lots were they turning you down because
you know, you weren't established because you know, I don't
know you were a woman, Like what do you know
about this? Or like what were those kind of pushbacks? Right?
Speaker 3 (17:15):
Yeah, yes, yes, and yes, I would say, basically fell
into three buckets. One, lady, it can't be done. You
can't make a pizza cress at a cauliflower. Two you
don't have enough volume for us. You know, when you
think about pizza manufacturing in the United States is pretty
small group. Then you narrow it to a gluten free facility,
(17:37):
much smaller group. So the universe of people that I
was dealing with was small, and most of them didn't
have the capacity to take on a new customer or
we were too small, Like what kind of volume is that,
I'm not going to do that. So that was like
the second bucket, and the third bucket was, you know, look,
nice idea and all, but what what the hell do
(17:57):
you know about making frozen pizza. I've been doing it
for years, lady. So I would say the roadblocks fell
into those three categories.
Speaker 1 (18:06):
And how did you get over them? Really?
Speaker 3 (18:08):
Well, it was actually the very very last manufacturer who
turned me down, and I remember because just happenstance. I
was in Japan at the time when I got the notice,
and I picked up the phone, most expensive phone call
of my life, and I talked to that for like
two and a half hours. I basically begged, pleaded, talked
(18:31):
about ways that we could do it. Try again. It
was probably the most I have ever pleaded in business.
And I got them to try one more time and
we were able to do it.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
We are That's the perseverance, and I think that truly
at the heart of every entrepreneur. It's really about that
perseverance because you are going to get a thousand no's
and for you to still get up in the morning
and try to do something and move forward and try
to way. You just don't take a no from somebody
that either can't give you the s yeah, or you
(19:06):
know you're just gonna be held after finding a way
and the ability to just kind of launch now, I
just love the fact that you launched this. How difficult
was like distribution because you know, one thing is making
the product, but then you got to get your product
to be bought to be seen, yes, right, So like
how hard it was getting distribution?
Speaker 3 (19:23):
Well, it's interesting in many ways, you know that was
the easier part. I didn't know that. So first of all,
in the world of manufacturing and CpG, you have to
make the product before you can sell it. So I
had to make samples of what I call the world's
most expensive pizzas because I didn't know if they were
(19:44):
ever going to go anywhere. So I made samples and
my first Whole Foods has this wonderful program where if
you live in the region where you can pitch the
local region to carry your product. So I lived in
the Soapac region at the time, and you bring your
samples to the regional headquarters, which is kind of like
I like to say, it's like dropping off your kids
(20:06):
at daycare, only worse. You bring your product to like
the receptionist, which is like handing over your life. Because
I had like already worked on this ten months and
you don't get a meeting. You're literally dropping like close
to a million dollars to make these samples. Wow, not
to mention how many hours, and you know all of that,
(20:26):
and you're dropping them off. I didn't know if they
were going to go anywhere. A week later, I heard
from the buyer there. Of course I memorized the email
by now, and it's like, we tried your pizzas, we
love them, we want to bring them into thirty stores.
And so they went into those thirty stores and everything
sold out. And then we went to Expo West, two
(20:49):
employees and my son at the time, and we made
eighteen hundred pizzas in a weekend and people loved them
and bought them. And so the distribution part was easy
year than I thought it would be.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
I have to imagine all this has been a slaver
of love. And you actually didn't just build a company,
you built a BRANDMRSA. We're all about brand new. So
what was your biggest aha? Because you've been working with
brands for such a long time. You obviously had been
in media, and obviously you know pr and all these
different vectors, but now you're building your own brand. And
(21:23):
how difficult was it for you to maybe have other
people playing with your baby, give you advice on your baby,
tell your baby's ugly. Maybe I mean to help us
understand the shaping of the brand.
Speaker 3 (21:34):
It's such an interesting question because I think working as
a consultant or right at an agency was such a
good background. Oddly enough, because as you both know, you
get a perch and a great view into a lot
of different companies and a lot of different brands, and
(21:55):
you see what you like, and you see what you
don't like, and you see what works, and you see
what fails, and you also see sometimes they take your
advice and sometimes they don't. What was so interesting coming
from that world is all of the the handcuffs were
off and I got to listen to my own advice
(22:17):
and I got to try things that a lot of
the clients I had had all over the years never
wanted to try.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
Isn't that gratifying? Oh my god, it's got to be
so exhilarating. We're like, Okay, these people didn't listen to me.
I'm going to do it, and I'm going to do
it my way.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
I mean, especially when you're obviously right.
Speaker 4 (22:38):
Well, it makes it easier on this side, but who
the hell knows, but the fact that it is incredibly
gratifying because and also it's like, that's the best.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
Time of building a brand, right. It's funny. Even when
I worked at Edelman, you know, everyone liked working on
the big companies, the big brands. I was always drawn
to the upstarts. I was always drawn to the sort
of disruptors. I didn't know what that meant at the time.
I just knew that's what I like because you have
a lot more flexibility you can try. I think sometimes
(23:10):
they work, sometimes they fail. But that notion of being
able to try and shape the brand that you know
when it's yours is pretty much in your soul and
your blood. It's almost intuitive for me. It's very hard
to separate, maybe too much so, but hard to separate
(23:30):
me from the brand. On a personal level, I always
call Colleiepower my third child and definitely the most difficult
of the three.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
But you know, Gail, it's funny because for all the
dimensions of brand we talk about, I'm very sort of
aesthetically and visually in voice oriented, and we don't talk
about that as much as an observer of what you've
built for me. Has to be one of the things
that has been no pun intended, the secret sauce of
the pizza brand is I mean, brilliant logo, brilliant packaging,
(24:03):
brilliant voice. And I would love now your take, having
done it in a consulting capacity for so many years.
But now, as we just said, starting it, how much
can you honestly now say you know what? That really
was a big part of it, because I'll walk down
the freezer aisle. I'm sorry to me, and maybe I'm
biased because I know you, but that brand pops, It
(24:24):
just pops right off the shelf and out of the case.
And maybe we still underestimate that a little bit.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
It's such an interesting point, Marissa, And it's funny because
I remember in the early days when I wanted to
do the packaging. I wanted to put sort of the
big black meme on the packaging, in those letters, big
black letters. Boy did I have lots of people tell
me no, like, oh, no, you can't do that, No
you shouldn't do that. No, here's all the reasons why
(24:51):
it wouldn't work. And I think as an entrepreneur in
any field, you have to sort of make a deal
with yourself. You have to say, here are the rules
I need to follow. There are brand guidelines you need
to follow. There are rules about building a brand that
we know intuitively, we know from experts. All of that
(25:12):
that's really important. You have to agree which ones of
those are you going to keep true to? But you
also have to say, what am I going to do differently?
How am I going to stand out? What is going
to be unique about what I'm offering? Otherwise why the
hell do it? And so for me, maybe one of
(25:33):
not only was the first action creating a category that
didn't exist, but it really was putting those letters and
those memes on the front of the box. Because my
insight at the time was, Wow, when was the last
time anyone walked down the freezer aisle and smiled.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
Well, it's always so cold, right, So you know you're
walking down the aisle, Yeah, it's always so cold.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
Yeah, you're like, you're not in a good mood, right,
And I thought, wouldn't it be great if people could
like walk by the freezer door and smile or laugh
or want to take their picture with the box. So
I held true to that despite a lot of naysayers,
and I'm glad we did because we just went through
(26:17):
a whole packaging refresh. We've tested some new packaging because
you know, you have to do that, and it's interesting
because our old packaging came up on the top. So
it was nice to see.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
We're going to get some more of these insights quick break.
When we come back, we're going to get ready for
cool or cringe as well.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Okay, we're back with Gail, and I want to shift
gears a little bit and just talk about this idea
that you spent such a big part of your career.
I mean, what for many people would be an entire
career in corporate life, although government and other things too,
and then you reinvent yourself as an entrepreneur. I think
(27:02):
that alone is so inspiring to people as we think
about and I talk about my career having been continuing
to be chapters all the time. But what I think
is so interesting. It was clearly a decision to say
I'm done with that, I want to do this. But
what did corporate life teach you? And maybe what did
you have to unlearn from that? As a founder?
Speaker 3 (27:23):
Oh boy, it taught me a lot, and I was
very blessed in the sense that I worked at some
amazing companies with great leaders. It taught me how to
be fair, It taught me how to be thought provoking,
how to give counsel, how to make impact, and you know,
when I met some incredible people. I think the thing
(27:46):
I had to unlearn, particularly when you're on your own
in the early days, you didn't have a lot of
people to talk to. Like it was myself and my
conscious and my gut and my tears, you know, in
the car thinking you know, what have I done. It's
funny because your instinct is to be tentative and pressure
(28:09):
test it with all of your colleagues. You don't have that,
so you have to trust your gut. You certainly don't
have money to do research or get insights, so you
have to trust your guts and more importantly, you have
to believe in your mission, because if you don't, then
(28:33):
you're never gonna succeed. You're gonna let those naysayers win.
You're gonna always be questioning yourself. So if you just
always remember what you're doing, it for the rest you
know falls very naturally. It's painstaking though, no question, and
it's still painstaking, and just in a different way. Well.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
The perseverance, the listening to your gut, but also staying
fruit a mission, I think is perhaps one of the
ultimate lessons, whether you're helming a big brand or whether
you're helming a brand that you're first inventing yourself. Probably
one of the best pieces of advice with Gail. Thank
you so much. I learned so much from you and
(29:17):
watching your journey has been amazing. Can we switch and
now play a little fun cooler, cringe speed round of you.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
I learned a long time ago just to do whatever
you said. So I'm all yours.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
I love it. I love it.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Oh my gosh. Ifpdingly all right, Steve, and you want
to go for the first.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
One, I'm gonna kick it awesome, Okay, colliflower ice cream?
Cool or cringe?
Speaker 1 (29:41):
Is that real?
Speaker 3 (29:42):
I had someone come to me at Expo West with
a tub of ice cream a spoon and said would
you please try it? And it had cauliflower in it,
and I did and it was good and it was good.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (29:55):
I love to celebrate innovation. That doesn't mean I know
whether consumers will listen, but for someone to try, I
know how hard it was to make that pint, So
it's always gonna be cool.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
All right, enough, all.
Speaker 3 (30:08):
Right my kids?
Speaker 2 (30:11):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (30:11):
Really, Expost, which for people don't know, is one of
the biggest food trade shows. Yes, so let's go there.
Cooler cringe trade shows in twenty twenty five.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
I'm going to another one soon and I just got
back from xbois always cool. It is my happy place.
It's always my happy place. I sit there for three
days and I get to shove pizza in people's mouths.
The best thing is you get to see how they
react because when you're in CpG, you're not in their
(30:45):
homes when they're having dinner, you're not in their homes
when they're using your toothpaste or whatever. You get to
interact with people in real time trying your product. There
is no place I'd rather be.
Speaker 2 (30:57):
I love that. I love that. See that is a
product person there, that is a true founder. And speaking
of founders, you know, I'm curious. You know we asked
this question in our last pot with Shelley's Alice, But
I'm curious. You know you are a founder, you're an entrepreneur.
How do you feel about the label girl boss or
how would you want to be described as a founder?
(31:17):
That cooler? Cringe?
Speaker 3 (31:19):
Girl bosses cringe. I don't like the word girl unless
you're talking about someone who's under eighteen.
Speaker 2 (31:26):
Or how about female founder?
Speaker 3 (31:27):
I think for the moment that we're living in, it's appropriate.
Why because female founders get three percent of all venture
capital dollars, less than three percent, sorry, less than three percent.
So until that number becomes a heck of a lot higher,
(31:48):
we need to call it out. And we need to
support female founders by cheering them on, supporting them on
social media, sharing their stories, buying their products. That's what
we can do. So love that. But do I long
for a day when we don't need that Moniker, when
(32:08):
we don't need International Women's Month or Women's Day or
all of that. You bet I do. And nothing would
make me happier than for colleiae power to be used
as an example of how women can deliver great ROI,
because that is a fact, has nothing to do with colleigepower. Women,
(32:29):
female founders, female lied companies deliver a better ROI than
their male counterparts, full stop. That is not conjecture, that
is fact.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
Aimen to that, Gail, thank you so much for joining us.
Thank you for being an amazing female founder, but truly
an amazing founder. And to that point, I hope everyone
learned a little bit enjoyed hearing about your story. You're
so happy to have had you on.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Thank you, Gil, thank you so much for having me.
Thank you, what a pleasure.
Speaker 2 (33:00):
And now it's time for what's on your minds? And
so this is a really fun, I think thought provoking question, Marisa.
So we have a question from Renee, which is, if
you could have dinner with any business leader, dead or alive,
who would it be.
Speaker 1 (33:19):
I love, I love and hate questions like this because
I always want to say a million different answers. Are
you going first? Or am I I think you go first? Okay,
I'm pausing to think. Okay, here's my answer. I think
it would be off brand for me if I didn't
answer with a great female business leader. So I think, look,
(33:42):
having spent almost a decade of my career, a very
formative part of my career at the Esday Latter Companies,
and having read her autobiography just recently, you know, this
has been going. I've just recently read a piece of
historical fiction that was totally modeled after her. I think
I'd really like to have dinner with Esdae Lauder.
Speaker 2 (34:03):
That's a great answer because.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
She was iconic. It kind of goes from the conversation
we just have with Gail, like would she want to
be seen today as a female founder or just a founder?
And she shares my ethnic identity with me, and I'll say,
this is a woman if you know this word kutzba, right, Like,
she had gumption, she had courage, she had guts, and
she broke through so many so many glass ceilings and
(34:28):
so many doors. So I think that's my answer.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
It's a great one.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
I would have many more, but that's a good one.
How about yours?
Speaker 2 (34:35):
Mine is personal and it's it's a little bit melancholy,
but I would want to really just have the opportunity
to have dinner with a guy by the name of
Danny Lillin, who was the co founder of Akamie, and
he was my friend. He was just an incredible technologist.
But he was the first person coded nine to eleven.
(34:58):
And it was the kind of thing where he was
so brilliant and he was you know PhD in you know,
machine learning computer science from MIT, but built like a
football player, and he was just such an incredible leader
and spirit, and he was funny, and he was intense,
and he pushed you and and you know, he kind
(35:20):
of built so much of the foundational technology of the Internet.
That is, you know, we are all leveraging and using today.
And the incredible irony the day that he died, the
technology that he built staved the Internet. Like literally, you
cannot access a website on nine to eleven if it
wasn't using akamized technology, Like every single site was calling
(35:41):
akama cell. It proved the value of what he built
in spades. But he didn't get to see all of this,
and would just be so curious in this moment that
we're in, obviously with the dawn of the AI era,
for someone like him to see this, I think that
would be this, you know, an incredible, incredible opportunity.
Speaker 1 (36:01):
Well, let us know who you'd have at your dinner
table in terms of great business leaders, Pastor President, I said,
Pastor President, thanks for joining us. If you'd like us
to answer one of your questions, of course, tell us
what's on your mind by emailing us at ideas at
brand dashnew dot com, or you can just drop a
(36:23):
comment on one of our social channels. Thanks for joining us,
and we'll see you next time on brand New
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