10/20/25: Israel Blows Up Ceasefire, US Journo Attacked By Settlers, Rand Paul Shreds Trump On Venezuela, Bolton Indicted & MORE!

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Speaker 2 (00:37):
Indeed, we do a lot to get to. So the
ceasefire in Gaza was back off, now it may be
back on. We're going to take you through the TikTok
of exactly what happened and where we are now, as
best as we can figure it out. We're also going
to be joined by Jasper Nathaniel. You guys may remember him.
We've had him on the show a number of times.
He's a journalist and activist. He's been covering the attacks

(00:57):
on palestin means in the West Bank self was lured
into a trap by the IDF, chased by murderous settlers,
and then the US embassy said, even if you like
need our help, we're not going to help you. So
he is going to join us to break down exactly
what happened, how it connects to broader context of what's
going on with Palestinians and two Palestinians. In addition, we've

(01:20):
got more news in terms of Venezuela, more boats blown up,
more international fallout, more indications that we are rapidly speeding
towards a potential regime change war. John Bolton indicted George Santos,
sentence commuted A while going on, There new revealing Epstein
docs that Saga is going to break down for us
and Showycott Trok Body, who is the former AOC chief

(01:41):
of staff and is now challenging Nancy Pelosi and her
congressional seat, is also going to join us to break
down his race and how he sees the future of
the country, in the future of the Democratic Party. So
a lot of interesting stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:52):
He is a smart guy.

Speaker 3 (01:53):
I've always enjoyed reading and reading some of his takes
and interested to hear some of what he has to
say about that race. Thank you to everybody who's been
supporting the show Breakingpoints dot com. We do you want
to give you an example of why we need your support.
Let's go ahead and put the Crystal screenshot up here on
the screen so you guys can all see. Crystal has
been posting on TikTok, and you can see that multiple

(02:14):
of her posts about Israel are now quote ineligible for recommendation.

Speaker 1 (02:19):
So everybody go follow Crystal, by the way, follows me
as well.

Speaker 3 (02:21):
I have joined TikTok, I've given in I only have
three hundred and fifty followers.

Speaker 4 (02:26):
Just check this up for a second, though. It's kind
of interesting.

Speaker 2 (02:28):
The miraam Adelson one was like literally the only Israel
one that they allowed me to keep up. That Gavin
Newsom one is literally just me throwing to the clip
of Gavin Newsom being like a pac what's that? It's interesting,
that's why you're staying crazy. And so that one and
then two others that I did talking about the ceasefire

(02:48):
deal ineligible for recommendation. So you can see the new
Zionis takeover of TikTok has taken hold, and it is
just a reminder of how vulnerable we are. We rely
on these big tech platforms and you know it's not
always the safe bet to do so. So that's why
your support means a lot to This is what we're

(03:09):
dealing with.

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Crazy, We're alive today on YouTube.

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(03:53):
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Genuinely, you have no idea and being in.

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This business this morning, for example, AWS is how to
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It would be only two podcast platforms, Apple and Spotify
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(04:17):
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much if you can't support us breakingpoints dot com. All right,
let's go ahead and get to the Israel ceasefire and
who the hell even knows what's going on there? It

(04:39):
really is like totally shocking. I think whenever we break
down everything that has happened with the lead up to
the ceasefire, it also really vindicates a lot of people
who are like, hey, just hold on a second before
we're all celebrating. We celebrate how about this, we celebrate
the release of the hostages, which actually did happen the
rest of it wait and see.

Speaker 4 (04:58):
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2 (04:59):
So Saturday, I'm just going to take you through the
timeline of what transpired and brought us to this present moment,
which is right with a lot of uncertainty as it
has been from the beginning.

Speaker 4 (05:09):
Let's got to put a one up on the screen.

Speaker 2 (05:10):
So Saturday, at some point we get this news from
Brock Revied, official stenographer of the US government and the
Israeli government. He says, according to the State Department, the
US has informed the guaranteur nations of the Gaza Peace
Agreement of credible reports indicating an imminent ceasefire violation by
Hamas against the people of Gaza. This planned attack against

(05:33):
Palestine civilians would constitute a direct and grave violation of
the ceasefire agreement and undermine the significant progress.

Speaker 4 (05:40):
Achieved through mediation efforts.

Speaker 2 (05:42):
The guaranteurs demand Hamas uphold its obligation under the ceasefire term.
Should Hamas proceed with this attack, measures will be taken
to protect the people of Gaza and protect the integrity
of the ceasefire. The US and other guaranteurs remain resolute
in our commitment ensuring the safety of civilians, maintaining calm
on the ground, advancing peace and prosperity for the people
of Gaza and the region as a whole. So anyone

(06:05):
who's been covering those looks at that and is like,
oh boy, here we go. They are giving Israel basically
cover to violate the ceasefire agreement. You will also know,
if you've been watching this closely, that Israel has been
violating the ceasefire agreement effectively since that agreement went into effect.
More on that in a moment. Then we see, let's

(06:25):
put a two up on the screen. There was some
incident that occurred, okay, and initially there was a lot
of confusion about who killed who and what exactly happened.
We got some clarity on that. I'll get to that
in a moment. But in response to this incident, Israel
begins bombing Gaza in what they describe here as a
major ceasefire violation. Heavy Israeli bombing rocks the Gaza strip

(06:49):
on Sunday, they write, killing at least fifteen Palestinians in
a major violation the ceasefire. More than one hundred airstrikes
were reported in Rafa and Conunis in the south, Jibali
in the north, and parts of central Gaza among the
hit where a cafe, a mobile phone charging station, a
group of journalists, and a house sheltering displays people. The
Israeli military said the strikes were in response to an
alleged attack by Palestinians on its troops in southern Rafa,

(07:12):
involving a rocket propelled grenade and sniper fire. Israel's Channel
twelve for the More said political leadership has also decided
to halt the entry of humanitarian aid into Gaza until
further notice. So we have Israel bombing wild throughout the strip,
the south central part of the strip and the northern
part of the strip, saying they're going to cut off

(07:33):
all aid. Okay, that was again another key part of
the ceasfiregroup was as least six hundred trucks would be
entering per day, and they said at this point we're
also not going to open the Rafa border crossing, which
I don't think that they've opened to this point. Anyway,
Go ahead and put a four up on the screen
because Ryan and actually also Sager were able to get
the news of what this incident actually was, so Ryan

(07:55):
writes here. Soon after the explosion in Rafa, I'm told
by a source familiar the White House and pan Got
knew that the incident that again Israelis were using as
a pretext to do an all out, once again assault
on the Gaza Strip. That this was caused by an
Israeli settler bulldozer running over an unexplored exploded ordinance, contradicting
neat Yaw who's claimed that Hamas had popped up from

(08:17):
tunnels after net Noaw who said he was blocking all
AID from entering Gaza and response and unleashed a bombing campaign.
The Administration conveyed to Israel, they know what happened net now,
who then announced he would reopen the crossings in a
few hours. So Sager, the long and short of that
is again their bulldozer ran over one of their unexploded ordinances.

Speaker 4 (08:36):
So they basically blew.

Speaker 2 (08:38):
Themselves up, claimed it was Hamas, and used that as
a pretext to cut off all aid collective punishment wildly illegal,
obviously and brutal and cruel and in contrary to the
seas Fire agreement, and go back to all out.

Speaker 4 (08:52):
Assault on the Gaza Strip.

Speaker 2 (08:53):
Now, the Administration deserves credit here because they apparently came
and said, no, we understand what happened. This was not
Hamas and you were going to We're going to go
back to the seas file. The seasefire is going to
be in forced. Now they only get so much credit
because Israel's already violated the seas fire roughly literally roughly
fifty times. But as best we can tell, that is
the chain of events, and it underscores how Israel wants.

Speaker 4 (09:16):
To go back to the genocide.

Speaker 2 (09:18):
And this thing is incredibly, incredibly fragile. It requires constant
vigilance from this administration to keep it even approximating being
on the.

Speaker 1 (09:27):
Range, which is the issue. That's the thing. Ntsagnah.

Speaker 3 (09:29):
So Trump is in one of his moods where he
wants peace, which is good.

Speaker 1 (09:34):
Listen, I'll take it it's one of those.

Speaker 3 (09:35):
Apparently he berated Zelenski in a meeting for over two
and a half hours and said, listen, man, you're either
going to lose, You're gonna have to give up and
decide not to give him long range missiles. That seems
to be the mood that he's in on Friday. We'll
see how it lasts until Sunday. But what the Israelis
are banking on is eventually we'll get away with this,
and I think they're right. I mean, it's one of
those where consider the amount of management that it's going

(09:56):
to take on the US side to have to debunk
every is really claim or like, for example, is every
single time that the Israelis want to restart it? Are
we just going to have to put Jared Kushner and
Steve Wikoff on a plane, which they are right now
if anybody's wondering, They're left Miami and are on their
way to Israel to try and to solidify the ceasefire.
The amount of attention that this is going to take,

(10:17):
not just from the low level, but from the very
top of the administration, because the only person that can
actually stop Nettagnyahu is Trump himself, So you have to
elevate it through the inner agency process, send it up
to Trump. There's just no way, we know this White House,
there's no way that they can stick to this for
days and months and years on end, and this is
the eventual endgame. Meanwhile, I mean, should we all sit
with this? They straight up lied as usual about this bulldozer,

(10:40):
but Here's the issue is this time, I'm not exactly
sure how the US had like perfect intelligence, and they
were immediately telling reporters like Ryan, Kurt Mills and others,
They're like, this is bullshit.

Speaker 1 (10:50):
It didn't happen. What about when it's ambiguous we have
no idea?

Speaker 2 (10:53):
Well, what about when Hamas genuinely does, like I mean,
they are on a campaign contribution, like we already saw
Israel trying to use that as a reason to break
the season.

Speaker 3 (11:02):
I want to sit with that because that was kind
of the original parts of the ceasefire violation. If we
look to the very top at some of the things
that the Stage Department had said, they said, quote, a
planned attack against Palestinian civilians would constitute a direct and
grave violation of the ceasefire, which is incredibly ironic considering
what the Israelis have done. Let's sit with what Trump
himself said, which Ryan and I covered on our show

(11:24):
last Wednesday. Trump endorsed Hamas retribution. He said, I don't
have a problem with it, to be honest with you,
because they were killing I mean, according to them, nobody
really knows, but they were killing people who were either quote,
collaborators or people who stole killed children for food and
sold it on the black market.

Speaker 4 (11:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (11:43):
I think Trump also just got gangs and was like,
of course you got to get yeah, get get.

Speaker 1 (11:49):
Rid of them.

Speaker 3 (11:49):
I mean, listen, you know, in the absence of law
and order, somebody has to fill the void. So for Hamas,
this gets to a much bigger thing, which my original
take had been before the Israeli lie had been who
is going to govern Gaza? And when I say govern,
I'm not even talking about the high level political entity.
True governance starts at the street level. If you were

(12:10):
a looter and you sold food on the black market,
well somebody has to deal with you. Right now, the
only person is Hamas. Who are the troops that are
going to enforce that you said you want them to
lay down their weapons. They have ruled that place for
what eighteen nineteen years now almost at this time, there

(12:31):
is no police or other government authority. So if the
solution is debatification, like we did in Iraq, we take
all the weapons away, civil war chaos, which is exactly
what they're advocating for. They're like Humas, you have to
unilaterally disarm. Meanwhile, the pro Israel gangs get to keep
their weapons.

Speaker 1 (12:51):
Well, what do you think is going to happen?

Speaker 3 (12:52):
Then they're going to go and they're going to kill everybody,
and then who's going to defend them?

Speaker 1 (12:56):
So of course they're going to come up rise.

Speaker 3 (12:58):
So without a centralized government authority and a literal occupation
by the United States, the UAE or Saudi Arabia, this
is the end state which we've all desired, and it's
not one that I think that people are going to
put up with because in a lot of ways, it
all starts now. Like the war, as horrible as it was,
the actual next step starts today with the political civilian

(13:19):
administration of the Gaza Strip, and so the demand that
Almas not carry out its law and order executions or
whatever has to be then replaced by some sort of
central figure, some sort of central backed legitimate authority, or
you're going to have Iraq and Afghanistan all over again,
which are already on the road to and then same

(13:39):
with the Israelis. They're legitimately, I think, going to be
able to claim chaos and attacks on them because nobody
can stop it.

Speaker 1 (13:46):
Nobody is going to.

Speaker 3 (13:47):
Say, oh, you don't carry out at tacks on no
one's going to go and arrest somebody's going to go
in and attacks roll right. So the vacuum, the same
terrorist vacuum that created isis that created al Qaeda in Iraq,
that create I mean who The entire story of Afghanistan
is about to play out again. I actually think it's
going to be, frankly like just as disastrous because you

(14:07):
not only have a bombed out place, you have one
point seven one point eight million people whoever is left
is alive, that are desperate for anything. I mean people
in those sorts of desperate straits, they'll go along with
you know, the most radical party if they can stop
shooting and looting. That's how the Taliban rose to power, Yeah,
in the nineteen nineties. So I see a lot of dangers.
I see a lot of dangers that had inside of Godsma.

Speaker 2 (14:29):
And it's just so clear, Like if you had any
doubt that the Israelis didn't want to just find any
excuse at any point to get back to all out war,
I think like.

Speaker 4 (14:38):
That should be completely dispelled.

Speaker 2 (14:40):
At first, you had, you know, this flap over, Oh
they're not getting us the remains of the hostages quickly enough,
even though in the ceasefire deal. Everyone understood this is
going to be very difficult. And by the way, the
Israelies are blocking any like heavy equipment, earth moving equipment
to be able to dig out anything from the rubble,
So how are you suppor to pull this off? So

(15:00):
that's the first thing that they try. Oh Hamas is
violating the seasefire in that way again as an excuse
so that they can get back to.

Speaker 4 (15:06):
Their all out war.

Speaker 2 (15:07):
Then you have the you know them, Oh, suddenly they
care so much about Palestinian civilian life and they're just
appalled at what Hamas is doing in the streets and
the campaign of retribution.

Speaker 4 (15:18):
Then you have.

Speaker 2 (15:18):
Whatever this thing was with the bulldozer where and it's
really interesting to me too, saga that the State Department had.

Speaker 4 (15:25):
Some sort of a warning of an imminent ceasefire.

Speaker 2 (15:27):
Violation, and then they they you know, use this bulldozer
thing as a pretext where they just literally like blew
themselves up with their own ordinance, unexploded ordinance, lie about it,
get caught, and so you know, this administration has to
come and enforce and what the Israelis do and what
they have been doing. Let's put a three up on

(15:48):
the screen again. This was before this bulldozer situation. This
Israeli army had already committed forty seven violations of the ceasefire,
killing thirty eight people, wounding another one hundred and forty three.
One of those instances, they killed eleven members of a
Palestinian family deadly, a single violation of the ceasefire that
took effect at that point eight days ago. Among them

(16:10):
were seven children that were killed in that attack. So
you know what they do. They and they're doing the
same thing in Lebanon. They see what they can get
away with, and they keep pushing the envelope, keep pushing
the envelope. And so they went a little too far
with this bulldozer bullshit. They got schecked a little bit,
but they're going to keep trying, keep pushing, keep pushing,
keep pushing. And that's why, you know, forget about Phase

(16:32):
two and governance and reconstruction and all of that is
so far off, and they are so far at odds
from any shared vision between you know, the US, Palestinians
and Israel. But even just maintaining this very new ceasefire
feels increasingly, i don't want to say impossible, but extraordinarily
extraordinarily difficult.

Speaker 1 (16:53):
It's good.

Speaker 3 (16:53):
Look, I mean, I would say impossible in the long run,
just consiuering a long poli. Yeah, Israel, it just seems, frankly,
like so difficult. I'll read you another quote just from
yesterday Israeli television from Ben Gavie quote. Now we have
received the hostages, we must return to war and open
the gates of hell upon Gaza.

Speaker 1 (17:12):
That's a national security advisor.

Speaker 3 (17:14):
Okay, Smotriz said what he said, we will have Jewish
settlement inside of Gaza.

Speaker 1 (17:19):
Let's sit with the reality of.

Speaker 2 (17:22):
All that now, and how are they going to react
when it's increasingly clear Hamas is just back in charge
because who.

Speaker 4 (17:26):
Else is going to be in charge? Which is they're
the only ones.

Speaker 3 (17:29):
It's funny because it's like a horseshoe moment with the
Israeli right wing where they're like.

Speaker 1 (17:34):
Well, wait, we can't.

Speaker 3 (17:35):
The whole point of the war was to say Hamas
is no longer in charge, and then for many of
us to be like, yeah, that was an impossible goal,
but they're like, no, but we have to continue the war.
And so the fact that Hamas still has at least
some political administration capability will democratic support to enforce something
on the ground. Shows you already that the war itself
was a failure. Again, it's impossible without occupation. We've tried

(17:56):
this a million times throughout history. The Israelis have no
interest in actual civil only administration of Gaza. They'd rather
just small leaf and so in the absence than now
what you know, the Uaea, Saudi Arabia, the US would
have to step up.

Speaker 1 (18:07):
I'm not for that at all.

Speaker 3 (18:08):
I don't think we should occupy, you know, Israel's mass
inside of Gaza. So what's going to happen just hectoring
tweets from the State Department and threats of death from
the Israelis, And it's a constant mowing the lawn effect.
Now with Trump, you know himself, he's got these grand plans.
So here was this most recent interview with Maria Bartrioma
over on Fox News about his plan for Gaza.

Speaker 5 (18:27):
Let's take a listen could be developed, and you said
you wanted to develop it for that.

Speaker 6 (18:33):
Not me as an individual, the US. I liked it
as like freedom place, you call it freedom Place, and
we would get all of the people that live there
into decent homes throughout the region. If you look, Egypt
has a lot of land, Jordan has a lot of land,

(18:55):
you know, right next to a lot of countries have
a lot of land. Had an initial vision that we
would uh get them look at gas. You know, there's
nothing standard.

Speaker 7 (19:08):
The whole thing is so rubble.

Speaker 6 (19:10):
So it's not too hard to top that.

Speaker 3 (19:13):
So he says, a freedom place, you could call it again,
not possible.

Speaker 1 (19:17):
You need full blown occupation.

Speaker 3 (19:19):
You need a US administration of Japan of Germany. And
those are the only two successful ones. Not every recent
experiment that we have done, it didn't work. The likely
modal outcome in the Middle East is we destroy a regime,
we decimate and e miserate the population, and then we
have a long experiment where we try to impose something

(19:39):
and then eventually the most radical element inside of that
society will probably rise to the top, very top. Yeah,
so congratulations.

Speaker 2 (19:46):
Well, and as someone who's you know, opposed to immigration
and really you know, makes a lot of his politics
around that, he sure does like to create migration crises,
you know, so switching millions of people whoever remains in
the Gaza strip out of God, I mean, it's just
and the phase two of this, I don't even it's
really not even worth bothering to talk about, to be

(20:08):
honest with you, because it's so prepostive. This Tony Blair
and Trump's the head of the board and no Palestinians
will be able to stay. But then here's the president
again being like, no, they're gonna leave. They're gonna have
great homes in other countries where I don't know they've
got room in Egypt. Surely Egypt has its own political
major political issues, by the way.

Speaker 4 (20:24):
Major economic issues, like they're not.

Speaker 2 (20:27):
Super keen on absorbing a population that is destitute and
completely and thoroughly traumatized, Like every single individual in Gaza
is going to need so much care and assistance to
get them back to being able to function in society.
I mean, it's just insane what's been done to these peo.
You can't even wrap your head around a let alone
the children, the medical care, you know, the lack of nutrition,

(20:48):
the amputations, and so not only is it, you know,
a difficult situation when you have migration crisis anyway, but
then you have this incredibly traumatized, you know, like population
suffering from all the healthcare anyway, the whole thing is insane,
Like there's no contemplating of what this could look like
in any way that's going to be livable for Palestinines,

(21:08):
let alone just the Israelis have no interest in doing
anything other than complete war and ethnic cleansing until there's
nothing left, because at this point, that's what they see
as a final solution, Like that is on the table,
and not just for far right total psychos, that has
become a far more acceptable endpoint for a broad swath

(21:29):
of the Israeli population. And that's what this administration like.
They will have to be so focused and committed and
willing to use all the levers that they have to
force some sort of an outcome on the Israelis. And yeah,
it's hard to imagine.

Speaker 1 (21:43):
It's theoretically possible.

Speaker 3 (21:44):
I don't personally see it as I mean, look at Ukraine,
we were Yeah, Zelenski comes to the Oval, we berate him.
It looks like the war is going to end. We
finally get Putin's summit. Then afterwards we have this grand
meeting of all the Europeans. Nothing comes happens, absolutely nothing
changes on the battlefield. Trump gets mad at Putin, says

(22:04):
I'm going to give you the Ukrainians long range missiles.

Speaker 1 (22:07):
So that's where we were ending up.

Speaker 3 (22:09):
He actually even said maybe Ukraine can take back all
of Crimea, so that's where we were.

Speaker 1 (22:13):
Then Ukraine.

Speaker 3 (22:14):
Zelenski comes to Washington, and this is all from behind
the scenes reporting. We're not exactly sure, probably most of
it ly from the Ukrainian side. Trump rates him for
two hours, has a phone call with Putin and says,
why don't you just take all of Putin's terms?

Speaker 1 (22:25):
So we're back. I mean, I don't know which way
we went.

Speaker 8 (22:28):
Now.

Speaker 3 (22:28):
Imagine being on the Israel side, right, if you're the
Hamas people, Yeah, you took the deal. The hostages are gone,
but the incentive side on the Israel on Israel is
now they don't even have to care to pretend about
the hostages, that's right anymore. And I mean the Seaspire
has been what like ten days, and they've tried to
break it three times, seriously tried to break it.

Speaker 1 (22:46):
Yeah, three times. How is this going to last for
two years, three years, five years, ten?

Speaker 4 (22:49):
I mean, yeah, Israel still controls fifty three percent.

Speaker 3 (22:53):
So and then yeah, you have the civilian problem that
I talked about with literal like law enforcement. And yes,
it's great that aid is going to be there. Eventually,
somebody's going to beat somebody up for something. Who's going
to do anything about that, You're gonna have cops like, no,
you're gonna call somebody, and then you're gonna have rise
of gang violence like that's what happens in these scenarios
we've had. Unfortunately, we've played it over and over and

(23:14):
over again. You don't even have to be all that,
you know, intelligent to see where things are going.

Speaker 1 (23:18):
So anyway, all right.

Speaker 3 (23:19):
Speaking of gang violence, the Jasper Nathaniel journalist, American journalist
has been in the West Bank, ruthlessly attacked by these
Jewish settlers inside of the West Bank, basically told to
fend for himself by the United States Embassy.

Speaker 1 (23:32):
So let's go out.

Speaker 4 (23:33):
By the United States Embassy.

Speaker 1 (23:35):
Let's be honest, let's speak to him.

Speaker 2 (23:39):
We are very fortunate to be joined this morning by
Jasper Nathaniel, who is an incredible journalist.

Speaker 4 (23:43):
You guys should go subscribe to his substack.

Speaker 2 (23:45):
Infinite Jazz and a great front of the show who
just witnessed and experienced something incredibly wild.

Speaker 4 (23:50):
Jasper, great to.

Speaker 7 (23:51):
Have you, thanks for having me.

Speaker 1 (23:53):
Good to see you.

Speaker 9 (23:53):
Man.

Speaker 2 (23:54):
So I saw these videos on social media of you
being chased down by a mob of violent Israeli terrorist settlers,
and we can put some of these images up on
the screen. And you, of course have been documenting abuses
against Palestinians in the West Bank for months at this point,
if you could just take us through where you are

(24:15):
and what the hell we're looking at here.

Speaker 7 (24:18):
Yeah, I'm in a town called Termisayah, which is just
outside Romama in the in the central West Bank. This
is the first day of the olive harvest for the village. Basically,
everybody went out together as a group because they knew
they were expecting settler violence, and so everybody drove in

(24:41):
a caravan to their to their individual plots. And basically
from the very beginning of the day we were seeing
violent settlers. The first road we tried to take there
was a settler with a gun to sort of menacing us.

(25:01):
But then things got really bad later when we were
trying to leave the fields and we got tracked by.
On one side there was a couple of settlers who
would not let us pass, and then on the other
side there was an IDF jeep, and so I got
out of our car to go up to talk to

(25:22):
the soldiers because the people I was with were they
were not white, their Palestinian Americans actually, which is an
important point, but I was the only white person basically,
So so I got out in my hands up walked
up the hill to talk to them. They're aiming their
guns at me, which is pretty much how soldiers talk

(25:43):
to you in the West Bank. And I shouted to
them like we we are being trapped by settlers who
are not letting us out and we need safe passage.
And they started saying, what are you doing here, blah
blah blah. I get so a little back and forth,
and I convinced them like we're really just trying to
get out and we need your help, and they said, fine, okay,

(26:04):
you can come. So I went back in the car.
We drove up. They told us the soldiers said wait here.
So we waited maybe a minute, and then the army
jeep just sped off out of nowhere and left. There
was two settlers on an ATV, one of them with
a gun, and a couple other Palestinians, and basically, to

(26:28):
fast forward a little bit, the other car had been
smashed and had its tires slashed by settlers, and they
were having trouble getting out, and so I was trying
to help that car get out when the videos you
just showed about one hundred or so settlers just emerged
from the hills and I just started running. We all

(26:53):
started running. I mean they originally tried to go in
the car, but in the video you can see the
car gets overtaken. They dragged the driver and the passenger
out and they both miraculously escaped, and we basically ran
for our lives. And when I got back down to

(27:13):
the car that I had been in, one of the
settler who is basically right on my tail, who is
the guy who you see in the video in the
in the another video which maybe you'll show, really big
guy with a really big club. Okay, so basically he
smashed through our windshield and then he runs ahead, and

(27:36):
that's a video of him just beating an old lady,
an elderly lady who had been picking olives. He knocked
her unconscious with the club and then he hit her
twice more when she was on the ground, and then
he kept running and then he beat two activists actually
to European activists and I went to help the lady.

(27:57):
This is that scene right now. She has a brain hemorrhage.
Is last I heard. She was in the ICU. But
she had stabilized, so that's good news. But it was
just total chaos. I mean, it was pandemonium. And you know,
this is funny, funnily enough. This is a wealthier town

(28:23):
in the West Bank that is eighty five percent American
citizens actually, so it's people back and forth, and they've
been pretty insulated from a lot of what certainly what
like the Shepherding villages and the Hebron Hills face because
you know, they have money and they have blue passports,

(28:44):
and only in the last couple of years had they
really started to feel the heat. And I think that
yesterday was a very clear indication that the I mean
this was a message sent by the settlers in coordination
with the IDF that you are we will hunt you

(29:09):
down and will hurt you or will kill you, and
I will do it on your own land. And nobody
is spared, not old ladies, not American journalists, not farmers,
anybody in our path, anybody on their own land will
be clubbed. And you know. This is like if I

(29:31):
wasn't there yesterday, nobody would know about this, or maybe
it would be a little story. Is happening everywhere every
single day in the West Bank, and it's it's one
of those things where it's like, it's really hard to
explain just how shocking and brazen and cruel it is.

(29:53):
And I don't just mean like the scene itself that
you know you see on video, which I guess is
pretty shocking, but like, these settlers have literally stolen their
agricultural land and occupied their farmhouses. So they've built like
these nice and when I say farmhouse, think more like

(30:15):
small mansion. I mean again, these are like wealthy people.
They put a lot of money into building up little
homes in they're awa fields, and the settlers are now
living in them and launching attacks on the homes owners
from those houses.

Speaker 2 (30:31):
And in collaboration with the IDF, which is another important
part of your story, Jasper.

Speaker 3 (30:36):
Can I also add a corollary, Hey, Jasper, where are
all these settlers from?

Speaker 1 (30:39):
Did you hear any familiar accents?

Speaker 7 (30:42):
I didn't hear anybody talking. They had masks on and
they did not say a word, So that's a good question.
I mean, they're probably from all over. Some of them
are probably from Israel, some of them could be Russian American,
that could be from anywhere. Sorry, Chrystal, can you repeat
your question?

Speaker 2 (31:01):
Oh I just said an important part of your story is, oh, yes,
rogue actors, because that's the way you know, oftentimes in
Western media or you know, Joe Biden's administration sanctioned a
couple of these most psychotic characters. They like they're they're
fringe characters, but in fact, and your story demonstrates this,
they're they are working in collaboration directly with the government

(31:22):
and with IDF assistance.

Speaker 7 (31:25):
Yes, I mean bigger picture, like, the Israeli government provides
an unbelievable amount of financial backing and you know, political
backing to the most violent settlers, including the actual murderers.
They often arm them, they give them, they they you know,
these settlers, what they do is they peel off from

(31:47):
a settlement and they basically like put down a tent
somewhere and raising is really flag, and then the tent
becomes two tents, and then a little home is built
and something that got controlled this whole area and even
under Israeli law, outposts are illegal because you need to
get you know, authorization to build a settlement. But Smotrich,

(32:08):
what he's been doing. The finance minister in Israel is
offering retroactive authorization to outposts. So the people who are
out here stealing land, terrorizing Palestinians are are getting full
backing from the government and doing this in terms of
the IDF. Well, listen, the most generous reading for what

(32:34):
happened yesterday, just for you know, to to give them
the benefit of the doubt, is that they really fucked up.
They sorry, excuse my language, but they didn't okay, they
didn't know that there were one hundred settlers hiding just
you know, in the trees. And maybe they thought that

(32:54):
the two settlers that were already there, you know, even
though one had a gun, they thought, I'll probably just
leave on his And it was just like they messed
up and they left us to get attacked. My experience
was that they led us up, left and then immediately
the settlers came out from the hills and chased me

(33:17):
and chased us. And I want to also say, like
two weeks ago I wrote a story about Palestinian Americans
who have been killed in the West Bank, and I
went with their families to Washington, d C. As they,
you know, in a completely futile effort, sought accountability. And

(33:42):
a number of those kids who were killed have been
killed right around where I am, because again, this is
where a lot of the Americans live. So so right
now I'm staying at the house of Mohammed Ibrahim, who
is the sixteen year old Palestinian American who's currently in
is really military detention. He's been there for over eight

(34:02):
months now. His first cousin is se Fla Mussela, who
was beaten to death by a band of settlers, probably
exactly like the ones that were chasing me, could even
be some of the same people. About a couple kilometers
away from here is where Fla was beaten to death.
Telfiek was shot dead by an Israeli sniper about a

(34:27):
five minute drive from here. So I mean, we I
am really in the heart of where the Americans are
are are killed, the Palestinian Americans are killed, and you know,
so what what we witnessed yesterday, or what I witnessed yesterday,
this is what happens here. This is what they do.

(34:47):
I mean, you know, it's a it's a lynch mob.
And and I'll tell you they're terrifying. I mean, these
guys are terrifying, and they have guns, and people know
they are not afraid to kill, and they're not afraid
to club old ladies, and so it is it's quite

(35:11):
effective what they do. Now, I'll just add the residents
of these towns also understand that not only do they
want to get to their olive trees because it's you know,
in part, it's their livelihood. There's other places I should
say they are much more dependent on their oblives. Here
since there's a little more money, it's a little bit
less so, but there's still a deep symbolic value. But

(35:33):
what they think is that if they stop going out
into the fields and they let the settlers just run
the hills, they'll be coming for the village next. Settlers
famously are never satisfied. They get all the agriculture in
and then what they're going to see is a lot
of beautiful homes.

Speaker 3 (35:53):
And they're going to go for the I do want
to make sure, I mean, I think you know, your
testimony is incredible. I also do want to make sure
we talk about the role of the US embassy here.
Can we put B to B please on the screen,
just to show your exchange text message exchange here with
the US embassy. You said, we've talked about We've told
these relies that they plan. You say, we need American protection.

(36:14):
We are Americans. You repeatedly say, I am an American tourist.
Can you protect me? And they say, no, the protection
of American citizens the responsibility the host nation government. You reply,
are you implying the Israelly government will protect me and
other Americans here?

Speaker 1 (36:25):
I don't understand.

Speaker 3 (36:26):
The IDF directly led us into an ambush and they reply,
that is what is supposed to happen. Yeah, so effectively
they told you dropped dead. They said, we will do
absolutely nothing for you. You know, you are a United States citizen.
You are also in the home of people who have
duels or I guess American citizenship. You're in a village
with a lot of American citizen and these people are
being left completely completely out there by their own government.

Speaker 7 (36:49):
There's sixty thousand Pelstinian Americans in the West Bank, and
most of them are in this area, and they get zero,
zero protection from the United States, from the State Department.
And you know, if you if you look at those
text messages. He says to me, it's the host nation's
responsibility to protect American Taurus. And if they don't do it,

(37:14):
we pull our embassy from there, like we did with
Syria and with Venezuela, and I think Yemen. So and
then he acknowledges Israel is actually failing to protect Americans.
So by his logic, they should have pulled the embassy
out of Jerusalem. But instead, of course, you know, Huckabee
is as close as ever with Nan Yahoo, and I
do not believe we're considering pulling out the embassy. So look,

(37:38):
I don't need to explain the just like gross double
standards with America's kid gloves that I use with Israel,
or just the relationship. But I have to say, you know,
I was not subtle there. I told them before that exchange.
We spoke on the phone and I said to it

(37:58):
he had seen the video. I can't reveal the guy's
name because it was off the record, but I said, listen, man,
I was very close to being killed. Like if those
guys caught me. We saw what they did with the
old lady, what do you think they would have done
with me? And I'm going back out to the fields
tomorrow to document it and I need you to protect me,

(38:20):
and they said no. So there it is.

Speaker 2 (38:23):
I want to put before up on the screen to
your point about like there are no safe places, save people, nothing.
So this is this Christian village that Huckabee had previously
made a big deal about and gone to visit and
now being attacked also by Israeli saddlers. I saw a
video in this you know, you were speaking to someone

(38:44):
the same about like for people who don't know, you know,
a long time activist practice has been to as a
Westerner or white person or an American to be present
during the harvest during other critical times, because there was
a sense that like, okay, well they won't murder the
American journalist, surely, so this will provide some level of

(39:05):
protection to the Palestinians, or they won't murder the European activist,
so this will provide some level of protection. And that
that thinking like that is no longer the case. Anyone
and everything is a target. There's total impunity.

Speaker 4 (39:18):
You know.

Speaker 2 (39:19):
It's like they know that they could they could have
murdered that old lady and there would never be any
they would never be tried for it.

Speaker 4 (39:25):
They certainly wouldn't be convicted for it.

Speaker 2 (39:27):
There would be no justice from the Israeli justice system
for anyone who is other than you know, a Jewish Israeli.
So is that your experience as well, that you know
American journalists or European activists, they are now just as
much a target and nothing is off the table in
the way that perhaps they used to be.

Speaker 7 (39:46):
It's funny because right before this, well, to answer your question, yes,
that's always been my experience. But however, just before this,
I was back in the Alba fields and I actually
just posted this video on Twitter immediately before coming on.
I was back in the fields on the exactly where
I was attacked yesterday, exactly where the old woman was

(40:08):
clubbed yesterday. And it's a peaceful day there. There's no
settlers around, and the idea is patrolling and going up
to the olive farmers and asking if they're okay or
if they need anything. Now do I think sincere No.
Do I think it's gonna last forever? Absolutely not. But
it's very clear why this is happening. And I know

(40:30):
for a fact because as I was there, a police
commander appointed to me. He recognized me from the video.
He wanted to talk to me. They're doing the you know,
I'm gonna call the charade of an investigation. Maybe they
can prove me wrong.

Speaker 3 (40:46):
You know.

Speaker 7 (40:46):
They insisted that they're taking it very seriously. They were
also so disturbed by the video of me getting chased
and the old way to getting hit. They're gonna go
after that man and get him. And I said to them, look,
prove me wrong. You know, I've never seen it happen.
I just came from Masafriyata where Aude Hatheline was murdered

(41:07):
by Yenon Levy. You know, Levy is still walking free.
He's still doing construction there. Violence settlers don't get arrested.
Prove me wrong. So look, do I think that what
happened yesterday and the coverage of it is going to
you know, change everything. Absolutely not. But but my point
is it does show that the Israeli government or the

(41:30):
Israeli military or both, they are responsive to to this
kind of thing. Now, we've all watched what they've done
in Gaza for the last two years. Obviously, you know,
they've they've committed just horrific genocide and have largely just
like batted away, you know, shamelessly battered away every accusation

(41:51):
against them. But in this case, it could not have
been more clear that the fact that all these people
saw what happened is why they had safe day of
harvesting their alives today. And so I think that, you know,
there's a balance between wanting to fully acknowledge what you're saying, Crystal,
which is that the settlers, the violence settlers, act with

(42:11):
complete impunity. But there is evidence that if we showed
the world the kind of violence and brutality that they're facing,
you know, maybe they'll have a day of good harvesting,
which is some pressure.

Speaker 4 (42:25):
That's an important point.

Speaker 2 (42:26):
All right, guys, everybody needs to subscribe to Jasper, Subsidak,
Infinite Jazz over at Substak and Jasper.

Speaker 4 (42:33):
Please please be safe, and.

Speaker 2 (42:35):
You know we really appreciate your work and your physical
and intellectual courage.

Speaker 7 (42:39):
Good to see you, man, thanks for having me.

Speaker 3 (42:45):
Turning down to Venezuela, some very troubling stuff. A new
statement from the president saying that Maduro offered everything, but
that that's not enough.

Speaker 1 (42:53):
Let's take a lesson.

Speaker 8 (42:54):
Madudo offered everything in his country, all their natural resources.

Speaker 3 (42:59):
He even recorded message in English recently offering mediation.

Speaker 8 (43:03):
He has offered everything.

Speaker 6 (43:07):
He's offered everything. You're right, you know why, because he
doesn't want to fuck around with the United States.

Speaker 1 (43:13):
Then take it, take the take the deal. All right,
it's a good deal.

Speaker 3 (43:18):
We get some oil, they get through some sanctions, relief,
we all move on with our lives. There's no more
Venezuelan migrants trekking their way to the United States.

Speaker 1 (43:26):
I like it. It's a good deal. And instead, I have.

Speaker 3 (43:29):
No idea what has pervaded this. I would really love
and this I'm not trying to say. I'm not trying
to blame not blame Trump, but something in his information
environment has changed, or at least around Venezuela. Because remember,
this is the administration which had Rick Grennell, who, by
the way, is one of the better members of the administration.
He's the guy who he's the US Special hostage Envoy.

(43:51):
He negotiated with Maduro for the release of some citizens.
He was directly engaging with Maduro apparently about some future deal.

Speaker 1 (44:00):
Things were actually on the right track. But then here's
what happened.

Speaker 3 (44:02):
Mike Waltz, the retard in chief of the National Security Council,
got himself fired. Marco Rubio got himself selected for the
National Security Advisor, the first person since Kissinger to be
the dual NSA Secretary of State. He runs American foreign
policy to a degree again not seen since the Kissinger days.

Speaker 1 (44:21):
And I warned about this from day one.

Speaker 3 (44:22):
I was like, guys Rubio, because everyone said, guys Sacker,
don't worry about it. Rubio is a reform neo Khan.
I said, maybe maybe on Ukraine, or at the very
least not reform. He'll listen to what he's told on Ukraine,
he'll listen to what he's told on other areas. But
I and I again Bookmarket, you can go watch what
I said on the lectury in podcast, I was like,
what I am deeply worried about is Venezuela. It's an issue,

(44:44):
which I know because I know the South Florida. Floridians.
They're obsessed. It's monomoniacal. And they don't have the requisite
level of pushback in Washington because we haven't seen these
psychos in power since the nineteen eighties, so everyone's kind
of forgotten how obsessed they are with Latin America.

Speaker 1 (44:59):
I knew the political constituency.

Speaker 3 (45:01):
He's the guy who'd been pushing for regime change in
twenty nineteen, the whole Hawangai Do situation. He posted that
photo of Gaddafi next to Maduro, like this is deep
for him for his ideology. So he comes into power
and immediately somehow has convinced Trump again despite the fact
there's no data that Maduro is like the chief ventanyl
smuggler of Latin America, which no, it's called Mexico. It's

(45:25):
the Mexican drug cartels. Those are the people who are
sending ventanyl here, has nothing to do with Venezuela. And
yet he's somehow convinced him that this is the number
one fentanyl smuggler of the United States. Now we're bombing
all this Caribbean, you know, the Caribbean waters, International waters,
doing all these crazy drone strikes, which I think Trump
makes him feel good right to do that. But the
thing is is that there's a far cry between that

(45:48):
now green lighting the CIA regime changeops, which he covered
our last show, and then also now openly demanding basically
his removal from power, like we are if you and
we're going to about to go through all the other
stuff with the with the military.

Speaker 1 (46:02):
The media is not taking this stuff seriously.

Speaker 3 (46:04):
This is genuinely the closest that we have come to
actual legit regime change wark probably since you Rock, and
I think everybody is just everybody just kind of thinks
it won't happen.

Speaker 1 (46:15):
It's like the.

Speaker 3 (46:16):
Pieces are all there, guys, it's like December two over here,
except nobody is on Fox News or nobody frankly in
the legitimate media. They're you know, trying to They're pointing
out the different chest pieces as if they're individual. Right,
US admiral fired drone strike. You're like, no, put the totality.
Look at where things are going, Like we're looking to
the checkmate scenario.

Speaker 4 (46:36):
They're very bad at that in general.

Speaker 2 (46:38):
And I mean part of what is so troubling about
what Trump says there about like, yeah, they offered us
everything is because I think the reasonable cope would be like, oh,
he's just doing all this to pressure them to get
some kind of a deal. So if you're saying, like, oh, no,
they offered me the deal of my dreams, but I'm
still I'm still going to bomb random I'm still gonna
authorize the CIA to do covert regime change, like then

(47:01):
there's no off ramp. Like if he offered you, quote
unquote everything and you're still moving forward, that is an incredibly,
incredibly dire indication.

Speaker 4 (47:12):
You know, I don't know. I've been trying to think.

Speaker 2 (47:14):
About this too, because there are pieces of it that
don't totally make sense.

Speaker 4 (47:20):
So I think you're right.

Speaker 2 (47:21):
I think in this administration in particular, some of these
characters have realized that Trump isn't going to check what
they say, so they can just tell them they and
they have seem to have Again, this is not to
deny him. Agency is just trying to understand the inner
workings of this administration. Rubio has an ideological fixation on Venezuela, right,
and the same way Biden was a die and the

(47:42):
wool committed dion as Rubio was like a died in
the wool committed neocon when it comes to Venezuela, certainly,
and on other areas maybe it's more flexible, but Venezuela
that one is locked in.

Speaker 4 (47:51):
And then it benefits Stephen Miller and.

Speaker 2 (47:53):
His like war on immigrants because you've got the trender
Ragua piece, and if you're labeling drug traffickers you're labeling
them like enemy combatants. That gives you a free hand
to do a lot of the things that he wants
to do.

Speaker 7 (48:06):
Too.

Speaker 3 (48:06):
If you're an active war with somebody, then you can
it's more of a legal justification.

Speaker 2 (48:10):
Now it gives you just it gives you. I mean,
I think it's it's abhorrent. I think what they're doing,
by the way, what they're doing is illegal with even
with this you know, paper thin justification they're given, but
it gives you the like the cover to do the
extra judicial assassinations that we're seeing in the Caribbean. It
could potentially be expanded into the US. There's nothing that
would keep it from also being used on this on
you know, US soil. So Steven Miller likes that from

(48:33):
his ideological perspective, you don't have to think with with Trump,
they've been talking about trender Ragua and really making that
like a big thing for a while now, and so
I think that has fueled his interest in this regime
change operation. Like I think maybe he genuinely is convinced
that there's some Maduro trender ragua, gang cartel, fentanel, whatever

(48:55):
thing that fits with his political brand. And you know,
and then you have the other ego piece of they
tried to do it in his first term and they failed,
so he feels kind of humiliated that they did this
one Wan Guido thing. And by the way, Max womanhal
Thal has an interview that is really worth listening to
with the guy who was alleged to be the head
of this like secret plot to overthrow the Maduro regime.

(49:18):
The US government the first Trump administration denies they had
any involvement here, but you can go and listen and
you can see some of the documents that are coming
out in discovery with this guy as well. But he
says they were trying to foment this secret plot using
former special ops he was a former Green Beret, in
order to within Venezuela overthrow the overthrow the Maduro government
at that point. So in any case, there's also an

(49:39):
element of just like his ego being bruised by the
fact that this thing didn't work out the first time around.

Speaker 3 (49:44):
Yeah, and the psychoanalysis again, all here matters because this
is how it works right under. Currently, as I just
told the story of Ukraine, we've gone through four different
Ukraine policies literally in the last six months, So who
knows what you're going to wake up and get ran Paul,
by the way, speaking out vocific against these strikes, you
got to give a guy credit, a very principled person
at least on this issue.

Speaker 1 (50:03):
Let's take a listen.

Speaker 5 (50:04):
President Trump has authorized military strikes against suspected drug boats
in the Caribbean. As you know, so far more than
twenty people, Senator have been killed in six different strikes.
Do you believe that these strikes against these suspected drug
boats are legal?

Speaker 9 (50:24):
No, they go against all of our tradition. You know,
when you kill someone, you should know. If you're not
at war, not in a declared war, you really need
to know someone's name. At least you have to accuse
them of something. You have to present evidence. So all
these people have been blown up without us knowing their name,
without any evidence of a crime, and for decades, if

(50:45):
not centuries. When you stop people at sea, in international
waters or in your own waters, you announce that you're
going to board the ship and you're looking for contraband
smuggling or drugs. This happens every day off of Miami.
But we know from Guard statistics that about twenty five
percent of the time the Coastguard boards the ship, there
are no drugs. So if our policy now is to

(51:07):
blow up every ship we suspect or accused of drug running,
that would be a bizarre world in which twenty five
percent of the people might be innocent. The other thing
about these speedboats is there they are two thousand miles
away from us. If they have drugs, they're probably peddling
drugs to one of the islands of Trinidad or Tobago
off of Venezuela. The idea that they're coming here is like,

(51:30):
it's a huge assumption and really shouldn't you have to
present some proof. It is the difference between war and
peace and war though you don't ask people's name, But
if they want all out war where we kill anybody
and everybody that is in the country of Venezuela are
coming out, that has to have a declaration of war.
It's something that is not pretty, very expensive, and I'm

(51:52):
not in favor of declaring war on Venezuela.

Speaker 8 (51:54):
But the Congress should vote.

Speaker 9 (51:56):
The President shouldn't do this by himself.

Speaker 1 (51:58):
Props of Ran Paul.

Speaker 3 (51:59):
They are talking about how these strikes are not only
the legality but also just the sheer kind of craziness
of the policy, and I want to put so let
me again take you through the chest pieces.

Speaker 1 (52:10):
One of the pieces of news that we.

Speaker 3 (52:12):
Who covered last week was about this US military admiral
or US naval admiral, who had visited the Caribbean and
he had done that twice since the big build up,
and we actually looked at that as a piece of
significance because of the huge build up naval build up. Well,
it now turns out, let's put this stuff here on
the screen, that he has now had to step down.
This is from southcom Admiral Alvin Halsey is leaving less

(52:35):
than a year into his tenure as the Pentagon escalates
attacks against boats in the Caribbean Sea. And he is
not only leaving it amidst the rapid build up of
ten thousand forces in the region, but of this new
CIA mission and also the speculation, the scuttle butt, at
least from what I've heard around town, is he was
one of those people who raised concerns about some of

(52:58):
these strikes, not just the legal justification, but the strategic
justification as well. You put those two things together with
him going away, it's not good. And also, by the way,
can I remind everybody that there's currently no real journalists
who are right now at the Pentagon today who can't
even ask they can't even get the bullshit.

Speaker 1 (53:15):
Version from the Pentagon spokesperson while they're in the buildings.

Speaker 3 (53:18):
This is not good, Like, this is exactly the time
whenever you really need people with experience and others to actually,
you know, put some scrutiny on what's happening. And you know,
there's not even any embeds as far as I understand,
there's no journalists down on the carriers even tracking see
what's happening. Even in the height of the war in Iraq.
One of my favorite books, Generation Killed, there was a

(53:40):
Rolling Stone journalist in the lead humby of the lead
convoy going into Iraq, like we had some limited idea
of what was going on here. Nothing, it's just government video.
We don't know a damn thing about what's happened.

Speaker 4 (53:51):
That's right.

Speaker 2 (53:54):
Those strikes in the Caribbean, every time we learn something
about them, it, you know, turns out to be nothing
like the way that it's being presented. Not that okay,
even if they were drug traffickers, it still wouldn't be okay,
we've been interjecting drug traffickers in these waters. You know,
if you have to like blow them up, then they
can't stand trial. What does that tell you about the
case that you'd be able to make against them? But
you had an instance recently where one of the people

(54:17):
that we randomly murdered in the Caribbean was Colombian, at
least one of them. And so the president of Columbia,
who is very outspoken leftists, says mister Trump, Columbia's never
been rude to the USA. On the contrary, its greatly
admired its culture. You are rude and ignorant toward Columbia.
Read as your Sharsha affairs in Columbia did one hundred
years of solitude, and he assured you you will learn

(54:38):
something about solitude. I don't do business like you do.
I am a socialist. I believe in aid, common good
and common goods of humanity, greatest of all life put
in danger by your oil. If I'm not a merchant,
then much less a drug trafficker. In my heart, there's
no greed. Can never get along with greed a mafio.
So as a human being whom bodies the best of capitalism, greed,
and I'm the opposite, a lover of life. Therefore, a
millennial warrior for life. Greed flees from us because because

(55:00):
life is more powerful. And as in response to this exchange,
and he and Trump were going back and forth, Trump
is now cut off aid to Colombia and is threatening
increased tariffs on them. Now we aren't like Columbia receives
a fair amount of USA, but not as much as
it did at one point in like the early two
thousands during Planned Colombia and that era. But in any case,

(55:22):
so this is, you know, some of the fallouts going
on in Columbia is an important but like large part
of the cocaine production is in Colombia. So if you
want to deal with you know, drug production and drug flows,
this is a country you want to be able to
partner with. Instead we're antagonizing them, so we can blow
up random fishing boats in the Caribbean.

Speaker 3 (55:40):
Well, and if you put it together with what's happening,
let's go to the next part from Trump. He went
ahead and said that President Gustavo is an illegal drug leader,
strongcouraging massive production of drugs all over Columbia has become
the biggest. As of today, these payments or any other
form of payment or subsidies will no longer be made
to Columbia. The purpose of drug production is a sale
of mass amounts of products into the United States. So

(56:02):
this is immediately, you know, cutting aid in response to
the criticism. Columbia, of course next to Venezuela, and actually
was part of what their difficulty has been is also
dealing with a lot of these Venezuelan migrants, which they
themselves have their own crisis with. It's causing a lot
of political consternation in the country and has for some time.
Let's again started to put some of the chess pieces together.

(56:24):
Let's put this next one up here again. Nobody blinks
and I apparently B fifty two's flew off the coast
of Venezuela in a recent show of force. I mean,
these are like nuclear capable bomber. This is if people
don't know what a B fifty two is. It is
genuinely one of the coolest aircraft that the United States
military has. I got to see a couple when I
was in Katar, and seeing them in the plane or

(56:46):
seeing them in the sky, it's unbelievable. Like the level
of military might that they are, and so to take
three and to just you know, take it all around
Venezuela off the coast, there's only one reason to do that.

Speaker 1 (56:58):
It's the same reason that we all fly them. It's
a threat.

Speaker 3 (57:01):
And so yeah, they took off from bark Stale Air
Force Base and they just kind of circled around of
Venezuela in a huge show of force. All of this
is just pointing in one direction. As you said, the
cope is just basically it's all negotiation. But I think
here's the fear from Maduro. What if he's like, Okay,
this is it. I can't negotiate with these people at all.

(57:21):
And so when the eventual time does come for negotiation,
you say no, forget it, and then you know there's
one miscalculation. All it takes is one errand to Venezuelan
pilot or air defense or somebody to do something and
then boom. I mean, that's why you don't get into
very close situation. Why even be in this situation. He
said he would give us the oil, take it, just

(57:43):
take it. What's the problem.

Speaker 8 (57:45):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (57:47):
Last part.

Speaker 3 (57:48):
We just want to give a shout out to our
friend Juan da vide Rojas put this up here on
the screen.

Speaker 1 (57:52):
He wrote a great piece. I encourage everybody to go
read it.

Speaker 3 (57:54):
Why regime change in Venezuela is bad for America, and
he talks about specifically the last time the United States
mass this level of military might in the hemisphere was
the nineteen eighty nine invasion of Panama, which ousted Manuel Noriega.
And while the assembled forces are inadequate for a full
scale invasion, decapitation strikes on government officials a state assets
similar to NATO's twenty eleven intervention in Libya, seem likely,

(58:16):
and as he points out, one of the reasons that
this is happening is from Marco Rubio, the fact that
all the statistics don't really add up whenever it comes
to the found of fentanyl and everything coming here. But
he goes through the strategic justification. The notion that a
Postmaduro dovelment can promptly fix Venezuela is a disturbingly reminiscent
of Washington fantasies about post Taliban Afghanistan.

Speaker 1 (58:39):
Unlike Noriega, who.

Speaker 3 (58:40):
Governed six years to nineteen eighty three and nineteen eighty nine,
Chavismo has ruled Venezuela for twenty seven has destroyed the
country's institutions. On increasingly rare occasions, when opposition candidates are
allowed to prevail, the winners are then stripped of their
constitutional powers. In twenty twenty four, to ensure Maduro was
re elected, the regime perpetuated election fraud so brazy that
even some of his closest international allies call the results

(59:02):
into question. Even in an ideal, negotiated transition, it would
take decades for Venezuela to restore a semblance of the
rule of law, and nobody signed up for that.

Speaker 1 (59:12):
I don't want that.

Speaker 3 (59:13):
I don't want to be responsible from Venezuela. I don't
think Venezuelan's want us to be responded, like, leave them
to their own destiny.

Speaker 2 (59:19):
How much better would we be to make a deal,
a business deal with them and it sanctions relief and
you know they can, like Maduro can sink or swim
on his own. You know, if he's able to run
the government away that people find effective, and yeah, let
them to decide their own fate. I mean that feels
like what it should be an America first type of
a principle, and there's nothing good. There is nothing good

(59:44):
that will come of some regime change war. And the
other thing that WANTAVI goes through is like, you know,
there's a number of already armed and trained militant groups
in and near Venezuela. So it's also not like there's
you know, I'm all the ingredients for chaos and violence
and death and destruction in a failed state. It's all there,

(01:00:04):
and you know, apparently that's what we're flirting with at
this point.

Speaker 4 (01:00:08):
Absolutely absolutely insane.

Speaker 3 (01:00:10):
Yeah, turning out to John Bolton, the former National Security Advisor,
has been indicted. Let's go and put this up here
on the screen. Federal grand jury in Maryland returning an
indictment on eighteen separate counts, eight counts of unlawful transmission
of national defense information and ten counts of unlawful retention

(01:00:30):
of national defense information. These are from the alleged violations
of the nineteen seventeen Espionage Act, which prohibit the unauthorized
position or transmission of national defense information. So basically, let
me go through and read some of the key allegations
inside the criminal complaint. The indictment, by the way, is public,
so you can go through and read it for yourself.

Speaker 1 (01:00:49):
Quote.

Speaker 3 (01:00:49):
Bolton is alleged to have shared over one thousand pages
of diary like records of his time at the National
Security Advisor with family members or quote editors via his
personal email account while he was pairing his book. These
records reportedly included sensitive classified information from meetings with senior
US officials, foreign leader discussions, and intelligence briefing. He is
alleged to have printed and stored classified material at his

(01:01:11):
home in Bethesda, Maryland. The indictment claims that Burstel's Poltent
personal email account, which he at times emailed to his
wife and his daughter, were later than hacked by a
cyber actor believed to have been linked to Iran, and
that hackers gained access to all of the class information
that he had stored there. That the representative he told
the FBI in twenty twenty one about the hack, but

(01:01:32):
he did not disclose the classified information was stored in
the account or that hackers had obtained the classified data.
He's pleaded not guilty and said he's a victim of
political retribution. Now, I mean, I think that that is
probably true, that he's a victim of political retribution, But
you know, first they came for John Bolton, and I
didn't say very much because it's John Bolton. And you know,

(01:01:53):
I first they came for John Bolton, and I read
the indictment and it turned out that he did the
very thing that he is accused others of doing. And
he's called for a crackdown for government, you know, for
government and invent for prison time.

Speaker 1 (01:02:05):
And so yeah, that's that's mostly what I have to say.
After they came for Job bull Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:02:09):
Well, okay, so I think it's actually very interesting. I
guess first, really technically they did come for James Comy.
So and then let's say, and I think those two
prosecutions are much more, very different, much flimsier and more bullshit.
I mean, Letitia James is complete and total bullshit Comy.
I mean, these prosecutors had to resign, like they had

(01:02:30):
to put total flunkies in charge before they would pursue
these charges.

Speaker 4 (01:02:34):
So this one is different.

Speaker 2 (01:02:36):
Now, what I will say here is I think it's
worth pausing and thinking about the mind of not just
John Bolton, but I think this is the way that
many elites behave when they get into power. On they
think about, okay, how am I going to position myself
or my my career, my book deal? Like, how am
I going to profit off of this public service? And

(01:02:57):
so when he comes into the first Trump administration, he
immediately starts this text chain with his wife and his
daughter where it's you know, he's calling it his diary,
and he's sharing with them all kinds of this is
a according to the government story, right, He's going to
be able to make his own case about what was
going on and whether it's classified, and it'll be able
to defend himself. And I think he certainly has a
good case that this is political retribution. Wouldn't have been

(01:03:19):
charged under another garment. I do think that that is
the case. But so he comes in thinking how am
I going to parlay this into a book deal, which
he did right by the way after the fact. So
he's sharing with them all this stuff at the moment
to keep track of what's going on and all the
decision making that he's privy to, et cetera.

Speaker 4 (01:03:36):
Now, I think this is.

Speaker 2 (01:03:37):
Completely characteristic of the way that many elites operate when
they get into office, and it is also completely characteristic
of the type of yes crimes that elites are usually like, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:03:49):
Yeah, of course I get to store a classified info
for my book in my personal email.

Speaker 1 (01:03:54):
Again, right, who among.

Speaker 2 (01:03:56):
Now, if you're a whistleblower and you're something, you're sharing
something classified the wrong setting and blah blah.

Speaker 4 (01:04:02):
Blah, then god forbid.

Speaker 2 (01:04:04):
But you know, and then also there's the irony, of
course of Trump with the documents stacked up in his
bathroom or whatever. That will put that aside for the moment.
But so now any elite who gets crosswise with Trump,
the things that usually elites are just allowed to do,
now they're not going to be allowed to do that. Now,
I am okay with that if it's applied across the board.

(01:04:27):
The problem is that obviously it's done in this incredibly
political way where if it's just for Trump's enemies and
so it reminds very much of that famous saying for
my friends everything for my enemies the law, and with Trump,
it's not just the things that actually were legitimate violations.
They will also comb through your mortgage application and try
to find some sort of bullshit whatever, like they did

(01:04:47):
with Letitia James. They're trying to do it with Adam
Schiff and others to make a case against you even
if there really is no case to make with this one,
they happen to have a little bit more to work with.
It just falls in the category of things that elites
typically do and get away with. But now that you're
on the wrong side of the King, you're going to
be made to pay.

Speaker 3 (01:05:05):
Yeah, Like you know, sometimes the King actually doesn't miss
and on this one, let's Glenn actually flagged this fantastic
clip of John talking about Julian Ang's let's take a lesson.

Speaker 10 (01:05:16):
Well, I think that's a small amount of the sentence
he actually deserves. He's committed clear criminal activity. He's no
more a journalist than the chair I'm sitting on. The
information that he divulged did, in fact put many people
in jeopardy. It undercut the ability of the United States
to have confidential diplomatic communications, not just with other foreign governments,

(01:05:39):
but in many countries with dissidents. People who even speaking
to American diplomats could find themselves in trouble. And so
you know, he's been complaining about his treatment over the
past period of time. He's the one who sought asylum
in the Ecuadorian embassy. Now he faces extradition to the
United States. I presume he will get due process in

(01:06:02):
the United Kingdom to determine whether extradition should go forward,
and when he gets to the United States, he'll get
due process here. And I hope he gets at least
one hundred and seventy six years in jail for what
he did.

Speaker 1 (01:06:13):
One hundred and seventy six years.

Speaker 3 (01:06:15):
Well, John, we'll see how you can test that whenever
it comes to your own defense.

Speaker 2 (01:06:20):
Probably if we went back, I bet he said a
bunch of stuff about Hillary's classified Of course we had too,
because at that point he was a loyal Republican.

Speaker 3 (01:06:27):
So these guys, you know, it's like you said about
their egos, you can I mean, and I covered the
Hillary email thing, and I remember one of the things
that actually made me really angry about it is there
was this naval sailor who accidentally shared pictures from onboard
a nuclear submarine and he had been charged with releasing

(01:06:48):
information about classified information. And he I think he was
either thrown in jail, he got seriously like the book
was thrown at him, and what he did was in
no way.

Speaker 1 (01:06:58):
Comparable to what Hillary had done.

Speaker 3 (01:07:00):
And that was a clean hit because it's like she
gets to get away with everything, whereas the normal everyday
people who are working inside the government when they do
something even remotely close set by accident again literally by accident,
they get thrown in jail.

Speaker 1 (01:07:14):
Here.

Speaker 3 (01:07:15):
You know, to your point, he's doing this bee enrich himself.
What great services John Bolton never performed for the United
States of America or for the business world.

Speaker 1 (01:07:23):
No, he trades off of his name and of his influence.

Speaker 3 (01:07:26):
I have some great stories, both the speaker fees and
other things that he demands whenever he would speak to,
like little student organizations that I have heard from around
wash He's one of the notorious divas in this town
who has writers in his contract like he's Metallica or something.

Speaker 1 (01:07:39):
You think I'm joking. I'm not joking.

Speaker 3 (01:07:41):
Everybody here knows what I'm talking about. And so that's
the guy. And so he did this to make money,
That's what it was about. Yeah, and he thought he
was above the law, and so John, no one is
above the law.

Speaker 2 (01:07:52):
Well, actually a lot of people are above the law.
We'll get to George Santos here in moment. But now
that you're crosswise with Trump, you're not going to be
above the law.

Speaker 4 (01:08:00):
I did look it up.

Speaker 2 (01:08:01):
So with regard to Hillary Clinton using a non secure
personal server for official communications, he said in a twenty
seventeen interview that if I had done at the State
Department what senior US officials like Clinton did, I'd be
in jail right now, and asserted that, you know, if
he or any typical government official had done that, then
they would face immediate prosecution and imprisonment. So that was

(01:08:22):
his view before when he was on you know, when
he was closely aligned with the Republican Party and this
was a partisan issue, he was, yeah, nothing but the
law for missharing or you know, mishandling classified information. But
you know, the on the other side of this, we've
got the George Santos sentence commutation and he was convicted.
You know, it's worth remembering what he actually did. So

(01:08:44):
he stole eleven different people's identities in order to like
steal their funds to fund his life and his campaign.
Convicted of you know, took money from his campaign and
uses personal slush. But there was a lot more besides
that he did. And you know, one thing is just
this one guy, I will say, the way he was
treated in prison I found to be he was in
solitary confinement, which I think you know.

Speaker 4 (01:09:06):
Is torture and shouldn't be used on anyone, let alone.

Speaker 2 (01:09:08):
You know, a person who's convicted of basically like a
white collar crime, but in any case, he joins a
list of nine other Republican congressmen who have had their sentences.

Speaker 4 (01:09:18):
Either communed or been pardoned.

Speaker 2 (01:09:20):
If you are on Trump's good side, and you've seen
the way that you know people have paid money to
get in Trump's inner circle, or hire a lawyer who's
close with Don Junior or whatever, then you can you
can commit whatever crimes you want as long as you
say the right things about Trump. I mean, here we
have ten Republican congressmen who've been granted pardons or clemency

(01:09:41):
from Trump, with Santos just being the latest one. And
so you know that is that is the reality of
this regime. The notion that there is any sort of
impartiality is completely and utterly dead. It is all political.
It is all I will, you know, go after my enemies.

(01:10:02):
If you say nice things about me, if you're going
to toe the line, then I will I will pardon you,
I will commute your sentence.

Speaker 4 (01:10:08):
And that is very important.

Speaker 2 (01:10:09):
Because it gives all the people around him a sense
of impunity because they all know, even if they are
committing crimes, certainly, if they're committing crimes on his behalf,
they will face no accountability because as long as they
stay on his good side, he will pardon them, he
will commute their sentences.

Speaker 4 (01:10:25):
And so you know, that is the broader picture.

Speaker 2 (01:10:28):
Bolton is a complicated one because first of all, I
think he's like one of the great villains of our politics.
And second of all, because he I mean, according to
the government's case, again, he'll the ability to make his
own case. Whatever he genuinely did handle mishandle classified information,
you know, applying his own what he said in the
past to his own actions, he would be worthy of prosecution.

(01:10:50):
And by the way, another thing we didn't mention, which
another very negative fact for him is Iran did actually
hack into yeah, no easy messages.

Speaker 1 (01:10:57):
That's actually worse than Hillary and we're able.

Speaker 2 (01:10:58):
To yeah, and we're able to glean some information, were
threat trying to threaten and blackmail him with the information
that they had been able to obtain. So you do
have you know, a foreign adversary that was able to
gain access to this information, et cetera very negative set
of facts for him. But then you added to the
overall picture of like this being part of a retribution campaign.
And I think it is true that under another administry,

(01:11:20):
including another Republican administration, or back when he was a
you know, loyal Republican under another Democratic administration, I don't
think he gets prosecuted. But for it being this particular administration.

Speaker 3 (01:11:31):
Yeah, I think you're one could make the case that
it was political not to prosecute that. Actually the Biden
administration led him off of the hook because they liked
him because he was on TV criticizing Trump. So maybe
we're just riding the ship and you know, the next
time I jokes aside, this is an interesting question. When
the Democrats are in power, then why would they not
Why should they not then use this new standard against

(01:11:51):
the true Like if you're why would you not prosecute
Jared Kushner, why would you not prosecute Steve Wikoff?

Speaker 1 (01:11:55):
Why would you not prosecute.

Speaker 3 (01:11:57):
Any of the people. I mean, I'll put Stephen aside
because it's kind of the separate thing. But I don't
know I've seen that considering the No King's protest for
you about talk about which shwycott.

Speaker 1 (01:12:06):
Later on today.

Speaker 3 (01:12:07):
That's kind of what the base wants, and so I
wonder what direction that they're going to go.

Speaker 1 (01:12:11):
What do you think?

Speaker 2 (01:12:12):
I think that a litmus test in the twenty twenty
eight primary will be holding some of the Trump administration
officials to account.

Speaker 4 (01:12:20):
I don't think wit Coff and Kushner at the top.

Speaker 2 (01:12:22):
I would say Stephen Miller, christinoam are towards the you know,
towards the top of the list. Maybe russ vote, but
Miller would be, you know, target number one, maybe Ewon Musk.
I think that it will be a litmus test of
like and there's a fine line we can have this.

Speaker 4 (01:12:38):
We won't dwell up.

Speaker 2 (01:12:39):
We don't have to have a long debate about this
right now, but I'm sure it'll be a conversation we
continue to have. There's a fine line between you know,
politicizing and retribution and just going for blood. And I
think a lot some of the problems we have in
this country right now is from elites acting with impunity.
So I do think you need some elite accountability for

(01:13:01):
crimes that are committed. I'm thinking of you know, I'm
thinking of the war criminals in the first Bush administration Again,
John Bolton, I'm thinking of I'm thinking of the bankers
who never went to prison. And when you have a
vastly unequal society by wealth, and then you have a
show of elites who were able to commit overt criminal acts,

(01:13:21):
especially acts against the American people, and do that with impunity,
then that does contribute to like a total societal collapse.

Speaker 4 (01:13:29):
So yeah, I think there will be I think there
will be some of that.

Speaker 2 (01:13:32):
Now, do I see a Gavin Newsome like going through
people's mortgage applications and just inventing things out of whole cloth?

Speaker 4 (01:13:39):
No, I don't say.

Speaker 2 (01:13:40):
I mean, remember, these are the people who couldn't get
around to appointing Merrit Garland and decided it should be
Merit Garland, who was like the lamest person on the planet,
in order to even go after like the guy who
was their main adversary. That's who Democratic Party elites ultimately are.
So I think you're right where the base is is.
They definitely want to see not you know, not a

(01:14:02):
like exactly what's being done in the Trump administration, but
they want to see some accountability for these things. The
question is whether their elites are of them. Whoever gets
elected is going to have the stones to do any
of that, and that's a very open question. All right,
let's see, So this morning we are joined in studio
by a gentleman who is challenging Nancy Pelosi in the
Democratic primary for Congress, also former chief of.

Speaker 4 (01:14:25):
Staff to aoc chalcol Body.

Speaker 1 (01:14:27):
Great to have you, Yeah, thanks for having me, he
good man.

Speaker 4 (01:14:29):
Welcome, Glad to have you in town.

Speaker 2 (01:14:30):
I wanted to start with I know you were at
the No King's protest in San Francisco. We've got you
guys can put some of these images up on the
screen from around the country. I know the estimates were
in the many millions for these actions across the country.
In my little town, King George County, they even had
like a pretty decent number of people, which is something
I've never seen before. Just talked about your you know,

(01:14:51):
experience in San Francisco and what your interactions were like
with the people who came out for it.

Speaker 11 (01:14:56):
Yeah, it was a lot of fun, you know, and
it was energizing. It was like electrifying. It was about
fifty thousand people in San Francisco that showed up, way
bigger than last one, because I went to last one
as well, and people, I mean, it's just like gives
you some hope. I think that was the main overhalming
sort of vibe. I'd say, I got there and it was,
you know, peaceful, like there's nothing even bordering on violence,

(01:15:19):
right attack, no Antifa attacks, nothing going on. And you know,
the thing I think is really important about something like
this is it is also building infrastructure to actually get
people out on the streets. Right, So the fact that
you can keep doing this, repeat this, I think we're
going to have some real infrastructure to get folks out
on the streets and to have some sort of real opposition.

Speaker 8 (01:15:37):
Yeah, we need that.

Speaker 3 (01:15:37):
Well, that's kind of my question to you, because you know,
I grew up around the Tea Party eight camping of
age in politics, and what I saw was not only
the marches, but there was a political infrastructure. And with respect,
I don't see that same level candidates like you at
this point in the two thousand in that cycle. Let's
say in the twenty ten race, they had major money
behind them to challenge incumbents. You know, I'm sure you're

(01:15:59):
studying some of those runs, So explain that disconnect to me,
why is it that millions can take to the streets,
but there doesn't seem to be a centralized, organized force
people standing up and saying I'm done with the Democratic
establishment or are they saying it and I'm mistaken?

Speaker 11 (01:16:14):
So there isn't the same i'd say, kind of like
moneyed infrastructure that the Tea Party had. But I do
think this is one of the big divides between candidates
like myself, like Katabu Gazale, like the newer folks who
are running and the old guard, right, I think Candid's
like us, We are part of that and we see
our roles. It's not just trying to go into be
politicians and legislators like we actually need to be organizers
and be part of this sort of these protests on

(01:16:38):
the street and actually be organizing civil society to create
a real opposition party.

Speaker 8 (01:16:42):
So I agree, you know that.

Speaker 11 (01:16:43):
I think what the Tea Party did was an example
of how that actually happened on the other side.

Speaker 1 (01:16:46):
Okay. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:16:47):
One of the things that I have noted for a
while now is different among the Democratic base in Trump
two point zero is that they really are frustrated with
their leadership. Yeah, plose, No, longer. You know the leader
in the House that Kim Jeffries, who I mean Pelosi
at least she had some Machiavilion instincts. Jefferies is just

(01:17:07):
completely seems weak. Schumer has been pathetic as well. And
so when I see those images, you see the same
level or even heightened level of dissatisfaction anger from the
base at what the Trump administration is doing and a
leadership that they feel increasingly has let them down. That's
very different from the first Trump administration where they felt,
like you know, Nancy Pelosi and Chiff and others were

(01:17:30):
like fighting for them and they were all aligned. I
do think that creates an opening not just for candidate's
like you, but for you know, more of a sort
of Sanders left populist ideology, because those are the people
that actually are being caught fighting, like those are the
people who've been leading the charge. And so if you
have a base who's disgusted with the lack of fight
and you see that the fighters are people who you know,

(01:17:51):
tend to share our ideology, I think that does create
nobody not to mention the fact that the previous like
liberal direction of let's not rock the boat and let's
just try to return of a status quo has obviously
completely failed.

Speaker 8 (01:18:03):
Yeah, I think it's twofold.

Speaker 7 (01:18:04):
Right.

Speaker 11 (01:18:04):
One thing is when Trump won the first time, I
think a lot of people, especially mainstream Democrats, thought that
was just a fluke, you know, and Trump getting elected
again has gone a big part of the party in
the base to just you know, think about this as
like what is actually going on, Like this is a
real failure of the Democrat establishment. Yeah, And so I
think there's two things that's going on where they're seeing
the current Democratic Party being completely unable to do anything

(01:18:26):
about what's going on in the moment with what I
think is an authoritarian coup. And and so they're looking for,
you know, leaders who are actually going to take this moment seriously.
They're not, you know, they don't want this sort of
way back and play dead politics, like the backlash build
and we're just gonna win on the in the next
election off that backlash because that might not happen, right,
But the other pieces, people really are thirsty for an
actual vision to fix the deep economic problems that led

(01:18:48):
to someone like Trump. Like that's something I had to
explain the first Trump term when I was working with AOC,
he had to try.

Speaker 8 (01:18:53):
To explain, you know, Trump was a result of these
larger problems.

Speaker 4 (01:18:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (01:18:57):
I don't find that to explain that anymore. Everyone gets
it right.

Speaker 11 (01:18:59):
So now we're at a place where I just get
to pitch what's our version of the vision for actually
how to fix this because maga's not doing it right.

Speaker 8 (01:19:05):
Mag is not going to fix it.

Speaker 1 (01:19:07):
Well.

Speaker 3 (01:19:07):
My question though on San Francisco is, let's be real, Like,
Nancy Pelosi is still tremendously popular right in her among
a lot of Democrats. I saw a recent unfavorable rating
like thirty three percent.

Speaker 1 (01:19:16):
That was like total.

Speaker 3 (01:19:17):
But in your district, you know, she has constantly never
really had to take any of these primary challenges seriously.
So I guess my question is how do you seek
to over like, why is this time different? I mean,
I've been doing the show with Crystal for years now.
I probably interviewed to everach primary challenger that has come
to Nancy Pelosi. I'm still here interviewing another Nancy Pelosi challenger.

(01:19:38):
Why is this time different?

Speaker 7 (01:19:40):
Yeah?

Speaker 11 (01:19:40):
So the bet with this race was that there's this
deep set satisfaction with the Democratic establishment, right, not necessarily
Nancy Pelosi herself, but that people are really ready for change.
And we actually ran a poll last month that showed
a couple interesting things. You know, it still shows Nancy
Pelosi is generally well liked. You know, people actually respect
her and like her. But when when you ask Pelosi

(01:20:01):
supporters would they be willing to vote for somebody new,
about fifty one percent to say yes right when you ask.

Speaker 8 (01:20:06):
And overall in the population is about two thirds of
the population.

Speaker 11 (01:20:09):
And then when you actually pull her against me, first,
one thing we learned is I've already cut the lead
in half.

Speaker 8 (01:20:13):
As down twenty five, now I'm down thirteen.

Speaker 11 (01:20:15):
And when we actually show a positive bio of her
and a bio of myself, we end up winning the
race by six. So people in the district are really
you know, basically, they're at this place where like, we
like her, we think she is great for a certain time,
but clearly we need something new, right, And so the
point is to just get across the fact that I'm
you know, I'm actually a serious candidate.

Speaker 8 (01:20:35):
I've got real experience in politics.

Speaker 11 (01:20:37):
And also everything I'm running on is overwhelmingly popular, not
just in San Francisco but across the country. I'm running
on things to actually fix our economic problems. I'm trying
to running on anti corruption and that's really resonating with
the district.

Speaker 4 (01:20:48):
Is she for sure running again?

Speaker 8 (01:20:49):
She filed her, She's filed with the with the FBC.

Speaker 1 (01:20:52):
Okay.

Speaker 11 (01:20:53):
She whenever people ask her like, are you definitely running again?
She always is mum about it. But you know, the
rumors are maybe it's going to be her that ends
up being her pick.

Speaker 2 (01:21:02):
Who knows which doesn't You have two daughters, Christine, Christine interesting.
I would love for you to talk a little bit
while we have you about you said, you know, you
need to offer people an alternative, positive vision. I think
you've been one of the people who has been at
the forefront of actually really thinking deeply about what that
vision would look like.

Speaker 4 (01:21:19):
So talk a little bit about how you see that.

Speaker 11 (01:21:22):
Yeah, you know, I think it's it's basically like to
back up a bit, like I think basically, for decades now,
wages have been staggering for most Americans, while the cost
of essentials have really skyrocketed, right, And I think at
the same time, our country has just been really stuck
actually being able to do anything big. We can't take
on big projects. We've de industrialized the Midwest. I think
one real example of how bad our state capacity is

(01:21:46):
is I think of EV's in China, right, Like EV's
in China ten years ago, when they're starting to make them,
We're being so smug about it. We're like, they're not
never gonna catch up to us. Our technology is so great.
And then literally last year they are starting to make
EV's our beninars, and we're just like, well, game's over,
No way we can we can compete.

Speaker 4 (01:22:02):
Right then it feels a little bit.

Speaker 11 (01:22:03):
Like that, Yeah, to be honest, I know, right, and
that's kind of true, But that's it's such a failure
of imagination I think on our part of what can
we actually do as a country. So you know, part
of what I'm running on is i'd say the things
that people like burn your AOC and everybody runs on,
which is we need structural fixes to things like healthcare, childcare, education,
these big cost centers. Right, we actually need universal healthcare,

(01:22:26):
universal childcare. But the other piece that I've been really promoting,
this was really a lot of Green New Deal work,
is we actually need to have the government do a
massive mobilization to kind of build up our industrial capacity
and our state capacity to do stuff, to build industries,
to build housing, to build all the stuff that we
actually need in this country to survive. And are the
examples we look at when we talk about this, are

(01:22:48):
you know, a lot of the rich nations that got
rich in the twentieth century, because if you look at
the history of the twentieth century, basically every rich nation
today they went through these periods where they massively transformed
their economy and really periods of time. And the way
they did it is they really governed in a way
that's very different from us.

Speaker 8 (01:23:04):
You know, they didn't just pass some policies.

Speaker 11 (01:23:07):
You had to actually have this movement that was organizing
civil society to kind of be on this mission, and
often that mission was to get rich.

Speaker 8 (01:23:14):
As a nation.

Speaker 11 (01:23:14):
And sometimes the mission our case, you know, during World
War Two, is to beat the fascists. And you made
real plans, you had institutions to finance and execute those plans.
It's a whole different kind of governing that's really been
a focus of a lot of my work.

Speaker 3 (01:23:24):
Okay, but to press you a little bit, your part
of the party that you've been involved with now for
some time has not really had a good run in
San Francisco. Right, So San Francisco, Daniel Lurie beats London
Breed in the mayoral race, you had Chase A.

Speaker 1 (01:23:36):
Boudin who went down.

Speaker 3 (01:23:37):
It seems like the homelessness and the crime, which look
no offense like, was definitely associated with a lot of
the politics.

Speaker 1 (01:23:44):
That you've been involved with.

Speaker 3 (01:23:45):
Some pass was utterly rejected by a lot of those voters.
So like, why should I believe your vision for governance
when the very city which you probably had the most
influence on, not you personally your randon politics to the
most influence on, basically became an emblem for failed city
the United States.

Speaker 8 (01:24:00):
Yeah, you know, I really think that it was.

Speaker 11 (01:24:02):
It's a backlash of government dysfunction because I agree, you know,
I think the San Francisco government has not actually managed
to take care of the homeless people in our city
and have them not have to live out out on
the streets, right, And I'm not sure daniel Lewi's necessarily
going to fix that either, and we're going to see
the same backlash.

Speaker 8 (01:24:18):
I think there's the same reason.

Speaker 11 (01:24:19):
At a national level, you have someone like Barack Obama
win on a message of change, and then when people
feel like that didn't work out, you.

Speaker 8 (01:24:25):
Have someone like Donald Trump win.

Speaker 11 (01:24:26):
I think people are really quite open to what the
change looks like, but people are really sure that whatever
we're doing right now that's not working.

Speaker 2 (01:24:32):
Are you worried that Trump's abuse of government power? Because
in a certain way, he's kind of greasing the skids
for what you're talking about. He's like, you know what, Congress,
forget it, judiciary brand like, who cares? Who cares about laws?
I'm just going to do what I want to do right.
In a certain way, he creates space for, you know,
a more aggressive government policy. In another way, something I've
both been concerned about is like, you know, it gives

(01:24:54):
libertarians a bit of an argument of hey, when you've
got this unchecked government's kind of a problem. Are you
worried about a back lash to his abuse of government
making it more difficult for you know, a vision such
as yours that does require direct government action to be
accepted by the people.

Speaker 8 (01:25:10):
Yeah, I'm I'm worried about that. Yeah.

Speaker 11 (01:25:11):
And I'm the kind of person I don't generally believe
that there's like one system that'll fix anything like that.
People do matter, and yeah, you can have you can
use a powerful government for good and you can use
it for bad, right, And FDR, in my opinion, was
an example of how we had a powerful government that
had lost a capacity used it to improve people's lives. So,
you know, I think the job here is to try

(01:25:33):
to distinguish that, to say that, you know, the stuff
that's going wrong right now, that's because Trump is throwing
out Congress, which, by the way, I'm not saying we
throw out Congress, right, Like FBR actually used to love
going in front of Congress and you know, defend his ideas,
and that's how he felt he could build political support
for it, not all.

Speaker 1 (01:25:49):
Not always okay, Yeah, well he did.

Speaker 8 (01:25:51):
Actually he had all the committee. He actually showed up
in front Congress, right, and which which Trump has never done.

Speaker 11 (01:25:57):
And so you know, I think it's more powerful if
you actually bring civil society and the body politic along
when you're doing this kind of big approach, Like you
can't actually just go it alone and have the government
just do something because you need to have the national night.

Speaker 7 (01:26:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:26:11):
I apologize for getting so specific, but like that is
part of your job. I'm gonna be represented.

Speaker 1 (01:26:14):
So I think about that mall. What is it the
Westfield Mall.

Speaker 8 (01:26:17):
I bought Westfield.

Speaker 1 (01:26:18):
I bought one of my ties there.

Speaker 3 (01:26:19):
It's empty now, right, it's because of crime, It's because
of homelessness. I read an article recently in the Wall
Street Journal. It's a multi billion dollar boondoggle. They won't
pay the mortgage. Like, what are you going to do
about that? You know, at the end of it, like
that was a great place and now it got ruined.
It got ruined by again a lot of that governance.
And I'm just not hearing, you know, quite a bit
about it.

Speaker 11 (01:26:35):
Right. I'm not going to downplay, you know, the issues
around homelessness and crime that mall specifically, though, I do
think there's been some misinformation around.

Speaker 8 (01:26:42):
Because malls are not doing well all around the Count's true.

Speaker 11 (01:26:45):
We've got some, you know, the japan Town Mall, Stonestown
Gallery in San Francisco, they're doing great, and they've matched
a pivot to figure out a model that actually works.

Speaker 8 (01:26:52):
I get the thing that Westfield just didn't.

Speaker 11 (01:26:53):
They had this old mall style and they're in the
middle of downtown where there's all this other retail. So yeah,
I think crime and and homeless has had something to
do with it. But I don't think that's the whole
story with Westfield.

Speaker 1 (01:27:02):
Okay, I mean, I'll take your word for it.

Speaker 3 (01:27:04):
I just think it's more of a there's a reason why,
you know, people point to it as it failed, not
just the mall, but like you don't retail Market Street
and everything I remember visiting your I can't believe what
happened to this place. And so that's why I'm just
honestly a bit skeptical. Like I hear big things about
green new deal, et cetera. Sure it sounds great, but
you know, if that's actually how the governance itself of
the city is having visited, I mean, one of the

(01:27:26):
critiques you've had, I know, is around oligarchy, Like you're
going to be representing probably one of the most per
capita cities with billionaires.

Speaker 1 (01:27:33):
What's your plan to do deal with that?

Speaker 3 (01:27:34):
There's going to be a lot of you know, paper
millionaires who are in that district who really like some
of the more status quo.

Speaker 8 (01:27:39):
Is it going to be voters?

Speaker 1 (01:27:40):
Is it going to be them?

Speaker 3 (01:27:41):
Because I've seen a lot of them being prioritized by
San Francisco politicians.

Speaker 8 (01:27:44):
Yeah, we can't.

Speaker 11 (01:27:44):
I mean, there are a lot of them, but they're
still a small fraction of the actual city.

Speaker 2 (01:27:49):
Right.

Speaker 11 (01:27:49):
And if you look at people in San Francisco, if
you ask them about this question of oligarchy, especially tech workers. Actually,
because I talked a lot of tech workers, they hate it.
You know, tech workers are really embarrassed by being kind
of represented by people like Elon Musk and Peter Teel
and David Sachs, and they kind of are the first
to be like, we need to show that we are
not them, right, and so in San Francisco, though, when

(01:28:10):
you talk about these failed policies, I think, actually the
failed policies there is a result of the lack of
state capacity on San Francisco's level, you know, the fact
that San Francisco doesn't actually build.

Speaker 7 (01:28:20):
You know.

Speaker 11 (01:28:20):
And part of my politics here is and this doesn't
always line up with progressives, but I do think red
tape and your instruction costs, I'm both, you know. I
think the thing that the ymbi's I think get right
is yes, we do actually need to make it faster
and easier and cheaper to construct. But the thing I
think they get wrong is that's not going to be
all we need to actually get stuff built. You know,
we actually need public financing, social housing, all these other

(01:28:42):
tools to make sure we get the stuff built.

Speaker 4 (01:28:45):
Yeah, you're yes, and on a plime, I'm a.

Speaker 8 (01:28:47):
Yes, sand guy.

Speaker 2 (01:28:47):
Yes, let's talk a little bit about because Sager brings
up the you know, tech heavy district that you would represent.
I mean, what are your thoughts on the development of AI,
the likely you know, mass displacement of workers, the way
that would upend the social cast tract. You know, right
now they're all in what I would consider basically a
race to the bottom speed who can get you know,
their AI to AGI fastest without any regard for what

(01:29:08):
the consequences to society would be. You know what are
I know, you're you know, you're a deep figure on
all these things. So what are your thoughts there on
what we should do?

Speaker 6 (01:29:16):
Man?

Speaker 11 (01:29:16):
I mean, I think it's so lame that right now
AI is going to a place where're just going to
have like a slop TikTok full of AI porn?

Speaker 8 (01:29:24):
Is I guess like the montization strategy. Yeah, I mean
it's it is.

Speaker 11 (01:29:27):
It is just like we've created a speculative bubble where
we're letting the markets aside where the stuff goes, and
it's going to create complete dystopia. But I think of
the AI question, it's kind of downstream from the fact
that we don't have any capacity at a national level
to do any sort of planning of where our economy goes, yeah, right,
and where where some big disruptive technology like this, how
it should be used, because it could be the case

(01:29:49):
that when you have very productive technology, the benefits of
that is spread across more of society.

Speaker 8 (01:29:54):
It's not just accumulating the same element.

Speaker 11 (01:29:56):
And there's one version of this whey I equated to
kind of automation the car Many sector. So when that
started happening, when car manufacturing started getting really automated.

Speaker 8 (01:30:05):
In Germany, they have labor and corporations and.

Speaker 11 (01:30:08):
Government that all sit on the boards of their car manufacturers, right,
and they do some planning. They're like, this is how
we're going to do automation in our car manufacturing. The
result of that it has sort of changed because EV's
have really changed the game. But initially the result of
that was German workers end up making twice as much
in wages as their American counterparts. They also made more
cars per capita than an American car manufacturing, and they

(01:30:28):
had more automation than America.

Speaker 8 (01:30:29):
Right, So I think that's the way we should be
treating AI.

Speaker 11 (01:30:32):
We need to actually have society have a say on
how we're using this technology so it doesn't just turn
into you know, slot news feeds.

Speaker 3 (01:30:38):
You mentioned tech releaders. Where do you stand on the
H one B question? So you'd be representing a district
of a lot of yees. You used to talk about
tech workers. A lot of those people have come to
me said we're being abused by H one B workers.
What do you think about the issue.

Speaker 11 (01:30:50):
Yeah, I mean I'm in the camp of we definitely
need reform, Like I do think we need to I
think we should attach H one B from employer like
employees from employers because I think it's a very exploited
assist them. And I think we need to have higher
basically prevailing wage requirements on the visa so that there
it has upward push on wages. So the result of
bringing it, you know, so you really are bringing in

(01:31:10):
H one B workers that you can't hire locally and
it's pushing everyone's wages Upso as net benefit.

Speaker 1 (01:31:16):
Do you think these companies have been abusing the HMB system.
A lot of them are being your district. Yeah, absolutely,
they've not been abusing it.

Speaker 8 (01:31:21):
Yes, I'm going to.

Speaker 2 (01:31:22):
Talk about the disconnect between where the base of the
Democratic Party has been and where Democratic Party leadership has
been on Israel in particular.

Speaker 4 (01:31:30):
If we can put F two up on the screen,
this was an.

Speaker 2 (01:31:32):
Interesting set of polls that was I think leaked actually
that this is from Democrats in a variety of swing districts,
so that was the you know, the sample that was
taken here, and they ask people for favorable or unfavorable
views on the variety of things. So unfavorable for Israel
is fifty percent favorable, is only twenty seven percent, Palestine
completely opposite, sixty percent favorable, only thirteen percent unfavorable.

Speaker 4 (01:31:56):
Net Yahu has a.

Speaker 2 (01:31:58):
Six percent approval rating, APAC has a sixteen percent approval rating,
the Israel Lobby in general fourteen, the UN seventy three positive,
and Doctors without Borders eighty two. Can put the next
one up on the screen as well. I just some
other numbers to chew on with regard to this topic.
In your own words, please describe your impressions of Israel.
They ask here fifty nine percent offer something that is negative.

(01:32:19):
The number one response there was there committing a genocide.
On the positive side, they're kind of mixed there. The
number one is support the people, not so much the government.
Number two is Israel has a right to exist. And
then you've got some twelve percent that are more or
less neutral to.

Speaker 4 (01:32:38):
Their views.

Speaker 2 (01:32:39):
Here, let's put the next one up on the screen
as well. When thinking about the current crisis in the
Middle East, you mostly have sympathy for Palestinians, equal sympathy
for Palestinians and Israelis, or mostly have sympathy for the
Israelis five percent, five percent of the Democratic base say
they mostly have sympathy for the Israelis, and yet their
leadership overwhelmingly mostly has sympathy for the Israelis.

Speaker 4 (01:33:02):
You know, does this feel to you like an important.

Speaker 2 (01:33:06):
Like litmus test issue for democratic based voters, because of course,
if you pull it's not the number one issue that
most people say. Yet it seems like it's such a
moral abomination and such a failure, a moral failure on
the part of democratic leadership who likes to posture like
they care about human rights and they care about international law.

Speaker 7 (01:33:23):
That to me.

Speaker 2 (01:33:24):
It seems that it has become an important kind of
dividing line issue in democratic primaries in particular.

Speaker 8 (01:33:30):
Yeah, I agree. I think it's become a proxy for
the larger question of who do you serve?

Speaker 6 (01:33:35):
Right?

Speaker 8 (01:33:35):
Are you actually representing people? Are you representing money?

Speaker 11 (01:33:38):
Yeah, because there's no explanation for why you would continue
voting to send unconditional military funding to Israel when your
voters are telling you they don't want it, when you
see the horrible genocide that Israel's committing with that money,
when it's against our own law, the Lehi law says
we shouldn't be doing this other than money, Right, that's
the only answer. And you know, I actually think you

(01:33:58):
see this on a whole host of issues. You know,
there's a big divide between our voters are at on
things like a comngrescional stock trading ban, right or banning
the revolving goal, becking Congress and the lobby industry on
big money, and where politicians are at. And you know
that's honestly, it's a big political opportunity in some cases
for people like me who are running, who are actually
just running on these issues that are very popular. I

(01:34:18):
you know, you get painted as progressives, which I call
myself a progressive, but it's really just popular issues.

Speaker 3 (01:34:23):
So what did you think give your old boss's decision
to vote for defensive weapons to Israel?

Speaker 1 (01:34:28):
Is that a vote that you would say.

Speaker 11 (01:34:30):
I wouldn't have voted the same way as No, But
but you know, I think if you look at she
did the same vote as Bernie, they've been voting that
way for a long time, and ultimately she didn't actually
vote on the bill.

Speaker 8 (01:34:39):
So you know, no real money got sent to Israel there.

Speaker 1 (01:34:42):
Yeah, but the logic of it, so you're saying no
more at what's your what's my logic on it?

Speaker 11 (01:34:46):
Is any money money we're sending to Israel right now,
like I don't think they're being so careful about this
is only going to defenses, only going to offense. Any
money we give to to support their defensive capabilities, that's
more money they have for their offensive capabilities, and those
offensive capability are being used for blorrent actions right now.

Speaker 2 (01:35:03):
Last question for you, did serve as as chief of staff.
She's talked about both as a potential primary challenger Chuck Shermore,
which frankly I think she would win an old Landslide
if he even decided to run again, And she's also
talked about as a potential presidential contender. Do you think,
you know, she could be an effective presidential contender. Do
you think that she, you know, would have an ability
to lead the country in that way?

Speaker 8 (01:35:23):
Absolutely? Yeah, I think.

Speaker 11 (01:35:24):
I mean, I think she is a generational talent, and
I think she's incredible communicating. I think the thing she's
got is twofold one. She actually cares, which is rare
in politicians, and she is able to explain things and
do the kind of politics that I think is necessary
for this moment, Like if we want to do big stuff,
you know, if we want to actually get the country

(01:35:46):
to be able to do these big structural changes, you know,
fix healthcare, get industrialization happening again, you actually need someone
in the presidency who's able to communicate that and use
as a way to build political will to do.

Speaker 8 (01:35:57):
Those big things.

Speaker 11 (01:35:58):
You're not gonna be able to do it through a
regular establishment democrat who's just pull testing everything and figuring
out what to say.

Speaker 8 (01:36:04):
You know at the moment.

Speaker 3 (01:36:05):
See, that's interesting because when you came in I remember
when you became re chrieve of Stack because you're a
shitsterer in Congress, which which I like.

Speaker 8 (01:36:12):
I loved it.

Speaker 1 (01:36:12):
That's part of the reason I've always respected you.

Speaker 3 (01:36:14):
But the critique I've seen from a lot of progressives
has been that after you left, I forget your other
colleagues name after the two of you guys, corpent that's
right after the two of you guys left. It's like,
now we're starting to play the Pelosi game. We're starting
to go for the Oversight Committee, even though we're still
not going to get it, start to play ball with leadership.
We're not doing sit ins anymore. So what do you
think went wrong or if anything went wrong?

Speaker 11 (01:36:35):
I don't think anything went wrong. I mean I left,
you know, I love sort of in a planned way.

Speaker 8 (01:36:39):
Like I came in. I did the shit starting to
get the Green New Deal, launch, got her office hired,
and I had a kid on the way, right, and
I got out, and you know, I think I think.

Speaker 11 (01:36:48):
She needs support, right, Like That's the piece of this
is if someone like ac does become president, she actually
wants to do this big thing. That's really what it
comes down to, because not just about winning this presidency,
we actually have to deliver at the end of the
day or it is going to go back to some
sort of a authoritarianism.

Speaker 8 (01:37:01):
But she's going to need a Congress to back her up.

Speaker 11 (01:37:04):
And that's like a big part of my focus right
now is I am trying to recruit people to run
all across the country. I'm talking to people who are
popping up primary Democrats. We're going to need a move
into replace a whole bunch of these Democrats to completely
change the party. And in that sort of environment, I
think she can be very successful.

Speaker 2 (01:37:18):
Okay, all right, Schrecott. Tell people where they can support
your campaign if they're so inclined.

Speaker 11 (01:37:22):
Yeah, go to my website. It's Choycott do us, Sai
kat do us. You know, I mentioned in that poll
that if all we do is get everyone to hear
about this campaign in the district, we're going to win.
So we're doing a huge volunteer run operation. So if
you'd live in the Bay area, you can come out
to Canvas. We've been canvassing every weekend. We again like
fifty to sixty people every day on Saturday and Sundays

(01:37:43):
in But if you're outside of the district, we're doing
phone banks from anywhere in the country. So please time
to volunteer on my website or you know, send a
few bucks our way.

Speaker 8 (01:37:50):
If that works.

Speaker 1 (01:37:52):
I'll be looking at your campaign with interest. Ser So
we'll see you later, all right, thanks so much for
having me. Thank you guys so much for watching.

Speaker 3 (01:37:58):
We're gonna have to skip the Epstein set in today
just because we went long as usual.

Speaker 1 (01:38:02):
Don't worry, we'll cover it tomorrow. We'll see you all
then

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