6/17/25: Trump Tells Tehran To Evacuate, Israel Bombs Iranian Media Live On Air, Israel Blocks Escape Of US Citizens, Trump Bashes Tucker

Krystal and Saagar discuss Trump telling Tehran to evacuate, Israel bombs Iranian media live on air, Israel blocks escape of US citizens, Trump bashes Tucker Carlson.

 

To become a Breaking Points Premium Member and watch/listen to the show AD FREE, uncut and 1 hour early visit: www.breakingpoints.com

Merch Store: https://shop.breakingpoints.com/

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, guys, Saga and Crystal here.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election,
and we are so excited about what that means for
the future of this show.

Speaker 1 (00:08):
This is the only place where you can find honest
perspectives from the left and the right that simply does
not exist anywhere else.

Speaker 2 (00:14):
So if that is something that's important to you, please
go to Breakingpoints dot com. Become a member today and
you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad free,
and all put together for you every morning in your inbox.

Speaker 1 (00:25):
We need your help to build the future of independent
news media and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints
dot com. Good morning, everybody, Happy Tuesday. We have an
amazing show for everybody today, a very consequent show, possibly
our last show before the outbreak of full blown US involvement.
So what do we have?

Speaker 3 (00:43):
But really, who the hell knows?

Speaker 2 (00:44):
Yeah, at this point we were both uplate monitoring what
the hell was going down? So many contradictory signals. It
seemed very ominous what was developing. I would say, it
still seems very ominous. So we'll just take you through
everything we know at this point. We'll also track some
of the additional news from yesterday, the Israelis targeted runny
and state broadcasters. Shocking and extraordinary scenes playing out live

(01:06):
on TV.

Speaker 3 (01:06):
Will bring you that.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
Also, Israel's implemented a policy to block their own citizens,
and apparently there was a heated conversation between our own
ambassador trying to block US citizens from fleeing that country
that is, of course now under attack. We've got a
bunch of Tucker and Steve Bannon clips to show you
their take on what's going on here.

Speaker 3 (01:27):
As Trump spent.

Speaker 2 (01:28):
Some portion of yesterday also sniping at Tucker, jabbing him
with the most trumpion of insults. You don't even have
a TV show anymore, was like really.

Speaker 1 (01:36):
Hitting where I heard a man who went on podcasts?

Speaker 2 (01:40):
Okay, yes, indeed, So anyway, interesting to see what the
conversation is unfolding there. Glenn Greenwald is going to join us.
He's going to talk about the role of media disinformation,
both right now so that you can help parse through
all of this flood of information that is coming at you,
and also drawing out some of the parallels with how
the media was weaponized in the build up to the

(02:03):
a Rock War. So that's going to be a really
important conversation. There are other things happening in the world, though.
We have some really wild updates out of the Minnesota
after those attempted assassination of two lawmakers, one of them
you know, actually killed and murdered by this madiac who
apparently went to the doors of two other lawmakers as well.

Speaker 3 (02:21):
Anyway, I'll save.

Speaker 2 (02:22):
All the details for that story, but really crazy details
that we're learning now. We also California Attorney General reached
out to us and said, hey, I want to come
on the show and talk about this lawsuit we've filed
against the Trump administration with reguard to federalizing the National Guard.
Extremely timely conversation because there are hearings with regard to
that lawsuit in court today. So looking forward to speaking
with him as well, and.

Speaker 3 (02:45):
Probably going to get to the AMA Live.

Speaker 2 (02:47):
There's a little bit of scheduling question mark, so if
not today, we may kick it to the Counterpoints crew tomorrow.

Speaker 3 (02:53):
Anyway, so we will see.

Speaker 2 (02:54):
But Sager, we wanted to really make sure to thank
everybody who's been supporting the show because it really has
been quite extraordinary over the past several weeks.

Speaker 1 (03:01):
That's right, Yesterday was one of our biggest days ever
in terms of the history of Breaking Points, which is
very you know, I mean, it's very gratifying in terms
of both the amount of work we put in, but
really the entire team. So thank you to everybody's been
supporting us. You can do so at Breakingpoints dot Com.
We're really I mean, this is a special moment for
the history of the show, not even really in terms
of our numbers, but I think in terms of being

(03:22):
able to have a place where you can both get
the news and viewpoints which are just not available in
the mainstream. As we hurdle towards you know, another catastrophic war.
So with that, Crystal, why don't we go ahead and
get into it.

Speaker 4 (03:33):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:33):
So, as I was saying all kinds of things unfolding
yesterday and sorry you can jump in if I forget
any of the key details here, but we started to
get reports, specifically on of Israeli media, that Trump was
hours away from signing an executive order that would get
us directly involved. Now, of course, we are already involved
in Israel's war with Iran. It's our weapons. We are
providing defensive support a run to Israel. There are indications

(03:56):
as well that we may have been involved with the targeting.
Trump was involved in the Sun Refuge leading up to this,
so we are already involved. But the next step forward
were backward, dramatically backward, in my opinion, would be for
us to get directly involved in the actual bombing of Iran.
So these reports start to emerge in Israeli media specifically.
Then we start to see all this information about all

(04:18):
of these military assets being moved rapidly into the region.
Then we get word that number one, Trump is not
going He's he's in Canada at the G seven meetings.
Number One, he's not going to sign on to the
joint statement that they're putting out calling for de escalation.
He later backtracked on that by the way they changed

(04:40):
in the language. He did sign on, but this was
the indication we were getting he wasn't going to sign
on to that, and he was going to leave those
meetings early, come back to DC, and he wanted all
of the relevant players to join him in the situation
room at two three am whatever it was that he
was getting back. So everyone's looking of this and going,

(05:01):
holy shit, this looks really bad. All the indications are
there that we are joining this thing directly, and it's
happening imminently. In addition, Trump puts out this truth. Let's
put this up on the screen.

Speaker 3 (05:14):
This is a two.

Speaker 2 (05:15):
He says, Iran should have signed the deal. I told
them to sign. What a shame and waste of human life.
Simply stated, Iran cannot have a nuclear weapon. I said
it over and over again. Everyone should immediately evacuate Tehran. Tehran,
of course, being the largest city in Iran, home to

(05:37):
some ten million people directly in the city sixteen million
if you talk about the surrounding areas, just you know,
absolute insanity here and seems like a direct threat coming.
As I said at the time when we had these reports,
and he's leaving the G seven early and he's going
to the situation room, saga, and so we were all,
you know, just calling everyone we could get any information from,

(05:58):
glued to our screens, dune scrolling, trying to figure.

Speaker 3 (06:01):
Out what the hell was going to happen.

Speaker 1 (06:02):
I spent a lot of last night on the phone,
and basically here's what I could gather is that what
we are in the most critical period of the next
forty eight hours. The situation room meeting in the White
House is narrowed down to basically two separate options. A
lot of what I've heard has now been backed up
by the New York Times the Situation Room meeting. There
are two separate options now effectively before the President. One

(06:22):
is to drop these bunker busting bombs, these thirty thousand
pound munitions from American B twos. One of the reasons
why this odd necessitates only in pure US offensive involvement
is that these munitions are so large is that they
can only be carried by the B two platform, so
it must be dropped by the United States of America.
Part of the reason why some US Central Command requested

(06:45):
so many of those assets. Much of these is not
only the Carrier Strike Group which is now left in
the Indo Pacific and heading on its way to the
Middle East, but a lot of it is actually carrier
refueling tanks that are being spread all across from the
United States heading over to the Middle East. So what
what it would require is just to explain the military

(07:05):
operation is it's not a single bunker busting bomb in
the foid Oh facility because it's so deep underground. This
munition was developed in two thousand and four by George W.
Bush specifically to go after both Iran and North Korean facilities,
which are underground. It requires dropping a thirty thousand pound
bomb and then multiple drops over and over and over again,
effectively making a hold and dropping a bomb another one

(07:27):
in the hole, over and over. This would be one
of the most honestly one of the most shocking bombing
missions which will be captured on camera. Since Hiroshima people
are really not even really prepared for what it will
look like. We have tested the munition that was I
think it was under Trump's first term. That's the one
option on the table. The other option on the table
is Jade Vance Section and Steve Wickhoff basically fly to

(07:51):
the Middle East and meet directly face to face with
Iranian officials. This was an option that was relatively on
the table as of last night. However, the President is
really pouring cold water all over this cause we put
a two B please up on the screen. President Trump
says he has not reached out to Iran for peace
talks in any way, shape or form. Trump calls dozens

(08:13):
of reports suggesting otherwise, quote highly fabricated fake news. Let's
also go to the next one, please, because this is
very very important. These are comments aboard Air Force One
roughly around two thirty am Eastern time. Quote. Trump wants
a real end to the nuclear problem with Iran. This morning,
it will find him in the White House situation room. Quote.
I didn't say I was looking for a ceasefire. This

(08:33):
is in reaction to some comments by Emmanuel Macron, he said,
quote he wants a real end with Iran giving up
entirely on nukes, effectively unconditional surrender from the Iranians on
their nuclear program. The Israelis are quote aren't selling up
their barrage on Iran. He predicted. You are going to
find out over the next two days. You're going to
find out. Nobody slowed up so far. Asked his thinking

(08:54):
for calling for Tehran to evacuate, he says, I just
want people to be safe. He says he needs to
be present at the White House so that he can
be well versed and not to rely on phones to
know what's happening. And he said he quitted undecided about
sending Wickcoffer advance to meet with Iran. Quote. I may,
but it depends what happens when I get back. So
we had a diplomatic option which is on the table. However,

(09:15):
almost all US public communications at this point from Donald
Trump saying I'm not interested in the ceasefire, i haven't
reached out to Iran, I'm not involved in direct talks
with them, do not indicate that those are going to
be successful. All of this could be a ruse. Keep
that in mind. That's basically what a Trump administration'smo on
all of this is. However, I mean, just from reading
the tea leaves as to where they are, we could

(09:36):
all be, you know, very pleasantly and shockingly surprised. But
I am extremely not optimistic. The go or a no
go order will come in the next forty eight hours.
The assets are now mostly in place. You've got the
Carrier Strike Group on its way. We already have huge
amounts of US military assets. But the real sign of
what is to come, if it were to happen, are

(09:57):
the movement of those refueling tankers. That is exact exactly
what you would see in a offensive scenario. So things,
I mean, this is as bad as against this is
March two thousand and three. I mean, this is it.
The go or the no go order is coming soon.
And I think what's so shocking has been the span
of less than a week. Let's really take a step back.
This Director of National Intelligence, Tulsey Gabbard. Maybe she was lying.

(10:21):
I don't think she was. In March she said and
signed that Iran is not anywhere close to a nuclear weapon.
In fact, the latest intelligence estimates that it would take
them nearly three years to build some sort of nuclear weapon.
All of this is a crisis manufactured by Israel and
now Donald Trump effectively to force this issue. What's also crazy,
You know, I was almost thinking about this, and it
sounds insane to say the Iraq war was more legitimate

(10:44):
than this one, in that George W. Bush had a
year's long propaganda campaign against the American people. They faked
the National Intelligence estimate around WMD in Iraq. They've made
their case to the United Nations by Colin Powell. It
was all lies, don't get me wrong. Yeah, And they
sought a bipartisan congressional authorization from for the war in Iran.
You can say, and part of the reason Bush survived

(11:04):
to know for is Kerry voted for the war two
and so did Hillary. Then all the Democrats supported, I mean,
the vast majority of the Democrats supported, the vast majority
of the entire country supported it. This is a unilateral
action by Trump and Israel, basically saying our own Western
intelligence is bullshit. And so on top of that, the
crisis right now. I mean, look, there's a lot of

(11:24):
people are hyperventilating, et cetera. The consequences on this are immense,
and I mean we're going to spend probably the entire
show talking about this, but just to you know, give
people the immediate picture that we will have probably a
go or no go order in the next forty eight hours.
I would love to see Steve Wickcoff and Jadvance get
on a plane to the Middle East and meet with
the Iranians, you know, face to face. That would be

(11:47):
a benefit, of course, but there's big questions about what
can actually happen on the Iranian side as well. Their
entire you know, top military echelon is dead. They may
be in a position like the Germans or the Japanese
being asked for unconditional surrender, seeing regime change and saying
screw it, We're going to fight it out to the end,
to the death, you know. I mean, this is not

(12:08):
an uncommon situation for people who are forced into that.
I hope they don't choose that course, but it's very possible.

Speaker 2 (12:14):
As Trump was bragging about some of the negotiators, some
of the top negotiators he's working with, we're also assassinated,
you know, which is very intentional on the part of Israel.
And you know a playbook that they've used time and
time again to Sober's point about how just at the
end of March, So just a few months ago, Toulsey
Gabbard was testifying that no Iran is nowhere close to

(12:35):
a nuclear whether they're not trying to pursue one, it
would take three years if they didn't begin to try
to pursue one. Trump was asked about that on Air
Force one last night, and he said, I don't care
what she said. I think they were very close to
having them. Don't care about the assessment of his own
intelligence agencies. He'll just take Bob's word for it, apparently.

(12:56):
And so here's the logic that the Israelis will be
pushing and the many hawks within this administration will be
pushing as well. Okay, now that they have not come
anywhere close yet to destroying Iran's nuclear capabilities, nor can
they without our assistance, but they have increased the likelihood

(13:18):
and the logic of Iran actually now rushing to develop
a nuclear weapon, because even people who were previously moderate
are going to look at the State Affairs and say,
we were fools to trust the US. They were lying
to us, they were using these diplomatic negotiations as a
ruse to create a distraction while Israel comes in and
attacks and assassinates of our top political military leadership. So

(13:40):
we have no other choice at this point in order
to have some sort of deterrent effect in order for
this government to have a shot at surviving, now we
do need to rush forward and develop nuclear weapons, something
that again our own intelligence community said they were not
doing previously. So Israel will say, you know, and they're

(14:01):
not wrong about this. Now Iran will rush to develop
a bomb unless you come in the United States of
America and basically rescue our asses and not only destroy
their nuclear capabilities. Because I think it's also really important
to keep in mind that in a lot of I mean,
that is just basically a pretext to enable this long

(14:22):
desired war against is against Iran that Israel has been
pushing for for years and years bbing done now who
specifically many of the bipartisan foreign policy blob here in
the United States as well. So the nuclear capabilities are
in a lot of ways a pretext. But in any case,
that's what they will be selling to Trump, and you know,

(14:43):
there are a lot of indications here that he may
well be receptive to that logic. Certainly, the idea that
so what was floated in the press that he's objecting
to was this idea.

Speaker 3 (14:55):
That they're going to put forward.

Speaker 2 (14:57):
The Trump administration is going to put forward sort of
one final deal offer on the table, and he's who knows,
because he's now admitted to lying to us and lying
to the Iranians and lying to the whole world about
his intent to move forward with the diplomatic negotiation, So
who knows what he's really thinking. You certainly can't take
his word for literally anything. You also can't take these

(15:18):
news reports at face value either, because they're perfectly willing
to leak lies in order to shape the information space
as well. So that's why it's so difficult to discern
what is going on here. But he's pushing back on
the idea that he has any interest in offering any
sort of a deal, and even if there was some hey,
we're going to put one final deal on the table.
The content of that deal matters a lot because if

(15:41):
it contains, if it's effectively the quote unquote Libya option,
then that is a poison pill, directly pushed again by
the Israelis and oother neocons in this administration to try
to guarantee that it is something that the Iranians could
never ever accept. Go ahead and put a two D

(16:02):
up on the screen. This speaks again to what Trump
has been saying about the possibility of, you know, a
ceasefire or some sort of diplomatic solution.

Speaker 3 (16:10):
He says.

Speaker 2 (16:10):
Publicity seeking President Emmanuel Macron of France mistakenly said that
I left the G seven summit in Canada to go
back to DC to work on a ceasefire between Israel
and Iran.

Speaker 3 (16:20):
Wrong.

Speaker 2 (16:21):
He has no idea why I am now on my
way to Washington, but it certainly has nothing to do
with a ceasefire much bigger than that. Whether purposely or not,
Emmanuel always gets it wrong.

Speaker 3 (16:32):
Stay tuned now, Sager.

Speaker 2 (16:34):
My brain is a little adult at this point, but
correct me if I'm wrong. Earlier yesterday, Trump said he
wanted to see Iran in.

Speaker 3 (16:42):
Israel get to a ceasefire.

Speaker 2 (16:44):
So you know, this is just all over the place
in terms of what he's saying, and I think intentionally, So.

Speaker 3 (16:51):
Real quick, here, we could put a four up on
the screen.

Speaker 2 (16:53):
After Trump said everyone needs to evacuate to Ran, you
can see miles and miles.

Speaker 3 (16:59):
Of backed up by the way. There's huge fuel shortages.

Speaker 2 (17:03):
Apparently there's no gas at the gas stations in this
area at this point, and so people are trying to flee.
But this is a city again of ten million people.
I mean, it's a larger metro area than New York City.
To give you a sense of the size and scope.
Just imagine for a moment that Iran told us New
York residents you have to evacuate, and the waste of

(17:27):
human lives, I mean, in just this direct threat. And
it's much more horrifying coming from US because Iran doesn't
really have the capability to back that up, but we do.

Speaker 3 (17:36):
So Michael Tracy called it, I.

Speaker 2 (17:39):
Think the most irresponsible statement that has ever been made
in the history of the presidency. And it's hard to
think of what could compete with it.

Speaker 1 (17:47):
I mean, I don't know if I'd have to think
about that one, but it'll rank up there just because
of the glibness of the fact that it is not
one where we're in a declared war. This is not
Tokyo in nineteen forty five, Like, we're not engaged in
an existential battle to the death. This is a war
of choice and a war of preemption more than anything.

(18:07):
And look, it's not only insane to just say everyone
should evacuate or Tehran, but it's also buying into this
is really framework about the existentialism of Iran At the
end of the day. Look, existential is a word that
has meaning. I'm speaking directly to Bill Ackman and too
many of the other neocons here. Existential means life or death. Okay, Iran,

(18:31):
even with their shoddy ballistic missiles and cruise missiles and
all of that, it's a regional threat. So is it
existential to Israel? I mean, we could debate that. I
could make a case for it. Is it existential to
Saudi Arabia? Yeah, you could debate that, and you could
make a case for it. Is it existential to New
York City? No, there's actually one nuclear power or quote

(18:51):
rogue nuclear power capable of reaching the mainland United States.
That's called North Korea. That's actually an existential threat. And
that's why the North Korean regime lives to fight another day,
because they've developed that capability. Even if Iron had a
nuclear up when it would not be an existential threat
to the United States in any way, shape or form.
That implies the ability literally to hit the US homeland

(19:12):
with a nuclear weapon. And yet the bb net and
Yahoo and Trump now framework is that this is literally
an existential threat enough so that it requires the full
force of the United States military. And here's bbe. I mean,
this is straight out of O two, straight out of three.
America first should not mean America dead FIRSTUS tel Aviv

(19:32):
Now it's New York. According to him, Let's take a listen.

Speaker 5 (19:35):
So are you going to target the Supreme Leader.

Speaker 4 (19:37):
Look, we're doing what we need to do. I'm not
going to get into the details, but we've targeted their
top nuclear scientists. It's basically Hitler's nuclear team. You know,
we got them. We still have work to do on
other sites. We have targeted their ballistic missile manufacturing facilities.
Understand this. You see these bombs. You saw a single bomb.

(20:00):
It's one ton bomb, John dropping on Tel Aviv and
other places, causing killing men, women and children. They're deliberately
targeting our population. We're not doing that. We're targeting their
military sites, their nuclear sites, their ballistic missile sites, so
they don't have twenty thousands of these that no country
could survive. What I'm saying is that we're not merely

(20:22):
protecting ourselves. We're protecting everybody. We're protecting our Arab neighbors
with whom we want to expand the peace as we
did under President Trump's leadership in the Abraham Accords. That
will be possible if Iran is defanged. We're also protecting
the world. They have ballistic missiles that can now reach
deep into Europe and soon could reach the United States.

(20:42):
And imagine what this regime that caused death to America
every time that bombed your American embassies, that murdered two
hundred forty one Marines in Beirut, that killed and injured
thousands of American servicemen in Iraq and Afghanistan, that try
to blow up a restaurant in Washington, that burns the
American flag. You want these people to have nuclear weapons

(21:05):
and the means to deliver them to your cities. Today.
It's tell Aviv Tomorrow's New York. Look, I understand America first,
I don't understand America dead. That's what these people.

Speaker 1 (21:15):
Want, America dead. We're nobody in America is going to
die because of Iran. It's just preposterous. But that's Look,
this is straight out of two thousand and two. We
don't want the smoking gun to be mushroom cloud. You
might as well put you know, Condoleeza Rice's face right
all over this. And now these also giving away the
game because it's not just about the nuclear weapons program. Look,

(21:39):
this is obvious from day one. This is a regime
decapitoation operation with a nuclear sideshow. The nuclear aspect is
just a pretext basically to incite regime change. But they're
really giving it away here, I mean basically talking about
making the Middle East great again. BB gave an interview
yesterday to Iranian opposition. He says, if the US helps

(22:02):
Israel assassinate the Ayatola, it will quote help end the conflict.
Let's take a listen.

Speaker 5 (22:07):
Officials tell us that the President flatly rejected a plan
an opportunity that the EU that the Israelis had to
take out the Supreme leader. Do you understand his concern?
My My understanding is his concern is that this would
escalate the conflict beyond where it is already.

Speaker 4 (22:27):
It's not going to escalate the conflict. It's going to
end the conflicts. Imagine what will happen if they had
nuclear weapons and the ICBMs, the intercontinental ballistic missiles to
deliver it to every place on Earth. We're preventing the
most terrific war imaginable, and we're bringing peace to the
Middle East. And I believe that after our action, we're
going to be able to bring the Middle East to

(22:49):
new heights that nobody even imagined, you know, make the
Middle East great again, make it truly.

Speaker 1 (22:54):
Great, make the Middle East great again. I mean, look,
it's insaneosteris It's the same thing. I mean, it's literally
nineteen fifty three all over again. We've got the Shah's
son here, he knows everything about Iran, put him in power.
He got Israeli government ministers, you know, putting out photos
with the sha son. I wish I was making this

(23:14):
shit up. It's insane. I mean two thousand, you know,
I realized this is probably a massive segment of our audience.
It doesn't really remember a lot of the details of
the war in Iraq. But the war in Iraq had
their own, you know, Shah. His name was Akment Chalabi
and he was a guy rolling around here in Washington,
and he was friends and he convinced Bush and a
lot of other neo kons here in DC that he
was representative of the real Iraqi people. The reason you

(23:36):
guys have never heard of him is because about six
months into the war, they're like, yeah, this ain't gonna work.
And you know who they ended up elected, people who
ended up igniting a massive civil war in their country,
which killed you know, thousands of American soldiers, millions of
Iraqi citizens, and to this day it remains basically an
Iranian outpost. Ironically, if you really think about it, so
all together, like everything that is old is new again,

(23:58):
and you know, the rhetoric is exactly the same. But
what's so dismaying is that people are not looking and
learning the lessons of all of those And it's just
so dismaying to me because the downside risk of all
of this is so immense. Look, I'm not going to
sit here and say World War three. But at this
point I genuinely think the best case, the best case

(24:21):
scenario for this is Libya. How did that work out?
I mean, look at Benghazi, look at those cities. I
mean they collapsed into disaster. Look at the Syrian Civil War.
How many millions of people were affected and hundreds of
thousands are dead. Look at the fallout, Look at the
American intervention we end up backing aside. There's civil and

(24:42):
then this is a country ninety million people, almost one
third the size of the United States. They have sizable
ethnic minority populations. They have chemical and biological weapon stocks,
likely you know, stash in different places, easily could come
under control of this or that and the next thing,
you know, what's going to happen, the same thing. We
had US troops in Libya doing special operations rates fighting isis.

(25:05):
We had to bomb Syria, I mean everybody, and we
still have troops in Syria to this day. Yeah, and
that happened in two thousand and fourteen. It will be
a disaster and it will have ramifications for years to
come and keep us embroiled in the Middle East. I mean,
in the nightmare scenario, it's not World War three. I
don't think, you know, Russia and China and all that

(25:27):
were going to happen. But the nightmare scenario to me
is hundreds of thousands of American troops who have to
secure US interests in the Straits of Hormuz or to
protect you know, oh, protect this asset, or protect that
it doesn't happen, you know, all at once. Remember Vietnam. Oh,
just a few advisors, that's it. All that, and then
it scales up and it up and up. We went
into Afghanistan with the promise that we would be put

(25:48):
putting out the Taliban, then we would be out. We
went into Iraq. Donald Rumsfeld's plan to go into Iraq
as we would knock the regime over, we would replace it,
would be out within two years. They literally called it
a cakewalk on national television. We were there for over
a decade. And so we are watching this all play
out in the same way. The people, the civilians are
going to suffer that a lot of American service members,

(26:10):
you could suffer too.

Speaker 2 (26:10):
And everything that BB says is like the polar opposite
of the truth. The idea that this aggressive, illegal war
of choice would protect Americans is insane. To Soccer's point,
it would put Americans at risk. It would immediately put
at risk the Americans, the thousands of Americans who are.

Speaker 3 (26:26):
Already serving in the region.

Speaker 2 (26:29):
So it would and think of the catastrophic blowback and
fallout from our misadventures in Iraq that spurred more terrorism
that you know, they talk about Iran as like the
number one sponsor of terror in the world. Like the
amount of terrorism that we fomented through our disastrous you know,
decision to go into a rock is unbelievable. So you

(26:52):
talk about, you know, Libya, Okay, let's imagine they get
their wish and they turn Iran into a fail state
in the way that Libya is. Libya is a population
of seven million people, exactly. Syria is a population of
about twenty four million people.

Speaker 3 (27:09):
Iran is ninety million people.

Speaker 2 (27:13):
You think having a failed state of ninety million people
is going to make the Middle East great again? Like insanity,
psychopathic insanity, the amount of human misery that we would
watch unfold. I mean, it's just you can't you can't

(27:34):
wrap your head around it. And so everything that BB
says is the polar opposite of reality and flies in
the face of all of the lessons that we should
have learned over these many years of mis adventure in
the Middle East, and not even just the recent.

Speaker 3 (27:52):
History that we've been around and cognizant for. I mean,
the reason we have this.

Speaker 2 (27:55):
Iranian government to start with is because US intervention in
the Middle East.

Speaker 3 (28:01):
So you know, the fact that we're back to.

Speaker 2 (28:04):
The well and even contemplating this, and look, maybe he's
going to decide to the last you know what, we're
going to take the diplomatic option, if that's even if
the space for that is even still open, because there's
no doubt the space has been narrowed by the fact
that they admitted and bragged about lying to the Iranians
about their interest in a diplomatic resolution, not to mention

(28:26):
the fact that the previous deal that the Iranians had
agreed to under the Obama administration had immediately been you know,
pulled back, and we got out of it under the
first Trump administration. So it's not like we have a
lot of credibility. But maybe they decide to pursue that
last ditch diplomatic effort. Maybe there's enough space remaining for

(28:48):
the Iranians to come to some sort of a deal
with the US.

Speaker 3 (28:52):
But the fact that this is.

Speaker 2 (28:54):
Even being contemplated is so outrageous and unconscionable.

Speaker 1 (28:58):
Oh yeah, I mean that we could get it to
that in the immediate term. I you know, I'm like you,
I just hope that there is at least some off
ram But I gotta tell you, I don't see it.
I don't see I really really hope that I am wrong.
But I have not spoken really with any person who
is actually very optimistic about that possibility. You know, let's see.

Speaker 2 (29:23):
The Israeli yesterday started putting out threats against Iranian journalists
and specifically the Iranian state broadcasters, and then let's go
to a eleven guys.

Speaker 3 (29:31):
We can put these just.

Speaker 2 (29:33):
Horrifying and extraordinary images up on the screen while this
woman is broadcasting live. You can see her here talking,
they attack the building that she's in, and shortly thereafter,
actually incredibly is she and her colleague there come come
back on air and are able to you know, talk

(29:55):
presumably about what unfolded. But I mean, this is the
sort of thing soccer that's just like normalize. I mean,
the number of journalists that they murdered in Gaza with
scarcely a word, by the way, outside of trey yinst
of Fox News from Western media about the targeting, targeted
assassinations of journalists inside of Gaza.

Speaker 3 (30:18):
And now you have this.

Speaker 2 (30:21):
You know, they announced that they were going to attack
this broadcaster.

Speaker 3 (30:25):
They did it.

Speaker 2 (30:26):
While they're live on air, and again silence from any
sort of you know, the Western media supposedly care so
much about journalism. We have to put a twelve up
on the screen so you can see what I'm talking
about here in terms of the threat. They say, well,
the Iranian regimes television stations be attacked soon. Defense Minister
cats the mouthpiece of Iranian propaganda and incitement is on

(30:46):
its way to disappearing. So they don't even feel the
need to like pretend that this was an accident or
they were going after military targets. They're just happy to
announce it directly blatant war crime and put the next
piece up on the screen. Afterwards they confirmed they said
the same. Defense Minister says, the Iranian Regimes propaganda incitement

(31:07):
broadcasting authority was attacked by the IDF, so just out
and out admitting it was them. After this all unfolded,
the Iranians decided that they would go ahead and then
threaten some of the Israeli propaganda channels. We could put
this up on the screen channel twelve and channel thirteen,
or it says evacuate the headquarters of channel twelve and fourteen.

(31:29):
Sorry Israeli channels twelve and fourteen. Immediately this was Iran
in Arabic account on Platform X issuing this warning message.
As far as I know, nothing happened at those stations,
But just unbelievable the impunity that the Israelis act with
at this point. I mean, there's just no like previous
norm or law of war that they respect whatsoever. They've

(31:51):
detonated car bombs in Tehran, brag about that as well,
the pager attack which maimed and killed innocent people who
happened to be nearby. You know, people were going about there,
they were at the market or whatever when these things
blew up. There was all sorts of collateral damage. And they,
you know, they bribed about that. They're super proud of it.
They killed a bunch of the assassinations that they were

(32:14):
able to accomplish here in this war that they started
to begin with. Those things they were assassinated like in
their beds at their homes, which means that their wives,
their children, their neighbors were also killed. The civilian death
toll is that some ninety percent is the estimate right now.
And so there's just no limit because they've been allowed
to act with so such impunity and with zero accountability

(32:37):
from the world.

Speaker 1 (32:38):
Right and you know, okay, you could the justification is, oh,
it's state broadcasting. It's part of the propaganda. And it's like, well, okay,
anybody who has ever studied a regime change operation or coup,
you know in Africa, this is one of those classic things.
What is the first thing that the rebels always want
to do? You see state broadcasting and the ability of
the regime to be able to get its message out there.

(33:01):
So even let's just stay purely on strategic grounds, what
does this indicate I must saying about no nuclear weapons program?

Speaker 3 (33:07):
This is about Lady was like a nuclear scientist.

Speaker 1 (33:10):
About nuclear weapons. Yeah, this is about regime change. This
is about degrading the ability to get the message out.
This is about reducing their state capacity to trying to
foment chaos. There's also there's so much Israeli cope online
about how these Iranians are just you know, screaming out
for freedom and for lack of repression. Now, not going
to doubt that there are a lot of Iranians who

(33:30):
are upset with the regime. But you know, even today
I was looking were some of the most prominent Iranian
activists against the regime are like you, Donald Trump and
Bebie not only you know, killing civilians whatever and causing
chaos in Tehran, but you know, this whole evacuate Tehran
order is one of the most like unhuman things that

(33:51):
we've ever seen in terms of chaos, in terms of
just think about if somebody told you you need to
That message was posted two thirty am Tehran time. We
have what the inevitable. We were told repeatedly, Israel will
finish the job on its own. We're not asking anything
from the United States. Then slowly it was okay, well,

(34:12):
we just need you to defend us. We we'll keep going offensively.
And now here we have Yoev Golan. He's the former
Minister of Defense for bb Net and Yahoo, presided over
much of the Gaza war goes on CNN. Of course,
these guys never know how to do an interview with
their own television networks, and what does he say. He says,
America has an obligation to actually enter the war offensively

(34:34):
and to take out I run, let's take a listen.

Speaker 6 (34:36):
I believe that the United States of America and the
President of the United States evan obligation to make sure
that the region is going to a positive way and
that the world is free from Iran that possessed nuclear

(34:58):
weapon in the the middle of the richest place in
oil and gas in the world. This could be a
disaster for the world. And I believe that the termination
of the American president that have been shown recently will
pave the way to America to enter into this very

(35:22):
important operation. The President of the United States have the
option to change the Middle East and influence the war
and influence the world, not only the war, in order
to do something that will create a better future of.

Speaker 1 (35:39):
All of us. America has an obligation. So there you
have it. I mean, these people are shameless. They will
say that they're doing it all themselves. And now they've
basically spent the last five days just begging for US involvement,
and in a sense, as you said, they actually created
the crisis which would necessitate quote unquote US intervention because

(35:59):
if the Aranians are like, screw it, Okay, let's sprint
to the bomb, then what there's only one force in
the world that can take them out. They went into
the operation knowing from day one they would never be
able to destroy the Iranian nuclear facilities. They could degrade it.
That's not the same thing. And at this point, also
if the US position is basically zero nuclear weapons, again
it's very difficult to square if you're the Uranians, and

(36:21):
this is where you need strategic empathy. I'm not, you know,
in any way sympathetic or whatever to the Iranian regime.
I'm going to try and put myself in their shoes.
If you have the entire higher echelon of military command assassinated,
if you negotiated and thought they were serious and then
they bombed, they used that as cover to bomb you,
why would you look, what would you do? And in

(36:42):
a sense too, for from this point forward, as we
learned with Libya, if you give up your nukes, they
may still take you out a decade from now, So
why would you do it? You would not do it.
I would say, sprint to a nuke and let's fight
to the death. I mean, look, it's grim, don't get
me wrong, but you know this is where also people
talk about the ideology and that well there's ideology baked

(37:05):
into that as well, right, and be like, look, this
is a final face off between us and the evil West,
and so be it. You know, millions will die. Look
at the Hitler and Bunker theory or the way that
the Japanese high command is willing to sacrifice their own civilians.
And by the way, you didn't see mass rise up
against them because the uncomfortable and truth is that unconditional
surrender set the conditions in which the people accepted their
own death trap, and they themselves said, okay, this is it.

(37:28):
We will join the regime even though we hate them
on these various things, to fight them. I'm not saying
that's necessarily going to happen, but it's very, very very possible.
That's the biggest problem with all.

Speaker 2 (37:37):
I mean, true to Parsi says that there has been
a real rally around the flag effect.

Speaker 1 (37:41):
In a run, somebody bombs you. What are you going
to do if somebody bombs us, I'd be like.

Speaker 2 (37:45):
Okay, threatens Well, you know, however, many million people in
New York City, Like, of course you're going to think
of the for those of you who are old enough
to remember the patriotic fervor after nine to eleven, right,
I mean the country really did you know the number
of people signed up for the military and bought into
the propaganda about why we have to go into or

(38:06):
I mean, it was off the charts, and so yes,
of course there's going to be a rally around the
flag effect as you have the Israelis bombing them and
the US threatening them and involved in the bombing, and
so you are actually forging a much more cohesive nation
and much more support for a you know, government that

(38:26):
by all accounts, was pretty unpopular at this point. And
you know, in terms of the logic with regard to
to nukes, they have to be thinking like, shit, we
should never have even negotiated with Obama. We should have
just gone for we should have just gone ahead because
they we wouldn't feel so comfortable messing with them now,
and the Israelis would not feel so comfortable messing with
them now. Those I that is the logic that our

(38:50):
foreign policy has created, and it was entirely predictable, and
in fact, I know the Israelis understood this going in
that counter to their narrative that their attacks and their
degrading of Iranian nuclear facilities and also you know, like
going after military and political leadership and their attacks now
on oil and energy infrastructure and all the rest, far

(39:12):
from limiting their nuclear capacity or degrading the calculus or
the desire to rush towards the nuclear weapon, they knew
going in that the logic would be, all right, well,
now we have to go after a nuke. And that's
exactly why they did it, because they knew that they
had to block this diplomacy that was ongoing before it
actually succeeded. And this is their big chance to create,

(39:38):
to create a dynamic where they have leverage with us
to try to pressure us into this war. And it
looks very grim in terms of Trump buying into that
logic and getting played and going all along with them.

Speaker 3 (39:49):
And that is not to, by.

Speaker 2 (39:50):
The way, take away his agency, because nothing drives me
more crazy than all of this cope about like always
being misled by the neocons. No, he's a big boy.
It's very clear him making these decisions, and he is
the reason why we are in the position that we
are in right now.

Speaker 1 (40:07):
Yeah, and if you want the blackest of all pills,
let's go ahead and put a ten up there on
the screen. Quote. This is the latest poll just came
out yesterday from Grayhouse. By the way, we don't know
a ton about this, but this is the only polling
that we really have this organization. Do you support the
US support attacking Iran if necessary? Now? I think if
necessary is important. But this is amongst Trump twenty twenty

(40:27):
four voters yes, seventy two nineteen.

Speaker 7 (40:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (40:31):
No, it'll be overwhelmed on the Republican base, it will
be overwhelming and overwhelming support.

Speaker 1 (40:35):
It will be I will I question whether there will
be some Democrats too, because this is one where I
think that the Democratic base will be against it. Yeah,
but there's no democratic leadership against the war right now.
In a way, there's silence is nothing. Yeah, silence speaks volume.

Speaker 3 (40:51):
They've been pathetic.

Speaker 2 (40:52):
I mean, listen, I thought the thing that happened with
Alex Padilla was bad. Going to freaking war with Iran
is way worse. And they were so much more exercise
over you know, him being wrestled to the ground after
he tried to, you know, ask a question of Christy.
You know, I'm at a conference again.

Speaker 3 (41:06):
That was bad.

Speaker 2 (41:07):
Potential World War three is worse, Okay, vastly worse, and
the silence is absolutely deafening. I do want the one
little glimmer of positivity here. You have some bipartisan effort
to put forward a War Powers resolution to say basically like, hey,
you can't do this, you can't enter a war with

(41:28):
Iran without getting the backing of Congress. And so you
had Tim Kaine in the Senate along with here's the
full list.

Speaker 3 (41:36):
This is as of.

Speaker 2 (41:38):
Ten thirty pm last night. You have Tim Kaine, Bernie Sanders,
Elizabeth Warren, Jeff Berkley, Chris van Holland, Ed Markey, Tammy Baldwin,
and Tina Smith. So all Democrats only in the Senate.
In the House, you do have Thomas Massey, the lone
Republican who was signed on for a similar War Powers
resolution along with Rokana Rashidah to leave AOC.

Speaker 3 (42:01):
That's all we got so.

Speaker 2 (42:02):
Far, So pretty slim pickings. You know, there are a
handful of Democrats. Tim Kane was pretty early to come
out and say this unacceptable. Bernie Sanders has been probably
the most vocal AOC signing on.

Speaker 3 (42:14):
But you're absolutely right that it's so like, it's so.

Speaker 2 (42:20):
Enraging that you have this moment when the president is
contemplating dragging us in to this horrifying war at great
cost and risk to our people, to regional stability, to
civilians and human life in and around Iran, and there
is just very little opposition being mounted from the supposed

(42:43):
opposition party.

Speaker 3 (42:44):
It is utterly pathetic.

Speaker 1 (42:46):
Look, and I'm going to say something unpopular, but I
think it's just basically true. At this point MAGA they're
going to support Trump no matter what. If he supported
a deal, they would say, Look, he's the greatest genius
of all time. If he goes to war, they'd be like, oh,
they had to come in and Trump. Trump is the preeminent.
He is the force. It's the only thing that matters.
There is no policy behind it. I made my peace

(43:06):
with that long ago. And for many people talking about
the MAGA base wants this or that is honestly bullshit. Okay, like, look,
we've had ten years now at this point. But but
and this is where maybe this is very elitist to me.
This is why I almost think it doesn't matter. This
isn't about popular will. This is alt. At the end
of the day, foreign policy is the most elite of

(43:26):
elite concerns. It's very rarely ranks in the highest of
the priorities unless a war actually starts. Let's look at
the past. The vast majority of the American people supported Iraq.
They said later that they didn't, but they did. That's why, though,
this is an intra elite war over foreign policy theory
basically to affect the White House. And unfortunately that's actually

(43:46):
where Israel has the highest strategic advantage because so much
of Washington is basically influenced by Israel and or they had,
you know, the ideology. It's not even just money, it's
really it's about like affinity, like the ability to you know,
they have all these free pre junkets over there, people
spend time over there. They get to know that there's
this great influence campaign and a soft and a hard
level that's been going on for I don't know eighty

(44:08):
years now, basically since its existence. So you have that, and.

Speaker 2 (44:12):
There's an ideological belief that Israel is an important strategic interest.

Speaker 1 (44:16):
For US, so you have that right that pervades Washington.
So all of this what's happening right now. I actually
don't think it has anything to do with MAGA. I
really don't. This is not really a democratic question, small d.
This is really a question at the foreign policy elite level,
especially because Trump is such a cult of personality, that is,
people will back him no matter what. That's part of
this whole like, oh, the MAGA base and all of
that will fracture. I think all of those arguments are specious. Really,

(44:40):
the way that we should argue about this is this
a good idea or a bad idea. That's it. That's
purely all that matters, especially when we know that we
have this group of voters which will go with him
no matter what this does. Though, and we'll talk about
this in the Tucker segment. Put a lot of the
people who have an audience, who are almost solely based,
sickly comprised of MAGA, in a very very tough position

(45:02):
because a lot of them actually do have genuine beliefs
and or principles or philosophies about the way things should
be done. And then when they go against an or
counter to Donald Trump, you're going to find yourself in
a very very difficult position. This is the difficulty in
the conundrum of anybody who is complete, like really totally
tied to Donald Trump as an identity and as part
of why when you do have a differing opinion, you

(45:24):
at the end of the day will always lose. You
will lose to Trump and you will lose to the
Maga base, which is really really unfortunate. Now there are
alternative power centers here. And this is again the lesson
from the war in Iraq, Barbara Jordan and the people
who voted against the war in Iraq and three were villains.
They called them treason. They wanted to throw them in jail.
They were vindicated in a span of just three years.

(45:45):
So if you believe what you believe, stand up and
say it now, you could be wrong. I listen, the
shot Stun could be in power, the Israelis could be
totally successful. I'll eat it. I'd be happy, honestly, I
would be happy if this all ended up well, because
they would mean Americans are dead and the Iranian people
are happy. I just don't think it's going to happen.
I think I have a lot of evidence to back

(46:05):
that up. I don't think they have very much evidence
on their side. Yeah, to be able to say that.
And so when the time comes and the bill can come,
do you know, eventually things will come around and so America, look,
I think they will support this war. Unfortunately, I'm just
telling the truth. Most people don't spend their days reading
books or they don't know anything about Libya or Syria.
They're like, eh, something happened there or whatever. But you know,

(46:26):
at the end you'll come to find that it was
a big mistake in the long run.

Speaker 2 (46:31):
Last thing, and then we can move on to this
bit about the Israelis blocking their own systems from leaving
the country and trying to block our citistens from leaving
their country as well. This was actually one of the
pieces that was very ominous yesterday. Put eight three up
on the screen and we'll talk more about Tucker and
the Tucker block. But Trunk yesterday we had covered, had
said that he was sing sniping at Tucker and was like, listen,

(46:52):
I say what America first is. And unfortunately he's right
about that, and so he went more aggressively at Tucker yesterday.
He said, somebody please explain to Kookie Tucker Carlson that
Iran cannot have a nuclear weapon.

Speaker 3 (47:05):
And like that.

Speaker 2 (47:06):
I mean the number of Magavo people like Laura Lumer
that I've been seeing attacking Tucker, you know, because Trump says, Okay,
he's in the out group.

Speaker 3 (47:14):
Now, that's it. And Tucker has barely.

Speaker 2 (47:15):
Even like hasn't really actually even criticized Trump. He's just
been mostly doing the whole like, oh, there's these forces
inside the administration that you're trying to convince Trump blah
blah blah.

Speaker 3 (47:26):
But the fact that Trump felt.

Speaker 2 (47:28):
The need to effectively like excize him from the coalition
I think was also very troubling.

Speaker 1 (47:33):
Will I don't know, but yeah, I mean that is
a great lesson in terms of how the relationship with
Donald Trump works.

Speaker 2 (47:40):
And yeah, that's where we're sitting there next to him
at the RNC. They were the best buddies not very
long ago.

Speaker 1 (47:45):
Yeah, look, a relationship only runs one way. At the
same time, within Israel, there is an extraordinary development. Let's
go and put this up there on the screen. There's
a new report here from a New Policy which is
an American lobbying organization for US policy towards the Middle East,
actually advancing national interests. Here's what they say. Quote sources

(48:07):
tell US At a meeting yesterday between US Ambassador Mike
Huckabee and Israeli Prime Minister net Yahoo devolved into a
shouting match over Netanyahu's objections to US plans to evacuate
citizens from Israel and the wider region. US officials believe
that the net Yahoo objection was predicated on his desire
to hold US citizens at risk in order to increase

(48:29):
the likelihood of US entry into Israel's conflict with Iran.
So let's sit on that for a little bit, shall we.
First of all, there are seven hundred thousand Americans. This
is the current belief within Israel, seven hundred thousand. I
believe they have the largest outside American citizen population then Mexico,
which tells you quite a bit. However, there is a

(48:51):
little bit of a difference is that many of these
people are dual citizens according to the data that we have.
But it also is being used as a pretext for
why the United States has such a quote obligation to
defend Israel. Now, let's just say Mexico, all right, So
if Mexico, who do they share a border with Guatemala.
So if Guatemala was bombing Mexico, would we intervene to

(49:13):
protect Americans in Mexico. Yeah, I don't think so. I
don't think that that logic works all that well. There's
a secondary element to this, which is that it currently
at least a lot of these US citizens don't seem
to be allowed to leave. You know, we haven't seen
yet some of the reports there, and obviously the flight
situation there is pretty crazy. But almost every one of

(49:33):
the other great powers has told their citizens to evacuate immediately. Yesterday,
the Chinese Foreign Ministry issued his statements that all Chinese
citizens should leave Israel immediately. The Russian Foreign Ministry came
out and said all Russian citizens should leave immediately. There's
actually a huge Russian population in Israel. A lot of
people don't know that. But the point is is that
those countries seem to be have the ability to tell

(49:55):
their citizens to leave right now. I believe we do
have travel advisories and all of that, but the question
is about their ability to do so. And this pairs
and this is already confirmed. This isn't even based on
a report. Put this up there on the screen from Haretz,
which is an Israeli news organization. Israel Tail's Airlines do
not let Israeli citizens leave, even once repatriation flights are

(50:17):
able to continue. Quote estimates suggest rescue flights for Israelately
stranded abroad won't begin before Thursday, and even then only
two flights per hour be allowed during daylight. And the
plan does not match the scale of the crisis. So
I mean, effectively, what you're seeing is that they are
locking their people basically in their borders in the same
way that Ukraine tried to do so in order to

(50:37):
force everybody to fight in the draft. And they're afraid.
I guess of the you know, the number of Israelis
that do have dual citizenship all around the world, who
could take advantage of that and say I'm getting the
hell out of here, I don't want to fight in
this war, or you know, hiding a bomb shelter every
other day raises some profound questions about human shields and
locking people basically in a death trap and forcing them

(50:59):
of their own defeat. I'm not going to deny, and
there's probably a lot of Israelis. I would say that
vasherajority of Israelis probably support this war based on all
the polling. Yeah, we seen agreed. Let's be honest, but
at least some of them want to leave, and the
I think that the action by the Israeli government speaks volumes.

Speaker 2 (51:14):
Yeah, they don't want so first of all, to go
back to US citizens.

Speaker 1 (51:19):
Yeah, that's a big being.

Speaker 3 (51:19):
Blocked from leaving.

Speaker 2 (51:20):
We don't know if they were able to actually, you know,
like Convince how could be in the US administration.

Speaker 3 (51:25):
Of that policy.

Speaker 2 (51:26):
But what they're saying here they want to use American
citizens as human shields, Like that is what that means.
And they want to use American citizens as pawns in
their game to try to force an escalation and force
US to come in on their side. I guarantee you
they are praying for the Iranians to hit some US

(51:46):
military base and to kill some American service members so
that the war fever picks up here in the US
and this administration feels even more pressure, is even more
likely to directly join the fight on Israel's behalf. That's
how sick they are, Like, that's what they're cheering for,
Which is why you shouldn't put like some you know,

(52:07):
false flag, fake attack past them either, because they've done
such things in the past. So I mean, this is
not to be conspiratorial. This is to be a student
of history and understand their logic and what they are
capable of. You can't put anything past these people at
this point. So their stated policy goal, their desire that
they're a arguing with our completely psycho by the way

(52:28):
US Ambassador to Israel micagobi Abilis and all this end
times nonsense. Their stated policy objective is to trap American
citizens in Israel, to use them as human shields to
try to foment and escalate a further, even larger scale war.

Speaker 3 (52:44):
That's where we are.

Speaker 2 (52:45):
And with regard to their own citizens, I think sober
is exactly right.

Speaker 3 (52:49):
Number one.

Speaker 2 (52:50):
They don't want images of thousands or tens of thousands
of Israelis fleeing the country.

Speaker 3 (52:56):
They don't want that.

Speaker 2 (52:57):
They also, i think, are concerned because this is the
country that you know, was really overstretched militarily. You know,
you've got the uh Gaza genocide occupation, you have a
siege that was implemented in the West Bank and increasingly
aggressive actions there. You've had bombing campaigns in numerous regional
neighbor neighbors, and you have you know, a reserve corp

(53:20):
that's been called up again and again and again. So
they're worried also on just like a tactical level of
losing additional amount of their manpower of people you know,
who flee overseas and don't want to be part of this,
who may support the war broadly but may not exactly
want to be the ones who are fighting it. So
that's you know, that's the calculation their ageation, which is

(53:41):
pretty grotesque.

Speaker 1 (53:43):
It's I mean, look, it's like I said, it speaks volumes.
They don't want their own citizens to leave. But at
the same time, again, let's not say that the vast
majority of the people don't support this war and at
least at least the political establishment does. Let's put this
up there on the screen. This is from the Times
of Israel, but the op position has actually rallied around
the Iran campaign quote despite long opposing PM's leadership. Yeah,

(54:05):
you're lapede, the primary opposition leader says, not now who
must go, but not during the existential fight right in
a while.

Speaker 3 (54:12):
This is happening right now and now.

Speaker 1 (54:14):
Tali Bennett, the former Prime minister, says there is no left,
no opposition and no coalition when it comes to preventing
Iranian nuclears all.

Speaker 2 (54:22):
So fucking fake, like just down of nowhere, they just
make up, Oh, Iran's about to have nukes. They haven't
offered any evidence of this. Our own intelligence community says
that is not the case. They aren't pursuing nukes, that
it would take three years. We've been hearing for decades
now that Iran is days away, weeks away, months away,
whatever I mean. Even Bebe himself isn't saying they're like

(54:45):
weeks away from an Iranian nuke. So this is all
about a political calculation by Bibnata Yahoo that number one,
he does not want the diplomatic negotiations that the Trump
administration was engaged in to succeed. Number two, he is
still very on very tenuous political footing himself.

Speaker 3 (55:05):
And so this is a way to you know, in
the same way there's.

Speaker 2 (55:07):
A rally around the flag effect in Iran, there's a
rally around the flag effect in Israel that you can
see here as evidenced by the opposition basically saying like
this is our guy for as long as this war continues,
We'll guess what that incentivizes war continuing forever. So that's
why this is happening right now. It has nothing to
do with any Iranian activities regarding developing a nuke. That

(55:28):
is the pretext and the goal here very clearly is
to collapse this government and foment either a failed state
or some sort of direct regime change. That is the
true aim of what they're doing. And so do not
believe all this, like don't get caught up in all
this nonsense, Trump tweeting out, oh, Iran cannot have a
new Okay, then keep going with your negotiations, which had

(55:48):
a genuine shot at success until you lied about them
to trick the Iranians and help to you know, close
the possibility of any sort of a diplomatic solution.

Speaker 1 (55:59):
Yeah, I mean, especially what we're looking at right now
from Donald Trump. I mean what we see is just
you know, like not only a backing of the campaign,
but what you're also watching or just accepting a lot
of these implicit assumptions like that this is a war
of necessity, that the Israeli intelligence is somehow better than
our intelligence. I don't believe that. I mean, look, Telsea

(56:21):
Gabbard signed it and testified before Congress under oath. If
she lied, go ahead and tell us, show us the proof. Right,
This is what I mean about Iraq. They actually did try.
I mean, they made up all of this bullshit about
yellow Cake and Curveball and niche Are. I mean, I
can tell you the whole story.

Speaker 3 (56:38):
A lot to propaganda.

Speaker 1 (56:40):
It took a while build up, Colan Powell, and you know,
there's no question that they're on their path to a WMD.
I was actually going back and reading the exact TikTok
of all of it. In a way, it's impressive the
amount of bs that they were able to make sound legitimate.
They don't even try this time. It's all out here
in the open. They're just like, no our intelligence assessment.
I don't agree with her. That's what Trump said today.

(57:00):
And in terms of the Israeli society and government, it's
pretty clear they're united around this. Put B four up
here on the screen. We have Neftali Bennett, the former
Prime minister. What a peculiar country Israel. When Iranian missiles
rained down on US, two hundred thousand are scrambling to
come home, not away from danger, but towards it. I
love my nation of lions. It'd be interesting I'd see
what that number would be if they did actually allow

(57:21):
outbound flights, but Israel finding it.

Speaker 3 (57:24):
Away from danger, you're not letting them. I did say.

Speaker 2 (57:28):
I don't know if this is confirmed or not, but
apparently some Israelis are taking like.

Speaker 3 (57:31):
Yachts to Cyprus really too. Yeah, to get around the
error ban.

Speaker 2 (57:37):
One last thing and then we can move on to
this Tucker and Steve Bannon conversation, which is interesting. We
got a number of pieces of it to share with you,
But did you follow Tulsi put out that like weird
ass nuclear review last week, and it was very ominous
and she's talking about like the nuclear attacks, you know,
are dropping the bombs in World War two and all
the carnage from that, and sounding is very ominous warning.

Speaker 3 (57:59):
And at the time, first I was like, what is this?

Speaker 2 (58:02):
And then also it felt like it was more And
maybe it was in the contract text of like Ukraine
Russia and the possibility of a nuclear conflagration there, But
I don't know. Now with the outbreak of you know,
US joining this war with a r I don't know
if it was like more about that, I'm not sure,
but it was interesting to me.

Speaker 3 (58:18):
Now looking back in.

Speaker 2 (58:19):
Retrospect, I'm like, was she trying to send a message
as some sort of a plea for help.

Speaker 1 (58:24):
I don't know. Yeah, look at this point, look we're
not there yet. But you know, for Tulsi, this is
the person who staked her into and look, she's compromised.
I think many things that she said in the past,
but I don't think she has compromised herself on Iran
and really on Iraq war, right, which is the central
reason according to her. Just you know, when we spoke
to her as to why she wanted to get into politics,
it's like, if they do launch a war, you have

(58:46):
to resign if you have any integrity whatsoever. I mean,
but I don't think it'll happen, but I think she should.
There are a few other people in the administration. RFK
Junior is one of them as well. This is a
person who, look, he may be very very pro Israel,
but he has spoken repeatedly about the war in Iraq
with a disasters neo conservative intervention. I mean, it's a
separate question entirely if it involves like fully bombing, and

(59:09):
it's something by his admission, he said it was some
of the most disastrous choices in US history. It's like, okay,
the same thing, you need to resign. There are a
lot of people in the administration who have literally forged
their way to you know, to Donald Trump and two
working in their positions right now because of their opposition
to forever Wars and other things. And so look, if

(59:30):
somebody's going to do such an about face, then you
kind of do have at least some you know, there's
there's an integrity question here when it comes to that.
And if they don't, I mean they're going to be
scarred for all times.

Speaker 3 (59:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:41):
Look, we'll see in terms of how this works.

Speaker 2 (59:44):
But I think you see is the one that really
comes top of mind to Yeah, because she's just her
whole thing is against the warmonds forever wars. That's our
whole thing, right, And so if you and you have
Trump throwing you under directly under the bus now quite literally,
I don't care what she.

Speaker 1 (59:59):
Said, you in front of the eyes of the world.
I mean, if you think about it, you know, the
ODE and I the Office of the Director of National
Intelligence supposed to be the boss of the entire US
intelligence community. So she goes abroad and she's meeting with
let's say, our five eyes people and said this is
the US intelligence assessment. They're gonna be like, why should
we believe you? You know that Donald Trump says he
doesn't even trust you. Easy. He kicked your legs out
from under you completely and neutered. I mean, it's it's

(01:00:21):
honestly embarrassing. It's humiliating. I quote, I don't care what
she said, right, I mean, this is one where it
really is, uh, it really is just it's astounding and
it is sad. Let's get to the Tucker segment because
it's important here as well. You know, this gives you

(01:00:41):
some preview into the elements of the people who quote
MAGA or MAGA leaders who are trying to push back
and some of the futility which that has and perhaps
though could preview, you know, some break in the coalition
or at the very least at a leadership political level.
So we'll see how this works. But Tucker Carlson actually
flew to Washington yesterday, something that he rarely does, specifically

(01:01:04):
just to sit down with Steve Bannon live in the
studio and basically the campaign against US intervention in this war.
Let's take a listen to what he and Steve Bannon
had to say.

Speaker 8 (01:01:13):
The platform of Fox, though, it's just not Mars. But
why is Fox like all weekend? It's just cheerly, it's
the same. It's exactly you can play side by side
Iraq in two thousand and three. Oh I was there
and here and what's happening today? Why is it? Why
is this apparatus? Well, Evince the funniest because he's terrible
on TV. And again I never had any problems with

(01:01:34):
him at Fox. He kind of controls Hannity in this
weird way. I never understood what that was about. I
never really cared to learn.

Speaker 9 (01:01:42):
Sean was great to me, always nice, and so was Levin,
so I just like kind of stayed away. But they
didn't want to put him on TV because he's like
screechy and he's just not a coming president. Like I'm look,
su're literally floating in and out of consciousness and the
attendant has taken the remote to go have a cigarette.
You're gonna flip the channel when.

Speaker 1 (01:02:02):
Gets on TV.

Speaker 9 (01:02:02):
It's like listened to your ex wife scream about alimony payments.
That's like not appealing.

Speaker 1 (01:02:08):
So they wouldn't put them on TV.

Speaker 9 (01:02:09):
And then you know, Sean push and they gave him
some kind of weekend show that nobody watched. Now I
don't have a TV, but someone was just who owns
the TV was just telling me that he's like all
over prime Time.

Speaker 1 (01:02:21):
So what is that.

Speaker 9 (01:02:22):
That's not by popular acclaim, that's not like their viewer surveys, like,
you know, we need a lot more Mark Levin, less
Jesse Waters, more Mark Levin. What they're doing is what
they always do, which is just turning up the propaganda
hose to full blast and just trying to, you know,
knock elderly Fox viewers off their feet and make them submit.

Speaker 8 (01:02:45):
This is this is where they're.

Speaker 1 (01:02:47):
I mean, look, that's as good as it gets in
terms of calling out Fox News at least. And I
will tell you I because Secretary of Defense Pete Hagsath
was appearing live on Fox yesterday. I unfortunately was watching
some just to make sure, you know, we weren't having
an announcement of war. And by the way, Secretary of
Defense was on for two minutes. Do you want to
know the first question that they asked him about two minutes?

Speaker 3 (01:03:07):
Well, I know the answer is here.

Speaker 1 (01:03:09):
Yeah, it was about the military preak. Yeah, they were like,
why don't you just tell us about how great that.
I was like, are you fucking kidding me? You're literally
in the middle of a crisis in Jesse Waters is
asking about the military parade.

Speaker 3 (01:03:21):
Of course it was Jesse Waters.

Speaker 1 (01:03:22):
I couldn't believe it. I mean, it's like, you don't
even pretend do you have any news organization? Okay, but whatever,
let's put that to the side. Tucker is correct. I mean,
just yesterday apparently Fox broadcast a report about secret Iranian
nuclear sites that have recently been found. I mean, it's
out of three all over again. But this is also
why there is a generational divide on the issue. In fact,

(01:03:43):
there was some polling that came out yesterday which showed
that people who primarily got their news from cable are
dramatically more pro Israel. People who got their news and
this includes right wingers. Actually, people who got their news
from the internet and or podcast or do a mix
of both are dramatically less trustful of a lot of
mainstream institutions. But look, here's the truth. These are the

(01:04:03):
people who vote. These are the people who really have,
you know, the ear of some of the people involved.
And with Trump, it's obvious that he respects television more
than anything so before we play even more Tucker stuff,
it's actually important to say that even Tucker's mild criticism there,
did you guys hear what he said? He said, I
love Trump. I think he's a deeply humane person that
is as couched as it gets. I mean, can we

(01:04:26):
let's be honest here, right? Yeah, well, even that just
the temerity to say something about Trump not needing to
go to war with Iran. Here's what Trump had to
say in response. Guys, let's go ahead and play CE four.

Speaker 7 (01:04:39):
They've been talking about this deal for six years, which
is and he's done what they haven't been able to do.
So he's done really a very good jet. I don't
know what Tucker Carlson is saying. Let him go get
a television network and say it so that people listen.
Thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:04:59):
Let go get a television network. I mean again, this
is preposterous for a number of reasons. One, Trump actually
eschewed television for the podcast. There was the whole narrative
about the podcast election, and he got millions and millions
of views online. The Tucker Carlson Show is probably far
bigger than it ever was on Fox News in terms

(01:05:20):
of the number of views I mean, it's always number one,
number two, two to five on the top podcast in
the entire United States, gets millions of views on YouTube.
It's just empirically, you know, true that you've had far more.
He's had far more reach. I don't know about influence,
but reach, yeah, on an independent sphere something. His White
House has an alternative media seat for So I don't

(01:05:41):
know what that's all about if he only cares about television.
But the point is is that in his head, foxes
all that matters. And what Tucker is calling out there
is Sean Hannity, Mark Levin and the entire Fox Primetime
is just geared up for World War War. And the
crazy thing is it's the same people General Jack Keane, right,
the same guy on TV and O three or sorry

(01:06:02):
in seven and potion for the Surge is now here
back on television, Pump in the war in with Iran,
he says, it's a critical a core national interest of
the United States are died in the wool neo cons
there's no getting around it whatsoever. And yet it's being
mainlined into the boomer mind at every level. And look,

(01:06:23):
this just is about Fox, because it's about the right wing.
This is every network. Yeah, I mean it's insanity out there,
it really is. CNN's got IDF spokespeople freaking Scott Jennings
from a bunker in Jerusalem telling Trump to finish the job.
News Nation is somehow even more unhinged with Cuomo and
Leland Viddter on the Iran question to watch.

Speaker 2 (01:06:44):
Oh by the way, Scott Horton taken Leland for her
part if you want some enjoyable viewing, but I actually
need to watch MSNBC.

Speaker 3 (01:06:51):
I'm curious.

Speaker 1 (01:06:52):
I think the line that I've not yet seen a
single clip tells me what I need to know, which
is that there we don't just like the Democratic Party,
They've got nothing. And you know, this is actually a
big test for Chris Hayes. Some of us have been
around long enough. You know that Chris is origin stories
about the war in Iraq too. So Chris, where are
you man? Like You've got a primetime network, make yourself
the central you know, rally the base, do something we need.

(01:07:13):
We need Keith, you know for you know, it didn't
turn out so well for Keith, but at the time,
at the time, it was important, it was important.

Speaker 3 (01:07:21):
Did you see this comment from Miss McConnell.

Speaker 1 (01:07:22):
What was it?

Speaker 2 (01:07:23):
He was asked Manu Rajuo asked him about Iran and Israel,
and he said, quote, what's happening here is some of
the isolation isolationist movement led by Tucker Carlson and Steve Bannon,
are distressed. We may be helping the Israelis defeat the Iranians.
I would say it's been kind of a bad week
for the isolationists. So, you know, Mitch McConnell here taking

(01:07:44):
a victory lap. Yes, but you know, ultimately, like you said,
Tucker has broad a reach, but perhaps less influence, and unfortunately,
I think that is the case. Unfortunately, cable news still
has some purchase on our society and in terms of
like elite conversations, and to your point, when you're talking
about foreign policy, the elite conversation really matters a lot. So,

(01:08:08):
you know, and the vast majority of MAGA core MAGA
voters he had independence who voted for Trump, who I
think will be disgusted with this decision and we'll say
this isn't what I voted for and will be unhappy
and move away from him. I think his approval rating
may go down as a result. If he gets as
directly involved in a run. But I think his approval
ratings the Republican Party will continue to be sky high.

(01:08:31):
They will continue to, you know, do whatever mental gymnastics
they need to do to say this is totally different
than a rock and this is totally in line with,
you know, with what I wanted and what I voted for.
And listen, in fairness, Trump on the campaign trail was
talking about how Israel should bomb Iran's nuclear facilities. So
the White House posted this long thread of all the

(01:08:52):
times that Trump said Iran cannot have a nuclear weapon,
and look he did. He said, now you know, he
also trotted out Tulci Gabbard, R F K Junior to
posture like they were going to be the pro peace
ticket and that they were going to be against the
warmongers and they were opposed all as shady, et cetera.
But he also said the thing that you know, some
of us picked up on and paired with his first

(01:09:16):
term record indicated that no, he's not going to be
some dove. He's not going to be committed to a
completely different foreign policy orientation. He's not going to be
committed to extricating us from this region. He was the
most pro Israel president we've probably ever had in his
first term.

Speaker 3 (01:09:33):
So you know, that's that's what it is.

Speaker 2 (01:09:36):
And the Magabase found a way to reconcile that at
the time, and they will continue to do so.

Speaker 1 (01:09:40):
Yeah, look as you said, and I think it's very
obvious Maga and all of them will go along and
the line will probably be the Libya line. I still
believe to this day. I don't think Trump is dumb
enough initially to commit to some full blown regime change
operation which requires boots on the ground. I think it's
going to be a Libya style situation. And remember Obama

(01:10:01):
and Susan Rice were all saying, what about Libya. It
was a tremendous success. We committed, just a few American
jets shot them down, and then the Libyan people rose
up and they seized their destiny for themselves. And then
our ambassador was a literally dying and smoldering ruins. Oh,
I don't know. Eight months later and Isis took over.
Bengazi turned into a slave market and a footpath and

(01:10:25):
a boat path to Europe for one of the world's
worst demographic crises in modern history. Oh, just you know,
only took a couple of years for that to work out,
So that will be the line, is that no Americans
died while doing it. And it's like, Okay, no Americans
died in the Syrian Civil War? Do we think it
was a disaster? I do? Uh, you know, because guess
what French people died in the Bata Khan when Isis

(01:10:46):
massacred all of them and it was planned in Syria. Actually,
a lot of Americans were killed fighting ISIS in twenty
seventeen in Iraq, which was bled over from Syria. Same
in Libya. Sure did a lot of Americans die as
a result of Libya. No, not directly, except for you know,
the people in Benghazi. But let's also think about all
of the weapons in the civil war and all of

(01:11:08):
the fallout from that in the region, the chaos that
it's wrought on Europe. Just because you know, the bar
cannot be one person die an American dies or not.
That's not the issue that is at hand here. The
issue is destabilize the regime. Does it cost us the
cost the United States more blood, more treasure, more attention
being paid to this region. And that's really what he

(01:11:30):
has committed himself. To within this and it's going to
be a disaster. To this point, here you have Tucker
and Steve Bannon going off on this. Let's take a listen.

Speaker 9 (01:11:39):
I actually really love Trump. He's a deeply humane, kind person.
And I am saying this because I'm really afraid that
my country is going to be further weakened by this.
I think we're going to see the end of American empire.
Obviously other nations would like to see that, and this
is a perfect way to scuttle the USS America, the

(01:12:00):
shoals of Iran. But it's also going to end I
believe Trump's presidency and effectively end it. And and so
that's why I'm saying, what do.

Speaker 4 (01:12:08):
You mean by that?

Speaker 8 (01:12:09):
That's that's coming for you that you get.

Speaker 9 (01:12:11):
Look, I knew Bush. I knew George W. Bush with
you know, family connections to Bush. I knew Bush personally.
I still see Bush sometimes and you know, of course
he hates me, and he does because I criticized him
on a rock and that war is the sum total
from historical perspective of his administration. But I knew him,

(01:12:32):
and he had all kinds of plans for the things
that he wanted to do, but one domestically, domestically to
improve the country. And you may agree or disagree, but
like in his mind, he wasn't just about the invasion
of Iraq in March.

Speaker 8 (01:12:44):
Of Oh No, No, he was going to redo social security typody.
He was going to take care of the entitlements issue.

Speaker 1 (01:12:50):
And he really thought it was going to work.

Speaker 9 (01:12:52):
And you could laugh at that or whatever, but the
point is, the second you get himmeshed in a real war,
not a fake, let's go bomb the villagers and declare success.
Though we don't even have a good track record, like Whyle,
the Hoothy's still there. I mean this a whole other question,
which is how prepared is the US military for real conflict?
And the answer is totally unprepared, scary unprepared. I don't

(01:13:13):
think people understand that.

Speaker 1 (01:13:15):
End of the American empire. I mean, we had talked
about this with Dave yesterday, but I think it bears,
you know, reiterating is Look, there's a reason like this
is it When you get in messin of war, it
will kill your entire presidency. It becomes this singular issue.
Everything else it gets dragged down. I said yesterday, the
evangelicals a lot of them believe that Bush Iraq is

(01:13:35):
what killed their entire movement. I mean, like I said,
I don't think it's one hundred percent true, but there's
probably some truth to it if you believed in social
security reform. I don't, but they believe it. That's what
killed it. It was Iraq. It was Iraq, and it
was a Hurricane Katrina. Those two things nuked the entire
Bush project. They became in messing at the entire White House,

(01:13:56):
became in Iraq project. They never did a single piece
of major mestic legislation ever. Again, that will similarly happen here,
except Trump is somehow beating Bush on the timeline. It's
only been six months into his presidency. This will define
for the next three and a half years if things
go poorly. I mean, they're really just banking on the
ability to land the plane. But there's just no evidence
of that, you know, And what he points out is

(01:14:18):
a bigger question as well. Even if Americans don't get
deployed to hundreds of thousands or any of that, the
spotlight in the attention that we'll have to have on
the country of Iran as a result of this operation
is years decades to come. Think about Iran is not
only a country of ninety million. Let's say the regime
collapses and it goes Libya, civil war, Iraq. You'll have Katar, Saudi, Turkey,

(01:14:43):
all these other people. They are all going to pick
sides Israel, everyone's going to pick there. They're all going
to fight each other. There will be mass death. You
have a direct footpath. They can walk to Europe literally
by foot if they wanted to. So you're going to
have a mass demographic crisis in Europe. And then on
top of that, all of these different subregional issues surrounding it,
like Syria and the Iraqi government, they themselves be destabilized

(01:15:04):
because Iran was so in mesh in their politics. And
so then what happens if we have a civil war
there and then they bleed into each other and all
of this is when that's exactly when the John mccains
and Lindsay Graham's of the world say, we got to
go in and we got to pick a side, just
like we did with Syria, just like we did with Libya,
and guess what, we're not very good at it. And
all the while it requires more US munitions, more carrier
strike groups, more Israeli defense, and what's going on in

(01:15:26):
East Asia? Fifty percent of global GDP laughing at the
United States of America. I mean, already we've probably depleted
an entire year's worth of FAD interceptors in five days.
Five days. I mean, it would require the World War
II level mobilization of the US economy to come back
and to actually produce the level of munitions just to

(01:15:48):
be able to support an offensive in an ongoing war
against Iran. Forget about some of the theater. It's not
going to happen. This is not two thousand and three
in the unipolar moment. And you know, I didn't even
talk about all of the underlying social decay and problems
that we have here at home. So I think he's
exactly right. I mean, I don't know if it would
be the end of the American Empire, but it would
be a step in them.

Speaker 3 (01:16:10):
Anyway.

Speaker 2 (01:16:11):
Yeah, And I mean, think of all the costs that
just the Hoothies and Yemen were able to exactly exactly
against us, like with the you know, when they're relatively
like minor operation which wasn't even really directed at us.
And then think about you know, the cost out a
country like Iran could exact. You know, I personally would
like this administration to fail, but not at the cost
of going to war in Iran. That is, you know,

(01:16:32):
not a cost that it should be or is acceptable.

Speaker 3 (01:16:35):
In any way. And I think your point about the.

Speaker 2 (01:16:39):
Escalation of our the acceleration of our decline is incredibly apt.
Let's go and play this last sad that we have
from Tucker and Steve Bannon. This is c three guys
where you can see how careful they are about avoiding
any direct criticism of Trump. And I think this is
a preview of the justifications to come that you already see.

(01:16:59):
You know, I saw Charles Kirk last night on Fox News. Oh,
I trust Trump, and we have to trust in Trump.
And he was made for this moment, and thank god
we elected him to be here during this point in time.
Like the rationalization that we've seen in the past from
many of these figures is anything Trump does that they
don't like, it's never his fault. It's like the people

(01:17:19):
around him, or he got tricked, he got pulled into something.
The deep stay blah blah blah. And so Tucker and
Bannon in an effort to maintain apparently failed effort to
maintain some sort of credibility and influence within the Trump
administration also cocked this, you know, elaborate imaginary scheme in
which Trump is really dedicated to peace, and it's just

(01:17:40):
all of these unseen forces around him that are effectuating
the outcome that we all see.

Speaker 3 (01:17:45):
Let's take a listen to that.

Speaker 9 (01:17:46):
And the incentives to pull the US in are so profound.
I guess if I could just say one political thing,
the watching Donald Trump, who, of course you know very
well who I think at core is sincere about peace time. Yeah,
big time, big time. I mean that's that's real, watching
him done so wrong. The lies, Oh he knew all along.

(01:18:12):
You know that the peace process was faked. Steve Wikoff
was playing a long That is a lie. That's a lot,
I know, that's a lot. Those guys meant it.

Speaker 1 (01:18:21):
It's a total lie.

Speaker 9 (01:18:22):
And all these people that that Mark Levin and all
of the minions who are running cover for a foreign government,
they're all telling that same why And I just I
feel for President Trump and I think I don't know this,
I'm just guessing, but at this point I feel like
he just has to kind of roll with it. You know,
what do you say you can't you want to get
an argument about that right in the middle of a war.

Speaker 8 (01:18:44):
I think he reiterated last night that we got to
get back to the peace part.

Speaker 4 (01:18:47):
The guy laid down.

Speaker 1 (01:18:48):
They're lying about him.

Speaker 9 (01:18:50):
He's sincerely even now, he sincerely believes. Whether he's writer
or not, I can't say, but that this could be
a predicate to a peace deal. What we're seeing now,
he really thinks that and wants that.

Speaker 2 (01:19:02):
So he's holding onto the idea this was all This
is all an effort to get to a piece deal.

Speaker 1 (01:19:07):
I mean there's a duality of Trump. I think both
of those things can be true. I think when Trump
is on the phone with Tucker and them, he probably
is saying things like that, He's probably got hours of
conversation with a lot of people. Actually, I know this
literally to be the case, talking about how he wants
a deal with Iron. He's also a deeply impressionable boomer
who watches a lot of Fox News, and when he
has dinner with Mark Levin is like, yeah, maybe it

(01:19:29):
is a good idea to go at. And this is
the problem with somebody who doesn't think that deeply about
any of this. I mean, it also shows you really
the downside of somebody who basically could promise all things
to all people. But part of the clarifying part of
the presidency is that you do actually make a decision,
and when you make that decision, you actually come into power.
You find out who what heal, somebody really thinks, or

(01:19:50):
who has really been swayed or not. Part of the
reason they have to frame this stuff is this happened
yesterday with Dave. I love Dave, and Dave doesn't care
about this, But Dave actually was kind of a real
figure in Maga write I would say in terms of
his audience. People look to him for guidance and just
you know his position.

Speaker 2 (01:20:09):
He had real antiope to solidify libertarians voting for Trump.

Speaker 1 (01:20:12):
Yeah, and that was really important. And so when he
was on our show and he was like, impeached Trump
and I'm done with Trump, I was like, oh man,
because what I know is that for them Trump is
the ultimate question. Trump can never fail, He can only
be failed. Now that's a very convenient narrative for Donald J. Trump.
It's obviously bullshit. And those of us who talk like
Dave or who say these things like that's bs or

(01:20:33):
you actually have agency, you get shut out real quickly.
Like I just am being honest in terms of the
way that this all works for political influence. And that's
part of why Bannon and Tucker, like they both are
doing shows and they're trying to give their opinion, but
they're political actors as well, trying to push in actual agenda.
And what you're all watching is how that works in
practice and also how difficult and honestly humiliate it can be.

(01:20:56):
I mean, especially Bannon's case, because Bannon, you know, constantly
like he's he'll hit them on elon, he'll hit them
on this and all, and then Trump will just be
like I don't agree with that at all, and he'll
elevate them and Bannon's like, I'm speaking for the magabase
and it's like, well, are you really. He's like, that's
why that whole mantle of I'm speaking for the MAGA
base or any of that. I think everyone needs to
drop it and we should just argue on the merits.

(01:21:19):
Let's just argue on the actual thing and say, look,
this isn't this we can talk about politics. I mean,
you want me to give the real anti political case
for Trump. I said it earlier in the show Bush.
The reason he survived is because he got the whole
country to agree with men and co opt to the
Democratic Party. If you do this, if Donald Trump does this,
he will own the decision entirely. No Democrats going to

(01:21:39):
vote for this war. They're not stupid enough, you know,
to a lot of Republicans won't even necessarily vote because
it won't come up for that, and he and his
national security team will own it for all time. There's
none of that protection for them political establishment or the media,
even in the media, to be honest, because they're not
as complicit in this one. Like you can't spread the
blame around you were going to own it one hundred percent.

(01:22:00):
That's about as a political reason as ever not to
do the course that you're currently taking.

Speaker 4 (01:22:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:22:05):
Well, and Tucker is a much more I mean no
disrespect for Todave who I think you're right as an
influential figure on the right ones important pulling together you know,
the Trump winning Trump coalition, bringing Libertarians into the ten
et cetera. But Tucker is a much larger and more
influential figure. And even with him being so careful. Trump
still hit him, hit him multiple times and just completely

(01:22:28):
you know, brushes him aside. Kookie Tucker Carlson thinks that
it's fine for Ron to have nuclear weapon, you know,
and so and it are politics. This is the worst
thing about the Trump era. It's all about Trump. He
is the central dividing line. If you are you know
how you feel about him and his every single decision
and your willingness to go along with it no matter

(01:22:51):
what it is, that defines where you are in the
political spectrum. I mean, it's easy to forget now. Liz
Cheney was a big Trump supporter. Liz Cheney campaigned with Trump,
okay in twenty twenty. She was on the Trump train,
and then the minute it has nothing to do with
her being in ne O'Connor whatever. I know, that's what
they claim. It had nothing to do with that. She
criticized Trump after January sixth, that was it. That was

(01:23:13):
what killed her. And same thing with all this, you know,
antipathy towards Mitch McConnell, who now is apparently like you know,
riding high because he's getting his way in terms of
foreign policy, has nothing to do with him being corrupt
or in ne O'Connor any of the rest. It had
everything to do with again, he was critical of Donald Trump,
and you can't do that, and they will, you know,
trash you and destroy you, and the base will go

(01:23:34):
along with whatever you say about who is on the
good side and who is on the bad side. So
you know, that's that's the landscape as it exists now.