September 12, 2025 • 66 mins
Krystal, Ryan, Emily and Saagar break down the latest on Charlie Kirk's assassin.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, guys, Sager and Crystal.
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dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
Let me ask you, guys this and again this. We
don't We don't know the ideological leanings of this person.
We don't know, if you know, they could be politically
all over the blue.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
We don't know. But let me ask you guys this question.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
Do you think I'm right that even if it is
like a clear cutcase of like some white nationalist or
groper type or whatever that this guy turns out to be,
that Trump will just pretend that it's otherwise or use
this anyway to his ends.
Speaker 5 (00:59):
I'm curious about him saying yesterday he had some sense
of the motive before this. That tells me that maybe
they think or they thought they had reason to believe
that there's some I don't know, like what is going on?
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Were they going off the supposed trends in super bullets.
I mean, we didn't spend enough time on that because
it was so it's so disgusting to me that the
Wall Street Journal ran with that, And apparently it turned
out there were like some arrows like potentially already printed
on the bullets, because there are little like markings on
there that they were like these arrows, I think that
(01:34):
must mean he's pro trans which was completely invented, and
you know, all kinds of lay people. When this news
came out of like markings on the bullets indicating transgender ideology,
people were like, what would that even be? But apparently
no one at the Wall Street Journal that reprinted this
thought for two seconds to ask that question.
Speaker 5 (01:55):
Or they reported, well, here's also what's interesting is that
they reported so Steven Krab got it first, and the
journal was probably rushing because of Stephen Crowder, which is
already just like what the hell? But they reported that
ATF was taking these markings seriously, and the journal probably
failed to contextualize how thin the like evidence was that
(02:20):
that was, you know, something to take seriously. But what
it says to me is that somebody at ATF was
taking it.
Speaker 6 (02:30):
Very, very seriously. And so because of that. Okay, here,
so we've got a press conference coming.
Speaker 7 (02:36):
In no way, I mean, real quick to Chris. But
like Trump said, he I don't care. Trump is telling
Trump Trump already answered your questions. Yeah, that's probably so,
I don't care who did this.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Yeah, the problem is, yeah, sure we got radicals on
the right, but they're doing it for the right reasons.
I mean, that's what you know, that's the whole justification
for January six. We already know he pardoned a bunch
of you know, violent JA six riders. All right, here's
the pressor.
Speaker 8 (03:05):
Leaving the rifle in a bush.
Speaker 9 (03:07):
Messages related to a to visually watching the area where
our rifle was left and a message referring.
Speaker 8 (03:14):
To having left the rifle wrapped in a towel.
Speaker 9 (03:19):
The messages also referred to engraving bullets and a mention
of a scope and the rifle being unique.
Speaker 8 (03:27):
Messages from the contact.
Speaker 9 (03:28):
Tyler also mentioned that he had changed outfits. I know
there's been speculation as well as to the writing.
Speaker 8 (03:40):
On those casings.
Speaker 9 (03:41):
Here we go, those those bullet casings, and I believe
we have that.
Speaker 8 (03:48):
As well, and I'll share that with you now.
Speaker 10 (03:54):
So the area north of Campus Drive Road where the
suspect crossed over, you saw some of that in the
video that we released last night, consists of a grassy
area with trees on the edge of the UBU campus.
Speaker 9 (04:06):
Investigators discovered a bolt action rifle wrapped in a dark
colored towel. The rifle was determined to be a Mouser
Model ninety eight thirty out six caliber thirty six caliber
bolt action rifle.
Speaker 8 (04:18):
The rifle has scope mounted on top of it.
Speaker 9 (04:21):
Investigators noted inscriptions that had been engraved on casings found
with the rifle.
Speaker 8 (04:27):
Inscriptions on a fired casing.
Speaker 9 (04:29):
Read notices, bulges, capital, OWO, what's.
Speaker 8 (04:35):
This question mark, inscriptions on the three on fired.
Speaker 9 (04:38):
Casings red he notices exclamation point, catch, exclamation point, arrow symbol,
right arrow and symbol, and three down arrow symbols. A
second on fired casing red oh, bella.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Chow belle chow bella chow chow.
Speaker 8 (04:56):
Chow, and a third on fired Casey Red. If you
read this, you are a LMAO.
Speaker 11 (05:05):
We are indebted to enforcement across the state who's worked
seamlessly together local law enforcement, state law enforcement, and our
federal partners with the with the Federal Bureau of Investigation.
Speaker 8 (05:19):
We're grateful for everyone who work together in such a short.
Speaker 9 (05:24):
Amount of time to find this person and to and
to bring justice. I want to think the public who
has been so engaged reviewing, reviewing videos, helping us with
sending in tips and helping us get to this point.
Speaker 8 (05:43):
I want to thank the family members of.
Speaker 9 (05:46):
Tyler Robinson who did the right thing in this case
and we're able to bring him into law enforcement as well.
I especially want to thank the family of Charlie Kirk Erica, Charlie's.
Speaker 8 (06:05):
Parents, his children. I want us to.
Speaker 9 (06:08):
Be thinking of them as we bring justice in this case.
They will be involved in that justice. We will be
working very closely with them as we move through this
process as well. This is a very sad day for
again for our country, a terrible.
Speaker 8 (06:26):
Day for the state of Utah.
Speaker 9 (06:28):
But I'm grateful that at this moment we have an
opportunity to bring closure to this very dark chapter in
our nation's history with that. Will now turn the turn
the microphone over to the director of the FBI.
Speaker 4 (06:43):
Cat Those bullet markings are hard to decipher.
Speaker 8 (06:50):
This is what happens when you let good cops be cops.
Speaker 12 (06:54):
The FBI and our partners are proud to stand here
today together to bring justice to the family of Charlie.
Speaker 8 (07:00):
In honor's memory.
Speaker 13 (07:01):
I want to express my deep gratitude to President Trump,
the Vice President, and the entire White House who have
been so incredibly supportive with both resources and just personally
to the FBI as a team. They had our backs
to the entire way, and I just want to express
my gratitude for giving us the resources we need to
operate in this space to bring this sort of justice
at this sort of speed. In thirty three hours, we
(07:23):
have made historic progress for Charlie. Governor Cox, our partnership
has been absolutely incredible these last few days. Our partnership
will ignore your state and local partners, your sheriffs, your
GPS community has been unbelievably impressive in the hardest of times,
and a case like this cannot be solved, cannot be
(07:46):
brought without partnering with your state and local authorities.
Speaker 8 (07:49):
The FBI has a certain role to play. We will
play that role and we will lead up with federal government.
Speaker 12 (07:54):
Governor Cox, we are so grandful from your state partnership
that let out on this investigation a little bit of
the timeline. Charlie shot at twelve twenty three pm on Wednesday.
The first FBI agent's arrived on scene in sixteen minutes.
We chiefs the police at twelve thirty nine and secured
the scene.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
This is cya to try to convince people they did
a good jobs.
Speaker 13 (08:19):
We utilize these assets to transport personnel, specialty technicians, passage
rescue teams.
Speaker 8 (08:24):
We also utilize these assets to go.
Speaker 13 (08:26):
Back and forth from the East Coast and here in
Utah to transport forensic evidence and other evidence that will
be analyzed that is being analyzed at our FBI laboratories
in Quantico and other laboratories including the ATF.
Speaker 8 (08:38):
In my direction, the.
Speaker 12 (08:39):
FBI released the first set of FBI photos of this suspect.
Speaker 8 (08:42):
At ten am local time on nine to eleven.
Speaker 12 (08:46):
Then shortly thereafter, the FBI reward of one hundred thousand
dollars was.
Speaker 13 (08:50):
Released at ten forty five am Local myself and Deputy
Director Bon Gino arrived on the scene at ap propably
five thirty PM on nine to eleven. The Governor let
a press conference last night at approximately eight pm where
in my direction, the FBI released and ever before seen
video of the suspect.
Speaker 12 (09:11):
We also released new images to the public of the suspect.
And just last night, the suspect was taken into custody
at ten PM of the time, in less than thirty
six hours thirty three to be precise, thanks to the
full weight of the federal government and leading out with
(09:32):
the partners here in the state of Utah and Governor Cox,
the suspect was apprehended in historic time period.
Speaker 8 (09:39):
And I want to highlight what Governor Cox.
Speaker 13 (09:40):
Said, This would not have been possible without you the
media and you the public.
Speaker 8 (09:44):
That's why we went so public.
Speaker 6 (09:46):
So the suspect was on the loose for more than
twenty four hours.
Speaker 8 (09:49):
Transparency.
Speaker 4 (09:51):
The trumpet is a frame historic historical.
Speaker 13 (09:56):
Authorities along with the federal authorities processing that crime scene quickly.
Speaker 8 (10:00):
Yeah, I even had.
Speaker 13 (10:01):
The ability to walk through.
Speaker 12 (10:06):
That crime scene and walk through the steps the suspect
took to.
Speaker 13 (10:11):
Learn more about what was needed and what resources we
need to prayer to create a full picture for the
FBI and leadership back in Washington. Furthermore, thankfully to state
local partners, forensic evidence has been seized and continues to
be garnered. Forensic evidence has already been evaluated FBI laboratories
in Quantico and state local authorities here. We will continue
to process evidence as we see it.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
As we collected, we can probably get out of this.
It doesn't seem like we're going to get any more news, right.
Speaker 5 (10:38):
Unless they take questions, but that could still be another
ten minutes.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Let's well, let's go through with a cake.
Speaker 4 (10:46):
Yeah, if you if they go to the let's go
through the cases.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
Yeah, let's go.
Speaker 7 (10:51):
Let's let's go. So, yeah, I got them here, uh
in order. The first one they said was, notice is
Bulge's ow a, what's this? Which is some it's some
furry bullshit? What uh it's I mean? People can just google,
People can just google this provocative internet meme associated with
(11:13):
furry fandom with strong sexual connotations notices bulges.
Speaker 4 (11:19):
Okay, all right, I'll look it up so you don't have.
Speaker 6 (11:22):
To describe it to me.
Speaker 7 (11:23):
Then then hey, fascists catch which seems pretty clear what
that is.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
And then it said Okay, it says the notice is
bulge thing parodies furries and online role play subcultures is
from no your meme.
Speaker 4 (11:40):
Okay, all right?
Speaker 7 (11:41):
Oh Belachow Bella So Bellachow is a is a Italian
anti fascist song. So that that that is the thing
that that that plus hey fascist catch is him signaling
that's where they would have gotten the Antifa stuff from this.
And then if you read this you are gay l
m a. Oh that that gives Groy patrol.
Speaker 5 (12:04):
Which is sort of, by the way, similar to what
we saw in Minneapolis where you had troll language.
Speaker 6 (12:09):
And this is just so I mean, it just makes
your stomach sink because.
Speaker 7 (12:12):
We have two troll languages and then two Antifa stuff.
So is the anti FA stuff there to like convince
people that this is that he's anti Like, we're going
to find out more about this guy. But you know,
it could be that he's actually an actual ANTIFA guy,
(12:32):
you know, who grew up in this household with this
you know, his dad in the sheriff department and then
kind of rebelled against his dad.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
That's certainly uncommon story happens.
Speaker 7 (12:41):
It could also be that this is a Groy patrol
who's just it's no and that we have a troll assassination.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
Assassin or something.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
It can also be did you guys look into this
like online cult that people were theorizing the Minnesota shooter
was part of because they had all kinds of symbology
that was all over the map too. And I can't
remember the name of these sort of like linked like
neo Nazi death cults basically online radicalized death cults where
(13:16):
some of the some of the mo is like gaining
notoriety and out doing each other in your you know,
acts of terror and murder that you commit. And there
are you know, number of instances where the killers appeared
to be linked to this like basically online death cult.
And that's another that's another possible. Like clearly this person
(13:39):
was very online, Like we can say that, yeah for sure,
with the language.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
You know, the use of memes.
Speaker 6 (13:45):
You know, it looks like a gaming keyboard in the picture, the.
Speaker 4 (13:48):
Board in the picture.
Speaker 2 (13:49):
Yeah, I mean just and also just that's the life
of a twenty two year old man oftentimes in uh
in this day and age.
Speaker 4 (13:58):
Not to sound like.
Speaker 6 (14:01):
But it's true.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
Really, so person was clearly very online, and there's certainly enough,
you know, like just the fact that there's any anti
anti fascist stuff in there is going to be enough
for Trump and co. To say to say this is
that's a good point on the left, you know, it's
radical Marxist blah blah blah.
Speaker 4 (14:21):
So that's certainly what they'll be going with.
Speaker 14 (14:23):
You know.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
Whether that is fully the case or not, I think
it still remains to be seen because the indications are
kind of all over the place, like the if you're
reading this, you're gay, lmao. I don't know, don't know, guys.
Speaker 5 (14:36):
Yeah, it's unclear, uh right now which direction this is
going in. Because to me, when I look back on
the Minneapolis shooter, I don't think it's it's unfair for
the right to say that whatever was going on ideologically
on sex and gender clearly played into that. But also
(14:58):
it was troll language, and when in that case the
shooter died, so it's almost impossible to decipher the troll
language from a mentally ill person and no restruction or
the other that it.
Speaker 6 (15:10):
Was going in. This person is alive. This person is alive.
Speaker 5 (15:14):
And actually, as we pulled out of the presser, I
just saw this update from the New York Times authorities
in this news conference have described extensive evidence that they
say ties the suspect and custody the shooting of Charlie Kirk,
including statements to relatives suggesting that he committed the crime,
social media messages, and physical evidence. So I would say,
at least in this case, the odds of us getting
a much more complete picture of where this person was
(15:36):
coming from. And this is a good thing, by the way,
just exploded, because otherwise you get into ink blot test
territory where you can kind of laughch on to one
part of the picture or another part of the picture,
and it's more easily used as a football. So if
you can get more clarity in this case, I think
that is like a huge blessing.
Speaker 6 (15:54):
But we'll see.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
Well, the other thing is just you know, even if
let's say that he had been killed or killed himself,
or you know, the cops ha killed him or he'd
killed himself or whatever, then the conspiracies would also run wild,
right like the fact that he they have him, that
he's alive, that he can speak for himself. Not that
(16:19):
it's going to put all conspiracy theories to bed, but
it will put you know, it will make it more
difficult for those to gain I think widespread public acceptance
and traction. And I think I think it matters a
lot that they have this guy. You know, listen, and
I've already talked about how I think Trump is like
(16:39):
the worst person possible to be our president at a
moment such as this. Part of why I obviously posed
him into the election, part of why I was very
deeply concerned about what a second Trump administration would mean
and would do for this country and for the world
at large. But you know, I think like just the
fact of having a suspect who at this point at
(17:01):
least very much looks like this is the guy at least,
then you know that it helps relieve some of the
like the mystique and some of the theories, and potentially
some of the like you know, follow on inspiration, because
you know you're gonna see him not go out in
a blaze of glory, but you know, be humiliated in
(17:21):
a prison jumpsuit and you know, brought pretty low. So
I hear you get like, I think those things matter.
Speaker 6 (17:28):
I think that's I hope that's true. I think that's
likely true.
Speaker 5 (17:31):
On the other hand, it does bother me or It
does worry me that you get into and it's too
early even to be speculating too much, but you end
up with like Charles Manson, cult around someone. I don't
mean like a literal cult, but like a cult following
where people are obsessed and get fixated on someone in
prison for you know, just cause, or like even Mangioni,
(17:54):
you see some of this after he said he was innocent,
which means you could like really be mister directing people
in different ways. Hopefully that doesn't happen here, but says
like I had nothing to do with this. I'm just
to quote Lee Harvey Oswald, I'm just a patsy. So
I guess there's still always potential that things could go
in a bad direction. But yeah, I agree Chris, I
(18:15):
think this is likely a very good sign.
Speaker 6 (18:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:19):
Well, and he's not as good looking as Mangioni, so
will be less inspirational for people.
Speaker 4 (18:27):
Tell me, I'm.
Speaker 1 (18:29):
Hawaiian.
Speaker 7 (18:30):
I don't seen any Hawaiian gear yet, otherwise I think
you'd see a lot of people calling him a boogoloo dude.
Speaker 6 (18:37):
Well, that was a thing.
Speaker 5 (18:38):
I mean that movement basically collapsed too. Yeah, that was
that was around that was like a Proud Boy adjacent
if I'm remember incorrectly.
Speaker 7 (18:49):
Yeah, but yeah, but kind of wacky and cultish and
yeah and extremely online like trolley, very trolly. Yeah, and
you know, believed in like random violence and accelerationism and yep.
Speaker 6 (19:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
Well the other thing massive like meme that's you know,
hyper meme focused.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
So this like so that, yeah, I means God only
knows what weird online subcultures exists that you know, relatively
normal people have no idea about, you know, be careful
parents what your kids are consuming on the internet.
Speaker 4 (19:30):
I'll just say that.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
I mean the other part, the other part to say
about the press conference is cash retal has been you know,
I mean it's been ridiculous during this whole thing, right,
tweeting out, oh, we've got a subject in custody and
then having hours later really well turn down that guy
was in a sense, sorry, oops, we're still looking. They
delayed that press conference yesterday, was supposed to be in
(19:54):
the afternoon and reportedly, you know, it ended up not
happening till like nine o'clock n at night, reportedly because
they were waiting for Cash and maybe Bongino as well
to get into town and then they just you know,
stood there like idiots during the press like they hadn't
they didn't actually speak or participate at all. So you
delayed this press conference. They claimed it because it was
(20:17):
because of rapid developments, which made everybody think, oh, they
must be on the trail. That was not the case
at that point, just so that he could be there
for the photo ops. So clearly he was trying to
project a lot of authority here in this particular press
conference and a lot of command and using a lot
of very Trumpian language about how historic the man hunt
(20:40):
was and that's what happens when you let good cops
be cops, was one of the things that he said
to try to cover the fact that he did not
come across as a strong leader here. And there was
also a reporting about, listen, we know that a bunch
of FBI agents have been pulled off at their jobs
to assist ice. We know some of them have been
like roaming the streets in DC. We know that the
head of the Salt Lake City FBI office was fired
(21:02):
we're not really sure why in recent weeks as well.
So a lot of cya in this press conference from
Cash Betel as well.
Speaker 5 (21:12):
Well, that's I mean, again, what we're learning just minute
by minute here is the suspect. I find this very disturbing,
and I think it should continue to disturb people, whether
or not we can, you know, rightfully celebrate that the
pictures were put out there and enough that someone came forward.
That's all good, and I hope justice has served. This
(21:32):
is a stone cold assassin who was able to escape
a densely a densely packed event on a college campus
and stay at large for over twenty four hours, so
god knows what could have happened in that time period. Thankfully,
(21:53):
you know, it doesn't look like anyone else was hurt.
It doesn't look like that was the case. It doesn't
look like more damage was done the twenty four hours.
But if you have, again, a stone cold assassin who
murders a political speaker in broad daylight in a densely
packed area, I have no stomach to celebrate their father
walking them into or their father turning them in more
(22:16):
than twenty four hours after that happened. I don't think that,
at least as of right now, reflects good police work
at all. I actually think that picture of him from
surveillance cameras.
Speaker 6 (22:27):
Probably could have been released.
Speaker 5 (22:28):
I don't want money Morning cornerback to me, quarterback it,
but it does seem to me that could have been
released within three hours of.
Speaker 6 (22:34):
The event happening rather than twenty four.
Speaker 5 (22:36):
So you have this mass panic, you have misinformation being
leaked to the press in the twenty four hours because
there was a killer on the loops, presumably in Utah.
So I just I think, you know, it's too early
to say any of that definitively because we don't know
what was happening behind the scenes, but I think it's
a very high possibility that this was actually a not great,
(23:01):
a less than adequate investigation and law enforcement response.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Not to mention the lack of prevention, when we know
that this guy had been spotted on the roof multiple
times prior to Charlie Kirk's arrival, and this tip was
apparently you know, provided and nothing done. You know, the
law enforcementisode, Charlie had his own security detail, and then
(23:25):
there were apparently only six police officers there to secure
the event, which you know, I know, like certainly the
landscape for people doing public events of this sort going
forward is going to be a very you know, very
very different. I saw Ben Shapiro is apparently going to
pick up the rust of this tour. This was supposed
to be the first stop, first step, first stop on
(23:48):
this new Charlie Kirk College tour.
Speaker 4 (23:50):
So he's going to pick that up.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
But you know, also we have to look at like,
were there things that were missed leading up to the
day that could have prevented did this horrific series of events?
You know, for them, this horrific murder to start with.
Speaker 5 (24:04):
Yeah, And I mean, obviously I have a lot of
thoughts on that because part of like, I'm on the
board of a group that does lectures for students and
student chapters and all of that and have done it myself.
And I checked in with some of my friends in
that space and they made an interesting point, which is
that our discourse has gotten so poisoned that it's now
actually also difficult to do indoor events because when you
do an indoor event, trolls will.
Speaker 6 (24:26):
Like buy up all of the tickets.
Speaker 5 (24:28):
And so it's actually why you've seen a lot of
conservative speakers start doing outdoor events because it kind of
makes it easier to be in front of the public
and when you're doing campus stuff. Nobody has like the
resources to screen the roofs, like local police departments don't,
which to me is insane post Butler that you know,
people would do an outdoor event without screening the roof.
(24:50):
But then we're also just talking about college campuses where
kids should be free to have speakers in and yell
at them and challenge them and scream at them or
whatever you should. I don't have to worry about a
sniper on a roof. I mean, it's so insane that
this is where we are. But you cannot be doing
outdoor events anymore where you aren't clearing a roof that's
two hundred feet away. It's that is such a pathetic
(25:13):
commentary on the country. I mean, that is just unbelievable
on a college campus where kids are just interacting with
a thirty one year old like pundit, It's completely insane.
Speaker 4 (25:25):
Yeah, and the studio I have been hit.
Speaker 2 (25:28):
There's there's going to be as we learn more about
this individual, there's you know, a lot of room for
commentary also about you know, internet culture and what it's
doing to everyone's brains. You know, this appears to be
a guy from a middle class family. You know that
we don't know what the life was or what struggles
(25:50):
might have existed or whatever. But you know, I thought,
I actually thought, Emily, where you were going with your
commentary when you say I don't have room for praise
of you know, a father his son in twenty four
hours later is I thought, you don't have room for
praise of that father.
Speaker 4 (26:04):
Thank God you did the right thing in the h No.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
No, but you raised a killer and I do think
that there's something to be said about you know, about
that as well.
Speaker 5 (26:14):
So crazy, yeah, and who But this is what's so
crazy about the internet too, is that you have kids
from seemingly normal backgrounds who are parented well sometimes and
again I'm not making assumptions in this case, but who
are parented well and don't need to be partying and
(26:34):
doing drugs to get into the wrong crowd because it's
coming through the screen, and that screen is their portal
into darkness. Whereas in the past, there was more friction
you had to start, you know, getting involved in shady
groups of friends or whatever it was, but now there's
just way less friction to go down dark paths because
(26:55):
it all comes from the little screen that you keep
in your pocket, and that is horrifying.
Speaker 6 (27:02):
I can't imagine for parents how horrifying that is.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
Yeah, it is pretty horrifying. As a parent, I can
tell you it is pretty horrifying, which just why you know,
you definitely have to be aware of what your kids
are doing with their time and who they're spending their
time with. If they're you know, they're on their devices
a lot, you need to take note of what sort
of content they're consuming.
Speaker 7 (27:28):
Yeah, the Internet is real life, yes, and forget that.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
Yeah, I mean there's rampant speculation on the timeline right now.
Of course everybody it's a rorshack test, everybody seeing what
they want to see in this guy and his profile
and what he wrote on the bullets and whatever. So
we'll we'll let that speculation go on. But is there
(27:57):
are there are other stories you guys want to get to?
Will a way to for more any more news With
regard to Tyler Robinson, this is.
Speaker 6 (28:08):
All I've been able to think about philosophical days. I
feel you on that.
Speaker 5 (28:12):
And it's crazy because there's a ton of stuff going.
I mean, we had drones over the Polish skies. There's
potential law enforcement going into Memphis. It's not as though
this is a slow August news cycle as it was,
you know, maybe a couple of weeks ago. This is
a packed news cycle, and it just seems so hard
to focus on anything else.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
Emily, how do you think that the that this murder
will change like influencer culture and public events and how
people think about their you know, their what they're doing
and how much they're available, how what their security situation
looks like? Like what are you hearing from people on
the conservative side on that.
Speaker 5 (28:56):
I mean, I'm scheduled to be on Megan Kelly's tour
this fall, actually on a stop in San Antonio with Glenn,
and you can imagine Glenn. I can't imagine the security
that Glenn has to worry about constantly.
Speaker 6 (29:10):
So, I mean, I haven't heard anything in that space.
I don't know what's up.
Speaker 5 (29:13):
I assume everything is going as planned, but I also
just am so I don't know about you guys, Like
I'm so blackpilled that a lot of what you know,
elite influencer prominent, high profile influencer culture says it just
seems like there's such a dark subculture of irony posting
(29:35):
and all of that that I'm I'm.
Speaker 6 (29:37):
Glad I liked how Dean Withers reacted.
Speaker 5 (29:39):
I thought that was extremely classy, and I thought his
raw emotion was really powerful. And I think, you know,
probably eighty percent of gen Z watches Dean Withers, whether
than the left of the right, and says that was
a really that was the appropriate reaction.
Speaker 6 (29:54):
That's what this country should be about.
Speaker 5 (29:55):
Or Jank like that was that's exactly what this country
should be about, but doesn't to some extent. This is
the problem is with the other twenty percent or ten
percent or whoever it is, who are not at all.
I mean, they feel like they have no control or
agency and they don't give a fuck what you know,
how Dean Withers.
Speaker 6 (30:16):
Or Jank reacts or how anyone else reacts.
Speaker 5 (30:19):
It just doesn't matter to them because it's all cringe
and everything is ironic and there's a nihilism to it
that I mean. I think influencers are probably going to
do some really great stuff over the next year and
be great about civic debate and push each other in
public and you know, try to have like really hard conversations.
(30:43):
I think that's great. Do maybe more of what we
do which is left on right as as often as possible.
Speaker 6 (30:50):
I think that's all great.
Speaker 5 (30:51):
But to me, I don't know that that makes any
difference whatsoever with the five percent of just utterly nihilistic
people who were disillusioned with the political system.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
Yeah, unfortunately, I'm less hopeful that that even will be thencome.
I mean, I guess for some influencers, but most of
what I saw was, you know, I mean, frankly, most
of what I saw often the right, from Trump on down,
was like, this is war. We want vengeance, Let's crack
down on free speech, Let's destroy them. You know, they
want to kill us, this is this is war, et cetera.
And so I didn't really see many people out there
(31:27):
using it as a moment to say, hey, let's come
together and you know, let's turn down the temperature and
resolve our differences. So and you know, again, you've got
an arsonist in the in the White House. I just
you know, Ryan, I know you were one of the
reasons we really wanted to have you on yesterday, and
you were traveling so here and able to but we
were trying to think of historic parallels to this moment,
(31:49):
because you knows, as awful as it is for someone
to take a shot of the president.
Speaker 4 (31:54):
That's part of American history. There's always going to be people.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
Who want to kill president, even you know, even the legislators,
the Minnesota legislators, that legislator who was killed in the
legislators that were targeted. It's like, okay, well these are
still political officials. Like very unsettling. But part of what
made this so shocking and really sort of solidified for
me that we're living through this very different era, like
(32:19):
it's not new, we're living through it is the fact
that he is this. You know, he's an influencer, he's
an activist. Obviously, it hits really close to home. But
you know, what do you see in terms of historic parallels?
Are there other periods of American life that we can
look to as being even somewhat analogous here?
Speaker 7 (32:38):
Yeah, And I watched you guys talk about it yesterday
and Soccer's right, So yeah, I said, you know, I
couldn't think of anything other than the pre Civil War period,
which is very ominous because you know, that's a dark
like fifteen years heading into what then becomes the Civil War.
And he he flagged them famous example yesterday which was
(33:01):
a which is this guy Elijah Lovejoy who was I
believe in Ohio, either Kentucky or Ohio newspaper editor who
was a hardcore abolitionist and murdered by you know, bro,
you know, pro slavery forces. His cousin. I'm not his cousin.
I think it was his brother. Oh what people can
wikipedie all this. But his brother was Owen Lovejoy, who
was a congressman who was anti slavery congressman who was
(33:26):
also turns out a a an ally of then wig
politician Abraham Lincoln. And when when Lincoln was running for president,
it was it was really there was there was a
lot of skepticism about him from the anti slavery side.
It was Lincoln really with us or not? And it
was Owen Lovejoy who basically was Lincoln's kind of validator
(33:52):
to the left saying no like and and you know, no, no,
he's one of us. He just can't really say it
because he's trying to win a national election. And Ohen
Lovejoy got so much of his own credibility, not just
from his own politics, but from the fact that he
was the brother of this martyred anti slavery editor Elijah
Lovejoy and martyrs play a radicalizing role in in all movements.
(34:20):
You know, Chris Edges mentioned this yesterday on Twitter that
when when when movements, When when somebody has martyred in
a movement like Charlie Kirk.
Speaker 8 (34:29):
Just was.
Speaker 7 (34:31):
It, it sanctifies violence, no matter what that particular person
felt about violence. In Kirk's case, he was, you know,
strongly for discourse. You can hate what he said, but
he was about persuasion and argumentation. You can you can
hate that he was for argumentation on behalf of something
(34:52):
that you think is terrible, but he was not advocating
for for violence. But what happens with his martyrdom is
that now people in the movement who call for discussion
and debate will say, no, you know, Charlie Kirk tried that,
or you know, Elijah Lovejoy tried that, and look what
(35:12):
happened to him. He was killed by our evil enemies.
And the only thing we can do is war like that.
That's the only option that's that's left to us. And
if you don't do that, you are betraying the legacy
of our marker. And and it's very hard internally in
(35:33):
those factional arguments to argue against that, even if you
can point to and this states, you know, not that
Charlie Kirk is MLK, but like MLKA was very you know,
all about nonviolence. But what a lot of people said
afterwards is we'll look what it got him. You know,
it got him killed. The only path forward is to
(35:56):
fight for him, and to fight violently for him.
Speaker 5 (36:01):
Well yeah, because it's I forget who said this, but
it it's it shows someone who's like trying to have
a back and forth and trying to say, like, let's
let's debate. Let's uh, you know, debate really rowdily if
that's an adverb, but let's let's do it.
Speaker 6 (36:24):
And that effort was ended with a bullet.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
So what messages that say, don't do that anymore?
Speaker 6 (36:31):
Like it's not your gen z.
Speaker 5 (36:33):
Charlie Kirk has been an ever present fixture of your
social media diet for five to ten years, and that
doesn't matter whether you're political or not. This kid was
on south Park. This guy was on South Park because
he was well known enough to be parodied on.
Speaker 6 (36:48):
A pop culture platform like that.
Speaker 5 (36:50):
And you have for years been scrolling through this guy
yelling at the libs, debating on college campuses all of
that on a podcast, and suddenly the video that you
scroll past is him engaged in that very say, same
act and ending literally in a geyser of blood. The
(37:11):
point that some people will take from that is, you know,
dialogue doesn't work. It doesn't work because you can end
it with a bullet and that's a horrifying there's a
horrifying takeaway that people might walk away with.
Speaker 1 (37:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
Chris Hedges wrote a piece Brian, I don't know if
you read it that talked some about, you know, the
role of the martyr, and I thought made some very
salient points about the way that a martyr can be
used in a movement to further radicalize. And this isn't speculative,
Like you can go and look on the timeline at
the number of people who were saying that's it, gloves
(37:50):
are off.
Speaker 4 (37:50):
Now we're waging war.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
They want to kill us, and then President of the
United States, as we played earlier, saying you know, well,
you know, it would be nice if we could solve
it at the ballot, but that's not really possible because
it's we don't even have a ballot box.
Speaker 4 (38:04):
It's so rigged, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 2 (38:06):
So you know, that's what's like when you add those
the sense of political existential stakes, which in some ways,
you know, I mean the states of politics are high. Right,
there's I don't want to sugarcoat it, like there is
a reality that the political stakes are high in fact,
(38:26):
and then you add to it this tinder box of
gun culture, untreated mental illness, mass inequality, increasing the economics
that we have been covering the economic numbers this week,
but they're not looking great. Things continue to trend to
higher inflation, higher inflation, higher unemployment, more jobless claims, et cetera.
(38:46):
And you know, and then you have these other existential
fears over AI, over climate crisis, over you know, migration
for some see that as an existential, you know, existential
type fear. And you're looking at you're looking at a
powder keg. That's that's the sense. And you know, Ryan,
(39:10):
do you think that the so I don't. I don't
particularly enjoy the pre Civil war comparison. That one is
really scary. I don't love the seventies comparison either, but
I guess it's somewhat less scary. Like do you think
do you see parallels with that time period as well.
Speaker 7 (39:25):
The yes, and probably more so with than than with
pre Civil War, because, as you pointed out on the
show yesterday, the slaver class and also the anti slavery
folks properly understood the fight over slavery as as existential
and fundamental to the soul of the country. What is
(39:51):
what is that today?
Speaker 1 (39:53):
Like that?
Speaker 7 (39:54):
Does that doesn't exist? Like that the two parties agree on,
like most things, Ran, I.
Speaker 5 (40:04):
Don't know if you've you've ever read the biography of
Barry Goldwater that Lee Edwards wrote.
Speaker 6 (40:08):
It's a he was a historian.
Speaker 5 (40:10):
He was actually at the Heritage Foundation for a really
long time, but he was Goldwater's comms director.
Speaker 6 (40:14):
He was at the March on Washington. He was involved
in a lot of the.
Speaker 5 (40:19):
Like conservative political activism in the rise of the Reagan Revolution.
And my friend Chris Bedford and I talked to him
in June of twenty twenty as DC was like in
a state of rolling crisis and asked him how it
compared to nineteen sixty eight. And I've taken a lot
of heat for reposting this just in the last like
I don't know, forty eight hours whatever it is now,
(40:39):
But he said, he told us when we asked how
it compared to nineteen sixty eight, I was kind of
like saying, like pushing him. I thought to say, like, no,
it's not as bad, don't be hysterical whatever. And he said,
now it's worse than nineteen sixty eight because some of
those like institutional points of consensus have frayed, and that
(41:00):
is a very very different time to and that is
like so that you do the Civil War parallels feel
more accurate in a point like that.
Speaker 2 (41:10):
So, guys, I want to sorry. People are sharing a
clip and now let me see if I can play
it of the governor talking about how family members believe
that Robinson had become more political in recent years. So
let me go ahead and see if I can share
this clip and we can react to it.
Speaker 14 (41:31):
On the other side, investigators interviewed a family member Robinson,
who stated that Robinson had become more political in recent years.
The family member referenced a recent incident in which Robinson
came to dinner prior to September tenth, and in the
conversation with another family member, Robinson mentioned Charlie Kirk was
(41:52):
coming to UVU. They talked about why they didn't like
him and the viewpoints that he had. The family member
also stated Kirk was full of hate and spreading hate.
The family member also confirmed Robinson had a gray Dodge Challenger.
Investigators identified an individual as the roommate of Robinson. Investigators
(42:12):
interviewed that roommate, who stated that his roommate, referring to Robinson,
made a joke on discord. Investigators asked if he would
show them the messages on discord. He opened it and
showed several messages to investigators and allowed investigators to take
photos of the screen as each message was shown by
Robinson's roommate. These photos consisted of various messages, including content
(42:35):
of messages between the phone contact named Tyler with an
emoji icon and Robinson's roommate's device.
Speaker 2 (42:43):
So the commentary there again as that spoke to a
relative who had been with Tyler just recently. Tyler mentioned
Charlie's coming into down, talked about why he hated them
him and said he was full of hate. I can
tell you the what a lot of people on the
(43:06):
right are saying online is they're tying it into Oh,
he went to college and became radicalized, so you know,
and radicalized against the right and you know, became this
like murderous antifa guy, and so you can already see
you know, the obviously this administration already has been very
(43:29):
aggressive against universities. The right has been very this has
been part of a political ideological project anyway, So I
fully suspect that piece will be used further to go
after and.
Speaker 7 (43:41):
You know, maybe this is maybe this is me just
reaching for what I want to be true. But uh,
if filled with hate recently becoming filled with hate, would
they would they be using that in the context of
becoming anti fascist.
Speaker 1 (44:04):
I couldn't tell that, yeah, filled with hate.
Speaker 2 (44:10):
I couldn't tell if he was saying that he was
filled with hate Tyler, or whether he was saying Charlie
Kirk was filled with hate and that's why he didn't
like him.
Speaker 6 (44:17):
Right.
Speaker 2 (44:18):
It was a little bit unclear in what the governor
was saying there, but people are taking you are saying
it to mean that Tyler was saying Kirk was filled
with hate.
Speaker 7 (44:26):
Does he say did he say anything? And maybe we
can find more of this clip, but did he say
anything about what these messages were? Like the clip cut
off where he before he told like what the jokes
were that he was telling and what the messages were.
Speaker 2 (44:40):
I haven't seen. I have not seen that, but we'll
keep We'll keep looking and seeing if seeing if they
indicated what those Discord messages were, because yeah, that would
certainly be that would certainly be relevant to.
Speaker 5 (44:54):
Know and and this, you know, we don't need to
even continue finding way to underscore this, but the fact
that someone was posting messages on Discord, I think, you know,
we've we've seen the furry reference so far Discord. That's
indicative of somebody who is deep, deep in online culture.
Speaker 2 (45:17):
Yeah, the radicalization seems less to be doe with, you know,
whatever academic institution he was at, and more to do
with whatever Discord server he was at.
Speaker 7 (45:28):
Also, the the arrows, it looks like and maybe people
have some better clue into this, you know where they
said that down right.
Speaker 2 (45:38):
Or up side upright, down down down, Yeah, fire.
Speaker 1 (45:43):
Too, I mean hell divers too or what?
Speaker 4 (45:45):
That's what I had to run some video game meme.
Speaker 6 (45:48):
The time says.
Speaker 5 (45:49):
The list of messages on the suspects casing is described
by a government cox include apparent references to online culture
and gaming quote up arrow, right arrow and three down
arrow symbols as described by Cox, maybe a reference, uh
maybe a re so a sequence of moves on a
controller that released a bomb in the video game Hell Divers.
Oh wow, another engraving quest. Owo, what's this? Is a
(46:15):
phrase used for trolling in online role play communities.
Speaker 2 (46:19):
Yeah, and it's a furry specific I guess. I don't know.
The Internet was a mistake. I don't know, guys, what
to tell you? What to tell you? She is onto
something in China, shut it down? I mean it's this
is yeah, I mean, the most twenty twenty five thing
(46:43):
you can imagine.
Speaker 1 (46:44):
Like total gam gamer troll.
Speaker 2 (46:46):
Brain rot gamer troll engravings on you know, bullets that
are used to murder a prominent activist, an online influencer,
and with the videos being streamed into our feats basically
in real time so that we can all over and
over again watch watch one of the gorious, most horrific
(47:10):
things you can possibly imagine, Like what what hell are
we living through?
Speaker 5 (47:16):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (47:16):
Seriously, I.
Speaker 5 (47:19):
Yep, it's hard to understand right now what this is
going to do to zoomers who have already seen so much.
I mean, I think back, I'm slightly younger than you guys.
You guys were like your brains were fully formed when
some of the like beheading videos we're hitting Twitter in
(47:40):
you know circle like twenty thirteen.
Speaker 6 (47:43):
I forget when.
Speaker 5 (47:44):
Fully was, but I saw that when I was like
probably sixteen, And it's not normal for the human brain
to experience that. It's not normal for the species to
experience that. Where it's you can zoom in, you can
it's posted so many times in the hours after Charlie
(48:05):
was shot. It was I probably saw it fifteen different
times on my feed, you know, if you were trying
to get the news on a mainstream website. It's not
like this was in the bowels of you know, something
somebody downloaded on like bear share and sent to their
friends over email.
Speaker 6 (48:24):
Like that's not what it was.
Speaker 5 (48:26):
It was on a mainstream website, and it sounds tripe
to us now, But I'm just thinking to somebody who
was like probably sixteen and saw a human being beheaded multiple.
Speaker 6 (48:37):
Times, like this is so much worse.
Speaker 5 (48:40):
I mean, they saw Brian Thompson, they saw all of
that all over, and it's a level of exposure to
violence that previously only would have existed in like war zones.
But even then you're experiencing something physically and in person,
and the disconnected nature of watching a total stranger that
you will never meet, you do not know, and then
(49:01):
being incentivized to weigh in either with a great thought
that's classy, or with a horrible thought because the algorithm
that pushed that video to you is also demanding a
response from you. We're so absolutely fucking cooked. We're just cooked.
Speaker 4 (49:17):
Yeah, I mean, what else can you say?
Speaker 2 (49:19):
Like, And that's before we even talk about the you know,
the images of a genocide that we've been seeing every
single day, the horrific video of Arena who was murdered
on a you know, public transit, and this is like
maybe I'm misremembering, but the beheading videos, like you had
to like actually like I never watched it. You had
(49:40):
to like kind of intentionally. This was almost unavoidable.
Speaker 7 (49:47):
Go ahead, Ryan, No, no, I I we were breaking
that in real time, and I'm going to head it up.
And then I put it in a different tab because
I didn't want to see it. Yeah, and then as
and then I was I'm going back to working later,
I clicked on that tab not knowing what it was,
and there it was, and it's still in my mind.
Speaker 2 (50:07):
Yeah, I mean, that image of Charlie will ever be
out of my mind because it was I mean, it
was horrifying. And I just you know, one thing that
I can't quite fully describe or put my finger on,
but like, think about, Okay, this killer puts these brain
rot memes, engraves them intentionally, like went out of his
way to do this so that you and I and
(50:30):
Ryan and the whole world could talk about it and
decipher his Internet memes that he put on there for lulls.
And there's this sense of there's this sense of disconnect
and unreality where it's like it's that nihilistic nothing matters,
you know, the more like outrageous thing you say, the
(50:53):
more like disgusting and hateful thing you say, the more
sort of notoriety you get. And and this sense that
other humans are quote unquote NPCs, right, they're not really real.
I mean there's just this I don't know, this sense
of sort of disconnect from your fellow human. And there
(51:14):
are always going to be sociopathic type people out there
who just naturally have that disconnect from humanity and are
able to you know, pull a trigger and blow someone's
tibits from you know, two hundred yards away and you know,
have no regrets about it or whatever, or.
Speaker 6 (51:29):
A knife in the case of Arena, right, Like, that's it.
Speaker 2 (51:32):
Right, So that was a very intimate murder. You know,
that's very intimate to be that close and to murder
someone in that way. But yeah, I just I have
a feeling like this type of Internet nihilism is converting
many more people into basically like sociopaths with little sense
(51:52):
of fellow common humanity.
Speaker 5 (51:56):
Yeah, and that's what Like, I'm genuinely not trying to
make this a partisan or anti Trump comment. I'm saying
this as somebody who's Charlie Kirk's age thirty two. He
was about to turn thirty two when Donald Trump says
what he said about elections, that is something you heard
from the Fringes when I was growing up, when we
(52:16):
were growing up. And the fact that that came out
of the president of the United States, president the United
States mouth after so many people in gen z just
saw what they saw. I think genuinely, like boomers, people
in Trump's demo have no idea what type of rocket
fuel that is for nihilism and violence and danger, and
(52:40):
it horrifies me to think about that combination.
Speaker 6 (52:44):
It really really does.
Speaker 2 (52:46):
I mean Ryan the you know, some of the violent
weather underground and those type of movements. I mean I
feel like that comes from a similar place of like,
you know, oh well we the political system like failed us,
and so you know, there's this is this is the
only thing that Matt, this is the only thing that
could work. I mean you can also see it in
(53:08):
terms of like, uh, this, you know, the parallels are
not perfect guys here, so forgive me. But the Hamas
Palestinian like violent resistance too. It's like, hey, we tried,
we tried, this thing didn't work, so our only path
forward is is violence.
Speaker 7 (53:24):
The difference between uh you know that kind of organized
violence and this is that what you could hate it,
but it has and you can disagree, like I think
the weathermen were reckless adventurists who uh you know, on
and on people care about my you know weather ut
(53:47):
of ground critique. But like the point is like they
had they had an idea, like they were going to
spark a revolution whatever, Like it had an it had
a one two three, there.
Speaker 6 (54:00):
Was a grand strategy.
Speaker 1 (54:01):
I think it's an.
Speaker 7 (54:01):
Outrageous one two three and stupid and counterproductive and blah blah,
but it was a the was a one two three,
Like what is this?
Speaker 1 (54:09):
Like this feels like trolling.
Speaker 7 (54:12):
It feels like taking someone's life in the most with
the flick of a wrist with for a personal catharsis
and just joking like like you're in a discord server
like to but this is to take someone's life with
references to like video game memes and meme and furry
(54:35):
memes is so sacrilegious to humanity. Mm hmmm, So keep
that on discord, like you want to.
Speaker 6 (54:44):
Feel you want to feel black pilled.
Speaker 5 (54:46):
The weather underground could actually organize a group of physical
people to plan.
Speaker 7 (54:56):
Right that way, they blew them so, they blew themselves up,
but at least they were able to get more than
one person in a room.
Speaker 5 (55:02):
They were not yet they were they right, right right,
And so that's a huge difference from a lone wolf
Internet radicals or Internet nihilists, because think about I mean
think about this that he was not part of a
literal underground community of dozens of people who are organizing
(55:24):
in back rooms.
Speaker 6 (55:26):
This is somebody who was alone.
Speaker 5 (55:28):
When you are part of a radical revolutionary group, whether
it was right or left underground or whatever else. These
are people who had, like that was a sense of
purpose and belonging community. This is somebody who has no
and that's all like everything that Ryan said underscore, like awful,
(55:48):
horrible way to define community through violence like that. But
this is somebody who is who's trying to find purpose
in saying there is no purpose and is trying to
make that point the Oh my god, I mean, it's
just so depressing to think about.
Speaker 7 (56:04):
I think I have a clip here that's a little
bit more of the the family member stuff if you
want to roll back through this again, just like so.
Speaker 4 (56:15):
We can see if are you able to share it Ryan.
Speaker 1 (56:18):
Yeah, let me do it here.
Speaker 14 (56:21):
The family member also confirmed Robinson had a Gray Dodge Challenger.
Investigators identified an individual as the roommate of Robinson. Investigators
interviewed that roommate, who stated that his roommate, referring to Robinson,
made a joke on discord. Investigators asked if you would
show them the messages on discord. He opened it and
(56:41):
showed several messages to investigators and allowed investigators to take
photos of the screen as each message was shown.
Speaker 8 (56:48):
By Robinson's roommate.
Speaker 14 (56:50):
These photos consisted of various messages, including content of messages
between the phone contact named Tyler with an emoji icon
and Robinson's roommate's device. The content of these messages included
messages affiliated with the contact Tyler, stating a need to
retrieve a rifle from a drop point, leaving the rifle
(57:12):
in a bush. Messages related to a to visually watching
the area where a rifle was left, and a message
referring to having left the rifle wrapped in a towel.
The messages also referred to engraving bullets and a mention
of a scope and the rifle being unique. Messages from
(57:34):
the contact Tyler also mentioned that he had changed outfits. Wow,
I know there has been speculation as well as to
the writing on those casings, those those bullet casings, and I.
Speaker 8 (57:53):
Believe we have that as well. We already do this
and I'll share that with you.
Speaker 4 (57:57):
Yeah, yeah, we already got the casings.
Speaker 2 (57:59):
But the so, in my understanding, right, this man murdered
Charlie Kirk and then went on a discord server to
be like talking about the gun and talking about changing
his clothes and basically.
Speaker 1 (58:13):
Talking about it seking his roommate for help.
Speaker 4 (58:15):
Is that what I'm understanding here.
Speaker 1 (58:20):
That he's doing.
Speaker 7 (58:21):
He's doing that police talk, which makes it deliberately difficult
to translate into English, but that.
Speaker 4 (58:25):
Does That is wild. That is wild.
Speaker 2 (58:29):
You did this and you got away, you left your gun,
and you're like talking about the gun, talking about where
you left it, talking about how you changed your clothes,
bringing about this to your buddy on a discord server,
like when it.
Speaker 6 (58:42):
Took twenty four plus hours.
Speaker 5 (58:43):
They didn't until this person's again, like until this person's
dad turned them in.
Speaker 6 (58:48):
This was in a.
Speaker 5 (58:49):
Public place full of CCTV at a densely crowded event,
and this person is bragging about it on a discord
server afterwards, and the FBI more than twenty four hours
in about thirty six hours in had nothing except for
by the grace of God, this person's father had the
willpower to turn them in. So increasingly looking like from
(59:14):
my perspective right now, is increasingly looking like uh, possible
antif nihilism, but also horrific.
Speaker 6 (59:22):
Law enforcement response.
Speaker 5 (59:23):
I mean, just what the hell of crazy?
Speaker 6 (59:30):
That's so dangerous? It's so dangerous.
Speaker 2 (59:33):
Yeah, and there and and then cash hotel has the
temerity to go out and brag about how historic and
how incredible, how incredible of a job they'd done. I mean,
it's just it's unbelievable.
Speaker 1 (59:43):
I Mean the truth is that you don't.
Speaker 7 (59:44):
Law enforcement doesn't have to be that great. If you
if a picture gets out, like, right, you're gonna get
You're gonna get found.
Speaker 2 (59:54):
Yeah, because everybody is the public, right, and almost all
the public is going to be on your side. Right,
There's gonna be very few that would actually be willing
to you know, harbor the Charlie Kirk murder, not turn
them in, you know, right.
Speaker 7 (01:00:10):
So unless he's you know, going you have to wear
a ski mask and then people be like, what the
hell are you doing wearing a ski mask?
Speaker 11 (01:00:16):
Right?
Speaker 1 (01:00:17):
Maybe the other so just during the pandemic, maybe could
have stuck in.
Speaker 2 (01:00:20):
You could have gotten away with it. Yeah, Or if
you're posing as an ice agent, you could pull out.
Speaker 1 (01:00:24):
All that's true. I'm an ice agent on the roof.
Speaker 2 (01:00:26):
Yeah, actually, yeah, that would be been even more of
a twenty twenty five murder. And then the other aspect
of it, you know, to add to the sort of
dystopian unreality, the whole thing, because I know you guys
saw this, like influencer who was there, who was posting
to TikTok, like follow me on TikTok, and like mugging
(01:00:47):
for the camera, which again is like, you know, even
as you're living through this horror, you're still like somehow
disconnected from it, even as you're like in the real world,
still disconnected from it. And after the fact, I know,
we like apologize, I'll be a better creator, whatever, but
you're like disconnected from the very reality and the humanity
(01:01:09):
that you are existing with and living through.
Speaker 5 (01:01:12):
Because your reality is that your career is tied to
the algorithm, and so you are This is like Marshall mccleuan,
You are as a human being changed by the medium
that is controlling your life. And these mediums are not
changing us for the better. There's just clearly we are
being warped into our own thought processes having dictation by
(01:01:34):
the algorithm because you start thinking in terms of the algorithm,
and people need to be extremely careful about it, and
we aren't, and the tech companies aren't. The tech companies
X included Elon Musk is condemning all of this, but
he owns a company that has one of the most
major roles in poisoning US algorithmically, poisoning US algorithmically. So
(01:01:56):
it's just like it reminds me of the video of
that went viral in a totally different vein of that
young man who was saying he was working really hard
and couldn't get ahead, that went megaviral like a month ago,
and it was he was dead on in his description
of the economy. It was, it was accurate, it was poignant.
(01:02:18):
And then you look at the bottom of the TikTok
and it says things like hashtag follow me, and it's
think about that, I mean, hashtag follow me, hashtag so
like you had hashtags basically.
Speaker 6 (01:02:31):
Being like I want to become an influencer something to
that extent.
Speaker 5 (01:02:35):
And it's just like that is just I don't know
that you could possibly be much more depressed about the
state of the country.
Speaker 2 (01:02:41):
Yeah, And I think it's an accelerant, Like I don't
think it starts with the social media. I think it's
it's an accelerant the internet culture for a society that's
already sick in any number of ways. But yeah, I
don't I don't know what to say about it. And
we can wrap up here pretty soon, because I don't
I don't see you know, I don't know what else
(01:03:01):
we're going to get right now. But Ryan, you got
any any last thoughts you want to add in here?
Speaker 7 (01:03:07):
No, I mean the only uh, you know, for people
like myself who don't want this to be like a leftist,
the only hope is that he's trolling with his hey
fascist catch and that sort of stuff, mellow chow and
the belli chow. That that that that's that, that's some kind
of a troll in a in a misdirection.
Speaker 1 (01:03:29):
Yeah, I think I think I hear Mac. What's Mac saying?
Speaker 5 (01:03:33):
Oh? No, that was actually it was you heard yourself
through my microphone, gotcha?
Speaker 7 (01:03:39):
So, uh, you know, these are just you know, dark, dark,
dark times really and it's uh, it's still hard to
believe that Charlie Kirk is dead.
Speaker 2 (01:03:52):
Yeah, it is just thinking that it feels it's crazy.
And I mean that's the other aspect of this is
Emily you brought up like the parasocial relationship that millions
have with him and will experience this as if you
know someone who's genuinely close to them.
Speaker 4 (01:04:09):
Was gil mm hmmm, h m hm.
Speaker 5 (01:04:12):
I mean, it's it's so like and that can go
in really positive directions for some people. But again, I'm
not worried about the people who are reacting healthily to this,
because I know that there's a large group of people
that aren't going to react ealthily to this because they
have no community, they have no friends, but they have
(01:04:33):
a they have a computer. And I'm just going to
put this before we wrap. I just want to put
this image that we've gotten in of Charlie's widow now
widow on the screen because it is just you just
look at her face and the video emerge of her
exiting Air Force two with Ushavants and just gripping Ontosha Vance. Obviously,
(01:04:58):
JD was very close friends with with Charlie. Charlie helped
get JD onto the ticket by lobbying behind the scenes
with what Don Junior uh And so this is something
that this administration, I mean again at the White House yesterday,
those young Trump staffers, that the level of doom that
was ever present hanging in the air the entire day
(01:05:21):
and shock it just you know, it's it's one way
I think, you know, we're talking now about how people
in the public are experiencing this, and that's right, because
it's crazy. But just also think about how closely this
is touching the way that we talked about this earlier,
the reactions from this administration. This is so so personal,
(01:05:45):
so personal. So it's a really scary time.
Speaker 4 (01:05:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:05:48):
Yeah, and Trump had no like direct personal connection to
big Balls. This is someone he knew and knew closely
and you know, was looped in within minute station in
any number of ways. So we'll see where we go
from here. Anything else, guys.
Speaker 6 (01:06:07):
I just hope you guys, uh, stay safe.
Speaker 2 (01:06:09):
And yeah, I appreciate you guys, I'll say that, and
you know, I let's we'll end on the good news.
Speaker 4 (01:06:16):
It's good news that this guy.
Speaker 2 (01:06:17):
Got caught, good news that he's in custody, good news
that you know, they've got him. And I'm sure we're
gonna we're gonna learn a lot more here and you know, well,
if there's anything that pops up big over the weekend, guys,
one or the other of us will try to cover it. Otherwise,
Soccer and I will be in studio for a normal
show on Monday, and we will see you then.
Speaker 6 (01:06:36):
Pull people out of nihilism.
Speaker 5 (01:06:38):
By the way, sorry, I just want to say, because
like we have some very online people and we're grateful
for all of you.
Speaker 6 (01:06:44):
If you see someone going down a dark path, do
what you can to pull them out of it. That's
the best we can all do right now.
Speaker 4 (01:06:50):
Yep, all right, guys, talk to you soon.
Hey, guys, Sager and Crystal.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Here, independent media just played a truly massive role in
this election, and we are so excited about what that
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Speaker 3 (00:08):
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Speaker 3 (00:25):
We need your help to build the future of independent
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dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
Let me ask you, guys this and again this. We
don't We don't know the ideological leanings of this person.
We don't know, if you know, they could be politically
all over the blue.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
We don't know. But let me ask you guys this question.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
Do you think I'm right that even if it is
like a clear cutcase of like some white nationalist or
groper type or whatever that this guy turns out to be,
that Trump will just pretend that it's otherwise or use
this anyway to his ends.
Speaker 5 (00:59):
I'm curious about him saying yesterday he had some sense
of the motive before this. That tells me that maybe
they think or they thought they had reason to believe
that there's some I don't know, like what is going on?
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Were they going off the supposed trends in super bullets.
I mean, we didn't spend enough time on that because
it was so it's so disgusting to me that the
Wall Street Journal ran with that, And apparently it turned
out there were like some arrows like potentially already printed
on the bullets, because there are little like markings on
there that they were like these arrows, I think that
(01:34):
must mean he's pro trans which was completely invented, and
you know, all kinds of lay people. When this news
came out of like markings on the bullets indicating transgender ideology,
people were like, what would that even be? But apparently
no one at the Wall Street Journal that reprinted this
thought for two seconds to ask that question.
Speaker 5 (01:55):
Or they reported, well, here's also what's interesting is that
they reported so Steven Krab got it first, and the
journal was probably rushing because of Stephen Crowder, which is
already just like what the hell? But they reported that
ATF was taking these markings seriously, and the journal probably
failed to contextualize how thin the like evidence was that
(02:20):
that was, you know, something to take seriously. But what
it says to me is that somebody at ATF was
taking it.
Speaker 6 (02:30):
Very, very seriously. And so because of that. Okay, here,
so we've got a press conference coming.
Speaker 7 (02:36):
In no way, I mean, real quick to Chris. But
like Trump said, he I don't care. Trump is telling
Trump Trump already answered your questions. Yeah, that's probably so,
I don't care who did this.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Yeah, the problem is, yeah, sure we got radicals on
the right, but they're doing it for the right reasons.
I mean, that's what you know, that's the whole justification
for January six. We already know he pardoned a bunch
of you know, violent JA six riders. All right, here's
the pressor.
Speaker 8 (03:05):
Leaving the rifle in a bush.
Speaker 9 (03:07):
Messages related to a to visually watching the area where
our rifle was left and a message referring.
Speaker 8 (03:14):
To having left the rifle wrapped in a towel.
Speaker 9 (03:19):
The messages also referred to engraving bullets and a mention
of a scope and the rifle being unique.
Speaker 8 (03:27):
Messages from the contact.
Speaker 9 (03:28):
Tyler also mentioned that he had changed outfits. I know
there's been speculation as well as to the writing.
Speaker 8 (03:40):
On those casings.
Speaker 9 (03:41):
Here we go, those those bullet casings, and I believe
we have that.
Speaker 8 (03:48):
As well, and I'll share that with you now.
Speaker 10 (03:54):
So the area north of Campus Drive Road where the
suspect crossed over, you saw some of that in the
video that we released last night, consists of a grassy
area with trees on the edge of the UBU campus.
Speaker 9 (04:06):
Investigators discovered a bolt action rifle wrapped in a dark
colored towel. The rifle was determined to be a Mouser
Model ninety eight thirty out six caliber thirty six caliber
bolt action rifle.
Speaker 8 (04:18):
The rifle has scope mounted on top of it.
Speaker 9 (04:21):
Investigators noted inscriptions that had been engraved on casings found
with the rifle.
Speaker 8 (04:27):
Inscriptions on a fired casing.
Speaker 9 (04:29):
Read notices, bulges, capital, OWO, what's.
Speaker 8 (04:35):
This question mark, inscriptions on the three on fired.
Speaker 9 (04:38):
Casings red he notices exclamation point, catch, exclamation point, arrow symbol,
right arrow and symbol, and three down arrow symbols. A
second on fired casing red oh, bella.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Chow belle chow bella chow chow.
Speaker 8 (04:56):
Chow, and a third on fired Casey Red. If you
read this, you are a LMAO.
Speaker 11 (05:05):
We are indebted to enforcement across the state who's worked
seamlessly together local law enforcement, state law enforcement, and our
federal partners with the with the Federal Bureau of Investigation.
Speaker 8 (05:19):
We're grateful for everyone who work together in such a short.
Speaker 9 (05:24):
Amount of time to find this person and to and
to bring justice. I want to think the public who
has been so engaged reviewing, reviewing videos, helping us with
sending in tips and helping us get to this point.
Speaker 8 (05:43):
I want to thank the family members of.
Speaker 9 (05:46):
Tyler Robinson who did the right thing in this case
and we're able to bring him into law enforcement as well.
I especially want to thank the family of Charlie Kirk Erica, Charlie's.
Speaker 8 (06:05):
Parents, his children. I want us to.
Speaker 9 (06:08):
Be thinking of them as we bring justice in this case.
They will be involved in that justice. We will be
working very closely with them as we move through this
process as well. This is a very sad day for
again for our country, a terrible.
Speaker 8 (06:26):
Day for the state of Utah.
Speaker 9 (06:28):
But I'm grateful that at this moment we have an
opportunity to bring closure to this very dark chapter in
our nation's history with that. Will now turn the turn
the microphone over to the director of the FBI.
Speaker 4 (06:43):
Cat Those bullet markings are hard to decipher.
Speaker 8 (06:50):
This is what happens when you let good cops be cops.
Speaker 12 (06:54):
The FBI and our partners are proud to stand here
today together to bring justice to the family of Charlie.
Speaker 8 (07:00):
In honor's memory.
Speaker 13 (07:01):
I want to express my deep gratitude to President Trump,
the Vice President, and the entire White House who have
been so incredibly supportive with both resources and just personally
to the FBI as a team. They had our backs
to the entire way, and I just want to express
my gratitude for giving us the resources we need to
operate in this space to bring this sort of justice
at this sort of speed. In thirty three hours, we
(07:23):
have made historic progress for Charlie. Governor Cox, our partnership
has been absolutely incredible these last few days. Our partnership
will ignore your state and local partners, your sheriffs, your
GPS community has been unbelievably impressive in the hardest of times,
and a case like this cannot be solved, cannot be
(07:46):
brought without partnering with your state and local authorities.
Speaker 8 (07:49):
The FBI has a certain role to play. We will
play that role and we will lead up with federal government.
Speaker 12 (07:54):
Governor Cox, we are so grandful from your state partnership
that let out on this investigation a little bit of
the timeline. Charlie shot at twelve twenty three pm on Wednesday.
The first FBI agent's arrived on scene in sixteen minutes.
We chiefs the police at twelve thirty nine and secured
the scene.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
This is cya to try to convince people they did
a good jobs.
Speaker 13 (08:19):
We utilize these assets to transport personnel, specialty technicians, passage
rescue teams.
Speaker 8 (08:24):
We also utilize these assets to go.
Speaker 13 (08:26):
Back and forth from the East Coast and here in
Utah to transport forensic evidence and other evidence that will
be analyzed that is being analyzed at our FBI laboratories
in Quantico and other laboratories including the ATF.
Speaker 8 (08:38):
In my direction, the.
Speaker 12 (08:39):
FBI released the first set of FBI photos of this suspect.
Speaker 8 (08:42):
At ten am local time on nine to eleven.
Speaker 12 (08:46):
Then shortly thereafter, the FBI reward of one hundred thousand
dollars was.
Speaker 13 (08:50):
Released at ten forty five am Local myself and Deputy
Director Bon Gino arrived on the scene at ap propably
five thirty PM on nine to eleven. The Governor let
a press conference last night at approximately eight pm where
in my direction, the FBI released and ever before seen
video of the suspect.
Speaker 12 (09:11):
We also released new images to the public of the suspect.
And just last night, the suspect was taken into custody
at ten PM of the time, in less than thirty
six hours thirty three to be precise, thanks to the
full weight of the federal government and leading out with
(09:32):
the partners here in the state of Utah and Governor Cox,
the suspect was apprehended in historic time period.
Speaker 8 (09:39):
And I want to highlight what Governor Cox.
Speaker 13 (09:40):
Said, This would not have been possible without you the
media and you the public.
Speaker 8 (09:44):
That's why we went so public.
Speaker 6 (09:46):
So the suspect was on the loose for more than
twenty four hours.
Speaker 8 (09:49):
Transparency.
Speaker 4 (09:51):
The trumpet is a frame historic historical.
Speaker 13 (09:56):
Authorities along with the federal authorities processing that crime scene quickly.
Speaker 8 (10:00):
Yeah, I even had.
Speaker 13 (10:01):
The ability to walk through.
Speaker 12 (10:06):
That crime scene and walk through the steps the suspect
took to.
Speaker 13 (10:11):
Learn more about what was needed and what resources we
need to prayer to create a full picture for the
FBI and leadership back in Washington. Furthermore, thankfully to state
local partners, forensic evidence has been seized and continues to
be garnered. Forensic evidence has already been evaluated FBI laboratories
in Quantico and state local authorities here. We will continue
to process evidence as we see it.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
As we collected, we can probably get out of this.
It doesn't seem like we're going to get any more news, right.
Speaker 5 (10:38):
Unless they take questions, but that could still be another
ten minutes.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Let's well, let's go through with a cake.
Speaker 4 (10:46):
Yeah, if you if they go to the let's go
through the cases.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
Yeah, let's go.
Speaker 7 (10:51):
Let's let's go. So, yeah, I got them here, uh
in order. The first one they said was, notice is
Bulge's ow a, what's this? Which is some it's some
furry bullshit? What uh it's I mean? People can just google,
People can just google this provocative internet meme associated with
(11:13):
furry fandom with strong sexual connotations notices bulges.
Speaker 4 (11:19):
Okay, all right, I'll look it up so you don't have.
Speaker 6 (11:22):
To describe it to me.
Speaker 7 (11:23):
Then then hey, fascists catch which seems pretty clear what
that is.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
And then it said Okay, it says the notice is
bulge thing parodies furries and online role play subcultures is
from no your meme.
Speaker 4 (11:40):
Okay, all right?
Speaker 7 (11:41):
Oh Belachow Bella So Bellachow is a is a Italian
anti fascist song. So that that that is the thing
that that that plus hey fascist catch is him signaling
that's where they would have gotten the Antifa stuff from this.
And then if you read this you are gay l
m a. Oh that that gives Groy patrol.
Speaker 5 (12:04):
Which is sort of, by the way, similar to what
we saw in Minneapolis where you had troll language.
Speaker 6 (12:09):
And this is just so I mean, it just makes
your stomach sink because.
Speaker 7 (12:12):
We have two troll languages and then two Antifa stuff.
So is the anti FA stuff there to like convince
people that this is that he's anti Like, we're going
to find out more about this guy. But you know,
it could be that he's actually an actual ANTIFA guy,
(12:32):
you know, who grew up in this household with this
you know, his dad in the sheriff department and then
kind of rebelled against his dad.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
That's certainly uncommon story happens.
Speaker 7 (12:41):
It could also be that this is a Groy patrol
who's just it's no and that we have a troll assassination.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
Assassin or something.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
It can also be did you guys look into this
like online cult that people were theorizing the Minnesota shooter
was part of because they had all kinds of symbology
that was all over the map too. And I can't
remember the name of these sort of like linked like
neo Nazi death cults basically online radicalized death cults where
(13:16):
some of the some of the mo is like gaining
notoriety and out doing each other in your you know,
acts of terror and murder that you commit. And there
are you know, number of instances where the killers appeared
to be linked to this like basically online death cult.
And that's another that's another possible. Like clearly this person
(13:39):
was very online, Like we can say that, yeah for sure,
with the language.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
You know, the use of memes.
Speaker 6 (13:45):
You know, it looks like a gaming keyboard in the picture, the.
Speaker 4 (13:48):
Board in the picture.
Speaker 2 (13:49):
Yeah, I mean just and also just that's the life
of a twenty two year old man oftentimes in uh
in this day and age.
Speaker 4 (13:58):
Not to sound like.
Speaker 6 (14:01):
But it's true.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
Really, so person was clearly very online, and there's certainly enough,
you know, like just the fact that there's any anti
anti fascist stuff in there is going to be enough
for Trump and co. To say to say this is
that's a good point on the left, you know, it's
radical Marxist blah blah blah.
Speaker 4 (14:21):
So that's certainly what they'll be going with.
Speaker 14 (14:23):
You know.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
Whether that is fully the case or not, I think
it still remains to be seen because the indications are
kind of all over the place, like the if you're
reading this, you're gay, lmao. I don't know, don't know, guys.
Speaker 5 (14:36):
Yeah, it's unclear, uh right now which direction this is
going in. Because to me, when I look back on
the Minneapolis shooter, I don't think it's it's unfair for
the right to say that whatever was going on ideologically
on sex and gender clearly played into that. But also
(14:58):
it was troll language, and when in that case the
shooter died, so it's almost impossible to decipher the troll
language from a mentally ill person and no restruction or
the other that it.
Speaker 6 (15:10):
Was going in. This person is alive. This person is alive.
Speaker 5 (15:14):
And actually, as we pulled out of the presser, I
just saw this update from the New York Times authorities
in this news conference have described extensive evidence that they
say ties the suspect and custody the shooting of Charlie Kirk,
including statements to relatives suggesting that he committed the crime,
social media messages, and physical evidence. So I would say,
at least in this case, the odds of us getting
a much more complete picture of where this person was
(15:36):
coming from. And this is a good thing, by the way,
just exploded, because otherwise you get into ink blot test
territory where you can kind of laughch on to one
part of the picture or another part of the picture,
and it's more easily used as a football. So if
you can get more clarity in this case, I think
that is like a huge blessing.
Speaker 6 (15:54):
But we'll see.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
Well, the other thing is just you know, even if
let's say that he had been killed or killed himself,
or you know, the cops ha killed him or he'd
killed himself or whatever, then the conspiracies would also run wild,
right like the fact that he they have him, that
he's alive, that he can speak for himself. Not that
(16:19):
it's going to put all conspiracy theories to bed, but
it will put you know, it will make it more
difficult for those to gain I think widespread public acceptance
and traction. And I think I think it matters a
lot that they have this guy. You know, listen, and
I've already talked about how I think Trump is like
(16:39):
the worst person possible to be our president at a
moment such as this. Part of why I obviously posed
him into the election, part of why I was very
deeply concerned about what a second Trump administration would mean
and would do for this country and for the world
at large. But you know, I think like just the
fact of having a suspect who at this point at
(17:01):
least very much looks like this is the guy at least,
then you know that it helps relieve some of the
like the mystique and some of the theories, and potentially
some of the like you know, follow on inspiration, because
you know you're gonna see him not go out in
a blaze of glory, but you know, be humiliated in
(17:21):
a prison jumpsuit and you know, brought pretty low. So
I hear you get like, I think those things matter.
Speaker 6 (17:28):
I think that's I hope that's true. I think that's
likely true.
Speaker 5 (17:31):
On the other hand, it does bother me or It
does worry me that you get into and it's too
early even to be speculating too much, but you end
up with like Charles Manson, cult around someone. I don't
mean like a literal cult, but like a cult following
where people are obsessed and get fixated on someone in
prison for you know, just cause, or like even Mangioni,
(17:54):
you see some of this after he said he was innocent,
which means you could like really be mister directing people
in different ways. Hopefully that doesn't happen here, but says
like I had nothing to do with this. I'm just
to quote Lee Harvey Oswald, I'm just a patsy. So
I guess there's still always potential that things could go
in a bad direction. But yeah, I agree Chris, I
(18:15):
think this is likely a very good sign.
Speaker 6 (18:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:19):
Well, and he's not as good looking as Mangioni, so
will be less inspirational for people.
Speaker 4 (18:27):
Tell me, I'm.
Speaker 1 (18:29):
Hawaiian.
Speaker 7 (18:30):
I don't seen any Hawaiian gear yet, otherwise I think
you'd see a lot of people calling him a boogoloo dude.
Speaker 6 (18:37):
Well, that was a thing.
Speaker 5 (18:38):
I mean that movement basically collapsed too. Yeah, that was
that was around that was like a Proud Boy adjacent
if I'm remember incorrectly.
Speaker 7 (18:49):
Yeah, but yeah, but kind of wacky and cultish and
yeah and extremely online like trolley, very trolly. Yeah, and
you know, believed in like random violence and accelerationism and yep.
Speaker 6 (19:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
Well the other thing massive like meme that's you know,
hyper meme focused.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
So this like so that, yeah, I means God only
knows what weird online subcultures exists that you know, relatively
normal people have no idea about, you know, be careful
parents what your kids are consuming on the internet.
Speaker 4 (19:30):
I'll just say that.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
I mean the other part, the other part to say
about the press conference is cash retal has been you know,
I mean it's been ridiculous during this whole thing, right,
tweeting out, oh, we've got a subject in custody and
then having hours later really well turn down that guy
was in a sense, sorry, oops, we're still looking. They
delayed that press conference yesterday, was supposed to be in
(19:54):
the afternoon and reportedly, you know, it ended up not
happening till like nine o'clock n at night, reportedly because
they were waiting for Cash and maybe Bongino as well
to get into town and then they just you know,
stood there like idiots during the press like they hadn't
they didn't actually speak or participate at all. So you
delayed this press conference. They claimed it because it was
(20:17):
because of rapid developments, which made everybody think, oh, they
must be on the trail. That was not the case
at that point, just so that he could be there
for the photo ops. So clearly he was trying to
project a lot of authority here in this particular press
conference and a lot of command and using a lot
of very Trumpian language about how historic the man hunt
(20:40):
was and that's what happens when you let good cops
be cops, was one of the things that he said
to try to cover the fact that he did not
come across as a strong leader here. And there was
also a reporting about, listen, we know that a bunch
of FBI agents have been pulled off at their jobs
to assist ice. We know some of them have been
like roaming the streets in DC. We know that the
head of the Salt Lake City FBI office was fired
(21:02):
we're not really sure why in recent weeks as well.
So a lot of cya in this press conference from
Cash Betel as well.
Speaker 5 (21:12):
Well, that's I mean, again, what we're learning just minute
by minute here is the suspect. I find this very disturbing,
and I think it should continue to disturb people, whether
or not we can, you know, rightfully celebrate that the
pictures were put out there and enough that someone came forward.
That's all good, and I hope justice has served. This
(21:32):
is a stone cold assassin who was able to escape
a densely a densely packed event on a college campus
and stay at large for over twenty four hours, so
god knows what could have happened in that time period. Thankfully,
(21:53):
you know, it doesn't look like anyone else was hurt.
It doesn't look like that was the case. It doesn't
look like more damage was done the twenty four hours.
But if you have, again, a stone cold assassin who
murders a political speaker in broad daylight in a densely
packed area, I have no stomach to celebrate their father
walking them into or their father turning them in more
(22:16):
than twenty four hours after that happened. I don't think that,
at least as of right now, reflects good police work
at all. I actually think that picture of him from
surveillance cameras.
Speaker 6 (22:27):
Probably could have been released.
Speaker 5 (22:28):
I don't want money Morning cornerback to me, quarterback it,
but it does seem to me that could have been
released within three hours of.
Speaker 6 (22:34):
The event happening rather than twenty four.
Speaker 5 (22:36):
So you have this mass panic, you have misinformation being
leaked to the press in the twenty four hours because
there was a killer on the loops, presumably in Utah.
So I just I think, you know, it's too early
to say any of that definitively because we don't know
what was happening behind the scenes, but I think it's
a very high possibility that this was actually a not great,
(23:01):
a less than adequate investigation and law enforcement response.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Not to mention the lack of prevention, when we know
that this guy had been spotted on the roof multiple
times prior to Charlie Kirk's arrival, and this tip was
apparently you know, provided and nothing done. You know, the
law enforcementisode, Charlie had his own security detail, and then
(23:25):
there were apparently only six police officers there to secure
the event, which you know, I know, like certainly the
landscape for people doing public events of this sort going
forward is going to be a very you know, very
very different. I saw Ben Shapiro is apparently going to
pick up the rust of this tour. This was supposed
to be the first stop, first step, first stop on
(23:48):
this new Charlie Kirk College tour.
Speaker 4 (23:50):
So he's going to pick that up.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
But you know, also we have to look at like,
were there things that were missed leading up to the
day that could have prevented did this horrific series of events?
You know, for them, this horrific murder to start with.
Speaker 5 (24:04):
Yeah, And I mean, obviously I have a lot of
thoughts on that because part of like, I'm on the
board of a group that does lectures for students and
student chapters and all of that and have done it myself.
And I checked in with some of my friends in
that space and they made an interesting point, which is
that our discourse has gotten so poisoned that it's now
actually also difficult to do indoor events because when you
do an indoor event, trolls will.
Speaker 6 (24:26):
Like buy up all of the tickets.
Speaker 5 (24:28):
And so it's actually why you've seen a lot of
conservative speakers start doing outdoor events because it kind of
makes it easier to be in front of the public
and when you're doing campus stuff. Nobody has like the
resources to screen the roofs, like local police departments don't,
which to me is insane post Butler that you know,
people would do an outdoor event without screening the roof.
(24:50):
But then we're also just talking about college campuses where
kids should be free to have speakers in and yell
at them and challenge them and scream at them or
whatever you should. I don't have to worry about a
sniper on a roof. I mean, it's so insane that
this is where we are. But you cannot be doing
outdoor events anymore where you aren't clearing a roof that's
two hundred feet away. It's that is such a pathetic
(25:13):
commentary on the country. I mean, that is just unbelievable
on a college campus where kids are just interacting with
a thirty one year old like pundit, It's completely insane.
Speaker 4 (25:25):
Yeah, and the studio I have been hit.
Speaker 2 (25:28):
There's there's going to be as we learn more about
this individual, there's you know, a lot of room for
commentary also about you know, internet culture and what it's
doing to everyone's brains. You know, this appears to be
a guy from a middle class family. You know that
we don't know what the life was or what struggles
(25:50):
might have existed or whatever. But you know, I thought,
I actually thought, Emily, where you were going with your
commentary when you say I don't have room for praise
of you know, a father his son in twenty four
hours later is I thought, you don't have room for
praise of that father.
Speaker 4 (26:04):
Thank God you did the right thing in the h No.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
No, but you raised a killer and I do think
that there's something to be said about you know, about
that as well.
Speaker 5 (26:14):
So crazy, yeah, and who But this is what's so
crazy about the internet too, is that you have kids
from seemingly normal backgrounds who are parented well sometimes and
again I'm not making assumptions in this case, but who
are parented well and don't need to be partying and
(26:34):
doing drugs to get into the wrong crowd because it's
coming through the screen, and that screen is their portal
into darkness. Whereas in the past, there was more friction
you had to start, you know, getting involved in shady
groups of friends or whatever it was, but now there's
just way less friction to go down dark paths because
(26:55):
it all comes from the little screen that you keep
in your pocket, and that is horrifying.
Speaker 6 (27:02):
I can't imagine for parents how horrifying that is.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
Yeah, it is pretty horrifying. As a parent, I can
tell you it is pretty horrifying, which just why you know,
you definitely have to be aware of what your kids
are doing with their time and who they're spending their
time with. If they're you know, they're on their devices
a lot, you need to take note of what sort
of content they're consuming.
Speaker 7 (27:28):
Yeah, the Internet is real life, yes, and forget that.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
Yeah, I mean there's rampant speculation on the timeline right now.
Of course everybody it's a rorshack test, everybody seeing what
they want to see in this guy and his profile
and what he wrote on the bullets and whatever. So
we'll we'll let that speculation go on. But is there
(27:57):
are there are other stories you guys want to get to?
Will a way to for more any more news With
regard to Tyler Robinson, this is.
Speaker 6 (28:08):
All I've been able to think about philosophical days. I
feel you on that.
Speaker 5 (28:12):
And it's crazy because there's a ton of stuff going.
I mean, we had drones over the Polish skies. There's
potential law enforcement going into Memphis. It's not as though
this is a slow August news cycle as it was,
you know, maybe a couple of weeks ago. This is
a packed news cycle, and it just seems so hard
to focus on anything else.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
Emily, how do you think that the that this murder
will change like influencer culture and public events and how
people think about their you know, their what they're doing
and how much they're available, how what their security situation
looks like? Like what are you hearing from people on
the conservative side on that.
Speaker 5 (28:56):
I mean, I'm scheduled to be on Megan Kelly's tour
this fall, actually on a stop in San Antonio with Glenn,
and you can imagine Glenn. I can't imagine the security
that Glenn has to worry about constantly.
Speaker 6 (29:10):
So, I mean, I haven't heard anything in that space.
I don't know what's up.
Speaker 5 (29:13):
I assume everything is going as planned, but I also
just am so I don't know about you guys, Like
I'm so blackpilled that a lot of what you know,
elite influencer prominent, high profile influencer culture says it just
seems like there's such a dark subculture of irony posting
(29:35):
and all of that that I'm I'm.
Speaker 6 (29:37):
Glad I liked how Dean Withers reacted.
Speaker 5 (29:39):
I thought that was extremely classy, and I thought his
raw emotion was really powerful. And I think, you know,
probably eighty percent of gen Z watches Dean Withers, whether
than the left of the right, and says that was
a really that was the appropriate reaction.
Speaker 6 (29:54):
That's what this country should be about.
Speaker 5 (29:55):
Or Jank like that was that's exactly what this country
should be about, but doesn't to some extent. This is
the problem is with the other twenty percent or ten
percent or whoever it is, who are not at all.
I mean, they feel like they have no control or
agency and they don't give a fuck what you know,
how Dean Withers.
Speaker 6 (30:16):
Or Jank reacts or how anyone else reacts.
Speaker 5 (30:19):
It just doesn't matter to them because it's all cringe
and everything is ironic and there's a nihilism to it
that I mean. I think influencers are probably going to
do some really great stuff over the next year and
be great about civic debate and push each other in
public and you know, try to have like really hard conversations.
(30:43):
I think that's great. Do maybe more of what we
do which is left on right as as often as possible.
Speaker 6 (30:50):
I think that's all great.
Speaker 5 (30:51):
But to me, I don't know that that makes any
difference whatsoever with the five percent of just utterly nihilistic
people who were disillusioned with the political system.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
Yeah, unfortunately, I'm less hopeful that that even will be thencome.
I mean, I guess for some influencers, but most of
what I saw was, you know, I mean, frankly, most
of what I saw often the right, from Trump on down,
was like, this is war. We want vengeance, Let's crack
down on free speech, Let's destroy them. You know, they
want to kill us, this is this is war, et cetera.
And so I didn't really see many people out there
(31:27):
using it as a moment to say, hey, let's come
together and you know, let's turn down the temperature and
resolve our differences. So and you know, again, you've got
an arsonist in the in the White House. I just
you know, Ryan, I know you were one of the
reasons we really wanted to have you on yesterday, and
you were traveling so here and able to but we
were trying to think of historic parallels to this moment,
(31:49):
because you knows, as awful as it is for someone
to take a shot of the president.
Speaker 4 (31:54):
That's part of American history. There's always going to be people.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
Who want to kill president, even you know, even the legislators,
the Minnesota legislators, that legislator who was killed in the
legislators that were targeted. It's like, okay, well these are
still political officials. Like very unsettling. But part of what
made this so shocking and really sort of solidified for
me that we're living through this very different era, like
(32:19):
it's not new, we're living through it is the fact
that he is this. You know, he's an influencer, he's
an activist. Obviously, it hits really close to home. But
you know, what do you see in terms of historic parallels?
Are there other periods of American life that we can
look to as being even somewhat analogous here?
Speaker 7 (32:38):
Yeah, And I watched you guys talk about it yesterday
and Soccer's right, So yeah, I said, you know, I
couldn't think of anything other than the pre Civil War period,
which is very ominous because you know, that's a dark
like fifteen years heading into what then becomes the Civil War.
And he he flagged them famous example yesterday which was
(33:01):
a which is this guy Elijah Lovejoy who was I
believe in Ohio, either Kentucky or Ohio newspaper editor who
was a hardcore abolitionist and murdered by you know, bro,
you know, pro slavery forces. His cousin. I'm not his cousin.
I think it was his brother. Oh what people can
wikipedie all this. But his brother was Owen Lovejoy, who
was a congressman who was anti slavery congressman who was
(33:26):
also turns out a a an ally of then wig
politician Abraham Lincoln. And when when Lincoln was running for president,
it was it was really there was there was a
lot of skepticism about him from the anti slavery side.
It was Lincoln really with us or not? And it
was Owen Lovejoy who basically was Lincoln's kind of validator
(33:52):
to the left saying no like and and you know, no, no,
he's one of us. He just can't really say it
because he's trying to win a national election. And Ohen
Lovejoy got so much of his own credibility, not just
from his own politics, but from the fact that he
was the brother of this martyred anti slavery editor Elijah
Lovejoy and martyrs play a radicalizing role in in all movements.
(34:20):
You know, Chris Edges mentioned this yesterday on Twitter that
when when when movements, When when somebody has martyred in
a movement like Charlie Kirk.
Speaker 8 (34:29):
Just was.
Speaker 7 (34:31):
It, it sanctifies violence, no matter what that particular person
felt about violence. In Kirk's case, he was, you know,
strongly for discourse. You can hate what he said, but
he was about persuasion and argumentation. You can you can
hate that he was for argumentation on behalf of something
(34:52):
that you think is terrible, but he was not advocating
for for violence. But what happens with his martyrdom is
that now people in the movement who call for discussion
and debate will say, no, you know, Charlie Kirk tried that,
or you know, Elijah Lovejoy tried that, and look what
(35:12):
happened to him. He was killed by our evil enemies.
And the only thing we can do is war like that.
That's the only option that's that's left to us. And
if you don't do that, you are betraying the legacy
of our marker. And and it's very hard internally in
(35:33):
those factional arguments to argue against that, even if you
can point to and this states, you know, not that
Charlie Kirk is MLK, but like MLKA was very you know,
all about nonviolence. But what a lot of people said
afterwards is we'll look what it got him. You know,
it got him killed. The only path forward is to
(35:56):
fight for him, and to fight violently for him.
Speaker 5 (36:01):
Well yeah, because it's I forget who said this, but
it it's it shows someone who's like trying to have
a back and forth and trying to say, like, let's
let's debate. Let's uh, you know, debate really rowdily if
that's an adverb, but let's let's do it.
Speaker 6 (36:24):
And that effort was ended with a bullet.
Speaker 1 (36:27):
So what messages that say, don't do that anymore?
Speaker 6 (36:31):
Like it's not your gen z.
Speaker 5 (36:33):
Charlie Kirk has been an ever present fixture of your
social media diet for five to ten years, and that
doesn't matter whether you're political or not. This kid was
on south Park. This guy was on South Park because
he was well known enough to be parodied on.
Speaker 6 (36:48):
A pop culture platform like that.
Speaker 5 (36:50):
And you have for years been scrolling through this guy
yelling at the libs, debating on college campuses all of
that on a podcast, and suddenly the video that you
scroll past is him engaged in that very say, same
act and ending literally in a geyser of blood. The
(37:11):
point that some people will take from that is, you know,
dialogue doesn't work. It doesn't work because you can end
it with a bullet and that's a horrifying there's a
horrifying takeaway that people might walk away with.
Speaker 1 (37:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
Chris Hedges wrote a piece Brian, I don't know if
you read it that talked some about, you know, the
role of the martyr, and I thought made some very
salient points about the way that a martyr can be
used in a movement to further radicalize. And this isn't speculative,
Like you can go and look on the timeline at
the number of people who were saying that's it, gloves
(37:50):
are off.
Speaker 4 (37:50):
Now we're waging war.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
They want to kill us, and then President of the
United States, as we played earlier, saying you know, well,
you know, it would be nice if we could solve
it at the ballot, but that's not really possible because
it's we don't even have a ballot box.
Speaker 4 (38:04):
It's so rigged, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 2 (38:06):
So you know, that's what's like when you add those
the sense of political existential stakes, which in some ways,
you know, I mean the states of politics are high. Right,
there's I don't want to sugarcoat it, like there is
a reality that the political stakes are high in fact,
(38:26):
and then you add to it this tinder box of
gun culture, untreated mental illness, mass inequality, increasing the economics
that we have been covering the economic numbers this week,
but they're not looking great. Things continue to trend to
higher inflation, higher inflation, higher unemployment, more jobless claims, et cetera.
(38:46):
And you know, and then you have these other existential
fears over AI, over climate crisis, over you know, migration
for some see that as an existential, you know, existential
type fear. And you're looking at you're looking at a
powder keg. That's that's the sense. And you know, Ryan,
(39:10):
do you think that the so I don't. I don't
particularly enjoy the pre Civil war comparison. That one is
really scary. I don't love the seventies comparison either, but
I guess it's somewhat less scary. Like do you think
do you see parallels with that time period as well.
Speaker 7 (39:25):
The yes, and probably more so with than than with
pre Civil War, because, as you pointed out on the
show yesterday, the slaver class and also the anti slavery
folks properly understood the fight over slavery as as existential
and fundamental to the soul of the country. What is
(39:51):
what is that today?
Speaker 1 (39:53):
Like that?
Speaker 7 (39:54):
Does that doesn't exist? Like that the two parties agree on,
like most things, Ran, I.
Speaker 5 (40:04):
Don't know if you've you've ever read the biography of
Barry Goldwater that Lee Edwards wrote.
Speaker 6 (40:08):
It's a he was a historian.
Speaker 5 (40:10):
He was actually at the Heritage Foundation for a really
long time, but he was Goldwater's comms director.
Speaker 6 (40:14):
He was at the March on Washington. He was involved
in a lot of the.
Speaker 5 (40:19):
Like conservative political activism in the rise of the Reagan Revolution.
And my friend Chris Bedford and I talked to him
in June of twenty twenty as DC was like in
a state of rolling crisis and asked him how it
compared to nineteen sixty eight. And I've taken a lot
of heat for reposting this just in the last like
I don't know, forty eight hours whatever it is now,
(40:39):
But he said, he told us when we asked how
it compared to nineteen sixty eight, I was kind of
like saying, like pushing him. I thought to say, like, no,
it's not as bad, don't be hysterical whatever. And he said,
now it's worse than nineteen sixty eight because some of
those like institutional points of consensus have frayed, and that
(41:00):
is a very very different time to and that is
like so that you do the Civil War parallels feel
more accurate in a point like that.
Speaker 2 (41:10):
So, guys, I want to sorry. People are sharing a
clip and now let me see if I can play
it of the governor talking about how family members believe
that Robinson had become more political in recent years. So
let me go ahead and see if I can share
this clip and we can react to it.
Speaker 14 (41:31):
On the other side, investigators interviewed a family member Robinson,
who stated that Robinson had become more political in recent years.
The family member referenced a recent incident in which Robinson
came to dinner prior to September tenth, and in the
conversation with another family member, Robinson mentioned Charlie Kirk was
(41:52):
coming to UVU. They talked about why they didn't like
him and the viewpoints that he had. The family member
also stated Kirk was full of hate and spreading hate.
The family member also confirmed Robinson had a gray Dodge Challenger.
Investigators identified an individual as the roommate of Robinson. Investigators
(42:12):
interviewed that roommate, who stated that his roommate, referring to Robinson,
made a joke on discord. Investigators asked if he would
show them the messages on discord. He opened it and
showed several messages to investigators and allowed investigators to take
photos of the screen as each message was shown by
Robinson's roommate. These photos consisted of various messages, including content
(42:35):
of messages between the phone contact named Tyler with an
emoji icon and Robinson's roommate's device.
Speaker 2 (42:43):
So the commentary there again as that spoke to a
relative who had been with Tyler just recently. Tyler mentioned
Charlie's coming into down, talked about why he hated them
him and said he was full of hate. I can
tell you the what a lot of people on the
(43:06):
right are saying online is they're tying it into Oh,
he went to college and became radicalized, so you know,
and radicalized against the right and you know, became this
like murderous antifa guy, and so you can already see
you know, the obviously this administration already has been very
(43:29):
aggressive against universities. The right has been very this has
been part of a political ideological project anyway, So I
fully suspect that piece will be used further to go
after and.
Speaker 7 (43:41):
You know, maybe this is maybe this is me just
reaching for what I want to be true. But uh,
if filled with hate recently becoming filled with hate, would
they would they be using that in the context of
becoming anti fascist.
Speaker 1 (44:04):
I couldn't tell that, yeah, filled with hate.
Speaker 2 (44:10):
I couldn't tell if he was saying that he was
filled with hate Tyler, or whether he was saying Charlie
Kirk was filled with hate and that's why he didn't
like him.
Speaker 6 (44:17):
Right.
Speaker 2 (44:18):
It was a little bit unclear in what the governor
was saying there, but people are taking you are saying
it to mean that Tyler was saying Kirk was filled
with hate.
Speaker 7 (44:26):
Does he say did he say anything? And maybe we
can find more of this clip, but did he say
anything about what these messages were? Like the clip cut
off where he before he told like what the jokes
were that he was telling and what the messages were.
Speaker 2 (44:40):
I haven't seen. I have not seen that, but we'll
keep We'll keep looking and seeing if seeing if they
indicated what those Discord messages were, because yeah, that would
certainly be that would certainly be relevant to.
Speaker 5 (44:54):
Know and and this, you know, we don't need to
even continue finding way to underscore this, but the fact
that someone was posting messages on Discord, I think, you know,
we've we've seen the furry reference so far Discord. That's
indicative of somebody who is deep, deep in online culture.
Speaker 2 (45:17):
Yeah, the radicalization seems less to be doe with, you know,
whatever academic institution he was at, and more to do
with whatever Discord server he was at.
Speaker 7 (45:28):
Also, the the arrows, it looks like and maybe people
have some better clue into this, you know where they
said that down right.
Speaker 2 (45:38):
Or up side upright, down down down, Yeah, fire.
Speaker 1 (45:43):
Too, I mean hell divers too or what?
Speaker 4 (45:45):
That's what I had to run some video game meme.
Speaker 6 (45:48):
The time says.
Speaker 5 (45:49):
The list of messages on the suspects casing is described
by a government cox include apparent references to online culture
and gaming quote up arrow, right arrow and three down
arrow symbols as described by Cox, maybe a reference, uh
maybe a re so a sequence of moves on a
controller that released a bomb in the video game Hell Divers.
Oh wow, another engraving quest. Owo, what's this? Is a
(46:15):
phrase used for trolling in online role play communities.
Speaker 2 (46:19):
Yeah, and it's a furry specific I guess. I don't know.
The Internet was a mistake. I don't know, guys, what
to tell you? What to tell you? She is onto
something in China, shut it down? I mean it's this
is yeah, I mean, the most twenty twenty five thing
(46:43):
you can imagine.
Speaker 1 (46:44):
Like total gam gamer troll.
Speaker 2 (46:46):
Brain rot gamer troll engravings on you know, bullets that
are used to murder a prominent activist, an online influencer,
and with the videos being streamed into our feats basically
in real time so that we can all over and
over again watch watch one of the gorious, most horrific
(47:10):
things you can possibly imagine, Like what what hell are
we living through?
Speaker 5 (47:16):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (47:16):
Seriously, I.
Speaker 5 (47:19):
Yep, it's hard to understand right now what this is
going to do to zoomers who have already seen so much.
I mean, I think back, I'm slightly younger than you guys.
You guys were like your brains were fully formed when
some of the like beheading videos we're hitting Twitter in
(47:40):
you know circle like twenty thirteen.
Speaker 6 (47:43):
I forget when.
Speaker 5 (47:44):
Fully was, but I saw that when I was like
probably sixteen, And it's not normal for the human brain
to experience that. It's not normal for the species to
experience that. Where it's you can zoom in, you can
it's posted so many times in the hours after Charlie
(48:05):
was shot. It was I probably saw it fifteen different
times on my feed, you know, if you were trying
to get the news on a mainstream website. It's not
like this was in the bowels of you know, something
somebody downloaded on like bear share and sent to their
friends over email.
Speaker 6 (48:24):
Like that's not what it was.
Speaker 5 (48:26):
It was on a mainstream website, and it sounds tripe
to us now, But I'm just thinking to somebody who
was like probably sixteen and saw a human being beheaded multiple.
Speaker 6 (48:37):
Times, like this is so much worse.
Speaker 5 (48:40):
I mean, they saw Brian Thompson, they saw all of
that all over, and it's a level of exposure to
violence that previously only would have existed in like war zones.
But even then you're experiencing something physically and in person,
and the disconnected nature of watching a total stranger that
you will never meet, you do not know, and then
(49:01):
being incentivized to weigh in either with a great thought
that's classy, or with a horrible thought because the algorithm
that pushed that video to you is also demanding a
response from you. We're so absolutely fucking cooked. We're just cooked.
Speaker 4 (49:17):
Yeah, I mean, what else can you say?
Speaker 2 (49:19):
Like, And that's before we even talk about the you know,
the images of a genocide that we've been seeing every
single day, the horrific video of Arena who was murdered
on a you know, public transit, and this is like
maybe I'm misremembering, but the beheading videos, like you had
to like actually like I never watched it. You had
(49:40):
to like kind of intentionally. This was almost unavoidable.
Speaker 7 (49:47):
Go ahead, Ryan, No, no, I I we were breaking
that in real time, and I'm going to head it up.
And then I put it in a different tab because
I didn't want to see it. Yeah, and then as
and then I was I'm going back to working later,
I clicked on that tab not knowing what it was,
and there it was, and it's still in my mind.
Speaker 2 (50:07):
Yeah, I mean, that image of Charlie will ever be
out of my mind because it was I mean, it
was horrifying. And I just you know, one thing that
I can't quite fully describe or put my finger on,
but like, think about, Okay, this killer puts these brain
rot memes, engraves them intentionally, like went out of his
way to do this so that you and I and
(50:30):
Ryan and the whole world could talk about it and
decipher his Internet memes that he put on there for lulls.
And there's this sense of there's this sense of disconnect
and unreality where it's like it's that nihilistic nothing matters,
you know, the more like outrageous thing you say, the
(50:53):
more like disgusting and hateful thing you say, the more
sort of notoriety you get. And and this sense that
other humans are quote unquote NPCs, right, they're not really real.
I mean there's just this I don't know, this sense
of sort of disconnect from your fellow human. And there
(51:14):
are always going to be sociopathic type people out there
who just naturally have that disconnect from humanity and are
able to you know, pull a trigger and blow someone's
tibits from you know, two hundred yards away and you know,
have no regrets about it or whatever, or.
Speaker 6 (51:29):
A knife in the case of Arena, right, Like, that's it.
Speaker 2 (51:32):
Right, So that was a very intimate murder. You know,
that's very intimate to be that close and to murder
someone in that way. But yeah, I just I have
a feeling like this type of Internet nihilism is converting
many more people into basically like sociopaths with little sense
(51:52):
of fellow common humanity.
Speaker 5 (51:56):
Yeah, and that's what Like, I'm genuinely not trying to
make this a partisan or anti Trump comment. I'm saying
this as somebody who's Charlie Kirk's age thirty two. He
was about to turn thirty two when Donald Trump says
what he said about elections, that is something you heard
from the Fringes when I was growing up, when we
(52:16):
were growing up. And the fact that that came out
of the president of the United States, president the United
States mouth after so many people in gen z just
saw what they saw. I think genuinely, like boomers, people
in Trump's demo have no idea what type of rocket
fuel that is for nihilism and violence and danger, and
(52:40):
it horrifies me to think about that combination.
Speaker 6 (52:44):
It really really does.
Speaker 2 (52:46):
I mean Ryan the you know, some of the violent
weather underground and those type of movements. I mean I
feel like that comes from a similar place of like,
you know, oh well we the political system like failed us,
and so you know, there's this is this is the
only thing that Matt, this is the only thing that
could work. I mean you can also see it in
(53:08):
terms of like, uh, this, you know, the parallels are
not perfect guys here, so forgive me. But the Hamas
Palestinian like violent resistance too. It's like, hey, we tried,
we tried, this thing didn't work, so our only path
forward is is violence.
Speaker 7 (53:24):
The difference between uh you know that kind of organized
violence and this is that what you could hate it,
but it has and you can disagree, like I think
the weathermen were reckless adventurists who uh you know, on
and on people care about my you know weather ut
(53:47):
of ground critique. But like the point is like they
had they had an idea, like they were going to
spark a revolution whatever, Like it had an it had
a one two three, there.
Speaker 6 (54:00):
Was a grand strategy.
Speaker 1 (54:01):
I think it's an.
Speaker 7 (54:01):
Outrageous one two three and stupid and counterproductive and blah blah,
but it was a the was a one two three,
Like what is this?
Speaker 1 (54:09):
Like this feels like trolling.
Speaker 7 (54:12):
It feels like taking someone's life in the most with
the flick of a wrist with for a personal catharsis
and just joking like like you're in a discord server
like to but this is to take someone's life with
references to like video game memes and meme and furry
(54:35):
memes is so sacrilegious to humanity. Mm hmmm, So keep
that on discord, like you want to.
Speaker 6 (54:44):
Feel you want to feel black pilled.
Speaker 5 (54:46):
The weather underground could actually organize a group of physical
people to plan.
Speaker 7 (54:56):
Right that way, they blew them so, they blew themselves up,
but at least they were able to get more than
one person in a room.
Speaker 5 (55:02):
They were not yet they were they right, right right,
And so that's a huge difference from a lone wolf
Internet radicals or Internet nihilists, because think about I mean
think about this that he was not part of a
literal underground community of dozens of people who are organizing
(55:24):
in back rooms.
Speaker 6 (55:26):
This is somebody who was alone.
Speaker 5 (55:28):
When you are part of a radical revolutionary group, whether
it was right or left underground or whatever else. These
are people who had, like that was a sense of
purpose and belonging community. This is somebody who has no
and that's all like everything that Ryan said underscore, like awful,
(55:48):
horrible way to define community through violence like that. But
this is somebody who is who's trying to find purpose
in saying there is no purpose and is trying to
make that point the Oh my god, I mean, it's
just so depressing to think about.
Speaker 7 (56:04):
I think I have a clip here that's a little
bit more of the the family member stuff if you
want to roll back through this again, just like so.
Speaker 4 (56:15):
We can see if are you able to share it Ryan.
Speaker 1 (56:18):
Yeah, let me do it here.
Speaker 14 (56:21):
The family member also confirmed Robinson had a Gray Dodge Challenger.
Investigators identified an individual as the roommate of Robinson. Investigators
interviewed that roommate, who stated that his roommate, referring to Robinson,
made a joke on discord. Investigators asked if you would
show them the messages on discord. He opened it and
(56:41):
showed several messages to investigators and allowed investigators to take
photos of the screen as each message was shown.
Speaker 8 (56:48):
By Robinson's roommate.
Speaker 14 (56:50):
These photos consisted of various messages, including content of messages
between the phone contact named Tyler with an emoji icon
and Robinson's roommate's device. The content of these messages included
messages affiliated with the contact Tyler, stating a need to
retrieve a rifle from a drop point, leaving the rifle
(57:12):
in a bush. Messages related to a to visually watching
the area where a rifle was left, and a message
referring to having left the rifle wrapped in a towel.
The messages also referred to engraving bullets and a mention
of a scope and the rifle being unique. Messages from
(57:34):
the contact Tyler also mentioned that he had changed outfits. Wow,
I know there has been speculation as well as to
the writing on those casings, those those bullet casings, and I.
Speaker 8 (57:53):
Believe we have that as well. We already do this
and I'll share that with you.
Speaker 4 (57:57):
Yeah, yeah, we already got the casings.
Speaker 2 (57:59):
But the so, in my understanding, right, this man murdered
Charlie Kirk and then went on a discord server to
be like talking about the gun and talking about changing
his clothes and basically.
Speaker 1 (58:13):
Talking about it seking his roommate for help.
Speaker 4 (58:15):
Is that what I'm understanding here.
Speaker 1 (58:20):
That he's doing.
Speaker 7 (58:21):
He's doing that police talk, which makes it deliberately difficult
to translate into English, but that.
Speaker 4 (58:25):
Does That is wild. That is wild.
Speaker 2 (58:29):
You did this and you got away, you left your gun,
and you're like talking about the gun, talking about where
you left it, talking about how you changed your clothes,
bringing about this to your buddy on a discord server,
like when it.
Speaker 6 (58:42):
Took twenty four plus hours.
Speaker 5 (58:43):
They didn't until this person's again, like until this person's
dad turned them in.
Speaker 6 (58:48):
This was in a.
Speaker 5 (58:49):
Public place full of CCTV at a densely crowded event,
and this person is bragging about it on a discord
server afterwards, and the FBI more than twenty four hours
in about thirty six hours in had nothing except for
by the grace of God, this person's father had the
willpower to turn them in. So increasingly looking like from
(59:14):
my perspective right now, is increasingly looking like uh, possible
antif nihilism, but also horrific.
Speaker 6 (59:22):
Law enforcement response.
Speaker 5 (59:23):
I mean, just what the hell of crazy?
Speaker 6 (59:30):
That's so dangerous? It's so dangerous.
Speaker 2 (59:33):
Yeah, and there and and then cash hotel has the
temerity to go out and brag about how historic and
how incredible, how incredible of a job they'd done. I mean,
it's just it's unbelievable.
Speaker 1 (59:43):
I Mean the truth is that you don't.
Speaker 7 (59:44):
Law enforcement doesn't have to be that great. If you
if a picture gets out, like, right, you're gonna get
You're gonna get found.
Speaker 2 (59:54):
Yeah, because everybody is the public, right, and almost all
the public is going to be on your side. Right,
There's gonna be very few that would actually be willing
to you know, harbor the Charlie Kirk murder, not turn
them in, you know, right.
Speaker 7 (01:00:10):
So unless he's you know, going you have to wear
a ski mask and then people be like, what the
hell are you doing wearing a ski mask?
Speaker 11 (01:00:16):
Right?
Speaker 1 (01:00:17):
Maybe the other so just during the pandemic, maybe could
have stuck in.
Speaker 2 (01:00:20):
You could have gotten away with it. Yeah, Or if
you're posing as an ice agent, you could pull out.
Speaker 1 (01:00:24):
All that's true. I'm an ice agent on the roof.
Speaker 2 (01:00:26):
Yeah, actually, yeah, that would be been even more of
a twenty twenty five murder. And then the other aspect
of it, you know, to add to the sort of
dystopian unreality, the whole thing, because I know you guys
saw this, like influencer who was there, who was posting
to TikTok, like follow me on TikTok, and like mugging
(01:00:47):
for the camera, which again is like, you know, even
as you're living through this horror, you're still like somehow
disconnected from it, even as you're like in the real world,
still disconnected from it. And after the fact, I know,
we like apologize, I'll be a better creator, whatever, but
you're like disconnected from the very reality and the humanity
(01:01:09):
that you are existing with and living through.
Speaker 5 (01:01:12):
Because your reality is that your career is tied to
the algorithm, and so you are This is like Marshall mccleuan,
You are as a human being changed by the medium
that is controlling your life. And these mediums are not
changing us for the better. There's just clearly we are
being warped into our own thought processes having dictation by
(01:01:34):
the algorithm because you start thinking in terms of the algorithm,
and people need to be extremely careful about it, and
we aren't, and the tech companies aren't. The tech companies
X included Elon Musk is condemning all of this, but
he owns a company that has one of the most
major roles in poisoning US algorithmically, poisoning US algorithmically. So
(01:01:56):
it's just like it reminds me of the video of
that went viral in a totally different vein of that
young man who was saying he was working really hard
and couldn't get ahead, that went megaviral like a month ago,
and it was he was dead on in his description
of the economy. It was, it was accurate, it was poignant.
(01:02:18):
And then you look at the bottom of the TikTok
and it says things like hashtag follow me, and it's
think about that, I mean, hashtag follow me, hashtag so
like you had hashtags basically.
Speaker 6 (01:02:31):
Being like I want to become an influencer something to
that extent.
Speaker 5 (01:02:35):
And it's just like that is just I don't know
that you could possibly be much more depressed about the
state of the country.
Speaker 2 (01:02:41):
Yeah, And I think it's an accelerant, Like I don't
think it starts with the social media. I think it's
it's an accelerant the internet culture for a society that's
already sick in any number of ways. But yeah, I
don't I don't know what to say about it. And
we can wrap up here pretty soon, because I don't
I don't see you know, I don't know what else
(01:03:01):
we're going to get right now. But Ryan, you got
any any last thoughts you want to add in here?
Speaker 7 (01:03:07):
No, I mean the only uh, you know, for people
like myself who don't want this to be like a leftist,
the only hope is that he's trolling with his hey
fascist catch and that sort of stuff, mellow chow and
the belli chow. That that that that's that, that's some kind
of a troll in a in a misdirection.
Speaker 1 (01:03:29):
Yeah, I think I think I hear Mac. What's Mac saying?
Speaker 5 (01:03:33):
Oh? No, that was actually it was you heard yourself
through my microphone, gotcha?
Speaker 7 (01:03:39):
So, uh, you know, these are just you know, dark, dark,
dark times really and it's uh, it's still hard to
believe that Charlie Kirk is dead.
Speaker 2 (01:03:52):
Yeah, it is just thinking that it feels it's crazy.
And I mean that's the other aspect of this is
Emily you brought up like the parasocial relationship that millions
have with him and will experience this as if you
know someone who's genuinely close to them.
Speaker 4 (01:04:09):
Was gil mm hmmm, h m hm.
Speaker 5 (01:04:12):
I mean, it's it's so like and that can go
in really positive directions for some people. But again, I'm
not worried about the people who are reacting healthily to this,
because I know that there's a large group of people
that aren't going to react ealthily to this because they
have no community, they have no friends, but they have
(01:04:33):
a they have a computer. And I'm just going to
put this before we wrap. I just want to put
this image that we've gotten in of Charlie's widow now
widow on the screen because it is just you just
look at her face and the video emerge of her
exiting Air Force two with Ushavants and just gripping Ontosha Vance. Obviously,
(01:04:58):
JD was very close friends with with Charlie. Charlie helped
get JD onto the ticket by lobbying behind the scenes
with what Don Junior uh And so this is something
that this administration, I mean again at the White House yesterday,
those young Trump staffers, that the level of doom that
was ever present hanging in the air the entire day
(01:05:21):
and shock it just you know, it's it's one way
I think, you know, we're talking now about how people
in the public are experiencing this, and that's right, because
it's crazy. But just also think about how closely this
is touching the way that we talked about this earlier,
the reactions from this administration. This is so so personal,
(01:05:45):
so personal. So it's a really scary time.
Speaker 4 (01:05:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:05:48):
Yeah, and Trump had no like direct personal connection to
big Balls. This is someone he knew and knew closely
and you know, was looped in within minute station in
any number of ways. So we'll see where we go
from here. Anything else, guys.
Speaker 6 (01:06:07):
I just hope you guys, uh, stay safe.
Speaker 2 (01:06:09):
And yeah, I appreciate you guys, I'll say that, and
you know, I let's we'll end on the good news.
Speaker 4 (01:06:16):
It's good news that this guy.
Speaker 2 (01:06:17):
Got caught, good news that he's in custody, good news
that you know, they've got him. And I'm sure we're
gonna we're gonna learn a lot more here and you know, well,
if there's anything that pops up big over the weekend, guys,
one or the other of us will try to cover it. Otherwise,
Soccer and I will be in studio for a normal
show on Monday, and we will see you then.
Speaker 6 (01:06:36):
Pull people out of nihilism.
Speaker 5 (01:06:38):
By the way, sorry, I just want to say, because
like we have some very online people and we're grateful
for all of you.
Speaker 6 (01:06:44):
If you see someone going down a dark path, do
what you can to pull them out of it. That's
the best we can all do right now.
Speaker 4 (01:06:50):
Yep, all right, guys, talk to you soon.
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